Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Nothing worth doing is easy.

I’m sure you banged some questionable people yourself. We’re allowed to grow past that.

Oh FFS you might as well trust a 6-year-old with a flamethrower.

My right to basic bodily autonomy is not on the table. that’s the new deal.

Republicans do not pay their debts.

Authoritarian republicans are opposed to freedom for the rest of us.

I’d hate to be the candidate who lost to this guy.

You’re just a puppy masquerading as an old coot.

Too often we confuse noise with substance. too often we confuse setbacks with defeat.

I wonder if trump will be tried as an adult.

Their freedom requires your slavery.

Republicans choose power over democracy, every day.

Everyone is in a bubble, but some bubbles model reality far better than others!

Why is it so hard for them to condemn hate?

Come on, man.

The next time the wall street journal editorial board speaks the truth will be the first.

Republicans are the party of chaos and catastrophe.

Celebrate the fucking wins.

You cannot shame the shameless.

It’s always darkest before the other shoe drops.

We are aware of all internet traditions.

It looks like winning debates is a black job!

You can’t attract Republican voters. You can only out organize them.

If you still can’t see these things even now, maybe politics isn’t your forte and you should stop writing about it.

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53Comments

  3. 3.

    TriassicSands

    I have it on good authority (friends in the biz) that it’s Louis CK. I’ve heard stories about his propensity for whipping it out and jerking off in front of women at inappropriate times (i.e. dinner table, bar, etc.).

    I’m having a really hard time figuring out when exactly it would be “appropriate” to do that.

  5. 5.

    SiubhanDuinne

    I think (would have to look it up to confirm) that SNL went on the air in the fall of 1975. I know it was early days then, if not the first season. Reason I remember, my mother died in late October 1975. It so happened she died the same day (and at the same age, 58) as her (and my) favorite animal at Brookfield Zoo, the elephant Ziggy. And somehow that’s all tied up in my mind with this totally new show on NBC the Saturday night of the worst weekend of my life.

  9. 9.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Valdivia:

    I will accept the hugs, gratefully, but it was not my intention to bring you or anyone to tears! It’s just that I have this strange confluence of emotional memories, and because of that, I’ve never really been able to give SNL the credit it deserves.

  12. 12.

    Mnemosyne

    If you read the comments at Gawker, the extra creepy thing is that this is apparently a common thing for female comedians to be subjected to — several commenters say that it has not only happened to them, but that several different male comedians did it. WTF is wrong with these assholes?

  13. 13.

    Valdivia

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    no worries, I was moved by it. More important the hug impulse than anything else.
    I understand perfectly what you meant too since there is a song that is in mind forever associated with my brother’s passing, only because I was obsessively listening to it at the time.

  15. 15.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Valdivia:

    I hear you, my twin. It’s fascinating the way songs, smells, TV programs, who knows what, get all baked in with our most profound and emotional moments. I’m sure Chevy Chase would be appalled if he knew why I have such a visceral negative reaction to him; I expect he’s actually a very nice man, but in my life, his timing sucks.

    Hugs are always welcome. I send them back to you.

  18. 18.

    Valdivia

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    I was thinking parallel to this with regards to Browning and Donne in the previous thread. How things become associated, grouped, in our minds. The emotive tissue is sometimes obvious to us, sometimes not.
    Thanks for the hugs, twin :)

  19. 19.

    Ruckus

    @Mnemosyne:
    I believe that I read somewhere a while ago that a lot of male comedians really are shy, introverts. That stand up gives them an outlet to be in public. And being a stand up can be an empowering thing, most clubs you can be a bit of an asshole and the crowd will eat it up, especially if there are hecklers. I assume then this can become, to them, an accepted way of coming out of their shell, of acting out to other people for attention. Of course this could all be crap.

  20. 20.

    Mnemosyne

    @Ruckus:

    I’ve heard that a lot of comedians consider comedy to be an aggressive act, and it’s not uncommon for comedians to be very aggressive people. Add in the fact that a lot of male comedians seem to think that female comedians shouldn’t exist, and this is the kind of behavior you get.

  22. 22.

    fuckwit

    @Mnemosyne: They get up on stage and masturbate in front of people for money all the time. It’s part of the job. Except, the crowd is there willingly, and paying, of course, in that situation.

  23. 23.

    The Sailor

    I’m having a completely inappropriate response to a friend dying.
    I want to punch all the walls.

  24. 24.

    Brachiator

    @Ruckus: Hecklers are the assholes, not the comedians. In interviews and conversation, comedians hate having to deal with hecklers, even though heckling put downs have to be developed as part of the act.

    Apart from this, I agree that comedians can be introverts, but I always find it interesting how much language about comedy acts deal with killing or slaying the audience. It is clearly metaphoric and hatred is not intended, but a sense of mastery, transforming indifference and hostility into ecstasy.

