Also notable is that @gabrielsherman's invented new method here: in-sentence fact-checking https://t.co/tEbC0bYRS8 pic.twitter.com/BGNVPhJGhj
— Jonathan Chait (@jonathanchait) April 4, 2016
Kinda long for reading over coffee, but so full of delightful nuggets. NYMag‘s Gabriel Sherman takes a break from poking Roger Ailes with a stick to pants another perennial NYC pest in “Operation Trump”:
… Hardly any of Trump’s staffers arrived at their positions with high-level political experience. The last time Lewandowski ran a campaign was in 2002, when he managed a losing Senate reelection bid in New Hampshire. Hicks and Scavino spent zero time in politics before this. Hicks did PR for Ivanka Trump’s fashion line and promoted Trump resorts. Scavino graduated from caddying to serve as general manager at Trump National Golf Club; he spent his free time as an unpaid disc jockey at a local radio station. Trump’s national spokeswoman, Katrina Pierson, is a onetime Obama supporter turned tea-party activist who once was arrested for shoplifting. His foreign-policy advisers include a former banker who writes a foreign-policy blog that quotes Kanye West and Oprah, and an energy consultant whose LinkedIn page cites as a foreign-policy credential being one of five finalists for a model-U.N. summit…
As early as 1987, Trump talked publicly about his desire to run for president. He toyed with mounting a campaign in 2000 on the Reform Party ticket, and again in 2012 as a Republican (this was at the height of his Obama birtherism). Two years later, Trump briefly explored running for governor of New York as a springboard to the White House. “I have much bigger plans in mind — stay tuned,” he tweeted in March 2014.
Trump taped another season of The Apprentice that year, but he kept a political organization intact. His team at the time consisted of three advisers: Roger Stone, Michael Cohen, and Sam Nunberg. Stone is a veteran operative, known for his gleeful use of dirty tricks and for ending Eliot Spitzer’s political career by leaking his patronage of prostitutes to the FBI. Cohen is Trump’s longtime in-house attorney. And Nunberg is a lawyer wired into right-wing politics who has long looked up to “Mr. Trump,” as he calls him. “I first met him at WrestleMania when I was like 5 years old,” Nunberg told me.
Throughout 2014, the three fed Trump strategy memos and political intelligence. “I listened to thousands of hours of talk radio, and he was getting reports from me,” Nunberg recalled. What those reports said was that the GOP base was frothing over a handful of issues including immigration, Obamacare, and Common Core. While Jeb Bush talked about crossing the border as an “act of love,” Trump was thinking about how high to build his wall. “We either have borders or we don’t,” Trump told the faithful who flocked to the annual CPAC conference in 2014.
Meanwhile, Trump used his wealth as a strategic tool to gather his own intelligence. When Citizens United president David Bossie or GOP chairman Reince Priebus called Trump for contributions, Trump used the conversations as opportunities to talk about 2016. “Reince called Trump thinking they were talking about donations, but Trump was asking him hard questions,” recalled Nunberg. From his conversations with Priebus, Trump learned that the 2016 field was likely to be crowded. “We knew it was going to be like a parliamentary election,” Nunberg said.
Which is how Trump’s scorched-earth strategy coalesced. To break out of the pack, he made what appears to be a deliberate decision to be provocative, even outrageous. “If I were totally presidential, I’d be one of the many people who are already out of the race,” Trump told me. And so, Trump openly stoked racial tensions and appealed to the latent misogyny of a base that thinks of Hillary as the world’s most horrible ballbuster…
If Trump makes it to the nomination, he will face other challenges for which he seems right now completely unprepared. He’ll have to rally at least some of the GOP Establishment, which he’s spent the last year vilifying… He will also have to figure out how to raise money. Trump won’t fund a general election himself, and he has no national fund-raising apparatus in place. During my tour of Trump’s campaign office, I overheard Glassner on the phone discussing the nascent state of their finance efforts. “I have to find a place for these rich guys to go to,” he said. “Dinners, receptions, events. We need everything, because we don’t have a finance committee.” It will be a hard sell for Trump, one of the hardest of his career, to persuade GOP donors to pony up, especially after his attacks on the donor class. Groups like the Club for Growth have been committed to stopping Trump. And the Koch brothers have also been unhappy; the assumption is that they will sit this election cycle out…
***********
Apart from schadenfreude — and the Wisconsin primary, if you can bear the idea — what’s on the agenda for the day?
One last nugget from @nymag: Trump's team is exhausted and he wears a bulletproof vest: https://t.co/mSFLdnNhC8 pic.twitter.com/urXmk2oNM7
— Sopan Deb (@SopanDeb) April 4, 2016
Baud
Yeah, not gonna be a problem.
OzarkHillbilly
A bullet proof vest? Donald, we don’t need to shoot you to destroy you. You are doing a fine job of that all by yourself.
David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch
satby
@Baud: I wonder. 73% negatives from women must include a couple of Republican establishment women too.
Good morning everyone. I can’t believe I come back after a blog hiatus to a Trump thread. Or a Bern one previously. But if they’re imploding, I’m happier.
rikyrah
Good Morning ?, Everyone ?.
Mustang Bobby
@Baud: The Republicans will rally behind anyone who will give them the faintest whiff of the possibility of winning the White House again. Like the New Yorker cartoon said earlier this year with Satan running for president, “Yeah, he may be Evil Incarnate, but he says what he thinks…”
Speaking of Evil Incarnate, I’m in a hotel in Tallahassee a couple of blocks from the state capitol building. After dinner last night I expected to see Rick Scott slip into the shadows… I hear he cannot be exposed to sunlight.
Schlemazel (parmesan rancor)
I LOVE the fact checking in-line! what a great world it would be if all reporters did that all the time!
On a sports note, congratulations to the champions from last night! It was a tremendous game of speed and skill & no surprise it needed OT to decide. USA 1 – Canada 0 IIHF WORLD CHAMPIONS
different-church-lady
Trump — actually, not Trump.
@satby:
Subtract 73% from 100%. What do you get?
JPL
@satby: I’m so sorry about your mom. How was the trip?
satby
@rikyrah: Good morning rikyrah?
satby
@different-church-lady: LOL. John Rogers is a prophet.
Schlemazel (parmesan rancor)
@different-church-lady:
since I installed the “make Donald Drumpf again” app your first comment is . . . interesting
You beat me to the 27% comment – that number is getting to be scary, is it ever wrong? If there were a Nobel Prize for sociology John Rogers should be given it and then it should be retired.
satby
@JPL: Thanks! I’m still in St Pete, clearing out some of the stuff from my mom’s condo. After I wash and drop off at a church some donations ( her clean clothes still smell like cigarette smoke) the girls and I are heading to Disneyworld for a day on Wednesday, courtesy of my sister who works there. Then on the way home, we plan to see the places we missed trying to get down here fast.
And I get that some people don’t like to fly,but OMIGD, that is a long freak in drive from MI.
Schlemazel (parmesan rancor)
@rikyrah:
Back at you!
Although I have to admit every time I see your nym I wonder why the capitol of Saudi Arabia is commenting here
Baud
@satby: People have short memories.
How are you holding up?
Botsplainer, Cryptofascist Tool of the Oppressor Class
Repeating something I said below above Trump’s interview with Woodward and Costa:
Jesus Christ, that man is shit-all stupid and has zero understanding of the actual power the office holds. He thinks he can snap his fingers and things will just happen, because he’s the boss of us all. In the glob of privilege, entitlement and narcissism this stupid person calls a brain, running a government is the exact same thing as running a business. I said a couple of days ago that if he hadn’t been born rich, he’d be a collection manager at a payday lender or a “buy here pay here” car salesman. I take that back – he’s too dumb for those jobs. He’s more of a pawnshop helper type.
BillinGlendaleCA
@different-church-lady: There’s that number again.
