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You are here: Home / Past Elections / Election 2016 / Open Thread – Halftime at the GOP Debate

Open Thread – Halftime at the GOP Debate

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The Guardian‘s liveblog here.

I like the predictions from BJ commentor Sloan:

Fiorina claims to have video of Loch Ness monster.

Jeb! shivs Rubio with a ball point pen, invokes “stand your ground” law.

Ted Cruz manages to be even more creepy. Sees post-debate bounce.

Trump rates everyone’s daughter on scale of 1 to 10.

Rand Paul shows up dressed like Batman. Nobody notices.

Christie orders Papa Johns pizza and doesn’t share with anyone.

Kasich lights himself on fire to get noticed. It doesn’t work.

Carson literally sleeps through the whole thing. Standing up, eyes wide open. And is declared the winner.

Also:

From Guardian US columnist Jeb Lund, live from Tampa, Florida.

That was a really fun bit during the Kiddie Table debate, when Lindsey Graham joked about being a Fox News instead of CNBC watcher. It’s just a little reminder that CNBC is the Marxist network that aired Rick Santelli’s 1% whine about taxation and moochers that the conservative astroturf group FreedomWorks used to launch the Tea Party.

Also via the Guardian, kibitzing:

Reader Interactions

301Comments

  2. 2.

    beltane

    A “Republican insider” promised us a campaign ending debacle tonight. Has this promise been kept? (I don’t have cable)

  5. 5.

    dmsilev

    Earth to Fiorina: Big businesses merging to create bigger businesses is best _stopped_ by government.

  8. 8.

    Mike J

    @dmsilev:

    Earth to Fiorina: Big businesses merging to create bigger businesses is best _stopped_ by government.

    Fiorina knows about big businesses merging to create one new, smaller business.

  11. 11.

    Stillwater

    Did Fiorina just say crony capitalism is the first step towards socialism? That can’t be right…

  12. 12.

    Mary G

    I keep flipping back and forth between this and the ball game. One Tweet on the crawl said “this debate is like a poetry slam, without the poetry.”

  19. 19.

    Betty Cracker

    Rubio’s campaign people are pretty slick — they’ve told him that when called on colossal fuck-ups, claim the media is repeating liberal slander and pivot to talking points.

  23. 23.

    Elizabelle

    I’m not watching the GOP debate too much, but am impressed with the questions. No idea if there’s followup, but way better than CNN.

    Kasich mentioned “death tax.” That’s the biggest grift out there. A cap of $2-3 million, if that, would protect the vast majority of Americans.

  28. 28.

    Corner Stone

    They all love poor and working poor people, apparently. That is who all of these people are fighting for, dammit!

  29. 29.

    dmsilev

    Fiorina: “92% of the jobs lost under Obama were from women”

    I’m going to go out on a limb and say that’s bullshit. Also, Obama’s job record is net positive. By a lot.

  31. 31.

    Kay

    “Demonizing seniors”. They almost have to. They’ve run thru demonizing every other category of people the last decade. Seniors are the last group standing.

  33. 33.

    MomSense

    The lights are flickering and the wind is howling so I may be spared from watching all of this debate.

  37. 37.

    Felonius Monk

    If the bullshit gets much deeper you won’t be able to see any of the idiots candidates any longer.

  39. 39.

    Schlemazel

    @Elizabelle:
    Estate tax does not even kick in until the estate is over $5 million. Most Americans too ignorant to discuss the actuality of the “death tax”. When told there is a plan with rules exactly what they are today a yooooge majority of Americans are all in favor, even the ones that claim to be against todays death tax

  40. 40.

    Betty Cracker

    Okay, what did Carson say that made the entire audience groan aloud? I was feeding fish and didn’t catch it…

  41. 41.

    Stillwater

    “Doesn’t it speak to your vetting process that I’m asking you, on national TV, whether you stopped beating your wife yet?”

  42. 42.

    Corner Stone

    @dmsilev:

    Earth to Fiorina: Big businesses merging to create bigger businesses is best _stopped_ by government.

    I loved that bit!
    “Folks, there’s a reason businesses are merging and killing jobs, raiding pensions and providing less choice. It’s because of big govt!”
    “They have to protect themselves and crush small business because government is forcing them to!”

  43. 43.

