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You are here: Home / Politics / Trumpery / Hail to the Hairpiece / So Very TIMELY Open Thread: Stop & Frisky Trump

So Very TIMELY Open Thread: Stop & Frisky Trump

by Anne Laurie|  September 21, 201611:01 pm| 155 Comments

This post is in: Hail to the Hairpiece, Open Threads, Post-racial America, Republican Venality, Assholes, I Reject Your Reality and Substitute My Own

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.@realDonaldTrump wants to take the controversial stop-and-frisk policy nationwide: https://t.co/N7E3yUVwK8

— Jeremy Diamond (@JDiamond1) September 22, 2016

Trump will propose nationwide stop-and-frisk to address violence in black community 2nite on Hannity: pic.twitter.com/HDSPYtepqb

— Alexandra Jaffe (@ajjaffe) September 21, 2016

The GOP nominee wants to bring back stop and frisk after it was found to be an unconstitutional practice in court. ?

— Angela Rye! (@angela_rye) September 22, 2016

A 2013 @AGSchneiderman report found that "stop-and-frisk" does not cut crime. It isn't the only one. Trump is lying. https://t.co/jVKxxuS1mK

— Jamil Smith (@JamilSmith) September 21, 2016

Stop-and-frisk (1) is already in place; (2) doesn't really work; (3) suggests Trump isn't really seeking Af-Am votes https://t.co/jkeNoVqpb5

— David A. Graham (@GrahamDavidA) September 21, 2016

Of course, it’s not about encouraging African-Americans to vote for Trump; it’s about appealing to his base, the proud outspoken Basket of Deplorables. He’s doubling down on the white nationalists / neo-nazies / LawnOrdure ‘poorly educated’ that Deadbeat Donald loves so much.

Trump's townhall w/ Hannity on African American issues is now the most ridiculous thing to happen in this election. That's saying something

— Dan Pfeiffer (@danpfeiffer) September 22, 2016

Remember when this guy was supposed to be a steadying influence?…

Trump advisers think presence of Rudy on campaign trail will be steadying influence on him. https://t.co/onmpZHlyC4 pic.twitter.com/SMvUd77MkM

— Jim Roberts (@nycjim) August 14, 2016

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Reader Interactions

155Comments

  1. 1.

    hovercraft

    September 21, 2016 at 11:04 pm

    You stomped right on top of Steve.
    Thread fight.

  2. 2.

    Major Major Major Major

    September 21, 2016 at 11:06 pm

    your median trump voter

  3. 3.

    Marcion

    September 21, 2016 at 11:09 pm

    So I signed up to volunteer for the Hillz tonight… are they going to get in touch with me or should I just show up to their office? I’ve never done this before, even when Obama was running, but Trump scares me and if it comes to it, I want to be able to tell my future kids I at least tried to stop him…

  4. 4.

    Keith P.

    September 21, 2016 at 11:10 pm

    Hey, nationwide stop n frisk got a lot of applause. Oh, wait, it was in front of another white Republican crowd. The outreach continues.

  5. 5.

    Major Major Major Major

    September 21, 2016 at 11:11 pm

    @Marcion: just show up if they don’t get back to you. Volunteer recruitment is a fairly low item on the to-do list right now.

  6. 6.

    redshirt

    September 21, 2016 at 11:12 pm

    What the heck is “stop and frisk” and why is this the first time I’ve heard of it?

    Also,

  7. 7.

    jl

    September 21, 2016 at 11:15 pm

    Trump minority outreach is more and more transparent attempt to grab White bigot vote.
    As I mentioned earlier today, heard news report that while whomping HRC in White vote, Trump is still only getting a little over 50 percent support. (edit: IIRC roughly 50 to 40, I guess he’s gotta get most of those undecided)
    Needs to get that up.
    So, this vicious nonsense, and a ‘minority outreach’ townhall meeting attended almost entirely by White Trump supporters.

  8. 8.

    Dork

    September 21, 2016 at 11:15 pm

    In a further effort to court the AAs, Trump outlined his plan to keep cops from shooting black motorists by replacing their Tasers with gorilla tranquillizers, using bananas and watermelons to lure them out of their vehicles. For night stops, he’ll mandate that they light a wood plank on fire for better sight, preferably one in the shape of a “T”, and have the cops wear all white, including hats with pointy tips, to improve sighting.

  9. 9.

    Adam L Silverman

    September 21, 2016 at 11:20 pm

    @redshirt: They’re officially referred to as a Terry Stop. Its an attempt to add an element of community policing, which makes sense and we have empirical evidence for it working, to broken windows policing, which has no empirical support for efficacy, is not based on any criminological theory, and is simply a culture war argument. The idea is that all parts of a jurisdiction will have significant numbers of policing personnel on foot in the community and they have the power to stop anyone, at any time, to ask them basic questions and to perform basic searches without any real probably cause and with no warrants for weapons without permits/prohibited weapons, drugs, etc. Basically it turns community policing and the attempt to weave law enforcement into the life – the warp and weft – of the community into an adversarial set of confrontations between police on patrol and the citizenry at all times.

  10. 10.

    hovercraft

    September 21, 2016 at 11:20 pm

    @Keith P.:
    1 – It’s unconstitutional
    2 – It plays into white peoples fear
    3 – It doesn’t work
    So it fits in perfectly with all of the Trump proposals so far. Build the wall, torture, carpet bomb ISIS, spy on muslims, profile blacks, hispanics, and muslims.
    If it doesn’t work, and endangers our country while antagonizing non white people, Trump is for it.

  11. 11.

    jl

    September 21, 2016 at 11:20 pm

    @Dork: Only plan I heard from Trump on how to solve the problem is to remove officers unfit for their job after they identify themselves by an unjustified shooting of a black guy.

  12. 12.

    Adam L Silverman

    September 21, 2016 at 11:21 pm

    @redshirt: Also, you live in the middle of nowhere. That’s why you’ve never heard of it.

  13. 13.