Baud
@satby:
Disneyworld will be a nice diversion.
satby
@Baud: I have moments. But it has been healing to work on cleaning out her condo and the girls have been a great help. It was a shame to miss seeing my mom a last time, but my family is relieved that she went fairly quickly without suffering too long, and that gives us all a lot of comfort. We’re Irish, we tend to be pretty matter of fact about death after a long and mostly happy life, which is what my mother was gifted with.
BillinGlendaleCA
@Baud: Never been there, I’ve been to Disneyland here, the one in Paris and the one in Tokyo.
David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch
The Secret Service disguises are getting very cleaver (photo)
satby
@Baud: You’re a good egg, thanks. Yes, the girls are ok about seeing all the sites and historical stuff, but for them, the trip is Disney. They’re over the moon about it.
Baud
@David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch: Bunny needs a machine gun.
OzarkHillbilly
@satby: As one who is nearly always the last to know, did your mother die?
BillinGlendaleCA
On the agenda for today: take the wreck in for a brake job, send the kid pictures from our hike and a proposal for another hike.
ETA: @OzarkHillbilly: Maybe we’ll run into that homeless guy with the UCLA cap again?.
Baud
@BillinGlendaleCA: Disneyworld is the only one I’ve been to.
debbie
@satby:
I’m so sorry you didn’t get there in time.
Patricia Kayden
Just heard on ABC’s Good Morning America that Trump will cut off money from Mexican immigrants back to their families in Mexico to force Mexico to build the wall. Even the Reporter was questioning if that was legal.
More excellent minority outreach from the GOP.
Botsplainer, Cryptofascist Tool of the Oppressor Class
Oh, and I read the NYDN interview with ignorant jackass Sanders. I’ll summarize for the benefit of all who don’t want the headache of reading it:
In this interview, Bernie is auditioning for a role in “Les Miserables”, delivering lines in a word salad evocative of memories of Sarah Palin. He plainly demonstrates a level of cluelessness about the economy and the function of government that makes me question his suitability for any elected office he’s ever held, and is simply unfit for the office he seeks. His lack of foresight makes me question the wisdom of the voters of Vermont who have propelled this idiot so far in life.
japa21
As to what is on the agenda, going to work knowing only 19 word days left to retirement. Leaving work knowing only 18 work days left until retirement. And no, I am not counting.
Then come home and know I will hear and read either unbearable gloating or insufferable whining and probably both as the Wisconsin results come in tonight.
Baud
@Patricia Kayden: I just saw that also. He’d been better off saying he was going to start a war with Mexico.
Baud
@japa21: Congrats on the upcoming retirement.
OzarkHillbilly
@satby: Sorry for your loss tho inevitable it was. Becoming an orphan is never easy, no matter how old one is.
debbie
@Botsplainer, Cryptofascist Tool of the Oppressor Class:
Woodward’s as much a hack as Trump. I listened to an interview with David Cay Johnston and it was far more substantial. This isn’t what I listened to, but it’s basically the same.
I was living in NYC in the 1980s when Trump was golden. I’d forgotten about things like his treatment of the Polish immigrants building Trump Towers, but he really has been a jackass since birth.
OzarkHillbilly
@BillinGlendaleCA: I can spot a stalker from thousands of miles away.
TheMightyTrowel
@japa21: i know the cure for primary fever: unplug and play with kittehs
Amir Khalid
@Botsplainer, Cryptofascist Tool of the Oppressor Class:
I had the same thought about Bernie. I think he really wants to be Enjolras.
MomSense
Oh god. Listening to a Cruz supporter in Wisconsin on NPR.
NYDN interview with Sanders was painful.
JGabriel
Gabriel Sherman @ NYMag:
Bernie Sanders or Hillary Clinton.
MomSense
@satby:
Oh Satby, I’m so sorry.
debbie
@MomSense:
With the barf bag? I thought I’d woken up back in high school.
debbie
@JGabriel:
That’s Trump’s Inner Salesman kicking in. You round up or round down, whichever benefits you more.
Botsplainer, Cryptofascist Tool of the Oppressor Class
@MomSense:
He’s simply unfit for the job and is the living embodiment why I kick hippies in the face as often as I possibly can.
Demoralize them early in life, and they never grow up to be Sanders.
Aimai
Any quotes from the interview? Im not going to listen but id like to know more.
And, Satby, so glad you have the girls to help with ghe condo snd sre going to disney afterwards. Young people are so grounding when we are grieving. Im very, very, sorry about your mother.
JGabriel
@Schlemazel (parmesan rancor):
The capitol of Saudi Arabia comments everywhere.
Betty Cracker
@satby: So sorry to hear about your mom. Staying busy can keep you sane, but be kind to yourself too.
Betty Cracker
@Botsplainer, Cryptofascist Tool of the Oppressor Class: I suspect your efforts don’t have the effect you wish, any more than the harangues of the most obnoxious Sanders supporters win converts for their side.
JGabriel
@satby: My condolences on your loss. May your mom rest in peace, or, you know, agitate like hell from beyond the grave for a better world if that’s her preference.
Patricia Kayden
@Baud: Don’t give him any ideas, Baud. He probably wants to start war with Mexico and a few other countries.
@satby: ((satby)). My co-worker couldn’t return to Florida in time to see her Father pass so I understand through her how you feel about not making it back in time for your Mother.
Baud
GMA said this morning that Trump needs 70% of remaining delegates to win the nomination outright, but that Sanders has a better chance of catching Clinton than Cruz does of catching Trump. (Although Trump will apparently win big in New York.).
So a contested convention looks increasingly inevitable.
debbie
@Betty Cracker:
Exactly! And then they’ll expect the objects of their vitriol to fall in line after a candidate wins the nomination.
debbie
@Baud:
This is why Goofus refuses to quit. He’s positive he’ll be Cleveland’s Annointed One.
raven
@satby: I’m sorry to hear about your mom.
different-church-lady
@Botsplainer, Cryptofascist Tool of the Oppressor Class:
Confess: you didn’t harbor this impulse until about, oh, late 2009, right?
Chyron HR
@debbie:
“Talk shit, get hit.”
Baud
@debbie:
To be fair, some people like rough play.
satby
@OzarkHillbilly: sorry, wandered off to clean more. Yes, unfortunately she slipped away as we were driving through Kentucky so I didn’t see her. It appeared that she was going to be around for several more days because her vital signs were pretty strong, but she fooled us. It was a blessing, and I had talked to her only a few days earlier, so it’s ok.
JGabriel
@Botsplainer, Cryptofascist Tool of the Oppressor Class:
I confess, I have very little patience for that attitude. I think punching to the left is entirely counter-productive. As John Cole said a few days ago, Let the left be the left:
Of course, I would agree with that – being someone who describes his own politics as left-center-left and who has been calling himself a social democrat for about 25-30 years.
That said, I just don’t see the point in mocking or attacking people who are basically on the same side as us, and who want the same kind of better world as we do (universal health care, opposing bigotry, ameliorating global warming, creating better access to higher education, etc.), even if they’re given to occasional bouts of purity spiral melodrama once in a while.
If you’re looking for some sort of affirmation that passionate lefties, who essentially have good intentions, deserve to be mocked, attacked, hippie-punched, and hippie-kicked as much as conservative terrorist tea party wingnuts deserve mocking, ridicule, and violence – because both sides do it! – you won’t be getting it from me.
Frankly, I’d just much rather be punching and kicking to the right, where the evil people live.
satby
@debbie: well, I suspect she heard the nurse tell my sister she would probably be around a while longer and thought “the hell I will!”. She was on almost constant morphine, so it’s good she went without having to suffer more. I’m at peace about it. Thanks though.
satby
@japa21: yay, you and retirement!
satby
@OzarkHillbilly: Thanks. Our kids are taking it harder than my sisters and I, their Nana was huge in their upbringing.
MattF
@debbie: Good catch. It’s true that there’s a very specific specific trend in his errors– and that suggests, in turn, that he actually knows the correct numbers. And also suggests he doesn’t expect any ‘journalist’ to notice or care.
