Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Just because you believe it, that does not make it true.

Many life forms that would benefit from greater intelligence, sadly, do not have it.

Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Peak wingnut was a lie.

Sadly, there is no cure for stupid.

He wakes up lying, and he lies all day.

Sadly, media malpractice has become standard practice.

Fuck these fucking interesting times.

Take hopelessness and turn it into resilience.

Democracy cannot function without a free press.

The republican ‘Pastor’ of the House is an odious authoritarian little creep.

Optimism opens the door to great things.

“woke” is the new caravan.

Too often we hand the biggest microphones to the cynics and the critics who delight in declaring failure.

New McCarthy, same old McCarthyism.

They think we are photo bombing their nice little lives.

GOP baffled that ‘we don’t care if you die’ is not a winning slogan.

I did not have this on my fuck 2025 bingo card.

If you thought you’d already seen people saying the stupidest things possible on the internet, prepare yourselves.

If ‘weird’ was the finish line, they ran through the tape and kept running.

If you can’t control your emotions, someone else will.

One way or another, he’s a liar.

Fight for a just cause, love your fellow man, live a good life.

We know you aren’t a Democrat but since you seem confused let me help you.

You are here: Home / Civil Rights / Criminal Justice / Shitty Cops / Drop the Hammer

Reader Interactions

204Comments

  3. 3.

    Trentrunner

    This is historic. About fucking time. That was pitch-perfect and substantive.

    (Also, Howard Kurtz proved himself an eternal douche by tweeting wondering whether Mosby has a conflict of interest because she acknowledges the youth protesting. Fuck him.)

  4. 4.

    D58826

    She certainly lowered the boom on the cops involved. Given her description of the callas disregard of the safety of Gray, I wonder why it wasn’t first degree murder. You don’t keep throwing a person in a police van w/o a seat belt without some level of pre-meditation. On the other hand no sense in overcharging and risking an acquittal, like the cop in Chicago.

  6. 6.

    beltane

    @Trentrunner: Well, there’s also a story on the FP of Daily Kos saying that the cops would never be charged because the State’s Attorney is the daughter of two cops, and the nice of several other cops.

  8. 8.

    boatboy_srq

    Wow.

    Story is here. Looks like the Sun is doing a decent job of the reporting.

    Quote from the article (for rikyrah):

    Mosby said Gray was improperly arrested on April 12 because officers had no probable cause to detain him.

  9. 9.

    Jim C.

    Her parents, grandfather, two aunts, and three uncles were all police officers. We’ll see how she actually performs. She pretty much had no choice but to pursue criminal charges, but how aggressively she pursues them will be telling.

    I will wait to applaud and celebrate until I’m sure she won’t be another Bob McCulloch.

  10. 10.

    Jerzy Russian

    @Trentrunner:

    Howard Kurtz proved himself an eternal douche

    It can’t be easy to constantly out-douche yourself, so you have kind of give Mr. Kurtz some grudging admiration.

  12. 12.

    JPL

    @D58826: I was going to mention to you down below, that it might of had something to do with intent. There are enough lawyers on the site, that they can share their opinion of the charges.

  15. 15.

    Cluttered Mind

    @Jerzy Russian: At this point in his career it’s possible Kurtz has decided that he’s close enough to the world record of out-douching oneself that he may as well just go for it.

  16. 16.

    SiubhanDuinne

    Good. In the best of all worlds, this might just help put the brakes on some of the out-of-control policing across the country. It won’t happen immediately and it won’t happen everywhere, but maybe some cops will begin to realize that just because they wear a badge, their actions aren’t consequence-free.

  20. 20.

    JPL

    In another city, Wildstein is pleading guilty but it is a closed hearing. shucks!

  21. 21.

    Scott S.

    @SiubhanDuinne: I don’t think it’ll slow things down at all. If anything, I think they’ll get worse than ever. They’re like Republicans — telling them they’re wrong, just makes them double down.

  22. 22.

    Rob

    Forget my Washington Post link, the Baltimore Sun’s story is surely better (@boatboy_srq #8).

  23. 23.

    TooManyJens

    For people who didn’t see the press conference: if you get a chance to watch the video later, you should. Mosby was incredible. At a couple of points, she directly addressed the young people of Baltimore, saying that their voices had been heard and that “as young people, this is our time.”

    It’s almost incomprehensible to see a prosecutor who identifies with young anti-brutality protestors instead of regarding them as the enemy.

  24. 24.

    Jim C.

    @Trentrunner:

    Absolutely. It’s a necessary first step. But there was so much evidence and publicity that her hands were basically tied.

    The same was true with Wilson. But Bob McCulloch did everything possible to get the jury to NOT return an indictment, even though the old saying that a grand jury will indict a ham sandwich if asked is true.

    I’m in “wait and see” mode for the moment. So far she hasn’t done anything beyond what she absolutely had to do.

  26. 26.

    JPL

    @Jim C.: She appeared to be angry because bad cops make everyone look bad. Mosby praised most of the force but you could tell, she wanted to get rid of those that tarnish the department. I felt that she was sincere.

    btw.. This is really good news for Christie because Wildstein’s plea will be barely mentioned on the news.

  30. 30.

    TooManyJens

    @JPL: Yes, this. She came across as though coming from a law enforcement family made her even more offended at the disgraceful way these officers behaved.

  31. 31.

    feebog

    This is a big Biden deal. Between this and the Walter Scott case, we might be seeing a turnaround.

  32. 32.

    rp

    @D58826: First degree is very difficult to prove. She’d have to show that the cops intended beforehand to kill him. Honestly, I’m shocked she charged someone with even second degree murder. I thought manslaughter at best.

  33. 33.

    Harold Samson

    @JPL:

    I felt that she was sincere.

    Sincerity. If you can fake that, you’ve got it made.

  37. 37.

