You can call him Darth. A man of the people. @Doranimated Lord Vader polling higher than all 2016 pres candidates | http://t.co/0ygL4UKjTB
— Bill Kristol (@BillKristol) November 30, 2014
When you want wrong, you can count on Bill Kristol to bring it.
Speaking of Twitter’s ability to showcase small-minded wrong people in their full idiocy, from the Atlantic, on Friday:
Earlier today, it seemed like #BlackStormtrooper might actually eclipse #BlackFriday as a trending topic. That’s because the official trailer that aired Friday for the next film in the Star Wars saga—The Force Awakens, directed by J.J. Abrams and scheduled for release in December 2015—opens on a black man wearing a stormtrooper’s uniform.
The man, who is played by John Boyega (of Attack the Block), pops into view perspiring and panting hard. He is surrounded by desert: in all likelihood the rolling dunes of Tatooine, the homeworld of both Luke Skywalker and Darth Vader. And he appears to be in trouble.
Maybe the only people more alarmed than Boyega by his circumstances were commenters surprised by the sight of a black man’s head emerging from the white plate armor of an Imperial stormtrooper. People on Reddit compared the trailer to a scene from the 1987 Mel Brooks spoof Space Balls, a gag that plays up a black stormtrooper as jive talkin’. In other threads and on Twitter, some people registered mere racist shock. But a few corners of the Internet turned to the internal logic of the Star Wars universe to appeal the presence of a black stormtrooper. Didn’t the prequels reveal that all stormtroopers were white clones?
No, they didn’t. In Star Wars Episode II: Attack of the Clones, the Jedi Knight Obi-Wan Kenobi travels to the secretive planet of Kamino, where he discovers the existence of a clone army that would feed the so-called Clone Wars and eventually serve as the model for the evil Galactic Empire’s stormtrooper infantry. (Spoiler alert: Don’t watch the prequels.) Those clones weren’t white in any sense of the word. Jango Fett, the bounty hunter who served as the genetic template, was culturally (and perhaps ethnically) a Mandalorian. And the actor who portrays him, Temuera Derek Morrison, is a New Zealand-born person of brown skin and partial Maori descent…
I only ever saw two of the Star Wars movies, but even *I* know Darth Vader is James Earl Jones. (insert winking emoticon here)
***********
Apart from mocking the douchecanoes, what’s on the agenda as we wrap up the weekend?
burnspbesq
Just finished unpacking. Appears that TSA confiscated the Leatherman multi-tool that was in my checked bag. Why they would take that and not the Spyderco knife that was in the same pocket is … confusing.
Corner Stone
@burnspbesq:
Ha. I saw this and thought it was a special shout out just at burnsbbq.
Tell us more about LAX player heroes all up in the hood.
Villago Delenda Est
Reddit is one vast ocean of douchcanoeery. From shore to shore, broader than the Pacific, it’s douchecanoes left, right, and all the way fucking down.
ruemara
The fact that so-called fanboys don’t remember that Jango was brown and that he was played by a Maori actor is scoff-worthy. But after the shitstorm that ensued with the Hunger Games cast reveal, particularly around Rue, I wasn’t surprised.
Villago Delenda Est
@burnspbesq: We’re talking TSA here. Fucking broke on purpose, as it was designed by the deserting coward Heimatsicherheitshauptampt.
Mike J
I find it hard to believe that anybody stayed awake through the prequels long enough to figure any of that out. My eyes glazed over with the one paragraph synopsis.
MomSense
So many douchecanoes so little time.
Seriously the douchecanoes are like black holes. They just suck all the energy, joy and life out of everyone around them.
lamh36
I saw the trailer didn’t even register that dude was Black, but then again never saw the prequels & never will so wasn’t a big deal.
Boy, white racist idiots sure know how to ruin everything.
I was actually just reading the article on this very subject this morning
srv
Is nothing sacred.
@Villago Delenda Est: reddit is a very representative cross section of Americana
schrodinger's cat
@Mike J: I hear you. The prequels were terrible and had sucky dialog. I am not muck of a fan of the original trilogy either.
ETA: Remember, “I have the high ground?”
schrodinger's cat
@MomSense: I read about your new kitteh, photos please.
MomSense
@schrodinger’s cat:
Will do!!
Jimmi the Grey
Also too, StormTroopers are not Clones. The ST’s from movies 4, 5, & 6 are recruited from imperial human citizens…of which Lando Calrissian was one.
aimai
I was so horribly dissapointed when Darth Vader took of his helmet and revealed that pasty white face. If James Earl Jone’s voice was good enough they should have cast him in the actual role.
Jimmi the Grey
On phone and cannot edit so to add: Lando was an Imperial citizen, not a stormtrooper.
gene108
I never fully understood the point of Stormtrooper armor*. It didn’t protect them from the small arms fire of the day, in any appreciable way versus the unarmored.
It did not seem to offer much protection from sticks and stones, as seen in the battle on the Sanctuary moon called Endor, in Return of the Jedi.
* I like Star Wars. I’ve seen the prequels and do not loathe Episodes II and III as much as most, it seems. I’ve read a few of the books and comics. But damn that Stormtrooper armor is worthless.
NotMax
Once again, an incomprehensible twitter citation.
English: a quaint concept.
Tommy
I did Thanksgiving with my family and extended family yesterday. Brother married into a huge family. There is just me, my mom, my dad, and my brother. Moderate. Others. Normally they are kind of far right. I am the only liberal in the room. But lately, last three years or so they have gotten better.
Well until last night.
I was told by my brother’s wife’s dad and brother, and I will admit I inserted myself in the conversation, because I was sitting between them as it happened on the same couch. Comments were made like, “I’d have shoot him.” I was like hold on, hold on. They said Wilson’s gun was almost taken and the ONLY option was to kill Brown (this went on for a long, long time). Yada, yada, yada.
The happy part of the story, later Paul (my favorite extended family member BYT), a little older then me and totally “blue collar” was telling me if he owned a store in Ferguson he’d have sat out front of it with his guns. Somebody come up on it, well he’d deal with it. His wife heard this walking by and laughed at him. Said no you wouldn’t, you are not the kind of man that would kill another. I’ve been married to you for 35 years. Just shut up.
That was part of my Thanksgiving ….
Then told the protests where there was looting and businesses burning down, Al Sharpton paid for those people to do it.
ruemara
Fuck this shit. This is the sheriff of Missouri county’s response after being asked to provide details about his statement that President Obama approves of the riots in Ferguson. https://twitter.com/sheriffclarke/status/539174651231223809 Asshole.
