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Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

I’d hate to be the candidate who lost to this guy.

They are lying in pursuit of an agenda.

Sadly, there is no cure for stupid.

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My years-long effort to drive family and friends away has really paid off this year.

The words do not have to be perfect.

The republican caucus is already covering themselves with something, and it’s not glory.

Do not shrug your shoulders and accept the normalization of untruths.

“Squeaker” McCarthy

Never entrust democracy to any process that requires republicans to act in good faith.

Perhaps you mistook them for somebody who gives a damn.

Accountability, motherfuckers.

Republicans seem to think life begins at the candlelight dinner the night before.

A thin legal pretext to veneer over their personal religious and political desires

This really is a full service blog.

We’ve had enough carrots to last a lifetime. break out the sticks.

Wow, you are pre-disappointed. How surprising.

Meanwhile over at truth Social, the former president is busy confessing to crimes.

Let’s not be the monsters we hate.

Whoever he was, that guy was nuts.

I didn’t have alien invasion on my 2023 BINGO card.

Let’s delete this post and never speak of this again.

When do the post office & the dmv weigh in on the wuhan virus?

Come on, man.

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You are here: Home / Economics / Grifters Gonna Grift / Open Thread: They’re All Bozos Marks on That Bus…

Open Thread: They’re All Bozos Marks on That Bus…

by Anne Laurie|  October 25, 20137:46 pm| 74 Comments

This post is in: Grifters Gonna Grift, Open Threads, Assholes

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@billmon1 Pretty sure Tea Party groups understand Koch Brothers are 1 big, elaborate grift. Dont think they understand that THEY'RE the mark

— Jonathan Lundell (@jklundell) October 22, 2013

@jklundell OK, sure, they all marks. But the Kochs are the "whales."

— billmon (@billmon1) October 22, 2013

For home entertainment purposes, while I get TaMara’s Recipe Exchange converted.

What’s on the agenda for the start of the weekend?

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Previous Post: « Weekend Rally: Stop Watching Us
Next Post: Friday Recipe Exchange: Pumpkin Patch Edition »

Reader Interactions

74Comments

  1. 1.

    schrodinger's cat

    October 25, 2013 at 7:50 pm

    Weekend thread needs itteh bitteh IT Committeh

  2. 2.

    gbear

    October 25, 2013 at 7:50 pm

    What’s on the agenda for the start of the weekend?

    Forgetting that I have a day job.

  3. 3.

    schrodinger's cat

    October 25, 2013 at 7:51 pm

    Caught some of the snooze hour according the TV liberal Pundit Jowly (Mark Shields) if the exchanges don’t work till next year than Obama is a failed President.

  4. 4.

    PLH in NYC

    October 25, 2013 at 7:52 pm

    Woodstock Invitational Luthiers Showcase. Acoustic heaven!
    http://www.woodstockinvitational.com/

  5. 5.

    schrodinger's cat

    October 25, 2013 at 7:57 pm

    MoU-Bobo hybrid from Bangalore opines about Indian men leaving media watchcat thoroughly unimpressed.

  6. 6.

    KG

    October 25, 2013 at 7:58 pm

    all this talk of whales and marks makes me want to hit the tables this weekend…

  7. 7.

    Yatsuno

    October 25, 2013 at 8:04 pm

    There’s a blimp floating really really low over the Sound right outside my building. Since it’s painfully slow it’s providing some nifty entertainment.

  8. 8.

    Randy P

    October 25, 2013 at 8:07 pm

    On tonight’s agenda: POPCORN!

    Just popped popcorn right on the cob. That was kind of fun. Just as I was saying “I don’t think it’s going to p…” it went off.

    Our decorative corncobs this year are all, according to the person who sold them to us, popcorn. I was skeptical but they were right! So there’s lots more coming. Just in time for what looks like lots more “Republicans circling the drains” stories next week.

    I know they’ll be back with new evil plans in time for the Nov 2014 sequel, like any good horror-movie villain, but I’m having a really good time with the news right now.

  9. 9.

    lamh36

    October 25, 2013 at 8:08 pm

    not much. I’m off this weekend, no bowling league for 2 weeks (I played 2 sets of 3 frames yesterday and my legs are killing me…BTB, what type of doctor do you go to for bone and/or muscle pain that may stem from obesity or foot issues???).

    Haven’t been home to NOLA in awhile, so me and my lil sis are gonna drive down and maybe stay til Sunday.

  10. 10.

