First, the beauty — here’s a shot of a gorgeous lizard photographed by faithful reader cope, who reports that this lovely fellow was seen in Rabbit Valley, Colorado:
The colors on that critter just knock my socks off. If I were to order a custom paint job on a Dodge Challenger, I would designate that lizard’s photo as the official color palette.
Now for the Beast — an elaboration on a theory that came to me in the morning thread:
For those unfamiliar with the concept, “transubstantiation” is the process some Christians believe converts the wafers and wine handed out during communion services to the actual body and blood of Jesus Christ.
I don’t go in for supernatural stuff, but I know evil exists, and I believe it has seized power in two branches of the U.S. government and is angling for a third. Is Trump the locus of that evil – the Beast? Or is he just a third-rate conman who is acting as its front? I don’t really know.
But I do know this: These are not normal times. Whether you believe there’s an organized conspiracy to transform the US government into an authoritarian kleptocracy, whether you view it as an opportunistic convergence of shitlords or subscribe to the theory that it’s some combination of the two, evil is afoot. And the only proper response is opposition.
Everyone associated with Trump has undergone the process of trumpsubstantiation and is therefore an evil shit-stain. That’s why the Republicans in congress decided this morning to go ahead and move the nominations of self-dealing crooks Mnuchin and Price forward without a proper committee vote.
There are no rules any more. There’s no neutral ground either. You don’t compromise with evil. You don’t accommodate it. You don’t shower it with comity and hope it returns the fucking favor. You oppose it. With every fiber of your being.
Right now, I don’t have a moment, a dollar or a kind word to waste on anyone who doesn’t understand this.
Jerzy Russian
God Damn, this is one fine post. I especially like the new word you(?) coined. I know I am not worthy of you, but I have to ask: Will you marry me? If it helps, I look like a cross between Sean Connery and Harrison Ford.
Major Major Major Major
Yep. Everything he touches turns to shit. This is why it’s imperative that the Dems filibuster his SCOTUS nominee. Cloture is consent.
rikyrah
It really is this simple. And, don’t feel any guilt about it either.
PHUCK.EVERY.MUTHAPHUCKA.WHO.VOTED.FOR.HIM.AND.THE.PURITY.PONY.AND.UNICORN.CROWD.
PHUCK.ALL.OF.YOU.
sukabi
Good for you Betty… The repubs have finally pulled the last tattered scrap of what passed for “honor” off by moving forward with these two documented liars…
There was a time when lying to congress was a crime…
Villago Delenda Est
We’re going to need a
HUGEYUUUGE toilet brush to deal with all this shit.pamelabrown53
Great post, Betty Cracker.
On the cover of this week’s “New York” magazine touts a story by Michael Idov, entitled: “Living in Russia in the Age of Putin”. With each paragraph I became more and more terrified that this is the vision of President Bannon. At the upper echelons of society, life can seem democratic because rich people can buy/bribe their way through a totally corrupt system. From Putin down to the police on the street. If you guys have a chance, I highly recommend reading it.
Ares Akritas
The Democrats should stand on principle and invoke the well-known George W. Bush rule: “The Senate cannot consider the SCOTUS nominee of a president who’s lost the popular vote so that the American people will have a voice in this momentous decision.”
George W. Bush did not appoint any SCOTUS justices until after the 2004 election, when he actually won the popular vote and could claim a mandate from the American people. The Senate should follow this important precedent.
Major Major Major Major
CNN news alert: Trump said GOP senators should “go for it” and invoke nuclear option.
Brachiator
Absolutely. I don’t know if this has been written about already, but I was looking at an NPR news story about how the GOP is accusing the Democrats of outrageous obstruction because of their talks to attempt to block the Supreme Court nomination of Judge Gorsuch.
I was reminded of this past news story:
These people are both evil and shameless.
ETA: And there should be a special place in hell for all the purity ponies who ignored the importance of the Supreme Court and kept whining about how Hillary was a warmongering tool of the corporatists. Dumbasses.
Villago Delenda Est
@Brachiator: Susan Sarandon was not acting in “Rocky Horror”.
? Martin
As I feared yesterday. We’re now in a civil war, with just the shooting yet to start. Dems cannot back down from these positions and clearly the GOP won’t either.
Yarrow
Saw this linked on Twitter. It’s a Facebook post of a British citizen who travels a lot and visited Iran in 2011. As a result she has been denied ESTA waiver to visit the US. She has to apply for a special visa for permission to travel. That starts at $160.
You know if this is happening to her it’s happening to a lot more people. I have British friends who refuse to visit the US and it’s only going to get worse. How long before Americans have to jump through a lot of hoops to travel?
Jerzy Russian
@Major Major Major Major:
Jesus Hussein Christ! Don’t use “T—p” and “nuclear” in the same sentence.
hilts
An ambulatory pile of feces is a great description for Trump himself and not just his enablers. I’m also partial to describing him as a tragic waste of protoplasm and a malignant cancer in our body politic.
The lizard photo is wonderful!
jl
I contacted DiFi’s office and instructed her to do absolutely everything possible to block the Trump nomination of Gorsuch to SCOTUS. Otherwise I would spend time and money to end her political career, and to oppose anyone who she supported.
I politely but firmly explained that, as a citizen, Democratic primary election voter and constituent, I was not expressing a ‘concern’ or voicing my opinion, i was issuing an instruction.
Oatler.
Trump wasn’t kidding when he said his bit about being able to shoot a guy on the street and still win. His supporters are screaming (literally) for chaos and that scene of Slim Whitman whooping and hollering as he rides the bomb down is prophetic. “Kill us all, just make sure The Other gets killed worse.”
Major Major Major Major
@Jerzy Russian: take it up with CNN.
Villago Delenda Est
@Oatler.: Slim Pickens.
Jerzy Russian
@Brachiator: Regarding the hypocrisy, many on the GOP side will say something like “you argued back then that what we were doing was wrong, so you should not do the same exact thing now.”
jl
@Oatler.: Well, evidence coming in that the Fed did in fact jump the gun on its interest rate hike. Macroeconomic conditions are weakening again. See what those loons say after another few years of a crap jobs economy. Actually, fairly high probability of at least a mild growth recession. See how many people will admit to voting for Trump in a few years. Good chance less than those willing to admit they ever voted for W, who is G-damned genius and world historical great statesman compared to this vicious goof.
Yarrow
Trump has no idea who Frederick Douglass is.
I guess he thinks he’s still alive?
cmorenc
@Brachiator:
Just as the Naderites (especially the ones living in Florida) rejected all responsibility for their diversion of votes causing Bush to narrowly win Florida because “Gore should have run a better campaign” – the assholes who voted for Jill Stein will, with stubborn self-righteous obliviousness, insist much the same about Hillary Clinton and the 2016 electoral outcome. Because if the rest of us were only as smart and righteously progressive as they are and voted for a true progressive, or the democratic candidate had been good enough to win without them, Trump would not have won. But nooooo, it’s not their damn fault. Worse than a stupid asshole is a self-righteously stupid asshole.
BTW: The Stein vote alone in each of Wisc, Mich, and Pa, if instead had been for Clinton, would have been enough for her to win in each of those three respective states. Next time you run into a Stein voter, challenge them to explain exactly how their vote tangibly advanced the progressive cause, not just in 2016, but all the way through to at least 2020.
JPL
@Yarrow: At least he didn’t say that it was unfortunate that he couldn’t attend today’s gathering.
Chris
@Jerzy Russian:
There is a reason I haven’t actually wasted the time to sit down and argue with one of these people in… so many years I can’t even remember.
Major Major Major Major
@cmorenc:
And Gary Johnson. A vote not for Hillary was a vote for Trump, unless you were blocked from voting at all.
Brachiator
Off topic, but on the theme of Beauty and the Beast
The new trailer for the live action version of the film is quite charming.
I might see the thing just for the scene here with Gaston. And we need to leaven the outrage with a little hope.
Oatler.
@Villago Delenda Est: I prefer to think of Slim as yodelling toward WIII.
SiubhanDuinne
@Beauty: That is one spectacular lizard! The tail must be fully twice the length of his body. And the colours look like jewels.
@Beast: Did not listen, but have just read the full transcript of Republican President Asterisk’s remarks on Black History Month, and yet again I am curdled with shame that this excrescence is the POTUS. Literally every sentence is an embarrassment. It’s currently the top item at Digby’s site.
Miss Bianca
Wow! Now I’m wondering where Rabbit Valley is…
The Moar You Know
@Yarrow: I expect out-of-country travel to be the next freedom we lose, and soon. If you have the means to get out and stay out, do so. I do not, unfortunately.
Like they say on the airlines, if you gotta get out fast, leave your shit behind. Whatever it is, it is not worth your life.
laura
@Villago Delenda Est: Not known for whistling.
@? Martin: re: civil war IMHO, Radio Rawanda. One of these days the Fox/Rush/Levine/Jones/Hannity/Breitbart Pretty Hate Machine will call out for half of America to deal with the likes of us. That’s my worst fear. That and the other half will gladly, happily kill us because we are no longer fellow Americans, we’re no longer the other political party, and come that time, we’ll no longer be considered human.
bendal
@Jerzy Russian: Oh that defense is showing up all over the internet. “Blame Harry Reid, he’s the one that got rid of the filibuster so it’s ALL HIS FAULT that Republicans are changing the rules now”. I’m seeing that in every discussion about the latest Senate Republican moves.
This despite the fact that Reid invoked that change only after a historical and unprecedented use of the filibuster to not only block all of Obama’s nominations to judicial positions, but to block any and all fiscal legislation as well.
The Moar You Know
@Major Major Major Major: Elections have consequences. The Wilmer/Stein voters will accept that responsibility in the same fashion that the 2000 Nader voters do, which is “not at all”. Might trouble their beautiful minds.
Villago Delenda Est
On cope’s photo (good choice, Betty!): better looking lizard than Donald, fer sure. Or Neil Gorsuch, for that matter.
Haydnseek
@Miss Bianca: Me too! But when it comes to rabbits, I don’t know jack…….
LongHairedWeirdo
ObPedantry: Transubstantiation is the Roman Catholic belief that, while the bread and the wine retain form, they are, in reality, the body and blood of Christ, and have changed entirely – and a “side-miracle” makes them appear, to all tests, to be bread and wine. Consubstantiation is the related term where there’s a belief that there is a change, but that it’s that they are both, bread and wine, *and* body and blood.
It’s not an especially meaningful difference to outsiders – both insist a miracle occurs, and it’s only the form of the miracle that is questioned.
How the difference doesn’t matter to most folks reminds me of a quote I’ve seen attributed to Maeterlinck: that the centrist wisdom of today will be the most inhuman of things tomorrow; during the inquisition, the centrist position was that one oughtn’t burn *too many* heretics, and only the wild radicals said one shouldn’t burn *any*. (I don’t ever remember the quote exactly but I can assure you that, had the term Very Serious People been invented at that time, it would likely have been used.)
zhena gogolia
@Oatler.:
Slim Pickens, please!
