Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

The fundamental promise of conservatism all over the world is a return to an idealized past that never existed.

You can’t attract Republican voters. You can only out organize them.

The worst democrat is better than the best republican.

Everybody saw this coming.

We won’t go back.

White supremacy is terrorism.

Compromise? There is no middle ground between a firefighter and an arsonist.

Accountability, motherfuckers.

Innocent people don’t delay justice.

It’s a new day. Light all those Biden polls of young people on fire and throw away the ashes.

Despite his magical powers, I don’t think Trump is thinking this through, to be honest.

They were going to turn on one another at some point. It was inevitable.

Proof that we need a blogger ethics panel.

He imagines himself as The Big Bad, Who Is Universally Feared… instead of The Big Jagoff, Who Is Universally Mocked.

Speaking of republicans, is there a way for a political party to declare intellectual bankruptcy?

Make the republican party small enough to drown in a bathtub.

“Jesus paying for the sins of everyone is an insult to those who paid for their own sins.”

Balloon Juice has never been a refuge for the linguistically delicate.

Fight for a just cause, love your fellow man, live a good life.

Teach a man to fish, and he’ll sit in a boat all day drinking beer.

Fight them, without becoming them!

Good lord, these people are nuts.

I am pretty sure Katy Tur wasn’t always such a bootlicking sycophant.

🎶 Those boots were made for mockin’ 🎵

You are here: Home / Elections / Election 2016 / Open Thread: Sad Angry Little Men

Open Thread: Sad Angry Little Men

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Note which organization paid for this poll…

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162Comments

  1. 1.

    Baud

    Worth noting that the Trump campaign doesn’t know anymore about what’s happening than the average cable viewer

    Yet CNN is reporting Trump’s claim of high white turnout.

    The Weather Channel has devoted this evening to Escape the Election. They are broadcasting claiming scenery with music.

  2. 2.

    hellslittlestangel

    Two things I’m looking forward to tonight:

    1. Darrell Issa weeping again.

    2. Sarah Palin seething with resentment as Mike Pence gives his ticket’s concession speech.

  3. 3.

    GrandJury

    Poor sad small fingered shit sack. The results are not even in yet and he’s already trying to blame voter fraud, and anything else they can pull out of their asses, for the coming humiliation. What a pathetic human being.

  5. 5.

    Mnemosyne

    I admit, I’m confused by the racist asshole’s t-shirt. When did the Clintons stop being white?

  6. 6.

    hovercraft

    I’m getting nervous, I think she’s got it, but ther are a lot of deplorables out there.

  7. 7.

    jacy

    Speaking of sad, angry, little men: my ex sent me a weird rambling letter this afternoon, telling me how “ecstatic” he was with his new life, and rehashing a bunch of stuff he told me recently he would never rehash. Seeing as he’s a dyed-in-the-wool Republican, I think this is a result of his existential dread at what he sees as the obvious outcome of today’s election. Much like Trump, he’s gone unhinged. Go Hillary!

  8. 8.

    Frankensteinbeck

    Those photos of Trump and his son making sure their wives votes ‘correctly’ fill me with a visceral anger. Why this more than all the other bullshit, I don’t know, but it enrages me.

  11. 11.

    Brachiator

    All right, getting close to results time.

    As the Joker said in the Dark Knight, “Here we go…”

  14. 14.

    The Dangerman

    Trump is just cheating off his wife’s test.

    I don’t think Melania ever wanted to be First Lady and I could see her voting for someone other than Hubby (it’s NY, as if it matters).

  15. 15.

    SenyorDave

    Now there’s a Breitbart poll? Since Breitbart is run by Bannon, Trump’s campaign CEO, isn’t this an obvious conflict of interest (not being facetious)?

  17. 17.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @Mnemosyne:
    Clinton is what Obama wants, will work in favor of brown people, and Trump is specifically the candidate for whites, not just white himself. All of those things justify the shirt in the conservative mind.

    They really, really lost their shit at Obama being elected.

  18. 18.

    Cermet

    Turn out appears way up in Florida; obviously due to massive influx of old, white males … wait, more likely to be a very high Hispanic turn out. Either way McCain is helped by … wait, wrong election. Maybe Hillary does take Florida by a larger margin than I had even hoped for. Maybe.

  19. 19.

