I don’t think one-on-one debates are a good forum for Trump. His debate strategy is to show up unprepared and make a few “LOOK AT ME” comments that gets attention from the media. That worked great with ten people because preparation matters less when you’re only answering ten minutes of questions instead of 45 and because getting people to look at you with ten others on stage is a challenge whereas with two the whole goddamn world is looking at you anyway. Also too, his fuse is too short to deal with prolonged mano a mano conflict.
So this didn’t surprise me at all. In fact, I predicted last night to friends that Trump would try to skip the other debates:
“If I were Donald Trump, I wouldn’t participate in another debate unless I was promised the journalist would act like a journalist, and not an ignorant fact check,” Giuliani said late Monday night in the post-debate spin room, according to video provided by Bloomberg.
Establishment journalists are such cucks that they might give into this bullying and let Trump do a 2 hour informercial in place of a debate, but they really ought to tell him to fuck himself, that if we wants to bargain, their offer is this: nothing, not even the money that they usually pay Corey Lewandowski, which would they would appreciate if he would put up personally.
germy
(WaPo)
germy
“Ignorant Fact Check”
I’ve never seen those words together.
BR
Here’s where to go to volunteer for the campaign — time to press the advantage and crush Trump in Nov. Win!
NotMax
What hosting a debate means to the college or university where it takes place.
Thanks to the Hofstra alumni and others who ponied up for the event.
Shell
Jaysus, if you need any more proof that these people are whiny cry-babies…
I see Trump fled to the comforting arms of Fox & Friendss this morning to do his rigged-spin. He wasn’t making thoses sniffings and other noises, something was obviously wrong with his microphone….
elm
Doug, can’t we leave the racist/sexist/4chan terminology to the right-wing assholes?
Matt McIrvin
Facts all come with points of view. Facts don’t do what I want them to.
Facts just twist the truth around. Facts are living turned inside out.
Trentrunner
The “Hillary Clinton is Straight-Up Jim Halpert” vine is priceless. (No idea how to link, sorry.)
Also, new 10-minute Will & Grace episode is out, overall supporting Hillary. No surprise that Karen Walker is a Trump supporter. And it’s funny.
Doug!
@elm:
I like making fun of insane right-wing lingo.
Percysowner
@Shell: And the dog ate his homework!
Matt McIrvin
@germy: I’m going to hit her so hard, and I’m going to telegraph all those punches RIGHT NOW!!
SenyorDave
Trump will not skip the other debates, he loses immediately. Also, how would it look if he skipped the debates, but Pence didn’t.
Fred Fnord
@Doug!: AKA ‘bringing it further into regular usage.’
I know us saying ‘please stop’ won’t make you stop, but please stop.
SenyorDave
@Matt McIrvin: I’m going to hit her so hard, and I’m going to telegraph all those punches RIGHT NOW!!
I don’t see how going after Bill’s infidelities will help him. I can imagine her saying something like “Bill and I have been married for 41 years. We have gone through some rough periods. We have worked through our problems and we remain committed to each other.”
I don’t think it would help her to go after him on his personal life. The people it bothers are already supporting her for the most part.
RaflW
This from conservative campaign vet today:
As I replied to him, and to Chait earlier: Trump can do this, but if he does, we get to call him the biggest cuck ever to have been cucked.
Hillary dominated him and he slinks off to the binky room? Pathetic. We cannot, must not let him get away with this without maximum damage.
dmsilev
I wonder whether Mr. Great Deal-Maker understands what happens when you’re negotiating and you don’t have much leverage to work with.
? Martin
Here’s the current activity for voting on questions for the next debate:
Thoroughly Pizzled
If Trump chickens out of the remaining debates, I hope they still interview Hillary across from the empty podium, and that MSNBC doesn’t cut away.
singfoom
He can’t skip the debates. That’s an automatic loss and even he couldn’t spin that. (Of course, we live in crazy world, so who knows.)
So, over/under on the chances that Drumpf calls Hillary a sexist slur during the next debate given that Trump will “hit her harder” next time?
She’ll just keep hammering him. She destroyed him on the light substance of the debate. (Debates are always pretty light on substance), but somehow his base won’t care. They never will. It remains to be seen how the middle will react to last nights debates. How many days do we need to wait for the poll change? 3 days? Or basically friday afternoon?
p.a.
@Matt McIrvin: Lyrics? Reminds me of T Heads’ Animals. Or is it T Head’s? Conceptually, I prefer the former; implies individuality within unity.
bemused
I thought Trump would have been furiously tweeting all night after the debate. Did his family put him in quarantine?
bobbo
@SenyorDave:
Agreed. We have fantasized about this in the past and it just isn’t an option for him. Nor will the debate sponsors change the rules for him.
That said, he has never lost a debate before, so we are in somewhat uncharted waters.
? Martin
My suggestion would be for someone like AL to find 3 questions in each of the 10 categories that is fair and seems to have some interest behind it and promote those 30 questions for us to vote on, rather than us distributing votes wherever. Repost that page every day. Other sites will pick up on it as well and those specific questions will get some traction.
NotMax
@Fred Fnord
Agreed, Repetition of such insipid and crude natterings is not mocking, it is normalization
Major Major Major Major
@? Martin: well, fortunately for us all the debate people have to do is “formally consider” the winners.
schrodinger's cat
What is with cucks? Are you proving the theory that’s out there, that you are srv? Not funny.
JMG
@? Martin: Every town hall format debate so far has had questioners carefully screened to come up with decent questions, not agitprop from either side.
dmsilev
@bemused: They probably hid his phone (Donald, if you’re reading this, look inside that stuffed lion your son was riding in that photo. Left front paw. You’re welcome.).
Joel
@? Martin: Coordinated wingnut activity
RaflW
I gotta think about this some more, I’m just having this impulsive idea and I’m sure fellow BJers will offer feedback.
But if Trump ducks out, should Clinton debate Johnson? I know there would be some risks in legitimizing the moron, but it’d make Trump a double-laughingstock.
Dunno. But its interesting to roll around in the mind.
Gotta go meet with some colleagues, so I gotta pick the thread back up in two hours…
Doug!
@Fred Fnord:
I’m making the meme danker faster.
eric
@SenyorDave: Hillary ads if Trump skips debate
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P5SyuiljV-E
MuckJagger
Apparently, when Giuliani says that a journalist should act like a journalist, he means “someone who will accept whatever nonsense Trump spouts at face value.”
singfoom
@elm: @schrodinger’s cat: What’s the problem with him making fun of their use of cuck?
