So, it’s conference championship weekend, which makes me happy and sad — happy that there will be some great match-ups to watch, and sad because where did the damn season go? Here’s the schedule:
‘Bama will almost certainly trounce my poor little Gators. But nothing is impossible in college football. Just imagine if the Gators won!
The subsequent turmoil in the playoff picture would be the least of our worries: Nick Saban’s lips would compress and his sphincter would tighten to such a degree that it would deform the space-time continuum, creating a black hole with such strong gravitational pull that nothing, not even light, could escape, eventually absorbing all the matter in our solar system and perhaps destroying the whole galaxy as it becomes the most supermassive black hole in the universe. But this is unlikely.
Anyhoo — open thread!
Big R
My parents are Florida alumni. I’m an Alabama alumnus. Today is a no-taunting day in our family, and my mother has announced her intentions to wear purple and orange.
Dolly Llama
Hell, I’m a Georgia fan. The season’s been more exciting this past week than it’s been all year long, and it could get moreso before things settle down.
raven
@Dolly Llama: woof
jeffreyw
No football for us, but we do have a nice beef and hominy stew going, and the bread machine should turn out a loaf right about dinner time.
Need moar kitteh? Here’s a calico named Cali. She’s demonstrating napping technique in one of Mrs J’s kitteh beds. The open eye is not the best form but she’s new at modeling and will surely improve.
The Dangerman
The chaos if Bama goes down would be epic; I don’t think Florida can jump from 18 to the Final Four with a win and I don’t think they could hold a Final Four without an SEC team (heads all over the South would explode; we can hold a debate later if it would be worth the cleanup effort). If Bama loses, there will be shenanigans and they will somehow only drop from 2 to 4.
? Martin
@The Dangerman:
That sounds like a good thing…
The Dangerman
@? Martin:
But think of the damage to NASCAR and potential Donald Trump voters…
…ok, I see your point.
Scout211
Please, please, oh football gods and goddesses, shine your light on my Hawkeyes tonight. ‘Kay?
I don’t think they can beat the Spartans. But I would be most happy if they do.
Dolly Llama
Betty, I tend to think your gators will get beat like people used to beat their children, but I could be wrong.
ETA because I’m a dumbass and didn’t read the original post hardly at all.
PurpleGirl
@jeffreyw: Awww. Kittehs are always appreciated.
Villago Delenda Est
Here’s hoping Clemson gets tripped up. And Betty, I am sending good thoughts to your Gators.
burnspbesq
So, as i understand it, the maximum-chaos scenario would involve wins by USC, Iowa, Florida, and the goddamn cheating Tarholes.
Sorry, that’s a bridge too far. If the goddamn cheating Tarholes were playing ISIS, I would be rooting for ISIS.
burnspbesq
C’mon Bournemouth!
BGinCHI
@burnspbesq: ISIS has no air game. Solid ground game just isn’t going to be enough.
Betty Cracker
@burnspbesq: That’s how I feel about the Semi-holes.
BGinCHI
@burnspbesq: Was just yelling at the screen for that very reason.
You see the Man City score? Sweet.
BGinCHI
@Betty Cracker: Same here about the Notre Dame-Holes.
Hmm, that sounds dirtier….
Villago Delenda Est
@burnspbesq: I don’t think USC can pull it off. I’m rooting for the Trees because the Fighting Fashion Nightmares beat them. Perverse, eh?
As for your sentiments, well, I understand your animus towards NC, but hey, they’re going up against Clemson. Clemson rubs me the wrong way, always has, always will. That damn paw.
bk
@burnspbesq: 11/7. 66-31.
Villago Delenda Est
@BGinCHI: Daesh also has useful idiots in the US working hard to enable their agenda. Not sure that parallels with anything in college football fandom.
The Dangerman
@Villago Delenda Est:
I think SC is destined for a beat down of “women and children, hide your eyes” proportions; it’s the reason Haden hired Helton last week.
Bill Murray
@Villago Delenda Est:
There are a lot of right wingers in both camps?
Digger O'Dell
ESPN3 seems to have three games on at the same time.
Felonius Monk
@BGinCHI:
Watch your language, Norway. I went to both Notre Dame and Purdue, so I resemble that remark. :)
BTW, have you seen this?
