Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

🎶 Those boots were made for mockin’ 🎵

Jesus, Mary, & Joseph how is that election even close?

Joe Lieberman disappointingly reemerged to remind us that he’s still alive.

Spilling the end game before they can coat it in frankl luntz-approved dogwhistles.

It’s the corruption, stupid.

Thanks for reminding me that Van Jones needs to be slapped.

Despite his magical powers, I don’t think Trump is thinking this through, to be honest.

Stamping your little feets and demanding that they see how important you are? Not working anymore.

The poor and middle-class pay taxes, the rich pay accountants, the wealthy pay politicians.

The worst democrat is better than the best republican.

“Cheese and Kraken paired together for the appetizer trial.”

A lot of Dems talk about what the media tells them to talk about. Not helpful.

He really is that stupid.

Do not shrug your shoulders and accept the normalization of untruths.

Seems like a complicated subject, have you tried yelling at it?

… riddled with inexplicable and elementary errors of law and fact

In after Baud. Damn.

Putin must be throwing ketchup at the walls.

T R E 4 5 O N

Republicans don’t trust women.

Historically it was a little unusual for the president to be an incoherent babbling moron.

Everybody saw this coming.

American History and Black History Cannot Be Separated

If you are still in the GOP, you are an extremist.

You are here: Home / Foreign Affairs / The CIA Torture Report May Not Be Released After All

The CIA Torture Report May Not Be Released After All

by | 123 Comments

This post is in: , , , ,

Just yesterday, I had what passes among us devout Cynics as hope. Another Friday doc dump that will live in infamy, per Bloomberg View:

Secretary of State John Kerry personally phoned Dianne Feinstein, chairman of the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence, Friday morning to ask her to delay the imminent release of her committee’s report on CIA torture and rendition during the George W. Bush administration, according to administration and Congressional officials.

Kerry was not going rogue — his call came after an interagency process that decided the release of the report early next week, as Feinstein had been planning, could complicate relationships with foreign countries at a sensitive time and posed an unacceptable risk to U.S. personnel and facilities abroad. Kerry told Feinstein he still supports releasing the report, just not right now…

Hill staffers and human rights advocates saw the Kerry call as a stunning reversal by an administration that has publicly supported the report’s release for months. For Senate Republicans, who have warned about the potential fallout for more than a year, the administration is belatedly coming around to agree with their position.

“There’s always a lot going on in the world and the timing of the release of a report like this never convenient,” one senior GOP senate staffer said. “They should have thought about that a long time ago and advocated against the release.”

For the large community of nongovernmental organizations and human rights groups that have been fighting for the release, the administration’s action is a betrayal, and also a sign that the whole issue has been poorly managed…

Any delay would be a huge problem for Feinstein for several reasons. First of all, her staff just completed a grueling months-long negotiation with the CIA over what details would make it into the final release. Those negotiations were personally mediated by President Barack Obama’s chief of staff, Denis McDonough, who flew to San Francisco several times to negotiate directly with Feinstein.

Second, if the release is pushed off past next week, Feinstein will no longer head the committee, and the incoming chairman, Republican Richard Burr, could very well prevent the report from being released at all. That could negate years of work by Feinstein’s investigators and prevent the report’s conclusions, many of which will be disputed vigorously by the CIA, from ever coming to light…

This is bullshit on stilts — of course it is “never a good time” for the World’s Greatest Nation(tm) to sack up and admit to having tortured people. Shame on my former Senator Kerry for letting this smarmy, craven garbage go out with his name on it, and shame on President Obama for asking him to do so.

As of a couple of hours ago, per Esquire, outgoing Senator Mark Udall hadn’t repudiated the idea that he could read the entire report into the Congressional Record:

Mark Udall: I have made it clear over the last couple of weeks—if the report is not declassified in a way that’s transparent and shines a bright light on what we did, then I will consider using all and any options.

Scott Raab: I’ve heard this before.

MU: And right now, we are at the point where I’m still optimistic that the White House, working with a committee, is going to do the right thing, which is to declassify the report in a way that’s understandable and transparent. And so I’m working through what we call regular order here in Washington. But if, in my opinion, the report is either—obviously, if it’s not released, then I’m gonna use every power I have, because it’s too important. It’s too historic. And we can’t afford to repeat the mistakes to let this slide…

What happened broke faith in the Constitution. It’s made our challenge much greater when it comes to facing the threat of Islamic fundamentalism. And it is morally repugnant. When this report is declassified, people will abhor what they read. They’re gonna be disgusted. They’re gonna be appalled. They’re gonna be shocked at what we did. But it will lay a foundation whereby we don’t do this in the future. That’s been my goal. That’s been my mission.

