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You are here: Home / Open Threads / Spicer: Take Two (Open Thread)

Spicer: Take Two (Open Thread)

by TaMara|  January 23, 20171:47 pm| 255 Comments

This post is in: Open Threads, Republican Stupidity

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Looks like Spicer is going to take a second run at the press. Let me know how it turns out. I can’t bear to watch.

Open Thread

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Previous Post: « Aetna and cynicism confirmed
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Reader Interactions

255Comments

  1. 1.

    Shell

    January 23, 2017 at 1:49 pm

    At least his suit is a little less ill-fitting.

  2. 2.

    tybee

    January 23, 2017 at 1:49 pm

    i love slow motion train wrecks

  3. 3.

    JPL

    January 23, 2017 at 1:49 pm

    I had it on mute for a few minutes, and I noticed that he has his hair styled and makeup put on. It’s a much better visual image. lol

  4. 4.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 1:50 pm

    He’s just reading flat propaganda. Looking up every 12 to 15 seconds then reading from a sheet of paper.

  5. 5.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 1:50 pm

    @JPL: The suit is still not a great fit but world’s better than Saturday.

  6. 6.

    Yarrow

    January 23, 2017 at 1:53 pm

    @JPL: Wasn’t the image the only thing Trump cared about with the first one? That he didn’t look good, or something?

  7. 7.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 1:53 pm

    This is some NoKo Dear Leader Strongman type shit.

    He is really bad at this job.

  8. 8.

    Yarrow

    January 23, 2017 at 1:55 pm

    @Corner Stone: Really? That’s pathetic. But, hey! His suit fits better so that must mean he’s doing a good job, amirite?

    Is he going to take questions?

  9. 9.

    Elizabelle

    January 23, 2017 at 1:55 pm

    Watching Law and Order SVU; haven’t seen this one. So not watching the alternative facts briefing.

    Does Spicer look less like a lesser Nazi in this outing?

    Lie, lie, lie, lie, lie, lie, lie.

  10. 10.

    the Conster, la Citoyenne

    January 23, 2017 at 1:56 pm

    @Corner Stone:

    It only matters if the media is really bad at their job, and we already know the answer to that.

  11. 11.

    PsiFighter37

    January 23, 2017 at 1:57 pm

    First question was to NY Post reporter, second to someone framing a pro-life question. Great…

  12. 12.

    Lizzy L

    January 23, 2017 at 1:58 pm

    I’m reading the liveblog on The Guardian website. His answers to questions are — not enlightening.

    When will the border wall start to be built?

    As soon as possible, Spicer says.

    Are you enforcing the Obamacare mandate?

    Discussions continue on repealing and replacing Obamacare, he says.

  13. 13.

    JPL

    January 23, 2017 at 1:58 pm

    @Yarrow: Trump was disappointed with the Saturday press conference, because the visuals were off. Now he has a side row filled with female aides, and Spicer has been dressed up. I still don’t think he keeps his job though.

  14. 14.

    lamh36

    January 23, 2017 at 2:01 pm

    ‪@carolynlochhead ‬White House closes public switchboard, replacing with recordings ‪directing to post comments on line or on Facebook. 202-456-1414

  15. 15.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 2:02 pm

    @JPL: I remember that Robert Gibbs was also very bad at this job but he smoothed out a little. I don’t think he ever started out quite *this* bad.

  16. 16.

    opiejeanne

    January 23, 2017 at 2:03 pm

    @lamh36: Well that’s just super.

  17. 17.

    Spanky

    January 23, 2017 at 2:05 pm

    Any signs of Jimmy/Jeff//Gannon/Guckert asking a puffball question?

    You just know he’ll be back.

  18. 18.

    Immanentize

    January 23, 2017 at 2:06 pm

    @lamh36: Is that temporary? Seems like the President doesn’t actually control the White House entirely, does s/he?

  19. 19.

    Spanky

    January 23, 2017 at 2:06 pm

    @JPL:

    Now he has a side row filled with female aides,

    Page Six girls?

  20. 20.

    Brachiator

    January 23, 2017 at 2:06 pm

    This really makes me miss episodes of “The West Wing.”

  21. 21.

    Elizabelle

    January 23, 2017 at 2:07 pm

    @lamh36: Probably couldn’t hire enough people with asbestos ears.

    How fun would it be to be a Talking Points Memo intern undercover at the White House comments switchboard? Probably the wild west, between opponents and (worse) supporters.

  22. 22.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 2:07 pm

    He keeps calling countries “companies”. I wonder if that’s an accident.

  23. 23.

    Kay

    January 23, 2017 at 2:09 pm

    I know that no one knows what’s actually in the TPP, most especially Donald Trump but one thing ABOUT the TPP is it is very, very good for agriculture states. Because it opens markets abroad for US agricultural products and because US markets for imports are ALREADY open that is a guaranteed win for US agriculture producers.

    Republicans will screw all the ag state Republican voters who have supported them year after year to help Donald Trump retain his razor close majority in rust belt states.

  24. 24.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 2:10 pm

    @PsiFighter37:

    second to someone framing a pro-life question.

    Christian Broadcast Network. He called her by name, did not announce the network affiliation.

  25. 25.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 2:11 pm

    ACTUAL FUCKING CHYRON ON MSNBC:
    White House: Our Intention Is Never To Lie

  26. 26.

    NotMax

    January 23, 2017 at 2:11 pm

    “Good day. We’ve always been at war with Eastasia. Good-bye.”

  27. 27.

    liberal

    January 23, 2017 at 2:11 pm

    @Spanky: lol

  28. 28.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 2:11 pm

    Still litigating crowd sizes. Wow.

  29. 29.

    Quinerly

    January 23, 2017 at 2:12 pm

    It’s falling apart.

  30. 30.

    Immanentize

    January 23, 2017 at 2:12 pm

    @Corner Stone: That is the true definition of Fascism — the elision of government and corporations. Frankly, Cass Sunstein did a little ground work for Trump with his “liberal paternalism” claptrap.

  31. 31.

    NotMax

    January 23, 2017 at 2:12 pm

    @Corner Stone

    We all know what the road to Hell is paved with, don’t we?

  32. 32.

    Mothra

    January 23, 2017 at 2:13 pm

    I did not know that iPhones, tablets, and YouTube had to be “added” together- wouldn’t streaming account for all of them?

  33. 33.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 2:14 pm

    @NotMax: Hopefully the bones of people who served in the Trump admin.

  34. 34.

    opiejeanne

    January 23, 2017 at 2:14 pm

    @Brachiator: The West Wing is on Netflix. It’s good for your sanity, most of it.

  35. 35.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 2:14 pm

    White House: Sometimes We Can Disagree With The Facts

  36. 36.

    sukabi

    January 23, 2017 at 2:15 pm

    @Corner Stone: did they put a fact check calling bullshit under it?

    Eta or at least a “LOL ???”

  37. 37.

    Yarrow

    January 23, 2017 at 2:15 pm

    @lamh36: Wow…… That is just…. Wow.

  38. 38.

    dexwood

    January 23, 2017 at 2:15 pm

    @NotMax:
    The opposite of good is good intention.

  39. 39.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 2:16 pm

    This has all gone horribly wrong now. They were not able to line up enough tame patsies in a row to ask softball questions.

  40. 40.

    Roger Moore

    January 23, 2017 at 2:17 pm

    @Corner Stone:

    White House: Our Intention Is Never To Lie

    And since they’re always lying, this should be interpreted as “Our Intention Is Always To Lie”.

  41. 41.

    randy khan

    January 23, 2017 at 2:17 pm

    @lamh36:

    As I suspected in my post on an earlier thread. Shocking.

  42. 42.

    liberal

    January 23, 2017 at 2:17 pm

    @Kay:

    …but one thing ABOUT the TPP is it is very, very good for agriculture states.

    Please provide a cite supporting this claim.

  43. 43.

    O. Felix Culpa

    January 23, 2017 at 2:18 pm

    ACTION OPPORTUNITY:

    The Republicans need to get the message from the majority of Americans that we value and need the benefits of Obamacare. Here’s how we do that.

    On January 23rd [TODAY] everyone who feels that way (our numbers are legion) sends a note to Donald Trump with a simple message:

    “Don’t make America sick again. Improve Obamacare. Don’t repeal it.”

    One envelope for every ACA supporter in your household…even if they are under 18 years old.
    Just that simple message. Put it in an envelope, and put a stamp on it.

    On January 23rd, mail it to:
    Pres. Donald Trump
    1600 Pennsylvania Ave NW,
    Washington, DC 20500

    Can you imagine the picture of 53 MILLION letters arriving at the White House by January 26th? It will be a mountain. That image might help deter the Republicans from killing the most substantial improvement to American healthcare since the discovery of Penicillin.

    Do it today! Drop it into a mailbox near you on Monday, January 23rd.

    Please send this email to 20 (or more) of your friends, neighbors and fellow Americans. Ask them to do the same.

  44. 44.

