Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

We’ve had enough carrots to last a lifetime. break out the sticks.

Republicans: slavery is when you own me. freedom is when I own you.

When I decide to be condescending, you won’t have to dream up a fantasy about it.

Schmidt just says fuck it, opens a tea shop.

This has so much WTF written all over it that it is hard to comprehend.

“And when the Committee says to “report your income,” that could mean anything!

We still have time to mess this up!

I did not have this on my fuck 2022 bingo card.

It may be funny to you motherfucker, but it’s not funny to me.

fuckem (in honor of the late great efgoldman)

Make the republican party small enough to drown in a bathtub.

Despite his magical powers, I don’t think Trump is thinking this through, to be honest.

Reality always lies in wait for … Democrats.

You can’t attract Republican voters. You can only out organize them.

Joe Lieberman disappointingly reemerged to remind us that he’s still alive.

Wow, I can’t imagine what it was like to comment in morse code.

The party of Reagan has become the party of Putin.

Just because you believe it, that doesn’t make it true.

Speaking of republicans, is there a way for a political party to declare intellectual bankruptcy?

No Justins, No Peace

Do not shrug your shoulders and accept the normalization of untruths.

Technically true, but collectively nonsense

Thanks to your bullshit, we are now under siege.

It’s always darkest before the other shoe drops.

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Reader Interactions

249Comments

  2. 2.

    Mj_Oregon

    Not quite everything. Your critters are there to keep you company. Pet them for me, please. I miss having my furry kids to comfort me when I’m down.

  3. 3.

    Jeffro

    It’s not really data, but I’m getting the sense from news sites, FB, Twitter, and so on that Dems are up for fighting back right away. GOOD. Count me in.

  8. 8.

    Kryptik

    Not everything sucks, John.

    ….at least the ‘Eers are off to their best season in the Big 12 to date. And you still have your brood.

  9. 9.

    Omnes Omnibus

    FIDO. Mnem suggested tonight she had seen reports that liberals respond to positive messages (I agree with that), but we sure as shit don’t see them. I would ask that every FPer here use what outreach this blog has to pick people up and encourage resistance. Please bury the urge to vent despair. It isn’t helpful. We have a fucking fight ahead, but let’s fight it. ¡No pasarán!

  10. 10.

    Fair Economist

    Looks like your attitude has had an improvement over the last few days.

    I’m actually feeling quite a bit better myself. Long-term politics look good, the Republicans are already overreaching, and Trump is acting less fascist. Most of the harm will be reversible in the medium terms. It still sucks for the people who are going to get hurt by cuts to the budget and Obamacare, and the climate issues will not be fully reversible, but those were just as much a problem a few days ago, so I’m better.

  12. 12.

    Glidwrith

    Hi folks – down thread for what we can do were ideas of constant year round registration, setting up blue/red sister parties to fund said registration, procuring ID as a first step for registration, paying jobs instead of volunteers and a portable registration bus to move around a state like a bookmobile. Below is the list of folks expressing either interest or coming up with these ideas.

    Elizabelle
    gogol’s wife
    WarMunchkin
    Geg6-involved with the local party, procure ID as first step
    Another Scott-mentioned VoteRiders
    From Both Sides of the Pond
    bemused senior – computer support
    Applejinx
    Debbie- portable registration bus (think bookmobile or mammogram screening)
    SiubhanDuinne- writer

    So, a series of questions:

    What sort of a business can be set up? NGO? Limited liability corporation? What will be appropriate for state/federal taxation? ETA: VoteRiders lists itself as a non-partisan, 501(c)(3) non-profit organization.

    Who could we contact within our local democratic parties? Would/should we do so? If affiliated with the Democrats, does this cause a problem in registering people to vote?

    Where would the money for this project come from?

    Who would manage the money? Can it be put into some form of escrow or trust to keep it targeted to the organization’s goals?

    Can we maintain enough privacy to protect ourselves if/when the shitgibbons come calling?

    How do we set up blue/red partnerships?

    Knowing the requirements for each state is a matter of public record and VoteRiders has already done the job for us: http://www.voteriders.org/voter-id

  13. 13.

    Mnemosyne

    @Fair Economist:

    I think — hope! — that we will ultimately be saved by the fact that Trump is terminally disorganized and has no fucking idea what he’s doing. Plus the establishment Republicans don’t have much pull with him, so it’s going to be total chaos.

    Our job now is to obstruct as much as possible and lay the groundwork for a wave election in 2018. Shiv ’em with a smile.

  17. 17.

    mike in dc

    Four Jews are sitting on the front stoop of the building in 1934 Berlin.
    The first sighs deeply.
    The second shakes his head and mutters sadly.
    The third just holds his head in his hand and sobs.
    The fourth says,

    “If all you guys are going to do is talk politics, I’m leaving!”

  19. 19.

    Shalimar

    @Major Major Major Major: The Supreme Court isn’t totally fucked yet. They’re going to replace Dead Scalia with Young Scalia. As long as Ginsburg and Breyer don’t die in the next 4 years, the status quo will stay the same as it has been the last few years. Yes, I know that is a big if.

  21. 21.

    Jeffro

    @mike in dc:

    Four Jews are sitting on the front stoop of the building in 1934 Berlin.
    The first sighs deeply.
    The second shakes his head and mutters sadly.
    The third just holds his head in his hand and sobs.
    The fourth says,

    “If all you guys are going to do is talk politics, I’m leaving!”

    Love. This.

    Fight fight fight, folks!

  22. 22.

    Mnemosyne

    @Glidwrith:

    Can I put one leg over my hobbyhorse for a moment? One of the big hurdles for voter ID is that people need copies of their birth certificates, but it’s too expensive or too distant for them to get them. Is there a way to help facilitate that? We could have people in each state helping people fill out the paperwork, pay for the certificate, file with the county clerk, etc. This could be an adjunct to your project or a separate one.

  24. 24.

    LookingForACanadian

    @Glidwrith: I’ve been thinking the last few days that there oughta be a privately funded “ACORN” of sorts focused on getting people “legit” within the bounds of the ridiculous laws that have been put in place (and that are sure to get worse) in many states. Fighting the laws seems to be moot, at least right now, so let’s get the people set up. Is that what this is about? If so, count me in. I’m skilled in the law (ahem), but am available for just about any need. Thanks.

    Also, anyone have an in with a guy like Buffett for the funding piece?

    ETA: it looks like that IS what this is about. So happy! I just told several people today that this is the small piece of the big 2016 fail picture that I would like to focus on, personally.

  26. 26.

    Tissue Thin Pseudonym

    @Glidwrith: I’m not good with social organizing, but I might be able to do the accounting. I’d have to find all of my reference material for non-profit accounting, about which I never really learned, but I’m probably a step ahead of most people on that, since I have a Masters of Accountancy.

  28. 28.

    Shalimar

    @Mnemosyne: I think a nice Doug J style trolling operation to sow chaos among Republican voters unhappy they aren’t getting anything they were promised could work well. Someone has to bombard Congress with complaints. We might as well co-opt the side that is already good at it to help us.

