Is this all part of the script?
"@timjcam: @megynkelly @FrankLuntz @realDonaldTrump Fox viewers give low marks to bimbo @MegynKelly will consider other programs!"
— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) August 7, 2015
Or is the monster Fox News built rampaging through Murdoch-Ailes Castle to destroy his creators? Will Kelly and/or her colleagues call Trump out for retweeting the “bimbo” comment and the other abuse he’s been gleefully shoveling their way since the debate wrapped up?
If so, Trump will just bray about political correctness again, and Fox viewers will lap it up thanks to the decades Fox spent cultivating wingnut butt-hurt over not being able to call women bimbos and sluts with impunity anymore (along with slurs against minorities, of course). Fox & Friends better bundle up; I hear the North Pole is pretty damn chilly, even this time of year.
Mike J
JPL
Has anyone watched Fox News today, to see how they are handling the Trump tweets?
WereBear
@JPL: Why should they handle it? Don’t they ignore actual news they don’t like?
beltane
The Donald has been The Donald from waaay before Fox News was a gleam in Rupert Murdoch’s eye.
Judging from what I’ve seen on Twitter, the consensus among the Republican faithful is that Megyn Kelly had it coming to her.
Col. Klink
I honestly cannot remember an “It’s alive!” moment I have enjoyed watching as much as this. Please don’t let that man jump the shark before New Hampshire…
KG
@beltane: I just checked the Spectator blog’s wrap up and ventured into the comments (because I NEVER LEARN!), and blaming Kelly seems to be where they’re going… one actually said “she needs to be knocked down a peg or two.” So, she’s apparently UPPITY!
Linda Featheringill
I’m all in favor of Trump as the GOP candidate.
srv
I cannot imagine any objective person watching that debate to have missed the moderators (and presumably Ailes) machinations.
Attack Trump, attack Walker, pump up Jeb, and softball Rubio as a backup.
It is a sad state when all of the MSM has the same agenda.
beltane
To quote a line from Wolf Hall, “Those who have been made can be unmade.”
Well, guess what? Donald Trump has not been made, at least not by Murdoch and Ailes. I have no idea how they put a stop to this.
CONGRATULATIONS!
I have never, before last night, seen a “debate” where the moderators were so clearly trying to take one guy out of the race right then and there.
It failed badly. And I think their golden boy, John Ellis Bush the Failure, managed to torpedo his prospects right then and there. Either he’s staggeringly inept at campaigning or he just doesn’t want to win this (I suspect the second). He was awful.
But anyway, Fox built this audience and Trump is giving them what they want, better than anyone else by far. Red meat, all the time. And I could not believe he managed to save the question about his bankruptcies. Turned that around on Wallace and threw in a nice nugget of populist hatred about banks and lending on top. The guy knows TV and knows Republicans better than Fox.
Trump made Fox News look like shit last night. He’s already made the GOP look like the lunatic party. That’s a fucking win for everyone in the country, save for Fox.
Monster destroys Village. Film at 11.
ETA:
@beltane: Not at all surprising from the party of legitimate rape.
Amir Khalid
I didn’t see the debates, of course. But I gather that Trump has not just won a debate; he has also shown that there is no force in the Republican party that can shame him into eating his words — not even his threat to run as an independent candidate. I don’t think I’ve ever seen a US presidential election cycle where a candidate had his party by the balls like this.
beltane
This reminds me of high school, of those moments just as a food fight is about to erupt in the cafeteria when the staff is giving signs of having lost all control.
WereBear
@Linda Featheringill: Me too. It would be the most truthful thing they have done since 1932.
beltane
@CONGRATULATIONS!: Republicans sincerely believe that the only proper position for a woman is legs open/mouth shut.
Jeffro
I think the air’s going to start trickling out of the Trump balloon pretty steadily between now and Thanksgiving, going down by 2-3% per week. He doesn’t look good when in direct comparison to the rest of the field and oh my goodness did I just really say that??
It’s been fun watching him but I almost want the dumb stuff over, so that Dems will realize just how deadly serious Walker, Rubio, Cruz, etc really are about taking this country down some very dark paths. Still can’t believe that to a man, they all were ok with “no abortion, no exceptions”. Wow – o – wow.
Gin & Tonic
@Amir Khalid: where a candidate had his party by the balls like this
I don’t think it “his party” in any traditional sense. He’s never run for any other office on the R ticket, he doesn’t need the money or support of the RNC, he can just say “I’m a Republican” and however much Prince Rebus wants to say “no, you’re not” – he can’t.
