Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

The party of Reagan has become the party of Putin.

Republicans are radicals, not conservatives.

Dear media: perhaps we ought to let Donald Trump speak for himself!

Fight them, without becoming them!

They think we are photo bombing their nice little lives.

We are builders in a constant struggle with destroyers. let’s win this.

A thin legal pretext to veneer over their personal religious and political desires.

Narcissists are always shocked to discover other people have agency.

Their boy Ron is an empty plastic cup that will never know pudding.

It’s a good piece. click on over. but then come back!!

Do not shrug your shoulders and accept the normalization of untruths.

Schmidt just says fuck it, opens a tea shop.

I know this must be bad for Joe Biden, I just don’t know how.

A lot of Dems talk about what the media tells them to talk about. Not helpful.

Don’t expect peaches from an apple tree.

No Justins, No Peace

with the Kraken taking a plea, the Cheese stands alone.

No one could have predicted…

Donald Trump, welcome to your everything, everywhere, all at once.

Technically true, but collectively nonsense

Republicans do not pay their debts.

DeSantis transforming Florida into 1930s Germany with gators and theme parks.

I desperately hope that, yet again, I am wrong.

I like you, you’re my kind of trouble.

You are here: Home / Elections / Election 2016 / Tuesday Morning Open Thread: One Day At A Time

Tuesday Morning Open Thread: One Day At A Time

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218Comments

  1. 1.

    TS

    g.d. Morning Joke still attacking Hillary and talking up Trump – what does Trump have on him?

    So MJ is now reliving the Clinton years and blaming Hillary for everything her husband did

  2. 2.

    gf120581

    @TS: Joe’s still in the denial stage of grief.

    Republicans are now facing the distinct possibility that Trump may cost them everything. It leads to palpable desperation.

  5. 5.

    TS

    @gf120581: It’s time he and Mark Halperin were taken out washed down and hung up to dry. As for the woman who sits next to him – she is enabling this hate to go on and on and on.

  8. 8.

    Keith G

    I was dismayed that Ruth Bader Ginsburg felt the need to add a final tag onto a discussion about the protests that started in the NFL:

    “Would I arrest them for doing it? No,” Ginsburg said in a Yahoo interview with Katie Couric. “I think it’s dumb and disrespectful. I would have the same answer if you asked me about flag burning. I think it’s a terrible thing to do, but I wouldn’t lock a person up for doing it. I would point out how ridiculous it seems to me to do such an act.”

    As rebukes go, it was quite mild, but it was totally unnecessary. It may seem ridiculous to a quite elderly upper-status white woman, but to others it seems totally relevant and important.

  9. 9.

    Kay

    I think Clinton is doing great and she’s up in Ohio by the same margin every Democrat wins Ohio (if they win) but crowd sizes have absolutely nothing to do with “voting”.

    I was at an Ohio State rally where Obama appeared in 2010. Huge crowd. You all know how that turned out. I sat next to this lovely young family who where basically there for a picnic :)

    Also- see: Bernie Sanders and Donald Trump.

  11. 11.

    amk

    @Mike E: Given that they lost the house, the senate and then gave the thugs a brutal house majority in the last 6 years, yes, the dem voters are a problem.

  14. 14.

    NorthLeft12

    This disconnect between the hard core Republicans and virtually the rest of your country [and possibly reality] is the single biggest issue that you have going forward.
    I am not sure how this gets fixed, and I would completely reject any pandering or significant compromising to bring these doom and gloomers on board. Hopefully time will heal this wound.

  15. 15.

    Kay

    @PsiFighter37:

    I listen to him on the radio sometimes. He’s been doing “the case against Donald Trump” for months. It’s well-argued. He starts with some broad category of conservative belief- “abortion”, say, and then quotes Trump and lays out why Trump isn’t a conservative.

  19. 19.

    Joe Falco

    Last week, the ACC decided to move its collegiate tennis tournament from North Carolina to my neck of the woods in Rome, Georgia because of the transgender bathroom idiocy the state Repubs inflicted on themselves. This just as Rome’s brand new tennis center opened earlier in the year.

    So carry on, NC Repubs! Your loss is already my gain even before voters will hopefully toss your hateful keisters to the streets in a few weeks.

  20. 20.

    Kay

    @amk:

    The reason it’s good as a practical matter is they can collect young peoples contact info for GOTV. Obviously they can fake that, though, young people, and some of them do.

    My sense was the young families there in 2010 (there were a lot of them) were taking their kids to see the President, which is nice.

  22. 22.

    Kay

    @NorthLeft12:

    It’s a vicious cycle though, because the Republican leadership gets the Republican base fired up by lying to them and then the Republican leadership can’t deliver on the lies, so the base gets furious and rejects leadership.

    They told them they would eradicate Obamacare, indict Eric Holder, impeach Obama- they told them Romney was winning- it goes on and on. Their base believed it. I heard over and over in 2012 that Obama was “toast”, and this was from people like county chairs. To change this they’d have to stop lying and they’d have to clean out the huge number of grifters and frauds who are making piles of money off this.

  25. 25.

    bemused

    @NorthLeft12:

    There’s been a huge disconnect between far right Republicans and everyone else country wide for a long time. Locally, wingnuts live in the same bubble consuming only far right wing media, mainly associating socially with their own tribe because liberals are unpatriotic, immoral and will give them socialist cooties. They have self isolated themselves to the point that they truly believe they and their views are the majority in their communities.

  26. 26.

    Kay

    @NorthLeft12:

    They don’t have anything else. Newt Gingrich is replaying the script. He’s saying the country ends if Clinton is elected.

    This is Newt Gingrich’s occupation-he lies to the GOP base. This is what he he does for a living. They can’t get rid of these people. They’re the pillars this rotten structure is built on.

  27. 27.

    Betty Cracker

    @Keith G: While I think the assertion I’ve seen made in many places online (not from you) that disapproval of CK’s anthem protests = racism is bullshit, I agree with your implication that it comes from a place of privilege and is probably therefore best left unsaid. In a similar way, men are entitled to disapprove of my actions on behalf of feminism. But I’d be lying if I said my reaction to that was anything other than “fuck their opinions.”

  29. 29.

    Baud

    @Kay:

    It’s a vicious cycle though, because the Republican leadership gets the Republican base fired up by lying to them and then the Republican leadership can’t deliver on the lies, so the base gets furious and rejects leadership.

    Need more lies.

  35. 35.

    Kay

    @Keith G:

    It’s really common among older Democrats, though. They’re offended by what they consider bad behavior around patriotic symbols. I was at a state Party meeting once- huge room-people from all over the state- and one of the speakers mentioned Clinton’s flag burning thing and most people stood up and clapped. The vast majority. My sense here is they feel they have been demonized for being unpatriotic because they’re Democrats so they really go for these rah-rah America things. It’s akin to how older Democrats feel they have to tell me they would never get an abortion. It’s defensive. It’s a response to how the Right portrays Democrats.

