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You are here: Home / Past Elections / Election 2016 / Thursday Morning Open Thread: Get Out the Vote

Thursday Morning Open Thread: Get Out the Vote

by Anne Laurie|  October 13, 20166:09 am| 214 Comments

This post is in: Election 2016, Hillary Clinton 2016, Local Races 2018 and earlier, Open Threads, Proud to Be A Democrat

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Apart from waiting on the latest Trump embarrassment, what’s on the agenda for the day?

Say hello to Senator Kirkpatrick https://t.co/fDjdHKY7vx

— Dana Houle (@DanaHoule) October 12, 2016

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Previous Post: « Late Night Creepshow Open Thread: Locker Room Taunts
Next Post: Cobbling together quasi coverage »

Reader Interactions

214Comments

  1. 1.

    rikyrah

    October 13, 2016 at 6:12 am

    Good Morning ?, Everyone ?

  2. 2.

    TS

    October 13, 2016 at 6:15 am

    There we are – Morning Joke attacking Bill Clinton – what has Trump got on this pair – will it impact the divorce settlements?
    Quoting Steve Bannon
    My Lord they are worried on Joke – they are doing everything – now claiming journalists who are attacking Trump – well Mica has had “experiences” with some of these people.
    These people are off the planet & the “guests” are fighting back. “If we are going to believe the Clinton accusers, then we must believe the Trump accusers.
    Now Mica is talking about ALL the Washington people who do bad things. Now Joke is being vicious in his attack on the Clintons – this man is almost as manic as Trump.
    Poor Mark Halperin – admitting Trump is behind. Ahhh Wiki leaks – And Halperin says it’s all being co-ordinated by the Clinton campaign – well so close to the election. Why didn’t they drop is sooner.

    These folks are really bad conspirators

  3. 3.

    p.a.

    October 13, 2016 at 6:19 am

    Phone banking for Hils this evening.

  4. 4.

    Mary G

    October 13, 2016 at 6:20 am

    @rikyrah: Good morning???

  5. 5.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    October 13, 2016 at 6:20 am

    @TS: Both sides!

  6. 6.

    TS

    October 13, 2016 at 6:23 am

    I’m rambling – but watching Joe and Mica trying to defend the indefensible is now becoming humerus – all they got is Bill Clinton – who last I heard is not on the ballot. The “both sides” in terms of who is bringing down the conversation is also laughable. No reason to turn it off any more – they are toast. Point and laugh should be the policy.

  7. 7.

    OzarkHillbilly

    October 13, 2016 at 6:26 am

    The ghost of William Rehnquist stalks the hollowed halls of Misery’s judicial system:

    On Tuesday, the appeals court ruled that it will not examine Lincoln’s “actual innocence” claim unless the Missouri Supreme Court clearly states that such claims will be examined in non-death penalty cases.

    “Because the Missouri Supreme Court has not recognized a freestanding claim of actual innocence in cases where the death penalty has not been imposed, we are not at liberty to expand Missouri habeas jurisprudence to permit consideration of the claim in this case,” Appellate Judge Cynthia L. Martin wrote in the ruling.

    Sean O’Brien, one of the attorneys representing Lincoln in the appeal, called the ruling “scary.”

    “The literal holding of the court is that innocence is not a good enough reason to release a prisoner,” said O’Brien. “In other words, this is not a miscarriage of justice to sentence an innocent person to die in prison of natural causes?”

  8. 8.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    October 13, 2016 at 6:26 am

    @TS: But, but, Hillary said mean things about these women(only thing I remember Hillary saying at the time was about “The Vast Right Wing Conspiracy”).

  9. 9.

    TS

    October 13, 2016 at 6:30 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA:

    But, but, Hillary said mean things about these women

    They said much more than that – put Bill and Hillary together – they both did bad by these women. Joe with his years and years of political experience just knows how bad these people were in the 1990s. He is seriously in a fools paradise.

  10. 10.

    Kay

    October 13, 2016 at 6:31 am

    @TS:

    Morning Joe should voluntarily release all internal emails between staff and cable celebrities. They promoted Trump for 6 months. I’d love to see if there was coordination. They love the “transparency” of stolen emails. Let’s see theirs.

    This “celebrating theft” thing they’re doing probably becomes less fashionable when someone other than Hillary Clinton is the target. Joe and Mika had private meetings with Trump. Does the public have a right to know what was said?

  11. 11.

    Jeffro

    October 13, 2016 at 6:35 am

    Ok, am I the only one with a tear in my eye and MUCH appreciation for BHO after watching that Hillz video? Damn.

  12. 12.

    Kay

    October 13, 2016 at 6:41 am

    It’s always interesting, too, how none of the cable people are worried about offending Clinton supporters in the way they’re worried about offending Trump supporters. Hillary Clinton has gotten millions and millions of votes over the years as both a Senator and twice in a primary. Votes, not poll numbers or “do you trust her?” polling questions. Is hers a constituency that matters, one that needs to be courted and retained as viewers, and if not, why not?

    The Clinton campaign had “visibility” events all over Ohio yesterday. There were a small group of women outside our Clinton headquarters yesterday participating- all women, all older. Are they somehow less valuable voters than the men at Trump rallies?

  13. 13.

    Kropadope

    October 13, 2016 at 6:42 am

    Obama, the case against term limits.

    @Kay:

    It’s always interesting, too, how none of the cable people are worried about offending Clinton supporters in the way they’re worried about offending Trump supporters.

    A question of concern for personal safety, perhaps?

  14. 14.

    TS

    October 13, 2016 at 6:46 am

    @Kay: When – for a short time – Joe and the offsider went negative on Trump the latter immediately tweeted as to what he knew about this pair. I think he threatened to reveal some things they do not want revealed. Whether there is anything in writing – I think Joe knows to NOT put things in writing – Mika – not so much.

  15. 15.

    BlueDWarrior

    October 13, 2016 at 6:46 am

    @Kropadope: Perhaps, but I think it’s just going toward the concern that most cable news watchers are white and over 50, which is a demographic that screams “conservative” unless you’re MSNBC, where it more screams “totebagger”.

  16. 16.

    OzarkHillbilly

    October 13, 2016 at 6:46 am

    @Kay: Yes.

  17. 17.

    Immanentize

    October 13, 2016 at 6:47 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: I worked on the earliest of the actual innocence claims in Herrera v. Collins case. You are right that Rehnquist haunts us still with the idea that innocence is not enough to get relief in habeas corpus proceedings without some additional claim of error. But that idea was dispelled, I thought, in later cases. It is painful to see an appeals court return to it.

  18. 18.

    Patricia Kayden

    October 13, 2016 at 6:48 am

    @p.a.: Good for you. We’re in the final stretch and looks like she’s running ahead. Yay!!

  19. 19.

    Kay

    October 13, 2016 at 6:50 am

    @Kropadope:

    It’s nice. They’re really optimistic and excited about her presidency. Most of them voted for her in a primary twice and she won the state both times. This is a long time coming for them.

    If they’re looking for a positive story after this depressing shit show of an election, they could talk to supporters of Hillary Clinton. Millions and millions of people have voted for her.

  20. 20.

    Patricia Kayden

    October 13, 2016 at 6:50 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: Outrageous. That is why we should be against the death penalty. Too many of its proponents are ok with innocent people being out to death by the state.

  21. 21.

    Patricia Kayden

    October 13, 2016 at 6:52 am

    @TS: Someone should ask Joe about that intern he murdered while he was a married man. Let him that is without sin cast the first stone and all that jazz.

  22. 22.

    Thoughtful David

    October 13, 2016 at 6:52 am

    @Jeffro:
    No. It’s great.
    Gonna miss him.

  23. 23.

    TS

    October 13, 2016 at 6:52 am

    @Kay: Trump supporters seem to be more likely to take offense and become violent. The continuous attacks on the press at the rallies is a good example.

    For the good news the WP endorsed Hillary today & specifically noted it is not an #anyonebutTrump endorsement

    No, we are not making this endorsement simply because Ms. Clinton’s chief opponent is dreadful.
    Republican presidential nominee Donald Trump is dreadful, that is true — uniquely unqualified as a presidential candidate. If we believed that Ms. Clinton were the lesser of two evils, we might well urge you to vote for her anyway — that is how strongly we feel about Mr. Trump. But we would also tell you that was our judgment. Fortunately, it is not.

    WP Endorsement

  24. 24.

    Kropadope

    October 13, 2016 at 6:53 am

    @Patricia Kayden: As long as the good poll numbers don’t lead to complacency, but rather an urgent desire to press the advantage, this is good.

    Also, my friend who was with Trump from day one saw the debates and changed his mind just like that. News is that Trump don’t know shit.

  25. 25.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    October 13, 2016 at 6:53 am

    @Kay: Joe answered that. You see, they really don’t like Hillary, but they secretly vote for her because her opponents suck.

