Are you an attorney? Are you terrified of having a President who compares refugees to Skittles? Join me here: https://t.co/Xl23Dmob5I
— rebkah howard (@pink_funk) September 20, 2016
Apart from being reassured that some Americans still understand the ideals upon which our commonwealth was founded, what’s on the agenda as we wrap up another week?
Best response to the "Skittles" thing I've seen yet: @Anomaly100 @YDanasmithdutra #topprog #libcrib #p2 #uniteblue #Dems pic.twitter.com/fI8HJdKiZ6
— Spry Guy (@SpryGuy) September 21, 2016
look at this enormous lonely unfuckable immigrant-loving green-haired tumblrina sjw pic.twitter.com/0NhdoKSwwP
— Sam Kriss ? (@sam_kriss) September 20, 2016
rikyrah
Good Morning ?, Everyone ?
Cermet
So far, not too bad. When the organ’s decide its a good day, who am I to argue? So, good morning to you, rikyrah.
Mustang Bobby
All systems are functioning within normal parameters.
rachel
@Mustang Bobby: My allergies are making my eyes water.
Patricia Kayden
Good Morning, Rikyrah.
That is a powerful response to that racist skittles meme — especially given that for the most part, we all are immigrants or descendants of immigrants. Ironic that Trump, who had a Mom from Scotland and a Dad of German descent, never looks at himself that way and is so hostile towards immigrants.
Good to see that the Charlotte demonstrations remained peaceful last night. The police need to release that dang video.
Kay
There’s a lot of positive but localized coverage of Syrian refugees:
I find these stories fascinating- how it often seems there’s a national theme (like Trump) that just doesn’t apply in some way “on the ground”. We have a Laotian community here and I’m always interested in their stories. They’ve been here a long time but if you talk to them their parents or grandparents all started out in the DC/VA area.
Wouldn’t that be a great debate question for Trump? What are his thoughts on Little Syria in Toledo, OH? How does he square the fact that new immigrants fit in fine in these places despite his national cable tv campaign of fear-mongering? Are most people just less fearful than the big, swaggering loudmouth?
Schlemazel
I read that scientists announced discovery of a virus that causes apathy
Well, actually they discovered it years ago but none of them felt it was worth mentioning. Because, why bother?
Happy Friday everyone
Mustang Bobby
@Kay: I grew up in Perrysburg, home to the stunningly beautiful Islamic Center of Greater Toledo that rises out of the cornfields and greets you as you drive north on I-75.
Ben Cisco
Nothing says the video cannot be released BEFORE that stupid law takes effect…
Schlemazel
@Kay:
There is an organization in St. Paul, The International Institute, who’s whole mission is to help immigrants make the transition to full citizenship while maintaining their history and cultural attachments. My family worked with them when I was a kid. At that time (pre Viet Nam)most of the folks coming in were from Eastern Europe but we also had Lebanese and Syrian, Malaysian and Pacific nationals and probably some I have forgotten about. They all had their stories of why they came here, they all wanted a better life for their children and they all dealt with disassociation from the majority in some way. The place is still working today though the majority are now East African and Asian but their stories are very much the same. They form tight communities because of language & custom but when given the chance they want nothing more than the “American Dream” same as all of us.
gene108
Well if Skittles were people, I would not eat them, because cannabalism….eeewwwwwww gross…
If Skittles were poisoned in a candy bowl, I would not eat them. I would go to the store and buy unpoisoned Skittles.
If “Skittles” are an analogy for refugees and/or immigrants, I’d let them all in. America is strong enough not to get upended by three people.
Kay
@Schlemazel:
I love the stories. The more specific the better. I think the Laotian effort was Reagan’s- it’s about that time.
Mennonites are really pro-immigrant. There’s a town close to here that is probably 30 or 40% Latino (Mexican origin)-that’s high for Ohio. They’re there because the town was founded by Mennonites and Mennonites (or ancestors of) still essentially run the place. They were originally invited there by religious people. It’s a nice place. Solidly secure working class with good schools. The only disparaging thing I;ve heard about it was (sadly) from a judge in that county.
satby
@rikyrah: Good morning to you!
@Ben Cisco: Ben, how are you doing? Sorry to hear that you’re still having some tough stuff happening.
J R in WV
Here’s a comment I posted way late on the “Breaking News” thread Adam posted, about police shootings.
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This is grim, so trigger warnings!
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Back in Jim Crow days between the end of Reconstruction and the passage of the Civil Rights act, something near to 4,000 people were lynched in the US, from about 1880 to 1968. Here’s a description from the Washington Post article, they’re quoting from a report by Equal Justice Initiative in Alabama:
Evidently lynching in the south was a formal method of keeping the African-American population under control, but lynchings happened in at least 44 states, and not all victims were black.
Now my big question: are police shootings today worse in some ways than the lynchings of historic Jim Crow racism?
According to the Washington Post work on police shootings, there were 990 people shot by Police in 2015, and so far in 2016, the best they can tell, 707. But Police Departments don’t always provide any information about these shootings, even after Freedom of Information requests are filed.
In 2015, 494 Whites were shot, 258 Blacks, 172 Hispanics and 66 other/unknown. If similar numbers on average ran for 50 years, that would be 24,700 Whites and 12,900 Blacks. This is obviously just an off-hand estimate, but it isn’t based on zero data or pulled out of thin air either. In the WaPo graph the lines for 2015 and 2016 lay right on top of one another. And, honestly, some of these people needed to be shot, because they were in the middle of a killing spree, but obviously not all of them fit in that group.
The lynching report ran for 88 years and only got to 4,000 people murdered in terrorist racist attacks up through 1968.
