Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

We’ve had enough carrots to last a lifetime. break out the sticks.

Bark louder, little dog.

John Fetterman: Too Manly for Pennsylvania.  Paid for by the Oz for Senator campaign.

Teach a man to fish, and he’ll sit in a boat all day drinking beer.

Accused of treason; bitches about the ratings. I am in awe.

The republican caucus is already covering themselves with something, and it’s not glory.

Fuck these fucking interesting times.

Let there be snark.

They’re not red states to be hated; they are voter suppression states to be fixed.

A Senator Walker would also be an insult to reason, rationality, and decency.

Too often we hand the biggest microphones to the cynics and the critics who delight in declaring failure.

Not all heroes wear capes.

The next time the wall street journal editorial board speaks the truth will be the first.

They traffic in fear. it is their only currency. if we are fearful, they are winning.

Thanks to your bullshit, we are now under siege.

If you’re pissed about Biden’s speech, he was talking about you.

Historically it was a little unusual for the president to be an incoherent babbling moron.

“But what about the lurkers?”

Conservatism: there are some people the law protects but does not bind and others who the law binds but does not protect.

We are builders in a constant struggle with destroyers. let’s win this.

You don’t get rid of your umbrella while it’s still raining.

My years-long effort to drive family and friends away has really paid off this year.

Give the craziest people you know everything they want and hope they don’t ask for more? Great plan.

Since when do we limit our critiques to things we could do better ourselves?

You are here: Home / Past Elections / Election 2016 / Let’s Nip This Kaine Anti-Choice Bullshit Right in the Fucking Bud

Let’s Nip This Kaine Anti-Choice Bullshit Right in the Fucking Bud

by | 248 Comments

This post is in: 

Before you hear bad information on this from whining members of our progressive betters (in fact, I just heard some clown on Inners complain Kaine’s position on abortion is SOOOOOOO 90’s), Tim Kaine is pro-choice and anti-abortion.

What, you say? HOW CAN THAT BE?

Simple, if you have two functioning brain cells. He personally opposes abortion. Here he is in his own words:

Q: When you first ran as Lieutenant Governor, you were classified as a pro-life Democrat. You’re now not considered a pro-life Democrat. How would you describe your abortion position?

KAINE: People use labels all the time. But I’m kind of a traditional Catholic. I don’t like it personally. I’m opposed to abortion. And personally I’m opposed to the death penalty. I deeply believe, and not just as a matter of politics, but even as a matter of morality, that matters about reproduction and intimacy and relationships and contraception are in the personal realm. They’re moral decisions for individuals to make for themselves. And the last thing we need is government intruding into those personal decisions. So I’ve taken a position which is quite common among Catholics. I’ve got a personal feeling about abortion, but the right role for government is to let women make their own decisions.

Got it? He opposes abortion and as such WILL NEVER FUCKING HAVE ONE, but he doesn’t think it is the government’s job to tell women what to do with their bodies.

THAT’S THE VERY FUCKING DEFINITION OF PRO-CHOICE. You SUPPORT the right for someone to make a choice. Pro-choice does not mean, as the lunatic right will tell you, that you are pro-abortion. It simple means you think people should have a choice. He has a 100% rating from NARAL and Planned Parenthood. Now who you going to believe? Them, or some wankers on your fb feed?

This is for anyone who claims he is anti-choice.

lalala

Reader Interactions

248Comments

  1. 1.

    Vickie Feminist

    Thanks for clearing that up.

    But HONESTLY, all I can think about tonight is your damned cat. So did Steve come home?

  6. 6.

    Tom Q

    If you were to disqualify anyone who held this position, you’d be effectively banning Catholics from the party.

  10. 10.

    Baud

    Looking forward to next week when we criticize Dems for not having a 50 state strategy.

  11. 11.

    Bobbo

    OMG is that Krispy thing for reals?
    Also too, I think that was Biden’s view on choice too?

  14. 14.

    Vickie Feminist

    @John Cole: In my experience with cats, no news is good news. One cat came home 5 wks later. But the ones who didn’t make it, I heard the bad news immediately. So silence means Steve is just taking his sweet time.

  15. 15.

    ThresherK

    @Vickie Feminist: Thank you for giving me something to think about rather than Chris “failed Chippendales audition” Christie dancing.

    Safe return, Steve.

  17. 17.

    Just One More Canuck

    That image is absolute proof that Cole hates all of us – I’ll never unsee that

  18. 18.

    Trentrunner

    Is it weird that I loathe Christie just a bit less for that dancing gif? He seems like he’s having fun.

  22. 22.

    Trentrunner

    Giordano’s taxonomic distinction between progressives who actually get things done/work the trenches vs. the purity progressives who don’t really get shit done (Sanders, Stein) is very, very useful–and apt here. He’s a fan of Kaine.

  23. 23.

    James

    I just wish he was more ardently anti death penalty. As a Virginian I’m not disappointed by this choice. If something happened to Hillary Tim Kaine would continue on as an excellent president. He’s well qualified and a reasonable center left democrat. He’s basically what should be expected from Hillary.

    He’s also a former governor and senator from a swing state with a democratic governor. He hits all the important notes. He also does an important public service by proving how meaningless the VP choice really is.

    I do wonder about him as Hillary’s attack dog. That never seemed like his thing. He’s more the happy warrior type. As of now it seems like the Pence/Kaine debate in Farmville (Longwood represent!) will be a snooze fest.

  24. 24.

    Phylllis

    That gif is disturbing. Not Trump molesting Ivanka onstage last night levels of disturbing, but pretty close.

  25. 25.

    Mnemosyne

    Jesus fuck, you just HAD to include that butt shot, didn’t you?!?!?

    I hate you, John Cole.

  26. 26.

    lamh36

    Right about now. It’s time to only deal in facts and NOT bullshit or we are no better than Trump. HRC, VP pic not my choice, but still…I’m fine with it. Tim Kaine was Obama’s second choice to Biden, wasn’t he?

    Folks wanting a non-boring choice is how the GOP ended up with Donald Trump! Boring ain’t always a bad thing… IJS

    Oh, check out Al Giordano’s twitter timeline where he talks about when he met Tim Kaine…in ’08

    it’s a great read

    @AlGiordano 8m8 minutes ago
    1. Let me share some knowledge I have about Tim Kaine, who was my favorite on the 2008 short list for VP. He’s going to be exceptional.

