Regardless if Trump loses or not, his candidacy and his tactics are going to have long-standing repercussions for society. Today, der TrumpenFührer decided that not only are Americans of hispanic descent not fit for the court, but Americans of the Islamic faith:
Presumptive GOP nominee Donald Trump said that it was possible that a Muslim judge would be biased against him when asked in an interview aired Sunday for his views after proposing a ban an all Muslims.
Trump reiterated on CBS News’ “Face the Nation” that he thought U.S. District Judge Gonzalo Curiel, who is presiding over the federal fraud case against Trump University, was biased toward him because he was “very strongly pro-Mexican.”
CBS host John Dickerson asked Trump if he thought he wouldn’t be able to be treated fairly by a Muslim judge.
“It’s possible, yes. Yeah,” Trump replied. “That would be possible, absolutely.”
“He is a member of a club or society, very strongly pro-Mexican, which is all fine. but I say he’s got bias. I want to build a wall,” Trump said, referring to the wall he wants to build between the U.S. and Mexico.
I wish there was an enterprising reporter or journalist who would just confront Trump with a checklist of ethnic backgrounds and religions and ask him to put a check next to which ones are real Americans who are capable of serving on the judiciary fairly.
At any rate, by validating his candidacy, Paul Ryan and others are most certainly partly to blame for this kind of thing:
A group of students at a western North Carolina high school built a wall made of boxes and blocked access to a common area, and their Latino classmates are upset.
The students were allowed into McDowell High School, about 100 miles northwest of Charlotte, on Wednesday to perform a prank as a teacher supervised them.
A photo of the wall with about 30 students standing in front of it was shared on Instagram and captioned, ‘We built the wall first.’
Principal Edwin Spivey says one of the kids wanted to put a Donald Trump logo on it and was told he couldn’t do that.
The wall was taken down before classes began on Thursday.
Donald Trump, the presumptive Republican presidential nominee, has promised to build a wall along the US-Mexico border if he gets elected.
He said in a June 2015 speech announcing his candidacy: ‘I would build a great wall, and nobody builds walls better than me, believe me, and I’ll build them very inexpensively, I will build a great, great wall on our southern border. And I will have Mexico pay for that wall.’
At the time, he also said: ‘When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending their best.
‘They’re not sending you. They’re not sending you.
‘They’re sending people that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems with us.
‘They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people.’
Why is that teacher still employed? Oh, yeah. North Carolina.
I’ve long said that I prefer to have my racists out in the open- I like letting the Klan march in Skokie because I actually do like people to speak their minds and then be held accountable for them. I much prefer being able to keep an eye on those hooded peckernecks than have them hidden underground making bombs and planning lynchings. At the same time, I don’t think political correctness is some horrible scourge on humanity. Yes, there are a bunch of whiny shits on college campuses, but hopefully they will grow out of it, and when they don’t, it’s because they have shitty faculty who didn’t teach them. But most of all, what political correctness means is a basic sense of fucking decency.
The Trump campaign has burnt to the ground any sense of decency, and is actively whipping up hate. This is scary and is going to be a mess for a long time coming, particularly since these kids are learning it from their parents and are going to get even angrier and more radical unless their beliefs change, because they are soon going to be the minority in America. What’s happening in schools like this in North Carolina is we are breeding the next group of racists who are going to make life hell for all of us long after I am dead.
tastytone
And the wheel goes round. Ai yai yai.
Ramping Up
Thanks to Drudge, upcoming tell-all book CRISIS OF CHARACTER by Hillary’s former Secret Service Agent shot up to #1 on Amazon from #6,000 or so overnight! This will be the UNFIT FOR COMMAND of 2016!
SiubhanDuinne
J.
While it is too late to prevent Trump from seeking the office of President of the United States, this solution would (hopefully) prevent future Trumps from even considering a run, or would prevent them from being the nominee.
Ramping Up
From the book blurb:
This is going to be extremely damning. Watch it get wall-to-wall coverage on cable news right up until the convention. Hillary is being defined.
RepubAnon
There’s really no such thing as “political correctness” – there are only people speaking their minds. The term “political correctness” is basically a phrase that conservatives use to suppress speech they disagree with – as in:
“Conservatives speak their minds – liberals don’t want to admit that the conservatives are right, so they just make hypocritical criticisms in an effort to be ‘politically correct.'”
bystander
Ya You! Another reason not to spend money in North Carolina!
NCSteve
No. Not “because North Carolina.” Because Western North Carolina. The part of North Carolina that is to North Carolina as, say, West Virginia is to Virginia, or Pennsyltucky is to Pennsylvania.
hovercraft
John you are too naive, white people can are the only people who can judge white people. White people are also the only one’s who can judge black people latino, and any other people. Whites are mature enough to set aside petty personal prejudice, the rest of us not so much.
Miss Bianca
@SiubhanDuinne: My father told me that a lot of bigwigs told R and H that they loved South Pacific, except for that one song – that they really needed to take it out if the play was going to go anywhere. Thankfully, they didn’t listen.
MattF
And you know what? I don’t feel a shred of sympathy for the Republican politicians who are now stuck between the actual Trump and their fantasies of a ‘good’ Trump that’s– somehow– lurking under the badger, somewhere.
shomi
“Regardless if Trump wins or not”
That’s as far as I got. What a ridiculous way to start a blog post. Like it’s a 50/50 type thing and just roll with it….Lol. Stay wrong….Cole. That’s what you are good at.
Tim C.
@RepubAnon: Wait… huh? I’m not following. I thought “politically correct” was the Right-Wing code term for “Not overtly bigoted in some way”
Iowa Old Lady
Is anyone else getting some sort of security alert when the log onto BJ? I’m wondering if it’s my computer that’s borked.
Baud
I too am pleased it’s out in the open. It had to be sooner or later.
max
The Trump campaign has burnt to the ground any sense of decency, and is actively whipping up hate.
Er, what sense of decency? Do you not recall the Ground Zero mosque and all that going back to 2001?
This is scary and is going to be a mess for a long time coming
It’s been a mess and a long time coming. I’m pretty sure popping this pimple coming to a head is going to be good, not bad.
particularly since these kids are learning it from their parents and are going to get even angrier and more radical unless their beliefs change, because they are soon going to be the minority in America.
There is no limit to teenage stupidity. They’ll be embarrassed by the whole thing in ten years or so. Well, a lot of them will be.
What’s happening in schools like this in North Carolina is we are breeding the next group of racists who are going to make life hell for all of us long after I am dead.
They never left. But as you say, they lack manpower so this is likely a dwindling problem. (There’s always a Confederate revolt when their manpower is crapped out and they’re going to lose. When they have the manpower, they don’t need to revolt.)
max
[‘The ghosts of 1861 walk among us.’]
MattF
@Iowa Old Lady: Not me, so far.
RepubAnon
@Ramping Up: The working title was probably “Our Loosely-Enforced Libel Laws…” You’re correct, though – Maureen Dowd will be pushing this book in every column until the election – and if Hillary wins, throughout Hillary’s term in office. Trump University will be on page 12 below the fold.
Renie
In an earlier thread that was taken over by trolls, I pimped an article my son got posted on Salon.com today Looking the other way: The accepted sexual abuse of young boys by institutional powers.
I was reading the comments about it and surprised to see an opinion that part of the solution should be to educate children that this type of behavior is not acceptable. At first I thought this is just another way of blaming the victim but is it even possible to help children understand that is not acceptable to the point they can control the situation? Too many times this abuse is done by authority figures so how can a child take command of the situation? Seeing a bully like Trump be in authority and being praised by his supporters for his oppressive behavior, aren’t children being taught that intimidation is an okay social behavior?
Anoniminous
@Ramping Up:
If you need help with the long words your local thrift store will have an English dictionary for sale, cheap.
Walker
@NCSteve:
Yeah, because the eastern coast (excluding the Black Belt counties) is such a progressive area. In my experience, the out of state retirees in the Wilmington area are even more racist.
Iowa Old Lady
@MattF: Then it’s probably me. Thanks.
hovercraft
@MattF:
It’s the epistemic closure, they truly thought/think that their view of the Clintons and Obamas is shared by the silent majority. Trumps boasts of having the number 1 show with 10 million viewers suckered them into believing he could win. Since he crushed all his challengers they thought he could crush Hillary. You would think they would learn after 25 years, they are not hated.
MattF
@Renie: And kids often just repeat their parents’ opinions. Most of them will grow out of it, some won’t.
Chyron HR
@Ramping Up:
So “HILLARY UNIVERSITY” lasted for less than 12 hours? Even for you, that’s pathetic.
trollhattan
Coincidentally I have a friend, now retired from the Secret Service, who was on HW’s, Bill’s and Hillary’s details. Soon he’ll be able to note he protected three presidents.
shomi
@Chyron HR: You see that pattern as well I see. Apparently they are still following the 90’s playbook. Nobody ever accused conservatives of being adaptable and innovative.
MattF
@MattF: I should say, I’m not suggesting that the kid’s parents would approve of abuse– just that ‘teaching’ that abuse is bad isn’t likely to be effective. You need to encourage specific behaviors that combat abuse.
Miss Bianca
So, I had a comment about character, honor, Hamilton, Burr, and Trump, and it just vanished into the ether. What triggered that? “Hamilton”? Testing…
ETA: OK, so it wasn’t “Hamilton”. Good to know, for Mnem’s sake, if not for mine!
Adam L Silverman
@Ramping Up: He wasn’t a Secret Service agent. He was a junior – as in two years on the job – uniformed Secret Service Officer at the White House. He worked a shift assigned to a specific location in the building, then he went home for the night. He was not on either President Clinton’s or Secretary Clinton’s actual security detail. His only actually notoriety was informing the Deputy Chief of Staff that he saw Monica Lewinsky in the West Wing at times when he didn’t think she needed to be there. That’s it. He never traveled with the Clinton’s. He didn’t spend time in either of their White House offices. He didn’t spend time in the residence. Talk about suckering the rubes.
http://www.nytimes.com/1998/04/24/us/secret-service-officer-worried-about-lewinsky.html
hovercraft
@Ramping Up:
Dysfunction, the word that personifies Trump. His campaign is in turmoil run based on what fleeting brain fart the candidate has, with no one able to save him from himself. A candidate who lacks impulse control in both his personal and public life. You do know that to discredit Trump there’s no need for an informer, all we need to do is put out his sessions with Howard Stern, or his hundreds of interviews in his own words/voice. The commercials will be epic.
Mary G
My comment got eaten twice?
RepubAnon
@Tim C.: Yes, conservatives use “politically correct” whenever they’re called out for overt bigotry – but it’s broader than that. Anyone criticizing a conservative is accused of making those criticisms in bad faith in an effort to be “politically correct” – and that accusation is then used to silence those critics. In essence, the dreaded “PC Police” are the conservatives seeking to silence anyone trying to introduce facts, civility, or anything else conservatives disagree with into a discussion.
Villago Delenda Est
Ethnically diverse crowd in front of the “wall” there.
Every last one of those snots should be hauled off to basic training under a Hispanic surnamed drill sergeant.
Villago Delenda Est
@Adam L Silverman: The rubes are predisposed to be suckered. Doesn’t take much to give them the fully monty.
Teddy's Person
@Villago Delenda Est: The teacher supervising the “prank” should join them.
Baud
@Adam L Silverman: Good enough for Wingnut Welfare.
RandomMonster
@Ramping Up: I’m sure the Clinton campaign is trembling over the latest hatchet piece. They’ve probably decided to just declare Bernie the victor and retire in shame, to live out the rest of their days in obscurity.
Adam L Silverman
@Villago Delenda Est: This is true. “I stood in front of the Oval Office for a year, but I know everything that went on inside when the door was closed. And in the First Lady’s Office on the other side of the building. And upstairs in the residence. And on Air Force one and Marine One, which I never set foot on….”
Genius!!!
Villago Delenda Est
@Ramping Up: You are a idiot. But we knew that already.
(Note to Juiceitariat: Ramping Up is one of the rubes.)
bystander
@bystander:
“Ya You” was autocorrect’s version of “Yay!” I really don’t use “ya you” as an interjection. For the record.
Is it just me or is there a significant uptick in trollposts?
hovercraft
@RepubAnon:
Politically correct is their new ‘race card’, or any card. It’s used to turn themselves into victims. Kind of like how they love the first amendment until it’s used to criticize them. I want banners all over the country telling them,it allows you to criticize but does not protect you from criticism.
Major Major Major Major
@SiubhanDuinne: That’s where my mind went.
Good rant, Cole.
My first thought was a David Cross bit. I don’t remember anything but this one line, but it’s about how you have to learn these things…
I will take issue with this:
The fish rots from the head there. The administration is feckless. The ranks of faculty members who will risk their careers for this stuff are shrinking. (Not blaming the faculty though, their job market is, um, rough.) The problem’s still overblown, and it’s not going to have any measurable effect on society other than some kids who aren’t fit for the job market until they’ve earned their lumps (and lord knows that’s never happened before), but… bleh. I blame money.
Ramping Up
@Adam L Silverman:
The media won’t care and neither will idiot low-info swing voters. Keep on trying to dispute it–it only gives it oxygen. Remember UNFIT FOR COMMAND?
MattF
@bystander: The trolls are getting ever more insistent. It’s actually a positive sign, but it is irritating.
Cat48
My mother taught me when I was going to kindergarten to treat everyone the same, regardless of their race. Thanks mom.
Major Major Major Major
@Ramping Up:
Remember when your boy had to steal both his elections because he was too much of a dumbfuck to actually win?
Frank Wilhoit
As usual, the real point is a much more general one.