    Miss Bianca

    January 23, 2017 at 2:18 pm

    @Quinerly: Was it ever together?

  45. 45.

    Laertes

    January 23, 2017 at 2:18 pm

    Oh God. Baghdad Bob just cited the cheering crowds at the CIA as evidence of Trump’s popularity there, utterly oblivious to the fact that CBS has recently reported that Trump packed that audience with his own cheering section.

  46. 46.

    Yarrow

    January 23, 2017 at 2:18 pm

    @Corner Stone:

    Still litigating crowd sizes. Wow.

    Really? Did someone ask a question or did Spicer bring it up himself?

  47. 47.

    randy khan

    January 23, 2017 at 2:18 pm

    @Quinerly:

    Details! We want details!

  48. 48.

    Miss Bianca

    January 23, 2017 at 2:19 pm

    @O. Felix Culpa: ooh, nice one! I’m gonna do it!

  49. 49.

    Roger Moore

    January 23, 2017 at 2:19 pm

    @NotMax:

    We all know what the road to Hell is paved with, don’t we?

    Melting snowballs.

  50. 50.

    Kryptik

    January 23, 2017 at 2:19 pm

    @Laertes:

    “Disagreeing with Facts” in action.

  51. 51.

    Gin & Tonic

    January 23, 2017 at 2:20 pm

    @Kay: I am certain that Xi Jinping is quietly cheering.

  52. 52.

    O. Felix Culpa

    January 23, 2017 at 2:20 pm

    @O. Felix Culpa: Wouldn’t hurt to send the letter to Paul Ryan either:
    1233 Longworth HOB
    Washington, D.C. 20515

    “Don’t make America sick again. Improve Obamacare. Don’t repeal it.”

  53. 53.

    bystander

    January 23, 2017 at 2:20 pm

    @Corner Stone: I wish I could agree with you about Thomas Roberts, but I can’t. I kept wanting Joy to hush him up, not that she would ever do that.

    The changeover at MSNBC has affected a lot of people. I caught an ad in which Rachel Maddow exhorts us all to give the wretched Greta Van Succubus a chance. Uh huh.

  54. 54.

    opiejeanne

    January 23, 2017 at 2:21 pm

    @Corner Stone:

    Christian Broadcast Network. He called her by name, did not announce the network affiliation

    CBN. One of the scabbiest huckster “Christian” money-making groups/companies out there.

  55. 55.

    Thoroughly Pizzled

    January 23, 2017 at 2:22 pm

    Why was TPP defended so tepidly? I can’t believe Obama let his party turn on it in such numbers. Was it to avoid smashing up the negotiations?

  56. 56.

    Origuy

    January 23, 2017 at 2:22 pm

    Sorry if this has already been posted. After they marched, 500 women learned how to run – for office
    The last paragraph is worth noting.

    “The most important thing we saw yesterday, the big takeaway, was the numbers of women in rural America, in the middle of America, who came together and realized, ‘I’m not alone,’ ” she said. “That’s so empowering, and those are going to be our future candidates.”

  57. 57.

    Percysowner

    January 23, 2017 at 2:23 pm

    In a totally unsurprising reveal we now know why there was cheering and laughing at Trumps CIA speech from Talking Points Memo Report: Trump Stocked Audience At CIA Speech With Cheering Supporters.

  58. 58.

    lamh36

    January 23, 2017 at 2:23 pm

    If this press briefing doesn’t make each and every HONEST journalist pissed off then the whole lot of them deserve what they get

  59. 59.

    NotMax

    January 23, 2017 at 2:25 pm

    @Roger Moore

    Guessed before checking that the link was to this.

  60. 60.

    TriassicSands

    January 23, 2017 at 2:25 pm

    From the WaPo:

    Sean Spicer earns four Pinocchios, but, seriously, we wish we could give five.

    Obviously, the Post needs a new unit. I suggest the “Trump,” which kicks in after four Pinocchios. However, we’re going to have to move to the Light Trump. Much like the vast distances to stars and other galaxies, Trump’s lies outstrip normal units of measure. The Light Trump should be enough — at least for the foreseeable future.

    Spicer’s Saturday lies earn the first “Trump.” The lie was obvious and easily disproved.

  61. 61.

    Roger Moore

    January 23, 2017 at 2:26 pm

    @lamh36:
    I would put it slightly differently. You’ll be able to tell which journalists are honest by whether this press briefing pisses them off. Journalists who accept being transparently lied to as the price of access are not honest.

  62. 62.

    dww44

    January 23, 2017 at 2:26 pm

    @Corner Stone:I remember that Gibbs was quite bad as well. He may have smoothed out, but he never really got more progressive. Josh Earnest turned out to be the best Press Secretary of the last couple of decades.

    As long as we’re tallking about the press here’s an email I got a couple of hours ago from the AJC. The email title was “We need help” although the linked article was a bit more restrained, just about all the tornado damage in the state yesterday and the night before. FYI, Albany is the part of the state that Shirley Sherrod hails from and where she, as far as I know, still resides. Albany/Dougherty county has become a majority African American county in recent decades.

    “We need help,” Christopher S. Cohilas said during a news conference. “FEMA, please get people on the damn ground.
    #Albany officials: “We need help… FEMA… please get people on the damn ground” at news conference now @wsbtv
    — Brian Monahan, WSB (@BMonahanWSB) January 23, 2017
    “We don’t have enough resources. We need everything our country can give us.” President Donald Trump on Sunday called Gov. Nathan Deal to offer condolences and pledged his support.

    “We’ll be helping out the state of Georgia,” he said.

  63. 63.

    aimai

    January 23, 2017 at 2:27 pm

    @O. Felix Culpa: Excellent idea. I will do it. I am already engaging in the postcard project of the women’s march but this is definitely worth doing.

  64. 64.

    West of the Rockies (been a while)

    January 23, 2017 at 2:27 pm

    So li’L Seanie Spicer is again struggling? Awesome. Spice Boy failing again.

  65. 65.

    liberal

    January 23, 2017 at 2:28 pm

    @Thoroughly Pizzled:

    Why was TPP defended so tepidly?

    Because anyone with a fucking brain in his head and a love of liberty would be aghast at any so-called “trade agreement” that gave corporations supernational powers, aka “investor-state dispute settlements”?

  66. 66.

    MisterForkbeard

    January 23, 2017 at 2:28 pm

    @bystander: Ick, no. Fox people were awful then and continue to be awful now. I know Maddow is probably contractually obligated to do this, but I’m kind of upset with her now.

  67. 67.

    Quinerly

    January 23, 2017 at 2:29 pm

    @Kryptik:
    I caught that, too. I hope someone covers that.

  68. 68.

    Ceci n est pas mon nym

    January 23, 2017 at 2:30 pm

    Meanwhile, overheard from right-wing world (the wingnut two cubes over). “I hear they banned CNN from White House press briefings, har har. Don’t know the details but something about how their reporting on Inauguration Day was suspect…”

    The “suspect” part being that they pointed out the discrepancy between Spicer’s statements and objective reality.

    Le sigh.

  69. 69.

    MisterForkbeard

    January 23, 2017 at 2:30 pm

    @TriassicSands: “We have a new scale. 1-4 Pinocchio’s for lying, and a Dumpster Fire for Trump Administration attempts to lie about easily verifiable facts.”

  70. 70.

    NotMax

    January 23, 2017 at 2:32 pm

    @MisterForkbeard

    Maddow has constantly demonstrated she wears opaque ideological blinders when it comes to speaking of her drinking buddies.

  71. 71.

    liberal

    January 23, 2017 at 2:32 pm

    @Immanentize:

    That is the true definition of Fascism — the elision of government and corporations.

    Not really (not that I’m fond of such elision). It’s true that many fascist states were marked by corporatism. But if you look at the definitions listed under Wikipedia, it’s not mentioned at all.

  72. 72.

    Quinerly

    January 23, 2017 at 2:32 pm

    @Laertes:
    This Administration continues to poke at the CIA. This isn’t going to end well. My money is on the CIA. Spicer just out and out lied twice now in this presser about that cheering and clapping at the CIA.

  73. 73.

    Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho

    January 23, 2017 at 2:32 pm

    @TriassicSands:

    Sean Spicer earns four Pinocchios, but, seriously, we wish we could give five.

    I love that also too.

    And who doesn’t bring a cheering section to rallies, I mean agency addresses, after all?

  74. 74.

    Brachiator

    January 23, 2017 at 2:33 pm

    Baron Harkonnen: He who controls the Spicer, controls the universe!

    — with apologies to Dune

  75. 75.

    Laertes

    January 23, 2017 at 2:33 pm

    @Thoroughly Pizzled:

    I imagine that once both Clinton and Trump had come out against TPP, it was dead as a doornail and there wasn’t much that President Obama could do about it. Kicking up a fuss over it would have hurt Clinton, and at the time this didn’t seem like a lost cause.