    Pete Downunder

    Just a reminder to ex-pats in the land down under – Democrats Abroad having election gatherings at Morrison Hotel in Sydney and Pig n Whistle Eagle Street in Brisbane, starting about now. I’m off to the Pig n Whistle shortly.

  21. 21.

    albertZ

    I don’t recall but has it been actually confirmed that Trump voted before? If his kids never bothered that suggests a lot. Lack of participation runs in the family.

  27. 27.

    Jeffro

    So Kellyanne’s already going with the “didn’t fully support” (what’s that German word again), while Trump is claiming fraud at places where his campaign is too disorganized to have observers and too cheap to have done any polling, much less any GOTV.

    What bananas these folks are. Good luck selling ads on ImNotACompleteDoucheReallyImNot dot com, Trumpy!

  29. 29.

    dogwood

    Getting ready to do my stint at the Salvation Army soup kitchen. Not looking forward to it since our clientele is pretty much MAGA friendly. Hope it’s pretty well settled by the time I get home.

  31. 31.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @humboldtblue:
    While I am horrified by the violence, from the voting angle, at least it’s in California. It will not make a significant difference in the election. So, I can put that aside and hope no more lives are lost. Any shooting is a bad thing.

  33. 33.

    dmsilev

    According to TPM, Profile in Courage Pat Toomey waited until roughly five minutes before polls closed in PA to announce that he had voted for Trump.

  34. 34.

    dmsilev

    @Jeffro:

    So Kellyanne’s already going with the “didn’t fully support” (what’s that German word again),

    Dolchstoßlegende
    “Stab-in-the-back-myth”

  36. 36.

    PsiFighter37

    Apparently 27% of the Georgian populace is angry at the federal government. Love that number.

  38. 38.

    The Dangerman

    @Frankensteinbeck:

    Any shooting is a bad thing.

    True, but it must not be too bad; not a single local station is covering it. Live, I mean (and LA like’s its live gore, especially high speed car chases, where there is the hope of gore).

  39. 39.

    Mnemosyne

    @humboldtblue:

    Yikes! For non-locals, that’s out in the San Gabriel Valley, east of Pasadena. I know that nearby Monrovia was having some major gang war problems — I wonder if this is related to that.

    If the polling places are having to shelter in place, I’m assuming they’ll stay open late? Scheduled closing time is 8 pm.

  40. 40.

    Kathleen

    @hovercraft: Here are preliminary turnout numbers for Hamilton County (Cincinnati):

    RT @ChrisCinciBiz: Adding in the early votes, the total HamCo voter turnout so far is 348,830 out of 580,354 registered voters.

    That turnout is amazing.

    Hamilton County is swing county for Dems in Ohio. Though I think our luster is diminishing, as the political establishment (both sides) is indicating it wants to start seeing other states.

  42. 42.

    Patricia Kayden

    @Mnemosyne: Good catch. LOL. Racists don’t have to be smart. They just have to be the right color.

    @Jeffro: When Secretary Clinton is declared the winner, I want a gif of Kellyanne’s sad face to memorialize that perfect moment forever.

  44. 44.

    TriassicSands

    Trump isn’t trying to see how Melania voted — he’s trying to figure out how to fill out the ballot.

  46. 46.

    Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism

    Voting hours extended to 8:30pm in 8 precincts in Durham County, NC. Technical problems this morning meant people were turned away.

  47. 47.

    hovercraft

    Love the GA info
    30% black
    5% Latino
    5% asian
    61% white
    thats why its too close to call
    A good sign for our side.

  52. 52.

    Patricia Kayden

    @Oatler.: I assume Chuckie is suffering pretty badly too. I recall very early in the GOP primary season when he opined that Republicans had the best presidential candidates in decades. Couldn’t figure out what he saw in that collection of Clown Car Occupants. It will be a long sad night for him and Kellyanne. (smile)

  53. 53.

    Mnemosyne

    @hovercraft:

    I have to admit, I never know what makes my fellow white people decide that someone’s White Card needs to be yanked. I was Provisionally White from the beginning since I’m a (part-) Italian Roman Catholic, but I’m pretty sure my card was forfeited years ago with my first vote for Bill C. Not that I ever noticed.

  56. 56.

