Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

New McCarthy, same old McCarthyism.

Is it negotiation when the other party actually wants to shoot the hostage?

🎶 Those boots were made for mockin’ 🎵

Since when do we limit our critiques to things we could do better ourselves?

The republican caucus is already covering themselves with something, and it’s not glory.

Let’s not be the monsters we hate.

Only Democrats have agency, apparently.

An almost top 10,000 blog!

I didn’t have alien invasion on my 2023 BINGO card.

The cruelty is the point; the law be damned.

Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

A thin legal pretext to veneer over their personal religious and political desires

Within six months Twitter will be fully self-driving.

Balloon Juice has never been a refuge for the linguistically delicate.

Give the craziest people you know everything they want and hope they don’t ask for more? Great plan.

The next time the wall street journal editorial board speaks the truth will be the first.

The poor and middle-class pay taxes, the rich pay accountants, the wealthy pay politicians.

I was promised a recession.

Everybody saw this coming.

Let’s delete this post and never speak of this again.

Do not shrug your shoulders and accept the normalization of untruths.

Fuck these fucking interesting times.

Red lights blinking on democracy’s dashboard

Sadly, there is no cure for stupid.

You are here: Home / Open Threads / Obama Syria Address Open Thread

Reader Interactions

395Comments

  1. 1.

    Mnemosyne

    I sure hope you meep-meep, eleventy dimensional chess folks are right.

    Me, too!

    Though I’m pretty sure that the odds of this being a “we begin bombing in five minutes” speech are fortunately very low at this point. Hopefully it will be a nice, dull, “here are current developments that we’re watching” speech that will make all of the talking heads yawn and say, Boooorrrrring!

  6. 6.

    Davis X. Machina

    Garance Franke-Ruta connects the dots between where we are tonight and Obama’s 2009 Nobel Peace Prize acceptance speech….

    “We must begin by acknowledging the hard truth: We will not eradicate violent conflict in our lifetimes. There will be times when nations — acting individually or in concert — will find the use of force not only necessary but morally justified….

    “To say that force may sometimes be necessary is not a call to cynicism — it is a recognition of history; the imperfections of man and the limits of reason….

    “I raise this point, I begin with this point because in many countries there is a deep ambivalence about military action today, no matter what the cause. And at times, this is joined by a reflexive suspicion of America, the world’s sole military superpower.

    “But the world must remember that it was not simply international institutions — not just treaties and declarations — that brought stability to a post-World War II world. Whatever mistakes we have made, the plain fact is this: The United States of America has helped underwrite global security for more than six decades with the blood of our citizens and the strength of our arms.”

    .

  7. 7.

    Baud

    I think Rand Paul would do well to go with the My Cousin Vinny rebuttal:

    Uh… everything that guy just said is bullshit… Thank you.

    It’s what he’ll say anyway. Why sugercoat?

  19. 19.

    dmsilev

    @schrodinger’s cat: Hard to say. Google’s not very helpful (did you know that Firedoglake has a dedicated 11-D chess tag? Not going to touch that with a 10-parsec pole). The phrase does largely seem to be associated with Obama though.

  29. 29.

    WereBear

    I sure hope you meep-meep, eleventy dimensional chess folks are right.

    Well, so far, so good, right?

    He’s BEEN outwitting the racist whackjobs, right?

  30. 30.

    jl

    I wish I were a reactionary. Then I would know in my bones that the inadequate blah president cheated, and time traveled into the future and the past to work things out to make his maladministration look good, the worst outcome I could imagine.

    Let’s hope for the best.

  34. 34.

    MikeJ

    @jl:

    I wish I were a reactionary. Then I would know in my bones that the inadequate blah president cheated

    Or you could be one of our local unicorn fuckers and believe exactly the same thing.

  37. 37.

    Villago Delenda Est

    @WereBear:

    He’s BEEN outwitting the racist whackjobs, right?

    C’mon. It’s not like that outwitting racist wackjobs is that difficult. Fish in a barrel, for the most part.

  38. 38.

    burnspbesq

    Obama had better not talk for more than an hour, or he’ll lose the audience to the season premiere of “Sons of Anarchy.”

  39. 39.

    J.

    I’d rather be watching American Masters: Billie Jean King, but PBS decided to preempt it just as King was about to go nuclear on Bobby Riggs’s ass. GRRR.

  42. 42.

    Cacti

    I sure hope you meep-meep, eleventy dimensional chess folks are right.

    Of course you do, drum circler.

    You and the other FPers who’ve been showing their ass for the past 3-weeks are totes not looking for your next rage-gasm.

  43. 43.

    Villago Delenda Est

    @efgoldman:

    That will do it. Anything involving games of chance played for cash trips the spam filters, as do references to boner pills, breast and male member “enhancement”, and similar topics of great interest to spammers looking for marks.

  47. 47.

    chopper

    “My fellow Americans, I pleased to tell you that I just signed legislation outlawing Syria forever. We begin bombing in 5 minutes”

  58. 58.

    Villago Delenda Est

    @chopper:

    “My fellow Americans, I pleased to tell you that I just signed legislation outlawing Syria stupid forever. We begin bombing the states of the Old Confederacy, Arizona, Kentucky, and Sarah Palin’s compound in 5 minutes”

  83. 83.

    CaseyL

    No surprises or revelations; mostly a summing up, along with a clear statement of principles and “why we must act.” There will be no vote on a military strike while negotiations are ongoing.

    So lets hope the negotiations are successful.

  85. 85.

    RobertDSC-Power Mac G4 Dual 1.25

    I thought it was OK. Square and to the point. I’m still not convinced, but considering the ridiculousness of the GOP and their fanboism for Putin, it laid out the case and had some good points.

    I was against a strike but can at least appreciate the President’s position better.

    Too bad he can’t strike the GOP instead. So much more good would come out of that.

  87. 87.