    2. Kaine supported Obama in the 2008 primaries vs Clinton. This pick makes a lie out the nonsense that she is somehow a vindictive leader!

    3. When in the fall of 2008 I reported from swing states, I landed at Dulles & began in Virginia, where then-Gov. Kaine asked to see me.

    4. Much to my chagrin, his Governor’s Office then prohibited smoking. I started out by teasing him: “You lead a tobacco state, dammit!”

    5. I can testify that Kaine has a terrific sense of humor & his protestations that he’s “boring” are just part of an ongoing comedy routine.

    6. Most interestingly, the reason Kaine wanted to meet me was not to get good press for himself, but to talk about data-driven politics.

    7. He said he had followed my 2008 primary projections state by state in real time & wanted some insight into my methodology.

    8. Kaine also mentioned that he had followed @NateSilver538’s work when Nate was still using the psued of “Poblano.” He’s an early adopter.

    9. During that meeting I wanted to test if it were true that he is fluent in Spanish & shifted to that language. ¡Y sí se pudo muy bien!

    10. Kaine also displayed a keen interest in human rights, journalist safety & social movements in Latin America, very rare among US pols.

  28. 28.

    MattF

    Clinton and Kaine are comfortable with each other and baslcally identical on the issues. It’s a conventional choice. IMO, there isn’t going to be a socialist revolution any time soon.

  29. 29.

    Mnemosyne

    @John Cole:

    Some people were saying you should check your neighbors’ garages and/or sheds in case he decided to take a nap in there and got locked in by mistake.

  30. 30.

    Mike J

    Peter Sullivan ‏@CitizenSullivan 9 hours ago
    Tim Kaine’s voting record:
    Planned Parenthood: 100%
    Brady Campaign: 100%
    NARAL: 100%
    Human Rights Campaign: 100%
    AFL/CIO: 94%

  33. 33.

    amk

    gud gawd, cole. we all know how you love the ‘straight shootin’ nj corrupt fucker, but this?

  34. 34.

    MazeDancer

    Tim Kaine supported Obama in 2007.

    100% with Planned Parenthood is good enough rating for me. Kaine’s position is the same as Joe Biden’s: devout Catholics also devoutly devoted to women’s rights.

    Hillary knows how hard it is to be President. She knows what she needs. She wanted a Biden. A Gore. A true partner. A mensch. She deserves that. She chose the best VP for herself and the country.

    Tim Kaine took his Harvard JD and was a civil rights lawyer for 17 years. If you’re Southern, you know you can’t get more liberal than that.

    There is a Nazi trying to take the White House. There is no more evidence of rich privilege than people mounting up on their purity ponies right now.

  36. 36.

    PaulW

    Here’s the thing.

    KAINE IS COMPETENT. Compared to the crazy republicans he’s a great pick.

    Why can’t we sell competence as a thing anymore? That’s supposed to be an important qualifier for the job.

  37. 37.

    lamh36

    @DanaHoule 3s3 seconds ago
    People, step back: Hillary’s campaign isn’t pitching Kaine’s mod bona fides, they’re pitching his progressive bona fides. Think about that.

  38. 38.

    Mike J

    Ronald Klain ‏@RonaldKlain 51 minutes ago
    Kaine SUCCESSFULLY took on NRA in a gun state, smoking in a tobacco state, climate change in a coal state. #ProgressiveWhoGetsResults

  39. 39.

    Immanentize

    @John Cole: I asked my cat, Toasty, to send out an emergency cat signal across his network. We are in the Bosyon area but Toast assured me (meow) that he had done so and that the message was sent.

    I am.the one in the family who cannot stand it if Toast is not in by 10. But he is.always OK. Just has cat business. Be calm?

  46. 46.

    Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (Formerly Mumphrey, et al.)

    I live in Virginia, and I’m pretty pissed off right now. It isn’t because I think Kaine is a bad pick, though. It’s because it opens the fucking Senate seat up in 2017, which is an off-off year, and, unless somebody dies in office or something, it’ll be the only Senate race in the country, and the Kochs and all the other Republican, right wing nut groups are going to pour everything they have into winning it. We don’t need this headache here. I only hope she throws her full weight behind whoever runs next year, and helps us hold this seat. President Obama was a little too detached from these close special election races for my liking. She owes us here, and I’ll be livid if she lets this seat go to the Republicans.

  47. 47.

    MJS

    @srv: Please describe what would pass for “conservative nuance.” “I’m against abortion except for my mistress” doesn’t count.

  48. 48.

    Doug R

    @John Cole: Our daughter let our cat out on the balcony late one night and forgot to let her in (my daughter is on the autistic spectrum). The next morning the cat was nowhere to be seen. We printed up flyers with a color picture and posted them around the block when we walked around. We left her favorite cat tree outside right underneath our balcony with a can of cat food and then tuna. The cat tree ended up covered with ants and we became a local raccoon’s FAVORITE humans. A couple of days in, I went out below our balcony, not a soul in sight. I open a can of cat food and INSTANTLY a raccoon materializes out of the woods. He wouldn’t leave either, until I imitated the hiss I heard from him the day before.
    Finally after 3 days our I saw our cat come out of the edge of the woods. It took another 3 days for her to calm down enough to approach my wife, who was basically camping out in a chair by now. Here’s video of the raccoon. Here’s the picture of Tiger we used.

  50. 50.

    Davis X. Machina

    @Tom Q: Clinton could have picked someone who demanded trials for Wall Street bankers; repudiated NAFTA, TPP, fracking Kissinger; Zionism; US military adventurism and militaristic hegemony; supports federal decriminilization of marijuana; advocates for federal standards for police officer training, hiring, and accountability; embraces deep ecology environmentalism; and calls for the provision of free tuition and single payer health care.

    But no….

    BTW, that’s the non-negotiable minimum for VP.

    (For President, it’s longer….)

  53. 53.

    hovercraft

    @Baud:
    They obviously are not truly pro-choice, they have been secretly working for years to get an anti-choice vp in there who will off the boss so he can appoint a replacement for Scalia (who is still dead) who will honor his memory by out lawing abortion. Ruth Coniff has spoken, the Clintons hate progressives.

  57. 57.

    I'mNotSureWhoIWantToBeYet

    @Kelly: Several good prospects:

    In response, so far, people have mentioned the following possibilities: Former Rep. Tom Perriello, Gov. Terry McAuliffe, Rep. Don Beyer, Rep. Bobby Scott, former Delegate (and current Virginia Secretary of Public Safety) Brian Moran. Since we’ve got the other two Democratic Congressmen, might as well throw in Rep. Gerry Connolly as well. Who else?