It’s weird that they’re appropriating the word cuckold in a political sense but there’s nothing inherently offensive about the word. It describes a specific situation. What am I missing?
Barbara
@germy: I think you would call that expression an oxymoron. But a lot of people where I grew up use the word “ignorant” to mean obnoxious or extremely unpleasant. I didn’t realize that it meant uninformed or unaware of the facts until I was in junior high school. For all I know, that’s how Giuliani is using it too. Which would make him ignorant and in need of a fact check, but one aspect of privilege is being free from correction even when you are blatantly wrong.
Major Major Major Major
@singfoom: significant racial undertones.
? Martin
@Major Major Major Major: True, but they can’t openly ignore the system they set up. If there’s a zillion questions about Hillary’s emails, then they’re going to have to ask at least one email question. Similar with Benghazi, etc.
At the very least it would be nice to see some questions that normal people care about.
Barbara
@RaflW: No. I wouldn’t give Johnson the free air time. That was one reason Sanders wanted so many debates — it was all free exposure for him.
bobbo
@p.a.:
Talking Heads, “Crosseyed and Painless,” from “Remain in Light”
Bill Arnold
@Doug!:
Always the meta game player. :-) Can’t say you’re wrong.
hovercraft
@germy:
Remember the lady who runs the debate commission(president maybe), said that there shouldn’t be fact checkers, because people have different ‘facts’, as an example she cited the unemployment numbers.
Major Major Major Major
@? Martin: fair enough, couldn’t hurt to have some FP coordination.
But you knew there was going to be an email question regardless.
Oatler.
New Democracy Now! episode has Jill Stein “participating” in the debate she was locked out of (by Corporation Police). Gary Johnson was unavailable (non-Terran fact-finding tour?)
MattF
It would be surprising if Trump backed out of the remaining debates. Of course– he’s lazy and he’s a coward, so it’s possible.
schrodinger's cat
@singfoom: @Major Major Major Major: And misogynistic ones as well.
Bruce K
I’ve been operating for a year under the impression that anyone who uses the term “cuck” as an insult is not worth listening to. Has that insult actually entered the mainstream?
singfoom
@Major Major Major Major: I hear the word “cuck” or “cuckold” and I think of Chaucer. The definition of the word on a 2 second google search gives me:
I’ve never seen it used with any racial undertones. But ok I guess.
? Martin
@Major Major Major Major: I imagine they would need to at least present it as a question that both candidates can answer.
Mike E
Heh, “John Barron” on line 1….
Major Major Major Major
@singfoom: the ‘appropriated’ political sense of ‘cuckold’, shortened to cuck, means having your spouse fucked by a black guy. It’s an alt-right/4chan (but I repeat myself) thing.
Thoroughly Pizzled
@Bruce K: I’m half-expecting Trump to use it himself before this is all over.
scav
@germy: ahh, the clutching to the oldies that didn’t work even then but must be trotted out now as the untimate savior and Big Gun.
“Well, yes, Donald, there have been rough spots and mistakes, but one doesn’t always do is run away, dump all existing relationships, and make the same or different mistakes elsewhere. Sometimes a person, a relationship, a nation is important enough that one looks honestly at the problems, the issues, the past mistakes, and works together with one’s partners to improve things. Has it been perfect with Bill? Of course not, but we are Better Together.” et cetera.
Major Major Major Major
@scav: you can’t just declare bankruptcy on a marriage. Not everybody leaves their spouse for the person they cheated with.
Napoleon
This is very good from Chait on this subject
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2016/09/why-debate-moderators-shouldnt-be-fact-checkers.html
Amir Khalid
@Oatler.:
Democracy Now!, whoever they are, should take pity on this poor woman, and not indulge her delusion that she is in the running to become POTUS.
amk
@? Martin: yet another cycle of wingnutz shooting blanks. None of those stupid questions will make it even 2nd round, let alone the final.
PPCLI
@? Martin:
Man, that question would be a gift to Hillary. Suggested answer: “We would defend Israel against such an attack with all our power. No hesitation. And, contrary to what Donald has suggested about our allies, we wouldn’t wait until they paid us first.”
Full stop.
scav
@Major Major Major Major: Ooo, better as closer to a bumper sticker. And they’ve had years to establish the basic shape and months to tailor to the individual.
ETA there’s the whole walking out on contacts line to mine too.
Major Major Major Major
@PPCLI: but thanks to crooked Hillary they now have the money to stage an attack, regional allies North Korea blah blah
hovercraft
@RaflW:
The next debate is a townhall, the audience is being chosen by Gallop and the questions are coming from the public, Anderson will only be asking what, follow up questions/ Where is the bias. The format will also make it harder for him to be as nasty. I hope/think, maybe.
MattF
@germy: Well… There’s actually a serious point to be made here. In real life, people have to make decisions about whether to go on with a relationship or end it. Clinton and Trump have each made opposite choices on that specific question, and have done so repeatedly. And the choices each one has made have been very much in character for both of them. Hilz could point that out and, while she’s at it, take note of what it means for anyone who is relying on a President to do something.
different-church-lady
@Matt McIrvin: “One of these days, Alice… ONE of these days…”
amk
@Major Major Major Major:
Good zinger to use against the punk. It’s twofer.
Face
Surely I cannot be the only one who thinks the optics of this phrasing are not pretty. Hitting a woman, even when meant metaphorically, evokes physical violence. No me gusta.
different-church-lady
@shomi:
In this election, small things like that aren’t to be taken for certain.
Humdog
Cuck is offensive. It treats women as men’s property and scores a man as less than when he doesn’t have control of his woman. It tends towards racist because racists use it to denote the “ultimate humiliation”, that a man’s property has been sullied by a black man using it.
You are perpetuating a harmful stereotype and it disgusts me. Are you going to start using “nigger lover” too because some of the troglodyte right use that phrase as well. There are a whole bunch of transgressive words you can start using ironically, if you want to be that guy. Fuck you, Doug, really, fuck you for playing with this.
Barbara
@hovercraft: She was also Senator John Danforth’s Chief of Staff. In other words, pretty clearly in the tank for Republicans. They need to remember that the google machine makes all this stuff a lot easier to find out.
Anonymous At Work
The conflicting personality traits in Trump obvious, re: skipping next debates.
The narcissist in him cannot resist free publicity that’s all about him. It cannot resist the opportunity to show the world how he can WIN.
The bully in him cannot another humiliation to happen. If he can’t overwhelm the lesser apes around him, he’ll lose his power and be reduced to a small-handed real estate developer that no one respects.