    David ?▶️?Blue Wall?▶️? Koch

    Robert Costa Verified account @costareports

    Kellyanne Conway to @chucktodd: Trump “didn’t have the full support of the Republican infrastructure”

    Retweets
    180
    Likes
    277
    6:15 PM – 8 Nov 2016

    0 replies 180 retweets 277 likes

    Jean-Luc Bouchard ‏@jlucbouchard 52m52 minutes ago

    she sounds confident

    0 replies 0 retweets 18 likes

    …………and the backstabbing begins.

  57. 57.

    Patricia Kayden

    @Frankensteinbeck: They’re dyed-in-the-wool sexists and keep “their” women in check. I still hold out hope that Melania will kick Trump to the curb — especially since it’s obvious that he’s not faithful to her.

  60. 60.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @jacy: I was just making up my mind to endure Nicole Wallace, about to un-mute, when they announced Rudi Grossferatu. Maybe media matters will do a tally on who gets more minutes on MSNBC tonight/ Rudi or Kellyanne.

    Too bad cause I really do like Gene Robinson.

  62. 62.

    Davey C

    Hi folks, any suggestions for what I should be watching/listening to tonight? I don’t have cable, so something available on the internet would work for me.

  63. 63.

    Kathleen

    @khead: I predict that tomorrow morning, NPR and all the morning TV shows will scour the heartland for scared, angry white people and not able to find one person who voted for Hillary.

  64. 64.

    Patricia Kayden

    @dmsilev: I would presume that the vast majority of Republican politicians currently running for office will support their Party’s presidential nominee. Not sure why I would give them the benefit of the doubt to do otherwise.

    @hovercraft: GA almost went for President Obama in 2008. It would be great if it slipped into the Democratic column.

  66. 66.

    BJ Lurker

    Can someone please reassure me that this is going to end well? I’m looking at latino numbers and starting to freak.

    I just can’t imagine a cabinet of Gingrich, Guiliani, and Rancid as chief of staff.

    Please talk me off the cliff.

  68. 68.

    the Conster, la Citoyenne

    @Davey C:

    I’m watching Bloomberg. It’s just more news and not opinion. They also talk international – much broader perspective.

  72. 72.

    Cermet

    tRump knows Florida is likely lost and they are melting down. Yeah! Still, until the official line calls Florida not in any way a sure thing. Game over then; Hillary can lose Florida and it means little. So, the race is on then. Will the media hid a Hillary win in Florida to hold viewership?

  73. 73.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @delk: Will leisure suits make a comeback as the male pant suit?

    I’m holding out for Nehru jackets. I think they’ll be slimming.

  76. 76.

    PsiFighter37

    FWIW, the exit polls seem to show Bayh losing pretty handily. Sucks because I thought that would be a gimme, but I will be happy to still be rid of Evan Bayh’s presence.

  77. 77.

    Mnemosyne

    @David ?▶️?Blue Wall?▶️? Koch:

    this afternoon David Gergen said on CNN, “the big sleeper story of this election is the Latino turnout. Nobody saw that coming.”

    Funny how only paying attention to conservative white voters means you end up missing the giant story taking place right in front of you.

  79. 79.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    Katy Tur ‏@ KatyTurNBC 1h1 hour ago
    “Close. Tense. Sickening.” Two NH GOP sources say they are nervous. One points to huge turnout in liberal Durham.

    C’mon, Hillary! C’mon, Maggie!

  81. 81.

    The Dangerman

    I guess my particular problem with Rudy G. is that still trying to spin/politic at 7p (EST) is pointless. Rudy, my man, it’s over, have a drink and call it a day…

  87. 87.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @The Dangerman: the small man sees his last chance at a balcony slip away, slip away …

    DRUMMOND. […] I wonder how it feels to be Almost-President three times—with a skull full of undelivered inauguration speeches.
    HORNBECK. Something happens to an Also-Ran.
    Something happens to the feet of a man
    Who always comes in second in a foot-race.
    He becomes a national unloved child,
    A balding orphan, an aging adolescent
    Who never got the biggest piece of candy. (III, 477-86)

  89. 89.

    Roger Moore

    @Mnemosyne:

    For non-locals, that’s out in the San Gabriel Valley, east of Pasadena. I know that nearby Monrovia was having some major gang war problems — I wonder if this is related to that.