    Perriello and Scott are probably the most progressive in that list.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  59. 59.

    ruemara

    To veer slightly OT, we’re on route to Karl Strauss Mira Mesa right now, where some choose to meet-up with fellow juicers. Look for the adorably cute women with green balloons. Also, meh, on Kaine, but he’s obviously a progressive who understands that being prochoice doesn’t mean he personally must be wild about abortion.

  61. 61.

    laura

    I’m not happy with this pick at all.
    Should a not caved for the complaint of “needs executive experience” and what feels like more concern for possible republican pick up votes.
    Latino and Hispanic have no where else to go.
    Ignore the future of the party.
    Yes. I’ll work my ass off to get her elected. Don’t expect me to cheer.

  65. 65.

    Corner Stone

    Not sure who the people whinging about Kaine thought HRC should have picked? Isn’t this a fuckton like x-splaining to the fucking Democratic nominee how to politic?
    No, girl. Not *that* red dress, **that** red dress looks better on you.
    The fucking balls on these people.

  66. 66.

    Feathers

    @Mnemosyne: Yeah. I have a neighborhood with a lot of cats running around. I was hearing a cat, but figured that it was coming from outside. Went down to do my laundry and …. there was a very frightened and hungry cat in my basement. Didn’t have any food, but made a path of open doors to the outside. The cat eventually made a fast scram out the door. Never saw it again.

  67. 67.

    debbie

    @ruemara:

    Enjoy the meet-up and get pictures. I’m with you on the meh, but I want to hear him speak before I start banging my head against my desk.

  69. 69.

    Thoughtful David

    @Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (Formerly Mumphrey, et al.):
    I too live in Virginia, and although I’m not pissed off, I do wish we had been able to keep Kaine. He’s a great guy, but we can’t afford to lose his senate seat. And yeah, amk @ #56 Dems needing to get out and vote, is important, but we’re a purple state and we need to keep the odds as high as we can.

  71. 71.

    Corner Stone

    The nominee gets to pick their running mate. This seems more than very insulting.

  72. 72.

    Jeffro

    @Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (Formerly Mumphrey, et al.):

    I live in Virginia, and I’m pretty pissed off right now. It isn’t because I think Kaine is a bad pick, though. It’s because it opens the fucking Senate seat up in 2017, which is an off-off year, and, unless somebody dies in office or something, it’ll be the only Senate race in the country, and the Kochs and all the other Republican, right wing nut groups are going to pour everything they have into winning it. We don’t need this headache here. I only hope she throws her full weight behind whoever runs next year, and helps us hold this seat. President Obama was a little too detached from these close special election races for my liking. She owes us here, and I’ll be livid if she lets this seat go to the Republicans.

    I live here too (is half of BJ from VA?) and I’m thrilled. Yes, HRC owes us a strong campaign to help hold the seat. We also, you know, live here and could do our part for GOTV (especially in a non-prez election year) It’s something all Dems should have on their calendar in Oct and early Nov, frankly.

  73. 73.

    redshirt

    I’m the same way. Abortion is nasty, and I wish no one had to have one.

    That said, it’s every woman’s right to have one when they want to. Within a certain window I suppose.

  74. 74.

    Jeffro

    @Thoughtful David:

    we’re a purple state and we need to keep the odds as high as we can.

    We’re a light blue state getting bluer each election…AND you’re still right, we need to keep the odds as high as we can.

  75. 75.

    Corner Stone

    @Baud: I was on Team Tom. But I’m seeing a lot of fucking idiots talking about Mayo Sandwiches and how Kaine isn’t winning some demographic.
    Well, guess the fuck what peeps? He’s about to govern the shit out of this place.

  79. 79.

    Emma

    @laura: As a Hispanic/Latino (amazingly, either one works for me) I can attest that we’re getting a hell of a lot of attention from Candidate Clinton. And being able to have someone being interviewed in spanish-language tv that doesn’t embarrass himself trying to do it in Spanish and who expects kudos for just mumbling a few phrases, AND who understands Latin-American issues, well, that’s a huge plus.

  80. 80.

    I'mNotSureWhoIWantToBeYet

    @laura: Maybe skim his Twitter feed. Kaine walks the walk,

    He’s not ideal, but he’s a very good choice and can appeal to Latinos. His Senate bio:

    Tim has focused closely on climate change and its effects on Virginia, especially sea level rise and flooding. In 2014, he co-hosted a bipartisan conference that brought together policymakers, experts and regional stakeholders to discuss strategies to combat the threat that these challenges pose to Hampton Roads.

    Tim grew up working in his father’s ironworking shop in Kansas City. He was educated at the University of Missouri and Harvard Law School and started his public service career by taking a year off from Harvard to run a technical school founded by Jesuit missionaries in Honduras. After law school, he practiced law in Richmond for 17 years, specializing in the representation of people who had been denied housing due to their race or disability. He also began teaching part-time at the University of Richmond in 1987.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  81. 81.

    Kay

    @Corner Stone:

    He has a friendly open face and I bet he has a sense of humor. God knows this country could use a little cheering up after that hate-fest last week. Maybe he and Joe Biden could do a nationwide tour in a fast car :)

  82. 82.

    Felonius Monk

    @Corner Stone:

    The nominee gets to pick their running mate. This seems more than very insulting.

    The nominee did pick her running mate. Fuck the naysayers.

    And, if you’re going out for Popeye’s tonight, would you please get some for me. That sounds awful good about now. :-)

  84. 84.

    Jeffro

    Edit: other folks noted Clinton’s, Kaine’s, and the D party’s credentials when it comes to representing the interests of Latinos and Hispanics much better than I did.

  85. 85.

    Mnemosyne

    @laura:

    Latino and Hispanic have no where else to go.

    Read the Al Giordano tweets above. Kane speaks fluent Spanish and seems to have a very good grasp of (and interest in) Latinx and immigration issues. Expect to see him speaking for himself on Univision very soon.

  87. 87.

    Thoughtful David

    @Jeffro:
    Well, yeah, we can argue about exactly our shade, but no matter what, we’re too damned close to red. Keep in mind that in 2009, after a good showing for Obama in 2008, we got Felon McDonnell and Ken “The Kook” Cuccinelli.
    Our exact color depends too much on turnout.

  88. 88.