I think the next two weeks’ media coverage will determine whether he attends or not. Follow-up on his misogyny, racism, xenophobia, lying, tax returns, Birtherism, and ignore as far as policy will force him to find an excuse, any excuse to back out. A few days of misery followed by a return to “balanced” coverage will encourage him to try again.
IN the meantime, expect a working of the refs like never before. I would not be surprised if Trump and his surrogates, or even all Republicans, show a willingness to boycott NBC and MSNBC, and the shows/Sunday shows of anyone who thought Lester Holt did a good job.
germy
I didn’t expect to see this sort of reporting from the serious folks
different-church-lady
@? Martin: “Somebody in MA voted: “What about the squirrels? When is someone going to do something about the squirrels?”
hovercraft
@bemused:
There was a skirmish in the area where the cars were parked last night post debate. They may have been admonishing him not to tweet, or maybe they took his phone away. Or maybe they got it to his head that if he spent the whole night saying the debate was rigged and unfair it would be used to prove he lost.
Napoleon
Fact checking moderators
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2016/09/why-debate-moderators-shouldnt-be-fact-checkers.html
amk
bbc screaming fp headline now – trump lambasts US debate moderator holt.
congrats bbc on your bw media promotion.
hovercraft
@dmsilev:
Sorry to go out on a tangent, but that reminds me. Why the hell did he mention that his 10 year old son has computers and is very good with them? Is that his plan to provide cyber security, enlist the nations children to protect our internets?
different-church-lady
@amk: Only losers complain about the refs.
different-church-lady
@hovercraft:
Maybe Trump knows who really hacked the DNC.
amk
@hovercraft: and a 400 pound man sitting in his mom’s basement.
Frankensteinbeck
People are saying Trump can’t back out of a debate. Of course he can. Yes, it would be strategically idiotic. When has that EVER mattered to Trump? He does what his emotions tell him to do. He convinces himself that his whims are genius. As for what his whims are, he’s a classic bully – a pathetic coward when people actually stand up to him. He spent the second half of the debate and the time after whining about how unfair it was, so yes, he knows he lost and he feels utterly humiliated and furious. It is entirely possible that he will refuse to do any more debates rather than face the terrifying possibility of losing to a woman again. This was the worst night of his life, and the White House Correspondents’ dinner where Obama humiliated him pales in comparison. He got laughed at on stage, while a woman verbally made a fool of him. I don’t actually know what he’ll do, but his fear and anger will drive him to something stupid, and backing out of the debates is one option.
@bemused:
He was too busy calling in to TV shows, to complain about the microphone and call the beauty pageant contestant who spoke out against him ugly and fat. He’s an utter wreck, too wounded to do anything but whine.
Brachiator
Very nice “Godfather 2” reference.
MattF
@hovercraft: It popped into his head, so he said it. Bit of an impulse control issue.
PPCLI
@Barbara: Ah, now there is a blast from the past. John Danforth. The man we have to thank for Justice Clarence Thomas.
Villago Delenda Est
@? Martin: The Drumpfenproles are pathetic. Sad, really.
Brachiator
@Humdog:
Uh, no. It’s really more complicated than that, even among white racist fools.
hovercraft
@different-church-lady:
Well we do have very large squirrels up herein the Northeast, and they tend to be quite bold and give you the side eye when you get in the way. So I’d say it’s a valid question.
different-church-lady
@hovercraft: WHO SAID IT WASN’T?!? I DIDN’T GET A SINGLE STRAWBERRY THIS YEAR BECAUSE OF THEM!!!!
Humdog
@Brachiator: “um, no”? Well, you really told me what is what. Explain where I went wrong or join Doug in the fuck you parade. It is offensive and using it jokingly spreads the offense. Good to see you supporting such a term.
Jeffro
He will show or not show, it really doesn’t matter. If he shows, he’s sure to be Trumped-Up to 11, and I have no doubt Hillz will leave him bleeding out in short order.
At this point, there’s very little he can do or say to change the course of this election, except to make things even worse for himself. No one believes he can or will change once in office.
The Goopers should have stood on principle (ANY principle, fer Pete’s sake) and denounced him early on. Now, I’m all too happy to watch this anchor drag them down, down, down…
hovercraft
@different-church-lady:
Sorry about your strawberry’s, I thought hat you were mocking the person who asked the question. My bad.
elm
@Brachiator: Those are important elements, though it doesn’t cover the issue completely. The power of the insult “cuck” is pretty closely tied in to racism and misogyny.
different-church-lady
@hovercraft: WHAT IF SQUIRRELS ATTACK ISRAEL?!?
dmsilev
@different-church-lady: When I think of strawberries and this election, I think of Trump in the Captain Queeg role in The Caine Mutiny. Except I doubt he could handle ‘geometric logic’.
Brachiator
@Frankensteinbeck:
Very true. His humbling also has to pierce the hearts of his most vile white racist followers. Trump made a big deal about how he broke down Ted Cruz, Jeb, and Mario. But he was first publicly humiliated by a black man, and now he has been slapped around by a woman. A woman!
I expect that soon Trump will claim that Hillary was really born in Kenya and demand to see her birth certificate.
I don’t actually know what he’ll do, but his fear and anger will drive him to something stupid, and backing out of the debates is one option.
This is what Trump always does. I’m surprised (not really) that the media has not shown the degree to which this is a long standing pattern.
I remember when Trump got into a feud with Rosie O’Donnell, who had disputed the details of his great wealth on “The View.” Instead of just dropping it, he foolishly got into a running verbal feud with a professional comedian. He never learns and has brought his blustering stupidity into the political arena. Unfortunately, he doesn’t know how to back down or retreat graciously, so he will escalate this until it totally backfires against him.
Iowa Old Lady
@RaflW: I’d say no to debating Johnson. When voters step into the booth, we want them not to have heard Johnson’s name or know anything about him. Historically, third-party candidates do worse in the election than they did in polls, partly because most people have no idea who they are.
cokane
@elm: lol, this whole line of discussion in the comments shows that Doug has still got it when it comes to trolling
nonynony
@germy:
Oh yes. There’s a surprise move of political jujitsu. Let’s throw her off her game by bringing up the fact that her husband cheated on her. I’m sure that this will completely take her by surprise and throw her off because this is something that has never happened to her at any point over the last 20+ years.