    Aleta

    September 21, 2016 at 11:22 pm

    Let’s cut to the chase and just arrest him for indecency now.

  14. 14.

    jl

    September 21, 2016 at 11:22 pm

    @Adam L Silverman: it’s not part of any effective ‘community policing’ policy.The proponents only call it that for PR reasons.

  15. 15.

    Elizabelle

    September 21, 2016 at 11:23 pm

    State of Emergency declared by McCrory (who used to be mayor of Charlotte, do recall). May he be a short-timer as governor.

  16. 16.

    srv

    September 21, 2016 at 11:24 pm

    It would not be that hard to fix the Constitutionality issue if it was just expanded to cover latinos, muslims and maybe hippies. So not racist.

  17. 17.

    Ruckus

    September 21, 2016 at 11:24 pm

    @Adam L Silverman:
    He doesn’t live in the middle, he lives way, way out on the outskirts of the middle of nowhere. That’s even farther out.

  18. 18.

    Mike J

    September 21, 2016 at 11:24 pm

    @Major Major Major Major: They called me today (weekend voter reg) while I was working the Dem booth at the fair.

  19. 19.

    Adam L Silverman

    September 21, 2016 at 11:25 pm

    https://twitter.com/PatMcCroryNC/status/778794984912846848

    I have declared a State of Emergency & initiated efforts to deploy the Nat’l Guard & Highway Patrol to assist local law enforcement in CLT

    And

    https://twitter.com/wxbrad/status/778777870583881728

    [email protected] orders everyone off the streets or you will be arrested including media they say.

  20. 20.

    Keith P.

    September 21, 2016 at 11:25 pm

    @hovercraft: If it’s authoritarian in nature, Donald’s all in.

  21. 21.

    Major Major Major Major

    September 21, 2016 at 11:25 pm

    @Elizabelle: does that mean we can put him in a FEMA camp?

  22. 22.

    Ruckus

    September 21, 2016 at 11:26 pm

    I keep telling everyone that Donnie is a stone racist and has been since at least he was a late teen. He isn’t doing this crap to appeal to his support, he really believes all of this crap. Every last bit.
    ETA And that is one of his endearing qualities.

  23. 23.

    Mike J

    September 21, 2016 at 11:26 pm

    @hovercraft: 4) The president doesn’t set policy for local PDs, no matter what Trump thinks.

  24. 24.

    Major Major Major Major

    September 21, 2016 at 11:27 pm

    @Mike J: you probably weren’t in the database as volunteering that weekend. Or it was an old call list. Or the DNC and HFA and DSCC and DDCC aren’t fully coordinated. Or or or or

  25. 25.

    redshirt

    September 21, 2016 at 11:27 pm

    @Adam L Silverman: Possibly. I do have (poor) internet though. It feels like the first time I’ve heard that phrase and y’all make it seem like it’s a long standing thing.

    In other news, I am under attack by field mice.

  26. 26.

    hovercraft

    September 21, 2016 at 11:27 pm

    @redshirt:
    Think SB 1070 but for black and brown people. From Wikipedia

    The Stop-question-and-frisk program, or stop-and-frisk, in New York City, is a practice of the New York City Police Department in which police officers stop and question a pedestrian, then frisk them for weapons and other contraband; this is what is known in other places in the United States as the Terry stop. The rules for stop, question, and frisk are found in the state’s criminal procedure law section 140.50, and are based on the decision of the United States Supreme Court in the case of Terry v. Ohio.[1][2] About 684,000 people were stopped in 2011,[1][3][4] however the number of stops has been reduced dramatically since then, to 22,939 in 2015.[3] The vast majority of those stopped were African-American or Latino,[1][3][4] a disparity which, according to a 2007 study, persists even after controlling for “precinct variability and race-specific estimates of crime participation.”[5]

    The program peaked in 2011 with over 700,000 stops and over 90% found nothing. Basically it was legalized racial profiling. They stopped more POC even though more weapons and contraband were found on whites year after year after year.

  27. 27.

    Omnes Omnibus

    September 21, 2016 at 11:29 pm

    @Adam L Silverman: The original purpose of a Terry stop was to allow LE to pat someone down for a weapon in a situation where the LEO felt him/herself to be at risk but not do a full-on search. Theoretically, someone with a couple of joints in his pocket wasn’t in danger of arrest based on a Terry stop. In reality, especially as used now, it gives cops the ability to fuck with black men at will. Me, I think that the original Terry stops were a Fourth Amendment violation.

  28. 28.

    Adam L Silverman

    September 21, 2016 at 11:29 pm

    @jl: I thought I’d stated that.

  29. 29.

    pseudonymous in nc

    September 21, 2016 at 11:30 pm

    Proposing a racist police state for African-Americans’ own good, on top of a racist welfare state for white people. That’s some genuinely evil shit.

  30. 30.

    redshirt

    September 21, 2016 at 11:31 pm

    @hovercraft: Thanks. Now that you give specifics I do recall this, just didn’t remember the catch phrase.

    Fuck Trump.

  31. 31.

    LAO

    September 21, 2016 at 11:31 pm

    @Adam L Silverman: I’m not quibbling with your description of the practical reality of Terry stops, I just note for the record that the standard for a Terry stop is “a reasonable and articulable suspicion of criminal activity”. That is, of course, defined so loosely, as to be rendered moot.

  32. 32.

    Adam L Silverman

    September 21, 2016 at 11:31 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus: Tracking. I was trying to describe, in practical terms, how they were used.

  33. 33.

    redshirt

    September 21, 2016 at 11:33 pm

    @Ruckus: I’ve got a Starbucks 40 miles away. I’m not that remote. :)

  34. 34.

    Elizabelle

    September 21, 2016 at 11:34 pm

    “Destruction and anarchy.” spoken by Pat McCrory.

    But isn’t that kind of the end result of Art Pope’s legislative agenda?

  35. 35.