    Cacti

    Unpossible.

    I’ve been hearing from the credulous cracker press that Freddie Gray suicided by beating his own head against the police van walls.

  38. 38.

    Villago Delenda Est

    @JPL: Yeah, but if Wildenstein has been flipped, the Outlaw Joisey Whale is still in a world of hurt.

  39. 39.

    Rosalita

    I am delighted and surprised by the charges. I sincerely hope justice is finally served, but holy shit, if these guys get off it’s going to be Armageddon.

  40. 40.

    Elie

    I think it is frankly impressive that this was done 1) so quickly and 2) that the charges and circumstances related to those charges were related in such detail. That she comes from a family of cops was a nice added highlight. Brava! Loved the way that she read the charges also — with assertiveness and a bit of anger…

    Yes, there is much that still needs to happen, but I am grateful that things are off on a good foot for something so horrifically unnecessarily tragic.

  41. 41.

    SC

    @Elie: but you think we would have this response from her had the protests not happened the way they did?

  42. 42.

    Cluttered Mind

    @rp: IANAL, but it seems to me that by doing this she’s giving the jury options. They can’t convict of a crime that hasn’t been charged, so by bringing all these charges, she’s indicating that she’s willing to try the case and leave it up to the jury to decide what the officers are actually guilty of. If they were only charged with manslaughter and then over the course of the trial it comes out that what they did was actually murder and not manslaughter, they might not get convicted. By bringing all these charges, the jury has options.

  43. 43.

    Cluttered Mind

    @Villago Delenda Est: Especially considering that Wildstein was thrown under the bus early on in this scandal and then repeatedly run over by the bus. Whatever fuzzy feelings of loyalty Wildstein may have once felt for Christie are likely long gone. If he’s willing to talk, my guess is he’s not going to hold anything back.

  44. 44.

    Elie

    @SC:

    No. Probably not. Definitely not. Also, the weight of all the other national horrible examples (though not explicitly — but through influence)

  45. 45.

    TooManyJens

    This is Marilyn Mosby’s husband, city councilman Nick Mosby:

    Mosby burst into the national spotlight this week after a tense, on-camera exchange with a Fox News reporter. With unrest at its worst, Fox’s Leland Vittert pressed Mosby: Was it right that looters had robbed and set fire to several stores in the neighborhood? Mosby kept responding that he thought looting was wrong, but that broader, historical realities — like a paucity of investment and counterproductive policies imposed on struggling inner cities just like his — were like kindling. They went back and forth like this for a few minutes until an exasperated Mosby finally had enough. “At this point, this is not productive,” he said. “All you want to do is talk about this” — pointing over his shoulder to the liquor store that had been looted, and walking away from the conversation.

    Just like that, Nick Mosby, a first-term city-council member representing Baltimore’s 7th District, became something of a folk hero. He said what a segment of the Internet was feeling about coverage of the burning city.

  47. 47.

    Xantar

    I’ve met Mosby a couple of times. She comes across as very passionate and fiery. I’m also fairly certain that she has ambitions for higher office.

    Which is not to say she can’t be motivated by genuine desire to do good. I just mean that she is certainly aware of what this means for her career, too.

  48. 48.

    Jack the Second

    Excellent, I hope they receive a fair trial from impartial judges and jurors.

  49. 49.

    JPL

    NYTIMES

    Bill Baroni, the former deputy executive director of the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey, and Bridget Anne Kelly, a former deputy chief of staff to Mr. Christie, were expected to be indicted.

  50. 50.

    Elie

    .. And don’t forget that there are civil charges that can be brought, since they did not follow department policy…

  51. 51.

    Cluttered Mind

    @rp: If they did intend to hurt him, isn’t that still felony murder? You don’t need intent to kill to go down for first degree murder if you were planning to commit a different felony against someone (assault with a deadly weapon, for example) and you go too far by accident.

  52. 52.

    japa21

    @TooManyJens: Exactly. It is quite possible the cops in her family are just as disgusted at the bbehavior of the “bad apples” as we are. Secondarily, and a possible consequence of this, specially if more charges are brought elsewhere in the country, it might induce some of those “good cops” who have been upset but kept their mouths shut, to start really being “Good Cops” by stepping forward more when they see the behavior of the bad ones.

  53. 53.

    Laertes

    Depraved-heart murder seems like a pretty good fit for the facts, based on some half-assed IANAL googling. To prove murder 1, she’d have to show that they intended Gray’s death, which I can’t imagine how she’d do.

  55. 55.

    Lit3Bolt

    So what? The officers have been given 2 weeks to corroborate their stories, lawyer up, and have probably had insiders telling them what evidence prosecutors do and don’t have. 2 weeks to poison the jury pool, leak false and misleading information, and a CVS was burned that’s the real crime here when will the black community take responsibility of its hive mind?

    Acquittal on all charges for 5, one will be the fall guy MAYBE is my prediction.

    Waiting to hear the outraged comments from the Baltimore Police Union chief, Patrick Slavemaster.

    EDIT: Oh I forgot, they continue to be employed by the police dept, during the entire trial. Only if convicted will they lose their badge.

  56. 56.

    Tone in DC

    I am relieved that she charged those cops. It is a very good start.

    I personally don’t see Mosby (or any other prosecutor) as another McCulloch. I truly hope that guy is unique. Like Cheney, Bolton, Yoo and that NY FOP gashole who continues to bloviate against DeBlasio.

  57. 57.

    Elie

    I’m actually not convinced that all of the injury to Mr. Gray happened in the van. When I look at the video footage of him being taken to the van on his arrest, it doesn’t look like he can put weight on his legs and that they seem a bit weak or floppy. I may be wrong, but an initial injury may have occurred during his arrest when they had him on the ground.

  59. 59.

    peach flavored shampoo

    She’s going to be the target of innumerable death threats. She’d better have some better personal security. FROM OTHER COPS, natch.

