With what, hysterical laughter? MT @politico: Dan Rather has finally weighed in on the "60 Minutes" Benghazi report. http://t.co/evi1Nm0wzr
— billmon (@billmon1) November 15, 2013
Warning, Politico link:
… Speaking to Joe Madison’s radio show “The Black Eagle,” Rather said that the corporate hierarchy at CBS News — which he described as “not so much our friends” — share at least as much as the blame as any correspondent for the flawed report.
“There is a tendency when these kind of things happen to blame the correspondent whose voice and face was on the story, but whatever happened and however it happened, people in the corporate hierarchy of CBS News and leaders of the news division share at least as much of whatever blame there is to be as the correspondent, but they try to make it appear their fingerprints aren’t on it,” Rather said….
“I just know this, that No. One, I’m always pulling for CBS News, and I hope they’ll be transparent, look into this and tell what they know and try to move on from it. No. Two, there is a difference between this and the trouble I got into at CBS News,” Rather said. “We got into trouble, that is I and the other reporters, because we reported a true story…the difficulty with this Benghazi story, that they now acknowledge, the story was not true and they stood by it for a long time.”
A “60 Minutes” spokesperson said Wednesday they are in the midst of a “journalistic review” into the Benghazi segment which featured security contractor Dylan Davies, who gave conflicting reports to the FBI, his security firm and “60 Minutes” about what happened the night of the 2012 attack on the diplomatic compound. In a new report, McClatchy DC details how the “60 Minutes” package contained several errors that to-date have gone unnoticed, and Davies has also reportedly gone into hiding…
Can’t blame the man for enjoying just a little schadenfreude…
What’s on the agenda for the end of another bad-news week?
Bill E Pilgrim
Dibs on the RR:
https://balloon-juice.com/2013/11/13/benghazaaaiieeee-ratfvckers-all-the-way-down/#comment-4714196
Mike E
@Bill E Pilgrim: I doff my hat to you!
raven
SO wait, are we supposed to be all pissed off about what’s-her-face or are we now supposed to REALLY give a fuck about this Cohen schmuck? You guys keep changing shit around.
OzarkHillbilly
Dodging raindrops, mixing and pouring more concrete, ordering drywall for the lids in that house I’m building, being disgusted with a bunch of gutless weasel Democrats who can’t run away from the ACA fast enough at the first sign of trouble, etc etc.
Say what you want about Republicans, and I usually do, they know how to fight.
Mike E
@OzarkHillbilly:
Yep, dirty. Something that the press has special shovels with which to scoop up. The red banshees howl loud enough when Dems just fight back, but god forbid they adopt similar tactics.
Mike E
Whoa, the rare double. WP, I’m shakin’ my fist atcha!
OzarkHillbilly
@raven: I know just what you mean. I only have so much outrage. I have to be careful where I spend it.
Anya
@raven: You really don’t get it, do you?
raven
@Anya: You know, I don’t give one shit what you think or say. Do you get that?
OzarkHillbilly
@Mike E:
Is there another way to fight? I was taught that anything else was dancing.
tybee
anyone have a good fried calamari recipe? i’ve acquired a couple of pounds of squid and i wanna fry it.
Anya
@raven: It’s obvious to me that you don’t care about how harmful racism is to our society and to our discourse. It’s also very obvious that you don’t care how hurtful those racist views are to me on a personal level. Yes, I get it, you are not only unsympathetic but also down right dismissive. I get it!
raven
@Anya: You know exactly nothing about me, nothing.
MomSense
Speaking of media, I couldn’t take another minute of Morning Joe so I started watching BBC and it turns out there is a whole world of news out there. Meacham, Halperin, and Heilemann would be shocked that the rest of the world is more obsessed by the situation in the Philipines than website woes.
Mike E
@OzarkHillbilly: I like Patton’s advice: kick ’em in the ass! It ain’t beanbag after all. But when “optics” only apply to Dems, it’s best not to go for the junk, especially when your opponent likes to fuck that chicken…it obscures the view.
ETA @MomSense: TRMS last night pointed out the tornado in OK right after Moore and the recent typhoon are the two strongest storms ever measured. By far.
Mustang Bobby
Tech question: does anyone know how to stop embedded clips from Comedy Central — i.e. The Daily Show and The Colbert Report — from auto-starting in Firefox? When I go to sites with them embedded I’m greeted with a cacophony of Jon Stewart talking over Stephen Colbert. It’s really bad on feed-readers like Newsblur.