    Azusa is just down the freeway- or two stops on the Gold Line- from my work; my boss and his boss both live there. And FWIW, that part of Asuza has plenty of its own gang activity without having to import any from Monrovia.

  90. 90.

    Hal

    The Trump campaign sure isn’t reacting like a campaign expecting a win.

    Let me also say how amazingly disappointed I am in so many people I went to high school with or have worked with since moving back to upstate ny almost six years ago. On Facebook today I have seen people invoking God while voting for Trump while wearing a Trump hat, bragging about being proud to vote as a natural born US citizen, talking about “real” change coming as if that change isn’t just code for having a white man as president again.

    My coworker and I are both black. We were talking today about how we look at people we know who voted for Trump differently now. With a certain suspicion about how they really feel, what they really think. I grew up biracial, being raised by my white mother, and I have heard what some white people say behind closed doors when they are in safe company.

    Trump has exposed a raw, racist, hostile American underbelly that now feels safe out in the open. I hope a defeat of Trump will at least push back on this frightening rise in ignorance and hatred.

  92. 92.

    Patricia Kayden

    @Cermet: No. I think the media will show the results ASAP. It’s just as fun to see a candidate get crushed as it is to see the race go neck-to-neck. This race could go either way given how divided this country is.

  94. 94.

    danielx

    @Kathleen:

    True enough, and I say it as a (more or less) lifelong Indiana resident. As was said in relation to Kansas…

    Q: what’s wrong with Indiana?
    A: it’s full of assholes.

  99. 99.

    EBT

    So one active shooter at a polling station and one suspicious package both before polls even closed.

  100. 100.

    Jeffro

    @hovercraft:

    FFS Tweety is talking to Rudy. Time to wandaer out of the room.

    Normally I’d agree, but if you wandered out, you missed an early slap (for which the Pepes of this world will never forgive)
    Tweety: “I’ve known you a long time and never had a problem with you until this campaign…why join in with…this” (i.e. Trump) The disgust was so clear, even I was like ‘daaaannnngggg, Tweety’
    Giuliani: “I believe I have conducted myself honorably”
    MSNBC panel:

  102. 102.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    Good news, bad news…?

    Matthew Yglesias ‏@ mattyglesias 1m1 minute ago
    The numbers I see out of Florida so far indicate that Trump is cooked.
    Brett LoGiurato
    ‏@ BrettLoGiurato
    Markets jittery, which is weird because the early consensus was that this was going to be an early night’

    On balance, I’ll take Yglesias opinion over “the markets”, who wet the bed worse than Democrats at every sparrow’s fart

  103. 103.

    the Conster, la Citoyenne

    Tom Watson
    ‏@tomwatson

    Fox panel very bullish on Hillary in Florida. Not pretending Trump is in play. #interesting

  104. 104.

    Percysowner

    I can’t watch. I’m just too nervous that something will go wrong and that idiot will pull out a win. I feel sick. Time for more wine.

  106. 106.

    humboldtblue

    @Roger Moore:

    It appears to be a personal dispute could have gang ties but it still impacts those polling places. Shooter barricaded in house near shooting location in residential neighborhood.

  107. 107.

    Jeffro

    @Hal:

    The Trump campaign sure isn’t reacting like a campaign expecting a win.

    I’ll say. Charging supporters $13 for a drink ($11 for a beer) at their victory party…???

  108. 108.

    Frankensteinbeck

    I lived in Kentucky at least half my life, and I will be interested in the final totals there. I expect a giant wave of white support for Trump, maybe better than Romney got. Numbers to confirm my personal experiences of the state’s culture are useful to my understanding of the world.

  111. 111.

    trnc

    @The Dangerman:

    When did Rudy Guliani become such a complete and total shit?

    Dunno, but I’m pretty sure his kids would have the answer, assuming they’re able to remember that far back.

  112. 112.

    dmsilev

    NYT has a nice visualizer doing a realtime summary of all the Presidential results; current forecast (which is pretty twitchy because the night is young) is Clinton with about a 4 percentage point edge in the popular vote and about 315 EV.

  113. 113.

    Cermet

    @Hal: As if this country wasn’t fundamentally racist (be realistic – Amerikan religion is the basis of much of modern racism)- we like to think otherwise (and compared to most all countries our levels of racism is, really, far lower!) But this country will have this battle for many more generations, but it is getting better.

