Got a really solid night’s sleep last night and did a good bit of icing, and woke up feeling pretty great this morning. The right shoulder, which I mentioned has been acting up and I have an appointment to have checked tomorrow that I scheduled last week is actually more painful than my left one. The left one is sore, but not acute stabbing pain, just a sort of dull ache, and I have a really good range of motion with it, so I am pretty sure that all I have is a little temporary tissue damage that will sort itself out. I’ll have it checked out tomorrow anyway.
At any rate, I stopped taking the vicodin they gave me and will probably just drop the rest off at the pharmacy tomorrow on my way to the doctor. The dilaudid shot got the pain under control, and then last night I took one 5mg at six and one right before bed so I would sleep comfortably. I took two advil this morning and iced both shoulders, and that seems to be enough, so I am done taking that stuff. I really, really hate pain pills- I’d much rather have a shot to numb localized pain than these pills that muddle my thought processes. I’ll stop by the pharmacy tomorrow on the way to the doctor and have them dispose of the pills properly, as you should never, ever flush pain meds or antibiotics.
Shoulders were ok enough that they no longer hurt when I walk and I was able to take the dogs out on a couple mile walk this morning. So maybe the bird shit was a good thing after all, and my injury might have been much worse without the doodie to the face (and of course I don’t believe any of this superstitious nonsense, but I’ll play along). I’d also say that if I didn’t drink yesterday, I’m not really sure what it would take for me to drink again. My mother was concerned I might, because self-medicating with booze for my right shoulder is what really got me on the downward slope the last time. I assured her that is not going to happen, because I don’t see the logic behind compounding an injury with a substance abuse problem. Busted ass shoulders are enough on my plate to deal with that I don’t need to make things worse.
Talk to Ron this morning, the guy I went to rehab with, and he is doing very well and still sober and clean (he says t his is the longest he has been clean for probably twenty years, and it is weird not having scabs on his arms and legs). We chat every couple of days just to check in on each other, and he is doing great. Still living in the shelter in Morgantown, but he is working construction and making some money, going to meetings and doing outpatient, and really seems to have his head in the right place. He really likes Morgantown because there is so much to do that is free and just has a lot more opportunities than the other places he has lived that really have nothing to do but drugs. He started working out (well, walking a lot) on top of his day labor, because he had been a junkie for so long that a lot of his muscles had atrophied, and seems really happy and positive. The way the shelter works is there is a breathalyzer every time you try to enter (you are allowed to keep your stuff there during the day, but you are forbidden to enter if you are under the influence), but it has not been a problem for him. We are planning to ask permission for him to leave for two days yet retain his spot (you have to be incidence free and request three days in advance), and I think I am going to go pick him up on Friday after work and bring him back here for some real meals, AC, a big screen tv, and just some peace and quiet and a night or two away from the craziness that is every night in a homeless shelter. I’ll take him back Sunday night or Monday morning.
At any rate, in a really good mood because I am so relieved my shoulder is not the worst case scenario. BTW, Wesley Lowery will be on Beat the Press this morning, so you might want to tune in to see Chuckie T’s inaugural show, which will actually feature a real working reporter. If there is any good to come out of Ferguson (beyond a push to demilitarize the police), it is that my faith in local reporters and politicians have been restored to some extent. There were some really solid reporters on the ground (Lowery was one of them) during the chaos last week, and I was super impressed with some of the local pols like Antonio French. It’s nice seeing people who care and are passionate about their work and who talk straight.
Looks like it is going to rain here, so I am just going to take it easy and maybe do a little laundry, but nothing too big. You?
*** Update ***
Jay Nixon seems way over his head. I have not seen one action of his (other than putting Johnson in charge) or one interview that has impressed me or made me feel confident about him as a leader.
Mnemosyne (iPhone)
Sitting on the airplane waiting for everyone to get settled so we can return home to LA.
I mentioned in the thread below that my friends in recovery always post a schedule if they have to take pain meds and have someone else hand them out if possible. It reduces both temptation and stress to have someone else in charge (or at least have a schedule in charge).
Chickamin Slam
Good morning Cole! Glad to hear you are feeling better after yesterday.
Today my father and I are supposed to be volunteering for the forest service. He had a mild stroke a week ago though so things have been up in the air. Luckily it affected only his speech. His days of working are basically over now. He turned 70 a couple months ago.
So we have food and gear to pack into a car that probably needs to be serviced. It’s been a rough week. Hopefully he will have time to rest and write poetry. He has picked that up in his retirement.
w3ski
I have never met you face to face, and yet here I am waking up wondering how you are doing with the shoulder. Glad you are muddling thru. I was an alky myself and a couple years off the booze now. Hurting is a real incentive to drink so all I can say is I am Proud of you for holding back. Good Job.
And too there you are taking care of another ‘wounded soul’. Bless you dear sir, your heart is really in the right place.
Wishing All the best for you.
Henry in Calif.
Betty Cracker
So glad your shoulder isn’t completely busted and that you’re in a good place mentally as well!
We’re headed home from our trip to the Suwannee. Dogs are panting like mad, from anxiety, I guess since they haven’t done anything but sit on their fat asses for the past hour.
It’s a beautiful day, but hot, so I’m happy to be in an air-conditioned vehicle watching the pretty countryside roll past.
Iowa Old Lady
@Chickamin Slam: Sorry to hear about your dad’s stroke.
Glad he’s taken up poetry though. I occasionally go to an open mic night at a local art center and a woman often reads her elderly mother’s poetry. The mother took up poetry in her 60s and is sick enough that she can’t leave the house.
Tara the Antisocial Social Worker
Glad the shoulder’s not any worse – it seems totally unreasonable for you to keep getting in freak accidents even when sober.
Packrat and I spent a couple days in a cottage in Mendocino near the beach. We brought the two border collies along, and they loved the beach, but they were whiny and jumpy the rest of the time. We had to change our lunch to a to-go meal after Hera started barking at someone at a cafe. Guess being away from home was a bit much for them, especially so soon after we lost our labrador.
So far as I can tell, the cats didn’t even notice we were gone, or relocate their naps from where they were when we left.
And I still smile every time I see that “+0” next to your name. Good on you, Cole.
Mike in NC
CBS war running a fawning interview with that dim asshole Paul Ryan, so I had to get up and cross the room to turn it off.
Iowa Old Lady
I can’t believe people were talking about Jay Nixon for VP. He doesn’t look quite as incompetent as the Ferguson police chief, but that may be because he’s kept his mouth mostly shut.
c u n d gulag
Good to hear from you, John – feeling better, and still sober!
Congratulations!!!
I’m sorry about what happened to you, but you seem to be handling things just fine!
Best of luck, my friend!
May the FSM keep your noodles and pasta buttery and al dente!!!
AliceBlue
Great news John. Glad to hear it.
Good on you for keeping in touch with Ron. You put the “m” in mensch!
The Snarxist Formerly Known as Kryptik
Glad to hear your shoulders aren’t as screwed up as you possibly thought. Hell of a thing to have that happen to both shoulders.
Far as Ferguson, I find myself sliding back into despondency after seeing how many people flipped their switches back to ‘the thug deserved it’ after the allegedy robbery video.(Sorry, the details about when and why it came out just feel so suspect I can’t take it at face value). Even those I’ve seen who didn’t go full backsliding into ‘super violent rioting black thugs’ bullshit suddenly found a new deference for the cop in question, despite the admittance that the guy stopped Brown for reasons totally unrelated to the robbery and go ‘what can you do, he was fleeing the scene of a crime’, and….god, fuck all.
I really feel like I need someone to talk me off the ledge with this shit, since it seems like every time shit like this happens, a tragedy that should make people rethink the national consensus on shit, either gun control, institutional racism, etc., someone throws up an unverified or unrelated shiny and suddenly we backslide even further away from where we started now.