It doesn’t happen with IE.
JPL
The Braves are going to get a fancy new stadium in the burbs. The Cobb county taxpayers will not have to pay additional taxes but will be taking 9 million a year for thirty years out of the property taxes. Last year the teachers were furloughed for five days because Cobb didn’t have the funds to pay them. How is this a good thing?
@MomSense: According to our news, they weren’t harmed by Obamacare so it’s not news. We live in a sick society.
JWR
@Anya,: I’m sure the majority here are on your side. But just a reminder.. do not feed. ;-)
MikeJ
@Mustang Bobby:Firefox is supposed to have some sort of click to play functionality built in, but since I use noscript I never figured out where it is.
MomSense
@Mike E: @JPL:
That storm was monstrous – storm surge of 40 feet in one area.
Anya
@MomSense: The situation in the Philippines is so devastating. I don’t understand why it’s not getting the coverage it deserves. When will our media talk about what’s happening to our planet.
@JWR: Thanks! I agree, it’s not worth it.
OzarkHillbilly
@Mike E: You know why “optics” only apply to Dems? Because everybody knows the Repubs are going to fwck that chicken. They expect it. There is no shock value in it anymore. If the Dems did it on a regular basis there would be no shock value in that either.
Dems worry too much about how people perceive them. Repubs hate us because we are servants of the anti-Christ. Independents hate us because we’re “just like Republicans.” And Dems? We think we have all the right answers and the world would be a better place if only everybody else would play nice and get out of the way. We need to get a clue: They won’t.
NotMax
A weekend and week ahead with a few gems on TCM. All times Eastern.
Sat., Oct. 16, 6:00 a.m. – A Walk in the Sun
Mon., Oct. 18, 8:00 p.m. – Gregory’s Girl
Wed. Oct. 20, 8:45 p.m. – Judgment At Nuremberg
Thurs. Oct. 21, 3:45 a.m. – The Train
Mustang Bobby
@NotMax: I think you mean “Nov.” on those dates.
NotMax
@NotMax
Gah!
Make that Nov. every place I typed Oct.
No excuses, just sloppiness.
Mustang Bobby
@NotMax: Happens to me all the time.
Those are some great movies. The speech Spencer Tracy gives at the sentencing in Judgment at Nuremberg is epic.
mai naem
Watching Mornin’ Ho this morning makes me want to wretch. Howard Dean looked like he was going to reach over and punch Nicolle Wallace. She was advocating for junk insurance policies. Chuckee Cheez going on about the Dems. Mary Landrieu would sell her grandma for a dollar if it got her one vote. Of course,David Gregory,as always,gets to highlight whatever wrong Obama has supposedly done.
Botsplainer
I keep showing my wife Rob Ford stories and saying “see, I’m not really so bad. You could be married to him.”
He’s my ticket out of any issues I cause.
Mustang Bobby
@mai naem: Getting up really early lets me watch a re-run of TRMS at 4:00 a.m. ET before leaving for the office at 5.
Mike E
@OzarkHillbilly: Agree, except that ‘Independents’ (NOT Bernie Sanders) are 1.) embarrassed Repubs, who resort to calling themselves Libertarians, instead; 2.) cranky old white people who identify with TEA party loonies (who are self-identified, uber-religious, Repubs); and, 3.) ‘Reagan Dems’ who are, yeah, you guessed it.
For the record, I’m a Dem voter who’s registered Unaffiliated due to the neo-liberal abandonment of Democratic Party planks and ideals. I share your disgust in the lack of ‘fight’ but we need not worry about recruiting the so-called Independents, because they were never going to be on our side and time will take care of them anyway.
NC Sen Kay Hagen is a nice case in point on how to not fight, not win, and assure that the real Repub wins in ’14. Also.
Kay
@mai naem:
It’s silly to compare this to Katrina and the NYTimes should be ashamed of themselves.
Katrina was a mass exodus of human beings. More than a million people had to flee. Almost 2000 people died. It was the biggest civil engineering failure in US history.
It’s lazy to make this dumb comparison, and they do it because it’s the easiest way to write about political events. THIS is JUST LIKE…this…other thing!
Their behavior and work is embarrassing. They should apologize to the people who lost their city and their loved ones.
tybee
this is cool. and about the only good thing that will come out of the harbor deepening:
CSS Georgia to be retrieved from river
http://www.cnn.com/2013/11/13/us/georgia-civil-war-ironclad-ship/index.html?hpt=hp_t3
raven
@JWR: I got your troll hanging right here.
agrippa
The so called ‘news media’ is pretty poor. I do not think that there ever was a ‘good old days’ for the media. It has never been very good. Yes, there were, are , good reporters and good news outlets, from time. But, that is an exception to the rule.