  30. 30.

    WarMunchkin

    @Glidwrith: I’ll have to think about your questions more, but one part I want to emphasize that you brought up sort of is the importance of encrypted messaging and multifactor auth for any communications. Kompromat is here to stay, and it only affects Democrats because of institutional messaging pathways (MSM, Reddit, AM Radio, Breitbart).

  31. 31.

    Gretchen

    How does this sound for a petition at whitehouse.gov?

    WE THE PEOPLE ASK THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT TO PROPOSE A NEW ADMINISTRATION POLICY

    Voter id for all

    Created by M.P. on November 12, 2016

    The federal government should make voter ID available to all citizens. State-level rules are often difficult to comply with, resulting in the disenfranchisement of many eligible voters. The federal government has citizenship records for all, and can issue ID to all citizens, which states should accept as an alternative to driver’s licenses and other ID. Using the federal ID would prevent the concerns of Voter ID advocates, such as double-voting by the same person, or voting by non-citizens, while making sure that citizens who are eligible voters have access to acceptable ID and are able to exercise their right to vote

  32. 32.

    Shalimar

    @AliceBlue: Under longstanding traditional rules of the Senate, yes. Republicans have held up far more that way than with filibusters. But I suspect holds are going away too. All it takes is a majority vote in January when they’re setting the rules of the new Senate.

  33. 33.

    Mnemosyne

    @AliceBlue:

    Honestly, I don’t remember what the exact rules are but, yes, they need to do all of that. But don’t threaten to do it now — wait until the new session starts so the Repugs don’t have a chance to change the rules.

  34. 34.

    Glidwrith

    @Mnemosyne:

    One of the big hurdles for voter ID is that people need copies of their birth certificates, but it’s too expensive or too distant for them to get them. Is there a way to help facilitate that? We could have people in each state helping people fill out the paperwork, pay for the certificate, file with the county clerk, etc.

    That is exactly the sort of thing I think many folks here would like to try. We’ve got Juicers in every part of the country, I think it is doable.

  43. 43.

    Gretchen

    The filibuster will be gone in January. Any rules that interfere with what the R’s want to do will be gone. They’ll pass whatever Scalia Junior they want 51-49.

  45. 45.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Shalimar: And Associate Justice Kennedy does not like it when the appellate courts or his colleagues screw with the decisions he’s authored. This may help to keep both Obergefell, Casey, and the union decision from last year that came from California in place.

  46. 46.

    Glidwrith

    @WarMunchkin: Hmm. My hubby brought up the same concerns. I think a lot of us like our privacy and several have said over the years they wouldn’t run for office because few people are squeaky clean enough for public office. The newest front-pager is supposed to be educating us on keeping our private stuff private. How private can we be and still run this sort of organization?

  47. 47.

    PeakVT

    @AliceBlue: Honoring holds is just a norm, in the end, not a permanent feature of the constitution. The Repukes will blow away that norm as soon as they feel the need, just like they have with most other norms over the past decade or so.

  49. 49.

    Mnemosyne

    @Glidwrith:

    Yay! I had to help my mom get my late brother’s birth certificate from California when she was in Illinois. IIRC, it turned out that the easiest thing to do was a request by mail, so I printed out the form from the website and mailed it to her so she could sign it and mail it in. I’m assuming red states have instituted requirements like getting requests notarized, so you may need to get some notary publics on board.

  50. 50.

    Morzer

    @Mnemosyne:

    Zoe: “If they take the ship, they’ll rape us to death, eat our flesh, and sew our skins into their clothing – and if we’re very, very lucky, they’ll do it in that order.”

  51. 51.

    Dog Dawg Damn

    Not even a week has gone by and I’m already being told on Facebook that Safety Pins are
    1) Being used by White Nationalists to Trick People and Abuse them
    &
    2) They are just useless, white guilt signaling and offensive to minorities

    I call bullshit. I think solidarity signaling is extremely important in opposing authoritarianism. The whole thing seems like a disinfo campaign to disorient and discourage participation.

  52. 52.

    mkro

    Won’t the union households that voted Trump in Wisconsin, Pennsylvania and Michigan be surprised when the Trump admin stops defending labor laws? Ha ha, too bad for them. Idiot white dudes.

  53. 53.

    catclub

    @Major Major Major Major:

    Remember that a lot of republicans, including those in congress, don’t actually want most of Trump’s agenda either.

    Huh? Tax cuts for the rich.
    Killing Dodd-Frank.
    Killing the EPA.
    Killing Planned Parenthood
    Deficit spending gone wild – the military industrial complex.
    Killing Climate change Carbon emissions cuts.

    Isn’t that enough bad?

  54. 54.

    mkro

    Oh, yeah, let us not forget Trump’s belief that we do not need a federal minimum wage … That will be fun! And great business for Trump, Inc!

  55. 55.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    @Mnemosyne:

    I think — hope! — that we will ultimately be saved by the fact that Trump is terminally disorganized and has no fucking idea what he’s doing. Plus the establishment Republicans don’t have much pull with him, so it’s going to be total chaos.

    I think it’s more than just Trump, I think the entire GOP has no real policy and lot of what we fear is us projecting what we would do if we were them – organize, get a consensus among the party, have a plan and follow it. Instead it seems that the only thing that unifies the GOP is not being Democrats.

  57. 57.

    Gretchen

    @dogwood: @dogwood: No, you don’t have to appear in person, but you have to pay. If I needed to prove my citizenship to register to vote today, I would need to pay $21.50 for an Ohio birth certificate, and $34 for a Michigan marriage license to explain why my name is different than my birth certificate, for a total of $55.50. Say I make $8.50 an hour before taxes, that’s a day’s wages to give me the right to take unpaid leave from my much-needed job to go vote. Probably not gonna happen. That’s why I like my idea of having the Feds, who know who was born here and where they live now, issue an ID for anyone who wants one, free. It would make Alex Jones’ head explode, but on they’re the ones who are insisting that the right to vote depends on having an ID.

  58. 58.

    Morzer

    @mkro:

    But.. but .. they’ll have the Right to Work. Not so many jobs though and the wages and benefits are going to be distinctly on the littlely side.

  60. 60.

    Morzer

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques:

    They have a plan – the Ryan Budget. Yes, it will wreck America, but it’s what they want because they are basically a zombie death cult at this point, shambling forward in mindless hatred to a future they just want to destroy.

  61. 61.

    Mnemosyne

    @dogwood:

    Not usually, but you do usually have to download a form and mail it in with payment.

    One potential problem: I remember rikyrah mentioned a while back that it’s not that unusual for older African-Americans to not have a birth certificate, especially if they were born in the South. A lot of people were still born at home in the pre-Civil Rights days and never got one. Legally, states have to have a process to get one issued after the fact, but it’s complicated (surprise!) and often requires an attorney. Any organization will need to have people in place for that situation, too.

