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Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

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You are here: Home / Organizing & Resistance / Don't Mourn, Organize / Tuesday Morning Open Thread: Herding Cats, or Progressives

Tuesday Morning Open Thread: Herding Cats, or Progressives

by Anne Laurie|  January 3, 20175:42 am| 259 Comments

This post is in: Don't Mourn, Organize, Excellent Links, Open Threads

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(Arlo & Janis via GoComics.com)
.

In the spirit of staying upbeat for the new day, here’s the new National Legal Director of the ACLU, David Cole, on “The Way to Stop Trump“:

… There is no question that President Trump will be a disaster—if we let him. But the more important point is that—as the fate of American democracy in the years after 9/11 has taught us—we can and must stop him… [I]f we now and for the next four years insist that he honor our most fundamental constitutional values, including equality, human dignity, fair process, privacy, and the rule of law, and if we organize and advocate in defense of those principles, he can and will be contained. It won’t happen overnight. There will be many protracted struggles. The important thing to bear in mind is that if we fight, we can prevail.

If you think this is overly naive, consider the fate of George Bush’s “war on terror.” In the immediate aftermath of the terrorist attacks of September 11, 2001, Bush acted as if he were entirely unconstrained. He had reason to think that he could get away with it. His popularity soared to its highest level. The Supreme Court had just voted to put him in office. He had a solid Republican majority in the House of Representatives, and the Democrats had only a razor-thin majority in the Senate (thanks to Senator James Jeffords’s decision in June 2001 to switch from Republican to Independent, and to caucus with the Democrats)…

For much of his first term, Bush did indeed get away with such tactics. But much to his dismay, Americans did not sit back and accept that the executive was above the law. As I describe in my recent book, Engines of Liberty: The Power of Citizen Activists to Make Constitutional Law, they protested, filed lawsuits, wrote human rights reports, lobbied foreign audiences and governments to bring pressure to bear on the United States, leaked classified documents, and broadly condemned the administration’s actions as violations of fundamental constitutional and human rights. Human Rights First organized retired generals and admirals; the Center for Constitutional Rights and Reprieve, aided by an army of pro-bono lawyers, brought the plight of Guantanamo detainees to the world’s attention; the Bill of Rights Defense Committee sparked a grassroots protest through local referenda on the Patriot Act; and the ACLU used the Freedom of Information Act to dislodge thousands of documents detailing the CIA’s torture program, which it and PEN American Center then disseminated in accessible form. The academy, the press, and the international community all joined in the condemnation.

As a result, the course of history changed. By the time Bush left office in 2009, he had released more than five hundred of the detainees from Guantanamo, emptied out the CIA’s secret prisons, halted the CIA interrogation program and extraordinary renditions, and placed the NSA’s surveillance program under judicial supervision. His claims of uncheckable executive power had been rejected, and the Geneva Conventions applied to all detainees…

So if Bush could be stopped, notwithstanding widespread popular support, a large-scale attack on US soil leading to a war footing, and a history of judicial and congressional acquiescence in similar prior periods, Trump is also stoppable. He doesn’t have anything like the popular support Bush had after 9/11. And the recent history of the repudiation of Bush’s abuses will make it harder to repeat them…

***********

Apart from preparing for the Resistance, what’s on the agenda as we (sorta) start the new week (year)?

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Reader Interactions

259Comments

  1. 1.

    OzarkHillbilly

    January 3, 2017 at 5:53 am

    House Republicans have gutted an independent ethics watchdog, putting it under their own control, in a secret ballot hours before the new Congress convened for the first time.

    The unheralded vote severely weakens the Office of Congressional Ethics (OCE), which was set up after a lobbying scandal in 2008 to investigate corruption allegations against members of Congress. The move, led by the head of the House judiciary committee, defied the Republican congressional leadership and was reportedly supported by several legislators currently under OCE scrutiny.
    Republicans’ plan to erase Obama legacy starts with chipping away at Obamacare
    Read more

    The amendment was voted through by the House Republican conference over the New Year’s holiday with no prior notice or debate and inserted in a broad rules package the House will vote for on Tuesday. It turns the formerly independent OCE into the Office of Congressional Complaint Review, a subordinate body to the House Ethics Committee, which is currently run by the Republican majority and has a long history of overlooking charges of malfeasance by lawmakers.

    The new body will not be able to receive anonymous tips from members of Congress or make its findings public.

    It’s going to be a long 4 years.

  2. 2.

    rikyrah

    January 3, 2017 at 5:59 am

    Good Morning, Everyone ???

  3. 3.

    Phylllis

    January 3, 2017 at 6:14 am

    @rikyrah: Good morning.

  4. 4.

    geg6

    January 3, 2017 at 6:22 am

    Ugh. Back to work after a 17 day break. Ugh.

  5. 5.

    RedDirtGirl

    January 3, 2017 at 6:37 am

    @geg6:
    Yeah! Just spent 11 days on break and now it’s back to the grind. At least it’s a four-day week :)

  6. 6.

    Raven

    January 3, 2017 at 6:45 am

    I’ve had that same long break but working at home blurs the lines. My bride was to go to a training program in Rome, Ga for 2 days this week and turn around and go back all of the next week! It’s a 3,hour drive so coming home isn’t feasible.

  7. 7.

    Emma

    January 3, 2017 at 6:48 am

    Good morning all. Time to pick up our lives after a long break. I don’t think I am ready.

  8. 8.

    Baud

    January 3, 2017 at 6:48 am

    @rikyrah: Good morning.

  9. 9.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    January 3, 2017 at 7:00 am

    I’ve been taking an on-line Photoshop class, I’ve learned much. I’m still pissed that I didn’t get a good picture of the B-2 yesterday. Looks like I’m going to need to practice using auto-focus on moving objects.

  10. 10.

    Origuy

    January 3, 2017 at 7:04 am

    Thanks to one of my favorite websites, Atlas Obscura, I just found out that the Los Angeles County Coroner’s office has a souvenir store. The perfect gifts for someone on your list.

  11. 11.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    January 3, 2017 at 7:09 am

    @Origuy: They’ve had that store for years, interesting gifts.

  12. 12.

    OzarkHillbilly

    January 3, 2017 at 7:09 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA: Try using a smaller aperture, it increases the depth of field, Of course that has the effect of slowing down the shutter speed too which, if the object you are trying to photograph is moving very fast will then blur. (a jet should be far enough a way that it’s relative speed would be lower) It’s a fine line to dance.

  13. 13.

    bemused

    January 3, 2017 at 7:09 am

    John’s house reno is interesting to watch and coming along pretty quickly no matter how long and tortured it must feel to John, imo. Could be a hell of a lot worse. I thoroughly endorse the kitchen faucet. We just, finally, switched out our decades old kitchen faucet for a faucet like John’s. Heaven. Best improvement in kitchen faucets ever. Wish we had done that a lot sooner but we, especially my spouse, doesn’t replace anything until it is falling apart, as long as it still works kind of guy.

  14. 14.

    evodevo

    January 3, 2017 at 7:13 am

    @Origuy: OMG. You couldn’t make this stuff up LOL

  15. 15.

    OzarkHillbilly

    January 3, 2017 at 7:15 am

    @bemused: If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it.

  16. 16.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    January 3, 2017 at 7:17 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: I know that, the problem was that I probably was using the wrong auto-focus setting(I was using spot), and it wouldn’t lock on to the jet. It was probably closer that you might think it was, I’m guessing it was flying about 2000 feet(since I couldn’t see the top of the Verdugo Hills, it meant the ceiling was under 3000′) and was directly overhead. I was already challenged as far as shutter speed at f/5.6(maximum aperture at 200mm) and at ISO 400, since it was cloudy.

    ETA: I’ll probably go to the busy street near here and practice with different auto-focus settings on trains and cars.

  17. 17.

    raven

    January 3, 2017 at 7:18 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA: I struggle with that with the redtail hawks that torment me.

  18. 18.

    OzarkHillbilly

    January 3, 2017 at 7:20 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA: Cloudy days suck.

  19. 19.

    raven

    January 3, 2017 at 7:22 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA: I have this video photography class.The dude says “if you have a DSLR and you use auto you wasted your money”. Later he says “auto is correct 95% of the time”. What the fuck- over?

  20. 20.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    January 3, 2017 at 7:26 am

    @raven: I spent the first few months that I had the camera using it full manual(exposure and focus), now I’ll generally use the ‘Program mode’ and auto-focus. I’d agree that if you use “Auto mode” on a DSLR you’ve wasted your money, since you’re not capturing RAW. You could do just as well with a good point & shoot.

  21. 21.

    satby

    January 3, 2017 at 7:32 am

    Good morning all! I seem to have caught the nasty bug that’s going around, so if I can get through 5 hours of work today I will have 3 days to try to recover. My son is still here, which is nice because he helps with the critters, but he should hear today or this week if he’s going to get that contract job in Kentucky. If he doesn’t, I may have a roomie for a while ?

  22. 22.

    Baud

    January 3, 2017 at 7:33 am

    @satby: Feel better.

  23. 23.

    satby

    January 3, 2017 at 7:35 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: @raven: @BillinGlendaleCA: So I’ll ask you guys: I also just signed up for a online Photoshop class, and was thinking of upgrading my camera, which is a good point and shoot, to a better model DSL. Any suggestions?

  24. 24.

    bystander

    January 3, 2017 at 7:36 am

    I have a confession. Despite months of not going anywhere near Moanin’ Joe, I turned it on today. In the few seconds I could,bear it, Joe was holding forth to his breathless audience to inform them that Joe noticed at dinner the other night (referencing his and Weaka’s pilgrimage for journalism to Mar a Lago) that He is much more calm, much more centered…and then I turned it off.

    Oh yes, I’m sure Trump is just getting more presidentialer by the minute.

    Anyhow, I deserve it.

  25. 25.

    satby

    January 3, 2017 at 7:36 am

    @Baud: thanks sweetie

  26. 26.

    Baud

    January 3, 2017 at 7:36 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA: You can shot RAW with everything else on auto, right?

  27. 27.

    satby

    January 3, 2017 at 7:37 am

    @bystander: stuff like that just demonstrates that Joe is in the propaganda business, not the news or even pundit business.

  28. 28.

    Baud

    January 3, 2017 at 7:38 am

    @bystander: Say three Hail Bauds! and you will be forgiven.

  29. 29.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    January 3, 2017 at 7:40 am

    @satby: If it’s the cold that’s been going around, it’s lasts a week(we’ve all had it here), get some rest.

  30. 30.

    debbie

    January 3, 2017 at 7:41 am

    @bystander:

    Yeah, part of me was glad Glenn Beck was on vacation over the holidays so I wouldn’t feel obligated to listen and get pissed off.

  31. 31.

    raven

    January 3, 2017 at 7:44 am

    @satby: Try KEH, I bought my Canon T3i from them and am very happy.

  32. 32.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    January 3, 2017 at 7:44 am

    @satby: The kid got a Canon T6(18mp), seems like a pretty good camera. My camera is not a DSLR, it’s mirorless(Samsung and Sony). If you want something that works in Photoshop, get something(point & shot or DSLR) that shoots RAW. The other thing to consider is the sensor size, bigger is better.

  33. 33.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    January 3, 2017 at 7:45 am

    @raven: The kid got her’s at Costco(I think), $550 with 2 lens.

  34. 34.

    raven

    January 3, 2017 at 7:47 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA: I personally have seen little benefit from shooting raw except the ginormous file size.

  35. 35.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    January 3, 2017 at 7:47 am

    @Baud: Most of the (mirorless and DSLR’s) will have an “Auto Mode” that DOES NOT shoot RAW, they also have a “Program Mode” that does automate exposure and does shoot RAW.

  36. 36.

    raven

    January 3, 2017 at 7:47 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA: Yea, KEH sells used gear.

  37. 37.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    January 3, 2017 at 7:55 am

    @raven: You have alot more freedom in post and jpg’s have alot of compression. The camera does processing in it’s software to produce the jpg, but it’s more often than not suboptimal as far as what the image could look like. You can also correct for exposure problems and do bracketing in post.

  38. 38.

    bystander

    January 3, 2017 at 7:55 am

    @Baud: All Hail Baud! and I’m sticking with New Scandinavian Cuisine in the future.

  39. 39.

    satby

    January 3, 2017 at 8:08 am

    @raven: @BillinGlendaleCA: Thanks! I’ll take a look.

  40. 40.

    Central Planning

    January 3, 2017 at 8:09 am

    @Raven: 3 hours is certainly feasible. I regularly make a 3-hour trip (one-way) for work. Sometimes I’ll do it there and back in a day, but that makes for a long day, especially when leaving at 6am.

  41. 41.

    Patricia Kayden

    January 3, 2017 at 8:11 am

    @geg6: Me too. Sigh.

    @OzarkHillbilly: The fox is guarding the henhouse, so to speak. Scandalous times ahead.