Trump cannot imagine losing except through “unfairness”, viz. bias or corruption. A “fair” process is one that gives him the outcome he wants, and that is how it is known to be fair. Conversely, an outcome that he does not like proves that the process was “unfair”.
The source of the “unfairness” only matters insofar as he can tell a resonant story about it. This is where it becomes possible to talk about “racism”, because what that signifies is the resonance of a story about Mexicans, Muslims[, Jews, blacks, queers, liberals, etc. ad inf.]. But there again, the primary resonance of the story is always the notion that “if it had been fair, we would have won”.
This is the real toxicity of Trump’s attacks upon his perceived enemies, whomever they may be, whatever their group affiliations may be.
Oldgold
I am starting to worry that Trump is imploding so fast that he won’t be the nominee and that we will end up facing a plausible GOP candidate in the fall.
Mnemosyne
@Renie:
From what I’ve read, child molesters try to target the kids who have some kind of chaos at home that makes it difficult for them to talk to their parents, which makes it less likely that the molester will get caught. If anyone has a responsibility, it’s the responsibility of the parent or parents to make sure they keep those lines of communication open so their child feels comfortable confiding in them.
geg6
@Ramping Up:
LOLOLOLOLOL!
Hilarious troll. Thanks, I needed that laugh.
Adam L Silverman
@Major Major Major Major: I believe what you want is:
Sydney Smith 1771-1845
redshirt
I weep for what might have been. The late 90’s featured a burgeoning neo-hippy movement, which was absolutely crushed by 9/11 and W. And we’ve been descending a dark path ever since, despite the light of Barack Obama.
If Trump were to win, I fear the darkness would fully descend and who know what happens after that.
We’re fighting not just for our country, but for our very world and everything alive on it.
A Ghost To Most
@Ramping Up:
Is that like ON-DEMAND FUNDING?
Fucking Hitler Youth.
Tim C.
@Major Major Major Major: He won legit in 2004. At least I’ve never seen any real evidence to the contrary. 2004 was also before a lot of the crap hit the fan for the W administration, Pre-openly admitting torture, pre-Katrina, pre-attemting to destroy Social Security, Pre-near economic collapse. The GOP winning formula for presidential elections has been since 1980: Sunny talk about cutting taxes, fear the outsiders… but don’t look like an a-hole about it. That’s a hard plan to execute these days for anyone, much less Trump.
Ramping Up
@Major Major Major Major:
Haha, keep whining you little bitch. Here, take a trip down memory lane.
Bush WON.
Brachiator
Trump’s got his enemies list already, and he ain’t even president yet. Hell, he ain’t even the official nominee yet.
There are all kinds of legal and constitutional objections to everything coming out of Trump’s mouth concerning his bizarre and racist idea of judicial conflict of interest. And yet, while GOP leaders try to gently back away, they know that they are held hostage by this mad man, and so refuse to clearly point out that he is an idiot as well as an obvious bigot.
Trump is finding a new way, every day, to demonstrate the proof of Hillary Clinton’s contention that he is temperamentally unsuitable to be president. And yet instead of looking for an alternative before it is too late, the Republicans cling more tightly to him.
This cannot end well for the GOP, even if they somehow win in November.
Gimlet
@Frank Wilhoit:
Trump cannot imagine losing except through “unfairness”, viz. bias or corruption. A “fair” process is one that gives him the outcome he wants, and that is how it is known to be fair. Conversely, an outcome that he does not like proves that the process was “unfair”.
Also brings to mind McConnell’s refusal to allow Obama to name Scalia’s replacement on the SC. Apparently there is widespread perception of unfairness in the courtroom rather than dispassionately applying the law to facts.
Catherine D.
Ah, don’t worry. There won’t many human generations to worry about after the planet implodes. I’m rooting for the cockroaches to take over. (quietly sings “Their Brains Were Small and They Died” to self)
Elizabelle
@Oldgold
I’ve been wondering about that too. And then, whoever ends up the GOP nominee, the mainstream media will be “look! A return to sanity.” It’s worrisome.
Although: since he does seem so close to imploding, I am surprised that Ryan and McCain endorsed Trump NOW, and not a lot closer to the convention. I don’t see either living down that endorsement, either.
Cannot guess what is going on on the GOP side. They’re way over the shark, into barrel over Niagara Falls mode. Only question is “do they bounce?”
redshirt
@Ramping Up: I’ll be impressed if you can continue this act in 2020.
UNLIMITED BITCOINS!
Ramping Up
CRISIS OF CHARACTER author is also setting up a group of former Secret Service workers against the Clintons. Very reminiscent of 2004! Gonna be even more fun for my side this time!
Turmp U will turn into “Trump Who?” now that CRISIS OF CHARACTER is #1 on Amazon. Drudge is endlessly promoting the book and Rush will be reading excerpts from it tomorrow. Halperin will talk about it on Morning Joe!
Crank up the loudspeakers! We’re going to push this thing wall-to-wall! It will be THE story of the Summer!
Gimlet
Was kind of hoping Obama would give the eulogy at Muhammad Ali’s service.
Ramping Up
@redshirt:
I’ll be working hard for the reelection of President Trump in 2020.
Miss Bianca
“Marked as spam”, by God!
Major Major Major Major
@Tim C.: There was a lot of ratfuckery in Ohio, certainly enough to flip it, and still a lot of fallout from the 2000 purges and caging in Florida and some other places. Remember that big purge they were going to do in Florida before they got caught? Who knows what else we missed. But yeah, I was mostly using hyperbole. Thanks for the call-out, that sort of thing can be irresponsible ?
redshirt
@Ramping Up: lol. As if. For as long as I’ve been reading your drivel you’ve literally never been right. Heck, just this campaign you’ve cycled onto your 4th choice, the very candidate you were bad mouthing a few months ago.
You do realize you’re never right, right?
Gimlet
@Ramping Up:
I’ll be working hard for the reelection of President Trump in 2020.
I only hope you are able to do for him what you did for “Jeb!”
trollhattan
@Ramping Up:
That’s the word that earned the banhammer last time. Consistent, is our little remora of desperation.
Iowa Old Lady
@Brachiator: A big advantage of the temperamentally unsuited claim is that it’s true, so Trump constantly enforces it all by himself.
Major Major Major Major
@redshirt: Bitcoins are a perfectly legitimate technology, they’re just not what most of their supporters claim/think they are. (I love the nickname ‘Dunning Kruggerand’.)
@Catherine D.: I don’t know where people get this idea that humans will go extinct. We’ve survived bottlenecks before. We’re awesome at that. We’re hearty. So is herpes, I’m not making a value judgment.
Jeff Spender
As a piece of performance art, I think Ramping Up might be the Stephen Colbert of the internet.
Tim C.
@Major Major Major Major: I’ve been there myself. Did the tour, got the t-shirt.
Ramping Up
@redshirt:
I was nervous about Trump at first given his limited involvement in the conservative movement and unconventional campaign tactics. But the latter fear was allayed by his unconventional tactics utterly wiping out the entire GOP field, and the former by his list of SCOTUS nominations.
Trump just wants the glammer and prestige, that list made it pretty clear. He’s not going to follow through on his tradewar stuff or universal healthcare. He will let his cabinet and judicial appointments be hand-picked by The Heritage Foundation and his legislative agenda written by ALEC. Grover Norquists’s “working digits” line is apropos for Trump.
With Trump, THE BOYS ARE BACK IN TOWN…, and running the government behind the scenes.
trollhattan
@Gimlet:
And Willard. It’s the moron trifecta–put your money on Trump to place.
redshirt
@Major Major Major Major: My joke was that by 2020 bitcoins would be the default currency. Fell flat, I guess. I love “Dunning Kruggerand”.
Brachiator
@Frank Wilhoit:
Wait, are you talking about Trump or Sanders?
A Ghost To Most
@Gimlet:
“Damn the accuracy, it’s the sound we want!”
Major Major Major Major
@Miss Bianca: And yet our troll gets off scott-free! ☹️ ? ?
MattF
@Elizabelle: It’s a problem, but it’s their problem– I don’t see how the past six months could just be sent to the memory hole. They’re just wending their way from the deep bench to the deep do-do.
patroclus
@Gimlet: I wish.
Unfortunately, decency, like Elvis, left the building. In my view, it was when the Republicans decided to go all in on Lewinsky and impeachment over sex. But it had been building for a long time even before that. Trump will be the worst Presidential candidate ever nominated by a major party. He doubled down on his racism this morning by disqualifying Muslims from the judiciary (in addition to Latinos). I suspect women, Asian-Americans, African-Americans and gays and lesbians will be next. But, he’s had a terrible week and seems to be cratering (almost entirely on his own). I’m beginning to get my hopes up about a landslide again.
frosty
@Miss Bianca: South Pacific, eh? I was thinking Tom Lehrer since I had a vague recollection of the song and it read like it was right in his wheelhouse.
Jeff Spender
My cryptocurrency of choice is Dogecoin.
Not to be confused with Nerdgold or Digibits or BicuitsN’Gravy or however many hundreds of other cryptocurrencies there are.
Elizabelle
@Major Major Major Major:
That is perfect. LOL.
Formerly disgruntled Clinton supporter
@Right To UNLIMITED RIDICULE: Too bad your boundless enthusiasm and blind optimism can’t be put to better use. Humanity’s loss, I suppose…
Ramping Up
@patroclus:
And YET, this thing is TCTC in the RCP average, both nationally and in the swing states. What does that say about Hillary if Trump is so awful?
Major Major Major Major
@Ramping Up: glammer!
@frosty: National Brotherhood Week
patroclus
If the racist troll is going to be continually allowed free rein here, then I’m out.
germy shoemangler
washington post
Brachiator
@redshirt:
And yet, holee crap, rampant inanity is actually on to something here:
Paul Ryan has promised to deliver position papers on taxes, the economy, etc., which I guess will set the course of the Republican agenda. The plan has to be that Trump will give these plans his blessing and promise to be a good boy and allow them to be enacted if he wins.
Then, I guess the plan is that Trump will not have to bother pretending that he has any coherent ideas about government and just concentrate on being the ringmaster of the GOP general election campaign circus. After all, the only thing he has going for him is being a master showman.
Miss Bianca
@Major Major Major Major: I know. I’d console myself with the thought that it was just my gorram brilliance that was making FYWP flip out, but even I am not capable of that level of delusion.
greennotGreen
Several commenters have mentioned the responsibility of parents to not teach their children racism. Both my parents were racists although I’m sure they’d deny it. I was once disowned because I had a black boyfriend.
Neither my sister or I are racists. (Usual caveats for white Americans apply.) I think it’s for two reasons. One, having been raised in a secure environment and perhaps having the necessary genes (whatever genetics may contribute to it,) we both have liberal brains. We’re more tolerant of and curious about differences, new experiences, new information. Two, for me, anyway, I listened in Sunday School. I read the New Testament. I read the parable of the Good Samaritan. I read the new command Jesus gave, “Love one another as I have loved you.”
So, from our parents we could have learned racism, but we didn’t. At some point in everyone’s life, one has to accept responsibility for their own character. At some point those Drumpfjugen in the photo may look back and be appalled by their behavior. If not, it’s on them.
gindy51
@Adam L Silverman: My friend’s uncle did work with Clinton and Bush I as well as training during Reagan (he’s 85 years old). If Hillary had won in 2008, he’d have voted for her. He is planning on voting for her this November… his first DEM vote EVER.
Keith G
@Renie:
Doing such a thing in the right way could be part of a multifaceted way to attack such abuse. A victim might not be able to escape the initial incident, but if children are able to feel that it is important to talk about such events in a safe environment, it is possible that the damage might be limited.
Gimlet
SAN JOSE — A day after a melee erupted outside a Donald Trump rally, the San Jose police chief and mayor on Friday defended themselves from a national backlash
While it appeared to many onlookers that police allowed the violence to proceed unchecked, San Jose police Chief Eddie Garcia insisted that it was more important for police to hold their “skirmish line” formations than to stop individual attacks. Four arrests were made.
“We are not an ‘occupying force’ and cannot reflect the chaotic tactics of the protesters,” Garcia told reporters. Unless a victim’s life was in peril or the violence was “spiraling out of control,” he said, officers held back to avoid inciting more violence and having the crowd turn on officers. He also said the 250 police weren’t enough to control the roughly 400 protesters.
Major Major Major Major
@germy shoemangler:
(Twin Peaks)
J.
@SiubhanDuinne: Sadly all too many children if not being actively taught to hate are being shown how to. (Also who knew this song from South Pacific would become a presidential campaign theme song over 65 years later?)
Ramping Up
And a big fat LOL to you all still believing Trump will drop out soon. I believed as you did once before I saw his political genius. This isn’t a big joke or publicity stunt–Trump is for real and ain’t dopping out, no way no fucking how.
MattF
@Brachiator: Except that Der Trump wouldn’t be led around so easily. Trump creates chaos– someone like Ryan, trying to promote specific policies, might as well be having a conversation with a lamppost.
Ramping Up
@Brachiator:
You got it! Paul Ryan will be a kind of Prime Minister in the Trump Administration.
germy
@Brachiator:
Another ADHD candidate. Just like McCain and Palin and W. They couldn’t focus for two minutes. Just scribble their name over whatever is pushed in front of them.
Howard Beale IV
Here’s hoping Trump’s lawyers get sanctioned if they continue their Curious Curiel attacks. And none other than Larry Klayman shows what happens when you go down that rabbit hole of attacking a judge.
germy
@Ramping Up:
I agree. No way in hell would he ever drop out. I just don’t see him doing that. He’ll stick with it right to the bitter end.