    Jeffro

    I’m finding two trends to be very interesting here:
    1) they have all decided that it is awesome to run against the media since they have no actual explanations for some of the sorrier points in their histories
    2) when pressed they outright lie, especially Fiorina, Carson, and Christie ( but then again that is just since I got home and I’m watching there may have been others who have been more egregious – probably Cruz if I’m guessing)

    Bernie was awesome by the way. He is clearly getting more polished although after almost 7 years of Obama I feel like I am spoiled and expect too much when it comes to political speeches from progressives ?

  45. 45.

    Patrick

    @dmsilev:

    Fiorina: “92% of the jobs lost under Obama were from women”

    Consider who said it; Fiorina the video tape liar. She doesn’t exactly have much credibility…

  48. 48.

    Corner Stone

    I can’t believe I’m doing this to myself. I may force myself to take a break, pick up some supplies at WalMart and then make a run by MickeyD’s on the way home after a gas up at an Exxon station so I can buy lottery tickets.

  49. 49.

    dmsilev

    @Betty Cracker: It wasn’t Carson, it was the question, about Carson’s involvement in some medical-supplement snake oil outfit. Apparently the audience thought it was unfair.

  57. 57.

    Corner Stone

    Debates are not good for Trump. He gets tired or something and goes low energy.
    That was a good media zinger, however.

  59. 59.

    Stillwater

    I agree with the super-PAC thing too. I’ll be interested if he sticks with that view when the heat’s really on.

  62. 62.

    Jeffro

    @Jeffro: I think on number one, Rubio just proved my point. It should be fun watching Ted Cruz try to claim the mantle of the anti-media warrior away from Marco.

  65. 65.

    Elizabelle

    Bing Crosby is singing and narrating the story of Ichabod Crane. Could not tell you what the Repubs are doing …

  76. 76.

    Redshift

    @beth: The biggest, yes, but not 93%. That’s definitely a “73% of all statistics are made up on the spot” kind of statement.

    Not to mention the fundamental dishonesty of pretending Obama was responsible for the job losses, when in fact the job losses were at 800,000 per month and increasing before Obama took office, and started steadily declining immediately after Obama’s policies started being implemented.

  79. 79.

    Schlemazel

    The Onion:
    Jeb? Bush Inching Podium Closer To Center Of Stage During Commercial Breaks
    Carly Fiorina Promises To Fight For Whoever Everyday Americans Are
    John Boehner To Paul Ryan: ‘I Was Once Young And Beautiful Too’

    This is why it remains America’s #1 news source

  80. 80.

    Nate Dawg

    Ben Carson is completely unaware that economic activity has EXTERNALITIES and that without outside intervention, the system will trash itself into a shithole (See, e.g., China).

  82. 82.

    Nate Dawg

    Ben Carson: “I’ve since decided that all subsidies and all regulations are bad, because they cost someone, somewhere money.”

    Wow. Staggeringly stupid.

  84. 84.

    RaflW

    @frankrichny
    Still waiting for Jeb!’s “breakthrough” moment. Or did we sleep through it?

    Bye bye, Jen Bish.

  88. 88.

    gian

    Gold standard. War against inflation that isn’t actually happening. That and kill social security.

  89. 89.

    Kay

    @Redshift:

    I think it’s weird to focus on job losses. That isn’t the issue anymore. We have 4% unemployment here. Everyone is working.

  92. 92.

    SiubhanDuinne

    Still watching with audio off.

    Rand Paul has almost as punchable a face as Ted Cruz. Not quite, but a good solid runner-up.

  95. 95.

    gene108

    Hosting a debate during the World Series!!!! Forcing Americans to not watch baseball’s biggest series. Baseball, America’s national pastime!!!

    Why do Republicans hate America?!?!

  98. 98.

    beth

    Why doesn’t anyone ever ask these morons who is going to process all those postcard tax returns when they eliminate the IRS? Will taxes be in the honor system?

  100. 100.

    beth

    Why doesn’t anyone ever ask these morons who is going to process all those postcard tax returns when they eliminate the IRS? Will taxes be on the honor system?

  101. 101.

    FlyingToaster

    @gene108: Forcing is ‘way too strong. The Series is on broadcast; the so-called debate is on Signature cable. At least, on my cable plan (basic, signature, premium, subscription are the tiers).

  103. 103.

    Redshift

    @Kay: In GOP World, Obama has been a disaster for the economy. I guess to justify that they have to pretend that only the bad things that happened during his tenure actually exist.

