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I know this must be bad for Joe Biden, I just don’t know how.

Yeah, with this crowd one never knows.

Do not shrug your shoulders and accept the normalization of untruths.

“More of this”, i said to the dog.

People are complicated. Love is not.

Impressively dumb. Congratulations.

We cannot abandon the truth and remain a free nation.

A thin legal pretext to veneer over their personal religious and political desires

Why did Dr. Oz lose? well, according to the exit polls, it’s because Fetterman won.

We are builders in a constant struggle with destroyers. let’s win this.

Incompetence, fear, or corruption? why not all three?

This blog will pay for itself.

Reality always lies in wait for … Democrats.

Accused of treason; bitches about the ratings. I am in awe.

The truth is, these are not very bright guys, and things got out of hand.

I’d try pessimism, but it probably wouldn’t work.

The words do not have to be perfect.

Too often we hand the biggest microphones to the cynics and the critics who delight in declaring failure.

It’s always darkest before the other shoe drops.

John Fetterman: Too Manly for Pennsylvania.  Paid for by the Oz for Senator campaign.

You don’t get to peddle hatred on saturday and offer condolences on sunday.

Jesus, Mary, & Joseph how is that election even close?

Despite his magical powers, I don’t think Trump is thinking this through, to be honest.

Sitting here in limbo waiting for the dice to roll

You are here: Home / Civil Rights / Racial Justice / #BLM #M4BL / No Justice for Tamir Rice

No Justice for Tamir Rice

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Grand Jury refuses to indict police officers for driving up to a 12 year old kid, gunning him down before the car was stopped, and then failing to provide medical attention:

A grand jury in Cleveland has declined to indict a city police officer in the fatal shooting last year of 12-year-old Tamir Rice.

The decision by grand jurors on Monday was the end of a lengthy investigation that was criticized by Tamir’s family and by activists, who called the shooting senseless and said the officer should have been charged with murder months ago.

Tamir, who was black, was carrying a replica gun outside a recreation center when someone called 911. The caller cautioned that Tamir was probably a juvenile and that the weapon was “probably fake,” but that information was not relayed to the two officers who responded, Timothy Loehmann and Frank Garmback.

Surveillance video, which has been widely circulated online, showed Officer Garmback pulling the police cruiser within a few feet of Tamir, and Officer Loehmann, who is white, stepping out of the car and almost immediately firing his gun. Tamir died hours later. His partner, Officer Garmback, was also not indicted.

Timothy J. McGinty, the Cuyahoga County prosecutor, who made the announcement at a news conference, said that while “this was a perfect storm of human error,” the evidence considered by a grand jury over two months “did not constitute criminal action by police.” He noted that the law gives the benefit of the doubt to a police officer “who must make a split second decision.”

This basically boils down to the fact that McGinty didn’t want an indictment, and then made sure he didn’t get one. And let’s remember who this scumbag is:

Ohio prosecutor Timothy McGinty accused the family of 12-year-old police shooting victim Tamir Rice of being “economically motivated” in their pursuit to bring the officer responsible to trial.

“They waited until they didn’t like the reports they received. They’re very interesting people… let me just leave it at that… and they have their own economic motives,” McGinty said during a community meeting Thursday, Cleveland’s WKYC reported.

McGinty’s remarks Thursday were his first public comments on the grand jury process regarding Rice’s death, raising questions about his objectivity in the case and its ongoing investigation.

In other news, it’s a shame that Tamir Rice wasn’t born white:

A North Carolina woman was arrested on Christmas Eve after she was spotted with a BB gun in front of the police department and pointed it at officers and told them to shoot her.

Police received a 911 call about a woman in front of the police department with a gun around 7:30 p.m. Thursday. They found Elaine Rothenberg, 66, standing in front of a doorway at the police department with a gun raised and in a shooting stance.

Police said Rothenberg, who was from North Carolina but had been staying on Cliffside Drive in the city, yelled about hating cops and told officers “what are you doing, shoot me!” and “what are you, scared?” She raised the gun at officers and yelled “boom, boom, boom.”

After a brief standoff Rothenberg told officers the gun was fake and threw it to the ground, police said. She was taken into custody and police determined she had been holding a BB gun.

Rothenberg was charged with first-degree threatening, second-degree breach of peace, seven counts of reckless endangerment and interfering with police.

So glad we live in a post-racial America.

Reader Interactions

148Comments

  1. 1.

    Kryptik

    There was an indictment though.

    Tamir Rice was indicted for looking too old while black, and therefore being a “thug”, and “thugs” are always ok to kill.

  2. 2.