    Steeplejack (phone)

    What in holy hell is that Christie GIF?! I pluck at my eyes and still it cannot be unseen.

  89. 89.

    WaterGirl

    I saw that title and immediately thought “I love you, Cole!”

    Now to read what you wrote and see if Steve is home yet.

  90. 90.

    debbie

    @Baud:

    Why would that matter? Can’t a White person hope for a diverse ticket without getting abused?

  92. 92.

    Aleta

    Cats should receive a full set of keys to all the garages in the neighborhood the day they arrive.

  94. 94.

    Baud

    @debbie: I think CS was referring to some of the over-the-top comments that people have been seeing online. Every choice has it’s pluses and minuses, and it is a minus that we won’t be getting a non-white ticket.

  95. 95.

    Thoughtful David

    @Thoughtful David:
    Oh, and I am a member of my local Democratic Committee and out volunteering six months of every year for Democrats in some race or another.* So I do know we need to GOTV every year for Democrats.

    * Which is why all the jonny-come-lately bernfeelers piss me off so much.

  96. 96.

    jl

    Another advantage for Kaine that I’ve noticed is that he always seems to be a genuine cheerful good humor, no matter what. And very quick witted and agile in debate.
    Those might be important running against the this debased, less disciplined, much more corrupt, dumber Reagan-with-a-snarl wannabee.and his clueless veep nominee.

    The Progressive Case For Tim Kaine As VP
    Krystal Ball
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/krystal-ball/the-progressive-case-for-_2_b_10773840.html

  98. 98.

    Hal

    I like Ben Jealous but he was just on Rachel Maddow saying Kaine doesn’t help Hillary win any votes? None? Not Virginia? No appeal to Hispanic/Latino voters? Just a big fat nothing. The next couple of weeks are going to be annoying.

  99. 99.

    gogol's wife

    I’m happy. But as someone said earlier today, at this point I’d vote for Romney at the top of the ticket against Trump. I just f-in don’t care.

    CRUSH TRUMP

  101. 101.

    justawriter

    At least it wasn’t Ball, I mean Vilsack. I know that as a former farm boy from a plains state I’m supposed to like the guy, but I don’t.

  102. 102.

    Mnemosyne

    @debbie:

    I feel better about Kaine now that I’ve seen some of the posts and articles about him. He’s definitely not the conservative Southerner that people were expecting.

  103. 103.

    gogol's wife

    I’m not getting it as a gif, just successive still shots that are making it impossible for me to access BJ with any sort of speed.

  104. 104.

    TaMara (HFG)

    John just announced on twitter the Steve has in fact RETURNED. All Hail Steve.

    I know absolutely nothing about Kaine, look forward to learning about his. But personally I was rooting for Julian Castro.

  105. 105.

    redshirt

    The only downside to Kaine as mentioned is above is the 2017 special election.

    Is that confirmed, by the way?

    I’ll assume so, and if so, yes, it will likely lead to a Republican Senator.

  109. 109.

    GxB

    Re : Krispy gif- “Ya put as much as you can manage of your whole self IIIINNN… Ya put as much as you can manage of your whole self OUT…”

    Alternately, I’m sure the Internets pr0n deviants can provide a filter to remove clothes in gifs… thank your stars.

    Otherwise, Kaine looks solid – let’s round ’em up and bring it home (including the senate).

  110. 110.

    Jeffro

    @Thoughtful David:

    Oh, and I am a member of my local Democratic Committee and out volunteering six months of every year for Democrats in some race or another.* So I do know we need to GOTV every year for Democrats.

    Yup. Taking the kids with me to help register voters for a few hours tomorrow, myself! Help builds a lifetime of habit ;)

  112. 112.

    Percysowner

    @Hal: I saw Ben Jealous as well. Do candidates usually ask former heads of organizations to endorse them? He seemed miffed that the campaign hadn’t requested his endorsement, but I don’t know the ins and outs of getting endorsements.

    As to the people getting their panties in a twist about Kaine’s abortion stance. Substitute Divorce for Abortion and see how that works. It’s something his church considers to be morally wrong. It’s something he wouldn’t do himself. He’s not asking anyone to outlaw divorce, however.

  116. 116.

    Quinerly

    @Hal:
    I have been very disappointed in Ben Jealous lately. Can’t “read” him nor can I figure out his angle.

  119. 119.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Phylllis:

    Trump molesting Ivanka onstage last night

    It really pains me to say this, but to the best of my awareness, the only media person (I refuse to use the term “journalist”) who even took notice of that intimate little moment was Maureen Fucking Dowd.

  120. 120.

    Jeffro

    @Thoughtful David: Seconded (see #111). We are going to Rock. The. Commonwealth!!! lol Okay maybe not rock it (it would embarrass my kids) but we ARE going to help it get bluer every year! See you out in the field!

  121. 121.

    Mnemosyne

    @Kay:

    Since Hillary’s campaign is going all in on “love and kindness” and “working together,” I think Kaine is going to fit in really well.

  122. 122.

    Baud

    @GxB: Yes, but that’s rare. I don’t think Kaine is a net loss on votes.

    One advantage I think he has — which Clinton also has in spades — is that he probably has personal relationships with Dems across the country. So that should help with organizing and messaging.

  123. 123.

    Quinerly

    Kaine…..as comfortable quoting Scripture on the floor of the Senate as quoting Zappa. I like this pick

  124. 124.

    redshirt

    I was hoping for Castro or Perez but Kaine kind of splits the middle – a white man who’s fluent in Spanish and vested in Hispanic related issues.

    It’s kinda perfect, I’ll grant. It’s not bold though.

  126. 126.

    Tom Q

    @Davis X. Machina: Wow. I thought you were parodying. (We’ve finally reached that point on the left of being unable to be sure — the right was years ahead of us, but we got there in the end.)

  127. 127.

    debbie

    @Mnemosyne:

    I don’t have anything against him, but I was hoping for a ticket that shouted diversity at all the faces of the White Bread Republicans.

  128. 128.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Kay:

    I believe there’s consensus that LBJ (Raven! Cue!) delivered Texas for JFK, but since then the choice hasn’t been that big a deal.

    My personal view is that a really terrible VP pick might depress the vote in a particular state or region or across a particular identity group, but otherwise I don’t think it matters that much these days.

  131. 131.

    redshirt

    @Mnemosyne: Maybe you joke, but I think it’s a good theme to work for Clinton. If ever an election has been as stark as this one, between Evil and… good, I don’t know it. Even Obama – McCain was more nuanced then this one.