Slim Whitman, lol. At least there’d be some nice tunes.
Jerzy Russian
@Brachiator: That trailer was awesome. I liked the cartoon, and it would be so cool if the live action version closely followed it. I loved the voice of Gaston, and the number where everyone is trying to cheer him up is a hoot (“every last inch of me is covered in hair”, “nobody takes cheap shots like Gaston”, etc.).
Thoroughly Pizzled
@cmorenc:
That’s how you get them. When their only argument is, “We were irrelevant!” one has to wonder why they’d even bother.
Yarrow
I found this ridiculously long tweetstorm via the brilliant Sarah Kendzior. It’s worth a look, but should be storified or something. Anyway, a couple of takeaways that could be useful for talking to Trump voters. Some of us have to deal with them on a daily basis at work or other activities.
1. Use the framing, “I don’t feel safe…” As in “I don’t feel safe with unqualified people running national security.” “I don’t feel safe with immigration laws and procedures being thrown into chaos.” Pick your own version of that that you think will resonate with the person you’re talking to. The point is to frame it in terms of “I don’t feel safe” and get them to worry a bit.
2. Another framing that might work: “I don’t feel we can trust a president who…” “I don’t feel we can trust a president who says he’ll release his taxes and then says winning means he doesn’t have to.” Again, use your own version of issues that fit. The point is to instill worry. Pull them into your vortex of worry.
Note: This tactic will really only work for white people talking to other white people. The power structure of a non-white person expressing fear to a white Trump voter isn’t going to do much to instill any worry in the Trump voter. And there are plenty of Trump voters who are not redeemable. This tactic will likely do nothing for them. There are others who can be moved. It might work for them. If someone is stuck dealing with Trump voters, it’s something to try.
Entire tweet storm here.
Miss Bianca
@Haydnseek: Ha ha – maybe it’s in Conejo County!
ETA: Nope, Teh Google says it’s on the Western Slope, pretty much opposite end of the state from Conejo County. This wonderful world!
Jerzy Russian
@Miss Bianca:
You see it as you enter Colorado from Utah driving along I-70. Awesome scenery out there.
Major Major Major Major
@Thoroughly Pizzled:
They like losing. It proves they’re pure.
Timurid
@The Moar You Know: One-way foreign travel will still be freely available. Emigration is a cheap and easy way to dispose of undesirables. Long before judicial exile becomes a thing, they will be creating incentives for people to say ‘fuck this’ and jump on a plane.
artem1s
Been thinking lately about how long these things take to develop and really come to a head. I was curious about when the Missouri Compromise was enacted and looked it up. 1820. It took another forty-five years later until we were in full civil war. The Dems have been playing their part in pretending the southern slave owning corporatocracy is going to wise up and figure out its not a good idea to kill your customers. Maybe. Maybe they have finally begun to understand they are not going to be able to delay this war any longer.
Give or take a few years, we are now 45 years out from Nixon and the Southern Strategy. The watershed moment when the GOP decided that power was more important than their immortal souls and the best way to get it was to ratfuck the poor and disenfranchised. Or if you want, we are 37 years out from the GOP compromise to marry the ‘old school GOP’ Bush Crime Mob to the empty suit, sock puppet, hair piece from California. Either way, looks like we may have reached peak wingnut.
liberal
@jl:
One way to sabotage Trump would be to convince Janet Yellen to resign. Trump and his resident idiots would possibly pick someone who’s much more of an inflation hawk (they’re too stupid to realize that, politically, it would be much better to pick a dov).
RealityBites
Got to bed this morning at 6:40. Saw a breaking news notice on my phone when I got up a few minutes ago with the name “Ginsburg” in it and thought I was going to have a panic attack. Turns out she gave a speech at VMI and is OK. May she live many more healthy years.
Got to get my nerves toughened up to get through these horrible times.
Will go now and find out what she said.
pamelabrown53
@The Moar You Know: #29
The reason I think we, Americans, will have to “jump through a lot of hoops to travel” is that grass roots in foreign countries will pressure their governments to institute retaliatory measures. Who can blame them? America abdicated any semblance of moral authority with the election of Trump. Sadly, the preponderance of Americans neither hold passports nor travel abroad. What some of the saner ones may understand is how America’s fall will make us less safe. This whole idea of “nationalism” is beyond reactionary: Will Trump force Ivanka to divorce Kushner and marry the son of Putin? ((If Putin has a son)! Plus we’re adding a modern day enactment of the “Crusades”.
jl
Also occurred to me that so far, Trump economic policy impulses, reflex reactions and confused chaotic spasms, are all working against continued robust (edit: not sure I should have used ‘continued’. any recent ‘robust’ expansion has been episodic at best, and not nearly enough to make up for the losses) economic expansion. This is mainly working through international financial channels, so won’t hear much about it, certainly nothing that makes a lick of sense, in the big broadcast or cable media.
The US economy does not need a ‘US dollar strong like horny young bull!!’ policy right now. But Trump is delivering that so far. The Wall St financiers he dishonestly slammed during the campaign, but since his election seems to love, certainly do see some advantages, though, for their international operations.
An interesting, though horrifying, economic experiment would be the, on the whole, crappy weak recovery from the Great Recession end just as they screw up health care.
Betty Cracker
@cmorenc: I was one of the stupid fuck Floridians who voted for Nader in 2000. I was much younger and dumber at the time, but that’s no excuse, just an explanation. I fully accept my part in facilitating the tragedies that resulted from the SCOTUS appointment of Shrub, and it will remain one of my biggest regrets until the day I die. One thing I will say in my defense is that there wasn’t a recent historical example of how badly things can go off the rails if voters regard their franchise as a venue for self expression rather than civic duty. The Stein voters circa 2016 don’t even have that flimsy excuse. I only hope they’ll one day experience the regret I still feel and always will.
JordanRules
Lovely lizard!
Protested in front of McCain and Flakes offices in PHX yesterday with a group of about 100 or so. A smaller group of 5 was allowed to go into their offices and formally address our issues (Sessions and other appointees, Russia, wall and ban). Got the usual responses from their staff…We can provide formal response in a month or so yada, yada. Felt good to be out and it was a gorgeous day. We got a lot of support from the passerbys and some middle fingers too.
I miss the smart lady in the pantsuit who should be running our country.
liberal
@? Martin: Founders fault. Presidential systems (as opposed to Parliamentary ones) eventually fall apart.
Chris
@Jerzy Russian:
I love the part where he leads the oppressed peasantry in a heroic storming of the castle and nearly liberates the region by killing the local feudal lord. Alas, this tragic revolutionary figure was cut down before his time, and we had to wait a few more centuries for the revolution…
… wait. What do you mean, he was the bad guy?
Villago Delenda Est
@The Moar You Know: Which is why have no use for them at all. The “Nach Hitler, Uns” crowd never takes into account the cost to third parties of their obstinacy.
Ridnik Chrome
@The Moar You Know: Who is this “Wilmer” I keep seeing mentioned here? Is it a “Maltese Falcon” reference that I’m not getting?
Chris
@Timurid:
Made even more so by the fact that you can continue to tax them when they’re abroad, and that if they try to dump the passport, you can hit them with a non-trivial exit tax.
(American nationalism’s hatred of taxes doesn’t extend to the filth that thinks it’s too good to live in America).
Jeffro
@Yarrow: Great tweet thread and I generally agree with her thoughts.
Still think we’re going to put forth our ideas, as proactively as possible, to help contrast with the awfulness of the Rs and to fight the “Dems only oppose, they got nuttin” nonsense. I know we’re just beginning to really get our feet back under us with the marches and Indivisible Guide and what not, but putting out what we stand for will be ever more important leading up to 11/2018.
The Moar You Know
@? Martin:
@laura:
Arm up. I did way back in 1998, what was coming was obvious even then. Eliminationist rhetoric is always the tell, and that’s when the right started spewing a lot of it. I always knew that when there was going to be shooting in this country, it wasn’t going to be patriotic citizens vs. the Army/cops. That’s not a war anyone can win. No, it was always going to be the righteous Christian citizens councils gunning down libs/browns/blacks/queers/anyone else in the streets, and the one thing they were counting on was that none of those people would be able to shoot back. If those folks do, the self-righteous murder squads will run the fuck away.
It’s almost too late, but you still can do it.
Villago Delenda Est
@liberal: They were working with what they had. The Westminster System did not exist then.
Tilda Swintons Bald Cap
@rikyrah: I thought this was pretty good:
Over at LGM
Angrifon
@jl: While I share your sentiment, DiFi is retiring at the end of this term and she had repeatedly shown that she gives less than a shit about doing the right thing. I hope she is sensible enough to know she won’t be able to show her face in public if she votes for cloture.
jl
@Angrifon: Well, I do what I can. Maybe if she wimps out, I can threaten to show up at her office and stay there until she calls the cops? I’m in that mood.
Edit: may be symbolic anyway. Dems make trouble in the Senate, I suspect the GOPers will change rules so it runs like the House.
Chris
@artem1s:
I still say the only plausible civil war scenario is basically the same as in the old days; if liberals end up running the government again, and conservatives (not yahoos with guns showing their asses on federal property, but actual politicians and state governments and the like) react by starting a war.
EZSmirkzz
Donald and the Trump Pets may have no rules Betty, and I don’t expect anyone to overtly support their right wing Leninist government. A lot of people are going to get hurt by these cretins, many of whom voted for him for reasons.
But I think we have to have some general rules of the road.
1. Do everything above board and in the open. The three letter boys, many of them infiltrated by right wing extremists, have made counter intelligence programs an art form. You can’t infiltrate what isn’t there.
2. Remain non-violent at all costs. The government has no response to non-violence that doesn’t make them look worse than they already do. No one wants a Bloody Sunday redux, especially the authoritarians.
If any one you know suggests violence towards others, or destruction of property, you know who the infiltrators are, whether from government agencies or political organizations. These are not your friends nor are they you allies.
3. Many of you youngsters, ( 55 and under,) wanted to get back to the sixties just ten or fifteen years ago so we killed it. These are your times, your issues and this is your moment. Make the most of it, have fun, especially have fun, enjoy your work and efforts and those around you and their work and their efforts.
4. Drop your pants and slide on the ice once in a while. – Dr. Sidney Freedman M.A.S.H.
If you can’t, or won’t, go into the lion’s den don’t sweat it. Some people will. Resistance takes many forms, do what you understand. Other than authoritarians, if you can’t think of anything nice to say, don’t say anything at all. When Trumpsters go fire, go water. When they go low, we go high. Things will get worse before they get better, use it to your advantage. Use the leverage to advance your goals, not theirs.