    Corner Stone

    They’ve been slut shaming Tamir all over the damn place. His skirt was too short and his skin was too black.
    I still have yet to figure out how “he looked older” makes shooting someone in a park after 2 seconds evaluation better, somehow.

  5. 5.

    Frankensteinbeck

    If Tamir had been six foot six of crime-hardened muscle holding a real gun that he’d been threatening people with, you know what would have been the stupidest fucking thing in the world to do? Pull up right next to him on the grass and immediately open fire. There is no justification for Tamir’s death, no way in which this was not homicide. The only question is how deliberately this was a race-motivated murder.

  6. 6.

    Corner Stone

    “His parents sent him out that day on a mission. They sent him to that park with that toy, knowing he was their ultimate meal ticket. They sent him to ruthlessly attack, over and over and over again, a harmless cop car for more than 1.9 seconds! They callously sold their son for an attempt to cash in.”
    /OH Prosecutor, essentially

  7. 7.

    Brachiator

    From various news sources:

    Come Jan. 1, licensed firearms owners in Texas will be able to openly carry a handgun in most places. A law signed by Republican Gov. Greg Abbott earlier this year will make Texas the most populous state in the U.S. to allow the practice, known as “open carry.”

    Existing Texas law requires licensed gun owners to conceal their handguns so they aren’t in plain view. The new law will allow them to carry handguns openly, in belt or shoulder holsters.

    But private businesses and other establishments have the right to ban open carry under the law, and many have been wrestling with how to proceed….

    But some law-enforcement officials worry allowing citizens to publicly carry firearms will put police officers at greater risk. In a February survey taken before the law was passed, 75% of Texas police chiefs who responded said they were opposed to open carry, according to the Texas Police Chiefs Association.

    “When my officers are responding to situations or disturbances where a gun is involved, how are they supposed to know who the good guy or the bad guy is with the gun?” said Houston’s police chief, Charles McClelland.

    This is an invitation for more shooting of innocent people, especially people of color. Cause, you know, probably a bad guy, and if not, who knew?

    And yet the NRA loves this crap, and is backing it to the max.

  8. 8.

    Mnemosyne

    So, just checking, “human error” that kills someone is no longer punishable by law? I guess we can rid of all of those pesky involuntary manslaughter laws currently on the books.

    Oh, that’s right — it’s only cops who can never be held accountable for their errors. Fuck the rest of us.

  9. 9.

    SiubhanDuinne

    Sorry to say I am not the tiniest little bit surprised by this. Disappointed and disgusted, yes, but not surprised.

  11. 11.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @Brachiator:

    75% of Texas police chiefs who responded said they were opposed to open carry

    Then I suggest you become Democrats, guys*.

    *That raises an interesting question. How many police chiefs are women? Are my prejudices that it’s a male dominated profession true?

  12. 12.

    celticdragonchick

    Burn the fucking system down. That’s all. It’s hand jobs and fluffing for anybody who has money and the right skin color or who works in the system, and a bullet in the chest for everybody else (most especially if you have…ahem…off white skin tone)

    Criminal justice has nothing to do with justice. It protects the one percent.

    Burn it down.

  13. 13.

    celticdragonchick

    @Mnemosyne:

    So, just checking, “human error” that kills someone is no longer punishable by law?

    Mulligans all around as long as you say “I believed he was a threat!!!!” and you have a badge.

  14. 14.

    lamh36

    @sarahkendzior 7m7 minutes ago
    Our most beloved Christmas movie is about a white boy and his toy gun in Cleveland, Ohio. Spoiler: the police didn’t murder him

  15. 15.

    Steeplejack (tablet)

    @Corner Stone:

    Also, maybe you don’t have to make a “split-second decision” if you don’t roll up “a few feet” away from someone you think might have a gun.

  18. 18.

    lamh36

    @AriMelber

    Prosecutor Matt Meyer cites unnamed associate of Tamir Rice saying he would sometimes pull the toy gun out “like a robber.”

    Notice the use of “associate” to describe the friends of a 12 year old.

    This prosecutor has never thought charges should be brought for these cops. He brought no evidence to support indictment to the grand jury. He knew what he wanted from the start.

    Yet time and time again, I’ve been told… to believe in the justice system. Sandra Bland, John Crawford, Laquan, Freddie Gray, trayvon, mike brown, eric garner…the list goes on and on.

    I am fuckin’ tired of it. And alot of people like me are fuckin’ tired of one more person saying well, “the justice system works this way”…as if the justice system in this country ever worked for POC as well as it had for non-POC.

    And no, I don’t give a fuq bout the “civil suit” may give the families some peace…BULLSHIT. It’s fuqn cop-out and it it makes some feel better thinking then great…but it does NOTHING for me…

    Why, cause…rinse, lather and repeat.