Mike in NC
@Ramping Up: You keep using “we”. Do you keep a pet turtle in your mother’s basement? Don’t feed it the lead paint chips!
germy
@Ramping Up:
It’ll be great British comedy: Yes Prime Minister!
Shell
Another swift-boat of lies and utter bull shit. You should be so proud!
MattF
@Howard Beale IV: Tsk. Those judges all stick together. It ain’t fair.
Major Major Major Major
@Mike in NC: Poor turtle.
aimai
@Renie: The current thinking on children and autonomy is that we need to begin very early teaching children that they have the right to say no–no to forced kisses, forced touches, etc… And it starts very early and with interactions that some parents are not comfortable policing. Its quite common in many families for children to be forced to comply “Give Grandma a Kiss!” or “Give Uncle Bob a hug!” This is considered a prerogative of older relatives and children are not considered to have the right to refuse. Of course its generally harmless–grandma just wants a kiss and uncle bob just wants a hug. But it can set kids up for a lifetime of disregarding their own bodily autonomy, of believing they don’t have the right to say no.
The issue isn’t that kids who are taught they have the right to bodily automy can fight off a pedophile authority figure. But that those abusers are generally looking for, and even grooming, kids with weak protections and no boundaries. So a kid who can say “no, I’m not sitting on your lap” doesn’t get molested. The predators are stalking easier prey. (I’m not arguing for throwing other kids to the wolves. Just pointing out that all kids need to be given the freedom to protect their own boundaries, at the same time that we need to protect kids from more agressive abusers.)
JPL
@Oldgold: The problem at this point with Trump withdrawing, his supporters would riot. They will anyway, so what the heck..
trollhattan
@germy:
We’re going to have a PM? What will Republicans call themselves when we’re no longer a republic?
SiubhanDuinne
@Ramping Up:
The part in bold is what makes this blurb Art.
greennotGreen
@Brachiator: This is actually the preferred Republican modus operandi. They thought it worked great during the Reagan years, especially during Reagan’s second term. They like a figure head so they can control things behind the scenes without repercussions on the actual actors (no pun intended.) That’s what they thought they were getting with W., but he turned out to be a bossy, arrogant know-nothing largely out of their control. But since they’re Republicans and incapable of learning from history, they’re trying again with Trump, another bossy, arrogant know-nothing. We can’t let them steal it this time! Trump doesn’t have a brother or sister who’s a governor, does he?
lollipopguild
@frosty: Tom had “National Brotherhood Week” which was/is very good. Most of the people in the song have passed but his point is still valid especially with T-rump being openly racist.
SiubhanDuinne
@Miss Bianca:
I have heard or read that as well. It’s a powerful lyric.
JPL
@patroclus: He does tend to spoil things.
J R in WV
@Tim C.:
I don’t think he did win in 2004. The Ohio Sec of State was a former exec of Diebold, [whatever they call themselves today] which provided many of the voting machines in Ohio. Voter suppression, crooked voting machines, stolen electoral votes from Ohio = stolen election # 2 for G W Bush.
Diebold, which provides audit tapes in their banking ATMs, but not in their voting machines, because voting isn’t important and money is? Or because they intended for their machines to be stealable from square one?
Shell
Hee-hee-hee. Zing!
John Cole
@shomi: That was supposed to be loses. Doesn’t make sense if it is wins.
Fixded
lollipopguild
@Elizabelle: Sounds like a law firm. Cheatem Dewey and Howe.
germy
@trollhattan: a dumpster fire?
Surreal American
@Ramping Up:
The key is to get people *outside* the epistemic closure of wingnuttery to buy your bullplop, you nitwit.
Shell
There already has been two. Bill Clinton was elected twice, remember? Try to keep up.
Mnemosyne
@SiubhanDuinne:
I particularly like that we’re supposed to be unaware that a person who almost got the Democratic nomination in 2008 is now “scheming” to get it in 2016. I guess publicly stated goals and plans count as “schemes” to people who are unused to how politics work.
hamletta
@Gimlet: Obama probably never met Ali. Bill Clinton has been asked to speak, though.
Was just at the beer store, and some Teamsters were picketing the Red Hot & Blue in the shopping center. The guy handing out leaflets was young, so I gave him the Readers’ Digest bio on Lee Atwater to explain why I’ve been boycotting them forever.
Profiting from stirring up the rubes’ racism is more evil than racism itself. Atwater was the worst. No wonder he needed to unburden his soul when he was dying.
lollipopguild
@trollhattan: Nazi’s.
Ramping Up
@Shell:
“The important thing is to win.”–Richard M. Nixon
Ramping Up
@Surreal American:
And of course they did in 2004, it was all too easy. Obama was a special case because white guilt kept swing voters from really buying in to the fact that Obama has a real hatred for this country and is an incompetent boob to boot.
greennotGreen
@hamletta: In Nashville there’s a popular pancake restaurant that I have boycotted since 1969. At that time the owner stood in the doorway with a shotgun to block any black people from eating his stupid pancakes. It’s been run for years now by his son who, I’m told, is a good guy (although I believe there was an incident a few years back with some poor service for a guy of east Indian ancestry.) Anyway, I won’t eat there because it’s an indictment of Nashville that the place is still in business. It should have closed in 1969 when the owner showed himself to be a racist jerk. Unfortunately, there were plenty enough racist jerks in the city at that time to keep the pancakes coming.
Ramping Up
@Shell:
“Thanks” to one H. Ross Perot.
greennotGreen
@Ramping Up: Are you still taking your meds? Up the dosage.
Elizabelle
@SiubhanDuinne: Great catch. You got me to look.
also:
Clean case of projection; it’s a statement that’s arguably true about Republicans, and that no one who can be taken seriously has ever said about either Bill or Hillary Clinton. They are both policy wonks, and actually care deeply about their American constituents. You may not care for their policy solutions, as the rightwing does not, but describing their work as being “afterthoughts” is insane.
Byrne “came to understand” nothing. He saw what he wanted to see, (and from outside the building, peeps!), and now he is trying to fleece the Trumpenfolk of their cash.
Shell
@Ramping Up: I thought you just said winning was everything, no matter how you do it.
Surreal American
@Ramping Up:
Prime Ministers typically have more political power than heads of state. So yeah, that’s gonna fly really well with Der Trumpenführer.
Miss Bianca
@SiubhanDuinne: What made me remember the story, tho’, is that my dad was not, to put it mildly, the model of the social justice warrior. Not openly racist, but subject to all the prejudices that an upper-middle-class WASP guy would be likely to have. So the fact that he commented approvingly on that song always said something to me – I just wasn’t sure *what*. Maybe, just as you said, that it’s a powerful lyric that’s going to get you thinking whether you want to or not.
trollhattan
@greennotGreen:
New dose instruction: Take them all. Now.
sigaba
I happened to open up a Private Browsing tab and click on Breitbart’s rundown on Meet the Press. All the commenters could stand to talk about was how awful it was that Trump said something nice about Paul Ryan, and then other commenters rushing in to remind them that Trump is just doing his Art of the Deal and keeping his enemies closer, and in November Trump would “fix” Ryan. Others rushed to promote the guy who is trying to primary Ryan as the only solution to fighting the “Globalist” agenda.
I don’t think Hillary came up once. It was simply taken for granted that the enemy was the RINO and Hillary was maybe beside the point (or would surely be in jail in November, I suppose).
Surreal American
@Ramping Up:
Kicked Rmoney’s ass. Funny that you’re still all butthurt about it.
shomi
@John Cole: Still sounds to me like you think he has a shot.
The reality is that most voters including die hard Republicans cannot stand Trump and no matter what they say about Hillary, they are going to vote for her or 3rd party candidate (effectively the same thing).
Anything the media says to the contrary (including their cherry picked polling) is bullshit. The media will always always always try make it seem like it’s more of a horse race than it actually is.
SFAW
@Racist Hump:
Hey, racist, go back to Stormfront with others of your ilk.
You lying, racist, misogynistic fuck.
Baud
@Elizabelle: Are you back from Barcelona?
Frankensteinbeck
@Renie:
This education is actually very useful, although obviously it’s not a solution, just one part of a solution. Never underestimate not just the physical powerlessness of a child, but the mental and emotional powerlessness. Abusers get away with a lot of stuff because the child is too intimidated, guilted, or even fooled into thinking it’s love to report it. Not to mention that if it happens to them and they know it’s not their own fault, the kids are saved a portion of the psychological scarring left in their adult lives.
Major Major Major Major
@greennotGreen: Easy there, that shit can be fatal.
On the other hand, if he decreased the dosage, the filter might slip and he’d say something blatantly racist and get banhammered twice in one weekend.
SFAW
@Ramping Up:
Lying as usual.
Perot took as many votes from Clinton as he took from Bush.
Go back to Stormfront, you lying, racist, misogynistic fuck.
Villago Delenda Est
@A Ghost To Most: It’s also like UNLIMITED CORPORATE CASH! Just ask President Romney how well THAT worked out!
hamletta
@greennotGreen: That’s my opinion, too. If you’re a racist, your mama didn’t raise you right, and you were too dumb to figure it out on your own.
I just pity you.
Mnemosyne
Interesting tidbit about Muhammad Ali that I came across in Wikipedia — in 2009, he traveled to Ireland to visit the hometown of one of his Irish ancestors. The people of the town understandably went insane with joy that Ali came to visit them.
Major Major Major Major
@J.: I iz in ur blog, commentin on ur post
Emma Anne
@John Cole:
So, John, any chance you could expand your list of bannable offenses to people who are banned and come back under different names?
SFAW
@Major Major Major Major:
He already got banned for that some months ago. Too bad it can’t be made to stick, because he sure as shit hasn’t become an “un-racist.”
redshirt
@greennotGreen: I have a long list of businesses I won’t frequent because they displayed their political orientation. I’ll never understand why a business would risk pissing off a sizeable percentage of their prospective customers by putting up Trump signs.
redshirt
@Emma Anne: Too much work.
Ramping Up
@Surreal American:
Romney was on track to victory until Sandy.
Major Major Major Major
noted jurist Alberto Gonzales sez that Trump is right to question the judge’s impartiality
Reggie Mantle
@Frank Wilhoit:
@Major Major Major Major:
hovercraft
@hamletta:
Ali was at Obama’s inauguration in 2008, and he also attended at least one other event at the white house.
The Republic, Blah Blah Blah...
@Ramping Up:
And how many of those books were bought in bulk purchases by ‘unidentified parties’ w/ the express intent of pushing that book onto the Amazon best sellers list?
Major Major Major Major
@Reggie Mantle: You are stupider than I thought if you think the 2004 election was fair, and even stupider than that if you didn’t know 2000 was stolen. The latter is up there with denying climate change.
Surreal American
@Ramping Up:
Protip: Try not to believe what you’re trying to sell to others. Don’t get high on your own supply.
hovercraft
@Elizabelle:
Especially since one of the most consistent things people say about her is that she is a policy wonk, to the point that villagers complain that her speeches are boring because they are too policy oriented.
sigaba
Okay I must know,
@Ramping Up: why would Sandy change anyone’s vote? It seems like both Obama and Romney didn’t really offer much difference on hurricane response policy.
Renie
@Mnemosyne: That’s a very good point. Having communication open is also vital to avoiding a lot of issues where kids can go astray. It also teaches them an important skill about learning to discuss things.
Ramping Up
@sigaba:
“Rally ’round the flag” effect plus Christie sucking up to Obama gave him bi-partisan cred.
hovercraft
@Mnemosyne:
The Irish love their “black Irish”, they love their “native so ” O’bama.
Ramping Up
@The Republic, Blah Blah Blah…:
So? The point is to get the attention of Morning Joe, Mark Halperin, Politico et al. Then the masses will buy the book for real.
It goes like this:
Drudge–>Bulk Purchases–>Rush–>Fox News–>Halperin–>Morning Joe–>Politico–>CNN–>WaPo/NYT–>more book purchases and repeat
trollhattan
@Major Major Major Major:
Gonzales…sounds suspiciously Mexicanian to me. Investigate!
hamletta
@greennotGreen: Would that be Pancake Pantry? I didn’t know that history.
I interviewed the owner 20 years ago, and he bragged about serving Whitney Houston, so I’d imagine he’s a little more enlightened than his daddy. But not surprising some of those battle-axes waiting tables are less so.
I still dream of the sweet potato pancakes, though. Sorry.
hovercraft
@sigaba:
Everyone knows that the polls all showed RMomey was going to win until Christie hugged Obama. Therefore Sandy is the only reason Obama won.
The Republic, Blah Blah Blah...
@Ramping Up: I have no idea what point you think you’re making…
J.
@Major Major Major Major: Iz thanks you. :-)
Renie
@greennotGreen: This sentence you wrote: At some point in everyone’s life, one has to accept responsibility for their own character. That’s maturity. Many people go through their whole life without accepting personal responsibility. Trump is the perfect example.
Major Major Major Major
@The Republic, Blah Blah Blah…: Sounds like he’s saying the point is to sell books. Not sure what that has to do with people actually reading them or caring though.
tybee
@Retching Up:
yeah, just like you saw jeb! and rafael’s sooper jeenyus. and there was someone else you thought was going to run away with the election. it is difficult to remember all the people who have fooled you.
yer a hoot.
rikyrah
This is W-H-I-T-E-P-R-I-V-I-L-E-G-E
Trump vows not to change — which means everyone else in politics has to
By Karen Tumulty
June 3 at 7:14 PM
There are reasons to be skeptical that the wall on the border would ever be built. Putting a ban on Muslims entering the country seems neither practical nor constitutional.
But Donald Trump has finally made one three-word campaign promise that voters may be able to count on.
“I’m not changing,” he declared this week.
Indeed, it is the rest of the political world that is having to adjust.