I can see why people don’t want to pick up random rocks to check out what’s under them– particularly rocks that Der Trump happens to be standing on– but if you’re a journalist, that’s your job.
satby
@MomSense: @Aimai: @Betty Cracker: Appreciate the kind thoughts, thanks.
Botsplainer, Cryptofascist Tool of the Oppressor Class
@JGabriel:
But they don’t “want the same things we do”. They want to burn it all down, and are the core demographic that may show up to vote every eight years or so, if they remember to wake up. They aren’t donors, they aren’t organizers, they haven’t done the hard, messy work of committee meetings, rallies, fundraisers and the like.
They say “give us bread and land and brotherhood”, do nothing on a routine basis to bring it about, and snipe at those who do the actual work.
Fuck them.
satby
@JGabriel: @Patricia Kayden: @raven: and thanks all. She went “her way” after a long and happy life. We Irish call that “a good passing”.
David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch
@different-church-lady: I don’t agree with the “hippie punching” language; criticism should be specific.
That said, I never liked John Edwards, Weiner, Grayson, etc. The whole I’m pure and every one else is corrupt routine is really off putting. And it’s always the holier than thou types who end up being the most flawed.
raven
@satby: From Joe Biden:
satby
@Botsplainer, Cryptofascist Tool of the Oppressor Class: I agree with this. I get so frustrated with people who are passionate for one election cycle only, get sour grapes when their guy loses (or wins but doesn’t give them their pony) and then do nothing for the next 4-8 years to advance their so-called goals. I have known several IRL, and they uniformly turn into “both sides” truthers. And they think my fixation on policy and platforms and every election is boooring
satby
@raven: one of my favorite quotes, and I appreciate the reminder. Thanks again.
Betty Cracker
I don’t believe the exhaustion excuse for Trump’s ill-advised remarks during his interview with Tweety. For once, I think the wingnuts have it right: Trump isn’t really pro-life based on principle; he’s just faking it because he wants to win the GOP nomination. And he’s too lazy and arrogant to believe he needs to study up for the role, so he was winging it and got caught out. It’s like the “Two Corinthians” thing.
different-church-lady
@David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch:
Nor do I, but I do confess a frequent urge to scream “BLOODY PEASANT!!!” and shake the crap out of these Denises (Deni?) the way Graham Chapman did in Holy Grail.
That being said, I as far as I know the whole “hippie punching” meme came from some poor hippie whining about how everything anybody ever said amounted to a punch.
I think in the last three or four days Sanders Derangement Syndrome finally became a thing. I suppose it was inevitable.
Baud
@different-church-lady: I guess I should be depressed that no one has bothered to suffer from Baud Derangement Syndrome.
:-(
MattF
@Betty Cracker: I don’t give the wingnuts too much credit– their view is that Der Trump is a crypto-leftist, which is nonsense. See, e.g., Marc Thiessen in the WaPo, if you can bear to read it.
Jim
27 club
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/27_Club
raven
@satby: I thought about my old man while walking Augusta National yesterday. He loved Arnie, Jack and Player so I felt he was walking with me.
OzarkHillbilly
@Baud: I know of one person who suffers from that. ;-)
gvg
@Botsplainer, Cryptofascist Tool of the Oppressor Class: I understand the frustration, but continuing too far down this road is how “christians” come to denigrate the poor and come up with drug tests for welfare. Sometimes people grow up too. However they tend to remember and hold grudges against those who are hostile to them. It’s better to keep it to the facts, like, “I don’t think that will work, and I do think this will”. Later on they may remember which was right.
I am not happy with Sanders nor certain types of supporters, but broad brush rage is not my choice here. Trump supporters on the other hand…
Baud
@OzarkHillbilly: Thank you!
lol chikinburd
@satby: I’m so terribly sorry. You’ll be in my thoughts — and I really must email you one of these days.
rikyrah
As minimum wage makes gains, the opposition splinters
04/05/16 08:00 AM
By Steve Benen
There is no realistic hope of raising the federal minimum wage so long as there’s a Republican Congress, but away from the Beltway, striking progress continues.
In a political climate defined by stagnant wages for millions of workers, growing inequality and populist revolts in both parties, activists from outside of the political establishment and low-wage workers achieved a major victory on Monday when the Democratic governors of California and New York both signed bills that would gradually increase their states’ minimum wages to $15 per hour.
In California, the legal minimum will go from $10 an hour now to $15 in 2022. In New York, which currently has a $9 minimum wage, the increase to $15 will apply to New York City by the end of 2018, counties surrounding the city by 2021, and more gradually in parts of the state where the cost of living is less.
……………………………
Of course, with a far-right Republican majority in the U.S. House and Senate, the odds of success are effectively non-existent. But why is that? GOP opposition to even a slight increase in the federal minimum wage is as obvious as it is ferocious, but why are Republicans so obstinate on the issue, especially in light of broad public support for a wage hike?
Most GOP policymakers won’t simply acknowledge their philosophical objection, but rather, they’ll say Republicans are honoring the wishes of “job creators” in the private sector – to raise the minimum wage, the argument goes, will hurt employers in businesses nationwide who don’t want, and can’t afford, a higher federal minimum.
Culture of Truth
My two take aways from that interview were that Trump didn’t prepare for running, either with a proper ground game or a delegate strategy (not to mention prepping on issues) and it’s costing him now. Also, his running mate is likely Jeff Sessions.
aimai
You guys weren’t kiddign about the Bernie interview. It was a train wreck. How will his fans handle the fact that he, essentially, copped to being pro-drones and pro-Israel (status quo) with no real plans or ideas for how to bring about the peace he claims to want for Israel? (I don’t blame him for not having an answer, exactly, but its clear he just never, ever, thought anyone would ask him any serious questions about a Sander’s administration.) As others have observed he also simply doesn’t have any idea why even “illegalalities” in some industries might not result in more than monetary fines. Just because those fines were big doesn’t mean there were other chargest that could have been brought.
different-church-lady
@aimai:
By claiming that Hillary is MORE pro-drones and MORE pro-Israel, plus INDICTMENT!
rikyrah
West Wing Reports ✔ @WestWingReport
Commencement addresses by Michelle Obama this year: Jackson State U. (Jackson, MS); Santa Fe Indian School (NM), City College of NY
JGabriel
@different-church-lady:
Gee, thank you. You see, I’m pretty sure I’m the one who started that meme/discussion about 6-8 years ago here at Balloon Juice.
And as someone who has dressed like a preppy for most of his life, and spent the mid-80’s as a college DJ playing punk, post-punk, indie, and rap, I’m pretty much a full generation and a whole counter-culture away from being an actual hippie. My sensibilities are way more Talking Heads, New Order, The Replacements, REM, Yo La Tengo, Pavement, Arcade Fire, and Grimes than they are Crosby, Stills and Nash.
japa21
@satby: Thank you. And let me add my condolences. I was able to get to my mother the day before she slipped into unconsciousness. By the time I got to my dad he had already done so. Either way it is difficult. But at the same time I knew my sadness was because of what I would be missing, not for them. And I knew I had many years to look back on.
And it sounds like your mom was one of those people who had a mind of her own, right to the end.
Kathleen
@satby: my condolences satby,
different-church-lady
@JGabriel: First time I ever saw the term “hippie punching” used was outside of Balloon Juice. (GOS if I remember correctly.)
Cermet
I have written a rather technical scientific/engineering paper that is 76 pages long. Throughout, I reference two linked spread sheets in Excel. Erased the hyper link between them (by accident) and I am in the process of fixing that; however, discovered that in one spread sheet an important cell wasn’t filled in and I am not certain if that impacts the complex web of calculations (over thirty major calculations involving over one hundred data cells (which many of these, in turn, have sub-calculations that may link as well.) This will take a long time to determine since I have to rework the logic and data chain for all these calculations – also, realized that I need to create another spread sheet so I can now include the calculations for some diagrams that I forgot to include (just for appearances – luckily, these results do not impact the other spread sheets directly.) So, a blunder results in discovering an error that may or may not impact the conclusion. The work will not be fun – hate re-figuring complex logic in a web of cross linking calculations! That is just one of three projects that are running – the other two are experimental and also having strange and confusing results that mean a (maybe) start over.