  62. 62.

    Miss Bianca

    @dogwood: I got a copy of mine thru’ the mail, last time I needed it for a passport application. That was Massachusetts, don’t know how it works for other states.

  63. 63.

    mkro

    And with Kris Kobach now on the Trump transition team, we’ll be sure to see a ton of “show me your papers” laws for both immigration enforcement and voting, nation-wide. Yay!

  65. 65.

    mkro

    I’m excited to see the national open-carry bill from our Republican federal gov’t. I’m certain that will be coming in 2017.

  66. 66.

    catclub

    @Glidwrith: If there had been money for this before, there would have been money for state democratic parties in red states.
    The whole problem with sucking up to corporate money by democrats was that was where the money was, but it still was not there for building state democratic parties.
    Someone else mentioned finding the Warren Buffett or similar to fund it.
    I bet Andrew Tobias never thought of that.

  67. 67.

    jk

    @Fair Economist:

    Trump is acting less fascist.

    I don’t think Trump can keep up that act much longer. Unfortunately, the MSM lacks the guts to hold to hold him accountable for anything, so I hope the planet can survive 4 years of this lunatic.

  68. 68.

    WarMunchkin

    @SgrAstar: I don’t think so yet. McConnell is the MVP of Republicans – remember that he’s the one whose obstruction made us completely unable to respond to economic crises in the first place. He’s going to be smart about it, keep the filibuster, allow us to obstruct things like Obamacare repeal, campaign against us on obstruction in 2018 and attempt to pick up 8-9 Dem seats.

  69. 69.

    Mnemosyne

    @Dog Dawg Damn:

    As I said in other threads, the fact that neo-Nazis are trying to sabotage it proves that it’s a powerful symbol. They don’t want people visibly standing against them.

    I may be heading to the craft store to get a nice, big kilt pin. And maybe some alphabet beads so I can spell out Love Trumps Hate.

    These assholes stole the election. They’re not going to steal my solidarity symbol, too.

  70. 70.

    Glidwrith

    @Omnes Omnibus: At the moment this is in the brain storming stage: outline what we want, how we get what we want, who wants to work toward the goals and the means to do so. I fully expect to draw on the collected knowledge of the Juicers here before trying to shape the organization itself. I figure the first set of questions posted above is enough for folks to chew on for an evening thread.

    Hi Adam! I’ve been reading whenever you post on methods and means to accomplish policy goals. Anything you can detail or point out on the nuts and bolts of getting from point A to Z is appreciated.

  72. 72.

    Mary G

    @Gretchen: I agree that a national ID plus a requirement that all states honor it for voting without further ratfucking allowed sounds like the best plan. It’s just, how do we get it passed? Seems impossible right now.

  73. 73.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    @catclub: That isn’t what their voters want. Their voters want help dealing with the economic changes and are pissed they aren’t getting it. Up tell now they blame the Demcracts but they turned out in droves to vote for this cheese bag on his vage promise to do that.

  74. 74.

    catclub

    @mkro:

    And with Kris Kobach now on the Trump transition team, we’ll be sure to see a ton of “show me your papers” laws for both immigration enforcement and voting, nation-wide. Yay!

    When Arizona did that I stopped visiting the Grand Canyon – which I love doing.
    Now I just want to not visit the US.

  75. 75.

    Morzer

    @mkro:

    National open carry, vote suppression on steroids, plus the right for militias to act as poll watchers to prevent voter fraud…. it’s not a pretty future we’ve got coming.

  76. 76.

    Jeffro

    @Dog Dawg Damn: Go for it with the safety pins, as long as that’s not ALL that we do.

    otherwise it’s just a yellow ribbon car magnet, pretending that it’s doing something to bring the troops home.

  77. 77.

    Mnemosyne

    @SgrAstar:

    That’s why Senate Dems need to lay low until after the rules are set for the session. It’s harder to change them mid-session, IIRC.

    And, like I said, I’m kind of liking the idea of a lot of passive-aggressive moves. Random delays. Shuffling of papers. Senators wandering randomly in and out while Republicans are speaking.

  79. 79.

    Gin & Tonic

    @Shalimar:

    As long as Ginsburg and Breyer don’t die in the next 4 years

    I’m not an actuary, but at one point I did start studying for the exams. This is a losing bet.

  80. 80.

    Lizzy L

    @jk: I’m still thinking he’s going to resign in a couple years and turn the job over to Pence. He wants to live in Trump Tower and keep on doing rallies. He doesn’t want to govern the country, and he doesn’t know anything about how to do it. I’ve known some narcissists. They are not good at doing hard stuff, and they cannot tolerate failure. They run away from it.

    Of course, President Pence would be godawful.

  82. 82.

    Peale

    @Mary G: be careful what you wish for these days. I’m sure Kobach would like some form of national ID that would be difficult to apply for in most cases and impossible to get for naturalized citizens.

  84. 84.

    Shalimar

    @mkro: A Democrat should propose amending the Open Carry Law to rename it the Show the Bad Guys Who They Need to Kill First Law. Mock them whenever possible.

  85. 85.

    Jeffro

    @Mary G: Well…how DO we do it? How would we? It would probably start by you (and the rest of us) writing to our current elected officials describing what we want and how we expect them to help. Then we’d want to follow up with that by getting more Dems elected locally, statewide, and nationally. Heck, one of us might even want to run for office and stand up for this very good idea.

    I think folks need to make a weekly time commitment to doing these things – the other side sure is. A few hours a week to email a Senator or write the local TV news station or write an op-ed for the paper is not a huge commitment. Get fired up and let it fly!

  86. 86.

    Adam L Silverman

    @AliceBlue: Yes. There are multiple ways to hold nominations and legislation up, even if they try to do away with the filibuster. There’s a regular hold, an anonymous or pocket hold. For appointments, specifically judicial ones, there’s the blue slip process. The home state senators from where the judge is coming from/going to have a blue slip they have to return before the committee chair will proceed with the hearings. One or both can hold the nomination up by not returning the blue slip.

    And I’m not completely sure McConnell is going to get rid of the filibuster. Senators first loyalty is to the Senate, which is why its the world’s greatest deliberative country club. He knows that he could be back in the minority in 2018 or 2020 and if so, he’ll need all his tools. And, because he’s actually very, very cautious in what he does and he’s a good strategist- you notice he rarely does anything flashy, whereas Ryan can’t stay away from a camera and mic and couldn’t formulate a strategy if his life depended on it, which is why his policy proposals aren’t really policy proposals? – he’s looked at just how unpopular Trump is as he’s entering his Presidency, how unpopular Pence is back home/with anyone that has to do business with him, and how unpopular what Ryan wants to do when its polled and therefore if they force things, there could be a big backlash. So preserving your weapons for tomorrow, even if it makes your life more difficult today, is, I think, a good probability with McConnell on the filibuster.

  89. 89.

