Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Their freedom requires your slavery.

A thin legal pretext to veneer over their personal religious and political desires

They’re not red states to be hated; they are voter suppression states to be fixed.

We are aware of all internet traditions.

It may be funny to you motherfucker, but it’s not funny to me.

Russian mouthpiece, go fuck yourself.

… pundit janitors mopping up after the GOP

The words do not have to be perfect.

Usually wrong but never in doubt

“Jesus paying for the sins of everyone is an insult to those who paid for their own sins.”

The GOP couldn’t organize an orgy in a whorehouse with a fist full of 50s.

When I decide to be condescending, you won’t have to dream up a fantasy about it.

Fuck these fucking interesting times.

Perhaps you mistook them for somebody who gives a damn.

We still have time to mess this up!

fuckem (in honor of the late great efgoldman)

Wow, you are pre-disappointed. How surprising.

The willow is too close to the house.

Hot air and ill-informed banter

Speaking of republicans, is there a way for a political party to declare intellectual bankruptcy?

Make the republican party small enough to drown in a bathtub.

We cannot abandon the truth and remain a free nation.

Not so fun when the rabbit gets the gun, is it?

Whoever he was, that guy was nuts.

You are here: Home / Open Threads / Because of wow. / Popcorn and incentive structures

Popcorn and incentive structures

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First as a teaser:

Secondly how in the world did the Republican establishment fuck up so badly? I have some odd connections to Republican million dollar donors and bundlers and I know they shovelled tens of millions of dollars to Right to Rise and other places. All of the reporting that has hit Trump hard was either digging out tapes or reporters doing the hard grunt work of reading through tax returns, cross referencing things and pulling the string. It is not the political dark arts. Sticking a couple of College Republicans on “Listen to Howard Stern” and “consume Playboy archives” duty would have paid off massively in the Fall of 2015. And that could have been done with minimal fingerprints.

Finally, there is chatter that the RNC is trying to force Trump out. I want to highlight a post from early August after the Khan implosion:

He does not care about the House, he does not care about the Senate. He does not care about policy outcomes. He has a very limited shadow of the future and a very narrow give a fuck space that barely intersects with Republican insider give a damn space.

What is the gain for Trump to step aside? His brand is underwater as his name is currently toxic. If he is to step aside, his brand (and his ego) won’t recover quickly. His best chance of re-establishing his brand (and his ego) is to double down and win. If he wins the White House in November even if there are 98 Democrats in the Senate and 431 Democrats in the House, he won, and the Republican establishment are full of losers. His brand would take off and he could make odd speeches at golf courses while Mike Pence attempts to govern.

If he steps aside, the party insiders are better off, but his brand is shit and his ego is bruised as he would be the loser genuflecting to the wills of the loses that he beat in the primary process.

Has that changed at all?

Oh yeah, fourth point, Orville Redenbache has to be making a killing as we’re all passing the popcorn.

Reader Interactions

88Comments

  4. 4.

    Corner Stone

    Secondly how in the world did the Republican establishment fuck up so badly?

    They need all the people who are still absurdly on Trump’s side right now. From the beginning until today.
    They could not dare piss them off or they would never have even a start at a shot at winning in Nov. Remember, “Please clap” ? That was it. It was all over before that but that was the loud gong for the R establishment.

  6. 6.

    redshirt

    @Baud: But when he loses his brand as it is now is toast.

    He’s going to have to rebrand and grift the wingnut welfare circuit. Good money, to be sure, but not YUGE.

  8. 8.

    Elizabelle

    Wasn’t he allegedly in this more for starting a new Trump TV venture? (Along with the campaign event grifting.) How’s that working out for him?

    ETA: And how lucky for him his media advisor/purported partner got forced out for gross sexual behavior on his own. Classy Roger Ailes. It’s the Grope and Grab Network.

  10. 10.

    Mark B

    This has definitely revealed the incompetence of Republican campaign operatives. After years of taking a few words out of context from public speeches to form talking points, they’ve completely given up on the hard work of actually researching and digging into the background of their opponents. They’ve become fat and lazy.

  11. 11.

    Gvg

    Is Orville actually still alive?
    Somehow I think this relates to Citizens United and millionaires thinking each one of them could buy the election when what really happened is the money disguised the lack of voters who agreed with them.
    There is also something about too many people not realizing you always have to compromise to get anything you want in a democracy. I gather school reform eliminated civics courses a generation ago. Looking back I actually learned something in those courses like Americanism vrs Comunism which I thought was fluff then.

  12. 12.

    gf120581

    @Elizabelle: Not sure, but I hope it comes to fruition, if only because of the havoc it could wreak on Fox News. Half their people (especially the likes of Hannity) could bolt to Trump’s thing.