  26. 26.

    Kay

    October 13, 2016 at 6:57 am

    @TS:

    They were gross in their groveling to Trump and I won’t forget. Chris Matthews too.

    Trump is “a builder” and a “successful businessman”. Yeah, right. Anyone who repeated that because Trump said it is an absolute moron. This stuff was always out there- it was all over the place. His business failures were reported by both the NYTimes and Bloomberg. They deliberately ignored it. That’s not even including the fact that Trump is a sexist pig, which was ALSO on record, in reams of interviews and media appearances.

  27. 27.

    TS

    October 13, 2016 at 6:57 am

    @Patricia Kayden: I have no idea why that is never mentioned in the media – truly weird – especially when he continually attacks every politician he tries to ruin.

    Now Joke is discussing that Hillary should be indicted – and why doesn’t the WP endorsement mention this. They are now attacking the WP spokesperson in regard to the endorsement – He is holding his own.

  28. 28.

    Schlemazel

    October 13, 2016 at 6:58 am

    @Kropadope:
    I think part of all the shit-shoveling Drumpf is doing at Bill is really designed to depress the turnout. “They are both so dirty” sort of stupidity. I hear people talking like that. I am not sure it will work given what an evil clown Drumpf is.

  29. 29.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    October 13, 2016 at 6:58 am

    @Patricia Kayden: Joe Conason said something about that when he was on Morning Joe once, he’s not been invited back.

  30. 30.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    October 13, 2016 at 7:01 am

    @TS: That’s not the WP spokesman, that’s the WP editor.

  31. 31.

    BlueDWarrior

    October 13, 2016 at 7:01 am

    @TS: Joe is at his worst when he goes into Clinton Derangement mode, and it’s so easy to tell when he’s about to pop. Basically everyone who is a Clinton supporter comes on and intones, if just not outright says when Joe starts talking about how much this campaign has hit the dregs “Well maybe if ya boy didn’t drag it into the mud kicking and screaming by insulting literally everyone not in his core base then maybe we wouldn’t be here.”

    Also Trump had to know these tapes were sitting out there and that he would have to answer to these myriad accusations; if anything, I think they were waiting for them to drop so he and Bannon and the rest of them could go Total Nuclear War on the entire campaign. It really does seem like their aim is to poison the well so thoroughly people are going to be begging for a dictator, just to spare us another Presidential campaign. (And do we have just the dictator for you!)

  32. 32.

    OzarkHillbilly

    October 13, 2016 at 7:02 am

    @Immanentize: The idea is that cases like this is what the pardons process is for. Gov Pence has put the lie to that.

    @Patricia Kayden: One of the major arguments against the death penalty has always been the fact that there is no appeal that can bring an innocent man/woman back to life. In this case the man was given to 2 life sentences and still can’t get judicial relief. So what’s the diff?

  33. 33.

    Baud

    October 13, 2016 at 7:02 am

    @Kay:

    Hillary supporters are the ones rigging the vote…by voting! Can’t encourage those people.

  34. 34.

    Kay

    October 13, 2016 at 7:03 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA:

    They’re not important because they’re older women who don’t make a lot of noise and aren’t strutting around bellowing curses and bullying people. The visibility events were positive. It was women smiling with those giant printed campaign signs outside the headquarters, waving at cars. There were two little boys, probably someone’s grandchildren. That’s okay- they’ll get their revenge- they vote. Every election.

  35. 35.

    BlueDWarrior

    October 13, 2016 at 7:04 am

    @Kay: Wouldn’t it be highly ironic if the most Nixonian candidate lost due to a new Silent Majority.

  36. 36.

    MomSense

    October 13, 2016 at 7:07 am

    @Jeffro:

    Nope. That was a moving video.

  37. 37.

    Geoduck

    October 13, 2016 at 7:07 am

    @Kropadope: Even if Obama could run again, I doubt that he would. I’d vote for him of course if he did.

  38. 38.

    Kropadope

    October 13, 2016 at 7:07 am

    @Schlemazel:

    “They are both so dirty” sort of stupidity. I hear people talking like that.

    I do too, but only the usual suspects.

    @Geoduck:

    Even if Obama could run again, I doubt that he would.

    True, but I would feel a lot better knowing it was his choice.

  39. 39.

    Baud

    October 13, 2016 at 7:10 am

    GMA says Trump pulling out of Virginia.

  40. 40.

    SiubhanDuinne, liberal mob enforcer bitch

    October 13, 2016 at 7:11 am

    Wow! Bob Dylan won the Nobel Prize for Literature!

  41. 41.

    Kropadope

    October 13, 2016 at 7:11 am

    @BlueDWarrior:

    Wouldn’t it be highly ironic if the most Nixonian candidate lost due to a new Silent Majority.

    You mean an actual silent majority? The last one was actually pretty loud in my experience.

  42. 42.

    TS

    October 13, 2016 at 7:12 am

    @Kay:

    That’s not even including the fact that Trump is a sexist pig, which was ALSO on record, in reams of interviews and media appearances.

    This was the conspiracy this am – none of the recent abuse of women stories came out earlier because the Clinton campaign wanted it kept under wraps until just before the election. This is the both sides – because Trump is attacking Bill Clinton they so so so want the women attacking Trump to have been brought to the forefront by Hillary Clinton. She is NOT going to do that. The both sides are in Joe’s head.

    Oh my heavens – Halperin is admitting Trump has a problem. Joke says the campaigns are both in the gutter – he is in serious denial.

    Now they are full of the “fightback” with Trump finding so many more women to accuse Bill Clinton.

  43. 43.

    Kropadope

    October 13, 2016 at 7:12 am

    @Baud:

    GMA says Trump pulling out of Virginia.

    Good for Virginia and good for the USA we won’t have to worry about more baby Trumps. Wait…

  44. 44.

    Kay

    October 13, 2016 at 7:13 am

    @BlueDWarrior:

    They should wear an AR-15 or a t-shirt denigrating men if they want to be taken “seriously”. This carrying around clipboards and going door to door isn’t exciting enough.

  45. 45.

    Elizabelle

    October 13, 2016 at 7:14 am

    Bob Dylan won the Nobel Prize for Literature?!

    Is that confirmed? Email alert from the LA Times.

  46. 46.

    MomSense

    October 13, 2016 at 7:14 am

    @Baud:

    Why I just rigged the vote yesterday — by voting. Felt great.

  47. 47.

    OzarkHillbilly

    October 13, 2016 at 7:14 am

    @BlueDWarrior:

    Also Trump had to know these tapes were sitting out there and that he would have to answer to these myriad accusations;

    Obviously you’ve never met an actual honest to Gawd rich person. They never have to answer for anything. That’s what lawyers are for.

  48. 48.

    Baud

    October 13, 2016 at 7:15 am

    @TS: Someone should remind Joe that neither Donald nor Bill have been associated with a dead intern.

  49. 49.

    TS

    October 13, 2016 at 7:15 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA:

    That’s not the WP spokesman, that’s the WP editor.

    Thanks – I’ve not seen him before – missed the introduction.

  50. 50.

    Mary G

    October 13, 2016 at 7:15 am

    Bob Dylan won the 2016 Nobel Prize for literature. Cool.

  51. 51.

    Elizabelle

    October 13, 2016 at 7:16 am

    It’s true. LA Times:

    Bob Dylan was announced as the winner of the Nobel Prize in Literature on Thursday morning.

    Dylan was awarded the prize “for having created new poetic expressions within the American song tradition.”

    The American musician had long been rumored to be considered for the prize, but literary watchers considered his name among those in the running a novelty. The room of watchers at the Swedish academy seemed shocked by the announcement in a Web broadcast.

    Yippee! And as startling as PBO’s win.

  52. 52.

    Baud

    October 13, 2016 at 7:16 am

    @MomSense: Cool. Who’d you vote for? ;-)

  53. 53.

    Kropadope

    October 13, 2016 at 7:16 am

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    Obviously you’ve never met an actual honest to Gawd rich person. They never have to answer for anything. That’s what lawyers are for.

    I can see that helping with avoiding serious consequences. Vote-getting? Not so much.

  54. 54.

    OzarkHillbilly

    October 13, 2016 at 7:17 am

    Imagine what the 2016 presidential election would be like if Alaska Airlines were in charge. Donald Trump would have been shown the door a long, long time ago.

    On 9 October, the Seattle-based air carrier kicked a passenger off of flight 520 from Seattle to Burbank for harassing a female flight attendant.

    The man in question didn’t call the attendant “disgusting”. He didn’t say she had “the face of a dog”. He didn’t call her “a neurotic and not very bright mess”. He didn’t walk in on her while she was naked and expecting privacy, or brag about grabbing her genitalia or force a kiss on her.

    Those actions do not disqualify one from being a Republican presidential candidate. But they would keep someone out of even a middle seat on Alaska Airlines.