    Yet another striking example of how Democratic candidates will be able to talk about the same things in the primary and the general election, but GOP candidates won’t, because their primary voters occupy a different reality than the rest of the country.

  104. 104.

    NonyNony

    @beth: We’ll just send our postcards directly to the Pentagon, the only part of the government they want to fund.

  107. 107.

    PsiFighter37

    I am reading the liveblog and I can practically hear the giggles from the Guardian bloggers that one of these assholes is going to be the nominee.

  108. 108.

    Miss Waterlow

    The stream at digg.com is pretty funny. NBC keeps taking it down and they keep putting it back up.

  109. 109.

    Jeffro

    @Baud: totally. I know we all detest him and rightfully so but he definitely appeals to enough of the GOP to keep moving up while Bush is certainly on his way out

  110. 110.

    dmsilev

    @Baud: If Jeb gets relegated to the kids table for the next debate (just 2 weeks from now), that would be awesome.

  111. 111.

    Anne Laurie

    @gene108:

    Hosting a debate during the World Series!!!! Forcing Americans to not watch baseball’s biggest series. Baseball, America’s national pastime!!!

    Serious question: How far in advance are the World Series games planned out? Did the RNC know they’d be contending against America’s Pastime, or are they just that ham-fisted?

  113. 113.

    Betty Cracker

    @SiubhanDuinne: Yep. Unless Rubio steps on his dick pretty soon, he’ll be declared the winner by a landslide, and the media man crush will begin. The Bush family dirty tricksters in FL better start pulling skeletons out of his closet damn quick.

  114. 114.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Baud:

    Agree with your scone sentence.

    Shudder at your first.

    ETA: Damn you to everlasting hell, autocorrect. I fucking typed “second” and you goddamn well know it. What gives you the unmitigated fucking gall to think you can get away with substituting “scone”? Take this pumpkin spice scone and SHOVE IT.

  118. 118.

    cmorenc

    @Kay:

    “Demonizing seniors”. They almost have to.

    Maybe you misunderstood and they were demonizing “senior sheep”, since Carly Fiona is there.

  119. 119.

    Redshift

    @Peale:

    Maybe women lost more because by the time Bush was through, the men had already lost their jobs.

    This is what fact checkers found when Romney made the claim originally. Also, many of the women who lost jobs were in government and teaching jobs, where there were losses later because of Republican opposition to countercyclical government spending and sending money to the states (i.e., pretending to be “fiscally conservative” to hobble government when it was needed.)

  123. 123.

    Ruckus

    As this is an open thread I have a question.
    Was reading Pearce and came across the post about Syria and what the Pentagon thinks we need to do. So….
    Why is it that the Pentagon never comes up with a solution that is to just walk away, for getting involved will solve nothing and will quite likely get us involved in another decade long war which won’t end any better than the last 2, thousands killed, budget wrecked, turmoil worse than ever and the US even less popular than now. Have the career military and politicians learned nothing from the last 50 yrs? Are we destined to be the world’s bully forever?

  124. 124.

    gf120581

    @Jeffro: Rubio is basically becoming the GOP establishment choice in this race because there’s literally one else. Jeb is sinking like a stone, Christie is too damaged, Kasich is too much of a loose cannon for their tastes…they’re literally out of options and the only one left is the thirsty empty suit with enough skeletons in his closet to make Bluebeard jealous, had the biggest paper in his home state call on him to resign because he’s almost completely blown off his current job, and looks like a teenaged boy who borrowed one of his dad’s suits to sneak past the bouncer.

    If I was a member of the GOP establishment, I’d be real tempted to do a Boehner and drink myself into oblivion right now.

  125. 125.

    dmsilev

    @Baud: He apparently thinks that college students shouldn’t live in dorms. More money for private slumlords, I guess.

  126. 126.

    Kay

    @cmorenc:

    Martin O’Malley said they were demonizing seniors. Which actually makes me laugh and is a good line. Martin O’Malley should be someone else’s campaign operative. Couldn’t you see him in that role?

  129. 129.

    Iowa Old Lady

    @Ruckus: I once asked my career military BIL more or less that same question, and he said the military believes in military action. Same way teachers recommend tutoring if a kid is late to read.

  130. 130.