    Peace sells – is anyone buying?

  134. 134.

    GOVCHRIS1988

    Can I be devils advocate here? What if the choice Clinton made was not really to win white males over to her camp, but actually wanting someone she could work with in the White House. I mean, we’ve seen Barack Obama and Joe Biden for eight years and whether you’re a Republican or a Democrat, thats an example of a running mate any would want, someone that has your back.

  135. 135.

    Aleta

    @SiubhanDuinne: He was oddly inappropriate with Pence the night before (in a different vein).

    (Is there a particular thing that is triggering comment eating tonight?)

  136. 136.

    GxB

    @Baud: Point taken – just thinking about a certain Alaskan within the past decade or so (not that it mattered much to the true believers).

  137. 137.

    Woodrowfan

    Pick a good Northern Va Dem to replace him, someone who can turn out Arlington and Fairfax in big numbers and we’ll keep the seat. that’ NOT Connolly FYI.

  139. 139.

    Emma

    @redshirt: Hillary’s not bold, perhaps, but she is competent. And that works for me just fine. One of the things the Kaine choice does is to avoid the many, many divisions among Hispanics. Someone like him, who makes an earnest effort to communicate with people in their milk language and understand their issues, is a good compromise. Now, someday maybe, Candidate Kaine will be able to select a Hispanic as his running mate. Preferably a woman.

  140. 140.

    Baud

    @redshirt: Agree. This is a watershed election. I think history will treat is as the end of the era that began in 1968.

    ETA: Assuming Trump doesn’t win and there is a future generation of historians.

  141. 141.

    dr. bloor

    @GOVCHRIS1988: That’s not really a “devil’s advocate” point of view. Her comfort level with him is obvious, and she appears to see him as an important asset not just for the campaign but for governing as well.

    It’s a bonus that the contrast between HRC/Kaine and TRUMP/(pence) couldn’t be starker.

  143. 143.

    hovercraft

    @Hal:
    He’s just miffed that Hillary has not called him yet to ask for his endorsement. Tim Caine does no harm, and apart from the Bernie supporters who thought she might throw them a bone, he is exactly who you thought she would pick. She was never going to pick a out of the box pick unless she was in trouble, she’s a ‘cautious politician’. That’s just who she is.

  145. 145.

    WaterGirl

    @James:

    I do wonder about him as Hillary’s attack dog. That never seemed like his thing. He’s more the happy warrior type.

    Kaine was an excellent surrogate for Barack Obama in 2007/2008. Quite likable and quick on his feet in that role.

  146. 146.

    different-church-lady

    @Quinerly:

    as comfortable quoting Scripture on the floor of the Senate as quoting Zappa.

    Same thing, really.

  147. 147.

    Aimai

    @Emma: right. I dont understand why some people are insisting on acting like the VP slot is the only job HRC is ever going to offer anyone. my guess is that she will offer plum slots in her admin to a number of people sho could have been condidered for VP but who didn’t have enough experience. Four more years of democratic rule following on obamas multi talented multi racisl administration is going to launch a whole lot of minority and female candidates into the stratosphere. Some of them will run to replace Hillary in eight years.

  148. 148.

    jl

    @Carolyn Kay:

    ” Boring choice. ”

    That is what I thought so as well a few weeks ago. Watch some videos of him and read up on his story.
    Sure, not as progressive in every little way as I would like. So what?
    Seems like he will be a very effective and hard working candidate that can help the ticket. Enough for me.

    I look forward to the Kaine-Pence debate. And maybe the Kaine-Trump debates too, if Trump gets savaged badly enough in the first one with HRC and decides it must be rigged, and more are ‘unfair’ or ‘inappropriate’.

    That would be effing hilarious if Trump chickened out and the veep nom and the Dem primary loser gave him a chance at a practice round Maybe Uncle Bernie would give Trump a chance to chicken out of a debate for a third time. Would make a great shaggy dog story to tell his grand kids some day.

  149. 149.

    J R in WV

    @redshirt:

    A fetus can die or develop terminal abnormalities at any stage of development, so limitations on when a woman may terminate an unsuccessful pregnancy are absurd.

    I have read of the horrible circumstances a dying or doomed fetus brings upon the woman suffering from that death, you should look around and educate yourself.

    Good for Hillary, picking a good candidate for V-P.

  150. 150.

    BlueDWarrior

    @Tom Q: The Internet lets you be as unhinged as you want to be with no reprocussion other than words on a screen metaphorically yelling at you.

    Also the left has always had it’s fair share of woo-woo people, they just haven’t gotten much media exposure since we stopped putting hippies on the camera at rock concerts in the early 70s.

  152. 152.

    GOVCHRIS1988

    @laura: You know, its funny. We heard this same complaint nearly verbatim when President Obama picked Vice President Biden eight years ago.

  153. 153.

    Aleta

    When Clinton was on stage with Warren recently, she looked relaxed and happy and supported. That’s what I want in her running mate, someone who makes her feel that way.

  154. 154.

    muddy

    @Aleta: Yes, it’s not like Pence is Rudy Giuliani in drag. I’m sorry to say I have seen Trump kissing Giuliani’s neck on that occasion. I can’t subject myself to it again to find a link.

  155. 155.

    different-church-lady

    @Aimai:

    I dont understand why some people are insisting on acting like the VP slot is the only job HRC is ever going to offer anyone.

    I know. She’s going to have dozens of opportunities to betray progressives when she starts naming her cabinet.

  156. 156.

    jl

    We don’t know how Kaine is going to be perceived in the way that matters (getting the ticket elected) until we see how he does on national political stage. I think he may do very well, far better than expected. He may not be ‘boring’ at all. Let’s hope for the best.

  157. 157.

    BethanyAnne

    This choice says “Sane and upbeat and competent and safe”. Hell of a contrast. I like it.

  158. 158.

    Tom Q

    @debbie: You don’t think a woman at the top of the ticket does enough for diversity? Do we have to go to a no-white-man ticket to be sufficiently hip?

  159. 159.

    redshirt

    @J R in WV: I meant in terms of an abortion by choice, not by health reasons. I hate to get into the weeds on this, but it seems wrong for a woman in the 8th month of a healthy pregnancy to have an abortion.

