The first thing I thought about when I read this Politihoe piece on Hilary Clinton’s alleged “hit list” or, should you go the Hill route, the much more Nixonian “traitor list,” was this:
This comment DougJ from 2009 will never be wrong:
I’m watching Monica Crowley and Pat Buchanan on the McLaughlin group and so help me God, I am praying for a dirty bomb in Georgetown.
These people will destroy us all.
Don’t be fooled by Obama — we are fucked.
I hate these people.
I prefer their 15 Chris Christie Controversies You May Have Missed.
Want to see Mitt Romney dance? He was at a conference for young, single Mormons.
Rafalcaesque for me.
@ranchandsyrup: Fuck you, you bastard.
West of the Cascades
The Kellers look positively benign and benevolent by comparison.
@ranchandsyrup: I’d rather smear a can of Lyle’s Golden Syrup on my bare ass and sit on a fire-ant hill than click on that link.
@Omnes Omnibus: does he really love America? That dance is s. Korean. You know which country borders s Korea?
@Violet: Thank you. I guess I should read it, to be prepared for probable survival of Christie long enough to limp along to eventual defeat in the next presidential cycle.
But, a confession, Christie is a kind of distasteful boring subject and I have to admit that it has become to me a civic duty rather than a pleasure to keep up with his political troubles.
Palin, Lil’ Newtie, the Saintorum, Mr Plan 999 from the Outer Limits, even Mitt, were more interesting. Christie is just an unpleasant dissembling thug in comparison.
But on other hand, if Christie goes down, then there will be Jeb. Even more boring.
All people who host chat shows
And the guests who’s on them too
And customs men who fumbling through your underwear insist
I don’t think they’d be missed
I’m sure they’d not be missed
And I am biased, but when I saw the phrase ‘mad bitch’ and the pic, I made the connection to Milbank before I thought about HRC. And I am not even much of an HRC fan, though admit that in every way she would be far better president than any GOPer or corporate Democrat.
maximiliano furtive, formerly known as dr. bloor
James E. Powell
If Hillary Clinton runs in 2016 every one of us who have claimed that Barack Obama being elected twice produced the most unhinged right-wing reactions in American history are going to be taken to school.
I’ve got facebook friends who are no more than people who graduated from the same high school as I did. There are quite a few ordinary, average wingnuts among them. I’ve already seen some pretty outrageous stuff – “Killary, the Butcher of Benghazi” – I can only imagine what we will see during a campaign.
Mike in NC
The only person I’d not care to see dance more than Mittens is Chris Christie.
You may put them on the list,
You may put them on the list,
For they’d none of them be missed,
I’m sure they’d not be missed.
@ranchandsyrup: China? Russia? Japan?
@James E. Powell:
That is one of the problems with never reaching Peak Wingnut. There is no control group by which you can reliably measure such things.
Yikes, can you image the movie poster?
But boring all the way down kinda beats witch denial or transvaginal probes.
So: Given X, v: ho-hum or batshit insane, which opponent should X choose?
@Ash Can: Come on, click on the link. The laugh I got from it temporarily pushed Mr. and Mrs. Keller out of my mind.
Seriously, “I hate these people” is the only possible thing to say sometimes.
@ranchandsyrup: No thank you. I would prefer to think that the worst dancing ever is the 11th Doctor at Amy and Rory’s wedding.
This “hillary hit list” thing is just so jaw droppingly stupid. Booman had a piece up about it which actually took it seriously. I lost all respect for him when he began angsting about how she and her team would have to “prove” themselves past this kind of scorekeeping.
@James E. Powell: I’ve been saying: on January 20th, 2017, eight years of appalling racism come to an end, and eight years of appalling misogyny begin.
@James E. Powell: And that will be enough of a reason for me to put a bumper sticker on my car, donate, and vote for her.
@James E. Powell: “The Butcher of Benghazi” shows the extent to which they make up stories in their heads and then believe them. The rest of us can’t even guess what they are, much less refute them.
At this point, I’m kind of hoping that Hillary Clinton is a stone cold killer.
In fact, I’ve learned recently that America is in a mood to send a bully to Washington, so this can only help her.
@Citizen_X: The Wingularity, then, might be theorized to be the day that a gay black woman is inaugurated.
One of my wingnut co-workers refers to Secretary Clinton as the Bitch of Benghazi repeatedly in his postings on social media.