Tilda Swintons Bald Cap
@cmorenc:
Fuck that noise, punch ’em in the ear.
Captain C
@Yarrow:
In this case, the Trump voter might start fapping right then and there.
ruckus
@Yarrow:
Bet it won’t be all that difficult to leave,if you are the “right color or religion,” but it might be just a tad difficult to return, citizen or not.
delk
If everything that Trump touches turns into shit, after his impeachment the germaphobe should be forced to walk through hospitals. Every time I am in one, and whoo boy I have been a lot of them, I hear patients say “NO” when nurses ask if they have had a bowel movement.
The Moar You Know
@Betty Cracker: Never heard a Nader voter say this. Mad respect to you.
Also, you make up the best words here on a consistent basis. “Trumpsubstantiation” is wonderful.
Jerzy Russian
@Betty Cracker: I don’t get too upset with those who voted for Bush in 2000. Sure, he was a bit of a doofus, but he seemed like an OK guy to the average voter. In addition, we had institutions and career civil servants who could keep things going even when a doofus was at the top. Gore was obviously the better choice, but at the time a vote for Bush did not seem like treason. On the other hand, a vote for Bush in 2004 was inexcusable, and a vote for T—p was basically the equivalent of eating babies and kicking puppies.
Roger Moore
@Yarrow:
He also appears to have a very weak grasp of what history is.
Also, too, I wonder if “Trumpsubstandardation” might be a better term.
Thoroughly Pizzled
@Chris: Yeah. We’re not good at shooting first. But hopefully we’re good at fighting back.
Major Major Major Major
@Jerzy Russian: Agreed.
Yarrow
@Jeffro: I saw your comment about that earlier today. I agree, but I also wonder how any of that will get any coverage. Kind of like Hillary’s plans and proposals during the election. She had them but people kept claiming she didn’t.
Doesn’t mean I think Dems shouldn’t put forth proposals. I just think they also need to figure out how to get those plans and bills covered in the press so people know the Dems are working for them. Right now it’s “both sides are the same” and “Congress is terrible.”
Captain C
@liberal: Knowing them, they might pick a full-on Gold Bug.
Captain C
@Ridnik Chrome: A certain losing primary candidate the mention of whose proper name seems to trigger a Google Alert for some local annoying trolls.
EZSmirkzz
@Chris: I’d leave the Civil War talk to the wing nuts. If you’ve read the “Intercept’s” special reports you’ll understand how potent the current surveillance of Americans really is, and given the NY Field Office and Comey’s violation of the Logan Act, just how squirrelly some of those patriots are. You don’t need to say anything at all to the Pissed Pants Patriots, they stay scared.
Just sayin’.
Ares Akritas
@Betty Cracker: people listen to you Betty. Please ask readers to call their senators and demand that the respected George W. Bush SCOTUS rule be adhered to — after all, it is as valid as the Biden rule the Republicans invoked to prevent a Democratic nominee for a whole year.
NO QUARTER
SiubhanDuinne
@EZSmirkzz:
A very important point. Thanks for making it.
Chris
@Villago Delenda Est:
I’ve had a lot of interest in reading material about fascism in the last eight years. The thing that stuck out at me was the extent (very much downplayed in popular history) to which fascism owed its ascension to conservatives in power throwing the doors wide open to its regime. Without conservative cooperation, fascism doesn’t happen.
This election cycle’s been a useful reminder to me that while traditional conservatives bear the brunt of the “enabler” blame, quite a bit of the radical left did a lot to not cover itself in glory either (mainly communists); from those in Germany going “nach Hitler, uns!” to those all over Europe who ceased anti-fascist activities under Uncle Stalin’s orders until 1941.
Ridnik Chrome
@Captain C: Okay, but why “Wilmer”? Is it his gaudy patter?
Villago Delenda Est
@Chris: Probably right. Surprised it didn’t happen when that blah guy got elected.
The huge question is, where will the military stand? Will it basically split, as the last time, with the officer corps members from the breakaway states going with them? The military is much different now than it was in 1860. We have an actual standing Army, Air Force, Navy, and Marine Corps now.
bemused
@SiubhanDuinne:
I think I’m going vomit….
Ian
@Ares Akritas:
Argument fails to merit context. GWB did not appoint any SCJs during 2000-2004 because there were no vacancies.
Major Major Major Major
@Ridnik Chrome: Just something somebody suggested when we came up with the strategy.
@Captain C: Pence is one, and Trump seems like the type, soooo…
@Ares Akritas: I like the tweet I saw, sorry for all the repetition everybody!: Donald Trump should not be allowed to nominate a Supreme Court justice during the last year of his presidency.
Ridnik Chrome
@Villago Delenda Est: To be fair, the “Nach Hitler, Uns” crowd was half-right.
hilts
h/t https://www.buzzfeed.com/rubycramer/nancy-pelosi-says-democrats-have-a-responsibility-to-find-co?utm_term=.nmJj3pY4Z#.slJVvX71Z
Villago Delenda Est
@Thoroughly Pizzled: Fort Sumter. There you go.
jl
@Chris: A hopeful sign is Trump’s economic stupidity and ignorance. From what I can tell, he managed to learned a few rules of thumb on how to calculate a risk adjusted discount rate that the dopiest local real estate agent knows, and they gave him a degree at Wharton.
They need to deliver the economic goods to their bent-out-shape supporters. The recent authoritarian regimes in Eastern Europe knew enough economics to do just that. Erodogan was savvy about that early in his regime, though not sure how things will go now. Trump? Total mess on that front.
Edit: Well, it is not ‘hopeful’ for the poor ordinary schmuck, but is hopeful in terms of Trump’s support declining even more. The Trump stock market boom is done, and I think that is the last we will see of anything positive on that front. I’d get ready for at least a growth and wage recession, which Trump might goof up into a real recession.
Thoroughly Pizzled
@Chris: I read a book on fascism back in the summer of 2009. I said back then that it couldn’t happen here, because the parliamentary system of Europe allowed radical parties to gain a foothold, but having just two parties here would drown out fringe voices.
So in addition to all his other atrocities, Trump proved me wrong. I hate it when that happens.
Stan
@Yarrow:
Yeah, he thinks he plays for the falcons. He’s black, he’s famous…..must be an athlete of some kind, right?
EZSmirkzz
@SiubhanDuinne: One of the oldest tricks in the book. No one has to break any laws other than “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.” The authoritarians will tell us that it is the state of the city or county demanding a permit, not the Congress. Civil disobedience then requires us to be civil, accept the punishment, and then sue the bastards in court.
schrodingers_cat
We are Arjun on the battlefield of Kurukshetra and we have to fight with all we have got. We have no choice but to fight without any expectation of victory.
Sally Yates, did that.
Villago Delenda Est
@hilts: Well, I can agree with her on that.
But his cabinet nominees and Gorsuch? Nuh-uh. Besides, that’s all on the Senate, Pelosi is out of that loop.
Chris
@EZSmirkzz:
Well, I’m not calling for a civil war, to be clear. I think the people who do think armed insurrection or even secession is a viable option are nuts, and that it would be suicidal in practice even if I agreed with it in principle, which I don’t.
I’m just saying that the only scenario in which I can imagine one happening is basically the same as last time. Liberals aren’t well represented enough in any of the “men with guns” organizations, or among elites, and those that are represented among elites tend to be moderate. Any attempted liberal insurrection gets squashed like a bug right quick. Conservative insurrection I could actually see lasting long enough to be an actual civil war.
Ares Akritas
@Ian: The George W. Bush rule is as valid as the Biden rule. Period. Let us not nitpick with so-called “context” and “facts.”
chris
If you see an ad saying that Dr.Oz has died, Do Not Click.
Villago Delenda Est
@Ridnik Chrome: Well, yeah, they got to rebuild the rubble. And they did it badly.
Chris
@Villago Delenda Est:
The military will follow the orders of the elected government. Anybody who tries an insurrection will be taking them on.
jl
@Chris: I wonder if state like CA, IL and NY will be able pull off de facto fiscal secessions. That will important in keeping modern civilization style things going in those states.
Peale
@Yarrow: The rule change happened a year ago. That isn’t new. She probably hasn’t been to the US in the past year. I know we want to get all up in the Fascist’s faces over this, but we have to be careful about these things. The problem will be that some people will be stopped for visa violations and some people will be stopped for just being from one of the said countries. The big issue is that the visas issued by one agency of the government are no longer considered valid according to another agency and tht is creating chaos all around.
EZSmirkzz
@Chris: Our history is replete with similar examples, a third of the colonists were Tories, and another third were mush or money mongers during the Revolutionary War. All modern Americans are proud descendants of the one third who were revolutionaries.
I don’t think this is a battle of people and about things. This is about ideas, moral and philosophical. Keep yours. to hell with them and theirs. JMHO
Captain C
@Ridnik Chrome: That I don’t know. The only (other) Wilmer I know of played Fez on That 70’s Show.
Major Major Major Major
@jl: In theory it sounds fun, but let’s be honest, that would more or less destroy both the newly-created countries and what was left of the US.
Captain C
@jl: If IL gets rid of Governor Hedgefund, maybe.
ETA: with the caveat, of course, that M^4 at 1:46pm is probably right about that.
Cacti
Reuters instructs its reporters to cover the Trump administration like an authoritarian regime and to expect threats.
Betty Cracker
@Ares Akritas: Aw, not even my DOGS listen to me! But yeah, we should call our senators and reps daily to express opposition. And if you can’t get through (and I’ve been finding my senators’ phone lines jammed at every office today), you can send a fax online via services like faxzero.com (free for up to 5 3-page faxes per day). If anyone knows of other services like that, share!
jl
@Chris: Would also complicate the responsible officers efforts at delay and obstruction of deadly nonsense from Trump and his henchmen. I trust the military far more than the Trumpists. Even the mad dog Mattis, since I am desperate and have to keep hoping. He can try to move on from that nick name, but I won’t forget it.
Chris
@jl:
A few years ago, MacLaren (I know, I know) pointed out that whatever its economic issues, the United States was still seen worldwide as a safe and worthwhile place to invest your money compared to many other major powers where blatant corruption was the norm – like Russia and China, but even democratic ones like India.
At the time, I thought it was true. But the new president gives every sign of wanting to govern like a Russian oligarch-president, and has a party behind him that looks like it’d be happy to turn the whole country into CPA-era Iraq. I have to wonder how long that’ll remain true.
jl
@Major Major Major Major: I don’t see how states like CA figuring out how to run their own fucking fiscal policy on the down low will bring down the damned Republick. Get a grip.
@Chris: I think I see your point. If Trump gets goofy enough with US fiscal and Treasury policy, like trying to unilaterally renegotiate US debt, or breaking up Eurozone (even if its policies are wrongheaded), or teaching German or Chinese economies some kind of lesson, do people want a few big states that are not in total economic and financial meltdown or not? I would assume Brown is working on it.