    ETA: Wrote one woman: “Does this mean someone will ask Trump to gather his belongings and exit the country?”

  55. 55.

    Elizabelle

    October 13, 2016 at 7:18 am

    @SiubhanDuinne, liberal mob enforcer bitch:

    Love it!

    It’s a great selection, actually. Whole body of work. Also a well regarded memoir. Congrats Bob Dylan.

  56. 56.

    SiubhanDuinne, liberal mob enforcer bitch

    October 13, 2016 at 7:19 am

    @SiubhanDuinne, liberal mob enforcer bitch: @Elizabelle:
    @Mary G:

    Deserves a dedicated post later in the day. Hope some FP will put one up.

  57. 57.

    Kay

    October 13, 2016 at 7:20 am

    @TS:

    none of the recent abuse of women stories came out earlier because the Clinton campaign wanted it kept under wraps until just before the election.

    Oh, bullshit. She’s not the Ruler of the Universe. It didn’t “come out” because Republican operatives were too stupid and blind and scared to look for it. He said all this shit on tape, most of it on the Howard Stern show. They know he’s been interviewed 50,000 times over decades.

    It didn’t occur to any of them that someone who talks about his daughter like that is incredibly fucked up? They had PLENTY to indicate where they should look and what they should look for. It’s been reported since March. There were stories indicating this since March.

    He ran beauty pageants and he’s a pig. 1 + 1 = 2 Seriously, do they need a roadmap? Buzzfeed is the only outlet that interviewed the contestants? This is their job. Why is Hillary Clinton doing it for them?

  58. 58.

    debbie

    October 13, 2016 at 7:20 am

    @Kay:

    It’s the Trumpster’s Principle: Horrible when Bill did it; okay that Donald also does it because Bill did it.

  59. 59.

    OzarkHillbilly

    October 13, 2016 at 7:21 am

    @Baud: Yeah but, Vince Foster.

  60. 60.

    debbie

    October 13, 2016 at 7:22 am

    @SiubhanDuinne, liberal mob enforcer bitch:

    Finally! About time!

  61. 61.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    October 13, 2016 at 7:23 am

    @Mary G: Nobody will understand a word he says in his acceptance speech.

  62. 62.

    Baud

    October 13, 2016 at 7:25 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: Has any “respectable” person gone there with Vince Foster? That does seem to be a line they won’t cross…yet.

  63. 63.

    rikyrah

    October 13, 2016 at 7:26 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: that is horrific ???

  64. 64.

    Shalimar

    October 13, 2016 at 7:27 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: The state Supreme Court sets judicial precedent for a state. I have no idea whether the appeals court is interpreting the current precedent correctly, but it should be moot after the case reaches the Missouri Supreme Court. If the Missouri Supreme Court doesn’t rule that actual innocence is grounds for overturning any conviction, then that will be the outrage.

  65. 65.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    October 13, 2016 at 7:27 am

    OT: I got a new printer today, it handles 13×19 paper. It’s yoooge!

  66. 66.

    rikyrah

    October 13, 2016 at 7:27 am

    @Kay:
    You have been on point all election season, Kay.

  67. 67.

    OzarkHillbilly

    October 13, 2016 at 7:28 am

    @Kropadope:

    Vote-getting? Not so much.

    Nonono…. This is TRUMP! we’re talking about. He’s the BEST! The GREATEST! The YOOOOGEST! He WINS! everywhere he goes. The Laws of Nature do not apply to him. He can defy gravity! Women LOVE! him. He should know, he’s raped enough of them.

    Trump is not the first rich person to think he is the Savior of the Universe, just the latest and at the moment, the loudest.

  68. 68.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    October 13, 2016 at 7:28 am

    @Baud: Vince Foster being Hillary’s lesbian lover or that she killed him?

  69. 69.

    MomSense

    October 13, 2016 at 7:30 am

    @Baud:

    I thought about writing in Baud.

  70. 70.

    rikyrah

    October 13, 2016 at 7:31 am

    @Kay:
    Come on Kay. Obama won twice, and somehow his coalition is a fluke. All the working class voters are White. White voters are studied into segments… White with college, no college, blue collar, white collar. While non-Whites are all lumped together.

  71. 71.

    hovercraft

    October 13, 2016 at 7:32 am

    @rikyrah:
    Good morning.

  72. 72.

    Patricia Kayden

    October 13, 2016 at 7:32 am

    Trump just can’t keep his puny hands to himself.

  73. 73.

    rikyrah

    October 13, 2016 at 7:33 am

    @TS:
    Joe has an actual DEAD BODY in his past. Only a White man could have an actual dead body in their past and get a tv gig like this.

  74. 74.

    TS

    October 13, 2016 at 7:34 am

    @Baud: If only

    My language in describing my thoughts/pundits b.s. is somewhat disorganized and not as precise as I wish it could be – I still have visions of Trump stalking Hillary around the stage on Sunday night & this vision is impacting my thought process. My one overriding thought is how can anyone vote for Donald Trump. I remember every election since 1960 – Trump is even lower than Goldwater in who is viable to lead the United States.

    In between attacking the Clintons, Joke & Mika are saying that Hillary will be so much better than Obama in the WH – because she knows how to work the system and has so much political experience. They are g.d. blaming the President because republicans in congress won’t talk to him.
    This is such a conflict with them wanting Trump to win the election – he would be a disaster trying to work with congress.

    I am rambling again – sorry.

  75. 75.

    MJS

    October 13, 2016 at 7:34 am

    @Kay: The short answer to your question is “yes”, they are less valuable as viewers, because whether it’s Morning Joe, or any of the idiot shows on Fox, they are not interested in actual thinking viewers. Viewers who think don’t stick around long, because they see rather quickly that the hosts of these shows, and there guests, do not think. These shows are for the people who can’t be bothered to actually read anything beyond their Facebook page.

  76. 76.

    Kay

    October 13, 2016 at 7:35 am

    This is what shoulda sunk him:

    Trump has never apologized for calling for our murder. In fact, despite all evidence to the contrary, he’s still convinced that we were guilty. When the Republican nominee was recently asked about the Central Park Five, he said, “They admitted they were guilty.” In a statement to CNN’s Miguel Marquez, Trump wrote, “The police doing the original investigation say they were guilty. The fact that that case was settled with so much evidence against them is outrageous. And the woman, so badly injured, will never be the same.” It’s further proof of his bias, racism and inability to admit that he’s wrong.
    When I heard Trump’s latest proclamation, it was like the worst feeling in the world. I felt as if I couldn’t breathe. Since I was 15, my life has never been my own. I had no control over what happened to me. Being in the spotlight makes me wary and self-conscious again. I am overwhelmed with a nagging fear that an overzealous Trump supporter might take matters into his or her hands.

    Make sure you vote and get others out. Think how pleased this Trump victim will be when Trump and his supporters suffer a humiliating defeat on election night.

  77. 77.

    rikyrah

    October 13, 2016 at 7:35 am

    @Kay:
    Tell that truth.

  78. 78.

    Punchy

    October 13, 2016 at 7:35 am

    Why the hell does every morning thread start with such grief over what some GOP cheerleader and his mistress are saying about the Dems? Why do I care, and why would anyone expect something other than a complete trashing of the Dem party?

  79. 79.

    Elizabelle

    October 13, 2016 at 7:36 am

    @Kay:
    @TS:

    [Comments by] University of Maryland broadcast journalism professor and former NBC employee Mark Feldstein, [to USA Today in a story about Billy Bush]:

    “I think Billy Bush deserves to lose his job, not just because of the misogyny of his comments but because he clearly knew about this videotape and the remarks Trump made and concealed it from the public and his bosses at NBC for some time,” Feldstein says. “This is the biggest story of the political season, and he knew about it and did not report it. A journalist’s job is to report the news, not cover it up.”

    Feldstein says he blames “media conglomeration” for a pattern of TV’s journalistic failures.

    “This seems to be a pattern with NBC,” he says. “Their executives at the top are making decisions that have nothing to do with journalism and are based on political and public-relations PR ramifications. NBC has disgraced itself in the way it has covered the election — and I say this as someone who used to work there and likes them.”

    This episode is the “apotheosis of entertainment values taking over the politics and news coverage,” Feldstein says. “It’s the real story of the 2016 campaign and one key factor is the huge mergers that have allowed media conglomeration.”

    We need to get a handle on this. We should break up the huge media conglomerates, and could. Some are actively distorting our democratic process.

  80. 80.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    October 13, 2016 at 7:36 am

    @TS:

    They are g.d. blaming the President because republicans in congress won’t talk to him.

    That’s Conventional Wisdom in DC. It’s not true, but everyone in the DC and NYC media know it to be true.

  81. 81.

    Patricia Kayden

    October 13, 2016 at 7:38 am

    @Kropadope:

    News is that Trump don’t know shit.