The deaths are a tragedy, no doubt, but 4 dead for the political objective of removing Ghaddaffi is quite a bit better than the 4,000 dead at removing Saddam.
Then again we know that rightwing math is pretty suspect.
@jl:”…or corporate Democrat.”
Wait, what? Hillary and Bill are literally the definition of “corporate Democrat,” so no, she would not be better than that. They helped start the DLC and she even ran it for years. She would be a horrific candidate for Democrats with all the division she and her husband stoke among Democrats, and especially since she cannot win a national election. This is just a statement of fact.
Of course, we have midterms to win first in 2014 and shouldn’t allow ourselves to be distracted by these “divide and conquer” games though…
@rda909: I agree with you. Let’s install Barack Obama into a third term, and from there, King for Life.
I guess the media needs some new tabloid BS to chase now that Gates has completely contradicted himself and rebutted the RW’s talking points about his book. He’s now saying Obama didn’t say he opposed the Iraq Surge for political reasons, instead that he said others may have, and that he was committed to the Afghan surge when it was implemented, but expressed concern about how the strategy was working out the next year, in private (cough) conversations with Gates. Gates also again says the President made all the right decisions on Afghanistan and that he agrees with the draw-down schedule:
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@rda909: A whole lot of PUMAs told me in the Great ’08 Primary Wars that this country would never elect a black man, that was just a statement of fact, Macomb County Bradley Effect Reagan Democrats. A lot of pundits told me for four years that Barack Obama was losing popularity with Democrats, they stated it as a fact.
I watched that live this morning. Gates was incoherent.
@Gex: I can hear Dancin’ Dave now. “Question: Do you think having worked at the NSA will help or hurt Wanda Sykes in her run for the Presidency?”
Someone please front page this it is epic
Villago Delenda Est
The Dick whisperer whispers to himself.
Villago Delenda Est
@Mike in NC:
You’ve not seen Dancin’ Dave doing his thing, have you?
Villago Delenda Est
I agree. Bill and Hill are DLC corporatists, in other words, Rockefeller Republicans. Obama is on the cusp of it, himself.
Villago Delenda Est
Toss in Muslim for good measure…black lesbian socialist Muslim will cause heads in Riyadh to kerplode, which is a bonus.
Which in a sane world should should mean no one would take his rambling charges seriously. He’s now qualified his indictment of Biden too. Now he’s saying he essentially agreed with Biden during the Obama Administration but has a long list of gripes from back when he was serving in GOP admins and Biden, as a Senator from the other party, opposed a number of his party’s legislative goals. So it’s all some ancient grudge he just can’t let go of:
And then then there was this petty anecdote to add to his petty grudges:
Nominate Kamala Harris, so we can has both!
Gastritis broke their calculators.
OT, kinda, but yet another reason – as if one was needed – to detest Republicans. Don’t like the terms of your divorce settlement, even though you’re worth a metric shitload of money? Get your friendly Republican state legislator, to whom (along with his wife the Light Guv) you have contributed the low, low price of $11k, and he’ll write legislation tailored by your divorce lawyer to fix you right up!
The Milwaukee Journal Sentinel has done a nice job of lifting rocks and exposing squirming political creatures during the reign of Koch Bros. homunculus Scott Walker; I’m sort of surprised a strip mine hasn’t been proposed for the site of the publication’s headquarters. All in the interests of the state’s citizens, mind….
These people are corrupt swine.
Our country is run by high schoolers.
@ranchandsyrup: No dear heavens nooooooo!
@Baud: Only the athletes apparently.
@Villago Delenda Est:
I remember back in 1992 that candidate Clinton made noises about opposing NAFTA and other so-called ‘free trade’ agreements.
I also remember that President Clinton was one of the biggest boosters of ‘free trade’ agreements.
Shit, NAFTA wouldn’t have passed if it weren’t for the fact that more than half of the support in Congress came from Republicans.
The Clintons are the definition of ‘corporate Democrat’.
That said, President Hillary Clinton is definitely preferable to President Chris Christie or President
@Carolinus: Was Gates always this dumb? This is just Old Man Yells at Cloud, pt. 35679.
@kdaug: Thanks for steeling my resolve. You are correct. The danger of people like Christie and Jeb, is that they will deliver the same goods as the others. Maybe more slowly, or prettied up more, or with some sugar to help the goods go down, and make it taste a little sweeter before he poison sets in. But they want to take us as the more obviously dangerous people.