  76. 76.

    lamh36

    January 23, 2017 at 2:34 pm

    ‪So all it takes is to lie more professionally…ok cool got it…smh…US press is a fuqn joke!‬

    ‪‪@ktumulty‬
    PressSec doing a solid, professional job. #reboot

  77. 77.

    Mnemosyne

    January 23, 2017 at 2:35 pm

    @O. Felix Culpa:

    I would do it as a postcard. A sealed envelope gives them an excuse to throw them all away out of “anthrax fear.”

  78. 78.

    the Conster, la Citoyenne

    January 23, 2017 at 2:35 pm

    @Percysowner:

    He brings his own studio audience. What a fucking lunatic.

  79. 79.

    GregB

    January 23, 2017 at 2:36 pm

    Moscow Spice?

    Baghdad Bob Spice?

    Propaganda Spice?

  80. 80.

    O. Felix Culpa

    January 23, 2017 at 2:36 pm

    @Miss Bianca: @aimai: Thank you! I’m heading out to the post office shortly to mail my letters. Along with a few packages I promised to send for Ms. O.

  81. 81.

    Quinerly

    January 23, 2017 at 2:37 pm

    At 5:00 AM the DOD tweeted “Social media postings provide an important window into a person’s mental health. Know what to look for.” I’m pretty sure this is General Mattis first day. Hmmmmmmmmmm.

  82. 82.

    MisterForkbeard

    January 23, 2017 at 2:37 pm

    @liberal: Yep. My understanding is that part of her contract says she can’t attack fellow MSNBC people and has to help promote them, but she goes farther than she needs to.

    @Ceci n est pas mon nym: Not much you can do to help combat that kind of nonsense. Trump said it, they believe it, and it doesn’t matter how obviously wrong he is.

  83. 83.

    NotMax

    January 23, 2017 at 2:37 pm

    @the Conster, la Citoyenne

    Henceforth to be known as truffers.

    (Trump fluffers.)

  84. 84.

    A Ghost To Most

    January 23, 2017 at 2:38 pm

    @lamh36:

    Fuck KarenTumulty – yesterday on CNN she was acting all pissed about the lies; today she is with the program, as expected

  85. 85.

    Thoroughly Pizzled

    January 23, 2017 at 2:38 pm

    “I’ll get back to you.”

    “It’s day one.”

    “It’s the first day.”

    They want to be held to the standards to which they’ve been held their entire lives.

  86. 86.

    Quinerly

    January 23, 2017 at 2:40 pm

    @Miss Bianca:
    Not really but it obviously started to go downhill. I give him less than 90 days.

  87. 87.

    O. Felix Culpa

    January 23, 2017 at 2:40 pm

    @Mnemosyne:

    I would do it as a postcard. A sealed envelope gives them an excuse to throw them all away out of “anthrax fear.”

    Good idea. Is anthrax still a thing? I have some nice postcards of New Mexico I can send our President (ptui!) and House Majority Leader (ptui again!).

  88. 88.

    TriassicSands

    January 23, 2017 at 2:40 pm

    @Quinerly:

    Spicer just out and out lied twice now in this presser about that cheering and clapping at the CIA.

    I missed that. What did he say? I heard the clapping and cheering and it sounded quite enthusiastic. (The same enthusiasm was present when Trump called the media people incredibly dishonest.)

  89. 89.

    Miss Bianca

    January 23, 2017 at 2:41 pm

    @NotMax: “trufflers”? Pigs rooting for the rare, rare, nugget of truth?

  90. 90.

    trollhattan

    January 23, 2017 at 2:41 pm

    Well, well, Wikileaks magically has become concerned about the missing Trump tax returns, and now offers to release them should somebody care to share.

    Three months too late, assholes.

  91. 91.

    schrodingers_cat

    January 23, 2017 at 2:42 pm

    @GregB: Moscow mule.
    Watching this I feel, like I need to start brushing up on my Hindi skills.

  92. 92.

    rikyrah

    January 23, 2017 at 2:43 pm

    @Corner Stone:

    he’s reading from a piece of paper?

  93. 93.

    Kay

    January 23, 2017 at 2:43 pm

    @liberal:

    The US opened US markets to ag imports. Other countries didn’t reciprocate. The TPP remedies what is an uneven playing field for US ag- they have to compete with foreign producers in the US but they aren’t allowed access to the markets in other countries.

    That’s exactly what happened with manufacturing, except there it was free traders who created the uneven playing field. They opened US markets to imports but other countries didn’t reciprocate.

    Trump is making the same mistake free traders made in the 1980’s and 1990’s, except he’s doing it for protectionist purposes. He doesn’t understand fair trade. It’s ABOUT reciprocity. “Trade” isn’t bad. That was never what the fair trade argument was about. It doesn’t matter if he gets rid of a deal that opens foreign markets to US ag. The US ALREADY opened markets to foreign ag. All he’s doing now is making it harder for US producers to compete.

    You can look at it as plus and minus signs. The US is a plus sign. Free trade. If they are competing with a minus sign they’re at a disadvantage. It has to be minus/minus or plus/plus. Plus/minus hurts the free trade country. That’s us.

    So in agriculture we know the US is a plus (+) So we need another plus country to trade with or it’s not a level playing field. The TPP turns Japan (for example) into a +. Right now it’s +/-, US/Japan. That hurts US ag producers.

  94. 94.

    Gin & Tonic

    January 23, 2017 at 2:44 pm

    @TriassicSands: It was enthusiastic because it was all Trump shills.

  95. 95.

    Mnemosyne

    January 23, 2017 at 2:44 pm

    So MomSense mentioned earlier today that Richard Cohen (Trump’s lawyer) was snarking that the pink hats women were wearing on Saturday weren’t made in America. Ladies (and crafty gents), I say we track down this jackass’s office address and send him a bunch of pink hats of his very own since it seems like he really wants one. Who’s with me?

  96. 96.

    Jeffro

    January 23, 2017 at 2:44 pm

    @TriassicSands: I think the lie was that the clapping was from CIA officials, when it was actually from Trump invitees and suck-ups who had been given the first three rows of seats.

  97. 97.

    Mnemosyne

    January 23, 2017 at 2:45 pm

    @O. Felix Culpa:

    They would claim it was still a thing, so I wouldn’t even let them have the excuse.

  98. 98.

    Fester Addams

    January 23, 2017 at 2:45 pm

    @Mnemosyne:

    A sealed envelope gives them an excuse to throw them all away out of “anthrax fear.”

    Pretty sure all mail to congress and the White House is delivered to a distant, contractor-run facility where it’s opened by (presumably poorly paid) workers, scanned then destroyed. There won’t be a Miracle on 34th Street style pile of mailbags anywhere near D.C.

  99. 99.

    Quinerly

    January 23, 2017 at 2:45 pm

    @TriassicSands:
    I can’t link on this smarty pants phone. Go to CBS and TPM. Stories up about how Trump brought a cheering section with him to the CIA speech. People from the CIA have told this to CBS. At this very moment Spicer is again lying about it. Third time.

  100. 100.

    MisterForkbeard

    January 23, 2017 at 2:46 pm

    @trollhattan: WikiLeaks went whole hog on the ant-hillary pro-Trump bandwagon last year. I can’t imagine how anyone with half a brain thinks of them as a neutral arbiter of… anything.

    And yet some of my liberal friends still insist they’re just merely anti-secrets. Sigh.

  101. 101.

    Jeffro

    January 23, 2017 at 2:46 pm

    @trollhattan: Anything that comes via Wikileaks, true or not, will automatically be suspect by both sides – and it’ll make any other future releases suspect as well. They won’t care if there are a million versions of Trump’s taxes out there, they can just claim that none of them are true.

    We need someone to get Trump’s real returns to the WaPo or NYT, a.s.a.p.

  102. 102.

    O. Felix Culpa

    January 23, 2017 at 2:47 pm

    @Mnemosyne:

    I say we track down this jackass’s office address and send him a bunch of pink hats of his very own since it seems like he really wants one. Who’s with me?

    I’d say “yes,” except I can’t knit and it would be a sad waste of nice hats. Otherwise I love it for the prank value. Add “Lovingly handcrafted in the USA” labels. Abbie Hoffman would be proud.

  103. 103.

    O. Felix Culpa

    January 23, 2017 at 2:48 pm

    @Mnemosyne: I hear ya. I’ve passed your postcard suggestion on to the friend who initiated this effort.

  104. 104.

    p.a.

    January 23, 2017 at 2:50 pm

    @Percysowner: He’s not President. He’s Chuck Barris prodecing a schlock tv show.

  105. 105.

    Kay

    January 23, 2017 at 2:50 pm

    @liberal:

    That was why I knew Obama was a true free trade believer. There was no political benefit for Democrats in that deal. All the benefits flow to GOP states. That’s why it had nearly 100% GOP support. It was a wash or a deficit for Democrats but it was an absolute win for Republicans.

  106. 106.

    TriassicSands

    January 23, 2017 at 2:50 pm

    @Gin & Tonic: @Jeffro:

    Thanks for the clarification.
    But, but, but…Trump would never do something like that.