    Mnemosyne

    And speaking of Senate games, the quorum requirement is 51. If there are days when Dems know that at least 1 Republican is not going to be there, it’s Blue Flu day for the Democrats.

  91. 91.

    Timurid

    @Mnemosyne:

    “If they take the ship, they’ll rape us to death, eat our flesh, and sew our skins into their clothing – and if we’re very, very lucky, they’ll do it in that order.”

  92. 92.

    catclub

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques:

    That isn’t what their voters want.

    But if they tell them doing it will make liberals unhappy, they will go for it.
    I did not put killing the ACA in there. I think they will do that because they promised that. Trump will happily lie that healthcare will be better and cheaper, and all those horror stories about the ACA over the pas t 5 years will not come up in the case of the new version.

    What policies that Trump is promising are the GOP in congress opposed to?

  97. 97.

    Gretchen

    @Lizzy L: Yes, President Pence would be godawful, but if Trump quit in 2017 we could run against Periods for Pence in 2018, which would help.

  99. 99.

    Morzer

    @mkro:

    Doubtless we shall soon not need an alphabet or numerical system. If flint was good enough for Jesus and the dinosaurs, it ought to be good enough for America.

  102. 102.

    Emerald

    @Mnemosyne:

    Exactly. I will remember my safety pin tomorrow. And my Hillary pin as well.

    If any minorities think it’s a stupid idea I’ll listen, but it seems to be going fairly strong in Britain as a response to Brexit.

  104. 104.

    dogwood

    @Gretchen:
    That’s what I thought. Mnem was saying you had to travel great distances to get a birth certificate which I don’t think is true. But who knows maybe that’s why Obama couldn’t produce his. Couldn’t get time off from work let alone afford the plane fare to Honolulu.

  105. 105.

    Gretchen

    @Mary G: I agree that we couldn’t get a national voter ID through a Republican Congress. But if Obama called for it, and Dems make a lot of noise about it, maybe we can get the Kris Kobachs, who have been screaming about the necessity of voter ID, to explain to everyone why they object to the most accurate, foolproof, double-voting-preventing voter ID of all. They can’t. It might make a dent in the narrative that it’s perfectly reasonable to require a driver’s license to vote, just like getting on an airplane.

  108. 108.

    Adam L Silverman

    @mkro: It won’t be national open carry. It’ll be national reciprocity for conceal carry. The states make too much money off of conceal carry/permitted open carry to give up that revenue stream.

  109. 109.

    the Conster, la Citoyenne

    @Emerald:

    Venezuela is a failed state. That march would have been hung on Bernie every which way because of his leftist dictator loving past, if he’d been the candidate.

  111. 111.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Glidwrith: I’m really not sure what you’re trying to do, so not sure what to say. When you have a little more clarity on the outcome/effect you’re trying to achieve, feel free to email me and I’ll provide whatever recommendations I can on the strategy side.

  112. 112.

    Hill Dweller

    Chappelle’s monologue was great, even with portions being muted. I hope SNL/NBC put the uncensored version on the web.

  113. 113.

    Old Dan and Little Anne

    My wife the AP Gov teacher keeps telling me the Senate needs 2/3 to end the filibuster. Loving SNL.

  114. 114.

    Morzer

    @catclub:

    They might just be waiting for the Trump University trial to nail Donny to the wall, at which point they can offer him a pardon from President Pence in return for slinking off into the sunset. Much easier than impeachment and with the desired result.

  115. 115.

    Steeplejack

    @Mnemosyne:

    Many (if not all) states have outsourced optional birth-certificate procurement to a company called VitalChek (and possibly others). For example, you can apply for a copy of your Kentucky birth certificate directly to the state and get it for $10. You have to download an application, fill it out and mail it in. VitalChek allows you to do the whole transaction on line in minutes and pay with a credit/​debit card. (You still have to wait for the certificate to be mailed to you in both cases.) It is more expensive. I had to do it six or seven years ago, and I seem to remember there were two options, regular and “expedited.” I think I paid about $30.

    VitalChek is “official” to the extent that you get links to the VitalChek site from the state websites. I checked at random Kentucky, Virginia, Montana, Florida, Colorado and California. Of those, only California doesn’t use VitalChek, apparently because in California you can get a copy of your birth certificate only by mail. The VitalCheck website indicates that you can get a California certificate through them. It may be that it takes longer because VitalChek has to mail in the application rather than transmitting it electronically.

    Anyway, getting people copies of their birth certificates to facilitate getting voter ID may be more a matter of money than one of a lot of volunteer time backing and forthing with red tape. One person with a laptop could easily handle a line of people, fill out their on-line application for the appropriate state and order the birth certificate.

    Where the money comes from is a legitimate question.

  116. 116.

    catclub

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques: “Their voters want help dealing with the economic changes and are pissed they aren’t getting it.”

    I have heard that Jamie Dimon is one candidate for Treasury and another is Steve Mnuchin – a hedge fund guy who was his campaign finance chairman. The stand GOP establishment, or the wealthy elites will be taken care of.

    Let me know when he names a czar empowered for getting coalminers and steelworkers more and better jobs.

  117. 117.

    tkrr

    My pushback: a Facebook page called Left In Action, spotlighting liberal humanitarian initiatives. (Note: they aren’t all run by liberals; it’s just that their actions further our nefarious agenda of making the world better.)

  118. 118.

    Morzer

    @the Conster, la Citoyenne:

    It’s what will be hung around the neck of Jeremy The Idiot Corbyn in the UK, if the Tories ever feel the need to attack him – which seems unlikely, given his extreme unpopularity and talent for looking like Jill Stein’s long lost idiot Commie brother.

  120. 120.

    Gretchen

    @Peale: And that would be different from the current system how?
    And as awful as Kobach is, he won’t be in charge forever. And somehow those self-righteous types who want nothing more than to punish other people always turn out to have a some deep dark secret, usually involving illicit sex.

  122. 122.

    Morzer

    @catclub:

    a czar empowered for getting coalminers and steelworkers more and better jobs

    Joe Manchin is tanned and rested and ready to grovel.

  123. 123.

    catclub

    @Morzer:

    at which point they can offer him a pardon from President Pence in return for slinking off into the sunset.

    Unnecessary, isn’t it? This is a civil trial where people are suing him for damages. otherwise, you would have a DA in the press to name as the prosecutor. I have not seen that, at all.

  124. 124.

    Morzer

    @Timurid:

    Until you make them fear your vote more than they fear anything else, they will continue to coast along. The GOP now has the discipline and structure of a parliamentary party – we can’t keep lagging behind as a band of raggle-taggle amateurs who can go in whatever direction they like.

  127. 127.

    Lizzy L

    @Steeplejack: A friend of mine tried to use VitalCheck to get her Connecticut birth certificate. She does not have a SS card, or a state ID. They asked her to scan and e-mail or fax a shitload of substitute documents with her name and address on them, charged her $40, and then informed her that sorry, none of what she had sent them was sufficient to have them actually send her a fucking certificate. It does not help that she is disabled and lives in an assisted living facility in CA. They do not issue refunds, and there’s no way to actually talk to a live human being. Fuckers.