Goddess grant that I’m pulling a Cole, here — that this is some eleven-dimensional-chess Obama-fu where at least the skeletal, heavily redacted Executive summary gets released as planned. But I most sincerely doubt that. Help us, Obi-Wan Udall, you’re our only hope…

Reader Interactions

123Comments

  2. 2.

    burnspbesq

    Dear Senator Feinstein,

    Tell Secretary Kerry to bugger off. Release the report, in its entirety and unredacted. I promise I will take back all the nasty things I ever said about you.

    Very truly yours,

    A California Voter (who held my nose and voted for your sorry ass four times)

  3. 3.

    Yatsuno

    Help us, Obi-Wan Udall, you’re our only hope…

    And make the fucking morons from Colorado realise their huge mistake in not giving you your job back.

  4. 4.

    Tree With Water

    “We have not journeyed across the centuries, across the oceans, across the mountains, across the prairies, because we are made of sugar candy.”

    The American people can take it. Leak the damn report already.

  6. 6.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    @burnspbesq: You did vote against her in the primaries, right? I did, not that I thought it would do any good. Yes, I also voted for her while holding my nose in the general.

  8. 8.

    Another Holocene Human

    Obama is the sort of person to govern with a team, by consensus. That’s a very good way to run things. But you aren’t going to get all the Imma do this and imma watch you try to stop me form of governance. You need a narcissist for that. A crook. A con. A kingfisher. Oops, they are fucking tons of things up? But they really annoyed the other side and that’s what counts.

    Obama went into a Washington establishment that didn’t want anything investigated or exposed. And history has shown that the American people don’t really care much either.

    Back in the olden days after Harding left the presidency his admin was investigated for years. And Americans just got fucking bored with it. They didn’t want to hear about it any more.

    People are dumb. Especially in large groups.

    Obama could chose to die on this hill anyway, I mean I would admire that. I’m thinking he’s a little more worried about getting budgets passed for the next few years. Sword falling is something an executive agency head could do but they’re all Villagers so that will never happen.

  10. 10.

    A Humble Lurker

    This is bullshit on stilts — of course it is “never a good time” for the World’s Greatest Nation(tm) to sack up and admit to having tortured people.

    But some times are worse than others. As long as they’re not using this as a tactic to permanently make it go away let them do that. If they can get the timing right so that more folks sign on for helping with Syria or Iran doesn’t walk away from any nuclear deal or Putin might be less of a douche and still get the report out than it’s a sad thing but they probably should. Other countries (even if they pull shit like that themselves) will take any excuse they can not to contribute to stuff outside their borders. (Which is understandable to an extent.) It’s possible the administration doesn’t want to give them one.

  11. 11.

    RareSanity

    Secretary of State John Kerry personally phoned Dianne Feinstein, chairman of the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence, Friday morning to ask her to delay the imminent release of her committee’s report on CIA torture and rendition during the George W. Bush administration, according to administration and Congressional officials.

    if the release is pushed off past next week, Feinstein will no longer head the committee, and the incoming chairman, Republican Richard Burr, could very well prevent the report from being released at all.

    …yes, I’m sure this is all just a happy coincidence.

    Just need a little more time to finish these delicate negotiations with CLASSIFIED then, there will be no problem releasing the report.

  12. 12.

    drkrick

    @Yatsuno:

    Help us, Obi-Wan Udall, you’re our only hope…

    And make the fucking morons from Colorado realise their huge mistake in not giving you your job back.

    You don’t think his inclination to do something like this had something to do with the money that made sure he didn’t get the job back?

  14. 14.

    Keith G

    @Another Holocene Human: That does not square with the reporting of how this White House handles it’s bidness. There have been numerous reports, complaints and even two or so books indicating how closely held important decisions are by Obama’s central team in the West Wing.

    Kerry may well suck, but thinking that he was not carrying out the wishes of the Oval Office would be delusional.

  15. 15.

    Anne Laurie

    @A Humble Lurker:

    As long as they’re not using this as a tactic to permanently make it go away let them do that.

    Did you read the fucking article? If this report doesn’t get released before the Repubs take over in January, it will never get released. And President Obama knows that, even better than you and I and Dianne Feinstein. The report comes out now, or it’s down the memory hole, and you may remember the novel that phrase comes from.

  18. 18.

    trollhattan

    @burnspbesq:
    I think he was my introduction to the concept “I’m rich, so you should vote for me.” Little did I understand the floodtide he and Arianna were unleashing on the nation.

  21. 21.

    Baud

    If the result of this delay is to prevent the release altogether, I’ll be disappointed. I’m not a big believer in premature disappointment.

  23. 23.

    trollhattan

    @burnspbesq: I can’t recollect a “serious” Dem primary challenge to Boxer or Feinstein after their first terms. All the tile-shuffling over the next four years will be very interesting, to say the least. I’m holding out for zombie Alan Cranston.