    Yatsuno

    October 25, 2013 at 8:12 pm

    @lamh36:

    BTB, what type of doctor do you go to for bone and/or muscle pain that may stem from obesity or foot issues??

    Go to a GP first. They usually try physical therapy before a stronger intervention that requires an orthopedic visit.

  11. 11.

    Omnes Omnibus

    October 25, 2013 at 8:13 pm

    @Yatsuno: Blimps are cool.

  12. 12.

    Mnemosyne

    October 25, 2013 at 8:18 pm

    Since I may not make it to the recipe thread, I made this Beef Tagine with Butternut Squash this week and it was yum-my. The cooking time didn’t really allow for the beef to get tender, though, so next time I would make it in the crockpot.

    @lamh36:

    When you see the doc, have them check your thyroid function and also check and see if any of the symptoms of PCOS sound familiar. Those are two things that can make it damn near impossible to lose weight no matter how hard you try. Other than that … Weight Watchers. Your workplace may even offer a group so you don’t have to go offsite for meetings.

  13. 13.

    lamh36

    October 25, 2013 at 8:19 pm

    @Yatsuno: yeah, I figured I try that first. When was in DFW last year I went to a podiatrist and I already know I have issues with my feet.

    But this pain has been chronic since I started the bowling league. I’ve had this pains in my right thigh/leg area whenever I lie down. It’s not like a charlie horse, but a radiating pain whenever I turn over and it’s only when I lie down. I’m hoping it’s just some bad muscle strain. The 2 weeks off from bowling I think will tell the tale

  14. 14.

    Omnes Omnibus

    October 25, 2013 at 8:21 pm

    What’s on the agenda for the start of the weekend?

    Trying to stop being ill. Woke up this morning and I was freezing cold – hands and feet, almost shivering. It was 65 degrees in the apartment. As the day went on, I start to feel the feeling described in Comfortably Numb. So, it was cornmeal mush for breakfast and chicken broth later. Plenty of liquids and staring at the TV. I don’t get ill very often so I am not good at it.

  15. 15.

    Yatsuno

    October 25, 2013 at 8:22 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus: I think it’s a part of an enviromental protest. It has a whale with a banner saying, “Please protect my Home”. It is really cool, but it got really close to the water line. This was after it aimed for my building. That was fun, I almost wanted to head home for fear we were about to get hit.

  16. 16.

    WereBear

    October 25, 2013 at 8:22 pm

    @lamh36: You can also try the exercises at this website:

    The Egoscue Method

    He has a free phone app, too. I taught myself from his book. Lifechanging!

  17. 17.

    lamh36

    October 25, 2013 at 8:23 pm

    Somebody should forward this to Ezra Klein and the like… Booman gets it.

    A Word on a Non-Story
    by BooMan

    More than three weeks into the official roll-out of ObamaCare, I haven’t written a word in defense or as criticism of the website Healthcare.gov. The reason is pretty simple. I am perfectly content to have the Republicans pushing to make the website, and therefore the law, work better. I know that the administration is mortified about the problems they’ve encountered and totally motivated to fix them as soon as possible. They don’t need scolding from me.
    I’m not in the camp that thinks there is some moral duty not to criticize the administration over these problems, but I definitely don’t see why anyone should feel obligated to pile on. The problems will get fixed and we’ll all move on.

    In the meantime, every time the Republicans criticize the website they are defending the law, and I think that is great. I’ll be happy to give them credit for speeding up the fixes and helping to make sure the law is implemented correctly. Good job, morons.

  18. 18.

    Comrade Scrutinizer

    October 25, 2013 at 8:23 pm

    @lamh36: Couldn’t handle not bowling for two weeks. Ms CS and I are on a mixed league on Saturday night. This year has been the suck: our team keeps playing teams that bowl way over their averages that night. Killing us in league standings.

  19. 19.

    Roger Moore

    October 25, 2013 at 8:23 pm

    Who will watch grift the watchers grifters?

  20. 20.

    Yatsuno

    October 25, 2013 at 8:24 pm

    @lamh36: A GP is also cheaper than an ortho, plus PT is MUCH less expensive of an intervention. I think you could be right but the GP can help you get that all sorted out.

  21. 21.

    Mnemosyne

    October 25, 2013 at 8:26 pm

    @lamh36:

    Sounds like it could be sciatica, which makes it a back problem. The good news is, it usually responds well to physical therapy and rest.

  22. 22.

    Amir Khalid

    October 25, 2013 at 8:26 pm

    RIP Giant George. The world’s largest dog has passed away, a month before his eighth birthday.