    Omnes Omnibus

    September 21, 2016 at 11:34 pm

    OT: Accidentally bought a bottle vanilla instead plain brandy today. Made a drink. Regretted it.

  36. 36.

    lamh36

    September 21, 2016 at 11:35 pm

    @Elizabelle:

    @PatMcCroryNC
    Joining @seanhannity on @FoxNews right now to discuss state of emergency in Charlotte.

    Right, because Fox News is where you go to reassure white folks…that you got the Blacks under control

  37. 37.

    different-church-lady

    September 21, 2016 at 11:35 pm

    Trump’s townhall w/ Hannity on African American issues is now the most ridiculous thing to happen in this election.

    Not if you understand that for a lot of sad, sick people in this country “African American Issues” means “What the hell are we going to do about the black menace?” It has utterly nothing to do with what actual African Americans think.

  38. 38.

    Aleta

    September 21, 2016 at 11:35 pm

    @redshirt:
    ‘Broken Windows’ and the New York Police
    -Michael Greenberg Nov 2014

    Black Lives and the Police
    -Darryl Pinckney Aug 2016

  39. 39.

    different-church-lady

    September 21, 2016 at 11:36 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus: Can we get a class action lawsuit going?

    I’m not kidding.

  40. 40.

    sigaba

    September 21, 2016 at 11:37 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus: You have to wonder what’s wrong with the brandy that someone contemplated dumping vanilla into it.

  41. 41.

    hovercraft

    September 21, 2016 at 11:38 pm

    @Mike J:
    As many pointed out in one of the threads downstairs he is not capable of passing a civics test let alone the citizenship test. This is the man who thinks that even though he would like to abolish the EPA, somehow he would be able to prevent the Flint water crisis. Apparently no one has taken the time to point out to him that the president has a great deal of power in matters pertaining to foreign affairs, but almost none domestically. He seems to believe that state and local officials are just unnecessary window dressing.

  42. 42.

    different-church-lady

    September 21, 2016 at 11:39 pm

    @LAO:

    I just note for the record that the standard for a Terry stop is “a reasonable and articulable suspicion of criminal activity”.

    TRUMP: “These people are black! How the hell much more articulate do I need to be?”

  43. 43.

    Ruckus

    September 21, 2016 at 11:39 pm

    @redshirt:
    It is possible that there are 40 Starbucks within a mile of me. Of course I’m not on the edge of in the middle of no where.

  44. 44.

    Omnes Omnibus

    September 21, 2016 at 11:40 pm

    @different-church-lady: Against Korbel for making the stuff? I’ll do some research.

  45. 45.

    LAO

    September 21, 2016 at 11:40 pm

    @different-church-lady: that was pretty much the NYPD’s position, as well.

  46. 46.

    Elizabelle

    September 21, 2016 at 11:41 pm

    Body cam photography.

    The constitutional rights of the police officers? Which rights would that be?

    Seriously, NC is pretty hinky about releasing police body cam.

    Now McCrory has to get back to work. Maybe Sean Hannity’s calling him.

  47. 47.

    Adam L Silverman

    September 21, 2016 at 11:41 pm

    @LAO: No argument here. As with O2’s reply – I was providing a non legal/lawyerly, practical explanation. I appreciate you both clarifying for everyone.

  48. 48.

    Adam L Silverman

    September 21, 2016 at 11:42 pm

    @redshirt: But its across the border in Canada right next to the border crossing…

  49. 49.

    Peale

    September 21, 2016 at 11:42 pm

    @Mike J: Well since he threatened to cut off federal funds to “sanctuary cities”, I’m sure he’d think of a way to cut them off to cities that didn’t have the right African American Harassment policies in place as well.

  50. 50.

    Adam L Silverman

    September 21, 2016 at 11:43 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus: Would probably work well for bananas foster though.

  51. 51.

    hovercraft

    September 21, 2016 at 11:43 pm

    @redshirt:
    WTF.
    Okay you are way out in Misery country, I can’t imagine living way out there. Gia bless you. I need my creature comforts, I need my Dunkin and my bodega a couple of blocks away. I feel being 30 miles from the City I’m pretty far out.

  52. 52.

    Felonius Monk

    September 21, 2016 at 11:44 pm

    @redshirt:

    I’ve got a Starbucks 40 miles away.

    Long way to walk for a Carmel Moose Latte.

  53. 53.

    different-church-lady

    September 21, 2016 at 11:44 pm

    Fuck Trump. Wants to deport people but won’t lift a finger against the flavored spirits menace.

  54. 54.

    Aleta

    September 21, 2016 at 11:44 pm

    @redshirt: @Aleta:
    4 paragraphs taken from the article above by Greenberg:

    The stop-and-frisk tactic that was heavily employed during the Bloomberg administration is an example of the logic of the broken windows theory taken to an extreme: beat cops were told to dispense with the pretense of minor infractions to identify suspects; simply being on the street became sufficient cause for a frisk, and then a search, to take place. Eighty-seven percent of those stopped were black or Hispanic.
    …
    In 2011, two years before Judge Shira Scheindlin of the US District Court ruled that stop and frisk was a form of “indirect racial profiling” and that it violated the Constitution’s equal protection clause, more than 50,000 New Yorkers were arrested for “displaying” tiny amounts of pot.
    …
    The paradox is that high-crime neighborhoods make young people vulnerable to violence, but a police policy of zero tolerance in those neighborhoods makes them vulnerable to police arrogance and unnecessary incarceration. They are squeezed from two sides.
    …
    The inequity is glaring. With the aim of maintaining order in poor, high-crime neighborhoods, police saddle thousands of young men with criminal records for an offense that the state has largely decriminalized and that white people regularly commit with impunity. Penalties imposed by the courts for possession are usually minimal—dismissal of the case after six months if the person has no further run-in with the law—but the damage can still be considerable, taking the form of rejected job and housing applications or being banned from joining the military and attending certain colleges.

  55. 55.