Dana Milbank never struck me as a beer kind of guy. I always figured his drink was a saucer of milk.
Villago Delenda Est
Amen. Even corporatist Dems are preferable to anything the GOP has to offer, and those are the only two choices we will have.
@rda909: HRC is HRC, not Bill. And this is 2014, not the late 1990s. IMHO, HRC’s economic positions were at least as, and arguably more liberal than Obama’s in 2008.
I think at this point, I would trust HRC on economics more than WJC, since he is still talking neo-liberal nonsense half the time he opens his mouth on econ.
But, if HRC campaigns for 2016, we will have time to make up our minds on her merits versus those of her opponents.
@Gex: Make her an atheist and you’re there.
This is such a fcuking obvious “Both Side Do It” to Chris Christies retaliation crap.
Of course maybe somebody should let Politichoe know that when Bill Clinton is convinced to come to some fundraising event for some pol who didn’t endorse Hills, he causes a traffic jam unintentionally.
And might actually be a legit story if they could show Clinton using her power as an elected official to punish people who got on her bad side. And they don’t have even an unsupported claim of that happening.
There’s a big difference between, “I’m not going to use my standing as a private citizen to campaign for your reëlection” and “I’m going to use the power of the government to harm you.”
@aimai: Ed Kilgore at WaMo has a sensible rejoinder to the Hillary “hit list”:
Nobody sensible should read and believe anything from Politico without independent confirmation.
I only saw a tweet about Hillary’s “hit list” early today, and I knew it was a fraud without even reading the story.
This is why I simply don’t talk politics with Republicans anymore. Well, one of several reasons, but that one’s enough in and of itself; they simply don’t live in reality. They’re so, permanently hooked on the Fox News feed that it’s like talking to a flying-saucer conspiracy theorist. Every topic you bring up, they’ll have a half-dozen well prepared “facts” ready that they got from the Murdoch-tube that morning, every one of them bullshit, but every one of them requires you to go online, figure out what the fuck they’re talking about in the first place, find out that it’s bullshit and then come back and explain why that is. And once you’ve walked them slowly and carefully through that entire process, they’ll either just refuse to believe you anyway, or they’ll concede the point (but a week later when it comes up again they’ll have forgotten all about that) and then immediately move on to their NEXT bullshit talking point… and then you have to repeat the procedure all over again.
Even under the most optimistic conditions, it’ll be dinner time before they’re even capable (as in, in possession of enough facts and disillusioned of enough bullshit) of holding a conversation on any given topic. Who has the time and energy? It’s like trying to discuss World War Two with someone who thinks there really was an International Jewish Conspiracy and Poland really did attack Germany in 1939.
@MikeJ: Not only that but the Clintons aren’t allowed to decide who they want to support within their own party but Christie is allowed to retaliate against a person of the opposition party for whom it would be perfectly normal to support their party’s candidate. WTF?
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: That may be so, but I have a pretty good record of only voting for winning Democrats and I personally have little to no inclination to vote for Hillary.
Male bullies – strong and Presidential
Strong women – bitches who need need to go back to the kitchen.
Oh, good, you got the memo. ;-)
But..Poland did attack Germany.
I saw footage of the Poles attacking the Gleiwitz radio station on the Fox newsreels. :)
@karen: I think Baud’s bully characterization better reflects Hillary than “strong woman.” I also think he’s right that America’s in the mood to send a bully to Washington, so when she gets elected I promise to make a point to blame every Republican I know, personally, for her election. “Obama was ready to work with you, you had your chance, now you’ve ruined both parties.”
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Huh, well I never told you those things. I knew President Obama would win because of how Barack was building his campaign in ways I had never seen on a national scale before, and from people I know in Chicago who had worked with him for years who said he as trustworthy as can be, and was a man of impeccable integrity in his personal life.
I’ve worked on campaigns for and against either of the Clintons since their days in Little Rock. Hillary cannot win a national campaign.
Oh come on. Hillary will never run for Prez ’cause (according to The Globe) she has a terminal brain tumor. Dig her grave now.
@Kropadope: Just because you only vote when you’re sure they’re going to win doesn’t really prove much. I personally vote to try to get the best people available into office.