JPL
So I put on Meet The Press and see Andrea. Where is Chucky? Did I miss the Wesley Lowery interview? So many questions and no answers.
SiubhanDuinne
I’ll add my relief that your shoulder is much improved this morning, my awe in your huge generous giving heart, and my congratulations and pride in that +0 after your name.
Amir Khalid
I picked up The Fault In Our Stars today because I liked the movie so much. I did not know that the character Peter Van Houten (played by Willem Dafoe in the movie) a mamber of the family that invented the Dutch process for cocoa. The Slate writer who said YA fiction is beneath adult readers is full of shit.
Would anyone here recommend Stallone’s Grandpas with Guns 3, or should I just avoid it?
SiubhanDuinne
@JPL:
One of the articles about the MTP changeover the other day said that Chuckles’ first show would be September 7.
It's Not The Fall, It's The Landing
As someone mentioned earlier in the week, Nixon is useful mostly for his veto over the craziest stuff being pushed by the Missouri state legislature, which is full of wingnuts and religious fundamentalists.
Along with Capt Ron Johnson and Antonio French, state senator Maria Chapelle-Nadal also deserves some props as one of the few public figures to have actually improved her standing in the last week by being out there with the community.
brettvk
Nixon’s performance and public exposure has been horribly disappointing. Being a Dem in Missouri is to live with compromise (particularly if you’re living in a sea of red like the Ozarks) and I’m not very fond of either Nixon or McCaskill, but you go to the polls with the pols you have. That said, he’s done worse than I would have expected — and sadly, It feels like he was dithering because of his political aspirations, which is somehow worse than just being clueless. He was our best bet to pry Blunt out of his gold-lined office, but that won’t happen nnow.
mattH
@The Snarxist Formerly Known as Kryptik: Go read The Authoritarians by Bob Altermeyer (link is Whole Book on the side). In some ways it’s too fatalistic in its conclusions, but it does give you an idea why so many people are almost gladly duped. I think it would even make a good book selection if people here would like to read and discuss it. The thing that strikes me the most is that the greatest time of equality in the US also corresponds with the period where religious groups might have been the least politically active. Not sure if that’s really true or just the pattern I see come out of the book’s conclusions.
Nicole
So glad the shoulder is not as bad as it could have been!
I was given serious pain killers once, after a fall from a horse, and I lasted three days before I stopped taking them- I was instructed to only take them at night and I realized I was looking forward to bedtime a bit too much.
Spent the weekend with the parents in PA and took the kid to Dutch Wonderland, which I think I last went to in the late 1970s or early 1980s. My dad’s health is not good enough for him to be able to do an all-day excursion, so he stayed home and entertained our dog, who came with us to PA. I brought a full box of dog biscuits, which is now over half empty. We’re afraid the dog will refuse to come home, in favor of staying with the grandparents, who spoil the canine as much as they do the wee primate. ;)
I’d worry that the dog will get fat, except that increasing her food input just increases her poop output. Which, at least for this owner, is a lateral move at best.
MattF
Good news– it looks like Daniel Davies (aka dsquared) is returning to public view:
crookedtimber.org/2014/08/16/the-end-of-a-glittering-career/
Davies is/was a high-end financial advisor and is an unapologetic fan of capitalism. He is also on the opposite end of the sanity spectrum from the yahoos you see on CNBC. His most famous blog post could be subtitled ‘Applying What I Learned in Business School to the Iraq War’ and has been cited as one of the all-time best posts ever:
blog.danieldavies.com/2004/05/d-squared-digest-one-minute-mba.html
Note, btw, the date of the post.
Betty Cracker
@Amir Khalid: Don’t know about the Stallone film (except they are rarely worthwhile), but I did want to mention I tried the 3-D clip-ons at Guardians of the Galaxy the other day, and they were fantastic, so thanks for that idea. If you haven’t seen GotG yet, see it instead of the Stallone flick! If you have seen it, see it again! ;-)
sharl
Glad to hear the good news JGC. And that’s a lovely plan you have for Ron.
Regarding Ferguson, I’ve been reading about CNN reporter/commentator Don Lemon, who is new to me. On the one hand he has been getting some good reviews for his coverage of the aftermath of Mike Brown’s (likely) street execution. But he apparently has some history of pissing off his fellow African-Americans with some rather unusual pronouncements on race relations. So even if he has been doing good work in Ferguson, he appears to have a reputation with the Black community that he won’t be able to shake so easily.
From Elon James White:
And Black Twitter was having lots of fun supplying captions for one particular screen shot of the man, e.g., here and here. The looks on the faces of those folks behind Mr. Lemon are priceless.
rikyrah
Glad to hear you are doing better Cole. Keeping you in my prayers.
Violet
Glad you’re feeling better, John. That’s a nice thing you’re looking to to for your friend from rehab. You’re such a good guy.
I happened to watch the press conference yesterday, and holy cow is Jay Nixon out of his depth and an idiot. You can read my comments about it in a thread yesterday here. I mean they are treating Capt. Ron Johnson like dirt–sending him out to do the dirty work. I’m sure he’ll be the fall guy if it fails. Jay Nixon couldn’t even talk to his own constituents–had to get the black guy to do it for him. Just appalling.
rikyrah
@sharl:
How did I miss this?
HILARIOUS!!!!
Violet
@JPL: Chuck Todd doesn’t start at MTP until September 7.
My Truth Hurts
Hey man, I’ll, uh, dispose of those Vicodin pills for you. No problem.
Joyce Harmon
John, for localized pain, you might try the pain relief rubs, creams or lotions with topical analgesics and anti-inflammatories.
rikyrah
@Violet:
Your comment on this yesterday was absolutely on point.
Mike J
Those blue lines are there for a reason.
shelley
John, so glad the shoulders are better than you feared they’d be and youre not feeling too bad. AND you took the critters for a walk as well. Criminy!
*********
On a side note, also glad your pharmacy will take back an unneeded prescription. I’ve got a couple of old pain scripts hanging around and no way to get rid of them. (No flushing, no trashing, and our pharmacy’s won’t accept them.) Hell, I’ve got an old bottle of Darvocet, which i don’t think they even prescribe anymore. Our town is supposed to have an annual ‘bring in your old drugs’ dump day but it never seems to come around.
Violet
@rikyrah: Thanks. I didn’t even realize the press conference was happening–had just paused the TV and when I fast-forwarded it to see what I’d missed, saw the press conference so I watched. Just terrible.
The whole thing was horribly run, the poor folks in the church asking or shouting versions of the same question: “Why no charges yet?” “Where is the police report?” “Where is the police offer who shot Mike Brown?” Etc. Those are reasonable questions–and they’re all about justice for Mike Brown. But the idiots in charge are focusing on “security” and then send poor Captain Johnson out there to do their dirty work. He’d been so good for the community and Thursday was such a good day–and then they do this? His body language and tone was about as opposite from what it had been as possible. He was angry. You could tell. He didn’t want to be saying those things to those people. I don’t think he agreed with that curfew at all but what could he do. Chain of command and all.
Just appalling. They’re doing a good job of refocusing the media on “thugs” and “violence” and “looting” and away from justice. That’s exactly what they want to do. I hope people continue to call it out.
OldDave
@Mike J: Those blue lines are there for a reason.
All I can say is this: I Can’t Wait
Pogonip
John, you’re one of the nicest guys going, even if you do hate us all. And congratulations on resisting booze for medicinal purposes.
I was thinking about your mentioning that you have weird accidents because you are thinking about things and not paying attention to the barber chair or the mop or whatever. Now that you’re nice and sober and alert, why don’t you try paying attention, like you did in the war zone, when you are doing things, and confine your deep thinking to when you are safely seated?
chuckbutcher
26yr ago 3x treatment was the charm. A couple things were different. I finally got that smart as I am my best thinking got me there. I was going to die or off myself. There are always excuses – any worth dying for? Friendship and respect are earned and it is up to me to do what it takes, including accepting help. Having fun or just getting along w/o the crutch takes practice and it is easy to be stupidly angry while re-learning poorly.
