Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Giving up is unforgivable.

The arc of the moral universe does not bend itself. it is up to us to bend it.

Prediction: the gop will rethink its strategy of boycotting future committees.

A snarling mass of vitriolic jackals

Jack Smith: “Why did you start campaigning in the middle of my investigation?!”

Every reporter and pundit should have to declare if they ever vacationed with a billionaire.

Fear or fury? The choice is ours.

If you’re gonna whine, it’s time to resign!

“When somebody takes the time to draw up a playbook, they’re gonna use it.”

Lick the third rail, it tastes like chocolate!

Too often we confuse noise with substance. too often we confuse setbacks with defeat.

The way to stop violence is to stop manufacturing the hatred that fuels it.

I am pretty sure these ‘journalists’ were not always such a bootlicking sycophants.

So fucking stupid, and still doing a tremendous amount of damage.

Not loving this new fraud based economy.

Nothing says ‘pro-life’ like letting children go hungry.

Radicalized white males who support Trump are pitching a tent in the abyss.

People are weird.

Tick tock motherfuckers!

Today’s gop: why go just far enough when too far is right there?

Shallow, uninformed, and lacking identity

When you’re a Republican, they let you do it.

No offense, but this thread hasn’t been about you for quite a while.

Welcome to day five of every-bit-as-bad-as-you-thought-it-would-be.

You are here: Home / Politics / An Unexamined Scandal / Saturday Long Read Watch: Pine Ridge

Reader Interactions

70Comments

  1. 1.

    raven

    We are watching “The West” a Ken Burns production. It’s good to be refreshed on was murdering fucking scumbags Americans can be.

  3. 3.

    theturtlemoves

    Having grown up close enough to Pine Ridge to run against them in track and cross country in high school, I’ve been keenly aware of how dirt poor that place is and has been for years. The government really does need to do a better job of helping folks on Pine Ridge and Rosebud and all the reservations out there to lift them up out of poverty. That said, a bunch of hipsters from LA putting up posters and demanding something as patently unrealistic as just giving back millions of acres of land that are currently occupied by folks that would likely argue a bit might not be the most viable solution. Glad someone is trying to raise awareness, but I have the horrible feeling this is going to just be another cause of the month, the posters will get covered by other posters, and the Lakota will go back to living in a third world country smack in the middle of America. Pictures and video don’t really convey how freaking desolate that place really is.

  5. 5.

    Jewish Steel

    Pictures and video don’t really convey how freaking desolate that place really is.

    Quite the contrary, it depicts their situation somewhat romantically. Glorious revolutionaries amid the squalor and epic grandeur of the Black Hills. It’s a nice little piece of film making, but I agree that it doesn’t accomplish what it sets out to do.

  6. 6.

    theturtlemoves

    @raven: Exactly. Millions of stickers and years later and the Dalai Lama is still in India and Tibetans are self-immolating and the Chinese are… still there. So, that apparently hasn’t worked out. And that cause has way more visibility than the poor bastards on Pine Ridge. Great how somebody outside of SoDak finally noticed and everything, but that place has been poorer than Haiti for many, many decades, so points off on timeliness.

  7. 7.

    theturtlemoves

    @Jewish Steel: Yeah, it does romanticize it a bit much, doesn’t it? Saw a different documentary a while back talking about the rape statistics on Rosebud. There are fewer women on Rosebud who haven’t been raped than those who have. There’s no romantic struggle against the oppressors there. That’s just the oppressed finding someone they can, in turn, oppress themselves. Which does convey the desperation on those places. If they weren’t in the middle of a state with no population and therefore no customers, they could at least open some casinos…

  9. 9.

    The Very Reverend Crimson Fire of Compassion

    Today is the last day of the SunDance at Pine Ridge. My buddy George Arenivar is dancing (and piercing) his 20th(?) Sun Dance. My wife spoke at the ceremony almost twenty years ago. Our community takes truckloads of shit (clothes, bikes, supplies) every year. Want to do more than bitch about hipsters? Get off your ass and fucking donate. Don’t like how others treat the subject? Do something your damned self. Otherwise, shut up. You’re just another part of the problem.

  11. 11.

    Annamal

    Theturtlemoves, it might not be practical to give the land back, but creating the idea that that is a possibility might not be the worst idea.