I once said on twitter that if I knew that being black made me a combination of Magneto and Darkseid, I’d have demanded better parking. It seems we have magic destruction powers. Even when unarmed. And Tommy, next time your jackass family spouts off, ask them why they’re more upset about property damage and loss, less upset at the loss of life of a young man, the devastation of the family and even the slightest appearance that America has the level of unequal justice system we can find in a banana republic.
lamh36
The article I linked above also mentioned Rupert Murdock taking to twitter to defend against the chatter about the new Moses movie Exodus where all the Egyptians are played by white actor
Rupert on twitter wondered what all the hoopla was about because all the Egyptians he knows consider themselves white. Ridley Scott blamed iit on Hollywood and Christian Bale acutely used some sort of reverse racism bullshit when asked about it (I kid u not)
Tone in DC
The reddit non-fans hate the minority trooper.
Like FDR said, I welcome their hatred.
Mike J
@ruemara: What did he say? I have javascript turned off on my tablet and all twitter ever shows is a “why don’t you join” screen. Can’t you just quote the 140 characters so I don’t have to give him a hit?
gene108
@aimai:
When did David Prowse piss in your cornflakes?
The man finally gets a bit of camera time, without the helmet on, though with a lot of make up, and dialogue in his own voice, and you can’t let him have his moment?
It’s bad enough Lucas edited David Prowse’s “Ghost” Annakin out of the end of RotJ and edited in Sebastian Shaw, but I don’t see why cutting his one bit of dialogue out is soooo important to you.
I’m guessing James Earl Jones is probably not the right size for the Vader suit.
burnspbesq
@Corner Stone:
Life’s too short to bother with the likes of you.
Mike E
@schrodinger’s cat: I watched the prequels and I remember none of it…tbh, I remember gadgety moments but no real character or galactic history details. I coulda gleaned more from 3 trips thru a carwash.
Tissue Thin Pseudonym (JMN)
Both pass defenses look pretty confused in Green Bay.
lamh36
Here ya go. You can also find Murdock tweets here including how Egyptians are middle eastern but far from Blacks as they treated Blacks like slaves???
MOVIES
Christian Bale Defends Ridley Scott’s Exodus Whitewashing, Doesn’t Think It’s Weird He’s Playing Moses
Mr Stagger Lee
A light saber version of a broad sword? What is the purpose of the laserized hilt? So can we get a Scottish actor and a light-claymore?
Ultraviolet Thunder
They wanted it. I lose all kinds of useful small objects from my toolcase when I fly, which is 76 times this year (actual count). I’m on my 4th box knife and 5th 4-way screwdriver. For some reason the easily visible bottles of BANNED lab grade methanol get a pass.
Mexican TSA-equivalent is even worse. They confiscated a SPORK from my carryon for looking too stabby.
And if you roll your eyes they suddenly forget that they were speaking English a second ago and switch to Spanish.
NotMax
@Mike J
Amen. I fell asleep during the first prequel. What I did see was painfully awful enough* that didn’t even attempt seeing the next two.
Figured the hafl hour, more or less, passed out through the middle of the picture was the brain’s way of desperately sparing itself from the onslaught of drek.
* Most particularly any appearance of
AnakinMannequin Skywalker.Starfish
Of course, Darth is polling better than all of the potential candidates. Why settle for the *lesser* of two evils?
ruemara
@Mike J: What I said. Obama approved of the riots in Ferguson. He was asked to expand on his comments by a black journalist. Hilarious bigotry by a neocon online with a badge ensued. and is currently ensuing.
@Mr Stagger Lee: It is to create possibly the dumbest design for a laser sword ever. the equivalent of taping two sharp double bladed knives to your katana.
Ultraviolet Thunder
Is anyone else dreading the inevitable, inescapable, irresistible juggernaut of promotional hype that’s bearing down on us to wring every last red cent out of the new Star Wars movie?
You know it’s going to be frikkin’ EVERYWHERE in every possible form.
Tissue Thin Pseudonym (JMN)
Gronk almost ran out of his pants.
ruemara
@Ultraviolet Thunder: I’d ship that stuff ahead of time to your hotel. Sounds like you’re funding their kleptomania.
NotMax
@NotMax
Realized what a mess it was going to be very early into it, during the scene when tea is served, seeing the protocol droid serve the callow student before the revered master.
Frankensteinbeck
@Mr Stagger Lee:
To look scary and badass. Note that it does not have to actually succeed. All that is required is that some Sith went ‘I’m puttin’ a LASER crossguard on my lightsaber!’ That is exactly how they think.
EDIT – @ruemara:
Which, to continue my point, no shortage of idiots would do. Exactly the same kind of idiots who would sign up as Dark Jedi.
KG
I’d vote for Vader just to see him use the force choke on either a reporter or member of congress or both
Ultraviolet Thunder
@ruemara:
I travel on a moment’s notice, often to board a plane and work the same day. I ship the large/delicate stuff to the jobsite but I have to travel at all times with 68lbs of hand tools and small equipment. I’ve taken to putting delicate and thievable items in my suitcase (now 40lbs) to try to hang on to them. And I have spares of everything I possibly can.
They seem to like knives and good screwdrivers so I put the crummy ones on top as decoys and bury the nice ones in the hope that they’ll be too busy to dig.
schrodinger's cat
@KG: That would be the day, so many candidates amongst the Punditubbies are ripe for the Vader treatment.
gene108
@lamh36:
I always find it odd that the Jews I know seem to have less vested in the Old Testament than many Christians. The ones I know are not the most orthodox, but even so they are not remotely close to thinking they need to follow all the rules laid out for the Jews 3,000 years ago and are not trying to pick and chose selective portions to apply to the modern world.
They have their customs and culture, but the Old Testament stories are treated more as mythology than a living breathing document that must be used to make decisions for the modern age.
Christians seem to still run to the Old Testament, when they need passages to condemn someone and show God is angry at such and such group and want to use parts of it to make decisions about how we live today.
Frankensteinbeck
@ruemara:
Reading that is weird, because a lot of the sheriff’s lines are straight out of the trolls here. I guess an asshole is an asshole, on both sides of the political divide.
NotMax
@ruemara
Light scimitars and light flamberges may not be far behind…
For those of a more criminally terroristic bent, light box cutters.
srv
Deval Patrick is a no-show for 2016.