WereBear
Seconded. That is a pivotal piece of research, and yet so accessible and a joy to read. Though, of course, not to contemplate.
But he nailed down why a conservative’s brain works like that.
Abo gato
I took the generic version of Vicodin before and after I had both knees replaced. It seemed to be the only thing that would let me walk since the knees were pretty bone on bone. Anyway, I was hooked. At least, I told myself it wasn’t all that bad, I only took one a day. My ortho would give me a prescription for 120 of them that cost 10 bucks at the pharmacy. Took that one a day for about 8 years and finally decided to stop. Tapered off by taking half of one. That took about a year, then taking them every other day. Been done with now for about 2 years. Not going back.
SiubhanDuinne
@Mike J:
I was more thinking cupcakes.
Josie
So glad to hear good news about your shoulder, John. Hope it continues to improve. You are so thoughtful to invite Ron for a weekend. It will be good for both of you. You seem to be at your happiest when you are helping someone else.
indycat32
I think they sent Cpt. Johnson out there to be the fall guy and when what he did actually worked they had to rethink the whole thing and came up with the curfew to prove you just can’t reason with “those people”. Saw someone on MSNBC this morning saying the Ferguson police dept. is incompetent. I disagree. They delayed releasing the cop’s name so he could get out of town. They fail to secure the scene (by letting Wilson leave in his police car), they don’t interview witnesses so their recollections will be compromised by what’s said on TV. Looks like it’s all going according to plan.
InternetDragons
I had a bad feeling when I saw your joke yesterday about cutting a foot off =P
In all seriousness, and from one alcohol-free soul to another (coming up on 30 years with +0), you are doing great! I am always hesitant to offer too much specific advice because everyone’s path through sobriety is a bit different. I’ll toss a couple of things out today, though, and hope that I don’t seem too intrusive.
A lot of your work in early sobriety (which I define as the first 3 years or so) is focused on learning to manage your emotions without alcohol, learning to be at home in your own body, and generally establishing the habits and patterns of thinking that will keep you addiction-free. And the stuff that worked for me or anyone else may or may not work for you. I guess that is one of the reasons I like AA (and there is also plenty of stuff I dislike about it, lol). But it can be really powerful/helpful to just LISTEN to other folks’ stories and hear what they’ve learned and how they coped.
Anyway…shoulder pain. I know shoulder pain. I was in a really severe motorcycle accident in my late 20s that re-designed my shoulder and hip and knee in ways I won’t describe here because it’s all sort of sickening. I’ll just say – multiple surgeries, over six months in a wheelchair, two years on crutches, and zero use of my right arm for almost a year. And pain. Dear gods the pain.
The pain part has never entirely left me, so this is what I’ve done while maintaining sobriety throughout: I use acupuncture. I had the acupuncturist teach me some acupressure so I can do a bit of the techniques at home. I also learned self-hypnosis specifically based on pain management strategies. All of that plus the occasional advil is all I have needed for pain management to date.
So that’s the suggestion I’d offer: Consider the acupuncture. And perhaps consider the self-hypnosis if your university has folks who have pain management training skills.
Best of luck and much <3 to you. And blessings to you for reaching out to Ron. It'll help both of you. Just please, please remember that not everyone makes it through sobriety and if he does happen to slip back, don't let that pull you along. Here's hoping he'll do great, though!
lamh36
shelley
For the life of me, I can’t think what I typed that put me into moderation. Oh well, somebody always complains about it one time or another.
Violet
@indycat32: Exactly. They are highly competent in what they want to do. Kill the black guy. Protect the white cop. Abuse the black populace. Slander the victim’s character. Change the discussion from justice to security. They are succeeding on all counts.
rikyrah
@Violet:
That’s why they sent that ridiculous Nixon out to do that. Johnson came in, and not only was he hailed, but the people themselves stopped the looting. Silly me, I thought that was what the police were supposed to do, but they decided they wouldn’t.
This is some straight up racist ass shyt.
They were upstaged by the Black man, showing them how they should have done their jobs in the first place, and they were mad.
I’ve never been one to say don’t vote.
And, I still say you should always vote.
But, hell muthaphuckin’ no to ever voting for Nixon for ANYTHING ever. Period.
Don’t have to vote for Blunt. Just leave that office open as you go up and down your ballot.
Mealy mouthed muthaphucka didn’t show any respect to those constituents who only wanted the truth about what happened to Michael Brown.
Phuck him.
SiubhanDuinne
@shelley:
I think it was “phärmåčŷ.”
Violet
@rikyrah:
Yep. Captain Ron Johnson did an amazing job. The community loved him and the change he brought. He knows that community since he grew up there. And they shat all over him. He was angry. You could tell in that press conference. He didn’t agree with that curfew.
Violet
@rikyrah:
Speaking of voting, I saw on twitter that there are voter registration tables out in Ferguson.
InternetDragons
I think it’s going to take a lot more than this BS to discredit the amazing work that Captain Johnson accomplished. The contrast between he and Nixon is stark. Everyone can see that.
InternetDragons
I think it’s going to take a lot more than this BS to discredit the amazing work that Captain Johnson accomplished. The contrast between he and Nixon is stark. Everyone can see that.
Iowa Old Lady
I heard this morning that last night in Ferguson, the press was theoretically confined to a press area where they saw things from the police point of view.
rikyrah
@indycat32:
tell the truth.
tell the truth.
lamh36
@Iowa Old Lady: not theoretically, literally. They were choraled in a pen and only the bravest and to my my younger reporter even braved the fray. It’s why when the penned journos were claiming no tear gas the actually on the ground reporters were saying hell no.
It’s also how the pic of the CS (ie tear gas) canisters were photographed and therfore police had to fess up.
Without those pics and reports the penned journos were going by police spokesperson
lamh36
Correct me if I’m wrong but they still haven’t released the county autopsy of Mike Brown. Waiting for tox so they can malign his character some more.
Iowa Old Lady
@lamh36: Yeah, the presence of those journalists is why I said “theoretically.”
I know lots of readers here don’t like DK, but there’s a great diary there right now summarizing twitter posts from last night. Alderman French is an amazing man.
ETA link: dailykos.com/story/2014/08/16/1322238/-Twitter-last-night-in-Ferguson
Amir Khalid
@lamh36:
The tox screen typically takes a month or two, and might give needed context to the findings from examining the body, so there’s nothing necessarily sinister about the autopsy results not being out yet.
lamh36
@Iowa Old Lady:
If you were in twitter last nighy the only people actually reporting from outside the press pen were Alderman French, Jon Swain from ATL Dispatch (I think it’s ATL dispatch) and a reporter form VICE. VICE also kept up live stream video and photography
srv
Violet
@Iowa Old Lady: Yep. They were in a pen. By the police. There were a few reporters out there. The video guy from VICE was out there.
Yep. The penned journos weren’t very happy about it–some of them had been ordered by their superiors not to get arrested (Mike Pearce, LA Times). The only good that came from that, imho, is that the journalists took pictures of their press pen and showed how useless it was and what asses the cops were. They proposed a press pool to go down to the protestors and were told no:
In the age of Twitter and smartphones you can’t hide the truth as easily.
Iowa Old Lady
Ducklings going down a waterslide:
facebook.com/photo.php?v=559175380870961&set=vb.210223395766163&type=2&theater
schrodinger's cat
I am glad that your shoulder is feeling better.
lamh36
@Amir Khalid: Ok then does it take a month to release the number of times Mike Brown was shot? Or a month to release the police officers report?