@Belafon: No, no, no. I don’t only vote when I’m sure they’re going to win. In fact a couple I was pretty sure weren’t gonna make it, such as Deval Patrick 2010, which I made a point to volunteer on. Also, I did vote those elections, not sit them out. I voted for David Cobb over John Kerry, secure in the knowledge that my vote is worth approximately a warm bucket of spit in a presidential election in the great state of Massachusetts.
Many of you are sounding a whole bunch like firebaggers. Yea it sure does suck to have someone in office you can agree with only some of the time. Did you all forget dubya? Shit I still remember Reagan and foolishly thought no one would ever be worse. Damn!
So yea, if it comes to it I will happily vote for Hillary instead of what ever neofascist the Republicans end up nominating. And like it. Because I remember what it was like not agreeing at all with the man in the big white house.
@kindness: I’m right there with you on supporting less-than-perfect candidates as the best viable option. If I lived in Missouri instead of MA, my vote my have been for John Kerry, for example. I don’t foresee a circumstance where Hillary is the best viable option. Any a-hole the Republicans can puke up is a better option than allowing the Democrats to become a mirror image of the Republicans.
Oh, unless they nominate Rand Paul. In that case the best viable option is Canada.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@rda909: Well, I’ll have to take your word for it. After all, you are some random person on the internet.
I’ve heard that song somewhere before, when was it….? All I remember is it worked out really well.
@jl: Given Hillary’s decades long professional track record, I do not for second think she’d as liberal or more than President Obama has been. Hillary would not have brought Elizabeth Warren into the national spotlight and created the CFPB. Lanny Davis would be on the Supreme Court had she won. I have serious doubts should would’ve pushed for or signed the substantial credit card regulations President Obama championed. While I applauded her intentions at the time for “Healthcare for All” in the 1990s which was similar to what we have now, she and Bill of course were not able to even come close to accomplishing progress on it, and the overall vision between each is stark:
“I happen to be a proponent of a single payer universal health care program. [Applause.] I see no reason why the United States of America, the wealthiest country in the history of the world, spending 14 percent of its Gross National Product on health care cannot provide basic health insurance to everybody. And that’s what Jim is talking about when he says everybody in, nobody out. A single payer health care plan, a universal health care plan. And that’s what I’d like to see. But as all of you know, we may not get there immediately. Because first we have to take back the White House, we have to take back the Senate, and we have to take back the House.”
“You know, I have thought about this, as you might guess, for 15 years and I never seriously considered a single payer system.”
Yes, she does talk about, as does President Obama, how single-payer isn’t feasible in the short term, but she consistently over the years has said that single-payer isn’t even her goal in the long term either. The opposite of President Obama. And on and on…she RAN the DLC, for cryin out loud.
And of course, none of this matters if the Democrat loses the election, so that is first and foremost, and Hillary has proven to me that she’s a terrible campaigner. Anyway, let’s win the 2014 midterms first….whaddaya say?
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Don’t compare Hillary Clinton to Al Gore. Hillary Clinton is actually awful. Perhaps with a President Santorum (I know, blech) we may finally achieve Wingularity.
A step backward that enables three steps forward I’ll count as a win.
President Hillary is full march backwards and declaring it to be forward.
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: I knew you’d come around, fellow random Internet person.
@Villago Delenda Est: Yes, if she becomes the Democratic option, I’ll be voting for her in the general, but until then, I’ll be doing all I can to make sure she isn’t my option, since she cannot win a national election.
That plus the fact that she’d be second only to Reagan for oldest first-term POTUS in history, makes me more than a little wary of her as the presumptive nominee.
For the first time ever I had a thought in common with Barbara Bush (the old one) when she said there had been enough Bushes, there were other families. I feel the same about Clintons.
@rda909: OK, point taken. But Obama is quite conservative and DLC himself on many economic issues, many of which do not make big news like health care reform.
But, I agree, let’s go for the 2014 before we spend a lot of time fighting over 2016.
And you are correct about campaigning. If HRC had not learned anything about the Democratic nomination process, good chance she won’t be the candidate even if she runs. If she surrounds herself with Mark Penn types again, I wont’ be enthusiastic for her in the primaries.
Of course she keeps lists. When you have been around as long as the Clintons, the lists get very long and difficult to keep in your head. Much more practical to write things down so you don’t confuse Dana Millibank with Dana Carvey. I stopped worrying about “enemies lists” like this long ago. It’s like worrying about “files”. I’d worry more about disorganized people in office.