KG
@Frankensteinbeck: the cross guard is actually probably less dumb than Maul’s double sided light saber. Having actually learned how to fight with a Bo, the Maul design us just asking to lose a hand
Mnemosyne
@lamh36:
If it was the “crossroads of the empire,” why are all of the major characters white? I mean, that explanation sounds like a great reason to cast the most multi-cultural cast ever, not to go with the same ol’ white people.
Also, regarding the #BlackStormtrooper issue — hello, do none of these young fans remember Han and Luke pulling the old knock the dude out and take his armor for a disguise ploy in the first film? How do they know Boyega is playing a stormtrooper and not someone disguised as a stormtrooper, hmmmm?
Frankensteinbeck
@KG:
Yes, I thought about that too, but didn’t want to launch a side argument. Being only able to safely grasp one little stretch of such a huge weapon is wildly impractical – but I bet it made Darth Maul feel SO tough.
In theory, and with the lack of consistency and thought in anything designed by Lucas you have to include a mountain of salt, it doesn’t matter if the weapon is practical or not. The Force wins or loses you the fight. That’s the point of taking a lightsaber against a blaster in the first place.
jon
I very much enjoyed Attack the Block. Watch it with subtitles to catch the slang, as it’s full of the stuff. But if you enjoy sci fi/horror and kids against the world films, and want to see a little racial politics enter the fray as well, it’s a great movie.
See it. Seriously, it’s fun.
pat
@efgoldman:
.
Oh, I guess Gronk is the person and not the substance. Right?
/knows absolutely nothing about football
gene108
@NotMax:
In a world* where Light (Saber) Whips exist, why not Light Scimitars and such?
* Of course nothing becomes official, until gets into a movie, so there’s plenty of room to scrap the idea “for real”.
Geoduck
@Mnemosyne:
That was my automatic assumption too, that he’s one of the film’s heroes who somehow ends up wearing stormtrooper armor. I was more depressed by the fact that they’re evidently going back to Tatooine once again, instead of showing us something New and Different.
lamh36
@Mnemosyne: exactly. The very idea of a white man, a white actor talking about having to “suffer with this skin…” is just so ri-god-damn-diculous to me.
Someone said maybe Bale is contractually obligated to defend or talk up the film, but still if the best he can do is that bit of tone deaf bullshit then maybe he should have come up with a better contract
Patricia Kayden
In a fantasy world, such as Star Wars, why would all the Storm Troopers have to be White? Never watched any of the Star Wars movies and will only watch the latest because Lupita Nyongo is in it.
Mnemosyne
@lamh36:
Also, too, I really wish that, one of these days, when an actor is asked why s/he was cast, s/he says, Because the money guys would only give the director the budget he wanted if he cast a movie star, and I’m a movie star. Because 99 percent of the time, that’s the actual answer.
ETA: And I think Bale could very easily have given my answer and sounded like a whole lot less of a douchebag. He’s Batman, fer chrissakes — of course the money guys are going to assume the movie is going to make more money with Bale’s name attached. Just admit it, dummy!
Tissue Thin Pseudonym (JMN)
I really like the original Star Wars movie, and most of The Empire Strikes Back, too, except for the stuff on Dagobah. But after that the superstructure of the franchise just became overwhelming. People began to think that it was far more than it actually was: a fun space opera that didn’t make the slightest bit of sense if you thought about it hard. George Lucas himself is more guilty of that than anyone.
I got dragged to The Phantom Menace and never bothered with the last two. I won’t go to the next ones, either.
gene108
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Double-bladed_lightsaber
CaseyL
Bale isn’t entirely full of shit; just a thousand or so years off.
Egypt was somewhat multi-ethnic… but only after it was occupied by Persia, then liberated by Alexander after he defeated Cyrus, and then more or less handed over to Ptolemy after Alexander’s death. Ptolemy was Alexander’s half-brother, therefore a Macedonian, and founder of the Ptolemiac Dynasty in Egypt (which ended with Cleopatra some 300 years later).
It’s very unlikely Cleopatra was black. She was the heir to multiple centuries of Ptolemys intermarrying, including marrying brothers and sisters, to preserve their Macedonian bloodline.
lamh36
@Mnemosyne: exactly. People know how the game us played. Telling the tRuth wouldna hurt nothing
Specially in this case…as with Noah all you need to say is …Bible story…and a certain segment of population will show up
ruemara
@Mnemosyne: Exactly.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
Likely the black storm trooper is running like hell because he figured out how worthless his armor and weapons really are. Hence all the hate since the guy isn’t willing to die like a good little canon fodder.
gene108
@Tissue Thin Pseudonym (JMN):
I think with the amount of money via multi-media tie-ins, such as toys, comic books and novels, and later T.V. shows, video games, RPG’s, etc. people seem to not have been able to fully
exploitplumb what the true depths of the Star Wars universe may hold.Mnemosyne
@Patricia Kayden:
There’s a famous shot-on-the-set clip from the original film that shows the stormtroopers and Vader talking to each other, and they’re all British, because the film was shot on soundstages in London. The American-accented voices were dubbed in later.
Of course, we all know now that assuming that everyone in Great Britain is white is a pretty silly assumption, too.
lamh36
I mean look. The ole Ten Commandments movie was cast by primary white actors too, except good ole Yul Brynner and I freely admit to not hating it, more so cause of tradition but still…
That was a different time. The fact that Scott et al was aware enough to know they’d have to defend the whitesplaining shows that he knows it would be a problem.
But he’s more than likely banking on the Church-going crowd not to care enough
Mayken
@ruemara: that and being so unimaginative as to not be able to figure out any reason whatsoever a non-clone might be in a trooper suit.
Eta: Or what @Mnemosyne: said!
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@lamh36:
WTF? We know what they looked like because they left a lot of art behind and a pile a mummies.
J.D. Rhoades
@Mnemosyne:
How do they know Boyega is playing a stormtrooper and not someone disguised as a stormtrooper, hmmmm?
Exactly, considering that he appears to be running for his life. And if you listen to the soundtrack, he’s apparently being chased by those nasty hovering spy droids from Empire Strikes Back or their equivalent.
My totally unsupported theory: there’s an Imperial remnant plotting to “Take Their Galaxy back”, Boyega’s character went undercover to try and ferret it out, and his cover got blown.
gene108
@CaseyL:
In Bale and Scott’s defense no one really knows what the ancient Egyptians looked like and how much Egyptian appearance has changed over the last 4,500 years.