    Redshirt

    That the Freepers have gone head over heal in love with Putin is something I could not have predicted 5 years ago. Showing me that yes, as cynical as I have grown, I can still be surprised.

  97. 97.

    ruemara

    I’d like to watch the speechifying (well, no), but I’m going to pour myself a rum and drink a bit deep. I had an odd experience tonight. Due to a situation out of my control, I wound up doing a bit of overtime for no pay and I popped in to visit my old boss to tease him a bit that I no longer had broadcast duties and could go home today. That was fun, but when I saw the admin aide dropping off food for our stars and handing him a meal, I had to ask why. You see, when I started, it was explained to me that everyone who has to work this late gets a meal. Once I was doing the broadcasts solo, about a month later, that stopped. I asked and the clerk laughed at me, like I had been dreaming and I let it go. Budget, right? So, a month after they remove my position, suddenly the broadcast engineer gets meals again. 6 years, no meal-as long as the black woman is there. White guy returns, oh dear, he deserves to be fed. It ain’t the food, it’s the principle. I wish I could describe the level of hurt I feel. When I do it, it’s nothing and worthless. Way to be, people.

  104. 104.

    Chris

    Fucking Lord. I just got an email from the Washington Times (how the fuck did I get back on their list?) titled “Obama, Nobel Peace Prize winner, insists U.S. must strike Syria to deliver message.”

    So I click on the article and what does it actually say?

    In an address to the nation Tuesday night, Mr. Obama said he still favors a missile strike against Syria as punishment for a chemical weapons attack. But he said he wants to wait to for the international community to work its will.

    “Over the last few days we’ve seen some encouraging signs,” Mr. Obama said in a televised address from the White House. “This initiative has the potential to remove chemical weapons without the use of force.”

    The president again laid out the facts of Syria’s war atrocity and said the attack cannot go unpunished.

    “The facts cannot be denied,” Mr. Obama said. “The question now is what the United States of America, and the international community, is prepared to do about it.”

    The president has changed his mind since Aug. 31, when he announced he wanted congressional approval to launch a limited military strike against Syria as punishment for a chemical-weapons attack ten days earlier that killed more than 1,400 people.

    Fucking Lord, I hate conservatives. God help me, but I do. Yes, all of them.

  110. 110.

    Betty Cracker

    @Cacti: I’m calling you out, you lying prick. Links to the so-called rage-gasms, or back the fuck off. Calling you out as a liar and a moron doesn’t count, by the way, since that’s what you are. Put up or shut up, motherfucker.

  111. 111.

    gogol's wife

    @Baud:

    I have come reluctantly to the sad but indisputable conclusion that Obama is NEVER going to say, “Excuse me while I whip this out.” In public, anyway.

  114. 114.

    Elie

    @ruemara:

    I get exactly what you are talking about and I can feel the pain… I know what you must be feeling and there is no response to it beyond to swallow your bitterness, hold your head up high and operate from your most core, ethical self. There is no other choice and you wouln’t want anything else.

    Seriously, most non-black people just cannot fully appreciate what you are feeling and what your pain is about. They can’t — When you talk about this sort of pain — just know that some of us will know — and that you are bearing witness to a knowledge of fundamental unfairness.

  117. 117.

    Cassidy

    @raven: I don’t know. I thought it was pretty concise description of workplace bigotry and pretty consistent with how he’s described her job in the past. Maybe I read into it.

  125. 125.

    Botsplainer

    Obama is failing me by not selling out progressives. That’s what I elected him for.

    OT- this may be the finest obituary ever written, and it is real.

    http://gawker.com/damn-i-wish-id-done-that-for-my-dad-1287904654

    Marianne Theresa Johnson-Reddick born Jan 4, 1935 and died alone on Aug. 30, 2013. She is survived by her 6 of 8 children whom she spent her lifetime torturing in every way possible. While she neglected and abused her small children, she refused to allow anyone else to care or show compassion towards them. When they became adults she stalked and tortured anyone they dared to love. Everyone she met, adult or child was tortured by her cruelty and exposure to violence, criminal activity, vulgarity, and hatred of the gentle or kind human spirit.

    On behalf of her children whom she so abrasively exposed to her evil and violent life, we celebrate her passing from this earth and hope she lives in the after-life reliving each gesture of violence, cruelty, and shame that she delivered on her children. Her surviving children will now live the rest of their lives with the peace of knowing their nightmare finally has some form of closure.

    Most of us have found peace in helping those who have been exposed to child abuse and hope this message of her final passing can revive our message that abusing children is unforgiveable, shameless, and should not be tolerated in a “humane society”. Our greatest wish now, is to stimulate a national movement that mandates a purposeful and dedicated war against child abuse in the United States of America.

  126. 126.

    fka AWS

    p0k3r, c1aIis, sho3s, etc. are in the spam filter for a reason. Unless you want the comments overrun with bots posting “click here” links, the spam filter is a good thing.

  129. 129.

    WereBear

    @ruemara: 6 years, no meal-as long as the black woman is there. White guy returns, oh dear, he deserves to be fed. It ain’t the food, it’s the principle. I wish I could describe the level of hurt I feel. When I do it, it’s nothing and worthless. Way to be, people.

    You are right, and of course you feel that way.

    Anyone would.

    You’d think, the number of useless white guys laying around, that they would be devalued. So much for the free market!

  136. 136.

    ruemara

    @efgoldman: Unfortunately, I work for a public agency, with a very liberal, PC, tolerant collection of elected, who upon taking power have systematically removed or displaced anyone a shade too brown or with any icky accents. This has been pointed out by our non-so brown and perfectly accented seniors, who have shrugged it off as sad but not worthy of standing up to. And it isn’t about being shat on, it’s about the hidden bigotry.

  138. 138.

    Belafon

    @raven: I’m pretty sure Obama will “blink” very slowly and basically order all of the force that was currently in Syria out of the country. And then, a few days later, people will finally realize that nothing had to be moved.