(Also the trick to pulling off a surprise that throws someone off their game is that it has to be, you know, a surprise. Telling everyone that you’re going to do it pretty much negates the ability for it to be a surprise. Clinton bringing on Alica Machado? That’s a surprise that Trump clearly wasn’t expecting. Trump bringing up Bill’s wandering wang-dang-doodle? Might as well ask her about her e-mails because she’s seeing it coming and has something ready for it.)
elm
@cokane: This is a low point for him. Trolling is a art.
jonas
@germy: “Facts” reveal Donald Trump to be ignorant. So you can’t have them.
eric
@Humdog: actually, “fuck you” is a heterosexual-sexual term of dominance that suggests gendering the other to female.
Not arguing with your objection to “cuck,” but i think gentler corrections of linguistic choices are more appropriate, particulary for a commenter who regularly is right on the mark.
scav
National Town Hall format might not work for him either. Yes, he definitely needs and does better with the immediate feedback of adoring acolytes en masse with some throwing softballs as a special treat, but will he get it in these larger conditions? They’ll work it as hard as they worked to get the moderators neutered, but the entire audience is going to be harder to cow. And if the suppressed giggle (“Temperament?!”) of an audience told to be quiet is so dangerous, which might the town hall reaction provoke? And then, blaming the entire audience for being rigged and biased and unfair, while not going to budge true believers (“It’s all rigged!”) is just going to nail home his whiney it’s never my fault credentials.
Detect Obvious. What a sad little superskill for me to have, and only intermittent at best.
cokane
@elm: bullshit, one little word wreaking backbiting and consequent butthurt in the commentariat — that is subtle mastery of the form
Iowa Old Lady
@Jeffro: Cruz showed terrible timing in endorsing Trump right before last night’s debacle.
eric
@Brachiator: I would not put it past him to suggest that she is not feminine, and blame Bill’s transgressions on her hyper-aggressive “manliness.”
nonynony
@Brachiator:
Oh yeah. I remember that too. In fact someone was just talking about it yesterday. Who was that?
Oh right. It was Donald Trump. Who decided – for reasons that will forever remain inexplicable I assume – to bring it up during the debate.
trollhattan
@Iowa Old Lady:
Everything about Ted is terrible, so he at least has consistency.
“Donny got beat up by a girl. Donny got beat up by a girl. Donny got beat up by a girl.”
Just wanted to say that.
MattF
@Iowa Old Lady: Cruz bears the burden of being the Anointed One– I suspect that interferes with his judgement.
Aleta
Debates are hard, because someone else gets to talk too. And then the moderator says to respond to what she said, and that’s big-league hard, because you didn’t hear what she said, except when she starts it with Donald. Because you have a wonderful mind, and it’s already
Idiot wind
Blowing every time you move your mouth
Blowing down the back roads headin’ south
Idiot wind
Blowing every time you move your teeth
You’re an idiot, babe
It’s a wonder that you still know how to breathe
eric
@nonynony: because it was another woman that he (as he sees it) put in “her place.” His genderized aggression is a constant theme in everything he says and does. to use the lingo: “he wants to make people his bitch.” the problem for him is that Hillary knows who she is and what she is capable of doing. That chump is going to be abused well before he makes Hillary his anything.
nonynony
@Iowa Old Lady: I feel like the mystique around Ted Cruz and his vaunted political prowess is a lot like the aura that surrounded (surrounds?) Karl Rove. Cruz isn’t half as good as everyone credits him with – he’s been lucky for the most part. Luck has been breaking against him since Trump entered the presidential race and his bad luck streak continues.
gogol's wife
@dmsilev:
I don’t know why, it’s just a compulsion I have to throw this out there every single time: THE MESS BOYS ATE THE STRAWBERRIES.
hovercraft
@eric:
Michelle is a “he-she”, those kids are not the Obama’s because two men can’t have kids. That’s why the kids look nothing like the Obama’s.
Yes I know.
gogol's wife
I’m with those who vote against using the word “cuck.” As well as “alt-right” as if it meant something.
Doug!
@gogol’s wife:
I don’t like alt-right because it sounds like conservatives with moustaches playing mandolins, not like insane racists.
hovercraft
@different-church-lady:
Simple, we nook them, I mean what’s the point of having them if we don’t use them. Plus it will warn all those A-rabs not to mess with us.
Calouste
@gogol’s wife: There is a perfectly good term for “alt-right” that’s been in use for a while. It’s “neo-Nazi”.
eric
@hovercraft: my recollection is that the Right pegged Hillary as a lesbian until they needed heterosexuality to explain her murder of Vince Foster. (remember the watermelon…..good times)
Geoff
Long-time lurker, first or possibly second time commenting. I have to agree that I found Doug’s use of the term “cuck” extremely off-putting and distasteful. Whether or not it has adopted a racialized identity, there is no benefit of going down to their level and using horrid slang based on a ridiculous concept of a man being somehow worth less because he was cheated on. I would Strongly prefer not to see it used at all anymore; worst case though, I will simply stop reading all of Doug’s posts, and otherwise carry on as normal.
Bruce K
@Calouste:
That’s a wonderful way to put it. May I please steal that quote?
Kay
Trump’s sleaze sticks to anyone who gets near him:
They have been letting him play them for 20 years. All they had to do was say “no, we’re not covering your bullshit self-promotion” and yet none of them did.
eclare
@Calouste: Agreed. Call it what it is, alt-right sounds like a wrong turn or some other direction. Neo-Nazi.
Villago Delenda Est
@gogol’s wife: Well, I’m for using it to describe the neo-Nazi assholes who use it.
Miss Bianca
@? Martin: “My suggestion would be for someone like AL to find 3 questions in each of the 10 categories that is fair and seems to have some interest behind it and promote those 30 questions for us to vote on, rather than us distributing votes wherever.”
I like that idea.
jenn
@gogol’s wife: Yep, 100% with you here.
Brachiator
@Humdog:
@elm:
Oh stop it. We’re talking about sexual fetishes, which have all kinds of twists to them. It is almost beside the point to talk about this being offensive.
You talk some very simpleminded stuff about this being about woman as property. But there are a billion fan fiction stories and Amazon kindle books about the other side of this, which is also talked about in the stupid white racist reddit threads, in which white men whine about being humiliated and turned into sissy men by white women who mock them and their sexual indadequacy and abandon them in order to be with their black lover. This is also a variation of British sexual fetish in which upper class women “prove” their husbands to be weaklings by having sex with servants in front of their husbands. There is a gay male variation to this in a fascination with rough trade and rent boys.