  36. 36.

    rikyrah

    @Keith G:
    What did Jessie Williams say?
    If you are not a part of the struggle for Black liberation, then do not lecture those who are. Sit down.

    Yeah, this applies to RBG.

  37. 37.

    rikyrah

    @Kay:
    But, their version of patriotism is White washed bullshyt.
    They don’t seem to have a problem with what CK is protesting, but are offended by the peaceful protest?
    Phuck outta here.

  41. 41.

    Pest Bog Mummy, Frakensteinbeck

    @Kay:
    I will note that this is bottom-up, not top-down. You’ve seen what happens when Ryan tried to walk away from Trump. Or what happened in 2009 when people like McConnell and Rove tried to say Rush goes too far. The voting core of the GOP demands this insanity, becomes furious if they don’t get it, and rejects politicians who try to put on the brakes in favor of politicians who either cynically pander to them or are believers themselves – and there are a looooot of those, or politicians on the edge who, say, don’t think Obama is a foreign Muslim, but do think he hates America and all things American and it’s basically the same thing so why not encourage the crowd?

    @Baud:
    They always were. One of the media’s favorite myths is that there is this huge pool of independent, nonpartisan voters who understand that there’s no real difference between the parties and are the wisest and most noble voters of all. They’re free-thinking heartland Real Americans. It comes straight out of their ‘both sides do it but Democrats are worse’ mentality, ties tightly to their horse racing, and note how they absolutely slobbered over the idea that the Tea Party represented a huge grassroots movement of these noble independents rising up for better government.

  42. 42.

    Kay

    @rikyrah:

    I agree. I’m immediately suspicious of people who say they support “the cause” but not the tactic because it seems like nothing is “acceptable”. This protest to me is the essence of respectful political speech. It doesn’t get any better.

    I really admire the high school players. That takes courage.

  43. 43.

    TS

    @rikyrah:

    They don’t seem to have a problem with what CK is protesting, but are offended by the peaceful protest?

    But when the protesters take to the streets “they” tell them they don’t have a problem with what they are protesting – but do it peacefully. There is NO type of protest that is acceptable to “them” if it relates to inequality and racism. If, however, you are protesting against immigration or for Donald Trump – anything goes.

  50. 50.

    NorthLeft12

    @Kay: I agree with you about the leaders, they are irredeemable. I am thinking more about the base, or a good chunk of it. If evidence, that the economy and life in general is getting better, becomes overwhelming then some of the base will come around and at least be open to compromise.
    Those leaders [Ryan, McConnell, Cruz, Cotton, Gingrich, etc.] must be marginalized and bypassed to allow a new leadership to take over who might actually be open to compromise and improving the state of the country. Maybe? A fella can dream, can’t he?

  51. 51.

    Botsplainer

    Is this what passing through Peak Wingnut feels like, when Glenn Beck says something rational?

    Have we passed the wingularity?

  52. 52.

    aimai

    @Kay: Right. I’m not personally opposed to flag burning or desecration at all–but like a lot of other Democrats I want to reclaim the idea/image of patriotism and reclaim the flag–just like I want to reclaim the constitution–from the right wing. So although I see why some people may rightly feel like they want to use the flag (or the constitution) to highlight their political issue or their grievance I also dont think that a hard fought presidential campaign is the place to, essentially, try to split the democratic coalition by making people choose sides w/r/t to a highly contested image, in public, while we are fighting for our lives. Does that make sense? Other times of the year I would feel differently. But right now? No, certain protests are counterproductive when we are attempting an all out mobilization of the entire “not trump” citizenry to defeat Trump. Anything that conduces to unity: I’m all for it. Anything that fractures the coalition, like grievance hunting or attacks on other allies, is a bad idea.

    ETA: my apologies. The protest was peaceful and no destructive so my points were entirely out of line. I haven’t actually seen or read anything other than the comment thread here.

  53. 53.

    Kay

    @Baud:

    Older Democrats are sometimes more defensive because they came up in a time when conservatism was king. I used to feel so bad during the Bush years when Democrats would tell me they had children in the military when the douchebags were all calling them traitors. This got to them. They were defending.

  54. 54.

    Pest Bog Mummy, Frakensteinbeck

    @BillinGlendaleCA:
    But the pundits saw previously apolitical Americans rising up in an honest demonstration of America being a center-right nation that would be governed smoothly if Obama would just stop being so extreme, which of course was the reason Republicans became so extreme.

    EDIT – @NorthLeft12:

    If evidence, that the economy and life in general is getting better, becomes overwhelming then some of the base will come around and at least be open to compromise.

    Not a lot. Racism doesn’t track with the ups and downs of the economy, and flourishes among the economically secure and in times of plenty (for the racists). It tracks with perceived threats to the status of the dominant race.

  56. 56.

    Gindy51

    @NorthLeft12: I don’t know about that. In my hood (rural SE IN) the ones who are supporting Trump are doing VERY well. New additions to houses, nice cars in the garages, kids in new clothes. His supporters here are in no way doing badly economically.

  58. 58.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @NorthLeft12:

    If evidence, that the economy and life in general is getting better, becomes overwhelming then some of the base will come around and at least be open to compromise.

    You don’t watch much FOX news, read much Red State, or listen to much Limbaugh, do you?

  59. 59.

    Kay

    Donald J. TrumpVerified account
    ‏@realDonaldTrump
    Desite winning the second debate in a landslide (every poll), it is hard to do well when Paul Ryan and others give zero support!

    My middle son is working with a Christian conservative on a construction crew. They have to ride 40 miles together there and back to the site and my son is really quiet so this must be a monologue, the poor thing.

    Anyway, this guy believes Clinton and Trump conspired to destroy the GOP.

  60. 60.

    OzarkHillbilly

    The “Donald ” sandwich:

    on white bread
    full of baloney
    covered with Russian dressing, and
    served with a small pickle.

    (you guys probably already seen this, I’m just a little behind)

  61. 61.

    JPL

    @Kay: Since the GOP preaches personal responsibility, it seems to me that they are perfectly fine, destroying themselves.

  62. 62.

    p.a.

    “Come and see the violence inherent in the system.”

    I think there could be ‘incidents’ at polling places this election, hope I’m wrong, hope they don’t go beyond a description as ‘incidents’, but the Dumpsterfire candidate is fanning flames his party set years ago about voter fraud.

    The other violence I’m curious about is Trumptard/Teatard violence against their ‘betrayers’ in the RepubServative movement who dump Trump. These idiots formulated the ideas, nurtured the suckers who believe the ideas, live off them, and now have to answer to them. Think they may be under more threat than Dems at polling places. I seem to be dehydrated; can’t summon up a tear for them.

  63. 63.