Sigh…the only universal thing that always seems to be true is that Conservatives always think they are winning and Liberals always think they are losing. Wr0ng way Cole mentioning Ball Juice Doug’s comment for example.
2012 election was perfect example. Conservatards were convinced the polls were skewed and “oh that debate did you see that omg” fukhead Sullivan freakout…lol. Of course the usual suspects right here on Ball Juice piling on. Annoying as fuk around here around election time. Only place more annoying is the Orange Satan.
@jl: Actually, no he’s not. He has a long history of writings and public appearances long before he became a politician showing that he’s not conservative on most issues. I think the mistake that is so often made is that he’s a believer in “politics being the art of the possible,” so the privileged among the liberal ranks get impatient as he helps those in most need first…the incrementalism debates…but on issue after issue, his history shows he’s very liberal across the board.
In fact, the DLC started including him on in their marketing materials, and Obama publicly called for them to take his name off their stuff.
Regardless, neither you nor I will ever vote for him again, so these debates are secondary to winning as many elections as possible in our lives going forward, so that we can eliminate any control Republicans have over our government….forever. Deal?
When I met Bill, I literally had no idea who he was (1990). He didn’t have an aide whispering in his ear as he ran the line for intros. At the end of the night, he said goodbye to 30 some people he’d never met by their first names.
They do not forget, and they do not forgive. He who introduced me went with Obama in 2008 and that family has not heard the end of that, and they were core to his ’82 election.
That said, the Clinton machine is spinning up, and their rallying cry is: “There’s only one way Hillary is not President in 2016. She’s either dead or dying.”
You can take that to the bank.
@muricafukyea: Herp de derp.
Hey. Chris Christie. Hilary here. Seriously, you want this to be over who has the biggest stones?
At least I can see mine.
Another Holocene Human
@MikeJ: aiiiii, I just wanted Endeavour last night on Netflix, not cool!
Another Holocene Human
@James E. Powell: I’m afraid you’re right. And in that case, the only thing to do is to hold out for the candidacy of Chirlane McCray.
Another Holocene Human
@Gex: Don’t forget disabled! Know Your (1990s) Memes!
Another Holocene Human
@Chris: It’s a political Gish gallop. The only way to fight back is to make them ridiculous. Fortunately, they do half of the work for us.
Another Holocene Human
He did? That’s awesome.
Bob In Portland
To John Cole:
Saw “True Detective” tonight.
@Another Holocene Human: Yea, there was a dust-up about it early on in the 2007-2008 primary season, since Hillary of course was all proud of her DLC mentality, and also it was coming out how during John Edwards’ time in the Senate, he was one of the only Senators to score higher on the DLC Scorecard than Hilary did (a fact so many privileged progressives would try to ignore).
And to top it off, one of the other leading Democrats involved in the campaign, Joe Biden, was one of the few others who had never been a DLC member.
If Nov 2016 does come down to Clinton v Bush, IMHO more voters will rather see a second act for the Clintons in the white house (and female voters a woman president) than would rather see a third act for the Bush clan in the presidency. Bill and Hillary have traveled far better through the past decade than have the Bush clan with most of the public.
Jeb will go down, too. The stink of Bush is still on us.
Still a dumbass with Obaman Derangement Syndrome, I see.
Make that Obama Derangement Syndrome.
But you’re still a dumbass, Corner Stone.
@James E. Powell: Your friends must know that their rage against Mrs. Clinton will be ineffectual inasmuch as she probably will win in a landslide against any of their Clown Posse. They need to start crying from now. Love it!
@mdblanche: I just want to admire the sheer beauty of that cut for the rest of the day.
If you really want to fall into flat despair, read “This Town” by Mark Leibovich. The writer pretends to be all bemused and above it all, but you can tell he’s desperately proud of being one of the gang. And the people and events he catalogs are way beyond revolting.
@cmorenc: I am hoping Hillary Clinton does not run and finally (finally!) leaves the national stage. @James E. Powell: I hope Ms. Clinton feels as you do and gives this a pass. Let her go home and count her millions, travel the world making speeches, whatever, just make her go away.
I am a woman of her generation, and her assumption of status because SHE MARRIED IT is so irritating I can’t explain it to anyone but another original feminist.
What has she done on her own, other that delay health care for a generation, accomplish nothing as Sec. of State (well, what were her initiatives and how did they fare?) and “stand by her man?”
Make her go away.