    Jeffro

    Jeb is at his fake-ist when he tries to act all red meat and stuff … It is amazing that he even is getting the numbers he’s getting considering just how small his natural constituency is . Try and picture any given group of GOP voters or any right-leaning interest group : their interests are almost certainly better served by another GOP candidate up there on that stage

  131. 131.

    Corner Stone

    I’m eagerly waiting for a female center in the audience to break out her large dildo and yell loudly, “Hey, Bush! If you’re going to suck, suck like this!”

  132. 132.

    cmorenc

    @Anne Laurie:

    Did the RNC know they’d be contending against America’s Pastime, or are they just that ham-fisted?

    Baseball is more like America’s “past time” these days, a game whose peak popularity relative to other pro sports was several decades ago. A game from America’s past – the perfect complement to soccer, America’s sport of the future since 1972.

    (thanx to “Men in Blazers” for that last quip).

  133. 133.

    RaflW

    Jeb is total toast. He just talked about regulating fantasy football. Christie just killed him on that.

  136. 136.

    Anne Laurie

    @Ruckus:

    Why is it that the Pentagon never comes up with a solution that is to just walk away…

    Same reason (but multipled by a factor of many) that your auto mechanic can always find something that needs to be fixed or replaced on your car “just to be safe” — nobody gets promotion or funding for saying “let’s just sit this one out, no point throwing good money (or troops) after bad”.

  139. 139.

    Chyron HR

    Was fantasy football regulation the campaign-killingly stupid stunt of the night? Did the duck come down to give Bush a prize?

  140. 140.

    Nate Dawg

    Republicans are too stupid and divorced from reality to nominate the most electable candidates. Chris Christie is doing amazing, and would scare me as their general candidate.

  143. 143.

    Nate Dawg

    Wait, wasn’t paying attention for a minute, which John was Chris Christie talking to: “Even in New Jersey, that’s rude…” ???

    Kasich? Jeb? The moderator?

  145. 145.

    Jeffro

    @Nate Dawg: Hillary would eat him alive …” Thanks Governor Christie that’s just great – if government is always the problem why do you want to be the head of it ?”

  147. 147.

    J R in WV

    And so Mrs J was watching the world series via HD Homerun on the newest laptop, and shrieked when she spilled half a glass of sparkling Chandon wine into it.

    It was still working when I shut it down, then I turned it upside down and used blow-job-in-a-can on it, which seems to have gotten lots of fluid out of it.

    She was upset. I said, it’s a cheap laptop, not a Cray, so don’t be upset.

    Worse being upset than anything else. Go Mets!

  154. 154.

    Nate Dawg

    Huckabee: Fix medicare by curing old-age.

    Doctors, Researchers, Scientists: Why didn’t we think of that? Oh, and that’s not gonna be cheap, buddy.

  156. 156.

    gf120581

    @Jeffro: Also, after last Thursday, I won’t ever underestimate Hillary’s skill at making male opponents of hers look like bullying assholes. If she could make a wimpy non-entity like Rick Lazio look like the douchbag of the western world in a debate, imagine what she could do against Governor Soprano.

  158. 158.

    Rising Above

    The campaign has a veritable Iron Mountain of oppo research on ‘Lil Marco that is being sifted through as we speak.

    The Bush family will not be screwed with. In a few weeks Rubio will be flustered, red-faced, yelling to Jeb to “stop lying about my record”.

    Dole. Dukakis. McCain. Gore. Kerry. And now Rubio.

    When you fuck with the bill, you will get the horns.

  159. 159.

    Kay

    @Baud:

    He has a task force on college efficiency. I have not investigated it sufficiently but there have already been two outraged editorials that’s it’s about privatizing and contracting out services and enriching the people on the task force thru those contracts, so there’s a shocker.

  160. 160.

    RaflW

    So it appears that Jen Bish thought that he could go after Rubio, that it would be his stunning breakout moment. I cannot fathom how deluded he and his top campaign staff must be.

    ETA:
    @jonlovett
    Jeb running on a pretty compelling pity platform.

  162. 162.

    Nate Dawg

    Is it me or does Donald Trump talk only in simple declarative sentences!!

    “We’re gonna fix medicare. We’re gonna save money. We’re gonna save the country.”

    He can’t string together a complex sentence, it’s really bizarre.

  163. 163.

    rikyrah

    @Kay:

    I think it’s weird to focus on job losses. That isn’t the issue anymore. We have 4% unemployment here. Everyone is working.