Jeffro
@srv: @CONGRATULATIONS!: I really didn’t think they (Fox in general or the moderators specifically) were all that helpful towards Jeb. Kaisch, yes (most definitely). And they went light on Rubio & Walker imho.
Mandalay
Seven different (non-scientific) self-voting polls all have Trump getting about half of all votes after last night’s debate.
Those consistently at the bottom in all of those polls: Bush, Christie, Walker.
Reince Priebus must be crapping his pants.
FlipYrWhig
@Jeffro: I honestly can’t believe they still want to emote about abortion for the 36th consecutive year. Get some new material.
bemused
The GOP has only itself to blame for the rise of Trumpism. They have heavily encouraged, courted and moneyed their baser base for years and then are stunned that the teaparty, lunatic legislators refuse to fall in line. How did they not see this coming?
Josie
Fox is not the only group in on the fix. MSNBC commentors were pushing Rubio and Kasich big time last night. Since I did not see the debate, I don’t know how well they actually did, but I’m hearing that Rubio in particular got softball questions. Was CNN similarly “helping” Rubio?
Patrick in Michigan
On topic: I agree trump bombed badly. See here, please: thoughtsandrantings.com/2015/08/07/my-thoughts-on-the-fox-debate/
Off topic: I see you John Cole is using hosting matters. I love them. Been using them for a few years now. Fantastic service! :D
-Pat
cmorenc
Fox’s main response to dealing with the Donald-monster they’ve fostered will be MOAR HILLARY CLINTON EMAIL SCANDAL, but since they’ll still be forced to intermittently show clips about Trump, they’ll adopt the same technique they use when showing any clips of Obama, Hillary, Reid, et. al – they’ll embed at least an unpleasant sandspur, if not a shiv in the caption or “fair and balanced” presentation (my ass). All the while pretending to presenting it to viewers so “you decide” (how much an a deceptively manipulative incompetent or insufferable jackass is this person?)
Of course, you may object: “what Clinton email scandal – that’s a red-herring mountain Fox and the GOP are trying to make out of an anthill”. Nevertheless, the focus here is on Fox’s tactics, not their accuracy or truthfulness.
CONGRATULATIONS!
@Gin & Tonic: I was quite surprised to find out a few years back that there is no way to “fire” someone from a political party. If you register as a Democrat, you are a Democrat even if you believe that dismantling the entire government and jailing women during pregnancy for the safety of their feti should be the law of the land.
Peale
@KG: Don’t try to make me rally around Megyn Kelly.
scav
It’s not that the questions were “tough” — it’s that they were biased. Everyone should have gotten tough questions (or fluff, whatever). Not a mad set of you get “tough”, you get reminders of talking points, you get hints to go after somebody else on the stage. Not so much moderators as orchestrators.
Mandalay
@CONGRATULATIONS!:
I think you are right. He’s obviously genuinely disgusted by the shitshow going on, and I don’t think he really cares enough about becoming president to play along with their nonsense. But he ends up seeming aloof and uninterested, and who is going to vote for someone who doesn’t seem to care?
He reminds me of Gore in his 2000 campaign who wasn’t that interested either. Bush is just going through the motions.
Amir Khalid
@Gin & Tonic: That’s an artifact of your political system, isn’t it — to run for office in the party’s name, one doesn’t have to be a dues-paying member; one only has to assert one’s Republicanness. Bernie Sanders, who votes with the Democrats in the US Senate, is much more a Democrat than the Donald is a Republican. I agree that The Donald, who is in no way beholden to the Republican party unlike its other candidates, has essentially hijacked its brand.
Betty Cracker
@Jeffro: I’m still clinging to the sanity flotsam that allows me to believe Trump will implode spectacularly. But I give him credit for blustering his way through some heavy, sustained artillery from the Fox News crew.
But man, the rest are perhaps even scarier, if not as colorful. That line about no abortion exceptions from Walker, who resembles a cut-rate, mentally defective undertaker, was chilling as all hell, and it seems to be the new catechism of the pack. I’ve got to believe most couples who have had a child — even Republicans — would find that level of fanaticism scary.
Peale
@scav: “So do you think Donald Trump is a loudmouthed bigot? Or just your standard clueless clown…Jeb, you’ve got 34 seconds on this one…”
Paul in KY
@Patrick in Michigan: Patrick, I don’t think the topic of this thread was ‘Trump bombed badly’. It was more ‘Sonofabitch, the guy whupped Fox’.
germy shoemangler
Fair and balanced network… before one cutaway to commercial, Wallace said something to the candidates like “when we return, we’ll talk about democrat solutions, and we’ll hear your better ideas.”