Staying warm over there?
burnspbesq
@BGinCHI:
Leicester City is currently in first place. Wrap your head around that.
burnspbesq
@Betty Cracker:
We did our part for your cause last night. Duke 2, F$U 0 in the national semis in women’s soccer. How good is the ACC? The eighth-place team is playing for the national championship tomorrow.
Felonius Monk
Rooting for the Hawkeyes over the Spartans tonight cause its been a long time since the days of Alex Karras and Forest Evashevski.
burnspbesq
@bk:
Hopefully that memory will sustain you when the NCAA shuts you down for three years and SACS pulls your accreditation.
Villago Delenda Est
@Felonius Monk: The comments on your link are fascinating. One person pointed out that it smacks of astroturf. Shoop sounds to me like exactly the kind of coach you want to have, unless of course you have a total asshole as AD.
BGinCHI
@Felonius Monk: You know I did my BA at Purdue too, yes?
It’s not the cold here, but the rain and dark (see last thread). Being near the ocean keep the temps more moderate, though it brings the rain, the rain, the rain.
Wally Ballou
Here in metro Detroit, a GOP legislator has indulged in overt racism of the baldest sort.
Felanius Kootea
Not a football fan (in Nigeria, I grew up on futbol, aka soccer, and over two decades in the US haven’t changed that affinity). Since this is the only active open thread I’ll post something non-football-related.
Went to see Spike Lee’s Chi-Raq last night (my husband is from the Southside of Chicago, had heard all the controversy about it and really wanted to see it while it’s still in theaters). Very timely given the gun debate. It’s an adaptation of Aristophanes’ Lysistrata that focuses on ending a gang war in Chicago that has produced many innocent victims through stray bullets. I have to say that it is definitely over-the-top but, in my opinion, one of the best movies Spike Lee has made since Do the Right Thing and Malcolm X. Teyonah Parris (Mad Men, Dear White People) was phenomenal as Lysistrata but I was also amazed by Nick Cannon’s turn as her boyfriend and head of one of the gangs (I’ve never taken him seriously as an actor). John Cusack plays a priest based on the real life Father Michael Pfleger (pastor of Saint Sabina for 34 years). Samuel Jackson narrates. My husband thought it was too over-the-top and since Lysistrata is at its heart, a comedy, that it didn’t go far enough or have the impact it should have. It will be in theaters for a few weeks and on Amazon Instant Video right after. (Like Netflix with Beasts of No Nation, Amazon is moving into the original film making and production game).
Roger Moore
@Villago Delenda Est:
There went your credibility to comment about college football.
BGinCHI
@Felonius Monk: No, but if Purdue has a craven AD and a craven football coach that would not surprise me.
I root for the basketball team but not football.
Wonder if Mrs. Shoop is related to Rick Mount? Ahh, the Rocket.
BGinCHI
@burnspbesq: I can’t. I really can’t.
BGinCHI
@Felonius Monk: Alex Karras’s brother played for Purdue.
Yeah, that’s some trivia.
Dolly Llama
@burnspbesq: Damn, Burnsie. If I didn’t know any better, I’d think you went to NC State talking like that.
Davebo
Can’t believe the Longhorns are up 20-0 on Baylor.
Not at all surprised U of Houston is taking care of business against Temple.
Gator90
G-d willing, the Gators will play over their heads, perform heroically for all 4 quarters, and keep the score semi-respectable.
Failing that, I will console myself with the knowledge that my second team, the Hurricanes, somehow found one of the best coaches in the game on the scrap heap and wisely plucked him therefrom.
Davebo
@Gator90: Miami still has a football program?
Dolly Llama
@Gator90: Wow, a Gator whose second team is Miami? That’s like me (UGA guy, see above) saying my second team is Tech or Florida, isn’t it?
For the record, I hope your Gators upset Alabama so Kirby Smart can finish shitting, get off the pot, and get his ass to Athens to salvage what’s left of our recruiting class.
Davebo
@efgoldman: I get that. When your punt returner is taking snaps times are bad.
I just hope UT can pull it off. Lots of pressure on Charlie Strong but I’d like to see him get another year. Beating OK and Baylor would seal the deal. (Actually, beating OK should have been enough)
Gator90
@Dolly Llama: I married into a family of Hurricane fans, moved to South Florida and have been attending UM games for years. So I sort of adopted the Canes as my second team. (Oddly, however, neither my wife nor any of my in-laws has reciprocated with the Gators, whom they continue to hate with mindless fury.)