    Adam L Silverman

    September 21, 2016 at 11:45 pm

    @different-church-lady: He could actually try to complete a single phrase, let alone a sentence, before he jumped to the next one. Just a thought.

  56. 56.

    lamh36

    September 21, 2016 at 11:45 pm

    @JM_Ashby 2m2 minutes ago
    McCrory is about to toss millions of dollars down the misgendered toilet with his blundering response, Guard will arrive and do nothing

    Trying to look good in the eyes of those white surburban NC people, who are upset by the possibility of police brutality/discrimination against Blacks, but who don’t want those folks out on the streets to get too rowdy.

  57. 57.

    Lizzy L

    September 21, 2016 at 11:46 pm

    Someone should ask Trump what he thinks will happen if local LE tries to apply stop and frisk practices in an open carry state. As, for example, in Missouri, where the Republican legislature overrode their governor’s veto 5 days ago and enacted a law which lets citizens

    carry concealed weapons in public without a state gun permit, criminal background check or firearms training. It strips local law enforcement of its current authority to deny firearms to those guilty of domestic violence and to other high-risk individuals. And it … allows gun owners to shoot and claim self-defense based on their own sense of feeling threatened.

    (NYT)

    That’ll go well, don’t you think?

    Of course, as all Trump supporters know,Trump’s idea of stop-and-frisk only applies to African Americans, Latinos, Muslims, and other scary people. No way can it apply to white people. Right?

  58. 58.

    pseudonymous in nc

    September 21, 2016 at 11:46 pm

    And I’m reminded of sus laws in the UK that were reincarnated as Section 44 and then Section 60. Wherever and whenever search powers exist they’re used disproportionately towards minorities.

  59. 59.

    hovercraft

    September 21, 2016 at 11:46 pm

    @lamh36:
    Hannity used to claim he was a conservative, but now that he’s appearing in Trump commercials he is officially part of the the RNC effort to elect rethugs, so he;s doing his bit to boost McCrory.

  60. 60.

    Adam L Silverman

    September 21, 2016 at 11:47 pm

    Apparently they’ve attacked the NASCAR Hall of Fame:
    https://twitter.com/ESPortillo/status/778801963165032448

    One TV smashed, another airing protest coverage love at BWW at Nascar HOF

    https://twitter.com/katieperalta/status/778802030789865472

    Am told NASCAR Hall of Fame was looted, Buffalo Wild Wings looted, Westin looted #CharlotteProtests

    Katie Peralta ‏@katieperalta 3m3 minutes ago
    no lie

    This’ll bring every cracker out in force…

  61. 61.

    Peale

    September 21, 2016 at 11:48 pm

    @different-church-lady: Yep. You could pretty much guarantee that if referendums could be had on whether African Americans had too many special rights and how to address the problem of having too many special rights, whites would vote to limit those rights every time. And that’s really what Trump is saying to his white voters – he, unlike Obama, represents the real America and he’ll make sure that the force of government is used to remove as much dignity and freedom to those who his voters don’t think are part of real America.

    But its not racist. How could you say that!

  62. 62.

    Omnes Omnibus

    September 21, 2016 at 11:48 pm

    @Adam L Silverman: If I am going out to get the ingredients for that, I may as well just get a bottle of regular brandy. In any case, I’ll save this shit to pour over ice cream.

  63. 63.

    Adam L Silverman

    September 21, 2016 at 11:49 pm

    @Felonius Monk: Made with real moose!

  64. 64.

    hovercraft

    September 21, 2016 at 11:49 pm

    @sigaba:
    And vodka, what the hell did vodka do to deserve all the travesties being done to it. If you must add flavor do not contaminate the bottle itself!

  65. 65.

    redshirt

    September 21, 2016 at 11:50 pm

    @Adam L Silverman: Naw, it’s in Lewiston, which, I guess is kinda the same thing.

  66. 66.

    Adam L Silverman

    September 21, 2016 at 11:51 pm

    @Thing Three: They check there too.

  67. 67.

    Felonius Monk

    September 21, 2016 at 11:52 pm

    @Adam L Silverman: Absomoosely.

  68. 68.

    different-church-lady

    September 21, 2016 at 11:53 pm

    @sigaba: Ah, you joke. But in truth all this flavored crap started off as a way for distillers to get rid of their sub-par product. And the Brandy producers were at the top of the curve — all the exotic flavored liquors that flooded the market in the early 21st century were basically brandy that didn’t make the cut with stuff added to it.

  69. 69.

    redshirt

    September 21, 2016 at 11:53 pm

    @hovercraft: I said Starbucks. I know of 2 Dunks within 20 miles in either direction. It’s not Laura Ingalls Wilder country up here, not completely.

  70. 70.

    redshirt

    September 21, 2016 at 11:54 pm

    @Aleta: Thank you.

  71. 71.

    Adam L Silverman

    September 21, 2016 at 11:56 pm

    @Lizzy L: This became an issue during the debate last year in Texas on permitted Open Carry (meaning if you have a concealed weapons license in Texas you may also, where permitted, open carry). One of the Democratic legislators proposed an amendment to make open carrying not a precursor for a stop by police. He was concerned, because his district is largely African American and Latino/Hispanic, that should any of his constituents choose to open carry it would provide the reason for police to stop someone when they’d have no other reason to do so. The amendment was stripped from the final bill:
    http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2015/05/robert-farago/tx-senate-strips-stop-n-frisk-protection-from-open-carry-bill/

    “A Senate committee on Monday approved an open carry bill that had been stripped of a House amendment seeking to ban police stops to check for concealed handgun licenses,” statesman.com reports. “The amendment was added on the House floor last month by Rep. Harold Dutton, D-Houston, who said police have no business stopping citizens engaged in a legal activity. ‘We don’t let the police stop every car just to figure out who does and who doesn’t have a driver’s license,’ Dutton said. ‘I think the same principle applies here.’” Well yes. Yes it does . . .