  25. 25.

    Mnemosyne

    @Brachiator:

    It is clearly metaphoric and hatred is not intended, but a sense of mastery, transforming indifference and hostility into ecstasy.

    That’s also a common fantasy that rapists have — sure, she says she doesn’t want it, but he’ll be so great that he’ll win her over.

  26. 26.

    Mnemosyne

    @The Sailor:

    I’m so sorry. I would strongly suggest punching couches or mattresses instead so you don’t break your hand, but if there’s no one around who would be frightened and you can do it without hurting yourself, I say punch away.

  27. 27.

    ruemara

    @The Sailor: I’m sorry. I know punching the walls sounds good, but, it won’t bring him/her back and it will mess up your hand. Like Mem said, punch some pillows or a mattress. instead.

  28. 28.

    Brachiator

    @Mnemosyne: No, no,no. With comedy, singing, and other types of performance, the audience is willingly delivering themselves to the comedian. But there is a challenge to the performer to make the audience laugh. There is an element of the sexual here, but it is distinctly public and consensual.

    You see this clearly in the vaudeville and British music hall tradition, where favorite performers are rewarded with love and adulation. Also in opera to some degree. This may go back to all stage performance, beginning with the Greeks.

    And the stage, the space between performer and audience, provides distance and boundary. The whole point is to touch your audience without touching them. But the audience clearly want to be there.

  30. 30.

    Ruckus

    @Brachiator:
    Well, it’s a small sampling but I’ve been to a number of comedy clubs and some guys did far more than put down the heckler. And not all the hecklers were assholes either. Some were just having fun and playing off the act. It was a noticeable thing when the response to a heckler went too far. The entire room would go silent. If I had seen it only one time it would not have made as much an impression on me but it was often enough to notice a trend. Of course not all comics were this way, some responded to hecklers without losing a beat and made it part of the act. That usually shut the heckler up much better than the angry guys. And made a much better show.

  31. 31.

    Mnemosyne (tablet)

    @Brachiator:

    No one is saying that Louis CK or any other male comedian touched them, only that they “performed” a solo act that they were forced to watch. I think the parallel is much closer than you seem to realize.

  32. 32.

    Ruckus

    @The Sailor:
    Wanting to punch the walls is not all that inappropriate, anger at a death is common. What is inappropriate is actually hitting the wall and hurting yourself. Call a help line if you need to. Talking to someone, letting the anger dissipate can work wonders. Are you a vet? The VA has a help line 800-273-8255.
    ETA Decades ago I worked on a help line for over 3 yrs and the number of people who really had no one to talk to was amazing. The things that a trained stranger can hear and help with can be very helpful.

  33. 33.

    Brachiator

    @Ruckus: There are some very good podcasts featuring comedians talking about their craft. Hecklers are an occupational hazard, but comedians do not like this. Nobody paid to see the hecklers and they interrupt the performance. Hecklers think they are adding to the fun, but they aren’t. And bad comedians might use a heckling as a crutch to distract from bad material in a comedy set.

    One podcast episode did discuss a comic who went too far and too hostile in dealing with a heckler and just lost the audience. This is always the fear, losing the audience. That and a heckler who might get violent. And even making a heckler look foolish might cause distress to a date or friends with the heckler.

  34. 34.

    Brachiator

    @Ruckus: There are some very good podcasts featuring comedians talking about their craft. Hecklers are an occupational hazard, but comedians do not like this. Nobody paid to see the hecklers and they interrupt the performance. Hecklers think they are adding to the fun, but they aren’t. And bad comedians might use a heckling as a crutch to distract from bad material in a comedy set.

    One podcast episode did discuss a comic who went too far and too hostile in dealing with a heckler and just lost the audience. This is always the fear, losing the audience. That and a heckler who might get violent. And even making a heckler look foolish might cause distress to a date or friends with the heckler.

    Carp. Getting comment publish fail message.

  36. 36.

    Brachiator

    @Mnemosyne (tablet): I don’t think the parallel was there at all, nor was I even attempting to allude to the Louis CK thing at all. But the dynamics of comedy or singing performance are very different . For example, nobody sane buys a ticket and then claims that they were forced to watch a performer. And the performer rightly assumes that the audience is there for him. There is a defined and consensual relationship. I honestly don’t see how this can be disputed.

    The other situation is different and perverts and crosses boundaries, and here we can consider some similarities. The pervert who exposes himself or publicly finish might feel that the observer wants this, but his compulsion must ignore any real negative reaction. And these people probably would be afraid of or reject an actual invitation to a physical encounter. But even here, any claim that the victim wanted this is a lie, and the pervert probably knows this. What remains is a perverted need to perform, to act out.

    But a normal comedian or singer may crave attention and want to perform, but they cultivate an act because they also want the real voluntary consensual adulation.