Dolly Llama
@Gator90: I understand. I used to be married to a Gator. I emphasize the “used to be.”
BGinCHI
SCORE!!!!!
F U Chelsea.
Ruckus
@Dolly Llama:
Not being a football fan, my mind immediately heard a couple of not suitable for a family blog jokes. Not even a family like this one.
Amir Khalid
Wow. Bournemouth have taken a 1-0 lead in the 82nd minute at Chelsea. Probably not the score Jose Mourinho wanted to see.
dr. luba
@Wally Ballou: And of course it’s a Knollenberg! His dad was my rep until the demographics caught up with him and my district went blue; sonny boy had to move on to safer Troy.
Two generations of idiots is enough!
(Actually, I was surprised it wasn’t L. Brooks Patterson again. Maybe he learned to shut up after the New Yorker eviscerated him by accurately quoting him.)
raven
“one of the best coaches in the game ”
That is some serious horseshit especially from a gator.
raven
@Davebo: So you grew up on a boat? Texas Gulf Coast? I fished out of Port Aransas about 40 years ago!Saw Michael Martin Murphy at the Armadillo and Frieda and the Firedogs at the Broken Spoke on that trip! I had my Goat Roper Radio bumper sticker on my 62 GMC for many years!
Amir Khalid
@BGinCHI:
Some people are calling this match a relegation six-pointer. Bournemouth were in the bottom three at the start of the day, and Chelsea seem to be headed there now.
Gator90
@raven: I could be misremembering, but I believe I heard recently that only 3 coaches won more games their first 15 seasons than Richt did, and 2 of those were Barry Switzer and Tom Osborne. Not such bad company, IMO.
BGinCHI
@Amir Khalid: Agreed. These wins are huge for a side like BM, who could not have expected to get points today.
The universe is not kind enough for Chelsea to get relegated. Alas.
Davebo
@raven: No, I grew up on a houseboat on an undisclosed lake.
And I wouldn’t share that picture if I were you! Even 40 years ago there were size limits so not only is that stringer pretty pathetic, it’s also illegal. But yes, I fish Port A from time to time and had good luck there with specs and reds over the years.
Amir Khalid
@BGinCHI:
Chelsea might escape relegation this season by the skin of their teeth. I reckon Jose can still manage that, if Abramovich keeps him on. But it’s going to be a heavy financial hit for the team and the business, with no Champions League football to attract the top players they’ll want to sign.
ETA:
Sore loser.
raven
@Davebo: Like I give a fuck. I was on a boat, if they were illegal it was their responsibility to tell me and they didn’t.
raven
@Gator90: If I were a fucking mediocre Florida team that waxed us the last two years I’d call him a great coach too. Great guy, great coach. . .baloney.
BGinCHI
@Amir Khalid: Cry me a fucking river asshole.
Plus, Chelsea fans? Just terrible.
ETA: To be clear, I’m talking about Mourinho in my first line, not beloved commenter AK.
Betty Cracker
Can’t believe these dipshit announcers on the TX-Baylor game. When TX elected to go for it on 4th, they were saying it was the right decision, a gutsy call. When they didn’t make it, they were all “Poor decision to go for it.” Hello? Some of us can recall what you just said 3 minutes ago, asshats! ??
Felonius Monk
@BGinCHI: Yes, I do know you got a degree from Purdue. That’s the raison d’etre of my comment.
The weather here (eastern upstate NY) is beautiful blue sky and bright sunshine and near 50F. Nice December weather and the grass is still green. In fact, my neighbor was mowing his lawn earlier today.
Betty Cracker
@raven: Hippie dude!
raven
@Betty Cracker: Just one of the fellas!
Amir Khalid
@BGinCHI:
No problem. Meanwhile Man City did today what they always do when Vincent Kompany is out injured: they fell apart. Liverpool can gain some ground on them tomorrow at Newcastle.
Captain C
@burnspbesq: That was a very happy result. Both because I really like the Cherries, and because it’s fun to see Chelsea sink like the ’92 Mets (one of my worst fan seasons ever).
