Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Perhaps you mistook them for somebody who gives a damn.

The cruelty is the point; the law be damned.

If you tweet it in all caps, that makes it true!

Republican obstruction dressed up as bipartisanship. Again.

They traffic in fear. it is their only currency. if we are fearful, they are winning.

Damn right I heard that as a threat.

Republicans don’t want a speaker to lead them; they want a hostage.

A Senator Walker would be an insult to the state and the nation.

Jesus, Mary, & Joseph how is that election even close?

Nothing worth doing is easy.

It’s time for the GOP to dust off that post-2012 autopsy, completely ignore it, and light the party on fire again.

A Senator Walker would also be an insult to reason, rationality, and decency.

Republicans do not pay their debts.

Second rate reporter says what?

JFC, are there no editors left at that goddamn rag?

Some judge needs to shut this circus down soon.

Not so fun when the rabbit gets the gun, is it?

rich, arrogant assholes who equate luck with genius

Proof that we need a blogger ethics panel.

Motto for the House: Flip 5 and lose none.

Come on, man.

I did not have this on my fuck 2022 bingo card.

Accountability, motherfuckers.

Meanwhile over at truth Social, the former president is busy confessing to crimes.

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Open thread

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Why do cops get so twitchy? In part, because they never know which call will end up like this.

A Springfield, Massachusetts man is in custody after stealing a police cruiser and leading police on a low speed chase while taunting them, telling them their job was “boring” and that he was going to go “find some crime,” reports MassLive.

I can’t even.

Chat about whatever.

Reader Interactions

185Comments

  5. 5.

    Amir Khalid

    If all cops ever got were children throwing tantrums like this one, police work would be really irritating, but it wouldn’t be physically dangerous. I’m sure cops would be a lot more mellow.

  7. 7.

    bemused

    Greg Sargent on King v Burwell linked to interesting Politico piece on David King. King and the 3 other challengers to Obamacare have annual incomes ranging from $35,000 to $45,000 a year. One is 56 years old and the other three are in their early 60’s, very close to Medicare eligibility age. King is 64, only one year away.

    I shouldn’t even ask why these idiots think crippling Obamacare will be good news for them unless they expect to handsomely rewarded for being involved in the lawsuit.

  8. 8.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Belafon:

    I did. I thought the cutest part was that adorable Thurston napping in all that warm fur….

    Oh. You said Steven, not Steve. Never mind.

  9. 9.

    low-tech cyclist

    Don’t cops tell people not to leave their keys in the car? OK, the auto-lock malfunctioned (per the link) which got him into the car, but unless the cops left their keys inside, how did he start driving it?

  13. 13.

    Fred Dickinson

    I see the sucking off of Obama over the jobs report is proceeding apace.

    Never mind the record childhood poverty.

    Never mind the lowest labor force participation rate since the 1970s.

    Never mind the retirement crisis on one end and student loan indentured servitude on the other.

    Both parties want to do the bidding of capital, namely, bending the worker over a pool table and conducting a brutal ass raping. Democrats just use a condom and a little lube while Republicans go bareback.

    And most of you are happy to take it and not ask for so much as a reach – around.

  16. 16.

    RareSanity

    Michael Kopeski, 27, has been charged with larceny of a motor vehicle, failure to stop for police, four counts of assault and battery on a police officer, and resisting arrest after officers eventually convinced him to pull over, at which time he put up a fight.

    @John Cole +0:

    It doesn’t take a genius to figure that one out.

    A guy in New York “puts up a fight” over being arrested for selling cigarettes, and ends up dead.

    This dude steals a police car, mocks the entire police department over the radio while they’re chasing him…then “puts up a fight”, but is brought into custody, alive, without even the hint of a scratch on him.

    Hell, he doesn’t even look like his hair was mussed.

  18. 18.

    shelley

    16 degrees at high noon and more snow is on the way. Who needs the polar vortex? This winter is as bad as last year. My dog spends the day plastered up against one of the heat ducts.

  22. 22.

    Lord Baldrick

    Heh. My grandfather was Police Commissioner of Springfield right after WW2 – he LURVED showing off that Badge #1 for the rest of his life. He would not have fired the cops, but would have stuck them on horrible assignments for two years.

    Bonus – same guy gave Leo Durocher his big break in pro ball.

  23. 23.

    CONGRATULATIONS!

    Don’t cops tell people not to leave their keys in the car? OK, the auto-lock malfunctioned (per the link) which got him into the car, but unless the cops left their keys inside, how did he start driving it?

    @low-tech cyclist: Every cop I’ve ever seen locally leaves the vehicle running with the keys inside. Usually the window is rolled down as well, but I’m in SoCal. Doubt that’s the case in MA.

