So here’s a new and disturbing statistic: in a recent Survey USA poll Donald Trump not only beat out Democratic nominees Hillary Clinton, Bernie Sanders, Joe Biden, and Al Gore, but he received more than 20 percent support from African-Americans in every matchup. The hell?
“Donald Trump has a certain swagger about him that I think registers with people. Especially if he is talking about trying to make government work for the people,” said Donald E. Scoggins, a lifelong Republican and president of the Republicans for Black Empowerment. “I think Trump’s support is primarily personality driven.”
We’ve just decided that this is a case of black people trolling, because, seriously? It’s Trump.
Team Blackness also discussed a rabbi’s request that Jews rescind their whiteness, a man who embezzled $8.7 million and then lived on the Appalachian trail, and David Cameron’s “bae of pigs” controversy.
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gian
You can say that again. The Donald does say he is popular with the “the blacks”
I expect his rants about mexicans resonate with people who are likely competing with new immigrants for low wage jobs.
Mike in NC
Survey USA seems to be a joke.
Calouste
Unfortunately, they only polled how Trump was doing against various Democrats, not how other Republicans were doing. That would have given some insight if their sample was skewed or not.
Chris
Color me skeptical.
Betty Cracker
@Chris: Why? Do you doubt that there are morons in every demographic? 20% of chickens would probably vote for Colonel Sanders.
Archon
I suspect there is an underreported nativist, anti-latino element within the black community. Trump also isn’t opening declaring he’s going to make life harder for poor people like all the other Republicans.
Still, I’d be shocked if Trump got 20 percent of the black vote in a general election.
Tom Q
@Archon: Seeing how no GOPer has exceeded about 11 percent of the black vote in 50 years, the idea that an outfront bigot like Trump would be the one to shatter the statistic is…umm…questionable.
redshirt
@Betty Cracker:
27% of chickens, I think.
trollhattan
The “jumbo shrimp” of political organizations.
Betty Cracker
@Tom Q: I suspect black Americans mostly vote their self-interest just like everyone else. If Trump succeeds in “otherizing” brown folks via immigrant-bashing while telling working class black and white Americans that their lives will be better if we get rid of the free-loading “others,” some will fall for it, just as millions of white people are dumb enough to vote for Treasury-looting Republicans to stop mythical welfare queens.
EdinNJ
At this point it’s meaningless. Most of Trump’s numbers right now are derived from name recognition and media coverage. I’d bet of those 20%, 18% couldn’t tell you a single thing about Trump’s stance on the issues.
redshirt
@efgoldman: Every day I am happier I killed my TV. I haven’t seen a political ad in 3 years and counting!
smintheus
SurveyUSA is producing garbage polls right now, making little attempt to obtain a sample that reflects the voting public. They’re all heavily skewed toward older and richer voters and Republicans.
catclub
@EdinNJ:
I bet they can tell you those stances will be yoooge.
Benw
20% is still less than the fraction of white people who support Trump. Black people: still smarter than white people.
redshirt
@EdinNJ: Trump is pro-Trump, I bet.
the Conster
@efgoldman:
The Chris Christie ones? I can’t figure out why he thinks NH is gettable, especially when he seems to be running against Obama.
Mandalay
@Mike in NC:
This.
The poll linked to was conducted on September 2 and 3, it only interviewed people with a land line, and those responding were just pushing buttons on their phone.
That poll is meaningless and irrelevant, and certainly not worthy of discussion here three weeks later.
redshirt
@the Conster:
Maybe because Maine’s governor is still a big supporter, and Maine is next to NH, ergo NH is a big Christie supporter.
Maybe?
Gimlet
Pope Ted
GOP presidential candidate Ted Cruz said he disagrees with Pope Francis’ call Thursday to abolish the death penalty, calling the use of capital punishment a “recognition of the preciousness of human life.”
“I believe the death penalty is a recognition of the preciousness of human life, that for the most egregious crimes, the ultimate punishment should apply.”
Cruz also said that whether the death penalty should be in place is an issue that should be left up to each state.
One of the pope’s sharpest messages came on the topic of the death penalty. He called for its “global abolition” and arguing that any punishment should never preclude the chance for rehabilitation.
“I am convinced that this way is the best,” Francis said. “Since every life is sacred, every human person is endowed with an inalienable dignity, and society can only benefit from the rehabilitation of those convicted of crimes.”
blueskies
What, black people aren’t allowed to be stupid? Shit, they’re still under the national average of the magical 27%. Fucking underachievers…
SiubhanDuinne
@Gimlet:
Link, please? Pretty please?
Mandalay
@Gimlet:
Ted Cruz does buffet Commandments. If he sees one he doesn’t like he just ignores it and moves on to the next one. Live your life by Calvinball rules.