So, the day sucks but in a not too bad of way, I guess.
Emily68
@satby: My mother died in 2004 and when my dad died in 2008 and my brother cleaned out the house, he found ~500 letters my dad had written during WWII to his then-girl friend, later his wife and our mother. We had no idea these letters existed. My brother said he read a couple and they were pretty mushy and so I wondered for quite some time if I even wanted to read them. It seemed like such a violation of their privacy. BUT, I finally overcame my scruples and since last summer, I’ve been reading and transcribing them one letter at a time and sending them out to my brothers and their families. It’s been the most wonderful thing. It brings him back to us for a while. Even the occasional ethnic slur is forgiven–after all he was a man of his time and since we’re all adults now, we know our father wasn’t perfect.
So my whole point is–I hope you find something equally wonderful.
Chyron HR
@JGabriel:
Well, as long as you don’t vote for Trump we won’t hold that against you.
Gin & Tonic
@satby: Sorry you didn’t make it in time. Glad to hear there wasn’t a lot of suffering for her.
rikyrah
THE RACHEL MADDOW SHOW 4/4/16
Clinton, Sanders knock controversial judge as Wisconsin heats up
Rachel Maddow reports on the latest developments in the presidential primary race as both parties turn their focus to Wisconsin where Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton are both including criticism of Wisconsin Supreme Court Justice Rebecca Bradley in their campaigning.
raven
@Emily68: Scan them and save them, they might make a good homemade book some day. I have the Vmail sent to my dad in the Pacific and he saved my letter from Korea and Vietnam.
rikyrah
@satby:
Yes, the girls are ok about seeing all the sites and historical stuff, but for them, the trip is Disney. They’re over the moon about it.
Disney…some of the best branding ever.
Children know it…children want to visit it.
Just One More Canuck
@satby: my condolences
laura
@satby: I’m so sorry that you couldn’t get a final face to face goodbye. Wishing you grace and peace.
raven
@japa21: My wife and I both had our moms die alone in bed and we with our fathers in the hospital. After a few years it doesn’t matter.
Elizabelle
@satby: Sorry to hear of your mom’s passing. Love hearing that Nana will be missed, and was very involved with the youngs.
Look forward to hearing the girls’ reactions to Disneyworld.
What an eventful past few months these have been for you.
So: do you return to Michigan for longterm? Or find another home? (And don’t worry about answering that one for a few months. Lot on your plate.)
Whatever, take care of yourself.
MattF
@Cermet: Sounds like the old adage that random errors are dealt with systematically and systematic errors are dealt with randomly.
aimai
@different-church-lady: Lots of people were using the term. It applied, IIRC, to the press and the conservative/democratic political tendency to punch left, at imaginary hippies, whenever progressive or liberal ideas were being debated too loudly, or whenever progressives looked like they might actually get something done. See, e.g. Sistah Soljah for a variant of hippie punching. It was kind of a badge of honor/sign of good faith when a politician or a pundit punched left and hit some hippie person or idea.
raven
@rikyrah: I always heard Augusta National was a Golf Disneyland. Now I see why.
PurpleGirl
@satby: So sorry Satby. (With my erratic sleeping schedule and reading times, I probably missed anything you wrote.) Enjoy the rest of your trip with the girls, especially Disneyworld.
Does this mean you won’t need to move to Florida?
Gin & Tonic
@Emily68: My wife and I have a box full of the letters we wrote to each other when we were “dating” but living in separate cities. While we are clear that whichever one of us survives the other is to burn them, we’re less clear on what to do if we die together (i.e. in a plane crash or something.) We don’t want to burn them yet, for some sentimental reasons, but the thought of our children reading them is just unacceptable. A real dilemma.
Cermet
@MattF: LOL
Iowa Old Lady
@different-church-lady: @aimai: And that you are misrepresenting and misunderstanding what Sanders said. Cf. GOS
PurpleGirl
@TheMightyTrowel: Or if you don’t access to real live kittehs there are always kitten cams on livestream. You can even find a cam showing a cat giving birth. I like the cams of Shelly (in Vancouver) and Foster Dad John (outside Seattle).
Gin & Tonic
@raven: Assume you watched the second half of last night’s game by now. Pretty wild, huh?
raven
@Gin & Tonic: God it was awesome! So many shitty games and then that. I’m still bitter about the crap May got away with against the Illini 11 years ago so I was glad to see Carolina get hosed on a couple of calls!
Betty Cracker
@aimai: Regarding that interview, here’s what Sanders said when asked for specifics about what should have been done to hold Wall Street execs / big banks accountable:
There’s really no excuse for that type of dissembling from Sanders. He has made the outrage that many people share — including me! — about banksters skating after tanking the economy central to his campaign. I’ve read responses to that same question from Sanders supporters here on this site that were better than that lame hand-wave above from the candidate himself.
JGabriel
@Botsplainer, Cryptofascist Tool of the Oppressor Class:
Think about it. That’s seriously nonsense – or, at the very least, a poorly selected metaphor. If the left really wanted to *burn it all down*, then all they’d have to do is vote Republican and wait for global warming to fry the planet.
Do you honestly know any leftists who are pro-oil or pro-global warming?
Seriously? Lefty activists don’t organize, donate, do the hard messy work of committee meetings, put together and lead rallies, etc.?
I think Greenpeace, the Sierra Club, Black Live Matter, the Occupy movement, et. al., are all going to be pretty surprised to find out that they don’t … actually I’m not even sure what you’re trying to say here.
Do you think such organizations aren’t organized, that they don’t donate, or hold rallies? Or are you arguing that they aren’t leftists, or have no leftists among their ranks?
Either way, I’m pretty the members of such organizations or supporters of such movements will be pretty surprised to find out that they either aren’t leftists or don’t organize.
Jeepers, it’s like we’re having the same conversations over and over again here at Balloon Juice. Wait, not like, we are having the same conversations. Here’s what I wrote in response to a similar argument back in 2010. Six. Years. Ago:
raven
JGabriel
@Chyron HR:
Heh. Thanks. As I’ve said plenty of times before, I’ll probably be voting for Sanders in the primary, and definitely voting for the Democratic nominee, be it Clinton or Sanders, in the general.
Gin & Tonic
@Betty Cracker: Worse than that is the part about the subway. He says he rode the subway a year ago, then when pressed about the process, he says “you get a token and you get in.”
1. Subway tokens were discontinued in 2003
2. Everybody knows you get “on” the subway, not “in” – just like, in NY, you stand “on” line. not “in” line.
rikyrah
@different-church-lady:
I know we joke about it, but doesn’t it creep out anyone else?
Gin & Tonic
@raven: It was, of course, the right play, but he did fuck up pretty bad with that pass to nowhere. But since they won, nobody will remember that after another day or two. I had a feeling that if that shot didn’t go in for Jenkins, Nova would have lost in OT.
MattF
@Gin & Tonic: Jeez, even I know that, and I haven’t lived in NYC since 1966.
OzarkHillbilly
@Emily68:
After my mother died and we put the old man in a home, we found 5 boxes of love letters she sent him during Korea.
@raven: After a buddy of mine’s paternal grandfather (Hank Sr), died, he (Hank III) and his father (Hank Jr) went to his apartment to clean it out. My buddy found a box full of WW II era stuff that his grandfather had never thrown out. While going thru all this “really cool old stuff” he came across a small book. He opened it up and found a telegram inside it informing Hank Sr, that his son Hank Jr, was MIA. My buddy began reading the hand scrawled notes and soon realized that it was a diary his father had kept after getting shot down over Yugoslavia, picked up by the partisans, and smuggled to the coast where he was picked up by an English submarine and returned to Italy where his airbase was.