So today we are way more than an order of magnitude worse in terms of death toll counts. That’s pretty grim, isn’t it? And the President can’t seem to do anything significant about it, so far, after 7 years and 8 months. Maybe Hillary will look into this.
It is certainly more likely than expecting Trump to give a rat’s ass about it. He would probably say, “You guys get to work, this isn’t getting us where we need to be!”
At least these victims mostly die quickly, laying on the pavement, or in their yard or porch. They aren’t tortured, burned alive, chopped up alive for souvenirs. I’m not sure if there are collectable postcards, there are sure a lot of internet photos, so it would still be easy for a racist to collect them for fun and entertainment.
There are archives of these postcards out there, by the way. I do NOT recommend you do Google images, I… trust me, just don’t go there.
Sorry to be a downer. But this shit is real, and we have to do something about it if we want to be able to call ourselves a civilized nation. The cops are killing us, by far more than any other group of people committing crimes per capita. They are more dangerous than Radical Islamic Terrorists, who manage to kill 2 or 3 people in the US annually, unless you count that one day when no one was president to take responsibility, that day in 2001, the day George W Bush was NOT the President of the United States. Just ask Rudy Giuliani, who also NOT mayor of New York City on 9/11/2001.
But the Islamic Terrorists would have to knock down skyscrapers over and over every few years to catch up with the murder rate of our own police. That’s pretty bad.
Betty Cracker
Speaking of immigrants, WaPo published a wonderful multimedia piece on Japanese women who married American GIs in the post-WWII occupation period and made new lives here in the US. Take a look. The strength of those women will amaze you.
Of the many things I despise about the Trump campaign, the demonization of immigrants disgusts me the most. The cynical way that bastard uses other people’s fear and grief to smear an entire group, the way he irresponsibly suggests that immigration status is a marker of violent tendencies. “Demagogic” is too polite a word for that.
Kay
I find national polls comforting right now. I wouldn’t move if Trump won, because fuck him- I’m not leaving, but I would have to be basically a professional protester for 4 years and I don’t want to :)
Kay
They have the Clinton campaign h’quarters up and running. It’s not an “official” one- it’s locally funded- but they have a national organizer who is there full time.
Republicans don’t have one (yet) which surprises me because they have a full slate of local candidates and we have one. Ours will lose, too :)
JPL
Mark Cuban is going to sit in the front row Monday night. I wish Clinton would use him more in Ohio and PA.,
Ben Cisco
@satby: I’m a little sore (physically AND mentally), but otherwise OK.
Hal
Trump can’t pull above 45% even in Clinton’s “worst” weeks politically. He’s not going to win if people turn out to vote. The support isn’t there. I’m also perfectly fine with Trump losing to a combo of Clinton, Johnson and Stein if it means a comfortable majority do not vote for him. Hell, Bill Clinton got less than 50% of the popular vote in 1996.
El Caganer
@gene108: Would you eat them on a plate?/Just to make our country great? Don-I-Con, that Don-I-Con……I do not like that Don-I-Con!
Kay
There’s so many negative incentives for the GOP. They now have to oppose “college”. They need fewer college graduates. It’s literally a race to the bottom within that Party.
JMG
The state polls show a very close race with Trump having an excellent chance of winning.
The national polls show a reasonably wide Clinton lead.
The demographic subgroup polls, added together, would indicate an even bigger Clinton lead.
Beats hell out of me.
BlueDWarrior
@JMG: basically it all depends on the likely voter screen at this point
hovercraft
Good morning everyone.
I love Alex.
Morning Joe is already making me want a drink, they are disappearing the already low bar. He is coached by one of the greatest debate preparers of all time. All he has to do is not drop his pants and maybe apologize and he’ll win the race.
The Q polls mean that he can win and she should be scared. Republicans coming home is apparently shocking. Yes the national polls are looking good for her, but apparently they are no longer important, now it’s all about the state polls which show a tight race. Last week we were told not to focus on the states because they were a lagging indicator, now suddenly they are the leading indicator.
Betty Cracker
@JPL: Saw Mark Cuban’s tweet regarding that:
It would be hilarious if he surreptitiously makes faces at Trump, pretends to scratch his nose with his middle finger, etc., until Trump flies into a rage about it.
JMG
That Times/Upshot article where they gave their own polling data of Florida to four other pollsters to evaluate and got four different answers was great. I think it best for sanity to assume it’s a tie and work on that basis until at least Halloween.
JMG
@Betty Cracker: If there’s one guy as addicted to the spotlight as Trump, it’s him.
Peale
So, I posted a few weeks ago that my friend in India managed to slide his way into a TV singing reality show in India and pass through to the first round. His audition was finally broadcast and posted . So excited for him. Unfortunately I can’t watch the show until I figure out how to fool the network into thinking I’m watching from India. I know he’s made it through at least another cut. It looks like the show runners have decided to position him as the singing call center boy from the provinces. The living “on hold music” singer.
MJS
Since this is an open thread, I just have to say how dispirited I am that this race is as close as it is. I could understand if (almost) any one of the other nitwits running in the Republican primary had won, and it was this close (or, frankly, even if they were leading). It’s difficult for one party to keep the White House for 12 or 16 years. And I get that the Republican nominee, by definition, has to be less-than-intelligent (either in reality, or intentionally so). But for a large part of this country’s voters to be seriously considering this absolute joke of a candidate is, for lack of a better word, disgusting. As moronic as he was, Reagan winning in 1980 was virtually inevitable. The economy was in the crapper, and the incumbent president was primaried. Bush winning in 2004 was bad, but giving credit where it’s due, his political team hit all the right notes against an uninspiring candidate. This is much worse than either of those elections. It is so hard to believe that we are very close to electing a loud and proud racist, sexist know-nothing scam artist as president. If that does come to pass, I’d say I’ll weep for this country, but I don’t think such a country will be worth any tears.