    D58826

    The latest on the Trump-Putin connection :

    Over at Newsweek, Kurt Eichenwald is livid over Trump reading a Russian disinformation report which manipulated one of his articles and questions how it got into Trump’s hands:

    This false story was only reported by the Russian controlled agency (a reference appeared in a Turkish publication, but it was nothing but a link to the Sputnik article). So how did Donald Trump end up advancing the same falsehood put out by Putin’s mouthpiece […]

    For now, though, Americans should be outraged. This totalitarian regime, engaged in what are arguably war crimes in Syria to protect their government puppet, is working to upend a democracy to the benefit of an American candidate who uttered positive comments just Sunday about the Kremlin’s campaign on behalf of Bashar al-Assad. Trump’s arguments were an incomprehensible explication of the complex Syrian situation, which put him right on the side of the Iranians and Syrian,s who are fighting to preserve the government that is the primary conduit of weapons used against Israel.

    So no, Mr. Putin, I’m not Sidney Blumenthal. And now that you have been exposed once again, get the hell out of our election. And Mr. Trump—you have some explaining to do

    http://www.newsweek.com/vladimir-putin-sidney-blumenthal-hillary-clinton-donald-trump-benghazi-sputnik-508635

  64. 64.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    @Pest Bog Mummy, Frakensteinbeck:

    if Obama would just stop being so extreme, which of course was the reason Republicans became so extreme.

    If he would have just had The Turtle and The Granny Starver over for drinks at the White House, everything in Washington would be great.

  65. 65.

    JMG

    Kay, of course you are right that crowd size means nothing, but since nobody ever reports on Clinton voters, shows of enthusiasm might generate stories and contribute a little to a bandwagon effect.

  66. 66.

    Van Buren

    @TS: No acceptable method of protest has been SOP since Frederick Douglas.
    I think it’s pretty clear that it’s not the method but the goal that upsets them

  67. 67.

    MomSense

    Oh my god Morning Joe just went nuts acting like he learned for the first time that Medicare can’t negotiate pharmaceutical prices. His GOP has blocked this every single time.

    When he voted for the W admin Medicare plan it specifically prevented Medicare from negotiating pharma prices.

    Is he being stupid now or was he stupid then when he was voting on this issue?

  68. 68.

    Botsplainer

    @Kay:

    Post election, it will take about 6 to 12 months for the Great Trump Brand Collapse to become evident. This will come about due to litigation losses, the NY charity investigation, IRS action and FEC investigations and fines. Once it becomes apparent that his asshole stereotype lawyers are impotent to enforce those NDAs (and likely stand down for nonpayment), the stories are going to firehose out like those at a five alarm blaze.

    By the time it is done, Bernie Madoff will have a better Q score than any Trump. This bring my dream of a smallish Trump family filled shitty 3 bedroom condo outside Ocala closer to reality. I want to see single mom Ivanka standing a counter at a GAP outlet, while the boys do landscaping work outside at the shitty strip outlet mall. I want Melania and Barron to have a better life with her nicer, actually wealthy new lover in the south of France, while Donald sits in the condo in a dirty tshirt watching Apprentice reruns and shouting at the TV…

  70. 70.

    Kay

    Trump Video is NOT “immaterial” in deciding who to vote for, Christie says. “I was really disturbed and embarrassed for him and his family.”

    But not the woman or women they’re speaking about. This is a way of thinking about women, where they have no independent personhood. They only exist in relation to men and “families”. They can’t fix it on the Right because they’re not even aware of it.

    You see the same thing in the state laws on abortion. The woman disappears. She’s gone. It’s downright eerie.

  72. 72.

    JPL

    @D58826: Adam had a post last night about the new information. link
    If he has time, he’ll write further about Russia, today.
    Eichenwald was on CNN earlier, and it seems unlikely that Trump or someone on the campaign just happened on the information.

  75. 75.

    MomSense

    @rikyrah:

    Good advice! BTW did you see the humanity for Hillary Pantsuit Power video? Near the end of the dance half the dancers get on one knee while the other half stand with their hands in their hearts and then they switch. The choreographer said this was a tribute to Kaepernick. It’s such a beautiful moment in the dance and it makes me happy that it was a tribute.

  76. 76.

    TS

    @MomSense:

    Oh my god Morning Joe just went nuts acting like he learned for the first time that Medicare can’t negotiate pharmaceutical prices. His GOP has blocked this every single time.

    You have just made me consider the obvious in relation to MJ being virtually the ONLY pundit show to endorse Trump’s attacks via reliving the Clinton stories of the 1990s – He is perhaps not entirely sane about anything.

  77. 77.

    O. Felix Culpa

    For Miss Bianca and other Coloradans, Hillary Clinton will be in Pueblo tomorrow. Here’s the RSVP link. I might drive up from New Mexico – perhaps an opportunity for a Ballon Juice meet-up?

    ETA: The event will be at the Colorado State Fairgrounds, 11:30-2:30 MDT.

  78. 78.

    hovercraft

    @TS:
    He’s still at it fighting the polls, Trump will bounce back. Heilman says he’s done just energizing the base no longer in it to win. Joe says that that he Lazarus come back to life, and that he now has a chance to come back. Heilman explains that yesterday at his Pittsburgh he came out at his rally and spent the first five minutes singing the praise of Ben Rothlesburger and saying how close they are. He’s no longer running to win, Joe a la Black Knight replies there’s a chance.

    EDIT: And then is running every Trump attack on Clinton, but nah he’s not with Trump.

  79. 79.

    Kay

    @efgoldman:

    It has changed, so I think it’s easy to forget how divisive these issues were for Democrats even 10 years ago. We once had a local women’s meeting where one woman stormed out over fetal stem cell research. Another one lectured us after the storming out about how divisive and radical we were. We all vowed to be more accommodating to dissenters.

  80. 80.

    ThresherK (GPad)

    Is “Fix the Court” a known group of idiots? One of em has an op-ed in the NYT and I glanced at it for 5 seconds. It set off my alarms.

  82. 82.

    hueyplong

    @Kay:

    Christie: “I was really disturbed and embarrassed for him and his family.”

    Because everyone knows the real victim in all this is Trump.

  83. 83.

    Kay

    @hueyplong:

    Maybe there;s a longer quote but if you were a cynical, conniving GOP pol like Christie wouldn’t you know enough to make it about women instead of about the the man and his family even if you consider women non-persons? It’s a way of thinking. Trump is just the symptom.

  88. 88.

    JMG

    Joe was one of the big drivers of the impeach Clinton move in the House. When that blew up on them, and when he had a little personal troubles of his own, he bailed on Congress. So he’s reliving glory days here as much as anything else.

  89. 89.

    OGLiberal

    If we use Noonan Science, that crowd means Hillary has Ohio wrapped up – she may as well pull all her ad spend there.