Did anyone else notice that?
bystander
Megyn was great. She had like three rows of mink eyelashes on each eyelid. If only she’d worn horn rims and her hair in a bun, viewership would have been even higher in the hopes that a p0rn movie was going to be filmed.
I don’t know what is funnier. Trump calling Megyn a bimbo or Trump calling Luntz a fat slob. It’s all good.
Paul in KY
@bystander: I like the anti-Luntz talk. That scumbag has hurt us.
KG
@Peale: don’t worry, I’m not trying to do anything. I just think it’s funny any time a woman who is conservative or center-right expresses a view that is out of step with the wingularity, she is to be immediately demeaned. But Bernie Sanders is going to talk at Liberty University so conservatives are really the one’s open to debate and different points of view!
Mike E
Is that a portrait of SCTV’s Dave Thomas as The Donald? Shoulda went with Joe Flaherty as Count Floyd playing Trump…veddy scary, keeds! Ooooo!
Betty Cracker
@Mike E: Nah. Even if I knew who those people were, I wouldn’t be able to pull that off. My development as a cartoonist ended in second grade.
gene108
Megyn will soon run into the same problem Sarah Palin has as she ages out of her forties, as a large part of her appeal is her looks and not her brains.* One day she’s going to reach her last fuckable day. and I am not sure Fox News cares to keep her around to reinvent herself.
* She was a practicing attorney before becoming a Foxbot. She’s not as dumb as she appears to be on TV.
Mike E
@Betty Cracker: Heh, definitely before you’re time…Dave did a stint with Brett Butler in Grace Under Fire, a sorta pre Roseanne.
Joe’s Count Floyd was a classic on SCTV, as a VHF C-grade schlock horror host…his intro and reenactment (these reels somehow never turn up or are the wrong movies entirely) of “Blood Sucking Monkeys From W. Mifflin, PA” was the funniest thing ever!
Betty Cracker
@gene108: IMO, Kelly comes across as a towering genius in comparison to Gretchen Carlson. But Jon Stewart outed Carlson as a closet smarty pants years ago too. There must be a Fox Finishing School and Lobotomy Center onsite.
Linda Featheringill
@Amir Khalid:
I agree. It’s funny. I think we should all run out and buy popcorn.
Betty Cracker
@germy shoemangler: Flew right over my head. I expect them to function as the propaganda organ of the Republican Party, so it doesn’t even register anymore when they say something like that.
Just One More Canuck
@Mike E: Monster Chiller Horror Theatre included such classics as Dr. Tongue’s 3D House of Meat/Cats/Stewardesses
gelfling545
@Betty Cracker: That line about no abortion exceptions from Walker
This is especially troubling to me as I cannot actually believe he gives one single…..care about the life of pretty much anybody who is not him.
Mike E
Well, we can’t have this nowadays, so our rich nostalgia must keep us warm…tho Bloom County’s return couldn’t have been timed better, no?
maurinsky
Trump’s ego cannot be deflated or punctured, so he is immune to the kinds of things that will keep other candidates in line.
There is no way any sane person can imagine Trump functioning as the leader of a democratic republic, though. He’s pure dictator, through and through.
Mike E
@Just One More Canuck: reply fail
Jeffro
@FlipYrWhig:
I wish they’d get off of it, too, but it’s ground that they just can’t cede – it’s too important to too large a part of their base.
Manyakitty
After last night’s performance, I’m even more convinced that Trump is trolling everyone. The whole third party thing gave it away. He genuinely doesn’t care what people say, but enjoys the attention he gets from blowing up.
Can you imagine that jerk engaging in any kind of diplomacy? Wow.
gian
Didn’t see the whole thing. Did they ask if he stopped raping his wife yet?
I wonder if he’d be a worse president than W. How much of Trump’s bluster is an act and how much is real…
Just One More Canuck
@Mike E: did it not show up?
Calouste
@CONGRATULATIONS!:
I noticed that as well. Obviously he was prepared for it, and prepared well, far better than people give him credit for. The narrative around Trump is that he is not serious, that he is going to flame out. But he seems to be prepared well, he’s got some organization going (p2016.org/trump/trumporg.html, can’t estimate how good that is), and he has more experience in the media, specially with hostile media, than the rest of the field combined.
gene108
@Manyakitty:
I got a bit of the politics as performance art vibe from Trump. When asked about his previous pro-life positions, he just grinned and trotted out a story about how friends of his decided to not get a abortion and that changed his mind.
It’s the sort of thing Republicans seem to have been doing for decades, as the mainstream of the Party lurches more and more to the Right, to justify themselves to the base and keep up with what the base demands,
Or how it does not matter they used to regularly bang hookers, because they now found Jesus again and have been forgiven of their sins.