Matt McIrvin
@Patricia Kayden:
One of the big names in the alt-right movement is Peter Brimelow, who is an immigrant and made his name with a popular book fearmongering about immigrants. It’s pure racism, of course: Brimelow’s book ended with a passage fretting about whether his blond-haired, blue-eyed kid would have any place in the America that was coming.
Patricia Kayden
@J R in WV:
There appears to be an historical connection between slave catching patrols and police forces. Google has loads of similar articles about this connection. So, there may be something to your question.
Bobby Thomson
@JMG: this.
Patricia Kayden
@Matt McIrvin: Hopefully, his blond haired, blue eyed kid won’t be as racist as he is and thus will have a place in an increasingly multiracial, multi-religious, multicultural America of the near future. If not, he can always move to Scandinavia to join his other blond haired, blue eyed cohorts. That’s up to his kid to decide because America is not going back to its segregationist, racist past.
Patricia Kayden
@MJS: No need to despair. As commenter BR has said many times, just go out there and help Secretary Clinton’s campaign by knocking on doors, making phone calls or donating. She is up in the national polls and in many key state polls. We can do this.
Chyron HR
@shomi:
Can you and the “Hillary’s going to lose worse than Mondale and McGovern put together” guy have a cage match to determine who gets shitposting rights here? It seems patently unfair that we have to put up with BOTH of you.
different-church-lady
@JMG: State polls lag national polls — read that somewhere I can’t remember. Don’t know if it’s true.
Xantar
Give me your sweet, your sour, your Skittles yearning to be in my stomach.
Jeffro
@Schlemazel:
Thanks – made my morning!
Love the long-form Skittles tweet too, thanks AL!
Everyone have a great day :)
different-church-lady
Uhh… so.
Got any advice for someone who feels worn down and apathetic? Not about the campaign, but about life.
I just have too many moments now where the predominant thought is, “What if I just let it all collapse? What’s the point in trying to hold this together anymore?”
And then I just trudge on anyway.
debbie
@Kay:
It would be like Reagan all over again! :(
Chyron HR
@Xantar:
If I gave you a bowl of M&Ms and told you it was illegal to refuse to rent to the brown ones, would you do it anyway?
Kay
He’s been telling the people inside the rallies that “thousands” didn’t get in, for months. They don’t know it’s a lie because they are inside
It is AMAZING what he gets away with. No future candidate has to worry about lying. At all.
BlueDWarrior
@Kay: Well the key to it is that the crowd has to want to believe it. As the old saw goes, “You can’t reason someone out of a position they didn’t reason themselves into.”
Trump figured out that you can say pretty much anything you want to so long as it gets positive reaction out the crowd because you are confirming their biases, or whatever have you. THat’s why he will lie and contradict himself with impunity right up until the crowd starts jeering him.
nonynony
@Patricia Kayden:
Hell TWO of his three wives were immigrants.
It isn’t about immigration – it’s about racism. They’re the “right” kind of immigrants (i.e. “white”) while the ones coming into the country now are the “wrong” kind. The vast majority of opposition to immigration in this country has always, always, always been about racism and ethnocentrism. All the way back to when the first immigration restrictions were enacted to keep out the Chinese and “swarthy” Eastern Europeans.
the Conster, la Citoyenne
@J R in WV:
My daughter works for an architecture/design firm here in Boston that heard about Bryan Stephenson and the Equal Justice Institute, contacted them about their idea for a lynching memorial, and it’s now underway in Montgomery AL. It’s going to be the most important public space in this country since the Vietnam War Memorial, and easily as powerful, because lynchings aren’t really in the past. In AL, they’re currently being carried out by judges.
debbie
This pro-life PAC ad ran during my local news last night. Consensus, my ass.
nonynony
@Chyron HR:
First you’d have to prove that they’re not the same person posting under two different nyms just to mess with everyone here.
They could both be DougJ and nobody would know.
the Conster, la Citoyenne
@different-church-lady:
I get it. Maybe pick one person or animal whose life you can somehow make better in some way. There is so much need and so many ways to volunteer.
Patricia Kayden
@different-church-lady: ((different-church-lady)). Instead of trying to give you a pep talk, may I suggest perhaps taking a break from whatever you find negative in your life? Perhaps a vacation is in order or perhaps talking to a therapist may help. I feel that way from time to time but as Dan Savage always says, “It gets better”.
debbie
@different-church-lady:
Do what I do: Keep trudging.
Patricia Kayden
@debbie: I bet many people who are “pro-life” are also pro-death penalty and don’t give a damn about the police shooting unarmed Black men. “Pro-life” simply equals controlling women’s reproductive choices since it also involves anti-contraception. If you don’t like abortions, don’t get one.
nonynony
@Kay:
I don’t think that’s true. For a few reasons:
1. It only applies to Republicans. Democratic candidates will need to have never spoken a lie or shaded the truth in their entire lives.
2. But assuming you meant that 1 was a given anyway – it only works for candidates who are all-out openly appealing to the basest of the Republican base. The true mouth-breathers. The folks in that basket of deplorables. I don’t think John Kasich could get away with Trump’s lies because he has a reputation as a serious person. Ted Cruz couldn’t get away with it either (even if his rep as a serious person is overblown). It’s not that they would get called on it, it’s that them lying outrageously like that would be a story.