JPL
@tybee: It’s amazing what federal tax payer dollars will accomplish. Many Georgians see deepening the harbor as a good thing but still bitch about federal spending.
agrippa
I was hoping that this roll out of the ACA would be, mostly trouble free. But, a roll out of anything is seldom trouble free.
But, the behavior of the Democratic politicians is very disappointing, it is not a surprise.
I expect silliness, cowardice and immaturity from them. In their own way, they are almost as bad as the GOP politicians.
The ‘news media’ is being the news media. It can do no other.
JPL
@agrippa: During the Cronkite era, the evening news was pretty good.
OzarkHillbilly
@Mike E: There are a few other types of independents. As a union carpenter I am very familiar with the racist xenophobes who vote their pocketbook (democrat) every election.
agrippa
@mai naem:
That is an example of why I am glad that I do not watch TV. I get to miss watching the silly news media act out; silly politicians ( Dean mostly excluded; he is not silly) play the fool; etc; etc.
agrippa
@JPL:
The Cronkite era was an exception. The WW2 folks may have had something to do with that.
Mike E
@agrippa: How about a 150-year retraction?
Hill Dweller
@mai naem: I refuse to watch Morning Ho, but Chuck Todd’s disdain for Obama(and Jay Carney) is palpable. I honestly think Todd is trying to destroy PO.
Hill Dweller
mai naem
@Hill Dweller: I listen to a show on Sirius with Julie Mason and she can’t stand Jay Carney. I just feel its personal. I wonder if it’s the same thing with Chuck Todd. I can totally see Jay Carney treating people in a dismissive way if they don’t live up to his standards.
@Kay: It’s truly offensive when the GOPrs compare O-care to Katrina. Are you kidding me?
Mike E
@Hill Dweller: Wow, this is hilariously inept. Did you catch Rachel Maddow’s side by side comparison of ACA to the Romneycare rollout? Nicely done, but it won’t rise above the din.
ETA @mai naem: I guess Snuffulupagus just revealed his party allegiance, if not his affiliation.
Kay
@Hill Dweller:
They were going to jam something into that lazy template, it was just a matter of time. They tried how many times? The flu outbreak, the gulf coast oil disaster, the auto bailout, I’m sure I’m missing some.
They like that template and they WILL use it. The facts don’t fit, but who cares?
They pull out “what did he know and when did he know it” about every three months, and that was a long time ago. Katrina is even better.
RaflW
@Hill Dweller:
Even the liberal NYT trolling the President:
Oh holy crap. Katrina was emblematic of an administration that didn’t give a flying fk about poor people (most likely Democrats, to boot!). And people’s lives were endangered and certainly emiserated because of the very half-assed response.
I really hate the whole Village obsession with having to brand every problem 1) a crisis and 2) how it measures up to some (usually inapt) past fiasco.
Kay
@mai naem:
I don’t think they’d do it with another disaster where people died, because people in media would be the first to howl “offensive!” But they’ll pick up “Katrina” and use it as a cudgel happily. Why is that?
The rollout itself is actually much more like the gulf oil disaster; the confluence of public law and private interests, contracts, engineering ineptitude and the inability to do a mechanical fix, but the gulf oil spill doesn’t let them do a lazy Bush/Obama comparison, so they won’t use it.
agrippa
@Mike E:
proves the rule about the poor news media.
lol
Baud
@RaflW:
“led to”. Love the passive voice.
Ash Can
Everyone making the Katrina-ACA comparison needs to be kicked in the junk. Repeatedly. Yes, a health care reform initiative that features an overloaded web site and that presented an opportunity to insurance companies and Republican governors to be assholes is EXACTLY LIKE 2,000 people dying, many thousands more losing their homes, and entire communities being wiped out. What the fuck is wrong with these people?
Kay
@mai naem:
Katrina was an actual US diaspora. That happened. That’s the historical context. The US looks different as a result of a mass exodus. To compare it to a website roll-out that failed is insulting.
They’re rewriting our history.
Elizabelle
The news media is training critical thinkers to treat them as Fox News.
I get tired of the pile-on.
Obamacare as Katrina, huh? Mirthless laughter.