At this point I’m just unwilling to give this county and police force any benefit of the doubt
This IS the group who release that robbery video against wishes of both state and federal officials and even though they admitted (then changed story) that robbery had nothing to do with why he was stopped.
ETA: Also too I didn’t say that it was unusual just that they were waiting to release it
Oh and what lees than a week after Robin Williams killed himself, we knew the prelim cause of death and that he was sober…Mike Brown was killed before that
sharl
@Iowa Old Lady: Yeah, that caged-in “Freedom of Speech Zone” concept – it goes at least as far back as the 2004 Democratic National Convention in Boston (video, 4m15s) – has become a popular go-to control method for press and regular folks alike.
max
@Betty Cracker: If you haven’t seen GotG yet, see it instead of the Stallone flick! If you have seen it, see it again! ;-)
Seconded! Best Marvel comic book movie I’ve ever seen. That doesn’t mean it’s not cheesy – it’s cheesy, but great, like Godzilla 2000. My only complaint was that Drax was a lot dumber than the original Destroyer. Worked here though.
At any rate, in a really good mood because I am so relieved my shoulder is not the worst case scenario.
Yes, and maybe you could work on taking care of yourself, which partly involves dissipating some of that anger so that you can keep your head about you and not get injured, eh?
I second SG’s recommendation of the Ryobi Extend-It, BTW, although Hitachi is a very good brand.
I’ll take him back Sunday night or Monday morning.
Damned decent of you, Cole.
I have not seen one action of his (other than putting Johnson in charge) or one interview that has impressed me or made me feel confident about him as a leader.
He seems to be something of a RINO. His politics are ostensibly with the protestors, but his gut is with cops. So he’s trying to avoid the entire issue. I don’t doubt he thinks its perfectly fine that they blew that kid away.
max
[‘We have plenty of potential VP candidates.’]
MattF
File this under ‘Mysteries of evolution’:
nytimes.com/2014/08/17/magazine/a-mothers-journey-through-the-unnerving-universe-of-unboxing-videos.…
Valdivia
Glad to hear you’re doing so great John.
chopper
well, this isn’t good.
Wonderful.
Kathleen
@indycat32: While there is no doubt that Ferguson Police Department couldn’t manage the Cake Walk booth at the FOP picnic, there is also no doubt that their ridiculous and insulting roll out of “evidence” is part of a plan (I also think outsiders could have been brought in just to cause problems and confusion). It’s telling that the Ferguson Police Chief appeared on Hannity, and Miller’s girl friend (also a policeman) appeared on a right wing radio show. That in and of itself tells me there is an agenda. One of the positive outcomes I can see is that the community will mobilize to implement policies and oversight to ensure fair treatment by police and courts (which would include efforts to recruit candidates and GOTV campaigns). I would also like to see an open discussion about how to mitigate the harm the mainstream (broadcast) media do by selectively reporting “facts” and images of African Americans.
On another note, I’m glad that you are feeling better John and I applaud your efforts to create your life on your terms and to help others along their way. You and other commenters here who have battled addiction are very brave and courageous. A perfect antidote to some of the vile hatred and evil we have witnessed this week in Ferguson.
Gin & Tonic
Kept thinking “it’s not going to rain, it’s not going to rain”, and put a coat of varnish on the kayak. Finished, cleaned up, made a cup of coffee, sat down to check on e-mail and some blogs, and what do I hear – raindrops on the leaves. Fuck. Just a passing sprinkle, I hope.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@lamh36: IF the fig leaf lie they used to justify the release of the video was FOIA requests from the “media” (and we can be perversely grateful that the nitwit sheriff didn’t think to cook up a few of those with FoxNews and some of their affiliates before hand to give themselves a paper trail), have any FOI requests been filed for the incident report? Hard to believe no one has done so
scav
@lamh36: I’m with you here, these lot are at best incompetent (charitably) and bordering on incitement. With deliberate aforethought. not to mention they’re really busy running to the national media.
Villago Delenda Est
I couldn’t understand why Nixon called for a curfew when the situation had changed so radically in Ferguson…for the better, when the Ferguson PD was taken off the streets and other LEOs with an agenda of calming things down took over.
Nixon seems to have his head up his ass on this…or, perhaps, is so worried about his political future that he’ll do anything at all to show he’s not going to coddle “those people”.
And, yup, our friends in the MSM have basically forgotten about Michael Brown, because, well, it’s very inconvenient for the standard narrative to focus on a murder victim. Fuck, they might actually be doing their supposed, idealized jobs instead of their real ones, which is to provide content to attract eyeballs to the commercial messages that pay for their cocktail weenies.
Violet
My comment is in moderation. Not sure why. I’ll try to break it up and see what posts
@Iowa Old Lady:
@Iowa Old Lady: Yep. They were in a pen. By the police. There were a few reporters out there. The video guy from VICE was out there.
@lamh36:
Yep. The penned journos weren’t very happy about it–some of them had been ordered by their superiors not to get arrested (Mike Pearce, LA Times). The only good that came from that, imho, is that the journalists took pictures of their press pen and showed how useless it was and what asses the cops were. They proposed a press pool to go down to the protestors and were told no:
J.D. Rhoades
Just tuned back in again and read about the shoulder. Glad it’s not as bad as it could have been, and doubly glad the little drink demon in your head isn’t trying to use this to rationalize drinking again. Stay vigilant, though. I know from experience the little bastard’s likely just playing possum.
Botsplainer
John, I am going to say this as somebody a few years older – you need some serious diet and exercise, along with work on fine motor skills.
Take up a sport that emphasizes movement, not video games. Racquetball, swimming, light aerobics will move you toward fitness without forcing you to interact with other people. At some point, you can take up running.
Excessive injuries due to accident can also be indicative of neuro problems unrelated to clumsiness. Check with your doc on that.
No matter what the cause, you will be far better served by pushing physicality as opposed to a video controller.
Violet
And:
Police kept the journalists right where they wanted them.
Villago Delenda Est
@Violet: The last thing the cops wanted were third parties not under their control observing what was going on…and then passing those observations on to the rest of the country.
rikyrah
@Iowa Old Lady:
Yes, he has been stellar.
SiubhanDuinne
@Iowa Old Lady:
I never get tired of watching that!
indycat32
@Kathleen: On Sunday night when the cops said that “somebody” threw “something” and therefore the demonstration was no longer peaceful and they started with the teargas, my first thought was “how convenient, that somebody threw something”.
Amir Khalid
@lamh36:
But you did say #53 they were waiting for the toxicological report because they wanted to smear Mike Brown some more.
However, I agree with you, there seems no good reason for the Ferguson PD to hold back eyewitness statements or Officer Wilson’s own account of the shooting, since these are part of the public record.
rikyrah
@Villago Delenda Est:
He has no political future.
He is done.
Because it was ‘ those people’ that only got him elected in the first place.
SiubhanDuinne
@max:
Which would make him a DINO, not a RINO, yes?
Violet
@Amir Khalid: Have to disagree with you. I think they are withholding the autopsy report in hopes the tox report will contain something incriminating. Then they’ll release them both at the same time and call him a drug addict.
There is no reason they can’t do any number of things like:
1. Give a timeline for release of autopsy report and tox report
2. Give a status update
3. Release a preliminary report–like the bullet wounds part but not the tox report
They are not doing any of those things. Instead they talk about “safety” and taint the jury pool with images of the “thug thief stealing cigars”. It’s bullshit.
If the police wanted to do the right thing they could and would. They don’t. They want to protect their own and slander the victim. They’re doing a stellar job of both those things.
TS
@Amir Khalid:
And nothing in Ferguson relates to racism under that thought – Of course they want the tox because it might given the pundits some more ways to attack the victim. Mike Brown died from multiple gun shots – nothing to do with toxins.
scav
@Violet: It is in the PD’s, city and county’s best intesest to confuse the issue and muddy the timeline so as to provide confusion and retroactive media-enhanced cover for the actions they deliberately chose and have repeatedly chosen. Their behavior is cut from the same cloth as their attempt to muzzle the media, except when they chose to go into friendly venues and mouth off, or release ‘evidence’ they were recommnded not to. They are not reliabe actors in this situation.