Brachiator
@Jerzy Russian:
My reply would be that the Republicans need to make up for their earlier obstructionism by voting on and confirming Merrick Garland. Then, both sides might have repaired the political damage done.
EZSmirkzz
@Chris: I would tend to agree, but that is displayed in the lack of voter turnout. People that don’t vote get counted in public opinion polls the same as voters do. The authoritarians can only do so much, but it is up to the opposition to get the non-voters off of their dead asses. Showing up on the street is great! Voting is better.
Let me be clear here too, if Democratic office holders won’t support the base, then the base needs to primary their asses into something more constructive to do with their time, and ours.
Edited for too much base.
Ian G.
Because I refuse to give him clicks, has anyone seen if Greenwald has said anything about the botched raid in Yemen, approved by Combover Caligula, that left a SEAL and an 8 year old dead?
My recollection is that Obama targeting the 8 year old’s father is when Greenwald decided that O was worse than Idi Amin.
Chris
@jl:
Pretty sure anything that looked like secession would simply have Washington send in the national guard and place the states under martial law. And that is how I’d expect any government to react, not just Trump’s or a Republican’s.
bluegirlfromwyo
@Jerzy Russian: Answer: “But you won. I’m just getting with the program.” I used a variation on that with conservative women moaning that feminists shouldn’t have had the Women’s March because other countries treat women so much worse. (But America First!)
Roger Moore
@bendal:
It’s the same as the argument about how the Supreme Court nomination process got thrown off the rails because of what the Democrats did to Robert Bork. But he was a terrible pick who deserved the treatment he got His role in the Saturday Night Massacre alone should have disqualified him from any public office, and that’s before you consider how radical and wrong his judicial philosophy was. Reagan was making a deliberate provocation by nominating him, and any discussion that ignores that is nonsense.
Major Major Major Major
@jl: Sorry, I misread you as advocating for actual secession.
jl
@Chris: I guess CA will be invaded by federal troops if it figures out how to run a deficit independent of US, or can find tricks to keep its credit rating high when the US’s goes into the toilet! I don’t think you understand what I am talking about.
jl
@Major Major Major Major: That is OK. I am very cranky this morning. Sorry for my uncalled for snark.
EZSmirkzz
@Ian G.: You’re not hurting Greenwald. I’m reminded of John Adams remark about Jefferson, who, while in Congress assembled stood up and gave a most blasphemous denunciation of religion in general and Christianity ion particular, and then sat back down next to his friend, (Adams,) and continued the previous conversation as though nothing had transpired in the mean time. Very much in line with Voltaire’s quip, “I may disagree with what you are saying, but I will defend with my life your right to say it.”
Don’t cut of your nose to spite your face.
NotMax
@Ian G.
A lot more killed than just those two. Lowball estimates for dead civilians number in the dozens.
Brachiator
@hilts:
This is idiotic, but typical of some Democrats. They like to play small ball, and look at economic and tax policy as piecemeal stuff.
Ian
@JordanRules:
I imagine what rethuglicans would be doing in congress to stmye her. Also imagine what the Democratic party should do.
Chris
@jl:
Clearly not. “De facto fiscal secession?” I’ve heard the idea floated a few times that NY or CA or whatever should simply stop tithing money to the federal government, or whatever, which I assume is what you were talking about.
? Martin
@Ian G.:
A lot more people died than those two.
And it doesn’t sound as though the mission was succesful based on this:
From the description, it doesn’t sound as though they were able to detain anyone, and it’s unclear if they were even able to reach their objective.
TenguPhule
Trump demands nuclear option for the SC vote.
And if the GOP pull the trigger.
That’s going to be the shot on Fort Sumter.
And so much for legal, non-violent solutions.
D58826
@sukabi: only if done by a Clinton
dmsilev
@Roger Moore: There’s a simple argument to cancel the Bork Gambit: “Robert Bork’s nomination received a vote on the floor of the Senate; and lost. He wasn’t filibustered, he wasn’t held up in committee, he wasn’t denied a committee hearing just “because we can”, etc.”. Not that it really matters; people playing the Bork card are just doing it as an excuse, not because they’re amenable to any sort of reason.
jl
@Chris: No, I was talking about finding ways to run our own fiscal and monetary policy on the down low and under the table. I’d imagine, short of a super major Constitutional crisis, that CA and other big blue states would still send the bucks to Uncle Sugar to subsidize the dysfunctional Red States. That is just a damn tax we pay, we can factor that cost into whatever we do.
Timurid
@? Martin:
I wonder how this all got started? I’m not sure Trump can even find Yemen on a map, and I’m certain he knows fuck all about inside baseball counter-terrorism stuff like the interaction of Tribe A and al Qaeda Splinter Faction B. I’m guessing he wanted to make a splash, asked Flynn for a list of the most dangerous/high value terrorist targets, picked one of them at random and said, “Have him bathed and brought to my tent.”
hilts
@Brachiator:
My feeling is oppose Trump in every way humanly possible and make him fight for everything. I’m in no mood to pretend that this lunatic is a reasonable or rational human being.
Chris
@jl:
Okay. Well, in that case, best of luck to all of them, and I imagine that they will in fact be trying to protect their states from the fallout as best they can.
jl
Krugman just tweeted a graph that shows why some recent authoritarian regimes have been able to maintain popular support.
In the long run, I believe that Trumpism will be an economic disaster. But cautionary tale: 2010 authoritarian takeover in Hungary, so far
https://twitter.com/paulkrugman/status/826861589840142336
It completely escapes me what Krugman sees that suggests Trump policies can do anything like that in the US. I think he is going into panic fugue states. If he explains his fears in one of his wonky blog posts, I might pay attention.
Edit: Krugman has admitted that when he gets scared and goes with his gut, he tends to make mistakes. I hope he is doing that now.
Ian G.
@NotMax:
I know. I’m just particularly disturbed by the 8 year old because, while we don’t yet know who is a civilian or not from the raid’s casualties, I’m going to assume an 8 year old was not a hardened jihadi.
D58826
@dmsilev: And if I remember correctly the No vote was bipartisan.
Major Major Major Major
@jl: Tax cuts, deregulation, and infrastructure stimulus will be great for the markets in the short term. And cause complete economic ruin ten years later.
NorthLeft12
Amen, Betty. Amen. And that is coming from a [relatively] newly conversion to atheism.
I really have no more time for these douchebags, and am not going to hold back on calling them out for the sake of politeness or togetherness. Yeah, we have them up here in Canada too. Fortunately we kicked their asses out in the last election, but it is a never ending struggle.
StringOnAStick
@Miss Bianca: Rabbit Valley is west of Grand Junction, just a few miles from the CO-UT border.
TriassicSands
People keep saying that, but what is “normal.” I’m afraid what we’ve got now is the new normal. The Republicans have been headed for this for decades. The last eight years have been a series of trial runs for replacing representative democracy with thug-led authoritarianism. Donald Trump isn’t an aberration, he’s a culmination.
TenguPhule
@Chris: Its not viable, but inevitable at this point. And unfortunately, you’re wrong on the “crushing” part. Its going to be the worst guerilla war the US has ever seen. Its not going to be a street battle of guns like Syria, but nightmare of anon IEDs like Iraq.
The knowledge is here, the anger is here, all that’s missing is the final casus belli.
schrodingers_cat
@jl: More likely his policies will cause Great Depression 2.0.
D58826
@Ian G.: While I agree about the 8 year old not being a terrorist, we have no idea who fired the fatal shot or if she simply was in the wrong spot at the wrong time with all of the bullets flying. I would like to think that american soldiers would not just murder an 8 year old, even though Lt Calley and Mei Lai are an obvious exception.
Timurid
@Ian G.: We’re probably due for a recession soon just because of where we are in the business cycle…
NotMax
How long before Bannon convinces Dolt 45 to fly a Confederate flag atop the White House this month “because there were blacks in the South’s military too?”
jl
@Major Major Major Major: I don’t think there is much hope of net increase in infrastructure spending, just more expensive projects that would have been done anyway. That is what Trump’s plan amounts to.
So, tax cuts. But the major GOP proposal for corporate tax reform will mean higher dollar. They are not proposing some equivalent of a VAT. So, that leaves deregulation. That has to create a boost big enough to overcome higher dollar in short run.
I am not counting on an expansion, and, personally, am planning for the opposite.
D58826
and on a happier note Twitter just announced that Queen Bee is expecting twins:-)
and a not happy note – Nat Sec adviser Flynn is putting Iran ‘on notice’ about the missile launch over the week end. No definition of what ‘on notice’ means at this point
trollhattan
@NotMax:
Bycatch. What’s a few dozen turtles and dolphins so long as we get our bluefin tuna?
–Every botched raid from this point forward.
Mike J
So the rumour around USAID is that the Peace Corps is going to be nuked entirely.
Roger Moore
@Villago Delenda Est:
It also seems a bit crazy to say that presidential systems always collapse in contrast to parliamentary systems when the oldest surviving written constitution (ours) is a presidential system. There’s no perfect system, so they’re all going to fail eventually.
Mnemosyne
@hilts:
I wouldn’t be surprised if this is a gamble that there’s no way in hell the Republicans can get their shit together to offer a bill on either of those thing. Sort of like when Obama head-faked the Republicans by offering to do a “grand bargain” on Social Security that he knew they couldn’t agree on.
Major Major Major Major
@jl: If the GOP was smart they’d do a short-term stimulus and tax cut, to provide popular cover for longer-term deregulation and looting. They of course are not smart.
Chris
@TenguPhule:
Not buying it. Violent revolution is simply not the way liberal demographics roll. And the minute it started, it would lose the support of most liberals.
@Mike J:
I have friends who’re doing that, and I’ve been wondering for weeks if he’d get around to destroying the Peace Corps. (Foreign aid is half the U.S. budget, you know).
stinger
@JordanRules: Me too.
NotMax
@D58826
There are single source reports in foreign press of our military entering a house and gunning down all the inhabitants, who were women and children.
trollhattan
@TenguPhule:
Suspect you’ll be shocked at how easily they get away with it, consequence-free.
Brachiator
@Ian G.:
She was the daughter of one of the Al Qaeda leaders:
Sadly, it is reasonable to think she might have been with family members or protectors. And obviously, this does not mean that she was some kind of hardened fighter.
Ian
@Ares Akritas:
The “Biden” rule was bullshit for ‘we can’t let anyone who isn’t insanely pro-life on the supreme court’. These are not rules, they are rethuglican framing.
trollhattan
@Mike J:
Finally, somebody to rid us of those bastards!
Seems completely in their wheelhouse to get rid of anything demonstrating ‘Murika’s sissy side.