  139. 139.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @raven: For reasons I prefer not to elaborate on, my choices of pundits tonight were Mara Liasson and Wolf Blitzer. So I turned off radio and TV, listened on the White House feed, and am getting my commentary from Balloon Juice. So much better.

  142. 142.

    ruemara

    @Betty Cracker: I think, considering the locale and the amount of lawyers in the electeds and the utter subtlety of the actions with sorta sensible reasons, I’d have no actionable case. Now the corruption and collusion info I’m sitting on, that’s another thing entirely.

    @raven: No worries. I just had not a single person to say it to. Drawback of too many workplace friends.

  147. 147.

    PsiFighter37

    So how did Obama fail us in the speech tonight? I didn’t bother to watch…more interested in the primary results in NYC.

  152. 152.

    Belafon

    @raven: Raven, you totally deserved that. I, a white male, understood what rumera wrote. Don’t go off on Elie for your boneheadednessessess (felt it needed more suffixes).

    ETA: I see you apologized.

  155. 155.

    rikyrah

    @Redshirt:

    That the Freepers have gone head over heal in love with Putin is something I could not have predicted 5 years ago. Showing me that yes, as cynical as I have grown, I can still be surprised.

    Obama Derangement Syndrome will do that to you.

  156. 156.

    PaulW

    @Redshirt:

    We’re gonna take this to the 12th Dimension, man.

    Obama is a master of Bosonic String Theory?!

    That would explain how Obama is able to manipulate all reality to do all the things the Birthers accuse him of doing.

  157. 157.

    Davis X. Machina

    @efgoldman: Jean Shepherd used to claim sometimes that he was broadcasting from WOR’s transmitter shack in the Jersey marshes, and was making tea with the hot water from the water-cooled finals… I didn’t know such things really happened.

  160. 160.

    ruemara

    @Belafon: Oh, behave. Raven’s a good egg and lord knows, it’s not like I was twerking and set myself on fire.

    @MomSense: TY. I love me some Etta. Even if that song makes me want to punch a man out.

  162. 162.

    Ruckus

    @raven:
    Not even close. Referring to someone who’s name starts with a C.

    I would have thought you would recognize a regular poster and understand her point of view but some times the trigger finger is just too fast.

    You misunderstood but far more important you apologized right away. I’d say that’s the end of any issue anyone might have.

  164. 164.

    Howard Beale IV

    @Omnes Omnibus: At one time the United States was not to be fucked with. Unfortunately, thanks to circumstances beyond our control, not only are we made fools of, but we also destroy ourselves from within at the same time.

  165. 165.

    scav

    @ruemara: Small cheap-minded and obvious with it and abetted by people who just won’t bother to pay attention. <clink>. Sure are a lot of them. Sorry.

  167. 167.

    lamh36

    so let me see if I understand this. The out cry was Obama should get Congressional approval before engaging in war. So Obama calls for Congressional vote and now Congresspeople upset because they don’t want to have to vote at all.

    And Obama is supposed to be the weak one?

  169. 169.

    Bobby Thomson

    @raven: Jesus Fucking Christ on a stick, you can be a total asshole.

    ETA: OK, I’m a little late. Glad you apologized.

  170. 170.

    Baud

    Oh Rand (via TPM):

    Sen. Rand Paul (R-KY) on Tuesday night reiterated his opposition to the use of military force in Syria, but said that Bashar al-Assad deserves to die if his regime was responsible for a chemical weapons attack that reportedly killed more than 1,000 of his own people last month.
    ……
    “It is a violation of every norm for someone to kill civilians,” Paul said. “I think Assad should be accountable. I think if Assad’s responsible, he deserves death for this. To kill civilian (sic) and women and children is without excuse, there is no justification for it.”

    But Paul, one of the most vocal opponents of military action in Syria, said that the administration’s call for limited airstrikes would do little to degrade Assad.

  171. 171.

    CaseyL

    @ruemara: The bigotry doesn’t sound very “hidden” to me. Is your workplace immune from lawsuits because it’s a government agency?

  172. 172.

    the Conster

    @Redshirt:

    Me too. I’ve got his back, and that’s the way it is with me and everyone who knows me knows it. I’m determined for him to succeed, because the alternative (Republicanism) is unthinkable.

  178. 178.

    different-church-lady

    @Redshirt: The cool thing is nobody actually got into an argument about anything. They just went right for the personal insults.

  179. 179.

    MomSense

    Anyone else catch this in the speech?

    However, over the last few days, we’ve seen some encouraging signs, in part because of the credible threat of U.S. military action, as well as constructive talks that I had with President Putin. The Russian government has indicated a willingness to join with the international community in pushing Assad to give up his chemical weapons. The Assad regime has now admitting that it has these weapons and even said they’d join the Chemical Weapons Convention, which prohibits their use.

  180. 180.

    Davis X. Machina

    @lamh36: I remember some wag years ago on the BBC explaining that MP’s dream at night about magically being able to simultaneously enter both lobbies on the same vote.

  182. 182.

    Ruckus

    @ruemara:
    @rikyrah: is absolutely right, there isn’t a black person(OK Clarence Thomas, Herman Cain) who wouldn’t understand. There are quite a few white folks who understand as well. We don’t know the feeling directly but we do understand how shitty it is.
    Have a hug, it might help.

  183. 183.

    Redshirt

    @the Conster: I only do so because I judge Obama as utterly sincere, and the Republicans as completely and totally craven. As such, even if he were to make a mistake (I don’t think he has), it would be a mistake, and we’re all imperfect. Maybe except for Barry. And to bury someone because of a mistake in the face of unrelenting evil is just beyond my comprehension. The stakes are too fucking enormous.

  189. 189.

    Cacti

    @Betty Cracker:

    I’m calling you out, you lying prick. Links to the so-called rage-gasms, or back the fuck off. Calling you out as a liar and a moron doesn’t count, by the way, since that’s what you are. Put up or shut up, motherfucker.