    She’ll be stopped every day on the way to work from now until 2082.

  60. 60.

    Heliopause

    This is a victory in a small battle. Next will be a ramped-up character assassination in the press of Freddie Gray, then convincing a jury to nevertheless convict the defendants. Ongoing will be the biggest battle of all; realizing that this isn’t just a case of bad policing, this is the policing we as a society decided we wanted, of large communities living in inequality and oppression that the richest society in the history of the planet has decided to tolerate.

  61. 61.

    Punchy

    I fully expect Twitter to crash today from this news. Conservatives losing their damn minds….

  62. 62.

    Brandon

    What both humors and bothers me is how easy it was for anonymous propagandists supporting police to ‘win the day’ yesterday with false and misleading information. It’s humorous because thankfully the prosecutors swift action it shows just how futile the focus on the media narrative and ‘winning the day’ can be when 24 hours later your lies are contradicted by actual, verifiable facts and events. But it is also worrisome because if the ‘investigation’ had gone on longer it was clear that certain/most segments of the media would allow and encourage this propaganda to flourish, which could have implications on the fair administration of justice. All of the people that abetted that nonsense yesterday have been shown today to be fools not worthy of public trust. Some, like right wing bloggers, never were worthy in the first place. But others, like major news organizations have demonstrated once again how enthralled they are with propagating and supporting the powers that be over the vulnerable.

  63. 63.

    patrick II

    The defendant’s attorney will ask for the trial to be moved because the accused will not be able to get a fair trial in Baltimore city. If it moves to the a white community in the surrounding county a white jury might not convict. If it stays in Baltimore perhaps a different story. This is going to take awhile to play out.

    Noticeable from the beginning — in Ferguson CSI was never called, much evidence never collected, and a police statement by Wilson was never made. The Baltimore police department seems to be going through the steps necessary to do this right, regardless of the way it turns out.

  64. 64.

    MattF

    @Heliopause: At least there’s now a counter-narrative to “he severed his own spinal cord.” And it’s going to be tried before a jury.

  66. 66.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    I have not studied (or, frankly, even read) the Maryland homicide statute, and I don’t know what lesser included offenses are available, or why the specific charges were selected. I’ll defer, then, to a MD prosecutor who knows those laws. Based on her public announcement, including its detail and her tone, I have confidence in her professional competence, as well as her sincere distress about the events surrounding the fatal arrest.

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    McCulloch failed to get indictments.

    And he put a great deal of effort into failing to get indictments, as I know you know.

  67. 67.

    TooManyJens

    @japa21: Even the Police Commissioner says the six cops involved didn’t do what they were supposed to do.

    “We know he was not buckled in the transportation wagon as he should have been. No excuses from me. Period,” Batts said a week ago. “We know our police employees failed to get him medical attention in a timely manner multiple times.”

    (via)

    The Fraternal Order of Police, on the other hand, claim “each of the officers diligently balanced their obligations to protect Mr. Gray and discharge their duties to protect the public.” So fuck that.

    Honestly, to me one of the most encouraging things is that there’s no way the officers can claim their actions were due to ‘fear for their lives.’ Because we all know that’s a Get Out of Jail Free card (for cops).

    Horns still honking in Baltimore.

  68. 68.

    Brandon

    @Elie: Well, that’s the beauty of charging the van driver with murder. Hopefully all of the officers will be tried together as co-defendants. Because if the van driver convincingly argues that the injuries were caused by the arresting officers, then it directly implicates those officers for manslaughter. Furthermore, it still does not absolve him and such a defense actually implicates him further in the other charges, including failing the render aid and vehicular manslaughter. That guy is stuck.

  69. 69.

    CONGRATULATIONS!

    I’m actually not convinced that all of the injury to Mr. Gray happened in the van. When I look at the video footage of him being taken to the van on his arrest, it doesn’t look like he can put weight on his legs and that they seem a bit weak or floppy. I may be wrong, but an initial injury may have occurred during his arrest when they had him on the ground.

    @Elie: He could neither move his legs and was complaining of not being able to breathe. Classic symptoms of “spinal shock”.

    I’ve said this all along, those bike cops rode him down and did a tackle off the bike. I used to race bicycles. If I tackled someone off a bike (Not hard especially with the elbow and knee pads they’re already wearing) I’d at the very least seriously injure them. It wouldn’t be much different than getting hit by a car and in some ways (less surface area = more impact force) more dangerous.

  71. 71.

    Eric S.

    I don’t suppose we’ll get a good, cuffed perp walk of the accused? It’d be nice.

  72. 72.

    Cluttered Mind

    @rp: At the very least it’s showing the the prosecution is starting from a very, very harsh position. That’s already a big difference from what we usually see in these situations.

  73. 73.

    rp

    @Cluttered Mind: My crim law is a little rusty, but I don’t think you can bootstrap a felony murder charge by claiming the assault as the felony. IIRC, assault is already a lesser included charge in murder.

  74. 74.

    JPL

    NY Times Wildstein Plea
    The first count is conspiracy to “obtain by fraud, knowingly convert and intentionally misapply property” of an organization receiving federal benefits. The property in question is the George Washington Bridge. (Read an article about the fraud charge.)

    The second count is a civil rights violation.

  75. 75.

    Cluttered Mind

    @rp: At this point I feel it’s almost irrelevant. If they’re convicted of any one of the really serious charges it’ll already be groundbreaking, and if they’re acquitted it doesn’t really matter what they were actually charged with, because the message will be clear regardless.

  76. 76.