    Spicer is now denying that they were Trump shills. The first row was “all CIA.”

  107. 107.

    john (not mccain)

    January 23, 2017 at 2:51 pm

    “My money is on the CIA.”

    Mine, too. They have spent decades coming up with clever ways to assassinate unstable autocrats who pose a danger to the US.

  108. 108.

    Brachiator

    January 23, 2017 at 2:51 pm

    @GregB:

    Moscow Spice?

    Baghdad Bob Spice?

    Propaganda Spice?

    Oh, definitely Propaganda Spice.

  109. 109.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 2:51 pm

    Angry Spicer Is Angry!
    He’s turning green and his pants are starting to split.

  110. 110.

    Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes

    January 23, 2017 at 2:52 pm

    @GregB:

    I am henceforth calling Kellyanne Conway “Old Spice”.

  111. 111.

    Yoda Dog

    January 23, 2017 at 2:52 pm

    @liberal: You’ve heard of google, yes?

    Here’s one.

  112. 112.

    NotMax

    January 23, 2017 at 2:52 pm

    @Jeffro

    One positive thing about the IRS is the standard of severe and dedicated security when it comes to access to individual returns. Would be of lasting damage to have that compromised.

    Now, when it comes to state returns…

  113. 113.

    Thoroughly Pizzled

    January 23, 2017 at 2:53 pm

    What a whiny-ass baby. Truly pathetic.

    All of the Republican White House press secretaries have been transcendentally loathsome.

  114. 114.

    Librarian

    January 23, 2017 at 2:53 pm

    @bystander: You should’ve seen the episode of her show when she talked about Greta coming to MSNBC. She couldn’t say enough great things about her and what a great journalist she is.

  115. 115.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 2:53 pm

    Dammit, I had to get on a call for a while and muted Sarcastic Spicer in the transition to Angry Spicer so I didn’t start lying about the TPS reports.
    Looked like he was getting lambasted for a bit.

  116. 116.

    p.a.

    January 23, 2017 at 2:54 pm

    @GregB: Forked Tongue Spice, Slithery Spice, Mephistopheles Spice.

  117. 117.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 2:54 pm

    @Librarian: That 15 minute tongue bath was fucking disgusting. I had been off Maddow for some time but that sealed it.

  118. 118.

    schrodingers_cat

    January 23, 2017 at 2:54 pm

    @Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes: Are you Botsplainer of the old? Score, on the Old Spice. A guy who I briefly dated used to have, what felt like a bath in that thing. Eeww.

  119. 119.

    mai naem mobile

    January 23, 2017 at 2:55 pm

    I’ve listened to Stephanie Miller and Randi Rhodes make a few comments(few and farnbetween) about Rachel Maddows behavior at Air America so I don’t think she’s all pure etc. I am sure she’s got her side of the story but Rachel is ambitious and I believe willing to bend her principles a little here and there to get where she wants to get. And,BTW, I think up to an extent, thats okay.

  120. 120.

    Quinerly

    January 23, 2017 at 2:55 pm

    Presser totally off the rails, in my opinion.

  121. 121.

    Thoroughly Pizzled

    January 23, 2017 at 2:55 pm

    When I think of sacrifice, I think of Donald Trump.

  122. 122.

    Tilda Swintons Bald Cap

    January 23, 2017 at 2:55 pm

    @A Ghost To Most: Is it too much to expect these media asshats to hold a consistent position for more than two days in a row ? I know stupid question, they’re going to get a lot of people killed.

  123. 123.

    Mnemosyne

    January 23, 2017 at 2:56 pm

    @Fester Addams:

    Since I’m feeling prankish today, why not go for a series of singing telegrams? Can’t re-route those to a remote facility.

  124. 124.

    NotMax

    January 23, 2017 at 2:56 pm

    @Thoroughly Pizzled

    Excepting Jerald terHorst.

  125. 125.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 2:56 pm

    @Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes: Not to be catty but KAC always looks like the proverbial “Walk of Shame” person after a hard night’s drinking in a low down dirty biker bar or beat down country jukebox poolhall.

  126. 126.

    Kay

    January 23, 2017 at 2:57 pm

    @liberal:

    I don’t care. As far as I’m concerned agriculture deserves everything Republicans do to them. Food stamps are thebest thing that ever happened to those people and they all oppose them.

    It’s literally A VOUCHER for poor people to buy ag products. I mean, Jesus. It’s not my job to draw them a map of how they benefit from that. It’s a giant subsidy for agriculture. Imagine if we had a huge voucher program for any other product. The recipients of that largesse would not be demonizing the end-user recipients! They’re morons.

  127. 127.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 2:58 pm

    Hallie Jackson looking on oh so intently. *this is my “I take this new job vveeerrryyyy seriously face” you like?*

  128. 128.

    trollhattan

    January 23, 2017 at 2:58 pm

    @Quinerly:

    off the rails

    So, business as (now) usual then?

    Donny’s ready for four years of Calvinball.

  129. 129.

    Quinerly

    January 23, 2017 at 2:58 pm

    @Thoroughly Pizzled:
    Spicer ain’t going to last in this position.

  130. 130.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 3:00 pm

    @Quinerly: I don’t think anyone there knows what to do at this point. They just keep asking these blathering questions and he either gets petulant or says he’ll have to get back to them on that.

  131. 131.

    Jeffro

    January 23, 2017 at 3:00 pm

    @NotMax: If only there were agencies…or perhaps an entire (I)Community…that was good at hacking stuff…

  132. 132.

    Thoroughly Pizzled

    January 23, 2017 at 3:01 pm

    @NotMax: Before my time. But it sounds like he was a decent fellow.

  133. 133.

    TriassicSands

    January 23, 2017 at 3:01 pm

    @Gin & Tonic:
    @Jeffro:
    @Quinerly:

    Spicer has now categorically denied there were any Trump people present…at all.

    He also tried to parse his statement about the size of the inaugural crowd so that it was “true.” He said he couldn’t imagine how anyone would interpret his words to mean anything but the “total audience of both in person and around the globe…combined.” Funny. Everyone interpreted them otherwise. He’s an accomplished liar.

  134. 134.

    Barbara

    January 23, 2017 at 3:01 pm

    @O. Felix Culpa: I posted this on Facebook with the intro that four people in my immediate family have coverage or better coverage because of the ACA, including my mother who is on Medicare — the ACA began closing the Part D donut hole.

  135. 135.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 3:01 pm

    Why IN THE FUCK can’t these fucking preening camera whores just ask one godsdamned question when it is their turn?!

  136. 136.

    The Lodger

    January 23, 2017 at 3:02 pm

    @Thoroughly Pizzled: And now I wonder if the hairpiece is flammable…

  137. 137.

    Timurid

    January 23, 2017 at 3:02 pm

    Yesterday the reporters and on air personalities were panicking over the unprecedented craziness from Trump and Spicer… a day passes… orders from the suits at Corporate have reached the front line, and everyone is back in THIS IS FINE mode.

    Elites want a King. Trump is a mess, but he’s the only guy who would volunteer for the job.

  138. 138.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 3:03 pm

    “Aaaannnd I’m spent.”

  139. 139.

    Jeffro

    January 23, 2017 at 3:03 pm

    @Corner Stone: Gonna be hard to stall day-in, day-out, for four straight years…

  140. 140.

    Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho

    January 23, 2017 at 3:03 pm

    @Mnemosyne: I think there are better uses for the hats, like donations to organizations that serve people who need hats in cold weather. Send Michael Cohen postcards explaining how they were made instead. Hundreds of them. Ideally with the story reported from many different sources. Stamp a pink pu$$y hat on them, or a kitteh face. Make hats for people who need them.

  141. 141.

    tobie

    January 23, 2017 at 3:03 pm

    @liberal: not quite. Trade agreements are designed to set standards where local law is lacking. For instance it binds a country like China to respect intellectual property even if China has no similar law on the books. TPP actually bound countries to US standards, it didn’t lower ours. You really shouldn’t listen to all the demagogic crap spouted by no-time-for-details St. Bernard of the North.

  142. 142.

    Calouste

    January 23, 2017 at 3:03 pm

    @john (not mccain): This might be the right occasion to point out that these days the CIA is by law prohibited from assassinating foreign heads of states.

  143. 143.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 3:04 pm

    Andrea Mitchell is blowjobbing the absolute fuck out this Spicer performance today.

  144. 144.

    Quinerly

    January 23, 2017 at 3:05 pm

    @TriassicSands:
    I just don’t get this continual poking at the CIA. Those guys know who were there. They know who clapped and some have let CBS know that they know.

  145. 145.

    NotMax

    January 23, 2017 at 3:06 pm

    @Traissic Sands

    “And – and – he’s president of more Americans than the first 24 presidents, combined! So there!”

    (Press room erupts in guffaws.)

  146. 146.

    p.a.