    That has been news from the very beginning of his joke campaign. How are people just discovering that fact now? Trump is a reality star and a sleazy businessman with a serving of bigotry on the side. Nothing about him is presidential. You cannot say the same for McCain (despite his horrendous decision to choose Palin as a running mate) or Romney (despite his robot-likeness). Republicans have sunk their party into the mud by nominating Trump.

  82. 82.

    Botsplainer

    October 13, 2016 at 7:38 am

    My happiness over Griftwald’s very public pantsing over John Podesta’s privacy rights (along with those who corresponded with him) is enhanced by the battles currently going on at Kos.

    My take is this:

    1. Assange is guaranteeing himself a prison cell once the Ecuadorians heave him, his crusty bathrobe and his hypoallergenic pillow out the front gate;

    2. Chelsea Manning gets to continue eating Nutriloaf until such time as Assange comes into the US correctional system;

    3. Snowjob will get to remain in Mother Russia until the end of his days;

    4. Griftwald’s target audience (and clicks) diminishes even further, as people realize that he has ALWAYS been a tool of the alt-right, as he always takes the fanboi position.

    And Glenn, if you’re reading this, fuck you and the horse you rode in on, you nazi fluffing asshole. Your buddy Assange never got around to hitting the Kochs, ALEC, the NRA, Adelson, DeVos or anybody that makes our lives worse.

  83. 83.

    OzarkHillbilly

    October 13, 2016 at 7:40 am

    @Shalimar:

    then that will be the outrage.

    Silly me, and I thought the outrage was that an innocent** man is in prison and these appellate judges are more concerned with judicial procedures than right and wrong. ;-) As to the MO supreme court, don’t hold your breath waiting for them to do the right thing.

    **apparently innocent, our judicial system is generally not capable of findings of actual innocence most of the time, hence a defendant is either ‘guilty’ or ‘not guilty’

  84. 84.

    Bruce K

    October 13, 2016 at 7:40 am

    My vote is in the mail, and this is one year I wasn’t about to write in Bill the Cat. (For Prime Minister of Greece, maybe. Not for President of the United States. Not this year.)

    What time are these bombshells hitting, anyway? Because thanks to the world being round, I’m asleep at about 5pm Eastern time and these days, by the time I wake up at 1am Eastern time, all that’s left is the mushroom cloud and my Twitter and Facebook feeds tied in knots and me wondering what the hell happened while I was asleep. I swear it’s becoming a daily thing with me: wake up, flip on the computer, and wonder how the hell this election season could get crazier still…

  85. 85.

    Patricia Kayden

    October 13, 2016 at 7:41 am

    @Punchy: A lot of BJ commenters watch Morning Joe. I guess it’s a way for them to do penance for their many sins.

  86. 86.

    rikyrah

    October 13, 2016 at 7:44 am

    There is a stark divide between men and women being exposed with this election. Larry O had on a panel of 3 women to discuss the women who came forth with claims about Ferret Head. While reading the one woman’s account, the panel was just nodding their heads -they had been there, done that. Anna Marie Cox was visibly shaken by it, because it brought up bad memories for an incident in her own life.
    There is absolutely something rooted in misogyny at bringing forth claims against Bill Clinton as a way to try and disqualify Hillary. It is dismissive of her as a person in her own right. Hillary Clinton is a lot of things, but she has NEVER been a Trophy Wife. ???
    He stalked her around that stage, and every woman that remotely spoke about it, saw it and was disturbed by it.

  87. 87.

    Baud

    October 13, 2016 at 7:44 am

    @Botsplainer:

    Shouldn’t important journalists have their emails hacked so the public can know the truth about who they get their news from?

  88. 88.

    Baud

    October 13, 2016 at 7:45 am

    @rikyrah:

    It is dismissive of her as a person in her own right

    Feature, not bug.

  89. 89.

    Patricia Kayden

    October 13, 2016 at 7:46 am

    @Botsplainer: I used to enjoy reading Greenwald when he wrote for Salon but boy has he changed since then. His attacks on Democratic politicians such as President Obama and the Clintons are amazing given his softball fluffing of Republicans. You would think that a gay man would know who his enemies are (looking at you, Pence).

  90. 90.

    Kay

    October 13, 2016 at 7:47 am

    @rikyrah:

    I couldn’t watch that documentary. When the one volunteered to go in for questioning I just couldn’t watch the rest. That kills me, the good faith belief juveniles have that they’ll be treated fairly, that the adults will run this right. Children are programmed to please adults- they’re vulnerable and it’s one of the ways they survive. He’s right when he says he has no control over what happened to him. Without some kind of ethical boundaries for adults they are screwed.

  91. 91.

    Baud

    October 13, 2016 at 7:47 am

    @Patricia Kayden: Pence is gay?

  92. 92.

    Jeffro

    October 13, 2016 at 7:47 am

    @Geoduck:

    Even if Obama could run again, I doubt that he would. I’d vote for him of course if he did.

    At a recent rally in VA with Michelle Obama, when the “four more years!” chant went up, y’all really should have seen the look on her face for a moment…”oh, NO” captures about 10% of it. But it was only for a second, and then she said, “thank you…just know that Barack and I will be spending the rest of our lives working for you all…”

    Going to miss them, but man do they deserve a break.

  93. 93.

    MattF

    October 13, 2016 at 7:47 am

    Bob Dylan wins Nobel Prize in Literature.

  94. 94.

    TS

    October 13, 2016 at 7:49 am

    @Patricia Kayden:

    A lot of BJ commenters watch Morning Joe. I guess it’s a way for them to do penance for their many sins.

    I do it to know the enemy. Usually I click off after 1 or 2 minutes. Currently watching them sink into desperate conspiracy theories has an element of entertainment.

  95. 95.

    Keith G

    October 13, 2016 at 7:50 am

    I am quite pleased that Bob Dylan won the Noble for lit. His was a voice ever present in my youth in the 60’s.

  96. 96.

    Kropadope

    October 13, 2016 at 7:50 am

    @Patricia Kayden:

    Romney (despite his robot-likeness). Republicans have sunk their party into the mud by nominating Trump.

    Let’s not forget, Romney lied his ass off, maybe as bad as Trump. He was dredging from the same basket of deplorable policies. Is he that much better for not also being publicly racist?

  97. 97.

    Kay

    October 13, 2016 at 7:51 am

    @Baud:

    You have to love how GOP pundits and operatives are reveling in the Donna Brazile thing. I’d pay a lot to see the Bush operatives communications from the Florida recount. Watch what you wish for, hacks.

  98. 98.

    OzarkHillbilly

    October 13, 2016 at 7:52 am

    @Botsplainer: Why don’t you stop beating around the bush and tell us how you really feel? ;-)

  99. 99.

    Baud

    October 13, 2016 at 7:54 am

    @Kay: What is the Brazille thing exactly? When I don’t hear details, I assume it’s bullshit.

  100. 100.

    Kay

    October 13, 2016 at 8:00 am

    @Baud:

    I’m not following it either. Allegedly she had a debate question or the outlines of a debate question and gave it to the campaign. It just doesn’t matter to me. Clinton so dominated the debate(s) that it doesn’t matter.

    It’s funny to me because Democratic partisans, the real true believers, think Brazille is too conciliatory to Republicans. They think she’s a weak surrogate.

  101. 101.

    Patricia Kayden

    October 13, 2016 at 8:01 am

    @Baud: Baud, you know what I was saying. Stop playing so early in the morning.

  102. 102.

    OzarkHillbilly

    October 13, 2016 at 8:01 am

    @Baud: Considering his homophobia I’d say the odds are about 50/50.

  103. 103.

    rikyrah

    October 13, 2016 at 8:01 am

    @SiubhanDuinne, liberal mob enforcer bitch:
    I thought I heard that on the radio this morning… It’s true??? ???

  104. 104.

    WesternPALurker

    October 13, 2016 at 8:01 am

    How do these two strategies work together?

    Bannon says they’re going to dig up more women from the past to accuse the Clintons.

    Trump spokesperson Delgado on ‘All In with Chris Hayes says re: Trump’s latest accusers: ‘These allegations are decades old. If somebody actually did that, Chris, any reasonable woman would have come forward and said something at the time.’

  105. 105.

    Baud

    October 13, 2016 at 8:03 am

    @Patricia Kayden: Yes, ma’am.

  106. 106.

    Botsplainer

    October 13, 2016 at 8:03 am

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    It would be an interesting thing to continually tweet at Wikileaks:

    “Where are the hacks on the Kochs, the NRA and ALEC?

  107. 107.

    sherparick

    October 13, 2016 at 8:07 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: Prior to the last month, has Trump ever had to answer for anything? The answer is obviously “no.”