    Brandon

    @rp: It increases the chances of conviction. Jurors, as people, are inclined to negotiate. So the purpose of multiple charges is to allow the jurors to negotiate to say among themselves, well maybe its not second degree murder, but vehicular manslaughter makes sense. If they were only charged with one crime and its a police officer, then it is easier for a jury to be lenient and find not guilty. Additionally, as you suggest, by piling up charges it helps in any potential plea negotiation. And what you may find happens next is that the prisoners dilemma kicks in and the officers start turning on each other, leading to further charges.

  77. 77.

    J R in WV

    Not a lawyer, but from where I sit, this is about the best thing that could have happened in this case.

    I wasn’t surprised by the flurry of wildly improbable stories (wild lies) that were published by reporters who should have (and probably did) known better over the past few days.

    The story here isn’t the damage to property, it’s the damage to people’s confidence in the law and the justice system. And, of course, the damage to Mr. Gray, who probably never stood a chance in the race for success in the modern world.

  78. 78.

    Face

    Anyone know if the police union’s mouthpiece has chimed in? Support for these charges or is he going “protect everyone no matter what” mode? I’d think a hostile union spokesman is going to so poison the debate in the MSM that Baltimore is going to continue to smolder for awhile.

    And god forbid they’re all acquitted. It’ll could be April 1992 all over again.

  79. 79.

    Brandon

    @rp: My understanding is that the death must happen in the commission of a felony. Therefore, if they are not charged with felony assault the prosecutor cannot apply felony murder. So you are right that the second degree assault charges are a lesser included charge in the indictment.

  80. 80.

    burnspbesq

    @boatboy_srq:

    Well played.

    FWIW, I don’t expect any trials to take place in Baltimore City. Any competent defense counsel will move for a change of venue, on the ground that all the pretrial publicity makes it impossible seat an impartial jury etc. etc. The defense will probably suggest Garrett County.

    If that doesn’t work, then maybe you waive a jury trial and roll the dice on a judge.

  81. 81.

    JPL

    OT.. Wildstein’s atty just gave a statement. He was asked about Christie and he repeated a statement he gave earlier and that is Christie knew.

  83. 83.

    Brandon

    @Face: The FOP sent a letter requesting the prosecutor to recuse herself and appoint an independent prosecutor because she is friendly with the local media and her husband is a city council member whose political future could ride on the outcome. It should be noted that the prosecutor is herself independently elected, so that argument sort of falls flat and if it was accepted at face value, it would mean that no prosecutor that received FOP electoral support could try any criminal case, not just those involving police officers as defendants.

  86. 86.

    Brandon

    @burnspbesq: My guess is that if venue is moved it would be to Charles or Calvert county. Other alternatives would not be reasonable for either defense (PG or Montgomery) or fair administration of justice (e.g. moving Rodney King trial to Simi Valley).

  92. 92.

    catclub

    @burnspbesq:

    FWIW, I don’t expect any trials to take place in Baltimore City. Any competent defense counsel will move for a change of venue

    and yet Tsarnaev was tried in Boston. Incompetent defense counsel?

  94. 94.

    MattF

    @Face: The Baltimore FOP has called for a special prosecutor. The exact reason is hazy.

    ETA: Apparently ‘conflict of interest’. Y’know, justice vs. police.

  95. 95.

    Mike J

    @Brandon: I don’t see why Montgomery county would be a problem for the defense. Plenty of affluent, white DC suburbs to contribute to the jury pool. Bethesda, Silver Spring, Rockville.

  97. 97.

    J.D. Rhoades

    @D58826:

    Given her description of the callas disregard of the safety of Gray, I wonder why it wasn’t first degree murder.

    “Callous disregard for human life” is a main element of what’s called ‘depraved heart’ murder, which is second degree.

  98. 98.

    Peale

    @Brandon: Unfortunately, I disagree with that. I think it would be better if more of the injuries were sustained in the van because that is were the police were not following policy of properly restraining the passenger. They also stopped five times (why?) and did nothing to help him. But I don’t think the case is going to go very far on the injuries sustained while they were chasing and arresting him. The union lawyer was probably correct in arguing that they didn’t need probable cause to pursue or detain him, and with the discovery of the knife they had reasons to arrest him, and up until that point they were following legal department procedures and shouldn’t be prosecuted for that. What happened on the way to the precint is very important.

  99. 99.

    the Conster

    She’s 35 years old. From Boston – inner city Boston, and a graduate of Boston College Law. First in her family to go to college, with all of her family as cops. She is something special. FSM bless her and keep her safe.

  100. 100.

    J.D. Rhoades

    @catclub:

    and yet Tsarnaev was tried in Boston. Incompetent defense counsel?

    Oh, they tried like hell to get it moved. Four times IIRC. It’ll be an issue on appeal.

  101. 101.

    Mike J

    Already heard from wingnuts upset that this will embolden people and make them believe that rioting gets results.

    Is there any reason to believe charges would have been filed without civil unrest?

  102. 102.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    @catclub: Federal jury pools are drawn from the federal court district, which is substantially larger than a county – or comparable level of political subdivision in a commonwealth – from which a state jury pool originates. Also, motions to change venue were denied.

  103. 103.

    Xenos

    @Laertes:

    she’d have to show that they intended Gray’s death, which I can’t imagine how she’d do.

    It is theoretically possible, say, if one of the officers flipped and gave testimony that the driver, for example, had been intending to kill Gray for some reason. Still not so easy to prove, though.

    I would like to see a new statute that established an aggravated 2nd degree murder for injuring someone when operating under color of law and withholding medical attention or failing to call an ambulance. Should be good for another 10 years in prison.

  105. 105.

    MattF

    @Mike J: Since charges were filed as soon as the medical examiner’s report came out, I’d say there’s no obvious correlation.

  106. 106.

    J.D. Rhoades

    The wingnuts are going ballistic over the “bias” the prosecutor showed and her “angry tone” in making the announcement. Because, you know, WHITE prosecutors are always so nice and sweet to people they’re indicting for murder.