Trump lying isn’t a story. It’s like trying to write a story about PT Barnum’s lies to the public to get them to see his circus. Even when there are stories about it nobody really cares because the expectation is that he’s a lying liar who’s self-promotion skills have always been the thing that he’s best at. You can’t fight that.
Now there could be another guy who bursts onto the scene like Trump. But again I want to point out – if the polling averages are to be believed Trump is still having trouble consolidating the Republican base around him. He’s still regularly polling in sub-44% territory in the averages even months after the convention. As a Republican he should have 45% locked up by now – in the previous 4 elections only McCain polled sub-44% this close to the election – and that was after he’d panicked about his low poll numbers and took the opportunity that the sudden market crash gave him to “suspend his campaign” as a stunt to try to goose them upwards. I think that’s a direct consequence of the fact that he IS attempting to directly and openly appeal to the worst of the GOP and some portion of the folks who at least think of themselves as better than that are balking at coming around. So I’m not sure that the “next Trump” would perform any better – especially as demographic shifts make the “appeal to the most racist white supremacists” campaign less likely to work rather than more likely to work.
Lurking Canadian
@Patricia Kayden: This is my advice too. Sometimes you’re trying to keep too many balls in the air and the best thing to do is to just let one or two of them drop. It cuts against the grain but it can work.
SenyorDave
@JPL: Mark Cuban is going to sit in the front row Monday night. I wish Clinton would use him more in Ohio and PA.,
Definitely! He’s smart, self-made billionaire who now seems to loathe Trump. Plus he’s got a strong populist streak. When Cuban says Trump’s conning people I think it connects.
Betty Cracker
@different-church-lady: We had a thread about how people deal with finding themselves on a horrible hamster wheel of suck a few years ago. I found some of the responses pretty damn insightful. YMMV.
For me, sometimes only a drastic change will disrupt the cycle of suck — a new job, a new residence, a new boyfriend (haven’t resorted to that in 23 years or so, but it used to do the trick back in the day!). Anyway, I hope you find your way to purpose and contentment.
debbie
@Patricia Kayden:
Or focus on education and prevention. That always seems to escape them.
MattF
For the record, it appears that Prof. Instapundit has figured out that he did a boo-boo.
debit
@different-church-lady: Sounds like depression to me. Been there. I would wake up, stare up at the ceiling and wonder why I should get up. That the only reason I was on this earth was to work at a job I hated in order to then pay for bills that would never get smaller…and then got up and went to work anyway, because I had kids and pets that depended on me. My suggestions would be: talk to your doctor, maybe there’s something going on. Find a physical activity that you like and then go do it every day. Realize that the voice of depression is a liar; you and everything you do has meaning and is necessary. And hang in there.
Eric U.
@MJS: I don’t have any Trump – supporting friends on FB, but I do see some leakage from other people’s friends. They simply don’t believe some things about Trump that any sentient being knows to be true. They are not paying attention, and are voting for Team Republican like they always do. They don’t even watch Fox, just no news at all.
bemused
Brangelina gossip on my tv now. Duluth New Tribune quoted TMZ yesterday that the family on private plane arriving from France landed at International Falls, MN Sept 14 and Jolie filed for divorce the next day. Hollywood news is saying Pitt was wasted on the flight and verbally and physically abusive toward the children and Pitt tried driving away in Falls airport fuel truck. Local Falls law enforcement said they had received no complaints.
Who knows what’s true and what’s not in that story but I never thought my neck of the woods would have any kind of connection with the breakup of such a famous Hollywood couple.
PPCLI
@Patricia Kayden: It would be good to start pressing “pro-lifers” on what to do about Syrian refugees. Do the pro-lifers believe that a clump of a dozen cells is a human being, but a two-year old child on a makeshift raft in the Mediterranean isn’t? Though of course the indifferent-to-life forced birther also doesn’t regard a clump of a dozen cells as worth saving if it is in the uterus of a woman in a Syrian refugee camp.
JPL
@Patricia Kayden: I bet most people are pro-fetus, because once that child is born, they are on their own.
Betty Cracker
@MattF: Perhaps too optimistic to conclude he actually learned something, but he did figure out he needed to do some PR damage control. I don’t feel a bit sorry for him for the Twitter pile-on because he has been the lead hound baying for other’s blood when a liberal said something he deemed offensive. Hypocritical little weasel.
@different-church-lady: Also, to co-sign something @debit said, physical activity can be a lifesaver. I fucking HATE exercise. I’m naturally lazy, and when I’m feeling down, it’s as if my ass has grown roots through the sofa and flooring, past the foundation and into the limestone aquifer below the surface of the earth. But if you can make yourself move regularly — even just taking a walk — it really can help.
Another Holocene Human
@J R in WV: I think you need to compare figures per capita. Not to downplay those figures, but the population today is much higher than it was in 1912, for example.
Out of the white victims of police violence, how many of them had disabilities? Or were homeless? White and black victims of police violence seem to have different profiles.
amk
@MattF: It’s only for one month, but still good of usatoday for doing this.
jonas
@Kay:
People in places like Toledo that you mention *aren’t* fearful of immigrants. It’s white rednecks living in places like northern New York that are 98.8% Caucasian who are just sure the great unwashed brown masses are about to overrun their communities. *They’re* the Trump supporters. People who probably haven’t seen an immigrant or refugee their entire lives.
jonas
@Kay:
This I think will be the long-term damage Trump will do. I don’t think he’s going to win, but going forward, it’s going to be clear especially to any up-and-coming GOP candidate at the national level that the best way to win primaries and get ahead is just to lie like a fucking rug, about everything. Every campaign from now on will be a fact-free orgy of bullshit turned up to 11. If you tell 15 lies in one speech, the media has space/time to maybe call you out on one or two, which you can later browbeat them over, but the rest sail on through. Wash, rinse, repeat.
