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You are here: Home / Open Threads / Bundy Bunch Update: Deschutes County Sheriff’s Office Major Incident Team Investigative Report

Bundy Bunch Update: Deschutes County Sheriff’s Office Major Incident Team Investigative Report

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Bundy Bunch

The Bundy Bunch

Yesterday the Deschutes County Sheriff’s Office Major Incident Team released their 360 page report into the shooting death of Robert “LaVoy” Finicum by the Oregon State Police. Apparently this is not the entirety of the investigative record. Les Zaitz has reported that the Deschutes County Sheriff’s Office’s spokesman has indicated that more material will be released as redaction work is completed. The entire report is below:

Finicum_Redacted_Web_3102016

The report includes forensics diagrams and photos, as well as interviews with law enforcement personnel. Some of the most interesting details were law enforcement’s concerns that militia supporters of the Bundys had infiltrated into Burns and other Oregon municipalities and created a unique type of threat as they appeared to be locals or tourists going about their daily lives. There was also concern with the rhetoric used by the Bundys, Finicum, and the other leaders and outspoken members of the standoff. Law enforcement recognized the passive-aggressive nature of the rhetoric that both asked law enforcement to come and assist them in their peaceful and lawful stand for the(ir interpretation of the Constitution) and simultaneously threatened the use of force and violence against anyone, including law enforcement, that disagreed with them and attempted to stop the occupation of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge. There was also concerns expressed about infiltration in Grant County, specifically collusion between Sheriff Palmer and the leaders of the standoff.

The Oregonian also has an interesting article into the investigation of the FBI’s HRT as a result of a team member taking two shots at LaVoy Finicum and not reporting that he had done so.*

And in what is sure to make LAO happy, a sovereign citizen tried to intervene in the Bundy Case by filing a motion with the Federal Court. The judge issued an order throwing out the motion.

Finally, High Country News has an excellent piece of long form journalism on Federal law enforcement’s move to bring the Bundys and their supporters to justice after two years.

* Full disclosure: Professor Brian Levin, quoted in the article, is an old friend of mine. We have been on panels together at meetings of the American Society of Criminology.

Reader Interactions

122Comments

  1. 1.

    Linda Featheringill

    Individuals are not sovereign. States are not sovereign [as shown in the middle of the 19th Century]. Nations are sovereign. Kings were sometimes referred to as sovereign and since they were a law unto themselves, I guess they were. But not today, folks.

    ETA: First!

  7. 7.

    kindness

    Elsewhere across the intertubes today I saw several people kvetching that it took 2 years to file anything against Cliven Bundy. I understand the frustrations but am more happy the lunatic is finally where he belongs.

  9. 9.

    Soylent Green

    “Just shoot me. You’re gonna have to shoot me.”

    It’s an amazing time we live in, when armed outlaws evading a felony traffic stop document the whole thing for us on their cellphones. Thanks, Shawna, good job.

    It’s clear from the testimony how nervous all the LEOs were leading up to the arrest about the threat they were facing — wondering if some militia lunatic would gun them down while they were going about their day-to-day business in Burns. So they wore civilian clothing and were very careful about their movements. For weeks the occupiers and their supporters kept crowing to the press and online how much they would like to kill some LEOs. This fear carried over to the actual takedown when the state police and FBI had every reason to believe they would be fired upon.

    News to me was that one of the guys shot at the truck as it came toward them at high speed.

    It’s also interesting that they gave up their preferred site in Grant County and moved it south to Harney at the last minute because they thought Sheriff Palmer might interfere with the operation.

    Justice won’t be served until Palmer no longer has a job in law enforcement. Is anybody doing anything about all the other “constitutional sheriffs” out there who don’t respect the federal authorities?

  11. 11.

    LAO

    As I read the transcripts of the post shooting investigation, I feel a level of sympathy for these Oregon state police. (Which is unusual and uncomfortable for me). When their identities are revealed, these insane “patriots” will hound them forever.

    Eta: I’m never heard the term “the less lethal” before. Going to try to work it into my everyday conversation.

  12. 12.

    elftx

    “Letter of Intervention”..that is so funny! Cliven does not recognize the Federal Court in NV. Utah is setting money aside so they can sue to have federal lands turned over to the state. Hopefully they will also cite that section of the Constitooooshun Bundy and the rest profess to understand.
    Once again thanks for keeping us all posted on this..yep I’m addicted!

  14. 14.

    oz29

    @Technocrat: I clerked for a trial-level judge who practiced Admiralty Law almost exclusively before moving to the bench. The closest I ever saw him come to losing his temper (in court) was when some clown who was being sued by Capital One started the “maritime law” nonsense.