    The e-mails reveal that “shockingly” a political campaign was practicing politics, trying to spin reporters, and trying to get feedback and information about matters impacting the campaign from contacts, friends, & acquaintances outside the campaign. Brazille, while working as a the clearly labelled “Democratic” talking head on CNN last March e-mail Podesta or someone in the Clinton campaign the subject of the death penalty may come up in a upcoming debate on CNN. This was framed in “Wikileaks” as some sort of great scandal, giving Clinton a heads up about the a particular question that would be asked, although it in fact was not the question asked.

  108. 108.

    Kay

    October 13, 2016 at 8:09 am

    The supervising editor on the first six seasons of “The Apprentice” says that Donald Trump would make comments about women between takes on the set like “I’d like to drill her,” and also made comments about women “he found less attractive,” according to a story posted on Wednesday in CineMontage, the journal of the Motion Picture Editors Guild.
    The editor, Jonathan Braun, who was also co-producer for one season, recalled that Trump’s “favorite word was ‘drill.’ He was always saying between takes, ‘I’d like to drill her,’ lewdly referring to female crew members working on set. He couldn’t help himself making comments about women and the way they looked. He also had comments about women he found less attractive. There was no question he took the men a lot more seriously than the women.”

    They apparently couldn’t threaten all The Apprentice people into silence. They’re not all venal cowards.

    How about those Christian conservatives, huh? 30 years of scolding everyone on morality and this is their candidate.

  109. 109.

    Baud

    October 13, 2016 at 8:10 am

    @sherparick: Thanks. As lame as I assumed.

  110. 110.

    sherparick

    October 13, 2016 at 8:10 am

    Morning Joke and Mika need to be careful about the sex scandal mudslinging at Bill as they both apparently live in a glass house. Bill may have Monica as an intern relationship gone bad on his record, but at least Monica was not found dead in the White House, as opposed to Joe’s intern in his office in Florida. Joe then resigned six months from Congress as his first marriage ended in divorce.

  111. 111.

    OzarkHillbilly

    October 13, 2016 at 8:11 am

    @Botsplainer: I’m sure there’s a reasonable explanation. “On the payroll” comes to mind.

  112. 112.

    Baud

    October 13, 2016 at 8:11 am

    @Kay:

    Trump’s “favorite word was ‘drill.’

    He is a blue collar hero. /Chris Matthews.

  113. 113.

    hovercraft

    October 13, 2016 at 8:12 am

    @TS:
    She knows how to do the blocking and tackling something we haven’t had in the WH with the last two presidents, says Joe. Mika just doesn’t know what to say about these new accusations. She’s just concerned about how far in the muck the campaign is going to be. Joshua Green has a piece on the Trump strategy.
    Joe is still trying to deflect with Bill Clinton and now he is trying to distract with the fact that things like this happened to Mika, from the same people in the media and politics who are now acting self righteous. Now Clinton is talking about Hillary and James Carville being in charge of the “sluts and nuts” shaming of these women in the 1990’s. Hillary should shut up about this and leave it to the media since there are people who remember the 90’s and her behavior.

  114. 114.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    October 13, 2016 at 8:19 am

    @Baud: “A Working Class Hero is something to be”.

  115. 115.

    hovercraft

    October 13, 2016 at 8:21 am

    Mark Halperin is pushing back on the panelists who think that this is an opo dump. Halperin says he believes that these women came out because of the Billy Bush and Trump’s answer to Anderson Cooper. Joke wants to equate the Megan Kelly question about his insults to women, with the tape and the answer, he thinks the timing is suspicious. Why now 4 weeks before the election, why not after the first debate. He says he’s not doubting the stories themselves, he’s skeptical about the timing. Everyone is pushing back on him. He gives just a smidge, says time will tell.

  116. 116.

    Brachiator

    October 13, 2016 at 8:23 am

    @SiubhanDuinne, liberal mob enforcer bitch:

    Wow! Bob Dylan won the Nobel Prize for Literature!

    Everybody must get stoned!

  117. 117.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    October 13, 2016 at 8:23 am

    @hovercraft: Joe doesn’t seem to understand the difference between calling women demeaning names and talking about the ability to commit sex crimes. Sort of the difference between getting a BJ from an intern and having a dead intern in your office.

  118. 118.

    Old Dan and Little Anne

    October 13, 2016 at 8:23 am

    Sadly, I look forward to the Morning Joke updates. Even though I quit watching over a year ago I still need my fix.

  119. 119.

    Baud

    October 13, 2016 at 8:23 am

    @hovercraft:

    He says he’s not doubting the stories themselves, he’s skeptical about the timing.

    As if I would criticize Hillary if she did orchestrate this.

  120. 120.

    Joel

    October 13, 2016 at 8:24 am

    @Kropadope: Yep, they’re scared.

    Personal safety is part of it. Job security is another — a coordinated harassment campaign would be enough to make a craven cable producer decide “enh, not worth it”.

  121. 121.

    OzarkHillbilly

    October 13, 2016 at 8:25 am

    @Kay: They are who we thought they were.

  122. 122.

    PIGL

    October 13, 2016 at 8:26 am

    @Immanentize: thinking about the judges, this has to be motivated reasoning, and the motive can only be evil.

  123. 123.

    Schlemazel

    October 13, 2016 at 8:26 am

    Interesting news in the security world. It appears the RNCs dear friends in Moscow installed malware on the RNC servers selling campaign crap & now own about 21,000 credit card numbers & 3 digit code numbers.

    My guess is this will be a concern unlike the email BS.

  124. 124.

    Shalimar

    October 13, 2016 at 8:26 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: Progress in court systems is very slow, but this is one of those obvious issues that will be set right eventually. Not eventually enough for the actually innocent man, unfortunately, because we are a horribly barbaric country in so many ways.

  125. 125.

    hueyplong

    October 13, 2016 at 8:26 am

    Anderson Cooper had to ask (I think) 3 times before Trump gave the substantive answer that, no, he hadn’t actually done the types of things that are talked about on the Access Hollywood video. The flat “no” answer makes everyone in the US other than Morning Joe think now is exactly when you’d expect a bunch of those stories to appear.

    The victims picked up the phone that night or the next day, and then it took a couple of days to do some sort of due diligence on the victim’s stories.

    A can’t think of any timing that makes more sense than now, Joe.

  126. 126.

    Joel

    October 13, 2016 at 8:28 am

    @rikyrah: Seriously. Someone should just straight drill him on that. I hope he goes down in flames with this election. The insular DC circle jerk has to die.

  127. 127.

    Hafabee

    October 13, 2016 at 8:31 am

    @Kropadope: I remember a bumper sticker back in the day: The Moral Majority is Neither. The same could be said for the so-called Silent Majority.

  128. 128.

    rikyrah

    October 13, 2016 at 8:32 am

    I am back from the farmer’s market. I bought some Apple Butter. What do you eat with Apple Butter?

  129. 129.

    MomSense

    October 13, 2016 at 8:32 am

    I’m going to keep the Obama sendoff (tears) and #pantsuitpower video on heavy rotation to make it through the rest of this election.

    Listened to about 5 minutes of Morning Joke and that was 5 minutes too many. Fucking Halperin was the one actually saying that the NYT has said that the women came to them on their own and there was no evidence of coordination while Joke was furiously insinuating that all of this had the stench of oppo research about it. Oh and he threw in a couple of “sluts and nuts” for good measure. Then he actually said something about going back 30 years in his life at which point I yelled “Dead Intern” at my car radio and wanted to drive back home and take another shower.

    Apparently Joke can’t get it through his wee little brain that der Trump’s decision to bring the accusers out for a North Korean style presser before a debate where he then lied about ever groping women might blowback on his campaign.

  130. 130.

    hovercraft

    October 13, 2016 at 8:33 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA:
    @Baud:
    It has to be about the Clintons and it has to be their fault. The Clenis trials were his baptism into DC and are his default setting. Everything must be filtered through that lens. The Clintons managed to survive and prosper after Joe and his ilk threw everything they had at them, they are more successful and admired that he will every be in spite of what Joe’s best efforts, and no matter what their detractors do they keep gaining more successes.

  131. 131.

    OzarkHillbilly

    October 13, 2016 at 8:33 am

    @Baud: Apparently it’s OK that Trump did. More misogyny!

  132. 132.

    danielx

    October 13, 2016 at 8:33 am

    @Kay:

    Clinton supporters are likely to write nasty letters and protest, mostly peacefully. Trump supporters are likely to start pulling out firearms….I suspect, without having any real grounds for it, that the correlation between being a Trump supporter and ownership of more than a couple of guns is pretty high.

  133. 133.

    Joel

    October 13, 2016 at 8:34 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: Well let’s not let them off the hook!

    RIP Denny Green

  134. 134.

    MomSense

    October 13, 2016 at 8:35 am

    @rikyrah:

    Everything. Biscuits hot out of the oven is my favorite but toast, croissant, english muffin…. oh dear I’m very hungry now.

  135. 135.

    raven

    October 13, 2016 at 8:36 am

    @rikyrah: Toast

  136. 136.