  160. 160.

    rikyrah

    Ari Berman ‏@AriBerman 1h1 hour ago

    Tim Kaine was fighting housing discrimination as a civil rights lawyer in VA while Trump was refusing to rent to African-Americans in NYC

  163. 163.

    Cat48

    @GOVCHRIS1988:

    That’s what I think she did. She thinks she can work with Kaine. He’s a good guy. Most white guys will vote Trump & the sane ones will vote Hillz or Johnson.

  164. 164.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @redshirt:

    I hate to get into the weeds on this, but it seems wrong for a woman in the 8th month of a healthy pregnancy to have an abortion.

    Who does that? My guess, no one. You know why? Laws.

  167. 167.

    jl

    I’ve been looking at a lot of Kaine videos on youtube for last few weeks. What strikes me is how likable and good humored (edit: and calmly confident, informed and comfortable) he always seems to be, even in pretty fraught debates. That might be a great advantage in the election.

    Trump good with crowds, at least with not completely adoring crowds? I don’t think so. Pence is stiff, slow-witted and dogmatic.

    Kaine might have a great very approachable and friendly, yet confident and in-command, personality for campaigning nationally, and that is pretty rare. Who else I know of? Maybe Booker? I hope we can look back and say that this was a ‘hit-it-out-of-the-ballpark’ pick, like Biden, except it slipped people’s notice at the time.

  169. 169.

    Steeplejack (phone)

    @Mnemosyne:

    Thanks (not!) for another “I don’t want to see it” memory, because whenever I think of fading, late-stage Ray Milland—which went on for 20 years, Christ—all I can see is his head next to Rosey Grier’s in The Thing with Two Heads. An ignoble end for a good actor—and that wasn’t even the end. Ugh.

  170. 170.

    Tripod

    OK – he’s a southern white male, Catholic, and speaks fluent Spanish. Experience as Governor and Senator. Kept winning in a GOP state swinging left. The fuck else do you want? I’ll give you foreign policy and…?

    I think Elizabeth Warren would have been a great pick, but somebody needs to be the moral center of that madhouse…. For a Latino the issue is Governor or Senator experience (and yes moar please). Corey was too NJ for how this shook out.

  171. 171.

    Baud

    I for one am looking forward to Inauguration Day and the ceremonial transfer of the White House Corvette from Biden to Kaine.

  175. 175.

    Technocrat

    @Stacy:

    What do these people want? They’ve already deemed Warren a corporatist sellout, and George Carlin is dead.

  176. 176.

    Jeffro

    UPDATE: apparently Trump has settled on “Corrupt Kaine” and is knocking him for accepting (fully declared) gifts like tickets while in office. This from the guy who bragged about buying politicians and may be getting paid by Vladimir Putin.

    Go with that, Trump: the entire GOP Senate loves Tim Kaine, but you keep doing, um, that thing with that chicken…

  178. 178.

    amk

    @jl: from az’s jeff flake (r)

    Trying to count the ways I hate @timkaine. Drawing a blank. Congrats to a good man and a good friend.

  179. 179.

    redshirt

    @Emma: Sure. But if we’re coming up with perfect liberal world, there would still be restrictions on abortions, right?

    That’s my point. Where those restrictions start is a very murky subject.

  180. 180.

    jl

    @Jeffro:

    ” accepting (fully declared) gifts ”

    That is a GOP smear, nothing less. And Kaine is very quick at calling the BS in interviews I’ve watched.

  183. 183.

    redshirt

    @amk: Ah, the internet. Where everyone can assume the worst immediately.

    Let me summarize:

    I don’t like abortion and wish no woman had to have one;
    that said, in this real world, every woman should have the freedom of choice for an abortion if she wants one, and that should be available in a easily accessed, reputable health care facility;
    that said, there still needs to be some restriction on abortion access – hence my reference to 8 months.

  184. 184.

    jl

    @Baud: No Baud bashing threads anymore. It breaks my heart. Guy’s campaign was such a loser, not even Trump is planning any revenge. Sad!

  187. 187.

    J R in WV

    And thanks for letting us ALL know about Steve’s triumphant return home. Really! I’m glad to know, he’s way too young to wander off and get hurt.

    Our cats and dogs are free to roam in the forest. We’re hundreds of feet from the local county road, which is one lane dirt, anyway. Our farm is 100 acres of forest and 2 or 3 acres of field, and we’re surrounded by other forested farms, it’s too steep for much else, so they get to romp in the woods, cliffs and rocks.

    Our Vets like for us to adopt their rescue kittens and dogs, because they know what kind of life we offer to our furry kin. Right now 3 of our 4 critters came from our Vet, the forth and youngest from the county Humane Shelter.

  188. 188.

    Mnemosyne

    @debbie:

    He’s not a great “at first glance” candidate, but I’m definitely heartened by what I’ve been reading about him already. He seems to have hidden depths that aren’t obvious in a photograph.

    And it’s going to drive Trump and his supporters absolutely fucking batty to have this Southern white guy happily supporting a powerful woman and speaking Spanish on TV. They are going to lose their fucking minds about him being a “cuck” and a “traitor” and it’s going to be glorious to behold. Just you wait.

  190. 190.

    Emma

    @redshirt: No. In the perfect liberal world, women would have the right/be trusted to make decisions about their lives and their bodies. Period.

  191. 191.

    Kent

    As a westerner I’m not terribly familiar with Kaine but I am happy with the choice and I think it makes a lot of sense. He seems to be similar to the Al Gore VP pick and one could do worse than Gore, I thought he was a pretty good VP and I was in the Federal government at that time.

    In terms of campaigning the main function of the VP is basically act as surrogate for the top of the ticket and clean up in the debate. I expect Kaine will do well on both accounts. Kaine strikes me as the type who can very competently and honestly advocate on behalf of Clinton and her policy proposals. And as far as debating Pence? He seems quick on his feet and personable. And most importantly non-Crazy.

    In terms of governance. I expect a Clinton administration to more or less be a 3rd Obama administration in the sense that they will most likely be limited mainly to governing through executive action as I don’t think filibuster-proof majorities in both houses of Congress are very likely. That means we need a VP with good executive experience in the bowels of government and who knows how to pull the levers of power. The Obama administration has proven very adept at this and would have accomplished a lot more with a more centrist Supreme Court. Clinton has a chance to go quite a bit farther with a 5th justice of her or Obama’s choosing. We need a VP like Gore who can ride herd on the Federal agencies and push stuff through. Kaine seems like that kind of guy.