  18. 18.

    oz29

    Interesting that Mr. O’Hagan cited FRCP. They usually rely on the UCC as their go to authority for all legal matters.

  20. 20.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Soylent Green: Palmer is under investigation and will likely lose in the next election. I read somewhere that Oregon, at the state level, (and maybe a couple of other states) has begun looking into the “Constitutional sheriffs and peace officers” movement. The events at the wildlife refuge have brought that out in a way that didn’t exist when it was just the retired guy from Arizona handing out awards, issuing press releases, and these types of sheriffs stating that they will fully uphold the 2nd Amendment.

  22. 22.

    Steve in the ATL

    @oz29: Just so everyone is clear, admiralty law and maritime law are not the same thing. I know you were all wondering about that.

    Also, neither one has anything whatsoever to do with these sovereign citizens. But you probably figured that out already.

    But I did have a ship arrested once, so that was kind of cool.

  23. 23.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Felonius Monk:

    Security people have left.

    Sorry, but isn’t that kind of the opposite of what security people are supposed to do when trouble erupts?

  26. 26.

    Adam L Silverman

    @LAO: The issue with it is it really should be less than and up to lethal. The term, both in the military and law enforcement, used to be non-lethal. In fact the US Marine Corps is still the Joint Force Modernization Proponent for non-lethal operations, which covers both the weapons systems and how to best utilize them.

    The reality, however, is that the less than lethal weapons systems can be lethal under certain circumstances. Tasers can kill. As can rubber (coated) bullets. Even a bean bag round, if it hits the right place and that right angle can kill. Are they useful tools? Sure, but they’re tools and while they’re designed and intended to be less than lethal, that isn’t always the case.

  27. 27.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Steve in the ATL:

    admiralty law and maritime law are not the same thing

    “I thought so little
    They rewarded me
    By making me the ruler
    Of the Queen’s Navee!”

  28. 28.

    Steve in the ATL

    And in what is sure to make LAO happy, a sovereign citizen tried to intervene in the Bundy Case by filing a motion with the Federal Court. The judge issued an order throwing out the motion.

    Did he sign the pleadings in his upper case name or his lower case name? Because that makes a huge difference in whether the court accepts these filings.

    No, not really. They’re nuts.

  30. 30.

    CaseyL

    @Steve in the ATL:

    But I did have a ship arrested once, so that was kind of cool.

    Very cool, I agree!.

    Must ask: how does one arrest a ship, exactly?

    With a really, really big net?

  32. 32.

    oz29

    @Adam L Silverman: The CSPOA must be feeling some pushback, because I notice their list of sympathizers is greatly reduced since their site redesign. A sheriff I am acquainted with used to be listed on their website as a “sheriff saying no to Obama gun control.” I pointed this out to him (and the county’s prosecutor) and he said he was absolutely not affiliated with the organization. His name is no longer listed.

  33. 33.

    Steve in the ATL

    @Adam L Silverman:

    Even a bean bag round, if it hits the right place and that right angle can kill.

    Yes, we all learned about the plaintiff with the eggshell skull back in law school.

    In semi-related news, we actually had a brief discussion of the Palsgraf case at work yesterday!

  35. 35.

    Adam L Silverman

    @oz29: That doesn’t surprise me that people with no actual affiliation were being listed as affiliated. My guess is that Mack sent letters or emails to every sheriff he could get an address for. Anyone who answered yes he included. Everyone who didn’t answer at all he also included. It was only the sheriffs that actually said no that he didn’t include.

  36. 36.

    LAO

    @Adam L Silverman: So today in court, I did not go full metal Bundy but did engage in a spirited discussion about sovcit with co-counsel and the government. About 5 years ago, one of the defense attorneys was required to act as standby counsel for a pro-se sovereign citizen. It was, he described, the longest 4 days of his life. (Should have been a 1 day trial). I joke about this stuff because that’s my nature but between these yahoos and Trump supports, I’m being to feel a bit frayed.

  38. 38.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Steve in the ATL: I was actually thinking a shot to the sternum, but sure back of the skull would work too.

    As for Palsgraf that’s awfully obscure. I’m almost afraid to find out what prompted that discussion.

  39. 39.

    Culture of Truth

    Currently following violence at Trump rally. So bad they canceled the event.

  40. 40.

    Steve in the ATL

    @CaseyL: Giant handcuffs. Or, in the alternative, an order from a federal judge (don’t tell anyone, but I used a magistrate, not the Article III judge!).