Josie
@different-church-lady: I’m pretty sure that Sam Wang wrote that when he was explaining why his numbers would show the race tightening this week. I’m looking at his site every day as though it is a lifeline. Hopefully the numbers will start to look better next week.
hovercraft
@different-church-lady:
It depends on who you listen to and when. Since the media narrative last week was that Trump was narrowing the gap, the state polls were a lagging indicator, she was still leading the state polls and the nationals were tied, with the LA Times being an outlier that had him up by 7. Today they seem to have reversed that, we don’t have national elections so what matters are the state polls, now the state polls are all important and we should disregard the national polls till after the first debate. Whatever establishes a neck and neck race is what the media will go with. There was some pushback on Morning Joe this morning, it was pointed out that even with her ‘swoon’ she was still at 270 in the worst case scenario. The Q polls in the states show that republicans are coming home, which anyone with a brain assumed wold happen. The two third party candidates are also beginning to lose ground, which is also expected, but he seems to be getting his fair share of them, which was not assumed by the media.
So all in all a mixed bag. Which means we have to keep working. As BR says go out and volunteer.
Three national polls have come out in the last 24 hours.
AP Clinton +6
Marist Clinton +6
Rasmussen Trump +5
jonas
@PPCLI:
They’re not pro-life. They’re pro-fetus. They don’t give a shit about the lives of birthed humans.
hovercraft
I wish Lester Holt would use this cheat sheet Monday, but that’s just wishful thinking.
jonas
@nonynony: I hope you’re right, that Trump and the media’s toleration of his unbelievable capacity for delusion and lies is sui generis. But I also worry that in the future, this kind of braggadocio and bullshitting will be the main way a candidate signals that they’re an anti-establishment “outsider” like Trump was. “I don’t care of those ‘elites’ in Washington or in the media tell me X isn’t true and that it never happened! We all know it is! I’m the only one here with the balls to say it!” (Crowd roars)
gogol's wife
@different-church-lady:
I think we all feel that way sometimes. I don’t know any answer other than trudging.
raven
Stone Mountain, Georgia — a city with just over 6,000 residents and a poverty rate well above the national average — has resettled more Syrian refugees than Los Angeles and New York City combined.
Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2016/09/21/this-tiny-georgia-town-received-more-syrian-refugees-than-la-and-nyc-combined/#ixzz4L5LHY2HD
Betty Cracker
@raven: That is truly remarkable. I had no idea.
gene108
@different-church-lady:
Virtual hugs. As people have said maybe take a break, change the routine and if it is in your budget see a therapist.
Feelings are like the weather. Bad weather will not last forever. Bad feelings will not last forever either.
hovercraft
@nonynony:
I agree Trump was already a ‘character’ that everyone knew. He spent 10 years creating his character on TV, and just like an actor who plays a role for too long, people will always think of you as that character, so no matter how many stories come out about his failed businesses or his self dealing, people ‘know’ him as the successful guy in the boardroom. This is partly why his base is not moved by new information, who he is cemented in their minds, and no amount of new info is going to change that. The lies are part of his bravado and his bigger than life personality, they are harmless and part of the show, so they’re not really lies. Which is why even when he lies his fans still believe he’s honest because those lies are merely to fool the rest of us not them, so they’re ‘white lies’.
No one else has invested the years in creating a persona, so the media expectations would hinder them, just look at Sarah Palin, she was as big a liar as Trump, but once the novelty wore off the media shredded her, because she didn’t have the base to simply overwhelm the noise from the media. Gish gallop is a strategy that only works in the short term for everyone else, just look at the first debate in 2012.
gene108
@raven:
Could be due to cost of living, as the government picks up the tab for the first few months of resettlement.
MomSense
@different-church-lady:
yup. Lately I’ve been wondering if I could cash out everything I own, build my own tiny tiny house and go live off the grid where there are no people. Then I look at tiny tiny houses online and discover they are fucking expensive. I shake my fists at the sky and trudge on.
hovercraft
@different-church-lady:
Keep on trudging.
If you can just try to get away. If you can go away then do it, but even if you can’t actually go away, break your routine and get away for a few hours, do something that you’d never ordinarily take the time to do. I find that putting myself in an entirely new situation can break up the tedium of the hamster wheel. Just get out and keep moving, we all go through it at one time or another, it gets better. Virtual hug.
JPL
@raven: I didn’t know that. I knew that DeKalb County had a large immigrant population, but had no idea it was that large.
Glidwrith
@MJS: Your answer is in your question: racism, xenophobia and misogyny are some of the most powerful negative social forces out there. They allow a man to literally walk up to another, kill him, tastaske his shit and walk away without consequence. They let judge tell a woman to her face that she deserves to be beaten and raped, if indeed, the abuser even sees the inside of a courtroom.
Depressing? Yes, but we have come a long way from lynchings in the streets and quite obviously we have a long way to go. The encouraging part is roughly two-thirds of the population sees and knows the evil that is out there. We can do this, but it takes courage, heart and work to make it better.
PPCLI
@jonas: Although that has been clear for some time, even without Trump. The first Obama/Romney debate featured a breathtaking Romney Gish Gallop in which he flatly denied believing things and holding positions that he was on the record and on video announcing. That is still viewed in retrospect as a solid win for Romney — one of the few moments where he might pull off the “shake the etch-a-sketch” trick. True, Obama was a bit flat in that debate, but that was at least partly because he was dumbfounded at the audacity of Romney’s misrepresentations of himself.
As far as I could see, Romney never paid any electoral price for that.