  42. 42.

    Central Planning

    January 3, 2017 at 8:21 am

    @Raven: To late to add, but the IRS rate for mileage reimbursement is 53.5 cents/mile for personal vehicle used for business.

  43. 43.

    Kay

    January 3, 2017 at 8:24 am

    I’m a liberal and I (literally) go further Left each year I get older, but this approach is just wrong-headed:

    With Democrats almost totally shut out of government, the most important position in the party is now the chair of the Democratic National Committee, who would be in charge of organizing the attempt to retake power. Rep. Keith Ellison (D-Minn.), perhaps the second- or third-most prominent member of the Bernie Sanders wing of the party, presented himself as a candidate.
    Centrist liberals in the White House have challenged Ellison, putting up Labor Secretary Tom Perez as an alternative. But the underhanded way they have conducted their campaign is politically blinkered and morally hideous.

    The most important position in the Party right now will be if they can elect a governor.

    You can’t be a grassroots, state and local centered Party and spend all your time on the national Party.

    They don’t need permission or validation to pull the Party Left. The way to pull the Party left is to win elections with liberal candidates. Specifically, OH, MI and WI because that was the claim- that centrist Democrats lost those. If liberals get them back there won’t be any more discussion of whether or not the Party should go Left. It will have gone Left. A Fact On The Ground.

    It’s a shame because there seems to be some energy on the Left of the Party – Sanders had a lot of supporters- but they can’t get off this bizarre signalling and demanding validation. They can’t just get on with it– they seem to need recognition or validation or some stab in the back story and that just doesn’t mean anything in real life. The focus on DC will kill them but God almighty you cannot tear Democrats of ANY stripe or ideology or faction away from it.

    .

  44. 44.

    Steeplejack (tablet)

    January 3, 2017 at 8:26 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA:

    I’m not up on the latest developments in autofocus technology, but I think fast action is the one place where you need to turn it off and focus manually.

    For an airplane in flight, couldn’t you just set the focus to the maximum distance and fire away?

  45. 45.

    sunny raines

    January 3, 2017 at 8:30 am

    not to be pessimistic, but there really is no comparison of bush-the-lessor and trump. bush was/is a stupid frat-boy, but at times he was vulnerable to the kinds of pressures mentioned, and his family is mainstream. trump is a soulless, psychotic, extreme narcissist. There will not be any appealing to him – there is nothing there in trump except vile disgusting evil.

  46. 46.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    January 3, 2017 at 8:34 am

    @Steeplejack (tablet): It probably would have worked better in hindsight; I’m going to try active auto-focus on trains and cars and see how that does. I tried manual focus last year, to varying degrees of success.

  47. 47.

    Baud

    January 3, 2017 at 8:37 am

    @Kay:

    But the underhanded way they have conducted their campaign is politically blinkered and morally hideous.

    I assume this is bullshit.

    Agree on all other points. How the DNC chair got to be the center of the party is bizzare.

  48. 48.

    Kay

    January 3, 2017 at 8:39 am

    @sunny raines:

    Too, Trump is enticing the GOP with all kinds of goodies, because Trump doesn’t have any real opinions. He’s buying them off and they’re more than willing to be bought. He got Jeb Bush onboard with one nomination- he chose Bush’s education secretary. Bush is thrilled and all the nonsense about ethics and principles went out the window.

    There’s this crazy assumption that Trump “believes” something and that will lead to some kind of push/pull in Congress. He’ll give them what they want and they’ll give him what he wants. It’s already happening.

  49. 49.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    January 3, 2017 at 8:41 am

    @Kay: That’s true, as long as Trump doesn’t step on Congress’s toes; and he will.

  50. 50.

    Steeplejack (tablet)

    January 3, 2017 at 8:42 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA:

    Some of my camera habits are still rooted in the fact that I started with a Yashica 120 way back in the Bronze Age. Sometimes it’s good, sometimes not.

  51. 51.

    Kay

    January 3, 2017 at 8:45 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA:

    THEY have priorities. He doesn’t. They’ll give him free rein as long as their priorities are met. I just watched Jeb Bush fold completely – Bush happily traded away all his Principled Conservative positions for a privatizing ed secretary.

    This is an ethics-free environment.

  52. 52.

    rikyrah

    January 3, 2017 at 8:48 am

    Life in Obamacare’s Dead Zone

    Excluded from the Affordable Care Act because of
    politics, thousands of poor Americans grapple with the
    toll — physical and psychological — of being uninsured.

    By INARA VERZEMNIEKS
    DEC. 6, 2016

    In the Riverview Gardens apartment complex, roused by the sounds of her neighbors waking, Janet Foy stepped over the anatomy-and-physiology textbook she fell asleep reading and vowed to herself that today would be the day she finally came back to life. That today she could start reclaiming some of the confidence she once felt when she stood onstage at church and sang about forgiveness and redemption and You who make all things new. At 56, Foy was broke, jobless and living with her older sister in public housing in Kansas City, Mo., and she didn’t feel much like singing anymore.

    Recently, she had been told by a manager at a Victoria’s Secret that there was no need to leave her résumé. But not too long ago, she wanted me to know, she was pulling in $1,000 a week at a Merle Norman makeup store, helping other people look and feel their best. But then she took in her brother to try to help him overcome an addiction, and soon she was pulled under financially as he spiraled out of control. She would show up to work too overwhelmed and exhausted to make any sales, and had to dip into her savings until that was gone. She begged to borrow against her next paycheck but eventually lost her apartment and moved into a friend’s spare room.

    How are you holding up? people would ask. I’m good, girl, she would say. Praise the Lord! But inside, she felt like the sci-fi movies she had seen in which “a person becomes encapsulated,” suspended between consciousness and oblivion.

    Finally, on the phone with her sister one night, she broke down: I’m not right, I feel like I am dying.

    “She was always the steady one,” her sister, Karen Smith Walker, says. “The one who could solve any problem. Always with a book. Always studying.” But now, after years of living with this desperation, Foy didn’t know how to find her way through it anymore.

    “I tried to get Obamacare,” Foy recalls. “I called the number, and when the woman told me what it would cost me, I just about dropped the phone. She told me I’d needed to make at least $12,000 a year for there to be any help to make it something I might be able to afford. Which still doesn’t make a lot of sense to me, even now, that having no money meant I got no help when I really needed it.”

    She also learned that she could not expect any help from Medicaid, which in her home state remained available only if you fit the criteria sometimes known by the shorthand “poor and” — poor and pregnant, poor and disabled. As a single childless woman, she could forget about it. There was no going to a doctor, even if she felt, as she put it, “like I was falling to pieces inside.”

    But then one day she found herself sobbing in front of a nurse and a social worker, members of a team dispatched by the local safety-net clinic to embed themselves in the lives of the uninsured residents of the apartment complex where Foy lived — a grass-roots, door-to-door, last-ditch effort to reach those who would otherwise, as one resident delicately put it, “remain S.O.L.” The team, part of a program called Community-Centered Care, or C3, developed by the Samuel U. Rodgers Clinic of Kansas City in partnership with the Housing Authority of Kansas City and the Truman Medical Center, used their collective expertise to help the uninsured come up with creative interventions for their health concerns, beyond relying on a regimen of studious neglect supplemented with panicked, bankrupting visits to the E.R. Some days that meant knocking on apartment doors and offering on-the-spot blood-pressure readings. Other days it meant arranging for guest speakers to come and lead on-site classes about reducing stress or cooking nutritiously with limited ingredients.

    No one should have to live like this.

    And, this is what the the Republicans want us to go back to.

    They couldn’t take one vote on the Jobs Bill.
    But, they voted to repeal Obamacare over 50 times.

    This woman’s story. Multiply it by millions. The human destruction that will follow.
    That is what they will do.

    It’s why we have to fight.

  53. 53.

    Spanky

    January 3, 2017 at 8:48 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA:

    ETA: I’ll probably go to the busy street near here and practice with different auto-focus settings on trains and cars.

    Thanks for the heads-up. I’ll alert Homeland Security.

    Feels more like coming off a 4-day weekend here, mostly because I worked T-W-Th last week. Or at least I was at work. Not a whole lot going on, but we were open, so no sense wasting vacation days. I spent a couple anyway on the Fridays before the holiday eves.

  54. 54.

    Kay

    January 3, 2017 at 8:48 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA:

    You’ve already seen it with business leaders. Carrier was blunt – they wanted a regulation-free environment and tax breaks. They got that and Trump got them to campaign for him. This idea that these people are all going to become more principled as Trump gives them more and more of what they want is insane. It goes the other way.

  55. 55.

    GrandJury

    January 3, 2017 at 8:50 am

    There is reason for optimism, albeit for all the wrong reasons. He is historically unpopular for an incoming prez. He does not have a supermajority like Reagan did. Once people get a look at good look what a disaster he is for real then his unpopularity will only get worse.

    We can just sit back and remind Repubs that “he does not have a mandate to govern”. That is the same bullshit they always throw at us even when Obama got more than 50% of the vote.

  56. 56.

    Spanky

    January 3, 2017 at 8:50 am

    @Baud:

    But the underhanded way they have conducted their campaign is politically blinkered and morally hideous.

    I assume this is bullshit.

    The article heavily sources Politico and the NYT. ’nuff said.

  57. 57.

    raven

    January 3, 2017 at 8:50 am

    @Central Planning: It would be a nightmare going from Athens to Rome around the topside of Atlanta.

  58. 58.

    Emma

    January 3, 2017 at 8:52 am

    @satby: If it is your first time with a DSL try used equipment and look for one labeled “enthusiast.” It has enough bells and whistles and it’s a good entry point. On the other hand, I had to “downsize” due to arthritis in my hands and shoulders and find the NIKON megazooms to be great. I don’t fiddle with lenses but they have the RAW capability when I want to use it. Limited options, but fine for garden and flower photography.

  59. 59.

    Botsplainer

    January 3, 2017 at 8:53 am

    Let me repeat my mantra – don’t ascribe “thought”, “planning” or “strategy” to anything Trump does. He’s a racist idiot, but one born to significant, extravagant resources such that resulted in him being surrounded with fawning “yes” men throughout life. Every whim was indulged and every fleeting opinion validated. Every failure got smoothed over and excused.

    And rather than go the usual trust fund route, he went into real estate so that he could make colossal mistakes.

    Along the way, he absorbed some lesson that he could renegotiate after work was done or supplies delivered, so he became “that fuckin’ guy” (in the parlance of dirt lawyers) in the construction trade.

    Failure and self-delusion about his business acumen is what he is – the core of his being. As last night’s Korea and China tweets demonstrate, he doesn’t have a clue about what he doesn’t know. His catastrophic foreign adventure early in his presidency is very likely to cut short the family grift, and I can readily see a war crimes trial in his near future. Any juicers who live in DC, lower Manhattan, central Missouri to Southern Illinois, Charleston SC or the vicinity of Malmstrom would do well to come up with some sort of personal evacuation and family/friends contact plan, to be kept on hand, on paper.

  60. 60.

    Spanky

    January 3, 2017 at 8:53 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA: I’m kinda curious myself just what is being discussed when Pence goes up to Congress to discuss 2017 strategery. I’m guessing there’s been some talk about an “exit strategy”. There will come a time when Trump will try to steamroll the House and Senate, and everyone knows he’ll go too far.

  61. 61.

    Betty Cracker

    January 3, 2017 at 8:53 am

    @Kay: I saw that article too, plus an article at Vox about how the Ellison vs. Perez contest has needlessly become a proxy Sandersite vs Clintonite scrap. Couldn’t agree more about the uselessness of the focus on the DNC. Might do a post about that later if I have time, unless you’re planning one.

  62. 62.

    Jeffro

    January 3, 2017 at 8:55 am

    @bystander: re: Scarborough on Trump

    He is much more calm, much more centered

    Um sure, Joe, absolutely. Hey that warm, wet feeling on my leg…that’s rain, right?

  63. 63.

    JMG

    January 3, 2017 at 8:56 am

    In 2009, when the Republicans were in much worse shape than the Democrats are now, did anyone notice a big fight over who was to be chairman of their national committee? Of course not, because that’s not where opposition centers. Schumer and Pelosi are the party’s leaders now for better or worse. Either Ellison or Perez would be a good choice. Maybe they should just cut cards for it to end this stupid bickering.

  64. 64.

    magurakurin

    January 3, 2017 at 8:57 am

    @Baud:

    How the DNC chair got to be the center of the party is bizzare.

    I’m pretty sure Barack Obama is going to be the center of the party once he gets going as a “private citizen.” They are dreaming thinking that the DNC Chair is some position of great power or influence. It’s all just silly.

  65. 65.

    Jeffro

    January 3, 2017 at 8:59 am

    @rikyrah:

    this is what the the Republicans want us to go back to.