    Don’t be angry at me that you and the rest of the “Syria is Iraq, Obama is Bush” front page circle-jerkers have turned out look like a bunch of gibbering morons.

    Take that aggression out on your drums.

  191. 191.

    ruemara

    @CaseyL: I think so. Not that they don’t make mistakes, but they are very good at finding something that can be reasonable. The fact that they’re now spending 2x my salary as a budget cut, well, that’s cos things didn’t exactly work as intended! And that my job became superfluous as friends of the electeds needed a contract, and I went natural with my hair, well, coincidence.

    @raven: I’d rather an honest mistake from an honest person, than the slimy bucket of knives I’ve been living every damned day for the past couple of years. And yes, we have a great bunch of folks in the BJ commentariat.

  196. 196.

    MomSense

    @ruemara:

    want to punch a man out

    Definitely know how you feel! Let’s just say I had a grabby boss who skirted with the harassment line like he knew exactly what he was doing.

  197. 197.

    Ladybug

    Just for anyone who actually has watched TV are any of them talking about how Obama & Putin talked about Syria putting their CW under international protection, or about reports that Kerry & his counterpart were in discussions for weeks over this?

    Or, are we still on the “Kerry made a gaffe” line of thinking?

  203. 203.

    SIA

    Oh, behave. Raven’s a good egg and lord knows, it’s not like I was twerking and set myself on fire.

    Best sentence on the internets today.

  204. 204.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @MomSense: But unless they refresh, they won’t see the exhortation to refresh. And if they do refresh, they won’t need it. Speaking of needing, now I need a drink.

  205. 205.

    Keith G

    @lamh36:

    So Obama calls for Congressional vote and now Congresspeople upset because they don’t want to have to vote at all.

    Well actually if my math is correct, the White House has requested that no additional votes be held while the diplomatic initiative is give a chance.

  208. 208.

    Omnes Omnibus

    Of course, everyone realizes that if the deal does go through and Assad does anything with chemicals in the future, bombing is on in an instant, right?

  210. 210.

    muddy

    My son just sent me this link, Monty Python and the Holy Grail modern trailer. You can tell he has been brought up right that he knew to bring this to my attention.

  211. 211.

    different-church-lady

    So while everyone is considering what their + will consist of, I would like to mention that last night I mixed my first Monkey Gland, and it was every bit as good as its reputation.

  214. 214.

    Culture of Truth

    It was great speech. Proof is Chris Matthew has lost his fucking mind. Also, this is who I voted for. Smart, effective.

  215. 215.

    CaseyL

    @ruemara: IANAL, but if you’ve been able to log each incident, and show a pattern of discrimination, an attorney or firm that takes on discrimination suits might at least be able to tell you what your options are.

    My apologies if you’ve tried that; I don’t know what recourses you’ve already looked into, or if you figure – in this economy – it’s best to not stir things up.

  219. 219.

    MikeJ

    @Omnes Omnibus: I’m ok with that.

    The other thing people should realise is that the next country to use chemical weapons is also going to be threatened, and if they don’t roll over, we will launch them. Threats only work when they’re credible,.

  220. 220.

    fuckwit

    What I find most amusing about Obama and many people who deal with him or alk/write/comment about him, is that he’s not doing anything complicated or fancy. He’s very consistent, very simple, very clear. There’s nothing complex about what he’s doing. He has a rock-steady compass, a very consistent set of principles, and there’s nothing complex about it. But it’s so different from how many people in politics operate or what they are used to, so alien, that it confuses people and makes them think he’s doing some 11-dimensional shit. He’s not.

    What he does is almost always very strraightforward. People miss it because they’re not looking for it.

  221. 221.

    Chris

    @ruemara:
    Hi I am a “unspecified minority” as well..Way back when our boys were small we attended this pretty ritzy Episcopal church (doctor types..and ever so tolerant..we even had a gay couple in the pews back in 98) Well on the weekends when some of the less melanin enhanced young families brought their children there were always people lined up to work in the nursery…When it turned to to be just our two? Not so much. I felt exactly the same way…Every minority feels ya….

  223. 223.

    MomSense

    @nineone:

    Yes, good and even though the cable “news” missed it, there has been much reporting of the diplomatic efforts. The idea that this is Putin’s idea when it has been discussed for more than 2 years now is ridiculous.

    I also loved this part.

    Other questions involve the dangers of retaliation. We don’t dismiss any threats, but the Assad regime does not have the ability to seriously threaten our military. Any other — any other retaliation they might seek is in line with threats that we face every day. Neither Assad nor his allies have any interest in escalation that would lead to his demise, and our ally, Israel, can defend itself with overwhelming force, as well as the unshakable support of the United States of America.

    The joint naval operation with Israel on 9/3 was also sending a message.

  225. 225.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @ruemara: If you are at a public agency, there should be an EEOC office to which you can go confidentially. Based on what you have said, there is enough there for further investigation. IMHO.

  226. 226.

    lamh36

    @Keith G: I was talking about the INITIAL call for their to be a Congressional vote.

    Prior to all this, their were reports that Congress people were pissed because “they want to pass something, but they don’t want to vote for it”.

  227. 227.

    Emma

    @fuckwit: I love watching the Press trying to find the meaning behind the words. I feel like screaming There’s no hidden meaning, you morons. He means exactly what he says!

  230. 230.

    SIA

    @lamh36: No kidding!

    I’m tired of the eye-rolling and the easy nit-picking of the president’s leadership on this over the last few weeks,

    Yeah, me too Andrew.

  232. 232.

    Cacti

    @Betty Cracker:

    Oh, you got nothing? Quelle surprise, you lying, demented fuck.

    When you know you’ve been on the wrong side, aggressively deny and act indignant.

    It’s an old PR strategy. Yawn.