  114. 114.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @EBT:
    It’s too early to be sure, but the shooter appears to have nothing to do with the election. As I expected, the racists are too chickenshit and disorganized to follow through their threats. They’re too scared they’ll run into some Black Panthers.

  115. 115.

    MazeDancer

    Georgia being “too close to call” is uplifting and excellent news no matter what.

    Kornacki reported 10% of electorate in Georgia is either Asian or Hispanic. Doubled in past 8 years.

  116. 116.

    humboldtblue

    @Baud:

    My anxiety isn’t rational

    That’s one of the benefits of not being very bright is ya don’t have to futz around with reason and stuff. Ya just go.

  118. 118.

    Central Planning

    I caught a few minutes of the Wilkow show on XM today on my drive home. He was totally unglued. He literally yelled a 5 minute answer to a caller’s question about Democrats destroying the country, supporting socialism like in Argentina, and so on.

    It was as impressive as it was wrong.

    He finally said at some point he hopes one party gets utterly and totally decimated. I’m sure he meant Democrats. I wanted to call in and ask what winning margin he was talking about, and if it was only if Democrats were on the losing end of the vote. But like I said, he was completely unglued and I didn’t want to help his ratings.

  119. 119.

    PsiFighter37

    Murphy way underperforming Clinton in FL. Can’t believe there are enough idiot ticket-splitters to send that lazy-ass motherfucker back to the Senate.

  120. 120.

    dmsilev

    @Jeffro:

    I’ll say. Charging supporters $13 for a drink ($11 for a beer) at their victory party…???

    The only surprising thing is that they weren’t serving Trump-branded wine. However, I’m sure we’ll get some Trump-branded whine soon enough.

  123. 123.

    Mary G

    @Mnemosyne: I keep starting things then watching John King push buttons on that stupid map. At least Palm Beach County is repudiating Trump despite Mar a Lago.

  124. 124.

    AkaDad

    My prediction:

    Hillary wins by 7-8 points.

    Dems win the Senate.

    2012 map with Iowa and NC switching.

  125. 125.

    LookingForACanadian

    Voter protection in a heavy immigrant precinct in MN today. Not one unruly challenger (actually no challengers at all) and I teared up more than once at the humanity on display. Go MN!

  131. 131.

    Patricia Kayden

    @Hal:

    Trump has exposed a raw, racist, hostile American underbelly that now feels safe out in the open. I hope a defeat of Trump will at least push back on this frightening rise in ignorance and hatred.

    I’ve heard this said by other Black people. Unfortunately, I wonder if the underbelly will push Republicans even further to the Right and result in more extreme candidates in 2020 and going forward. I don’t see how you can retreat to supporting diversity, multiculturalism and tolerance after your candidate was Donald “Mexicans are Rapists” Trump.

  132. 132.

    PsiFighter37

    @Baud: Rubio got his ass handed to him in the primary. I can’t believe there are enough fools to send him back to the Senate when he has said he hated working there.

  137. 137.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    @Haydnseek: I went to the Morrison Hotel here in LA* last Thursday, not much happening there.

    *Where they shot The Doors album cover.

  138. 138.

    Patricia Kayden

    Rove is gloating about how voter suppression tactics worked in North Carolina, effectively decreasing the Black vote. Disgusting.

  139. 139.

    Seanly

    How is it possible that I am both confident of a win but also scared? If anyone else feels this way, please be aware that is how I feel when I watch my Clemson Tigers play football when the spread is under 20 points.
    It looks like Florida will be one of the first states to report in. If Clinton wins FL it almost doesn’t matter how Trump does anywhere else, right?
    In other news, my wife who had the allogenic blood stem cell transplant is in the hospital for pneumonia. Luckily she was able to vote. Unfortunately, we’re not sure what is causing her lung issues. Hoping it’s not graft-vs-host – not very common this far out. Plus she had a lung event 2 years ago which almost killed her. She is better than 2 years ago or I wouldn’t be wasting my time fretting about this election.

  140. 140.

    Cermet

    Hillary has an edge in NC and combined with heavy turn out in Florida, this really means the small hands is in trouble – Hillary needs neither and her “lean states” look secure.