  72. 72.

    hovercraft

    September 21, 2016 at 11:56 pm

    @Thing Three:
    If the cop found you or your behavior ‘suspicious’ they could make you take off your shoes, and if you were really ‘suspicious’ they could haul you into a station and do a full search. The results were still the same 87% had nothing. There were people involved in the lawsuit who had been stopped 30 times in two years or something. Ut was ridiculous.

  73. 73.

    Adam L Silverman

    September 21, 2016 at 11:57 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus: I’m off to the kitchen and freezer, back in five or so with the ice cream!

  74. 74.

    trollhattan

    September 21, 2016 at 11:58 pm

    @redshirt:
    Pro tip: go inside the Starbucks restroom and you’ll find another Starbucks.

  75. 75.

    Omnes Omnibus

    September 22, 2016 at 12:01 am

    @hovercraft: That is so far beyond what the Court (IMO wrongly) okayed in Terry that it is not funny.

  76. 76.

    trollhattan

    September 22, 2016 at 12:02 am

    @Adam L Silverman:
    Aw shit, they released the Dale Earnhardt krakkan. How many times do we need to have this conversation: DO NOT FUCK WITH THE DALE ERNHARDT KRAKKAN!

    Y’all should go home now.

  77. 77.

    redshirt

    September 22, 2016 at 12:04 am

    @trollhattan: I’ve lived in Boston and seen the Starbucks viewable from the other Starbucks viewable from another Starbucks phenomena. It’s impressive.

    Serious Starbucks question: If I order a normal hot coffee, the barista who takes my order and my money pours it for me and I’m done. If I order a normal iced coffee, I’ve got to wait with the “triple macchiato double latte with a shot of espresso” crowd. What’s up with that? Pouring an iced coffee is only one step more difficult than pouring a hot coffee, and that extra step is adding ice.

  78. 78.

    Hill Dweller

    September 22, 2016 at 12:05 am

    @Adam L Silverman: Dale Earnhardt Jr also has a popular bar/restaurant/night club in the Epicenter. He is royalty in that area. Hell, they call him Redneck Jesus. If they loot his place, especially with him being pretty tight with the African-American community throughout his career(to the dismay of some in Nascar), it’s going to ratchet up the calls for retribution.

  79. 79.

    redshirt

    September 22, 2016 at 12:06 am

    Does anyone here watch Survivor?

    After watching religiously for 12 years, I’ve not watched for the last 4, but I caught tonight’s premiere. Still love it!

  80. 80.

    Adam L Silverman

    September 22, 2016 at 12:09 am

    @trollhattan: I sensed a great disturbance in the Force. As if thousands of pale men wearing dirty wife beaters with Confederate Naval Ensigns on their full sized pick up trucks cried out in anguish and were gone.

  81. 81.

    different-church-lady

    September 22, 2016 at 12:11 am

    I’ve lived in Boston and seen the Starbucks viewable from the other Starbucks viewable from another Starbucks phenomena. It’s impressive.

    I lived in Somerville many years, during the early phases of the Assembly Square battles. Back then the people who owned the property were very very adamant that the only thing they could do is tear down the existing Home Depot and build a lager one because it was too small.

    Behind the Home Depot that was too small, just across the Mystic River, there was another Home Depot in Everett.

    If you stood in the parking lot of the Home Depot in Everett you could see the Home Depot in Somerville.

  82. 82.

    Adam L Silverman

    September 22, 2016 at 12:12 am

    @redshirt: Why do you hate working men and women. Trying to put some poor, hardworking barrista out on the street!

  83. 83.

    Feathers

    September 22, 2016 at 12:13 am

    Timely ruling in Massachusetts:

    Black men who try to avoid an encounter with Boston police by fleeing may have a legitimate reason to do so — and should not be deemed suspicious — according to a ruling by the Massachusetts Supreme Judicial Court.

    Link

  84. 84.

    Adam L Silverman

    September 22, 2016 at 12:13 am

    @Hill Dweller: My understanding it was part of the NASCAR plaza. A window at the Observer, several windows at the Buffalo Wild Wings.

  85. 85.

    trollhattan

    September 22, 2016 at 12:13 am

    @Adam L Silverman:
    Rollin’ coal. One Last Time. For Jeebuz and Donny. I’m a little verklempt.

  86. 86.

    hovercraft

    September 22, 2016 at 12:14 am

    @Adam L Silverman:
    Oh it’s on now. And god help us if they’ve damaged anything belonging to The King or Big E Dale Earnhardt.

  87. 87.

    Peale

    September 22, 2016 at 12:14 am

    @Adam L Silverman: a museum is a museum, I suppose. I don’t like them being destroyed. It’s someone’s collection of things, and I appreciate collectors of things that might otherwise be discarded.

  88. 88.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    September 22, 2016 at 12:15 am

    @Adam L Silverman:

    This’ll bring every cracker out in force…

    I doubt Betty will be out there.

  89. 89.

    Adam L Silverman

    September 22, 2016 at 12:16 am

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: That’s small “c” cracker. BettyC is a capital “C” cracker.

  90. 90.

    redshirt

    September 22, 2016 at 12:17 am

    @different-church-lady: What are your thoughts on Assembly Square now? Have you seen it recently?

    Boston is freaking booming. So many new skyscrapers, luxury condos, heck, whole neighborhoods. Giant cranes everywhere.

  91. 91.

    divF

    September 22, 2016 at 12:17 am

    @Major Major Major Major: Question is, are you going to work a voter registration booth at the fair this weekend ?

  92. 92.

    Adam L Silverman

    September 22, 2016 at 12:18 am

    @Peale: I’m not excusing it, I was just explaining what had happened.

  93. 93.

    Steeplejack (phone)

    September 22, 2016 at 12:19 am

    New York City was incredible, the way that worked.

    God, Trump is a completely inarticulate buffoon. A buffoon who is one election away from the presidency.

    We need to make sure that Clinton not only wins but crushes him so that he and his despicable movement are thoroughly discredited.

  94. 94.