    White folks are working.

    Black Unemployment is twice as high.

  164. 164.

    trollhattan

    @J R in WV:
    My bride once worked at Chandon in the visitor’s center. She thinks I spend toooo muuuuuch tiiiiime on computers and thus, approves.

  167. 167.

    dedc79

    Baseball is more like America’s “past time” these days, a game whose peak popularity relative to other pro sports was several decades ago.

    Avg attendance at a baseball game today is right around 30k. In 1975, it was somewhere around 17,500, and in 1950 it was 10K.

    In many local markets, the consistently highest rated broadcasts on a nightly basis are baseball games.

    When people say baseball is a game of the past, what they’re really saying is that football tv ratings are insanely higher. They are, but there are far fewer football games and there’s far more gambling on football (fantasy and otherwise)

  168. 168.

    trollhattan

    @rikyrah:
    What these asshats keep dancing around is the core issue of wage stagnation and the fact that Every Stinking Policy they support will make it worse.

  171. 171.

    Corner Stone

    @Kay:

    I have not investigated it sufficiently but there have already been two outraged editorials that’s it’s about privatizing and contracting out services and enriching the people on the task force thru those contracts, so there’s a shocker.

    He basically just bragged about schools selling off assets to private funds. That’s his answer.

  173. 173.

    Ruckus

    @Iowa Old Lady:
    @Anne Laurie:
    I get this, it’s what they do.
    But there is a difference in not fighting a totally ignorant war and being prepared to defend a country, especially with the history of the last 50 yrs. And the military has suffered greatly from those wars that they have never won. You’d think that somewhere, someone might just come up with a new fucking idea. Maybe I’m just being a bit wishful and pessimistic today. My cup is damn near to being empty.

  174. 174.

    dmsilev

    Christie is quite correct. We didn’t hear ideas like privatizing Medicare batted around at Democratic debates.

  179. 179.

    Kay

    @Rising Above:

    I agree. He hasn’t been vetted sufficiently. It’s too bad the Jebster can’t hit Rubio on his crony, corrupt relationship with rip off for-profit colleges, because obviously Bush can’t open that can of worms since he’s hip deep in that sleaze too. Do you know Rubio was still lobbying for Corinthian while Corinthian was entering bankruptcy? There’s a letter. He was dumb enough to write a letter. The federal government got a default judgment against them today. They owe the US a lot of money.

  180. 180.

    Nate Dawg

    I cannot wait for President Hillary Clinton. Fuck these clowns. They need to get their ass whipped until it loosens enough for them to free their heads.

    Bizarro world where they think Democrats don’t have a good candidate. Fuck them.

  182. 182.

    RaflW

    OK, just switched to HGTV. I’ll still follow some of the nonsense on twitter, but I cannot sit here and listen to Christie claim that the GOP debate is more civil and substantive than the Dem debate. I’m out of patience for the shitshow.

  188. 188.

    yet another jeff

    True, Carly knows how to shrink the size of a business, no doubt she could do the same thing for the US.

  190. 190.

    Corner Stone

    I don’t think Christie should be saying “deadly serious” after he falsely quarantined that ebola nurse.

  192. 192.

    sloan

    I’m missing this whole damn thing dealing with toddlers.

    So is Marco! putting Jeb? out of his misery?

  197. 197.

    Corner Stone

    Carly makes me wish this really were a series of tubes. So we could play slip n slide together.

  200. 200.

    Nate Dawg

    Three word sentences — by Donald Trump.

    He doesn’t know how to talk like an intelligent person.

  202. 202.

    Chyron HR

    @Rising Above:

    The campaign has a veritable Iron Mountain of oppo research on ‘Lil Marco that is being sifted through as we speak.

    Are you even smart enough to remember that Jeb ordered you to say the exact same thing about Trump, and it never happened?

  204. 204.

    Nate Dawg

    Also, is his closing statement a brag about renegotiating the debate time length? What a clown.

  205. 205.

    Anne Laurie

    @Ruckus:

    And the military has suffered greatly from those wars that they have never won.

    “Well, yeah, but these days we have a volunteer army! So they asked for whatever bad things happen to them, am I right?”

    “And since they’re all volunteers, they don’t cost anything either!”

    The NeoCons and RedState pundits use more words, but as far as I can tell, that’s their fallback: VOLUNTEER military.