    Then the fuqn prosecutor used the bullshit ass press conference to shoot up that 12 year old child’s dead body some more along with throwing shit at the dead child’s parents…

    Fuq him and Fuq them all.

  20. 20.

    Betty Cracker

    I’ll admit I was naïve enough to think maybe the shooter would be held accountable since it was all captured on video. Stupid of me, I know. Fucking hell.

  21. 21.

    lamh36

    In a statement issued not long after the prosecutor’s announcement, attorneys for Tamir Rice’s family decried the grand jury process and renewed their calls for the Department of Justice to bring federal charges.

    “It has been clear for months now that Cuyahoga County Prosecutor Timothy McGinty was abusing and manipulating the grand jury process to orchestrate a vote against indictment,” the family attorneys said. “Even though video shows the police shooting Tamir in less than one second, Prosecutor McGinty hired so-called expert witnesses to try to exonerate the officers and tell the grand jury their conduct was reasonable and justified. It is unheard of, and highly improper, for a prosecutor to hire ‘experts’ to try to exonerate the targets of a grand jury investigation.”

  23. 23.

    lamh36

    Fuq John Kasick

    “Tamir Rice’s death was a heartbreaking tragedy and I understand how this decision will leave many people asking themselves if justice was served,” Ohio Gov. John Kasich (R) said in a statement. “We all lose, however, if we give in to anger and frustration and let it divide us. We have made progress to improve the way communities and police work together in our state, and we’re beginning to see a path to positive change so everyone shares in the safety and success they deserve. When we are strong enough together to turn frustration into progress we take another step up the higher path.”

  24. 24.

    James Franks

    I’ve been on a Grand Jury. John is exactly right; the only reason they didn’t indict was because the prosecutor didn’t want them to. The standard usually is; has the prosecutor presented enough evidence that there is a chance the defendant is guilty. That is a very low bar.

  25. 25.

    lamh36

    Fuq Marcia Fudge, sure would have been nice if she expressed this sentiment before…whatever…more CYA

    Congresswoman Marcia Fudge (D) said in a statement that that McGinty’s decision to release pieces of evidence throughout the ongoing investigation tainted the process, and that he should have stepped aside and allowed for a special prosecutor.

    “Although the grand jury decision may be the right one, we will never know because the prosecutor refused to step down and allow an independent review,” Fudge said. “The prosecutor conducted the investigation in a manner that I believe inappropriate and as a result he has lost the trust and confidence of our community, and, indeed, mine as well. I accept the decision, but the means do not justify the end.”

  26. 26.

    dogwood

    Nothing surprising about this at all. Too many aggressive racists are drawn to law enforcement, and there’s no serious mechanisms to weed them out. And I’m under no illusion that a good number of these over aggressive cops wouldn’t shoot a lot more white folks if they thought they could get away with it.

  28. 28.

    Baud

    Looks like this is a good time to repost my favorite Supreme Court paragraph:

    Another development over the past half-century that deters civil-rights violations is the increasing professionalism of police forces, including a new emphasis on internal police discipline. Even as long ago as 1980 we felt it proper to “assume” that unlawful police behavior would “be dealt with appropriately” by the authorities, United States v. Payner, 447 U. S. 727, 733-734, n. 5 (1980), but we now have increasing evidence that police forces across the United States take the constitutional rights of citizens seriously. There have been “wide-ranging reforms in the education, training, and supervision of police officers.” S. Walker, Taming the System: The Control of Discretion in Criminal Justice 1950-1990, p. 51 (1993). Numerous sources are now available to teach officers and their supervisors what is required of them under this Court’s cases, how to respect constitutional guarantees in various situations, and how to craft an effective regime for internal discipline. See, e. g., D. Waksman & D. Goodman, The Search and Seizure Handbook (2d ed. 2006); A. Stone & S. DeLuca, Police Administration: An Introduction (2d ed. 1994); E. Thibault, L. Lynch, & R. McBride, Proactive Police Management (4th ed. 1998). Failure to teach and enforce constitutional requirements exposes municipalities to financial liability. See Canton v. Harris, 489 U. S. 378, 388 (1989). Moreover, modern police forces are staffed with professionals; it is not credible to assert that internal discipline, which can limit successful careers, will not have a deterrent effect. There is also evidence that the increasing use of various forms of citizen review can enhance police accountability.

  30. 30.

    dogwood

    And what on earth does the family have to do with whether or not a prosecutor advocates for an indictment? I could give a shit if the Rice family are upstanding citizens or complete assholes. A cop killed a kid without provocation. That’s all that should matter to the DA.

  33. 33.