    But….but……

    Where I am in Northeast PA, I see many, many more Trump signs than Hillary signs so Trump’s going to win PA by like 15 points…won’t even be close.

  90. 90.

    WereBear

    @Kay: It’s a way of thinking. Trump is just the symptom.

    Someone downthread pointed out sometimes Trump doesn’t even say “She.” He says, “It.” It is so creepy and exactly like Silence of the Lambs.

    In the considerable time I’ve spent trying to figure out Trump and his ilk, all I have come up with in simple terms is that these are people who spend all their time drawing their Circle of Personhood tighter and tighter. No women, no POC, no children, no gays or lesbians, no poor people, etc etc.

    While Democrats work to extend the circle. Heck, I extend personhood to my higher mammalian pets, in that I regard them as thinking, feeling, beings worthy of respect and friendship.

    But in a Trumpian’s tiny brain, the only way to make themselves more is to make everyone else, lesser.

  91. 91.

    Cermet

    @aimai: Exactly what is wrong with burning the Amerikan flag? One is REQUIRED to burn the flag to dispose of it or if it has in any way been desecrated – would not, someone “hating” the US and handling the flag meet that definition? Then their burning the flag is an act of respect …lololol. This whole idea of flags being special is such petty bull $hit – Hitler had a big thing for flags … oh, just made a Nazi reference. Do I lose the argument?

  92. 92.

    Kay

    Reporters, stop saying emails were leaked by Wikileaks. Be honest: It was the FSB/GRU (i.e. Russian intelligence).

    Okay, true, not true or unknown, shouldn’t they be raising this? They’re goddammned experts on email management after 18 months of braying about it. The source of these emails doesn’t matter? Not at all relevant or interesting, as compared to their endless analysis of servers?

  93. 93.

    Patricia Kayden

    @gf120581: Not everything. According to the polls, Republicans should easily hold onto the House. They can still do some damage from that perspective.

  94. 94.

    Comrade Scrutinizer

    @NorthLeft12:

    I agree with you about the leaders, they are irredeemable. I am thinking more about the base, or a good chunk of it. If evidence, that the economy and life in general is getting better, becomes overwhelming then some of the base will come around and at least be open to compromise.
    Those leaders [Ryan, McConnell, Cruz, Cotton, Gingrich, etc.] must be marginalized and bypassed to allow a new leadership to take over who might actually be open to compromise and improving the state of the country. Maybe? A fella can dream, can’t he?

    If you go to white supremacist sites like Daily Stormer or Stormfront, you see these very same arguments made by the Pepes and the Trumpkins. They hate the GOP elites (GOPE) just as much as they hate Clinton and the libs, and they want to burn it all down. They see themselves as they new leadership to take over the country, except they reject any notion of compromise. All hail CU, which, along with the Mercers and the Kochs, enabled this goat fuck.

  95. 95.

    Kay

    @WereBear:

    He said he was entitled to bust into pageant dressing rooms and “inspect” the 19 year olds because he owned the pageant. He also owns hotels and casinos. Does he feel free to sexually harass the people who work there too?

    This isn’t normal behavior. It’s freak show stuff. No employer I have ever encountered talks like this. He should have been sued at the time by the young women he was leering at as a condition of their staying in the pageant. It’s abuse. He had them right where he wanted them.

  97. 97.

    TS

    @hovercraft:

    EDIT: And then is running every Trump attack on Clinton, but nah he’s not with Trump.

    And he will start in November – “You remember Mica, I told everyone month’s ago that Trump had no chance” – while he non stop attacks President elect Clinton.

  98. 98.

    Summer

    @Kay: Isn’t it’s the old union left coalition of the thirties that was never on board with a lot of the new left of the 60s?

  99. 99.

    hueyplong

    @Kay: Just saying it’s standard operating procedure for these people on several levels. Do not disagree with your point at all, or with the fact that yours is the more important point. You could pick any of their spin at random and find more examples that support your position.

  100. 100.

    NotMax

    So old that recall when BJ’s front page had posts for Act Blue and similar donations to downticket Dems,

    All Trump, all the time seems to have scotched that.

  101. 101.

    Kay

    @Summer:

    I don’t know but I do know a lot of the effort Republicans exerted on dividing Democrats or Democratic-leaners worked. The state amendments against same sex marriage? That worked. In 2004.

  102. 102.

    MomSense

    @JMG:

    They keep trying to compare Bill’s affairs and lying about them with sexual assault. Do they really not know the difference between consensual sexual relations and sexual assault?

  103. 103.

    Betty Cracker

    @Botsplainer: The Trump brand has got to be toxic beyond belief at this point, and among the very set of consumers he needs to attract. I know I’d rather sleep under a bridge than stay in a Trump hotel. I’d rather wrap plastic shopping bags around my feet with duct tape than wear shoes peddled by the Trump spawn. I suspect I’m not alone.

  107. 107.

    Comrade Scrutinizer

    @MomSense: They are pulling out allegations from women who accuse Clinton of nonconsensual acts. Granted that most if not all of the allegations have been debunked, they aren’t doing the apples and oranges thing.

  108. 108.

    artem1s

    @Kay:
    the significance of the crowd at Ohio State might be more related to Trump’s rally that was canceled. Also, Columbus is Kasich country. NEOH is generally all in for any Dem. the center of the state has always been far more conservative and the VoAg school is generally reflective of the more suburban communities where those kids parents live. The Lib Arts school (Ohio University) usually means Athens county is the only southern county that votes progressive. 18K in Columbus is a poke in the eye of the more ‘reasonable’ GOP, Pence and Kasich.

  109. 109.

    gvg

    There was a story in the leadup to 2008 election that clarified a lot of what I preferred in Obama over Clinton then. It had to do with Older Democrats experiencing some real wipeout elections when they proposed liberal things such as I wanted. Clinton was characterized as pre defensive because she expected to be attacked and so were other democrats. I remembered some of that including when I noticed people and politicians running away from the liberal label. Media ran away too. That made me mad back when it happened. Anyway, they rebuilt deliberately cultivating ties to business and making sure they looked patriotic squeeky clean. The Vietnam era stories of liberals spitting on returning vets did some real damage. So Clinton was slower to realize times had changed and not as willing then to say what people were ready to hear. Obama being younger was less scarred. Now Clinton is actually proposing more but other Democrats still expect these things to lose. These people care but don’t support this kind of protest.
    The other problem with it is I have seen an awful lot of symbolic protests which seemed so impractical and didn’t do a thing. I am kind of sick of them. From what I have seen, these local protests especially the anti war ones pre Iraq were by people who wanted attention and romanticised the 60’s, wanted to have been in those protests. I know that is not what they were elsewhere but around here, they were a small group of well I thought they were idiots. I knew the war was stupid, but I had never seen a protest do any good where as call ins to Congressmen and actual letters has worked.
    I am surprised this particular protest actually seems to be getting any attention. The original guy seemed rather clueless. So I expected it to hurt more than help and was sort of against it without wanting anything done to stop him. Since i was wrong, and it’s catching on, great.
    All this is to say older democrats can act kind of burned before without being against a cause. Actually wanting to win is important, rather than just settling for a purity protest.