ETA – though I agree with hovercraft a couple of messages above that it didn’t work in the long run
FlipYrWhig
@jonas:
“There are more brown people speaking their jibber-jabber language than I remember growing up, and I have to push 1 for English, and someone should do something about it.”
SiubhanDuinne
@Mustang Bobby:
I’ve driven past that many times on my various trips to Canada, but have never stopped for a closer look. Maybe I should — next trip will be right after the election.
(That’s not political fearmongering! I have relatives on the Georgian Bay, and mid-November is the earliest I have a block of time to visit them, given volunteer commitments for the opera and the Hillary campaign.)
StringOnAStick
I had planned to do a lot of volunteering this campaign, but all I’ve been able to do is toss money because of family issues and what seems like an endless round of foot and knee surgeries (so canvasing is out). Sunday I’m heading to Michigan to be with my husband while we attend to his brother’s final days; he just had his 56th birthday this past Wednesday. Cancer in the lungs really sucks. Hospice is involved now.
I won’t be watching the debate because of the racket that would make in the house, so I hope BJ’s debate thread is super informative. Remember posters, some people are relying on you for the color commentary!
SenyorDave
@PPCLI: The first Obama/Romney debate featured a breathtaking Romney Gish Gallop in which he flatly denied believing things and holding positions that he was on the record and on video announcing. That is still viewed in retrospect as a solid win for Romney
I think Clinton has to be prepared to use the word “lie” when appropriate. Also “dishonest”, especially in regard to the Trump charity. He used charity funds for his own personal gain. IMO, If Clinton tries to stay above the fray and make the debate about policy it won’t work out well. I think Clinton has to make an incredibly strong case as to why Trump’s character should eliminate him from consideration as POTUS . He’s a liar and a thief and she has to find a way to tag him with that. And tax returns, tax returns, tax returns. What is Trump hiding – shell corporations, phony charitable deductions. He scammed a charity, he certainly wouldn’t hesitate to scam on his taxes.
I'mNotSureWhoIWantToBeYet
@MJS: Someone may have already made this point, but the Carter / Reagan race didn’t become a blowout until after the single debate late in the race. The GOP flipping the Senate in that race was a big surprise.
It’s still early – lots of people don’t start paying attention until the debates. Instead, they have a predisposition to one party or the other. It takes something big for them to change their minds. In 1980, it was Reagan being able to laugh off the charges that he was going to blow up the world, gut Social Security, destroy the economy, and all the rest. Of course, many of the charges came true, but hey, he was a personable guy with good quips and didn’t sound like a monster… :-/
If the moderators actually ask questions about substance and make Trump answer them, then Hillary will have Donnie stuffed and mounted by the end of next week. If not, well, then she’ll have to work a little harder.
I continue to think that her support is much stronger than what is showing up in the “likely voter” massaged polls. But it’s not at all obvious to me how much of that support is going to translate into flipping the Senate and the House. (And I realize that I have a bit of rose-tinting on my glasses, so I wouldn’t bet that the election may still be much closer than it should because of the strong misogyny and Anyone But Clinton sentiments out there…) According to Wang at PEC Hillary winning by 6-7% (IIRC) in the popular vote is an indicator of the mass of support that Team D needs to flip the House. Let’s make it happen.
Cheers,
Scott.
Fair Economist
@different-church-lady:
Exercise and socializing help with feeling depressed. I have a good book “The How of Happiness” by Sonia Lyubomirsky which gives scientifically demonstrated ways to make youself happier. Some straightforward suggestions are keeping a gratitude diary, avoiding comparisons with other people, practicing random acts of kindness, and savoring something fun.
Good luck and remember your comments are appreciated here.
Major Major Major Major
@FlipYrWhig: Why do people get sooooo mad about pressing 1 for English? I get that it’s a proxy or whatever but it always struck me as sooooo stupid.
@SenyorDave: Obama assumed he would be debating the Romney that had been on display the whole time. I also had the impression Obama thought Romney had some honor in him up until that point. Hillary certainly doesn’t think the latter; Trump will probably TRY to be a normal Very Serious Person, and I imagine her goal will bet to get him to crack.
Elizabelle
Good morning, all. Happy Friday.
Watched “The Danish Girl” last night. What a beautiful film. Acting was incredible.
Director was Tom Hooper; also directed “The King’s Speech” and a lot of other good movies.
Also: RIP. This week we lost Curtis Hansen, director of “LA Confidential” and “8 Mile.” Just 71.
Miss Bianca
@different-church-lady: All I can say is, “sometimes, I’m right there with you”. The only consolation I can offer is a pretty negative one – it’s been worse at many different points in my life so I know, as Dan Savage so famously said in another context, that It Gets Better. FWIW.
ETA: And I see Patricia got there before me, almost in the same words! Pays to read thru’ the comments….
jonas
@PPCLI:
Well, he *did* lose. But I get your point. He never paid for it in terms of how the media *covered* him. He was nailed for the 47% gaffe — but that was a classic “gaffe” (accidentally pulling back the curtain on your own spin) and the media luuuuv gaffes. But the baldfaced lies (“I never supported X” — when you clearly did, on numerous occasions), which were far more serious in terms of our civil discourse, largely got a pass. And I agree that Obama was really caught off balance by Romney’s willingness to stand there and claim over and over again that the sky was green. He hadn’t prepped for that level of bullshit.
JMG
@Major Major Major Major: Why do so many Americans go to foreign countries and are shocked/pissed off that not everyone speaks English? Same deal. It’s not “we’re number one,” it’s “we’re all there is.”
JR in WV
@Patricia Kayden:
Mrs J and I went to Hillary’s “Campaign HQ” last night, took our computers, logged on to the Ohio Phone Call system, and I personally called nearly 100 separate numbers.