  128. 128.

    Gretchen

    @Steeplejack: Good summary. Where the money comes from is indeed the question. There have been times in my life when I didn’t have $10 for groceries, so I sure wouldn’t have spent it on my birth certificate. We have to figure out a way that $10 isn’t an obstacle to people voting.

  129. 129.

    Morzer

    @catclub:

    Do you think that the GOP won’t point out that there are so many other bad outcomes waiting for Trump if he doesn’t quit gracefully? Better to quit now with a preemptive pardon and some grateful, powerful friends….

    There’s been an interesting absence of GOP pressure on the judge to delay the trial.

  130. 130.

    Timurid

    @Morzer:

    Oh, I thought you meant that the Republicans would shank Trump in favor of Pence.

    But Trump U. is a civil trial. I’m not sure how it’s going to be a big deal. Trump survived half a dozen worse crises (any one of which would have instantly reduced Hillary to ash) during the election. Also, the media is in the tank for him. Those two things are not unrelated.

  133. 133.

    Morzer

    @Timurid:

    I suspect they will. I just want to see weak-sauce Democrats understand that the days when the party could put up with grandstanding and selling out are over.

  134. 134.

    catclub

    @mkro:

    I’m excited to see the national open-carry bill from our Republican federal gov’t. I’m certain that will be coming in 2017.

    STILL not valid on Trump golf courses and clubs.

    The list of broken promises will be endless. only people like me will even care.

  135. 135.

    Glidwrith

    @catclub:

    If there had been money for this before, there would have been money for state democratic parties in red states.
    The whole problem with sucking up to corporate money by democrats was that was where the money was, but it still was not there for building state democratic parties.

    I don’t necessarily know the answer to this, but hear goes for possibilities:

    1. Those parties aren’t set up to actually register people – my husband points out that unless registration is non-partisan there could be serious conflict of interest issues. The state machinery might even be set up that you can’t be affiliated with a political party.
    2. The parties are focussed on multiple issues, so voter registration is worried about only during presidential cycles. I can’t say I’ve ever noticed any voter drives in the mid-terms.
    3. Corporations are where some of the money is and many of them are demonstrating they will not cater to bigots (aka the ‘religious liberty’ laws. But, we don’t actually know if anyone asked them to fund only voter registration. Compared to the ridiculous costs in a presidential cycle, voter registration is peanuts (uh, but if you pay people a living wage instead of volunteers……..hmm, more thought needed on this).
    4. President Obama and Senator Sanders both demonstrated you can raise a shitload of money in small donations. Could we do the same?
    5. Party building isn’t necessarily an immediate goal. I certainly haven’t a clue how that works. I think we need a voter base in those red states first to support and expand the small blue spot that is already there. I also think as we spread that base, we will find folks that will self-select to try for office.
    6. Part of the problem may be that rich donors dictate how things are run, so the original goal is lost. Having grassroots funding could address that problem.

    I am going to shut down for now, but will review the thread tomorrow morning. Stay safe folks.

  136. 136.

    Jean

    Republicans didn’t do a lengthy postmortem after 2008 or 2012 and then act on it. No. They doubled down on acting from their usual playbook. They didn’t chant “Stronger Together” or “When they go low, we go high!” No. They went divisive and lower. They won. So go ahead and wear safety pins or use car magnets or whatever. They are symbolically, and in some cases, maybe a pin is helpful, but let’s fight, using all the tools the Republicans have used for the past 8 years.

  137. 137.

    TS

    @Major Major Major Major:

    Remember that a lot of republicans, including those in congress, don’t actually want most of Trump’s agenda either.

    Like who? Believe what they do – and they all voted for the horror show.

  138. 138.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    This is turning into an SNL skit

    Kai Ryssdal ‏@kairyssdal 17m17 minutes ago
    F. F. S.
    –Jonathan Swan @ jonathanvswan
    –NEW: Laura Ingraham under consideration for White House press secretary

  139. 139.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Old Dan and Little Anne: They need 2/3 to achieve cloture and end one and bring whatever the “question” (legislation, a nomination, a treaty) to a vote. At the start of every Congress, however, all it takes is 51 votes to change a Senate rule. So if you want to change the rule that allows for filibusters, you do it the day the Senate first convenes for the Senate when the rules are adopted and all it will take is 51 votes.

  140. 140.

    catclub

    @Morzer: No. I am saying that there will NEVER be a czar with actual power for getting more and better jobs for steelworkers or coalminers. That priority is already forgotten.

  142. 142.

    Gretchen

    @Glidwrith: The Obama campaign did voter registration. Every voter registration card made a stop at the Obama office and all data entered into their database before making its way to the Secretary of State. I was doing data entry from the registration cards in 2008. I think anybody can do it (except in Florida where they persecute people who try) as long as they get the cards to the state promptly.

  143. 143.

    Morzer

    @TS:

    It’s also a question as to whether they would resist if enough Trump voters screamed at them for Trump, the whole Trump and nothing but the Trump. Judging by their heroic nature as displayed so far, I rather doubt it.

  144. 144.

    Steeplejack

    @Lizzy L:

    Experiences vary. I didn’t have a copy of my Social Security card or a state ID card/​driver’s license when I got my birth certificate via VitalChek. In fact, I was getting the birth certificate so that I could get a Virginia state ID card. And I didn’t have to fax anything to VitalChek. I just filled out the on-line form and paid via debit card.

    My main point, though, is that, like a lot of things, the process is more automated now than it was in the past. And people have a lot of misconceptions about the process since they’ve never had occasion to use it.

  145. 145.

    Major Major Major Major

    @efgoldman: technically (constitution-wise) they can change the rules whenever the want by a simple majority, but the longstanding read is that filibuster tinkering must happen at the start of the session. I’m not entirely clear what role the parliamentarian plays in all this either.

  146. 146.

    Morzer

    @efgoldman:

    True in theory – but don’t you find it odd that nobody is demonstrating/screaming/making thinly veiled remarks in the judge’s general direction? If the GOP wanted to arrange something along those lines. I am pretty sure they could without too much trouble. Come to that, where are the GOP spokesmen on TV and the 24/7 Fox bulletins about this “outrage”?

  150. 150.

    Lizzy L

    @Steeplejack: Sure. I’m glad it went so easily for you. It sucked for my friend. She has still not managed to get her b.c.; she needs one to get a new SS card and a CA ID. I’m going to help her with this — we’ll get the form directly from the website of the state/city she was born in. Should work.

    I have another friend in NYC who has been trying to get a birth certificate for 26 years. No luck.

  152. 152.

    Morzer

    @Major Major Major Major:

    Exactly – the one vaguely intelligent and nationally popular proposal Trump offered has been shut down by McConnell. That’s him saying to Trump: “Thank you, Donny, but we’ll take it from here.”