    They couldn’t take one vote on the Jobs Bill.
    But, they voted to repeal Obamacare over 50 times.

    This woman’s story. Multiply it by millions. The human destruction that will follow.
    That is what they will do.

    It’s why we have to fight.

    I’m looking for the first D member of Congress who’ll ask one very simple question: why are we even talking about repealing Obamacare, again? 20M people with health insurance. The cost curve bent (and bent hard) for the first time in decades. No replacement plan in sight. Why o why would we even think about changing it, other than to make it even better?

    Could it possibly have something to do with taxes on high earners that help pay for it? Hmm…it would be irresponsible not to speculate RIGHT THE HELL OUT LOUD. Let’s have at it, Chuck & Nancy.

  66. 66.

    O. Felix Culpa

    January 3, 2017 at 9:03 am

    @satby: Waves from New Mexico! Hope you recover quickly. Ms. O sends her greetings too.

  67. 67.

    Another Scott

    January 3, 2017 at 9:03 am

    @satby: It really depends on your budget. Bigger sensors are better (all things being equal) because they collect more light (and photography is all about light), but smaller sensors are much cheaper and smaller sensors enable much longer effective zoom with more compact lenses at much lower costs.

    I had a Canon SLR years ago with ~ 4 lenses, but it was heavy and I couldn’t afford low-f# lenses.

    I’m a big fan of “super zoom” P&S cameras now – they’re kinda amazing. J just got one of these for XMax. It’s a neat little box for not a lot of money. (She previously had a gray-market Casio that she loved, but spilled some lemonade on the zoom dial and the motion got sticky and it never worked right afterwards.)

    If you really want a DSLR-like thing, (IMHO), the best compromise is still in the APS-C class camera range (rather than a full-frame or a mirrorless) – but you’ll get dozens of different opinions about that. Get a “kit” with a lens or two and experiment. Look at reviews at B&H and Amazon and DPReview and consider things like battery life (you may need multiple batteries). If you’re thinking about something for photos for your store, maybe think about additional lighting. Maybe something like this (haven’t tried it myself).

    Bill’s comments about shooting RAW are spot on – it’s almost required if you want maximum flexibility in Photoshop. But note that RAW is slower to store than just normal JPEG shooting, and the file sizes are much bigger (so you may need additional memory cards).

    I’m no expert, but try to keep up with this stuff a little. :-)

    Good luck!

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  68. 68.

    FlipYrWhig

    January 3, 2017 at 9:05 am

    @JMG: But then how will Sandersites get the thrill of feeling like they’re being stabbed in the back by THE ESTABLISHMENT, which is pretty much all they live for?

  69. 69.

    O. Felix Culpa

    January 3, 2017 at 9:11 am

    @Kay:

    The most important position in the Party right now will be if they can elect a governor. You can’t be a grassroots, state and local centered Party and spend all your time on the national Party.

    Totally agreed. I’m excited about the infusion of energy into the Santa Fe County Democratic Party. We’re gearing up for legislative issues (we recaptured the State House in 2016) and for the 2018 gubernatorial election. I’m running for ward chair, a first ever for me. I know of other good people who are getting involved in their districts as well. Together we can make a difference locally and push that change upward to the state and national levels (not the other way around, as the stupid media seem to imply).

  70. 70.

    rikyrah

    January 3, 2017 at 9:12 am

    @sunny raines:

    trump is a soulless, psychotic, extreme narcissist. There will not be any appealing to him – there is nothing there in trump except vile disgusting evil.

    Nothing but the truth.

  71. 71.

    O. Felix Culpa

    January 3, 2017 at 9:15 am

    @rikyrah:

    This woman’s story. Multiply it by millions. The human destruction that will follow.
    That is what they will do.

    It’s why we have to fight.

    AMEN!

  72. 72.

    Kay

    January 3, 2017 at 9:15 am

    @Betty Cracker:

    Is there some trick to turning on the comments with the new(er) system? When I do a test the comments are off and even if I hit the “comments on” box they stay off.

  73. 73.

    rikyrah

    January 3, 2017 at 9:16 am

    If It’s Not Treason, What Do We Call It?
    by David Atkins
    January 1, 2017 5:39 PM

    When Donald Trump takes the oath of office, it will mark the third time in the last half century the United States has installed a Republican president who allegedly worked with a hostile foreign power to sabotage American interests and the sitting U.S. president, in order to get himself elected. Read that sentence again slowly and consider the implications.

    In 1968, Republican candidate Richard Nixon worked behind the scenes to scuttle Vietnam peace talks. Nixon knew that if the incumbent president LBJ agreed to terms with the South Vietnamese government, the resulting peace would benefit not only American soldiers in danger but also his Democratic opponent Hubert Humphrey. So Nixon’s camp sent private messages to the South Vietnamese promising better terms if they waited until he was elected president. When LBJ learned of the sabotage, recordings show that he described it as treason. Nixon won the election, and the Vietnam War continued for years afterward.

    …………………………………………….

    In 2016, the entire American intelligence community, alongside private cyber-security firms, have been unanimous in accusing Russian intelligence services of hacking the private communications of the Democratic National Committee and Clinton campaign chairman John Podesta–as well as over a dozen Democratic candidates for the House of Representatives. It was an electronic burglary of private campaign data that dwarfed the Watergate break-in by orders of magnitude. The resulting disproportionate media coverage of the released emails was crucial in helping to give Donald Trump a narrow electoral college victory, despite losing the popular vote by almost 3 million ballots.

    We will not know the extent of the Trump campaign’s cooperation and involvement with this activity for months or even years. But we do already have some very disturbing facts. First and foremost, during his last press conference of the campaign Donald Trump explicitly asked Russia to hack 30,000 of Clinton’s emails (he later claimed to have only done it in jest.) There are reports that Russia has been cultivating Trump for years. There is the bizarre communication between a server in Trump tower and a Russian bank tied to the Kremlin that may or may not be innocent, but so far no one in the Trump organization has provided a credible explanation for it. Rather than condemn Russian interference in the election as it might have been wiser politically to do if he were the innocent beneficiary, Trump has taken the bizarre strategy of denying and minimizing it entirely. We know that Trump’s one-time campaign manager Paul Manafort worked for the Kremlin while living in Trump tower, and was only fired when the outrage over his Russian connections became too much to ignore. It’s possible that Trump is innocent in all this, but the preponderance of the evidence suggests otherwise.

  74. 74.

    SenyorDave

    January 3, 2017 at 9:17 am

    One thing to always remember is what I will call the Hastert Principle:

    When you are dealing with a Republican politician on the national level, EVERY one of them is much worse than they seem. Hastert is a great example. On the surface a figurehead, hack Republican, in over his head. In reality a sick pervert.
    Trump is scary because we already know he is a sociopathic sexual predator, racist, who can barely utter a single sentence without telling a lie. And he’s actually much worse than that. My personal guess is that Trump has at the very least raped multiple women, committed many felonies in his business dealings, and I wouldn’t be surprised if there literally are dead bodies in his skeleton closet.

    I don’t see how any Democrats can think they can work with The GOP and trust them on anything.

  75. 75.

    Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism

    January 3, 2017 at 9:18 am

    @Kay:

    The focus on DC will kill them but God almighty you cannot tear Democrats of ANY stripe or ideology or faction away from it.

    Yes, you can, and NCDP is getting started.

  76. 76.

    FlipYrWhig

    January 3, 2017 at 9:18 am

    @Kay:

    If liberals get them back there won’t be any more discussion of whether or not the Party should go Left. It will have gone Left. A Fact On The Ground.

    It’s a shame because there seems to be some energy on the Left of the Party – Sanders had a lot of supporters- but they can’t get off this bizarre signalling and demanding validation. They can’t just get on with it– they seem to need recognition or validation or some stab in the back story and that just doesn’t mean anything in real life.

    THIS This this this-ity this-this.

    Just win a fucking election, one you’re not expected to, in semi-hostile territory, and copycats will beat a path to your door.

  77. 77.

    rikyrah

    January 3, 2017 at 9:20 am

    @Kay:

    Centrist liberals in the White House have challenged Ellison, putting up Labor Secretary Tom Perez as an alternative. But the underhanded way they have conducted their campaign is politically blinkered and morally hideous.

    First of all, this is absolute bullshyt.

    I haven’t seen anyone doing anything underhanded.

    I admit, I’m TeamPerez all the way. The man’s been on the RIGHT side of issues for pretty much his entire professional life. He’s always in the fight on the side of good.

    And, I like what he’s presenting to Democrats for what’s important to him for the DNC.

    I didn’t have anything personal against Ellison…but, the longer this has gone on, the more resistant that I have become to even remotely considering him for DNC Chair.

    TeamPerez ALL THE WAY.

  78. 78.

    daveNYC

    January 3, 2017 at 9:20 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA: Chances are the autofocus didn’t work because you were pointing at a solid black object and autofocus likes to have some amount of contrast to work with.

    To be clear, there are two stats that can come to mind when talking about sensor size. Resolution and actual physical sensor size. I’m a big fan of full frame cameras, but you’re talking real money to get one of those.

    And shooting RAW is the way and the truth. I don’t get very complicated with the Photoshop, but just being able to tweak the exposure and fill lighting on the RAW is huge.

  79. 79.

    ArchTeryx

    January 3, 2017 at 9:21 am

    @rikyrah: Or they just want folks like me to die. “Poor and…” is basically a death sentence for anyone unlucky enough to be single and/or childless, and who happen to get sick.

    I have my own story to tell about that, and it actually has nothing to do with me. I saw being uninsured cost someone their life directly, and cost his wife – a kind and very active artist in the convention circuit – her sight and her ability to work at all. She would have ended up homeless save for her sister (a Catholic nun) but the cost was her entire social circle. I haven’t heard anything from or about her in years.

    It all went down a year before Michigan (finally) accepted the Medicaid expansion.

  80. 80.

    Kay

    January 3, 2017 at 9:21 am

    @Betty Cracker:

    I did a post maybe a year and a half ago and the comments stayed off and there was all kinds of confusion until some nice front pager rescued me :)

    So I don’t trust that they’ll be on if it says “on”

  81. 81.

    Denali

    January 3, 2017 at 9:21 am

    I am sorry, but Sanders was lucky that the Democratic Party accomodated him.
    There is no question that the working class voters have deserted the Democratic Party. The Party needs to figure out to reach them. They need to get the message across that the Republicans are not working in their interests – just look at the billionaires selected for the Cabinet. Perez will be more appealing to them.

  82. 82.

    Kay

    January 3, 2017 at 9:27 am

    @rikyrah:

    The writer admits Perez is a liberal but he sees some kind of devious intent there too- inciting a fight among liberals or something.

    He puts a lot of weight on the fact that Ellison is Muslim, because Muslims are a targeted group under Trump, but isn’t a popularly elected Muslim member of Congress better for “signaling” (and actual power) than the head of the DNC?

    It just reminds me of Howard Dean. They turned Howard Dean into this magic figure of “winning” and that just wasn’t true. I saw “the 50 state strategy”. There was nothing the slightest bit innovative or ground-breaking there.

    You know who Democrats should hire to run organizing? The people who ran Fight for Fifteen. They are the best liberal organizers out there right now, by a mile. That was brilliant – they got an enormous amount of favorable press and they WON some battles at the local and state level. Hire them.

  83. 83.

    Yarrow

    January 3, 2017 at 9:29 am

    in terms of doing something, I saw this yesterday.

    There is only one constitutional way to remove a president, and that is via impeachment.

    What’s needed is a citizens’ impeachment inquiry, to begin on Trump’s first day in office.

    The inquiry should keep a running dossier, and forward updates at least weekly to the House Judiciary Committee. There will be no lack of evidence.

    The materials should be made public via a website. The inquiry should be conducted by a distinguished panel whose high-mindedness and credentials are, well, unimpeachable.

    There needs to be a parallel public campaign, pressing for an official investigation. For those appalled by Trump, who wonder where to focus their efforts, here is something concrete―and more realistic than it may seem.

    Nixon was a vile president with a creepy personality, but he was also a student of history and a serious person. In the end, even Nixon acceded to court orders to turn over evidence.

    Trump is far more of a menace than Nixon. Trump will commit impeachable offenses. There is no way to contain him other than removing him from office, before the damage to our democracy is irrevocable. The process of building the impeachment case needs to begin now.

    I’m up for a citizens impeachment!

  84. 84.

    FlipYrWhig

    January 3, 2017 at 9:29 am

    @Denali: If pissed-off white working-class voters want to vote for Republicans, it should be up to the Republicans to satisfy them. The Democratic Party can’t be responsible for solving everyone’s problems while the Republican Party does diddly-shit for anybody. I say we just do what we do and may God have mercy on the other side.

  85. 85.

    David Evans

    January 3, 2017 at 9:31 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA: Many cameras find it hard to autofocus on airplanes in flight. You might be better to use manual focus, and focus not on the plane but on a distant stationary object.