Most were either no answer or voice mail, and we weren’t leaving messages. But most of the people who answered their phones were going to vote for Hillary. A couple had just been called by people calling from Kent! Imagine how much phone bank calling was going on for people to get two calls within a minute or so!
One woman tickled Mrs J, she told wife she was wearing her Hillary button, and had been calling for Hills yesterday, and was so excited to be able to cast a presidential ballot for a woman!!
Even though they aren’t putting any money into WV, which is smart because somehow we’re in a race to the bottom with Alabama, I feel good about this election. Even if that’s totally an illusion, that’s OK because I’ll feel better going into election night if I’m optimistic.
And I’m working for the campaign, and contributing. I hit up the ActBlue on the front page, and they split it among 16 candidates. Guess how much email I’m getting??
I’m unsubscribing from all of them, and leaving a positive message. I can’t possibly follow all those candidates and their races, nor contribute to all of them over and over. But I did my part for congress/senate races, as well as Hillary.
I encourage everyone to either use the online phone banking tool from home or find a local field office to visit to make calls. It’s actually fun. I have so far hit one surly woman who told me I was calling the wrong list because they were all Trump supporters! And hung up before I could say anything nice to her, too. Bitch.
It takes a really stupid female/black/immigrant to back Trump… Really!!
We’re probably going up to Ohio the two weekends before the election, trying to turn the swing state closest to us. I like PA better, its more mountains, but it’s a lot longer drive, we can be into Ohio in 2 hours and be working for Hillary.
JR in WV
@different-church-lady:
Seriously, take a nap. And get some multi-vitamins. Try to eat fresh veggies, and drink plenty of good cool water.
But that nap, it can really help you out, just an hour to rest up.
hovercraft
@Major Major Major Major:
The press 1 nonsense is the same dumb impulse that makes people travel abroad and then bitch cause no one speaks English.
One thing that the right says about Obama is true, he can be arrogant, and he took RMoney for granted, he assumed he was a better debater, which he was, but he also assumed that RMoney had shame, which to his chagrin RMoney did not.
Uncle Cosmo
@Jeffro: Q: What’s the difference between ignorance & apathy?
A: I don’t know & I don’t care.
An oldie but a truie.
Patricia Kayden
@JR in WV: Good for you and all the others doing their part to ensure a Clinton victory. This is why there is no need to despair. We will do this.
JR in WV
@debbie:
Well, that is a perfect example of misleading and false propaganda. If you only poll single catholic women who never plan to be pregnant, sure, you can get those results, if you work hard at it.
If you poll women who have had friends with problem pregnancies, ectopic pregnancies, malformed fetus issues showing up towards the end of their pregnancy… there’s a different majority there, isn’t there?
My Mom was a life-long Republican, yet worked hard to stay alive with COPD (a miserable way to live) to vote against the Republican candidates in her last two elections. She confessed it to me on her death bed. She did it because of the R’s position on abortion, she couldn’t bear it.
She made me promise not to tell my Dad that she had been canceling his votes for 8 years of presidents. I believe she had a friend or cousin who died from a botched abortion back when they were illegal, or died in a problem pregnancy when no doctor would perform the procedure that would save her life.
She lived 5 years longer than the doctors told us she could make. They were all 6 to 9 months, but there was an election she wanted to wait for. She mailed her absentee Democratic ballot and died about a week later. Close enough.
Those anti-choice people foment hate and violence, resulting in terrorists killing our doctors, nurses and organizers. They have at best twisted morals.
Another Scott
New nym – Formerly “I’mNotSureWhoIWantToBeYet”
Cheers,
Scott.
gogol's wife
@hovercraft:
I also feel that the whole Trump thing is enhancing any anxiety I would be having about all the normal things of life. I’m so irritable, I blow my top at the slightest thing, and then I remember — oh yes, we’re hurtling toward Putinism, that’s why you’re so upset.
Amir Khalid
The BBC is reporting that Terry Jones of Monty Python has been diagnosed with primary progressive aphasia, a severe form of dementia which affects his ability to communicate.
SiubhanDuinne
@debbie:
For some welcome balance — Atlanta, of all places, has a thriving Carafem center. Heard this story yesterday on local NPR station. The link is to a transcript, but there’s a “listen” button at the top of the page.
Gelfling 545
@Schlemazel: We also have the International Institute here along with several ofther immigrant/refugee aide societies. Journey’s End comes to mind as one that does a great work locally. We also had one section of the city that was slowly being abandoned and has now been largely revitalized through the efforts of the refugee communities. These people have been a great benefit to our city.
Gelfling 545
@gene108: If Skittles were inspected to the degree refugees are, they’d be health food.
waysel
@Kay: Under Trump administration, Trump moves you.
Major Major Major Major
@Gelfling 545: I love how the poisoned skittles thing came up like a week after the getting rid of the FDA thing.
SiubhanDuinne
@StringOnAStick:
I hope your brother-in-law’s transition is peaceful. If he is aware, I’m sure it will be easier for him knowing that people who love him are there.
Mnemosyne
@Matt McIrvin:
I would love to introduce that guy to my cousin-in-law’s blond, blue-eyed son, and then introduce him to my half-Black, dark-skinned cousin-in-law. Because genes are funny things and you never know for sure what you’re going to get when you mix them together and step back to see what the resulting baby looks like.
hovercraft
@Major Major Major Major:
They disappeared that comment, you’re imagining things, he never said he wanted to get rid of the FDA. You were just dreaming.
hovercraft
@Mnemosyne:
I have cousins who are fraternal twins, she looks black like the rest of us, but he came out Indian like our great grandmother who was from India.