    Meanwhile, in angry Betty’s world:

    This weekend, President Obama partially convinced John “Bomb-Bomb-Bomb” McCain and his zany sidekick, Lindsey “More Butch than 10,000 Teabaggers” Graham, of the wisdom of his Syria intervention policy. The hotheaded duo imply they were lured onboard by assurances of extra ka-booms, covert operations and other cool war-stuff executed by not-their-kids.

    With Boehner now signaling his willingness to go along, it’s clear that Obama has dialed the correct sleep number into the GOPosturepedic — so far. How far rightward is he willing to be dragged to keep their support, if at all?

    The President is being dragged rightward, AND…

    I was in the “let’s wait and see if someone other than ‘unnamed sources’ confirms that the president intends to launch a strike against Syria before we freak out” camp. Well, if Kerry’s presentation is any indication, it’s on.

    ETA: Briefing over. Kerry threw in some weasel words that leave open the possibility that there will be no bombing, but yeah, it sure sounds like they’re going to expend some ordnance.

    And John Kerry is a weasel looking to expend some ordnance.

    I hear confession is good for the soul, so give this one a try Betty:

    “I, Betty Cracker, was full of shit in my analysis on Syria”.

  233. 233.

    Keith G

    @Omnes Omnibus: It’s possible that this as as it seems and also it is possible that this is a ruse – a play for time which might favor those who are trying to build pressure opposing military action.

  235. 235.

    mai naem

    @ruemara: That is really shitty. I’ve had similar stuff happen. I totally get it. Not sure it’s illegal enough for a lawsuit though :< ( I would think on it and let the boss know that you know at an appropriate time.

  236. 236.

    jl

    @ruemara:

    I guess I can understand your sense of betrayal. As part of the white guy club, I have to say I am not surprised that could happen. There are enough retrograde scared and bitter white guys around to get that job done.

  237. 237.

    Betty Cracker

    @different-church-lady: What’s in that? I’m having a white Russian because Putin FTW! (That last part’s a joke, BTW. Figured I better add that in case the succulent shit-fer-brain’s case of Phantom Firebagger Syndrome is contageous.)

  239. 239.

    nineone

    @ruemara: Apparently they are not up to speed on that whole “racial entitlement” thing. I’d blame Obama, but he seems to be on a bit of a roll lately.

    And if there is any of that fire twerking, pics or it didn’t happen.

  240. 240.

    Culture of Truth

    That’s just an added bonus. How does it compare to the great “debate #1″ meltdown?

    The first debate wasn’t good but I told people not to panic and that team Obama would recover and win.

    Tweety seems to think Obama is going to bomb every elementary school in Syria.

    Clearly he’s making up for supporting Bush. As Bill Cosby said of his tough mother as doting grandmother, ‘you are looking at an old person trying to get into heaven.”

  241. 241.

    different-church-lady

    @Betty Cracker: Sorry, I deliberately didn’t link or describe, so that you’d all go off on your own research journeys.

    ETA: the only thing I’ll tell you is that you probably don’t want to move on to a Monkey Gland after a White Russian.

  244. 244.

    Culture of Truth

    Personally I don’t think bombing Syria would be worst thing in the world. But no one wants that, especially Obama, but to avoid bombing you have to make it clear you are willing to bomb.

  249. 249.

    Ladybug

    @Culture of Truth:

    By the “first debate meltdown” I meant Chris Matthews meltdown after the debate. Granted, it’s been a while, but from what I recall didn’t Chris Matthews sort of lose his shit over the first debate?

    Thanks for the info so somehow pursuing diplomacy (while keeping our military options open) = carpet bombing Syria.

    hmm

  251. 251.

    jl

    I thought it was a good speech. I thought the case for a chemical attack was perfunctory and weak, but I am biased (I’m against the strikes) and it had to be crammed into what was advertised to be a 10 to 15 minute speech.

    I think Obama clearly said he would pursue the diplomatic option seriously, and I think that is good.

    I’m sparing myself the media analysis. My blood pressure has been under control through exercise and a healthful slimming diet, I don’t want to mess it up again.

    I think Obama is starting to look like that lousy impersonation they do on SNL. The job is taking its toll.

  254. 254.

    patroclus

    @PaulW: Nah, he picked Gilligan’s Island.

    Pretty effective speech – I’m glad Obama is trying to enforce the Chemical Weapons conventions. I don’t want to bomb because I don’t think it would do much good, but this latest diplomatic track may prove fruitful. Glad to see the threat of bombing has forced the Russians and the Syrians to blink.

  255. 255.

    Cacti

    @Ruckus:

    You really should get a fucking life.

    The one you have now really isn’t working for you.

    I’ll get right on that, internet person Ruckus who took the time to read my posts.

    lol

  257. 257.

    Davis X. Machina

    @Culture of Truth:

    Clearly he’s making up for supporting Bush.

    Matthews was originally opposed to W’s excellent Iraqi adventure. His last column for the SF Chronicle (in 2002) was in opposition to the coming war. The rest came later.

  258. 258.

    Epicurus

    Jumping in late here, but this thread is EPIC! Sorry for the last part…first an Anchorman reference, Ella Fitzgerald, and someone wants to know the NYC primary results. This just went to “11”…btw, DeBlasio is leading strong atm, still not a whole bunch of reports. The NYT site has him at 38.8%, Thompson 25.8, and Quinn 15.7. BDB needs 40% to avoid a runoff, I think he’s going to get it. Play nice, y’all.

  261. 261.

    Howard Beale IV

    @Omnes Omnibus: Ya gotta make sure they work, after all. Simulations are all and good, but nothing says that we mean fucking business like a good healthy dose of fusion-based reality.

  262. 262.

    jl

    @Ladybug:

    ” Chris Matthews sort of lose his shit ”

    Seems like he just does that from time to time. I don’t know if there is a pattern or there is some trigger. I only watch clips of him when they are posted after it happens, since I think they are fun to watch.

  264. 264.