  15. 15.

    redshirt

    I’ve been trying to figure out how Trump could win this. Let’s use the 2012 election as the baseline.

    How can Trump do better than Romney?
    More white guys voting who did not vote for Romney
    Less African-Americans voting for Clinton(?)
    Russian hackers.

    How can Hillary do better than Obama?
    Lower republican turnout or at least less voting for Trump
    More Hispanic votes
    More republican women votes
    More white racist votes (those who wouldn’t vote for O because of skin color)

    Those seem to be the only areas where they could be change.

    Am I missing anything? If not, the ONLY way Trump can win is if there is a large group of whites who didn’t vote in 2012 but do in 2016. And I mean very large.

    Seems seriously unrealistic.

  16. 16.

    Baud

    @Mark B:

    After years of taking a few words out of context from public speeches to form talking points

    You didn’t build that!

    They built their entire convention around it!

  19. 19.

    jl

    Hard to believe, but read that some Trumpers were pissed that he gave his BS non-apology. And saw some tweets, or comments, on this very blog yesterday, from toxic zone of social media calling Trump a ‘cuck’. Strikes as odd, since his previous little dance steps to pivot out of hateful and butt stupid primary promises and statements were forgiven on grounds that ‘he has to do that for the general’.

    For some Trumpers, hearing their hero his very self, brag about how great it is to assault people and get away with it hit a nerve. Got to the core of some very deep impulse (don’t want to call it a ‘value’). And any backing down is betrayal. Probably not all of them want to assault women. Some are thinking of Hispanics, especially Mexicans, others Muslims and Arabs, others ‘The Blacks’ (all of whom would love Donald, if only he could get his message out). Oh yeah, the Jews, of course. Some commenter yesterday said Trump shouldn’t apologize, from a purely selfish political angle, since it was lose lose. Will win no one, and will enrage his base. That commenter was on to something, I think.

    I remember talk that Trump was busy scheming using campaign moolah and connections for a wingnut media career if his campaign tanked. Well, time to focus on plan B then. More he caves or goes RINO, more he backs away from committing assault on people when it feels good, worse for is future wingnut media empire.

  23. 23.

    raven

    On September 19, 1995, Redenbacher was found dead in the Jacuzzi of his condominium in Coronado, California. He had suffered a heart attack and drowned.[1] He was cremated and his ashes scattered at sea.[

  24. 24.

    Mandalay

    Libertarian Party VP nominee Bill Weld just told CNN that he opposes his party’s positions on gay rights, abortion and prostitution. WTF???

    The Clinton campaign might be able to get a lot of bang for the buck by having targeted ads showing that Weld and Johnson are complete con artists.

  25. 25.

    hovercraft

    @gf120581:
    I read somewhere that BillO and Hannity have clauses to get out of their contracts if Ailes leaves/left, but if IIRC when Greta left they said something about a window during which they had to exercise that option. And then Roger has a no compete clause in his severance package, so he’d have to remain in the same type of capacity that he has right now with the Trump campaign, as a “friend”.

  26. 26.

    Bill E Pilgrim

    I love how Republicans puff themselves up and act like it’s a badge of honor to withdraw support now, as if their “support” or lack of changes anything at this point. He’s on the ballot, hundreds of thousands of ballots have been filled out, mailed overseas, etc.

    They enabled this by denying for years and years that the party was spiraling off into the extreme right or extreme white or whatever you’d call where it is, always with the “Oh don’t be silly both sides have their extremes” and now that that kind of denial and propagandizing helped lead to this, they want to get credit for standing up in the last ten seconds when it basically means zilch to anything other than their attempt to save face.

  27. 27.

    Mark B

    @Mandalay: I think you just ignore them. They are doing a good job talking themselves into oblivion. No need to provide them any visibility at all.

  30. 30.

    Mark B

    @Bill E Pilgrim: They were perfectly OK with the sexism and racism and White Nationalism that he based his campaign on from the beginning. But he gets caught saying ‘pussy’ and it’s Katy bar the door, they’re out of there. It doesn’t make me respect them at all.

  31. 31.

    gene108

    I think part of it is Republicans have a huge media apparatus to do the mud slinging fot them against Democrats.

    A Democatic misstatement can be blown out of proportion for weeks by the right-wing media.

    When they all had to run against each other, the right-wing media could not overtly take he side of any single candidate.

    They had no effective means of oppo research at their disposal.

    Plus, in the post-CU world, Republican candidates can count a ton of ads against their opponent, in any competitive race, so they do not have to do much mudslinging on their own.

  35. 35.

    hovercraft

    @redshirt:

    How can Trump do better than Romney?
    More white guys voting who did not vote for Romney
    He’s doing better with white non college, but worse with educated.
    Less African-Americans voting for Clinton(?)
    Possible, but the Obama’s will do their all they can to prevent this.
    Russian hackers.
    The voting machines are not online so cannot be hacked.