    Lynn Dee

    This is really one of the most outrageous cases. If the cops hadn’t gone screaming up to within a few feet of Tamir, a split second decision wouldn’t have been necessary. Just heart-breaking.

  34. 34.

    ruemara

    Never had a doubt. My co-worker is a former Army guy and swore that the kid reached into his waistband. I told the role of an in country patrol is not the same as a neighborhood cop responding to a disturbance. Just worn out with this crap.

  35. 35.

    jl

    Not enough evidence to bring this to the jury? Really?
    I heard the prosecutor’s statement on radio, and seemed to me he was really straining.
    But, he sounded all nice and concerned, which I guess is supposed to be enough. It is not.

    I’ve seen enough video clips to conclude that pretty much any ‘lesser’ person can be executed in public by the local police in this country, though it happens far more often with African-Americans and Hispanics.

    The initial news of the latest shooting in Chicago is hard to believe. The guy who phoned in the initial domestic abuse complaint got himself shot by police, and a middle aged woman who happened to be outside at the time. All by accident?? WTF?

  36. 36.

    gratuitous

    Once again, here’s how you can determine whether someone’s life mattered to society at large: When a person is killed, do the local media and the powers that be provide a platform for the victim’s friends and relatives to give voice to their feelings, whether it’s sorrow, anger, outrage, or even murderous revenge? Or are they counseled to remain calm, and wait for further developments?

    When the survivors think the system has failed the victim or insufficiently punished someone, does the local media figuratively hold the survivors’ hands while uncritically publishing their frustration? Or do they concentrate on any expression that crosses some vaguely defined line and scold the survivors?

    If a criminal case is not built against the perpetrators, do the survivors get comfort from a prosecutor who has insufficient evidence to make a case or do they get a scolding?

    If a person’s life matters to society, the first alternative is what the survivors will get. When a person’s life doesn’t matter, they’ll get the second alternative.

  37. 37.

    Omnes Omnibus

    Sarah Kendzior ‏@sarahkendzior 44m44 minutes ago

    Our most beloved Christmas movie is about a white boy and his toy gun in Cleveland, Ohio. Spoiler: the police didn’t murder him.
    250 retweets 201 likes

  38. 38.

    rikyrah

    fyi

    Samuel Sinyangwe
    ‏@samswey
    Every person killed by Cleveland police over the past four years has been black. 70% have been unarmed. #TamirRice

  42. 42.

    lamh36

    Oh and how’s this for funny/non funny facts…

    @DanaHoule
    Yes, it is. RT @daiconrad: @DanaHoule Holy shit, is [the GOP’s] convention in Cleveland this year?

  43. 43.

    jl

    @rikyrah: It’s sickening. It is hard for me to believe what I heard on the radio, that some very special hi-tech split-milli-second analysis of videos showed that the kid really did point the gun at the cop, so the law could not touch the cop at all, very clearly. Really? Not enough question to refer to the jury? I call BS. And the guy’s really concerned sanctimonious apologetic tone made it worse.

    And if the prosecutor is correct, then something wrong with the laws, and we need a national program to reform policing in this country and retrain the police. It really looks like unsanctioned impromptu public execution by local police is just fine in this country, as long the executed is one of the ‘lesser people’: minority, poor, mentally disturbed, or in wrong place at wrong time and not rich.

  46. 46.

    Baud

    @Omnes Omnibus:
    @jl:

    There was this in 2014 this year.

    The United States Department of Justice and the City of Cleveland announced today that they have entered into a court enforceable agreement to address the department’s findings that the Cleveland Division of Police (CDP) engages in a pattern or practice of using excessive force in violation of the Fourth Amendment. The agreement will create widespread reforms and changes within the CDP. The changes focus on building community trust, creating a culture of community and problem-oriented policing, officer safety and training, officer accountability and technological upgrades. Under the agreement, the parties will jointly select an independent monitor to assess and report whether the requirements of the agreement have been implemented for a term of at least five years.

    ETA: Actually, earlier this year.

  47. 47.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Baud: Well then, the feds should be crawling all over Cleveland immediately.

    ETA: The consent agreement came after Tamir’s killing, but today’s result doesnnot fill me with a lot of confidence that the folks around Cuyahoga County are doing and thing but fuck all to fix things.

  49. 49.

    lamh36

    @hosienation 45m45 minutes ago La Vergne, TN
    He was 12 and “should have known better.” Meanwhile this Affluenza fucker KILLED 4, and they let him go. He didn’t know any better, tho.

  51. 51.

    Gimlet

    Bummer the cop didn’t have his day in court to clear his name once and for all.

    Have all that testimony and the cross examination right there in the public record so that the people could see the righteousness of it, just like the guilty verdict against the Chicago 7 (or 8).

  54. 54.