  24. 24.

    Richard Mayhew

    If those are the topics that concern you, please feel free to start your own blog instead of whining that other people who write for free aren’t writing about your favorite subjects with your favorite slant. We don’t read minds (often), so we’ll always be wrong.

  29. 29.

    EthylEster

    Amir Khalid and Just Some Fuckhead: I agree with your astute observations in comments #5 & #6 respectively.

    Lame, Tim F.

  34. 34.

    Soprano2

    My city recently had a police officer shot in the eye while questioning one of three people who were hanging out behind an auto parts store at 2 a.m. He was in his early 30’s, now his career as a police officer is over and he faces a long stint of rehabilitation just to become functional again. I’m no police apologist, but I can see why they worry about stuff like this. The man who shot him had assaulted police officers before, and evidently was failed by the mental health system for years. He was out on parole for some other charge.

  35. 35.

    Roger Moore

    @bemused:

    I shouldn’t even ask why these idiots think crippling Obamacare will be good news for them unless they expect to handsomely rewarded for being involved in the lawsuit.

    Zero sum thinking. Less medical care available for Those People means more for them.

  42. 42.

    bemused

    @Roger Moore:

    They aren’t making much money and Republicans barely getting by are some of the most bitter, pissed off people believing the “undeserving” are getting even one small dollop that should go to them. They never believe cuts to others can have any effect on them.

  43. 43.

    Betty Cracker

    different-church-lady & Amir Khalid: I agree that we should be open to accepting new trolls, but it can’t be a one-way street. We must ask ourselves what a new troll prospect brings to the table.

    Honestly, reach-around metaphors were tired when the “war-bloggers” trotted them out in support of GWB’s Great Adventure in aught-three. The first time this particular prospect came up to bat, he whiffed with an anti-Semitic phrase that caused a major thread derailment, but not in the direction he’d hoped. I hate to be a pessimist, but I doubt this one has the chops to improve on a dismal record.

  44. 44.

    BGinCHI

    @Betty Cracker: Why are so many trolls into ass-raping?

    Hey, if you have an argument to make, make it. You don’t need to use the inside of my ass as an emphatic.

  45. 45.

    shortstop

    I once got a $25 ticket for making an unkind remark about cop work along the lines of this dude’s observation. Yeah, it was a very long time ago. The third baseman calls it the Sassy Mouth Fine Incident.

  46. 46.

    Amir Khalid

    A Salon writer speculates on what’s in Harper Lee’s long-awaited second novel. (It was actually written before To Kill A Mockingbird. But when she submitted it to a publisher, the editor thought there was a novel in Scout Finch’s childhood memories and, well, one couldn’t say he was wrong about that.) But I can’t take the first speculation seriously.

  49. 49.

    Roger Moore

    @bemused:

    They never believe cuts to others can have any effect on them.

    I think that’s absolutely incorrect. They firmly believe that cuts to others will help them because it will mean more to go around to everyone who didn’t get cut. That’s the essence of the Republican model. The leaders define how much money there is to go around and get people fighting over the distribution. The idea of actually expanding budgets so there’s more to go around is explicitly taken off the table- no new taxes, ever!- so the only argument is over who gets how much.

  50. 50.

    BGinCHI

    @Amir Khalid: If she has a sophomore slump she’s never going to write her way out of it.

    Honestly, I’m already incredibly sick of hearing about Harper Lee and this new book. But maybe it will be smarter than TKAM.

  53. 53.

    Belafon

    @The Ancient Randonneur: How about from Erick Erickson (h/t LGF):

    I wish the President would stop professing himself to be a Christian if he is not going to proclaim Christ as truth and the only way to salvation. The “all paths” nonsense and moral equivalence might fit in with the present age, but the present age does not really fit with Christ.

    And as for doubts on whether I’m right, “the starting point of faith is some doubt” in my ability to save myself, not in whether I’m right. I know I’m a sinner. I know I cannot save myself. I have no doubt that Christ is the only way. It’s not that I’m right, but that Christ is right. So, Mr. President, get off your own high horse.

  55. 55.

    shortstop

    @BGinCHI: Yikes, that’s a little unseemly.

    @Bob In Portland: See that guy over there frantically trying to make eye contact with…anyone? That’s Fred. He’s got plenty of room at his table for you, buddy.

    OT, it’s already Friday afternoon and I have like two weeks’ worth of work to fit into this weekend. Ugggghh.

  57. 57.

    Amir Khalid

    @BGinCHI:
    TKAM is Harper Lee’s actual second novel, written as a prequel to Go Set A Watchman at an editor’s request. If that was her sophomore slump, I think this first one will be okay.

  61. 61.