  107. 107.

    burnspbesq

    @catclub:

    Could have been a judgment call that neither Worcester nor Springfield would have been better. I haven’t followed the proceedings closely enough to know off the top of my head whether there was a motion filed and denied.

  108. 108.

    Elie

    While I agree that the demonstrations and possibly the rioting, brought attention to the police criminality and subsequent charges — I just have to stroll over to the NYT comments on the op-ed about this not being about black culture — to see the work ahead and the extreme blow back and downside of the rioting/looting.

    It is very very difficult to address the impact of race on poverty in this country. The arguments start by acknowledging that slavery was “bad” and that cops shouldn’t do bad things to black people, BUT — then there is a listing of all the other nationalities that have been successful in the US and why can’t black people do that? I MUST be black culture that leads to too many babies and violence, right?

    We are right back to square one. Right back to no matter how accomplished any single black person becomes, such as our President, they are inherently inferior because their culture obviously is inferior to produce so many poor people who just like to burn things down.

    I have to stop myself from reading that stuff for a while…

  109. 109.

    Dave L

    So, any speculation on what the prosecutors have? Given the varied, charges, I’ll assume they heard some damning stuff from the more lightly-involved cops. And, presumably, from the coroner.

  111. 111.

    Brandon

    @Mike J: Considering that jury pool would include myself and my neighbors, along with a rapidly diversifying county jury pool, I think the defense would find it a hard slog. People are generally rather well educated and would look at the facts and the jury instructions and likely apply them quite strictly. I don’t think that would be what the defense wants. I obviously haven’t seen all of the evidence, however there are certain facts that are known. A lot will probably depend on the actual jury instructions, but it seems not difficult to draw some logical conclusions.

    For the arresting officers, they could get off. False imprisonment seems obvious due to no probable cause for arrest because the knife was not illegal. They may have had reasonable suspicion for a Terry Stop due to the flight, but no probable cause for an arrest. There could be an exclusion in the law for “honest mistakes” of lack of knowledge of the law by police, which was the subject of a recent SCOTUS case. So the jury instruction there will be important. But if found for false imprisonment, the physical contact incident to the false imprisonment would be assault.

    In terms of the van driver, he’s in more trouble due to the failure to secure, provide aid and follow procedures. It is not hard to see him found guilty of assault at minimum and vehicular manslaughter is possible depending on the statute.

    I just don’t see a MoCo jury being of much benefit to these guys at all.

  112. 112.

    Keith G

    @catclub: Actually, considering all the dynamics of the trial, Boston was not a bad place for the defense to make its case. They weren’t contesting whether or not the defendant actually was involved. Their hope was to be in a location that was anti-death penalty enough that they could possibly save the kid’s life.

  113. 113.

    peach flavored shampoo

    Already heard from wingnuts upset that this will embolden people and make them believe that rioting gets results

    I’d say that’s exactly the fucking point of the mayhem. It does, and should, get results.

  114. 114.

    Brandon

    @Peale: They only needed “reasonable suspicion” to detain him, which is a low bar and unfortunately making eye contact with a cop and running is enough to satisfy that standard. The arrest is another story though.

  115. 115.

    bemused

    @Elie:

    Those commenters, people who have only known white privilege, black-splaining make my head explode. Worse yet, they have no interest in trying to walk in someone else’s shoes.

  116. 116.

    Randy Khan

    @burnspbesq:

    [blockquote]FWIW, I don’t expect any trials to take place in Baltimore City. Any competent defense counsel will move for a change of venue, on the ground that all the pretrial publicity makes it impossible seat an impartial jury etc. etc. The defense will probably suggest Garrett County.[/blockquote]

    The prosecution should counter with Prince George’s County. That’s what I would do.

  117. 117.

    burnspbesq

    @JPL:

    Plea negotiations are always a possibility. This case would be easier to try if you could flip one of the cops. So maybe you get all of the defense lawyers in a room, and put an offer on the table that expires as soon as one defendant accepts.

  119. 119.

    J.D. Rhoades

    The most outrageous wingnut claim I’ve seen so far: it was all Gray’s fault because he was so skinny from smoking crack, his spine was easy to break.

  120. 120.

    cahuenga

    The video belonged to shop owner Hwang Jung, who said police copied the footage. The original was lost when his store was subsequently looted, he said.

    That’s the “4th stop” video, the one that I am all but certain made the case and broke the cover up. Without it, I don’t think we’d be seeing 6 charges, let alone of this severity.

  122. 122.

    Original Lee

    @Brandon: My guess is Charles County because it’s closest to being a 50-50 county, racewise. Calvert is still pretty white, but Charles has had a huge influx of middle-class minorities in the last 10 years. Howard is too close to Baltimore, and so is Anne Arundel. I don’t think the Eastern Shore is an option.

  125. 125.

    Belafon

    @Xantar:

    I’ve met Mosby a couple of times. She comes across as very passionate and fiery. I’m also fairly certain that she has ambitions for higher office.

    Which is not to say she can’t be motivated by genuine desire to do good. I just mean that she is certainly aware of what this means for her career, too.

    I’d rather have someone cowardly do their job rather than cowardly make up excuses for why they couldn’t.

  128. 128.

    Mandalay

    @Face:

    Anyone know if the police union’s mouthpiece has chimed in? Support for these charges or is he going “protect everyone no matter what” mode?

    Predictably, the latter….

    The Baltimore police officers union says the six officers charged in the Freddie Gray investigation aren’t responsible for his death…

    “As tragic as this situation is, none of the officers involved are responsible for the death of Mr. Gray,” Ryan wrote. “To the contrary, at all times, each of the officers diligently balanced their obligations to protect Mr. Gray and discharge their duties to protect the public.”