  24. 24.

    trollhattan

    Can somebody please check John Bolton’s BP, stat?

    UN human rights experts have expressed “legitimate concerns” about US juries failing to charge policemen involved in the deaths of two black civilians. It is part of a broader “pattern of impunity” concerning minority victims, the UN said in a statement.

    “I am concerned by the grand juries’ decisions and the apparent conflicting evidence that exists relating to both incidents,” UN Special Rapporteur on minority issues, Rita Izsak, said in a statement.

    A trial process would ensure the evidence is considered in detail, she said.

    “The decisions leave many with legitimate concerns relating to a pattern of impunity when the victims of excessive use of force come from African-American or other minority communities.”

    Human rights expert Mireille Fanon-Mendes-France, who currently heads the UN Working Group of Experts on People of African Descent, said the cases add to existing concerns.

    She pointed to “longstanding prevalence of racial discrimination faced by African-Americans, particularly in relation to access to justice and discriminatory police practices”.

    –BBC

  25. 25.

    Ruckus

    If this so much redacted report will cause problems, what would the full report that we will never see cause? If the report on the report that months was spent getting to this point is that bad….. And I’m pretty sure it is that bad. Maybe it’s time that President Obama just opens the flood gates and lets get on with it. If we fail as a nation then we do. Maybe some conservative voters might rethink their positions. OK they probably will but I’d bet not in the correct direction. So what’s the loss?

  26. 26.

    max

    This is bullshit on stilts — of course it is “never a good time” for the World’s Greatest Nation(tm) to sack up and admit to having tortured people.

    I would like to know just what the hell they’re trying to prevent. I am 100% certain everyone in every affected foreign country knows what was going on.

    Goddess grant that I’m pulling a Cole, here — that this is some eleven-dimensional-chess Obama-fu where at least the skeletal, heavily redacted Executive summary gets released as planned.

    Feh. They should declassify the executive summary AND the goddamned report, UNredacted, full stop.

    I would also like the White House and Secretary Kerry (in particular) to stop letting the usual fuckheads in the national security complex yank the White House’s chain.

    max
    [“‘The Russians will do this, the Saudis will do that…’ ‘The Russians and the Saudis are *already* doing that. Where have you been, on Mars?'”]

  27. 27.

    Tommy

    I think it is clear we tortured people. They don’t want us to hear it. I recall my father taking me to see a “great American” speak when he was a professor at the Army War College. That man was John McCain. He told us about being tortured. In detail. Hard to listen to. I don’t think most people get it.

  28. 28.

    Yatsuno

    @Tommy:

    I recall my father taking me to see a “great American” speak when he was a professor at the Army War College. That man was John McCain. He told us about being tortured.

    Grandpa Walnuts can fuck himself with a thousand rusty pitchforks inserted sideways. He fucking cheerleaded for people to suffer THE EXACT FUCKING SAME WAY HE DID. He’s a disgrace to his office & the rest of humanity. When that fucker kicks the bucket I won’t shed a single fucking tear.

  29. 29.

    Baud

    @Yatsuno:

    I take it you didn’t see this in the article.

    Last, Feinstein is set to deliver a major speech about the report at a Dec. 10 gala event hosted by Human Rights First, which is awarding her and Sen. John McCain the “Beacon Prize” for “their leadership to end the use of torture and other cruel treatment of prisoners by the United States.” As Feinstein wrestles with Kerry’s request, her staff must be furiously rewriting that speech.

  30. 30.

    moops

    Dear Senator Feinstein,

    I’m currently very concerned about your recent discussion with Secretary Kerry. If you don’t push forward with the CIA torture and rendition report then this country is in for a much darker future. Richard Burr will bury this thing when he is made head of the Committee.

    I know I will get an evasive but polite response, but you really have to take this seriously. Most Democrats I know have figured out that you have been partially culpable in this dark chapter in US history. This is a part of repairing your legacy.

    thank you.

    *sent now with actual name and address in California*

  31. 31.

    Dolly Llama

    @Tommy: Yeah, and he went on to discredit himself completely in the 2008 campaign, flipping 180 degrees on everything torture-related to try and get elected. That’s what he thought he had to do to win. Let that lean on you a bit with regard to who he felt he was appealing to.

  33. 33.

    Ruckus

    My other take is that there must be some sort of ongoing problem. I know we are supposed to only look forward but we know the report is out there. We know it says we did shit. We know it will never be known who did what, only that we did it. Of this there is no question. And a heavily redacted report on the report says too much? I call bullshit. First class, great steaming piles of bullshit. Fresh, still mushy and warm bullshit. There must be some current administration culpability. Even if it was unintentional there must be some there. I see no other rational behind this.

  34. 34.

    Another Holocene Human

    @Keith G: And there’s plenty of reports on how the inner circle has influenced Obama’s decisions.