If recent days are any indication, the remaining five months of this presidential campaign are likely to be fought entirely on Trump’s terms.
The celebrity real estate mogul continues to defy predictions — including some of his own — that he will soften his rhetoric and elevate it to a more presidential level as he moves into a general-election campaign.
Ruckus
@Oldgold:
There is no plausible republican candidate. Hasn’t been for a couple of decades. (ETA OK, several decades) So they get a shitty one elected by lying. Trump at least refuses to not tell how he really feels. Is there any doubt that he’s a bigot? No. Is there any doubt that he’s incompetent? No. The only problem is that a portion of the voters want an incompetent bigot as president. They don’t want him to run the country, they want him to ruin it.
Renie
@Keith G: Yes I didn’t think of it in that respect. As a tactic to bring it out into the open more often and hopefully, that translates into less occurrences.
Ramping Up
@Major Major Major Major:
The point is to dominate the news cycle with doubts/scandals about Hillary.
We will do to Hillary what we did to Kerry and Gore. That’s the point.
The Republic, Blah Blah Blah...
@Ramping Up: oh wait… it get…
You’re actually validating my point..
Ramping Up
@tybee:
That’s just it–Trump wiped the floor with the deepest, most talented bench we’ve had in a generation with nothing more than free media and a Twitter account. He will do the same to Hillary.
Elizabelle
@Baud: Nope. Still in the wonderful Barcelona. Gonna stay in Spain a few more weeks; at least another week or two in BCN.
Is probably a good idea to eventually head to Salamanca for language training at the same school, but Barcelona is just too beautiful, and it’s before the summer crowds. You do not even want to hear how perfect the weather has been. And so I stay.
Cannot speak well at all yet. Can understand a lot more words than I can come up with, off the top of my head. It’s so different at school, with our teachers who carefully pitch full phrases at us that we will understand, or maybe just a few new words. In restaurants, it’s easier.
But then at this homestay, with my extremely animated hostess who speaks no language other than Spanish — gah! (ETA: of course, she speaks Catalan. But no English, or French.)
Situation was masked, because we had another American woman with very good Spanish in the apartment last week, but once she left, Antonia finally realizes my listening comprehension is like with Gary Larson’s dog cartoon: “Ginger! Blah blah blah blah Ginger! … blah blah…”
She is notably deflated today, and I’ve been kinda hiding in my room.
Meanwhile, today brought the arrival of a vegan Russian — Vladimir — who smokes and drinks. Unbeknownst to Antonia, he has brought his own seeds for making sprouts. He eschews eggs and anything cooked. Raw, raw, raw. This is gonna be interesting.
Mike in NC
The pathetic troll didn’t care that Drumpf basically humiliated and emasculated his previous heroes Rmoney and JEB! Says a lot about his complete lack of self-respect. But think about his previous moronic trolling about UNLIMITED CORPORATE CASH etc. Definitely fits the Drumpf demographic of poorly educated white males who are stuck in shitty dead-end jobs and need to let out their aggression on somebody else, instead of accepting that they’re angry losers only due to their own shortcomings. Probably reads all the ‘best’ skinhead blogs to get his ideas. He’ll climb back under his rock in November and resurface here in 2020 unless his mother throws him out.
Sad!
Ruckus
@redshirt:
Have you just outted B Kristol’s side job, blog commenting for losers?
Major Major Major Major
@Ramping Up:
Wow, your benches fucking suck. Can I have a list of places that buy them so I can avoid sitting down there? If Trump could beat that then those benches would probably just snap under the staggering weight of my 200-pound frame.
Ramping Up
PLUS not only will he have the Twitter account but also the anti-Hillary infrastructure we’ve been building for four years–the book is just the beginning.
We’re going to hit her so hard over the head with a mudslide of negative attacks it will make what we did to Kerry and Gore look like a walk in the park!
Next up will be Bill’s “Orgy Island” where he had sex with teenage girls.
Surreal American
@Ramping Up:
And what you did to Obama. Oh wait…
germy
@Surreal American:
“Love is like oxygen. You get too much, you get too high. Not enough and you’re gonna die. Love gets you high”
trollhattan
@Ramping Up:
Whilst simultaneously getting Donny to shut up for five months. Please proceed,
governormorons.Percysowner
Fortunately, Hillary Clinton is not John Kerry. What I mean is that it never occurred to Kerry that anyone would attack his military service. He was unprepared to be Swiftboated. He never thought anyone would listen to that tripe and he paid for it. Clinton has no illusions that the Repubs won’t lie, cheat and steal to win. She is prepared for attacks like this. Whether it will be enough is the next question. I think she is, but I’m sure she’s one of the people who bought that book just so she knows what accusations are being made and she’s preparing to answer them in one way or another.
cleek
@NCSteve:
not Western: rural.
that school is in town of 7000 people, halfway between nowhere and notever.
Shell
Ha-ha-ha-ha-ha! Santorum? Carson? Crazy Cruz? You just brightened this rainy Sunday.
Betty Cracker
@rikyrah: That’s one of the dumbest columns I’ve ever read from a so-called serious political analyst. It would also make a fine Exhibit A in an indictment of our thoroughly useless Beltway media.
Memo to Karen Tumulty: You don’t change the way you cover campaigns because a candidate is campaigning as an overtly racist, incoherent, lying demagogue; you report that the candidate is campaigning as an overtly racist, incoherent, lying demagogue, you nitwit!
Ramping Up
@Percysowner:
Yeah and what about Gore? Dukakis? Mondale? Only Obama was able to withstand attacks thanks to (1) white guilt and (2) Sandy, Bill won the first time thanks to H. Ross Perot and the second time thanks to a tech bubble.
Omnes Omnibus
@germy: The Sweet? Wow.
Citizen_X
@germy shoemangler: Guaranteed that that bird is far more intelligent and less repetitive than Racist Up.
Elizabelle
@Ramping Up:
DougJ! Come on down.
Calling parody troll.
Renie
@aimai: It sounds like a very difficult line to walk. Keeping them safe while not making them fearful of everyone or everything.
D58826
@Anoniminous: Maybe they can come with a comic book version just for ‘Ramping Up’. No need to fill in the bubbles
redshirt
@cleek: 7000 people is a big town in Maine. Like in the top 20 in the state.
Major Major Major Major
@Ramping Up:
That’s a great strategy, right there.
Ramping Up
@Major Major Major Major:
Worked in the primaries!
BTW Trump gives his big counter-punch speech tomorrow. Will bring up Libya, Iraq, and Emailgate.
SFAW
What’s hilarious is that Racist Hump calls the Rethuglican Klown Kar Kandidates “the deepest, most-talented bench,” as if they actually had any talent, other than using dog whistles.
It’s kind of like say an elephant is the most aerodynamic of animals — if all you’re comparing it to is slugs.
dedc79
If people want to comment here to voice disagreement with the content of a post, that’s fine. But when you’ve got comments like Ramping Up’s that don’t even relate to the topic of the post, isn’t that sufficient grounds to block them?
And to the folks who keep taking the bait, what do you think you’re achieving? You’re not going to change the troll’s mind, and the troll isn’t going to change anyone else’s mind.
Reggie Mantle
@Percysowner:
Well, her campaign theme seems to be the same. “You HAVE to vote for me, stupid peons, because the other guy is WORSE!”
Objectively true, but it didn’t work, did it?
Surreal American
@Ramping Up:
Excuses. The GOP should have prevailed over a candidate that allegedly was an incompetent boob who hated his country.
You failed. You failed *so* epically!
Bob In Portland
According to Mussolini, Fascism is a merger of state and business, corporatism. On one hand this definition could be loosely applied to European governments like Britain, Netherlands et al as they divided up the rest of the world soon after the rise of the business class. That could have been applied to the US too, and certainly applies to it today, when the party that used to represent the average person (fitfully and in spurts) is now heavily tilted towards corporate lobbyists.
Still, there is a threat from a Trump candidacy and the general slide of Republicanism into (further and more absurd) bigotry which someone here noted the other day, is going about the process of normalization. The Nazis called it the “salami tactic”, a slice here, a slice there, until things have changed and you find yourself having gone along with steps one through nine, and it’s too late not to take step ten. There was a quote by Voltaire (or what someone imagined to be Voltaire) floating around on the internet, approximately He who can get you to believe absurdities can convince you to commit atrocities. That would apply to building giant walls and banning Muslims from coming to the US, certainly.
But the salami tactic now applies to both major parties. Back in the seventies when it became known that the CIA was assassinating people around the world there was a movement to make it illegal for Presidents to order anyone’s death. It’s been awhile, but I vaguely recall a Presidential memorandum, maybe during Ford’s time in office, where a President ordering murders was explicitly banned.
Now we have the winner of the Nobel Peace Prize routinely assassinating people around the world.
Now it’s okay for the President murder someone, even an American citizen, on the basis of incomplete intelligence (and if the intelligence is completely wrong and innocents are killed, it’s what happens when the world is the battlefield for the war on “terror”) and in seeming violation of the Constitution. We have police routinely shooting minorities in the street. That’s a result of slow changes in our society.
I realize people here dismiss me, but even those here who two years ago who called me a nut or whatever for pointing out post-WWII America’s involvement with fascists and fascist movements around the world don’t seem to deny Trump’s fascist comments and behavior. You may not see or understand the important part of Mussolini’s definition of fascism, the merger of business and state, which is too bad. You miss the bigger story.
We are faced with a choice of two different versions of fascism, the cartoonish Trump who seems intent of making himself look like a typical barbershop bigot, and the more acceptable and more thorough kind of fascism now being advanced by the Democratic Party, wherein business interests control government. The kind that allows us to sit meekly while we have endless war around the world. That’s another change in our society. There was actually once an anti-war movement in the US. It’s pretty much gone.
SFAW
@Elizabelle:
No, DougJ doesn’t, and wouldn’t, spew racist, misogynistic shit that way Racist Hump does/did.
Racist Hump is a thoroughly vile entity.
Major Major Major Major
@dedc79: Eh, I’m having fun.
As for relevance, why would you want relevance when you could have a picture of my cat?
Renie
@Frankensteinbeck: Yes I’m starting to see how we can educate them. But I wonder if it would work more with strangers than for the poor children who deal with it in their own family, such as the intimacy in families that is common, similar to what aimai talking about.
Major Major Major Major
@Reggie Mantle:
You got a time machine?
trollhattan
@SFAW:
There was that one time Galileo dropped the elephant and an iPhone off the Tower of Pizza….
Mnemosyne
@hovercraft:
They love every famous person who has Irish ancestry and goes there to visit, regardless of color. But getting a living legend like Ali to visit was probably better than anything other than a presidential visit.
Also, I’m assuming Obama’s schedule wouldn’t allow him to do the eulogy, but Bill has some time on his hands right now. I’m guessing that Bill will have a lot of really interesting things to say about the transformation of the country and especially the South that both he and Ali witnessed in real time.
rikyrah
to those who attempt to whitewash Muhammad Ali.
From a Playboy interview in his OWN WORDS:
redshirt
@dedc79: I’m preparing two dozen links which I’m convinced will turn the troll into a Sanders supporter.
SFAW
@Reggie Mantle:
Back to trying to pick a fight, I see. Go for it, little fella.
Howard Beale IV
@Ramping Up: HAW HAW HAW HAW HAW HAW HAW HAW HAW HAW HAW HAW!
You felchers have had twenty years to come up with the goods on Hillary and have come up with bupkis.
Y’know what your problem is? You can’t STAND a strong woman. All Hills has to do is point at your crotch, giggle and yer toast.
OK, who’s breaking out the troll grill?
trollhattan
Oh god, somebody lit the calling-all-morans lamp. Let the cutting and pasting commence. Later, all.
dedc79
@Major Major Major Major: I think there’s a longstanding precedent for pet pics being welcome, no matter what the topic :-)
SFAW
@trollhattan:
Damn, he must have been seriously ripped. Carrying an elephant all the way up? I certainly wouldn’t mess with him.
And was it a thin-crust or thick-crust Tower?
aimai
@Percysowner: This isn’t exactly true. Kerry had to go dark for a few crucial weeks or months because of lack of money. But its also the case that nobody is as prepared as Hillary and Bill to run against a figurative shit storm of lies.
Omnes Omnibus
@SFAW: Chicago style.
SFAW
@redshirt:
You’re a day late and a bitcoin short: BiP has already convinced him.
Citizen_X
@rikyrah:
Yeah, right: The Wicked Witch of Arkansas made one whole speech about him, and he spent the whole week sputtering and bursting into flames.
I heard of one leader like that. Interesting story: he ended up shooting himself in a bunker beneath the ruins of Berlin.
Adam L Silverman
@gindy51: Says something important, doesn’t it.
SFAW
@Omnes Omnibus:
Just like the Thug in Chief?
HinTN
@Ramping Up: OMG, you’re my co-worker.
aimai
@Renie: No, its really not that difficult. Its really more of a modern orientation towards children and bodily (and emotional) autonomy. You begin with that and the rest follows naturally. You aren’t scaring the kid because you are simply teaching them that they have a right to have their boundaries respected, and that they need to respect other people’s boundaries. Done right, and naturally, its just part of creating a safe and healthy environment for all kids.
Major Major Major Major
@Citizen_X: Say what you will about Hitler, but you’ve got to admit, he did kill Hitler.
dmsilev
@HinTN: Condolences.
Bob In Portland
@Oldgold: Someone scary like Paul Ryan comes to mind.
skerry
@greennotGreen: No, but his sister is a Senior United States Circuit Judge of the United States Court of Appeals for the Third Circuit. Maryanne Trump Barry.
Omnes Omnibus
@SFAW: I am just saying.