    That word, it does not mean what they think it means. Like a whole bunch of other words…

  206. 206.

    amk

    @schrodinger’s cat:

    It’s a 5 stage poll spread over nearly a month. Anything can happen. Of course, modi and co are on the offensive – especially personal attacks which they do best – since it is seen as a referendum on his over a year rule.

  209. 209.

    Another Holocene Human

    @dmsilev:

    “Dear Senator Rubio: You suck at managing money. Comments?”

    He is good at managing to work whatever money he’s managing into his own pockets.

  216. 216.

    Anne Laurie

    @Nate Dawg:

    He doesn’t know how to talk like an intelligent person.

    Or he knows exactly how to talk to his target audience.

    Simple declarative sentences, no long words. Four legs good!…

  222. 222.

    EdG

    Any bets on how long it will be before Rubio is Bushwhacked with stories of placing his penis in orifices not in his wife’s jurisdiction?

  224. 224.

    Jeffro

    And the first CNBC pundit out of the gate declares it for Rubio and Cruz…shocker…now Kaisch

    You know who you’re not gonna hear good things about tonight ? Jeb? and Fiorina.

  227. 227.

    Anne Laurie

    @sloan:

    I’m missing this whole damn thing dealing with toddlers.

    I’ve dealt with toddlers. You didn’t miss a thing — true, toddlers are more likely to actually fling garbage, but then again, they aren’t cheerfully plotting to destroy the lives of millions of other people.

  228. 228.

    FlyingToaster

    @Rising Above: And Clinton in 1992?

    Jeebus, you’re dumb. And, sadly, your chosen candidate is on the downhill slide.

    So, lessee:

    Schiavo. Schiavo. Schiavo.

    (You can dismiss Swiper this way, and Bill O’Reilly. It’s certainly worth a try.)

  230. 230.

    The Pale Scot

    Finally!

    Catholic Theologians Ask New York Times To Stop Letting Ross Douthat Write About Theology

    Aside from the fact that Mr. Douthat has no professional qualifications for writing on the subject, the problem with his article and other recent statements is his view of Catholicism as unapologetically subject to a politically partisan narrative that has very little to do with what Catholicism really is. Moreover, accusing other members of the Catholic church of heresy, sometimes subtly, sometimes openly, is serious business that can have serious consequences for those so accused.

    “What the signers meant, it seemed to me, was that when it comes to some theological matters Mr. Douthat has no idea what he’s talking about. And that’s true…”

    The man’s still a raving snake handling pagan at heart.

  231. 231.

    Corner Stone

    @Anne Laurie:

    toddlers are more likely to actually fling garbage, but then again, they aren’t cheerfully plotting to destroy the lives of millions of other people.

    Don’t kid yourself. Not for one second.

  233. 233.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    just saw a clip of Chris Christie making the correct point that asking about draft kings or whatever is silly, then he said “we have ISIS and al Qaeda attacking us”. Who’s “us”?

  234. 234.

    Jeffro

    Look at Trump giving himself an exit strategy: “I changed the dialogue on immigration ”

    ( and took out Bush of course )

  237. 237.

    Nate Dawg

    @Jeffro:

    Look at Trump giving himself an exit strategy: “I changed the dialogue on immigration”

    Please tell me that the Donald isn’t out yet. I refuse to believe that the dopey doctor is going to push him out.

  238. 238.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @Baud:
    You are taking these guys. There is no doubt in my mind that this whole debate, the candidate selection pool – this is all the work of Baud!’s dirty tricks election team. You have brilliantly ensured that no matter who wins the primary, the Republican candidate you face in the general will be bloodied, humiliated, covered in loser stink, and not least of all incompetent.

  239. 239.

    Chyron HR

    @Rising Above:

    Do you remember what happened when a Bush went up against a Clinton in 1992?

    (No, sobbing and screaming about “Brinks trucks” is not an answer. Try again.)

  241. 241.

    Kay

    @Corner Stone:

    It’s clever how he’s honing in on the trade thing. Everyone in Ohio just said “yeah! currency manipulation!” Sherrod Brown is nodding wisely :)

  242. 242.

    Frankensteinbeck

    Let me add that this is the only election I can remember where the winner of the primary will still come out looking like a loser. That’s what a train wreck I’m seeing.

  248. 248.