    Culture of Truth

    @Davis X. Machina: Well, I phrased it carefully because he claims to have opposed the Iraq war. But his embarrasing bromance with Bush is well documented and he is making up for it with near hysteria now.

  267. 267.

    Chris

    @jl:

    I guess I can understand your sense of betrayal. As part of the white guy club, I have to say I am not surprised that could happen. There are enough retrograde scared and bitter white guys around to get that job done.

    As part of the white guy club, what’s always infuriated me is the fucking Blue Code of Silence like rule that says you never assume the worst of your fellow white guys, and you never accuse them in public of any racially motivated indecent behavior… but on the other hand, when they think they’re in privacy with nothing but their own bros, damn if it all doesn’t come out (though usually preceded by an “I’m not a racist, but…” chuckle. You understand. We’re all white men here, and we gotta stick together). I can totally see how the mentality can lead to “hey, keep it on the down-low, but we’re not going to give the black lady her lunch, alright?”

    I mostly notice it among my elders (Millennial here), but it’s not unknown in my generation either.

  270. 270.

    different-church-lady

    For those unclear, Chris Matthews is a goddamned nincompoop. Further investigation is a wasted endeavor.

  277. 277.

    srv

    Pat Lang’s site says the Joos or the Risen-from-Dead Bandar Bush will engineer a False Flag scenario shortly.

    These guys sure don’t help a realist pushing a R2P-neocon love triangle in the Obama NSC meme.

    I can’t even post there anymore, all my handles banned after he started linking to infowars.

  279. 279.

    MomSense

    @Emma:

    The thing is, they don’t respect him enough to listen to what he actually says. He has been proving them wrong for so long now they can’t help themselves.

  280. 280.

    Jane2

    @Cacti: Are you reading BJ in an alternative universe? Betty was never what you describe on this issue (only on issues of dogs and drool, but I digress).

  282. 282.

    jl

    @Chris: Yeah. I’m not a racist/bigot, but… I’m not a sexist, but… I have nothing against immigrants but… And since you are a Millennial I hate to break it to you, but the older ones don’t bother with excuses before they tear into these damn kids today seem like they don’t want too.. (“eat shit like you did and pretend to lie it?” I want to say…)

    I had to work a project with a covert sexist once. Forced him to depend on a brilliant and disciplined woman on the project. I observed some reformation, but there was backsliding as soon as resources and money were on the line.

    Edit: It was nice forcing a bigshot to do something he didn’t want to, though. Being a numbers person has some advantages sometimes.

  283. 283.

    Betty Cracker

    @Cacti: You really are deranged if you think speculation like that is tantamount to “Syria = Iraq” and “Obama = Bush,” which is the idiotic accusation you keep making. Since when is it out of bounds to wonder if congress might drag Obama rightward on policy? Newsflash, sparky: It happens all the time. Compromise, coalition building, remember? Sometimes it changes policy for the worse. (See ACA and Dodd-Frank)

    Also:

    Kerry threw in some weasel words that leave open the possibility that there will be no bombing, but yeah, it sure sounds like they’re going to expend some ordnance.

    Does not equal:

    John Kerry is a weasel looking to expend some ordnance.

    Those other words in that sentence? They mean things.But nice try.

    As for whose Syria analysis is bullshit, just a few days ago, you were running around shrieking that anyone who isn’t for bombing Syria immediately is a monster who is looking forward to the hideous gassing deaths of Syrian children. Interesting how quickly you jumped on the diplomacy bandwagon. But Dag Hammarskjöld you ain’t. An asshole you are.

  284. 284.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Chris: One of the best things I have ever seen in response that “we are all white guys” attitude was an older guy who, after someone made a crass comment as we were waiting for a meeting to start, simply got up and said “I am not going to sit here and listen to this kind of thing. Someone please come and let me know when the meeting begins,” and then walked out.

  287. 287.

    Howard Beale IV

    @different-church-lady: Obama boxed himself into a corner, and is grasping at anything that gives him any kind of an out.

    The problem is that Obama allowed himself to get pigeonholed in the first place-and with the constant drip-drip-drip of the NSA fuckups being exposed on a continual basis one has to start asking some serious questions as to why the Administration allowed such a crises to develop in the first place.

  288. 288.

    jl

    @srv: Lang. Dammit. I went over there awhile ago since I thought he maybe would have some facts and figures and analysis from his knowledge of the region. And it looks like he has lost his mind. (edit again, he’s kind of like Tweety that way)

    I was going to check on his reaction to the speech, and you reminded me about it.

    Dang you, I will make you will pay for that. Somehow or other.

  293. 293.

    hildebrand

    @Howard Beale IV:

    The problem is that Obama allowed himself to get pigeonholed in the first place-and with the constant drip-drip-drip of the NSA fuckups being exposed on a continual basis one has to start asking some serious questions as to why the Administration allowed such a crises to develop in the first place.

    Alex Jones wants his talking points back.

  295. 295.

    Cacti

    @Betty Cracker:

    “I was taken out of context!”

    Wow, who could have seen that defense coming from a mile away?

    I see you completely omitted any mention of your Obama is being dragged rightward comments.

    And speaking of diplomacy, it’s precious that you’re naive enough to believe that Assad ever would have coming to the bargaining table if the threat of force wasn’t a real possibility.

    Obama and previous Democratic Presidents: si vis pacem, para bellum

    Betty Cracker: Everybody’s talkin ’bout bagism, shagism, dragism, madism, ragism, tagism, this-ism, that-ism, ism, ism, ism. All we are saying, is give peace a chance!

  296. 296.

    jl

    @Davis X. Machina:

    ” Don’t buy it. ” re the dreck Fournier is peddling; That column doesn’t tell you everything you need to know about him. He phoned it in. His heart was in the the weaknesses that Obama showed, and maybe if he decided to make that the whole column, it would have bee fun in a demented way.

  298. 298.

    srv

    @jl: Well. after a couple of weeks of hair on fire, he does have a post up saying he is waiting on the speechifying.