SFAW
@Major Major Major Major:
Channeling Walter Sobchak, are we?
Villago Delenda Est
@Ramping Up: Quoting a criminal. How typical of the party of criminals.
Mnemosyne
@rikyrah:
The president chose very similar words to quote in his condolence statement:
I have to admit, I kind of marvel at the people who are trying their best to whitewash Muhammad Ali right now. It’s so bonkers that I can’t even believe they’re trying to do it. It’s like trying to whitewash Bobby Seale.
Ramping Up
@Villago Delenda Est:
Nixon was before my time but from what I can tell from that generation he really drove liberals up the fucking wall.
The Checkers Speech alone was some excellent trolling! In fact it could be one of the greatest trolls of all time. He never did have to explain that slush fund!
Mothra
I agree – no matter what, this has damaged our nation. Trump’s voters are going to believe that his loss is because of fraud. They will continue to exempt themselves from basic decency and manners to any other than those who agree with them.
Bob In Portland
@Citizen_X: Just as an aside, I am reading RATLINE by Peter Levenda, who makes an interesting case that Hitler ended up living out his string on a small island in Indonesia.
As a child I remember Hitler fleeing was dismissed as a joke, but in the eighties when prominent Nazis like Eichmann and Barbie turn up, some in pretty big positions of authority in South America and the Middle East, the laugh is on the world.
Lurking Canadian
@Ramping Up: Dude, we are still waiting for the flood of oppo that JEB! was going to unleash to drown the upstart Rubio. Actually, we are still waiting for th BRINKS TRUCKS that were going to let Romney bury Obama. To say your credibility is low is to stretch the definition of low.
Are you just making this shit up? I’ve been assuming you were some kind of paid shill, spreading some kind of organized disinformation, but if that were the case, I’d think you’d be right some of the time. Do you get your talking points from the voices you hear over your fillings?
redshirt
@Bob In Portland: Jeez Bob. Do you believe Hitler is still alive in Indonesia?
Mnemosyne
Also, since i just realized I forgot to address the original topic — kids are idiots and they can probably be dealt with by making them do some community service and book reports, but the teachers and administrators who participated in and facilitated this “prank” should be out on their asses.
Ramping Up
@Lurking Canadian:
But we DID. We did spend millions of dollars against Trump and did unleash oppo on him–Trump U, Trump Steaks, Trump Water etc etc. It just made him even stronger. Hillary is repeating the same mistakes.
Omnes Omnibus
@Bob In Portland: Congratulations. You found a new CT. I am happy for you.
Mnemosyne
@dedc79:
If you’ve never installed the pie filter or another troll filter (some people prefer Troll-B-Gone), I would highly recommend it for you. It also makes it easier to scroll the threads because it reduces long posts down to one or two lines.
Major Major Major Major
@SFAW: OMG. The Eagles came on my Pandora station literally as I was reading that.
HinTN
@dmsilev: Needed. Thx
Mothra
@Ramping Up: maybe the 4,000th time is charmed! Maybe this time your dumb anti-Clinton fantasies will work on the normal person!
Adam L Silverman
@Major Major Major Major: Has he/she/it already been banned this weekend? If so, please point me to where that happened and I’ll pull the record and check the IPs.
Ruckus
@aimai:
My folks taught my siblings and I that, even if they weren’t trying to consciously. Respect yourself and others and treat people how you want to be treated. Of course it won’t be the same if you are taught that some groups of people are excluded.
Brachiator
@rikyrah:
Except the past few days have been fought on Hillary’s terms. Trump was at first flailing, then absent. He kept wailing “Hilllary lies” even as even the most reluctant journalists had to admit, “nope, she’s quoting exactly what Trump said.”
His guaranteed counter punch was weak, childish nonsense.
And now I really hope the Democrats take the battle to the GOP as a whole and keep asking, “exactly why are you embracing this fool?”
ThresherK
@Gimlet: Did that story includer Trumpsters using pepper spray on the anti-Trump crowd?
I’m fascinated with how quickly that fact will be disappeared.
SiubhanDuinne
@Mnemosyne:
Can’t you just see Scheming Hillary rubbing her hands together in glee? All she needs is a moustache to twirl.
Ruckus
@Lurking Canadian:
To be right some of the time, even a minuscule amount of time, one would have to have material that was right some of the time to work with. As that is not available we get to go with wrong all the time.
MattF
@Major Major Major Major: Tsk. I go away for a half hour and lightning strikes.
Adam L Silverman
@dedc79: This is the official policy straight from Cole, I checked with him the other night for clarification after others complained:
Keith G
@Renie: Strategies that prevent are important, but will never be perfect since those who wish to victimize can be so cunningly insidious and children cannot be counted on to be their own best advocate. My own experience leads me to firmly believe that giving children the power and expectation to be able to communicate blamelessly what has happened to them is key (though also not perfect) to harm reduction – even if that communication is years after the fact. Youngsters get hurt and move on, coping in silence. But even an isolated event will probably set up emotional consequences that are not isolated.
I think we are crap at after-care. But then, we are crap at all aspects of mental and emotional health.
hovercraft
@aimai:
For all that Obama went against campaign finance precedent in ’08, he was able to out raise McCain and showed the democrats how to defeat the GOP smear machine. Kerry should be the last democrat to allow that to happen. Though if BS had won, I wonder if he would have stood on principle, and allowed himself to be branded as a high taxing, sexual deviancy writing, socialist. Despite the GOP advantage in overall dollars, having more campaign dollars offsets that.
Major Major Major Major
@Adam L Silverman: I got the impression that sockpuppet Rolling Along went bye-bye yesterday afternoon.
redshirt
@Adam L Silverman: It’s a good policy overall.
The internet is filled with BS. You must train yourself to ignore it if you don’t want to see it.
Adam L Silverman
@Bob In Portland: Mussolini never said it, nor wrote it. Nor did the noted Italian fascist philosopher Gentile.
http://www.publiceye.org/fascist/corporatism.html
http://blog.skepticallibertarian.com/2013/02/07/fake-quote-files-mussolini-on-fascism-and-corporatism/
http://dneiwert.blogspot.com/2015/11/donald-trump-may-not-be-fascist-but-he.html
At the link immediately above, to Dave Neiwert’s site, he provides the following definitions from the actual scholarly literature. It might behove you to actually read something other than The Sakers Vineyard and Southfront.
Bob In Portland
@redshirt: No. The book says that the couple smuggled out of Germany and used the identification of a couple of Austrian anthropologists who measured Jewish skulls during the war were Hitler and Braun, and that the man died in 1970. It’s an interesting book, and it’s more important for presenting and understanding how the globe happened to end up covered with Nazis who avoided Nuremberg. What was Costello’s line? “It seems like South America is coming into style.” It should not surprise anyone that places where war criminals found comfort were places that were down with Operation Condor. And you can’t deny that Pinochet and many of those Argentine generals certainly copied Nazi fashion in their clothing and accessorizing.
I have no opinion about whether or not Hitler escaped death. All the evidence about Hitler’s death in the bunker seems to come from a few Nazis who had worked there. The various conflicting stories about Hitler’s last days do not have any actual forensic evidence other than the testimony of a dentist who claimed from memory the bridgework of Hitler, Braun and Martin Bormann. The Soviets made claims about recovering Hitler’s remains, I think that they actually discovered four different remains in different places that were supposed to be Hitler, the last one being the skull of a woman. Stalin never believed Hitler was dead, nor did J. Edgar Hoover. Those elements of western intelligence who insist that he died in the bunker turn out to be the same elements who helped moved Nazis along the ratlines around the world.
Whether or not Hitler escaped is probably the least important part of the book. I find it interesting but have no definitive judgment. The more important element was western collaboration with Nazis, fascists and the Catholic Church in moving these war criminals out of Europe. Heck, Walt Disney used to have Wernher Magnus Maximilian Freiherr von Braun on “The Wonderful World of Disney.” Suck on that lozenge for awhile.
D58826
@dedc79: 21st century version of bear baiting. The commentators enjoy it and the troll is harmless
Shell
Exactly. Saw an article by Ben Stein decrying Trump, saying he knows nothing about economics and his views could lead to a trade war. But is he still going to vote for him? Uh, do you need to ask?
Iowa Old Lady
@Keith G: As you might expect, children often have trouble getting adults to believe them when they report abuse. The younger the child, the less adults believe them. And if the abuser if a family member, the complications involved make some adults hope the report is untrue, so less likely to believe it. Maybe it’s the adults we need to educate.
redshirt
@D58826: The 21st century version of bear baiting is still bear baiting. Still legal in Maine.
Adam L Silverman
@SFAW: No deep dish, with a cornmeal crust, and the sauce on top of the toppings and cheese.
Now I want pizza from Gino’s East! You people are evil!!!!
hovercraft
@Brachiator:
With an incumbent democratic president this election should be a referendum of him and the economy ( Obama +50% so good for her, right/wrong direction not good, economy mixed). But Trump is so egocentric that he is making it into a referendum on him. I don’t think that’s a contest he can win.
redshirt
@Shell: Trump’s further exposing the utter emptiness of the Republican Party. That “Maverick” John McCain rolls over and shows his belly to the man who mocked his prisoner of war experience says it all.
Authoritarians, every single one of them.
redshirt
@Adam L Silverman: I waited like an hour to eat at Geno’s East and while it was good, it was a little much too, and certainly not worth an hour’s wait. But that’s what hype gets ya.
Brachiator
@Mnemosyne:
One BBC story is noting how the story of Ali’s visit in 72 keeps growing over time:
Kay
He’s not going to win, John. There’s more of us. We just have to all get out and vote and we know how to find our voters and get them out.
I'mNotSureWhoIWantToBeYet
@Omnes Omnibus: It’s all Yuri’s fault:
Have I killed the thread?
Cheers,
Scott.
Ruckus
@Iowa Old Lady:
My sister told me that one of our great uncles molested her. We were in our 50s and he was dead so the point I think was to try get someone to believe her because no one did when she was a child. It is possibly that this explained a lot about her life, both the initial act and the denial to her. I wonder how many kids grow up like my sister, not feeling that people believe in them and wondering what they did wrong to provoke such an act.
Adam L Silverman
@redshirt: Whenever I’ve eaten there I’ve been in Chicago for professional meetings. These are always held at the Palmer House. The concierge at the Palmer House always gives me a card that lets me get moved into the fast lane.
Shell
@redshirt: And you know, if by some miracle, a viable, electable candidate suddenly came out, they’d drop him like a rotten zucchini.
dedc79
@Adam L Silverman: @Mnemosyne:
Thanks for the clarification and script link. I wish everyone would just ignore them because they go away when they’re ignored. But I get that others feel differently and like to spar with the trolls.
Mike in NC
Drumpf has now lost Jennifer Rubin. How many winger pundits are still backing the idiot?
redshirt
@Adam L Silverman: Nice. I’ve only been to Chicago twice, both on business, and loved the parts of the city I saw. The downtown area with the pier and the parks and the museums around the lake is just spectacular.
chopper
@Ramping Up:
i just can’t stop laughing at this. mind you it’s the one true thing you’ve said all year, but i just can’t stop laughing.
rikyrah
The Fix
Jake Tapper asked Donald Trump if his judge attack was racist — then followed up 23 times
By Callum Borchers
June 3
There’s persistent … and then there’s Jake Tapper.
The CNN anchor posed the following question to Donald Trump on Friday:
Let me ask you about comments you made about the judge in the Trump University case. You said that you thought it was a conflict of interest that he was the judge because he is of Mexican heritage, even though he is from Indiana. Hillary Clinton said that that is a racist attack on a federal judge.
Actually, Tapper didn’t quite get to form a question. Trump interjected to talk about Clinton’s emails. So Tapper tried to steer the conversation back to whether Trump’s complaint about U.S. District Judge Gonzalo Curiel was racist. Trump deflected again. Tapper tried again. And again.
In all, Tapper made an astounding 23 follow-up attempts. This moment right here — with this look on Tapper’s face — perfectly encapsulates the exchange.
Adam L Silverman
@redshirt: One of my favorite cities.
Major Major Major Major
@Adam L Silverman: I love the Palmer House. They put us there for a wedding one time. The ceremony was in the basilica, the reception was in the rotunda room in the old public library, and all the rest was in the Palmer House.
That weekend had some great ceilings.
Gimlet
@redshirt:
That “Maverick” John McCain rolls over and shows his belly to the man who mocked his prisoner of war experience says it all.
Could be the Republican version of supporting the lesser of two evils
Adam L Silverman
@Major Major Major Major: The Grande Foyer of the Palmer House.
MattF
@Mike in NC: FWIW, Rubin has consistently despised Trump.
Mnemosyne
@dedc79:
Of the three trolls currently on the thread, two of them have been persistently showing up for at least two years despite having been banned at least once apiece. Those are the kind of trolls who should probably go in your troll filter of choice.
Cermet
@Bob In Portland: LOL; please, just stop the nonsense. By that logic everyone who ever died in WW II really is alive and living in South Amerika …even U.S. soldiers. LOLOLOLOLOLOL
Brachiator
@hovercraft:
Interesting point. Hillary’s attack has definitely exposed a vulnerability. Trump knows how to attack and how to counter punch, to a degree, but he doesn’t seem to know how to retreat or to change his tactics.
But Paul Ryan and the party leaders are rushing to provide him some cover. And Trump’s strongest supporters are doing everything they can to deny and dismiss the tough, relentless logic that Clinton used to dismantle The Donald’s pretense of competence.
It is not looking good for him, but it is still way too early to count him out.
redshirt
@Adam L Silverman: It would rank higher for me if it wasn’t for all the murders. I don’t get what’s happening in Chicago (as opposed to NYC and LA) that’s creating a climate that allows for so many murders.