The secret fear in all this bullshit does not revolve around the idea of woman as property, but the self-centered and often homoerotic fantasies of a white man who really wants to be fucked by a black man, but can only do so through the mediation of a white wife or girlfriend. This is one of the reasons why cuck videos are so popular in the South.
There is also a long tradition of black and white Southern underground humor (especially John and the Boss man jokes) that involves a white woman pretending not to enjoy her sexual encounter with a black man while later openly mocking her white husband’s stupidity. Fuck, even William Faulkner comes close to dealing with this in his novels, but he can only hint at the layers of self-deception involved.
So cuck is tied to racism and misogyny and a whole lot more. As far as I’m concerned, it should be mocked and talked about and brought into the open precisely because it exposes the festering sewer of the white supremacist movement, which at its core is about the secret fear of inadequacy and inferiority of its followers.
Miss Bianca
@Barbara: As in the expression, “Don’t you make act ig’nant”.
Major Major Major Major
@Brachiator:
I agree, but Doug used it uncritically and without context, which is not that.
Bill
We truly are through the looking glass when fact checking is seen as controversial.
Side note, I thoroughly enjoyed Secretary Clinton’s “I’m Going To Drone The Fuck Out Of Trump Tower” face last night.
mr_gravity
@Humdog: Saying a word is offensive to you makes the point. Dropping the n-word and following it up with “fuck you” pretty much negates that point. Words are not bad but they are sometimes used in bad ways.
Miss Bianca
@different-church-lady: that’s another way to handle this whole “take questions from the public” thing: completely “Boaty McBoatface” the process.
Hoodie
Trump’s performance last night goes back to what Al Sharpton said about Trump being a lounge act that doesn’t translate to the main room. Trump’s material is trite and relies more on bluster than content. The GOP debates were the lounge and he made his mark by yelling above the noise of the slot machines. The presidential debates have seen singular talents like Reagan, Clinton and Obama. Clinton, though she doesn’t share the same skill sets as those, is in the same class, i.e., she has skills that show she’s equally ready for the job. Putting Trump in a presidential debate is like having Carrot Top play the lead in Hamlet.
nonynony
@Kay:
The trick with a race to the bottom is that for every 50 people who say no, there’s one who says yes. And then when they reap benefits from saying yes those 50 people reconsider their position the next time they’re asked.
It’s one of the fatal flaws of capitalism, actually. And given our infotainment media is very much a capitalistic enterprise with few checks and balances on it, it’s not surprising to see it. Upsetting, but not surprising.
Timurid
@Major Major Major Major:
That’s going to be the name of my band.
Hungry Joe
@gogol’s wife: We’ll search the whole ship for the key! … Damn, that’s a great book; I re-read it a few years ago and it really holds up.
A big difference between Trump and Queeg is that not very deep down, Queeg feared … no, he KNEW that he was incompetent, whereas Trump has no clue. Trump would have deployed the yellow dye, then cut and run, just as Queeg did. But later he would have denied it.
Humdog
@mr_gravity: I did drop the n word on purpose to show the level of offense. Funny how I get called out for policing language of others by people policing my language. I do take the point, however, that I do not need to needlessly offend. Wonder why that point doesn’t apply to Doug or others making light of the complaints against cuckold?
Miss Bianca
@Hoodie:
OK, you just made me LOL. Always an excellent thing.
amk
Normalizing what idiot racist trolls like srv spew here is not having a ‘discussion’. That’s how msm normalized racist teabaggers.
Major Major Major Major
@Humdog: The thing is that it’s bleedingly obvious to everybody that the n-word is offensive, so if you use it as you did it should be obvious you’re doing so critically. People can’t be presumed aware enough to be trusted with ‘cuck’ though, as Doug used it.
Steve in the ATL
@different-church-lady:
I will vote for any candidate who can permanently keep squirrels out of my attic.
Kylroy
@RaflW: I also vote no on debating Johnson, simply because the kind of voters he’d peel away from Trump (i.e. not bone-deep racists) are also the kind of voters Hillary might (emphasis *might*) be able to sway.
sukabi
@Face: given the themes at his rallies, yeah, not good.
? Martin
@Miss Bianca: Turns out the voting is being organized inside 4chan where they are doing exactly this.
OTOH, the best solution to this might be to let 4chan run with it and basically invalidate the entire exercise.
Cermet
@Humdog: @Miss Bianca: Many people do not know that other meaning existed; I didn’t connect cuck to anything but a replacement for fuck; as in I don’t give a flying cuck. You assume he knew this and are going off the deep end.
Iowa Old Lady
@eric: That’s as sharp and succinct an analysis of Trump’s sexism as I’ve seen. I’ve been having trouble articulating the underlying dynamic, maybe because the surface stuff is already so plentiful and disgusting.
Humdog
@Major Major Major Major: Thank you. I am surprised to be told that fuck has a gendered meaning nowadays. I figured that when it can be our blog host’s oft-used tag line, we are at the point when it is a universal insult.
Miss Bianca
@Cermet: Excuse me, but I have nothing to say to this fucking/cucking conversation. Why the fuck – or cuck- are you dragging me into it?
eclare
@Steve in the ATL: Excellent idea! Hate squirrels.
Steve in the ATL
@Brachiator:
I concur. Mock them with their own term.
Major Major Major Major
@Humdog: I think they were ironically PC-policing you for PC-policing.
Brachiator
@nonynony:
You’re kidding? I had skipped out on the debate before then. Trump is even more pathetic than I thought if he would bring this up during a presidential debate.
Ridnik Chrome
I would say that Giuliani is his generation’s Nixon, except that would be unfair to Nixon.
Major Major Major Major
Okay. If neo-Nazis were going around calling people they were trolling ‘fags’, and Doug had said that ‘establishment journalists are such fags that…’, how would we feel?
Bill Arnold
@different-church-lady:
Maybe Trump knows who really hacked the DNC.
Maybe Trump hired the hacker(s). Maybe he’s worrying himself sick about the possible disclosure of a financial and/or communications trail. It would be irresponsible not to speculate.
Cermet
@Miss Bianca: I am sorry; I merely tried to reply to his/her comment and didn’t see your additional by-line until after it posted. Again, my apologizes.
Steve in the ATL
@Major Major Major Major:
This shit is getting meta AF.
different-church-lady
@Major Major Major Major: Dumber than I did yesterday?
Miss Bianca
@Cermet: s’awright. : )
Major Major Major Major
@different-church-lady: Well, that was going to happen to anybody who watched the debate.