    Amir Khalid

    @The Pale Scot:
    On the topic of Christianity, subject-matter expertise is not Ross Douthat’s strong point. A few years ago, Douthat wrote a book about Christianity in America in the post-WWII years. One of his NYT colleagues panned the book, saying Chunky didn’t know what he was writing about.

  251. 251.

    Elie

    Ahhhh — Missed the fun tonight, but my hubby thinks Carson is could eat out your heart… that his eyes are filled with a weird anger/hate. Juxtaposed with that weird calm demeanor, you have a true “creepy” candidate. He makes Trump look more normal (marginally anyway).

    I have always thought that he was crazy or had some sort of spiritual illness — not someone you want near any kind of power over living beings of any kind.

  252. 252.

    Rising Above

    @FlyingToaster:

    Without Perot, H.W. would have won.

    And Hillary is no Bill.

    Jeb may have gotten knocked down tonight, but he’ll get up again. It’s not whether you get knocked down, but whether you continue to fight. Fight he will!

    Three words for the Jeb campaign tonight: FULL STEAM AHEAD!

  253. 253.

    Renie

    Guardian reports that ?JEB?s campaign mgr, Danny Diaz, was in a heated confrontation with a CNBC producer outside the debate as it was happening and Reince Priebus tweeted “CNBC should be ashamed of how this debate was handled.” Guess even he thinks the klowns all looked stupid tonite.

  259. 259.

    NonyNony

    @Rising Above: That’s okay. Jeb is no W. He’s no HW either. He’s not even a Romney. He’s so bad that even the Bush family won’t be able to make up for his shortcomings.

  263. 263.

    Jeffro

    @Nate Dawg: Carson won’t drive him out (not directly): Trump’s own slowly dropping poll numbers will cause him to leave. If you can’t be loved and loved yuuuugggely, why run at all?

    he’ll say he got HIS immigration perspective into the GOP debates/platform/nominee’s eventual campaign, and nuked Jeb? Bush, so, mission accomplished.

  267. 267.

    yet another jeff

    @efgoldman: Heh…I almost decided to go with “us” instead of the US…but I thought that might be simultaneously too subtle and obvious…

  268. 268.

    FlyingToaster

    @Rising Above:

    Without Perot, H.W. would have won.

    Keep believing that.

    I don’t remember which analyst it was whose numbers showed that Perot voters would likely have sat out the election.

    And Hillary is no Bill.

    No, she’s learned from his mistakes. Notice the lack of MARK FUCKING PENN from her campaign this time.

    Oooh, the Royals just scored again!

  270. 270.

    Another Holocene Human

    @Corner Stone: Kudblow and Santelli? Glad I gave that a miss.

    Was Bartiromo on there too (I’m thinking of Maria but pretty sure they both suck)?

  272. 272.

    Another Holocene Human

    @Jeffro: The I-fap-to-profit crowd has no use for Carson’s piety and probably feel like his free-markets red meat is uninformed and fake. (At the debate, he made uninformed extremist statements instead of using dog whistles that indicate that he is going to protect the profits of Big Special Interest.)

  275. 275.

    Ruckus

    @The Pale Scot:
    …when it comes to some theological matters Mr. Douthat has no idea what he’s talking about.
    Actually the list of subjects that dumbhat has any idea about is measurable but it takes some pretty expensive scientific equipment to find positive results.

  276. 276.

    Another Holocene Human

    @schrodinger’s cat: Douthat is one of those “conservative” hires intended by an evil editing squad to make conservatives look bad. Like Jeff Jacoby at the Boston Globe. (George Will is there to lie and make them look good.) Jacoby was inconsistent and hypocritical when I read him and couldn’t argue his way out of a paper bag. And who exactly is Douthat’s constituency? Despite NYT’s best efforts his comments sections are usually 9:1 cold mocking him. Even rich NE Republicans don’t go in for Douthat’s brand of sexless sanctimony. And actual Catholics are like ***facepalm***.

  277. 277.

    Another Holocene Human

    @Elie:

    Ahhhh — Missed the fun tonight, but my hubby thinks Carson is could eat out your heart… that his eyes are filled with a weird anger/hate. Juxtaposed with that weird calm demeanor, you have a true “creepy” candidate. He makes Trump look more normal (marginally anyway).

    I have always thought that he was crazy or had some sort of spiritual illness — not someone you want near any kind of power over living beings of any kind.