  110. 110.

    Betty Cracker

    @NotMax: Did you not see Mistermix’s recent effort, which collected $52K via ActBlue for down-ticket Dems? I chose to direct my funds elsewhere as there are some local races I think are winnable that were not included in the candidate roster for that fundraiser, but good on MM for starting it.

  111. 111.

    Kay

    If you own a property that is branded “Trump” and it loses resale value due the actions of the Trump family, can you sue them for damages?

  113. 113.

    Botsplainer

    And yet another day goes by with ZERO leaked from the insecure, treasonous, danger to our safety personal server.

  115. 115.

    Steeplejack (tablet)

    @NotMax:

    We just finished an ActBlue promo that raised over $50,000. Did you sleep through that?

    And, yes, there’s a lot of posts about Trump now because he is a central figure in perhaps the most important election in a generation.

  116. 116.

    NotMax

    @Betty Cracker

    Some enterprising reporter could likely get a nice piece from asking owners of businesses inside Trump Tower if the bottom line of their shops and eateries has been affected one way or the other.

    Open secret that all the hotels have been hit. Hard.

  117. 117.

    Kay

    @artem1s:

    Thanks. I only go there for required legal… things and (you may know this) the northern part of the state is always pissed off at them down there because they don’t send us any of our tax money back. We feel they hate us and they’re all flush with state money and we have none :)

    I myself promote this resentment. Gin it up :)

  118. 118.

    Botsplainer

    @Betty Cracker:

    Brand is beyond repair. Travel agents are actively omitting mentions (and that is the group that is most responsible for booking luxury properties), and Trump property GMs and concierges were actively blown off at the August Virtuoso convention.

  119. 119.

    OzarkHillbilly

    “Oh God, of course Hillary’s favorite Spielberg movie isn’t the killer shark one or the dinosaur one, it’s the one about legislative negotiation.”

    Sam Bee who is on a roll.

  120. 120.

    NotMax

    @Betty Cracker

    Saw posts asking to reach a goal, but none of those had any explanation of what the money was for. Granted, was away on vacation for almost two weeks in September, but only saw “send more” without any context after returning.

    Time was that specific candidates and races were highlighted – that was more what I was referring to.

  121. 121.

    Comrade Scrutinizer

    @MomSense: They discuss Lewinsky (who has had the good grace to stay out of this), but it’s mostly in a reverse slut-shaming “Hillary couldn’t hold on to her man” context. The sexual assault attacks are based around Jones, Willey, and Broaddrick. Predebate news conference? Attempted debate confrontation with Bill?

  122. 122.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @Steeplejack (tablet):

    And, yes, there’s a lot of posts about Trump now because he is a central figure in perhaps the most important election in a generation.

    Or at least 4, no, 8 years. ;-)

  123. 123.

    Betty Cracker

    @NotMax: Well, you may have missed it, but MM did explain whom he was collecting money for and why it was worth supporting the Dems in those races as opposed to others. I objected because I thought we were writing off Murphy (looking to unseat Lil’ Marco) prematurely, but I applaud the overall effort.

  124. 124.

    Kay

    @artem1s:

    I rhetorically ask why “Columbus” hates our public schools in meetings. I sound like Cindy Lou Who “why are you taking our Christmas tree, why?”

  126. 126.

    TS

    @Betty Cracker:

    I know I’d rather sleep under a bridge than stay in a Trump hotel. I’d rather wrap plastic shopping bags around my feet with duct tape than wear shoes peddled by the Trump spawn. I suspect I’m not alone.

    I would think a majority of Trump’s supporters could not afford to walk in the front door of a Trump establishment. I smile to think of the major damage he has done to the brand.

  127. 127.

    MomSense

    @Comrade Scrutinizer:

    I know what the Trump campaign has been promoting. The Morning Joe panel is discussing Lewinsky and even Starr report. They are focusing on lying and affairs trying desperately to transform the Trump tape into lying and affairs instead of what it was really about.

  128. 128.

    geg6

    @Kay:

    Silly Kay. Women aren’t people. Whyever should they be addressed in law as if they count as human beings? Now, a fetus…that’s a human being. At least until it’s born.

  130. 130.

    scav

    Modern day xianity is certainly on a roll, moving beyond being hired for drought control by tax-break conscious governments, now it’s offically being invoked to heal the oil and gas sector. “Oilfield Prayer Day.”
    But! the PC rot is creeping in, even in godly OK: Gov. Mary Fallin has had to explicitly include “all faiths” in the resolution. WaPa Oklahoma Gov. Mary Fallin says all faiths, not just Christians, should observe ‘Oilfield Prayer Day’

  131. 131.

    Comrade Scrutinizer

    @MomSense: That’s not the same as accusations of sexual assault, though, unless you address power differentials and such. And as you point out, Morning Joke is not the Trump campaign: Joe and Mika are just treading the well worn CDS path.

  132. 132.

    PIGL

    @TS: Phil Ochs had their number 45 years ago vis Love me I’m a Liberal. Whatever it is is “going a little too far”.

  134. 134.

    geg6

    @Kay:

    This is why I do nothing for the party other than donate, volunteer to phone bank, do voter registration or canvass. Once, when I was much, much younger, I had visions of quitting education eventually to go to work in politics, a situation I thought I’d work my way up into as they years went by. But I have no patience for that kind of prima donna shit. I’ve told plenty of allies off when I thought it the right thing to do at the time. I’m too alienating a personality to do the collective organizing required to be a party leader or apparatchik. I’d definitely tell stem cell cry baby woman to go fuck herself. So I just quietly do the grunt work that I know is valuable, going on 38 years or so.

  136. 136.

    Peale

    @MomSense: because my guess…just a guess…is that Fox isn’t the only creepy “go down on the boss you’re fired” news room out there. They sound like kids who realized for the first time that their odd family might not be normal.

  138. 138.

    TS

    @Comrade Scrutinizer: If mika watched the debate she MUST have seen the stalking and intimidation that Trump used for the full 90 minutes. I know some men did not recognize it but every woman knows what he was doing. Despite this Mika is supporting Joe in his attacks on Hillary – talk about aiding and abetting – she is in, boots and all.

  140. 140.

    hovercraft

    @Kay:
    But why is he only referencing the second debate, I thought he also won the first one, he told us he won the Drudge poll 81 to 19. Why not point out that he’s swept the polls for both debates.

