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You are here: Home / Open Threads / I Feel Like Shit and I am Cranky

I Feel Like Shit and I am Cranky

by John Cole|  May 13, 201512:42 pm| 205 Comments

This post is in: Open Threads, OLD MAN YELLS AT CLOUDS

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shutupyou

I slept with my windows open and my fan on high, the temperatures dipped precipitously overnight, and while I did not get cold because I was under a comforter with three dogs, my sinuses feel like they were cemented with quickrete and I got a stiff neck and can not turn my head from side to side. I blew off an appointment and didn’t even call to notify them because I’m too embarrassed. I injured myself fucking sleeping.

I can’t find my damned heating pad, but if I do, I’ll probably aggravate the stiff neck fighting to keep Thurston’s stupid ass from chewing the cord.

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Reader Interactions

205Comments

  1. 1.

    Karen in GA

    May 13, 2015 at 12:45 pm

    Well, glad to see things are chugging along as usual where you are.

  2. 2.

    Raven

    May 13, 2015 at 12:45 pm

    I’m in the waiting room to see the hand doc and see what the found on the MRI’s. Can’t wait to see what he says about my upcoming fishing trip!

  3. 3.

    c u n d gulag

    May 13, 2015 at 12:46 pm

    John,
    I love you, and you make me think and laugh every time you post.

    But, maybe you should save the limited inter-tube space, and just tell us when you DON’T feel like shit, and aren’t cranky!

    Btw – I also always feel like shit, and I’m always cranky, too, brother!!!

  4. 4.

    Karen in GA

    May 13, 2015 at 12:46 pm

    @Raven: Good luck.

  5. 5.

    lamh36

    May 13, 2015 at 12:48 pm

    Dude! you are what my aunt likes to call “prone”…shit is just always prone to happen to you. :-)

    So do u think this is just old age finally catching up to you ? Or some real underlying slow roll chronic illness happening?

    I’ll day one thing, your post like these ways makes me feel like my occasional bone pain…ain’t that bad.

  6. 6.

    gogol's wife

    May 13, 2015 at 12:49 pm

    @Raven:

    I’m hoping for good news.

  7. 7.

    Amir Khalid

    May 13, 2015 at 12:50 pm

    Thurston’s ass can chew on a power cord? That is truly a talented dog.

  8. 8.

    Roger Moore

    May 13, 2015 at 12:50 pm

    Does anyone actually blame natural disasters on too little government? Sometimes we blame insufficient and/or incompetent response to disasters on too little or badly managed government, but that seems inherently reasonable.

  9. 9.

    burnspbesq

    May 13, 2015 at 12:50 pm

    Well, this should make you happier (can’t link because it’s behind a subscription wall):

    U.S. construction equipment manufacturer Caterpillar Inc., which is contesting in IRS Appeals a potential $1 billion tax liability concerning an alleged profit-shifting arrangement, disclosed in its May 1 SEC Form 10-Q that it has received multiple grand jury subpoenas requesting documents and information regarding its subsidiaries and its replacement parts business.

    IIRC, the last major grand jury investigation into potential criminal tax evasion by a major U.S. public company was the Tommy Hilfiger investigation, in 2004-05. Once every ten years isn’t nearly enough.

  10. 10.

    Cacti

    May 13, 2015 at 12:52 pm

    Last week, Charlie Pierce agreed with right wing that the POTUS is arrogant (i.e. uppity).

    Yesterday, Sherrod Brown called him sexist.

    Maybe we can hit the trifecta and Rachel Maddow or Elizabeth Warren can ask to see the real birth certificate.

  11. 11.

    Michael J.

    May 13, 2015 at 12:52 pm

    Seems like all my injuries happen when I’m sleeping. Last night left shoulder froze up, yea.

  12. 12.

    Raven

    May 13, 2015 at 12:53 pm

    Thx ya’ll!

    Cole is no worse than anybody else, he just gets the press. How else does a trip to the grill with chicken turn into 7 stitches and an MRI to look for cancer?

  13. 13.

    lamh36

    May 13, 2015 at 12:54 pm

    Booman has a great report up about Senator “old man yelling at clouds” and how even some of his GOP allies and media fans are realizing he’s a warmongering batshit crazy ole man

    My Old Friend, John McCain

  14. 14.

    David Fud

    May 13, 2015 at 12:54 pm

    Today I pulled my 3 year old out of a pool and got him breathing again. Folks, if you have a pool and you have little kids, make damn sure that you are watching them carefully. It takes about 1 minute, literally, and you world can come to a crashing halt. Just like mine almost did. It is going to take me a while to get the picture of my unbreathing son out of my head. Please avoid this at all costs. Thankfully, all seems well at the hospital.

  15. 15.

    burnspbesq

    May 13, 2015 at 12:55 pm

    @Cacti:

    The Right figured out long ago that the Keenyan Mooslim Usurper is the Eebilest Man Ever. The Left is just a little slow.

  16. 16.

    burnspbesq

    May 13, 2015 at 12:56 pm

    @David Fud:

    Holy shit! Glad to hear it turned out OK.

  17. 17.

    Amir Khalid

    May 13, 2015 at 12:56 pm

    For no particular reason, a 1980s pop classic from my country: Chow Kit Road, a song about Kuala Lumpur’s best-known bazaar.

  18. 18.

    Raven

    May 13, 2015 at 12:57 pm

    @David Fud: Oh man, so glad to hear that he’s ok!

  19. 19.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    May 13, 2015 at 12:57 pm

    Cole, you never cease to amaze. I hope your neck feels better soon. If it’s any comfort, I occasionally injure myself sleeping, as I’ll wake up with back spasms. It’s probably more neurological (MS) than an injury, but it sounds dramatic to say “I hurt myself sleeping.”

    @Raven: Please keep us posted.@Raven: You also have talents in that regard, clearly.

  20. 20.

    Alison

    May 13, 2015 at 12:59 pm

    Hey, Mandarama, if you should pop into this thread, can you message me over on Tumblr or email me? (arparker711 at gmail) Not sure if you haven’t had a chance to open your gates yet or if I’m fucking up and there’s a step I’m missing in ACNL to travel. I added you to my friend list and it confirmed you or whatever…but I’m wondering if there’s something else I’m supposed to do before a town shows up in my traveling list.

    If not and I’m just being a pest and you’re busy, no problem, I’ll shut up :P

  21. 21.

    singfoom

    May 13, 2015 at 1:02 pm

    @David Fud: I’m glad he’s ok. That sounds terrible. A reminder to take some infant/toddler CPR classes.

  22. 22.

    dedc79

    May 13, 2015 at 1:02 pm

    God doesn’t exist?! Then who is gonna tilt the ice tonight so that the rangers beat the caps?

  23. 23.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    May 13, 2015 at 1:04 pm

    @David Fud: I am so glad to hear he’s okay.

  24. 24.

    Felonius Monk

    May 13, 2015 at 1:04 pm

    @Raven: My thoughts are with you. I hope all turns out well.

  25. 25.

    beltane

    May 13, 2015 at 1:06 pm

    Speaking of God-related things, the Vatican has just recognized Palestinian statehood: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/14/world/middleeast/vatican-to-recognize-palestinian-state-in-new-treaty.html?_r=0

  26. 26.

    Kropadope

    May 13, 2015 at 1:08 pm

    While lack of government regulation doesn’t cause natural disasters, and even this is debatable in the age of anthropogenic climate change, lack of government action and weakness of government agencies has proven to exacerbate the consequences of natural disasters (see Katrina).

    Then there are the human-created disasters, such as Deepwater Horizon and the 08 financial crash. There is no arguing around the fact that these disasters were wholly created by exploitation of weak government regulation.

  27. 27.

    NorthLeft12

    May 13, 2015 at 1:08 pm

    Republicans are doing their damndest to ensure that government does not exist either.

    Actually that is completely untrue……the government that they want to keep and expand is the one that watches, listens, punishes, robs, and kills all of those OTHER people.

  28. 28.

    dexwood

    May 13, 2015 at 1:10 pm

    @David Fud:
    Happy for the outcome of this near tragedy. The same thing happened to my cousin’s 3 year old, but, sadly, with a very different result.

  29. 29.

    PurpleGirl

    May 13, 2015 at 1:11 pm

    @David Fud: OMG. Glad to hear that you got the child breathing again and hoping that there are no residual injuries.