    Hungry Joe

    I agree with everyone who’s been pointing out that the cops didn’t have to roll up to within a few feet of the boy. My police training amounts to zero hours and zero minutes, but I’d think that the proper procedure, when you’ve been told there’s a guy with a gun standing alone in a park, would be to stop, say, 50 feet short of him, and from the safety of your car call out, “Hey, buddy, you got a gun on you? How about letting us see your hands?”

    Is it too far-fetched to suggest that most police be unarmed most of the time? Maybe carry guns in their cars, but have to have a good reason for taking them out? Obviously if they’re going into what they’re sure is a dangerous situation, they’d arm up. But in general wouldn’t it be better if they had a badge, pepper spray, a stick, and a let’s-work-this-out attitude?

    Yeah, I know: DREAMER.

  55. 55.

    Rashi

    In regard to just the facts, is there criminality here or malpractice? Racism may’ve ultimately been the cause of the shooting but that’s not going to help a prosecutor get an indictment.

  58. 58.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Rashi: There were easily enough facts in this case for a competent prosecutor who wanted to get an indictment to get one.

  59. 59.

    dogwood

    @Hungry Joe:
    I agree completely. Never understood why they didn’t use a bullhorn to get the kid to drop whatever he had. And if I remember correctly, the person who called the police informed them that it might be a toy gun. It wasn’t a panic call by any means. That alone should have made this incident routine.

  60. 60.

    WaterGirl

    This is getting to be just like the mass shootings. Here’s another one. It’s a terrible tragedy. Nothing we can do about it. I’m so angry but I feel helpless to do anything about it.

    This is as much of an epidemic as any disease, it is surely killing more people than the Ebola scare did. It seems like every single human being in the united states should stand up and be counted. Do black lives matter, or not?

  62. 62.

    lamh36

    @dogwood: the entire process was shitty from the start, the dispatcher didn’t inform the responding officers that it was a toy gun.

    Oh and just in case you weren’t convinced this whole grand jury and prosecutor was a P.O.S. from the beginning…

    @AriMelber
    Prosecutor’s new #TamirRice report states

    Officers could fear he would leave, enter nearby Rec Ctr & shoot people:

  63. 63.

    Rashi

    @Baud: The video seems to be the only neutral source of evidence and apparently shows the kid holding or going for the gun so I’m not sure how you get an indictment here.

    @Omnes Omnibus: How exactly would he do that and for what charges?

  64. 64.

    jl

    @Gimlet: The hung jury in the first Baltimore case was bizarre and distrubing to me. I can’t understand it unless the cop was over charged and the jury couldn’t convict on lesser charges. From what I heard, all those cops acted in a clearly negligent manner. The defense seemed to be ‘Well, what the hey, they always act in a negligent manner, and never follow procedure… so no manslaughter, no reckless endangerment no nothing, since they are always negligent.”

    That is my understanding. If anyone knows better (IANAL), let me know.

  65. 65.

    gwangung

    @Rashi: Officers stated they warned RIce three times. And then gave first aid to him afterwards.

    Those are multiple counts of filing false reports. And the failure to give first aid or even allow it seems to be a factor in in his death.

  66. 66.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Rashi: Ohio is an open carry state. Assuming it was a real gun (it wasn’t), it was not illegal for him to walk around with it. Like this guy. Shooting someone who was not violating the law within seconds of arriving on the scene should be enough for probable cause that a crime was committed.

  68. 68.

    jl

    @Rashi: Everyone admits he was holding something that could be mistaken for a real and lethal gun. That is not the issue.

    Why the cops found it necessary to drive right up to the kid when there was no clear reason to, and shoot within two seconds of arriving, whether the cops should have known it was a toy gun, whether the kid could reasonably be considered to be threatening the cops with the gun, those are the issues.

    And IMHO white guy’s opinion, why middle class white guys can get away with worse (though I have seen public execution videos of them too) while African-Americans, Hispanics and homeless people typically get shot dead asap is a problem.

  71. 71.

    oz29

    @jl: I’m not sure it would matter. Most people have absolutely no clue what lawyers (particularly trial lawyers) do, let alone what goes on in the grand jury room.

    When I read the transcript of the proceedings in re Darren Wilson, I thought it was patently obvious that the prosecutors deliberately confused the grand jury and went out of their way to sabotage the case against Wilson. A very good friend of mine who is an elected prosecutor thought so as well. Remember the media reaction? “The grand jury cleared Darren Wilson of wrongdoing” and such.

    Worse still, cops are unlikely to bound over when the question is put to a judge in a public preliminary hearing. Another elected prosecutor I am acquainted with prosecuted a white tribal police officer for the videotaped shooting of a native american man who had his hands in the air. The judge (a former prosecutor who is now just a prosecutor in a robe) declined to find probable cause that the officer committed voluntary manslaughter.