  141. 141.

    geg6

    @Betty Cracker:

    I was at Marshall’s about a year ago, shopping for a Christmas present, and came across some Ivanka garments on the rack. I actually recoiled. First, they were ugly and cheaply made. And second, I realized then that she squicked me out as much as or, perhaps, even more than he did simply because I never had a good impression of him. But I had a better impression of her and it was in that moment that I realized that she knew how horrible a man her father is and still was working to foist him on the rest of us. And she has the look of a monster every time I see her or her name now. I’m ashamed of myself for being fooled.

  142. 142.

    Kay

    @hovercraft:

    Oh, he just lies to them constantly. I’ve read about ten tweets from reporters where Trump tells the people inside the rally that there are “thousands” who didn’t get in. It’s not true, but they don’t know it because they’re inside.

    It must be terrifying to be dependent on him for a job. They’d be turning the lights off for non-payment before he’d tell the truth about what’s going on. Imagine the bullshit those poor people have to endure. “Sales are GREAT!” Yeah, right. Okay, Mr Trump.

  143. 143.

    liberal

    @Keith G: Yeah, I don’t get it either. Though more importantly I don’t get why she let her ego get in the way of resigning early in Obama’s first term.

  145. 145.

    Fair Economist

    @Betty Cracker:

    I objected because I thought we were writing off Murphy (looking to unseat Lil’ Marco) prematurely, but I applaud the overall effort.

    Along those lines the map of competitive districts linked in the post is VERY VERY favorable to the Republicans. Right now the polls are indicating a swing to the Democrats of over 10% in the House votes but the map projects the Democrats to gain only about 5 seats. Um, no, even with the gerrymanders we’ll do a lot better than that. I’d say you should move everything in that list one category to the Democrats – which incidentally means there’s another 10-15 seats Sabato has as “Safe R” which are actually only “Likely R”.

  147. 147.

    NotMax

    Even Rasmussen (!) now has Clinton up by 7, and their poll numbers historically receive more massaging than a steer in Kobe.

  148. 148.

    hovercraft

    @MomSense:
    Yes Joe from Congress never heard of this before today. He puts the number up on the screen for people to call congress. So he’s saying he was in congress for 6 years and served on oversight committees, and never knew this. I know he has no audience (except me and a couple of others), but still to say you know nothing about the job you were supposed to be doing for 6 years is pathetic.
    I’m sure he will be shocked when he finds out that congresscritters are hypocrites.

    104th Congress– Committee on Government Reform and Oversight – Committee on National Security (formerly Committee on Armed Services)
    105th Congress – Committee on National Security – Committee on Government Reform and Oversight – Committee on Education and the Workforce
    106th Congress – Committee on Armed Services – Committee on Government Reform – Committee on the Judiciary
    107th Congress – Committee on Government Reform – Committee on the Judiciary

  149. 149.

    PPCLI

    @scav: I’m sure that the Hillary campaign focus-tested and honed every word of her responses, so I’ve no doubt they had their reasons. But I did regret that when Trump gave his remarks about coal and oil being threatened by “regulation”, Hillary didn’t spend 20 seconds or so to mention that the reason coal is dying right now is because of the massive production of natural gas that is nudging it out. And the reason oil states are struggling right now is because there is just so goddamned much oil being produced that the price is flat. And Trump’s solution is to produce even more oil and natural gas? That is supposed to help coal miners? That will boost the Oklahoma economy?

    And now we get “pray for the Oil fields day”. Pray for even more oil than before, so that the price can plummet down further? I wouldn’t say no to gasoline at 80 cents a gallon, but I can’t see it as a blessing for Ms. Fallin’s voters.

  150. 150.

    Kay

    @liberal:

    I agree. Ohio has age limits for judges. It’s not a bad idea. They put it to a referendum (backed by judges who want to stay on forever) and they lost big. It isn’t about her (or them). That needs to be front and center, always.

  151. 151.

    hovercraft

    @Botsplainer:
    Imagine by this time next year we could be treated to a spectacle better that the Snack Team Six trail, we could have Donald on trial in NYC and right down the street we could have Chris Christies Bridgegate trial. Does FSM love me that much?

  152. 152.

    liberal

    @NorthLeft12:

    If evidence, that the economy and life in general is getting better, becomes overwhelming then some of the base will come around and at least be open to compromise.

    LOL. The economy isn’t getting better. Yes, nominally we’re adding some jobs, but economic growth is pretty slow. (Not that I’m laying that on Obama.)

  154. 154.

    Iowa Old Lady

    I’m reading the most recent of Tana French’s Dublin Murder Squad mysteries (great series, btw), and this morning, I came across a scene in which the detectives think a woman’s date killed her in her house within minutes after arriving. One of them speculates the guy pressed for sex and she turned him down.

    The other one says what? He walked in the door and shoved his hand up her skirt? Didn’t even wait to have wine when he’d have a better chance?

    And I’m thinking, yeah, because he’s not Donald Trump!

  159. 159.

    redshirt

    For you Morning Joe diehards, do those always have so many commercials? Thank FSM I don’t get to watch very often, but when I do, it seems like more commercials than “content”. They had a commercial break from 7:28 to 7:36 this morning, and during that whole time CNN was on air.

    But then when they have “content”, it’s ridiculous and I change the channel anyway.

    I don’t miss cable.

  160. 160.

    randy khan

    @liberal:

    I’m sorry, but it’s silly to argue that RBG should have resigned early in the Obama Administration. She’s done a lot of good work since then, and she’s probably in the top 10% of all Supreme Court Justices ever. She’s earned the right to stay until she’s ready to go.

  161. 161.

    WereBear

    @MomSense: They keep trying to compare Bill’s affairs and lying about them with sexual assault. Do they really not know the difference between consensual sexual relations and sexual assault?

    For fundamentalists/evangelicals: no. They really don’t.

    A Tale of Two Boxes: Contrasting Sexual Ethics

    All sex inside marriage for procreation is GOOD. All other sex is BAD. Consent doesn’t enter into it.

    The Catholic Church is no better. One of the concepts that made the Catholic sex scandals so much worse than they should have been was the way their theology made the priest not being celibate the real sin. And then blame the victim for being tempting.

    Yes, it is terribly messed up. But that is the mindset that leads to Todd Akin being a complete asshole with his “legitimate rape” remakes, and not even knowing it.

  163. 163.

    Jeffro

    @ThresherK (GPad): Hmm…seems to be a relatively new group looking to term-limit (one 18-year term – how they arrived at that number, I can’t tell*) SCOTUS judges and force them to do more financial disclosures (anything related to the cases they are reviewing) as well as making them more publicly accessible (everything from publishing their schedules to allowing demonstrations on SCOTUS’ front steps, which I thought was already allowed?)

    Did a little digging and from this C-Span interview, it’s just the one guy (Gabe Roth) who wrote the op-ed and is the ‘executive director’. He got a grant from the New Venture Fund (which appears to be run by some relatively innocuous former Dem officials and conservation group members.