Captain C
@burnspbesq: The funny thing is, if you just flipped Chelsea and Leicester in the table, it would have been quite the reasonable prediction for this point in the season.
Davebo
@Betty Cracker: Idiotic announcers are a college football tradition!
Davebo
@raven: Obviously they weren’t old enough yet to learn to talk!
I’ve used bait in south florida bigger than those!
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@BGinCHI: re: your ETA. I figured as much, but the dark can do terrible things to people.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@raven: Fish fight, aisle 56!
Also, too, I sent you an email, since you said “heck yes” to my inquiry whether I could.
raven
@a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q): I can’t find it, I’ve been looking. I’m afraid it got dumped into a thread. Remind me of the topic?
Gator90
@raven: “dazzling array of individual talent”
That kind of recruiting prowess is certainly welcome in Coral Gables.
My predictions are often wrong, but just for fun here goes:
Richt, despite being much older, will win more games at UM than Smart wins at Georgia.
raven
@Davebo: Yea and they are the same size I caught the 130lb yellowfin on too.
raven
@Davebo: Not that I really care but there were no limits on Red Snappers, Redfish, AJ’s, Triggers or any other fish I know of back then. I actually don’t know where we caught those, I know we went out of Aransas but I don’t know how far out.
Davebo
Coogs win AAC championship. Not really surprising.
bk
@burnspbesq: Right.
a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)
@raven: Bella Q’s old man Navy WWII is the topic, and I sent it earlier today (I should have said). I just sent it again.
Off to bake Xmas cookies at a local cafe. Fun? I’ll find out. Hope everyone has a dandy afternoon.
bk
@srv: You know who else has a wife that came to the U.S. under that visa program?
raven
@a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q): markann at google mail
Davebo
@raven: LOL!
Let it go, the statute of limitations ran out a long time ago.
One of my oldest friends is by far the best fisherman I’ve ever met having fished all over the world. He’s much more into it than I am. He’s in the pacific northwest when not working but when he comes to town he always goes by this place.
raven
just fun
raven
@Davebo: Cool, I’ve never seen that! thanks
Mnemosyne (tablet)
@Wally Ballou:
Conservatives always say we can’t solve the problem of poor public schools by throwing money at the problem, but since we’ve never actually tried it, how can they be so sure?
Let’s throw enough money at Detroit public schools so that classes have a ratio of 10 students per teacher all the way through high school. Every school has 1 nurse for every 50 kids. Every school has 1 psychologist/social worker for every 15 kids. Throw money at maintenance until there isn’t as much as a squeaky door in every school building. Throw money into construction so every school has a nice gym and an indoor pool. Keep the spending at those levels for 30 years and if there’s still a gap, then they can say that throwing money at the problem doesn’t work.
But they’ll never do it, because they know it would work and prove them wrong.
zzyzx
@Digger O’Dell: ESPN3 is a web streaming service, not a channel.Important for those who need to see that Appalachian State/South Mississippi game.
If I cared about college football I wouldn’t laugh because my grad school alma mater (NMSU) is on ESPN3 right now. “My” Aggies are winning too.
The Timer was an Aggie toooo-ooooo…
Villago Delenda Est
@Mnemosyne (tablet): Throwing money at defense always seems to work. Why can’t it work for education? Or enforcement of regulations?
After all, tax cuts (throwing money at jerb “creators”) is their answer to everything!
Davebo
@raven: It’s a freaking playground for grownups into fishing.
I bought a Calcutta reel there just last week. I should be out on the bay using it today but other things got in the way.
goblue72
@Mnemosyne (tablet): And it would cost a LOT of money. Massive tax increase kind of money. There’s a diminishing returns to education in terms of money thrown at it – just like any other endeavor. And its not like we spend so much less than other countries. Finland – which liberals love to use as an example of a good K-12 system – doesn’t spend that much more than the U.S. on primary education as a percentage of GDP per capita.
How we spend our money is as important as how much we spend. Should we spend more? Sure. Should we just throw money at it? No.
Massachusetts is a good example of the kind of education reform the nation should be adopting – a combination of carrots and sticks – with more money being spent overall, with a focus on providing more parity between rich and poor cities, while also implementing strict standards (which included testing and teacher accountability). Charter schools – which nationally are coming under a worthwhile critical spotlight for some of their failings – have found success in Massachusetts. (Likely because Massachusetts doesn’t permit the kinds of charter school shenanigans that occur in other states).