    The entire justice system is built to make excuses for poorly trained, dumb, or even downright criminal cops. The system itself prevents any meaningful oversight of police. Sadly, our justice system does both of these things every day, in plain view, and nobody cares.

  72. 72.

    jl

    @Omnes Omnibus: Thanks for the reminder. That is something else that is a real problem: cops acting in a dishonest manner afterward and facing no sanctions.

    I remember the cop who shot the guy in the back after a very minor traffic stop merely because he decided to run away. Then the cop planted evidence to support a future false police report. Did that cop face any legal consequences (honest question, since I forget)? I think he was fired, but not sure.

    So many of these shootings to keep track of.

  74. 74.

    jl

    @oz29: From what I heard in the news about the California decision to ban grand jury investigations into fatal police encounters, the idea was that there should be a public record of the investigation to maintain public trust. If a DA conducted a bogus investigation to avoid a trial, at least there would be a public record of what was done.

    So, I think it is a good idea, and maybe best we can do until get police reform and retraining.

  78. 78.

    oz29

    @jl: Independent investigations are a lot better way to build public trust, in my opinion. Don’t get me wrong, I would be perfectly happy if the states that still use grand juries scrapped them altogether, so eliminating secrecy is fine by me. It appears to me to be a way for the legislature to look like it’s doing something without actually doing something that would piss off the police unions.

  83. 83.

    jl

    @oz29: I can see your point. But that might just remove the source of doubt to who appoints the independent investigator, and who that person is.

    But, I think requiring a detailed public record of such investigations is a good first step, which IANAL me understands is what is missing in grand jury proceedings.

  86. 86.

    Ruckus

    The Guardian site shows 1126 people killed by police this year. The number of blacks killed per million is over twice that of any other group.
    Will this ever stop? I’d ask how?
    We are a country of 300+ million people but even so these are unbelievable numbers. Except that is believable. Not understandable, not in any way right or necessary but believable.
    Our countries racism, half our political system, our seeming love of violence and especially our overriding idiotic love of guns gives us these results.
    How do we change it?

  87. 87.

    Rashi

    @gwangung: Don’t know the case well enough to make a judgement on that but you’d think the prosecutor would be making his life unnecessarily difficult if he failed to get an indictment on any easy and clearly justifiable charges.

    @Omnes Omnibus: The problem here is that the video shows the boy might’ve been waving, going for, or lifting his gun and there’s no evidence the cops acted with any criminal intent. How do you do reasonably expect to get a conviction here?

  88. 88.

    JPL

    @Rashi: Maybe the point is not to make two second decisions… In the olden days.. Well never mind..
    Don’t know the case well enough to make a judgement on that but
    so I won’t

  89. 89.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Rashi: First, we are talking about getting an indictment. Second, if you shoot a kid who is not violating the law and then deny medical attention to that kid, getting a conviction is not out of the question.

    FWIW, I tend to come a criminal matters from a defense perspective. I think the failure to get an indictment here is entirely due to the prosecutor tanking the case in front of the grand jury.

  90. 90.

    Starfish

    @Rashi: Your username does not appear familiar. It looks like you have just jumped in here on this particular issue to be obtuse, and really upset some of the regular people who are so much more interesting than you are. Am I missing something?

  91. 91.

    Gimlet

    @Rashi: Show the video to a hundred, even a thousand “qualified” nonOhio officers and ask if that is the standard of practice in that situation.

    If overwhelming “No”, he stands trial.

  92. 92.

    Baud

    @JPL: I bet if I quickly shot a white guy who was exercising his Second Amendment right to open carry, the prosecutor would be able to get an indictment.

  95. 95.

    Pogonipx

    How do you call out 3 warnings in ten seconds (I timed the shooting), let alone call out warning one, wait for response, warning two, wait for response, warning three?

    Has any information about the grand jury’s demographics leaked out? In Cleveland I’d expect all or most of them to be black.

    In any event, wake up, fellow palefaces. Over the years I have observed that black people are the canary in the U.S. coal mine. What happens to them happens to us 30-40 years later.

  97. 97.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    FWIW, I tend to come a criminal matters from a defense perspective. I think the failure to get an indictment here is entirely due to the prosecutor tanking the case in front of the grand jury.

    I suspect I may have spent more time at the state’s table than you have, so I like to pretend my perspective is kinda sorta balanced. I’ll admit, though, that it’s kinda sorta more of an analysis from a defense perspective. which has to be considered when you’re preparing a prosecution, obviously.