    I dunno, sounds like a pretty boring job to me…

    *ETA: supposedly this is to allow one of the nine justices to come up for replacement every two years.

  164. 164.

    bystander

    @OGLiberal: We have a place in NEPA and the idiot down the road has painted Trump in red on a giant boulder on their property. On the NY side in Sullivan County and overlooking a Revolutionary battle site, another moron’s usual decor of a Confederate flag is now enhanced with various handcrafted Trump doggerel. Disgusting.

  165. 165.

    JR in WV

    @BillinGlendaleCA:

    if Obama would just stop being so extreme, which of course was the reason Republicans became so extreme.

    If he would have just had The Turtle and The Granny Starver over for drinks at the White House, everything in Washington would be great.

    I’m not plugged into the DC cocktail party circuit at all, but my understanding is that at the beginning of his administration, President Obama had a standing invitation to cRepublicans in Cngress to attend Wednesday evening cocktail parties at the White House.

    No one came. They wouldn’t attend a cocktail party hosted by a black couple. Even the First Family!

    Wonder why?

    These bigots are less than the soil beneath my feet.

  166. 166.

    SFAW

    @BillinGlendaleCA:

    If he would have just had The Turtle and The Granny Starver over for drinks at the White House, everything in Washington would be great.

    Only if he served those drinks while in a butler’s outfit, and said “Yassuh, boss!” (I don’t think they’d want him to say “massa,” but then again, it’s Turtle and ZEGS, so who knows?) whenever Turtle or ZEGS told him to shine their shoes or some such.

    And even then …

  167. 167.

    hovercraft

    @Betty Cracker: This is a major problem for him. His fans love him but they are not the clientele he wants/ needs for his overpriced hotels and golf courses. Those people are repulsed by him, and his business was already down 40 % before he bean this new scorched earth phase. He may go down in a blaze of glory, but at what cost to his and his families livelihood?

  168. 168.

    JPL

    Trump is tweeting, mostly about Ryan being mean to him.. This is the latest tweet
    It is so nice that the shackles have been taken off me and I can now fight for America the way I want to.

    sad

  169. 169.

    hovercraft

    @Kay:
    That would be nice, but I think he would be most hurt by seeing his name removed from his so called properties.

  170. 170.

    Walker

    @NotMax:

    Rasmussen’s schtick is that they bias Republicans early in the cycle, but become more accurate the closer we get to the election. That is how they stay in business (because a bad prediction loses you clients).

  171. 171.

    MomSense

    @hovercraft:

    Yeah and I’m pretty sure the Medicare RX bill he voted for finally became law after Bush was elected and I think it may have been done using a budget reconciliation maneuver which they totally hated when used to pass the ACA.

    I think it was in Morning Joe when Maria Bartiromo revealed she didn’t even know that you couldn’t get coverage from Medicare until you turn 65.

  173. 173.

    SFAW

    @randy khan:

    Also, the pie chart showing what percentage of the population is related to women.

    Nate Silver had a tweet showing an electoral map, with the caption/heading “Exclusive @FiveThirtyEight projection on what the Electoral College would look like if women refuse to vote Trump.”

    If only it were possible.

  174. 174.

    randy khan

    @Major Major Major Major:

    The “ethical case” is purely political – that she would have been replaced by someone good and there was a risk of the Republicans getting to replace her. But she’s likely a better Supreme Court Justice than any replacement appointed by Obama would have been, so there’s a net loss if she left earlier. The case that she should have retired is somewhat better after Obama’s re-election because the cost-benefit shifts a bit, but having her leave in the first two years of his first term would have been silly.

  175. 175.

    hovercraft

    @redshirt:
    What they do is have long stretches without commercials then they bunch them together. So for instance this morning they went form 8 till 22 past (approx), and then they had a break, came back for a couple of minutes and then went back to break. So it’s the normal 22 minutes of commercials per hour, the breakdown is more irregular. Rachel also does that a lot.

  176. 176.

    SFAW

    @randy khan:

    That’s “liberal’s” thing — RBG is selfish and should resign so that Obama could get a liberal on the Court, instead of running the risk that Trump (or whoever) chooses the next Justice. Back when there was reasonable doubt about this election, it may have been worth discussing seriously. Of course, considering that Fat Nino’s replacement is off fishing, one wonders whether it would have made any difference.

    @Major Major Major Major:

    It’s not silly at all, there’s a perfectly legitimate ethical case to be made for it.

    It’s a political/pragmatism case, not an ethical one. Or is maintaining RBG’s seat as “liberal” now an ethical consideration?

  178. 178.

    hovercraft

    @JR in WV:
    And once the Teahadists arrived, John Boehner was told not to go to the White House without Teahadists to monitor because they just knew he would sell them out to the Kenyan Usurper. It got so ridiculous that Turtle even refused to come when some team from Kentucky was being honored.
    They were turning down things that you know they really wanted to attend, like Lincoln with Speilberg and members of the cast, and I remember there was a Tom Hanks movie they turned down.

  179. 179.

    germy

    @catclub:

    Glenn Beck is a Mormon.

    He’s also paranoid, manic and running his Blaze business into the ground. He’s been laying off staff, hiring CEOs who rip him off, laying off more staff, concocting bizarre schemes for compounds, movie studios and theme parks, hiring and firing more CEOs, then laying off staff.

  181. 181.

    hovercraft

    @MomSense:
    It’s hard to tell which one is dumber Bartiromo or Joe, and yet they both make millions to opine about things they clearly don’t understand. SAD!

  182. 182.

    germy

    @JPL:

    Trump is tweeting, mostly about Ryan being mean to him.. This is the latest tweet
    It is so nice that the shackles have been taken off me and I can now fight for America the way I want to.

    The little gloves are off!

  185. 185.

    JPL

    @germy: I’m not sure that anyone will notice the difference.

    Christie and Cruz both reaffirmed their support today. Good Times!

  186. 186.

    Chyron HR

    @germy:

    It is so nice that the shackles have been taken off me and I can now fight for America

    I assume in the same sense that animals fight “for” food.

  187. 187.

    SFAW

    @Major Major Major Major:

    However, I didn’t realize we were talking about only the first two years.

    Who was? Randy only talked about that being the window when Obama could possibly have gotten a liberal on the Court.(Not stated that way, but implied.) And “liberal” has been on that whole hobby horse for awhile.

  188. 188.

    amk

    @Walker: and lil nate will do that himself, but only after the elections by grading them with having a rethug bias. Too lil, too late, lil nate.

  190. 190.

    SFAW

    @Major Major Major Major:

    It’s a political goal, it has nothing to do with “good conduct” (for lack of a better term). Or is getting a Fat Nino clone as his replacement an “ethical goal” as well?

    Conduct of the Senate Rethugs is the unethical means by which they’re attempting to attain a political goal.