J.D. Rhoades
It needs to be emphasized that, according to Ferguson Police’s own statement, the officer who shot Michael Brown didn’t know anything about a supposed robbery and had no reason to believe Brown was anything but just another black kid he could hassle, then shoot if he didn’t like the response.
FlipYrWhig
@Villago Delenda Est:
It’s because there were looting incidents the night before. CNN (I was watching yesterday afternoon) was interviewing local business owners who were complaining about a lack of police protection. It was turning into a case of “maybe they’re not being aggressive ENOUGH!” I switched off before Nixon spoke. But I assume that was the thought process.
Cacti
AG Holder announces that Feds will perform their own autopsy of Brown, at the request of his family. The “extraordinary circumstances” of the case were cited.
Now I’m especially curious. The Browns had hired Dr. Michael Baden, of O.J. Simpson trial fame. I wonder if he found something that made think calling in the forensic cavalry was warranted.
Violet
@FlipYrWhig: And the anger on Friday came after the morning press conference where the “release of the officer’s name” turned into “Mike Brown is a thug and a robber.” Everyone in the community was angry at how that was handled. The mood had changed from upbeat and hopeful that things were moving in the right direction to anger that yet again the fucking Ferguson police were doing attacking the community–in this case slandering the victim.
Edit: Although the looting was wrong, the entire mood shift could have been avoided–and likely the looting avoided–if the police had handled the Friday press conference differently.
trollhattan
GH Reynolds, continuing to strive for World’s Most Repellant Human. Gosh, wonder what his “resolution” for the Ferguson situation might be? (a. moar guns b. bigger guns c. moar bigger guns)
Mandalay
@Kathleen:
Indeed. During the interview the police chief humbly and diplomatically says:
But while he may not be very bright, but he surely knows that he is involving himself in the politics simply by granting an interview on Hannity’s show, answering softball questions. The Police Chief is a liar with an agenda.
Mary G
I think Captain Johnson would make an excellent governor of Missouri, or if that wouldn’t get by the rednecks, mayor of Ferguson. Glad to hear there are voter registration tables out there. Nixon disgraces the name of Democrat.
John, glad your injuries weren’t as bad as feared to your “good shoulder” and that you are going to help your old roomie get out of the shelter for a couple of days. You are a mensch.
Cacti
@Amir Khalid:
Not just hold them back, but delay gathering them in the first place.
Also, if the inflammatory video is smoking gun evidence of a “strong arm robbery,” why hasn’t Dorian Johnson been arrested or charged more than a week later?
Mandalay
@Cacti:
You see the DOJ as the cavalry?
I would feel more comfortable if Michael Brown’s family had stuck with the original plan of having a private autopsy. Now the government is performing both autopsies. What could possibly go wrong?
skerry
@Botsplainer: I am going to add that you should think about yoga. There is an article today in the NY times about beefcake yoga.
I started yoga at my local YMCA earlier this year and am amazed at the difference in how I feel. I, too, need to drop a few pounds and have not been athletic for years (unlike my youth). I am now walking more and generally feeling better. Doubt if I will ever run again or do strenuous exercise. Have been kayaking a couple of times this summer.
It’s a good place to start.
Violet
@Mary G:
I don’t think he lives in Ferguson now so he may not be eligible to be mayor. But if people aren’t eyeing him for a political future, they’re missing the boat completely.
mtiffany
Shorter Andrea Mitchell: The shill from AIPAC has left the building, enter the beard of fatuousness.
Cacti
@Mandalay:
Holder has been extremely vigilant in using his office to protect civil rights. Brown’s parents had already hired a top notch forensic pathologist.
Likely as not, he’s had a chance to look at the body. I’m wondering if he saw something that raised red flags (i.e. Missouri examiner tampered with the wounds, etc.).
Brian R.
Rick Perry’s insisting that lawsuits against sitting chief executives are, in and of themselves, outrageous. An attempt to criminalize politics.
Wonder if the House Republicans agree?
raven
@Mandalay: The autopsy by the feds is at the request of the family.
”
“Due to the extraordinary circumstances involved in this case and at the request of the Brown family, Attorney General Holder has instructed Justice Department officials to arrange for an additional autopsy,” the statement said.”
scav
Could we maybe think about the Holder stepping in one of these ways? Yes, It’s clear there’s a need for some outside actor that, if possible, both sides trust. Check. Granted the real screamers aren’t going to be convinced by anything the Feds say when headed by the Muslim-Kenyan-Athiest-Commie-out-to-get-whitiy but that’s background noise at this point. More will likely trust the feds than a personally personal autopsy. What is also is is a very clear and official demonstration to the local officials\s that they are no longer necessarily regarded as trustworthy. A tit for the we’ll release the video despite advice tat.
Betty Cracker
@Cacti: Holder has quietly been an outstanding AG.
Kathleen
@Violet: I wonder what was behind LA Times edict to reporters not to get arrested. Are they concerned about their safety (which I could understand)? Or are they afraid Times would be attacked by fake reporters totally not focused on the real issues (unarmed African American youth shot in cold blood and local police act like Mad Max)?
skerry
@Cacti: The family of Mike Brown asked to see the video before the police released it, but were ignored.
The link (think progress) has a picture of Mike Brown’s parents that just breaks my heart. The look on the poor mother’s face. I cannot begin to image her pain.
Kathleen
@rikyrah: Indeed. A very caring and brave man.
Voodoo Priestess
I’ve decided it’s time to burn a chicken for you under the moonlight. Any idea which deity you may have pissed off?
skerry
@FlipYrWhig: Another curfew tonight
Cacti
@scav:
Also too, in lieu of what you described, Brown’s family wanted someone far removed from Missouri and the St. Louis area to perform their own assessment. If the private examiner and the Feds come to a similar conclusion, and the Missouri examiner a different one, it would substantially undercut the Missouri examiner.
Violet
@Kathleen: Who knows. It’s the media and it’s a business. Maybe whoever is at the top sent down an edict. Or maybe they didn’t want the arrested reporters to become the story again. The press pen was kind of amazing, though. Reporters didn’t want to be there but if they left they’d be arrested and they’d have even less ability to do their jobs so they were a little stuck. The journalists like the VICE reporters had been with the protestors all along and wasn’t hustled into the press pen.
I don’t think the “press pen” image does the authorities any good. It makes them look like they want to stifle the first amendment and given that they’ve already arrested reporters who were doing nothing wrong, and that in turn brought a lot of attention to what’s going on, this is just one more thing.
The curfew is on for a second night tonight so I guess we’ll see if the press pen happens again and if the reporters stay there.
Villago Delenda Est
@Brian R.: Well, if the Chief Executive in question is a near sheriff, well, that’s different. Because. Reasons.
max
@SiubhanDuinne: Which would make him a DINO, not a RINO, yes?
For him to be a DINO, he’d need to have been an actual goddamn Democrat at some point, like Joe Lieberman. Nixon appears to be the sort of fellow who would’ve joined the Republican party but they were too crazy for him. Thus, an ex-pat RINO.
Claire McCaskill has been perfectly wonderful on the issue and has been working hard behind the scenes.
max
[‘Compare and contrast.’]
skerry
@Cacti: Is the federal autopsy in addition to the private one or in lieu of it? I can’t find anything that clarifies it.
I hope it will be a 3rd autopsy.
Cacti
@max:
Claire McCaskill has put Jay Nixon to shame.
Villago Delenda Est
@Violet:
Well, that’s pretty much exactly what they want to do. They don’t want these guys reporting the fuckups of the PD.