    In New Zealand there are still a places that look like Pine Ridge but there are a number of tribes who have received at least some compensation over the last 40 years (Ngai Tahu in the South Island especially has done quite well out of fisheries) and a lot of it came out of a genuine fear that the government was going to give it all back.

    The Maori resurgence has also resulted in a network of maori language pre-schools, schools and Maori tv. It has also resulted in two political parties aimed at Maori (as well as a significant Maori wing in Labour and the Greens).

    New Zealand’s got a long way to go but we’re a lot further than we were.

  12. 12.

    Just Some Fuckhead

    @theturtlemoves:

    something as patently unrealistic as just giving back millions of acres of land that are currently occupied by folks that would likely argue a bit might not be the most viable solution.

    And yet it made perfect sense to take Palestine away from the Palestinians and give it to some modern-day Jews who never lived there. :)

  13. 13.

    Nellie in NZ

    Annamal – where are you? I’m in Taupo. Are you Kiwi by background or an expat? If expat, where from?

  14. 14.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    “All sorts of excuses are made for whites who harm non-whites, mainly that they act out of fear,” Harjo wrote. “No one really acknowledges what their fear is: That non-whites, once in charge of anything, will be as bad to the whites as they have been to us.”

    Context:

    Native Americans rank near the bottom on so many social indicators that “a lot of this one is Native people are always dealing with our own issues,” Perci Ami, a Hopi master trainer and facilitator who came to the convention in place of an ailing Patty Talahongva, a past NAJA president. If Martin had been an Indian, “We would have responded the way African American people are responding. That’s probably the main reason you don’t see a lot of discussion.”

    Outside the convention, some Native Americans have taken a different approach. Activist Suzan Shown Harjo last year used the Martin case, in which Zimmerman, a night watchman, fatally shot Martin, an unarmed black teenager, as an example of white privilege.

  17. 17.

    joel hanes

    If I were Emperor of the Universe (and who knows but but one day I shall be), every high-school student in the US would be required to read Dee Brown’s heartbreaking Bury My Heart At Wounded Knee as a condition of graduation.

    The government really does need to do a better job of helping folks on … the reservations

    A good first step would be to repay the billions stolen from Native Americans by the Federal Bureau of Indian Affairs just in the last fifty years

    Firesign Theatre summed up our national history with the native Americans:

    Speaking for the Great White Father in Washington and all the American people, let me say we respect you savages for your native ability to instantly adapt and survive — in whatever god-forsaken wilderness we move you to.

    Out there.

    Sign here.

  18. 18.

    Annamal

    @Nellie in NZ: Wellington but I grew up in Hamilton (definitely kiwi by background ).

    Tainui probably aren’t the best example in terms of tribal management (if there was one thing Hamilton didn’t need, it was a casino) but they also helped fund some of my friends through university…

  20. 20.

    tybee

    at least they still have some land to claim.
    my people had to buy back a little of their land, a few acres at a time, from the assholes who stole it.

    as my great aunt said, “un ega yuwi nuda”.

    i spit on every twenty dollar bill i get so wash your hands after handling one. :)

  21. 21.

    debbie

    @joel hanes:

    Each chapter of that book was more heartbreaking than the one before. I can’t remember ever reading another book where I literally had trouble reading through my tears.

  23. 23.

    Violet

    @efgoldman: Same thing is happening to me. I wonder if that happened after last night’s database mess? It’s particularly annoying because if you don’t realize your name isn’t saved and type out your comment and click Submit Comment, you get an error message telling you your name wasn’t there, but you can’t click Back to get back to your comment; you have to re-write it completely.

    Prior to the site upgrade a few months ago, I could click Back if something messed up with a comment and my comment would still be there. That is no longer the case.

  25. 25.

    Meteor Blades

    @theturtlemoves: You’re mistaken about both the motives of the people involved in the mural posted in Los Angeles and about what ALL Lakota tribes are seeking in the Black Hills.

    First of all, there were several Indians present at the installation in L.A., and one of the artists involved has a long-standing association with the people of Pine Ridge.

    Second, the Lakota have not EVER asked that the land now occupied by non-Indians in the Black Hills be returned to them. They are not seeking to replace injustice with injustice. Nobody would be kicked off their land. They have, however, refused to accept the government’s offer of money as a result of a 1980 Supreme Court decision. The total in the trust fund for that reparation is now close to or more than $1 billion. And the tribes still refuse to take the money instead of the land.