    January 23, 2017 at 3:06 pm

    @Kay: IIRC some of the pre-Teatard (R) congresscritters from farm states did support SNAP/whatever because they realized its benefits to BigAg. They still wanted piss in a cup for every loaf of Wonder Bread, but at the time there was support, at least among the professional pols.

  147. 147.

    Jeffro

    January 23, 2017 at 3:07 pm

    @Timurid:

    Trump is a mess, but he’s the only guy who would volunteer for the job.

    Wha…? No “Deep Bench”? =)

    He’s the one that half of their base wanted, that they were terrified of, and so the other 16 of them gave him enough of a pass.

    I still think that big donor dark money is the untold story of this election – Koch cash kept all the GOP MoCs well funded, while the Mercers’ cash and threats kept Cruz & Rubio from going totally rogue (and splitting the party). Same dynamic is playing out right now, notice Rubio caving on Tillerson.

  148. 148.

    Mnemosyne

    January 23, 2017 at 3:08 pm

    @Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho:

    Oh, I’ll also make hats for people who need them, but only sending pictures or postcards allows him to remain in his bubble and insist that it’s all fake and Soros-funded.

    I want the asshole to literally trip over pink hats inside his very own office and watch him try to claim they don’t really exist.

  149. 149.

    Thoroughly Pizzled

    January 23, 2017 at 3:08 pm

    @tobie: I was wondering about that. Is it the fault of the trade agreement, or the lack of follow-up domestic legislation? It’s probably impossible to get higher standards negotiating with other countries than negotiating internally.

  150. 150.

    Fester Addams

    January 23, 2017 at 3:08 pm

    @Calouste:

    the CIA is by law prohibited from assassinating foreign heads of states

    Probably not supposed to off domestic ones either.

  151. 151.

    Immanentize

    January 23, 2017 at 3:11 pm

    @liberal: Please don’t make me argue with Wikipedia, it will make me have a teacher’s sad.

  152. 152.

    Quinerly

    January 23, 2017 at 3:11 pm

    I’m probably beating this to death but the cheering at the CIA really got to me. Malcolm Nance was on Joy Reid yesterday mad as hell over it. We all know he is ex CIA and he said before that CBS report that he knew Trump brought a cheering section of about 40, I believe. That they were off to the side…that the CIA people looked to the side at the cheering section when it went down. Trump tweeted about the CIA cheering him and Spicer repeated it 4 times in this presser. They are idiots.

  153. 153.

    Jeffro

    January 23, 2017 at 3:11 pm

    @Corner Stone: Some of these media folks want SO badly to not have to report that one side has gone completely off the rails. Because you know, it’s just rude, I guess.

  154. 154.

    p.a.

    January 23, 2017 at 3:11 pm

    @Thoroughly Pizzled: I remember NAFTA: the worker and environmental protections in 2nd/3rd world economies were to ‘follow’ the original agreement. The century they were to follow IN was unspecified.

  155. 155.

    rikyrah

    January 23, 2017 at 3:12 pm

    @Kay:

    I don’t care. As far as I’m concerned agriculture deserves everything Republicans do to them. Food stamps are thebest thing that ever happened to those people and they all oppose them.

    I know…I know..

  156. 156.

    p.a.

    January 23, 2017 at 3:13 pm

    @Fester Addams: That would be FBI jurisdiction. They worked so hard electing him, offing him out of the question.

  157. 157.

    Thoroughly Pizzled

    January 23, 2017 at 3:14 pm

    @p.a.: Aye, there’s the rub. We should negotiate these agreements when the Democrats are comfortably in charge.

  158. 158.

    catclub

    January 23, 2017 at 3:15 pm

    @Fester Addams: I remember a TED-type talk that said you write a letter, by hand, to the local office of your congressman. That way is most likely to get read. Others are more generally counted and put in stacks.

  159. 159.

    Millard Filmore

    January 23, 2017 at 3:15 pm

    @trollhattan:

    Wikileaks magically has become concerned about the missing Trump tax returns

    If their goal is to sow discord and confusion, this makes sense. Now that the worst candidate is in office it is time to thrash him soundly. Putin has a plan …

  160. 160.

    TriassicSands

    January 23, 2017 at 3:16 pm

    @Quinerly:

    And this is how Trump wins. He gets competing narratives out there and eventually either people just ignore the whole thing or his supporters believe him and the rest of us…despair over the death of truth.

  161. 161.

    Barbara

    January 23, 2017 at 3:16 pm

    @TriassicSands: What he meant was that the number of Russians watching on tv was at an all time high, since Putin made sure that it was the only thing on all the tv stations at the time. That’s a joke, by the way.

  162. 162.

    rikyrah

    January 23, 2017 at 3:16 pm

    @Quinerly:

    I’m probably beating this to death but the cheering at the CIA really got to me. Malcolm Nance was on Joy Reid yesterday mad as hell over it.

    You are not beating it to death.

    It’s so unbelievably offensive..it just gnaws at you. Being a patriotic American, watching this fraud, insult the CIA, in their own house, IN FRONT OF ITS WALL OF HEROES – those that made the ultimate sacrifice for this country…

    and, have the gall to bring a CHEERING SECTION?!?

    It’s indecent. It’s profane. It punches you in the gut.

  163. 163.

    aimai

    January 23, 2017 at 3:16 pm

    Whatever people think of Maddow around here I have recently discovered that every single blue collar/pink collar woman I have encountered who is a rabid, well informed, democrat is a mad Maddow watcher. I would avoid dissing her and attacking her because she isn’t good enough, in your eyes, for some reason. In the real world she is one of the few friendly, female, faces of democratic/leftist information on TV. We don’t have anyone to waste in that position. And if she has to do what she has to do to stay on TV then that is what she has to do. We don’t have enough left wing radio/tv to spare anyone with any kind of an audience.

  164. 164.

    Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho

    January 23, 2017 at 3:16 pm

    @Mnemosyne: I understand your sentiment, but it’s a waste of yarn, and of clothing that could be used by people who need it. It’s a matter of perspective. He’ll claim Soros funded that as well, and it will be wasted effort. Send postcards of photos of boxes full of hand-knitted pink hats addressed to charities, but please doesn’t waste actual clothing making a point he won’t accept.

  165. 165.

    catclub

    January 23, 2017 at 3:17 pm

    @Fester Addams: The CIA is also prohibited from torture, that is for contractors.

  166. 166.

    patroclus

    January 23, 2017 at 3:17 pm

    @p.a.: The NAFTA side agreements included the creation of the Border Environmental Financing Facility which actually has financed a lot of environmental initiatives in the border region and improved environmental standards at the maquiladores. That was last century. And the Paris Accords concluded a year ago were this century. Trump will have no progress whatsoever and the Republican Congress is already attempting to ax out all consideration of climate change repercussions. But don’t let facts get in the way of your opinion – you sound just like Spicer.

  167. 167.

    Jeffro

    January 23, 2017 at 3:17 pm

    @Quinerly: They just wanted the appearance (including cheering) for propaganda purposes now and down the road. Never mind that watching the actual video was a horrorshow. Just a couple snippets of him in front of that wall being cheered is all they need.

    We’re going to have to get more pro-active about this stuff, and we’re going to need to beat on the media not to air it live (and/or without some added context), that’s for sure.

  168. 168.

    tobie

    January 23, 2017 at 3:17 pm

    @Thoroughly Pizzled: this agreement was designed to protect US producers who were getting creamed in countries that don’t respect patents and the like. This was one of its strengths, not weaknesses.

  169. 169.

    Davebo

    January 23, 2017 at 3:17 pm

    @aimai: Amen!

  170. 170.

    NotMax

    January 23, 2017 at 3:18 pm

    @p.a.

    One of the finest perorations I ever heard given on the floor of the Senate was Tom Daschle standing in opposition to NAFTA.

    Undoubtedly somewhere in the C-SPAN archives.

  171. 171.

    Yoda Dog

    January 23, 2017 at 3:19 pm

    @Kay: I’m sorry I jumped in there on your behalf. You clearly have it under control. I found a link for you, but you are the link. Good on you, I enjoy reading you.

  172. 172.

    Emerald

    January 23, 2017 at 3:20 pm

    @Librarian:

    I turned it off when she started that.

    She’s also constantly adoring Mrs. Greenspan.

    Normally I like Rachel and watch her. But the only truly reliable commentator on MSNBC is Joy Ann Reid.

  173. 173.

    Percysowner

    January 23, 2017 at 3:20 pm

    @Mnemosyne: Good idea. I’ll have to go get post cards, lots of post cards. So mine will hit the mail tomorrow probably.

  174. 174.

    Ella in New Mexico

    January 23, 2017 at 3:21 pm

    @trollhattan:

    Well, well, Wikileaks magically has become concerned about the missing Trump tax returns, and now offers to release them should somebody care to share.

    Three months too late, assholes.

    Not if you understand that Wikileaks acted on behalf of Putin, who is now the holder of all kinds of information that he can use to blackmail Our Glorious Leader into doing his bidding.

    This is a shot across Trumplets bow to shut down this government inquiry into the Four Stooges ties to Russia and to get busy doing what he was hired to do.