    BGinCHI

    @shortstop: In other news, I don’t much care for A Catcher in the Rye, either.

    I wish middle schools and high schools would move on from these texts.

  63. 63.

    shortstop

    I haven’t whined about Cracker Stepmama-in-Law here for a while, so I’ll indulge myself and say that CSIL is DIZZY with ANTICIPATION for the release of Old Fashioned, the cinematic antithesis of 50 Shades (also to be released on Valentine’s Day). It seems all the whoring and gaying and fornicating and spanking and whatnot of today’s generation does not sit well with this “committed follower of Christ.” The lady has been married three times.

  64. 64.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @BGinCHI:
    I love A Catcher in the Rye. Complex psychological story, and the main character’s progress from being so angry and alienated that he lies to the reader, to finding something he loves and makes life worth living, moves me deeply. However, I wouldn’t expect that to be everyone’s, or even most people’s cup of tea! Sort of an artistic exercise for writers.

  65. 65.

    Origuy

    @Scott S.: Oh, no, he’s not a Republican troll. He’s a Marxist. He wants the proletariat to rise up and create a workers’ paradise.

  66. 66.

    BGinCHI

    @shortstop: Did you see that the main male lead in 50 Shades is the same actor who played the serial killer psycho (torturer and murderer of women) in the series The Fall?

    Terrific series, with the great Gillian Anderson, btw.

  67. 67.

    BGinCHI

    @Origuy: Hmm. Maybe. Or he wants the Proletariat to fight back so that they can have straight, consensual, missionary-style sex so that they can free up the pool table.

    Dude wants to shoot some stick.

  70. 70.

    Betty Cracker

    @BGinCHI: I loved season one and just finished binge-watching season 2 last night. Am I the only person deeply disappointed with the ending?

  72. 72.

    BGinCHI

    @Betty Cracker: WTF?? (Warning: Spoiler alert!)

    Is that supposed to signal the next season, or end the whole thing? I’m guessing the former.

    Great show though could do with less of the teenager character. Cripes: HE’S A KILLER, DUMBASS!

  75. 75.

    Amir Khalid

    @Mnemosyne (iPhone):
    No, I’m not surprised either. At least I got to see the trailer in the cinema before the ban came down. But I understand there was a lot of stuff from the book that they didn’t dare shoot. The movie will probably turn out to be more of a tease than a payoff. (Were I E.L. James, I would have sold the movie rights to a more appropriate studio, like Wicked Pictures or Vivid Video.)

    You can still buy the book in bookstores all over Malaysia. If I ever read it, not that I plan to, I could probably imagine a sexier movie than they’ve made.

  76. 76.

    Iowa Old Lady

    @Belafon: I can’t believe the energy these people still have to make a big deal of every little thing the President does. Why aren’t they exhausted?

  83. 83.

    Calouste

    @Buddy H: There were quite a few ads for movies during the Superbowl. 50 Shades was probably the only one that wasn’t technically a remake or a sequel.

    Anyway, Shakespeare build a whole career on rewriting old stories, it’s how you do it that matters.

  84. 84.

    Betty Cracker

    @BGinCHI: I hope there’s a next season, but from what I gather, that’s not a certainty, so they should have wrapped it up for us, damn it. Still, it was a worthwhile series. You don’t often see explorations of female power and sexuality like that on teebee.

  85. 85.

    shortstop

    Well, I’m trying to think how to put this delicately, and I haven’t read the book, so I may be way off. But it occurs to me that this book is wildly popular with people who have never explored the complex and shifting nature of sexual power and the sometimes blurry lines between pleasure and pain. In other words, there are probably millions of folks, ranging from individuals who occasionally like a little smack on the ass during sexytimes all the way to total-lifestyle doms and subs, who are all going, “What’s the big deal? This stuff wasn’t just invented.”

  89. 89.

    Mike J

    @Amir Khalid:

    But I understand there was a lot of stuff from the book that they didn’t dare shoot. The movie will probably turn out to be more of a tease than a payoff.

    Hollywood doesn’t do sex well. Look at how bad 9 1/2 Weeks was. People who were fans of the book complained that the movie got everything wrong. In the course of watering it down they changed the tone and theme.

    I can’t imagine that making changes to 50 Shades could make it worse. I think I’d rather just watch 50 scenes with Sasha Grey.

  90. 90.

    shortstop

    @trollhattan: Mamet writes Caulfield: “The fucking phoniest fucking phony I fucking ever saw among phonies.”

    I always think of old Holden when I walk 40 blocks back to my hotel in Manhattan.

  91. 91.

    WereBear

    @Roger Moore: They firmly believe that cuts to others will help them because it will mean more to go around to everyone who didn’t get cut.