    When I was taking classes in recreation therapy we discussed pools, children and safety and why insurance was so costly. During the day you have to watch children and at night you have to think about the attractive nuisance aspect of pools.

    Again, hoping for the best for you and your child.

  30. 30.

    Punchy

    May 13, 2015 at 1:14 pm

    @dedc79: Unpossible. Ovie already promised a Caps victory.

  31. 31.

    Kropadope

    May 13, 2015 at 1:14 pm

    @NorthLeft12: What is it the Republicans are always saying? “The government that governs best is the government that only governs the least among us.”

    I added the bold sections to better reflect reality. I’m not sure who qualifies as the least among us under this paradigm, but it’s fast approaching 99% of us.

  32. 32.

    Germy Shoemangler

    May 13, 2015 at 1:16 pm

    @beltane:

    Speaking of God-related things, the Vatican has just recognized Palestinian statehood:

    will they mention that on ABC/CBS/NBC news tonight?

  33. 33.

    Amir Khalid

    May 13, 2015 at 1:16 pm

    @David Fud:
    Oh dear. Fortunately you were prepared to do the right thing. I hope everyone chez Fud recovers from this.

  34. 34.

    Belafon

    May 13, 2015 at 1:16 pm

    Someone needs to ask Erick about why God keeps shaking Oklahoma with all those earthquakes.

  35. 35.

    shell

    May 13, 2015 at 1:17 pm

    @David Fud: Man, David, that is awful
    . Thank the lord he’s okay.

  36. 36.

    PurpleGirl

    May 13, 2015 at 1:18 pm

    @Belafon: And tornadoes. Can’t forget the tornado season.

  37. 37.

    shell

    May 13, 2015 at 1:21 pm

    Cole, why don’t you just drape Thurston around your neck, like a natural heating device?

    The temps did take quite a dive last night. The front went thru around 9 o’clock, luckily for my dog, without any thunder or lightening.

  38. 38.

    Denali

    May 13, 2015 at 1:22 pm

    @John Cole,

    Sorry to hear about your bedtime tribulations. My husband’s cousin BROKE HER NECK while reading in bed.

    @David Fud,

    So glad your child is OK. The worst things happen in a split second.

    @Raven,

    Thoughts are with you. Hope all is well.

  39. 39.

    shell

    May 13, 2015 at 1:23 pm

    Just noticed…Is Erickson commenting on the Amtrak crash?

  40. 40.

    beltane

    May 13, 2015 at 1:27 pm

    @Germy Shoemangler: It’s a BFD so maybe they will mention it in passing, after proper attention has been paid to Tom Brady, etc.

  41. 41.

    Iowa Old Lady

    May 13, 2015 at 1:31 pm

    @David Fud: Holy crap. That should give us some perspective. Thank goodness you were there.

  42. 42.

    beabea

    May 13, 2015 at 1:31 pm

    John, I get the same stiff neck thing and painful, intractable headache when I go to sleep in a cold room with my hair still damp (which I irrationally keep doing despite knowing the likely outcome). Recently started using the Icy Hot patch, and they really help. Just stick on, no power cord for pets to chew on.

    And joining the other commenters’ best wishes for @Raven, and expressions of relief for @David Fud.

  43. 43.

    dedc79

    May 13, 2015 at 1:31 pm

    @Punchy: Even as a Rangers fan, I think the reaction to what he said has been unfair. I would hope he’d think they’re gonna win. I would hope he’d project confidence. However, I also hope he plays the way he has the past four games, rather than the first two.

  44. 44.

    beabea

    May 13, 2015 at 1:35 pm

    John, I get the same stiff neck thing and painful, intractable headache when I go to sleep in a cold room with my hair still damp (which I irrationally keep doing despite knowing the likely outcome). Recently started using the Icy Hot patch, and they really help. Just stick on, no power cord for pets to chew on.

    And joining the other commenters’ best wishes for @Raven and expressions of relief for @David Fud.

  45. 45.

    CONGRATULATIONS!

    May 13, 2015 at 1:36 pm

    Today I pulled my 3 year old out of a pool and got him breathing again. Folks, if you have a pool and you have little kids, make damn sure that you are watching them carefully. It takes about 1 minute, literally, and you world can come to a crashing halt. Just like mine almost did. It is going to take me a while to get the picture of my unbreathing son out of my head. Please avoid this at all costs. Thankfully, all seems well at the hospital.

    @David Fud: I am glad. Preach this to the skies. Happened to my wife at age 2. Happened to her father, also, at age 2. Obviously, both survived, but just because they got lucky doesn’t mean most people do.

    And David, I hate to tell you this, but you’re never going to get that picture out of your head. There’s a few in mine that have been in there a long time, and they’re not going away. Just take it as the reminder that it is, both of what went wrong and just how lucky you and him are.

  46. 46.

    Kathleen

    May 13, 2015 at 1:37 pm

    @Raven: Hope all goes well and you may fish, Raven.

  47. 47.

    Raven

    May 13, 2015 at 1:37 pm

    No cancer. More later.

  48. 48.

    Kathleen

    May 13, 2015 at 1:38 pm

    @David Fud: I’m glad that your little guy is OK.

  49. 49.

    agorabum

    May 13, 2015 at 1:40 pm

    @Cacti: circular firing squad; fire at will.

  50. 50.

    Iowa Old Lady

    May 13, 2015 at 1:40 pm

    @Raven: Excellent news

  51. 51.

    Kathleen

    May 13, 2015 at 1:41 pm

    @Raven: Glad to hear it.

  52. 52.

    ranchandsyrup

    May 13, 2015 at 1:42 pm

    BJ alum FdB on an over the top response to warren and emoprogs. http://t.co/6E1qbl7fjy

  53. 53.

    Roger Moore

    May 13, 2015 at 1:42 pm

    @Raven:
    Good news. Waiting for the update.

  54. 54.

    Germy Shoemangler

    May 13, 2015 at 1:42 pm

    @beabea: any ringing in the ears? Often that will accompany stiff neck.

  55. 55.

    ruemara

    May 13, 2015 at 1:42 pm

    @Cacti: I’m not sure what these guys are thinking but they are doing great work in pissing off black people. Disagree, but throwing that shit we’ve all had to hear when we’ve had the temerity to not do what the nice majority thinks we should do? Yeah, not going over real well with the largest base you got, Dems.

    Whoa, my best to the child @ DavidFud. So glad you were there. And grants on the good news, Raven! Does this mean the fish should fear you still?

  56. 56.

    Cervantes

    May 13, 2015 at 1:44 pm

    @Amir Khalid:

    Er … Happy May 13th?

  57. 57.

    JPL

    May 13, 2015 at 1:44 pm

    @David Fud: How scary. It will be awhile before your child is let out of your sight for sure.

  58. 58.

    scav

    May 13, 2015 at 1:44 pm

    @Raven: Yes!

  59. 59.

    Karen in GA

    May 13, 2015 at 1:44 pm

    @David Fud: No words for how terrifying that is. I hope all is well.

  60. 60.

    Karen in GA

    May 13, 2015 at 1:45 pm

    @Raven: Glad to hear.

  61. 61.

    ranchandsyrup

    May 13, 2015 at 1:47 pm

    @Raven: Niiiiiiiice.

  62. 62.

    rikyrah

    May 13, 2015 at 1:47 pm

    feel better Cole

  63. 63.

    JPL

    May 13, 2015 at 1:48 pm

    @Germy Shoemangler: No because according to Israel, the Vatican’s statement will prevent any further peace talks. You might ask why but the answer is cuz.

  64. 64.

    Citizen Alan

    May 13, 2015 at 1:50 pm

    @Cacti:

    Last week, Charlie Pierce agreed with right wing that the POTUS is arrogant (i.e. uppity).

    Are you referring to the incident where Obama gave a free trade speech at the fucking Nike HQ? Arrogant does not necessarily mean “uppity,” particularly when it describes a deliberate and calculated provocation to what are supposed to be one’s own supporters.

  65. 65.

    Kropadope

    May 13, 2015 at 1:50 pm

    @ranchandsyrup: Who is Allan Brauer and why should I care what he says or what Freddie the Boor says about him?

  66. 66.

    ranchandsyrup

    May 13, 2015 at 1:52 pm

    @Kropadope: you shouldn’t then. :)

  67. 67.