    Funny situation. The ship was from Yugoslavia and docked at the port in Savannah. They didn’t pay their bill so we (the Georgia Ports Authority, by and through its esteemed counsel) had the ship arrested.

    A couple of days later, Yugoslavia ceased to exist. I went back to the judge and asked him to release the ship as they would never be able to pay their bill.

    I still have an involuntary twitch when I see maps of that part of Europe….

  41. 41.

    Adam L Silverman

    @LAO: I can just see it: “Excuse me your Honor, but if it pleases the Court, would we take a few minutes to discuss sovereign citizen stuff? You see, I’ve developed something of an addiction to the two Bundy cases and I can’t get to my favorite website to see if the guy who consults on defense stuff posted an update. Thanks.”

  43. 43.

    Elizabelle

    @Culture of Truth:

    Just got in and see that.

    Any chance some of this is Brooks Brothers rioting ratf*cking?? They want to take Trump out, badly.

    Or however they can.

  45. 45.

    LAO

    @Adam L Silverman: Not sure I you know who Jack Weinstein is, but one does not fck around in his courtroom. Discussion held before he took the bench. He’s a gddmn institution.

  46. 46.

    Steve in the ATL

    @BillinGlendaleCA:

    Talking to the kid once, I mentioned libertarians, she replied, “Oh they’re idiots”.

    Smart kid!

    @Adam L Silverman: You don’t want to know. If you have read the opinion, which was a rite of passage in law school, the first part where the judge lays out the facts is a work of art. In the second part, though, the legal reasoning is muddled as hell. It’s as if the opinion was written by a schizophrenic clerk. Or a clerk who got drunker as he was writing.

  48. 48.

    LAO

    @Steve in the ATL:

    A couple of days later, Yugoslavia ceased to exist. I went back to the judge and asked him to release the ship as they would never be able to pay their bill.

    Betcha didn’t see that one coming. Lol

  51. 51.

    Adam L Silverman

    @LAO: I’ve heard of him. I taught Criminology, and was the graduate/undergraduate core curriculum coordinator at Long Island University for a year. I resigned and went to work for the Army on the assignment that would take me to Iraq.

  53. 53.

    Felonius Monk

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    isn’t that kind of the opposite of what security people are supposed to do when trouble erupts?

    It is in my book. Watching CNN, it looked like they all ran out and the a few minutes later the real cops came in.

    Democracy is a messy business.

  54. 54.

    O. Felix Culpa

    @Elizabelle: I don’t know about the Brooks Brothers angle, but I do know that Chicago is a very ethnically diverse city, with many immigrants from all around the globe. The student population of UIC reflects that diversity and is filled with first-generation students from immigrant families. Plus, it’s only a few blocks away from Pilsen, a huge Mexican neighborhood. Traditionally AA neighborhoods are also in hailing distance. So strong feelings about Trump’s incendiary presence are to be expected.

  55. 55.

    LAO

    Oh, and I read somewhere, that one of these yahoos declined representation based on his sincerely held religious beliefs. Let’s break that down – Jesus told him not to have a lawyer defend him against criminal charges in federal court. I’m Jewish, so I’m confused. Is this covered in the New Testament? Book of Mormon?

  57. 57.

    Adam L Silverman

    @BillinGlendaleCA: Their, ideological at least, children and grandchildren. The worst thing Trump could’ve done was cancel it. The best thing would have been to come out and demonstrate real leadership, call on his supporters to set a proper example, and done his thing. He’s going to be able to play martyr off of this for weeks.

  59. 59.

    Felonius Monk

    @O. Felix Culpa:

    So strong feelings about Trump’s incendiary presence are to be expected.

    Sounds like the wrong venue for a Trump rally. Unless, of course, incitement was the whole purpose.

  63. 63.

    Felonius Monk

    @LAO:

    Is this covered in the New Testament? Book of Mormon?

    Book of Moron, actually. A special book in the Bible for the Terminally Stupid.

  64. 64.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Felonius Monk: Those were probably his own paid, contract security. They weren’t Chicago PD or UIC PD. They created a self fulfilling prophecy.

  66. 66.

    Steve from Antioch

    I encourage everyone to get over to Lavoy Finicums website and buy your “Libery” bumper stickers before they are all gone…

  67. 67.

    Adam L Silverman

    @LAO: Neither. Its in the special ink edition of the Constitution along with the stuff about Sheriffs and land rights.

  72. 72.

    PurpleGirl

    @LAO: I don’t remember where or how I first learned about Judge Weinstein but, yes, he runs a strict court room and you don’t piss him off. (I worked in the Public Utilities departments of Leboeuf Lamb Libey and MacRae for 4 years.)