    Yes. Which makes them even more loathsome than I had suspected.

  92. 92.

    trollhattan

    @Origuy:
    Is Republican Marxist completely out of the question? Both are confused totalitarians that Just Need an Audience. Lots of common ground.

  94. 94.

    Roger Moore

    @BGinCHI:

    I don’t get the attraction to whatever 50 Shades is doing.

    I assume the main thing is that 50 Shades introduced a lot of fans to the idea of (apparently fairly tame) BDSM. Those fans want to see the book made into a movie. That doesn’t seem that hard to grasp.

    @Amir Khalid:

    (Were I E.L. James, I would have sold the movie rights to a more appropriate studio, like Wicked Pictures or Vivid Video.)

    I don’t get the impression that she’s terribly worried about artistic integrity, so the natural target would the company willing to pay her the most, not the one that’s going to do the best job of realizing her vision. Besides, it’s the big studios who are in the business of paying for other people’s ideas. The porn studios don’t need ideas, just an excuse for a lot of sex.

  96. 96.

    bemused

    @Roger Moore:

    I forgot to put in negative. No, they don’t believe they will suffer any negative repercussions themselves, directly or indirectly. It would all be good for them. Even very young children have learned a lot about cause and effect, “if I do this, this or that other thing could happen” before they even start school.

  97. 97.

    Buddy H

    @WereBear: Yes. I’m an aficionado of the comments section of my local news media (online versions of local newspapers and tv news stations). The peanut gallery is always chiming in with fox news talking points. They hate unions, they hate teachers (one commenter suggested all teachers be replaced with a computer learning system, then you could have classes with one hundred students). One columnist, Carl Strock (before he was let go for criticizing Israel) used to post the salaries of teachers and administrators.

    Rather than pulling everyone else up, the non-unionized, they’d rather push down anyone else.

    But of course there are never comments when it is reported that some cops made over $100K in one year with overtime.

  98. 98.

    Amir Khalid

    @shortstop:
    Fifty Shades is, by its own writer’s admission, a fan’s tribute to the Twilight series. Anastasia Steele and Christian Grey are knock-offs of Bella and Edward. Let me just say, a writer who wants to be Stephenie Meyer when she grows up isn’t aiming high.

  99. 99.

    Elizabelle

    @geg6: Wait. Aren’t they replacing the carpeting in the House chamber that day too?

    (Maybe that’s what’s coming next. Or a rumor of measles in the building.)

  106. 106.

    Belafon

    @BGinCHI: Imagine being a middle age woman in Puritanical America and someone writes a porn novel that Target will sell.

    Or, have you ever read a romance novel?

  108. 108.

    geg6

    @Soprano2:

    I get what you’re saying.

    But…

    They know what the deal is when they take the job. There is danger involved. But it’s much less danger than that faced than commercial fishermen or loggers or miners. I guess I don’t get why we have to act like they’re going into Fallujah every day when you and I both know that they are more likely to die from a heart attack from all the donuts and coffee they ingest.

  109. 109.

    Tommy

    @shortstop: I read a fair amount of erotica. I don’t think much of it deals with pain. But a fair amount of sex. People just getting it on. I always thought Fifth Shades, and I have not read it, was just a large group of America realizing they liked to have sex.

  110. 110.

    opiejeanne

    @BGinCHI: Everyone I know who has attempted to read 50 Shades has told me they had trouble getting past the first 20 pages or so.

  114. 114.

    shortstop

    @Belafon: I read somewhere* that a fifth or a quarter of the book’s readers were male.

    *and you know how useful THAT statement is…

  115. 115.

    geg6

    @BGinCHI:

    Well, of course. That’s because Catcher in the Rye sucks donkey balls. Quite unlike the masterpiece that is To Kill a Mockingbird.

  117. 117.

    shortstop

    @opiejeanne: I have nothing against anachronistic portrayals of American romance that glorify male chivalry and female virginity to the total exclusion of other, less traditional relationship dynamics…wait, yes, I do. But if I didn’t, I still wouldn’t go see it because my stepmama-in-law pisses me off sooooo much. This mature and wholly unemotional movie critique brought to you by…shortstop.

  119. 119.

    geg6

    @Amir Khalid:

    No, not if you read Fifty Shades. There is probably nothing less sexy, risque or titillating than that stupid book. You want some really interesting B/D/S/M literature, try Anne Rice’s stuff (before she went all crazy conservative Catholic on us, that is).

  120. 120.

    jl

    Glad I am out of the media loop. I don’t have to listen to people whining that Obama mentioned the Crusades and said that, you know what, Christians have done bad things too in the name of their religion.