My buddy, who had known his father had been a waist gunner on a B-24 flying out of Italy, had never known any of this, as his father just never spoke of it.
raven
@OzarkHillbilly: Awesome.
Betty Cracker
@JGabriel:
You were right then, and you’re right now. The good news is this interminable primary will be over soon, and then we can go back to punching Republicans as God intended.
rikyrah
@japa21:
Nobody blames you one bit for counting down.
magurakurin
@Betty Cracker:
If they are going to base their vote on what some random person on the internet said….then who gives a fuck? No one is responsible for anyone else’s vote. The Sanders supporters will have to search their own souls to make their choice. If they want to help defeat Trump, they will be welcomed with open arms. If not, well, you can’t always get what you want. But we’ll take out Trump without them…like so many times before.
And none of that changes how horrible that interview was and how tragically unprepared to be President of the United States Bernie Sanders is. We’ve dodged a bullet here with him losing.
OzarkHillbilly
@raven: Oh yeah, there was also a letter apologizing for not having written in over a month. :-)
gvg
@Betty Cracker: Not to mention that not all laws broken penalty is jail time, nor is it always appropriate. It is extremely likely that breaking financial laws will result in fines by statute, not jail. One issue is that when the law breaker is a corporation its actions are taken by humans in pieces not wholes. Deciding who did something and should go to jail is beyond dividing Solomon and the baby, plus getting the behavior to stop had to be aimed at modifying a corporate culture, not deterring an individual.
More actual bodies doing audits-getting funded would be a real help. Something like restrictive monitoring, not being allowed to be in certain markets for a certain time, etc might help. A process which he should have spelled out by now, to force a break up of too big to fail. We have actually done it before. ATT was broken up, A&P grocery chain was forced to divest. They should be given a ruling and given time so they can do divestment advantagously. Bernie should have had this ready.
dogwood
@JGabriel:
I hope you would concede a bit that it wasn’t just the DLC types that lost Congress and it wasn’t simply curbing their influence that brought about 2006 and 2008. The colossal failure of the Bush administration brought out dems, and independents in droves to vote, not just for democrats, but against republicans. And not every one of the voters who didn’t show up in 2010 and 2014 did so because they were so profoundly disappointed in Obama and the fact he wasn’t liberal enough. Many stayed home because their Bush anger faded and they had never been in the habit of voting in midterm elections in the first place.
Just One More Canuck
@OzarkHillbilly: From my own experience with my father, it doesn’t surprise me that your buddy’s father had never spoken about the war. My dad was an infantryman in Korea (Canadian military – PPCLI for the commenter by that nym) and as far as I know, he never spoke about to me or to any of my siblings (I’m the youngest of 5)
MattF
@rikyrah: Forgive me, but there might be an explanation from Percolation Theory. 27% could be a ‘critical density’ below which the smaller portion of the population breaks up into little disconnected pieces and loses contact with the larger, connected component of the population. Since the little disconnected pieces in the 27% don’t interact with the big, connected piece, they become frozen in their ignorance.
Betty Cracker
@magurakurin:
I think it’s absurd to allow a candidate’s obnoxious supporters to sway your vote too, but apparently it’s a thing — at least a couple of Clinton supporters right here on Balloon Juice claim they were driven in Clinton’s direction by irritating Sanders supporters.
The Lodger
@satby: So sorry to hear about your mother. I went through something similar when my dad died. I took the earliest flight I could get to the East Coast and he died when I was on the plane. It’s good that I was able to help Mom make funeral arrangements though. Fortunately this year I could get out to see her when she was in the hospital. The last cardiac procedure she had really helped and she is recovering enough to do physical therapy. Hugs.
magurakurin
@Betty Cracker: It is more than absurd. You don’t even know if they are, in fact, supporters. But, still, fuck it. There really is nothing to think about in regard to the vote in November. Pull the big D lever. If anyone has some sort of moral quandary over that considering the stakes at hand…full blown fascist as president….then they are a lost fucking cause anyway.
There is nothing, anyone, anywhere can say about Hillary Clinton, me, my wife, my dear mother and my dear departed father that will influence my arm pulling the big D lever in November. How that isn’t the same for any sentient being anywhere is beyond my ken.
OzarkHillbilly
@gvg:
So in other words, laws that apply to rich people tend to result in fines, where as laws that poor people break end in prison time. I am shocked, SHOCKED I tell you! that the laws would be so written.
PurpleGirl
Re finding letters from one parent to the other: After my father died in 1999, we found that he had kept all the letters my mother had sent him during their courtship. He’d had them tied with a pink ribbon (such sentimentality was unknown to us). We read a few of them but it was really hard. In the ones we read, my mother was pleading to see him that weekend or certain time, saying she loved him but much of her declarations sounded like manipulation. (Her first husband had killed himself after the ’29 market crash and left her with a mentally disabled son. She was working as a governess and personal maid when she met my father.) We never knew if she kept his letters to her.
To those of you who find good and wonderful letters, you are blessed. It can be bitter to find things were otherwise.
OzarkHillbilly
@Just One More Canuck: My father flew in B-29s in WW II and Korea. Never spoke of it unless poked and prodded and then never said any more than the minimum.
Gelfling545
@BillinGlendaleCA: Disneyworld is a whole ‘nother thing. About the size of a smallish county. I was at Disneyland Paris last week & my first thought was ” Wow, it’s tiny.”
Iowa Old Lady
My father was Canadian, so he was in the Canadian Navy from 1939 until the end of the war doing anti-U-boat patrols in the north Atlantic. The only thing he ever said was there were men on those subs who wanted to live as much as he did. FSM knows he was not anti-war, but he had a realistic sense of what his actions meant.
JGabriel
@dogwood:
All I know for sure about the 2006 and 2008 elections is that Democrats started winning again once we put Dean in charge of the DNC, and once he adopted and successfully executed a fifty state strategy – and, of course, that we had an amazing candidate with Barack Obama in 2008.
Yes, I agree and concede all of that played a role.
Calouste
@aimai:
I do. The guy’s been in Congress for 25 years. He should have an answer to any policy or politics question with that long a tenure.
JGabriel
@Betty Cracker:
Damn straight.
BR
I have now requested bumper stickers from both the Sanders and Clinton campaigns. They’re going on my bumper together when they arrive.
OzarkHillbilly
@Just One More Canuck: I should amend my previous statement in that he never spoke of missions. He did talk of some of the funny stuff that happened, hijinks they pulled, getting bit on the nose by a rat while sleeping on their bomber (“I opened my eyes and there were these 2 beady little eyes inches from my face and he just reached down and bit me!”) etc
raven
@OzarkHillbilly: He fly out of Japan?
Paul in KY
@satby: Subtract 73 from 100 & what do you get?
Chyron HR
@Betty Cracker:
There is a difference between deciding which, if any, Democrat you support in the party’s primary and deciding whether or not to vote for the Democratic candidate in the general election.
Chyron HR
@BR:
MISCEGENATION!!!!!!
ruemara
@Botsplainer, Cryptofascist Tool of the Oppressor Class: Don’t hold back. It’s not clear how you feel.
It is disturbing how, sorry to his fans, palinesque he is here. Very word salad, recursive logic and wishful thinking. But, to most I’ve shared it with, if they like him, they find it refreshing and true and wonder if this means I’ve changed my mind. Oh well.
Paul in KY
@Botsplainer, Cryptofascist Tool of the Oppressor Class: Comrade Sanders is well versed in the dialectic. That’s all that really matters in the end.
CONGRATULATIONS!
@Botsplainer, Cryptofascist Tool of the Oppressor Class: Have you ever been to Vermont? Trust me, shit becomes a lot clearer after a visit up there.
Paul in KY
@japa21: Best wishes on your impending retirement. Vacation every day!!!
Paul in KY
@satby: Glad your mom had a peaceful passing.
Mike J
[1] BuzzFeed News White House reporter.