  73. 73.

    Adam L Silverman

    @LAO: I enjoyed it, but I enjoy most movies based on comic books because I just keep in mind they’re based on comic books.

  75. 75.

    Steve in the ATL

    @efgoldman:

    @CaseyL: Giant handcuffs. Or, in the alternative, an order from a federal judge

    That joke has already been made. Off my corner, ho!

  78. 78.

    oz29

    @LAO: I’m not sure what the reason is in that specific case, but I have heard people decline appointed counsel based on the beliefs that (1) Bar Associations are somehow an unconstitutional creation, thus membership in the Bar is unconstitutional (some Mormons believe the Constitution is divinely inspired); (2) membership in the Bar requires lawyers to be atheists.

  79. 79.

    Steve in the ATL

    @Adam L Silverman: I was making a joke. Pinkerton’s are the guys that industrialists used to hire to beat up unionists and protesters, and probably whatever hippies were called in the 1800’s.

  81. 81.

    Steve in the ATL

    @oz29: Good lord. What about bar associations violates the Constitution? Do they realize that not every aspect of life is defined and regulated in that one document?

    Rhetorical questions, obviously.

  83. 83.

    Steve in the ATL

    @efgoldman:

    Are they autographing and selling the dildos and lube to pay for their defense?

    You forgot to add “Asking for a friend”

  84. 84.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Steve in the ATL: I know who they are. They have the worst terrorism data set on the planet. Which, of course, got used by the guy at U Maryland who never studied terrorism until he talked them into giving him the data set, to build the DHS funded Center for the Social Behavioral Study of Terrorism. He also wrote the RFP for DHS for that center funding, then leaked it to himself early. Also, he plagiarized part of my doctoral dissertation.

  86. 86.

    Felonius Monk

    @efgoldman:

    Are they autographing and selling the dildos and lube to pay for their defense?

    I think most of those got buried with LaVoy. I think it was the backup plan in case he didn’t meet up with the 99 virgins. Or am I getting my jihadis mixed up here?

  87. 87.

    oz29

    @Steve in the ATL: I used to get appointed as standby counsel to members of a former Bo Gritz-led commune a few times year, so I heard all manner of outlandish stuff. My all-time favorite was a guy (a friend of a client) who cornered me in a hallway and said he thought I was a good guy, so when he won his big lawsuit against the Rockefellers, and all the lawyers were banished to England (because The Constitution) I’d be allowed to stay. He didn’t tell me why on earth I’d want to stay.

  88. 88.

    PurpleGirl

    @Felonius Monk: I just did a fast Google. Judge Weinstein is indeed 94 years old and he maintains a full docket as a senior judge on the Eastern District of NY bench. He is one of the longest serving judges of the federal system, having been appointed in 1967 by LBJ.

  91. 91.

    Adam L Silverman

    @efgoldman: I informed my Dad, who was one of the most senior criminologists at that time and my criminology dissertation chair – who is the most senior criminologist of his generation, but couldn’t do much else. He was the president of the American Criminological Association at the time. And it wasn’t a major plagiarism. I had applied for an assistant professorship in his department. He emailed me, and this was before anyone knew he was trying to move into the terrorism field, and asked for a copy of a paper I’d presented at the annual meeting, which was the theory chapter out of my dissertation including my working bibliography. I figured he wanted to see it as an additional writing sample from the job search, so sent a copy. I had a fat fingered typo in one of the citations – specifically of one of the books written by my polisci dissertation chair (I had one for each discipline). It was in there, because I’d been copying and pasting the citation for three years from one document to the other. Anyhow, he eventually put something out and low and behold in the bibliography is Ken’s book with the wrong publication date. Basically, he just copied and pasted chunks of my own bibliography into his own without checking anything. As plagiarism goes, it was small fry. But as demonstration of a lack of professional ethics, it showed anything you needed to know about him.

  92. 92.

    SoupCatcher

    @efgoldman:

    I’m just surprised they’re not on eBay yet.

    I suspect they ended up in the trench the Butternuts dug at the wildlife refuge. I’m imagining some Motel of the Mysteries type archaeological dig in five hundred years or so.

  94. 94.

    Aleta

    For fellow obsessives: I’ve been wanting to offer this delusional video is from the Bundy ranch in 2014. It’s an amazing thing; the short story behind it is that members of the Oath Keepers* had left the militia “base” on the Bundy ranch (claiming inside info that a drone attack might be imminent). Ryan Payne wants to make a rule that they can never come back, so he’s holding a meeting to officially declare them deserters, cowards, traitors.