  86. 86.

    Kay

    January 3, 2017 at 9:31 am

    @rikyrah:

    I feel like the fact they believe Ellison is better positioned as the head of the DNC than as an elected member of Congress is just typical of this wrong-headed thinking. They are willing to give up an elected liberal for this ridiculous signalling and validation. It’s like they’re creating a narrative rather than a political Party.

  87. 87.

    magurakurin

    January 3, 2017 at 9:32 am

    @Denali: funny how working class African-Americans and Latinos didn’t seem to have deserted the party. Or do you have to be white to be working class?

  88. 88.

    Joe Falco

    January 3, 2017 at 9:33 am

    Heard on the radio this morning that former Georgia governor, Sonny Perdue, is on the shortlist for Secretary of Agriculture. Given Sonny’s tendency to wear any kind of costume during his governorship, I would not mind so much if he had to show up on the job dressed in the same jester’s outfit I’m sure Trump would have required Christie to wear had he not been given the boot after the election.

  89. 89.

    germy shoemangler

    January 3, 2017 at 9:33 am

    Jaime Harrison is a candidate for DNC head.

    Raymond Buckley is another candidate.

    I don’t know enough about either of them to have an opinion.

    If rikyrah is on team Perez, I’m leaning Perez. Simply because rikyrah is one of the commenters here who makes the most sense to me.

    Anyone have any info on Harrison or Buckley? I haven’t seen much.

  90. 90.

    ArchTeryx

    January 3, 2017 at 9:34 am

    @FlipYrWhig: I’d rather they NOT let the entire safety net be torn to shreds. That will net them nothing except a mass casualty event among their own voting bases.

    I really, really, REALLY don’t want to turn 2020 into a contest to see whose base has more deaths. It will, at best, led to demoralization on a scale not seen since the Civil War.

  91. 91.

    FlipYrWhig

    January 3, 2017 at 9:37 am

    @Kay: They believe ideology precedes praxis, rather than the other way around. Or, to put it another way, they like being in charge but they _really_ don’t like earning it by besting competitors. They mostly just want to show up and be declared superior by acclamation.

  92. 92.

    Major Major Major Major

    January 3, 2017 at 9:38 am

    Yawn. Time to head back into the office, I suppose. Oh well. Good thing I don’t hate my job!

    Over the weekend I started doing some reading for the new urban fantasy story I will be starting soon. Bumbled my way into a copy of Magic, Supernaturalism, and Religion, a general-audience survey of the history of the western occult by Kurt Seligmann of all people. (It’s got a bunch of very cool plates, as one would expect.) So I’ll be reading that on the train, as well as finishing Stories of Your Life and Others by Ted Chiang for a book club, which contains the short story that Arrival was based on. So far it’s good-but-not-great, though I really liked one of them, The Tower of Babylon. Oddly enough, my reading this coincided with having just finished the chapter on the Tower of Babel in the Seligmann.

  93. 93.

    Kay

    January 3, 2017 at 9:39 am

    @ArchTeryx:

    I feel like that’s where we are, though. Elections have consequences and people have been somewhat sheltered from the consequences because we had two Parties and Democrats were protecting and expanding the safety net.

    The reality is we just elected a one Party far Right government and there will be pain as a result of that.

    I didn’t do this, I didn’t want it, but those are facts. There will be consequences. I can say “there should be consequences, they deserve it” or “there shouldn’t be, they don’t deserve it” and it doesn’t change what will happen.

  94. 94.

    raven

    January 3, 2017 at 9:40 am

    @Kay: I continue to hope they fuck the VA all up.

  95. 95.

    FlipYrWhig

    January 3, 2017 at 9:41 am

    @germy shoemangler: Perez and Ellison both seem like good guys to me. I have been _repulsed_ by the way that Perez has been treated by the so-called left, which has a habit of learning of the existence of something one day and then declaring it to be the most important litmus test that ever faced the American polity the next. They did the same thing to Tim Kaine, which was also foul. Fuck that.

  96. 96.

    Kathleen

    January 3, 2017 at 9:41 am

    @bystander: Be kind to yourself. Look at it as taking one for the Juicer Comment Team.

  97. 97.

    raven

    January 3, 2017 at 9:42 am

    Man the Y will be a zoo for the next month until the wannabes go away!

  98. 98.

    ArchTeryx

    January 3, 2017 at 9:43 am

    @Kay: Then let them own it completely. Don’t help them destroy millions of lives. Keep a death count. Whatever the hell it takes. Obstruction worked for them, why the hell shouldn’t it work for us – with millions of lives at stake?

  99. 99.

    Kay

    January 3, 2017 at 9:46 am

    @FlipYrWhig:

    I just don’t know anyone at the local or state level who talks about, or listens to, the head of the DNC. There just isn’t this “support/validation/asking permission” thing going on. That isn’t how it works.

  100. 100.

    rikyrah

    January 3, 2017 at 9:47 am

    @satby:

    Good morning all! I seem to have caught the nasty bug that’s going around, so if I can get through 5 hours of work today I will have 3 days to try to recover.

    Oh satby, feel better :)

  101. 101.

    Yarrow

    January 3, 2017 at 9:47 am

    @raven: It always is. The first three weeks are the worst. Gets a bit better by the fourth.

  102. 102.

    Spanky

    January 3, 2017 at 9:48 am

    @germy shoemangler: Back to mangling shoes, I see. Must be the change in seasons.

  103. 103.

    Kathleen

    January 3, 2017 at 9:50 am

    @magurakurin: Well, DWS singlehandedly denied Wilmer the nomination with her own diamond encrusted thanks to donations from eeebil corporations fingers. So there’s that.

  104. 104.

    Kay

    January 3, 2017 at 9:50 am

    @raven:

    It’ll be impossible to tell if they fuck the VA all up because it will be privatized and fragmented. Big public agencies are an easy target because they’re big public agencies and they collect and publish data.

    One of the things I like about Bernie Sanders is he called the VA Outrage as a deliberate campaign to privatize the VA. That’s what it was. This idea that private health care is somehow vastly superior is just bullshit.

  105. 105.

    germy shoemangler

    January 3, 2017 at 9:51 am

    @Kathleen: Fred Flintstone, yelling outside of his locked house: “Wilmer!!!”

  106. 106.

    Botsplainer

    January 3, 2017 at 9:52 am

    @Denali:

    We can either have a 50 state strategy organized around centrism and incremental gains, or we can have an aggressive progressivism organized in urban blue strongholds.

    We can’t have both.

    The second strategy requires a major black swan to succeed, and is highly unlikely; it actually leads to major gains being undone.

  107. 107.

    Gin & Tonic

    January 3, 2017 at 9:53 am

    @raven: No shit. I go to a different gym, but the number of new faces you see in Jan-Feb is unreal.

  108. 108.

    Major Major Major Major

    January 3, 2017 at 9:53 am

    @Kay: Yeah, this is pretty much true. Anecdata here, but the huge Sanders fans I know who are getting involved in local party stuff now have been very disappointed to learn that it’s mostly registering voters in Oakland right now and fighting over land use. The only person I know who’s actually been happy to get his hands dirty doing the real work of a party is new to the whole political activism game since the election and pretty much only followed the primary by osmosis. So he knows that Hillary Clinton is an evil machine politician warmongering neoliberal shill, but he’s also amenable to learning the actual facts.

    So, in summary, the hardcore Berners I know are completely uninterested in actually working with the party, but this guy is out there collecting signatures.

  109. 109.

    Yarrow

    January 3, 2017 at 9:53 am

    @Kay:

    I feel like that’s where we are, though. Elections have consequences and people have been somewhat sheltered from the consequences because we had two Parties and Democrats were protecting and expanding the safety net.

    The reality is we just elected a one Party far Right government and there will be pain as a result of that.

    I didn’t do this, I didn’t want it, but those are facts. There will be consequences. I can say “there should be consequences, they deserve it” or “there shouldn’t be, they don’t deserve it” and it doesn’t change what will happen.

    And EVERY time someone says something about it, say, “This is what the Republicans said they were going to do and now they’re doing it.” EVERY time. Pin it on them when you talk to anyone. Just keep linking together that this is what Republicans said they would do and the fact that it’s happening. Not everyone will hear you but some people will.

  110. 110.

    Kay

    January 3, 2017 at 9:53 am

    @FlipYrWhig:

    I would think the most important skill for a head of the DNC right now is “proven organizing ability” – that isn’t the most important skill as far as “the establishment”, fundraising is, but if that’s what we want to do then that’s who they should hire.

    Neither of the candidates have proven organizing ability. So I don’t care which one gets it and “grass roots” liberals shouldn’t care either. It doesn’t matter.

  111. 111.

    germy shoemangler

    January 3, 2017 at 9:54 am

    @Gin & Tonic:

    the number of new faces you see in Jan-Feb is unreal.

    Gone in March…

  112. 112.

    rikyrah

    January 3, 2017 at 9:55 am

    @bystander:

    In the few seconds I could,bear it, Joe was holding forth to his breathless audience to inform them that Joe noticed at dinner the other night (referencing his and Weaka’s pilgrimage for journalism to Mar a Lago) that He is much more calm, much more centered…and then I turned it off.

    That’s because his azz was busted by others in the Media for going there. He tried to get all huffy and puffy and indignant.

    What you saw today was him trying to cover being busted.

  113. 113.

    daveNYC

    January 3, 2017 at 9:55 am

    @Kay: Elected member of Congress sounds good, but being a member of the House minority party means you have roughly zero power. Senators at least are a small group, and even minority Senators have some levers they can pull, but there’s way too many Congresscritters and the House is pretty straight up majority rule. Pelosi gets some love as the Minority Leader, but most everyone else is going to be off in ‘who fucking cares’ land.

  114. 114.

    Kathleen

    January 3, 2017 at 9:57 am

    @raven: Back in the 90’s we old timers called it “Amateur Hour”.

  115. 115.

    Major Major Major Major

    January 3, 2017 at 9:57 am

    @daveNYC: OK, so you’ve covered why Ellison as an individual might prefer being DNC head to being one in a sea of faces in the House, but, uh, there’s still the collective action problem where you need multiple people to have a majority.

  116. 116.

    Gin & Tonic

    January 3, 2017 at 9:58 am

    @rikyrah: Hey, he just went there for *work*. How was he supposed to know there’d be a party going on?

  117. 117.

    Phylllis

    January 3, 2017 at 9:58 am

    @germy shoemangler: Jaime has been the South Carolina party chair for the past couple of years. He was Clyburn’s floor whip prior to that. I haven’t seen much from the SCDP since he took over, but in all fairness, a couple of years is hardly enough time to really build up any infrastructure here in Secessionville.

  118. 118.

    Botsplainer

    January 3, 2017 at 9:58 am

    @Gin & Tonic:

    And gone by March 1…

  119. 119.

    Betty Cracker

    January 3, 2017 at 9:58 am

    @Kay: I don’t even see comments on or off as an option in the backroom posting template. Feel free to send me a screen shot at [email protected]; maybe we can sort it out!

  120. 120.

    Gin & Tonic

    January 3, 2017 at 9:59 am

    @daveNYC:

    but most everyone else is going to be off in ‘who fucking cares’ land.

    I guess the concept of providing services to the constituents who elected you is too old school to be cool?

  121. 121.

    Kathleen

    January 3, 2017 at 10:00 am

    @germy shoemangler: Also, sounds like that would be Fred Flintstone voiced by Jerry Springer, who as a WLWT news anchor referred to his co host Norma Rashid as “Normer”.

  122. 122.

    rikyrah

    January 3, 2017 at 10:00 am

    @Denali:

    There is no question that the working class voters have deserted the Democratic Party. The Party needs to figure out to reach them.

    Lie Lie Lie

    MUTHAPHUCKING LIE.

    FIRST OF ALL…

    The Black WORKING CLASS…
    The Latino WORKING CLASS…
    The Asian WORKING CLASS….
    The Native WORKING CLASS…

    HAVE NOT abandoned the Democratic Party.

    Second of All..

    In 2016….

    Hillary Clinton WON a majority of the Archie Bunker vote.

    It was NOT Archie Bunker who went for Cheeto Benito…

    It was Archie’s College Educated Boss and his White Wife..

    Yet, they are more than willing to push Archie out there as the ‘face’ of the Trump voter and scapegoat him.

  123. 123.

    rikyrah

    January 3, 2017 at 10:01 am

    @Kay:

    They are willing to give up an elected liberal for this ridiculous signalling and validation. It’s like they’re creating a narrative rather than a political Party.

    Uh huh
    Uh huh

  124. 124.

    Elizabelle

    January 3, 2017 at 10:02 am

    @rikyrah:

    TeamPerez ALL THE WAY.

    Agreed! Joining the rikyrah battalion. Go Tom!