    I think this is one of his elderly breaks. He waffles between Dempsey and Hagelian love and my-bros-say-Obama-is-war-happy.

    It’s all been about how reality has been manufactured. He apparently knew Bandar, and thinks he’s behind everything.

  302. 302.

    Cacti

    @Betty Cracker:

    Since when is it out of bounds to wonder if congress might drag Obama rightward on policy?

    I was wrong, you did mention it.

    Now that’s a novel defense:

    “Even though I was wrong, I could have been right.”

    Hmmm…Credibility scores: Obama 1, Kerry 1, Betty Cracker 0

  304. 304.

    Jane2

    @Cacti: I particularly liked the parts of the speech where Obama pretended the USA could pick and choose among the opposition as to who would be the next Islamic fundamentalist dictator.

  305. 305.

    Cacti

    @nineone:

    This is so fucking cool. It’s like Thelma and J.J from Good Times, ‘cept they were actually funny once in a while.

    I’ll try and throw in an occasional “Dynomite!” for you.

  307. 307.

    Cacti

    @Jane2:

    I particularly liked the parts of the speech where Obama pretended the USA could pick and choose among the opposition as to who would be the next Islamic fundamentalist dictator

    I hear he’s also really dumb and had to be rescued by Putin.

    I read it at The Nation’s website.

  308. 308.

    Betty Cracker

    @Cacti:You really are nuts. I never said I was taken out of context (pro tip: you’re not supposed to put quotes around words unless they are, you know, QUOTES), and I addressed the Obama dragged rightward thing right there in the third line. You’re babbling, and you’re pulling things I never said straight out of your ass. Thanks for demonstrating so conclusively that you’re a lying jackass.

  309. 309.

    Jane2

    @Cacti: I like how you ascribe all sorts of things people didn’t say to make your point, thereby proving Betty’s point. So what’s the opposition composed of, genius?

  310. 310.

    Davis X. Machina

    @srv: I’m waiting for a Sharks v. Jets throwdown between the Bandar-is-behind-it-all people and the Mossad-is-behind-all people.

  311. 311.

    SarahT

    So I’ve read this entire thread & just have to say that you people are pretty much the most entertainingly dysfunctional family EVAH – so much better than watching post-speech & election night blather. Thanks, Balloon-Juicers, and GO GO GO DeBlasio/Stringer/James/Brewer and (Brooklyn DA) Thompson !

  312. 312.

    Suffern ACE

    @Howard Beale IV: the crises developed because Assad’s regime used chemical weapons. The crises did not arise because of NSA leaks. The reason the crises developed is that the United States does not have any leverage with Syria. The reason that Syria could use those weapons consequence free is that Russia has leverage over Syria and refused to use that leverage. If the US was the arms supplier to Syria, it could cut off a supply.

    Whether or not Syria cares if the NSA gets the proper warrants under us law seems to be besides the point.

  313. 313.

    Cacti

    @Betty Cracker:

    You really are nuts. I never said I was taken out of context (pro tip: you’re not supposed to put quotes around words unless they are, you know, QUOTES), and I addressed the Obama dragged rightward thing right there in the third line. You’re babbling, and you’re pulling things I never said straight out of your ass. Thanks for demonstrating so conclusively that you’re a lying jackass.

    Poor thing. You’re just not used having it pointed out when you’re dead ass wrong.

    Betty: How dare you take things that I said in a way that’s unflattering to me!

    Glenn, is that you?

  314. 314.

    SarahT

    So I’ve read this entire thread & just have to say that you people are pretty much the most entertaining dysfunctional family EVAH – so much better than watching post-speech & election night blather. Thanks, Balloon-Juicers, and GO GO GO DeBlasio/Stringer/James/Brewer and (Brooklyn DA) Thompson !

  315. 315.

    Culture of Truth

    Ron Fournier is an awful human who violated every tenet of a journalist forever and ever by sending love notes to Karl Rove. He has no credibilty beyond Obama hate which is genuine.

  316. 316.

    SarahT

    So I’ve read this entire thread & just have to say that you people are pretty much the most entertaining dysfunctional family around: so much better than watching post-speech & election night blather. Thanks, Balloon-Juicers, and GO GO GO DeBlasio/Stringer/James/Brewer and (Brooklyn DA) Thompson !

  317. 317.

    Cacti

    @Jane2:

    I like how you ascribe all sorts of things people didn’t say to make your point, thereby proving Betty’s point. So what’s the opposition composed of, genius?

    They’re all scary Mooslims of course. Be afraid!

    ETA: You may find this hard to believe, but in a country where Islam is the dominant religion, Islamic groups are going to have a seat at the table in any peace negotiations (gasp).

  321. 321.

    Jane2

    @Cacti: Such witty repartee.

    Of course they’re Muslims, but that is not the point. Perhaps you should do some reading as to which groups make up the opposition. By saying that, I’m not pro-Assad or anti-intervention….just be very careful what you wish for. There are no white and black hats in Syria.

  322. 322.

    nineone

    @Cacti:

    I read it at The Nation’s website.

    I hear all the groovy dude and dudettes are also too hanging out at Tucker’s place these days, dontchaknow. Oh yah, I hear it’s a real shindig.

  324. 324.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    @seaboogie: I was 10 and on a White House tour, I was tired and sat in one of the chairs. I was yelled at. There are 4 chairs there, 2 on each side of the entrance to the Blue Room.

  326. 326.

    Ladybug

    too lazy to look it up myself, but after Bush gave a speech on Iraq, did any Democrat offer a counter speech or rebuttal speech like Rand Paul?

    Or is this just something just for this President?

  329. 329.

    jl

    @BillinGlendaleCA:

    Who yelled at you? The WH people or your parents, or your group leader?

    What did the President know about it and when did he know? Democrat or Republican?

    Did Cheney ever find out and if he did, why are you still alive?