    I am certain that the presentation to the grand jury was entirely designed to tank the case and avoid indictment. It’s easy to do in either direction.
    @JPL

    I bet if I quickly shot a white guy who was exercising his Second Amendment right to open carry, the prosecutor would be both eager and able to get an indictment.

  106. 106.

    Rashi

    @Omnes Omnibus: et al. My understanding is you seek an indictment if you feel you have the evidence to successfully argue your case to conviction. I don’t see how you do so with any degree of murder here. Where’s any evidence that the shooting was clearly unjustifiable, done with any criminal intent or negligence? And for those of you who think I’m trying to justify the shooting in any way, I’m not

  109. 109.

    raven

    @JPL: Yes! Thanks for letting us know. We watched it, went to bed and I woke up 2 hours later sick as a dog. It was the highlight of the weekend!

  111. 111.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Rashi:

    Where’s any evidence that the shooting was clearly unjustifiable, done with any criminal intent or negligence?

    I, and others, have already noted it.

    ETA: The standard for a true bill is probable cause that a crime was committed by the suspect.

  116. 116.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @Rashi:

    Where’s any evidence that the shooting was clearly unjustifiable, done with any criminal intent or negligence?

    The video. You do not seem to grasp that what they did is not correct procedure if someone is dangerous and waving a gun around. There is no situation in which it is justified to drive right up next to the suspect on the grass and immediately shoot them. Immediately. I watched the video. The kid did not have time to react. The driving up itself is insane, at best unjustifiable negligence. Shooting a suspect with no confirmation that they are dangerous is also unjustifiable negligence. If the kid pulled out the gun and pointed it at the officer’s head – which he didn’t – they would still be guilty of unjustifiable negligence leading directly to someone’s death.

  118. 118.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    I will not feed the troll. I will not feed the troll. I will not feed the troll. I will not feed the troll. I will not feed the troll. Probably…

    I should look at Monday Night Brain Damage instead.

  119. 119.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @Rashi:
    This is almost exactly like the Zimmerman situation. It was moot if Trayvon attacked him, because Zimmerman created the danger situation. The police here created the danger situation by driving right up to the child and firing before even an intelligent, calm adult could reasonably react. Creating a situation that then ‘forces’ you to commit a crime is recognized as criminal in the legal system. Yes, there was plenty of evidence to make a conviction reasonably likely.

  120. 120.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Frankensteinbeck: The timing of the shooting supports an inference that hte cops arrived on the scene with the decision to shoot already made – that is, the shooting was premeditated.

  124. 124.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Frankensteinbeck: Yeah, given the fact that I know at this time, i would have trouble coming up with a believable, overarching story to tell as defense counsel. I feel that I would be stuck chipping at the credibility of the various witnesses and more or less muddying the waters. Not where one would want to be while defending.

  125. 125.

    Steeplejack

    Whatever the Denver fans are sporadically chanting sounds like “Wheel. Of. Fortune.” Weird.

    This Tamir Rice grand jury thing has put me in a foul mood.

  126. 126.

    dogwood

    This is the gun culture we now live in. Whether we’re talking about police or civilians, you no longer need to be threatened in order to kill someone, you just need to “feel” threatened. Americans are buying this hook line and sinker. Sandy Hook might have been a turning point, but we decided nothing is more important than the right to own weapons and use them as we see fit. I’ve raised a few eyebrows over the last ten years, but when my grandchildren stay with me in the summer, they aren’t allowed to play with children in homes that have guns. I refuse to play along with this nonsense.

  127. 127.

    pseudonymous in nc

    Ol’ Paddy McGinty and his goat keeping the streets of Cleveland clear of strapping young bucks for the shit-scared white ethnic cops. At one time, police forces and DA offices were places in certain cities where people with Irish or Italian or Polish or German last names could get past private-sector prejudice; now it’s a fucking hegemony enforcing a particular kind of law and order.

  128. 128.

    Suzanne

    Just….fuck.

    I went to see that movie “Spotlight” last night, which is about the coverup of the sex abuse the the Catholic Church, and was reminded once again how far power goes to protect itself. In this case, literally washing away the murder of a child.

    There are times that I am not sure if this country is worth saving.

  130. 130.

    Steve from Antioch

    What did this ammosexual Tamir Rice think was going to happen when he was parading around in public brandishing a weapon?

  131. 131.

    Rashi

    @Frankensteinbeck: Do we know these cops acted outside clear and direct protocol in this specific case or that their actions could be deemed nothing but reckless or negligent? While it may be true that without Zimmerman’s actions the confrontation never happens, he broke no laws and his story was corroborated by the state’s case. I watched the whole thing and if you didn’t know better you’d have thought the state was presenting for the defense.