  23. 23.

    NotMax

    October 25, 2013 at 8:30 pm

    @lamh36

    Tried compression socks?

    Just me, perhaps, but another thing I’d look into is getting better, fitted bowling shoes, maybe even orthopedic models.

  24. 24.

    Mnemosyne

    October 25, 2013 at 8:33 pm

    @lamh36:

    Also three, if you have Type II diabetes in your family, now is probably the time to start getting monitored for it. My BFF switched to a vegan diet last year because her family has a strong history of Type II and her husband has serious heart disease in his family, so they needed to make some big changes.

  25. 25.

    BGinCHI

    October 25, 2013 at 8:34 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus: Sorry to hear that brother. Feel better.

  26. 26.

    Spaghetti Lee

    October 25, 2013 at 8:37 pm

    My molars have been hurting for two days. It’s a dull sort of pain though, not a stabbing pain, so that means it’s nothing too serious, right?

  27. 27.

    lamh36

    October 25, 2013 at 8:37 pm

    @Comrade Scrutinizer: Well to be honest, I joined the league as a favor to this lady I work with (i thought I’d be bowling with her, but she already had a team so I was placed with a team that is one of the newer ones). So I didn’t really start bowling cause I love it so much…lol.

    But I’ve paid my dues and when I pay my money for anything, I’ma damn well use it til I can’t anymore. So I’m in for the long haul until the end of the league year.

    All of that is to say that I dont mind missing 2 weeks. I literally only bowl during league meets and I don’t bowl otherwise.

    The 2 weeks though is because we bowl on Thursday and the team we were gonna play against next week were playing both games so they could miss Halloween night. The next week is the week of my birthday so I can finally go back to visit my friends in DFW.

  28. 28.

    Mnemosyne

    October 25, 2013 at 8:37 pm

    My boss gave me permission to sneak home early when she left for the day, and I think I’m going to take her up on it.

    She does drive me crazy sometimes, but at least she’ll do stuff like that, too.

  29. 29.

    Baud

    October 25, 2013 at 8:40 pm

    I’ll let someone else go to TPM and figure out what this is all about.

    Great Moments in Angry White People

    In desperate bid for relevance ‘Joe the Plumber’ proves Dems are the real racists with epic cross-burning tweet.

  30. 30.

    jenn

    October 25, 2013 at 8:45 pm

    @lamh36: Yeah, I think that’s a back thing leading to nerve pain – I had a huge case several years back from doing work that was requiring me to be bent over staring at the ground for 8-12 hours a day. I’m guessing if you’re bending over as you’re bowling (which I always did, anyway!), that you’re stressing your back, which is taking it out on your sciatic nerve.

  31. 31.

    Omnes Omnibus

    October 25, 2013 at 8:45 pm

    @BGinCHI: The upside was watching all three Omen movies back to back. With the correct fuzziness of brain, they can be pretty awesome.

  32. 32.

    NotMax

    October 25, 2013 at 8:45 pm

    @Spaghettti Lee

    Sinus problems or low-grade sinus infection will often manifest as dental discomfort (and vice-versa).

  33. 33.

    Anne Laurie

    October 25, 2013 at 8:47 pm

    @lamh36:

    I’ve had this pains in my right thigh/leg area whenever I lie down. It’s not like a charlie horse, but a radiating pain whenever I turn over and it’s only when I lie down. I’m hoping it’s just some bad muscle strain. The 2 weeks off from bowling I think will tell the tale

    Ugh, if it’s a burning or ‘pins & needles’ sensation, that may be sciatica. Which is definitely related to specific extension of the tendons. Yutsano is right, go to your GP and get a recommendation for a physical therapist. And a podiatrist, to ask about shoe inserts so you don’t keep re-injuring the nerves.

    For me, the thing that helped most with sciatica was finding a good chiropractor. Some HMOs / insurance cos provide recommendations (mine even has a discount for their affliated ‘alternative medicine’ practitioners, although I paid full price for my preferred out-of-network chiropractor). Doesn’t work for everybody (the Spousal Unit tried my doc for back pain and hated the whole experience) but for some of us it’s a godsend!

  34. 34.

    Spaghetti Lee

    October 25, 2013 at 8:49 pm

    @NotMax:

    My nose feels fine, though.

  35. 35.

    Anne Laurie

    October 25, 2013 at 8:51 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus: Feel better soon. Also, check your body temp and take anti-inflammatories if it’s high, cuz that really will help make you feel less uuuurggh.