    I happen to think that McConnell has just guaranteed himself a recession in the next couple of years, but they probably calculate that with “real” vote suppression they can ride that out.

  155. 155.

    John

    @catclub: Trumpf wants term limits for Congress; won’t happen. McConnell has already said his infrastructure plan is dead in the water too, and there were a couple others he said they won’t even get considered.

  156. 156.

    Mnemosyne

    @Lizzy L:

    This. The people who need a Voter ID are the people who do not already have a driver’s license or other common form of picture ID. Their situations are going to be more complex than that of most middle-class people.

  161. 161.

    TS

    @Major Major Major Major: And as I said before – what they say & what they do are often miles apart. Trump will sign Ryan’s budget and congress will approve whatever Trump (well the people telling him what to do) then wants.

  165. 165.

    Kay

    Source on transition team passes on quote from Trump on Ayotte:
    “Mr. Trump has zero interest in having her in the Cabinet or anywhere else”

    They’re all class, the Trumps.

    I’m not adjusting well to living in a chaotic banana republic run by a thuggish ruler and his family members.

  170. 170.

    Mnemosyne

    @Gex:

    I’m not sure if this is going to sound weird, but I think that this is turning into a battle between white people. i think non-racist white people should keep wearing the safety pins as a signal to other non-racist white people, and we shouldn’t stop just because neo-Nazi assholes are trying to co-opt it.

    I’m sorry that white supremacist assholes have ruined the initial purpose of helping POC and LGBT people feel more comfortable, but I fully intend to stand my ground and kick these assholes in the balls. They stole the election, they don’t get to take my solidarity symbol, too.

    (Though I will also add an anti-Trump or pro-Hillary message to my solidarity symbol to at least force them to beat people up while wearing a “Fuck Trump” button.)

  171. 171.

    lamh36

    SNL: Kate McKinnon’s Emotional Hillary Clinton Sings Leonard Cohen’s ‘Hallelujah’

    Tonight’s cold open, the first after Donald Trump was elected president, didn’t even have a punchline.
    To mark both the election’s unexpected outcome and the death of Leonard Cohen, Kate McKinnon’s Hillary Clinton sat behind a piano and sang “Hallelujah.” In what may be the last time we see her play this character on SNL, she couldn’t even bear to make us laugh. When the song was over, she turned to the camera and said, “I’m not giving up, and neither should you.”

  172. 172.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Kay: @Morzer: I’ll take a minor humiliation for Ayotte. I imagine she’s a bit relieved.

    I hope the humiliation is enough to piss off the other two stooges, McCain and Graham.

  174. 174.

    Kay

    “Source on transition team” means “one of the Presidents relatives”

    I don’t think the boilerplate, formal language fits anymore. They gotta knock it down a couple pegs. Lower the ‘ol bar another couple notches.

    “Ivanka says..”

  179. 179.

    jacy

    @Lizzy L:

    True — one thing that narcissists are great at is giving up on anything that ends up not feeding their addiction. I’ve seen lots of writers/thinkers that I respect speculating that Trump doesn’t make it through two years. Either he’ll abdicate or be removed. For my money, Pence is scarier, so I have the perverse hope that Trump sticks it out.

  180. 180.

    dogwood

    @Omnes Omnibus:
    What? I’ll cop to a lame attempt at humor. But, I’m not the person who claimed you might need to travel great distances to get a birth certificate. I was pretty sure that wasn’t true. So I asked if the rules had changed. I don’t know what you are claiming I’m wrong about. But thanks to the people who answered my question.

  181. 181.

    Juice Box

    I’m getting a lot more stuff done and novels read now that I’ve cut my internet surfing down to BJ and LGM. I can’t bear to look at the NYT or any other conventional news outlet.

  182. 182.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Stooge 1 couldn’t even be bothered to be upset when his service was being denigrated because he was a POW. So I doubt dissing Stooge 3B (3A was Lieberman) as she’s a lame duck is going to mean anything to him.

  183. 183.

    Juice Box

    @Morzer: I assume that the plan is to stop using big machines to mine the coal and go back to sending in the miners with hand picks. That will recreate those missing coal jobs.

  186. 186.

    Morzer

    @Kay:

    Eh. Rough game politics when people use a pronoun to refer to you. Ayotte tried to please everyone and ended up pleasing no-one.

  190. 190.

    James E Powell

    @Mnemosyne:

    I have made a decision beginning tonight. Any troll who tries to relitigate the election

    I’m not interested in relitigating the election, but I do want to know what happened. I don’t want to rely on incomplete data, snap judgments, or the predictable narratives that follow a loss.

  191. 191.

    Major Major Major Major

    @jenn: Graham gets a very occasional slow-clap from me. We’ll see!

    @James E Powell: Any analysis should be dispassionate, fact-driven, agenda-free, and with a firm grasp on who the real enemy is: the people who voted Il Douche into power.

    The trolls are not interested in performing this kind of analysis.

  192. 192.

    joel hanes

    Cole: if you’re in Fallout 4, and I think you are, this is a good time to rip down and completely rebuild a large settlement. Thoughtfully.
    Spending time with Curie couldn’t hurt, either.

  194. 194.

    Pogonip

    @catclub: Jamie Dimon? That’s like opening the window, leaning out, and yelling “I want to be a one-term president!”

    Half-term, more likely. I give it six months before the somnolent House actually bestirs itself to impeach him. The political class hates him almost as much as you do.

    I give it six days if Hillary ends up president.

  195. 195.

    TriassicSands

    @Fair Economist:

    I’m not one to give in to despair, but

    Most of the harm will be reversible in the medium terms.

    is just plain wrong. The worst harm will come from the Supreme Court and its decisions, given the longevity of justices on the bench and the number that Trump is likely to get to appoint, will have an impact for decades. That may not be the long term geologically, but it is long enough that many of BJs commenters will not live long enough to see the damage undone.

  198. 198.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @jenn: that he is, but he’s also mercurial, vindictive, and has run his last race. If the adulation of the Beltway comes from standing up to Trump, he’ll do it. Especially with Lindsey and Flake blowing in his ears. Toss in Ben Sasse, Mike Lee, Collins, Murkowski… the potential is there for an anti-Trump block, if his numbers start to slip with the base

  199. 199.

    dogwood

    @efgoldman:
    Another APgovernment teacher here, buts it’s been six years, I’m getting old, and this stuff is complicated. I think we are confusing permanent rule changes with the use of parliamentary maneuvers like the nuclear option. It used to take 67 votes to actually change rules. Maybe that has changed , but if that were the case the rules would be changing every time a new majority came in. I’m going to give my self a refresher course, but I have faith in AP government teachers and I know where she’ getting that number.

  200. 200.

    Mnemosyne

    @James E Powell:

    I’m happy to look at actual information, studies and statistics. In fact, I really want to see them so we can get a handle on what happened.