    The Police Unions have completely lost the plot. The nonsense of “reaching for something in his pocket” and “officers fearing for their safety” and “protecting the public” ain’t gonna fly any more. It’s the beginning of the end for those vile organizations. They don’t have the backing of the public, but once those in power also finally realize that they are a big chunk of the problem they are fucked. And good riddance.

  129. 129.

    shortstop

    If a guy weren’t needlessly dead, I’d say this makes me extremely happy. As it is, this makes me extremely relieved.

  131. 131.

    Gravenstone

    @Mike J: Considering the coroner just released their autopsy results yesterday, I don’t see how charges could have been filed any sooner.

  132. 132.

    Aleta

    I’m sort of crying, while last night I was so depressed about our diseased country that I wanted to either lie down forever or get drunk (which I have to avoid cause it brings me depression).

    Personally, though I don’t know her of course, or anything about her politics, I believe that the prosecutor was able to do this instead of fearing for her career because of each individual protester who came out to make thousands, and because of the Ferguson protesters and on and on.

    Although, the writers and actors and ball players and others who had the media’s eye might have been the tipping point.

    It brought home to me that pressure on the players in the ‘bad system’ is not enough. Showing massive support for those who can make the right decision but don’t want to lose their job, their life as they know it, is needed.

    I remember when the 2000 election was thrown by Florida and the Supreme Court, thinking that thousands could have gone to the street but didn’t. Of course the court wisely declared that they were stopping the recount because uncertainty (ie, unrest) would be bad for the country.

  133. 133.

    dedc79

    It looks like they had to close the comment thread on the Baltimore Sun article, since they were being overrun with racist comments. I hope it was just the same handful of stormfront assholes writing things like “kneeger” over and over again, but I worry/fear there was more to it than that.

  139. 139.

    MattF

    @dedc79: It’s easy for a small, determined group to overrun a thread. The real problem is that it shuts down public discussion of events– but if public discussion turns into hatemongering, there’s no marginal cost to cutting off the flow of pixels.

  140. 140.

    Mandalay

    @Rob:

    the Baltimore Sun’s story is surely better

    The Baltimore’s Sun’s coverage of this story has been superb throughout. Long may local papers flourish.

  141. 141.

    p.a.

    @dedc79: don’t know who said it first, but comments on feminist threads and race threads prove the need for feminism and anti-discrimination laws.

  143. 143.

    Villago Delenda Est

    @Randy Khan: That’s OK. We’ll forgive you this time. Next time, however, it’s a trip across town in a van with bad steering.

  144. 144.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Jim C.: Yes, of course, but that’s the point. This prosecutor has already surpassed McCulloch.

  146. 146.

    Peale

    @Brandon: The knife he had with him. At least that what I’ve read. That he could have spent a year in jail for having the knife. Whether he would have is another story.

  147. 147.

    MomSense

    Wow, I was hoping they would file charges but I wasn’t expecting it to actually happen. This is good news.

    @boatboy_srq:

    WIN!

  148. 148.

    brantl

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    McCulloch failed to get indictments.

    McCulloch, made no serious attempt to get an indictment. He used witnesses that he knew were lying (when he had no obligation to do so), to deliberately muddy the case.

  149. 149.

    J R in WV

    @J.D. Rhoades:

    ….it was all Gray’s fault because he was so skinny from smoking crack, his spine was easy to break.

    So if you were a strong-arm thief, and attacked a 79-Y-O gramdmother, with one punch you broke her neck and killed her, that’s grandma’s fault? Because her neck was too fragile?

    Because it wasn’t Mr Gray’s fault even if he was more fragile than the average football player! I see those cornerbacks hit receivers like a ton of bricks, and then they both pop up and run back to the line of scrimmage. Freddy wasn’t a cornerback, was he?

    This is sick stuff, which is no surprise coming from the right wing noise machine.

  150. 150.

    Aleta

    oh yeah–also happy for the kids who saw the organizing and marches get a result–even though only a chance at justice–and white adults paying attention to wrongdoing.

  151. 151.

    catclub

    @Keith G: My point was that just because defendant’s counsel files for change of venue, which they did multiple times in the Tsarnaev case, it does not automatically get granted, which was what BBQ seemed to imply
    when he stated it would not be tried in Baltimore City.

    FWIW, I don’t expect any trials to take place in Baltimore City.

  152. 152.

    shortstop

    @Keith G: But that was a federal trial, so the status of the death penalty in the trial venue was irrelevant.

  154. 154.

    Peale

    @cahuenga: Makes sense. Again, I wish there were better maps of the events of the arrest – of anything to do with this case. Where did they drive? Where did they stop? Where were they supposed to be going.

    Heck, I don’t even know the boundaries of the precinct. Where where the riots? Where was there looting. The stories I read at best make it seem like there is this place called Baltimore and everyone was rioting all over the city. Since I’m not a local I’m in need of maps.

    It is interesting that the same store that had the camera was looted, but then I guess all the stores were looted.

  155. 155.

    Aleta

    Yesterday a commenter (sorry I can’t find your name) pointed out that because Mr. Gray was alive when he reached the station, they had to send him to the hospital, where an assessment of his injuries was recorded by a doctor. Not a coroner working with the PD who could issue a Ferguson-style report.

  156. 156.

    Cliff in NH

    @Peale:

    It was a typical folding knife and totally legal.

    @CONGRATULATIONS!:

    He was riding a bike, not running, his bike is right there in the video.

    I’m getting sick of hearing this ‘running’ shit when he was clearly taken down from a moving bike by other bikes.

    It’s easy to be seriously injured when being tackled from a moving bike to concrete. They could have fractured his neck easily. The ‘rough ride’ is even worse when you look at his existing injuries – he could barely move when they shoved him in the van.

  157. 157.