Brachiator
@Major Major Major Major: RE: So cuck is tied to racism and misogyny and a whole lot more. As far as I’m concerned, it should be mocked and talked about and brought into the open
I disagree. It’s more that this entire fetish is now out in the open because of Trump’s association with the white supremacist lunatic fringe of the alt right. There are people who don’t know, or pretend that they don’t know the about the term, or who make simplistic assumptions about what it means. This makes it doubly idiotic when someone wants to claim that the word is offensive when its use and meaning is not only varied, but somewhat underground.
mr_gravity
@Brachiator: Thanks for providing some context as I really didn’t know that this was even a thing until wandered into this thread.
George Carlin is still my definitive source for things you should not say: https://youtu.be/kyBH5oNQOS0
different-church-lady
@Major Major Major Major:But I didn’t watch it.
West of the Rockies (been a while)
@singfoom:
I get what you’re saying, but, for me, such verbiage contributes to the collective coarsening of our national dialogue. I’m no Noonan, and I’m not clutching my pearls, but we can do better. I ask myself, is that how Sagan or Cronkite or Barbara Jordan or MLK would phrase things?
As ever, YMMV.
Bill Arnold
@Brachiator:
Have to agree with your defenses. Surprised a bit at the thin skins here.
BTW for those who haven’t seen it, this is interesting if disputable in some ways (warning: breitbart): An Establishment Conservative’s Guide To The Alt-Right
Brachiator
@Major Major Major Major: Okay. If Doug had said that ‘establishment journalists are such bottoms that…’, how would we feel?
Or furries. Or bronies. How PC is fetish lexicon?
different-church-lady
@Brachiator:
Depends on whether you’re a pitcher or a catcher.
(Disclaimer: I don’t actually know what that means.)
Major Major Major Major
@Brachiator: But they’re not saying those. They didn’t choose ‘cuck’ randomly out of a hat full of fetishes. There are reasons, some of which you’ve explicated, that this particular term was chosen, IMO the racial implications and the emasculation. And the single syllable with lots of hard consonants makes it sound like a slur, that’s probably a reason too TBH.
ETA: ‘hat full of fetishes’ reminds me of ‘binders full of women’
Betsy
Can we not use the word “cuck” — it derives its power as an insult from the idea that a man should have a woman to himself and control her sexuality. Please people. We’re against the patriarchy.
Major Major Major Major
@Major Major Major Major: p.s. ‘hat full of fetishes’ reminds me of ‘binders full of women’
Enhanced Voting Techinques
Good god, are any of you aware “cuckold” is a Mediveal term????
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuckold#History_of_the_term
What’s next, “Horray” is anti-semetic?.
Betsy
@singfoom: It’s extremely offensive to women in that it derives its power as an insult from the idea that a man should control a woman’s sexuality (someone who is cuckolded loses “his” woman to another man, or believes that her “bastard” offspring are his).
Control of women’s sexuality and reproductive capacity is the very heart of patriarchal thought, so anyone who aspires to liberal ideas about sexual and gender equality must avoid using the term as an insult.
“Cuck” as an insult relies on AND REINFORCES the patriarchal and sexist idea that men and women have their place; that men’s is to control women’s sexuality, and women’s is to be controlled so she doesn’t humiliate the man who supposedly controls her.
I suppose it would be all right in some cases to use it for its *literal* meaning, perhaps archly or something, but I haven’t really thought that through.
Humdog
@Major Major Major Major: dang it! When I get mad, I don’t notice the irony font. Thanks again for prodding me out of my snit.
But I still think we are better than that word here.
mr_gravity
@Brachiator: I think it works in that context.
The two words I try to avoid are “always” and “never”. It’s good to leave yourself a little wiggle room.
Oooh. Wait. That sounds naughty.
West of the Rockies (been a while)
@hovercraft:
You sure it wasn’t a squirmish? Maybe you’re misunderestimating things….
West of the Rockies (been a while)
@hovercraft: maybe he was trying to give a nod to his virility?
Applejinx
@singfoom:
Context. I too would like Doug not to use ‘cuck’ and I’ll tell you why: it’s not used in a context where it’s like ‘eh, she fucked a few guys, go figure. She says it didn’t work out, anyways she still likes my Man Thunder so what’s the problem? Girl goes out on the tiles sometimes. I love how passionate she is!’
It’s not that. Using ‘cuck’ implies that it’s the obligation of a man to own his woman, and ensure her obedience and faithfulness. It smacks of ‘purity ball’ insanity, and a stew of toxic and antiquated messages. And the problem is not that it’s signaling to women that they’re expected to stay on the reservation and be owned by their men.
The problem is that, as used, it is a shame-signalling device flagging A MAN as not dominant enough. Trying to shame women for not being Stepford Wives is stupid and antiquated, but unless you’re Heidi Cruz it’s just insulting. Women are not property. Blacks are not property. White males are not rightful property owners and have no business behaving as if they are.
BUT, normalizing the idea of ‘cuck’ means normalizing TO white males (or indeed black ones, but hear me out) that they are expected by each other to keep the women obedient and in line, and that failing to do so… being caught with a cuckolding female… is completely disgraceful, perhaps a stain to his honor that cannot be washed away.
And so, they act like controlling fuckheads training human property, and not only must the females be watched closely in case they ‘murder’ unborn sons and heirs also rightfully belonging to the dominant male, but there’s an even more horrifying crime they can commit with those dreadful vaginas. They can commit the cardinal sin, and entice stranger dick!
And so they kill their straying women, because a man cannot be un-cucked and might as well be dead as disgraced so utterly…
Please don’t use ‘cuck’, Doug. This is another man saying it, in case that matters, which it shouldn’t.
Shit matters.
Humdog
@Brachiator: Because I did not include its kink meaning, I am an idiot? Do you notice that it appears to be mainly men on this thread who are saying we should just get used to this term by using it over and over? I suppose you would think it would be a good idea to thicken my skin by calling me “bitch” many times until I become inured to it? What are you adding to the discussion by using this term? The insult that it gives to women is just something we need to suck up?
Are you the poster who loves anyone who punches an Occupy supporter, like the mayor of Sacramento recently did? If so, I will save my breath from here on out.
Brachiator
@Major Major Major Major:
The use of the term, I think, aptly focuses on the anxieties and fetishes of the white supremacist lunatic fringe. But it also clearly makes people here uncomfortable and makes some discussions more fraught than they should be.
Interesting. As Freud said, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. And sometimes a fetish is just a kink.
mr_gravity
@Betsy: Just to clarify a bit: Any word used as an insult is wrong. Sorry if my previous comments suggested otherwise.