    Next thing you know, people will be slandering Christianity by saying that some Christian nutcase could do something awful now, rather than 700 or 400 years ago. Like blow up a government building in OK and kill 200+ people. Something like that could never happen today! All Christians are very nice now.

    /snark

  121. 121.

    Roger Moore

    @BGinCHI:
    The point I was trying to make is that the attraction of 50 Shades is that it’s all the fans know about the topic. Because that’s all they know, that’s what they want to see.

  124. 124.

    shortstop

    @jl:

    I don’t have to listen to people whining that Obama mentioned the Crusades and said that, you know what, Christians have done bad things too in the name of their religion.

    What they’re actually saying, in direct contradiction to the actual contents of the speech, is, “Why does he always blame Christianity? Why doesn’t he ever criticize Muslims?” Because zero sum!

  125. 125.

    geg6

    @Tommy:

    Then you don’t read as much erotica as you think you do. I own several anthologies and at least a third or more of the short stories are all about B/D/S/M.

  127. 127.

    Amir Khalid

    @geg6:
    I’ve read much better erotica than 50 Shades, of course. My imaginary movie would most likely include the good bits from other writers.

  128. 128.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @shortstop: and @Roger Moore:
    The book is downright hated in the BDSM community, because it’s hardly at all about BDSM. It’s rape fantasy, Rett-dragging-Scarlet-upstairs stuff. Very popular, but traditional SM practitioners go ballistic about being confused with that, and in a culture with a major rape (and particularly rape denial) problem, it’s pretty controversial.

  129. 129.

    Tommy

    @geg6: I guess you read what you enjoy. B/D/S/M isn’t something that works for me. Just not my thing and I can find erotica that doesn’t touch on it.

  130. 130.

    Botsplainer

    Something really bad seems to be up at the IRS and TurboTax. I was trying to file our return claiming youngest daughter as dependent via Turbotax (lots and lots of educational and living expenses). IRS rejected, claiming she’d filed. I think – well hell, the little snot beat me to the punch, so I filed it deleting her dependent status, which also meant I lost the education stuff, which hurt – a lot.

    I’m eating lunch when I notice that there has been a rash of refund fraud via identity theft and that Turbotax has today suspended efilings in ALL states, that Federal filings are allegedly “unaffected”. So I text daughter, who advises she hasn’t filed. I’ll have to amend later to get those funds back (that’s about $4,000.00 laying around), but this could be a giant stolen identity pain in her ass if this isn’t just some sort of nightmare TurboTax glitch. I can’t even get close to getting in via the practitioner priority line – that one hangs up on me and says try back some other day. I’ve misdirected routing just to spoof my way in on an ostensible business question, but imagine they’ll give me the bum’s rush when I finally get through in an hour or so. Also, I can’t seem to reach the transcript service – it says the address I’m entering doesn’t match the one on the last return.

    I don’t have TDS privileges. My kingdom for them.

  133. 133.

    WereBear

    @Iowa Old Lady: Why aren’t they exhausted?

    Thinking you have to make a big noisy fuss lest God notices you aren’t and sends you to Hell; it sends the adrenalin of pure fear into a person’s veins.

  134. 134.

    raven

    They are putting the final layer of “chrusher run” on the street before they come with the asphalt Monday. They have been running a steam roller that vibrates for the last couple of hours and the joint has been rockin. I’m cool as long as my tuna don’t fall!

  135. 135.

    jl

    @shortstop:

    ” What they’re actually saying, in direct contradiction to the actual contents of the speech, is, “Why does he always blame Christianity? Why doesn’t he ever criticize Muslims?” Because zero sum! ”

    They want a war of civilizations, and won’t settle for anything less. So they emit lies within lies, and BS withing BS.

  136. 136.

    Gravenstone

    @Fred Dickinson: So because the world isn’t all sweetness and light RIGHT FUCKING NOW!!1!!, you’re going to throw a temper tantrum?

    Dude, any accomplishment should be acknowledged, especially in light of the organized economic sedition being perpetrated by the Republican party since 2009. But by all means, stamp your little feet and hold your breath until you’re blue. Maybe you’ll even pass out and mommy will kiss your boo boo when you fall.

  137. 137.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @shortstop:
    Yeah, stalker boyfriend forces her to have sex, which she then loves, repeat farther and farther past original comfort zone. Both my twitter and tumblr feeds are full of complaints about the difference, and I find it both amusing and empathetic. Obviously, BDSM does not want that confusion, and for understandable reasons. At the same time, I would think the people who understand that masochists don’t want their boyfriends to beat them would get that rape fantasy victims don’t want to actually be raped, and each fantasy promotes the reality to exactly the same extent. Hell, I like playing Half Life 2, but I wouldn’t want to shoot someone with a submachine gun.