  36. 36.

    Amir Khalid

    October 25, 2013 at 8:54 pm

    @Baud:
    I seen that already. As more than a few commenters there have noted, it’s just Samuel “Joe the Plumber” being a maroon as usual.

  37. 37.

    Viva BrisVegas

    October 25, 2013 at 8:54 pm

    @Spaghetti Lee:

    My molars have been hurting for two days. It’s a dull sort of pain though, not a stabbing pain, so that means it’s nothing too serious, right?

    See a dentist quick as you can. The important thing is that you have pain, not what kind it is.

  38. 38.

    KyCole

    October 25, 2013 at 8:55 pm

    Trying to find something new to watch on Netflix or Amazon Prime, while knitting a baby blanket. Hoping for more frost tonight so I can pull those flowers out of my yard. Just got all my trees trimmed, including my neighbor’s River Birch which is planted practically next to my house, and fills my yard with twigs and leaves. I love fall!

  39. 39.

    Violet

    October 25, 2013 at 8:56 pm

    @lamh36: Are you warming up before bowling? Are you stretching afterwards? Not sure how good of shape you’re in, but if you don’t exercise much then bowling can be challenging for your body.

    It’s telling that it’s on one side of your body–probably the leg that goes forward when you step up to the line to release the ball. Also, if you’re right handed, then all your weight is on that side when you hold the ball. Your body has to compensate for that and you get sore.

    Look up some good stretches for the IT band. Here’s a good start from the Mayo Clinic. http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/stretching/sm00043&slide=6. Make sure you are stretching your lower back when you finish–toe touches, forward bend—that kind of thing. Do it before you cool down because you don’t want to stretch a cold muscle, only a warm one.

  40. 40.

    mainmati

    October 25, 2013 at 8:57 pm

    @schrodinger’s cat: Saw that too. Shields is so far beyond his sell date. It’s embarassing. Snooze hour needs to get rid of both Bobo and Jowly and start over preferably with four not two and a different complexion.

  41. 41.

    raven

    October 25, 2013 at 8:59 pm

    Just got to Lynchburg after a day on the Blue Ridge Parkway. Not the reds and golds we hoped for but the silver and white at the high elevations were spectacular.

  42. 42.

    PaulW

    October 25, 2013 at 9:00 pm

    My cat Tehya died today.

    I am not in any kind of mood right now other than massive self-loathing for not taking better care of my pets.

  43. 43.

    lamh36

    October 25, 2013 at 9:02 pm

    @Violet: that does ring a bell. u are right, I def don’t stretch before hand and any stretching I do afterwards is not much and probably not good stretches anyway.

  44. 44.

    schrodinger's cat

    October 25, 2013 at 9:02 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus: Drink lots of tea, put ginger in your regular black tea while brewing it, works wonders for colds and the flu. I hope you feel better soon.

  45. 45.

    schrodinger's cat

    October 25, 2013 at 9:04 pm

    @PaulW: {{{{PaulW}}}} she was a very pretty kitteh.

  46. 46.

    lamh36

    October 25, 2013 at 9:04 pm

    Ok, I admit, I saw this pic of the DeBlasio’s and I kinda fell in picture love. That family is just too cute.

    Meet The DeBlasios

  47. 47.

    Violet

    October 25, 2013 at 9:05 pm

    @PaulW: So sorry to hear about your kitty. Don’t be hard on yourself–you loved your cat and gave her a good home and did the best you could by her. It’s always hard to lose a loved pet. Be kind to yourself.

  48. 48.

    raven

    October 25, 2013 at 9:08 pm

    Blue Ridge

  49. 49.

    KyCole

    October 25, 2013 at 9:08 pm

    @PaulW: So sorry about your cat. My favorite cat ever looked like her. Her name was Checkers.

  50. 50.

    jenn

    October 25, 2013 at 9:10 pm

    @PaulW: Tehya was a beauty! Please take care of yourself, and don’t beat yourself up. It sounds like Tehya and Page had wonderful lives with you. (Your writeup has me waffling between the teary eyes and running nose, too.)

  51. 51.

    Violet

    October 25, 2013 at 9:10 pm

    @lamh36: Well don’t stretch beforehand–just warm up. Do something to get your heart rate elevated, even if it’s stepping in place and arm reaches toward the ceiling. Just warm your body up. Then make sure you spend at least five minutes–ten is better–stretching the key areas you used after you bowl. You could get the whole team involved and make it fun.