  125. 125.

    rikyrah

    January 3, 2017 at 10:02 am

    @Kay:

    I feel like that’s where we are, though. Elections have consequences and people have been somewhat sheltered from the consequences because we had two Parties and Democrats were protecting and expanding the safety net.

    The reality is we just elected a one Party far Right government and there will be pain as a result of that.

    Truth.

  126. 126.

    rikyrah

    January 3, 2017 at 10:03 am

    @ArchTeryx:

    Kay: Then let them own it completely. Don’t help them destroy millions of lives. Keep a death count. Whatever the hell it takes. Obstruction worked for them, why the hell shouldn’t it work for us – with millions of lives at stake?

    That’s how I feel.

    There IS NO COMPROMISING WITH THEM.

    PERIOD.

  127. 127.

    Spanky

    January 3, 2017 at 10:06 am

    @Kay: Meh. Just fire off an Open Thread and see what happens. No point hand wringing about it. If comments are off then at least you have a working thread to diagnose. (“You” may = “Alain”, though.)

  128. 128.

    rikyrah

    January 3, 2017 at 10:07 am

    @Yarrow:

    And EVERY time someone says something about it, say, “This is what the Republicans said they were going to do and now they’re doing it.” EVERY time. Pin it on them when you talk to anyone. Just keep linking together that this is what Republicans said they would do and the fact that it’s happening. Not everyone will hear you but some people will.

    And, be HOSTILE when you say it.
    I have no patience for them.
    I’m at the point where I’m like, ‘ What THE PHUCK did you think was going to happen? ‘
    ” They took over FIFTY VOTES to repeal Obamacare.
    NONE on a JOBS BILL
    But, FIFTY.
    Who stopped them, each and everytime?
    The Democrats!
    But, both parties are the same…or some other bullshyt you use to coddle yourself for your stupidity.
    Elections have consequences, muthaphucka.
    Welcome to the Hunger Games.”

  129. 129.

    schrodingers_cat

    January 3, 2017 at 10:07 am

    @rikyrah: Too true, at least in the blue North East most working class stiffs (white/black/latino etc etc) are Democrats. The Republicans are the wealthy who feel “oppressed” by the PC or so they say. I just think they are jerks and like to see people suffer. St. Sanders folks are the same way except you also get a dose of sanctimonious smug along with the stupid and mean.

  130. 130.

    germy shoemangler

    January 3, 2017 at 10:07 am

    @Spanky: When the wrist hurts (carpal tunnel) I don’t feel like typing out the whole nym

  131. 131.

    Elizabelle

    January 3, 2017 at 10:08 am

    @rikyrah: I fear that some people can only learn through a negative example. That happened with W and Katrina. The blinders came off.

    People survive all sorts of things. We can survive this. Maybe it’s just one act of a multi-act play that will end much brighter than it looks right now.

  132. 132.

    Corner Stone

    January 3, 2017 at 10:08 am

    This is your daily “No shit, really?” reminder:
    Tillman Fertita is a fucking asshole.

  133. 133.

    rikyrah

    January 3, 2017 at 10:10 am

    More Fake News about VA Hospitals
    This time, the hapless New York Times is the culprit.

    by Phillip Longman
    December 30, 2016

    Donald Trump met with the heads of several monopolistic private health care corporations in Palm Beach on Wednesday. Bloomberg reports that “A person close to Marvel Entertainment CEO Ike Perlmutter said he also participated.” Trump was soliciting their advice on whether he should force the Veterans Health Administration (VA) to outsource more of the care of our nation’s veterans to monopolistic health care corporations. The comic book executive at least had no apparent conflicts of interests.

    America’s major veterans groups, including the American Legion, Vietnam Veterans of America, and Paralyzed Veterans of America, which all strenuously oppose any moves to privatize the VA, were not invited. Stay tuned for the rest of the story.

    But meanwhile, let’s just dwell for a second on how we got here before it’s too late. In the New York Times‘ story about the meeting, reporter Michael D. Shear offered this background: “The Department of Veterans Affairs has struggled to provide timely care to many veterans….News reports in 2014 said that dozens of veterans had died while waiting for care at a V.A. hospital in Phoenix.”

    Here we have the New York Times once again mindlessly repeating a devastatingly effective piece of fake news that may yet lead to the dismantling of the VA. It was put in motion by the Republican-controlled House Veterans Affairs Committee during hearings it staged over the summer of 2014. The committee’s chairman, Rep. Jeff Miller, claimed to have uncovered as many as 40 veterans who had died while waiting for care at the Phoenix VA, a claim that was endlessly repeated in the press and that did enormous damage to the image of the VA with the American people.

  134. 134.

    rikyrah

    January 3, 2017 at 10:12 am

    Even Glenn Greenwald And His Fans Should Fear the Trump-Putin Alliance
    by David Atkins
    December 31, 2016 8:00 AM

    On December 19th Glenn Greenwald went on Fox News to do what he and his Intercept-libertarian acolytes have done since Trump’s victory: minimize and deny the evidence that Russia was responsible for the hacking of Democratic officials that helped deliver the election to Trump. But why the protestations?

    Contrary to the assertions of many Intercept fans, the evidence that Russia was responsible is as damning as it can be in cases of international cyber-espionage. It’s true that it’s possible, as Matt Taibbi suggests, that blaming Russia is a bogus political play. But the Obama Administration has been nothing if not overly cautious in this arena, and flailing desperately and deceitfully isn’t this president’s style. Numerous intelligence services have confirmed Russian involvement, detailing as much evidence as they can without compromising their methods. The New York Times has its own comprehensive report. Russian intelligence services tried to cultivate Donald Trump for years. Donald Trump explicitly asked Russia to hack 30,000 of Clinton’s emails during a July press conference that turned out to be the last of his campaign–showing that at least at the time he believed Russia was behind the Watergate-style theft of private email data from Democrats. And we know that Putin has been openly backing Trump while mocking the Obama administration and the Clinton campaign.

    In light of all this, continually and actively denying Russian involvement as Greenwald and crew have done goes beyond Taibbi’s healthy skepticism of government officials and smacks of ideological fervor. Even the Trump campaign has stopped questioning the unanimous judgment of American intelligence services, and moved on to a “who cares?” approach that is already falling apart under pressure and scrutiny. Pretty much only the Russians themselves, the conspiracy theorists at WorldNetDaily and the Intercept libertarians are actively objecting to the evidence against Putin.

  135. 135.

    Starfish

    January 3, 2017 at 10:13 am

    @germy shoemangler: A singular focus on racial identity wars will be the death of Democrats. Ellison is doing a good job where he is. There are people already trying to pick up Kamala Harris who will be in her first Senate term to run for president because she fits the superficial requirements of being multi-cultural.

    Someone pointed out that the existing Democratic party is oldish, and Ellison may appeal to more young people than Perez will. The other two candidates you mentioned were from New Hampshire and South Carolina. Democrats won New Hampshire by such a thin margin that having someone from there might make sense. But a person from New Hampshire will be dismissed as East Coast liberal elite. The one from South Carolina may be able to focus on breaking up the red Southern states. But when you look at what the Republicans in North Carolina did, it sure feels a little hopeless.

  136. 136.

    Josie

    January 3, 2017 at 10:13 am

    @Gin & Tonic: This. My representative is a Democrat from Texas, which is a pretty powerless position to be in. I follow him on twitter, and he stays very busy working with other reps and local groups, trying to make things better for the people in his district.

  137. 137.

    rikyrah

    January 3, 2017 at 10:16 am

    Trump Is Calling His American Opponents “Enemies” While Praising Putin
    by David Atkins
    December 31, 2016 8:14 PM

    Donald Trump took to Twitter on this New Year’s Eve to taunt his American opponents as “enemies”:

    Happy New Year to all, including to my many enemies and those who have fought me and lost so badly they just don’t know what to do. Love!

    — Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) December 31, 2016

    Baiting and trolling one’s opponents on a holiday after losing the popular vote by almost 3 million votes is just another sign of Trump’s narcissistic insecurity. No one lost “badly” to Trump; he won a very slim victory by virtue of a rigged and archaic electoral college system. The man is a sore loser, a sore winner and a terrible human being.

    But he didn’t just taunt Americans who oppose him. He labeled them as “enemies”, which is unusual and alarming from a man who is about to control America’s surveillance and law enforcement apparatus. American presidents usually shy away from calling their domestic opponents “enemies” because that sort of rhetoric is the realm of dictators, not presidents who anticipate having to work with their opposition to pass legislation. It is reminiscent of Nixon’s “enemies lists” and other dark times in American history, and a very far cry from President Obama’s unifying rhetoric.

    It’s even worse, though. Trump is using this language on his domestic opponents while simultaneously praising a foreign nuclear-armed dictator who allegedly committed a malicious electronic burglary of the private communications of Trump’s political opposition. This is beyond unprecedented to the point of surrealism. It’s not technically treason, but it’s definitely subversion of American democracy and the national interest.

  138. 138.

    Elizabelle

    January 3, 2017 at 10:16 am

    Also: props to Anne Laurie for the no-Tr*mp blogpost art. The cartoon is great.

    Many thanks.

  139. 139.

    germy shoemangler

    January 3, 2017 at 10:17 am

    During an interview on Marc Maron’s “WTF” podcast released Monday, Bruce Springsteen said he questions whether Trump “is simply competent enough to do this particular job.”

    Springsteen is a high-profile Democrat and appeared with Hillary Clinton on the campaign trail. Springsteen says he understands how Trump got elected. He says the Republican played working class fears over a changing economy, increasing diversity and the Islamic State group.

    He tells Maron that he has “felt disgust” over elections before, “but never, never the kind of fear that you feel now.”

    Springsteen says he plans to do his best to play a “very, very small part” in trying to ensure America maintains its ideals.

  140. 140.

    Gin & Tonic

    January 3, 2017 at 10:17 am

    @rikyrah: Greenwald, Assange and Snowden should be sharing adjacent cells at the Supermax.

  141. 141.

    FlipYrWhig

    January 3, 2017 at 10:18 am

    @Starfish:

    Someone pointed out that the existing Democratic party is oldish, and Ellison may appeal to more young people than Perez will.

    Keith Ellison, voice of a new generation, is 53. Tom Perez, throwback oldster, is 55.

  142. 142.

    rikyrah

    January 3, 2017 at 10:19 am

    Obama’s Top 50 Accomplishments, Revisited
    The comprehensive legacy of the 44th President.

    by Paul Glastris and Nancy LeTourneau

    In March 2012, we compiled a list of what were, at the time, President Barack Obama’s greatest achievements, to accompany our cover story, “The Incomplete Greatness of Barack Obama.” Today, at the end of his second term, Obama’s legacy is far more complete. Indeed, items from the original list—such as increasing national service opportunities, creating the Race to the Top education reform program, and expanding stem cell research—fell off in order to make room for new ones.

    But his legacy is also under threat. Donald Trump and the new Republican-dominated Congress have pledged to undo much of what the president has achieved, including repealing the Affordable Care Act and reversing important executive actions on immigration and climate change. So it is with this caveat that we offer the following updated list of Obama’s top accomplishments.

  143. 143.

    Kathleen

    January 3, 2017 at 10:20 am

    @Gin & Tonic: Amen.

  144. 144.

    Botsplainer

    January 3, 2017 at 10:21 am

    @Gin & Tonic: I work (and was born and raised) in KY-03, ably represented by the extremely progressive and responsive John Yarmuth, who donates his entire congressional salary. I live in KY-04, which elects a red cheeked babyface ALEC fluffer by the name of Thomas Massie in a district that sprawls from Ashland-Huntington to the Cincinnati suburbs to the Louisville metro boundary. He has no clue about his constituents, their infrastructure or their economic needs, is invisible on the outer wings of the district, and simply follows a “guns-homos-abortion-tax cut” template that ALEC gives him, and those suburban-exurban Cincy psychos (with a great assist from my pustule red exurb) will happily keep him in congress. And it isn’t just middle to upper middle class whites voting it – large parts of the trucker cap contingent support it, too.

  145. 145.

    Starfish

    January 3, 2017 at 10:23 am

    @FlipYrWhig: Really? Wow.

  146. 146.

    rikyrah

    January 3, 2017 at 10:24 am

    Lips pursed.

    Quick Takes: Trump and Obama on Lincoln
    by Nancy LeTourneau
    January 2, 2017 5:10 PM
    POLITICAL ANIMAL BLOG

    * There are times when it is hard to comprehend the distance this country will travel from Obama to Trump on January 20th. To illustrate, let’s take a look at how the two of them describe our greatest president. On the 150th anniversary of the Civil War, President Obama wrote this about what Abraham Lincoln means to him, and to America:

    Always thoughtful, always eloquent, Lincoln’s writings speak to me as they speak to so many Americans, reminding us what is best about ourselves and the Union he saved: that though we may have our differences, we are one people, and we are one nation, united by a common creed…

    …Lincoln termed the United States, in one of his early messages to Congress, “the last best hope of earth.” Considering that our fragile Union was not 100 years old and stood a good chance of dissolving, it was an improbable thing to say. But Lincoln saw beyond the bloodshed and division. He saw us not only as we were, but as we might be. And he calls on us through the ages to commit ourselves to the unfinished work he so nobly advanced—the work of perfecting our Union.