    How can Hillary do better than Obama?
    Lower republican turnout or at least less voting for Trump
    Trump is working on that as we speak.
    More Hispanic votes
    He’s taking care of this too.
    More republican women votes
    This is where you probably have some lying to pollsters and their husbands.
    More white racist votes (those who wouldn’t vote for O because of skin color)

  36. 36.

    mainmata

    @Corner Stone: Absent the Trump base, the entire GOP consists of several thousand millionaire/billionaires, their courtiers and and random number of pols and right-wing ideologues; not enough to constitute an actual political party. Oh and the pols that are so piously denouncing Trump just don’t like the way he is trashing their brand, not disagreeing with his views.

  37. 37.

    Mandalay

    @Bill E Pilgrim:

    I love how Republicans puff themselves up and act like it’s a badge of honor to withdraw support now

    Yep, Condoleezza Rice being a prime example. Trump has been spouting reckless lunacy for over a year on foreign policy and she said nothing. And now she loftily proclaims that “As a Republican, I hope to support someone who has the dignity and stature to run for the highest office in the greatest democracy on earth”, as though Trump’s real dignity and stature only became visible in the “locker room banter” video.

    Rice is teflon-coated, but she is still a worthless piece of shit, and an Uncle Tom.

  38. 38.

    Prescott Cactus

    @RK: I wonder if another shoe will fall before the debate? TKO before the fight begins.

    Like playing bridge, you’ve got to know when to hold your Trump and when to play your Trump.

  39. 39.

    Hal

    @Mnemosyne: Dying laughing.

    Being on the elevator when somebody shouts “Hold the door!”

    No schadenfreude!
    Fuck you lady, that’s what stairs are for

  41. 41.

    gene108

    @Mark B:

    I think it is more that he and Billy Bush were talking about destroying the honor of a white girl, who the right-wingers could not off handedly dismiss as a slut-whore-feminazi.

    I think that’s when they made the connection the “pu$$y” in question could be someone they know.

  42. 42.

    Darrin Ziliak (formerly glocksman)

    @gene108:

    Plus, in the post-CU world, Republican candidates can count a ton of ads against their opponent, in any competitive race, so they do not have to do much mudslinging on their own.

    Then why didn’t the anti-Trump super PAC’s do any real oppo research?
    Given the sheer amount of money they figuratively set on fire during the primaries, paying several interns $75/hr to listen to old Stern episodes and watch ‘Apprentice’ outtakes would have cost nothing by way of comparison.

  43. 43.

    Corner Stone

    @Mandalay:

    Yep, Condoleezza Rice being a prime example. Trump has been spouting reckless lunacy for over a year on foreign policy and she said nothing. And now she loftily proclaims that “As a Republican, I hope to support someone who has the dignity and stature to run for the highest office in the greatest democracy on earth”

    He was chief birther for five fucking years. This was her bridge to speak out? Ha, but sad. So sad for her.

  46. 46.

    Corner Stone

    @Darrin Ziliak (formerly glocksman): Literally every single person in the R establishment knew he was a racist, bigot, misogynist.
    That was fine with them. They were scared to call him on it because they knew his policies and beliefs were what the base also believed.
    That’s what all this farce now is all about. Everyone knew.

  47. 47.

    Zach

    I’m 99% sure trump’s publically refusing to quit and privately working out a deal to pocket ~$10-100M from whichever GOP moneybags thinks they can use this chaos to buy a President.

  49. 49.

    amk

    Could it be that after a year of 24×7 verbal abuse from deadbeat donnie dick, the gopee ‘establishment’ is finally striking back?

    Nah, they are too fucking corrupt and craven cowards to do that.

  50. 50.

    gene108

    @Darrin Ziliak (formerly glocksman):

    My best guess is they wanted the Trump voters, who were drawn to him from the start. Therefore, they did not want to slam Trump too hard.

    My second guess is they all had their own skeletons in their closets that they did not want others poking around in. Therefore, they went easy on each other, so no one would take offense and bring out the long knives.

    I mean none of the Deep Bench went very negative on each other in the early going, when Trump and others were vulnerable, to narrow the field.

  52. 52.

    RepubAnon

    @gene108: Sure, but where were the Republican attack-PACs? Were they all so consumed with wondering whether Hillary’s e-mail server had a Sharia operating system that they had no time to find and leak opposition research on Trump to the press? Or was it that they didn’t realize the threat until too late – or thought he could win?

  53. 53.

    ? Martin

    Secondly how in the world did the Republican establishment fuck up so badly?

    Hillary Clinton was worse than Hitler. I’m sure most of these guys are dumbfounded how this video could be seen as worse than Vince Foster and Benghazi.