    Elie

    Every night, America is shown the “black crime culture” on local news outlets. Every night, white and “other” non black cultures see what they think is the prevalent black culture of crime and depravity. Every night, these folks can say, “aha – see — this is what the black culture is about” — no matter how many doctors, teachers and responsible citizens we produce, every night, the larger culture is “taught” how inferior we truly are. No matter what documentation of the facts and how this came to be is made, its just explained as blacks making excuses…

    What we need to protest as much as these cops, is the depiction of black America and black culture as a non-stop crime culture of disproportionate size that cannot produce strong citizens.

  159. 159.

    Ruckus

    @catclub:
    Not to defend burnsy but your quote shows that he didn’t say there would be no trial in BC, but that he didn’t expect there to be. I’d suspect any first yr law student to at least try for a change of venue. Would it be very helpful to change counties? As several have pointed out, maybe, maybe not.

  160. 160.

    Villago Delenda Est

    @Elie: Our “News” media is a sewer, and it’s the inevitable result of our model of television broadcasting, which is about profit before any other possible value.

  161. 161.

    NobodySpecial

    Yeah, I live too close to Chicago to believe in fairy tales about prosecutors and cops.

  162. 162.

    Gex

    @Dave L: I would have to say that the fact that they had to change their statements and reporting on the number of stops as private video uncovered a stop they didn’t include is one of the things they have. Attempting to falsify reports is a serious problem.

  163. 163.

    LWA (Liberal With Attitude)

    @boatboy_srq:

    Mosby said Gray was improperly arrested on April 12 because officers had no probable cause to detain him.

    But he looked at them!
    The Wrong Way!

  164. 164.

    Cervantes

    Re Tsarnaev, @burnspbesq:

    Could have been a judgment call that neither Worcester nor Springfield would have been better. I haven’t followed the proceedings closely enough to know off the top of my head whether there was a motion filed and denied.

    The defense made several requests. The judge told them to rely on voir dire, period.

  165. 165.

    Ruckus

    @Elie:
    To shorten your fine, excellent, wonderful, absolutely necessary comment – it’s called poisoning the waters, propaganda, or if you want you could simply call it what it really is, racist bullshit.

  166. 166.

    SoupCatcher

    My wife is watching the news conference in another room and I’ve been listening to the audio.

    The state attorney’s righteous condemnation is straight out of the Old Testament.

    She is awesome.

  168. 168.

    Patricia Kayden

    @TooManyJens: I wouldn’t speak to Fox News reporters. Just ignore them. They already have a narrative of Black people which they are always pushing. Facts be damned.

  172. 172.

    SiubhanDuinne

    Warrants have been issued for their arrests.

    Five of the six are now in custody, and the Mayor has asked the Police Commissioner to suspend all of them until the conclusion of the trial(s).

    I understand the head of the FOP has weighed in, but I don’t know what he’s said.

  173. 173.

    Juju

    @Elie: the police officers broke Freddie Gray’s neck before he was put in the van. Forcing him into the van made a serious injury a deadly injury. If you watch the various videos taken at the time of his arrest, you can see he can’t move his legs. If you watch his head as they shove him towards the van, you can see he has some, but little, neck control, but by the time they put him into the van he can no longer hold his head up, or even control his head. His head just swings and bobbles. At that point, he was realistically already dead. The van ride didn’t help the situation, but it didn’t cause his injury or his death. The police officers killed Freddie Gray before the van ride.

  174. 174.

    Interrobang

    @J R in WV: In some jurisdictions, can’t speak for MD, there’s actually a legal principle called “eggshell skull,” meaning that if you hit someone over the head and it turns out their skull is only as thick as an eggshell and they die, you’re still liable for their death. It’s used primarily in civil law AFAIK, but applies criminally in some cases. IANAL, but I used to work for one, which is where I picked up these pieces of legal trivia.

    In other words, besides being sick, the wingnuts are also full of shit. It would still count even if Grey had rickets or something that made his bones brittle.

  175. 175.

    Mandalay

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    I understand the head of the FOP has weighed in, but I don’t know what he’s said.

    This is in the letter he sent to Mosby.

    “…none of the officers involved are responsible for the death of Mr. Gray…”

  177. 177.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Mandalay:

    I was eventually able to read it. There were a lot of not-so-veiled threats in there, too (e.g., “Your husband has a swell career ahead of him; be a shame if anything were to happen to it.”).

  178. 178.

    Origuy

    That Wikipedia article on depraved heart murder has had two dozen edits today.

  179. 179.

    Aleta

    @Juju: Yeah, and didn’t notice anything wrong ??? What kind of depraved hearts are they cooking up down there?

  180. 180.

    cckids

    @Peale:

    with the discovery of the knife they had reasons to arrest him,

    Mosby specifically said in the press conference that the knife Gray was carrying was NOT a switchblade, was perfectly legal, and “therefore, the arrest of Mr Gray was illegal”.

    One more thing the press has gotten totally wrong this week.

  181. 181.

    Mike J

    @cckids: For further info,a site dedicated to knives has a state by state breakdown on laws.
    http://www.knifeup.com/maryland-knife-laws/

    From here, we know that dirks, switchblades, Bowies, and throwing stars are always illegal to carry concealed. We also know that pocket knives of any size (“penkives”) are always legal to carry.

  182. 182.

    cckids

    @Bobby B:

    Apparently they’re still drawing pay

    MSNBC just said that that has ended now that they’re indicted; they’re now suspended without pay.

  184. 184.

    Peale

    @Mike J: Thanks. I am gladly standing corrected on all the misinformation I was spreading on knives. What do I know? I just read the papers.

  185. 185.

    LanceThruster

    @D58826:

    I wonder why hate crimes statutes aren’t in play too as his race/color seemed to be a motivating factor. I would also think that the charges of ‘assault under color of authority’ would apply…i.e. “we’re cops so whatever we want to do to you we can.”

  186. 186.

    Lee

    Someone else might have brought this up, but I read earlier that she ran on the platform that no one is above the law and any LEOs that break the law would be charged.