    Lyrebird

    September 22, 2016 at 12:19 am

    @Ruckus: I wouldn’t know about his youth — I was mercifully ignorant of this deplorable candidate for a long time– , but his jaw-dropping condescencion sure comes naturally to him. Did you see the Congressional Black Caucus press conference video? One of the Reps, a woman but not Jackson-Lee, said something like that this election is a referendum on bigotry. Another Rep. called him “a two-bit racial arsonist.” And his trying-to-make-Nazism-acceptable son makes “jokes” about Skittles. RIP young Trayvon… may we honor your memory and keep these creeps away from the White House!

    (Maybe I shoulda just said “Ruckus! Speak!” and left it at that…)

  95. 95.

    Bobby Thomson

    September 22, 2016 at 12:20 am

    @redshirt: I thought the Cranes moved to Seattle.

    If it’s ice brewed coffee it’s different coffee. If it’s just the regular coffee where they charge you an extra 50 cents to a dollar to add ice, well, that’s Starbucks being Starbucks – which is why I get gas station coffee.

  96. 96.

    different-church-lady

    September 22, 2016 at 12:23 am

    @redshirt:

    @different-church-lady: What are your thoughts on Assembly Square now? Have you seen it recently?

    Only from a distance. I was shocked by how big one of the condo buildings is.

    I was very glad the city wrestled the first owners to the ground — basically just wore them down until they gave up. Very happy it wound up being a mixed-use area, and kudos to the two mayors who held fast on that. But from the renderings I’ve seen I worry that it’s going to be a bit bland and soulless and commercial.

    Have you been to the “Seaport District” lately? I wind up down there a lot for work, and it’s stunning how bland, overwheming and strange it seems — like it has no connection to the rest of Boston at all. Even the people who go there and live there don’t seem to have anything to do with the rest of the population.

  97. 97.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    September 22, 2016 at 12:24 am

    @Adam L Silverman: I don’t see case.

  98. 98.

    hovercraft

    September 22, 2016 at 12:25 am

    @redshirt:
    I know I just don’t drink coffee, but I have those nearby too, the closest one is about four miles, Dunkin is a five minute walk.

  99. 99.

    pseudonymous in nc

    September 22, 2016 at 12:25 am

    The thing about uptown (aka downtown) Charlotte is that it’s weirdly dead space: hotels and chain restaurants and clubs and convention stuff and office towers, but because everybody commutes and everybody drives, you can walk down blocks and barely see another pedestrian.

    Clearly there were some agitators in the crowds tonight (including people who picked up fireworks just over the state line in SC) but it also feels like the SWAT and riot gear was put on standby to protect property, which is a sign of priorities.

  100. 100.

    Peter H Desmond

    September 22, 2016 at 12:26 am

    @different-church-lady: i understand there’s a break in the internal revenue code for flavored vodkas, which is why the vodka shelves in the liquor stores are so abundant in varieties. seriously!

  101. 101.

    Nom de Plume

    September 22, 2016 at 12:26 am

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    OT: Accidentally bought a bottle vanilla instead plain brandy today.

    There is such a thing as vanilla brandy? I am not by any means an alcohol snob, but that is just an abomination.

  102. 102.

    redshirt

    September 22, 2016 at 12:28 am

    @Bobby Thomson: I believe just ordering a regular iced coffee gets you sent to the specialist barrista line – big delays – whereas a regular hot coffee is served by the person who takes your order and your money. It’s an outrage towards iced coffee drinkers. But then, Starbucks iced coffee IS an outrage – have you seen how much coffee you actually get? I ordered a cold brew yesterday. Maybe 1/3 was coffee, then they poured another 1/3 of water, then the rest ice. $4.65 or something.

    Glad I was expensing.

  103. 103.

    Omnes Omnibus

    September 22, 2016 at 12:29 am

    @Nom de Plume: I know it exists because I now have a bottle of it in my home. It is an abomination.

  104. 104.

    Lizzy L

    September 22, 2016 at 12:31 am

    Bedtime. Hoping for better news in the morning. Sleep well, all.

  105. 105.

    Aleta

    September 22, 2016 at 12:33 am

    @redshirt: And maple syrup practically grows on trees, and raccoons will pick up your trash for free.

  106. 106.

    Adam L Silverman

    September 22, 2016 at 12:33 am

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: oy vey

  107. 107.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    September 22, 2016 at 12:33 am

    @redshirt: Last time I had coffee was in the HW Bush administration.

  108. 108.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    September 22, 2016 at 12:34 am

    @Adam L Silverman: ?

  109. 109.

    Omnes Omnibus

    September 22, 2016 at 12:34 am

    @efgoldman: I know that. It does little for the brandy and ginger ale that I tried to have. Adding lime didn’t really help.

  110. 110.

    Adam L Silverman

    September 22, 2016 at 12:34 am

    @Omnes Omnibus: OT: just sent you an email. A unique response to that MA Supreme Court ruling about running from police and probable cause. Thought you’d appreciate it.

  111. 111.

    different-church-lady

    September 22, 2016 at 12:36 am

    @efgoldman: Deglaze pans with it. (Carefully.)

  112. 112.

    redshirt

    September 22, 2016 at 12:36 am

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: I’m hopelessly addicted. If I don’t drink coffee (or consume caffeine in some form) every day, I get flu-like sick in short order. It’s a real addiction.

    I have cut back massively in the last few years, but there’s still a lot of caffeine.

  113. 113.

    Frankensteinbeck

    September 22, 2016 at 12:36 am

    it’s not about encouraging African-Americans to vote for Trump; it’s about appealing to his base

    Do not ever underestimate how much racists think the Other is inferior. Trump almost certainly believes his policies will reduce black crime, and so every black person who thinks and is honest about black problems will support him. The same with denying welfare. I have lived with these people most of my life. They BELIEVE it. They think blacks don’t support these sensible policies because of laziness and a desire to commit crimes. The hate is tied to cruel stereotypes.