MCA1
@bemused: Stamina done got all used up.
Applejinx
@Humdog: No, that’s Botsplainer.
Seriously, other guys: using that word is overly fucked up. Ask yourself, so, this person I am disgracing by the word ‘cuck’: what are they expected to do, in order to restore the loss of male honor I’m impugning? Is the point that they can’t possibly avoid the disgrace (apparently, worst disgrace ever! shame!) or is the point that they’re being stupid for caring about it in the first place? If so, why am I using their word and framing the way they use it?
Too meta to be a good joke or a good insult. Just back away slowly from the ‘cuck’.
Major Major Major Major
@Brachiator: That’s sort of the generic phonetic profile of a slur. Low syllable count, hard sound in the back of the mouth. Fag, n-word, chink, spic, cocksucker even though it has lots of syllables, etc. Obviously lots of slurs that aren’t like that, and lots of words that are like that but aren’t slurs. But if you don’t know for instance what ‘jook joint’ means, it sounds super offensive. So one of the reasons ‘cuck’ caught on is perhaps that it sounds like this.
Dmbeaster
@SenyorDave: There is a far better reply if that dirt bag Trump goes for the Bill infidelity card. And that is for Hillary to look at Trump and say directly, you personally understand this issue, having boasted about cheating on your ex wives. Why do men such as you and Bill do this? Fortunately, we found a way to get past it and fix our marriage, and I am sorry you were unable to do the same.
Kenneth Kohl
@germy: Probably not a good idea for Trump to being up infidelities. I’d love it though…
Major Major Major Major
@Dmbeaster: I think just saying her part and not attacking him personally is probably the best response. You get into the mud too much with Trump and he wins, it’s his element. Plus, you know, it will resonate with actual humans. Let a surrogate attack him that way.
elm
@Enhanced Voting Techinques: I’m also aware that it has been used frequently and more recently with different connotations.
Major Major Major Major
Drudge’s headline right now is MEDICAL MIRACLE: SHE STANDS FOR 90 MINUTES.
So, they got nothin’.
Dmbeaster
@Major Major Major Major: There are no racial overtones with the word, except for the coincidence that the people using it also happen to be racists. It is vile given the sexual origin, and can be used to mock the typical user, but not for one’s own use as occurred here.
@Doug!: Except you did not really make fun of it, and instead made use of it as your own term.
Aleta
@Geoff:
Thanks for that perspective. It made me think about how this belief affects us. Like its use to justify domestic violence in the (twisted) mind of the abuser. (And past use as a defense in court, or to prevent prosecution or reassign blame.)
And Trump retweeting ” “If Hillary Clinton can’t satisfy her husband …” and now threatening to attack her with her husband’s affair
And the belief that losing a girlfriend or boyfriend to someone else, or being cheated on, proves we are defective.
A friend used to tell me about his stepfather who, whenever drunk, would falsely accuse his mother of infidelity and then bellow “I’m a man! I’m a man!” as though the imagined infidelity meant he had to vigorously defend his manhood.
Brachiator
@Humdog:
Let’s get this canard out of the way first. You don’t know me and I don’t think that we have posted comments to each other. I don’t call women (or men) by that word in the real world or in commentary. I certainly have no need or desire to do anything other than communicate to other people in a political forum. I might agree or disagree with your opinion. There is absolutely nothing about your gender or any other aspect of your character that I would ever presume to shape, mold, modify of comment upon. I have tried to be consistent with this as long as I have been online anywhere. You want to retract your slander and apologize?
If you know about the term, why would you exclude its kink meaning?
Actually, I’ve noticed that there are men and women here who are afraid of the word and are both ignorant and afraid of the messiness of fetish, and of the specific fetishes of the white supremacist lunatic fringe.
I have no problem if people do not want to see or use the word “cuck.” I object to the absolute and total lie that the word is “bad” because it seeks to control women or is simplistically an insult to women. In the context of idiot white racist men, it is clearly connected to fantasies about being dominated by women and by black men. This oozes from the sewers of the alt right web sites.
Short answer. No.
I’m the poster who mourns the murder of Nahed Hattar, who was shot in the head for putting an anti-ISIS cartoon on his Jordanian Facebook page. I respect bluntness and blasphemous ideas, especially those that hold racist cockroaches and bigots up to ridicule. That’s why I defend Doug!’s obviously satirical use of words here.
Now let’s talk about puppies!
liberal
@Major Major Major Major:
LOL.
Major Major Major Major
@Dmbeaster: the term has racial overtones as used by the people Doug is appropriating it from.
Mnemosyne
@Brachiator:
I think you’re missing the political context that the neo-Nazis have added to the word “cuck”: it’s not just some random black guy banging your wife, it’s Obama. And she wants what he has more than what you have.
Ignoring that it’s being used by neo-Nazis in that sense right now is like ignoring that they deliberately appropriated Pedro the Frog. They took a word that had another meaning and they appropriated it to use for their political purposes.
liberal
@Brachiator: BUT OMG IT WASN’T OBVIOUSLY SATIRICAL THE SKY IS FALLING!!eleventy!
James E Powell
So, back to last night’s debate.
I didn’t see or hear it. It was doctor’s appointment then quite a wait at the pharmacy then grocery store then a long drive home with REM at maximum volume. Got home about 8:50 PDT. Read twitter feed, read comments here, went to be more or less happy with the whole thing.
Then on the drive in this morning I decide to check out NPR and according to them it was all pretty much a tie, some say Clinton others say Trump and Hey! I got a great idea, let’s give some time to a guy who claims to be independent and fed up with the whole thing and probably not going to vote. I feel like they run that same interview with that same guy after every presidential debate.
BBC News says that “some say” Clinton did “slightly better.” Then I go online and see pretty much the same thing everywhere except here and other similar places.
Are we going to get a one-week turn around like Gore & Bush in 2000? Tuesday morning it was “Man, Bush doesn’t know anything” but by Friday it was, “Gore is such a dick, did you hear him sighing?”
They want a horse race, they want “balance,” but is there any doubt that if Hillary had messed up they would be screaming “Hillary doomed! Trump triumphant!”
What’s with these people?
Major Major Major Major
@liberal: @liberal: I see you have decided to contribute your usual amount of insight.
Steve in the ATL
@Humdog:
This has nothing to do with normalizing a term or inuring people to it. The point is to use the alt-right f/k/a Neo-Nazi’s own term, which they view as a great insult, against them. It’s not being used in any other context or against anyone else.