Cermet
@Ruckus: Tragic – and also, happens far too often. So sorry for her.
dmsilev
@Major Major Major Major:
For people not familiar with Chicago, this building is now known as the Chicago Cultural Center; it’s on Michigan Avenue across from Millennium Park and is free to walk in and look at the exhibits. The domed ceiling is Tiffany glass, and it’s beautiful. Go on a sunny day so that it’s properly back-lit.
redshirt
@Brachiator: I wonder if the death of Ali took away a significant amount of time for Trump et al to respond this weekend.
Major Major Major Major
@Adam L Silverman: Well, yeah.
Also Our Lady of Sorrows and the old library.
Doug R
@Major Major Major Major: Maybe not so hyperbolic after all: http://harpers.org/archive/2005/08/none-dare-call-it-stolen/?single=1
Kay
If he loses he collapses like a popped balloon. There’s nothing to him but “winning”. He’s empty, an image in a mirror.
I personally think it will be enormously gratifying and enjoyable to beat him, because it will destroy him. He won’t recover. As a bonus we get to beat his idiot sons too :)
Mobile
@Iowa Old Lady: Got it a few days ago. Something like, “Site not to be trusted.” Wouldn’t allow me to enter. Went away after a few hours.
MattF
@redshirt: More like, gave them an excuse to keep quiet. They’d all prefer to keep away– belling the cat is for people with courage.
sukabi
@Villago Delenda Est: it’s possible his r!ght to r!se flop sweat affected his mental capabilities, paid trolldum must be a depressing way to get by.
Doug R
@Major Major Major Major: Yeah, we survived at least four ice ages for frack’s sake.
Iowa Old Lady
@Mobile: Oh thank you! That’s encouraging.
Doug R
@germy shoemangler: Is the witness a “flight” risk?
cmorenc
At first glance when I started reading John’s post – my presumption was that the students were building the mock-wall with the intention of a means of demonstratively protesting against Trump’s proposal. UNTIL I read further and realized: a) some of the students expressed that they did so in support of Trump’s idea, and b) it was in McDowell County, NC (a relatively rural county east of Asheville (far enough to be outside its cultural influence), represented by a Neandrethal Tea-Partier Mark Meadows in Congress. That area has long been one of the more deeply red parts of NC.
Note that every damn one of the kids in the picture appear to be Caucasian, even though blacks and hispanics are anything but rare in the high-school age demographics of the area.
Major Major Major Major
@Doug R: You are the worst person ever.
Adam L Silverman
@redshirt: Social structure impact on social learning of behaviors. Combined with several generations of poor governance and worse policing and law enforcement. These are also social structural factors that further impact the social learning component. To markedly oversimplify: you have a distinct minority (as in a very small number) of individuals within certain historically underrepresented and marginalized demographics – by and large African Americans in Chicago, that have learned definitions favorable to and neutralizing to both criminal and deviant behavior in general and violent behavior in support of those activities in specific. Sutherland, the father of modern Criminology, recognized this empirical pattern when reviewing his colleagues work on deviance and delinquency in the 1920s and 1930s. Sutherland’s argument was that “yes, you’ve correctly identified where the deviance and delinquency is, but your explanation is missing something”. What was missing is that you don’t have socially disorganized or deviant neighborhoods and the societies within them, rather they’re differentially socially adjusted
maladjusted. The structural components lead to the deviant behaviors. If the schools are atrocious and education doesn’t provide a socio-economic escalator, then it makes perfect sense to engage in drug dealing or other criminal activities to get ahead. Similar for prostitution and drug usage and alcoholism. Sutherland correctly argued that under these types of conditions all of these behaviors are really the normative thing to do, because doing what would be normative elsewhere makes no sense. Combine this with the inability of the Chicago PD to do appropriate and effective law enforcement and the fact that no one cares about these areas and the communities in them except those living in them unless something really bad happens and you have a set of reinforcing social behavioral mechanisms.Bob In Portland
@Adam L Silverman: I’ve gone through my 1943 copy of George Seldes’ FACTS AND FASCISM, and his THE GREAT QUOTATIONS and after thumbing through pages of Mussolini quotes I can’t say for sure he used the word “corporatism” and it would have been in Italian anyway. He said a lot of things like that, though, and he emphasized the merger of business and state. Since I didn’t use quotes, then we are not talking quotes anyway. We’re talking about the meaning of fascism. Considering that both Hitler and Mussolini arose in their respective countries with the aid of corporate elements who expected something in return, if you remove the profit half of the equation you essentially have “fascism” as something that develops out of nothing for no good reason.
But it reminded me of a discovery I made back in the 90s. The American Heritage Dictionary changed its definition of “fascism” between 1975 and 1993.
From 1975: “A philosophy or system of government that advocates or exercises a dictatorship of the extreme right, typically through the merging of state and business leadership, together with an ideology of belligerent nationalism.” That was the accepted definition of fascism from WWII until the mid-seventies.
From 1993: “A system of government marked by a totalitarian dictator, socioeconomic controls, suppression of the opposition, and usually a policy of belligerent nationalism and racism.”
So at least the American Heritage Dictionary used “the merging of state and business leadership” as an important element of fascism, at least until Bill Clinton became president.
Are you saying that the merger of state and business leadership has nothing to do with fascism? Or, that’s just a coincidence? Do you feel the need to drain the profit motive from fascism? Do you feel the need to hide those elements and the profit motive behind fascism?
I would note that the vaguer, later definition of fascism offered by the AHD is so vague as to apply to any dictatorship, right or left across the spectrum. Specificity is better than vagueness in definitions, and someone in charge at American Heritage thought that their original definition was beginning to sound too much like what was going on in the US.
In any case, do you exclude the merger of state and business leadership from your definition? Why is it no longer important? Our government has waged wars, overthrown governments and decapitated regimes for the benefit of corporate investments over my lifetime. I see lots of Wall Streeters in Obama’s administration and lots of donors and people in Clinton’s campaign who work for a living in large corporate enterprises.
I realize that whenever anyone here points out the inevitable quid pro quo that arises with the billions that have been shoved Hillary’s way, but, really, removing the profit motive from fascism and the participation of business in fascist governments is a peculiar move.
By the way, the location of Auschwitz was determined by a meeting of Nazi officials and businessmen as to where would be the best location for slave labor. Herman Ab, German banker, was at that meeting. David Rockefeller in the New York Times obituary, called Ab the greatest banker of our time. Think about mouth gold when you ponder that.
I'mNotSureWhoIWantToBeYet
@redshirt: There’s a big multimedia story in the NY Times about the recent Chicago shootings. Not a lot of answers (gangs, turf battles, retribution, lack of arrests, etc.).
I don’t think it comes out and says it, but presumably at least two main things are needed:
1) The police need to straighten up and “serve and protect” and convince the city that they’re actually doing that.
2) There needs to be jobs for people that pay a decent wage for young people so that gangs aren’t appealing as a way to get ahead.
Cheers,
Scott.
Villago Delenda Est
@Ramping Up: Nixon’s guilt was obvious to even Barry Goldwater who informed Nixon that he didn’t have the votes in the Senate to avoid conviction and removal from office. Every Rethug who defended him on the House Judiciary Committee, after the “Smoking Gun” tape was released, announced they’d vote for Impeachment.
If the criminal Nixon had not resigned first, he would have been Impeached AND convicted and removed from office. Only Jerry Ford’s pardon saved him from well deserved time in prison.
Keith G
@Iowa Old Lady: @Ruckus: I have a growing confidence as I see more parents practicing a “matter of fact” methodology when it comes to discussions (age appropriate) about all things related to sexual development and conduct. Reducing the mystique and the “Ick!” factor is a potent protection.
I also hope we can get to a point where adolescents and young adults are given the information and social permission that will enable reaching out beyond their family to address past abuse so that they can really account for the challenges they are facing. I think that it is a safe bet that a lot of folks are drifting along in need of addressing past injuries. I know I did for far too long.
Ramping Up
@Villago Delenda Est:
He won in the end, didn’t he?
Republicans always do.
Just a fact of life you must accept.
Villago Delenda Est
@Ramping Up: He resigned in disgrace. If you call that winning, then it explains the glorious victories of President McCain and President Romney.
robert thompson
I am reminded by Cole’s definition of political correctness as simply common sense; that manners are the lubricant of civilization. Very late here but I don’t think the Trump rubes care much for civility, much less civilization.
hovercraft
@Brachiator:
I don’t think anything is going to dislodge his core base, nothing will move them. But for the majority of sane people his showing his ass is not attractive. The cover he’s getting from the GOP is not as big of an asset as it should be because they can’t focus on anything positive, they have to spend half their time defending him and repudiating his statements.
robert thompson
@Ramping Up: Being a pariah throughout the world is a strange definition of wining in the end. Perhaps Charlie Sheen was correct in his thinking as well.
Major Major Major Major
I want a new thread ☹️
guachi
@rikyrah:
Like the multiple wives Ali cheated on or the opponents he hurled racist epithets against? Ali was a great man but neither he nor you should pretend, in his death, that he was pure.
Bob In Portland
@Cermet: You misquoted me. Do you think your argument is strengthened by misquoting me? I even pointed out to another liar that the book said the man believed to have been Hitler died in 1970, and I also said that I had not made up my mind that that story was true. And as I said, it wasn’t the most important part of the book. The most important part of the book was western intelligence cooperation with helping Nazis escape Europe.
Do you deny that the US and MI6 helped to move around Nazis after WWII? If not, are you at all familiar with names like Eichmann and Barbie? I realize that some people here are sensitive about former Nazi concentration camp guards being deported from the US, but could you at least admit that they somehow got here? How?
Misquoting me is the lowest form of argument here. If you want to reply to me, please reply to what I write, not to something else.
Ramping Up
@robert thompson:
He died as a respected elder statesman.
And never served a day in jail.
Just like Bush and Cheney never will. Sucks for you don’t it? That’s what you really wanted, and you’ll never fucking get it EVER.
Adam L Silverman
@Bob In Portland: On way out the door, so really quick: 1) I’ve provided three citations that Mussolini never said it. You can’t provide one that he did. 2) Corporatism is a type of fascism, but it isn’t all that is fascism. Don’t have time to deal with the rest now. I suggest you read any of the authors that I provided excerpts from. Their works are considered the scholarly standard into the study of fascism. The American Heritage Dictionary is just a dictionary. In other words it isn’t.
smintheus
They build a g0ddamn fire hazard, and the principal says he can’t see any evidence the kids did anything wrong? The other kids who are offended by this should demand the right to bring a bunch of old tires in and build barricades in the hallways.
Mike in NC
Once the loser troll gets kicked in the junk enough, he falls back to “Reagan elected twice!” no matter that it was 30 years ago. Reagan is dead and forgotten and the Gipper ain’t coming back. Almost nobody under age 40 has ever heard of him.
Keep fucking that chicken you keep in your mother’s basement.
FlyingToaster
@Ramping Up: “White Guilt”‽
You’re out of your mind. White people who voted for Obama don’t feel guilty, trust me; we’re mostly sad that we can’t vote for him again. I and my whole family will laugh you back under your rock. Of course, we’re city folk, who have African-american neighbors and have gone to school with black (and hispanic and asian and for all I know, martian) kids since 1966, so we’re not your target audience.
Let’s see, you’re failing to re-elect McCain and Romney, so in 2020 you’ll be failing to re-elect Trump.
BTW, for most white Democrats, our preference is {Clinton OR Sanders} > {Ebola OR Zika} > {Trump or the other 16 dwarves}. Guilt really isn’t part of that picture, either.
Lurking Canadian
@Gimlet: That’s exactly what it is. There is a non-zero probability that Hillary Clinton will raise taxes on the rich. Since that is the only issue that matters to Republicans, they would vote for the the re-animated corpse of Genghis Khan, provided he had an (R) after his name.
Ruckus
@Cermet:
She went to her grave with it. Although in the last few yrs she seemed to get past a lot of the crap in her life. She was calm and accepting of her death. Facing down death gave her the strength to face down the past as well.
robert thompson
@Ramping Up: Thats pariah with a capital P. Sucks for me? Must suck to defend the soulless and heartless. The only people respecting this triumvirate of sociopaths are sociopath trolls like you. Be gone.
aimai
@Adam L Silverman: Another way of looking at it is that for certain neighborhoods in Chicago you simply don’t have a working State. The inhabitants are living in a failed State, where the economy and the streets are controlled by war lords (i.e. gangs). You get the same amount of violence anywhere there is no functioning police power, no justice, and no legitimate economy. Its just that we aren’t expecting it in a small area, perhaps only a few blocks. But its not uncommon historically or geographically.
The Sheriff's A Ni-
@Kay: I’m unsure if losing is already factored into Il Douche’s strategy. Blame the Republican ‘establishment’ for sabotaging his campaign, complete the hostile takeover of the party, spend the next few years taking the base for everything they’ve got, and then leave Ryan and Cruz with the smoldering remains.
D58826
@Kay: Trump will disappear for sure. What I worry about is he has made bigotry, racism and stupidity mainstream AND without the need for a dog whistle. After a taste of the limelight and media attention his followers will not go away. They have always been the dark heart of the GOP but now the republicans can no long wink and nod and say ‘oh the don’t represent us’. It will take time to put that evil monster back in the bottle and the GOP may not want to as long as they continue to have electoral success everywhere outside of the presidency. Not controlling the WH may actually work in the GOP’s favor. What has happened over the past 6 years – they have blocked almost everything Obama wants to do, they almost drove the country into default, they shut the government down and still had huge wins in 2010 and 2014 at all levels. So they deadlock the federal government and the democratic President gets the blame. If they controlled both ends of Pennsylvania Ave. people might start noticing where the real problem lies.