    TS

    October 13, 2016 at 8:36 am

    @Schlemazel:

    malware on the RNC servers

    RNC? Not DNC? Did the russians forget who they were supposed to be supporting?

  137. 137.

    Iowa Old Lady

    October 13, 2016 at 8:37 am

    @WesternPALurker: To that, I would like to say screw Delgado. The first time I remember being groped I was out to dinner with my family and the waiter brushed the back of his hand across my breasts every time he put a plate in front of me or cleared it. I thought it was a mistake the first time, but he kept doing it. I didn’t know what to do so I did nothing. I never even told my parents. I was 17.

  138. 138.

    MomSense

    October 13, 2016 at 8:37 am

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    That is an outrage.

  139. 139.

    The Lodger

    October 13, 2016 at 8:39 am

    @Shalimar: Don’t expect the Missouri Supreme Court to come up with an opinion promptly; state supreme courts can take years to deliver.

  140. 140.

    SiubhanDuinne, liberal mob enforcer bitch

    October 13, 2016 at 8:39 am

    @rikyrah:

    Good morning! Yes, it is true, and really great news.

  141. 141.

    satby

    October 13, 2016 at 8:41 am

    @Botsplainer:

    It would be an interesting thing to continually tweet at Wikileaks:

    “Where are the hacks on the Kochs, the NRA and ALEC?

    Challenge accepted

  142. 142.

    scav

    October 13, 2016 at 8:41 am

    @rikyrah: Agree with raven. Start with toast, simple toast. It’ll come to you. Having a little cinnamon or nutmeg nearby to sprinkle works for some.

  143. 143.

    Kay

    October 13, 2016 at 8:42 am

    @Baud:

    As if I would criticize Hillary if she did orchestrate this.

    It’s clever and politics ain’t beanbag when men fight, but when women fight it’s sneaky and underhanded. Always.

    That’s kind of a sexist classic in WomanWorld.

    These pundits are dinosaurs. They don’t even hear the bias. They’re more rigidly conventional than any small town Rotary Club member. Jesus Christ, I expect them to start calling the ancient Donald Trump a “playboy”

    It’s not an accident that Ailes behavior was covered up for decades. They all went along.

  144. 144.

    Jeffro

    October 13, 2016 at 8:42 am

    @rikyrah: @MomSense: I’d second what MomSense said…it’s good on biscuits, toast, and so on.

    If you’re feeling adventurous, try spreading some on a grilled ham & cheese, just before you put the two sides together – maybe something like fontina cheese and black forest ham? Mmm, I might have to make that at home sometime soon. The Fro family is all about trying different grilled cheese variations now that the weather’s cooling off…

  145. 145.

    raven

    October 13, 2016 at 8:42 am

    Liberty University students protest association with Trump

    “We are Liberty students who are disappointed with President Falwell’s endorsement and are tired of being associated with one of the worst presidential candidates in American history,” the statement said. “Donald Trump does not represent our values and we want nothing to do with him. … He has made his name by maligning others and bragging about his sins. Not only is Donald Trump a bad candidate for president, he is actively promoting the very things that we as Christians ought to oppose.”

  146. 146.

    OzarkHillbilly

    October 13, 2016 at 8:42 am

    @Shalimar:

    but this is one of those obvious issues that will be set right eventually.

    When it finally reaches a Federal court. (the MO SC may make a liar out of me, but I’ve yet to lose any money betting against them)

  147. 147.

    NotMax

    October 13, 2016 at 8:42 am

    Schism.

    Students at the evangelical Liberty University are breaking with school president Jerry Falwell Jr. over his support of Donald Trump, issuing a statement Wednesday night saying “we want nothing to do with him.”

    Claiming that Trump is “actively promoting the very things that we as Christians ought to oppose,” the statement from Liberty United Against Trump, which was obtained by The Washington Post, criticizes Falwell Jr. for tying the university’s name to a man who bragged about and is accused of sexually assaulting women.

    “Any faculty or staff member at Liberty would be terminated for such comments, and yet when Donald Trump makes them, President Falwell rushes eagerly to his defense – taking the name ‘Liberty University” with him,” the statement reads.
    [snip]
    Asked by the Post to respond to his students’ statement, Falwell Jr. called it “incoherent and false,” though he commended them for speaking up. Source

  148. 148.

    Schlemazel

    October 13, 2016 at 8:42 am

    @TS:
    They know very well who they support – PUTIN! The RNC has been laughing along without a clue but the Russians will gladly do them when it suits their needs. Not surprisingly the GOP will hop into bed with anyone they think advances their short-term goals without a thought as to the long-term consequences.

  149. 149.

    Baud

    October 13, 2016 at 8:43 am

    @Kay: Trump is a scamp! Who doesn’t love scamps?

  150. 150.

    hovercraft

    October 13, 2016 at 8:43 am

    @WesternPALurker:
    Since when has it been necessary for anything Trump or his campaign made sense. Just because a rule applies to the Clintons doesn’t mean it applies to Trump.
    Settling lawsuit implies that Bill was guilty in Jones case, but not in the dozens that Trump settled. Old allegations are old against Trump, but pertinent against Bill. His charity is private and can not be questioned, but every aspect of the Clinton Foundation must be examined.

  151. 151.

    Matt McIrvin

    October 13, 2016 at 8:44 am

    Now reading a long discussion with a guy who is voting for Trump because the whole Trump media/political phenomenon has him so disgusted that he wants to destroy the system and spite the media gatekeepers by voting for Trump.

    This is what we’ve come to. He has long chains of reasoning justifying this.

  152. 152.

    MomSense

    October 13, 2016 at 8:45 am

    @Jeffro:

    Smoked turkey, sharp cheddar, apple butter, lettuce, bit of dijon. This is bad. I might drop everything and run to the deli counter right now.

  153. 153.

    Patricia Kayden

    October 13, 2016 at 8:45 am

    @raven: Fallwell Sr. was a racist douche so the apple hasn’t fallen far from the tree. They can forgive Trump’s shortcomings but can’t extend the same to President Clinton. The hypocrisy is astounding. Good on those few students for speaking out. Wonder if there will be any fallout for their actions.

  154. 154.

    sherparick

    October 13, 2016 at 8:46 am

    This story led to Kos being barred from MSNBC because he raised it once when discussing Bill Clinton’s history of indiscretions and alleged misdeeds and the treatment of Gary Condit after an intern in his office was murdered in DC. Probably somewhat unfair.

    http://miamiherald.typepad.com/nakedpolitics/2015/04/from-the-miami-herald-archives-the-last-time-joe-scarboroughs-name-was-floated-for-florida-senate.html

    http://gawker.com/remember-when-a-dead-intern-was-found-in-joe-scarboroug-1711985081

    http://gawker.com/remember-when-a-dead-intern-was-found-in-joe-scarboroug-1711985081

  155. 155.

    Patricia Kayden

    October 13, 2016 at 8:47 am

    @Matt McIrvin: He’s privileged and could give a damn about his fellow citizens who will be harmed by a Trump Presidency. How nice.

  156. 156.

    MomSense

    October 13, 2016 at 8:47 am

    @Jeffro:

    Ok here is my fave grilled cheese at the moment, but it works better with a press. Sourdough, provalone, swiss, american, avocado, red onion, tomato, and a tiny bit of cucumber dill dressing.

  157. 157.

    scav

    October 13, 2016 at 8:47 am

    @Iowa Old Lady: Indeed, whoever come up with the “no reasonable woman’ line of defense and those that okeyed it have about zero real experience of actual women and their non-hypothetical lives.

  158. 158.

    OzarkHillbilly

    October 13, 2016 at 8:48 am

    @rikyrah: It’s good n toast of course but I like to mix it with yogurt.

  159. 159.

    Matt McIrvin

    October 13, 2016 at 8:48 am

    @Patricia Kayden: Many people are trying to convince him of such things; no luck.

  160. 160.

    danielx

    October 13, 2016 at 8:49 am

    @TS:

    …Trump is even lower than Goldwater in who is viable to lead the United States.

    Much.

    Goldwater’s foreign policy positions were nuts, but at least he had a semi-coherent policy stance. As, for that matter, did Trump’s primary opponents. Love them or loathe them, they were at least semi-consistent in their views and worldview, allowing for the usual backtracking and the like when caught stepping in shit. Trump does not have anything like a consistent position on anything, except the superiority of Donald Trump to…to just about everyone, actually.

    Goldwater was at least aware of the responsibilities of the office and interested in doing the job. Trump has no interest in either.

  161. 161.

    Kay

    October 13, 2016 at 8:49 am

    @Baud:

    Ugh. The sticking his tongue down her throat with the reporter gave me a horrid visual. He’s always been gross to me. I can’t stand that broad, honking way of speaking he has, his pronunciation. If it were a word it would be “brag”.

