Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Their freedom requires your slavery.

Wow, I can’t imagine what it was like to comment in morse code.

Insiders who complain to politico: please report to the white house office of shut the fuck up.

You can’t love your country only when you win.

Usually wrong but never in doubt

Incompetence, fear, or corruption? why not all three?

“woke” is the new caravan.

The next time the wall street journal editorial board speaks the truth will be the first.

Today’s GOP: why go just far enough when too far is right there?

Nothing worth doing is easy.

Optimism opens the door to great things.

JFC, are there no editors left at that goddamn rag?

When your entire life is steeped in white supremacy, equality feels like discrimination.

Sitting here in limbo waiting for the dice to roll

It may be funny to you motherfucker, but it’s not funny to me.

Within six months Twitter will be fully self-driving.

Too often we hand the biggest microphones to the cynics and the critics who delight in declaring failure.

You can’t attract Republican voters. You can only out organize them.

I’d like to think you all would remain faithful to me if i ever tried to have some of you killed.

Let’s not be the monsters we hate.

I’ve spoken to my cat about this, but it doesn’t seem to do any good.

A snarling mass of vitriolic jackals

When do we start airlifting the women and children out of Texas?

We still have time to mess this up!

You are here: Home / Economics / C.R.E.A.M. / Thursday Morning Open Thread: The Trump/Ryancare Rollout Is Progressing Not Necessarily to the GOP’s Advantage…

Thursday Morning Open Thread: The Trump/Ryancare Rollout Is Progressing Not Necessarily to the GOP’s Advantage…

by | 141 Comments

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… as the Emperor of Japan is reputed to have said, explaining the country’s surrender at the end of World War II.

What’s on the agenda as we slog through another day?
.

Reader Interactions

141Comments

  2. 2.

    Ceci n est pas mon nym

    It’s a very tiny silver lining, but one good thing that happens when Republicans actually expose their wish-lists to the public is that at least some people go from “oh come on, you’re exaggerating, they aren’t cartoon villains” to “holy shit, they really are cartoon villains”

    Kill Meals on Wheels to buy more bombs? Raise Granny’s insurance premiums by $8000? They really proposed that stuff? Yes, Virginia, they really did.

    @rikyrah: Good morning!

  3. 3.

    p.a.

    Good morning.

    Trump Aides Are Privately Blaming The Health Care Bill’s Problems On Paul Ryan

    These aides can’t have told this to Little Lord tRumpleroy because the blame won’t stay private then.

  4. 4.

    amk

    Odd that none of the thugs are using the term Obamacare any more.

    And that dems usual gobbledygook – wtf was that? Just say the rethugs owe the people a cheap and full coverage healthcare plan as they promised during the campaign. Make them own it. Instead of playing yourself as martyrs for the cause, ffs.

  5. 5.

    Frankensteinbeck

    I would rather this be Ryancare. People need to absorb that Trump is not a fluke. The whole Republican Party are sadists and white supremacists.

  7. 7.

    Baud

    @Ceci n est pas mon nym:

    at least some people go from “oh come on, you’re exaggerating, they aren’t cartoon villains” to “holy shit, they really are cartoon villains”

    Precious few. It’s an persistent problem.

  8. 8.

    Cermet

    The thugs have already won the war; the ACA is in a death spiral since there is no reason for anyone except the very sick or those with pre-existing conditions to sign up. This is driving health care insurance premiums to significantly go up for all of us. This will only get worse now the (far too small) penalty that did exist has been removed. tRump and the thugs have effectively mortally wounded ACA and unless the dems can convince the thugs to repair it, the situation will get far worse. Then, maybe, with enough pressure, a fix can occur but I am not holding my breath that the thugs will save it; rather, let it continue to go down to failure.

  9. 9.

    David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch

    Trumpcare is a TOTAL DISASTER!

    Weak! No energy! Bad ratings!

    Will be cancelled – mark my words!

    Sad!

  12. 12.

    David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch

    Donald J. Trump @realDonaldJTrump

    Paul Ryan works really hard but is a guy who just doesn’t have it–a total loser!
    3:58 AM – 16 Mar 2017

  13. 13.

    David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch

    Donald J. Trump @realDonaldJTrump

    Paul Ryan is a totally overrated clown who speaks without knowing the facts.

    3:59 AM – 16 Mar 2017

  14. 14.

    David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch

    Donald J. Trump @realDonaldTrump

    Paul Ryan is a totally overrated clown who speaks without knowing the facts.

    3:59 AM – 16 Mar 2017

  15. 15.

    Elizabelle

    @rikyrah: Good morning rikyrah. Good morning, everyone.

    If this healthcare rollout damages Paul Ryan’s reputation (which is undeservedly high), that’s good. Nicholas Kristof (FTFNYT) apparently takes some whacks at him this morning. Column is “And Jesus Said Unto Paul of Ryan.”