Gimlet
@SiubhanDuinne:
politico.com/story/2015/09/ted-cruz-pope-francis-death-penalty-214023
bluehill
I think some Trump’s of supporters just want to feel that America is great because for them the reality may not be terrible but it’s not what they hoped for and they don’t believe it’s going to improve so Trump is all they got. It’s kind of like the decision Joey Pants makes in the Matrix to go back into the illusion because the reality sucks so badly.
In this way Trump makes me think of Putin. Putin has incredibly high approval ratings within Russia despite the collapse of its economy and pariah status internationally. But at least he looks manly riding a horse without a shirt on! It’s ironic that some on repubs think Obama’s a communist yet seem to have an odd crush on Putin, causing Obama to quip, “have you seen Russia’s economy lately?”
Amir Khalid
@EdinNJ:
Trump couldn’t tell you Trump’s position on the issues. Trump hasn’t sat down to think them through. Why else do you think he dodges questions about them when he does interviews?
Amir Khalid
@Gimlet:
Ted’s not Catholic. He gets to diss the Pope as much as he likes.
Bobby Thomson
@Mandalay: so did Moses. Leviticus requires capital punishment for several non~lethal offenses.
redshirt
@Amir Khalid:
I read a few FreeRepublic threads on the topic and I was a bit surprised at the general low level of vitriol. It was there, but it seemed a minority position, and there were a substantial percentage of posters who were actually engaging the points the Pope raised, to a wingnut level degree. I am a surprised.
Given Trump’s all out war with Fox, I wonder if something major has shifted in the wingnut conscious.
Gimlet
@Amir Khalid:
Guess that’s why it’s OK to diss the Prez when it’s a Republican… oh wait they say you MUST respect the office.
Tissue Thin Pseudonym
@redshirt: Probably, but all of the evidence is that Trump also can’t tell you Trump’s position on the issues.
the Conster
@redshirt:
Wingnuts in disarray. Wingnuttery has lapped itself – gone so far right it needs to double back or they’re going to end up Maoists, or maybe they already are.
Mandalay
@bluehill:
Republicans have a crush on Putin because he is a fascist rather than a communist. The country is run by an oligarchy – Putin and his buddies – and capitalism has free rein as long as it aligns with the interests of those in power.
Putin is a brutal authoritarian, and is about as communist as Alan Greenspan. That’s why the GOP love him.
redshirt
@the Conster: Your fingers to FSM’s ears. If the ideological bloc that has been the Right Wing over the past 30 years can be broken up to any degree – even slightly – it will be a boon for the rest of us. Which includes every single person on this wonderful world.
redshirt
@Mandalay:
It is a perfect fit. Again, FreeRepublic.com – which I urge all of you to check out, it’s quite harmless, unless you think peering directly into the right wing brain is dangerous – the Freepers love Putin, which is just amazing when you consider a large percentage of the posters are elderly who lived through a large part of the Cold War and were no doubt “BETTER DEAD THAN RED” types their entire lives.
the Conster
@redshirt:
Eliminationism is the common denominator of all extremist ideology. Not sure we’d appreciate Maoist wingnuts more than the other kind, except for the irony factor.
the Conster
@redshirt:
They’re Putinists. Doesn’t realty have a ring to it though.
ThresherK
This was a poll of people with land-line fones only?
Hey, I’m impressed that SurveyUSA would take the time to completely replicate the failed methodology of the Literary Digest/Alf Landon poll.
Quite the historical reenactment!
redshirt
@the Conster: French wingnuts seem a little classier, somehow.
bluehill
@Mandalay: Oh right, now it makes sense.
I guess it’s human nature and/or part of American culture, but we like like giving the appearance of strength than actually being strong. That’s my explanation for our gun obsession – some many out-of-shape people walking around with guns pretending to be special forces; or our willingness to overpay for commercial-strength athletic gear that most will never come close to fully utilizing.
Along the same lines, this helps me understand why the weight loss industry will never go out of business and the growth of the pharmaceutical industry and spanx for women and men.
Mnemosyne (iPhone)
I’m also guessing that AAs are enjoying watching Trump bash his fellow white plutocrats. I know I am, even though I would never vote for Trump even if a gun was held to my head.
Mandalay
@ThresherK:
I incorrectly thought that initially, but on reading the methodology more closely:
So there you have it: the poll shows that Trump wins among land-line voters, but loses among cell phone voters.
Nobody could have predicted…..
ETA Cell phone owners were only contacted if they could not be reached by land line, so the poll is skewed in favor of those with a land line.
Elizabelle
@Mandalay: Thank you for pollsplaining. The old landline vs. cell divide.
srv
Reality has a liberal bias. Black liberals aren’t self-loathing like white liberals – they like finer things like Trump does and don’t have guilt over it.