  162. 162.

    hovercraft

    October 13, 2016 at 8:49 am

    @Kay:
    Today to my dismay I must defend the Morning Joe sycophants, all of them are pushing back on Joe. he was alone in voicing skepticism about the Clinton campaign orchestrating these women coming forward. They all said the women were understandably angered by Trump standing on stage and denying what these women knew to be true.

  163. 163.

    Baud

    October 13, 2016 at 8:50 am

    @Matt McIrvin: Pretext, thy name is bro.

  164. 164.

    WereBear

    October 13, 2016 at 8:51 am

    @rikyrah: Apple butter is awesome with pork chops. Also as the jam in peanut butter sandwiches. Has its toast fans, too.

  165. 165.

    raven

    October 13, 2016 at 8:51 am

    @Patricia Kayden: When my FIL was very ill I spent about a month working from he Panera at foot of Falwell Hill I would check out the students and faculty. It was strange, some of them seemed like normal people!

  166. 166.

    NotMax

    October 13, 2016 at 8:52 am

    @rikyrah

    All of the things already mentioned. Schmierkase (cottage cheese) and apple butter is a Pennsylvania Dutch favorite. Just stir ’em together.

    Not to everyone’s taste, but I occasionally use it on hot dogs as an alternative to mustard.

  167. 167.

    hovercraft

    October 13, 2016 at 8:53 am

    The new cover of TIME magazine.
    He’s melting, he’s melting.

    Now when Mike Lupica points out that Trump can’t have it both ways, on the old accusations can’t be believed. Joe pivots right back and says Hillary has the same problem.

  168. 168.

    Baud

    October 13, 2016 at 8:54 am

    @raven:

    That’s how they reel you in.

  169. 169.

    Jeffro

    October 13, 2016 at 8:55 am

    @raven: @NotMax:

    If the Liberty U students get loud enough about it, just imagine what Trump will say or Tweet about them, these good Christian kids…talk about scales falling from people’s eyes at that point…

  170. 170.

    raven

    October 13, 2016 at 8:55 am

    @Baud: Fat chance for this old atheist!

  171. 171.

    OzarkHillbilly

    October 13, 2016 at 8:55 am

    @raven: Huh. They noticed.

  172. 172.

    Matt McIrvin

    October 13, 2016 at 8:56 am

    @rikyrah: It’s good on toast, also surprisingly good on waffles.

  173. 173.

    nonynony

    October 13, 2016 at 8:56 am

    @NotMax:

    Claiming that Trump is “actively promoting the very things that we as Christians ought to oppose,” the statement from Liberty United Against Trump, which was obtained by The Washington Post, criticizes Falwell Jr. for tying the university’s name to a man who bragged about and is accused of sexually assaulting women.

    Asked by the Post to respond to his students’ statement, Falwell Jr. called it “incoherent and false,” though he commended them for speaking up.

    To be fair to Falwell Jr. – he’s right. There’s nothing about Trump that his version of Christianity has a problem with. His version of Christianity is based on a) bigotry and b) taking what you can when you can. Trump is a perfect example of Falwell’s Christianity.

    The problem is that the students at Liberty are young enough to actually believe the veneer of mainstream Christianity that Falwell wraps himself with to hide the fact that his version of Christianity is monstrous to regular people.

    Falwell is basically a Bizarro Jesus. An “anti-Christ” if you will. My hope is that some of the students there are young and impressionable enough to realize that they’re being fed lies.

  174. 174.

    Jeffro

    October 13, 2016 at 8:57 am

    @Matt McIrvin:

    Now reading a long discussion with a guy who is voting for Trump because the whole Trump media/political phenomenon has him so disgusted that he wants to destroy the system and spite the media gatekeepers by voting for Trump.

    This is what we’ve come to. He has long chains of reasoning justifying this.

    Remind him that the prion disease appears to have only infected half of our body politic…why doesn’t he come over to the competent, sane side and see if that is manageable? Remind him that all this coverage of Trump and Trump’s subsequent implosion is, in a way, pretty strong evidence that ‘the system’ works.

  175. 175.

    Kay

    October 13, 2016 at 8:57 am

    The two women who work up front listen to a country radio station that has trivia contests. The station just delivered a “lifetime hose”, which they said “I” won. One of them came up and grabbed it and said “if it were up to her we wouldn’t have this” – we do need a hose and I would not be competitive in any country music trivia speed contest. They’re multi-talented.

  176. 176.

    Jeffro

    October 13, 2016 at 8:59 am

    @MomSense:

    Ok here is my fave grilled cheese at the moment, but it works better with a press. Sourdough, provalone, swiss, american, avocado, red onion, tomato, and a tiny bit of cucumber dill dressing.

    That would work well for me hot or cold. That smoked turkey & cheddar combo sounds good too! Really, once you get away from ‘regular’ bread (whether one’s ‘regular’ is wheat or white) and American cheese, good things happen.

  177. 177.

    SiubhanDuinne, liberal mob enforcer bitch

    October 13, 2016 at 8:59 am

    @rikyrah:

    What do you eat with Apple Butter?

    Oh, yum, I love apple butter! Use it on anything you’d use jam, jelly or preserves on — bread, toast, English muffins, crumpets, pancakes, waffles — and if you eat dairy products, maybe have a nice chunk of sharp cheddar alongside.

  178. 178.

    Elizabelle

    October 13, 2016 at 9:00 am

    Politico link, but interesting: discussion with five authors of biographies about Trump. They’re not surprised by anything that has come out this fall.

    Politico: ‘I Think He’s a Very Dangerous Man for the Next Three or Four Weeks’

    Haven’t finished reading it, but it’s interesting and definitely not the usual “both sides” fodder.

  179. 179.

    Jeffro

    October 13, 2016 at 9:01 am

    @hovercraft:

    The new cover of TIME magazine.
    He’s melting, he’s melting.

    We’re watching history unfold before our very eyes…it’s weird knowing that, actually. “Make Government Boring Again” starts to sound more and more appealing…

  180. 180.

    SiubhanDuinne, liberal mob enforcer bitch

    October 13, 2016 at 9:01 am

    @MomSense:

    Biscuits hot out of the oven is my favorite

    Yes! How could I forget hot fresh biscuits!?

  181. 181.

    GregB

    October 13, 2016 at 9:04 am

    Is it time to end the security briefings for this cabal of Russian moles.

  182. 182.

    NotMax

    October 13, 2016 at 9:04 am

    @SiubhanDuinne, liberal mob enforcer bitch

    Also too on potato pancakes, mixed with some sour cream to cut the sweetness.

  183. 183.

    scav

    October 13, 2016 at 9:06 am

    @SiubhanDuinne, liberal mob enforcer bitch: Does anyone else remember putting red hots in it? It was so long ago that mom may gave been adding them to applesauce although it would work either way. The little pink halo they’d get probably more likely in applesauce.

  184. 184.

    Cermet

    October 13, 2016 at 9:08 am

    Glad to help again with the goal; we are in the last critical period and Hillary MUST win; can’t believe that it was this close. Says far, far too much about this country that I don’t like. SCARY and not in the Halloween sense either.

  185. 185.

    MomSense

    October 13, 2016 at 9:10 am

    @Jeffro:

    I don’t usually eat American cheese food but it does add to the melty quality of that grilled cheese.

    This discussion is making me really hungry!

  186. 186.

    NotMax

    October 13, 2016 at 9:11 am

    @GregB

    Based on Trump’s nonsense and gobbledegook about Syria, he doesn’t pay the slightest bit of attention at the briefings.

  187. 187.

    hueyplong

    October 13, 2016 at 9:13 am

    Good on the Liberty U students, including but not limited to throwing a little shade on Falwell Jr. Unlike him, they’re apparently fairly genuine in their beliefs.

  188. 188.

    SiubhanDuinne, liberal mob enforcer bitch

    October 13, 2016 at 9:14 am

    @scav:

    I certainly remember putting red hots in applesauce, and yes, I loved the way the red dye melted off and turned the surrounding applesauce pink :-)

    Apple butter is typically thicker and darker, so the “pink halos” wouldn’t have shown up as well.

  189. 189.

    jonas

    October 13, 2016 at 9:18 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: IIRC Scalia argued in a death penalty case a few years ago that actually being proven innocent does not give one standing to appeal a death sentence.

  190. 190.

    Shalimar

    October 13, 2016 at 9:22 am

    @The Lodger: I worked for the Alabama Supreme Court a few decades ago (before Roy Moore’s predecessor, when conservative Democrats still controlled the court). Yeah, I’m well acquainted with how backwards and slow they can be.

  191. 191.

    scav

    October 13, 2016 at 9:23 am

    @SiubhanDuinne, liberal mob enforcer bitch: Would indeed make more sense, although now I’m lest wondering why mom suddenly introduced candy into the house. Would certainly add a little zing to the butter, which would work for me. Ooo, the potato pancakes too, although I usually favored plain there — plus, putting stuff on them slowed one down and one had to be fast to compete with every else at the table.