NorthLeft12
@gogol’s wife: Agree on both counts. There are perfectly good words available to describe the alt-right like bigots, racists, ignoramuses, know nothings, Republicans, etc.
Mnemosyne
@Enhanced Voting Techinques:
And Pedro the Frog was an innocent internet meme until asshole neo-Nazis deliberately decided to ruin the character for everyone by putting him into violent racist artwork.
Same thing here: “cuck” porn has been around for decades (at least), but it’s the neo-Nazis that are applying it to politics and saying that anyone who, say, gets health insurance through Obamacare is letting themselves be “cucked.”
amk
@liberal: Your PC policing of PC policing sounds awfully like donnie dick’s telling like it is bs.
@liberal: True colors. Time to change your nym?
Brachiator
@Major Major Major Major:
Jook joint IS offensive. Ignorant Southern whites would associate it with a place where they might be able to get drunk and have sex with wild black women. Words like jook and jazz (“We jazz June”) have long had sexual connotations in America.
But for black people, a juke joint would have positive connotations of a place where they might socialize and be free of the negative gaze of ignorant honkies. And juke, by the way, is probably derived from a Gullah word, joog. Context is everything.
Your other stuff about “Low syllable count, hard sound in the back of the mouth” is overly simplistic when talking about the history of English, and doesn’t even account for the retention of Anglo Saxon words. “Swive” is not a hard sounding word, but was used as a synonym for fuck in the Canterbury Tales. I’ll give you the low syllable count.
Steve in the ATL
@Brachiator: hell “rock and roll” was a slang term for having sex before white teenagers co-opted it!
Major Major Major Major
@Brachiator: i was talking in overly generalized terms about modern American English and basically mentioned all your objections, but okay.
RaflW
@Iowa Old Lady: This makes sense. It really was sort of thought-experiment for me in whether 1. Trump would be more humiliated by having the debate go ahead without him and loony Johnson as his stand in and 2. show Clinton as tough and unflinching in being willing to show up for all the debates she agreed to.
I think the risks aren’t worth it. Johnson and that other person, the desperate one now “debating” a cassette tape with a pause button, don’t need the validation.
Mnemosyne
@Steve in the ATL:
Honestly, I’m not sure this is a great one to use against them. Particularly for the 4Channers, all it does is give them a woody at the thought that they invented a word that people are using and they aren’t insulted by it at all.
And I think the group that does find it to be an insult is (a) very small, if vocal and (b) never going to vote for a woman president anyway.
Mnemosyne
So, given all of the above, I propose that “cuck” be put into the database of Confusing Confusing Words. If someone uses it, don’t get mad, just cock your head to the side (physically or metaphorically), and say, “I’m not familiar with that word, what does it mean? Yes, but how does it apply here? I’m not offended, I’m just confused. It doesn’t make any sense.”
Guaranteed to drive conservatives up the wall and make them shut up.
elm
@Steve in the ATL: This isn’t using it against the neo-Nazis, but using it merely to refer to the press.
@Brachiator: I’m neither ignorant nor afraid of the messiness of kink. Cuckolding is not a fetish/kink of mine, but I have no problem with people who do participate in that fetish.
However it’s also clearly a fetish about humiliation, degradation, and shame. Those can be wonderful things for people who choose to and want to participate in them, but they are far out of bounds outside of an agreed-to relationship or scene.
There are lots of kinks about humiliation, degradation, and shame. Many of them involve use of language that is thoroughly inappropriate to use without prior agreement.
With respect to the neo-Nazis, I would think it appropriate to use the term “cuck” or “cucked” on them when it appears that one of their idols has humiliated them. E.g. Trump really cucked Stormfront when he changed his mind and supported amnesty! That would be crude, but directing their insult back at them and using all of the power they’ve granted the term and idea against them.
Brachiator
@Mnemosyne:
I am absolutely aware of the racial hysteria in the alt right’s fear and hatred of Obama.
Earlier you had written me a comment about Trump mastering the other Republican pretenders by proving that he was the alpha male. And there were obvious sexual connotations in Trump’s jibes at Rubio, and in his foul assertion that he could make Romney drop to his knees in front of him.
Trump’s blatant and reciprocated love for the white racist lunatic fringe obviously is rooted in the fantasy that Obama would be the ultimate alpha male. One of Trump’s most repellent jabs at Rosie O’Donnell was the claim that he could come over and take Rosie’s companion away. Trump’s deepest fear is that Obama could come over and take Melania away.
The cuck fantasy of controlling women always hides a deeper insecurity that he is ultimately too weak and impotent to ever be attractive to women. The political fear of pathetic white supremacists is that blacks, Latinos, Muslims, Jews and anyone else who is Other must be put in their place, otherwise white women would obviously want to be with more desirable males. And in the frazzled brains of these dopes, Obama has done too much to elevate nonwhites over whites. So, Trump is their savior.
Arclite
Oh, please, PLEASE let him pull out of the remaining debates. Hillary can then hound and mock him as a coward who got beat by a girl and would shrink in the face of aggressive nations and factions worldwide.
NotMax
@Major Major Major Major
This.
100% offensive and 110% unnecessary to drag it into use. See no difference than if he had referred to the First Family (or Ben Carson or Lester Holt or Melissa Harris-Perry, for that matter) as mud people and claimed he was mocking a term used by the virulent and despicable racist right.
@Calouste
Bircher works as well, but may only be identifiable by us olds. Also too, bigot has, sadly, yet to become an obsolete term.
And alt-right is simply an abomination, an attempt to use a microtome to distance a most disreputable and repugnant slice from the rest of the right, as if they are not part and parcel of that political stance,
@Enhanced Voting Techniques
So is sackbut. Fail to see your point.
JR in WV
@Humdog:
I have to agree here… cuck is being used in a disgusting way by despicable people. Racism and sexism are both part and parcel of the nasty package, along with ugly personal power politics I don’t know how to capture in a single word. So don’t use it unless you also intend to use every other hurtful slur in the hurting others handbook: “How to hurt friends and damage family” by D Trump.
Everyone can be a target, I make fun of conservatives, because they’re ridiculous on the face of it. Trump!! Amirite?
Geoff
@Aleta: Exactly. That you for putting that into a broader cross-gender context so eloquently.
3am
man, glad you are back and posting even if the circumstances are less than ideal. style points for specials reference.
No One You Know
@Humdog: And it’s an ugly, crude expression that recalls several vile associations at once.
Why would anyone want to shit where they eat?
Dump the garbage language in the places you found it, please. Not here.