  16. 16.

    debbie

    Not only will this tear apart the GOP (a very good thing), it will end the canards that government should be run like a business and that a CEO can be effective as a president.

  21. 21.

    Lapassionara

    @debbie: someone at his Nashville rally said to a reporter just yesterday, “I’ve always heard that government should be run like a business, and here is our chance.” Don’t know if even Trump will end that lie.

  22. 22.

    Elizabelle

    Roger Daltry might be doing more for cancer patients than congressional Republicans.

    LA Times: Why Roger Daltrey is building ‘chill out zones’ for teens with cancer

    … the founder and lead singer of the Who, alongside band-mate Pete Townshend, is championing the emotional well-being of teens diagnosed with cancer. Specifically: Setting up teen-centered units in hospitals, complete with flat-screen TVs, video games, a “chill out zone,” digital jukebox, pool tables and computer-equipped study lounges.

    …. Why this cause?

    I see the simplicity of it. In the medical system, there are either children or adults. And anyone who has had any dealings with kids will know that when they turn into teenagers, it’s a totally different kettle of fish. Teens with cancer were also going through the emotional trauma of being put with children, or even in the geriatric ward.

    What’s the strategy?

    Initially to get into some of the most prestigious hospitals in America. It took us two years to get a foot in the door at Memorial Sloan Kettering [Cancer Center in New York City] but we have a fabulous space in there now. Once the hospitals see the difference this makes in the treatment of this group, more are coming onboard. We want to be in every hospital in the country.

    Why has it been a challenge getting it off the ground?

    We thought it would be relatively easy over here. This is a benevolent, altruistic country. We’ve got 70 hospitals in the U.S. that want to work with us, but the fight to get funding is proving more difficult than we thought. It’s easy to raise money for children. Much harder to raise it for teens.

    What are the centers like?

    They are very cool. Our architects work with the teenagers directly. They’ve got the big screen TV with everything, but they also like the quiet spaces where they can keep their education up. And everything is always open, 24 hours a day. They can unload their problems with someone else who has been diagnosed, or going through treatments. They get the support of one another and it’s enormously helpful to recovery. You put these teens together, and it becomes a happier place to be.

  24. 24.

    bystander

    Love the video of Nashville rally yesterday. There’s nothing like people assembling to admire Twitler to the strains of “You Can’t Always Get What You Want”.

  25. 25.

    David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch

    Philip Ruckert @PhilipRucker

    Trump’s budget has massive cuts to the arts, science, the poor and foreign aid

    Retweets
    126
    Likes
    60

    12:06 AM – 16 Mar 2017

    Joe Scarborough‏ @JoeNBC

    This is more of the same Washington idiocy:
    1. Slash spending that cripples investments in our country
    2. Explode America’s crippling debt.

    73 replies 240 retweets 459 likes

    Joe Scarborough‏ @JoeNBC 8h8 hours ago

    What’s Russian for “Titanic”?

    181 replies 276 retweets 597 likes

  28. 28.

    Waspuppet

    @p.a.: And yet, like Wile E. Coyote, it doesn’t matter how many times they faceplant off a cliff. Come Sunday morning, there they all are on TV again, with a fascinated host giving a respectful hearing to their totally fresh new thinking.

  29. 29.

    Snarki, child of Loki

    Among the joys of watching GOPers cannibalize each other over health care is the thought of harvesting their remaining organs to save lives.

    And hearing the weak, fading voices of Zombies starving to death, whispering “braaaains?”

  30. 30.

    ThresherK

    @Elizabelle: Jesus said unto Paul Ryan? Oooh, Douthat’s gonna be so mad that Jesus is two-timing him with Kristof.

    Douthat is the personification of that joke about God being quiet outside the Catholic’s door in Heaven, because the Catholics think they’re the only ones up there.

  31. 31.

    Patricia Kayden

    @Frankensteinbeck: “RepublicanCare” has an even better ring to it. This health care fiasco is what the Republicans think the American people deserve and they are fine with 24 million less of their fellow Americans having access to health care.

    Cold blooded bastards.

  33. 33.

    David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch

    (((Yair Rosenberg)))‏Verified account @Yair_Rosenberg Mar 14

    As Trump nominates his fifth Goldman Sachs official, let us take a moment to remember the wrongest take of 2016:

    Edward Snowden @Snowden

    2016: A choice between Donald Trump and Goldman Sachs

    8:07 PM – 27 Feb 2016

    677 replies 23,180 retweets 40,653 likes

  34. 34.

    OzarkHillbilly

    Not that this will shock any one here, but today’s GOP in a nutshell, putting the misery back in Missouri:

    Citing a budget shortfall that’s forcing tough choices, House lawmakers gave initial approval on Wednesday to the repeal of a tax credit for low-income seniors and Missourians with disabilities who rent their homes.

    Raise taxes on the rich or corporations?? No, no, nononono…. We must raise taxes on the people who can least afford it. And why must we raise their taxes?