    There’s also all the surface stuff we can see for real, how Obama deals with pushback.

    If everyone is against him Obama doesn’t immolate himself. Many of his boldest actions have been inactions, using his final veto power as executive to not proceed on something he thinks is ill advised.

  35. 35.

    Archon

    Either this is eleven dimensional chess (Obama gets to placate the CIA and protect his predecessor by acting like the report was released against his objections before it’s inevitably released) or there is some horrifying stuff in there that will massively damage American security interests. My guess is it’s the latter but I’m not one of those liberals who thinks Obama is incapable of playing cynical but effective politics.

  37. 37.

    Another Holocene Human

    @Archon: We won’t know until it’s all over. I suspect that if it truly was harmful to US interests we wouldn’t actually hear about it. Obama has run a very tight ship on that (and it’s not his fault that cascade of failure that allowed Snowden to happen).

    They have the power to redact the shit out of whatever they want to.

    To me this reeks more of Village and establishment ass-covering, some very entrenched and powerful interests, and if there’s any chess going on it may be Obama daring the egos of some Senators to take the bait and punch the CIA in the eye because Obama is in no position to do it himself. It’s “let’s you and him fight” all over again.

    Yes, Obama can play cynical politics. No idea if it’s the case in this case but just look at his shrewdness that got him to this point. He may have had quite a bit of political self-delusion going on before reality hit in 2009* but he doesn’t suck at the politics game and he definitely knows what side his bread was buttered on when campaigning and that kind of bare knuckle stuff.

    *-anyone not crazy or evil would have to be a bit delusional to run for POTUS

  38. 38.

    moops

    To: Secretary of State John Kerry
    Subject: CIA Torture and Rendition Report

    I’m currently very concerned about your recent discussion with Senator Feinstein. You must stop interfering with this process. It is NEVER a convenient time to openly discuss our faults. If you don’t do it now the next Senate will bury and destroy this information and the process of recovering our dignity will never occur. Thus, we will repeat all of this very soon. It is inevitable. Behavior like this without consequences will be repeated. This watered down summary is the smallest step we can take. I fear it will not even be enough to stop this from happening again.

    I know I will get an evasive but polite response, but you really have to take this seriously. Most Democrats I know have figured out that you have been partially culpable in this dark chapter in US history. This is a part of repairing your legacy.

    thank you.

  39. 39.

    Baud

    It’s strange that the article mentions that Kerry asked Feinstein to delay issuing the report, but doesn’t say for how long. Even if the request was for an indefinite delay, you would think the article would mention that.

  40. 40.

    Baud

    I wonder if the delay is related to this:

    The Obama administration is telling members of Congress it has won significant concessions from Iran for extending nuclear talks, including promises by the Islamic republic to allow snap inspections of its facilities and to neutralize much of its remaining uranium stockpile.

    Those terms are included in a document that U.S. officials say represents the terms for a seven-month extension in nuclear negotiations between world powers and Iran, agreed to when the last deadline of Nov. 24 passed without an accord. A copy was obtained by The Associated Press.

    http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory/us-officials-list-irans-concessions-nuke-talks-27396552

  41. 41.

    moops

    @Baud:

    doubt it. Iran already believes everything that is in this document. This is just a partial admission of what they already have operated on as true.

  42. 42.

    Baud

    @moops:

    It’s different when you actually see it admitted in print.

    It also may be that Obama doesn’t want to deal with Congress on both extending the Iran talks and the torture report at the same time.

    I freely admit I’m speculating just like everyone else.

  43. 43.

    Mnemosyne (iPhone)

    @Ruckus:

    I can see another possible rationale: some of our allies whose noses are currently clean of torture allegations could be implicated. Imagine if it turned out that, say, Germany or France helped us torture people. That would be a major shitstorm.

    (I’m assuming that the British and Canadians are already heavily implicated, but they also probably wouldn’t want the extent of their involvement publicly known.)

  44. 44.

    skerry

    @Tommy: Others have already commented, but I want to throw in my $0.02.

    John McCain suffered during his time as a POW. That didn’t stop him from enabling other humans to suffer under W. He lost the right to be called a “great American” when he went against his personal experience and threw all ethics and morality to the wind in an effort to get a higher rank than his father or grandfather ever had.

    You think people “don’t get it” – I’m not so sure you “get it”

  45. 45.

    burnspbesq

    @trollhattan:

    I’m holding out for zombie Alan Cranston.

    That would be cool, but I don’t think it’s going to happen.

    Hell if I know. Anna Eshoo? Debra Bowen? One of Las Hermanas Sanchez?

  46. 46.

    Mnemosyne (iPhone)

    Also, too, can I take a moment to applaud the people who are writing/calling Feinstein and Kerry to tell them to release the damn thing? I will write my fax to Sen. Feinstein tonight and send it over the weekend. Writing to your congresscritter will do more good than screaming into the void of a comments section on a blog.