    Several people at this meeting (Booda Bear, Jerry DeLemus, Jason Patrick) have been indicted in the last month. Jason Patrick uploaded this and other videos he made every few days while at the Bundy Ranch, including interviews, and they are on his youtube channel.

    * The Oath Keepers as a group didn’t take part in the occupation of Malheur, and their leader Stewart Rhodes (https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/extremist-files/individual/elmer-stewart-rhodes-0) announced at the beginning of the occupation that it was a bad idea — no local support, not private property, no invitation from local landowner, etc. He was careful to praise Ammon, though.

  96. 96.

    redshirt

    @Adam L Silverman:

    I enjoyed it, but I enjoy most movies based on comic books because I just keep in mind they’re based on comic books.

    I do this as well and it works great. I don’t need to worry about things like science or reality or anything really. I just need to accept what the story presents and judge it by that standard. If it breaks its own internal logic, I’ll nitpick.

    I’m trying this now with all other movies and it seems to apply to any genre. Just accept a set of standards the genre needs to meet and all else can be considered extraneous. A murder mystery should have a murder that is mysterious.

  97. 97.

    Adam L Silverman

    @redshirt: The first Wolverine movie was a mess, but by and large I just treat them as we’re discussing. And since I pretty much only watch movies based on comic books these days or cartoons, it works pretty well. I’m going to enjoy and tune out for a couple of hours, not to have to think too hard. That’s what work is for.

  99. 99.

    Adam L Silverman

    @redshirt: It was okay. Blob was good. I thought Liev Schrieber did an excellent job portraying a psychopathic and psychotic Sabertooth. But they really ruined Deadpool and he’d have been Weapon XI. Wolverine was Weapon X.

  100. 100.

    The Republic, Blah Blah Blah...

    I gotta say… every time I see a picture of Ryan Bundy (2nd from the left, top row), he looks like he’s been punched in the face so many times, his face is permanently deformed… right hook on the left side of his jaw…

    Just saying…

  102. 102.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    Thanks for the fix, Adam. I will manage to get around to reading them tomorrow.

    @The Republic, Blah Blah Blah…: His face was deformed when someone – perhaps even another Bundy – drove over his head. Really.

  112. 112.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    @LAO: It should probably worry you. Clearly I need actual employment again. Teaching 2x/month during the academic year is not enough. My old pal suggested getting on the PD list, paying his building (he owns it) $75/month to use their conference room and have the phone answered and build a defense practice. I’m not sure I’ve got the energy at my age… Plus malpractice coverage, etc, etc.

  113. 113.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    @Ken: Ritzheimer’s mugshot is from AZ, where he turned himself in. The others were arrested in OR, and that’s the Multnomah County Sheriff star. on the rest

    I think I just demonstrated LAO’s point. I’m starting to worry myself.

  114. 114.

    Ruckus

    @a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q):
    Something new is always fun. I’ve had 3 widely different careers and am now working back in the first one. Of course for that to be much fun the second and third would have to have been successful. Still they make stories, not all that good of ones, but stories.

  116. 116.

    Miss Bianca

    @Adam L Silverman:

    God, I fucking hope so. From your mouth to God’s ear. This “constitutional sheriff” bit has chilled me to the bone. Oh, Colorado sheriffs…vowing and declaring they wouldn’t obey the law of the state when it came to the new firearms regulations. If anything good comes out of this debacle, let it be a critical investigation into the power of the Sheriff, plzzzzz….

  117. 117.

    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q)

    @LAO: I confess that I really miss court, but… I’m still working on finding another good nonprofit gig, once my NAMI chapter was acquired by merged with a bigger affiliate, I could consult with a MH advocacy group as long as they had the budget for it. I got to do a great deal of work in regional opiate epidemic response plans and coordinating them across communities, but funding is always scarce. ::sighs:: I’m too young to really retire, and, well, recession was hard on lots of planning for same.

    I really won’t rebuild a criminal defense practice, tempting though it is some days.

  119. 119.

    LAO

    @a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q): My response to you was pretty glib and god knows the financial collapse was pretty devastating. My firm is small — just two of us. Hustling to pay bills can be soul crushing and I sometimes find it hard to remember why I love criminal defense work so much. Unlike you, my experience is so narrow, that I’m sort of stuck. Anyway, I do wish you the best and hope that a great opportunity (with funding) comes up.

    I know that if I could — in a perfect/fantasy world — I would open a bookstore and sitting around reading everything. That would be awesome.

  120. 120.

    Soylent Green

    We have the Malheur gang here in Multnomah County’s lockup because the federal courthouse is next door. For court appearances they move them through a secure corridor under the street.

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