    ETA: based on your comment at 189, I expect we’re on the same page.

  191. 191.

    hovercraft

    @Timurid:
    I’m not sure e can maintain his current lifestyle just from grifting. The wingnut circuit is lucrative, but if he costs them the presidency, the senate and possibly the house, the money people will not be willing to pay him the big bucks. Remember for most of the money he was only grudgingly accepted. His credit will be worse than ever now that his ponzi scheme has been exposed. His only real hope is the idea of a media empire, but I’m not sure he can get even that financed. The Blaze is dying, Breitbart is a money suck. This is why the rabid raccoon is going down fighting it has no other options.

  193. 193.

    germy

    @hovercraft:

    Isn’t he a fairly recent convert ?

    Possibly. I don’t know. He is impulsive. I imagine one morning he woke up and shouted at his wife and kids “We’re switching religions! Hurry up and get dressed, I’ll be in the car!”

  195. 195.

    Major Major Major Major

    @SFAW: getting a Scalia clone in the Supreme Court to replace Scalia is probably an ethical goal for republicans, yes.

    ETA: (Ethical, from a consequentialist mindset, in the sense of resulting in more ‘good’ than (some of) the alternative(s). For a particular value of ‘good’.)

  196. 196.

    redshirt

    @hovercraft: Agreed. While Republican grifting can provide a good revenue stream for folks like Huckabee and Carson, it won’t keep Donald in the style he’s become accustomed to. Sad!

    I can’t wait to see Trump hotels changing ownership shortly. May he lose it all.

  197. 197.

    SFAW

    @Major Major Major Major:

    Still a political goal. It’s the conduct, not the goal (in this case) that’s ethical/unethical.

    An unethical goal would be something like “Let’s enrich our friends even further, so what if we screw the little guy?” (It’s an imperfect example, but not too far off.)

  198. 198.

    germy

    @JPL:

    Christie and Cruz both reaffirmed their support today. Good Times!

    TRUMP: Your father killed JFK. Your wife is ugly. You’re a liar.
    CRUZ: You’re a menace to this country. I simply cannot endorse someone as horrible as you.
    TRUMP:
    CRUZ: You’ve got my endorsement. I’ll get on the phone right now.
    TRUMP:
    CRUZ: When you win can I have a cabinet post? Secretary of State?
    TRUMP: That’ll be Christie’s job.
    CRUZ: In four years your base will be mine.

  199. 199.

    Major Major Major Major

    @SFAW: consequentialist ethics holds that the consequences of an action or course of action determine whether it was ethical. The utilitarianism of Mill and Bentham is probably the most familiar version.

    ETA: Hence achieving these ends is a legitimate ethical goal in a legitimate and widely used ethical framework.

    Now, you can argue that their calculus was wrong–blowing up the senate will result in a more liberal replacement than Garland and the end of the filibuster for the first two years of Hillary’s first term–but it’s still a discussion of ethics.

  200. 200.

    Jeffro

    @SFAW:

    Nate Silver had a tweet showing an electoral map, with the caption/heading “Exclusive @FiveThirtyEight projection on what the Electoral College would look like if women refuse to vote Trump.”

    If only it were possible.

    We may well come close: looks like, similar to what I’ve mentioned already these past couple of days, half of GOP voters might only vote for Trump and no down-ballot; the other half might skip voting for Trump and only vote the down-ballot. (Ok, it’s actually 60%/40% but still – check it out! )

    Again, if they were going to be screwed either way, as many said way back in Feb/March, they could have at least held to some principles. Ah well…

  201. 201.

    bemused

    Re: Republican voters finally realizing that their leaders, the people they have faithfully voted for years, decades have been lying to them with little intention of delivering the goods. What the hell has taken them so long to figure this out?

  202. 202.

    Jeffro

    Money quote from a Jeb! adviser in that WaPo article I noted at #200:

    “If Republicans are going to have to disavow Trump eventually because of how bad his behavior has gotten, it is incumbent on them to get the political benefit of doing it when it’s a principled stand, rather than waiting until they are backed into a corner and there’s no other choice.”

    Tough to get off the Trump Train when it’s a-rollin’…LOL…

  204. 204.

    SFAW

    @Major Major Major Major:

    Yeah, whatever.

    “Consequentialist ethics”? I’ll have to write that one down somewhere. But it sounds an awful lot like a variation of sorts of post hoc, ergo propter hoc.

    A SCOTUS appointment is a political appointment (with the possible exception of packing the Court). There’s not an ethical calculus in the goal itself, only in how the parties involved attempt to attain that goal.

  206. 206.

    catclub

    Again, the tape revealed nothing about this arrested-development adolescent that today’s righteously recoiling Republicans either did not already know or had no excuse for not knowing. Before the tape reminded the pathologically forgetful of Trump’s feral appetites and deranged sense of entitlement, the staid Economist magazine, holding the subject of Trump at arm’s length like a soiled sock, reminded readers of this: “When Mr. Trump divorced the first of his three wives, Ivana, he let the New York tabloids know that one reason for the separation was that her breast implants felt all wrong.”

    George Will, in a column that had no room for bashing Hillary Clinton. I wonder why he forgot that.

  208. 208.

    JR in WV

    @efgoldman:

    Unfortunately, while not elegible for a hysterectomy, I may become a candidate eventually for a mastectomy. I expect my family doc to order another mammogram next visit, my third. Not fun. Nor is the biopsy.

    Hopefully just tenderness, but no point in becoming a tiny statistic. So far, so good.

  212. 212.

    JR in WV

    @MomSense:

    I suspect to them if it is sex, you’re married. Everything else is just Fuq!ng, who cares about consent, they don’t have that in their world.

    Sick as in illness!

  214. 214.

    Uncle Cosmo

    @Cermet:

    Hitler had a big thing for flags

    FTR the opening words of the Horst-Wessel-Lied (NSDAP anthem 1930-45) are Die Fahne hoch! (The flag on high).

  215. 215.

    JR in WV

    @hovercraft:

    Pure essence of bigotry. They wouldn’t attend a gathering hosted by a black couple under any circumstances – even at the White House. Bigots, all of them.

    I’ve seen some of the evenings hosted by the President and First Lady on PBS, amazing entertainment, with chock-full of meaning moments. Tears for the beauty of the performances and the hosts!

    But nothing there for Republicans, nope. Nothing there worth their time. Sick bastards.

  216. 216.

    EBT

    Before anyone try to analyze Joe. Remember he still never answered why there was a dead woman in his congressional office.

  217. 217.

    SFAW

    @Major Major Major Major:

    Mill was a big consequentialist and a lot of America’s founding notions can be traced back to him.

    That’s nice. It also has nothing to do with the need for a SCOTUS slot to get filled. And the Wiki page talks about one’s conduct, not whether filling a SCOTUS slot is an ethical choice.

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