    Kropadope

    May 13, 2015 at 1:54 pm

    @ranchandsyrup: Simply having to ask is cause not to care. OK. I wish we could have that level of clarity about all internet spitball fights.

  68. 68.

    Amir Khalid

    May 13, 2015 at 1:56 pm

    @Cervantes:
    That’s one day that will never be a public holiday here. I spent it (well, the morning anyway) being seen by an ophthalmologist. Unlike the previous one, this one said cataract surgery was definitely in my future but didn’t need to get done soon. So I can wait a few more months for that.

  69. 69.

    opiejeanne

    May 13, 2015 at 1:56 pm

    @Kropadope: When discussing man-made disasters caused by lack of government will, see also the Oso landslide in Washington. The county has quite a bit to answer for.

  70. 70.

    Calouste

    May 13, 2015 at 1:56 pm

    @JPL: Thing is, the Vatican didn’t even recognize the Palestine State today, they already did that 2 years ago. What they did today is sign their first treaty with the Palestine State. But of course Baby Nethanyahoo throws a tantrum at everything.

  71. 71.

    Germy Shoemangler

    May 13, 2015 at 1:57 pm

    So the muppets have a new tv show. It’s more edgy than the old muppets. For example, Fozzie Bear wants to marry a human girl, and her parents object. “where will your kids go to the bathroom, in the woods?” “That’s an offensive stereotype!”

    Here’s the trailer.

    I’m old enough to remember the muppets from the Ed Sullivan Show and the first season of Sesame Street. I may enjoy this.

  72. 72.

    ranchandsyrup

    May 13, 2015 at 1:57 pm

    @Kropadope: It is? If you say so. there were posts on this yesterday and it’s an open thread. *shrug*

  73. 73.

    Cacti

    May 13, 2015 at 1:58 pm

    @Citizen Alan:

    Had Charlie limited it to “POTUS is arrogant” you might have have a point.

    But when he couches it thusly…

    Pitching this job-wrecking runaway train at Nike World HQ is demonstration enough that some of what the president’s opponents say about his arrogance is not misplaced.

    There’s really no way to interpret that where Charlie comes out looking good.

    ETA: On the contrary, it comes off as very dog whistle-ish.

  74. 74.

    p.a.

    May 13, 2015 at 1:58 pm

    I injured myself fucking sleeping.

    Thought you played lacrosse? This is a baseball injury.

  75. 75.

    Betty Cracker

    May 13, 2015 at 1:59 pm

    @David Fud: Holy shit, how scary! So glad he’s okay. There can’t be anything on earth worse than losing a child.

    @Raven: Great news!

  76. 76.

    Cervantes

    May 13, 2015 at 2:01 pm

    @beltane:

    Speaking of God-related things, the Vatican has just recognized Palestinian statehood:

    Not quite. What they have done for the first time is to craft a treaty with the Palestinians that refers to the latter party as a state. The treaty is not explicitly about recognition of that state, but you could say it is a de facto recognition. Also, the Vatican has used the word “state” before to describe the Palestinian political entity, in press releases and so on.

  77. 77.

    RSA

    May 13, 2015 at 2:02 pm

    @David Fud: I’m glad it turned out okay!

    @CONGRATULATIONS!:

    And David, I hate to tell you this, but you’re never going to get that picture out of your head.

    This is also true. But on the plus side, not that people who have done this tend to put it this way, but I’ll say it anyway… Congratulations on having saved your son’s life.

  78. 78.

    Amir Khalid

    May 13, 2015 at 2:03 pm

    @Cacti:
    Complaining that a politician is arrogant is not unlike complaining that there are vegetables in your salad.

  79. 79.

    Villago Delenda Est

    May 13, 2015 at 2:04 pm

    @Roger Moore:

    Sometimes we blame insufficient and/or incompetent response to disasters on too little or badly managed government, but that seems inherently reasonable.

    Except if your a congenital fuckhead like Ewick Ewickson.

  80. 80.

    Kropadope

    May 13, 2015 at 2:04 pm

    @ranchandsyrup: Well, when I asked, you told me I shouldn’t care. I was just accepting that as principle.

    Freddie might also consider stop doing Rush Limbaugh’s work for him, elevating numbskulls affiliated with Democrats who have no real institutional power to the level of national Democratic Party spokespersons.

  81. 81.

    Germy Shoemangler

    May 13, 2015 at 2:05 pm

    @Amir Khalid:

    this one said cataract surgery was definitely in my future but didn’t need to get done soon.

    My brother had it done and he was pleased with the results. His vision improved and he is happy now.

  82. 82.

    Cacti

    May 13, 2015 at 2:05 pm

    @Cervantes:

    Not quite. What they have done for the first time is to craft a treaty with the Palestinians that refers to the latter party as a state. The treaty is not explicitly about recognition of that state, but you could say it is a de facto recognition. Also, the Vatican has used the word “state” before to describe the Palestinian political entity, in press releases and so on.

    If a treaty refers to the State of Palestine or Palestinian State, etc., it’s a tacit recognition of Statehood in a document that has the force of law in another sovereign political entity. Press releases are just words.

    It’s a big Biden deal.

  83. 83.

    Cervantes

    May 13, 2015 at 2:07 pm

    @Cacti: “Tacit” and “de facto” are referring to the same thing.

  84. 84.

    Villago Delenda Est

    May 13, 2015 at 2:07 pm

    @Cacti: B. Barry Bamz is wrong, wrong, RONG about TPP. There is no other way to characterize it. And your interpretation of what Charlie said as dogwhistle for “uppity” is pushing it quite a bit. Obama is really tone deaf on this one.

  85. 85.

    Cervantes

    May 13, 2015 at 2:08 pm

    @Calouste:

    Thing is, the Vatican didn’t even recognize the Palestine State today, they already did that 2 years ago.

    Really?

  86. 86.

    beltane

    May 13, 2015 at 2:09 pm

    @Cervantes: It’s interesting. From what I’ve read, it seems the treaty is centered on the activities of the Roman Catholic church in Palestinian territories. Prior to this, the entity representing Palestine was the PLO, now it is the State of Palestine. Symbolic, but significant at the same time.

  87. 87.

    Cervantes

    May 13, 2015 at 2:09 pm

    @Cacti:

    ETA: On the contrary, it comes off as very dog whistle-ish.

    Not to me.

    @Villago Delenda Est:

    And your interpretation of what Charlie said as dogwhistle for “uppity” is pushing it quite a bit.

    I agree.

  88. 88.

    ranchandsyrup

    May 13, 2015 at 2:10 pm

    @Kropadope: from your response it was clear that you didn’t care so I’m not going to tell you that you should. But it looks like you went ahead and read it anyway. Doesn’t matter either way to me.

    Was elevating a numbskull all that FdB was doing?

  89. 89.

    Cervantes

    May 13, 2015 at 2:10 pm

    @beltane:

    Symbolic, but significant at the same time.

    I agree.

    Then again, more than a hundred other countries have already extended formal recognition.

  90. 90.

    Kropadope

    May 13, 2015 at 2:11 pm

    @Villago Delenda Est: Obama’s wrong about something we don’t know the content of yet. Sounds like left-wing garment-rending individuals before every single other Obama initiative that had not yet been fully fleshed out.

    “Obama sold us out!!!”
    “On what? How?”
    “I don’t know, but he did.”

  91. 91.

    CONGRATULATIONS!

    May 13, 2015 at 2:12 pm

    @Raven: Well, I think that qualifies as a “fuck yeah” moment. Go get ya some fish.

    I have bone bruises in at least a couple of places that I have to explain to the docs if they x-ray ’em.

  92. 92.

    Steppan

    May 13, 2015 at 2:12 pm

    @David Fud:

    Ooof! Glad all is well!

    We had a pool at my house (just got filled in a year ago, finally) when I was growing up. That almost happened to me – I was really young and helping stick the plastic retainer pins into their holes in the pool deck after taking the fixed winter cover off, and PLOP into the water I go at the deep end.

    Luckily, my mom was nearby and stuck her arm in and yanked me out by my overalls. Apparently I just looked really wide eyed.

  93. 93.

    satby

    May 13, 2015 at 2:13 pm

    @David Fud: So glad that had a happy ending! They make pool alarms:http://www.goodhousekeeping.com/home-products/pool-alarm-gate-reviews/a12136/best-pool-alarm-gate/

  94. 94.