    * Back in April 2016, Bob Woodward asked Donald Trump why Lincoln succeeded. Here is his response:

    Well, I think Lincoln succeeded for numerous reasons. He was a man who was of great intelligence, which most presidents would be. But he was a man of great intelligence, but he was also a man that did something that was a very vital thing to do at that time. Ten years before or 20 years before, what he was doing would never have even been thought possible. So he did something that was a very important thing to do, and especially at that time.

  147. 147.

    Betty Cracker

    January 3, 2017 at 10:26 am

    @rikyrah: There is an internal logic to it, if you accept that Snowden is Greenwald’s $1M baby, and therefore, (employing Greenwald’s annoying AF signature capitalization for emphasis) anything that aids Snowden or places him in a positive light is Good, and anything that threatens of reflects negatively on Baby is Bad.

    This explains the reflexive hostility to Obama and Clinton. It explains the excuse-making for Putin. If Putin up and clapped Snowden in irons (and why would he, propaganda coup that he remains), Greenwald would suddenly find the hacking evidence very compelling and rival Senator Joe McCarthy in the volume of his anti-Russian rhetoric. All without a nanosecond’s self-reflection.

  148. 148.

    Major Major Major Major

    January 3, 2017 at 10:27 am

    @Starfish:

    a person from New Hampshire will be dismissed as East Coast liberal elite

    Uh, by who, exactly? Nobody but us junkies could even name the DNC chair until March 2016.

  149. 149.

    MomSense

    January 3, 2017 at 10:28 am

    @Botsplainer:

    The fact that he is tweeting his ignorance for the world to see while simultaneously telling the world that he doesn’t need intelligence briefings is making it clear to all potential threats that we are an easy mark.

  150. 150.

    Jeffro

    January 3, 2017 at 10:31 am

    @FlipYrWhig:

    Keith Ellison, voice of a new generation, is 53. Tom Perez, throwback oldster, is 55.

    Who knew that two years could make such a difference?
    LOL

  151. 151.

    germy

    January 3, 2017 at 10:31 am

    “In 1796, as George Washington set the precedent for a peaceful, democratic transfer of power, he also set a precedent by penning a farewell address to the American people. And over the 220 years since, many American presidents have followed his lead.
    On Tuesday, January 10, I’ll go home to Chicago to say my grateful farewell to you, even if you can’t be there in person.
    I’m just beginning to write my remarks. But I’m thinking about them as a chance to say thank you”

    (Our president)

  152. 152.

    FlipYrWhig

    January 3, 2017 at 10:31 am

    @Betty Cracker: Yup. On LGM I said something similar when Greenwald/Snowden/Assange came up recently, and I further suggested that Greenwald at this point has a huge psychic investment in hacktivism and the concomitant notion that hacktivists are independent and conscience-driven and don’t work at the behest of states. So that’s how he pretty much HAS to view Russian hackers.

  153. 153.

    Yarrow

    January 3, 2017 at 10:32 am

    @MomSense: Yep. I’m sure China and Russia, among others, have taken good note of the fact that he’s an apparent narcissist and only listens to the last person he’s talked to. The fact that he indicates doesn’t believe the intelligence community is going to mean lots more terrorism attempts. Some will probably succeed.

    I can only hope he’s so incompetent that it becomes apparent quickly that he’s a risk to the country. I guess it will only be if he’s a risk to the GOP that they’ll decide to remove him.

  154. 154.

    germy

    January 3, 2017 at 10:34 am

    As the Associated Press reports, Canadian universities have seen a surge in applications from American high-school students since the November 8 election. The University of Toronto has seen a 70 percent increase in applications from U.S. students this year, while McMaster University in Hamilton, Ontario, has seen a 34 percent hike in U.S. applications. Other Canadian schools have also seen hikes of 20 percent or more.

    Officials at U.S. colleges have also noticed a shift in applications since the election. Recruiters pointed out that more foreign students are opting for schools in Canada or Australia instead, due to fears about safety and deportation, the AP reports. Additionally, Canadian schools have reportedly also seen an increase in applications for students from China, India, and Pakistan.

  155. 155.

    FlipYrWhig

    January 3, 2017 at 10:34 am

    @Jeffro: I’ll concede from lived personal experience that being 45 feels significantly worse than 43 was.

  156. 156.

    germy

    January 3, 2017 at 10:34 am

    @FlipYrWhig: Wait til you’re sixty.

  157. 157.

    Jeffro

    January 3, 2017 at 10:35 am

    Btw – Trump engaging in Twitter-finger-wagging at the GOP Congress for gutting its Ethics Office.

    That’s all, just questioning their priorities and scoring a few points with the rubes, not actually going to do anything about it. I’m sure Congress will repay the favor (if they haven’t already paid it forward by not concerning themselves with Trump divesting himself of anything)

    Kabuki Presidency & Congress coming up in T-minus 17 days…

  158. 158.

    FlipYrWhig

    January 3, 2017 at 10:35 am

    @rikyrah: Donald Trump knows nothing about anything and he’s been bluffing-slash-blustering for 70 years.

  159. 159.

    germy

    January 3, 2017 at 10:35 am

    @Jeffro: Good cop, Bad cop

  160. 160.

    Yarrow

    January 3, 2017 at 10:35 am

    @germy: Make America Great Again! Send all the smart people to other countries.

  161. 161.

    magurakurin

    January 3, 2017 at 10:36 am

    @Major Major Major Major: and they didnt know who Bernie Sanders was until March 2015. Too much silliness. we’re fucked.

  162. 162.

    FlipYrWhig

    January 3, 2017 at 10:36 am

    @germy: You hush your mouth. :P

  163. 163.

    Belafon

    January 3, 2017 at 10:36 am

    @rikyrah: Trump couldn’t even be bothered to read the Cliff Notes version of history.

  164. 164.

    magurakurin

    January 3, 2017 at 10:38 am

    @Belafon: for Shitgibbon there is no past, no future just a never ending now where he is the center of universe.

  165. 165.

    germy

    January 3, 2017 at 10:38 am

    @FlipYrWhig: I still feel 18.
    Yesterday I was walking down the street and passed a coffee shop with highly-reflective windows. Saw my reflection and wondered “Who is that old geezer?”

  166. 166.

    Jeffro

    January 3, 2017 at 10:39 am

    @Jeffro: Liz Warren is on the case, though, asking “Who thinks we have too many rules requiring government to act ethically?”

    Now if she’d just take the next step and show how Trump & the GOP Congress are covering for each other’s scuzzy practices, we might be on our way for 2018

  167. 167.

    Spanky

    January 3, 2017 at 10:39 am

    @germy shoemangler: Glad your wrist is feeling better. Now don’t overdo the “someone is wrong on the internet” typing. That’s what I tell my wife when she looks up to see why I’m pounding the keyboard.

    XKCD FTW

  168. 168.

    Patricia Kayden

    January 3, 2017 at 10:39 am

    @rikyrah: Another great write up of President Obama’s legacy. Bookmarking them all.

  169. 169.

    Spanky

    January 3, 2017 at 10:40 am

    @rikyrah:

    This time, the hapless New York Times is the culprit.

    I’m shocked. Shocked, I tell you.

  170. 170.

    Major Major Major Major

    January 3, 2017 at 10:41 am

    @magurakurin: when the GOP tried to make the RNC a signaling position they got Steele. When they went for insidery competence they got huge wins at every level.

  171. 171.

    bemused

    January 3, 2017 at 10:41 am

    @evodevo:

    He does carry it a wee bit too far at times, lol. When the previous washing machine stopped working, he spent a lot of time researching online and talking to company tech people to correct the problem, had the machine taken apart, ordered parts, still not working, more research. He really doesn’t have that much spare time to fuss with stuff like this anyway but I think it’s a challenge to a still good enough to fix guy. To sum up I had no workable washing machine for two weeks, forced to do basic laundry at mother-in-laws which I hated because she uses a laundry detergent with scent that makes me gag that clung to my clean laundry (she doesn’t see well so I think she uses too much to begin with) and we were running out of undies and socks. I’m fine with his handiness the majority of the time but this time I said this will never happen again. About a year later the many years old washing machine did give up the ghost plus it still wasn’t spinning as well as it used to. It was a happy, happy day when we got our new washing machine…very happy.

  172. 172.

    Denali

    January 3, 2017 at 10:41 am

    @Kay,
    What was the Fight for Fifteen? My brother-in-law, a retired college president,was very active in the Moral Monday movement in North Carolina, and it was heart breaking to see was has happened in North Carolina recently.
    @Rikrah,
    Perhaps my phrase working class was the wrong one. Perhaps my take on Trump voters was wrong. I do think voter suppression affected the outcome of the election.
    I am not saying that the Democratic Party should abandon its inclusiveness. I really don’t know what their strategy should be.

  173. 173.

    FlipYrWhig

    January 3, 2017 at 10:43 am

    @magurakurin: He’s like Bart Simpson during his Terrible Twos.

  174. 174.

    daveNYC

    January 3, 2017 at 10:43 am

    @Major Major Major Major: His district has been held by a Democrat since 1963 and he won re-election with 69% of the vote. That seat is about as safe as safe can be, so his resignation is not likely to cost the Democrats anything.

    @Gin & Tonic: What, like helping someone wrangle getting a passport or navigate the USCIS or something? I mean that’s nice and all, but that’s not exactly high impact work. DNC head honcho is a pretty solid promotion, especially if it comes with a mandate to get shit sorted out between the national and state levels of the party. Is your position that anyone leaving an elected office mid-term is abandoning their constituents?

  175. 175.

    bemused

    January 3, 2017 at 10:43 am

    @bemused:

    Oops, meant to answer Ozark Hillbilly.

  176. 176.

    Jeffro

    January 3, 2017 at 10:43 am

    @germy: Sorta. Reminds me a little more of two robbers razzing each other on the way out of the bank…”ooo, you rascal, takin’ all that dough! No, you crook, emptyin’ out those safe deposit boxes!” [laughs] [high fives exchanged]…and…scene.

    Because that’s really what we’re looking at here. Just bad crook and bad crook, going through the motions while they make off with others’ assets.

  177. 177.

    dww44

    January 3, 2017 at 10:44 am

    @Joe Falco: To continue with the theme of Trump’s appointees, Sonny has a viable and profitable grain and fertilizer business ( I’ve a cousin who managed one of his grain buying enterprises until his retirement last year) which he’s probably not going to divest himself of.

    Sonny became governor in 2002 when the entire state turned red. He himself was one of the many former Democrats who switched parties in the 90’s and 2000’s.

  178. 178.

    FlipYrWhig

    January 3, 2017 at 10:44 am

    @Major Major Major Major: Ooh, good point about Steele, although to be scrupulously fair, he presided over a fair share of victories himself. And IMHO Howard Dean was a signaling candidate too.

  179. 179.

    germy

    January 3, 2017 at 10:47 am

    WaPo headline:
    Trump slams Republicans for voting behind closed doors to weaken ethics office

    Fight! Fight! Fight! Fight! Fight!

  180. 180.

    raven

    January 3, 2017 at 10:49 am

    @dww44: Fucking idiot King Roy paved the way.

  181. 181.

    Belafon

    January 3, 2017 at 10:49 am

    @germy shoemangler:

    Springsteen says he plans to do his best to play a “very, very small part” in trying to ensure America maintains its ideals.

    This is slightly misleading, what Springsteen said is that he would do “his very, very small part” in that he will do what he can among the other 300+M people. That’s different than saying he’s going to do very little.

  182. 182.

    Spanky

    January 3, 2017 at 10:50 am

    @germy:

    Wait til you’re sixty.

    At 62 I’m a lot older than you are. A vast gulf divides 60 and 62.

    Well, half-vast.

  183. 183.

    NR

    January 3, 2017 at 10:51 am

    @efgoldman:

    I’ve said before and will no doubt say again: purity ponies will be the death of our party; and the hard-core, dead-end Sanders supporters don’t know how politics works or how to win fucking elections.

    Yeah, we should all just listen to the wise and mighty establishment Democrats, who clearly and demonstrably know how to win elections so much better than those stupid liberals. It’s not like establishment Democrats have lost the entire country to the Republicans over the last eight years or anything.

  184. 184.

    Major Major Major Major

    January 3, 2017 at 10:53 am

    @daveNYC: again, you’ve addressed why Keith might be bored as a congressman in the minority, but that is not a good reason for him to be DNC chair.