Patrick
@Hill Dweller:
The same Chuck who thinks the media has no responsibility whatsoever in fact checking lies by politicians? Trust me, most of us have the same disdain for Todd and the rest of the media.
Gin & Tonic
@JPL: In the history of media in America, the era from, roughly, Murrow to Cronkite was an aberration. We have reverted to the mean.
agrippa
@Hill Dweller:
It will take someone much stronger than Todd to ‘destroy PBO’.
He is free to make the attempt though.
I expect that PBO has a pretty thick skin.
Elizabelle
@Mike E:
You’ll think I’m awful, but I don’t much watch TRMS.
(1) she takes too long to get to the point and
(2) she sneers, which I find tiresome.
That said, she raises some excellent points.
It’s the delivery, and the preaching to the choir effect of all MSNBC evening programming.
Glad someone’s following the stories they do, and it’s sad they’re relegated to one major cable news channel.
Elizabelle
Watching Zeppelin’s “The Song Remains the Same” (fitfully) instead of news.
The 70s had some awesome Cadillac limousines. Love them rolling out from Madison Square Garden.
Now at Led Zep’s private jetliner.
And you would NOT want to mess with their band manager.
Wish we could send him to rough up Chuck Todd.
Ah, there rolls a TWA airliner.
Times past.
Kay
@Elizabelle:
Katrina reminded me of the approach to rebuilding Iraq after they destroyed Iraq, driven not by facts or competency or concern for those people but by blind, rigid, free marketeer conservative theory.
Which isn’t surprising, considering the same fucking set of dogmatic, delusional ideologues ran it.
Elizabelle
@Kay:
And all this incompetence and obtuseness builds cynicism in a public (Iraqi or American) that could use some actual improvements. And, you know, infrastructure rocks.
Mike E
@Elizabelle: I’m similarly awful, truth be told. LOD’s show last night was a lot better, tho he can be a pedantic, hectoring ass at times. I watch either show (plus All In) infrequently.
Has Bonzo burned rubber yet? I hope no whales were harmed during Moby Dick.
geg6
@Kay:
Yes, why is that?
So goddamn infuriating. Sometimes I feel such despair about this country and I think today may just be one of those days.
Just One More Canuck
@Botsplainer: He’s an FSM-send to husbands everywhere
Ash Can
@Kay:
Having come of age during the Cold War, it never fails to amuse me how interchangeable those terms are. Despots are despots the world over; only the names of the ideologies change.
Kay
@Elizabelle:
I found out first hand how hard it is to get people to make an investment in something long term with our school bond issue. We won, but the conversations I had were just so depressing. You can’t even make a practical “investment” argument along the lines of “look, at some point we have to fix this, and it’s not going to get cheaper, interest rates are low, etc”. People just don’t want to pay for things. They inherited a whole set of infrastructure that they didn’t pay for and they don’t see that they have any duty to either maintain it or build new. I don’t know what they’re thinking. Magic? If they ignore it it will go away?
I see us all lurching from crisis to crisis. They’ll build bridges when the bridges fall down, and not before. I wanted to scream. “Who paid for this building that you’re standing in? Someone did! It wasn’t you! Now YOU have to pay for one”
We have this beautiful, elaborate county courthouse. We could not build that today. No one would agree to pay for it. They’d all be screaming about the marble floors.
Ash Can
@Botsplainer:
@Just One More Canuck:
That’s assuming the wife in question doesn’t stop to think about just how low a bar Ford sets…
Elizabelle
@Kay:
It’s appalling.
We’d never have one spectacular national park, either.
Time for the pendulum to swing.
danielx
@raven:
It’s hard for me to get more bent out of shape with Richard Cohen than I’ve been for oh, the past couple of decades. All this about how Cohen is SUCH a tool, well, it’s not like this is news, and it’s not like his employer cares. If the Post’s editorial board got all bent out of shape about their opinion writers being complete douche rockets, they’d have to get rid of half of them (Gerson, Krauthammer, George Fucking Will…etc). A year from now Cohen will still be producing utter drivel like this:
But Cohen’s cluelessness does put him in a class by himself. This would be where I’d put in the obligatory line about “did he really think…”, except that contemplating Richard Cohen’s thought process is about like contemplating any other Villager’s thought process; something I’d prefer to avoid.
handsmile
@MomSense:
As loathsome as I find the BBC World News broadcast, it least it recognizes that there is a world on which to report. Regrettably, that world is as viewed from the perspective of a British Tory. Turning it on this morning, for example, I was subjected to David Cameron piously rebuking the Sri Lankan government on its policies on minorities. Of course, until AJA becomes available across this land, it is the only sane choice for first learning of the day’s new horrors among its televised alternatives.