So yeah, more money. But also reform. I would imagine Detroit schools (along with a lot of school districts in big cities) area complete mess that need reform from top to bottom.
raven
@Davebo: I wonder who makes them? The bait and tackle joint I went to in Panama City last week had a ton of their stuff.
Davebo
@raven: Who makes what?
raven
@Davebo: The Calcutta stuff, reels in particular.
Betty Cracker
@Gator90: Richt always seemed like more of an ACC guy to me. Makes sense for him to go to the U.
Redshift
@goblue72:
There’s one of the biggest flaws in our system. Schools are overwhelmingly funded by local property taxes, so the kids that need the most help automatically get the least, and vice versa. It would be hard to design a worse funding strategy if you tried.
Davebo
It’s been a good day so far college football wise but if Florida could somehow beat Alabama I think I’ll decapitate in my pants.
Steeplejack (tablet)
What’s the line on this Bama-Gators game?
raven
@Betty Cracker: He should bring a different type of player than the old Criminals vs the Catholics!
Mnemosyne (tablet)
@goblue72:
Here’s a PDF from the state of Michigan detailing public school expenditures. They claim to be spending $14K per student in the largest school district (Detroit), but teacher salaries are $18K LESS than the next largest school district with the same number of teachers. So what the hell is the state spending that money on? The buildings are crumbling, so it’s not going to maintenance or facilities.
I detailed above where I think the money should be spent: on smaller class sizes, school nurses, school psychologists, and facilities and building maintenance. If you disagree with any of those priorities, please explain why.
Just One More Canuck
Betty, up until now I didn’t care about either Alabama or Florida, but the prospect of “Nick Saban’s lips would compress and his sphincter would tighten to such a degree that it would deform the space-time continuum, creating a black hole with such strong gravitational pull that nothing, not even light, could escape, eventually absorbing all the matter in our solar system and perhaps destroying the whole galaxy as it becomes the most supermassive black hole in the universe” has turned me into a Gators fan – love your writing
Davebo @97 – decapitate in your pants?
raven
@Just One More Canuck: Someone tried to tell me that there were no college sports in Canada. That is untrue, no?
Davebo
@raven:
Shimano makes them. It’s the best bait caster I’ve ever tried and I’ve tried them all. Well, unless you need one of those mega Penn’s for deep offshore.
raven
God I hate it, the Gator coach is really a good guy.
raven
@Davebo: Cool!
Gin & Tonic
@raven: That is completely untrue.
oldgold
My Hawkeyes, like Rodney Dangerfield, get no respect.The Hawkeye fans have gone Godwin. For a good laugh watch this.
http://youtu.be/uNEYhwcbK9k
Betty Cracker
@raven: Didn’t set expectations high, did he?
Gin & Tonic
@raven: They have pretty big arenas for it, too.
raven
@Gin & Tonic: Glad I was right!
raven
@Betty Cracker: He was born at night bun not LAST night!
Steeplejack (tablet)
@Steeplejack (tablet):
Bama –17. Shnikeys. Didn’t think it would be that much.
raven
@Steeplejack (tablet): Shit, we were actually a 2 pt favorite over Bama. They fucking destroyed us (one of the greatest coaches EVAH). Makes you think Saban orchestrated the loss to Ole Miss just to get them fuckers good and mad.
Betty Cracker
@Steeplejack (tablet): The Gators are the worst 10-win team in the NCAA. No question. But in a couple of years, they’ll be scary good!
Steeplejack (tablet)
So I guess I should watch golf from the Bahamas. Yeah, no.
raven
@Steeplejack (tablet): There’s a bowl game there too!
Just One More Canuck
@raven: Like G&T says, untrue – just not nearly at the same level of attention as it is down there – a typical football game might draw a couple of thousand, except on homecoming weekends, when drunken alumni fill the stands. It’s not any kind of money maker
raven
@Just One More Canuck: This guy and I were just talking about the difference between here and Europe and he said Canada was the same. I was pretty sure that was not the case.
Betty Cracker
Is “engagement season” really a thing? Or just something jewelers are trying to make happen?
? Martin
@Mnemosyne (tablet): Security, truancy, food.