    ETA: also, screw him if he’s bored with being a congressman, he shouldn’t have run for congress.

    EATA: looks like the google alert went off, here comes our buddy. I’m off to read about Zoroastrianism!

  185. 185.

    PST

    January 3, 2017 at 10:55 am

    Two stories this morning make me feel a tiny bit better. I won’t make too much of them, truly, but cracks in the GOP facade are always good. First, a story in the New York Times says that the presumptive Secretary of Defense, James Mattis, actually has a demonstrably good record of opposing torture. A low bar, sure, but more than mere lip service in his case. Second, Trump tweeted some criticism of the house for weakening the Congressional Ethics Office, although it didn’t seem very sincere.

  186. 186.

    dww44

    January 3, 2017 at 10:55 am

    @raven: Because of his education policies that alienated so many teachers?

  187. 187.

    Jeffro

    January 3, 2017 at 10:55 am

    @germy:

    WaPo headline:
    Trump slams Republicans for voting behind closed doors to weaken ethics office

    Fight! Fight! Fight! Fight! Fight!

    Nope – just cover for their looting. Two crooks each pretending they care what the other is stealing. That WaPo headline could just as easily have been “Trump, GOP critique each others’ ethics, take no action”

  188. 188.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    January 3, 2017 at 10:55 am

    @sunny raines:

    not to be pessimistic, but there really is no comparison of bush-the-lessor and trump. bush was/is a stupid frat-boy, but at times he was vulnerable to the kinds of pressures mentioned, and his family is mainstream. trump is a soulless, psychotic, extreme narcissist. There will not be any appealing to him – there is nothing there in trump except vile disgusting evil.

    That’s the thing – souless evil. He is going to anger a lot of people right and left and because it’s all about him even the GOP won’t back him up. I mean why, when they can have a President Peance?

  189. 189.

    Belafon

    January 3, 2017 at 10:57 am

    @NR: I pop in periodically and you’re still just as boring and repetitive as ever.

  190. 190.

    ruemara

    January 3, 2017 at 10:57 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA: you most certainly can shoot RAW in auto mode. So that’s bunk. And if you’re doing multi-venue locations like the last music festival I shot, it can be a lifesaver.

    Re: ACLU. Well, good luck. Those 100+ judgeships being filled by the most partisan, venial and unethical president and congress don’t bode well for the courts as a method redress. We’ve got 2 years to vote in a new congress. Meanwhile, people are still trying to make Fetch Sanders happen. I’m not hopeful.

  191. 191.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    January 3, 2017 at 10:57 am

    @Jeffro: He really can’t do anything. Congress impeaches the president, not the other way around. That’s why all the purity ponies talk of electing a president to drain the swamp is bs.

  192. 192.

    NR

    January 3, 2017 at 10:57 am

    @Botsplainer:

    We can either have a 50 state strategy organized around centrism and incremental gains,

    Yes, that is what people all across the country are clamouring for: centrism and incremental gains. You can tell by the way they’ve overwhelmingly voted for it over and over again for the last eight years.

  193. 193.

    Jeffro

    January 3, 2017 at 10:58 am

    @PST:

    Second, Trump tweeted some criticism of the house for weakening the Congressional Ethics Office, although it didn’t seem very sincere.

    He questioned them making it a priority, not that they’re gutting their own ethics oversight. Just a free shot at Congress to put a smile on the rubes’ faces…Trump even made sure to hashtag it #DTS (drain the swamp). That Donald, he’s gonna shake things up! LOL

  194. 194.

    FlipYrWhig

    January 3, 2017 at 10:58 am

    @NR: LIBERALS WERE WINNING EVERYWHERE ALL THE TIME UNTIL ESTABLISHMENT BACKSTAB

  195. 195.

    Belafon

    January 3, 2017 at 10:59 am

    @Jeffro: When the enemy hands you a knife and turns his back, don’t criticize the fact that it’s only sharp on one side. Stab him with it.

    Channeling my inner Sun Tzu.

  196. 196.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    January 3, 2017 at 11:02 am

    @FlipYrWhig: people in southern Ohio and western Wisconsin are clamoring to vote for massive tax increases to create a new middle-class entitlement that will benefit everyone white dreadlocked kids in New Hampshire named Trey and Ryan know!

  197. 197.

    Jeffro

    January 3, 2017 at 11:02 am

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques:

    He really can’t do anything. Congress impeaches the president, not the other way around. That’s why all the purity ponies talk of electing a president to drain the swamp is bs.

    A president can’t do anything when Congress votes to gut its Ethics Office? Not officially, sure. But let’s not kid ourselves – any president, especially one with a backbone and ethics of his own, could make this a major issue, talk about what happened back in the DeLay/Abramhoff era, ask questions about why they’re getting rid of it, how they plan to police their own, etc.

    The subsection that now prohibits the Ethics Office from talking to the press in any way…that ALONE is newsworthy…and of course a president could be bringing that up.

  198. 198.

    germy

    January 3, 2017 at 11:03 am

    @Jeffro:

    Nope – just cover for their looting.

    Good cop Bad cop. Oldest game in the book.

  199. 199.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    January 3, 2017 at 11:06 am

    Beth FouhyVerified account
    ‏@ bfouhy
    While we’re on the topic of Congressional ethics: Jack Abramoff joins mitchellreports on MSNBC at noon today

    there are reporters, even TV personalities, who could get a very good and revealing piece out of a convicted criminal like Abramoff. I suspect Mrs Greenspan is not one of them.

  200. 200.

    NR

    January 3, 2017 at 11:06 am

    @Belafon: You want to talk repetitive? Wow, look, BJ commenters are trashing lefty “purity ponies” and blaming them for the demise of the Democratic party. Must be a day that ends in “y.”

  201. 201.

    germy

    January 3, 2017 at 11:07 am

    Tuesday Morning Open Thread: Herding Cats, or Progressives

    I know this: Cats forget nothing.

    About six months ago we had the vet make a housecall. The woman decided to put our cat on top of her favorite tower “just to give her nails a clipping, no extra charge”. The woman was nice, but her assistant held our cat’s head down while she clipped the claws.

    Six months later, our cat will NOT go on top of that tower. Used to be her favorite place to nap and lounge. No more. I put her up there and she jumps right off.

    Do progressive have the same memory? I thought they’d have learned after King Ralph in 2000.

  202. 202.

    Jeffro

    January 3, 2017 at 11:08 am

    @Belafon: That headline is a half-sharp knife? Or is it the media just going along with pretend-oversight between these guys, reinforcing to most that Trump “slammed” Congress in some way?

    Congress will no doubt “slam” Trump at some point, and they’ll both just laugh about it on the way out of the bank (see #178 above)

  203. 203.

    FlipYrWhig

    January 3, 2017 at 11:09 am

    @NR: Eight years ago on Election Day, the Oklahoma statehouse turned Republican for the first time in history. Whatever happened to that zealously liberal Oklahoma Democratic Party that at the beginning of that period could elect Dan Boren, an NRA board member who voted against Obamacare, cared nothing about the environment and was anti-abortion and anti-gay? Probably it was that milquetoast Democratic approach in the Obama years that demoralized all the erstwhile eager Borenites.

  204. 204.

    NR

    January 3, 2017 at 11:09 am

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Okay, we’ll try your approach: slowly and patiently explain to those people in southern Ohio and western Wisconsin that what they really need is more third-way centrist incrementalism, with a heaping helping of calling them racists on top of that. I’m sure they’ll flock to our banner after that

  205. 205.

    Major Major Major Major

    January 3, 2017 at 11:10 am

    News alert sez Ford cancels plans to build Mexico plant, will invest $700m in Michigan and create 700 jobs

  206. 206.

    FlipYrWhig

    January 3, 2017 at 11:10 am

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Oh, for sure! Everyone loves liberalism, it’s just that The Man keeps them from having it!

  207. 207.

    Steeplejack (tablet)

    January 3, 2017 at 11:10 am

    @germy shoemangler:

    Doesn’t your browser save your nym and e-mail address?

  208. 208.

    daveNYC

    January 3, 2017 at 11:11 am

    @Major Major Major Major: Hillary left the Senate halfway through her Senate term in order to become SoS, so I don’t really get what your point is. If it’s a better job that he thinks he can make a difference at, then I don’t see why he shouldn’t go for it. Dude’s been in that seat since 2007, so it’s not like he’s not put in time.

    There’s reasons to prefer Ellison to Perez and vice versa, but the fact he’s a sitting Congressman isn’t really one of them.

  209. 209.

    geg6

    January 3, 2017 at 11:11 am

    @FlipYrWhig:

    Forget it, Jake. Idiots like NR will tell you that FDR was a flaming socialist. Facts and history be damned when there’s a narrative about the evilosity of actual liberal Democrats to be waved about like a bloody shirt.

    The fact is that the far left has never won a damn thing. Hell, even their patron saint is nothing more than your bog standard New England rep, so even he doesn’t deserve to be in their pantheon of far left gods. In fact, I see no one in that pantheon except a bunch of old hippies, philosophers and linguists and young white men who know nothing about anything. Certainly no one who ever won an actual election.

  210. 210.

    Jeffro

    January 3, 2017 at 11:12 am

    @germy: I thought good cop/bad cop was when one cop is bad to scare an informant, and the good cop tries to be the informant’s buddy, in order to get info out of the informant?

    Here we have two clowns using each other to look better and/or look like they’re doing something about the other. So maybe instead of good cop, bad cop, it’s fake cop, fake cop? I think two robbers giving each other grief (with a wink and a nod) on the way out of the bank is closer to what we’ve got in Trump and Congress.

  211. 211.

    Botsplainer, Cryptofascist Tool of the Oppressor Class

    January 3, 2017 at 11:13 am

    @NR:

    Ever since Our Progressive Betters started sniping at blue dogs for being insufficiently pure somewhere around 2009, refusing to provide a counterweight to the tealiban at the townhalls or the conversations on the ACA (because they didn’t blow up every pension, 401k and mutual fund in the country), and dancing on the campaigns of the defeated blue dogs, it made that whole “50 state” thing difficult.

    And fuck you.

  212. 212.

    Larkspur

    January 3, 2017 at 11:15 am

    @germy: Hah. I literally did this one time when I was house-sitting at a new place. I heard a noise in the guest house and thought I should investigate – it was in the day time, and I wasn’t scared – and as I explored the guest house (it was quite a spacious guest house) I turned a corner and came face to face with this strangely dressed, haggard-looking old woman, and thank dog I wasn’t armed or I would have shot the full-length mirror. I sure left the guest house feeling shaken. Holy crap, that’s me!

  213. 213.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    January 3, 2017 at 11:20 am

    as to the DNC contest, I’ve heard Ellison say things that indicate he’s a very pragmatic person with an eye on state/local races, and other things that make him sound like a pious, Green Lanterny Sandernista. I’m willing to give him a chance, if only because his direct experience with electoral politics seems broader than Perez’s. I do wish he’d recognize that not everyone shares his (and Chris Hayes’ and Rachal Maddow’s) fascination with the Old Shouter.

  214. 214.

    Steeplejack (tablet)

    January 3, 2017 at 11:21 am

    @rikyrah:

    Back in April 2016, Bob Woodward asked Donald Trump why Lincoln succeeded. Here is his response.

    Book report from sixth-grader who didn’t read the book.

  215. 215.

    Major Major Major Major

    January 3, 2017 at 11:23 am

    @daveNYC: I don’t see anybody making an issue about his being a sitting congressman here, and I guess I don’t see your point either. If, however, he’s bored as a congressman, he shouldn’t have run for congress as recently as two months ago. That’s the sort of shit we slag Rubio for.

  216. 216.

    Yarrow

    January 3, 2017 at 11:23 am

    @Belafon:

    Channeling my inner Sun Tzu.

    Speaking of Sun Tzu, how about “The Art of War” for a Balloon-Juice book club book?

  217. 217.

    Belafon

    January 3, 2017 at 11:24 am

    @daveNYC: I think either of them will be fine. I think it’s good that Ellison is willing to resign to take on the job full time.

    I also think anyone looking at anything other than their abilities and what they plan on doing for state and local Democrats has their egos involved in their choice.

  218. 218.

    FlipYrWhig

    January 3, 2017 at 11:25 am

    @geg6: The thing that drives me up the fucking wall is the refusal to look at WHERE and WHO is in question here. These are actual people. We know the actual human beings who held office when there were Democratic majorities. This is recent history. I mean, this doesn’t involve poring over microfiche in a disused library or something. Conservative people in states that lean Republican and conservative at the presidential level used to elect conservative Democrats at the state level. Then they stopped. The evidence suggests that those people think the Democratic Party is TOO LIBERAL. Being MORE LIBERAL can’t possibly win back those voters.