  48. 48.

    burnspbesq

    @Another Holocene Human:

    Fcuk. Every day this is sat on, we’re one day closer to statutes of limitation running out.

    My absolute minimum is that Jose Rodriguez has to go to prison for obstruction of justice, for destroying the videos. I understand why he did it, but part of omertà is that when you get caught, you do your time.

  49. 49.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @skerry:

    I’m not sure those of you who are criticizing Tommy “get it.” He put the words “great American” in quotes for a reason — at the time, McCain actually was considered such, by a lot of Democrats and Republicans alike, and I think Tommy was merely quoting his father AT THE TIME. Now from what Tommy has told us about his parents (they remain Republican), it’s possible Tommy’s father still believes this about McCain, but I am pretty sure from what Tommy has told us about himself that he no longer has that opinion of the senior Senator from Arizona. I could be wrong, and I’m open to being corrected, but I think y’all are being rather unfair to Tommy and misreading what he wrote.

  50. 50.

    burnspbesq

    @Yatsuno:

    I think Kamala has her eye on Sacramento.

    I’m just hoping that wherever she goes, we can convince my law school classmate Jackie Lacey, the LA County DA, to run for AG.

  51. 51.

    Yatsuno

    @Mnemosyne (iPhone): Cantwell’s office is right next door to mine in the building. Unfortunately can’t visit on official time (fuck you Hatch Act!) but might on lunch if someone is there. Which isn’t very often.

  52. 52.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @skerry: I thought at the time, and still do, that it was McCain’s cave on the ’06 Military Commissions Act that led John Warner to retire from the Senate.

  53. 53.

    Another Holocene Human

    @Baud: Fat chance there are big Iran reveals because Iran has maintained integrity of their sovereignty and borders despite Washington.

    Obama has been putting pressure on Congress because the dumber assholes in that body are calling for MOAR SANCTIONS and strengthening the hand of “You can never trust those lying American-pigdog-British-Intelligence-lapdogs” hard right extremists in the Iranian government. I’madinnerjacket? He was a creature of the Bush admin, when GWB went away so did his voters!! Iran is a very flawed democracy but it is a democracy, much like another country we know, if the crazy rhetoric gets out of hand on both sides via the same stupid people in groups dynamics on both sides then this whole rapprochement talking de-escalation thing will fail, and the people who supported it on both sides will suffer politically.

    Lot of evil fuckers in Congress. I’m not hopeful.

  55. 55.

    Roger Moore

    @burnspbesq:

    Hell if I know. Anna Eshoo? Debra Bowen? One of Las Hermanas Sanchez?

    Whichever of Kamala Harris and Gavin Newsom doesn’t look likely to succeed Jerry Brown. Probably Antonio Villaraigosa.

  56. 56.

    Another Holocene Human

    @burnspbesq: None of the bastards will ever pay.

    Iran Contra? Remember how that turned out?

    The one valid point Glenn Greenwald ever made (when he was in his “courting” phase of the con and actually lifted his finger to research a book, this was some years back) was that there is a long tradition in the US of shielding people in high places who do very bad things from the consequences of their actions, from the Ford pardon on down.

  57. 57.

    trollhattan

    @burnspbesq:
    Bowen’s probably out of politics, given her recent issues. Too bad, but the lady needs to take care of herself.

    It’s really hard to handicap and I’m not up on the Dem’s D-league squad. Suppose several current congressmen will vie for the senate seats (am presuming both are on their last terms) and somebody will want to be governor apres Jerry, now that he’s shown the kids it’s still a job that can be performed with a degree of competency. Possibly Harris, but she’s mute on her plans. The senate seats are the bigger prizes, since they’re vacated so seldom.

  58. 58.

    Another Holocene Human

    @Roger Moore: Gavin Newsome reminds me of Anthony Weiner and IMO sucks just as hard.

    His skillset would do less harm to society tossed into the entertainment industry or maybe at one of those buy here pay here used car lots.

  59. 59.

    Yatsuno

    @SiubhanDuinne: FWIW nothing I said was against Tommy. And yes I saw the quotes so I know he wasn’t sharing that opinion. But whenever that vile stain gets mentioned I get so pissed because he should be in the fucking dictionary next to hypocrite. Except he’s so arrogant he’d take it as a compliment.

  61. 61.

    Trentrunner

    CBS News reports that the Obama administration is “bracing” for the release of the torture report on Tuesday.

  62. 62.

    Another Holocene Human

    What y’all said, you’re probably right and this whole report that’s put out there, deliberately, is Kerry as Obama’s waterboy but…

    Kerry still sucks.

    He’s always struck me as someone for whom half of his soul checked out decades ago and the other still shambling half of him just hasn’t figured that out yet and is going through all the motions.