    Cervantes

    May 13, 2015 at 2:13 pm

    @Amir Khalid:

    Don’t wait if you don’t have to. Maybe use some time to identify the best available surgeon.

    Good luck with it.

  95. 95.

    Cacti

    May 13, 2015 at 2:13 pm

    @Villago Delenda Est:

    And your interpretation of what Charlie said as dogwhistle for “uppity” is pushing it quite a bit.

    Charlie’s the one who said he agreed with “some of what the president’s opponents have to say about his arrogance”.

    That’s a curious thing to agree with when, when right wing complaints about “his arrogance” are primarily based on the racist cultural attitude that adult black men and women should be obsequious and deferential

  96. 96.

    catclub

    May 13, 2015 at 2:14 pm

    Oh, remember all the times that headlines would say ‘Democrats fail to pass legislation X” when the real reason was a filibuster by the GOP and the Democrats had a majority of the votes? In the TPA this rule was not applied. Instead, all the coverage was: “Democrats kill the TPA!”, even though the vote was 52-45 in favor. Funny that.

    It should have been “GOP fails to advance TPA bill” in the so-called liberal media.

  97. 97.

    Betty Cracker

    May 13, 2015 at 2:19 pm

    @ranchandsyrup: Damn! I agree with FdB that AB’s response was ridiculously over the top, but in typical FdB fashion, he’s making a mountain out of a molehill. Yes, there are Obama partisans who lose their shit in absurd fashion if anyone criticizes the president — a few of them comment at this blog. But I don’t think it’s anything close to a crisis for the Democrats.

  98. 98.

    satby

    May 13, 2015 at 2:19 pm

    @Raven: AWESOMENESS!

  99. 99.

    Kay

    May 13, 2015 at 2:20 pm

    @Cacti:

    Republicans love Obama’s new offensive against Democrats, Cacti:

    Republicans have been taking it personally for years. And though many of them want to see trade pass, they can’t help enjoying watching Obama take on his own party.

    Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2015/05/barack-obama-war-on-left-warren-trade-117886.html#ixzz3a2lFdDUV

    I thought he said he wanted labor and environmental protections and funding for displaced workers in the trade deal? Why is he objecting when 45 Senate Democrats might actually get those things?

    Which part of the Senate Democrat’s 4 conditions for Fast Track does he object to? Maybe he could let us know. If it’s the currency manipulation regulation then we could have a debate about that. It’s fine if he’s adopting the GOP position there, but he probably has to explain that.

  100. 100.

    Iowa Old Lady

    May 13, 2015 at 2:21 pm

    TPM reports that Jeb says answering that Iraq question would be a disservice to the troops.

    I’ve been convinced we’d see a replay of 2012 and Jeb would eventually be the last man standing, but I begin to doubt.

  101. 101.

    ranchandsyrup

    May 13, 2015 at 2:22 pm

    @Betty Cracker: yeah that’s my take as well. I do find it odd when white ppl (non-ironically) use the whiteness of their critics as a defense or cudgel, though.

  102. 102.

    Cacti

    May 13, 2015 at 2:22 pm

    @Kay:

    So Kay, is he an uppity sexist?

    Also too, isn’t it kind of benevolent sexism for Sherrod Brown to assume that Senator Warren needs him to ride to her rescue and defend her honor?

  103. 103.

    Matt McIrvin

    May 13, 2015 at 2:23 pm

    @Germy Shoemangler: I remember their old cover of Peter, Paul and Mary’s “I’m In Love With A Big Blue Frog”: “They say the property values will go right down / If the family next door is blue!”

  104. 104.

    Kropadope

    May 13, 2015 at 2:23 pm

    @Betty Cracker: This is how partisan politics is treated in media. Republicans don’t have to be held accountable for what they say, not even the elected representatives. Democrats have to be held accountable for whatever anyone loosely associated with them says, especially anonymous blog commenters and barely-influential party apparatchiks.

  105. 105.

    Calouste

    May 13, 2015 at 2:24 pm

    @Cervantes:

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/may/13/vatican-to-sign-state-of-palestine-accord

    The Vatican has said it is preparing to sign its first accord with Palestine, two years after officially recognising it as a state.

    In a statement issued on Wednesday, the Vatican said that the “bilateral commission of the Holy See and the State of Palestine” was putting the final touches to the treaty.

    “The agreement will be submitted to the respective authorities for approval ahead of setting a debate in the near future for the signing,” it said.

    While it will be the first time the Roman Catholic Church has signed a treaty with the State of Palestine, the Vatican has recognised the state since February 2013.

    “The Holy See has identified the State of Palestine as such since the vote” by the UN general assembly to recognise it in November 2012, Vatican spokesman Federico Lombardi told Agence France-Presse.

  106. 106.

    chopper

    May 13, 2015 at 2:24 pm

    @Raven:

    between that and the positive outcome of fud’s story, it’s a good day.

  107. 107.

    Amir Khalid

    May 13, 2015 at 2:24 pm

    @Cervantes:
    I go to the University of Malaya Medical Centre. It’s the oldest teaching hospital in Malaysia. I’m pretty sure they know what they’re doing.

  108. 108.

    Cervantes

    May 13, 2015 at 2:26 pm

    @Amir Khalid:

    Glad to hear it.

  109. 109.

    CONGRATULATIONS!

    May 13, 2015 at 2:27 pm

    TPM reports that Jeb says answering that Iraq question would be a disservice to the troops.

    I’ve been convinced we’d see a replay of 2012 and Jeb would eventually be the last man standing, but I begin to doubt.

    @Iowa Old Lady: I was certain of that as well, but boy he has shit the bed but good recently, a very inauspicious debut, hauling his brother out of the Storage Shed Of Shame and parading him around like he’s some kind of asset and not the albatross around the neck that he will be in the general. Although this may help for the primary, W. does poll REALLY well with the GOP these days, much to my shock – about 80% positive IIRC.

  110. 110.

    Matt McIrvin

    May 13, 2015 at 2:27 pm

    @CONGRATULATIONS!: My wife’s cousin drowned at age 2 or 3 by toppling headfirst into a large bucket. They’re sold with warning signs on them about that now: the images look ridiculous but are dead serious.

  111. 111.

    Shana

    May 13, 2015 at 2:27 pm

    @David Fud: I’m so happy you had a good result from a terrible situation. The image, I am sorry to say, will never disappear but it will change from abject terror to longstanding relief.

    When our now 22 yr old was 2 she was in her bedroom with the window open. Hubby and I were gardening in the back yard. She leaned against the screen which popped out and she fell one story to the deck. Hubby saw it but my back was to the house. She had a skull fracture over one eye and a couple of days in the hospital. Thankfully no permanent damage although annual follow ups to see if there was anything.

    Extra hugs and kisses all around.

    I’m so stealing “Storage Shed of Shame.”

  112. 112.

    Kay

    May 13, 2015 at 2:28 pm

    @Cacti:

    Why are you avoiding the trade deal issue, Cacti, and why is the President? While it’s interesting that he thinks Warren is a political hack it’s not really germane.

    4 conditions. Which one doesn’t he like enough to launch an “offensive” against Democrats? There’s a big piece in Politico about what are continuing plans to oppose Democrats, but no information on what he objects to on their Fast Track conditions.

  113. 113.

    gogol's wife

    May 13, 2015 at 2:28 pm

    @Raven:

    I’m glad to hear that.

  114. 114.

    Betty Cracker

    May 13, 2015 at 2:29 pm

    @Kropadope: True enough. The corporate media blew the whole PUMA thing up into a party crisis in 2008 — devoted whole segments of “news” programs to a small group of Internet cranks that had zero effect on the election.

  115. 115.

    Gravenstone

    May 13, 2015 at 2:29 pm

    Too embarrassed to admit the cause when blowing off your appointment, but not so embarrassed that you won’t make a front page post about it? Well, isn’t that special? /Church Lady

  116. 116.

    Cacti

    May 13, 2015 at 2:30 pm

    @Kay:

    Do you agree the President is an uppity sexist?

    It’s a Yes/No question.

  117. 117.

    Kay

    May 13, 2015 at 2:34 pm

    @Cacti:

    It’s rich to talk about “out of touch liberal elites” in Politico while relying on a book from the Peterson Institute for job gains projections,, especially when the book actually predicted zero job gains. Any increase will be offset by losses but it will be slow and so there will be plenty of time for assistance to affected workers and communities. Of course, there won’t be any assistance if that isn’t actually in the deal.