  114. 114.

    divF

    September 22, 2016 at 12:37 am

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: When I was young, someone much older than me told me that aging involves the successive renunciation of each of life’s pleasures. I’ve now reached a point where I know what he meant.

    I’m hoping to hold off on renouncing coffee for a while longer yet.

  115. 115.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    September 22, 2016 at 12:38 am

    @redshirt: Diet Coke, the breakfast of champions.

  116. 116.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    September 22, 2016 at 12:39 am

    @divF: I gave up coffee cause it upset my tummy.

  117. 117.

    Aleta

    September 22, 2016 at 12:40 am

    @redshirt: pro tip: order the regular coffee, carry it outside, and stick in in the perpetual snowbank

  118. 118.

    divF

    September 22, 2016 at 12:43 am

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: I may have to give it up because it upsets my sleep.

  119. 119.

    Adam L Silverman

    September 22, 2016 at 12:45 am

    @efgoldman: That too.

  120. 120.

    redshirt

    September 22, 2016 at 12:46 am

    @different-church-lady: People actually live in the Seaport District?!

    I find Assembly Square amazing/awesome/emblematic of 2016 American economy. You should visit – it has its own Orange Line subway stop – think of that! A new subway stop in Boston. It feels like a rich theme park with tons of apartments and condos. There’s stores and cafes and restaurants on the first floors, then living space everywhere else – a new neighborhood since it should be able to house like tens of thousands of people.

    There’s park space along the river, and plenty of internal space on the sidewalks. It’s fun.

    But just a part in an overall boom. Cambridge is booming – my last company got kicked out of the Kendall Sq area because some rich players had apparently taken over all the land. Go there now and see gleaming massive buildings, huge campuses of drug companies.

    Boston is booming. My old Fenway neighborhood has been totally transformed since I last lived there – 2007. Gleaming skyscrapers everywhere. The South End has luxury condo towers going up everywhere. Back Bay Prudential area has several new towers going up. South Boston has been transformed along the waterfront.

    Whereas in my current town, trailers burn down and are left abandoned as charred husks along the potholed road. There’s an intersection I drive through with 3 out of the 4 houses on the intersection abandoned. There are no cranes here.

  121. 121.

    Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)

    September 22, 2016 at 12:47 am

    Stuck in my brain tonight- must get it out for the time being.

    Junior Parker

    Tomorrow Never Knows

  122. 122.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    September 22, 2016 at 12:51 am

    @Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again): Interesting, but not the same without the guitar playing backwards.

  123. 123.

    Temporarily Max McGee (Soon Enough to Be Andy K Again)

    September 22, 2016 at 12:55 am

    @?BillinGlendaleCA:

    I dunno…I kind of like it pared down to it’s bare minimum, too.

  124. 124.

    Major Major Major Major

    September 22, 2016 at 12:57 am

    I put up a rudimentary interface for the Balloon-Juice commenter sentiment analysis.

    Sorry, people with emoji in your names, it breaks things.

  125. 125.

    different-church-lady

    September 22, 2016 at 1:01 am

    @
    redshirt
    :

    People actually live in the Seaport District?!

    Somebody must be buying all those condos.

    Neighborhood texture takes time to develop. I think Assembly has some hope for that, due to the way they laid things out — it might be corporate, but the retail on the ground floor/residences above is a classic urban neighborhood scheme.

    Seaport I’m very doubtful about. It’s just a playground for rich visitors, convention goers, and new young money. Every building stands on its own. There’s no real shopping. The only businesses are restaurants that cater to the convention/hotel crowd. There’s not even any space allocated anywhere for smaller outlets of any kind.

    The Fenway and Back Bay already have texture to spare, and the new buildings aren’t going to bury it.

  126. 126.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    September 22, 2016 at 1:01 am

    @Major Major Major Major: I ain’t taking my emoji out.

  127. 127.

    different-church-lady

    September 22, 2016 at 1:04 am

    @Major Major Major Major: That thing has got to be broken: “positive” is my biggest bar.

  128. 128.

    Major Major Major Major

    September 22, 2016 at 1:07 am

    @different-church-lady: Turns out people’s comments tend to be positive-sounding. Remember, it can’t detect sarcasm. This isn’t true for everybody! For example, if you pick NR, you can practically smell the wet pants.

  129. 129.

    workworkwork

    September 22, 2016 at 1:08 am

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: Disagree. Diet Mountain Dew has both caffeine AND orange juice. Truly the ideal breakfast beverage.

    Of course, you have to get past the fact that it tastes like neon battery acid….

  130. 130.

    Major Major Major Major

    September 22, 2016 at 1:09 am

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: Wait, no, emoji seems to work. I, uh… totally meant to do that.

  131. 131.

    different-church-lady

    September 22, 2016 at 1:12 am

    @Major Major Major Major: Amazing: even an algorithm has that guy nailed to the wall.

  132. 132.

    piratedan

    September 22, 2016 at 1:17 am

    @Major Major Major Major: ty M4, that was kind of cool to see. Also pleasantly surprised that the positive greatly outweighed the negative. Also shocked to see myself at 150, thought I would be much lower.

  133. 133.

    Ruckus

    September 22, 2016 at 1:23 am

    @different-church-lady:
    Really though how hard could it be? Restroom stalls have his number.

  134. 134.

    scav

    September 22, 2016 at 1:25 am

    @Major Major Major Major: “Moderate” would also be hard to catch in this permanently snark tag enabled environment. I can almost see positive, if the recipe and pet threads are included. Walter alone would warp the ratings in one direction.

  135. 135.

    Major Major Major Major

    September 22, 2016 at 1:27 am

    @piratedan: Thanks!

    @scav: Yeah, it’s every thread, June-now. I updated it with August and September(ish) tonight.

  136. 136.

    Omnes Omnibus

    September 22, 2016 at 1:39 am

    @efgoldman: In the the Mid-West the really tall building is the Sears Tower and, for those who really care, It is the Congress not the Eisenhower.