It completely escapes me why any person who comments on this blog would subject him/herself to watching more than one or two minutes (for the adrenaline rush) of Joe Scarborugh’s morning frat party. (That is, other than raven who evidently has many sins to atone for. :)) It only enrages, never informs.
And while a magazine essay is often referred to here as a “long read,” Naomi Klein’s The Shock Doctrine really is a book (at 700+ pages, admittedly a truly long read0 that BJ regulars should become familiar with.
http://www.amazon.com/The-Shock-Doctrine-Disaster-Capitalism/dp/0312427999
ETA: That last paragraph prompted by Kay’s #65 comment above.
Amir Khalid
@Baud:
Gee, I really wish people would quit misidentifying the present perfect tense as the passive voice.
/grammar fussbudget
Baud
@Amir Khalid:
That comment was Baud’s Katrina.
Kay
@handsmile:
I read the Shock Doctrine but I was really disappointed in Klein’s work re: the Gulf oil spill. The response to that spill followed a federal law, the Oil Pollution Act which was passed after the Exxon Valdez spill. One could not report on that response without putting it within the context of that law, and NO ONE in media did that, including her.
There was nothing mysterious about the chain of command there, including the role of BP. It was ALL in the federal law that governs oil spills. She can object to that law, she can say the law benefits oil companies, that’s a valid point, but she can’t jam those facts into her broader theory.
If one wanted to talk about the oil disaster in the gulf, one HAD to start at the Oil Pollution Act. It was the whole structure and context for what came after.
Her “theory” reporting on the oil disaster made me doubt all the other stories in The Shock Doctrine. What was happening in the gulf wasn’t unknowable and mysterious. It’s a federal statute. Anyone can read it.
burnspbesq
From the Department of Whiskey Tango Hotel, your daily dose of outrage at how red-state criminal justice falls well short of ideal.
http://m.motherjones.com/politics/2013/11/alabama-man-no-prison-time-raping-teenager
Kay
@handsmile:
The whole “the Coast Guard are in on the plan to give the Gulf to BP!” during the Gulf oil spill bothered me. Klein wasn’t a player in that, but others were. I don’t know much about the Coast Guard, but I once worked aboard the UNCW research vessel for a brief period during my misspent youth and Coast Guard people love the water.
It’s a horrible job. They don’t make very much and they work a million hours a week, or they did when I was on the North Carolina coast. The only reason anyone would take that job would be so they can be close to or actually ON the water. I don’t think they want to destroy America’s waterways.
handsmile
@Kay:
[FYWP has now twice vaporized my reply to you. If it happens a third time, I will email you.]
Appreciate your reply (which I see has turned into replies since I started to write this).
Sorry to read you were disappointed in The Shock Doctrine, but its value for me lies in Klein’s development/articulation, through various case studies from the mid-20th-c. to the present day, of a theory of “disaster capitalism” and its ideological origins in the Chicago School of Economics.
I am prepared to believe that experts in any one of those case studies, e.g., American involvement in 1970s Latin America (calling Valdivia!) or Iraq war reconstruction, would find gaps in Klein’s research or flaws in her analysis.
For a more detailed examination of the Gulf oil spill, I would look to books such as Drowning in Oil, Blowout in the Gulf or A Sea in Flames (only the first of which I’ve read in full). I would expect the authors of more focused books/subjects to be more comprehensive and painstaking in their reporting and findings.
As a critique of late capitalism and the collusion of state/corporate interests and, moreover, a book written for non-specialists, I continue to find The Shock Doctrine insightful and prescriptive. I try to bring skepticism or “doubt” into everything I read (even your dispatches from the front-lines of Ohio politics), but I credit revealed patterns of reliability and consistency.
ETA: in my haste to get this finally submitted, I neglected to italicize book titles.
handsmile
@Kay:
I don’t believe (more precisely, I don’t recall) Klein indicted any single Coast Guard corpsman/woman with a desire to “destroy America’s waterways” or discounting their diligence in performing their arduous tasks. At the same time, I suspect that executive-level policy making, the laws of unintended consequences, and a chain-of-command governance structure would be much the same in the Coast Guard as in any other large contemporary organization.
ETA: No, I don’t think “destroying America’s waterways” is the mission of the Coast Guard at any level. I do think it sometimes happens.