I somehow think there’s going to be more than enough stuff in this movie to be offended over, if you are not a white Christian.
J.D. Rhoades
@lamh36:
Then he doesn’t know the church going crowd. Those people are going to go nuts over every “historical inaccuracy” (and yes, I know how stupid that is).
lamh36
@Enhanced Voting Techniques:
It’s acruelly pretty funny. But they have a pic floating around the building of the Sphinx by the slaves in the image of the Pharoah. I supposed it’s based on the real life sphinx, excerpt that the bridge/shape of the nose to fit the white guy who’s plays Pharoah that you can’t help but envision it with the nose blown off as in modern times and the pproportions just seem off
ruemara
@J.D. Rhoades: Nah. Much respect, but nah. They believe in the incredible whiteness of being in the bible. The accuracy they love, is the bible being treated as historical truth.
lamh36
@gene108: and yet they know enough that the majority of the slaves are cast by POC?
The multicultural things is a cop out. Particular since Ridley also has been quoted as saying Hollywood wouldn’t be willing to finance an more “accurate” versions.
So which is it, “we don’t really know” or whitw folk just won’t see a biblical film with primarily POC?
lamh36
@ruemara: yep. Was gonna say, the belief in the witness of the Bible is hard fast to white majority Christians except in the case of when the Nubians are name checked
gene108
@Enhanced Voting Techniques:
We can take educated guesses, but mummies and their artwork do not leave behind what color skin they had. Soft tissue does not hold up well enough over the millennia and the artwork has faded a bit, so we do not know everything about the color pallet the Egyptians used to depict themselves.
I think, if this movie is intended to play for a white American Christian audience, they are making the calculated assumption that for the target audience all the heroic characters in the Old Testament looked as white as the Renaissance masters painted them.
Mnemosyne
@lamh36:
In the old days (of Hollywood), white movie stars were frequently cast as people of other races. One of the weirder examples today is when they cast a whole bunch of white people (including Katharine Hepburn and Walter Huston) as Chinese characters in Dragon Seed, but cast Chinese-American children to play their kids. (Huh?)
Someone needs to tell Ridley Scott that it’s freakin’ 2014, not 1944, and it’s okay to cast people of actual African descent as residents of Northern Africa these days.
And because it’s you, I know I can say four words that would have made you first in line to see this movie: Idris Elba as Moses. ;-)
chopper
Say what you want about the tenets of the sith, dude, at least it’s an ethos.
J.D. Rhoades
@Mnemosyne:
The absolute weirdest, though, has to be John Wayne as Genghis Khan.
lamh36
@gene108:
I agree this is the calculation. But I sure wish they’d just cop to it instead of the bullshit “we just don’t know” defense.
J.D. Rhoades
@J.D. Rhoades:
I would run over my Mama to see that.
lamh36
@Mnemosyne:
Never crossed my mind but now you’ve made my day!
:-)
ETA :funny enough I actually preferred Yul Brynner as Ramses..those legs, the skirts…Yul made a pretty hot pharoah. Why did ole Moses have to be so mean to him…lol
Mayken
@gene108: Prowse was cast long before Jones came on the scene mostly due to his height. Lucas didn’t like his voice, but they’d already done a lot of principle photography by then, hence Jones.
I agree it sucked he go edited out of the force ghost scene. Of course I also like to pretend the prequels didn’t happen.
gene108
@lamh36:
Ding, ding, ding…I think we have a winner…
I think the majority of the white American Christians, who will flock to see this movie, believe Jesus to be either a sandy-blond or strawberry-blond, depending on the artist’s rendition, with blue eyes.
Cast a
terrorist lookingArabauthentic looking Moses and the filmmakers will scare off their intended audience.I think there’s going to be plenty of stuff for folks to get upset about, with regards to this rendition of the Moses story, because – from the trailers – I think the movie is trying to “oh, ahhhh” the folks who like special effects movies, while playing to the sentiments of more conservative Christians.
I think actually trying to tell an interesting story, with interesting leading characters, or even be remotely authentic, are all secondary considerations. Most CGI heavy films usually have a basic formula: 1. Exposition, 2. CGI Action Scenes and more than likely, 3. EXPLOSIONS!!!
I figure this film will be heavy on points 1 and 2, though 3 will have to be toned down due to the lack of dynamite in ancient Egypt.
EDIT: In short, this is just the tip of the iceberg on stuff people will not be happy about, with regards to Exodus.
Mnemosyne
@J.D. Rhoades:
I have a book of that title. Interesting premise, but unfortunately the book itself is very poorly proofread and not very well written. A lot of the miscasting they talk about is white people cast as other races — Dragon Seed has its own chapter.
Weird quirk of the old Charlie Chan movies: they cast Swedish actor Warner Oland as Chan, with a strong Chinese accent, but always cast American-accented Chinese-American actors to play his sons, usually with Keye Luke playing Lee Chan, aka Number One Son.
Mnemosyne
@lamh36:
Funny trivia from IMDb:
The Other Bob
I watched the Star Wars trailer with my five-year-old and laughed with delight. I cannot wait to go watch it with mykids. Even if it sucks from a production standpoint (It has to be better considering J.J. Abrams.) I won’t care, because it is totally fun with the kids.
This summer I gave them a shit-ton on star wars stuff from my childhood to add to theirs. Best day ever.
Woodrowfan
well, Darth Vader was less evil than the Republican Party.
Frankensteinbeck
@lamh36:
I believe they’re making a calculated assumption that their target audience is proud of not being racists, and treasure improbable excuses. ‘Blacks are the real racists’ for example.
jon
There is no one way an Egyptian looks. It’s like asking what an American looks like. Are we a blond people with 2.5 children? Do we ride horses or Camaros? Is that a breed of horse, like the Pinto? Do the elderly resemble Bill Cosby or Orville Redenbacher? Do we live in trailer parks or tipis or Brady Bunch subdivisions?
The popular dramas of the early 31st and 46th Centuries better get it right, damnit!
Baud
@Woodrowfan:
Unlike the Republican Party, there was still good in him.
lamh36
@Mnemosyne: don’t know why, butspeaking of Hollywood tradition, I’m always reminded of MGM choosing back in the day to cast Ava Gardner over Lena Horne in a remake of another movie (can’t remember the original the remake was Show Boat) even though Lena Horne played the original and the character was actually billed as a Mulatto woman who married a white man.