    If you want the Democratic Party to be more liberal, which is a great wish, and which I ALSO WISH, you absolutely cannot cite as evidence any of the things NR habitually cites. You have to be saying instead that a more liberal Democratic Party would win over different people and that there would be so many of these people that they would win in a new way that nobody has ever won before. I think the evidence is thinner than Flat Stanley. But you know what would prove me wrong? WINNING A MOTHERFUCKING ELECTION SOMEWHERE USING THIS SET OF IDEAS. Christ, man, Jesus not Charlie.

  219. 219.

    Yarrow

    January 3, 2017 at 11:27 am

    @geg6: When the far left starts winning local and state elections, or, hell, even consistently putting up candidates for them, we can listen to them. As Kay said, the best way to get people to pay attention to you is to win an election in a competitive district. So…go on, far left. Show us how it’s done.

  220. 220.

    Belafon

    January 3, 2017 at 11:27 am

    @Jeffro: Just because we know how the game is played, doesn’t mean we can’t use it against them. There are a lot of people who voted for Trump because they thought he would change things (I’ll leave alone exactly how they thought he would change them). And Washington being corrupt was one of those things they wanted changed. Those are the people you’re after. Tell them Trump is opposing Republicans in Congress on this issue. Then, when he backtracks, you can go after him.

  221. 221.

    Thoroughly Pizzled

    January 3, 2017 at 11:29 am

    I know that I would have voted Republican this election if not for Reince Preibus. The face of Ellison or Perez will be on all ballots for the next four years, so this is definitely the Most Important Thing for Democrats Regaining Power, Part Fifty-Six.

  222. 222.

    MomSense

    January 3, 2017 at 11:30 am

    @Belafon:

    I do prefer Perez because of his record on civil rights and voting rights and the fact that he wants to make voting rights a major part of the DNC. I think that is exactly the direction we need to go in.

  223. 223.

    Steeplejack (tablet)

    January 3, 2017 at 11:32 am

    @Major Major Major Major:

    I’m thinking about renaming the housecat Bernie and then posting about Bernie in every thread.

  224. 224.

    FlipYrWhig

    January 3, 2017 at 11:34 am

    @MomSense: And labor rights.

  225. 225.

    hovercraft

    January 3, 2017 at 11:39 am

    @Steeplejack (tablet):

    Book report from sixth-grader who didn’t read the book.

    I take exception to that, my fourth grader can give a more cogent account of what made Lincoln our greatest president. He was the bestest, smartest, evah!! may be kindergarten level at best.

  226. 226.

    catclub

    January 3, 2017 at 12:03 pm

    @sunny raines:

    [Bush] and his family is mainstream. trump is a soulless, psychotic, extreme narcissist.

    I have remained impressed that Bush is not going to the inauguration. I wonder about Romney.

  227. 227.

    catclub

    January 3, 2017 at 12:06 pm

    @Belafon:

    There are a lot of people who voted for Trump because they thought he would change things (I’ll leave alone exactly how they thought he would change them)

    I just read an item noting how much of a ‘change’ election this was. The usual 95%+ of House re-elected, likewise no incumbent Democrats lost in Senate, only two GOP. A few state houses changed hands – 3 each way.

    So not a change election.

  228. 228.

    Kathleen

    January 3, 2017 at 12:15 pm

    @Botsplainer: those suburban-exurban Cincy psychos

    You got that right! Those people suck souls for a living.

  229. 229.

    Kathleen

    January 3, 2017 at 12:23 pm

    @germy: Just saw WAPO headline that the tweet caused GOP to “rethink” the move.

  230. 230.

    Another Scott

    January 3, 2017 at 12:23 pm

    @catclub: Shhhhhush! Data confuses the narrative!!

    :-/

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  231. 231.

    Brachiator

    January 3, 2017 at 12:27 pm

    House Republicans have gutted an independent ethics watchdog, putting it under their own control, in a secret ballot hours before the new Congress convened for the first time.

    I suppose this will make it easy for the Congress to stay in step with White House thievery.

    Dobbs: “If you’re the Congress, then where are your ethics?”
    Gold Hat: “Ethics? We ain’t got no ethics. We don’t need no ethics. I don’t have to show you any stinkin’ ethics!”

    — The Treasure of the Mar-a-Lago

  232. 232.

    Kathleen

    January 3, 2017 at 12:27 pm

    @FlipYrWhig: Or in the case of DWS and HRC, “The Woman”.

  233. 233.

    Kathleen

    January 3, 2017 at 12:30 pm

    @Larkspur: I get the same reaction when I look in the mirror (especially if it’s magnified) and see my reflection. I’m all like, “Who the hell is that and where did those wrinkles come from?” I’m 67.

  234. 234.

    NR

    January 3, 2017 at 12:31 pm

    @geg6: Well it sure is great that we have you sensible establishment Democrats to show us stupid liberals how to win elections. After all, you’ve been doing such a bang-up job of that lately, who could possibly question your wisdom?

  235. 235.

    NR

    January 3, 2017 at 12:34 pm

    @Botsplainer, Cryptofascist Tool of the Oppressor Class: Right, I forgot the mantra around here: establishment Democrats can’t fail, they can only be failed. Everything bad that’s ever happened is a liberal’s fault. How could I have forgotten that?

  236. 236.

    Brachiator

    January 3, 2017 at 12:39 pm

    @catclub:

    I have remained impressed that Bush is not going to the inauguration. I wonder about Romney.

    Romney will be handling coat check duties, and waiting tables later at the ball.

  237. 237.

    Lizzy L

    January 3, 2017 at 12:40 pm

    CNBC reports:

    House Republicans on Tuesday backed out of plans to weaken an independent ethics office after broad criticism of the move.

    The decision not to gut the Office of Congressional Ethics comes after an emergency conference meeting. The House GOP is reversing a surprising move it made Monday, only a day before the start of a new Congress, when it adopted a rules package amendment to put the OCE under the jurisdiction of the House Ethics Committee.

  238. 238.

    rikyrah

    January 3, 2017 at 12:42 pm

    @MomSense:

    I do prefer Perez because of his record on civil rights and voting rights and the fact that he wants to make voting rights a major part of the DNC. I think that is exactly the direction we need to go in.

    That’s why I’m TeamPerez

  239. 239.

    Brachiator

    January 3, 2017 at 12:44 pm

    House Republicans on Tuesday backed out of plans to weaken an independent ethics office after broad criticism of the move.

    They’ll be back.

  240. 240.

    Kay

    January 3, 2017 at 12:44 pm

    @NR:

    I don’t care if you get Keith Ellison. I think this idea that “get Keith Ellison = liberals win elections” is nuts, though. You will have definitely won the “get Keith Ellison” race though.

    I just think you’re on the wrong track – you’re on track that isn’t even anywhere near the road…

    But congrats on that Keith Ellison versus Perez win, should you prevail. The enemy of your enemy is your friend, or something.

  241. 241.

    J R in WV

    January 3, 2017 at 12:45 pm

    @BillinGlendaleCA:

    Bill, for something like a flying aircraft, you can set the camera to manual and then focus at infinity, or very near to it. You don’t have to let the camera try to focus on something far away with odd circumstances. Same for birds, you can estimate the range and set focus manually, with almost all cameras with any ability to make settings changes.

    I’m imagining yours is that capable, don’t really remember make and model off hand. Shame to miss a B-2 flyover, though.

  242. 242.

    tybee

    January 3, 2017 at 12:56 pm

    @Joe Falco: every time i pass through Bonaire, i roll down the window and spit.

  243. 243.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    January 3, 2017 at 1:04 pm

    @Kay: NR is the quintessential emo-prog, he’s been spewing his adolescent anger here for years. Bernie shouted things, Bernie likes Keith, therefore Keith is now the great Emo Hope. I’ll admit that part of the reason I think we should give Elison a shot– I do think he’s smart and committed and has given some indication of having ideas beyond shouting– is just to not give the NR-types somthing else to whine about.

    Not NR him (I’m guessing) self. He’ll never shut up.

  244. 244.

    925

    January 3, 2017 at 1:06 pm

    @NR:

    Look everybody, it’s the “Voice of the People”™.

  245. 245.

    SFBayAreaGal

    January 3, 2017 at 1:11 pm

    Troll #1 has arrived. Come on people stop feeding IT.

  246. 246.

    Larkspur

    January 3, 2017 at 2:02 pm

    @Kathleen: I know. When you’re young, you don’t realize that when you’re old and you look in the mirror, you see not only what’s there, but everything that came before, It’s this multi-layered historical archive, but only you (and maybe a few people who love you and have known you for a long time) know that the old visage isn’t all there ever was. It’s interesting as heck.

  247. 247.

    FlipYrWhig

    January 3, 2017 at 2:06 pm

    @Kay: Be prepared, if Ellison gets the gig, for NR et al. to bray at every setback REAL BERNIEISM HAS NEVER BEEN TRIED!

  248. 248.

    sukabi

    January 3, 2017 at 2:11 pm

    @OzarkHillbilly: they quietly and unanimously pulled the bill this morning…doesn’t mean they won’t try it again…but apparently the public support for their wonton power grab just wasn’t there…bad optics is my guess. Even drumpf has enough cleverness to know that you don’t call the bank and give a heads up before you rob it.

  249. 249.

    NR

    January 3, 2017 at 4:13 pm

    @Kay: Actually, to my recollection, I didn’t comment at all on the race for the DNC chair here. I simply spoke out against the stupid and ridiculous idea that “purity ponies” were the cause of the Democratic party’s demise.

    I don’t have strong feelings either way about the race for DNC chair. I think Ellison and Perez both have their advantages and their problems. Also, I mostly agree with you that the real battle over the next two years will be at the state level.

  250. 250.

    Steeplejack

    January 3, 2017 at 4:23 pm

    @sukabi:

    [. . .] wonton power grab [. . .].

    Okay, that, especially with your nym, is hilarious.

  251. 251.

    Mnemosyne

    January 3, 2017 at 4:30 pm

    @Thoroughly Pizzled:

    If you never watch Fox News (I was sometimes forced to watch it with my dad), you might be surprised to hear that Debbie Wasserman Schultz was Public Enemy #1 on there. They constantly talked about how horrible and corrupt she was and by extension how horrible and corrupt the Democrats were for putting her in charge of the DNC.

    That’s why all of the DWS hate from the Berniebros was so goddamned destructive — they were echoing what was already being said by Republicans and on Fox News, and it only amplified the relentless DNC and Democrats are corrupt drumbeat.

  252. 252.

    geg6

    January 3, 2017 at 4:36 pm

    @NR:

    I’ve got an outgoing president who won two terms in the face of the worst the GOP could throw at him.

    What have you got?

  253. 253.

    NR

    January 3, 2017 at 5:29 pm

    @geg6: 2009

    2016

    Yeah, it’s great that Obama won two terms. The rest of the party completely collapsed. And as I’m sure you’re aware, it’s not just the White House that matters.

  254. 254.

    geg6

    January 3, 2017 at 6:10 pm

    @NR:

    Still more than my progressive betters have managed.

  255. 255.

    NR

    January 3, 2017 at 6:13 pm

    @geg6: Um, no. Losing the entire country to the Republicans outside of the northeast and the west coast is not “more” than anything. In fact, it’s quite a bit “less” than what you started with.

  256. 256.

    Mnemosyne

    January 3, 2017 at 7:54 pm

    @NR:

    So are you ever going to read the multiple links from the Brennan Center I’ve provided to you about the ill effects of Citizens United and Shelby County v Holder, or are you going to keep pretending this was all the Democratic Party’s fault because nobody liiiiiked them?

  257. 257.

    NR

    January 3, 2017 at 8:14 pm

    @Mnemosyne: Are you ever going to acknowledge that money is not the end-all be-all in politics (see: this most recent presidential election, where Hillary Clinton spent twice as much $$$ as Donald Trump), and admit to the possibility that maybe the Democratic party leadership fucked up big time, Bad Jackie?

  258. 258.

    Mnemosyne

    January 3, 2017 at 8:43 pm

    @NR:

    Check how much the Koch brothers spent on Congressional races and come back to say that dark money doesn’t matter.

    Though I do love how 2.8 million more Hillary voters have ceased to exist in your mind and it really was that mythical Trump landslide that he keeps tweeting about. Are you always this susceptible to Republican propaganda? So far, all signs point to yes, but I’m sure there’s some Republican meme somewhere that you didn’t fall for.

  259. 259.

    NR

    January 3, 2017 at 9:10 pm

    @Mnemosyne: I’ve never said Trump won by a landslide. He didn’t. So I have no idea what you’re on about here.

    But hey, if you want to keep unquestioningly supporting the same Democratic party leadership that lost the whole country to the Republicans, that’s your prerogative. Don’t change a single thing. You’re going to be very disappointed in 2018 and 2020, but I’m sure you’ll find someone else you don’t like to blame for that, too. Because as we all know, nothing that goes wrong is ever your fault.

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