  133. 133.

    oz29

    @Omnes Omnibus: Yeah, but you’d come up with something, and you’d walk back to the table expecting them to acquit. You’d also expect the State to do it’s job as well as (or not quite as well as) you did yours.

    That’s what is so frustrating to me.

  134. 134.

    OGLiberal

    Prosecutors way too close to local LE to be partial. Need independent prosecutor -very independent – when LE folks are the accused. It ain’t tilted grand juries who are the biggest problem in cases like this, it’s tilted prosecutors who basically see themselves as brothers in arms with cops, regardless of their responsibility as prosecutors, because they need said cops, who seem to side with any sociopath their force may employ, to help them with other cases.

  135. 135.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @oz29:

    You’d also expect the State to do it’s job as well as (or not quite as well as) you did yours.

    That’s what is so frustrating to me.

    I agree completely.

  136. 136.

    Lit3Bolt

    From the CNN story:

    Officers grateful, attorney says

    Grateful to get away with murder.

    What’s next?

    Nothing changes.

    The shooting

    Was completely justified by the “perfect storm” of human error. (An actual quote!)

    A realistic toy

    The preteen is fully responsible for his own death. His toy was too realistic and he grew too tall, too fast. Only white cherubs and apple cheeked Mrs. Claus grandmothers are immune to summary execution.

    Once you scroll down past all this bullshit, you finally get to some stories that cast some doubt on the official version of events…but we always know what gets top billing in America. “Innocent Victim Probably Deserved Execution” is always the leading headline.

  138. 138.

    Mnemosyne

    @oz29:

    The entire justice system is built to make excuses for poorly trained, dumb, or even downright criminal cops.

    Thank you for saying this. This is how I feel as a layperson, so it’s good to have that feeling validated.

    I honestly don’t understand why judges and prosecutors are so short-sighted and assume there will never, ever be any kind of consequences for repeatedly sweeping this kind of stuff under the rug.

  139. 139.

    Mnemosyne

    Also, allow me to translate the BS about the civil suit from White Conservative to human language: Those People don’t care about human life the way we do, so Tamir’s parents don’t actually want justice — they’ll be happy with a cash payout. It’ll be like winning the lottery for them and since they didn’t really love their son the way a white person would, it’s no harm, no foul.

  140. 140.

    SiubhanDuinne

    Connie Schultz posted this on her Facebook page. Wow.

    That Justice is a blind goddess
    Is a thing to which we black are wise:
    Her bandage hides two festering sores
    That once perhaps were eyes.
    Langston Hughes

  141. 141.

    Mnemosyne

    @Rashi:

    I watched the whole thing and if you didn’t know better you’d have thought the state was presenting for the defense.

    That’s pretty much the definition of a kangaroo court tilted towards the defendant. I bet that if you read the trial transcript for Emmitt Till, you’d see the exact same thing.

    The fact that you can watch the prosecutors do the defense’s job for them and NOT realize it’s a set-up says a lot about you.

  142. 142.

    a different chris

    @Lit3Bolt: Those Hero Cops only had two seconds, not enough time to investigate all the possibilities, like maybe the kid had superpowers and was just about to destroy the entire planet. Or if he might have grown up to be Black Hitler. Or if the object in his hand was a gun or not. Two seconds to decide the fate of the universe! They had no other choice, really. The stakes were just too high.

    non-snark version: If you voluntarily put yourself into a situation where you only have two seconds to decide if another human lives or dies, you’ve already fucked up bad and there should be consequences.

  143. 143.

    VFX Lurker

    @Suzanne:

    There are times that I am not sure if this country is worth saving.

    I think this country’s less worse than it was a hundred years ago, partly because people fought injustices like this one.

    That said, I’m not sure how to fix a broken justice system.

  145. 145.

    Mack Lyons (@DDSSBlog)

    @Pogonipx: I’m just going to go out on a limb here and say that if America wanted to bring the ISIS/Al-Qaeda-type insurgency home, it should keep doing what it’s doing right now.

    But it won’t be those scary brown Arabs or Latinos they’ll have to worry about.

    This whole game of seeing how far you can push the black community before it collectively snaps is a dangerous, potentially nation-killing game.

  146. 146.

    a different chris

    145 comments, 31.6% of which are Corner Stone live-tweeting some goddamned sportsball game. Again.

  148. 148.

    Rafer Janders

    @Rashi:

    The video seems to be the only neutral source of evidence and apparently shows the kid holding or going for the gun so I’m not sure how you get an indictment here.

    A. There was no “gun” — it was a toy.

    B. Do you know how many times my white ass was running around in public parks holding toy guns when I was a little kid? Thousands. And yet never once did a police officer roll up to me and shoot me.

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