  175. 175.

    Ceci n est pas mon nym

    January 23, 2017 at 3:21 pm

    @TriassicSands: Weird that the global audience would have needed to use the DC Metro system. Whose ridership numbers he lied about anyway.

  176. 176.

    Quinerly

    January 23, 2017 at 3:21 pm

    @TriassicSands:
    Maybe I’m a little old fashion. I grew up believing you DON’T FUCK WITH CIA.

  177. 177.

    Stan

    January 23, 2017 at 3:23 pm

    @trollhattan:

    Wikileaks magically has become concerned about the missing Trump tax returns, and now offers to release them should somebody care to share.

    I think the real objective there is to turn in whoever gives them the tax information. It’s a trap.

  178. 178.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 3:23 pm

    @aimai: “She’s with us on everything but the Greta.”

  179. 179.

    TriassicSands

    January 23, 2017 at 3:24 pm

    @Quinerly:

    Well, you’re not DJ Trump. He fucks with everybody if it suits his purposes. He calls them names, questions their abilities, and then shows up and blames the “supposed” rift between him and the CIA on the media. It is really hard to defeat such a dedicated lying POS.

  180. 180.

    NotMax

    January 23, 2017 at 3:25 pm

    @Ella in New Mexico

    Didn’t Larry Flynt offer a bounty for the returns? Pre-election, but perhaps an offer not since rescinded.

  181. 181.

    Timurid

    January 23, 2017 at 3:26 pm

    This is Autocrat 101. Not lying with intent to deceive, but lying as a display of power. Taunting everyone with obvious untruths and assuming that they they have no choice but to accept the lies. And he’s been in office less than a week. He’s acting like a guy who’ll never have to win another vote again (see also; his endzone dance with Comey).

    We may not be doomed. He may not succeed. But one way or another, this is going to go fast. He’ll be King Trump or ex-President Trump before the year is out.

  182. 182.

    Stan

    January 23, 2017 at 3:26 pm

    @NotMax:

    One positive thing about the IRS is the standard of severe and dedicated security when it comes to access to individual returns. Would be of lasting damage to have that compromised.

    Now, when it comes to state returns…

    Golly….Andrew Cuomo, who claims to be a democrat, has control over THAT ;)

  183. 183.

    catclub

    January 23, 2017 at 3:26 pm

    @TriassicSands:

    It is really hard to defeat such a dedicated lying POS.

    Voting would have worked.

  184. 184.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 3:27 pm

    @Ella in New Mexico:

    This is a shot across Trumplets bow to shut down this government inquiry into the Four Stooges ties to Russia and to get busy doing what he was hired to do.

    I know the world no longer makes any sense but isn’t a counter-intel investigation into Mike Flynn just flat out fucking crazy?

  185. 185.

    Quinerly

    January 23, 2017 at 3:28 pm

    Good piece up at TPM on that crap some of us watched (so you didn’t have to)

  186. 186.

    dww44

    January 23, 2017 at 3:28 pm

    @Mnemosyne: Although I don’t knit,I support your effort here. His twitter handle is @michaelcohen212 and as he’s now the special counsel to the President, he certainly could be reached at the White House. Or maybe he’s not gonna move to D.C. either but is gonna remain behind at Trump Tower, given his prior position was that of EVP in the Trump Organization.

  187. 187.

    DaddyJ

    January 23, 2017 at 3:28 pm

    @opiejeanne: Yeah, I just finished watching The West Wing a couple days before the election. Goes really well with a shot of rye. There’s a number of reasonable conservative characters in it with integrity, so, you know, about the same level of realism as Doctor Who. But still entertaining.

  188. 188.

    Quinerly

    January 23, 2017 at 3:30 pm

    @TriassicSands:
    MSNBC just switched to Trump. He said he just signed “a very powerful document.” Geez…..

  189. 189.

    Stan

    January 23, 2017 at 3:30 pm

    @Kay:

    It’s literally A VOUCHER for poor people to buy ag products. I mean, Jesus. It’s not my job to draw them a map of how they benefit from that. It’s a giant subsidy for agriculture.

    I hear you….but. Farm work is backbreaking, it never takes a day off and never ends. Farm people are (rightly) proud of how hard they work, and (wrongly, I know….) think of themselves as independent/self-made.

  190. 190.

    Immanentize

    January 23, 2017 at 3:30 pm

    @Corner Stone: I’m old enough to remember when Greta was a young idealistic, kick-ass defense attorney in D.C. But her dad was friends with Tailgunner Joe McCarthy (True!) Oh how power corrupts…

  191. 191.

    NotMax

    January 23, 2017 at 3:32 pm

    @Immanetize

    So was Bobby Kennedy.

  192. 192.

    Immanentize

    January 23, 2017 at 3:34 pm

    @NotMax: Friends with McCarthy?

  193. 193.

    Stan

    January 23, 2017 at 3:36 pm

    @Emerald:

    the only truly reliable commentator on MSNBC is Joy Ann Reid.

    I agree. We all need to send her some love via MSNBC. Let them know we’re watching.

  194. 194.

    Quinerly

    January 23, 2017 at 3:37 pm

    I’ll just throw this out. Unrelated to Spicer. Was flipping around on tv last night and landed on Fox. It was a repeat show of I think that Jeanne Pirot (sp?) show. Dennis Kucinich was on gushing about how great Trump’s inaugural address was….how it basically was what he has been saying for years. WTF?

  195. 195.

    NotMax

    January 23, 2017 at 3:37 pm

    @Immanetize

    Yup, appointed counsel of his investigatory committee by McCarthy.

    Before RFK saw the light.

  196. 196.

    Joyce H

    January 23, 2017 at 3:38 pm

    @Timurid:

    This is Autocrat 101. Not lying with intent to deceive, but lying as a display of power. Taunting everyone with obvious untruths and assuming that they they have no choice but to accept the lies. And he’s been in office less than a week. He’s acting like a guy who’ll never have to win another vote again (see also; his endzone dance with Comey).

    We may not be doomed. He may not succeed. But one way or another, this is going to go fast. He’ll be King Trump or ex-President Trump before the year is out.

    But what’s great about this is that they are pre-inoculating the press and the public against believing anything they say, and they’re doing it right out of the gate and over absolute trivia! Crowd size at the inauguration, fercryinoutloud! If they can’t even be trusted to tell us the truth about something as obviously verifiable as whether or not there were more people at Trump’s inauguration than at Obama’s, how do you think the public will react if the administration says, “We have secret intel that we can’t show you that proves your sons and daughters have to go die to fight for this overseas oil field; trust us, it’s important”?

    As for it happening fast, Trump does everything too fast; that’s why he always fails. He’s too impatient and overpays for a property so that it can’t be operated at a profit, or sticks his tongue down a woman’s throat the first time he meets her, which is really not the way to run a successful seduction.

  197. 197.

    patroclus

    January 23, 2017 at 3:38 pm

    @Immanentize: Last night Greta was insisting that Trump got more votes from women than Clinton. She said it several times, but was finally corrected because she was merely parroting Fox propaganda that she learned while in that bubble (it was only white women). I think she’ll gradually get better having been removed from the propaganda – she was never all THAT bad when she was at CNN, but deteriorated profoundly while at Fox.

  198. 198.

    trollhattan

    January 23, 2017 at 3:39 pm

    There’s no depth past which Trump won’t dig to assemble his team of nation-killers.

    Last week, Donald Trump met with Yale’s David Gelernter, a computer scientist who once called Barack Obama a “third-rate tyrant,” as he seeks to fill the position of White House science adviser. Gelernter is a computing genius whom the Washington Post dubbed an “anti-intellectual.”

    If by that they mean Gelernter believes universities now are mostly interested in advancing political agendas and enriching administrators, then they’re right. As Gelernter writes in The Wall Street Journal Monday, “Over 90 percent of U.S. colleges will be gone within the next generation, as the higher-education world inevitably flips over and sinks.”

  199. 199.

    TriassicSands

    January 23, 2017 at 3:39 pm

    @catclub:
    Hey, I voted four times.

    But it was voting that made him win. Sadly, a majority nationwide isn’t good enough.

    The problem at the press conference today was that when Spicer lied about what he meant when he said “both” no one pushed back at all.

  200. 200.

    trollhattan

    January 23, 2017 at 3:40 pm

    @Quinerly:
    The heck? I had zero clue Kucinich was a tiny proto-autocrat. Was he always?

  201. 201.

    Miss Bianca

    January 23, 2017 at 3:40 pm

    @Kay: “oops”

  202. 202.

    Quinerly

    January 23, 2017 at 3:42 pm

    @trollhattan:
    Must be a hands thing.?

  203. 203.

    patroclus

    January 23, 2017 at 3:43 pm

    @Immanentize: “Friends” is pushing it – he was a Democratic counsel on the committee that was chaired by McCarthy – it was Bobby’s first job in D.C. and many Dems at the time were trying to out-Mccarthy Mccarthy, which only egged Joe on.