While the Clinton’s have been wildly successful in finding ways to mass incarcerate blacks, and Sanders has a black friend or two in Vermont or wherever he’s from, it’s clear a lot of people are looking for a third way.
redshirt
@srv: Nice divide and conquer technique.
Chris
@Betty Cracker:
No, because 20% of the black vote would be more than any Republican presidential candidate has ever gotten in a post Civil Rights Act world. Donald Trump, the world’s most famous Birther, is going to be the one to break that streak?
Chris
@Mandalay:
He also beats the crap out of gays and Muslims.
A guy
Why is this disturbing. Are they not capable of thinking for themselves or do you need to do it for them?
Woodrowfan
I was talking politics with a black guy setting up booths at the Arlington County Fair in August. He said his two favorite politicians were Obama and Trump! The latter one clearly surprised me, but he said he liked the way Trump spoke his mind. He did say he’d never vote for him, but thought he was entertaining.
scav
OK, everybody raise your hand that hasn’t responded to a poll as though you’re a mixed-raced hispanic albino Communist lesbian making an annual income of at least $100,000.
Davis X. Machina
@Chris: Are you sure people will even remember Trump’s bitherism when Obama isn’t in the race?
There’s a non-zero chance — I’d say a good chance — that the Democratic candidate is going to run away from Obama anyways.
Sanders will — why would he associate himself with eight years of Obama’s temporizing and lukewarm half- measures? — and Clinton might, out of sheer cussedness, bad old habits, brain-dead campaign advisors, or some blend thereof.
Birtherism in that climate blends back into a general noise background of GOP crazy…
redshirt
@Woodrowfan:
I was speaking with an Eskimo Uber driver and she was totally supportive of the Washington Redskins.
Frankensteinbeck
@the Conster:
The last thing I want in America is Mao’s ‘fuck science if it doesn’t give me what I want’ and ‘educated people should be sent back to the farms’ philosophy. We have enough ignorance, environmental disasters, and hunger without the nightmares he unleashed on China.
Soylent Green
I think his supposed right-wing bigotry is mostly a facade. He is playing the rubes as the suckers they are, telling them what they want to hear. If he believed he would have better chances running as a Democrat, he would be spouting progressive views instead. But demagoguery works much better on the other side, as Trump knows well. At times he lets his actual views slip, such as denouncing Dubya’s Iraq adventure as the giant fiasco that it was. He can’t let the wingnuts know what he really thinks about anything because that would reveal the man behind the wizard’s curtain. He intentionally avoids stating any actual views because his whole gambit is getting his followers to project their fantasies onto him. When Colbert tried to pin him down on birtherism (which Trump knows perfectly well is bullshit), he had no choice but to deflect the question.
I don’t think Trump will flame out or go a bridge too far, he will simply decide one day that he isn’t having fun anymore.
redshirt
@Soylent Green:
I believe the same.
And I think it’s more reassuring then the other “republicans” who actually want to enact much of the terrors they preach.
That is, if any Republican were to win – which I hope none of them do – Trump would be the least worst of all of them.
Mandalay
@Soylent Green:
I think he will stay in until the writing is on the wall that he can’t win the GOP nomination, at which point he will concoct some business world explanation for suddenly being forced to withdraw from the race.
What he definitely will not do is what Clinton did against Obama eight years ago: hang in there, fight it out, and lose honorably.
If he comes second he’s dripping in loser stink forever. If he pulls out for some bogus reason he’ll just claim until the day he dies that he would have won if only he had he been able to stay in the race. I suspect avoiding being second best is far more important to Trump than having a chance of becoming president.
Chris
@Davis X. Machina:
No, not sure, but I think the black community is still where it’s least likely to be forgotten. That’ll counteract at least some of Clinton and Sanders’ shortcomings.
And again, while there’ll always be black people who vote for the more racist party, 20%? Post-CRA, that’s unprecedented (and the general trend since that time, if any, is that the Republican share of the black vote’s gotten smaller not bigger).
Gwangung
@Chris: Ya think? Having a long memory is a survival tactic in minority communities. You damn well better remember or you won’t survive.
Joe
I’ve been wondering if one of my favorite albums from the 90s, PANDEMONIUM by Morris Day and the Time, would resurface. isn’t the best song on there, but it does have the most interesting title.
rikyrah
It’s Survey USA, Elon.
can’t trust them.
priscianus jr
“Team Blackness also discussed a rabbi’s request that Jews rescind their whiteness . . . ”
As a member of the House of David myself, I don’t think that would be too hard. Far as I can remember, we only became (honorary) whites less than 50 years ago . . . Our voting patterns are much closer to Asians than to “other” whites anyway.
ASV
The total sample is 900. I don’t see demographic breakdowns listed anywhere, but the black sub-sample is probably 90-100 people. That’s useless for survey data; it’s about a 10% MOE.
henqiguai
@the Conster (#39): Dead thread and all that, but what the heck –
‘PutiPies’?