  332. 332.

    Cacti

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    No. Cacti gets overly invested in his arguments and goes a bit nuts on occasion. T&H is a douchecanoe.

    To be understood by a man like Broken Sword…

    *sniffle

  333. 333.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    @jl:

    Who yelled at you? The WH people or your parents, or your group leader?

    The White House people.

    What did the President know about it and when did he know? Democrat or Republican?

    Howard Baker asked the same question about the same President a few years later. The President at the time was a Republican.

    Did Cheney ever find out and if he did, why are you still alive?

    Cheney wasn’t Chief of Staff until the next President.

  336. 336.

    jl

    @Ladybug:

    ” Or is this just something just for this President? ”

    I am interested to find out. The GOP must think it’s a great gimmick, and as long as that party stays in its current demented mode, we will see GOP rebuttals to fast food photo ops of the next Dem Pres ordering burgers.

    The Dems will jump on board, and I wonder if they will put on a similar pre-taped fail parade during a GOP administration. I guess rebuttals could be good.

    But a commenter above was right I just listened to Paul’s rebuttal, and whatever Obama is, Paul makes him look like a fricken genius.

  341. 341.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @jl:

    I just listened to Paul’s rebuttal,

    Self-hatred? Lost a bet? Less bloody than cutting yourself? IOW, why would you do that?

  342. 342.

    Ladybug

    @jl:

    See, I never really saw the point of rebuttals right after the speech. For the most part, you don’t know what POTUS is going to say (except for some excerpts) before the speech is actually given. I mean having Rand Paul give a speech from his basement or wherever, doesn’t quite have the gravitas as POTUS giving a West Wing speech.

  345. 345.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Ladybug: The only one that stands out as memorable in a positive way is Jim Webb’s SOTU rebuttal. Usually they are either debacles or forgettable. Not good odds.

  346. 346.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    @Ladybug: I think for SOTU speeches, they have the speech ahead of time. In this case, they didn’t. And to nit a bit, this wasn’t a West Wing speech, it was in the Residence.

  348. 348.

    The Moar You Know

    @ruemara: That is one of the most fucked-up things I’ve ever heard. All I can say is “people are assholes” – I’m dealing with a few right now trying to steal everything me and my family owns – but it doesn’t make it any easier.

    I am very, very sorry.

  349. 349.

    RobinDC

    Cacti is not unique. No, Cacti is a perfect representative for the average balloon-juice commenter. What a shithole this site has turned into.

  350. 350.

    Ruckus

    @Ladybug:
    If Ann Rand Paul gave a speech from the Oval Office it still wouldn’t have any gravitas.

    Sort of like Cacti. An ass for the sake of being an ass. IOW no redeeming value. Whatsoever.

  363. 363.

    Roxy

    Just in case you need a bigger push of not being able to keep WKRP theme song out of your head, here’s the lyrics:

    Baby, if you’ve ever wondered,
    Wondered whatever became of me,
    I’m living on the air in Cincinnati,
    Cincinnati, WKRP.
    Got kind of tired packing and unpacking,
    Town to town and up and down the dial
    Maybe you and me were never meant to be,
    But baby think of me once in awhile.
    I’m at WKRP in Cincinnati..

    Of course now I can’t get the theme song out of my head

  364. 364.

    Donut

    @Betty Cracker:

    Silly Betty. You didn’t know that in 2013 there are only two sects in the liberal tribe. After five years of the Obama presidency, one may only be an Obot or a Firebagger. Sincere questioning and thoughts that do not conform to the allowable categories are not permitted. Please relinquish your blogging credentials, as you are clearly no longer qualified to operate the Internet.

  365. 365.

    Suffern ACE

    OK. So beyond the chemical weapons, what are they going to be negotiating over? Is there a negotiating table?

  366. 366.

    Bobby Thomson

    @patroclus:

    Nah, he picked Gilligan’s Island.

    Well, it’s versatile. You can substitute the lyrics to Amazing Grace or House of the Rising Sun, or the Rime of the Ancient Mariner. Or vice versa.

  373. 373.

    dww44

    @ruemara: That whole think sucks. Petty and mean. If I ruled your domain, I’d compensate you for the wrongs done to you and do it quite publicly, too.

  374. 374.

    dww44

    @Chris: Sorta like those Newsmax headlines up there on the right. Doesn’t pay to pay too much attention to them. However, I wholeheartedly agree with you. Which is why, in the instance of Syria, I’ve moved from being against a military incursion to being maybe predisposed towards it. Especially if the diplomacy works.

    However, there are a few not so conservative sites on these nets that utilize the cheap misleading headlines while adhering somewhat to the facts of the story in the story. Grabbing page views. Huffington Post comes to mind.

  378. 378.

    Yatsuno

    @Mnemosyne (iPhone): This is at a university??? Ruemara, honey, you need to go to your EEO office like YESTERDAY and start getting things on the record. Universities live and die by their reputations, and a blatant incident of discrimination is a huge black mark that makes donors close their chequebooks.

  383. 383.

    Ted & Hellen

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    Cacti gets overly invested in his arguments and goes a bit nuts on occasion. T&H is a douchecanoe.

    It’s true!

    I still say Cacti is a woman though.

  385. 385.

    fuckwit

    @Baud: Also, threatening to blow the fuck out of people IS doing the diplomacy thing. Actually blowing the fuck out of them, not so much.

  386. 386.

    J R in WV

    @Mike E:

    Mike E says:
    September 10, 2013 at 9:03 pm

    @schrodinger’s cat: String Theory. Very irresistible to cats too. As well.

    Also, too puppies, as well, too.

  394. 394.

    StringOnAStick

    Diplomacy works best when backed by credible threat. Excellent job, Mr. President!

    And whoever noted above that the Pres is Mr. Consistent was so, so right. DC has become such an freak show that being Mr. Consistent looks entirely novel, when it really should be the norm.

Comments are closed.