The GOP has very successfully destroyed the broad public safety net and they shove these duties into the schools, so the schools take on the responsibility for ensuring that kids are fed and kept safe. They then blame these additional costs for the general failure of public schools and argue that they should be privatized.
Mnemosyne (tablet)
@Steeplejack (tablet):
The Carribbean league baseball season is in progress, though you might have to watch it on a Spanish-language channel.
Davebo
Gator just gave up there.
What was Steve Martin’s joke about punting on first down?
Mnemosyne (tablet)
@? Martin:
Rikyrah has a link to a depressing story in the thread below about kids in Chicago public schools primarily being taught math and science by substitutes, and then being chastised for low test scores when they have a hard time learning the material from an ever-changing rotation of new subs. And round and round the cycle goes …
schrodinger's cat
@Betty Cracker: First time I heard about it.
raven
@efgoldman: PIP comes with Dish regardless of the TV. The Dish anywhere also puts it on my iPad.
Just One More Canuck
@raven: I think that the value and availability of athletic scholarships is a lot higher in the US, which draws a lot of students south. My daughter plays competitive soccer, and all but one of her coaches played college soccer in the US. They could have gone to university here in Canada, but more likely out of their own pocket Like I said, we do have college sports up here, but it’s just not the industry it is down there
raven
@Just One More Canuck: Didn’t most of the women on the Canadian national team play college ball here?
D58826
@Mnemosyne (tablet): That line of reasoning never stops them from throwing more money at the Pentagon to solve the crisis de jur. Or we have the Ted Cruz soluidtiuon to ISIS ‘kill them all and carpet bomb wherever we find them’.
? Martin
@Mnemosyne (tablet): Yeah, that’s part of it as well. But to give an example – my kids HS has a uniformed officer on campus at all times. He/she works with counselors, does the DARE thing in health class, etc. That officer is paid for by the city, but not part of the school budget. That individual does not work for the school, but works for the city PD. But at some inner city schools I know of, those officers are paid for under the school budget. If they feel metal detectors are needed – those are paid for by the school and the operators of those are under the school budget (no metal detectors at my kids school). If you have truancy problems, you need staff to stay on top of that because attendance is how you are budgeted. (My kids school doesn’t have a truancy problem and doesn’t have staff dedicated to that in spite of having 2,000 kids).
So if you compare per-student spending, they look nothing alike. My kids school looks really cheap, and that inner city school is expensive, simply because of where some of these things are accounted from. These things add up quickly.
Steeplejack (tablet)
@raven:
I’ve got PIP with my Cox DVR.
? Martin
@raven: Title IX has a whole other set of effects. US universities have to put a lot more money into women’s sports in order to maintain the mens sports. That’s why US women dominate so many sports.
JPL
Finally finished the leafs and mowed the yard for the last time until spring. My grass is still green though, so who knows?
I blame Gore…
Go Gators!
Davebo
At least 32 reported dead in an explosion on a production platform in the Caspian Sea.
More bad news
Betty Cracker
Wooohoooo!
raven
This is why they play em!
Just One More Canuck
@raven: @? Martin: I think of team member is still in high school, but everyone else did I think – Title IX makes it a lot more attractive for Canadian females to go south for their education
The Dangerman
Gators! Other than blocking for kicks (and offense, of course), they’ve looked solid.
Liberal
@goblue72: testing as a means of evaluating teacher performance has no science behind it.
You need to build a regression model. After you take into account all the confounders like SES of the student household, there’s not much left. AFAICT no such models are built when testing is used to evaluate teachers.
raven
@The Dangerman: And their offense.
Mnemosyne
@Liberal:
Here’s the link that rikyrah provided below about the revolving door of substitutes at high-poverty schools. I misread it initially — it’s actually about a public school in Pennsylvania.
If kids don’t even have a consistent teacher with a consistent lesson plan, how the hell do we expect them to pass high-stakes tests?
Bill Murray
@Just One More Canuck: as evidenced by the fine Notre Dame – Connecticut Women’s BBall game going on now.
My school beat Simon Fraser in a US football game this year. Simon Fraser plays in the Division 2 Great Northwest Athletic Conference
Just One More Canuck
@Bill Murray: Ah yes, the not-so brilliantly named Simon Fraser Clan – at least they don’t spell it with a K