  26. 26.

    Steeplejack

    @Violet:

    I am able to mash Back to get back and add a nym and e-mail to my comment. Firefox 22.0 on WinXP here. But, yeah, things are messed up since the meltdown last night.

  27. 27.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Meteor Blades: I admire the adherence to principle that the Lakota have shown. I wonder though if there could not be some way that the poverty of the Lakota could be alleviated without breaking that principle. I don’t know what that way is, but I hope someone thinks of it.

  28. 28.

    Violet

    @debbie: Interesting. I’m using Firefox. It the comment hasn’t been there if I click Back since the upgrade. When FYWP happens, it can be annoying that the comment vanishes. Used to be I could click Back and just wait it out for a few minutes or so and repost and it would work.

  29. 29.

    Violet

    @Steeplejack: Hmm…I’m using FF 22.0 as well. Wonder if it’s something with my computer? It used to work just fine and hasn’t since the upgrade months ago.

  31. 31.

    Steeplejack

    @Violet:

    Are you perhaps blocking cookies from Balloon Juice? You have to allow them to get the “sticky” nym.

    If you have been having this problem for months, I would suggest that you delete your old Balloon Juice cookies and let them be refreshed.

    In Firefox, click Tools | Options | Privacy, then click “Show Cookies.” Highlight the Balloon Juice cookies and remove them. Close Firefox and reopen it; the cookies will be refreshed (assuming your browser is set to accept cookies from the current site).

  34. 34.

    Violet

    @Steeplejack: No, the name thing just started happening today. Before that it’s worked fine. It’s the pressing the Back button if FYWP happens and the comment not being there in the comment box. It just vanishes. That’s only happened since the upgrade.

    I did clear cookies fairly recently–a week or two ago. And I had to refresh the site’s cookies to get B-J to show up on the new server, so I know it did it then.

  37. 37.

    Violet

    The name thing is working again. I’ve done nothing. Is someone working on the server or something?

  38. 38.

    Litlebritdifrnt

    Update on my problems with the puter. I ran a MalwareBytes scan and it found several problems and removed them but it hasn’t helped with the twitter (and other sites) thing, I do note that the ads that are appearing on my twitter feed have a small sub script that state “Ads not by this site” Also, when I try to refresh twitter I get redirected to some “Adam Undefined” twitter feed. No idea why. I have recently downloaded Spybot and am running a scan right now, hoping that it can fix the problem.

  39. 39.

    Steeplejack

    @Violet:

    Sorry, I was going on your statement “It used to work just fine and hasn’t since the upgrade months ago.”

    As for today’s nym thing, I am finding that once I reënter my nym and e-mail address they stick. So maybe the problem has been fixed.

    (You might have to reënter the info in each thread that you have open.)

  40. 40.

    Yatsuno

    @Omnes Omnibus: I’m on my mobile and it seems to drop random comments every now and again. I thought maybe it was the signal at work but sounds like it’s FYWP.

    As far as the trust fund issue goes, it’s hard to imagine a situation at this point where they should sacrifice that money even if they get the land back. That interest accumulated because of the judgment award delay, and usually the plaintiff retains rights to that regardless of outcome. But I can understand them not taking the money, even though it would alleviate a lot of suffering.

  44. 44.

    red dog

    Not taking the money that could stop all the suffering by building homes, schools, clinics, roads etc and then complaining seems very foolish and nonproductive to me. If a tree is there to provide shade, use it for that purpose. It does not matter who planted it.

  45. 45.

    Violet

    @Steeplejack: Okay, I just followed your instructions and deleted the Balloon Juice cookie. Rebooted the entire computer. FF does not have my name in the box. I can put it in there, and it started remembering it, but in a new thread it’s not there.

  47. 47.

    Violet

    Okay, my name wasn’t showing up in other threads, but then on refreshing them, it shows up in the Name box above the comment box.

  48. 48.

    Steeplejack

    @Violet:

    But if you enter a comment without a nym, are you able to back up and put in a nym, or is that part still screwed?

    I loaded an old thread from yesterday, and my nym and e-mail address do not appear. So I guess things are still askew.

  49. 49.