Major Major Major Major
@FlyingToaster: ⸘interrobang‽
Richard Grant
I am predicting now that the Republican nominee in the 2020 Presidential race will be named N. Ron Hubbard, just to mess with us.
Ramping Up
“mother’s basement”
As someone else said this obsession about poster’s living situations and/or what they do is really creepy.
But this is nothing more than a typical progressive projecting their own failures in life onto somebody else.
If you must now, from where I am typing this from in my fully paid of house in which I have a beautiful “rolling hills” view of the Shenandoah Valley from where I’m sitting now. I’ve always been good at finding ways to ferret out money and have done very well for myself.
How about you? Perhaps that’s a life skill you could learn rather than whining about your minimum wage. Go out and be your own boss.
robert thompson
@FlyingToaster: I was born and raised in basically a whites only milieu but was taught at elementary school that bigotry and especially racism was not a good thing if you wanted an equitable society. It stuck. Wasn’t city folk and had deep rural South roots but was always reminded that one ancestor dodged the Confederate draft; the first in American history, and another was a Kansas abolitionist who joined the Federal Army with his eldest son who did not come home. Roots matter. Respect matters. Education matters. Trolls do not matter. Thanks, I like what you said.
PatrickG
@patroclus:
I used to read (after the fact, because West Coast and work) the entirety of comments threads on most posts. Lately, though, I’ve had a process, which goes like this:
(1) Ctrl-F, note 73 references to Ramping Up.
(2) Note that 44 of those references are explicit replies (@Ramping Up).
(3) Observe that Ramping Up is still active (and being responded to) within the last five comments.
(4) Write off the entire thread, because fuck it, I don’t enjoy fishing for pearls in shit.
So yeah, I’d like to agree with patroclus. I like BJ because it’s not a newspaper’s comment section. Pie and other filters are nice and all, but if you want people to read the comments, they shouldn’t have to wade through the effluent from a Texas pig farm.
On the other hand, some regular commenters and FP’ers seem to enjoy it. This is just a ‘meep’ of protest from a semi-lurker who would like to want to read the comments again. :)
? Martin
@Lurking Canadian:
They don’t care about that. Trump said he’d raise taxes on the rich, and I have a hard time seeing non-college educated whites honestly giving a shit about top marginal rates.
This is just straight up tribalism. They hate Democrats because of Limbaugh and company, therefore in a 2-party system they have to support Republicans. That means they’re on board with whatever Republicans want. Their interest is their tribe, not the specific policies of their tribe. If the GOP turns on the rich, they’ll easily go along. That’s not the kind of lizard-brain issue that connects them to the tribe – not like religion, not like fear. Taxes are very peripheral.
Ruckus
@redshirt:
I was thinking something similar. That Muhammad Ali’s death would bring out even more in the open that he was a great man and that in comparison drumpf’s hate and bigotry is even more apparent and truly disgusting. There is nothing drumpf can say or do to minimize the comparison of how hateful, small minded, moronic, useless, stupid, white, poor, he is, against how great Ali was. Everything that Ali stood for, everything, is a million, no billion times better than what drumpf stoops for.
Bob In Portland
@I’mNotSureWhoIWantToBeYet: The Soviet part in the Hitler body debacle is well-known. By the way, have you ever tried to burn two bodies in a shallow grave with a little kerosene?
Like I said a number of times, the important part of the book is in the title, RATLINE. We’ve discussed this before, and lots of people here don’t actually want to discuss this. Nazis got out of Germany at the end of WWII and some ended up holding important positions in various South American and Middle Eastern governments. As files are declassified we know lots about the Catholic Church and the US government moving these people around, people who should have been put on trial at Nuremberg. Unless you’ve deliberately avoided the subject, you know about Operation Paperclip. You know the Congress For Freedom and other CIA programs that moved Nazis and fascists around the world.
Napoleon said, and he said it in French so this is not a direct quote, history is a series of agreed upon lies.
A little history is a lie. Your quote is not the last word, or even the full story, of Hitler’s eventual death. But since whenever I mention a book here the villagers run the opposite way, you can think it’s the whole story. Ignorance is strength.
greennotGreen
@hamletta: Yes. I’m an old hippie, and I don’t forgive injustices easily.
Major Major Major Major
@PatrickG: Get troll-b-gone, you’ll thank yourself.
D58826
@Bob In Portland:
Please enlighten us since you seem to be speaking from experience. Day job perchance
Omnes Omnibus
@Bob In Portland:
Come on, who hasn’t?
Brachiator
@redshirt:
I would like to think so, but probably not.
Lurking Canadian
@? Martin: Oh, yes, rank and file Republicans are voting for Trump because he’s promising to let (and in some cases, help) them stomp THOSE PEOPLE in the face (for local values of THOSE PEOPLE). I’m glad you gave me a chance to clarify that.
But the original post was asking how could a guy like John McCain, who coasted for forty years on his war record, embrace a guy who called him a loser for being shot down. Or more generally, how could all these #NeverTrump Republican leaders, who swore a solemn oath to keep him from the nomination, now be lining up to kiss his brass-and-zirconium ring. And, for them, I believe, the answer is upper bracket tax rates.
Iowa Old Lady
Whoa. I just got a phone call asking me to vote for a particular candidate in Tuesday’s primary. I haven’t had a political call since the first week in February.
Ruckus
@I’mNotSureWhoIWantToBeYet:
Gangs rarely prosper as the replacement for worth, they prosper as the only avenue of worth. IOW when there is nothing else, no hope at all, gangs will prosper. When criminal activity is the only activity available…..
scav
Give it its due, the believer in Magical Brinks Trucks aims personally high — who knows, given enough millenia he may finally achieve the dizzying mental heights and accumen of Allium tricoccum.
As for the students and their instructors, It’d be altogether a better world if they stay permanently on their side of their damned boxes.
Shell
No, Id say it sucks for this country and is a continuing national disgrace.
pat
That does it. Time to get rid of this a-hole forever.
Bob In Portland
@Adam L Silverman: And I didn’t use quotation marks and Mussolini spoke Italian, not English, so creating a fight over specific words that Mussolini said is avoiding the subject.
The 1975 definition in the American Heritage Dictionary, “A philosophy or system of government that advocates or exercises a dictatorship of the extreme right, typically through the merging of state and business leadership, together with an ideology of belligerent nationalism,” is a better definition.
So, essentially, you agree with me and the American Heritage Dictionary of 1975. Unless you can’t see any belligerent nationalism in today’s US policies, and you can’t see any merging of state and business leadership. Which would be commentary about you, not fascism.
hueyplong
I can’t understand why the troll uses “we” when talking about the guy who cut off his stalwart hero’s appendage and made him eat it.
And there’s no way I think he lives in his mother’s basement. Instead, I suspect his mother lies mouldering in his basement, near the motel.
Ruckus
@Richard Grant:
Unless I’m misunderstanding your comment, isn’t that L.Ron Hubbard?
Who also seems to have been dead for a number of years.
Gravenstone
@Shell:
Ben Stein denouncing anyone else for not understanding economics is rather rich, no?
Ian
@Ramping Up:
Sounds like a perfect politician for you. Can’t you troll more logically?
Mike in NC
@pat: Frankly, I got bored messing with the troll and put the motherfucker in the pie filter, soon to be joined by a few BernieBros.
Matt McIrvin
The idea that Sandy won it for Obama is the standard face-saving explanation for how Romney could lose when he had it in the bag, but it’s completely untrue. Obama led all season in state polling for the EV and his lead was small only between the first and second debates.
Ruckus
@Gravenstone:
Maybe Ben knows what he doesn’t know. That’s a couple of miles above drumpf on the scale of knowing things.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Iowa Old Lady: Iowa does the suspenders and a belt primary and a caucus thing? I did not know that. Non binding?
ETA: @Shell: I knew Stein mostly as a famous-for-being-famous type– the bit part in Ferris Beuller and that quiz show he had on Comedy Central (I’m a sucker for quiz shows)– when I saw him on the old Maher show, yelling at Doris KG for supporting baby killers and getting yelled at by that MTV guy Jon Stewart. I’d heard he was some kind of libertarian, but he came across as one hateful PaleoCon sonofabitch that night.
PatrickG
@Major Major Major Major:
Pie filters (I use cleek’s) and troll-b-gone don’t help with the fact that so much of the thread is nothing but responses to the troll — see the now 48 / 348 comments that are direct responses to the troll.
The point of trolling is to drive conversation. RAMPANT ASSHOLE is certainly doing that!. I’m perplexed at the “Feed the trolls, they don’t matter” strategy employed here, and more perplexed as to why the response to mosquitoes is “get stronger bug spray”.
Like I said, my response is going to be to stop reading the comments where Ramping Up is included, because life is too short. Patroclus indicated likewise. I’ll leave it to the management to decide if that’s a desirable outcome. /shrug
Edited to Add: pie filters and troll-b-gone are more than sufficient for characters like Bob in Portland. Ramping Up is rather better at dominating threads.
Bob In Portland
Heywood Broun, May 1936:
This is how Americans prior to WWII defined fascism.
Major Major Major Major
@PatrickG: Last time I used it, troll-b-gone got responses to the troll too.
redshirt
@Adam L Silverman: Thanks for the details. I agree with that and understand it; what I meant specifically (I should have been clearer), why is Chicago specifically going through these issues now when all the other big cities have seen their murder rates drop dramatically. What has NYC done to reduce murder in that city that Chicago has not/can not?
? Martin
@Lurking Canadian: Ah, yes. It’s a bit self-referential that way. They carry the same avenue that we do that controlling USSC nominations and what bills move through Congress enable a host of other things to happen. Even if Trump isn’t the standard-bearer for your issue, your issue is likely better served provided your party maintains power. It’s always an exercise in convincing the rubes to give you power which you wield for your own interests. That’s true on the Democratic side as well.
Matt McIrvin
As for 2004, I think Bush did win it. The vote in Ohio was crooked but most polling indicated that it didn’t make the difference; he would have won anyway. Bush also pretty clearly won the national popular vote, for what it’s worth.
hovercraft
Early results from PR
Oh and the voting was a mess, final tallies not expected till 10pm. Polling places cut from 2000 in ’08 to 435 today.
PurpleGirl
@SiubhanDuinne: Great reference. I know many people don’t like Rogers and Hammerstein’s music but they so often slipped in a song like You’ve Got to Taught into what otherwise seems to a saccharine libretto. The song is pointed and concise. And about a northern culture — Lt. Cable is from Philadelphia and mentions Princeton. We expect it from Nurse Nellie from Little Rock but not really from Lt. Cable. I think this song redeems the other songs.
Iowa Old Lady
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: The caucus is only for the presidential choice. The primary is everything else. So I’ll be voting for the Democratic candidates for our House district to run against Rod Blum and for Senate to run against Grassley.
burnspbesq
@Ramping Up:
No actual person could be as stupid as you seem to be. Ergo, you must be trolling (and doing it rather badly, truth be told).
D58826
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Actually he is a bit more than famous for being famouts. From wiki
He is still an a-hole but at least he is a bit more than just famous for nothing.
I'mNotSureWhoIWantToBeYet
@Major Major Major Major: Does TBG work when people post a quote without the URL anchor to the comment they’re responding to? Or those who reply without a link or a quote?
TBG and the Pie Filter (seemingly) can’t handle every variation of reply types that one might want to filter. Ultimately, readers have to figure out how to skip over things that they find annoying. It’s unfortunate, but that’s the way it goes.
I try to reply at most once to a troll or (to what I consider) an annoying poster. Piling on doesn’t help in most cases, and if someone is already beating the poster about the head, my feeble additional comments aren’t going to help.
Moderation in all things (even moderation). ;-)
Cheers,
Scott.
D58826
@hovercraft:
Probably just to spite Bernie
Gravenstone
@PatrickG: Actually, Troll-B-gone blanks not only the offending posts, but any replies to them. Yes, it leaves large holes in overrun threads, but you will be spared reading any of their tripe, either direct or via quote.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@D58826: I knew he was a speech writer– that’s what Stewart kept yelling in disbelief (You worked for NIXON!) as he ranted about the evil and corruption of the Clinton administration, which at the time I think was the travel office thing– but I always figured it was the Beuller, Beuller thing that made him a media presence.
PatrickG
@Gravenstone: @Major Major Major Major:
Well, that’s interesting, didn’t see that from my casual inspection of the code. Might have to invest in that specifically for this asshole. I do like pie from Bob in Portland, after all. :)
My larger point about “seriously, you want people to install third-party software to avoid THIS IDIOT” remains, though.
hovercraft
@D58826:
Of course it was. I’m sure it has nothing to do with the budget crisis.
Schlemazel Khan
OH BOY! Cramping Up and Боб в Портленде both in the same thread!!! SO glad I went for a long bike ride despite having 22 MPH headwinds. At least I am not dumber for having done that but would be if I read those two. It would be nice if we could have a thread just for them so that decent, normal people could have an adult discussion
Doug R
@I’mNotSureWhoIWantToBeYet: There was an analysis of where Chicago guns come from. Sensible gun laws would help
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2013/01/29/us/where-50000-guns-in-chicago-came-from.html?_r=0
Doug R
@D58826: Yeah, but more people actually voted Democrat than Republican, it’s just the Gerrymandered seats hid it. With Drumpf at the top of the ticket, we could be looking at a clean sweep. 2006 all over again….
Doug R
@PatrickG: That’s what scroll wheels are for
redshirt
We might get a forced Tbogg if this continues.