[2] MSNBC
[3] Clinton spox
OzarkHillbilly
@raven: Saipan in WW II, Japan during Korea but I don’t know exactly where he was based.
gogol's wife
@satby:
I’m so sorry about your mother.
gwangung
@dogwood:
Countering that will take money. And organization. And effective on the ground work by lots of people.
That suggests a large organization and machine, like, say, the Democratic party. Which a lot of people want to break up because of “corruption.” Not sure they’re going in the right direction to get what they want.
Paul in KY
@Gin & Tonic: Would assume a staff member got whatever was needed & he just got on.
Paul in KY
@gvg: Why wouldn’t it be criminal Grand Theft?
LAO
Totally Off Topic, even for an open thread, I’ve had the best morning! First, I got a great night sleep for the first time in a week. Then, I put on my winter coat (which I expected not to have to wear again) and found $12 in the pocket. Then, I went to Starbucks and ordered a tall Flat White (my new favorite) and they “upgraded” me to a venti. The only downside is I just drank a 600 calorie coffee and I may never sleep again. The older I get, the less it takes to make me happy.
Now back to your regularly scheduled programming.
gvg
@OzarkHillbilly:
No, that is not what it means. It means that some types corporate crimes are the actions of a group in which no one person intended the result nor bothered to think of it and if there was punishment doled out it would tend to fall on the little folk who followed orders without seeing enough to even know what the results were nor power to have it not happen by quitting for example. Classic example is the Challenger space shuttle disaster but there are many many others. For that kind of crime you have to make the burden fall on the real bosses even though those bosses didn’t know about any of these actions. In other words stockholders and upper highest management have to lose money and bonuses so that it becomes necessary for them to make sure they know enough and structure rewards and punishments within the company so that it doesn’t continue to encourage ignoring safety standards in pursuit of profits. And make no mistake financial risk ignorance is another kind of cutting safety standards. Its really hard to do right, but is the only way I know of that can work. Key is having a budget for enough investigators and the GOP has been sabotaging this area for a long time in all areas.
If Sanders was really thoughtful IMO he would be talking up this angle and saying enough inspectors to actually catch the law breakers in a timely fashion and enough lawyers to actually keep after them in court. No plan will work without this. Not sure it sounds good to voters though.
Financial crimes are also hard to prosecute because jurors have trouble understanding them. Don’t know what to do about that. Other crimes like murder, regular robbery, drunk driving are much simpler to show a jury. Just the way it is and talking about rich law versus poor law won’t change it.
Gin & Tonic
@LAO: I’m so old I can remember when you had to go to Australia to get a flat white.
gvg
@Paul in KY: losing money in a casino isn’t grand theft unless the machines are fixed beyond the standard “take”. Sometimes these schemes were actual theft, but mostly they were just wrong and more risky than people had known. People believed the salesmen. salesmen beleieved the sales pitch even.
There were multiple things going on though, so some things were illegal. Faking signatures on mortgage forms for instance.
Mike J
@Gin & Tonic: You could get one in London twenty years ago.
Peale
@gwangung: No no no. Machines are evil. That’s why Hillary has one and Bernie doesn’t. Of course, that’s why once his candidacy is over, he’ll have 0 impact on the future direction of American politics.
Betty Cracker
@Chyron HR: True but irrelevant to the point being discussed, which is whether it makes sense to allow internet randos to influence your vote.
LAO
@Gin & Tonic:
An Australian friend introduced me to it about 15 years ago, he made the best espresso drinks. So I was ridiculous over-excited when Starbucks put it on the menu.
J R in WV
@raven:
I smile when I drive my Dad’s convertible roadster. He loved driving with no top on the car so much. We got damp around the edge sometimes, trying to remember how to put the top up under a bridge when a summer shower caught us.
He died on election day, 2004. No doubt voted “R” by absentee ballot. He managed the Toy Fund party organization for decades back home, Xmas for kids on welfare. It was more nearly a year-round job than a charity he supported.
LAO
@gvg:
I generally agree with most of what you said in your post. In my experience, prosecutors don’t necessarily understand financial crimes either. A couple of years ago, I represented a hedge fund that was the victim of a fraud. While the partners wanted to “cooperate” with the federal government’s investigation, they were hesitate because of … well I’m not going to say. Once they explained their concerns, I was 100% confident it would not be an issue and it wasn’t, because prosecutors only understand certain types of financial crimes, like Insider Trading.
The biggest problem with prosecuting the big banks and insurance companies for the 2008 collapse as I see it — is that much of what they did was not technically illegal as a result of deregulation of both the insurance industry and the securities industry.
Grumpy Code Monkey
RoonieRoo and I came up with a theory last night.
We were talking about what would happen if the GOP won the White House this time around (Trump, Cruz, whoever). They’d own both houses of Congress and the Presidency, and their base would have…expectations. Expectations that the last sane remnants of the GOP have no intention of meeting. They aren’t going to build a wall along the Southern border (illegals provide too much cheap labor). They’re not going to cater to the fundamentalists, whom they don’t need anymore. They’re not going to do the crazy shit. They’ll loot the Treasury and wreck the economy some more for working folks while blaming the Democrats, sure, but that’s about it. But that’s not nearly enough to satisfy the crazy people voting for them, and if all they have to show for it in 2020 is more tax cuts, then they’ll be primaried from the even further right, and may wind up losing the whole show to the Democrats.
So the GOP can’t afford to take both the White House and Congress. They need
someone to block them so they can tell their base, “no, we can’t do everything you want, the nasty Democrat in the White House won’t let us.”
And this is where Rince Priebus becomes an evil genius instead of an incompetent buffoon.
You tell your best and brightest to take a knee (and they, being the best and brightest, see the writing on the wall just as clearly as you do, so they agree). You let the freaks run for President. As a hedge you run some “competent” candidates like Bush or Christie (hey, we’re grading on a curve here) just in case the freaks flame out and you actually win and need a puppet. But you really hope that Team Blue takes the WH, because then you can block their agenda, but at the same time not do the crazy shit that the crazy base demands you do. Of course, you can’t give the game away, so you have to take a hit to your image and have everyone think you’re an idiot with no control over your people.
I really want to believe this is true, because the alternative is just too depressing to contemplate.
Then again, I also really want to believe that Trump’s candidacy is an epic troll orchestrated by Bill Clinton.
But then I think about Rove’s meltdown in 2012. I had always believed he knew when he was spinning bullshit and that he always kept at least one foot grounded in reality, but his reaction to Romney’s loss was surprising. It looked for all the world like he’d bought into the whole “skewed polls” nonsense. And that makes me less hopeful that Priebus is running a con on his own people.
redshirt
@japa21:
Congrats! But I hope you’re not a cop, because you’re pretty much dead in the next 3 weeks. If Hollywood has taught me anything.
dogwood
@Calouste:
His lack of an answer also stems from the way he has campaigned. He hasn’t left the stump to speak at length about a subject in a thoughtful, sober way. I stopped listening to Hillary and Bernie’s stump speeches long ago. There’s nothing new to be learned. I’m completely open to listening to candidates speak at length on a subject. I watched Hillary speak on counterterrorism, race, and at AIPAC. I didn’t agree with everything she said, but I don’t expect to agree 100% with anyone. I would give the same consideration to Sanders if he would take the time to actually speak at length on anything. I’m not sure why he avoids campaigning outside the confines of a rally. Perhaps his team doesn’t think he is effective alone in front of the camera. Hillary isn’t a master of that either, but she does it because it’s something presidents have to do all the time. Those types of speeches give candidates and presidents a good foundation for answering questions that are thrown at them in interviews and press conferences.
J R in WV
@Chyron HR:
Well, I’m an old, kinda hippy, and I like Yo La Tengo, and REM, and Talkiing Heads AND CSNY. So that OK too.
I don’t wear neckties much anymore.
japa21
@LAO: Totally agree with everything you say.
A good defense attorney would make the prosecution look silly most of the time.
And corporations cannot be sent to jail. In a large corporation it becomes very difficult to assign responsibility to specific individuals and provide specific proof.