  66. 66.

    Corner Stone

    Kerry told Feinstein he still supports releasing the report, just not right now…

    …just not right now…
    Fucking clowns.

  68. 68.

    Corner Stone

    @Tree With Water:

    The American people can take it. Leak the damn report already.

    “The American people” will most likely masturbate to the report. That is not the point and it never fucking has been.

  69. 69.

    Another Holocene Human

    @Corner Stone: And I’m guessing you have never had to herd cats run an organization full of people with competing interests.

    I have, and I have the claw marks to prove it. Some days not doing stupid shit is your biggest challenge.

  70. 70.

    Corner Stone

    @Another Holocene Human:

    I’m thinking he’s a little more worried about getting budgets passed for the next few years. Sword falling is something an executive agency head could do but they’re all Villagers so that will never happen.

    You’re just a fucking joke of an excuse machine at this point.
    Budgets passed with both chambers held by R’s? That’s what he’s fucking worried about?

  71. 71.

    Steeplejack

    @Anne Laurie:

    Or AHL could even just read the complete snippet above, which contains this:

    “There’s always a lot going on in the world and the timing of the release of a report like this never convenient,” one senior GOP senate staffer said.

    That’s clear as clear can be.

  73. 73.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Yatsuno:

    I understand. I loathe him too, and I will rejoice the day I hear he is no longer among us. If I could pee standing up, I would join you at graveside. But up until 9/11, the invasion of Iraq, and — especially — his run for the Presidency in 2008 and his selection of Snowbilly Snookie as his VP, he was actually not a terrible human being. Far from a good and great human being, to be sure, but not terrible and worthy of all respect as a former POW and survivor of torture. I actually think it was the 2000 GOP primary and the evil treatment he received at the hands of the Dubya campaign that changed him from a decent man to the horrible, hypocritical, embittered old crank we know today.

  77. 77.

    Corner Stone

    @A Humble Lurker:

    As long as they’re not using this as a tactic to permanently make it go away let them do that. If they can get the timing right so that more folks sign on for helping with Syria or Iran doesn’t walk away from any nuclear deal

    WTF is wrong with some of you simple minded fools?

  78. 78.

    Another Holocene Human

    Everclear didn’t write a verse about being president, but we all know Obama walked into a shitpile with a rusty shovel in 2009

    Try rebuilding an organization that your predecessor destroyed … oh, and he’s still lurking around stirring up trouble … and the institutional challenges … and the real opposition is there waiting for you like a spider

    God forbid you might ever have to walk a mile in my shoes
    Then you really might know what it’s like to have to lose
    Then you really might know what it’s like
    Then you really might know what it’s like

    Until then, siddown and shaddup.

  79. 79.

    burnspbesq

    @trollhattan:

    Hey, Dan Walters: I don’t know who’s telling you that the SOS’ corporate filing system has regressed, but as a weekly user I’m here to tell you that those people are full. of. shit. Restore the budget cuts, that Bowen had nothing to do with, and we’re good to go. No, our system isn’t as good as, say, Hong Kong’s, but no state’s is.

  82. 82.

    Corner Stone

    @RareSanity:

    Just need a little more time to finish these delicate negotiations with CLASSIFIED then, there will be no problem releasing the report.

    Awesome! Love that part.
    Yeah, we’re totes gonna release this report…as soon as we cure cancer and figure out cold fusion.
    That will indeed be a more convenient time.

  83. 83.

    Another Holocene Human

    @Corner Stone: As part of a structured organization of which you are just a cog.

    No effing comparison.

    You don’t know what you don’t know.

    And you’re posting drunk again. Close the computer, there’s a good lad.

  86. 86.

    burnspbesq

    @Corner Stone:

    Fuck you right back, dick. You’ve been commenting here for what, seven years, and the next constructive comment you post will be your first. At least some folks here are trying.

  91. 91.

    Corner Stone

    @burnspbesq: I love it that I can’t post a single thing here, not even directed at you or about you, but you just can’t take it.
    Face it, punk. I own you.
    How’s that taste?

  92. 92.

    Another Holocene Human

    @Corner Stone: Of a company? Of course not. We’re not talking about a shindig where all the participants are hand picked and paid to be there, which is all you have any experience with.

    Let’s start from the beginning.

    You have never herded cats. You’ve herded sheep, maybe, and sheep are dumb! But that is not anything like herding cats.

  93. 93.

    Another Holocene Human

    I’m the opposite of a “boss” which you would know if you, like, read people’s posts on BJ and remembered what user handle said what. It’s a bit too much nuance, not to mention followthrough at your BAC level, though. I see you have yet to deny it.

  95. 95.

    Another Holocene Human

    My whole musical world view has been shattered here, douchey boxing gloves & extended product line label vs skid row hooch.