But as you said that was a different time, this is 2014. Have some fuckin courage Ridley Scott
gene108
@jon:
The 31st century is only 1,000 years into the future, so they better fucking get it right.
The 46th century folks are bit more in line with the time difference between us and the Exodus story. Tack on another 2,000 years and you have the time difference between us and the earliest ancient Egyptian civilizations.
Tissue Thin Pseudonym (JMN)
The Packers may want to try actually tackling Blount.
lamh36
@Mnemosyne: well it worked. Even as a teen, I noticed the more “manly” physique of Ramses over Moses
Lurking Canadian
@ruemara: hang on, roll that back. The wingnuts were unhappy that Rue, representing the district of downtrodden agricultural labourers was black? I mean, I was kind of pissed off about that, but it seems the kind of thing the wingnuts’d heartily approve.
Mike J
@Lurking Canadian:
The wingnuts were pissed off that you were supposed to care when a black person died. Since it’s sad when Rue dies, obviously she was white.
Mayken
@Lurking Canadian: they were upset because she’s a character they cried over the death of in the book when they skipped over descriptions of her as black. So, yeah, they’re mad they are “tricked” into feeling sorry for a little black girl.
Eta: or what Mikej said.
NotMax
@J.D. Rhoades
Not to mention Paul Muni, Louise Rainer and others cast as Chinese in The Good Earth.
Strangest casting of Moses which comes to mind (purposely done for the comedy) was Soupy Sales in The Making of ‘…And God Spoke’.
lamh36
I suspect the same people who are upset at the idea of a Black stormtrooper are the same type who are just outraged that the new Annie movie will star Jamie Foxx as “Benjamin Stacks” (I thought it was a cute play on Daddy Warbucks) and little Quvenzhane Wallis as Annie. Which I can’t wait to take my Maddie to.
She could care less what color Annie is. She just saw a lil girl with curly hair like hers and said she wanted to see it.
Thank God for the children they may be the only one to save us all from this racist bullshit
NotMax
@lamh36
Daddy Warbucks totally whitewashed (no pun intended) for the stage play.
In the original comic strip, he was an execrable human. Even committed suicide because FDR was re-relected. Then miraculously resurrected by the cartoonist after FDR died, with no explanation of his return.
rikyrah
For the Chicago folks…
remember, the WINTER PARKING BAN goes into effect at 3 am.
move the car!!
don’t let Rahm get any of your money for towing fees!
gogol's wife
@lamh36:
It was a remake of Show Boat. The original (although I think it too is a remake) is worth seeing for the fabulous Paul Robeson — he is incredible in that movie — but it unfortunately also has a scene with Irene Dunne in blackface, so it doesn’t get shown much.
Julie is played by a white woman, Helen Morgan. She does her own singing, though, unlike Ava, and it is wonderful. But you also get to hear a tiny bit of singing from Hattie McDaniel, who was very good.
rikyrah
@lamh36:
Peanut told her mother exactly what day Annie would come out….
I didn’t know she was as interested in seeing it as I was..
But she knows the release date..LOL
Mnemosyne
@lamh36:
Yep, it was the 1950s remake of Show Boat. Horne could not be cast as passing-for-white Julie because it would mean that an actual verified black woman would be shown on screen in a romance with a white man, and the censorship rules did not allow that. Weirdly, you could have a story about an interracial romance (like Pinky), but both of the romantic characters had to be played by white actors.
Horne did get to sing Julie’s signature song “Can’t Help Lovin’ Dat Man” in MGM’s Till the Clouds Roll By … because it was a setpiece that could be easily snipped from the film by Southern theater owners who didn’t want their moviegoers tainted by seeing a talented black woman on their movie screens.
NotMax
@gogol’s wife
One of only a scant few films with Joe E. Brown which I can sit through without fidgeting. (For any fans of beefcake, Brown was also surprisingly buff.)
foo
@Ultraviolet Thunder:
This seems emblematic of the 3rd world shithole we are becoming. This reminds me of the kind of precautions I used to feel necessary only when travelling to real poor places like Morocco.
gogol's wife
@NotMax:
He’s in the later Show Boat. In the 1930s one it’s Charles Winninger.
I used to love the 1950s Show Boat but now I can’t sit through it. The 1930s one is so much better, except for that one horrible scene.
gogol's wife
@NotMax:
But what about Some Like It Hot? He’s incredible in that!
Temporarily Max McGee (soon enough to be Andy K again)
@jon:
Yep. A very diverse society- people with darker skin from the south, people with less dark skin from the west, people with even slightly lighter skin from the northwest…Then add in the Levantines, the Hittites from Anatolia.
What bothers me more is that people are taking this movie seriously whatsoever. If there was a Moses at all, he was some guy who brought a god of the town of Yhw to the lower classes of Canaanite society who’d killed their rulers, destroyed their cities and fled to the hills. Their claims that their god had given them the land were built to trump dynastic claims made by outsiders- such as the Egyptians- who had claims based on marriages to the former rulers of the land.
Mnemosyne
@lamh36:
Here’s a story about Gardner, Horne, and “Show Boat” — offscreen, they were very good friends, but there was always that little pall between them that Gardner got the role Horne desperately wanted.
@gogol’s wife:
If you follow the link to Horne’s performance at #104, there’s also a couple of links to Gardner’s undubbed singing as Julie. She’s no Lena Horne, but she’s not bad. But MGM decreed that almost every actor’s singing be dubbed with a “better” voice, so dubbed she was.
Schlemazel
Has anyone noted that anal warts poll higher than Bill Kristol? As does slime mold, whooping cough and cracked cuticles.
Mnemosyne
@rikyrah:
I haven’t made my mind up about seeing Annie, but it’s mostly because I was so disappointed by the 1980s version. It honestly was the very first movie I remember walking out of and thinking, That was a really bad movie. Definitely a formative experience for a future film student.
NotMax
@gogol’s wife
Better than Lemmon and Curtis were, to be sure.
Watchable film, but far, far from a favorite. Rather than women, the two stars always looked to me more like rejects from the seediest drag queen club on the wrongest side of the tracks. Monroe’s character is so brittle a gnat sneezing would shatter it.
Strictly IMHO.
Mnemosyne
@NotMax:
If another Joe E. Brown film you can watch without fidgeting is not Some Like It Hot, I’m afraid you may once again have to be dead to me, film-wise.