And, as you say, most if not all of what happened leading to the crash was not illegal.
And finally, many members of the financial industry have been sent to jail, but that is because their fingerprints were all over what was done and what was done was certainly illegal in those cases.
And people who should know better still scream because Obama and Holder didn’t send anything up the river.
Miss Bianca
@satby:
Yeah, very sorry to hear about your mother passing before you got there. But as you noted, she had probably decided “Up with this I will not put, any longer, morphine or no!”
Calouste
Looks like there is going to be a real life experiment of what a Sanders revolution would look like. Iceland is most likely going to have parliamentary elections soon, due to the Panama Papers fallout, and the Pirate Party is at around 35% in the polls.
Gin & Tonic
@redshirt: There was a very sad story about a decade or so ago where some Greyhound driver was driving his last shift, heading home for retirement. Had his wife with him. Overnight trip. Fell asleep at the wheel, crashed the bus and died.
Miss Bianca
@Grumpy Code Monkey:
Occam’s Razor, friend, Occam’s Razor. Or, rather, who was it that said, “never attribute to malice (or evil genius) that which can be adequately explained by stupidity (or, willingness to buy one’s own BS)?”
Gin & Tonic
@Calouste: I’ve thought for some time that Iceland is perfect Bernie country: a few years ago they said a big “fuck you” to the international banksters, and they’re all white.
boatboy_srq
@satby: [[hug]]
japa21
@redshirt: Not a cop, nor a soldier or anything like that. If you read Richard’s threads you will realize I work for one of those evil health insurance companies. Unless I trip and fall on my way out the door, I should be safe.
boatboy_srq
@Mustang Bobby: Tallahassee? Really? Eew. As for Governor Voldemort, sunlight doesn’t do much. But if you find the horcruxes…
japa21
@Gin & Tonic: Thanks for that story. Really cheers me up. Maybe I will walk to and from work my last day. It is only 26 miles each way.
Miss Bianca
@LAO:
Ah, thanks for saying that. I’ve been trying to say something similar to my Libertarian BFF when he starts railing about Obama and Holder and the Evil Banksters, but IANAL, so it’s nice to hear an actual lawyer talk about…you know…the *law* involved. Or not involved.
H’m. I think I need moar coffeeee…
ETA: Speaking of coffeeee, what is a ” flat white”, for all love?
WarMunchkin
@Betty Cracker: As proud member of, let’s say, the Atrios wing of the Democratic Party, I am fucking terrified by that interview.
At some point, beyond the internet commenter nonsense that goes on here, I’m into following politics because I care about implementing good public policy in the country that affects the lives of millions of people for the better. I don’t see how a candidate who is unable to answer a basic question about public policy advances that goal. I love Bernie and what he’s accomplished so far in this race, what he’s done to bring focus on vital, ignored Democratic issues, but that was abjectly embarrassing, and in a just world, his campaign would be doing some serious reflection immediately.
scav
@Calouste: Because all political events are equivalent, as judged convenient? Iceland isn’t the US for any number of reasons (see treatment of banks, for one), so why equate them? Because, a new party, operating under it’s own name just screams Saunders running as a Dem? There are examples of grumpy electorates all over the world, see Spain, see Greece, but hey, Iceland is the chosen example. Explique further.
Uncle Cosmo
@OzarkHillbilly:
I must’ve been in my early teens when I relayed to my father the gist of some WW2 stories my friend up the block told me that his father had told him (Marine machine-gunner on a landing craft in the Pacific IIRC).
My dad (diesel mechanic in an Army motor pool, also in the Pacific) cut me off in the middle, shouting Don’t you believe a word of it!
I snapped back, So you’re saying Mr. Johnson (NHRN) is lying? How do you know that?
–Because no one who went through those things ever wants to talk about them. EVER!
I never saw him angrier. And his unit (Leyte, Okinawa, Korean occupation) never saw combat–they lost one man, the first night on Leyte, shot by mistake by one of them as the rest crouched in slit trenches (water table 18″ down) with rifles in hand, scared spitless, because the Japanese were rumored to be infiltrating through the front lines.
He’d tell us the funny stories. It took awhile to pry the others out of him. Like the fact that after that experience on Leyte he was so afraid of having his throat slit by a Jap in his sleep that in combat zones he’d stay awake all night (& catch catnaps during the day).
I found out later that while the motor pools were being set up onshore, the techs unloaded supplies from landing craft. I wonder how many dead bodies, or pieces of bodies, he saw on those beaches before the graves-registration teams got around to them. I wonder what that did to him. I never took the trouble to ask. I wish I had. He’s been gone for 18 years this month.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
the “Why hasn’t Obama put any banksters in jail!” rhetoric drives me crazy, as if all he had to do was bellow “Seize them!” and they’d be tossed in a dungeon. IANAL but I remember when Patrick Fitzgerald went from FDL golden boy to scoundrel because he didn’t go after Karl Rove in the Plame case. What calmer heads said was that prosecutors don’t like to make cases they don’t think they can win, and PF was known to be especially careful about that. In the case of Wall St, the gov’t would have been taking on defendants with more or less limitless resources with which to dazzle jurors who in all likelihood were just thinking how much they want jury duty to be over. And any convictions in those cases would be fought on appeal for years.
Paul in KY
@LAO: Rock on, LAO!!!
Paul in KY
@gvg: I tend to think they are dissembling when they trot out the whocouldaknown defense. Seems extremely self serving, to me.
J R in WV
My late Uncle B flew in bombers in the South Pacific during WW II That’s most all I knew about it.
Then after my Dad died, we were going through Mom’s stuff, which Dad kept only allowing us to take her clothes away. We found Uncle Bill’s wings in mom’s jewelry box. Special wings for gunners on the big bombers. I did know he was often a turret gunner, alone for the whole day-long flight.
At first I was puzzled by that, but after I thought about it I saw. Mom was his kid sister, and when he got back from the war, he didn’t want reminders of that horror, so he gave it to his kid sister, who no doubt wrote him letters during the war.
A lot of very heroic guys were doing something very necessary, but which they hated, as was remarked above.
My Dad volunteered to go in ’42 after completing a year at the U. but was found to have a heart murmur at the induction physical, which may have saved his life, really. He made it to 80 before Big C and chemo got him down.
Punchy
The Onion could not possible reach this level of spooftasticness:
and
Good lord is there some butthurt in NC.
boatboy_srq
@satby: Which parks are you hitting? Need any pointers? BC and I (and possibly MB and others) can point you to some good things.
dogwood
@japa21:
Hope you enjoy retirement as much as I do. Just having the time to appreciate the simple pleasures of life is a real blessing. I always said I didn’t hate my job; I hated getting ready to go to my job. I still get up at 5:00 am, but it’s a pleasure now. Spring here is a glorious season, and being out and about or putzing around the house all day with the windows open in April and May is as good as it gets for me.
LAO
@Miss Bianca: Here is a description of a Flat White.
Is there nothing that can’t be found on wikipedia?
Paul in KY
@japa21: You said: ‘And, as you say, most if not all of what happened leading to the crash was not illegal’
I disagree. Just buying Moodys for the express purpose of ensuring the ratings were what they wanted them to be is criminal fraud.
Paul in KY
@Calouste: Gnarrr! We be salting ye lutefisk for me proletariat in a fortnight!!
Gin & Tonic
My father went to his grave (35 years ago this year) having never spoken a word to anyone (as far as I’m aware) about his wartime experiences. I’ve pieced together a few clues since then, but not much. He left zero memorabilia.
boatboy_srq
@Punchy: Naturally processing transactions (without local staff) is exactly the same as hiring hundreds of people to run the systems that handle those transactions, so location doesn’t matter. /snark
Miss Bianca
@Uncle Cosmo:
The only thing I ever learned about my father’s combat experience in the Pacific didn’t come from him, it came from my mom. She told me she could tell when he was having a combat nightmare because he’d start talking in his sleep about “the monkeys in the trees” and wake up shouting. I gathered that he was talking about Japanese snipers picking off his company.