  138. 138.

    Roger Moore

    @Iowa Old Lady:

    I can’t believe the energy these people still have to make a big deal of every little thing the President does. Why aren’t they exhausted?

    I think the biggest thing is that they tag team. It isn’t always the same person being outraged. I think they even specialize in different kinds of outrage. That gives them time to recover from their last blow up and to spend time looking for the next thing to complain about.

  140. 140.

    Tenar Darell

    @Buddy H: I beg to differ. Yes, they’re both period dramas, but Upstairs Downstairs is much more centered on the servants. Downton is really about the Grantham family. Yes, there are storylines around the servants, but they don’t seem to have the heft and centrality that Sarah and Rose had. Downton always circles back around to Lady Mary, co-opts Matthew and Tom into the upper class etc., whereas Upstairs Downstairs was always more about what Rose (and Sarah) saw and experienced. How Sarah grew and changed, even how the servants weren’t all devoted retainers but people with their own minds. I always thought that was the biggest problem with Downton, Fellowes doesn’t really write downstairs as well as upstairs.

  141. 141.

    opiejeanne

    @shortstop: That’s pretty much my reaction, hence my comments about preferring P&P, but you said it better.

    Although no longer having an annoying MIL, (who became quite sweet after FIL died, and I had always thought the pettiness and vitriol originated with her), I understand your reaction perfectly. They gave us a Christmas ornament one year when our son was about 6 that said “Baby’s first Christmas” on it. It didn’t have a date on it, and it was clearly a hint that we (or I) were not getting on with our duty to provide them more grandchildren.

    When I asked why they would give us one when the baby was in 1st grade the answer was that it was “just in case”.

  142. 142.

    opiejeanne

    @Belafon: If that is what is meant, I couldn’t force myself to read those. I thought they were ridiculous and not sexy at all.

  144. 144.

    Betty Cracker

    @Amir Khalid:

    Let me just say, a writer who wants to be Stephenie Meyer when she grows up isn’t aiming high.

    Amen to that. I haven’t read 50 Shades, but I did read the Twilight series because my kiddo wanted to read them (I was more helicopter-y then). Gyad, what a load of puerile crap.

  145. 145.

    Mnemosyne (iPhone)

    @Belafon:

    I’ve read many romance novels, the majority of which were far, far better written than “50 Shades.” I’m guessing that Robin Schoen (who walks right up to the dividing line between romance and erotica) has much more daring scenes in any one of her books than anything in “50 Shades.”

    I still think the success of the book is that they drew the “Twilight” fans who were ready for a lot more explicitness than Meyer was giving them.

  146. 146.

    sharl

    @geg6:

    …try Anne Rice’s stuff (before she went all crazy conservative Catholic on us, that is).

    Apparently Anne Rice doubled back!

    Anne Rice: Called Back to the Darkness? January 16, 2015

    Vampire novelist Anne Rice has a conflicted soul. When we talked to her in 2009, she had abandoned atheism and returned to the Catholicism of her youth, committing herself to chronicling the life of Jesus. She told the world she was “called out of darkness,” and swore off books about the fashionably undead. But just a year later, her faith fled once again, and the vampires came back. Guest interviewer Mark Oppenheimer finds out what happened.

  147. 147.

    Tenar Darell

    @Betty Cracker: Worst part (read them for work) besides the creepy stalker stuff where Edward spies on her sleeping and her reckless behavior when they’re apart, was the fourth book reveal of Bella’s pregnancy, that was shark jumping extraordinaire! (I didn’t own the book or when I got there I would have thrown it across the room).

  148. 148.

    opiejeanne

    @Betty Cracker: My Middle Child read the first Twilight book because her book club did, and it made her hiss and spit in ways I’ve never heard before. I’m usually the one having a heaving hissy about sexism and similar nonsense, but she was livid. She was incandescent, especially about Bella not having sex and not being bitten by her boyfriend because the author was a Mormon, and that being bitten was the thinly disguised stand-in for sex in the book, and the whole thing made her nuts.

    She didn’t read the subsequent books, when sex and bitey play-time became two separate things. I never read any of them but they were hard to avoid knowing about in this area. Heck, our weather reports always include Forks, and all because of those stupid books.

    Dracula is more fun than this, and sexier.

  150. 150.

    Tree With Water

    After the high speed chase he led them on, I remember thinking it would have been OK with me if a cop were to have given Rodney King a single shot to the kidney with his nightstick, and then arrested him. Just one. I know now that I was wrong, but I’d understand why if indeed it had happened– instead of the sick beat down by blue criminals that King endured.