Miss Bianca
@Mnemosyne: Al lright, Hamil-maniac…I’m digging +9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+9+
(‘scuse me a sec here – Lefty Kitty has her head in the popcorn bag and her little feets on the keyboard – much hilarity ensuing-)
Anyway, where was I? Oh, yes – digging Your Musical’s soundtrack so far. *Is* it a musical, after all? Seems like the songs are telling the story just fine without any spoken parts – I’d call that an opera, myself.
Major Major Major Major
@Miss Bianca: Schoolhouse Rap.
Miss Bianca
@Amir Khalid: Oh, no, that is so sad! The Pythons are all so quick-witted and cerebral, it’s doubly heart-breaking to hear that.
@Major Major Major Major: Ha! I would totally use “Hamilton” in a classroom setting.
waysel
@jonas: I like ‘anti- choice’ better. It’s more accurate and less of a positive message than ‘pro-life’. There was definetely PR invoked in naming the movement ‘pro-life’.
Another Scott
@MJS: Someone may have already made this point, but the Carter / Reagan race didn’t become a blowout until after the single debate late in the race. The GOP flipping the Senate in that race was a big surprise.
It’s still early – lots of people don’t start paying attention until the debates. Instead, they have a predisposition to one party or the other. It takes something big for them to change their minds. In 1980, it was Reagan being able to laugh off the charges that he was going to blow up the world, gut Social Security, destroy the economy, and all the rest. Of course, many of the charges came true, but hey, he was a personable guy with good quips and didn’t sound like a monster… :-/
If the moderators actually ask questions about substance and make Trump answer them, then Hillary will have Donnie stuffed and mounted by the end of next week. If not, well, then she’ll have to work a little harder.
I continue to think that her support is much stronger than what is showing up in the “likely voter” massaged polls. But it’s not at all obvious to me how much of that support is going to translate into flipping the Senate and the House. (And I realize that I have a bit of rose-tinting on my glasses, so I wouldn’t bet that the election may still be much closer than it should because of the strong misogyny and Anyone But Clinton sentiments out there…) According to Wang at PEC Hillary winning by 6-7% (IIRC) in the popular vote is an indicator of the mass of support that Team D needs to flip the House. Let’s make it happen.
Cheers,
Scott.
(Formerly ImNotSureWhoIWantToBeYet + apostrophe)
Another Scott
Bah. So much for changing my nym – I still can’t post about 25% of the time… Poof – it just vanishes.
(sigh)
Cheers,
Scott.
(Formerly ImNotSure… + apostrophe)
Uncle Cosmo
@Major Major Major Major:
I really don’t understand the foofaraw here. Has anyone here ever had to “press 1 for English?” Not I (said the rat ;^D). Not once. Ever.
In the VAST MAJORITY of automated phone answering systems in the USA, English is the default language & one presses whatever number for a different language. (“Por espanol, marque l’uno.”) Because English is most of their callers’ native tongue. If it’s not–i.e., if most of their clientele speaks Spanish or Korean or Thai or Klingon or whatever–then that will be the default language. I can imagine that being the case in a fairly small number of fairly small businesses in a fairly localized ethnic enclave. Anyone who calls one of those establishments ought to understand that. If they’re not willing to make the small accommodation of “pressing 1 for English,” they should just trade with a business where they don’t have to. Period.
Mnemosyne
@different-church-lady:
Honestly, seek medical help. It sounds like clinical depression, but there are other possible medical issues (like thyroid problems) that can also affect mood.
Your brain is lying to you. Don’t worry, a lot of us here have brains that like to do that. Ignore your brain when it tells you it’s hopeless to try and feel better and call your doctor. Today.
Major Major Major Major
@Uncle Cosmo: I press 1 for english sometimes I think. But I also live somewhere that has voting literature in like twelve languages.
Mnemosyne
@StringOnAStick:
I have been there, sister. My brother died of lung cancer last year at the age of 51, and it was a terrible thing to witness. I’m wishing peace and strength for you and your family.
Major Major Major Major
@different-church-lady: ooh, yeah, talk to a doc.
Mnemosyne
@Miss Bianca:
It’s a musical that’s “sung through.” Apparently opera has different conventions, so sing-through musicals don’t count.
I haven’t listened directly to it in a few weeks because I don’t need to — it’s in the jukebox in my head now.
les
@Uncle Cosmo:
Stolen from the catechism of the First Church of the Apathetic Agnostic.
jenn
@different-church-lady: Hug flying your way, should you choose to accept it! :*)
A lot of good advice and sympathies on here already, but I would add making sure to firewall some time with yourself and your friends. And tell them that you’re going through a rough time, not just as you’re meeting, but up front. I obviously can’t speak for your friends, but personally, there are times when I might prioritize finishing something up at work over a bullshitting session with friends – but wild horses couldn’t keep me away from being there when I could be useful in some way. And firewall some time to talk to longer-distance friends on the phone. And whatever of that you can schedule to do walking outside through the neighborhood or through a beautiful park is all the better. Inundate yourself with green things. Sit under a tree and listen to the birds and watch some squirrels. And/or river watch.
Best wishes to you!
Aleta
@J R in WV:
As of yesterday, The Counted website listed 791 people killed by police so far in 2016 .
The site has good information (not de-humanized), and layout is easy to read.
stinger
@Patricia Kayden: It’s about controlling women’s sex lives.
philadelphialawyer
Today would be John Coltrane’s 90th birthday.
All day special on WKCR 89.9 FM in NYC.
Also available on line….
Juju
@Xantar: more like yearning to stay on my hips.