    Another suggestion is to cross-train. If you are bowling a lot, that’s repetitive motion. Do something that has you moving in a completely different way, like walking or yoga or Zumba. You want to use different parts of your body to even out the stress a repetitive motion activity puts on your body.

  52. 52.

    Gin & Tonic

    October 25, 2013 at 9:12 pm

    @efgoldman: Canned clam chowder should be illegal.

  53. 53.

    Amir Khalid

    October 25, 2013 at 9:15 pm

    @PaulW:
    Hugs. You can’t be sure that you actually could have done more for your kitty, so don’t be too hard on yourself over it.

  54. 54.

    Aimai

    October 25, 2013 at 9:26 pm

    @WereBear: my parents swear by egescue. They are in their eighties. My father had crippling back pain until he took up egescue.

  55. 55.

    Pogonip

    October 25, 2013 at 9:28 pm

    @PaulW: You did the best you could afford by them. God bless you, and may St. Francis comfort you.

  56. 56.

    Ruckus

    October 25, 2013 at 9:28 pm

    @Gin & Tonic:
    It is in my world.

  57. 57.

    Eric U.

    October 25, 2013 at 9:36 pm

    @Pogonip: I’ve heard any number of stories where pets were kept alive though heroic means, and not many where they had long, happy, pain-free lives afterwards. I think it’s best to give up early and adopt another pet that needs a home.

  58. 58.

    Frankensteinbeck

    October 25, 2013 at 9:49 pm

    The thing is, the Tea Party and the Kochs aren’t grifting each other. They’re all getting grifted by consultants and poll unskewers and gold coin dealers and other middlemen. I don’t think the Kochs know it’s a grift, though. Everything I’ve heard suggests they’re true believers, paranoid racist nutcases fighting socialist anarchists (yes, bizarrely those used to be the same thing) that died out 80 years ago. Oh, they’ll throw in a little corruption on the side. A few noncompetitive bids, tax breaks, and deregulations are always sweet – but they’ll pour several times as much money in as they save just to stop the secret Marxist Muslim Kenyan from destroying America by helping people.

  59. 59.

    Gin & Tonic

    October 25, 2013 at 9:52 pm

    @Eric U.: I dunno. Our dog was injured a long time ago. My wife, a softie, spent far more than I would have on his surgery. “Heroic”? Maybe, maybe not. He would have died otherwise. This was 10+ years ago. He’s now old and diabetic and more or less blind, but he’s had a good and happy life. I’m glad she didn’t “give up early.” As has been the case so often, she was right and I was wrong.

  60. 60.

    Dee Loralei

    October 25, 2013 at 9:56 pm

    @PaulW: I’m so sorry for your loss. She was a beautiful kitty and well loved. You wrote a wonderful tribute to her. Be gentle with yourself.

  61. 61.

    Eric U.

    October 25, 2013 at 10:02 pm

    @Gin & Tonic: I would have a hard time putting an animal down for injuries, but cancer is another thing entirely.

  62. 62.

    Yatsuno

    October 25, 2013 at 10:05 pm

    Skeptical cartoonist is skeptical.

  63. 63.

    Sphex

    October 25, 2013 at 10:06 pm

    @PaulW
    I am a confirmed lurker here, but delirium to say you wrote a beautiful tribute to both your kitties, and to send you warm thoughts, and to encourage you to be kind to yourself as you heal from this loss. You gave them a good home for the time they had here: more cannot be asked.

    Again: be gentle and kind with yourself, as much as you can. You deserve it, and I’m sure they’d agree.

  64. 64.

    sphex

    October 25, 2013 at 10:11 pm

    @Sphex:
    Delurking, not delirium. Dammit, autocorrect!

  65. 65.

    PurpleGirl

    October 25, 2013 at 10:12 pm

    @PaulW: Both cats were beauties, the calico stunning. You loved them and gave them a home and took care of them the best you could. There isn’t more that you could have done. Remember the good times with them and how they made you feel — happy, giggly, whatever. Soon, hopefully, you’ll be in a place to consider another cat (or two) and give a rescue a chance. {{{{{hugs}}}}}

  66. 66.

    Anne Laurie

    October 25, 2013 at 10:32 pm

    @PaulW: Condolences on your loss. Tehya was indeed a Pretty Kitty (and so was Page).