    Like the doctor from Simpsons! The one who gives you your prognosis and then chuckles inappropriately.

  278. 278.

    trollhattan

    @Rising Above:
    I have to hand it to you, invoking the steam era with respect to the John Bush for president campaign is not only clever, it’s spot on. Golf clap to you, sir!

  279. 279.

    The Pale Scot

    @Amir Khalid: I can’t understand how a family converts from mainline protestant to Pentecostalism and then to Catholicism in the course of one person’s upbringing. Next stop is Hubbard’s cult or Golden Gate.

    And he constantly harps on woman for not buckling down and getting some baby making done while he has only one child in an eight year marriage. His wife writes for the Smithsonian, I’d bet on Ross being the submissive in the bedroom.

  283. 283.

    SFAW

    @Racist Above:

    Without Perot, H.W. would have won.

    Not even close to correct – Perot drew equally from Clinton and HW.

    Wrong again? Or merely lying? Tough to tell with you, you’re so good at both.

    @Racist Above:

    The campaign has a veritable Iron Mountain of oppo research

    Lying about one’s opponent is not quite the same as using oppo research, moron.

    I guess I should be glad you continue to lie — if you told the truth, I might have a heart attack from the shock.

  284. 284.

    yet another jeff

    @Corner Stone: Yeah…weird one armed floppy hand gesturing…and he just looked like he wasn’t feeling right at all…although that and his hair sticking up could have been the bad camera angle…made me worried for someone I don’t even like.

  285. 285.

    gian

    @Corner Stone:
    Trump is not an idiot and he’s not in the fox bubble.
    Doesn’t mean he’s not a right wing tool. Means he’s partly in reality.
    Meanwhile the GOP primary voters are looking for the next alf landon

  288. 288.

    Corner Stone

    @gian: The whole thing with TPP is that it in no way addresses currency manipulation by China. Anyone who says the TPP is to constrain China is willfully fooling themselves.
    Currency levels viz China is the whole deal.
    That it takes Trump to say that….who the F knows what that actually means.

  289. 289.

    Matt McIrvin

    @Jeffro: Trump’s poll numbers are not dropping any more. On average, they’ve risen as high as ever.

    Carson is still rising, though. Absolutely everyone else is losing. Even Rubio.

  290. 290.

    SFAW

    @Matt McIrvin:

    Absolutely everyone else is losing.

    But not Jeb-Jeb Brinks! (According to noted Jeb! shill Racist Above. He says Jeb!bie isn’t dropping. Of course, he also says that Pan Am stock is set to surge. Both Jeb!’s polls and Pan Am’s stock price are at about the same level.)

  291. 291.

    groucho48

    Only saw the first half hour or so but it was interesting how most of them were trying to top each other in protecting SS from those in government who stole people’s SS money…in other words, Republicans, but, apparently, they expect the base believes government is made up entirely of Democrats.

    Fiorina was pretty good at spinning and lying. She does it very smoothly. Carson clearly doesn’t understand what he is talking about. Cruz decided to just have fun and emit attack lines. Trump was good at eviscerating other folks’ talking points. Kasich would start off with strong statements and then drift off what he was talking about. Rubio was pretty good at deflecting attacks on himself. Didn’t score many positive points, though. Bush was completely forgettable. He’d be a perfect spy. He could sit in on top secret meetings and no one would notice he was there. Christie was his usual blowhard self. Just as Huckabee was Huckabee. I think he did get off one clever line but I don’t remember what it was.

    I think they all whined about the questions.

  293. 293.

    seaboogie

    @Corner Stone: She’s a honey from Argentina – almost ex-wife of a former lover who has passed away, and a friend – we went through a lot together, she and I. But she is very much a born-again sort of Xtian. Love her as I do, there is only so much praise Jesus-ing that I can handle. But it seems to be working for her, so that’s fine.

    For some reason – either FYWP and/or my computer, whenever I try to quote or link something, it always picks up the last thing that I posted/sent, and not my current one. Anyone else have problems with this? Maybe my computer?

  295. 295.

    Chris

    @Rising Above:

    So first the brinks trucks were backing up, then Jen wasn’t doing well but he was going to turn all that around tonight with R, R, R, and now he hasn’t turned it around BUT HE’S TOTALLY FUCKING GOING TO – ABOUT TO – ANY MINUTE NOW!!!!!

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