    Forgive, but I think I’ll go with Trumka. I know he’s a liberal elite but I just find him reliable than conservative elites.

  118. 118.

    Lavocat

    May 13, 2015 at 2:34 pm

    Cole, honestly, there’s only one thing left for you to do (AND I want photographic proof that you did it): go outside, point at a cloud, and scream at it.

    If you aren’t the human version of Grampa Simpson, then I do not know who is.

  119. 119.

    Cacti

    May 13, 2015 at 2:34 pm

    @Kay:

    So, was that a Yes or a No?

  120. 120.

    Mnemosyne (iPhone)

    May 13, 2015 at 2:35 pm

    @Germy Shoemangler:

    The old Muppets had an episode where Alice Cooper spends the whole time trying to get Gonzo to sell his soul to the Devil, who Cooper is communicating with through a radio in his dressing room.

    IOW, I think the old “Muppet Show” was edgier than you remember.

  121. 121.

    Kay

    May 13, 2015 at 2:36 pm

    @Cacti:

    When is the President planning on getting those labor and environmental protections he promised us?

    Sometime after his trade deal passes? Sorry. No sale.

  122. 122.

    Cervantes

    May 13, 2015 at 2:36 pm

    @Cacti:

    Also too, isn’t it kind of benevolent sexism for Sherrod Brown to assume that Senator Warren needs him to ride to her rescue and defend her honor?

    You keep asking this question but you don’t know that he made such an assumption.

    If one perceives racism or sexism or any form of bigotry, speaking out against it is prima facie the right thing to do.

    (NB: I’ve said elsewhere I myself did not think the president’s use of “Elizabeth” was sexist.)

  123. 123.

    Matt McIrvin

    May 13, 2015 at 2:37 pm

    @Mnemosyne (iPhone): And if you watch those old episodes now, some of the edgy “adult” stuff hasn’t aged well (it’s been visited by the Sexism Fairy, mostly), but that’s the way of such things.

  124. 124.

    Kropadope

    May 13, 2015 at 2:39 pm

    @Kay:

    4 conditions. Which one doesn’t he like enough to launch an “offensive” against Democrats? There’s a big piece in Politico about what are continuing plans to oppose Democrats, but no information on what he objects to on their Fast Track conditions.

    It’ll be awful hard to deal with our negotiating partners if Obama’s trying to balance the individual desires of members of Congress. That’s the whole reason for the requesting of fast track authority to begin with. Congressional Democrats seem hell-bent on destroying a rare opportunity to actually improve environmental and labor conditions in our trade policy, all due to a reflexive aversion to all trade deals.

    It’s also worth noting, the Ds saying they can’t trust Obama to enforce environmental/labor protections he negotiates as part of the deal sounds an awful lot like Rs saying they can’t vote for comprehensive immigration reform. They would like to, but they can’t trust him to enforce it. Just whiny excuse making to vote the way they always wanted to.

  125. 125.

    Germy Shoemangler

    May 13, 2015 at 2:39 pm

    @Mnemosyne (iPhone): Very true!

  126. 126.

    Cacti

    May 13, 2015 at 2:43 pm

    @Kay:

    So, was that a Yes or a No?

    Also too, Senator Brown has referred to Senator Warren by her first name publicly.

    That big sexist oinker.

  127. 127.

    Kropadope

    May 13, 2015 at 2:44 pm

    @Kay:

    When is the President planning on getting those labor and environmental protections he promised us?

    As part of the trade deal. Are you not paying attention?

  128. 128.

    Kay

    May 13, 2015 at 2:48 pm

    @Cacti:

    Since no is allowed to talk about what it’s in the trade deal, can I assume the labor and enviromental protections aren’t actually in there since 45 Democrats are insisting on a package of legislation to put them in?

  129. 129.

    Cacti

    May 13, 2015 at 2:50 pm

    Update:

    Brown passes on apologizing to the POTUS when speaking to Andrea Mitchell, but says he “doesn’t want this to be personal”.

    I guess that qualifies as an “I’m sorry” in Senate-ese.

  130. 130.

    Steppan

    May 13, 2015 at 2:51 pm

    @Kay:

    Given the other powers that the TPP would be ceding to multinational corporations, I think it’s a very safe bet that any protections as written would be toothless or totally unenforced.

  131. 131.

    Cacti

    May 13, 2015 at 2:52 pm

    @Kay:

    Senator Brown is quite the busy guy, what with his new role of defending caucasian maidenhood from negro predation.

  132. 132.

    Kropadope

    May 13, 2015 at 2:52 pm

    @Kay: My understanding was that the trade deal is incomplete and that Congress doesn’t have a whole lot more information about it right now than anyone else. Too many cooks and all…

  133. 133.

    Steppan

    May 13, 2015 at 2:53 pm

    @Cacti:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jGQ-ISsDm8M

  134. 134.

    Belafon

    May 13, 2015 at 2:58 pm

    @Kay: I think what Obama was wanting was fast track authority (I can understand that, I’d rather have Congress just vote down a trade deal they don’t like rather than me, as President, have to renegotiate a trade deal because they’ve added amendments). If having those four attached would get him fast track, I suspect he’d go with them.

    Otherwise, like they’ve said, we don’t know what he’s been negotiating, because that’s what the executive branch does with negotiations.

    I have discovered a reason I’d vote against fast track authority. It wasn’t just for this, it was for the next six years.

  135. 135.

    Southern Beale

    May 13, 2015 at 2:59 pm

    So, in case this is an open thread … today in Libertarians finding out how Libertarianism works:

    An Iowa man says an oil company offered him the services of a “$1,200 teenage prostitute” if he agreed to let them run a crude oil pipeline through his land. Crude oil indeed.

    Hughie Tweedy told the Gazette that the company, Dakota Access (a subsidiary of a Texas firm called Energy Transfer Partners), thrice extended the offer of “the sexual services of a woman,” contingent on his agreeing to have a $3.8 billion Illinois-to-North-Dakota pipeline routed through his property.

    Tweedy, who identifies as a Libertarian, says he told Dakota Access that in addition to offering up the services of an underage hooker, the company’s representative had admitted to faking an archaeological study to get the state to approve the project.

    He claims he recorded his conversations with the alleged pimp, held over beers, but that his attorney has advised him not to play them for the media, so he can save them for a potential lawsuit.

    See, we don’t need no regulations. Just more freedom! So that free hand of the market can run unfettered and free to pimp underage girls to landowners who inconveniently stand in the way of progress.

  136. 136.

    Kay

    May 13, 2015 at 3:00 pm

    @Cacti:

    Obama’s going tio have to talk about the trade deal at some point, Cacti. The Politico piece says he went after Warren to provide “cover” for free trade Democrats. She was the designated Lefty they could all be to the Right of, which puts them in the Safe Center.

    Why do they need cover? If it’s such a great trade deal and trade deals are so hugely popular they shouldn’t be worried about that.

  137. 137.

    CONGRATULATIONS!

    May 13, 2015 at 3:01 pm

    It’s also worth noting, the Ds saying they can’t trust Obama to enforce environmental/labor protections he negotiates as part of the deal sounds an awful lot like Rs saying they can’t vote for comprehensive immigration reform.

    @Kropadope: The issue but not the issue. I trust him just fine. He would do it. I don’t trust the next president, who will be in office pretty damn soon, to do so.

  138. 138.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    May 13, 2015 at 3:02 pm

    So The Sarmt One says asking him about Iraq disrespects the troops. Is it possible he’s the opposite of his teflon-coasted brother and some of this will stick to him? Dare we dream…?

  139. 139.

    rk

    May 13, 2015 at 3:02 pm

    @David Fud:

    Glad things turned out O.K. This gives me the chills. This happened to my son who was going with his siblings to a neighbor’s pool. I told them to go ahead. I only took two minutes. He knew how to swim (I’d spent endless hours at swimming lessons), but he jumped into the deep end and I don’t know what happened, but he started going under. A bunch of kids were in the pool but paid no attention. Thankfully my neighbor saw him from inside her kitchen and ran and jumped in to the pool to save him. To this day I don’t know what happened, why he forgot to swim and instinct didn’t kick in but I’m so thankful to my neighbor. I don’t know if I could have lived with myself if anything had happened.

  140. 140.