    As an aside, if the comedian blocked the door and forced the women to watch him, the restraint would be a criminal act most everywhere. A person would have to be delusional to claim this was consensual.

    Lastly, there is a part of the alleged Louis CK thing which is sad and typical. The agent or manager and publicist may be running interference and abetting this thing. I hate this stuff, in show business or politics or anywhere else. This is not just some pervert claiming that the woman wanted it, but a criminal conspiracy to protect a meal ticket.

  40. 40.

    Wally Ballou

    @Chet: Curt Gowdy promotes the first SNL episode during a pitching change in Game 1 of the 1975 World Series. Notice it was originally called “NBC’s Saturday Night”. That’s because at that time there was already a comedy show called “Saturday Night Live” (hosted by, of all people, Howard Cosell) over on ABC.

  41. 41.

    Bystander

    There’s something very touching about Louis CK’s behavior but I just can’t put my finger on it.

    I hate hearing stories like this about people I like, like LCK, and even people I don’t particularly care for but have some vague investment in, like Anthony Weiner. OTOH, I love stories like this about repubs and their 18 year old interns. And I freely admit it.

  42. 42.

    Joel

    CK on Mark Maron’s podcast was revelatory to me. Not even really a fan of his bit, but he’s an interesting dude. Sad to hear about these allegations.

  43. 43.

    MBunge

    I have no idea if there’s any truth to the allegations against LCK but I do find it amusing how often “sophisticated” fans of transgressive performers are in denial about stuff like this.

    Mike

  44. 44.

    beth

    I thought his SNL opening monologue last night got really creepy. Pedophile jokes just leave me cold.

  45. 45.

    Kevin

    There’s this “white frat boy” humour that has taken over recently that I just can’t stand. SNL, Jimmy Fallon…it’s everywhere. It just doesn’t do anything for me. There’s no edge to any of this crap “just don’t offend” seems to be the mantra of it. I think the Lip Synching show that Fallon created is the worst of it. Is that funny? Am I missing something?

  46. 46.

    J R in WV

    When SNL was young, it was great. Transgressively funny in a creative and funny way, not in a “whip it out and jerk it” way at all. Although they were willing to make sexy-ish jokes at times. We would laugh until we cried almost.

    We were all working nights at the time, so a show that started at 11:30 was just the right time, we were usually getting off then, and Saturday was the common day off for all of us. We worked at a daily newspaper, an AM paper, so presses rolled around midnight, so between 11 and 12 was final proofing, something no one does any more.

    I’ve never seen LouisCK other than in tiny bits, but I’m sorry to hear he’s got cosby issues. I think if he tried that in front of some women he would wind up injured! As in kicked in the family jewels, hard. Without notice. As it should be, perhaps…

    How did John get “big footed”…?

  47. 47.

    kc

    Louis Ck doesn’t strike me as being especially funny. Maybe I just haven’t seen him at his best.

  48. 48.

    Mnemosyne (tablet)

    @Brachiator:

    Just to be clear, I’m not saying that you’re defending the behavior, at all. It’s more that I can see parallels between the mentality of wanting to “kill” or “slay” the audience and the mentality of forcing women to watch you “perform.” They’re both quite aggressive acts, and I can see a certain kind of person blurring that line in his own mind.

  49. 49.

    Doug R

    Louis CK was pretty good. Turned it off after that rapey kidnappy Rihanna song. WTF?

  51. 51.

    Cervantes

    @Mnemosyne (tablet):

    For what it’s worth: “to slay X” and “to kill X,” in the sense of “to convulse X with laughter,” have been used since the Middle Ages.

  52. 52.

    Ruckus

    @The Sailor:
    Crying is good too.
    I used to say whatever gets you through the day but some people have no filter, no safety limits and whatever can end up being bad.
    It’s a loss and that hurts. It takes time for the pain to dissipate, to come up from that low. Let it is about the best thing I know to do.

  53. 53.

    shawn

    Everybody thinks “their” SNL was the funniest. You can almost (but not always) guess somebody’s age by asking them what their favorite cast was. Usually it is the one that was around when they were @13-18 years old and they think the show went downhill from there. Personally I have found every cast since I started (Hartman, Carvey, Miller, Nealon, Hooks, Jackson) funny, but I can’t stand watching older seasons, and I am pretty well versed in comedy.

    To CK allegations, I really hope not but performers can be sociopaths – their acts live by different rules and being a celebrity and being rich put them under even more different rules. I would honestly be floored if that story was not at the very least taken out of context (like he did it in a hotel room with a woman who was there willingly and also naked and then told the story a certain way and then that person told it a slightly different way – total speculation on my part – I have no actual information) – put through the giant adult game of telephone that is the world of comedy and celebrity and come out as we read it here. Maybe I am bending over backwards to understand, but a lot of people probably heard it and took it as full on Gospel. If it is true, geesh that sucks and is sad.

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