    Violet

    @Steeplejack: I just testing posting without a name and then hitting Back and I’m still screwed. The comment disappears when I hit back.

  51. 51.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @red dog: As I understand it completely from the outside, this is one of the few mechanisms for fighting that the Lakota see themselves as having. Refusing to take the money causes people to ask why. They can answer then that the Black Hills were stolen from them and that handing them some money doesn’t really make up for it. Fundamentally, it is pride.

  52. 52.

    Omnes Omnibus

    This could have been an interesting and informative thread had blog not been broken.

  54. 54.

    Yatsuno

    @Omnes Omnibus: Pride is all well and good,but it doesn’t feed the children who are starving nor the families struggling to survive. Should the Lakota get the Black Hills back, will that then solve all their social ills in one fell swoop?

  55. 55.

    Anya

    @Just Some Fuckhead: But that’s different, you godless libtard. If the Jews don’t all go back to Israel then Christ’s return could not happen and there’s absolutely no way that the Rapture could happen. Why do you hate Jesus?

  56. 56.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    @Yatsuno: They should get the Black Hills and the money. But then I’ve been a DFH since childhood.

  57. 57.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Yatsuno: No, of course not. The best analogy I can come up with though is this:

    Man: Would you sleep with me for a million dollars?
    Woman: I guess so.
    Man: Would you sleep with me for a dollar?
    Woman: What kind of person do you think I am?
    Man: We’ve already established that. Now we’re just negotiating a price.

    They won’t do anything that would be perceived as selling the Black Hills or ratifying the taking. I can understand it. I can’t, however, imagine what I would do in their circumstances.

    @a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q): Honestly, yes. That is it. Title to the parts of the Black Hills that are owned by the US government and compensation for the time they spent without it.

  58. 58.

    satby

    @Meteor Blades: Meteor Blades: well if the Lakora don’t want the current residents dispossesed and they refuse payment; what compensation (which I understand would still be inadequate) would they take? Because if the trust fund could help the tribe address some of the current conditions it seems awfully wasteful not to use it.

  60. 60.

    tybee

    @Yatsuno:

    so the person who had their house foreclosed on and the bank destroyed all their possessions, should take take what the bank president offered of “not gonna pay retail” and just shut up about the unfairness of it all.

    yeah, that pretty much explains the “white” view of native issues.

  62. 62.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Omnes Omnibus: National Forests, unlike National Parks, can be exploited for their resources. I would bet that, if title were turned over to the Lakota, they would be at least as a good as stewards of the land as the Forest Service.

  64. 64.

    theturtlemoves

    @Omnes Omnibus: Yeah, giving a good swath of timber rights would be a good start. Mineral rights would be a hollow gesture at this point, since most of the gold is mined out with pretty much only one company still actively mining. Canadian company, actually, so that’s another interesting twist.

    @The Very Reverend Crimson Fire of Compassion: Both my parents and I have given money to various schools and projects on the reservations and I’ve participated in sweat lodges at the Yankton penitentiary in the past. So, you can take your assumptions and shove them sideways there, sparky.

  68. 68.

    Sparky

    Fucking Wow! I was gonna comment on the video with a white boize make white noize and how they’re still taking the weird paternal approach to dem poor oppressed people, but the middle of this thread overwhelmed me. This bizarre back and forth about reloading comments or whatever would never happen on a pet thread.

    Now I have a sad.

    Oh wait. I get it. It’s a mega-thread about self-indulgent white folk! Ha-ha! You people can be so awesome!

  70. 70.

    Ilya

    Personally I thought it was a pretty cringey video made by a guy who personifies white guilt. It also didn’t help that he name-dropped Shepard Fairey every other minute. Plus, the upworthy link made it sound like they were going to explain how this guy went to Mt. Rushmore and it changed his life, when in reality there was absolutely no discussion of what made this guy change his mind. There’s some promising stuff at the beginning (the prevalence of gangs, drug abuse, alcoholism, domestic violence in the reservations) but then it quickly becomes a “white people are oppressors” video (no, seriously, they say this). Sorry, white people didn’t force a huge portion of the reservation population to be alcoholic/unemployed/physically abusive (although our history with them definitely didn’t help), and the reason that AIM is a joke has more to do with their self-destructive history than anything dreamt up by the White Man.

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