  192. 192.

    redshirt

    @amk: He hates Trump and just sincerely praised the Clinton campaign and the new VP choice. If the Donald were already in charge, that would be grounds for…. execution? Excommunication? Banishment?

    He might turn back towards the Light.

  193. 193.

    Aleta

    @muddy: If kissing were routine for him, I’d like it fine. But it looked more like he lost his sense of what he was doing in an emotional swing. Hard to explain. Not unusual for many folks, but the relationship and place made it seem out of control. Or else, his controlled display toward Mel is because she is 100% accessory, and when exuberant he does gravitate to male affection. I could see that. Pence unprepared I bet. However, I hope for them a developing and enduring love on the trail that will turn their worlds upside down.

  194. 194.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Emma:

    Also, inherent in the idea of a “bold” candidate is one who is well known. And given today’s media climate, “well-known” implies “controversial.” I don’t for a minute believe that Kaine is purer than the driven snow or completely devoid of controversy, but the very fact that he’s widely seen as “boring” means voters (and MSM) won’t go in with a whole array of negative preconceptions about him. Given HRC’s high unfaves, that strikes me as a good thing.

  195. 195.

    randy khan

    @Jeffro:

    Of course, 2017 actually is a high turnout year in Virginia because we’ll be electing a governor, lieutenant governor and attorney general. (And, lest we forget, the last time around, we elected all Democrats for those positions.) It’s not like you’d have the special Senate election at the top of the ticket, followed by dogcatcher and sewer district commission.

    I would guess who McAuliffe would appoint would depend on whether he planned to run for the seat, since his term will be up at the end of 2017. If he wasn’t planning on running, then he’d pick someone who he thought could win the special election. If he was, he’d pick a caretaker type.

  199. 199.

    NotMax

    @Kent

    The filibuster is strictly a creature of the Senate.

    Which is going to flip, BTW, and come under D control for at least two years.

  200. 200.

    Aleta

    If a comment is not posting because of some odd word, can I put the whole thing in empty code brackets or something?

  201. 201.

    Technocrat

    @Mnemosyne:

    Everything you said is spot on. This is like the worst nightmare of the alt-right.

    Frankly I think they’d be less aggreived about a two-woman ticket, than one where the woman is in charge.

  202. 202.

    eemom

    @Emma:
    @redshirt:

    I have to agree with redshirt on this one, and I’m as pro-choice as they get. Aborting a healthy fetus at a late stage of pregnancy where there is no medical reason for doing so absolutely does get you into the murder zone, where it’s equivalent to arguing that a woman who’s given birth who decides she doesn’t want the baby should be allowed to kill it in the delivery room.

    Fortunately, as noted above, this hideous hypothetical almost never arises in the real world.

    ETA: I venture that any sane woman who’s ever been pregnant would agree with this.

  203. 203.

    Steeplejack (phone)

    @Aleta:

    No, you have to put “empty codes” inside the forbidden word so that it doesn’t show up as a forbidden word to FYWP. If your comment had a forbidden word, you would get a message that your comment is in moderation. If the comment simply disappeared, the problem could be something else.

  204. 204.

    Aleta

    @Jeffro: Hey he’s so unbelievably talented he can promise law and order and “trillions of dollars flowing in” despite a history of mafia connections, fraud, bankruptcy and no credit.

  205. 205.

    Emma

    @eemom: Make it murder then, treat it as a murder and be done with it. Don’t carve out a special kind of criminal law for women and “the unborn.” Determine WHEN it would be murder and just write it into the regular everyday criminal law.

    I’ll bet you $10 nobody will want to.

  207. 207.

    pluky

    @redshirt: Well rest easy, they don’t. At the eighth month, with current neonatal practice, it wouldn’t be an abortion, but rather an induced premature delivery. That being said, the very few (and I mean VERY FEW) third trimester abortions actually done involve heart breaking developmental abnormalities of the fetus. There is nothing casual about them.

  208. 208.

    debbie

    @amk:

    Flake is tempting the Beast. Refusing to endorse Trump, and when Trump tells him he could make his reelection difficult, Flake reminds him he’s not up for reelection. Now this congratulating Kaine? Cruz could stand to learn a few things from Flake about subversiveness.

  209. 209.

    Technocrat

    @Stacy:

    You can forgive that at 16. When mine was 16 I decided that “whatever” meant “That is a great and wise choice, Father”.

    By your late 20’s there’s really no excuse.

  212. 212.

    different-church-lady

    @redshirt:

    But if we’re coming up with perfect liberal world, there would still be restrictions on abortions, right?

    In a perfect liberal world there would be plentiful birth control and everyone would know how to use it.

  213. 213.

    debbie

    @pluky:

    I don’t believe any woman, at whatever stage, would take abortion casually. That’s right wing propaganda.

  217. 217.

    Technocrat

    Last thread was transgender etiquette, and now abortion? You mofos are feisty tonight.

    At least we all agree FSM is the One True Meal.

  219. 219.

    Kent

    @NotMax:

    Right. But still, I don’t see the Senate Dems tossing out the filibuster completely, especially if the house is still GOP. They might perhaps chip away at it for executive and judicial appointments which the House isn’t involved with. Especially since we know there will still be plenty of right wing crazies in the Senate like Cruz and Cotton who will angle to block anything and everything they can. Might be the only way Clinton can actually get any appointments through. But for massive new legislative proposals on the order of say heath care reform or immigration reform I don’t see them doing anything about the filibuster, especially with a GOP house. What would be the point?

    I still think the first four (and most likely entire 8) years of a Clinton Admin would be mainly governance through executive action. And that will require getting deep into the trenches with executive agencies to push stuff through. Someone like Kaine who knows how to get stuff done in government.

  221. 221.

    Emma

    @redshirt: Abortion-on-demand culture? What in the name of Hecate and her sisters does that mean?

    Let’s start here. There are, as of the 2010 census, 151.8 million women in the US. Say 2/3 are childbearing. Find me the statistics for last trimester abortions that DID NOT include major illness in either fetus or mother as a percentage of the childbearing population. Then we’ll talk.

  223. 223.

    burmspbesq

    @srv:

    So, nuance for liberals, absolutism towards conservatives.

    Yes, and it’s a logically consistemt position, because conservatives absolutely suck.

    As do you.

  224. 224.

    burmspbesq

    Bill Clinton got it exactly right 24 years ago.

    Abortion should be safe, legal, and rare.

  227. 227.