    I am not going to listen to any more I told you not to nominate Hillary! whining. As I said below, unless you have access to a T.A.R.D.I.S. and a viable alternative (i.e. not the guy who lost the primary by 3 million votes), you need to STFU about that. If there was another Obama on the horizon for this year, s/he would have been a star at the 2012 convention.

  203. 203.

    joel hanes

    @Old Dan and Little Anne:

    optimist who feels it would be political suicide for the republicans

    I’m so old I remember when
    Refusing ever to hold hearings on a moderate and eminently-qualified Supreme Court nominee would be political suicide etc.
    Allowing sequestration’s cuts to military spending would be political suicide etc.
    Threatening the full faith and credit of the American debt would be etc.
    Ignoring a Congressional subpoena would etc.

    I conclude that the political narrative I have lived has zero predictive value.

  205. 205.

    jenn

    @Mnemosyne: I think it’s fair to say that the Clinton campaign made some mistakes – because every campaign does so. It’s good to get opinions on what those mistakes might be, even when I disagree. Where I differ from some of these folks is thinking that those mistakes are what cost her the campaign. There was a perfect storm of events that hit her campaign, and I don’t think any campaign could have withstood them. If the election had occurred on October 27th, she would have won, and all of this would not be happening. I know the original Bernie supporters want to think that he could have pulled it out, but he had a number of issues that he could be hit on, too. And if he’d won the primary, and the Russians’ goal was to cause chaos among Democrats to help out Trump, what makes us think that the Russians wouldn’t have released hacked crap from and about him? Given all of their activities that have come to light, I’d actually be surprised if they hadn’t at least tried.

    And re your question/determined course of action: I agree, 100%. Fighting about the primary and fighting about the general elections are not going to get us anywhere. What’s in the past is in the past. The big thing is where do we go from here.

  206. 206.

    Ryan

    This is the second time in my voting lifetime I’ve had my vote stolen from me by a candidate that did not win the majority of votes.

  207. 207.

    ruemara

    EVERYTHING IS AWESOME! EVERYTHING IS COOL WHEN YOU’RE PART OF A TEAM! EVERYTHING IS AWESOME!

    Well, at least I’m drunk

  209. 209.

    Mnemosyne

    @jenn:

    Yes, and I’m not saying we shouldn’t do a postmortem to find out what the problems were and try to fix them. I’m saying that playing Fantasy Primary with candidates who coulda/shoulda/woulda run is pointless.

    However, I want to say up front that I think that the message of “Stronger Together” is absolutely a winner, and we need to stick with it.

  210. 210.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @FlipYrWhig: David Sirota for DNC Chair, and that’s just the kind of clear and far-sighted thinking that can lead us back to the future

  213. 213.

    Mnemosyne

    @ruemara:

    Can you still meet next Saturday afternoon in SF? I’ll buy you more drinks. Email me at mnemosyne dot muse at gmail.

    Major^4, you’re invited, too. Afternoon of Saturday 11/18, but I only have a few hours.

  214. 214.

    Davis X. Machina

    @FlipYrWhig: A former winner of the DKos primary. Or am I confusing him with Jon Tester? But maybe he should be #2 on the ticket behind Wes Clark.

  218. 218.

    Tissue Thin Pseudonym

    I don’t think an impeachment of Trump is all that likely, because the costs of doing so would be very high. First, a hell of a lot of Republican voters would be angry as hell about it, and the threat of primary challenges would be real. Second, impeaching a president of your own party because he turned out to be exactly what we all thought he was is admitting an error on a massive scale, and we all know how much Republicans enjoy admitting that they were wrong about anything. And, exactly what do you think Trump’s response is going to be if the House votes to impeach him and the Senate fails to convict? If you come at the Hairpiece, you better succeed.

    Hell, depending upon just what the circumstances of an impeachment are, I could see Democrats in the Senate voting to acquit just to slam the window shut on the Republicans after they’ve walked out on to the ledge.

  220. 220.

    Boussinesque

    @Glidwrith: I’m interested, and have a few friends that might also be interested here in Silicon Valley area.
    As far as contributing skills, probably the most relevant stuff I could offer would be database-related, or writing. Some of the interested friends are lawyerly types as well.

  221. 221.

    bemused senior

    @dogwood: not in Texas. I got interested in the bullshit TX registration process and when I got to the birth certificate part I simultaneously decided I needed another copy of my own and ordered it by their website process. But every state is different.

  222. 222.

    catbirdman

    I’m so thankful for this one thing that doesn’t suck tonight. Whatever Trump and his band of amoral profiteers and apologists unleash on our country, it’s comforting to realize that, almost without exception, the world’s poets, artists, scientists, and legitimate theologians will be on our side. For spiritual sustenance, Trumpies will be falling back on such inspiring figures as Scott Baio and James Dobson.

  224. 224.

    Anne Laurie

    @dogwood:

    Do people have to appear in person to get a birth certificate now?

    When the Spousal Unit & I intended to apply for passports about a year ago, we were given the address of a company that will provide certified copies by mail for any U.S. birth certificate. Cost, IIRC, was about $35 each — discount for duplicate copies. You will need to have the applicant on hand to answer questions (SS#, parents’ full names, hospital, etc) but it can be done outside of business hours.

    Believe this was the site: https://www.vitalchek.com/birth-certificates.

    Helping as many people as possible to get their certified copies before the Repubs can organize to gut Lexis/Nexis would be a good idea, IMO.

  226. 226.

    Steeplejack (tablet)

    @Mnemosyne:

    If you read my previous comment, you’ll see that I didn’t have a driver’s license, ID card or Social Security card when I got my birth certificate.

  227. 227.

    Anne Laurie

    @Mnemosyne:

    I’m assuming red states have instituted requirements like getting requests notarized, so you may need to get some notary publics on board.

    Here in Massachusetts, we asked about getting a couple papers notarized when we went to our local city hall to vote (early). There were several NPs in various offices, including a nice lady in the building codes office, who took care of us in under ten minutes.

    It’s probably a little more complicated in some (red state / less populated) areas, but even the most anti-gubmint legislator doesn’t want to hear from aggrieved constituents who can’t get their patio revisions certified, their parents’ estates processed, or their 401(k) rolled over because some ideologue decided FREEDUMB! was more valuable than constituent service.

  228. 228.

    Mnemosyne

    @Steeplejack (tablet):

    No, I get that it was easy for you. It can also depend on the county where your birth certificate is kept — some of them are a lot more on the ball than others. But I think it can be more of a matter of luck than we want to admit.

    And when we say, All I did was go online and use my credit card to pay for it, we need to remember that with Voter ID we’re probably talking about people who don’t have either a computer or a credit card, and probably lack both.

  229. 229.

    Anne Laurie

    @Gretchen:

    That’s why I like my idea of having the Feds, who know who was born here and where they live now, issue an ID for anyone who wants one, free.

    I love your idea. But if those of us who can spare the $58 can start helping those who can’t get their birth certificates before the new Repub-happy congress comes into session to fvck things up, all the better, right?

  230. 230.