Yarrow
@hilts: I don’t really have a problem with Pelosi saying things that make her “look reasonable.” She can say anything she wants. It’s votes that matter and if anyone knows that it’s NANCY SMASH!
I think looking cooperative on infrastructure is good. She probably knows the Republicans will never put up something that requires spending. And they’ll tie anything to massive cuts that she’ll oppose. So at this point there’s not much downside in indicating willingness to cooperate. Except purity ponies will get their knickers in a twist.
JPL
@Brachiator: President Obama did not authorize the raid, and we do know that the current President did. Trump mentioned that families are fair game, and once can assume that he meant it.
JPL
Murkowski and Collins will vote no for DeVos for Education secretary. We need one more.
Yarrow
@Chris: I’ve been saying that for awhile. The American dollar is the world’s reserve currency. How long will that last? Where will the money go?
Ian
@EZSmirkzz:
Phrasing? Many Americans are descendent of immigrants or are immigrants. Many Americans of African origin fought for the British for their freedoms. Many Americans were here before the ships came from Europe.
Yarrow
@Brachiator:
Was Merrick Garland’s nomination ever formally withdrawn? Is he still actually a nominee? Or does that nomination somehow expire at the end of Obama’s presidency?
zhena gogolia
@Cacti:
I wish he’d send that memo to Dean Baquet.
SenyorDave
@Yarrow: Frederick Douglass is an example of somebody who’s done an amazing job & is being recognized more & more I notice” (he died in 1895
Here’s his Lincoln quote (in an interview with Bob Woodward):
“Well, I think Lincoln succeeded for numerous reasons. He was a man who was of great intelligence, which most presidents would be. But he was a man of great intelligence, but he was also a man that did something that was a very vital thing to do at that time. Ten years before or 20 years before, what he was doing would never have even been thought possible. So he did something that was a very important thing to do, and especially at that time.”
My wife taught for 25 years, both at a high school and elementary school level. She read this quote and said it would be at about a fourth or fifth grade level at best, and sounds like bs a student would give if they hadn’t read the book, maybe just skimmed it.
Trump’s a dope.
TriassicSands
The NYTimes this morning has a pair of opinion pieces, one explaining why “Democrats” should oppose Gorsuch, the other arguing that “liberals” should support him. The “for” piece employs words like “extraordinary,” “fairness,” and “decency” to describe Gorsuch. He “brings…a temperament that suits the nation’s highest court.”
Gorsuch may be all of the above except the part about temperament. He has written a book about assisted suicide and euthanasia that tells me all I need to know about a nominee for the Supreme Court. I’ve read excerpts from the book and I’m toying with the idea of finding a copy to read (Amazon offers it for a mere $26.95 for the Kindle edition), but the price is too much for me to read a book whose thesis is based on religious beliefs that should not be part of a secular society’s legal landscape. Gorsuch opposes assisted suicide and raises the typical bogeymen that opponents always raise. What his opposition tells me is that he is a man who is comfortable having his religious beliefs control the lives (and deaths) of everyone else. He has, apparently, and not surprisingly, carved out a neat exception to his contention that “human life is intrinsically valuable and that intentional killing is wrong.” That exception miraculously allows for state-sanctioned executions. Hmm. What a surprise.
The last thing the Court needs is another religious zealot who is going to support “individual freedom” except where it involves the government entering the bedroom and hospital room to make decisions for individuals. This is consistent with being anti-choice.
PS If all that weren’t bad enough, Gorsuch is the son of the execrable Anne Gorsuch Burford, one of the absolute worst “public servants” in recent (relatively speaking) history. She served in the Reagan administration as possibly the worst ever head of the EPA.
From Wikipedia:
Anne Gorsuch Burford was a key part, along with James Watt (the worst Interior Secretary ever) of Reagan’s war on the environment. Her son grew up to be a right wing judge opposed to government regulations (except where needed for religious reasons). Big surprise.
PsiFighter37
Collins and Murkowski voting against DeVos…just need one more GOPer…
NotMax
@Yarrow
IIRC, there are currently two vacancies on the Federal Reserve’s board of governors.
Just sayin’.
Major Major Major Major
@TriassicSands: I don’t care about Gorsuch’s ideology at all, it’s Garland’s seat and Democrats should oppose anybody else filling it.
Brachiator
@NotMax:
Really? Cite a source, with corroboration. Provide a link.
randy khan
@PsiFighter37:
Who do we target now? Toomey?
Major Major Major Major
@randy khan: We’re still waiting on one of our brave, principled #nevertrump senators to step up…
waiting……
workworkwork
@Yarrow: To us educators, this move when performed by students is referred to as “Albania: Land of Contrasts”.
schrodingers_cat
@randy khan: Flake, McCain or Graham
Esme and her mom
@Ridnik Chrome: It’s a reference from The Maltese Falcon. Humphrey Bogart refers to Elisha Cook’s character, Wilmer, as a gunsel. Googling provides some interesting definitions. Sorry if this has already been addressed.
Timurid
Since we’re cheering ourselves up with civil war scenarios… There’s one that’s more insidious and likely has a longer fuse than the length of any Trump administration, although Trump’s actions could speed it up significantly. The problem is that the two major parties have become increasingly segregated. The Republicans are already effectively the white nationalist party. But there are still many white Democrats…
What happens if there is an extended period of civil unrest and terrorist violence (i.e. the Troubles in Northern Ireland). Even if white supremacists start it, their opponents will inevitably commit atrocities of their own if things get bad enough. And the first time some random dickhead bombs a school full of white kids, even ‘liberal’ whites will flock to the Republican party. That exodus might even moderate the GOP for the moment… At long last the Republicans turn on an increasingly erratic and senile Trump who has lost control of the situation. They impeach him not for being a fascist, but for being bad at it. A more sane and ‘normal’ Republican administration takes over, the violence abates somewhat and the feared civil war is avoided… for the moment.
But now the country is divided into the White and Brown parties, and both sides know which way the demographics are moving. At that point it’s a matter of when, not if, something happens that will make Americans nostalgic for the good old days of Trump…
TenguPhule
@EZSmirkzz: Many good Germans thought that if they stayed silent and behaved, they could avoid the troubles around them as the little man with the mustache did what he pleased.
They were very very wrong.
There will come a point when even you realize that the Enemy does not care about peaceful protest. That ANY form or type of resistance will be treated all the same.That neither the lawmakers, the courts or the enforcers will be fair or just.
But I suspect you will realize it a little too late.
Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism
@Ian: I took it to be snark at the number of people who claim descent from the Patriots*.
*Term of art. A DAR/SAR member’s proven ancestor with proven Revolutionary service. It’s not as easy as it sounds.
Stan
@NotMax:
I am probably going to say this wrong but – what the f*ck do people think is going to happen when you send special forces into a building they are told is full of high value targets? They will go in planning to kill everyone there. Not doing so puts the team at unnecessary risk. Ask Senator Bob Kerrey.
Betty Cracker
@JPL:
Some asked that expired tin of Spam who currently serves as press secretary about that at the briefing yesterday. He tapped-danced around it for a few seconds and then called on a Breitbart-clone “reporter” to escape the followup.
Ian
@Ian G.:
Hi other Ian! You seemed to miss the part where Trump said he would kill the family members of terrorists. Campaign promise fulfilled.
Timurid
And in other news, Lindsey Graham is getting his Nazi on…
StringOnAStick
@Major Major Major Major: I had a hedge fund manager in my dental chair last week, so we talked the stock market a bit. He did say that he had thought that Drumpf’s deregulation plans would boost business, but now he thinks “the market is way ahead of its self” and “I’m not at all bullish currently”, plus “it was a good 8 year run, but it is over now”. I tend to keep track of what I hear from this guy. He’s not an overt asshole and is quite successful, but obviously someone in his line of work is always a republican because of the ‘fiscal conservatism” dodge.
I figure his no longer bullish stance is as close as he would likely get to stating the obvious: Drumpf is an economic Cat V storm rolling towards our shores, and the time to be financially cautious is now, not 10 years from now. Funny how he couldn’t let himself link that “8 year bull market” to the guy who just left the presidential office for a tropical vacation.
D58826
In the Iran press release Flynn (or maybe Trump since it sounds like him) said ‘instead of being thankful for these agreements Iran is now feeling emboldened’.
http://www.theamericanconservative.com/larison/flynn-and-the-dangerous-iran-obsession/
bupalos
@The Moar You Know: I know at least 2 others. Now die hard dems that learned their lesson and push left through the party, not outside of it.
People learn and change, and in fact that is our only hope.
Corner Stone
@Timurid: He’s getting fucking pasted on that feed.
Just a reminder. It doesn’t matter what great quips and soundbytes these cowardly R’s say about how bad Trump is. It’s what they do when it’s crunch time that matters. They are not our ally.
Timurid
@Ian:
SEALS are professionals. They’re not going to turn into the Manson Family just because their brand new President told them that the war crime lamp is lit.
rikyrah
@jl:
Long run?
Hell, short run
TenguPhule
@Chris: The prospect of hanging concentrates one’s mind considerably. And there are limits to everything, you simply haven’t found yours yet.
Run, Fight or Die.
liberal
@rikyrah: It can take awhile for things to affect the economy.
The biggest thing they could do to spin us into a recession would be to cut Federal spending. That might slow things down by the 2018 elections, if it’s front-loaded and the economy is stalling anyways, but maybe not.
I guess a trade war could screw things up rather quickly.
schrodingers_cat
@rikyrah: Exactly and comparing Hungary to United States, is like comparing Berkshires, to the Himalayas. Hungarian economy is minuscule compared to the US.
Seth Owen
@Yarrow: No, I am sure Trump named him, Parks and Tubman precisely because they are safely dead. Notably he did not name any living civil rights hero, such as Rep. Lewis.
Corner Stone
Senate Voting To Confirm Ex-Big Oil CEO as Secy Of State
Actual chyron right now.
Chris
@schrodingers_cat:
Also, European fascists don’t tend to share our obsession with economic royalism
Captain C
@JPL:
In light of this, if I were Uday, Qusay, or Lucrezia, I would be very careful about my travel plans going forward.
(Tiffany seems OK and leery of her father, and Barron’s only ten and it seems that at least Ivana’s kids have no use for him.)
jl
@liberal:
” I guess a trade war could screw things up rather quickly. ”
I wonder if there is a song called ‘Sky high dollar blues’? That is quick. Will kick in in less than a year. 3 quarters from now probably for real economy. Right now for stock market. High dollar blues beats the trade war boogie-woogie in the short run.
NotMax
@Brachiator
Single source by definition means cannot provide corroboration. Information from all reports is still sketchy and should not be interpreted as definitive yet. Piece read over the weekend claiming to be reporting several eyewitness accounts now brings up a 404 page, so here are some others.