Bob In Portland
@Adam L Silverman: The first quote was by Chip Berlet. I would be cautious about anything he writes. Or wrote. I presume he’s dead or out of circulation now. I don’t know who the guy is at the libertarian site. I respect David Neiwert and used to read him regularly.
The point about definitions of “corporatism” in 1920s and today is consequential only in that corporatism today has several definitions. Within most current definitions is the merging of state and business hierarchy. I came across a definition of corporatism that included FDR’s New Deal, so it can be agreed that one word is not the single definition of fascism.
A quote from Vernon Louis Parrington:
Bob In Portland
@I’mNotSureWhoIWantToBeYet: Apparently, some sites are not allowed to be posted here, so if I can’t post a link it’s the result of Balloon Juice censorship. I’ve got a comment right now awaiting moderation, and there’s no links except for the comment I was replying to. I presume that I’ll be banned here again. There are a lot of places on the net that censor.
I'mNotSureWhoIWantToBeYet
@Doug R: As long as the SCOTUS doesn’t change its mind on DC v. Heller, banning guns isn’t likely to work. Many Chicago laws were struck down already.
I like the Chris Rock idea (1:17). Make bullets in Chicago subject to a $2-5/ea tax (or pick a number). If the SCOTUS says people have the right to have a personal weapon, make sure there’s a (non-trivial) cost to go along with it.
Or maybe we should bring back public armories where people store their weapons:
Cheers,
Scott.
Omnes Omnibus
@Bob In Portland: Fuck your whining, Bob. No one is censoring you. If the link isn’t working, it is because of FYWP. Go to tinyurl and redo the link. That should fix it.
Matt
The Trumpenjugend in that photo kinda make me want him to win, just so I can cheer for them to get drafted & then killed in a war over how Random World Leader insinuated Drumpf’s hands were inadequately sized.
The whole “PC” thing seems to come down to bigots and fascists whining because they’re increasingly unable to say bigoted, fascist shit in public without being called on it. Oddly, their insistence that “people should be able to say whatever they want without consequences” fails to extend to anything vaguely critical of themselves or their beliefs…
bystander
@PurpleGirl:
They would rip you limb from limb on allthatchat.com for misspelling Richard Rodgers name alone.
South Pacific is a singular testament to the Greatest Generation and the other songs among the greatest achievements in American popular culture.
Bob In Portland
@Omnes Omnibus: Omnibus, I tried posting a link four times yesterday. I guess it could have been a BJ hiccup, but it seemed peculiar at the time. But thank you for your assurance.
D58826
@hovercraft: There is a facebook link on my iphone to an article by Robert Reich. He posted a long e-mail about how corrupt the process is in PR and the Clintons are behind it. The post has a string of comments accusing the Clintons of stealing the election, Carter Center should investigate all of those stolen votes in New York, etc etc etc. There are many comments hoping that Hillary will be indicted. If they don’tr get their way they are not voting because the will of the people is being denied. The 3 million vote advantage that Hillary has is written off as stupid people who didn’t know they were being robbed. Bernie has stirred up a hornets nest that he may not be able to control, even if he wants to.
Newsweek has a piece about what Bernie wants and how he has changed the terms of the democratic debate with his push for single payer and free college. I just wonder if, after getting crowd on its feet with free college, etc, if he mentions that that college isn’t really ‘free’. All Bernie is planning on doing is shifting the burden as to who pays for it. I really doubt that he spends a lot of time talking about the tax increases that will be needed to pay for his vision. Does he explain how he will close the gap between his plans and his tax increases that non-partisan economic modeling outfits have come up with. Or are they part of the corrupt Clinton plan to destroy Beanies dream. George HW Bush called Saint Ronulus the Unready’s tax plan voodoo economics. I think Bernie’s qualify for the same label.
HinTN
@dmsilev: Plus the wonder of the giant silver bean and the Geary pavilion itself, not to mention the museum, it’s a great place to spend time.
Terry chay
@Percysowner: even if she was not prepared (she is). Trump would never allow Hillary to top the news cycle for more than a day, even if he has to say the most racist and outlandish shit to regain attention.
Not
Going
To
Happen
redshirt
@Bob In Portland: No one at BJ is censoring your links Bob.
PatrickG
@Doug R:
Well, my irritation stems from accidentally scrolling over actually interesting comments. But whatever, I’ve long since passed the irony gap of adding worthless comments provoked by trolls. Like the sands in a glass, these too are the trolls of our lives.
But I gotta say, Bob’s martyr-shtick is just funnier than Ramping Up’s racist poll-unskewing.
HinTN
@Adam L Silverman: In summary, the Chicago PD have been pigs since before they hassled my white teenage ass in 1969 (thank FSM we had not discovered the mythical marijuana we so desperately desired) and they remain so today. Not that they are radically different from police anywhere in that doing the hard work of serving and protecting is not selected for by the pay scale usually attached to the job.
SiubhanDuinne
@PurpleGirl:
I grew up on early R&H musicals, wore out the original cast and soundtrack albums, and memorized all the songs at a young age. So “Carefully Taught” was just one of many Broadway songs I knew, like “Surrey with the Fringe on Top” or “June is Bustin’ Out All Over” or “Hello, Young Lovers.” I think I was quite a bit older before I really grokked how powerful those simple lyrics were, and older yet before I learned how controversial they had been at the time. Says Wikipedia:
Terry chay
@Gimlet: the lesser evil being dis honoring yourself and condoning the destruction of American democracy. The greater evil, of course, is losing re-election.
Adam L Silverman
@aimai: Yep, I’ve written a paper about this that explains that the problems faced in Iraq or Afghanistan or the Democratic Republic of the Congo or other similar locales are the same as we face here at home: differentially socially organized societies. Its why reconstruction of them, whether internally directed, externally directed, or a combination of the two is so hard: you have to overcome the learned behavioral components that allow one to survive under a warlord or where there is no functioning government or no jobs, etc.
dww44
@trollhattan: and I hope your friend does the right thing and never writes a tell-all book.
Bob In Portland
@Adam L Silverman: What I find interesting is that “corporatist” is in one of the definitions you use to condemn the use of corporatism as a definition of fascism.
Are you so worried that Mussolini might be misquoted, or are you concerned about the idea of fascism having an economic element?
This was the line that gave you so much trouble:
Last night I got a lot of grief for missing a comma when reading a comment. So, again, are you disputing the word “corporatism” or “Fascism is a merger of state and business”?
My point is that fascism is a money-making proposition. If fascism is merely the scary clown with orange hair, then you don’t understand fascism.
HinTN
@redshirt: That is the $64,000 question that I don’t think Rahm can answer.
Adam L Silverman
@redshirt: Crime is cyclical, so even if its down in most places it may still be high in a few. The other reason is NY basically just ran it out. They instituted overauthoritarian responses based on the broken windows argument (its not a theory, you can’t test it!) and they did so as crime had already fallen way off in NY City. What was left they pushed out into other areas making it someone else’s problem. Then, following 9-11, they ramped up and cracked down even more. Easy to police if every zone is covered in cameras. And other types of crime are still there, but the ones people bitch about have been relocated.
Adam L Silverman
@HinTN: That works too!
HinTN
@Schlemazel Khan: My definition of canoeing: the wind is in your face no matter which way the river bends.
Adam L Silverman
@Bob In Portland: Again, one of the elements of fascism is corporatism. In some places, like Switzerland that has a corporatism system, that’s all you get. So sometimes scholars refer to Switzerland as a soft fascist state, but it really isn’t a fascist state – it just has borrowed and enacted this one thing that is an element of fascism. All fascist states are corporatist, not all states that use corporatism are fascist. Beyond that I don’t have the time or the interest in typing a pro-seminar on ideology. Just read one of the actual scholars I referred you too in my initial response.
Renie
come on come one let’s get to 400
Mike in NC
@Renie: You did it man!
redshirt
@Adam L Silverman: While that may be true of some crimes, I don’t think NYC’s sky high 1970’s murder rate has been pushed out to NJ or CT.
Villago Delenda Est
@Bob In Portland: Hodor!
Adam L Silverman
@Bob In Portland:
ETA: I never said it wasn’t. You didn’t actually seem to read what I posted. My problem is you were claiming Mussolini said something without a citable source, when I provided you actual legitimate and credible sources you decided to ignore them and then you decided that Chip Berlet has somehow failed one of you purity tests. Forget what I wrote below. You’re taking a long overdue and well deserved time out. Go shill your agitprop somewhere else.
We’re not even having the same conversation. Go bother someone else. One more accusation about me or anyone else here and you’re banned.
pseudonymous in nc
@NCSteve:
Hm. HB2’s lead sponsor came from the Charlotte suburbs, and you’ll find #EverydayTrumpism not far from the urbane sophisticates of the Triangle.
pseudonymous in nc
@Ramping Up:
with your wife, Morgan Fairchild.
Right To Shite is not even an original fucking troll. Where is Gary Ruppert when you need to laugh at him?
Adam L Silverman
@redshirt: Those numbers were already down when NY, under Giuliani, started cracking down. Honestly, other than the cyclical nature of crime, no one is really sure why it went down. I’m of the “it was the elimination of lead” camp. What Giuliani did, and what NY has done ever since though, has been to crack down in a way that pushed the stuff to other places.
redshirt
@Adam L Silverman: I like the lead theory too, but then, did that not happen in Chicago?
Adam L Silverman
@redshirt: Yes, but the other dynamics are different.
Renie
@Renie: Wow never thought I would be #400. I guess being home on a rainy day helps with posting here; usually I see threads hours later or days later.
Renie
What am I doing wrong? I’m using the pie filter, it shows at the bottom and I can enter names but I’m still seeing BIP and Mr. ThrowingUp?
Villago Delenda Est
@Adam L Silverman: /applause
BiP’s main problem is his rigid ideology that gets in the way of nuance and thought.
Adam L Silverman
@Villago Delenda Est: Thanks, I think. I don’t like doing that stuff. The only problem is I’m not sure wordpress lets me take him out of time out…
redshirt
@Villago Delenda Est: Yeah, he seems like a smart enough guy with a lot of interesting experiences. But ideology trumps all.
And I hate that for at least a few years the Donald has ruined that word.
Ruckus
@Renie:
You have to have the latest version for it to work.
Renie
@Ruckus: I just downloaded it yesterday for the first time. Guess I’ll try it again
Ruckus
@Renie:
Did you also download grease monkey? That is required to make the pie filter script run.
Also what browser/OS are you running?
I do fine with mac os/firefox, have used win/firefox before and also had good luck.
Rand Careaga
@Elizabelle: I agree with Elizabelle. The guy is a parody troll (which I think is actually a more dishonorable stance than “sincere” trolling). For chrissake, he twirls his moustache like a cartoon villain: “Hahaha! Yes, we will use dishonest tactics, and the masses will fall for it again, hahaha, and there’s nothing you liberals can do about it!” It’s pissing in the discourse that gets him off, with politics a distantly secondary consideration, and the attention this yields (one reason I do not employ his handle in this comment), and as others have noted, feeding him is both positive enforcement and also pollutes the thread. Over at “Lawyers, Guns and Money” they’re pretty good about troll-starving, and it generally works.
I'mNotSureWhoIWantToBeYet
@Renie: If you see “Pie filter stuff Add Remove ____ Show List” then I assume it’s installed right.
To use it, just cut-and-paste the full name (handle) of the poster that you want to “pie” and click Add. Confirm your addition, then the page will refresh and you will see the ‘pied’ version of his/her post.
HTH.
Cheers,
Scott.
JWR
” But most of all, what political correctness means is [having] a basic sense of fucking decency.”
Quote of the
daymonthyeardecadeages!SFAW
@Ramping Up:
Well, if you consider the beneficence of your johns to be “ferret”ing out money …
Miss Bianca
@Adam L Silverman: Speaking purely personally, the creature could remain in time-out forever so far as I am concerned. But I have it on good authority (BiP’s, in other words) that I’m a rich-bitch faux feminist – which would be *awesome*, the rich part anyway, if only it were true! – so I may be a *wee* skosh biased.
PIGL
@The Republic, Blah Blah Blah…: All of them, Katie.
Renie
@Ruckus: Yes I have GreaseMonkey and am using Firefox on Windows 8. I can see the two of them in the list but still see them here. When I was on later threads I don’t see them but that could be cuz its working or they’re not posting in the other open thread.
Ruckus
@Renie:
Ahhhh yes. I’ve had that problem sometimes. It wouldn’t take them out of a post that they had already showed up in but would in later posts. If I closed the BJ tab and then reopened it, all was OK and they were gone from every post. It used to take them out of any post if you just refreshed but not so much any more, at least not all the time. Also the risen idiot seems to have so many IDs that I’m not sure if it can be removed, certainly not permanently. Maybe with a flame thrower or possibly by VDE.
Bill Arnold
@Ramping Up:
For raw political talent, I would put Nixon up there with LBJ, Bill Clinton and Barrack Obama. (Ranking to be done by historians 20+ years from now.)
Bill Arnold
@Ramping Up:
Nah. Obama was already very likely to win. (Are you suggesting that Sandy was … engineered … to boost the odds of an Obama win?)
PurpleGirl
@bystander: Hey, I got Oscar Hammerstein’s name right didn’t I. I don’t think that bad for memory. I said some other people called their work saccharine but they usually had one song that was pointed and concise like “Carefully Taught”. In The Sound of Music they included the song about the Anschulss (sp?). R&H had a definite social conscience pertaining to the eras they wrote about. And if you looked at record/CD collection, you find an original cast album for both those shows. Maybe I should have included a line or two about how much I like those shows.
joel hanes
@Jeff Spender:
What would the Doge do with a Dogecoin?
And what would the Duke do about the Duchess?