    Cacti

    May 13, 2015 at 3:05 pm

    @Kay:

    If you pop over to the Afrosphere of the internet world, Kay, you might find that black Democrats are a bit less sanguine about Sherrod Brown calling the POTUS a sexist than you are.

    And considering that any Ohio Democrat depends on strong African American support to win any statewide office, Senator Brown might want to, you know, tread a little lightly in the near future with the personal insults toward the first black POTUS.

  141. 141.

    Kay

    May 13, 2015 at 3:05 pm

    @Belafon:

    I have discovered a reason I’d vote against fast track authority. It wasn’t just for this, it was for the next six years.

    That’s why it has to be talked about. McConnell was crowing yesterday that he was really voting for the next GOP President to have Fast Track.

    Perez at the Dept of Labor has been much more muted in his support. No big job claims, no promises of Most Progressive Ever. He supports the deal but he’s not making any promises, which given our track record with trade deals is what all free traders should do, IMO.

  142. 142.

    Kropadope

    May 13, 2015 at 3:06 pm

    @CONGRATULATIONS!: Well, I don’t think it’s helpful to avoid making new trade agreements with stronger protections because those protections might not be enforced. Even if the new president doesn’t enforce those protections, they would still be law and there would be some leverage to force that president to act.

    Even still, if we can’t force that president to act, having improved trade agreements in place would be a damn sight better than relying on our older, known-to be-majorly-flawed trade agreements.

  143. 143.

    Kay

    May 13, 2015 at 3:12 pm

    @Cacti:

    I told I don’t think he’s a sexist. I think he attacked Warren, personally, and he got as good as he gave.

    There’s no substance on his trade deal even in the piece where attacked Warren. It’s all mush about not looking backward and how the US must lead and his new definition of “progressive” on trade.

    Eventually they release the trade deal, Cacti. Maybe he should defend it on the merits. No one examined the 10k job claim he made, and that’s as much “nonsense” as anything Warren said. The same month he went to Nike they moved another facility out of the US.

  144. 144.

    Kropadope

    May 13, 2015 at 3:12 pm

    @Kay:

    That’s why it has to be talked about. McConnell was crowing yesterday that he was really voting for the next GOP President to have Fast Track.

    Considering that such trade agreements in the past have obtained fast-track authority and that Obama is requesting it for this one, doesn’t it stand to reason that this particular fast-track approval would *not* provide such approval for all future presidential trade negotiations in perpetuity?

    Also important, even with fast-track authority the agreement itself can be voted down, just not amended. Approving the fast-track doesn’t approve the deal.

  145. 145.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    May 13, 2015 at 3:14 pm

    @Kay: I think he attacked Warren, personally

    If that was a “personal attack”, I wouldn’t want Obama on my side during a bar fight. They disagree on an issue, fercrissake.

  146. 146.

    Cervantes

    May 13, 2015 at 3:16 pm

    @Kropadope:

    Where did you get “in perpetuity”?

  147. 147.

    Kropadope

    May 13, 2015 at 3:17 pm

    @Kay:

    I think he attacked Warren, personally

    I think it was pointed out in one of the articles that this is because he has been asked by the media about Warren, personally and repeatedly.

  148. 148.

    Kropadope

    May 13, 2015 at 3:20 pm

    @Cervantes: From the misplaced fear that providing fast-track authority for this trade deal would mean providing it to some unspecified future president, a fear for which Kay cited the known malicious liar, Mitch McConnell.

    Read, it does you good.

  149. 149.

    Cervantes

    May 13, 2015 at 3:30 pm

    @Kropadope:

    From the misplaced fear that providing fast-track authority for this trade deal would mean providing it to some unspecified future president, a fear for which Kay cited the known malicious liar, Mitch McConnell.

    You’re just blissfully unaware of the details, that’s all. The fast-track legislation being pushed in Congress bestows (among other things) “trade promotion authority” for the next six years (not quite “in perpetuity”).

    Read, it does you good.

    Really? You don’t say?

  150. 150.

    Laertes

    May 13, 2015 at 3:30 pm

    Is anyone else hearing “I feel like shit / and I am cranky” to the tune of “My name is Prince?”

  151. 151.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    May 13, 2015 at 3:33 pm

    are we actually, at long last, going to stumble into a discussion of the invasion of Iraq because Jeb Bush couldn’t stumble through an interview with Megan Kelly?

    Add Ohio Gov. Kasich (R) to the list of Republicans who say they wouldn’t have authorized an invasion of Iraq like then-President George W. Bush.
    “There’s a lot of people who lost limbs and lives over there, OK?” Kasich told The Columbus Dispatch on Tuesday. “But if the question is, if there were not weapons of mass destruction should we have gone, the answer would’ve been no.”
    Kasich went on to say he “wouldn’t have seen it as vital to national interests.”

  152. 152.

    Manyakitty

    May 13, 2015 at 3:33 pm

    @David Fud: So scary! Glad he’s okay!
    @Raven: Sounds like a solid measure of success!

  153. 153.

    raven

    May 13, 2015 at 3:35 pm

    Since ya’ll have been so nice. As I posted they found no cancer on the lesion. The ortho said “man, you’ve taken a beating”! However, there is a severed nerve in the finger and he’s going to reattach it in the morning. Meeting with him it seemed like no big deal but then the hospital called and they are going to put me under and then want it “elevated” so I think I’m back tom square one on the healing. It’s minor compared to the cancer and a cut nerve can cause problems so here we go!

  154. 154.

    Cacti

    May 13, 2015 at 3:35 pm

    Senate strikes deal to pass fast track trade authority.

    Link.

  155. 155.

    Brachiator

    May 13, 2015 at 3:41 pm

    @raven:

    As I posted they found no cancer on the lesion.

    This sounds like very good news. I hope things continue to go well for you.

  156. 156.

    Kay

    May 13, 2015 at 3:43 pm

    @Cacti:

    I’m sorry that labor protections were last on the list of Senate priorities. I hope they actually make it into the deal.

  157. 157.

    Kay

    May 13, 2015 at 3:49 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    I didn’t take offense at it. I think Obama went after Warren personally and then Sherrod Brown went after Obama personally. I said he got as good as he gave. I don’t how you say that someone is opposing something to “get their voice out there” is anything other than personal. Of course it is.

    He didn’t say he disagreed with her, either. He said she doesn’t know what she’s talking about. Those are two different things.

  158. 158.

    Cacti

    May 13, 2015 at 3:56 pm

    @Kay:

    I’m sorry that labor protections were last on the list of Senate priorities. I hope they actually make it into the deal.

    Take heart, Elizabeth Warren got to do some high quality combustible hair activity and solidified her status as queen of the netroots.

  159. 159.

    les

    May 13, 2015 at 3:57 pm

    @ranchandsyrup:
    I see Freddie still takes too long to say too little.

  160. 160.

    Mandalay

    May 13, 2015 at 3:59 pm

    Meanwhile, across the pond, re-elected Prime minister Cameron is doing something about that icky British penchant for tolerance:

    For too long, we have been a passively tolerant society, saying to our citizens: as long as you obey the law, we will leave you alone.

    There’s a chilling definition of big government in his words: even if you obey the law we won’t leave you alone.

  161. 161.

    Brachiator

    May 13, 2015 at 4:00 pm

    @Cervantes:

    The fast-track legislation being pushed in Congress bestows (among other things) “trade promotion authority” for the next six years (not quite “in perpetuity”).

    Is this necessarily a bad thing? It might mean that trade promotion authority would be available to a President Clinton.

  162. 162.

    Doug R

    May 13, 2015 at 4:06 pm

    @Villago Delenda Est: smartypants sets you straight :http://immasmartypants.blogspot.ca/2015/05/procedural-disapproval-resolution.html?m=1

  163. 163.

    les

    May 13, 2015 at 4:07 pm

    @Kropadope:

    Considering that such trade agreements in the past have obtained fast-track authority and that Obama is requesting it for this one, doesn’t it stand to reason that this particular fast-track approval would *not* provide such approval for all future presidential trade negotiations in perpetuity?

    Bill is 5 years, any trade deal in that window.

  164. 164.

    Doug R

    May 13, 2015 at 4:10 pm

    @Kropadope: Exactly

  165. 165.

    Kay

    May 13, 2015 at 4:32 pm

    @Cacti:

    That’s great Cacti. That’s not patronizing at all.