Mnemosyne
@gogol’s wife:
The 1936 version of Show Boat was directed by James Whale. Yes, Frankenstein James Whale.
NotMax
2Mnemosyne
It falls into the scant few I mentioned which are non-fidget inducing.
Matt McIrvin
@gene108: I’m pretty sure helmetless Vader never had David Prowse’s face; it was always Sebastian Shaw. Lucas edited out Sebastian Shaw as Anakin’s ghost and edited in Hayden Christensen, who played Anakin/Vader in episodes 2 and 3.
David Prowse shows up with his actual face as a tall dude in A Clockwork Orange, if I recall correctly.
muddy
@Schlemazel: Just the stupid smug face on his thumbnail there makes me want to give him a good smack.
Schlemazel
@gogol’s wife:
My mom dragged me as a very young boy to see a show that included Paul Robeson and I think Miriam Makeba (I remember the woman doing a ‘clicking’ song that I saw Makeba doing years later so she is who I see doing it. I was too young to really appreciate Robeson’s voice but I remember he did ‘Ol Man River’ 3 times and I kept running to the bathroom so I didn’t have to hear it again. The woman (Makeba?) was much more accessible to a child & I liked her a lot.
Dad was a union worker & organizer & mom a pure hearted liberal, I saw a lot of commie pinko performers as a kid!
Schlemazel
@muddy:
We could finance the revolution by charging $1 to kick him in the nads & $5 to punch his face.
Matt McIrvin
@NotMax: The liberal politics of the stage Annie probably made Harold Gray spin in his grave. Dude was the mid-20th-century version of a Tea Partier.
Mnemosyne
@Schlemazel:
I was taken to see a stage show that starred Sid Caesar and Imogene Coca. Sadly, I have no memory of it whatsoever other than having been taken to see it.
Schlemazel
@gene108:
I was really disappointed that it was not Jones under that helmet. Nothing against the guy they chose to show but that was not Darth Vader
NotMax
@Matt McIrvin
You betcha. Perhaps worse, as he had no compunction regarding being overt in his bigotry.
Schlemazel
@Mnemosyne:
Gawd that would have been fun! I vaguely remember them from Your Show Of Shows but only tiny bits fortified by clips I saw years later.
NotMax
@Schlemazel
re: Vader’s ghost -That whole Catholic-y ‘one act of repentance supersedes a virtual lifetime of sin’ thing always rankled.
Mnemosyne
@Schlemazel:
It was at a small theater in suburban Chicagoland in the 1970s (maybe early 1980s), so it may not have been them at their peak.
Mnemosyne
@NotMax:
More Protestant than Catholic, really — us Catholics are the ones who came up with the idea of Purgatory, where you could work off your sins.
NotMax
@Mnemosyne
Religious doctrine (like sports) ain’t my bag. Less than passing familiarity with either.
FlyingToaster
@srv: @efgoldman: The Governor’s wife told him (and every reporter who would pay attention) that he was going back to the private sector in 2015 come hell or high water.
I can see him accepting a judgeship in about 10 years, but first he has to make up for the lost pay (the local media more-or-less forced Mrs. Patrick out of her job during his first year in office).
rikyrah
@J.D. Rhoades:
BWA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA
Schlemazel
@Mnemosyne:
Caesar had a bad time with booze & he didn’t get clean til the mid to late 60’s. That and his reputation as a real hot head made people not hire him which is a real shame. He was one of the great physical comics ever and Coca too. There is something sad and pathetic about physical comedy done by old people. It stops being funny for reasons I don’t understand. But I bet that was a fun night.
Brooks tells the story of Caesar (who lifter weights & worked out obsessively) getting PO’ed at a New York Cabbie & threatening to punch him so the cabbie rolled up his window. Sid reached through the wing vent, grabbed the guy by his leather bowtie & started yanking him out the wing vent! He said “You are about to re experience your birth!”
I'mNotSureWhoIWantToBeYet
@Schlemazel: rofl. :-)
Cheers,
Scott.
Mnemosyne
@NotMax:
If you ever have to pick an Abrahamic religion, Judaism may be the one for you — as I understand it, they don’t have an afterlife at all, so it simplifies those debates.
Funny aside I remember from an L. Sprague de Camp book — one of his characters has ended up in Norse mythology and is being taken to Hel (yes, only one L). Being a modern-day guy, he’s surprised that it keeps getting colder as they go down. He finally asks and is told, “Yes, Hel is the coldest of the nine worlds. Why do you ask?”
Which, if you think about it, makes sense. Only a culture that gets a lot of hot weather would decide that the worst possible place to spend eternity would be someplace hotter than any other. To a Norseman, of course the worst possible place would be colder than anywhere else.
Sly
Nerd Alert: “Mandalorian” isn’t an ethnicity, human or otherwise, but a quasi-religious, meritocratic, tribal warrior-cult. Anyone or anything can be a Mandalorian provided that they (a) like killing shit, (b) are good at it, and (c) like to be around other people who like and are good at killing shit.
As for this dumb controversy, assuming that the character Boyega plays is, in fact, a stormtrooper working for some remnant Imperial leader, the Empire began using non-Jango clone templates some years after its founding. Beyond that, and depending on who is running the remnant of the Empire in the Abrams flick (which takes place 30 years after the Emperor took a swan dive into the core of the Death Star), it is reasonable to assume that whatever cloning facilities the Empire had as of the prequel series have been captured by the since-reformed Republic or destroyed.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Schlemazel: didn’t Caesar (according to legend) dangle one of his writers– Brooks, Carl Reiner, Neil Simon, Woody Allen?– out the window of their office, like Kevin Cline and John Cleese?
Marc Maron interviewed Brooks and Reiner for his podcast. They went to Ceasar’s house once a week to keep him company till he died. Don’t know if he knew they were there or not. Dick Van Dyke, too.
Woodrowfan
@Mnemosyne:
Adds new meaning to “work it, feel the burn!”
Violet
Good Lord. It’s a movie. If people paid half as much attention to how Congress in league with the 1% are screwing us all over and intend to leave us destitute and working for pennies until we die as they do to Star Wars then we might actually get some things to change. People will debate the trailer, talk about the movie for months, and line up in costume to see the new film, but they can’t be bothered to vote.
Makes me crazy.
ThresherK
@Mnemosyne: Well, nobody’s perfect.