Domestic cite:
Foreign cites:
Also mentioned at that last site (different story there): “The raid on Saturday in Yemen’s Bayda governorate, which also included elite forces from a Gulf country…” That leaves open the question of which troops did what.
Seth Owen
@Yarrow: it expired with the last Congress.
Ian
@Timurid:
Your paranoid fantasies do not include the fact the Romney won more of the white vote than the orange shitstain, and the orange shitstain won more votes from AAs and Latinos. The underlying factor you miss is misogyny.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
Trump’s razor – him and his supporters believe in dumb things. I think he’s less the locus of evil and more the locus of stupid. Your’ confusion Betty is you’re assuming Nixon world rules from Trump in what is a Trailer Trash on the Potomac Reality Show Palin created. They don’t want immigration and foreigners in their country because foreigners are different, and anyone different than them is coming to rape and kill them! Yes, it’s pure fear, but there is nothing behind that fear but more fear.
Corner Stone
Good God. Sell everything you own and spend it all on hookers and blow until it runs out. The only sin would be to die by nuclear holocaust while you still have a condom or a hundo in your pocket.
Brachiator
@EZSmirkzz:
What? Some modern Americans have to be sniveling descendants of the two thirds who did nothing or who remained loyal to the Crown.
Other Americans came after the war or are otherwise descended from people who were not involved.
hilts
h/t http://blogs.alternet.org/election-2016/trump-has-already-raised-staggering-amount-money-his-reelection
A Ghost to Most
@The Moar You Know:
It is a good idea to be prepared for if/when the talking stops, if you are so inclined. I will go down swinging, somewhere in the mountains. I’ve had a shaky relationship with authority all my life, and none now.
El Caganer
@Timurid: I suspect the target was picked by his new BFF, King Salman.
TriassicSands
@Major Major Major Major:
My guess is you’ll care about his ideology when he’s the fifth vote to ____ (fill in the blank with any of numerous important issues).
Merrick is unlikely to ever sit on the Supreme Court. His only chance is a Democratic president in 2021 along with a Democratic majority in the senate. Otherwise, he’s a footnote in the history books. And it’s very unlikely he would be nominated in 2021.
NotMax
@Stan
Admit I did run a bit ahead by saying our military, rather than military members (whether ours or others).
EZSmirkzz
@Ian: Concepts.
All of us are immigrants. No one that I know of claims to be descended from the Tories. Or the money grubbers. Of course all of what you say is true, but if people are so sensitive about that that they can’t see the concept presented we may, (and I have had on this blog,) some problem communicating. My motto has been and remains, if any statement can be taken two ways take in the positive light.
Also too, what a word denotes and what it connotes may be two different things as well. This can lead to misunderstandings as well. It has never been my intention to offend anyone’s sensibilities by connotations when I am quite able to do so with denotation. I have never grown accustomed to younger peoples willingness to seek out slights to themselves or others, especially when the context doesn’t support their assumptions.
I’ll work on a more positive writing style and encourage you to work on a more positive reading style. I have loved the English language all my life, the way words sound, how they mean, the rhythm and cadence of its’ structure, and its’ duality of Anglo-Saxon and Romance languages. I can also be pretty abrasive in a word fight, being ambidextrous I always hit my mark.
This is rubbing shoulders with conservatives dislike of politically correct language, because conservatives while polite in person for the most part, are ill mannered and boorish in their writing, not to mention it being mundane and boring. This statement may of course offend you if you so choose to be, although it wasn’t my intention to do so, merely to point out how discreet indiscretion can be to conservatives, and yet hopefully I have in some small way offended conservatives for their crap English. (Hellooo Elizabeth! Long time no zing. :-) )
Timurid
@liberal:
Everyone fears some precipitating event that allows Trump to declare martial law and consolidate his power. The obvious scenario is a catastrophic terrorist attack. But that would require one of two things:
The mental giants leading ISIS and/or Al Qaeda actually get it done. But it’s not as if they weren’t trying their hardest during the late Bush and Obama administrations. It’s just that they are too inept to do the job. Even 9/11 was flawed in that a sizeable portion of the shallow pool of actually competent operatives was killed in the attack or exposed to capture in its aftermath.
A false flag attack. It’s not as if anyone on their side would have moral reservations. Even ‘reasonable’ figures like Ryan and McConnell are cannibals in three-piece suits. Ebola on a cruise ship or nerve gas at the World Series would be a small price for seeing their agenda implemented without condition. The problem is that they don’t have the balls, and they don’t have the skills. Now that Trump has totally alienated the IC, they can’t even fantasize about blowing the dust off of Operation Northwoods. If they tried it, they would inevitably fuck it up, with catastrophic consequences for themselves.
But an economic catastrophe would be pretty straightforward to accomplish using mostly (technically) legal means. Even easier if their Russian friends create an exacerbating crisis…
Captain C
@D58826:
Given the competence of this crew, it probably means, “we’re drawing up plans to conquer your country with 3 carriers, which will be located in the Persian Gulf, and two SEAL teams attacking from the west. You will kneel before our mighty shock and awe.”
Major Major Major Major
@TriassicSands: that’s not what I meant and you know it.
NotMax
@TraissicSands
Garland is still chief judge of the U.S. Court of Appeals for the D.C. circuit, which in legal parlance ain’t exactly chopped liver.
Jerzy Russian
@Betty Cracker:
Now that phrase is funny. What is not funny is that we have a expired tin of Span serving as the White House Press Secretary.
A Ghost to Most
@StringOnAStick:
Just moved most of my stock into safer pastures. Partly because I may need to retire earlier than expected, and partly because I think T. Coli is going to tank the market, for fun and profit.
Brachiator
@NotMax:
Could mean anything from an anecdote to a lie, or honest confusion about the facts.
jl
@Brachiator: What evidence exists indicates that my proud Revolutionary War heritage springs from profiteer officers in the army. So, why did I not vote for Trump? It is a mystery.
Corner Stone
@A Ghost to Most:
When does the pallet of SPAM get delivered?
EZSmirkzz
@TenguPhule: I think you don’t know me at all and are a little full of yourself my friend. As I stated before, anyone that advocates violence towards others or destruction of property is either a right wing agitator or a fool. I would hope you are neither.
Corner Stone
@A Ghost to Most: But more seriously, if US T-Bills are no longer safe havens, where in the hell could one stick their investments?
Timurid
@Ian: I don’t think a civil war is likely, much less inevitable. But since everyone else was amusing themselves by spitballing scenarios…
Major Major Major Major
@Corner Stone: bitcoin, obviously.
Ares Akritas
@Ian: You seem incapable or recognizing a little quality trolling. Of course the Biden rule was BS, The “George W. Bush rule” I made up is a little comeuppance.
Ksmiami
@laura: I’m a skinny chef with a lot of knives and explosive gasses etc. Not afraid of a bunch of fat fuCkers with bad aim.
SiubhanDuinne
@TriassicSands:
Try your public library. If they don’t have it, they should be able to get it in a day or two using InterLibrary Loan.
NotMax
@Brachiator
You’re the one who requested corroboration despite it being stated that was referring to single sourced stories.
Time will disperse at least some of the fog of what is still immediate and mostly long distance reporting. As Harriers and other support strike craft were called in, this was no small scale operation, so much to be sorted out.
Corner Stone
@Ksmiami: “Never trust a skinny chef”
/Lincoln
TenguPhule
@Corner Stone: Food, water, small tools, medicine, ammunition.
Things that people need to survive. And useful in barter.
A Ghost to Most
@Corner Stone:
I agree, but at this point I don’t want to see my portfolio get crushed like 2008. I thought I’d never find the bottom of my stomach.
Go long on armbands and hob-nailed boots.
TenguPhule
@hilts: And how is it not a violation of the Domestic emolument clause? Rule of law is truly dead in America.
Major Major Major Major
Tillerson confirmed 56-43.
A Ghost to Most
@TenguPhule:
My off-road vehicle stays loaded, and I can go many places that 95% of vehicles cannot. Humvees cannot safely travel many roads here; they are too wide.
EZSmirkzz
@TenguPhule: Pretty much all of which is covered in the SAS Survival Handbook. I’m not too interested in the prepper BS, but this book and one by Field and Stream should get the most naive up to speed. Somethings become obvious once they are pointed out to people.
NotMax
@Major Major Major Major
Know where he can get a good deal on a slightly used server for his house.
:)
TenguPhule
@Timurid: You somehow think that just because they’re inept idiots that they won’t try anyway. Remember, these people have morons for supporters who think the media is lying to them when the facts are reported. They don’t need a majority, just a large enough pool of bodies in one place that can override traditional law-enforcement at the scene. And then just blame the Democrats.
hilts
@TenguPhule:
In less than 2 weeks, Trump has set new standards for corruption and incompetence. He’s an unprecedented species of scum.
NotMax
@hilts
Harding 2.0. On meth.
trollhattan
@A Ghost to Most:
Yup, it’s been a nine-year slog out of the fiscal trench dug by Dubya and his cohort and I can’t spare the years to have my 401ks Trumpedoed all over again.
TenguPhule
@EZSmirkzz: Anyone who doesn’t see what’s coming and start planning accordingly is collateral damage waiting to happen. You may not like violence and not want violence, but violence is coming down the road to all of our addresses and those who think that following the old rules will keep them safe are going to learn the hard way that the new regime DOES NOT CARE about rules or laws or common decency. Run, fight or die.
Corner Stone
@trollhattan: So where is all your phat cash going?
BellyCat
Let them nuke the filibuster. We will pay dearly now, but after this (mal)administration, this will be the only way to clean up the mess. And the Dems will never do it themselves. We had our chance and mistakenly presumed some (any?) degree of comity would prevail.
The divisions today are too deep — and will be for the foreseeable future — for any type of compromise or party disloyalty among the Rethugs. Imagine what Obama could have done in 8 years without the filibuster!?!?
Once the ‘Murican people see how badly they end up after this shitshow, all the Dems need to do is run a charismatic person with a pulse (and slay the Purity Ponies) and we will see a future wave election that just keeps on building, while the rascists, evangelist, fiscal conservatives, and low-information deplorables destroy each in their efforts to scapegoat each other for royally fucking up what in retrospect will look like a pretty good state of affairs.
TenguPhule
@hilts: Its the Moore’s law of Trump Corruption.
Corner Stone
@TenguPhule:
Where do you get supplies of potable water? Where do you store fresh killed meat until you can cure it? Can you spend the amount of time in one place to cure it? You can’t grow anything if you’re constantly moving and eluding threat. Man as a forager is a tiny, tiny population.
TenguPhule
@BellyCat: Presumes intelligence and long term memory of American heartland voters not in evidence. Also presumes law abiding Republicans in office also not in evidence.