    Do you think the President will still go on his (planned) offensive against (certain) Democrats and labor? Why doesn’t he just go out and defend his trade deal on the merits? Because it’s not actually a job creation engine for the middle class and has little or nothing to do with jobs?

  166. 166.

    Germy Shoemangler

    May 13, 2015 at 4:35 pm

    @Mnemosyne (iPhone): If you watch the clip I linked to, there is a scene with Kermit sitting in his car. His eyes are red. He says “I’m always happy. Legally now.”

  167. 167.

    Kay

    May 13, 2015 at 4:41 pm

    The agreement gives Democrats a symbolic chance to show support for a get-tough approach to countries that keep the value of their currency intentionally low to make their exports cheaper and to raise the cost of American goods. But if that separate bill can get through the House, it would then be vetoed by the president, who believes it would blow up trade talks.

    So much for those high-priority “middle class jobs”.

    Oh well. Maybe Democrats can talk about raising the minimum wage for another decade. Surely by then we’ll all have felt the trickle-down effects of this trade deal.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/14/us/path-to-pacific-trade-deal-may-open-in-senate-after-all.html

  168. 168.

    Jimgod

    May 13, 2015 at 4:43 pm

    @Kay: I have noticed throughout this debate that the Obama supporters are really upping their anti-Warren statements, how she’s just a hysterical leftist, grand-stander, etc. It’s disturbing to read on many levels. Is it at all possible to disagree with this President, and even, gasp, criticize him on policy, without certain of his supporters immediately implying that we’re unreasonable leftists who hate trade and competition?

  169. 169.

    ranchandsyrup

    May 13, 2015 at 4:44 pm

    @les: Heh indeedy.

  170. 170.

    raven

    May 13, 2015 at 4:48 pm

    @Jimgod: Oh whatever.

  171. 171.

    Kay

    May 13, 2015 at 4:57 pm

    @Jimgod:

    I just think it’s terrible that the President intends to vetoe the one part of this thing that might actually save a middle class job.

    I don’t know why free traders oversell these things. They should probably stop telling people there will be hundreds of thousands of jobs. The 500 lobbyists that drafted this thing want new rules for 60 multinational corporations and maybe they’ll throw in some unenforceable labor protections? Just say so. It would be easier. We all know they’re getting everything they want anyway.

  172. 172.

    singfoom

    May 13, 2015 at 4:58 pm

    We have an idea of what is in the deal: https://wikileaks.org/tpp/

    It is not good.

    @Doug R: The idea of a procedural disapproval resolution after the fact is interesting, but I have little hope that Congress would actually use that. After skimming through the part of the bill about the procedural disapproval resolution, they’d get sent to Finance or House Ways and Means and could be killed there.

    Direct link to bill: http://www.finance.senate.gov/download/?id=FEC41212-F7AF-4A6D-BF83-978401999DAF

    Sure, it’s better than nothing, but I’m not so sure that it’s the escape hatch described. Better to not pass a bad trade deal in the first place, IMHO.

  173. 173.

    Goblue72

    May 13, 2015 at 4:59 pm

    @Cacti: you see that end over there? That’s the deep end. You’ve gone totally over it.

  174. 174.

    Brachiator

    May 13, 2015 at 5:03 pm

    @Jimgod:

    I have noticed throughout this debate that the Obama supporters are really upping their anti-Warren statements, how she’s just a hysterical leftist, grand-stander, etc.

    I have generally supported the president here, and too strong a supporter for some commenters’ taste. But I have never written a single post attacking or criticizing Senator Warren over this issue. And as I noted in one of my first posts, some Democrats opposed Obama on this at least as far back as February 2014, headed by then majority leader Harry Reid. I don’t see any point in bashing Warren over this or singling her out for special criticism.

    And for now I will even give a pass to unreasonable leftists.

    Also, keep in mind that this is the Internet, where commentary almost inevitably turns rancid. Almost no one is exempt from this.

    Not even unreasonable leftists.

  175. 175.

    Myiq2xu

    May 13, 2015 at 5:04 pm

    I got a stiff neck

    What else is new?

  176. 176.

    Aleta

    May 13, 2015 at 5:04 pm

    @JohnCole

    These pillows work well for a stiff neck. You scrunch the filling around to put some support under your neck and some under your head. Amazing difference.

  177. 177.

    Plantsmantx

    May 13, 2015 at 5:09 pm

    @Cacti: It’s kind of hard to be as upset about Sherrod Brown accusing the President of being “sexist” toward Sen. Warren when someone reacts to it like this:

    Allan Brauer
    ‏@allanbrauer
    Democrats are giving President Obama the full Emmett Till treatment over Elizabeth Warren. Good luck in 2016!

  178. 178.

    Kay

    May 13, 2015 at 5:31 pm

    @Cacti:

    President Obama said he would not sign a trade deal without “rigorous” protections for labor

    So we shouldn’t need Elizabeth Warren at all, right? If those aren’t in there I’ll know exactly who is responsible.

  179. 179.

    Cacti

    May 13, 2015 at 5:35 pm

    @Kay:

    That’s great Cacti. That’s not patronizing at all.

    Do you think the President will still go on his (planned) offensive against (certain) Democrats and labor? Why doesn’t he just go out and defend his trade deal on the merits? Because it’s not actually a job creation engine for the middle class and has little or nothing to do with jobs?

    Well, at least I didn’t call her Elizabeth, that would have been beyond the pale.

    While we’re at it, what exactly has her royal highness of internet progressive purity done that gets her such high marks with the political blog crowd? She certainly talks a good game, but what progressive policy goods has she actually delivered.

    The POTUS can point to healthcare reform, the Lilly Ledbetter Act, the end of DADT and DOMA, and so on. But he’s less trustworthy on progressive issues than a 1st term Senator who it took till the tender age of 46 to rethink being a Republican?

    Wevs.

  180. 180.

    Cacti

    May 13, 2015 at 5:39 pm

    @Plantsmantx:

    It’s kind of hard to be as upset about Sherrod Brown accusing the President of being “sexist” toward Sen. Warren when someone reacts to it like this:

    I know, right? White people are always the real victims.

    Reverse racism!

  181. 181.

    singfoom

    May 13, 2015 at 5:41 pm

    Why is it a pissing match over the personalities involved? Read the leaked version of the trade deal. Jesus. It’s not good for American workers. It’s good for multinational corporations. That’s who wrote this trade deal, that’s who is pushing this trade deal, that’s who benefits from this trade deal.

    Argue something on the merits of policy? Aw fuck it, let’s just line up behind personality A or personality B and slug it out. Fuck.

  182. 182.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    May 13, 2015 at 5:43 pm

    I haven’t attacked Warren. I tend to agree with her side in the argument. I just don’t see what Obama said as a “personal attack”, or an attack at all; I thought his word choice was vintage Obama, mild and measured. The only person acting hysterically as far as I can see, the only person who “made it personal” is Sherrod Brown, who is my dream presidential candidate.

    One of my biggest critiques of the MSM is the way “attack” and its fellow traveller “demonised” have been defined down. Again, they disagree. Not a big deal.

  183. 183.

    Plantsmantx

    May 13, 2015 at 5:49 pm

    @Cacti:

    What?

  184. 184.

    Germy Shoemangler

    May 13, 2015 at 5:53 pm

    @Cacti:

    She certainly talks a good game, but what progressive policy goods has she actually delivered?

    Here is a recent profile of her.

    “I think she’s doing exactly the right thing,” Barney Frank, the former congressman from Massachusetts, told me recently, referring to Warren. “Right now, she’s as powerful a spokesperson on public policy as you could be in the minority.” Frank worked closely with Warren in the House on financial-reform legislation to curb the power of banks. “She has an absolute veto over certain public-policy issues, because Democrats are not going to cross her. And if she were to even hint at being a candidate that would be over.” He added, “Democrats are afraid of Elizabeth Warren. No Democrat wants Elizabeth Warren being critical of him.”

    The first Obama nominee she helped scuttle was Larry Summers, whom Obama considered nominating as Fed chairman. She collaborated with her old friend Camden Fine. “She and I worked pretty closely together to torpedo Larry Summers,” Fine said, recalling a secret campaign they undertook. In the spring of 2013, Fine told the Administration that his organization was going to publicly oppose Summers as chairman. It would have been the first time in the group’s nearly hundred-year history that it took a position on a Fed chairman. Fine couldn’t believe that Obama was going to pass up the opportunity to nominate Janet Yellen, who would be the first female chair of the Fed. He e-mailed Warren with the question “Really?” Warren e-mailed back and said she felt the same way. “She was also communicating with the White House and telling them that she wasn’t happy,” he said.