    She has been in office 4(?) months.

  187. 187.

    AxelFoley

    @Brandon:

    What both humors and bothers me is how easy it was for anonymous propagandists supporting police to ‘win the day’ yesterday with false and misleading information. It’s humorous because thankfully the prosecutors swift action it shows just how futile the focus on the media narrative and ‘winning the day’ can be when 24 hours later your lies are contradicted by actual, verifiable facts and events. But it is also worrisome because if the ‘investigation’ had gone on longer it was clear that certain/most segments of the media would allow and encourage this propaganda to flourish, which could have implications on the fair administration of justice. All of the people that abetted that nonsense yesterday have been shown today to be fools not worthy of public trust. Some, like right wing bloggers, never were worthy in the first place. But others, like major news organizations have demonstrated once again how enthralled they are with propagating and supporting the powers that be over the vulnerable.

    This. So very much this.

  188. 188.

    Patricia Kayden

    @Juju: Murdered for doing absolutely nothing wrong. Amazing that this is still happening in the good ole USA.

  189. 189.

    Patricia Kayden

    @Peale: Did you actually listen to Ms. Mosby? She clearly said that there was no reason for Gray’s arrest and that the knife he had was legal.

  190. 190.

    Brachiator

    Mosby said Gray was improperly arrested on April 12 because officers had no probable cause to detain him.

    Damn.

  192. 192.

    opiejeanne

    @Brandon: I wondered about that. The driver was indicted for the worst of the charges, and I don’t see how he alone is responsible for this level of murder, “second degree depraved heart murder”. Are they saying that the van driver caused the most grievous physical harm to this man? The video of him being arrested seems to suggest that there was already a lot of physical damage done to him before he was stuffed into the van. Was the driver responsible for him not being strapped in securely?

  193. 193.

    opiejeanne

    @Face: I was in LA the day after the National Guard got there and settled things down. Ok, maybe it was two days after the Guard arrived. A weekend, seems like it was Mother’s Day.
    It was not fun driving through an area that had been hard hit, being stuck in gridlock traffic for more than an hour because some clown told me a shortcut to Ed DeBevic’s that took me right past all the angry people standing around on the sidewalks, with two little kids in my car. Stuff across the street from the restaurant and on either side was burned to the ground, and up towards Wilshire we could see the department store that was looted. Can’t remember the name. My kids knew what was going on, and I just told them to smile and not make eye contact while we were stopped.

    I sat up into the wee hours every night of that riot, and I lived way out in Riverside. Felt like I didn’t sleep for a week.

  195. 195.

    BobS

    @Elie: That’s what I’ve thought may have happened since I first saw the video. While it’s hard to tell about his upper extremities due to them being cuffed behind his back, he doesn’t appear to have any muscle tone in his lower extremities and there’s one point in the video where his flopping head has a rag-doll appearance. He may have simply been unconscious at this point (and unable to protect himself during the subsequent ride), or he may already have sustained the spinal cord injury (which I think is more likely) with his life-threatening injuries exacerbated during the ride. Either way, the appropriate thing for the cops to have done would have been to have called EMS — in addition to the ‘ABCs’ (airway, breathing, and circulatory support), paramedics would have placed a rigid collar around his neck and immobilized him on a body-length backboard to stabilize the bones of his spine and prevent any further damage to the cord.

  196. 196.

    opiejeanne

    @Juju: That was my take on it, too. That’s why I question the driver being charged with second degree murder/depraved heart, when Freddy was already fatally injured, unless the driver was involved in dragging him to the van.

  197. 197.

    opiejeanne

    @Cervantes: That’s a dime store from a very long time ago. I don’t remember one after 1970; not sure when the one in West Covina closed.

    This was a Nordstrom? I. Magnin? It was on the edge of Beverly Hills and that store was featured in almost every news program then, but I can’t spot it in the archived news reports. I can’t remember what area we were coming from, but if I hadn’t listened to the shortcut guy I could have gone a half mile farther down the freeway and doubled back to the restaurant and avoided the adventure. I was driving an 86 Mustang convertible, and when the girls asked what was going to happen when we were stuck in traffic, I told them that the sidewalk was wide enough that I could drive on it, and that I would if necessary. I’m glad I didn’t have to make that kind of decision.

  200. 200.

    Xenos

    @opiejeanne: The driver has an elevated responsibility for the safety of everybody in the van, I guess.

    I am not sure what exactly is meant by a ‘rough ride’ — if it is specifically driving in such a way (rapid starts and and stops) to cause injury to a shackled but unsecured passenger, then you have a pretty clear 2nd degree murder case. If it is driving around while the Lieutenant stomps on the victim’s neck while they are locked up together in the back, then it is not so clear, as you have an intervening criminal act as proximate cause of death.

  201. 201.

    Xenos

    @Xenos: Ok, I googled it. The van ride was intended to harm the victim. Murder 2, easy. Might even be murder 1, in some jurisdictions, as death was caused in the course of felony. The driver is not going to have some sort of defense based on thinking the victim was already fatally injured before the battery.

    What I find interesting is the presence of the Lieutenant in the van. Does not look good for the police force as a whole.

  202. 202.

    Barry

    @TooManyJens: “She came across as though coming from a law enforcement family made her even more offended at the disgraceful way these officers behaved. ”

    Except that time and time and time again, we see massive evidence that the overwhelming majority of police officers work to cover up disgraceful behavior.

  204. 204.

    Cervantes

    @opiejeanne:

    That’s a dime store from a very long time ago. I don’t remember one after 1970; not sure when the one in West Covina closed.

    I was referring to the J. J. Newberry store that was burned down on April 29, 1992 — the day the riots began. It was on South Western, I believe, and, yes, it was a dime store.

    Anyhow, you were referring to something else, it seems.

Comments are closed.