  204. 204.

    Tilda Swintons Bald Cap

    January 23, 2017 at 3:44 pm

    @Ella in New Mexico: Ha ha, no. No one is EVER going to see the Federal Tax returns in their entirety. Not all the history or various forms that Trump fills out every year and has since he started filing. Never going to happen. You may see something state wise, but Federal, never.

  205. 205.

    trollhattan

    January 23, 2017 at 3:44 pm

    @Quinerly:
    “High five, Donald! Whoops, missed.”

  206. 206.

    TriassicSands

    January 23, 2017 at 3:45 pm

    @trollhattan:

    He’s always been kind of a flake.

  207. 207.

    Timurid

    January 23, 2017 at 3:45 pm

    @Joyce H:

    As far as Trump is concerned, the seduction was over on 11/9. From here on out it’s just rape.

  208. 208.

    Captain C

    January 23, 2017 at 3:47 pm

    @trollhattan: I think Julian Assange is starting to realize that, even if he’s fine with Trump burning the whole world, most people aren’t and that they hold him at least somewhat responsible, and he’d probably like to leave the Ecuadorian embassy at some point in his life.

  209. 209.

    Miss Bianca

    January 23, 2017 at 3:48 pm

    @aimai: good point!

  210. 210.

    Gin & Tonic

    January 23, 2017 at 3:48 pm

    @trollhattan: Isn’t he the dude who received a bomb from Ted Kaczynski?

  211. 211.

    Gin & Tonic

    January 23, 2017 at 3:49 pm

    @Captain C: Chances are the heat goes up for ol’ Julian after the February elections in Ecuador.

  212. 212.

    dww44

    January 23, 2017 at 3:49 pm

    @patroclus: Agree. That was my take on her before she moved to Fox.

    I also agree with Aimai re Rachel Maddow, while eschewing her desire to be liked by all her cohorts on the right at MSNBC. She has been very good since the election, so much so that she won over my spouse who was never previously a fan. Prior to the election, those long and tedious educational segments were wearing thin. Since the election, they’ve been more historically relevant and she links them to where we find ourselves now.

  213. 213.

    Captain C

    January 23, 2017 at 3:49 pm

    @MisterForkbeard:

    And yet some of my liberal friends still insist they’re just merely anti-secrets

    I’ll believe that when I see them publish a large dump of secret Russian documents, including at least a few with damaging info on Putin.

  214. 214.

    Miss Bianca

    January 23, 2017 at 3:49 pm

    @Quinerly: @trollhattan: “lefty authoritarian” is a thing on the authoritarianism grid….

  215. 215.

    Mnemosyne

    January 23, 2017 at 3:50 pm

    @Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho:

    I want to cause him personal inconvenience inside his physical space in a way that cannot be construed as a threat of any kind. Postcards and pictures will not serve the same purpose. If there’s another way you can think of to make it difficult for him to physically use his office space for days on end, let me know.

    It takes me about 2 hours to knit a pussyhat. That time is worth it to me in order to inconvenience him, even if he throws it away. I’m kind of an asshole like that.

  216. 216.

    Larryb

    January 23, 2017 at 3:51 pm

    @Thoroughly Pizzled:

    Why was TPP defended so tepidly?

    You could ask the same question about Obamacare, and the answer would be the same. Obama was never good at rallying a movement to defend his policies + lefty purity pony butthurt.

  217. 217.

    trollhattan

    January 23, 2017 at 3:52 pm

    @Gin & Tonic: Ten Quatloos to G&T–I never would have made the connection.

  218. 218.

    patroclus

    January 23, 2017 at 3:55 pm

    @Larryb: I think Obama didn’t defend TPP last year because he didn’t want to undermine Clinton, who was pretending to oppose it. It would have been good for the economy, lowering tariffs and non-tariff barriers and improving intellectual property protection, but it’s fate was sealed when both parties turned against it. China will now take the lead on lowering tariffs in the ASPAC region – it was a major missed opportunity which will hurt America in the long term, especially if Trump follows through and starts a trade war with China.

  219. 219.

    Tazj

    January 23, 2017 at 3:56 pm

    @Quinerly: I didn’t watch Trump’s inaugural address. However, I was flipping around the channels that evening and watched CNN for a few minutes. John King was praising Trump’s speech, at least one part of it. King said Trump was the only one who could have given such a speech because he went after both sides. Apparently, in the speech according to King, Trump criticized Both Democrats and Republicans for enriching themselves at the expense of the American people. Now, while it is true that many politicians do unfairly enrich themselves, I thought that line was ridiculous coming from Trump who has spent most of his adult life enriching himself at the expense of others(Trump University, hotel workers, contractors for his buildings, etc. you know the list)
    I was flabbergasted that anyone thought he had any credibility with this issue, but apparently many voters and media people do. Maybe Kucinich is among them, and he believes Trump to be some new fantastic populist politician who is beholden to no one. I think he is either naïve or just wants a check from Fox News.

  220. 220.

    lol chikinburd

    January 23, 2017 at 3:56 pm

    (Just a note about the pic: if I ever get shakers like those, it’ll be the pepper one that has the halo and the salt one that has the horns.)

  221. 221.

    zhena gogolia

    January 23, 2017 at 3:56 pm

    @trollhattan:

    Wow, I thought everyone remembered that. It blew up in a building I used to practice piano in.

  222. 222.

    Mnemosyne

    January 23, 2017 at 3:57 pm

    @Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho:

    Or, to put it another way: I essentially want to send a live elephant to his office and force him to figure out what to do with it. Something large, inconvenient, and not threatening.

  223. 223.

    trollhattan

    January 23, 2017 at 3:58 pm

    @patroclus:
    Yup, China will basically come in and drink our milkshake because we’re withdrawing from a regional agreement. I’ll wager they’re bigly disappointed at having this drop into their lap.

  224. 224.

    trollhattan

    January 23, 2017 at 4:01 pm

    @zhena gogolia: Ted seems forever ago but two of his fatalities were in my town, so the stench lingers. Oddly, his and Gelernter’s views on humanities in higher education are identical.

  225. 225.

    Another Scott

    January 23, 2017 at 4:01 pm

    @Fester Addams: Mail Isolation Control and Tracking.

    It’s illegal to destroy mail.

    [edit:] I may be missing your point. But recall that Obama has answered real letters from people, not some PDF image. So I’d be surprised if as a matter of course that all letters to the WH are destroyed. But maybe you’re right…

    Cheers,
    Scott.
    (IANAL)

  226. 226.

    Yoda Dog

    January 23, 2017 at 4:03 pm

    @Tazj:

    I think he (Kucinich) is either naïve or just wants a check from Fox News.

    Both.

  227. 227.

    cosima

    January 23, 2017 at 4:05 pm

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/01/19/cnns-president-has-fired-a-warning-shot-at-donald-trump/?utm_term=.a3eb8d24004f

    snip: “The perception of Donald Trump in capitals around the world is shaped, in many ways, by CNN. Continuing to have an adversarial relationship with that network is a mistake.”

    What say you, Juicers? Did Zucker cut off his nose to spite his face with these comments?

    I say he did, and someone on the book of faces kindly informed me ‘your a moron.’ We are on the same side of the fence politically, so my only response to him was ‘*you’re* — did you read the link?’ And then he deleted his comment, so maybe he read the link, or maybe he is now hoping I die a painful death for correcting his grammar.

  228. 228.

    Quinerly

    January 23, 2017 at 4:07 pm

    @trollhattan:
    #205…thanks for that chuckle.

  229. 229.

    john (not mccain)

    January 23, 2017 at 4:10 pm

    @Calouste: Fortunately, this time around they don’t have to assassinate a foreign head of state to keep America safe.

  230. 230.

    Gin & Tonic

    January 23, 2017 at 4:10 pm

    @trollhattan: I have to be careful with how I phrase this, but I followed Kaczynski pretty closely and felt a certain sort of, um don’t want to call it admiration, but something like it, for his dedication to his cause.

  231. 231.

    Bill Arnold

    January 23, 2017 at 4:12 pm

    @trollhattan:

    Three months too late, assholes.

    (re wikileaks/tax returns)
    I’d take it. (Even given that one obvious motive (maybe intersecting with true motives) is further damage to the USA.)

  232. 232.

    hovercraft

    January 23, 2017 at 4:13 pm

    Spicer: It’s ‘Demoralizing’ For Trump To See Media Narrative About Him

    During his first daily briefing with reporters, White House press secretary Sean Spicer launched into a rant about the media’s treatment of Donald Trump when asked why the President discussed the crowd sizes at his inauguration during a speech at the CIA headquarters on Saturday.

    “I’s not just about a crowd size. It’s about this constant, you know, ‘He’s not going to run. Then if he runs, he’s going to drop out…'” Spicer said. “There is this constant theme to undercut the enormous support that he has. I think it’s unbelievably frustrating when you’re continually told it’s not big enough, it’s not good enough, you can’t win.”