The GOP will not relinquish power unless its from their cold dead fingers. And they’re willing to do whatever it takes to stay in control. Whatever it takes, laws be damned.
trollhattan
@Corner Stone:
My current shop offers managed accounts designed around one’s projected retirement date and as that gets closer, moves investments into an array of non-volatile stuff like CDs, bonds, etc and out of the market. Low-yield+low risk. My 401ks from previous jerbs are still all invested in the markets and my plan is to roll them into the current employer’s fund. Will also save a ton on management fees.
Post-Trump I can still redirect anywhere I want, once the dust/radioactive fallout settles.
TenguPhule
@Corner Stone: I can’t run. Literally nowhere for me to run to. I’m in what’s referred to as Death Ground by Sun Tzu.
EZSmirkzz
@TenguPhule: Where have I heard all of this before? You sound like you’re prepared for defeat, but what about victory?
Any violence on our part will absolutely loose public opinion. Been there, did that, still got the T-Shirts man. Unless you’re writing from a cave in Idaho, even then, the modern surveillance state will have noted your insistence on preparing for what seems far fetched at worst, too close for comfort at best, and have put a silent watch on your happy ass, so if you are preparing for the end times I would suggest you do it quietly and with cash, not proclaiming it on fucking social media outlets. This ain’t your grandfather’s revolution.
A Ghost to Most
@Corner Stone:
A bunch of my cash is going into ARB locking differentials, and bigger stronger tires. Then I can in and out of even more places. Luckily, it is also our summer passion, so none of this is wasted.
A Henry rifle might be, though.
eta
@EZSmirkzz:
Who’s talking about starting violence?
Corner Stone
@trollhattan:
Just think how much more efficient those order entry clerks will be when they have three arms.
Innovation!
Brachiator
@BellyCat:
A good chunk of ‘Muricans voted for Trump and are happy at the Muslm ban and the tough guy posturing against Mexico and other countries.
You cannot depend on Americans simply finding religion after Trump. And if Democrats think they need do nothing, or can get by with just anybody, they will only end up with something worse than Trump. And just imagine what something like that would be like.
EZSmirkzz
@A Ghost to Most: In my response to Betty, here, I talked about the rules of resistance,
I’m just following the converstion since then.
Ksmiami
@trollhattan: My thought is Dutch stocks / ETFs right now honestly. They have a robust economy, decent regulatory oversight, long history of capitalism. Also Canada
TenguPhule
@EZSmirkzz: I don’t see victory on the horizon. What I see is one long, long, long struggle with bodies piling as far as the eye can see. The peace has only held as long as it did in America because of faith and respect for rule of law. Once you take that away, people start to realize that law enforcement coverage is actually thin on the ground. Sure, they can mobilize for local superiority if there’s only a few cases at a time, but the bulk of enforcement has always been the respect/fear of the badge as a symbol even in absence of actual presence.
That has taken a beating in the last couple of years and its only getting worse as the law has been flouted by RWNJ while the colored folk keep getting shot, beaten and ridiculed.
I’m going call it as tit for tat. They murder an environmental activist in the dead of night, the next a fundy forced birther gets dumped in the street minus a head. Nothing official, but a shadow war. Whether the federal government breaks down into fighting factions depends on how corrupted the agencies have become, how many RWNJ have wormed their way into power and how many will “do their duty” and simply follow orders.
I don’t expect to start anything, but I can still see the monsters in the dark, just waiting for the dying glow of the lantern of liberty to go out.
cmorenc
@Betty Cracker:
Well, as long as we’re in confessional – my first vote ever in a Presidential election after I became eligible was in 1972 – was for Richard Nixon. And my muddle-headed thinking at the time was no better than yours for voting Nader in 2000 – “it seemed like a good idea at the time” doesn’t sound like much of a mitigating excuse when looked at through the lens of time, does it? But at least you and I evolved past our youthful foolishness.
A Ghost to Most
@EZSmirkzz:
Ah, apologies; different conversation.
EZSmirkzz
@TenguPhule: I think you’re entirely too pessimistic. Donald and the Trump Pets are alreadyunder 40%
If things work at as bad as you see them, then the rest of the world is going to need you outside, not inside the gulags. I say keep the faith baby, we got the numbers, ee got the time.
cmorenc
@BellyCat:
Part of the problem will be that with potential victory over RW forces in sight, the Purity Ponies will be drawn out in force insisting that only *their* Purity Pony is the true Purity Pony that can properly vanquish the evil empire and transform the country into rightful progressive order. On a miniature scale, that’s exactly what happened in Maine that allowed one of the most repulsively RW assholes win re-election, despite 62% of Maine voters voting for one of the two purity ponies running against him.
EZSmirkzz
@A Ghost to Most: None necessary.
Brachiator
@EZSmirkzz:
Polling ain’t votes. Trump and the Republicans are moving ahead with their agenda.
And the upcoming jobs report looks good. Trump will take all the credit.
TenguPhule
@EZSmirkzz: I hope you are right and that I am wrong. Truly I do. But ever since November, my dreams are of fire and blood, the screams of the dying and the condemned ring in my ears and nothing I’ve seen so far each day provides any comfort that those dreams of days yet to come are a lie.
Spanky
@TenguPhule: Boy! You sure must be fun at parties!
A Ghost to Most
This crazy old bastard is going to stand back, and let those of you who know how to talk to those people try to talk them down. I’m not sure it’s possible, but I know I’d only make things worse. Lots of anger clouds my abillity to think and respond appropriately.
I grew up in the middle of the racist, ammosexual culture, got out, and finally had to cut ties with my family 10 years ago. I know how they think, and I know the firepower they possess. Give them a brown (or silver) shirt with some patches, and they will happily ‘cleanse’ America for the babby Jebus.
TenguPhule
@Spanky: I was when I could get a good night’s sleep. Now I look like a raccoon.
Corner Stone
@TenguPhule:
KellyAnn…*is that you*?
A Ghost to Most
curious as to which word in my previous comment caused moderation – c l e a n s e ?
NR
@Brachiator:
Fixed that for you.
Thru the Looking Glass...
Uh… are the two some how mutually exclusive?
Xecky Gilchrist
That truly is an excellent lizard (and shot thereof.)
EZSmirkzz
@Brachiator:
Well maybe we ought to match their strategic thinking. This what Kos is screaming about over at his site. Democrats need to obstruct, unitedly, instead continually fighting rear guard actions. Fillibuster the SC nomination. Obstruct everything.
As to the jobs report Trump will take credit for sliced bread if you ask him. He’s been in office for 12 days, so only a complete moron would give him credit for the economy, so if he does …
The President has a lot less impact on the economy than political junkies give them credit for. Congress manages fiscal policy and the Fed Reserve monetary policy. The Fed and the Congress under the Rs have dragged their feet which is why it’s still a sluggish pile of crap. Part time jobs and contract labor aren’t anything to brag about anyway. As to my second assertion with luck he’ll prove my point.
Also too, the stock market doesn’t mean a fucking thing about the economy. We may as well be gaging the rational actors in the asylums, oh wait, the conservatives released them all so they wouldn’t be institutionalized, so I mean the people under bridges and in the private contract jails whom are rational actors like the stock market foobs.
EZSmirkzz
@TenguPhule: Well maybe you should drop your pants and slid on the ice. ;-). Seriously, we have the numbers. When Adams and the Federalist passed the Alien and Seditions Act it wasn’t four years later that Jefferson and the Democratic Republicans tossed into the dustbin of history. I can imagine a loved one maybe, maybe demoralizing you to such a state, but not those obtuse assholes charading under the banner of conservatism. I’m only hoping real conservatives wake up and smell the rotting mackerels.
Of course as that great Republican Abe Lincoln said, “You can all of the people some of the time, some of the people all of the time, but you can’t fool all of the people all of the time.” McConnel and Ryan et al are trying to make a liar out of Mr. Lincoln I suppose.
Hang tough.
Miss Bianca
@NR:Have you called any Senators? Taken part in any protests? Done anything useful *at all*? Or are you just going to sit there and continue to relitigate the primary and election and consider us privileged by the benefit of your lamestream cynicism, you little sad sack? We’d all love to hear that you actually got off your whiny, sneering ass and did something besides breathe the air and use the earthly resources that could be going to a worthier human being. And if you can’t manage to do anything useful, just fuck off and take your pollution somewhere else.
Villago Delenda Est
@Brachiator: Cripes, we need a snark detector repairman on this thread, stat.
Villago Delenda Est
@NR: I invite you, most cordially, again, to find a fire to die in. Asshole.
NR
@Miss Bianca:
You guys were relitigating the election long before I showed up by trashing so-called “purity ponies” and blaming them for Trump. It’s funny how you weren’t calling any of those people out, but the second someone stands up to their bullshit, there you are. I guess “relitigating” is only bad when it doesn’t follow your approved party line, eh?
Dev Null
@EZSmirkzz: FWIW I took Ian’s comment as proximately neutral – indeed, I nodded mentally at his gloss on your post and thought “good point”.
I haven’t clicked back to your original post to read the line Ian quoted in context, but (contra Ian) I would be surprised to hear that a sizable fraction of the African-American population in the American colonies (*cough*slaves*cough*) were revolutionaries in the usual sense. I’m not an historian, so if Ian or anyone else knows differently please feel free to correct me. The ancestors of Revolutionary era African-Americans sure as hell didn’t come over on the Mayflower.
On the basis of that understanding, it strikes me as (ahem) whitewashing history to say that “all modern Americans are descended from the one-third who were revolutionaries” … I get your joke, but … I dunno … I guess it strikes me as a bit tone-deaf. When I make this sorta mistake (and I do …) I attribute it to the blinders of my own “white privilege”. I could imagine that an African-American reader might find your comment, hmm, somewhat lacking in awareness.
Your suggestion that Ian read less negatively is (ahem) positively amusing; from my PoV you could have read Ian’s comment more positively (“less negatively”? … “more neutrally”? is it possible to be “more neutral”? :-) ) than you did, which needless to say was your knock on Ian.
Amusing too because your line can be read in yet another way (I did!); I got your joke only after reading this post (210). Yeah, the joke was obvious. Shame on me.
As regards “denote”: good word, thanks. I had to look it up – you might say that I knew the connotations of “denote” but not the denotations. I’d probably have used the word “signify” instead. (Not saying that “signify” is a better word, saying it’s the word I’d have used in the absence of “denote”.)
Not to be tedious (I know, I know), but in a post that suggests that your readers should read more carefully (or at least more positively), you used the phrase “we are all immigrants”. I’m probably being more dense than usual (yes, Virginia, that ispossible), but I am curious: in what sense are AmerIndians immigrants? Are you referring to the initial colonization of the Americas via Beringia 10Ky-15Ky BCE?? Seems a bit of a stretch, but mebbe that’s just me. Or am I missing another joke? Enquiring minds and all that …
Dev Null
@NR: So I have a short personal experience that might be relevant. I have an Indian friend – a really really smart guy – who told me he was voting for Jill Stein. I made a few not very subtle, uh, mildly non-positive remarks about Jill Stein. He reacted in anger. [1] According to my friend, Hitlery is a warmonger and we should “give peace a chance”.