    That’s the problem with living in your own bullshit reality for 25 years.

  55. 55.

    PPCLI

    @Iowa Old Lady: I dare say that they have learned a thing or two about the power of well-timed leaks after years of playing defence against the Arkansas project, and the American Spectator, and legions of private detectives funded by Richard Mellon Scaife, and Ken Starr and his legions of hungry Federalist Society wolves, right down to today a dozen corrupt House committees, and Freedom Works.

    Nice to see that they are getting a chance to use all that painfully acquired knowledge.

  56. 56.

    Annie

    I don’t think Trump will quit the race. Some weeks ago Jamelle Bouie wrote that somebody loses the Presidential election every four years but no candidate has ever quit. I also think Trump’s deluded enough to believe he’ll win.

  57. 57.

    amk

    now, ted crud considering withdrawing his ‘endorsement’. ted, the god botherer, always late to the party.

  58. 58.

    ? Martin

    @Iowa Old Lady:

    I don’t know how much of this comes from the Clinton campaign, but if they’re behind it, I am in awe at how thoroughly they’re crushing him.

    All of it. Look at the constant set-up. Clinton in the first debate, with 2 interviews with Alicia Machado already done by media outlets ready to drop. She set him up on the tax question saying ‘may not have paid any federal taxes’ and then 2 days out from the VP debate the tax returns drop. Then Kaine is constantly baiting Pence into denying that Trump said any untoward thing about women, and 2 days out from the 2nd debate this tape comes out. Not only does it hurt Trump, but it completely wrecks Pence at the same time, making him look like Trump’s enabler. I’m willing to bet she baits Trump into yet another fuck-up tomorrow night.

    This is like a West Wing script.

  60. 60.

    PPCLI

    @? Martin: Quite so. These are people who agree with Sarah Palin’s complaint that McCain would have won if he would have just allowed Palin to talk about Reverend Wright 24/7.

  64. 64.

    SuzieC

    My theory is that a very ugly racist remark , caught on tape, is about to drop. Last week was sexist week and we are about to experience racist week.

  69. 69.

    gene108

    @RepubAnon:

    1. They all had skeletons. None of them were aggressive with each other. No one brought up Christie’s closure of the GWB. No one hammered Carly for running HP into the ground.

    They were all in glass houses, and no one wanted to throw the first stone.

    2. All of their policy plans rested on the same wishful thinking as Trump’s plan to have Mexico pay for the wall. They really could not challenge him on substance. Hillary can. She has well thought out plans.

    Therefore, if Republicans were throwing old Howard Stern interviews at him, he’d just brush them off as the desperate tactics of people who have no plan, which is basically what he did, when they brought up the bankruptcies or his comments about women’s looks.

    3. This is a death of a thousand cuts, from the Megyn Kelly bleeding from her wherever comment to the Alicia Machado comments, the nasty stuff Trump says has built up, so it is hard to treat any one comment as just an isolated incident and not part of a broader pattern.

  70. 70.

    catclub

    @Zach:

    working out a deal to pocket ~$10-100M from whichever GOP moneybags

    The money will not be there. Who wants to be the only sucker to contribute – when you KNOW there are other guys who should have paid as well. Result – nobody pays. It does not happen.

  72. 72.

    catclub

    @gene108:

    so it is hard to treat any one comment as just an isolated incident and not part of a broader pattern.

    The Clinton campaign focusing on his misogyny with girls looking at themselves and his words, is either genius or luck … or foreknowledge!

  74. 74.

    SFAW

    @SuzieC:

    My theory is that a very ugly racist remark , caught on tape, is about to drop.

    Doubtful. That would only cause all the apostates to come running back to him with open arms (or on bended knee, or hat in hand, or whatever).

  75. 75.

    SFAW

    @redshirt:

    13 handicap don’t suck.

    Compared to Trump’s it does. His is the best. And yuge, like 100, maybe 200. And more is always better, right?

  86. 86.

    WaterGirl

    @Omnes Omnibus: @Omnes Omnibus: I did read somewhere that Obama practiced bowling a bit after his terrible showing as a bowler during the run-un to the election in 2008. I don’t think he’s GOOD, but I suspect we wouldn’t see a bunch of gutter balls if we saw him bowl again.

    I’m just happy knowing that there’s one thing in the world that he apparently had no aptitude for. :-)

  88. 88.

    WaterGirl

    @Omnes Omnibus: I just found it charming that he wasn’t good at it but he was still a good sport about it.

    I don’t like bowling, either. I bowled with a group of friends in high school and everyone thought I was high. (I was not.) I bowled my first game at the age of 5 or 6, and my score was 9. That might have been the most fun I ever had bowling.

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