The right-wing voters seem to buy into that sort of public contrition.
And Trump nailed it on the abortion question.
gene108
@Betty Cracker:
Do not ever sell your cartooning skills short Betty. They are awesome! Along with your narration you really are able to tell fun tales.
Mike E
@Just One More Canuck: see me @1:32, derp
Peale
@Manyakitty: Yes. The supposed advantage of having “someone who shoots from the hip and speaks his mind” is that you’re supposed to know where you stand. Foreign leaders are supposed to appreciate the aw shucks honesty, even if it is highly critical of them. Cause I mean, what leader of a country wouldn’t want someone telling him or her how they are failing. But with Trump, not only is he supposed to speak the unvarnished truth, he’s actually more than a little manic and unpredictable. I don’t think Modi or Putin or King Salman is going to appreciate the candid candor or find it very colorful.
trollhattan
Is the Trump Twittertwat for real? It’s okie-dokie to call a woman a bimbo whilst running for office? If so, can’t wait for him to share his thoughts on words that describe the president.
Manyakitty
@gene108: Yeah, but I don’t think he’s all that contrite.
@Peale: He’s hardly speaking unvarnished truth, either. He seems to let the words fall out of his pie hole and land where they may.
Just One More Canuck
@Mike E: I don’t mean to be obtuse, but I’m not following
Bjacques
Monster turns on creator, destroys village, throws girl in pond. Angry villagers turn up with torches, pitchforks and Frankenstein rakes, cheer monster and curse creator and girl for not showing monster and mob due respect.
Paul in KY
@Bjacques: Very succinct recapping of the whole mess!
Jeffro
@Betty Cracker:
I can’t see how any of these guys expect to magically ‘pivot’ on that one in the general election. NO exceptions? Please explain how that one would work in the real world, gentlemen. I know it’s too much to ask of our media, but all it would take is for one brave reporter or debate moderator to ask “Gov ___, god forbid but if it were your wife or daughter who were assaulted and became pregnant, they should then carry their rapist’s child?”
Matt McIrvin
@gene108: I’ve heard people speculate that Megyn Kelly is just pretending to be a right-winger.
My theory is actually the opposite: she is one of the few conservative true believers at Fox News. Unlike most of them, she’s not running a grift, and it actually bothers her when people on her side say things that strike her as nonsensical or inconsistent. Hence the election-night business with Rove and The Math, and the occasional fights she gets into with blowhards who get just a bit too misogynistic.
Calouste
@Jeffro: I think between “war with Iran on Day 1” and “no rape exception for abortion” Walker is toast in the general. The Dems could just start a shadowy ratf**king SuperPAC that pretends to be for Walker and quotes his own words.
Matt McIrvin
@Peale: In office, I think Trump would probably turn into Paul LePage on a national scale. He’ll have a grand old time as long as, like Bush between 9/11 and 2006, he has a sufficiently compliant Congress and judiciary that his word is law. The moment he realizes that his powers are limited and he can’t make things happen with a wave of his hand, he’ll turn into an incoherent rageboy.
Rasputin's Evil Twin
I watched about an hour of the debacle. Now it’s perfectly clear to me why Elvis shot TV sets.
mainmata
Those who believe that Trump turned on Fox I think have it wrong. This was a huge ratings night for Fox precisely because of the presence of The Donald. Absent him and few viewers would have tuned into see this dreary group of men. You have to remember there is literally no limit to the depth of cynicism of Murdoch/Ailes. They created the Tea Party along with the Koch Brothers and the Teahadists have enthusiastically embraced their Trumpenstein Monster. My view is that there is no reason for Faux Snooze to want The Donald to leave the scene until early next year if only to sustain the enthusiasm of the always moody and slobbering Teahadists, which make up the Base.
Patrick in Michigan
@Paul in KY: I hear ya…. I don’t think he did well at all.
cmorenc
@bystander:
We can throw rocks at Frank Luntz for being an evil putz, but he’s terrifyingly effective at what he does in formulating effective propaganda messaging strategies for the GOP, and when he’s being paid to do bona-fide focus-group research toward that end (as opposed to being paid to stage a pre-loaded faux group as a propaganda show like last night) – he’s also terrifyingly effective in figuring out what makes various sorts of voters tick.
Give the devil his due.
Denali
It is terrifying that Trump is doing well in the polls with his modis operandi that of essentially a dictator. Every little child would like to have his/her own way all the time, but the process of growing up provides a gradual realization that life is not that. Why is this brat attractive to so many people?