Kathleen
@indycat32: @rikyrah: Indeed. A very caring and brave man.
Yup. That kind of stuff happened a lot in the 60’s. I would put nothing past them. And who is making sure they get booked on right wing TV and radio? Does police chief know or care the kind of message this sends? And I’m surprised the shooter’s girlfriend (also a policeman) is allowed to talk since there is an investigation (we think) in progress. So who’s orchestrating the RW media outreach and why?
Cacti
@Kathleen:
Anything the gf of Wilson has to say is inadmissible hearsay.
max
@max: Thus, an ex-pat RINO.
‘To go into politics he needed to pick a party, so he flipped a coin… because BLOOMBERG FOR PREZ!’
All we need now is Evan Bayh… except nobody would notice him on account of his being a tree.
max
[‘Great camo job though.’]
Cacti
Another interesting tidbit about Officer Wilson.
His home is in Crestwood, MO, a town of about 11,000 with a 1.6% African American population.
Villago Delenda Est
@Cacti: Again, the purpose of releasing that video is to reinforce the “those people” meme that is out there in the minds of potential jurors. It doesn’t matter if charges are never brought against Dorian Johnson, the important thing is you have “those animals” behaving according to preconceived expectations. Therefore, the murder of Michael Brown was a righteous shoot of “an animal”.
The damage is done, exactly as it was planned.
scav
@Cacti: The family is behaving entirely responsibly and intelligently from what I’ve seen (it’s not been my main focus). What a contrast. I still suspect the feds of enjoying and making the most of the moment.
Cacti
@skerry:
I’m wondering that also.
Brown’s family had already hired the private examiner before the Feds’ announcement. I’m guessing that he has had or will have a chance to look at the body also.
Villago Delenda Est
@Cacti:
There is no such thing as “inadmissible hearsay” in the court of public opinion, where this battle is being fought right now.
Mandalay
@Cacti:
Because he hadn’t committed any crime. The real question is why his name got dragged through the mud at all, since he hadn’t committed any crime. But I think we all know the answer to that one.
Violet
@Villago Delenda Est: Exactly. They don’t want the reporters reporting anything that’s not approved.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Cacti: Seeing some gossip-y headlines and tweets that they’ve been feuding for years, but didn’t care enough to click on the details. McCaskill’s no hero of mine, but I give her credit here. At least Nixon called out the video ploy for what it was.
Twitter also tells me Candy Crowley had convicted felon and one-time Homeland Security Secretary Designate Bernie Kerik on her show to discuss law enforcement. Head, meet desk.
lamh36
@skerry: my understanding is that it will be all 3. St Louis County, private family, and DOJ
The Snarxist Formerly Known as Kryptik
@Violet:
It wasn’t just that the narrative turned to ‘Mike Brown is a Thug and Robber’. It’s how that narrative shift encouraged everyone else to see the entire situation, not just the killing, but the protests and the confrontations, everything in the same ‘blacks as a whole are hyper-violent thuggish creatures’ lens, the same one that claims “WHY AREN’T BLACKS PROTESTING THUG ON THUG VIOLENCE IN THEIR OWN CULTURE?!’
It’s bullshit narrative, but it’s one that keeps finding more and more purchase as people try to ignore the stacked decks.
Michael Bersin
@brettvk:
Yet, Senator Roy Blunt (r) was busy elsewhere on Thursday morning.
Villago Delenda Est
@Violet: One of the things the US military learned from Vietnam was that they needed to keep the press (particularly television reporters) on a very tight leash to present “the official story”, not the actual one.
Thus you have these “press pools” set up during subsequent military deployments to carefully control what is reported. It’s never explicitly stated that way…the notion of “safety of journalists” and “logistical constraints” are all offered as the REAL reasons for this, but by a happy coincidence it allows the military chain of command to control what is covered from the top down. Battalion commanders (even brigade commanders) don’t have the assets to keep those reporters on a leash, but at division and above you’ve got Public Affairs officers billeted to do precisely that.
What we saw in Ferguson was a reflection of this general military policy of controlling what is reported about the military.
Mandalay
@lamh36: Good news if correct, but do you have a link for that? All the headlines I see refer to the DOJ performing the second autopsy rather than the third.
Mandalay
@Michael Bersin:
There are very few winners from Ferguson, but Blunt has to be top of the pile. Despite his poor poll numbers, if Nixon ran against him Blunt would run him through the wood chipper.
lamh36
@Mandalay: I’ve honestly only been following on twitter. No link. But as u understand it the family had private autopsy then asked for DOJ ro step in.
lamh36
BTW, there is some new surveillance footage circulating and guess what…
Violet
@Mandalay: I wonder if there is anyone else the Dems can find to run against Blunt. Nixon’s career has to be done.
Baud
@lamh36:
Sad to say, but there has been so much misinformation put out there, both deliberately and inadvertently, that it’s going to take months to sort it all out.
Cacti
Holy shit, new store video from a different angle shows that Michael Brown did pay for his merchandise.
At 36 seconds, you’ll see the clerk walk out from behind the counter, fold currency, and stick it in his pocket.
raven
Bustin my ass to get the cobia smoker for the 2pm Garden Club Pot Luck. . . that starts at 4!
raven
Bustin my ass to get the cobia smoker for the 2pm Garden Club Pot Luck. . . that starts at 4!
Baud
@Violet:
When is Blunt up for reelection? Not this cycle, right?
Violet
@lamh36: I’d seen that video–or part of it–on TV. Motherfucking Ferguson police! There is not much they won’t do to slander that poor kid. Who was murdered by one of their officers.
Mandalay
@Baud: 2016.
Baud
@Mandalay:
Thanks. Lots can happen in two years.
Violet
@Baud: Wikipedia says he assumed office in January, 2011, so he must have been elected in the 2010 cycle. So I guess that would be 2016 for his re-election?
Mandalay
@Violet:
Run a dead Kennedy. He’d have a better chance than Nixon.
Violet
@Baud: That will be a presidential election as well, so turnout should be higher. That could affect things. Dems need a good candidate. Don’t see how Jay Nixon is it unless he magically turns things around from here. He’s been awful so far.
Kathleen
@Violet: One of the things that puzzled me about the “original” video from the Friday press conference was that it shows a store employee going behind the counter before Michael steps to the counter to obtain the merchandise. That’s why I was puzzled about the “not paying” story. I did see the interaction between Michael and another person (I assumed he was the store manager) but I’m still not sure what that was about. Very fishy.
kc
You’re a good man, Cole.
Baud
@Violet:
Right. Missouri seems to have weird politics, so who knows?
kc
@lamh36:
I’ve seen the same thing, in several places. I’m glad the family is getting an independent one.
stonetools
@rikyrah:
Er, no. Remember the context. The alternative to Jay Nixon in Missourah is not some fire breathing liberal candidate who will sock it to those Ferguson Police Department idiots, but some Teahadist who will back up those idiots to the hilt. You have to go with the Democrat you have, not the mythical unicorn Democrat you want.
The point here is to prod Nixon into doing the right thing. Indeed, he is doing the right thing by convening a grand jury- he is just doing it too slow. He should be also prodding the Ferguson PD to arrest the officer, because, as sure as shooting (pun intended), if a black man had shot a white officer down execution style, he would be in jail or dead by now.
It is always frustrating to have to prod a Democrat into doing what’s right, but at least it’s POSSIBLE. With a Republican governor in charge, it would have been out and out impossible.
kc
@Cacti:
Are you kidding me? For Christ’s sake.
Violet
@Kathleen: It is indeed very fishy. Well, okay, it’s not. Because it’s makes it clearer than ever that the goal of the Ferguson PD is to change the discussion from the police officer murdering the unarmed young man in the street to the thuggish ways of the victim. And they’re doing that very successfully.