  97. 97.

    trollhattan

    @burnspbesq:
    FWIW I won’t even grace my kid’s parakeet cage with Walters.

    My takeaway from what’s been revealed is she’s not headed for the rigors of another campaign. If she decides she’s up to it I won’t throw any rocks. It was a tough double-blow in tandem with Darrell Steinberg’s daughter, who is doing rather better lately.

  98. 98.

    moops

    @Yatsuno:

    I’m not sure. What are the consequences for reading out in public material that has been redacted as classified?

    I suspect there are consequences, and he is will to accept them.

  100. 100.

    Doug r

    You know if all those candidates hadn’t run away from Obama maybe more people would have voted for them and then we wouldn’t have to worry about the Republican committees

  102. 102.

    Ruckus

    @Yatsuno:
    Can he be stopped by his fellow members from reading it on the floor? I really don’t know the answer and I’d bet the google be of no help on this.

    @Mnemosyne (iPhone):
    Well someone has to be otherwise the whole affair would be about nothing. And it isn’t. It could be the Iran negations, it could be about our allies, it could be about people still in the administration, it could be about politics(what isn’t?), it could be about almost anything. What it sure isn’t about is how warm and fuzzy we as a nation have been for the last few decades. Yes the world is a tough place, but if one wants to make it better they have to, well, make it better. Hiding the truth about our past doesn’t make things better. Waiting for a better time? It’s a big and complicated world, there are always reasons not to do it. None of them trump the best reason to go ahead.

  103. 103.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Baud: He’ll be skiing in Colorado*, so what the fuck does he care?

    *Well, that’s what I would be doing.

  105. 105.

    Corner Stone

    @Another Holocene Human:

    We’re not talking about a shindig where all the participants are hand picked and paid to be there, which is all you have any experience with.

    Hilarious. I’ve been directing crews of people across three counties in TX that do poll watching/monitoring for the last 6+ years.
    Now, open your yap again and tell me what I know and what I’ve been doing?

  106. 106.

    A Humble Lurker

    @Anne Laurie:
    Yes, I did. I also noticed (as others have pointed out) there doesn’t seem to be a concrete amount of time this is supposed to be delayed, which would tell us if the delay WOULD kill this.

    @Corner Stone:
    We can see (again as others have said) other countries may be implicated who would help us and other countries with various international matters? That this is important and has ripple effects because ghee whiz, what we do (and who we ask to help) doesn’t just stop mattering where our borders end? Not to mention shit congress can still sign off on.

  107. 107.

    Corner Stone

    @A Humble Lurker: Who else are we going to get on board with any kind of deal that effectively addresses any kind of goal(s) re: Iran or Syria?
    And let’s just put it down here. If we release a torture report that angers some or any of our “allies” that participated in torturing people on our behalf, or with our tacit consent, then WTF?
    That’s the whole point of releasing this report!
    Realpolitik has its place, pragmatism and taking what’s given all have their place in diplomacy. But for fuck’s sake, whose ass are we really covering by burying this report? And let’s be real, if this is delayed to the next Congress it is effectively a cooked goose. It will never see the light of day until or unless there is a Snowden 2.0.
    This isn’t hard. There is no excuse for not releasing this report, unless it is to bury it.

  108. 108.

    RaflW

    I donated a couple hundred to Udall’s unsuccessful reelection effort. I’ll feel like I got my money’s worth if he does the Congressional Record thing.

    Right now I’m sure feeling like John Kerry (and his boss) can just suck it. Cowards.

  110. 110.

    Keith G

    @Another Holocene Human:

    God forbid you might ever have to walk a mile in my shoes
    Then you really might know what it’s like to have to lose
    Then you really might know what it’s like
    Then you really might know what it’s like

    Until then, siddown and shaddup

    The problem with the “siddown and shaddup” idea is that democratic governance emphasizes/demands just the opposite.

  112. 112.

    A Humble Lurker

    @Corner Stone:

    But for fuck’s sake, whose ass are we really covering by burying this report? And let’s be real, if this is delayed to the next Congress it is effectively a cooked goose. It will never see the light of day until or unless there is a Snowden 2.0.
    This isn’t hard. There is no excuse for not releasing this report, unless it is to bury it.

    Well according to this they’re worried about the safety of diplomats abroad, and the article is a little unclear but apparently the report is being burried. Until Tuesday. Unless it was originally supposed to be released on Tuesday and they want it delayed? Like I said, unclear.

  114. 114.

    Corner Stone

    @A Humble Lurker: What is unclear about this end result?

    Though the committee voted to declassify the entire report, the committee is expected to release next week just an executive report, which is hundreds of pages long instead of thousands.

    Even if it comes out, it’s going to be really suspect. And I wish none of our diplomats harm, anywhere, but come the F on Sec. Kerry. They exist in a world of uncertainty in a lot of hot spots around the world. Do we really want to accept the Benghazi mentality and suggest that diplomats are in more danger after we say we used X to torture people in Y?
    What are we supposed to do next?