(Someone was going to make that joke.)
Baud
@Violet:
Star Wars is the opiate of the masses.
gogol's wife
@Schlemazel:
He did it three times? Wow. It’s not my favorite song, but in the 1930s Show Boat he makes it electrifying. I assume he was way past his prime when you heard him, since he seemed to be in his prime in the ’30s.
Yes, that must have been Miriam Makeba. I was deeply impressed by her clicking when she did it on the Jack Paar show (I think) when I was little.
SiubhanDuinne
@Mnemosyne:
So to somebody from San Diego, say, the worst possible place to spend eternity would be someplace where the temperature got more and more moderate? That could work.
Tissue Thin Pseudonym (JMN)
I’m looking forward to an epic Bill Simmons rant tomorrow on the subject of Roger Goodell.
Mike J
@Violet: I’ll bet I know the names of more county level elected officials than almost anybody I know IRL and yet I still can still talk at length about rigging sailboats and racing tactics.
People have hobbies. Having a hobby doesn’t mean you’re not engaged with the real world. In fact, our other interests can lead us to learn about politics.
SiubhanDuinne
@Schlemazel:
@gogol’s wife:
I remember going to see Miriam Makeba on the University of Chicago campus in the late ’50s, maybe as late as 1960. She was amazing. Did a lot of click-singing, but also introduced me to some great folk standards. I especially remember “Everybody loves Saturday night,” which she sang in probably 20 or so different languages!
Tissue Thin Pseudonym (JMN)
@SiubhanDuinne: In Southern California Hell it rains all the time. Basically, it’s Vancouver.
gogol's wife
@SiubhanDuinne:
She was cool. Am I mistaken or did she just pass away recently?
gogol's wife
@gogol’s wife:
2008. I guess that’s recently, considering the way my mind works.
SiubhanDuinne
@gogol’s wife:
A few years ago, I think.
googling googling googling
She died in November 2008, age 76.
Violet
@Baud: Among other things.
@Mike J: I would also bet you are very unusual in knowing as much about politics, especially local politics, as you do. Most people can’t name their Senators or their Congressional Representative, let alone their city councilperson or county prosecutor.
Tehanu
@Mnemosyne:
That would be one of my favorites, The Incomplete Enchanter. The first half is Norse mythology and the second half is The Faerie Queene. I love the part where Harold fakes a spell to convince the ugly dwarf guard that he’s handsome, and then the spell works.
SFAW
@Mnemosyne:
And Wood Harris as Pharaoh?
@NotMax:
Paging Lee Atwater …
ThresherK
It’s official: Canada has run out of rock stars; Imagine Dragons are the Coupe Grey Cup halftime concert.
Calgary leads 17-7 over Hamilton.
NotMax
@SFAW
Have to admit that at first misread that as Woody Harrelson (was on a phone call and only half paying attention). Did not compute.
Mike J
@Violet: People aren’t politically disengaged because other things are more interesting. They’re politically disengaged because they’re taught that nothing they can do will make any difference. You can be politically engaged and have a rich, full life outside of politics, and you can be politically disengaged and have no life whatsoever. The two are unrelated.
SFAW
@Baud:
Does that make the “Star Wars Holiday Special” the ipecac of the masses?
Gravenstone
@ruemara: Actually, that’s the sheriff of Milwaukee County, Wisconsin. Fucker runs (and wins) as a Democrat, because he knows no Republican can win the post in Milwaukee County. This is the same asshole that advised people to carry weapons because you can’t rely on the cops to protect you or respond in a timely manner. He’s had a very long going feud with Milwaukee city government and police.
Baud
@SFAW:
LOL
NotMax
@Baud
That program and also the infamous super hero roast are two of the nadirs of pop culture TV.
Suffern ACE
@aimai: the issue was james earl jones in the suit. He’s got presence, sure. But David Prowse was a 6’5″ bodybuilder. They didn’t use his face either and he had to wear the suit for three films.
Gravenstone
@gene108: The actor who played the revealed Anakin was not David Prowse. It was Sebastian Shaw.
Schlemazel
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
That is the story – he was abusive to his staff. I understand that “My Favorite Year” was a pretty accurate representation of the show.
Baud
@NotMax:
LOL
scav
@SiubhanDuinne: But in SD? For me it might be the neighbors — their lack of moderation. Modern hells might be closer to an eternity spent on the 405 (or local equivalent) with the traffic getting slower and slower and no where to pull off to experience the moderate climate. Car windows stuck up. Come to think of it, a circular freeway would work rather nicely into an extension of The Inferno.
Mike J
@NotMax:
Not just Catholic, most of Christianity. The entire point of the religion is that nobody is good enough on their own. Many liberal Christians believe that even without the act of contrition God is still loving enough to forgive you anything you might do.
Schlemazel
@Mike J:
God how I wish I could remember the performance better. I saw he later in life and was dazzled. I was not yet 4 and could not appreciate what I was seeing. But it was very subversive, I learned without ever being told that all people had talent & color, nationality and gender really were artificial concepts when used to judge people.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Schlemazel: Googled Sid Caesar window and they say it was Mel Brooks. I’ve seen heard a lot of interviews with Brooks and I don’t remember him mentioning it. Maybe it doesn’t make it past my “too good to be true” filter. The Cary Grant story I could tell in as much detail as Brooks
@Baud: Good Lord. I remember the Life Day special, I watched it live and people love to rick roll the Bea Arthur scene. The superhero roast, I can’t even grasp at a straw.
Mnemosyne
@Baud:
I have actually watched the Holiday Special several times. As bad as you’ve heard it is … it’s worse.
Carrie Fisher says she has absolutely no memory of being in it, and I believe her — she’s clearly stoned out of her mind. Mark Hamill does his best and Harrison Ford looks like he wishes he knew where Fisher got that really good shit.
ETA: Here’s a link to the RiffTrax version. It’s especially fun because they left the original commercials in.
Baud
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: @Mnemosyne:
I haven’t seen either. And since I don’t do drugs, I don’t think I could.
Mnemosyne
@Baud:
Oh, you don’t need to do drugs. The show itself is so hallucinatory that you don’t need any outside assistance.
Woodrowfan
the Star Wars Holiday Special is a running gag in the comic strip “Sally Forth”
Temporarily Max McGee (soon enough to be Andy K again)
@Mnemosyne:
How does this logic apply to Hades?