    Spicer said that Trump kept defying the odds only to face a new narrative,

    “He keeps getting told what he can’t do by this narrative that’s out there. And exceeds it every single time. And I think there’s an overall frustration when you turn on the television over and over again and get told that there’s this narrative that you didn’t win, you weren’t going to run, you can’t pick up this state,” he said. “Over and over again there’s this constant attempt to undermine his credibility and the movement that he represents. And it’s frustrating for not just him, but I think so many of us that are trying to work to get this message out.”

    Spicer said that this is “demoralizing” for Trump.

    The press secretary also argued that the media’s treatment of Trump was unprecedented.

    “I’ve never seen it like this,” Spicer said.

  233. 233.

    trollhattan

    January 23, 2017 at 4:17 pm

    @Gin & Tonic:
    To quote the most quotable of movies, he had a certain ethos. They trucked his cabin here for the trial; it sat behind chainlink fencing at a closed Air Force base. Weird to think about what “terrorism” was prior to 9/11–recalling being pissed at him for causing them to remove the 15-minute parking meters in front of our airport terminal with one of his threat letters.

  234. 234.

    Quinerly

    January 23, 2017 at 4:25 pm

    @hovercraft:
    Who’s the delicate snowflake now?

  235. 235.

    pat

    January 23, 2017 at 4:28 pm

    @hovercraft:

    Do you want some cheese with that whine, Sean?

  236. 236.

    Stan

    January 23, 2017 at 4:28 pm

    Spicer stupidly let us know today that the resistance is scoring hits and trump is hurting.

    Keep up the fire, folks. Eventually their deflector shields will fail ;)

  237. 237.

    Yoda Dog

    January 23, 2017 at 4:29 pm

    @hovercraft: They act like their ‘movement” is so heady and important to reckon with. It’s just cleeks fucking law on steroids. “FUCK LIBERALS” was the main, and for many the only, voting impetus, imo. And then with the lies that are so huge and easily discernable that they’re insulting to eveyone’s intelligence. WHAT THE FUCK DO THEY EXPECT?! To expect anything but conflict is insane. But then I guess Im just not used to our new administration yet.

  238. 238.

    Corner Stone

    January 23, 2017 at 4:31 pm

    @Yoda Dog:

    is so heady

    It’s Hedley, you oaf!

  239. 239.

    joel hanes

    January 23, 2017 at 4:31 pm

    @Thoroughly Pizzled:

    Why was TPP defended so tepidly?

    A fair number of IP wonks had grave reservations about the IP enforcement provisions, even if they agreed that the goal of reducing overseas appropriation of US-based copyrighted, patented, trade secret, or trademark material was a good one.
    People who care most about untrammeled American hegemony/sovereignty hated the dispute resolution mechanism.
    People who think that they lost their jobs because NAFTA opposed it.
    Hardly anyone publicly identified the Americans who stood to benefit.
    Rs were reflexively opposing everything Obama ; if O came out too strongly for it, the R base would demand that their Congressional caucus oppose it.

  240. 240.

    laura

    January 23, 2017 at 4:32 pm

    @NotMax: no. Larry Flint’s magazine “Hustle” has offered money to anyone with proof of Trump underage or kinky sessy-times.

  241. 241.

    Another Scott

    January 23, 2017 at 4:34 pm

    @TriassicSands:

    Everyone interpreted them otherwise.

    I didn’t. I knew exactly what he was saying, and why. He explicitly said “watched” which is obviously a different word than “attended”.

    He said it as a shiny smoke screen to get the press all hot and bothered, to make it clear that Trump wants his version of reality to be reported as if it were actual reality, and to distract everyone from what he and his team are actually doing (and not doing). He’s trying to make the press cower. He’s said he’s in a “running war” with the media. Shouldn’t we believe him about that?

    What is going to be the first news organization to start boycotting Trump’s “press” operation? McClatchyDC? WashingtonPost? The BBC?

    We need to keep our eyes on the prize…

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  242. 242.

    Feebog

    January 23, 2017 at 4:40 pm

    @Another Scott:

    It’s illegal to destroy or intercept mail while in the mail stream. Once it is delivered the recipient is free to do whatever they want with it.

  243. 243.

    clay

    January 23, 2017 at 4:40 pm

    @hovercraft: I wonder if it was “demoralizing” for Obama to see people proclaim that he wasn’t American simply because of the color of his skin?

    Let me count the number of times that Obama whined about that in public. Ummmm……

    In short, Trump (and Spicer) can:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WSC25Li4E88

  244. 244.

    Ohio Mom

    January 23, 2017 at 4:42 pm

    @Mnemosyne: if you weren’t on the other side of the continent, I’d suggest yarn-bombing something of his in pink. Or creating a human wall of knitters knitting pink hats in front of his office.

    So ironic. Republicans are always going on about people doing for themselves and not depending on others for anything. Here you have people that ARE doing it by themselves, that is, making their own article of clothing. And his puny imagination can’t stretch that far.

  245. 245.

    pluky

    January 23, 2017 at 4:45 pm

    @liberal: http://www.agweb.com/mobile/article/how-the-tpp-would-affect-agriculture–naa-tyne-morgan/

  246. 246.

    SiubhanDuinne

    January 23, 2017 at 4:50 pm

    @Mnemosyne:

    Richard Cohen (Trump’s lawyer) was snarking that the pink hats women were wearing on Saturday weren’t made in America.

    Richard Cohen is a columnist for WaPo. The Trump lawyer is Michael Cohen. I don’t know how to link Twitter but some of the comments on his tweet asking whether the pussyhats were made in the USA were pretty funny. After a couple of people pointed out that they were hand-knitted by American women for American women, the comments all became variations on “Yeah, but where did the yarn come from, huh? HUH?”

  247. 247.

    Mart

    January 23, 2017 at 4:51 pm

    @dww44: Prior to the election, those long and tedious educational segments were wearing thin.

    Glad she helps bring some folks to the progressive fold. I am with Bob Sommerby at the Daily Howler; she rails on shinny objects (and cocktails and penises) but never brings the hammer to the big bad horrible things. Where was she defending Clinton’s emails? Did she let us know how many were classified after the fact. Did she describe the three emails with a “C” in the sidebar, not marked Classified at the top. Where were the “tedious educational segments” that there was nothing there on those fucking god damned emails? On so many big issues, she lays down. Almost like there is a plan.

  248. 248.

    D58826

    January 23, 2017 at 5:06 pm

    @Timurid: Yep. They each got a lollipop so they are happy.

  249. 249.

    Davebo

    January 23, 2017 at 5:22 pm

    @cosima: That a guy writing for the Washington Post (Callum Borchers) decided to use the phrase “butt-hurt” is pretty pathetic in and of itself.

  250. 250.

    SiubhanDuinne

    January 23, 2017 at 5:23 pm

    @hovercraft:

    Spicer said that this is “demoralizing” for Trump.

    Aw, that pore lil thang. My heart bleeds.

  251. 251.

    cosima

    January 23, 2017 at 6:03 pm

    @Davebo: Interesting point. I hadn’t noticed that – I was too annoyed, I guess, about Zucker’s comments and the fact that it plays right into the shitgibbon’s hands. Which makes me wonder — given that it’s a WaPo story, and with that cavalier phrasing on the part of the writer — if there’s some sort of pissing match going on between the two (CNN & WaPo). Or maybe Borcher is attempting to curry favour with the new administration to ensure that he gets a front row seat.

  252. 252.

    patrick II

    January 23, 2017 at 7:45 pm

    @liberal:

    Corporatism used to be in the wiki definition. Somewhere along the line it was removed.

  253. 253.

    cynthia ackerman

    January 23, 2017 at 8:47 pm

    @Mnemosyne:

    You’d be wasting your time and yarn.

    He’ll never see them, and won’t care that they were sent.

    Find a local Dem to support instead.

    Better yet, run for something yourself.

  254. 254.

    No One You Know

    January 23, 2017 at 11:02 pm

    @Ohio Mom: OMG. A human wall of knitters. Now that’s a visual…and will start a landslide of Madame DeFarge jokes, with all the edge of a guillotine.

    And I think Mnemosyne should do whatever makes her happy! Utilitarianism simply doesn’t pack the same kind of wallop as humor. Anger is a fire, and hate is cruel, but nothing withstands ridicule. Even the quick-witted can’t answer a good visual.

  255. 255.

    TriassicSands

    January 24, 2017 at 4:52 am

    @Another Scott:

    “That was the largest audience to witness an inauguration, period. Both in person and around the globe.”

    Those were Spicer’s exact words. “Both in person and around the globe” does note mean combined it means that each one was the largest audience in its respective category.

    Then, on Monday he lied again. How on earth would Spicer “know” that the worldwide audience watching on TV was the largest ever?
    Where did he get that “fact?” Asserting that as fact was a lie. Then, on Monday, claiming that if you combined the two numbers you would come out with the largest combined total was another lie, since he couldn’t possibly have had definitively true numbers about the number of home watchers.

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