  141. 141.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism: The State Board of Elections didn’t have much choice given that 1) the law states that any disruption over 15 minutes shall lead to an equal corresponding extension, which if they’d not gone along with the county board of elections they’d have 2) made a judge late for dinner for without a decent legal basis, which would not have gone well for them.

  142. 142.

    Splitting Image

    Christ that picture of Trump and his son looking over their wives’ shoulders makes me mad.

    Why feminism was necessary in one picture.

  144. 144.

    Frankensteinbeck

    @Seanly:

    If Clinton wins FL it almost doesn’t matter how Trump does anywhere else, right?

    Right. Wang has been pretty clear, Florida is the swing state Trump needs the most. Without it, he is shit out of luck.

  145. 145.

    dance around in your bones

    I am so glad that I have us lovely snarling jackals to filter this evening’s results through….my sister is going to come home from work soon and no doubt ask me if I want to watch the tv machine, and I will say (as always) ‘really, I prefer to ‘watch’ this through Balloon Juice and the hive mind there’ and she will nod sagely and understand. Sort of. She trusts my judgement, I guess. We’re Nasty Sisters!

  146. 146.

    p.a.

    If you need ‘away time’ youtube has the men’s and women’s 2016 college lacrosse finals; both good games, men’s went o.t. and a bit chippy.

  147. 147.

    the Conster, la Citoyenne

    Steve Schale
    ‏@steveschale

    Based on Hillsborough, Broward, Orange, Duval and Dade EV, I am sure Brooklyn is pretty happy right now.

  148. 148.

    the Conster, la Citoyenne

    Matt Viser Verified account
    ‏@mviser

    Hillsborough County is the bellwether in Florida. With about 16 percent of precincts reporting, Hillary Clinton has a 10-point lead.

  149. 149.

    The Pale Scot

    @Cermet:

    (be realistic – Amerikan religion is the basis of much of modern racism)

    All the Abrahamic religions are racist, the sandal wearing hippy tried to go a another way but the followers of the Prince of Peace weren’t having none of it.

    Really, even the the Buddhists in Myanmar are getting down with their inner bigot. (How does a south Asian ascetic become a smiling chubster ) Maybe the Taoists or Zoroastrians roll differently.

  151. 151.

    SkooL Sekriterry

    @Frankensteinbeck: Same here! Initial reaction was “How dare they!” followed by a surge of anger that surprised me. I’ve been pretty stoic up to now, but I might finally be cracking. Just a tad. A bit.

  152. 152.

    WaterGirl

    @Seanly: I just heaved a big, cranky sigh when I read about your wife’s problems with her lungs. I’m sorry, that’s so hard. Another sigh. Sending good thoughts your way.

  156. 156.

    Davis X. Machina

    @The Pale Scot: It’s not that simple : There is no longer Jew or Greek, there is no longer slave or free, there is no longer male and female; for all of you are one in Christ Jesus” (Gal 3:27-28)

  157. 157.

    Kathleen

    @Patricia Kayden: What channel and how are the “journalists” reacting? That’s just how so many of them deal with that – “Politics as usual both sides blah blah blah”. It’s unconscionable and media should be excoriated for that. (Actually Soledad O’Brien did call media out for that very thing in interview on CNN. A thing of beauty.) I’d provide a link but I have yet to master WordPressLinkage 101.

  158. 158.

    The Pale Scot

    @NotMax:
    A friend of mine who was a cameraman for NYC produced adult films back in the 70’s and worked at a Time Square store with those booths said it smelled like bleach. I assume that’s from salt being split to maintain the sodium channels. Swimming is an energetic activity!

  159. 159.

    Kathleen

    @efgoldman: That is amazing. I really believe this is going Hillary’s way (and I stand by my prediction she’ll take Ohio, but down ticket benefit may be negligible.

    How sweet! I have two first time voting grandsons in Florida. I’m glad they voted. Not glad who they voted for. MeeMaw (they still call me that) has her work cut out.

  161. 161.

    The Pale Scot

    @Davis X. Machina: I’m referring to the most adamant x-tians constantly referring to the most tribalistic books of the OT to justify their beliefs.

    Edit: Must be a another thread up

  162. 162.

    Ruckus

    @Mnemosyne:
    One of my fellow employees is in the National Guard and he was told to keep his phone nearby today. Just after he walked out of the door he came back in and told us about the shooting. We work in Covina, were probably a couple of miles of the shooting.

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