Frankensteinbeck
@Mnemosyne:
It’s more complicated than that. The short version is that whether or not there’s a heaven isn’t made specific because that’s not the point of the religion. It’s not about judging who’s good and bad, but about making a personal deal for favoratism with God. The long version is 3000-5000 years of Rabbis arguing with each other, often just for the sake of arguing. (Discussing the meaning of the Torah is itself a virtuous act, no matter how stupid the discussion.)
EDIT – @Temporarily Max McGee (soon enough to be Andy K again):
I guess Greece had a lot of boredom and wet, foggy weather.
Gravenstone
@Schlemazel: One of my friends from college has a favored threat for idiots behind the wheel, “don’t make me pull you out through your wing vent”. Perhaps he had Sid in mind when he came up with it. Sadly, how many people today under the age of 45-50 even know what a wing vent is?
gene108
@Matt McIrvin:
I think you are wrong. IIRC, the 1983 release of RotJ had Prowse as helmetless Vader and ghost Annakin. In the late 1990’s re-release, with Lucas digitially re-editing each of the original trilogy, Prowse was replaced as ghost Annakin with a younger version of Annakin, which was played by Sebastian Shaw.
@Woodrowfan:
I saw it when it came out and thought it was bad, as I went to bed under my Star Wars blanket, on my Star Wars sheets, and resting my head on my Star Wars pillow case dreaming I would get more Star Wars action figures.
divF
@Gravenstone:
– Tom Waits
Ruckus
@gene108:
That’s because for most sane people the bible is just a story, parables if you will, a guide for the times it was written in, not the absolute last word in what to do in any given situation. Especially as most of those situations never really happen any more. And as I’ve heard a rabbi say, even about some pretty cut and dried lines, an eye for an eye is an example, it’s just wrong. We’ve had centuries to figure this shit out and some have, but in my experience the vocal ones haven’t.
Mnemosyne
@Temporarily Max McGee (soon enough to be Andy K again):
The weather in Greece is mild enough that they could spend their time coming up with creative afterlife punishments other than, And then there’s fire! And more fire! And … lots more fire!
(To be fair, Dante came up with some pretty good and creative afterlife punishments, but he, too, was living in lovely Mediterranean weather conditions.)
Pappenheimer
Tehanu,
Re the Incomplete Enchanter – That was an ugly TROLL guard.
I really wish DeCamp were still alive and writing…
Amir Khalid
@gene108:
Here’s what I saw in KL: In the 1983 release of Return of The Jedi, it was Sebastian Shaw under the mask, and Shaw as ghost Anakin. The same in the digitally edited Special Edition re-release. Episodes IV-VI were re-edited again after Episodes I-III came out, and as I recall Hayden Christiansen was ghost Anakin.
Luthe
@gene108: As a dedicated connoisseur of all things Anakin Skywalker/Darth Vader, I can definitely say you’re wrong. As back up, have an IMDB quote: “In 1982, Shaw was approached by George Lucas to make an appearance in the final episode of his Star Wars films – Star Wars: Episode VI – Return of the Jedi (1983). The role was the small but crucial one at the film’s climax of the unmasked Darth Vader and later as the disembodied spirit of Anakin Skywalker.”
For the DVD release of RoTJ (which is *NOT* the same as the Special Edition, which came out on video), Lucas replaced Sebastian Shaw with Hayden Christensen, a decision I will never forgive him for.
Amir Khalid
This is a heartbreaking story.
danielx
Interesting interview with James Risen, discussing his impressions of how the country changed after 9/11. Of course the interview is conducted by Glenn Greenwald who, as all know, is a complete egotist and all-round bad person, so nevermind.
The Other Chuck
@aimai:
At which point the first thing Luke would have said was “you sure you’re my dad?”
Mnemosyne
@The Other Chuck:
Until G’s cousin had his two sons, I might agree with you, but damned if he (mixed-race and pretty dark-skinned) and his wife (white) didn’t end up with a blond-haired, blue-eyed son. Once you start mixing chromosomes together, you never really know what you’re going to end up with.
cckids
@The Other Bob:
I hear you. My son was 5 when the prequels came out. Our theaters here showed the original 3 movies beforehand & we took him to those; he was just in awe. He loved the prequels (well, he WAS 5-8 or so, pretty much perfect ages for them). Just so much fun to share with him.
Villago Delenda Est
@schrodinger’s cat: “Apology accepted, Chuckles the Toddler.”
SRW1
As a person of German descent, I can absolutely relate to the outrage about StormtrooperGate. After all, if even stormtrooperism isn’t an Aryan signifier any more, what else is there left?
Memo to self: Call Dr Strangelove about that arm cramp thing.
Hunter
Does anyone remember the outrage when Idris Elba was cast as Heimdall in Thor?
Hunter
@ruemara: I knew someone who used to ship his luggage ahead via Fed Ex when going on vacation, just to avoid the hassle of baggage claim. (This was before TSA was omnipresent, which is to say before American citizens were all suspected terrorists.)
SFAW
@SRW1:
As long as you can walk, it’s all good.
That ending, and “nobody’s perfect” may be the two best closing lines in movies, ever.
Anonymous At Work
These polls have a significant fallacy attached, but purposefully ignored: Voters cannot approve or disapprove of “Congress” in any meaningful way. Voters can only approve or disapprove of their own Congressional Representative and up to 1 Senator in any given election. I can be incredibly liberal but live in the district of Louis Gomert or be incredibly conservative and live in Pelosi’s district in San Francisco, and these polls would measure my dissatisfaction not only without meaning/direction but also without context.
J R in WV
@Amir Khalid:
Amir, thanks for sharing that with us! Dogs are a gift from God~ we love our dogs, past and present.
SFAW
@Anonymous At Work:
Unless you’re a Rethug and vote in two different states. As has happened, I believe. (No, no cite. But even if there were, it would be OK, because the Rethug double-voter is probably white, so it’s not REALLY vote fraud.]
Captain C
@Luthe:
And that was still not the worst thing he did with the various “special” editions.
(The worst, of course, making Han not shoot first, a sin for which he will never be forgiven, unless he reverses it. It’s too bad I’m not a Christian, or I’d be sure he’d be sharing a room with Jar Jar binks for all eternity in the apres vie.)
mainmati
@burnspbesq: Leatherman tools get confiscated in federal office buildings in DC too and aren’t returned (personal experience) even if they are intended for actual technical purposes. Morons in widespread evidence at the guard stations.