    Mnemosyne

    @redshirt:

    We’ve had sensible restrictions on abortion access since Roe v Wade — what did you think the whole “trimester” thing was about?

    The problem is, when you start talking about outright banning a specific kind of abortion, you’re thinking of a sociopath walking into her local abortionplex at 8 months and demanding an abortion, and we’re thinking of the women who’ve died in agony because no one was willing to perform the abortion that could have saved their lives.

    And, frankly, in Catholic countries and in Catholic hospitals in this country, my scenario ACTUALLY HAPPENS, unlike your hypothetical one.

  228. 228.

    redshirt

    @Mnemosyne: As I’ve said repeatedly, this is hypothetical world of 100% abortion rights. Is anyone even demanding that? I bet someone is. Just as some sick person will eventually try and abort an 8 month long pregnancy for “reasons”.

    It’s a big world and there’s lots of people.

  229. 229.

    burmspbesq

    @debbie:

    Fair point.

    What’s the over-under before Donohue or some similar jackass calls for Kaine’s excommunication?

  230. 230.

    JCT

    @redshirt: Flake is LDS and while not the sharpest crayon in the box, he clearly thinks Trump is pretty repulsive. Unlike Grandpa Walnuts who spins like a weathervane, he’s been pretty consistent in speaking up re: Trump’s overall tone and Hispanic-bashing.

  232. 232.

    Mnemosyne

    @redshirt:

    Right, but not only are we nowhere near that hypothetical world, irrational fears about any abortion at all (even one to save the mother’s life) somehow leading to that hypothetical world are leading to women dying in the here and now.

    That’s why people don’t have any patience for your hypothetical. It’s actually killing women right now.

  233. 233.

    Calming Influence

    In the late 80s our cat Casey failed to come home one night, and continued to fail to come home for three and a half months. But we left the cat door open, and one night I woke up with her meowing next to my head, completely bedraggled and scrawny, but alive.

    Just a few years ago our cat Moose managed to get out, and was gone for 17 days. He came back, bedraggled and scrawny, but alive.

    Not wishing to give false hope, but cats are amazing survivors (hence the whole 9 lives thing…)

  234. 234.

    eemom

    @redshirt:

    But it’s a big country with many people and thus, it will happen. And so we must consider it.

    k, now you’ve lost me. As others have pointed out, there are already laws, in sane non-republican jurisdictions, that limit late term abortions to the rare and heartbreaking cases of medical necessity. NOBODY is suggesting amending those to permit late term abortions on demand….so what, exactly, are you talking about?

  235. 235.

    burmspbesq

    @Mnemosyne:

    Which is why mergers between Catholic and non-Catholic healthcare systems shouldn’t be approved without ironclad and enforceable guarantees of continued availability of the full array of reproductive health services.

  237. 237.

    redshirt

    @eemom: 100% abortion rights. In such a world there can be no restriction on abortion, yes? A woman’s body is her own and she’s free to make all decisions regarding her body. Whatever decision. Yes? No?

  238. 238.

    Emma

    @redshirt: Yes. There are monsters in the world and any right can be abused, but I am much more willing to trust a woman’s decision than that of a random jackass in a cassock or an assorted group of “lives are sacrosanct until they pop out the chute and then they can starve to death for all I care” buttinskies.

  239. 239.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Emma: As a guy, I have little to add to this discussion but I will say that, IMO, the likelihood of a woman in her eighth month deciding to have an abortion for shits and giggles is so vanishingly unlikely that I would happily risk it happening in order to protect women who need that procedure for horrible and tragic reasons.

  240. 240.

    Ruckus

    @Emma:
    This.
    Anything other than her choice (I’d possibly throw in medically undesirable) is an unnecessary restriction. It’s her body, it’s her choice. No one else’s. That’s a hell of a responsibility for sure but she is the only person that should have the right to make it.

  241. 241.

    Ruckus

    @Omnes Omnibus:
    This. 1000x this.
    You chip away at a right and sooner or later that right is gone completely or is so unworkable as to be unavailable.

  242. 242.

    msmooth

    I was just listening to “Walk, don’t run” while reading this post; the gif of Christie was oddly in rhythm to that song.

  243. 243.

    Leland

    Please tell me that’s photoshopped. Also, thanks for making sure I don’t sleep for the next couple nights.

  244. 244.

    Nora Carrington

    @Jeffro: I showed up in the middle of the night to say that Kaine is a Good Guy. HRC pulling him out of the Senate isn’t ideal, but yes, if all of us pull up hard on our m/p/anties, we can get it done to find and run someone who can win in VA. Yes, we have to demand support from the DNC and the Prez and VP. Work back channels to get it — I have some.

    I grew up in a de facto and de jure segregated Virginia. Left at 17 and never went back. My mother is now 91 and lives in a retirement community west of Richmond. She badly wants me to move from MD closer to her. I’ve been pondering it and this election and how crucial VA is to it — plus the need to keep Kaine’s seat Dem — might push me over the edge.

    Kaine’s too young to have to pass the “did you march with MLK” test. He did something much harder. He put and kept his kids in Richmond public schools when he wanted to be/ran for/was mayor of Richmond. Richmond was the capital of the Confederacy. No one who has never been there can fathom how deep that means. The schools were and are majority black. He didn’t do the white flight thing that his legacy (son-in-law of a white Gov.) or class permitted and mostly encouraged. He doesn’t deserve the Medal of Freedom for that. The cost to him politically and to his kids socially doesn’t rise to the first hatch mark on the lives of the kids or parents his kids went to school with. It is not nothing.

  245. 245.

    debbie

    @redshirt:

    A woman’s body is her own and she’s free to make all decisions regarding her body. Whatever decision. Yes? No?

    Aren’t you?

  246. 246.

    No One You Know

    @Emma: Agree! Speaking as an unwanted child and the daughter of an unwanted child.

    And that 8-months-thing looks like a false flag, to me.

  248. 248.

    Litany

    Native Virginian here. Tim Kaine is so “pro-choice” that he supported “informed consent” and “parental consent” laws during his time as governor, and in 2009 signed a law funding a network of those horrible abortion pseudo-clinics that you may know as “crisis pregnancy centers.” He’s horrible on the issue through and through, and the fact that democrats want to conflate his anti-choice rhetoric and actions with “selling a few bad license plates” is evidence of the very real cognitive dissonance that the average liberal reacts with when confronted with the reality that their beloved representatives are center-right at best.

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