  185. 185.

    Kay

    May 13, 2015 at 5:58 pm

    @Cacti:

    I wasn’t a huge supporter of Elizabeth Warren. You originally went after Sherrod Brown. I am a supporter of his. Should we talk about his liftetime work in government?

    You’re just wrong about this, Cacti. Obama met with PRO TRADE Democrats today to get this deal and they wanted currency manipulation in there. Obama sided with McConnell. Again. No currency.

    You can portray this as “white progressive Democrats” all you want. The President is courting Republicans to get this passed, and he hasn’t advanced a single Democratic priority. They;re not even getting the “centrist” priorities. There’s nothing “progressive: about this deal. Obama’s not just to the Right of Warren on this- he’s to the Right of Wyden and the rest of the free trade crowd.

    You know, I could stand it if he hadn’t have felt it neccesary go out and crow about “jobs”. There aren”t going to be any jobs. Even the Peterson Institute admits it’s zero net gain, This deal will have no benefits for “ordinary Americans” and the very least the free trade crowd could is admit that. It may not HARM ordinary Americans but the idea that it is ABOUT them is a crock.

  186. 186.

    Cacti

    May 13, 2015 at 6:07 pm

    @Kay:

    I wasn’t a huge supporter of Elizabeth Warren. You originally went after Sherrod Brown. I am a supporter of his. Should we talk about his liftetime work in government?

    Your guy went the gutter route Kay. Now he says he doesn’t want it to be personal.

    Easy solution to that. Don’t make it personal in the first place.

    In case he’s forgotten, his margin of victory in 2012 was 6%. African Americans were about 15% of the vote in Ohio, with about 95% of them voting Dem.

    Tread lightly, Senator Brown.

  187. 187.

    Plantsmantx

    May 13, 2015 at 6:29 pm

    @Cacti:

    I don’t think the black electorate is going to refuse to vote for the Democratic Presidential candidate in 2016 because Sherrod Brown accused Barack Obama of being sexist toward Elizabeth Warren. Anyone who believes that believes the black electorate is stupid.

  188. 188.

    J R in WV

    May 13, 2015 at 6:40 pm

    @Amir Khalid:

    Amir,

    Once my dad had cataract surgery, his vision (which was extremely nearsighted, 20/600 or so) improved to 20/25 or so. He no longer needed glasses to drive or his other normal activities, for the first time in his life.

    The surgeon’s staff spent quite a while examining his eyes, and selecting specific lens implants to correct his vision. That took 3 or 4 hours, and the actual surgery was much briefer, 2 hours tops.

    2 or 3 days later he bought plain old Ray-Ban sunglasses for the first time in his life.

    So don’t hold back, ask the Dr. if you may expect the same outcome. Of course if your vision is already perfect, just tell me to go away!

    Everyone, best of luck. I just had to rescue the Mrs J who had fallen into a ladder on the ground, was tangled and trapped. No harm done, just scared from being trapped. Be careful out there folks, danger is everywhere!

  189. 189.

    chopper

    May 13, 2015 at 7:04 pm

    @Plantsmantx:

    I don’t think the black electorate is going to refuse to vote for the Democratic Presidential candidate in 2016 because Sherrod Brown accused Barack Obama of being sexist toward Elizabeth Warren.

    good thing cacti didn’t make that argument then.

  190. 190.

    Kay

    May 13, 2015 at 7:07 pm

    @Cacti:

    We’ll see if President Obama and Mitch McConnell make good on those promised “progressive priorities”, Cacti.

    The President assured us repeatedly they’re in the deal and anyone who said differently didn’t know what they were talking about. I’d worry more about that for 2016 than anything Sherrod Brown said.

  191. 191.

    Corner Stone

    May 13, 2015 at 7:31 pm

    @chopper: The fuck he didn’t.
    Who do you think he was threatening? Brown isn’t up again until 2018.

  192. 192.

    chopper

    May 13, 2015 at 7:38 pm

    @Corner Stone:

    so why did he being up brown’s margin of victory in ohio in 2012 when he warned him about the aftermath of upsetting black voters?

  193. 193.

    chopper

    May 13, 2015 at 7:41 pm

    @Corner Stone:

    or do you think in post 140:

    And considering that any Ohio Democrat depends on strong African American support to win any statewide office, Senator Brown might want to, you know, tread a little lightly in the near future with the personal insults toward the first black POTUS.

    cacti was referring to hills there?

    seems pretty fuckin clear he was talking about brown.

  194. 194.

    Corner Stone

    May 13, 2015 at 7:41 pm

    @chopper: They’re going to grudge vote (non-vote) three years from now to teach him a lesson about one comment related to one trade bill that’s going to pass anyway?
    Ok, if that’s what he meant then I retract my statement and will agree with PlantmanTX that Cacti has an incredibly poor opinion of black voters in Ohio.

  195. 195.

    chopper

    May 13, 2015 at 7:51 pm

    @Corner Stone:

    not likely. but brown isn’t doing himself any favors with black voters by talking trash about obama. and brown didn’t exactly have an easy election last time.

    i think that’s what cacti was getting at.

  196. 196.

    Corner Stone

    May 13, 2015 at 8:06 pm

    @Doug R: As much chance of that measure being enacted as my being in a Salma Hayek / Tamron Hall pr0no.

  197. 197.

    SuperHrefna

    May 13, 2015 at 8:28 pm

    @raven: I’m so, so glad they can reattach your nerve. I severed a nerve in my knee once, it healed badly ( neuromas are no fun) and was just generally a huge bother. Good luck for the procedure and mind you let it heal up properly! Physical therapy is awesome.

  198. 198.

    Plantsmantx

    May 13, 2015 at 9:11 pm

    @chopper:
    I don’t think Ohio’s black electorate is going to refuse to vote for the Democratic senatorial candidate in Ohio in 2016 because Sherrod Brown accused Barack Obama of being sexist toward Elizabeth Warren. Anyone who believes that believes Ohio’s black electorate is stupid.

  199. 199.

    chopper

    May 13, 2015 at 9:36 pm

    @Plantsmantx:

    good on you for reading his post this time.

    anyhoo, 2018 is going to be a brutal election for brown. i think he’ll pull it off but it’s gonna be hard as all shit. not just a midterm with shitty dem turnout but also a dem WH’s first midterm (think 2010) plus expect the GOP to throw epic money against him, even more than last time.

    brown needs to be thinking, even this early on, about what helps him with his voters rather than coming up with dumb reasons to antagonize them.

    surely it would have been dumber to say what he did in an election year. but it still wasn’t too smart.

    with that said, fuck the TPP.

  200. 200.

    Corner Stone

    May 13, 2015 at 9:58 pm

    @chopper:

    brown needs to be thinking, even this early on, about what helps him with his voters rather than coming up with dumb reasons to antagonize them.

    Maybe he was. Consider who his voters are and what they think of the TPP.

  201. 201.

    Betty Cracker

    May 13, 2015 at 10:07 pm

    @chopper:

    …not just a midterm with shitty dem turnout but also a dem WH’s first midterm…

    From your keyboard to God’s screen! (The Dem WH, I mean, not the shitty turnout.)

  202. 202.

    Plantsmantx

    May 13, 2015 at 10:18 pm

    @chopper:

    I read it the first time, and I read it as making the same threat as that insane Twitter “obot” who equated Obama being accused of being sexist with the kidnapping, murder and mutilation of a 14-year-old boy.

  203. 203.

    chopper

    May 13, 2015 at 10:30 pm

    @Plantsmantx:

    well that’s just silly to do that.

  204. 204.

    Cervantes

    May 13, 2015 at 10:35 pm

    @Calouste:

    Thanks, but the excerpt is incorrect. The last bit, where an actual Vatican official is quoted, shows how the preceding confusion arises.

  205. 205.

    Cervantes

    May 13, 2015 at 10:42 pm

    @Brachiator:

    Wasn’t commenting on the merits there. Just responding to someone’s (disingenuous?) suggestion that certain people are opposing “fast track” because they think mistakenly that it would provide “approval for all future presidential trade negotiations in perpetuity” (whereas no one thinks that).

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