So here we are.
I’m betting that President Bannon and his faithful lap-poodle Donnie are going to start a small-scale war with China or Iran or possibly even Germany. Because Donnie cannot back down when he thinks he has a winning hand, he will ratchet up the small-scale conflict until someone goes nuclear. Which is to say: I’m betting we’re all going to die either by being incinerated or by radiation poisoning or by freezing during the ensuing nuclear winter.
Whether or not Hitlery was a warmonger, she would not have bumbled us into a nuclear apocalypse. Anyone who says they didn’t know that Donnie was capable of bumbling us into war wasn’t paying attention.
Which is to say, some of us are still pissed at purity ponies. Voting for Jill Stein was not “giving peace a chance”, it was rolling the dice on a nuclear apocalypse.
The refrain to “nach Hitler” in the age of nuclear weapons isn’t necessarily “uns”; the refrain might be “we’re all dead”, eh?
Or mebbe TenguPhule is right and most of us will be killed by asymmetric internecine warfare.
Or mebbe it’s only a few hundred thousand people who will die because they can’t afford health care, ObamaCare having been repealed but not replaced.
You say “ran an incompetent campaign”. Hitlery very nearly won. She lost thanks to a freakish combination of contingent circumstances, among which Bill Clinton crossing the tarmac and Anthony Wiener sexting an underage girl. The first allowed Comey to get into the game in July; the second allowed Comey to stick his thumb on the scale the week before the election. And Putin put his thumb on the scale, which for whatever reason no-one anticipated.
Did I mention purity ponies? AFAIK it is historical fact that Al Gore lost in part thanks to purity ponies. That’s twice in five elections that purity ponies managed to defeat a flawed-but-decent&competent DemonCrap. Good work, guys. The stats look even worse when you consider that incumbents have an edge: that’s two of three open elections in which you guys factored into the DemonCrap’s loss. In consequence of the first loss, order of half a million Iraqis were killed / maimed / displaced. I haven’t looked at the numbers recently, but I seem to recall the Dubya-Cheney War cost America 35K dead and maimed. I’d ask them how they feel about your purity … but they’re dead.
As others have said, if you take Jill Stein out of the race it is at least possible that Hitlery would have won. A recent social science paper comes to the conclusion that third party candidates lead overall to lower voter turnout (sorry, no link, didn’t keep, might have been linked at LG&M); since the CW is that Hitlery didn’t turn out the Dem base in sufficient numbers it’s possible, even likely, that Hitlery would have won on turnout had Jill Stein not been in the race. The third point is that no-one, and I do mean (well, almost) no-one, thought Donnie could win, which kinda-sorta makes voting cheap. I mean, if Hitlery is going to win without your vote, what matter that you vote for Jill Stein, eh? For that matter, why bother voting?
A lot of people didn’t.
But if enough people take that PoV – apparently many did – that small number of votes, once in a great while can make the difference between winning or losing.
Hitlery was way too hawkish for my taste, but I voted for her. I wish I’d done more for her campaign … but I didn’t think Donnie could win. My daughter, a Bernie delegate at the DNC, also voted for Hitlery. She worked to reconcile BernieBros with Hitlery.
I’m not going to trash my Indian friend by name… but he is a purity pony. So, apparently, are you. That’s kinda-sorta naming names, amirite?
I sort it out in my head this way: on the one hand, you purity ponies de facto voted for one of the worst presidential candidates in American history, that candidate became president, and there’s a good chance he’ll kill us all sooner rather than later. Or perhaps we’ll be killed by rampaging alt-righters or IEDs or guys in pickup trucks with gun racks and Treason in Defense of Slavery flags in pickup trucks. Or perhaps it’s only the poor who will die. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
You voted for the worst presidential candidate in American history despite the availability of a flawed-but-highly-qualified better-than-average DemonCrap candidate who would have presidented in Obama’s footsteps … yeah, started a few small wars, but a) would not have bumbled into a nuclear apocalypse; and b) would have preserved ObamaCare, Social Security, Medicare, and the safety net more generally. Hitlery would have been pro-science.
That’s a lot of karma to live with. I can see that you might have a guilty conscience.
If you have a guilty conscience, that is.
You should.
On the other hand (still sorting in my head): Bill Clinton didn’t have to cross the tarmac. Anthony Weinstein didn’t have to sext an underage girl. Joe Biden could have run. Hitlery’s team could have protected their base in Wisconsin et al. I could have contributed more and worked harder to elect Hitlery. Others like me could have.
So you purity ponies don’t own sole responsibility for the election of the madman who is likely to kill all of us if we can’t figure out how to impeach him first.
The more important point is: we hang together, or we hang separately.
What are you doing to avoid us all getting hanged? (Well, incinerated or blown to bits by IEDs planted by our neighbors…)
HTH you understand why people like me are not enthused about you purity ponies. Speaking only for myself, I consider you and my Indian friend to be preening self-righteous moral peacocks. As the saying goes: “life is hard, and then ya dies.” Perhaps we all die. Perhaps sooner rather than later.
Dog help us all.
[1] Jill Stein consorts with anti-vaxxers. Not everyone is STEM, but goddamn, anti-vaxxers should not have the franchise, nor should they be allowed to run for office. My personal fave: Jill Stein pushed the meme that Hitlery would be worse than Trump. No way to re-run the experiments, and it depends on what one means by “worse”, but getting us all killed by nukes seems suboptimal to me. (I know, I know: “reasonable people can differ.”)
Anyone heard from Jill Stein recently?!? I don’t remember seeing her condemning anything Trump has done … why isn’t she fighting the good fight against Trump?
NR
@Dev Null: First, I voted for Hillary. So you can take your “purity pony” bullshit and shove it.
Second, Stein’s voters were not enough to swing the election to Trump. If every single one of them had voted for Hillary instead, she still would have lost.
Third, the Democratic party is not entitled to anyone’s vote. Most of the third-party voters in this election wouldn’t have voted for Hillary even if she’d been the only candidate on the ballot. The Democratic party could have run a better candidate that appealed to more voters. They chose not to. And we all paid the price.
So, again, take your “purity pony” bullshit and shove it.
Dev Null
@NR: I haven’t looked at the numbers, so I might be wrong, but you are the first person who has asserted that the delta between Trump and Hitlery in Wisconsin, Pennsylvania and a couple of other states is greater than the number of Stein voters. Easy to check, and I have been lazy: I haven’t checked the number.
Here’s your chance to prove your chops, Babe … empirical data could prove my argument wrong, or at least, well, arguable. “Hit me with the tire iron, Baby!” (trivia question, whence the quote?)
As regard “bullshit”, what’s your point? What’s your argument? If you have a logical / rational argument, why don’t you provide empirical data that demonstrates that I’m wrong? Or are you just flinging poo?
How old are you, anyway? Askin’ ‘cuz you sound like a 6yo.
“DemonCraps are entitled to anyone’s vote”: [ROFL]
1) did I say that? If so, please provide the quote. Generally speaking, putting words in others’ mouths is a losing proposition, because if I know what I said – and I (think I) do, then you’re not winning points when you tell me I said otherwise. Indeed, you look, uh, challenged. Special, even.
Because, y’know, I can always point out that I never said what you insist that I said.
2) “most would not vote for Hitlery”: I am embarrassed to suggest that this is a POOMA, because *of* *course* you have evidence for your assertion … but please be so kind as to provide that evidence, SVP.
Son, you are leading with your chin.
You might want to do something about that.
3) “I voted for Hitlery”: why, of course you did, Son. That’s why you are foaming at the mouth. [dryly]
I mean, srsly, if you voted for Hitlery, then you’re not a purity pony … in which case … help me out here? why are you defending purity ponies? Srsly, is this *all* you have?!?
Do you realize that you are making no sense whatsoever?
Not to put too fine a point on it, your assertion that you voted for Hitlery is not credible. What is with you Jill Stein peeps? You fulminate against Hitlery, but when you’re challenged, you say “I voted for Hitlery”.
Could you be so kind as to motivate your alleged vote for Hitlery? I mean, why should I believe you?
Does not compute, Child.
Why are you telling all of us that you voted for Hitlery … when very clearly you did not vote for Hitlery? And very clearly you have a guilty conscience?
Y’know? I have commented on narcissism in this forum (albeit under a different handle), and srsly, one of the primary indicators of extreme narcissism is self-contradiction.
Or “a lack of self-awareness”, but wevs, peeps.
You might consider talking to a therapist, or at a minimum checking out reputable online “am I a narcissist?” diagnostic tests. Should you wish for diagnostic information on NPD, well … IANAPsychologist, but I would be happy to provide you with reading materials that might help you diagnose your problem. (No need to thank me; the entire community benefits when narcissists grow up. [dryly])
Put differently: I can’t diagnose you because IANAShrink, but I can point you to multiple checklists that might help you realize that you are exhibiting beaucoup characteristically narcissistic behaviors.
Here and now … in the absence of any *empirical* *data* … you are not only unpersuasive, you are sabotaging the argument that you should be taken seriously.
I spent nearly two hours editing a response to your navel-gazing post … and you respond with emotive poo-flinging.
Y’know? Monkeys fling poo. What does your poo-flinging say about you?
Jes’ askin’. [dryly]
Wevs, doesn’t work for me. Can’t speak for the community, but guessing that poo-flinging doesn’t impress the community either.
Should you have substantive / objective observations, I feel sure (as a long-time lurker) that BJ commenters will be happy to provide feedback.
Perhaps even help you deal with your emotional immaturity. As I said in previous posts, responsibility for Donnie has to be a huge karmic burden for a person to shoulder.
Thank heavens I don’t carry that burden … but y’know? there was never a chance that I would.
Good luck carrying your karmic burden, Child. Hope it works out for ya …
And have a nice day. [/snark]
Dev Null
@NR: forgot to ask, poo-flinger: what are you doing to ward off the nuclear apocalypse?
Whining that you voted for Hitlery … sounds like.
Give me a reason to take you seriously.
Dev Null
[sighs] I spent an hour typing in a response and editing it ad nauseum. And it’s vanished without a trace.
Shorter: please provide empirical evidence for your assertions, because you sound like a 6yo who knows nothing but flinging poo.
Shorter: you appear to have cognitive / emotional issues. IANAShrink, but I’ve read a lot of lay pubs in this area, and would be happy to point you to self-eval materials.
Beyond that? Poo-flinging is not generally considered to be a rebuttal.
Jes’ sayin’.