  192. 192.

    OzarkHillbilly

    October 13, 2016 at 9:23 am

    @jonas: That was Rehnquist, would not surprise me in the least if Scalia was citing him tho.

  193. 193.

    jonas

    October 13, 2016 at 9:24 am

    @hueyplong: My own personal anecdata suggests that evangelical Christians who are actually serious about their faith commitments really deplore Trump and their leaders for supporting him. It’s the “yeah, sure, I’m an evangelical or whatever” pseudo-Christian dudebros who are all-in on Trump. They’ve never actually read a Bible, but think it’s political correctness run amok when a store clerk wishes them “happy holidays.”

  194. 194.

    OzarkHillbilly

    October 13, 2016 at 9:27 am

    @Shalimar:

    I worked for the Alabama Supreme Court a few decades ago

    You poor child…

  195. 195.

    dogwood

    October 13, 2016 at 9:31 am

    “Sometimes even the President of the United States must have to stand naked.” Positively 4th Street

    Congratulations to Dylan – so well-deserved.

  196. 196.

    sherparick

    October 13, 2016 at 9:34 am

    @sherparick: I need to correct this as the Gawker article pointed out that Scarborough resigned before Lori Klausutis’ death and really, there is no evidence any personal relationship between Ms. Klausutis and Scarborough beyond “employer – employee.”

    It is a temptation to “hit back” when folks at Scarborough jump at the least innuendo to attack Hillary, but the same standard of evidence and proof we want them to show in this case, we need to adhere to when the allegations are made against them. Two wrongs never make a right.

    Both Wiley’s and Broadericks stories had so many holes in them that Ken Starr and his team found the allegations against Bill unsubstantiated.

  197. 197.

    catclub

    October 13, 2016 at 9:39 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA:

    Hillary said mean things about these women

    They keep saying that, but I have never seen any quotes. I think that is mostly, if not completely, made up.

  198. 198.

    Gin & Tonic

    October 13, 2016 at 9:42 am

    @hueyplong:

    apparently fairly genuine in their beliefs.

    Why the qualifier? I read their statement last night, and it was a powerful indictment of their leadership, and completely well-founded in doctrine. It left no reason to believe the students signing it are anything but good and true believers. I may not agree with them on a lot of things, but I know enough to recognize where they are coming from and give them full credit for it.

  199. 199.

    catclub

    October 13, 2016 at 9:44 am

    @Jeffro:

    This is what we’ve come to. He has long chains of reasoning justifying this.

    Does he also have any credenzas to show you?

  200. 200.

    1,000 Flouncing Lurkers (was fidelioscabinet)

    October 13, 2016 at 9:45 am

    Shorter Joe Scarborough: “Waaah! The Democrats are not supposed to be good at this campaign dirty tricks stuff! That’s OUR thing!”

  201. 201.

    waysel

    October 13, 2016 at 9:52 am

    @catclub: The fact that we don’t see quotes is how we know it is completely made up. If they really had something, we’d hear it ad nauseum. Bigly.

  202. 202.

    Barbara

    October 13, 2016 at 9:55 am

    @catclub: It is fabricated — she has never said anything in public. There were accounts of what she said privately, and to be honest, I would be a little worried if she did not say mean things about the women involved to her friends. That would have made her pathologically nice. I dislike Trump with the intensity of the heat of a thousand suns, but he is being poorly served by his advisers. His on the record statements that are backed up by these women coming forward has nothing to do with Bill or Hillary Clinton, and the decades long obsession of the Roger Stones and Kellyanne Conways of the world is making them go off the rails in a very visible way. I don’t know anything about Jared Kushner but he seems to be coming out worse and worse with every decision he has a hand in, and Bannon just seems to be flat out delusional. He apparently thinks Paul Rubio and George Soros have entered into a conspiracy to effectuate one world government. How could anyone trust the judgment of someone like that.

  203. 203.

    acallidryas

    October 13, 2016 at 9:59 am

    Since I don’t think anyone’s added this yet, just a friendly reminder to volunteer. Even if you haven’t yet, there’s still time. Clinton’s campaign is looking for thousands of volunteers to GOTV election day weekend. Newcomers are welcome! AZ’s a toss up and even Utah is swingy this year. Let’s aim for a landslide, and get Hillary a democratic congress to work with.

    http://www.hillaryclinton.com

  204. 204.

    Shalimar

    October 13, 2016 at 10:02 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: -It wasn’t a bad job. I left after Karl Rove engineered a Republican takeover of the court (for which he would burn in Hell even if he had no other sins), so at least I missed that horror.

  205. 205.

    Original Lee

    October 13, 2016 at 10:05 am

    @Immanentize: IANAL, but wouldn’t there be a due process error that could be used?

  206. 206.

    NorthLeft12

    October 13, 2016 at 10:11 am

    @Matt McIrvin:

    This is what we’ve come to.

    Matt, I would suggest it might be a lot more accurate to say “This is what they have come to.”

    These RWNJs, white supremacists, sexual predators, Islamaphobes, and ignoramuses do not define most of the US public [IMO from up here in Canada]. Unfortunately, they seem to be a much larger minority than most wanted to admit, but exposing them for what they are may actually give you guys a chance to reset the boundaries of decency and civil discourse. Or make it worse.
    Best of luck!

  207. 207.

    hueyplong

    October 13, 2016 at 10:28 am

    @Gin & Tonic:

    “Why the qualifier?”

    Because that’s always how I say such things when all I know about people is what I’m reading on the topic at hand. Didn’t and don’t mean to cast aspersions on them.

  208. 208.

    Uncle Cosmo

    October 13, 2016 at 10:34 am

    @MJS:

    The short answer to your question is “yes”, they are less valuable as viewers, because whether it’s Morning Joe, or any of the idiot shows on Fox, they are not interested in actual thinking viewers.

    Commercial media exists to make a profit. Profit comes from entities (corporations, campaigns, individuals) who pay for the right to advertise on/in them. Entities pay for that right based on their judgement of potential profit from media consumers who will pay for their products or services. Advertising consistently avoids promoting the objective value of the product or service (sometimes because the good or service is not objectively superior in price or performance to those of the competitors) in preference to presenting it as a subjective panacea for the audience’s emotional &/or social needs.

    Viewers who think don’t stick around long, because they see rather quickly that the hosts of these shows, and there guests, do not think.

    Which disturbs the advertisers (& therefore the media) not at all: “Thoughtful consumers” buy based upon rational judgement of relative value versus need; they are mostly unmoved by appeals to emotional &/or social insecurities which are the basis of most contemporary advertising. The only eyeballs on the screen (or page) that concern the advertisers (& therefore the media) are those connected to people who can readily be persuaded to pay for what’s being advertised.

    (One could write [& many probably already have written] many tomes on the interaction between an increasingly fast, shifting, overwhelming, dog-eat-dog society that exacerbates individual insecurity & a consumer culture that takes advantage of this to transfer wealth from the bottom to the top of the wealth ziggurat. But that’s a topic for another time.)

  209. 209.

    Uncle Cosmo

    October 13, 2016 at 11:01 am

    @Brachiator:

    She was working in a topless place
    When I stopped in for a beer.
    I just kept looking at the side of her face
    In the spotlight so clear.
    Later on the crowd thinned out;
    I was just about to do the same – –
    She was standing there at the back of my chair
    Saying, “Don’t I know your name?”
    I muttered something underneath my breath;
    She studied the lines of my face.
    I must admit I got a little uneasy
    When she bent down to tie the laces of my shoes
    Tangled up in blue.

    No surrealistic word salad, no heavy social import, just smooth straightforward storytelling. Hail to you, Mr Zimmerman.

    (Y’know, you know you’re getting old when the elevator doors close & you hear the edgy music of your not-nearly-misspent-enough youth pablumized for your ascending or descending pleasure. But you know you’re really getting old when the creator of said music wins the Nobel Prize for Literature… =8^O)

  210. 210.

    Geeno

    October 13, 2016 at 11:05 am

    @rikyrah: cinnamon toast

  211. 211.

    chopper

    October 13, 2016 at 11:44 am

    @rikyrah:

    pancakes.

  212. 212.

    The Lodger

    October 13, 2016 at 12:10 pm

    @Shalimar: Alabama… yeah, they might be even slower than Oregon, which doesn’t set any speed records either.

  213. 213.

    Matt McIrvin

    October 13, 2016 at 8:15 pm

    @NorthLeft12:

    These RWNJs, white supremacists, sexual predators, Islamaphobes, and ignoramuses do not define most of the US public [IMO from up here in Canada].

    A solid majority of the white men, though!

  214. 214.

    Matt McIrvin

    October 13, 2016 at 8:18 pm

    @Uncle Cosmo: Some are mathematicians, some are carpenters’ wives…

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