The Ferguson police department is actually pretty competent at what they want to do–abuse the black citizens, murder people at will, protect their own, change the subject, create confusion, etc. They’re doing a damn fine job of those things.
Mandalay
@Baud:
It sure can, and his team of minders are surely already working a path to redemption, but I’ve seen enough of Nixon in the past week to know that I don’t want him anywhere near any political office in future.
It wasn’t that Nixon was merely unlucky, or got caught in a gaffe or two. He exhibited the complete absence of any bedrock beliefs, flip-flopped repeatedly, and clearly showed that he is not a leader. Fuck him. I don’t want a [D] after his name ever again, especially in the Senate. Send his worthless corpse off to a think tank in Washington, or the board of some Wall Street bank, where he can do no harm.
Violet
@stonetools: Yep. Not voting for the Democrat, if that Democrat is Jay Nixon, means the Republican will win. The magic liberal Democrat Senate candidate who isn’t on the ballot isn’t going to magically win.
Kathleen
@lamh36: Found a link to NPR story about autopsy:
npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2014/08/17/341082635/more-violence-arrests-in-ferguson-but-most-respect-cur…
Warning – you do not want to read comments. I scanned about the first 10 and became disgusted. I wonder if these bowel blockers listen to NPR or just troll.
Gene108
What is sad about the QuickTrip video that allegedly shows Mike Brown stealing a tobacco product, is that I’ve met plenty of people, who grew up as white middle class kids (both male and female) who did a fair bit of shoplifting as teenagers.
I think a lot of the public would just chalk it up to youthful indiscretion, if it ever became public and not take the association with criminality any further.
I used to think people we’re not self-aware of this double standard, but with the power of internet comments I think people want to actively maintain this double standard and are fully aware of what they are doing.
Violet
@Mandalay:
Yeah, this is the part that’s the real problem. There’s no there there. He’s all about himself and selling whatever he thinks will sell at the moment. No spine. No bedrock beliefs. No ability to take charge and inspire confidence in him.
Violet
@Gene108:
It wasn’t at the Quik Trip. It was at a different store.
Mandalay
@stonetools:
This is the bogus pearl clutching argument I see forwarded time and time again in support for Democrats like Hillary Clinton and Jay Nixon. We must accept them because there is nobody else. Bullshit! There is always someone else.
How bad does Nixon have to be? If Nixon was caught in bed with his grandpa while skull fucking a dead schoolboy would you still come up with this ridiculous argument? If Clinton decides not to run in 2016 would you just throw in the towel?
Violet
Re: the autopsy:
raven
@Gene108: The swisher thing was not at the QT.
Baud
@Mandalay:
Who’s the GOP nominee?
Violet
@Mandalay: There is always someone else but they have to get on the ballot or they won’t be elected. A write-in candidate, except in very unusual circumstances like with Alaska Senator Lisa Murkowski, will not win.
If Jay Nixon is the person on the ballot for the Dems when November 2016 rolls around then not voting for him will mean the Republican will win. At that point he may be terrible but at least he wouldn’t be a Republican in the Senate.
scav
@Baud: Yeah, Location Location Location, Context Context Context and Timing Timing Timing. It’s not much good arguing that there should be an dedicated MRI and a full trauma staff available when doing triage on site. In a perfect world, yes, but they’re bleeding here.
Not to disagree with the precept and the efforts to get better candidates and first aid kits to as many locations as possible, but plopping down and not playing or helping at all when perfection is not available immediately in an actual event seems slightly off.
Betty Cracker
@Gene108: I don’t think it’s the alleged shoplifting that is potentially so damaging (though it feeds into the narrative). It’s when Brown appears to shove the clerk aside and then turn around and chase him back into the store.
That’s going to give the people who want to exonerate the cop the evidence they need that Brown was physically aggressive toward the cop too. If that video is admitted as evidence in an eventual trial, I don’t think there’s much of a chance of convicting the cop.
Villago Delenda Est
You know how we’re always saying that when the wingnuts scream they’re projecting?
Well, you don’t get projection much purer than this.
Villago Delenda Est
@Mandalay: Your lack of understanding of what is realistic in this political circumstance means you’ll always, always be marginalized.
So have at it. You’re on the Nader glidepath to irrelevancy. Go for it!
skerry
Mandalay
@Betty Cracker:
If multiple witnesses testify that the cop shot Brown from a distance while Brown was stationary with his arms were raised, and the autopsies support that, then the video seems pretty irrelevant, and doubly so since the cop would not have even known about that video “evidence” when he fired.
Mandalay
.
skerry
@Mandalay: I think the chance of the cop being convicted depends much more on where a trial is conducted. Think Rodney King.
In fact, I have little faith that the cop will even be indicted, let alone tried.
Kay
@Cacti:
I thought it was a situation where he took the cigars and then was caught taking them by the clerk on his way out, so shoved the clerk. In that portion, he’s reaching over the counter with people walking in and out. It’s hard for me to believe he’s just blatantly stealing in the middle of the day in a store in a town of 21,000 people, and then walking away. It’s not the slightest bit covert.
sharl
@Gene108: Yep
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Betty Cracker: I don’t think the video is remotely probative as to how the shooting took place. It should not be admissible.
Betty Cracker
@Mandalay: Agreed, but it goes toward state of mind. It gives jurors who want to believe the cop’s story that Brown attacked him a reed to hang that theory on.
Villago Delenda Est
@skerry: Yup.
It’s amazing what will crawl out from under the rocks under these circumstances. I’m sure there will be a few Hackenkreuz flags at this “support” rally, along with some bedsheets being worn as robes. Some of these people are just not that clever about optics.
Sort of like the Ferguson PD.
CarolDuhart2
@Violet: Also, I bet if he was kicked upstairs, he would be less of a problem for Missouiri than he is now. Vote reliably for Senate Majority (we hope) leader and shut up.
Is there anyone who could run for Governor there?
Violet
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): Completely admissible in the court of public opinion, which is where Mike Brown is being tried at the moment. And the potential jurors are being influenced.
Violet
@skerry: From that link:
I think they’re hoping the black thugs are going to show up and beat them, thus proving their beliefs that all black people are thugs.
Villago Delenda Est
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): It won’t be admissible in a court of law, but it’s out there in the court of public opinion.
The jury pool is being poisoned, deliberately, to make it more likely that the murderer of Michael Brown, Darren Wilson, walks away without punishment.
It will take extraordinary revelations about all this to reverse the current trend. For example, proof of editing of the convenience store footage to cast Brown and Dorian in a “thug” light. And the revelations must receive widespread exposure, and our oh so compliant with authority news media can be counted on to not do that.
Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name)
@Violet: @Villago Delenda Est: I think you would be surprised how well juries can do at excluding evidence not presented at trial.
Gene108
@Mandalay:
You do realize there is very little difference between either Clinton and President Obama on any substantive policy matters?
I am sorry but the Great Liberal Hope does not exist. When Senator Sanders had a vote on closing GITMO and moving the prisoners to a supermax in Illinois, he voted with 89 other Senators to keep GITMO where it is.
The problem is not the politicians. Politicians follow the will of the people and give voters what voters want.
If you want a more liberal set of politicians, you need a more liberal set of voters.
You need to do a better job in educating people on the wonders of liberalism.
Villago Delenda Est
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): The voir dire for the Darren Wilson trial should be an adventure in and of itself.
Gene108
@Mandalay:
You do realize there is very little difference between either Clinton and President Obama on any substantive policy matters?
I am sorry but the Great Liberal Hope does not exist. When Senator Sanders had a vote on closing GITMO and moving the prisoners to a supermax in Illinois, he voted with 89 other Senators to keep GITMO where it is.
The problem is not the politicians. Politicians follow the will of the people and give voters what voters want.
If you want a more liberal set of politicians, you need a more liberal set of voters.