  151. 151.

    opiejeanne

    @Mnemosyne (iPhone): Janet Evanovich is all about romance and a bit of naughtiness, and her character Stephanie Plum kept two guys busy in bed for quite a few books, but not the first 2 or 3. I think I got up to book 16 in the series before I quit, but the first one had both of us laughing our heads off it was so funny. She wrote romance novels before she started the Stephanie Plum mysteries, but those aren’t as good at the romance as the mysteries are. I think those are the only romance novels I’ve ever read, other than one execrable example written by Anne McCaffrey which was all about wifely duty to a husband who abuses her. Barf.

  152. 152.

    Mnemosyne (iPhone)

    @opiejeanne:

    Anne McCaffrey was a science fiction writer, so that’s probably why her romance novel sucked. (Plus most pre-1985 popular romances have … issues, particularly around rape.) If you’re really interested, you might like Jo Beverley or Mary Jo Putney (though I haven’t liked Putney’s more recent books). A lot of romance novelists I liked have gone over to writing thrillers/serial killer novels, which is more profitable, apparently.

    And don’t forget that commenter JoyceH wrote a traditional Regency (ie no explicit sex) called “A Feather to Fly With” — you can get it on Kindle.

  154. 154.

    Violet

    @Mnemosyne (iPhone):

    Plus most pre-1985 popular romances have … issues, particularly around rape.)

    Ain’t that the truth. Typical plot: Guy rapes girl. Many times. Then she falls in love with him. Horrible stuff.

  155. 155.

    Violet

    @shortstop: Never heard of that movie, “Old Fashioned,” so took a look around. From the website for it, the beginning of the synopsis:

    A romantic-drama, OLD FASHIONED centers on Clay Walsh, a former frat boy who gives up his reckless carousing and now runs an antique shop in a small Midwestern college town. There, he has become notorious for his lofty and outdated theories on love and romance as well as for his devout belief in God.

    Guy who runs antique shop has cover story for why he won’t get involved with women? Suuuure it’s because of his old fashioned theories on love and romance. Uh huh.

  156. 156.

    Betty Cracker

    @sharl: I’m not a Rice fan (read a couple of her books on vacation when the only alternative was reading a cereal box and TV Guides from 1992), but from what I understand, the death of her husband is what drove her back into the arms of Christendom. I figured it wouldn’t last.

    @opiejeanne: To her credit, my spawn quickly realized the Twilight books were crap too. I was so relieved! But I did get dragged to a couple of the movies. I’ll never forget the one scene when the hawt werewolf kid suddenly removed his shirt — my eardrums were perforated by the simultaneous screams of 300 or so 12-year-old girls. I laughed my ass off.

  157. 157.

    opiejeanne

    @Mnemosyne (iPhone): I know all about Dragonriders of Pern (loved the first couple of books), which should be classified as fantasy. Not a lot of science in her books, but I have been told that I am arguing this is because I’m an Old.

    My take on why that romance book sucked was that she was unable to shake off religion to write a decent book, probably Catholicism.

    I’m not looking for a romance novelist to love, I just don’t get them. I have a friend who is a very successful writer of romance novels but who did just that, went more mainstream and wrote thrillers.

  158. 158.

    shortstop

    @Violet: Stop that! Just because his former life of reckless carousing took so much time that he didn’t realize his love for musical theater and shoes, you have to go assuming things.

  159. 159.

    opiejeanne

    @Gravenstone: Thank you. Amen.

    I thought Interview with a Vampire started out so very promising and then descended into nonsense. It’s like she never watched any of those Bela Lugosi movies.

  164. 164.

    shortstop

    @opiejeanne: Ugh, how stressmaking for you. Best to just laugh at these ladies, I guess. In my case I can do it along with my husband because she’s not his actual mom and didn’t come along until he was well out of the house.

  166. 166.

    sharl

    @Violet: That reminds me of a Paddy Chayevsky movie I’ve always kinda liked, a very dark satire called The Hospital which is weird in that 60s and pre-Kent State early 70s way. But I don’t even like to bring up the movie to others anymore because of the she-ends-up-enjoying-it rape scene that happens early on between George C. Scott and Diana Rigg. Damn shame. On the positive side: since 1971 SOME things seem to have improved a bit regarding what constitutes acceptable popularly expressed behavior.

  167. 167.

    shortstop

    @Betty Cracker:

    I’ll never forget the one scene when the hawt werewolf kid suddenly removed his shirt — my eardrums were perforated by the simultaneous screams of 300 or so 12-year-old girls. I laughed my ass off.

    As I did when I read this.

  168. 168.

    shortstop

    @opiejeanne: I thought the first few Stephanie Plum mysteries were delicious mind candy — good just-for-fun reading when I was tired and unfocused. Then she started recycling the same handful of tricks and tools, and I got bored.