    Another Scott

    @Tissue Thin Pseudonym: Yup. I think impeachment would be a very unlikely outcome, given what we know now. It has very, very long legs (part of the visceral hatred of Hillary has to go back to her being a staffer during Nixon’s impeachment).

    I worry more about Trump’s mental and physical health. Has anyone seen him walk more than about 50 feet at a time in the last 10 years? We know nothing about his actual physical (and mental) condition.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  231. 231.

    Anne Laurie

    @Jeffro:

    Go for it with the safety pins, as long as that’s not ALL that we do.

    Bingo. At this point, I think the neo-Nazi ‘alt right’ is much more aware of this meme than its intended targets (the ‘alt-right’ potential victims). But pissing off the alt-right and identifying ourselves to other not-Trumpists in public is a worthy goal on its own.

  233. 233.

    EBT

    You know, I never got around to getting a new BC after my name change and surgery. I should probably do something about that.

  234. 234.

    Anne Laurie

    @Lizzy L:

    Of course, President Pence would be godawful.

    “Mike Dense” was a joke even among his fellow congress-critters, intellectual heavyweights like Louie Gohmert.

    Trump at least has a certain animal cunning. Remember how much abuse Governor Pence took when he proudly signed his anti-woman/LGBT ‘Religious Freedom’ Act, and then had to rescind it after a couple of weeks once his corporate paymasters found out it was gonna cost them money due to massive national sportsball / convention boycotts? (That’s the main reason Pence was free to sign up for the Trump undercard.) If Trump loses all interest, or gets indicted, or suffers a fatal health incident, every aspiring Repub is gonna go for Pence like a swarm of piranhas after a big fat dumb ox. He’ll be lucky to come out with his pants, much less his title. And he has even less of an institutional support base in DC than he did in Indiana — the only people who might be interested in defending him are the hardcore Talibangelicals, and if Trump is in office more than six months without banning every form of birth control and sex education nationwide, the Talibs will already be denouncing Pence as a CINO (Christian(ist) in Name Only).

  235. 235.

    Anne Laurie

    @mike in dc:

    It’s a very old joke.

    So old, the first time I remember seeing it was in a Sholem Aleichem retelling with the punchline “If you’re going to talk about the Tsar like that… “

  236. 236.

    Mnemosyne

    @Anne Laurie:

    True fact: I just found out that I am related to Mike Pence by marriage. He is the first cousin of my aunt’s (late) husband.

    My uncle was conservative but smart, a guy who insisted on taking custody of his severely retarded brother rather than letting him be put in an institution, so I have a feeling he wouldn’t have been very fond of Cousin Mike, but who knows?

  237. 237.

    Steeplejack

    @Mnemosyne:

    No, I get that it was easy for you.

    I give up. It wasn’t easy for me. At the time I was not a “middle-class” person. Yes, it was probably easier for me than for someone who doesn’t have a debit card and a computer. Those issues can be addressed, as I said in my comment. But thanks for your lecture about what we need to remember.

    My main point was to dispel some of the confusion and misinformation in this very thread about the process and to explain that it is often easier—it can be easier—than requiring “people in each state helping people fill out the paperwork, pay for the certificate, file with the county clerk, etc.,” or traveling “great distances” to show up in person. Of course there will be anecdotal cases like Lizzy L’s friends, but that doesn’t automatically mean “VitalChek sucks! We can’t use them!”

    I was offering what I thought was helpful information, but feel free to ignore or discount it. Start the revolution without me.

  238. 238.

    Anne Laurie

    @Major Major Major Major:

    I do think [Sasse’s] probably either principled, running for president in 4-8 years, or both.

    I get the feeling that Sasse has decided there’s an opening for an actually principled Principled Conservative in the Republican party. Since better-known Very Principled Repubs like Ryan, Cruz, and Chaffetz have shown their moral stamina has a horizon no longer than six weeks, it would seem there’s an opening for someone who can at least pretend to honor his personal codes until after the latest election cycle is over. Bit of a long shot, but then, it has the advantage that none of Sasse’s fellows seem to have the wit or the ability to stake a claim in that niche!

  239. 239.

    Sab

    @Mnemosyne: I had to get my birth certificate from a big county in NC about ten years ago. I did it by mail, but it took almost a year. Apparently they weren’t all that interested in providing service to non-residents. And mine was marked Caucasian (I’m that old).

  240. 240.

    HelloRochester

    I have a total asshole neighbor here in SE PA who made the news for his complex Hillary jail political display. Trump’ s victory ha left him emboldened to shit up his entire lawn with a profusion of cray on signs. I’m doing what I can to beat his displays to death with local zoning laws including the amount of commercial equipment he has parked on his residential zoned property. Petty? Sure. Necessary? Absolutely.

  241. 241.

    Zinsky

    Cole – at first I felt demoralized and sad. Now, I strangely feel more alive than I have in years! Trumps razor thin victory has given me a new reason to live – to see this reptile going down in flames in 2020! If I’ve ever seen a one term president, it’s this pile of walking sewage. Count on him either being impeached, dying of a stroke, indicted for one of the many crimes he’s being accused of or simply being run out of office for incompetence and malfeasance in four short years.

  242. 242.

    Gretchen

    @Anne Laurie: Oh, absolutely. The idea of a national ID isn’t going to be practical in this Congress, but I’d like to see the talking heads talking about it to counter the folks that are insisting we need their statewide voter ID’s to prevent roving buses of illegal immigrants voting in multiple districts.
    Kurt Kobach still was trying to keep using his special registration that would let people in Kansas who couldn’t prove citizenship only vote in federal but not state and local elections. The courts told him it was unconstitutional, but he don’t need no stinking courts telling him what to do.

  244. 244.

    Another Holocene Human

    @catclub: From all I’ve heard the Dem party is good at drawing down money and bad at spending it. That person who posted from Kansas on Kos said they spent a lot of money on print campaigns, we know their history with spending money on ads, and I’ve seen similar in North Central Florida. This is a good use of money that actually gets voters to the polls.

  245. 245.

    Another Holocene Human

    @Steeplejack: My local episcopal church pays to procure copies of birth certificates for people. If you’re part of a liberal church it’s a thought.

    It helps with getting stuff like ID’s for food stamps and stuff like that.

  248. 248.

    Ghayduke

    Glad we went with the fighter. Boy howdy, if we hadn’t nominated the most qualified presidential candidate ever, we might just have lost to the least qualified candidate ever.

    Sure dodged that bullet.

  249. 249.

    Zinsky

    When I was maybe 21, I attended a bachelor party put on by one of the skeeziest guys in our high school. In addition to doing shots of 180 proof Everclear, they showed some horrible grainy porn movies on an 8 mm projector some other guy borrowed from his Dad. One particularly nasty clip was called, I believe, “Rectum Wrecker” and involved a guy with a schlong like an anaconda destroying some poor anus. I still have nightmares about it. I think liberals are about to experience something similar when Trump takes office.

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