You need to do a better job in educating people on the wonders of liberalism.
raven
@Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): He’ll get more than they think he should and less than we do.
stonetools
Yeah, who?
You have no idea?
Then maybe it’s possible you don’t know what the eff you are talking about. Maybe you should defer to the wisdom of the Missouri Democrats who are, you know, IN Missouri and who chose him.
I bet you guys are the same lot who earlier attacked Claire Mccaskill as being too right wing,
Suffern ACE
So has there been looting or attempted looting the last two nights in Ferguson or not? If so, then what is the problem with the curfew? I’m not following the argument here.
CONGRATULATIONS!
@stonetools: I get what you’re saying but there’s a time when a guy is doing more damage to the entire party than good, and we’ve reached that point with the bumbling Governor.
Violet
@stonetools: If there is someone else, the election isn’t until 2016 so that’s plenty of time for that person to get their act together for a Senate run. Time will tell.
cckids
@It’s Not The Fall, It’s The Landing:
She’s been fantastic. A breath of fresh air, seeing a politician not being wishy-washy about what’s up, too worried about optics to be real.
Her “fuck you” tweet to Nixon was classic.
Violet
@Suffern ACE:
There was looting on Friday night. The curfew was put into place yesterday. Last night there was no looting but protestors who didn’t leave were arrested–seven of them. One protestor was also shot.
The problem with the curfew is more complicated. What are your questions about it?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
a quick google search suggests Nixon is term-limited, has already ruled out another run at the Senate after having failed twice, and saw himself as an alternative to Hillary, but I think we can all assume that Nixon is destined for a lucrative law practice or think-tanker position
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@stonetools: Her behavior during the Stimulus debate could charitably be called unhelpful, more accurately be called stupid, and I think unnecessary even given her circumstances, but I was very glad to see her win in 2012 and amused and impressed by the way she did it.
rikyrah
@stonetools:
Er, yes.
Sometimes, the lesser of two evils is still evil.
The contempt and condescension by Nixon at that Press Conference was it.
There are bare minimum requirements that an elected official should be able to display when the time comes.
Nixon has failed.
So, hell no, fill out a ballot and leave whatever office he’s running for blank.
Not saying vote or the Republican.
But, don’t reward a mealy-mouthed muthaphucka who can’t stand up for what’s right in a time like this.
Goblue72
@Mandalay: it’s cute how you two actually think there’s a snowballs chance in hades that the white pig is convicted. Even on the slimmer than slim chance it goes to trial.
stonetools
Think of what Sam Brownback (next state over) would have done in the same situation, and then get back to me. The problem here is that Balloon Juicers think that Nixon’s constituents are made up of people like them. That ain’t true. They’re made up of Hot Air commenters and Rush Limbaugh ( b. Missouri) listeners. Such people are probably busy calling Nixon and asking why he isn’t backing the Ferguson Police Department to the hilt and ordering out the National Guard to protect the businessmen and the “good people” against those who “loot like rampant animals” (actual quote I saw on Twitter). Not surprisingly, he is opting for an equivocal “third Way” . He is imposing a limited curfew (12-5pm) while convening a grand jury and is holding off on an arrest till an indictment comes down ( most likely next week).
Now this doesn’t satisfy liberals who want no curfew ,an immediate arrest of the officer , and full disclosure of all police reports.But liberals aren’t the only ones he is listening to.
rikyrah
@stonetools:
Nixon got into office because of the 92% of Black voters in Missouri that got him in.
THEY ARE HIS CONSTITUENTS.
And, it’s not too much to ask for the man that THEY helped get elected
not disrespect them or disregard them.
I wouldn’t expect shyt from Sam Brownback, because the folks in Ferguson wouldn’t have voted for him.
Violet
@rikyrah: Understand your anger for sure. Let’s fast forward to 2016 and imagine the two candidates for Senator from Missouri are Jay Nixon (D) and Teabagger Idiot (R). Not voting for Nixon at that time means the Senator from MO will be Teabagger Idiot. And given the power the Senate has, that his bigger implications than just in Missouri.
The time for Dems to vote against Nixon (if he’s running then) is in the primary. Find another good candidate and get them to be the candidate. I know nothing about MO politics so I don’t know who that could be. There have to be some choices out there.
I’ve been wholly unimpressed by Jay Nixon as you know. He’s been awful throughout this whole thing. He should not be rewarded by the voters. However, I’d rather he win the Senate race (if he runs) than any Republican. Any day. I sure hope there’s someone better, though.
Keith G
Many conspiracy theories here, there are. Yeesssssss.
stonetools
@rikyrah:
Also, too, unfortunately, Virginia, greater evil is still greater evil.
Remember 2000, when we were told that Bush and Gore were the same and we shouldn’t reward the Democrats for electing a “corporatist” like Gore and instead we should cast a “protest vote” for a “true believer” like Nader?
LESSON LEARNED. FOR ALL TIME.
You may not believe this, but I’m betting that Nixon on his worst day is probably doing better than a Teapublican governor would have done on his best .
Look, folks, this ain’t our first rodeo. Back when we were young, pure, sweet liberal virgins, we believed that there really were liberal Prince Charmings out there who deliver us blue state Nirvana even in states like Missouri , much less nationally. Now, that we have been around the block a few times, we realize we have to settle.
stonetools
@rikyrah:
Indeed.And he put in Johnson, got the state involved in the investigation, and has a state grand jury considering the charges. Don’t take any of that for granted. A Sam Brownback clone would likely have done none of that.
Again, if you can’t think that anyone would do worse than Nixon, you aren’t thinking hard enough.
WDS
Glad you’re doing well John … so glad!!!
Here in Houston, there is no pill drop off (I’m not sure why – probably some red-state paranoia or something). At any large pharmacy you COULD spend money to mail the pills off to someplace that takes care of them OR -cue trumpets here- I read this a bit ago …
If you have cats, when you empty the litter boxes into a plastic bag, take the pills you want to get rid of and empty them INTO the bag, slightly mush them – and place in the garbage … LOL
Kathleen
@Violet: You’re absolutely right. Silly me for not recognizing they have their priorities straight. (BTW, I used to challenge people who said Bush admin “incompetent” with your argument, ie, “They’re quite competent at torturing, undermining the Constitution, consolidating wealth for the few at the top, lying, rescuing Haliburton from bankruptch”, etc).
Keith G
A few nights ago as I watched a life stream from Ferguson, I was wondering if there is any organization that is providing some architecture to the community’s wish (and right) to protest? Is there a grass roots, locally powered, Occupy-type group that has formed?
I find little use in typing, from 800 mi. away, complaints about who did what or who is not doing what…..and why.
Every so often, when my petty change jug gets filled, I donate the proceeds to a small rotation of local causes and sometimes to Battleground Texas. I have been using the Google to find an organization in Ferguson who might need some help with a little bit of office supply money.
If anyone hears of such, post a link.
sharl
@Keith G: Multiple sites I’ve visited – both STL-local and national (Buzzfeed) – have linked to the Michael Brown Memorial Fund at gofundme.com.
The Buzzfeed post (see item #2) also links to a food drive for the kids who are missing meals because schools have been closed, thus denying school-provided lunches to those kids.
I suspect there are other conduits out there, but I couldn’t personally vouch for any of them.
A bit of funny-not-really trivia: Jesse Jackson showed up there and asked for contributions to HIS church, for providing aid or activism training or some such shit. According to multiple accounts, he was booed off the stage; a proper response, based on those accounts of the man’s behavior.
Brian R.
@Villago Delenda Est:
Presidenting While Black is still an impeachable offense.
The Sailor
Like Humphrey, Carter, Gore, Kerry? Is there a single one in that group that wouldn’t have been better for the US than the asshole republicans that got elected?
That you and people like you got elected because they weren’t unicorns?
Joeyess
Cole? You’re a mess.