  169. 169.

    opiejeanne

    @shortstop: That’s helpful, that she’s not his Real Mom and she didn’t raise him.

    We eventually had two more kids, in our own good time. All three turned out just fine despite the fears of all of my friends and family that the eldest being an only child would turn out to be spoiled. He didn’t, and we consider ourselves very lucky that none of them ever got into trouble with anything serious. No drugs, no drunk driving, no scandalous behavior at school, and I can only credit something they possessed, some sort of common sense gene; I don’t think it was because we were such marvelous parents, but we did try.

    There was that one doorbell ditching incidence that my girls and their friends got caught in, after the two boys who egged them on fled the scene. They got my youngest to ring the bell; she was 9.
    The cops came but were much more upset with the homeowner than with the miscreants, because he had told them to get inside his house and the youngest little pipsqueak yelled at him that she didn’t know him and wasn’t going anywhere. I think the old lady across the street heard her and was probably the one who called the police.

  170. 170.

    opiejeanne

    @shortstop: Yeah, when she blew up the exact vehicle we owned, a bright yellow Escape, I howled with laughter even though we loved that car. The rest of the book and every book after was just her worrying about whether it would be Joe or Ranger, and that just wore me out. The repeated flouncing out of Morelli’s house got stupid.

    And that is the longest-lived hamster in the history of the world.

  171. 171.

    Violet

    @shortstop: All that fraternity carousing with all those guys! Lots of guys! No wonder he didn’t realize how old fashioned his thoughts on romance with women were. All those guys!

  174. 174.

    Iowa Old Lady

    @Tenar Darell: You read the Twilight books for work? What kind of work do you do?

    I read the first one but was bored. How many times do I have to hear that Edward was beautiful? However, Meyer did capture that teenaged sense that every little thing matters. He looks at you, and you think you’re going to die. He looks away, and you KNOW it.

  177. 177.

    WereBear

    @opiejeanne: Living through adolescence once was enough.

    For me, once was too many times. I was already more mature than 99% of my peers and 90% of the adults around me. It was heck waiting for some more people to catch up… and to be able to live independently.

    My stress went down to a fraction of what it had been once I didn’t have to put up with everyone else’s incompetence, only my own.

  178. 178.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    @Frankensteinbeck:

    It’s rape fantasy, Rett-dragging-Scarlet-upstairs stuff. Very popular, but traditional SM practitioners go ballistic about being confused with that, and in a culture with a major rape (and particularly rape denial) problem, it’s pretty controversial.

    This is why many people are slightly ballistic that the book is so popular. Non-consexual activity is not arousing to most of us, an it sure as hell shouldn’t be glorified.

  179. 179.

    Tree With Water

    @shortstop: There was a werewolf show on FOX maybe 25 years ago, that had very cool, state of the art human-to-werewolf special effects. I watched the premier with a friend, whose three year old little boy sat on the floor between me and the TV. The first time the human turned werewolf he snapped alert, stood up, turned around, marched directly to his father, and sat down right beside him. Any closer and he’d of been in his lap. It was an hilariously appropriate reaction by the little guy, one I’ll never forget.

  180. 180.

    WereBear

    @Tree With Water: LOL! I took my then-eight year old nephew to see HellBoy along with a girlfriend of mine. (With his father’s permission.) While we were standing in line, he ran into a friend from his grade at school, and we & the other child’s parents gave them permission to sit together, alone.

    All was well until the Portal opened and Cthulhu started to make an appearance. Suddenly he was in my lap, desperate to explore my bag of gummy bears. Once that segment was over, he went back to his friend and was fine the rest of the movie.

    And he didn’t eat any gummy bears :)

  181. 181.

    Mnemosyne (iPhone)

    @opiejeanne:

    Actually, it means you didn’t slog through “The White Dragon,” which is the one where they find the spaceships that brought them to Pern. So, yes, it’s science fiction, but it’s also what made me stop reading them. Her portrayal of men in homosexual relationships was very balanced for its time, but times change.

  182. 182.

    Suzanne

    @Mnemosyne (iPhone): I am interested in hate-watching Fifty Shades of Grey. I couldn’t bring myself to read the books, because I know they’re wretched, but the movie won’t take up too much time.

  184. 184.

    Tenar Darell

    @Iowa Old Lady: I was selling books then and responsible for the Children’s and Teen sections. There were girls as young as 10 begging to read them. I didn’t want to shut down a girl or a boy excited about reading, and my bosses wouldn’t be happy if I lost the sale. So I liked to be able to give Moms and Dads a heads up. Some took it (in which case I often recommended something more age appropriate or Tamora Pierce), some did not.

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