  115. 115.

    max

    @A Humble Lurker: Well according to this they’re worried about the safety of diplomats abroad, and the article is a little unclear but apparently the report is being burried. Until Tuesday. Unless it was originally supposed to be released on Tuesday and they want it delayed? Like I said, unclear.

    NYT:

    Jennifer Psaki, a State Department spokeswoman, said Mr. Kerry had “called his former colleague to discuss the broader implications of the timing of the report’s release because a lot is going on in the world, and he wanted to make sure that foreign policy implications were being appropriately factored into timing.” She added, referring to the Islamic State extremist group also known as ISIS, “These include our ongoing efforts against ISIL and the safety of Americans being held hostage around the world.”

    Josh Earnest, the White House spokesman, said the administration backed making the report public next week. “The president has long advocated the declassified release of this report, so we certainly welcome the news from the committee that they’re planning to do so next week,” Mr. Earnest said.

    Some Democratic members of the Intelligence Committee said they saw no reason to delay the release of the report and noted that there has been a stream of objections to making it public.

    “It is hardly surprising that there is an 11th–hour objection to releasing this vital report because there have been objections at every hour for quite some time,” said Senator Ron Wyden, Democrat of Oregon. “My own view is that many Americans will be deeply angered when they read this report about misdeeds and mistakes and out-and-out falsehoods.”

    “It is critically important,” he added, “that this report not be pushed under the rug, buried before the American people have a chance to see it.”

    So Kerry called Feinstein to see if he could get her to back off releasing the report. That, apparently, did not work.

    So we’re going to get the report. I think.

    max
    [‘OK then.’]

  116. 116.

    mclaren

    Sorry, the CIA has already shown Udall telephoto pictures of his children and grandchildren getting out of their cars and walking into school, and in the same stack of photos are pictures of the torture implements from Abu Ghraib with blood still on them.

    Udall will fold and be rewarded with an ambassadorship.

    But, seriously…if someone took your children and duct-taped them to chairs in your living room and fired up some power tools while spec ops mercs held you down on the floor screaming and asked conversationally: “So, what’s it gonna be?”

    …What would you do?

    How many people can stand up to that?

    ‘Cause that’s where we are in America in 2014. We’ve reached the point Soviet Russia reached in the 1950s when they sent out NKVD agents after word came in that there was a spy in some village, and the NKVD agents gathers all the men and women and children in the village square and starts feeding them nitric acid one by one until the spy comes forward.

    Post-legal America is not pretty. In a land without laws, the only rule is the Law of the Jungle.

  117. 117.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @max: “My own view is that many Americans will be deeply angered when they read this report about misdeeds and mistakes and out-and-out falsehoods.”
    We’ll see how many, but I have a depressing feeling that comparatively few of our 300-odd million fellow citizens will really be upset.

  118. 118.

    Tree With Water

    @Corner Stone: What point are you referring to? You sound so angry, and are talking gibberish. Re-read what I wrote. It’s as inoffensive as any post anyone will ever read at this blog.. Why your feathers are so ruffled is beyond me. I mean, geez, take it easy, you’ll live longer..

  120. 120.

    Culture of Truth

    Goddess grant that I’m pulling a Cole, here

    Shilling for the GOP until it wasn’t popular?

  122. 122.

    I'mNotSureWhoIWantToBeYet

    Meh.

    RawStory has an AFP story that says Feinstein and the White House talked on Thursday and ironed out their differences about releasing the report. Kerry said to her on Friday to “consider the timing”.

    ABC:

    Kerry called Feinstein to discuss the broader implications of the timing of publicly releasing a declassified summary of her committee’s report “because a lot is going on in the world, and he wanted to make sure that foreign policy implications were being appropriately factored into timing,” State Department spokeswoman Jen Psaki said Friday.

    She said Kerry during the call reiterated the support of the administration for the release of the report on detention and interrogation, but “he also made clear that the timing is of course her choice.”

    These factors to consider “include our ongoing efforts against ISIL and the safety of Americans being held hostage around the world,” Psaki said.

    Tom Mentzer, a spokesman for the California Democrat, said he had no immediate comment.

    The Senate Intelligence Committee is poised to release early next week the first public accounting of the CIA’s use of torture on al-Qaida detainees held in secret facilities in Europe and Asia in the years after the terrorist attacks of Sept. 11, 2001.

    With the news this morning that captives were killed in Yemen during a rescue attempt, it may simply be that he had that in mind. It didn’t sound to me like Kerry was saying never release it, or delay releasing it until the Republicans are in charge, or whatever.

    I expect the report/executive summary to be released next week.

    FWIW.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

Comments are closed.

Trackbacks