  137. 137.

    different-church-lady

    September 22, 2016 at 1:44 am

    @efgoldman: I am completely fascinated by what Sullivan Square was like back when there was an actual square there. I used to always wonder why it was even a place with a name. Didn’t understand it until I saw an old map of what it looked like before they tore it all down and drove an overpass through it and paved everything else.

    I think I have very vague memories of the Charlestown Elevated. I do definitely remember going through North Station to school in the 80s and seeing the the decommissioned elevated Orange Line platform, and wondering what it was all about.

  138. 138.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    September 22, 2016 at 1:47 am

    To add a bit of class to this joint: The entry hall at the Huntington.

    And, Blue Boy.

  139. 139.

    Steeplejack (phone)

    September 22, 2016 at 1:53 am

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    My deepest condolences.

  140. 140.

    different-church-lady

    September 22, 2016 at 1:54 am

    @efgoldman: Or, perhaps, no urban planning. It’s like there was no thought put into it at all, other than, “Yes, please, go ahead and put up large buildings on this former massive rail yard.” They seem to have cared about what went along the waterfront (ICA, Courthouse, park) but put no thought into what the parking lots would become.

    The silver lining is that it seems to have a spill-over effect onto the Congress Street area. Much more life there than there used to be.

  141. 141.

    Aleta

    September 22, 2016 at 1:55 am

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: 1. Those columns are brought out to appear so delicate. 2. Blue Boy!

  142. 142.

    Omnes Omnibus

    September 22, 2016 at 1:56 am

    @Steeplejack (phone): You get me. Thanks.

  143. 143.

    normal liberal

    September 22, 2016 at 1:58 am

    @efgoldman: @different-church-lady:
    Or find a recipe for a type of cookie that I believe are called brandy snaps, which would return the vanilla to its proper sphere of influence.

  144. 144.

    Anne Laurie

    September 22, 2016 at 2:02 am

    @LAO:

    I just note for the record that the standard for a Terry stop is “a reasonable and articulable suspicion of criminal activity”. That is, of course, defined so loosely, as to be rendered moot.

    I have seen it argued by vicious racists and Trump supporters (but I repeat myself) that the cessation of ‘stop & frisk’ led directly to what they believe is the recent outburst of police shooting black people. Because now that Our Defenders in Blue can’t check every obvious felon’s underwear for PCP vials, they are never sure that the wrong element isn’t about to leap out of the alley and murder us all in our beds.

    Obviously, if Tamir Rice lived in a stop&frisk community, he’d have known better than to play in the park with a toy pistol… but even if he hadn’t, then the poor cop who “had” to shoot him wouldn’t have felt so insecure as to fire on sight & let him bleed out afterwards. That’s just logic, hippie liberal!

  145. 145.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    September 22, 2016 at 2:04 am

    @Aleta: That entry hall reminds me of the White House.

  146. 146.

    Omnes Omnibus

    September 22, 2016 at 2:05 am

    @normal liberal: What is the purpose of my brandy? Making a couple of drinks. What ever else I can do with it, it is unsuitable for the purpose for which i purchased it.

  147. 147.

    scav

    September 22, 2016 at 2:37 am

    @Omnes Omnibus: Keep it around as a screening test: offer it to unknown guests and if they take it a) it’s useful information and b) you’ve not wasted something you like on them.

  148. 148.

    TheMightyTrowel

    September 22, 2016 at 2:38 am

    @efgoldman: one of my cousins just bought a flat in Mission Hill and her (deeply conservative, suburb dwelling) mom is not freaked out. I’m only 33, but when I was a teen in Boston, Mission Hill wasn’t where good white suburban girls went looking for property.

  149. 149.

    Chris T.

    September 22, 2016 at 3:14 am

    @Adam L Silverman: Not just real moose, Carmel moose! Monterey moose is pretty good, but Carmel moose is the best!

  150. 150.

    Applejinx

    September 22, 2016 at 5:54 am

    @efgoldman: The creepy part is what’s happening to London: all that plus absentee property owners means it becomes a ghost town. Only capital lives there.

    It’s fascinating and horrible all at the same time. I think the end game there is actually Detroit. The gentrified stuff looks pristine now, but it exists in a human context and capital is not forever. And when you abandon that fancy high-rise stuff, you get a Blade Runner industrial wasteland.

  151. 151.

    satby

    September 22, 2016 at 7:22 am

    @Major Major Major Major: yay, I’m #37! (?)

  152. 152.

    tarragon

    September 22, 2016 at 9:33 am

    @redshirt: @redshirt:

    I ordered a cold brew yesterday. Maybe 1/3 was coffee, then they poured another 1/3 of water, then the rest ice. $4.65 or something.

    Cold brew is something different. Who the hell knows how Starbucks does it, but done right it’s a lot of grounds brewed at room temp for 12-24 hours. You need to dilute it because it’s crazy strong and thick.

    It’s expensive because it’s a crazy amount of grounds for the resulting coffee. It’s extra expensive because it’s Starbucks.

    At home I do 165 grams grounds and 650 grams water in a quart jar for 24 hours. I get around 2 cups of results that I drink as 1 part cold brew to 3 parts water.

  153. 153.

    Aleta

    September 22, 2016 at 11:25 am

    @tarragon: What do you find is the best way to filter it?

  154. 154.

    Aleta

    September 22, 2016 at 11:43 am

    @efgoldman: I’ve been trying to track down a documentary about the “development,” that is eviction, of a part of Boston, perhaps in the early 80s. (Dorchester? somewhere in South Boston? not sure.) I think it was an old Portuguese neighborhood, mixed with other ethnicities. My memory is that a highway was also going to be built through the neighborhood. The filmmaker was involved with the resistance as well as documenting. He was a local resident, taught film at a local college or university, has since died. He used people in the neighborhood on his crew.

  155. 155.

    Sergio Lopez-Luna

    September 22, 2016 at 1:59 pm

    What bothered me the most was the question itself. The premise was that Black People are very prone to violence and criminality and that something must be done to contain them.

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