    Remember, the life expectancy for a feral cat is only two to three years… with a lot of cold, damp, misery, hunger, fear & pain during that brief span. You did your best to make Tehya’s life happy & fulfilling for fourteen/fifteen years — several feral generations, if your coworker hadn’t introduced you two all those years ago. I’m not gonna say Tehya would want you to be happy — if she’s like the calicos I’ve known, she’d want you to be rending your garments & wailing in public, as would be her due — but you did your best and she’d give you credit for that.

    May all the good memories come to crowd out your sorrow. And remember, another kitten or kittens will be waiting when you decide your home is too quiet with them!

  67. 67.

    jurassicpork

    October 25, 2013 at 10:52 pm

    An open letter to Debbie Wasserman Schultz: Alan Grayson Was Right.

  68. 68.

    Emma

    October 25, 2013 at 11:17 pm

    @PaulW: Don’t berate yourself. It sounds like you loved both your kitties and cared for them as best you could. Grieve for the loss and remember the good times.

  69. 69.

    FlipYrWhig

    October 25, 2013 at 11:39 pm

    @PaulW: PaulW, my condolences. I know you know this, but there’s no magic way to care for a pet so well that she never suffers. We had two long-timers who died within 5 months of each other. One was always indestructible. One was often sick with something. The indestructible one went first. It’s a horrible feeling, that awareness of absence and that lingering guilt. But that’s what grief is for, to process it, not to undo or reverse it. You can’t un-grieve. Just feel how you feel.

  70. 70.

    StringOnAStick

    October 26, 2013 at 12:27 am

    @Spaghetti Lee: Which molars, upper or lower, or both? Upper often means cold/sinus infection. Do you still have your wisdom teeth (3rd molars)? It could mean they are trying to erupt, and it’s time to get them extracted. General soreness could mean you’ve been grinding your teeth while you sleep (common, unfortunately).

  71. 71.

    James E. Powell

    October 26, 2013 at 1:12 am

    @Baud:

    Great Moments in Angry White People

    In desperate bid for relevance ‘Joe the Plumber’ proves Dems are the real racists with epic cross-burning tweet.

    Yet another reason to despise John McCain: making that jerk a corporate press/media star.

  72. 72.

    Suzanne

    October 26, 2013 at 1:45 am

    @PaulW: Hugs. From your post, it sounds to me like you were a wonderful kitty steward. I personally feel a little bit differently about certain veterinary interventions than some. I simply will not put animals through certain things. Even if it might be a good thing long-term, they don’t understand that, and they deserve most of all to not be in pain. Some treatments extend lifespan but don’t provide the pain-free life they deserve. So please don’t beat yourself up. You gave them both many years of love and that’s what they needed most.

    BTW, when I lost my Nico, I couldn’t watch, either.

  73. 73.

    Chris

    October 26, 2013 at 2:37 am

    @Frankensteinbeck:

    I don’t think the Kochs know it’s a grift, though. Everything I’ve heard suggests they’re true believers, paranoid racist nutcases fighting socialist anarchists (yes, bizarrely those used to be the same thing) that died out 80 years ago.

    And just think: all that shit, all the impact that they have on our politics, all the people not only in America but throughout the world who’re affected by their politics-industrial complex… it all stems from an eighty year old grudge that Papa Koch bore against Josef Stalin for not granting him the long-term oil contracts that he was hoping to get.

  74. 74.

    I'mNotSureWhoIWantToBeYet

    October 26, 2013 at 8:42 am

    @lamh36: In addition to what others have said, recognize that we all get stiffer as we get older.

    Every year or so we go on a hiking vacation and invariably I would get a horrible pain on the side of my right knee (sometimes in both) after a few hours of going down hill. To the point of needing a cane/walking stick to continue. After trying various braces and gentle stretching, the thing that finally made the pain go away for me was using a leg press on a weight bench to strengthen and stretch out my knees. Before doing that I thought I was reasonably strong and limber, but I found I couldn’t straighten out my legs on the press when I started… I was fine on our recent trip to the Yellowstone and the Tetons – better than I’ve been in decades, in fact.

    There are lots of muscles and ligaments and so forth that run all over your back and legs that are interconnected. They can press on nerves in mysterious ways, causing pain far from where the issue is.

    I’m not suggesting that what worked for me is what will work for you. Sometimes strengthening can make things worse. Just recognize that everything’s connected and that overall stiffening can be a problem.

    Lots of medical-types don’t know much about muscles. They don’t show up on X-rays and MRIs, so they’re not easy to diagnose. Try to find someone who understands things like Trigger Point Therapy as more than a buzz-word. My wife’s PT has been a life-saver.

    HTH a little. Good luck!

    Cheers,
    Scott.

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