Miss Bianca
@LAO:
Oh, dear…that does sound lovely. (drool)
scav
@Punchy: Damn those companies for expressing their moral values when not about firing sluts, those of alternative religions and refusing to bake wedding cakes or implement the best medical treatment available according to the wishes of the patient! Just who do they think they are?!
Brachiator
@Betty Cracker:
Yep. Absurd. There is the anti-Clinton lunatic fringe who insist on seeing her as Stealth Goldwater war-monger. But most of these people were previously the Naderite lunatic fringe; their hatred of Clinton is just the current place to hang their perpetual frustration.
Apart from this, I try to excuse excesses of enthusiasm, and can’t imagine a rational universe where anyone should consider changing their vote just because they don’t like a candidate’s supporters.
ETA: had been away from the Nets and media and did not know about the Sanders Daily News interview. Will check it out. I appreciated some of what he said during an interview with the YouTube pundits, The Young Turks.
Betty Cracker
@WarMunchkin: Yep. It’s downright scary, and if the Clinton peeps are sharp (and this go-round, they seem to be), they’ll be mining that interview in preparation for the upcoming debate.
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: It seems to me there were some pretty clear-cut cases of criminal wrongdoing, e.g., the robo-signing scandal, which the banks agreed to settle and for which no one was convicted, IIRC. You could make a good faith argument that the feds should have gone after the perpetrators for fraud. You could also make a good faith argument that the settlement was a better outcome for the people who got screwed.
Reasonable folks can disagree on that issue. But there’s really no excuse for basing your entire campaign on bankster fraud and being unable to come up with a single example of criminality when asked by an editorial review board.
Mike J
@Brachiator: While you may be right about politics, hating the Yankees because of their fans is perfectly rational.
japa21
@dogwood: Agree. Totally looking forward to getting up and having a slow cup of coffee on the patio with my wife, watching the birds, etc instead of gulping it down as I run out the door.
Calouste
@scav: I’m not equating the countries, I’m equating the political movements of Sanders and the Pirate Party.
feebog
@satby:
Sorry to hear of your Mom’s passing. My dad died in November 2014 and we were faced with a similar situation. The wife and I flew up to Seattle on a Sunday afternoon. My Dad was already unconscious, so I really didn’t get that final goodbye. But I was able to stay with him and hold his hand until he passed around 2:00 a.m. My Dad always said that he did not want to die alone, so being there, along with my oldest son, was a big deal. I’m glad you are at peace with her passing.
Linnaeus
My condolences to you and your family.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
You and I disagree on this, but that interview struck me as of a piece with the whole Sanders campaign. Good intentions are self-fulfilling.
Linnaeus
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Probably true, although this circumstance is itself indicative of a larger problem.
Uncle Cosmo
@Gin & Tonic: Dad was drafted in 1943 at the age of 30, when they were taking pretty much any male who could walk. He told me he felt patriotic for the first 24 hours in uniform; after that he couldn’t wait to get out.
None of them think/thought of themselves as particularly heroic–they just did what had to be done. And what had to be done was routinely hazardous & frequently horrific. They came home to an undamaged & grateful country with the chance for a decently-paying job, the wherewithal to marry & own a home & car & raise a family in peace. Having struggled through the Great Depression & then fought the War, it was reward enough. Why would they want to remember the fighting if they didn’t have to?
Calouste
@Brachiator:
Well, the supporters are attracted to the candidate for a reason. Even if I can’t immediately see why some people are attracted to a certain candidate, the fact that the people attracted to a candidate are obnoxious people makes me think twice about that candidate. As in think “What kind of dog whistles are these obnoxious people hearing from this candidate that I don’t hear?” Although with Sanders it’s not like you have to think about it that much. The casual ignorance of and indifference to racism and sexism is not hidden very far below the surface.
Linnaeus
@Calouste:
I hear you, although this kind of thing is really vulnerable to confirmation bias.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
also, too, breaking up the banks appeals to me, but besides the question of how do we get there, tirere’s the question of “then what?” We break Citigroup up into five pieces, are those five banks/ companies less politically powerful?
Ben Cisco
@satby: Sorry to hear about your loss. Sounds like you’re handling it as well as you can. I hope you find peace.
Betty Cracker
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: I do think Sanders relies too much on the phenomenon of the “revolution” to drive change, which is one of the reasons I went with HRC when it came time to vote. But some of y’all have gone from “he’s naive and impractical” to “he’s evil and must be destroyed.” That’s where we part company.
Gin & Tonic
@Uncle Cosmo: My father’s war and post-war experiences were very, very different, including not having a home to go back to. I’ll just leave it at that for now.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Betty Cracker: “evil and destroyed”? I do think he’s a narcissistic asshole, and because of that narcissism has reached a point where he’s doing more harm than good. I’d say I’m more in the “he’s pissing in our tent and should stop that” camp.
Aimai
@Betty Cracker: well–there is sometthing to the notion that “like master,like man.” I could easily have been for sanders but the broad, hysterical, snd vitupretive claims of his supporters made me more scepticsl of him rather than less. Their wxtreme antipathy to the democratic party made me see them , and sanders, as unreliable allies.
scav
@Calouste: But there seems to be a difference between a dedicated new party and a convenient lamprey action onto an existing one. And blithely ignoring the general context and environment in which the actions are taking place doesn’t bode well for thinking the results or events are transferable. One experiment involves a cat in a bathtub and another a weasel in a lingerie shop, but hey! they’re both grumpy quadrapeds!
Brachiator
@Calouste:
As long as I have been lurking in Balloon Juice, I have run into posters who love to write about dog whistles. They will insist on dog whistles even when the actual dog is biting them in the ass.
I think blather about dog whistles is overdone.
I live in Southern California. One day, I ran into a bunch of Bernie supporters on their way to a rally (they were all wearing blue Bernie love t shirts). Lots of young women. Lots of nonwhite folk. They looked like a friendly and happy bunch of people.
I got problems with Bernie. He is not my candidate for now. But when people talk about indifference to racism and sexism either on the part of Sanders, they are making shit up. His supporters are a mixed bag. Some of them are economic determinists. And some of them are dopes about gender and race. But I ain’t voting for them.
Also, the Democratic Party is still full of racists and sexists and homophobes. But they are often able to tamp down their worst feelings, and to see past them and vote for something better than their fears and anxieties. This is what usually makes them better than Republicans.
schrodinger's cat
@Betty Cracker: I don’t think he is evil, he is deluded. He sees everything through an economic lens and his grasp of economics is shaky at best.
Stan
@Uncle Cosmo: Rest easy. The beaches of Leyte were very lightly defended with very few US casualties. Okinawa had no beach combat at all. The fighting was brutal and intense, but all inland.
amygdala
@satby: Long-time lurker and enthusiastic purchaser of items from your Etsy shop here. Condolences to you and your family. I hope you and the girls have fun tomorrow, and a safe journey home.
Brachiator
@Mike J:
OK. I will give you that one.
Brachiator
@MomSense:
Sadly, I have to agree. Some pundits have made a big deal about Trump’s interview with journalists being a train wreck.
But for someone who is currently a US Senator running for president, Sanders revealed that he is sadly out of his depth, especially with respect to his signature issue, Wall Street. There is just nothing here of any real substance.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
and apparently we can the law to that list, and government, and the American electorate, and politics, and foreign policy, and …..
waynski
@Just One More Canuck: I had three uncles who served in the infantry in Korea, one a green beret who climbed the cliffs at Inchon, but it was an iron-clad family rule that you were, never, ever to ask them about it.
The Fat Kate Middleton
@satby: I am so very sorry about the loss of your mom. Let her love – and the love you felt for her – be what you remember best. Are you still planning to stay in Florida?
debbie
@Betty Cracker:
Boy, Elizabeth Warren would have had the editors’ eyes spinning at the level of detail in her response to that question. Still wish she would run.