    Under the budget Greitens sent to legislators in February, as many as 21,000 elderly and disabled Missourians could be booted out of nursing home and home care programs, saving the state more than $50 million through tougher eligibility requirements.

    Really? I mean, REALLY???

    Still, they said on the House floor, it’s not a vote anyone is eager to take. “We can only play with the cards we have been dealt,” said Rep. Justin Alferman, R-Hermann, who co-chairs the House budget committee.

    Hey Asshole, you’re dealing the cards from a deck you stacked.

    Democrats and some Republicans balked at the proposal, saying the credit — an average of $535 annually — helped keep seniors and people with disabilities in their homes and out of nursing facilities so they can live independently. Some called on the Legislature to instead revisit economic development tax credits helping corporations and companies “that can provide for themselves.”

    “This is the credit we go after?” said Rep. Brandon Ellington, D-Kansas City. “This is moralistically wrong.”

    What is coming out of the Misery House budget committee is head and shoulders above what Greitens wanted to do and probably will do in the end. (MO govs have the power to unilaterally cut spending if there is a budget shortfall)(hint: there is ALWAYS a budget shortfall)

  35. 35.

    rikyrah

    @amk:
    It’s simple, Dems. Once again for the bleacher seats;
    1. Always call it Trumpcare
    2. Always remind folks that 24 MILLION will lose their insurance
    3. Those 24 MILLION will lose insurance so that rich people can get a tax cut
    4. This is an AGE TAX

    See?
    Not so hard.

  36. 36.

    Jazzman

    @bystander: As with “Born In The USA”, when the RWNJs appropriate a pop song they almost always get it wrong. Trump’s theme ought to be “Sympathy For The Devil” (“Please allow me to introduce myself / I’m a man of wealth and taste”…Bigly!!)

  37. 37.

    Patricia Kayden

    @David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch: Joe Scarborough should ask Trump how to say words in Russian. He was so far up Trump’s butt during the election cycle that he was practically in Trump’s head. It’s so convenient that he is only now distancing himself from Trump after championing him before last November. Who is he fooling?

  42. 42.

    George

    @Frankensteinbeck: Call it TrumpRyanCare, a plan supported by the GOP. I don’t know why people are reluctant to call it what it is. We CAN smear two turds with one stone, you know.

  43. 43.

    Kay

    Healthcare reform is a political loser. Obama got it done but boy did he and Democrats pay a high price. They got zero political payback for covering all those low income people and middle class people got all pissed off and cranky because they either thought it was “unfair” or were convinced they were losing something.

    No one wants to pay what it costs. Democrats want to shift the costs and spread them over a larger group and Republicans want to pretend the costs just vanish into thin air. Democrats have the better argument because it at least admits it has to be paid for, BY SOMEONE, but every post-FDR President who tried it has either failed or (like Obama) succeeded but taken a huge political hit.

    You would think Trump would have stayed away from it. People said when Obama started with it that he should have focused on the economy and although I supported Obamacare I have to say it DID make more sense to start with “jobs”, politically.

    This is a very difficult thing to do, reforming health care! Bill and Hillary Clinton failed at it. Obama succeeded but he got no political benefit and paid a huge political price. I actually admire Obama and Democrats for doing it because I think they knew it wouldn’t benefit them politically.

  45. 45.

    Patricia Kayden

    @bystander: And love how Trump and his people ignore the Rolling Stones’ request that their song not be used for Trump-related functions. So respectful.

  46. 46.

    Mike J

    I thought pnh was usually pretty smart. Dem hating brain eaters of the left claim another victim?

  49. 49.

    OzarkHillbilly

    It’s hard to read this with anything other than horror:

    A 10-year-old poodle/Yorkshire terrier mix female dog that had been stabbed 19 times was being cared for Wednesday by the Humane Society of Missouri after she was rescued from a church in north St. Louis County.

    Police took a woman in custody in the attack on the dog, St. Louis County Police spokesman Benjamin Granda said.

    And then I read this:

    “The suspect is an 18-year-old female and she will be referred to the mental illness court,” Granda said.

    You know the first thing that popped into my head. The lack of a mugshot all but confirms it.

  52. 52.

    Patricia Kayden

    @Kay: What the Republicans want to do is destroy the ACA and they’ll succeed at doing that by eliminating the mandate and tax provisions. They have no intention of replacing the ACA with anything remotely as good (and I acknowledge that the ACA was flawed and needed fixing up). Trump’s plan to let the ACA die a natural death and then blame the Democrats seems like a political winner for Republicans except that they’ve been on record trying to kill the ACA for years now. Only hardcore Republican voters wouldn’t admit that if the ACA dies, it would be Republicans’ fault.

  53. 53.

    Aleta

    How can Republicans promise to increase working class jobs and then reduce health care and funding for public trans? Answer: They need unemployment and poor people to keep low wage workers in line.

    I suspect one problem they had with the ACA was that it allows more worker mobility. And less debt. It’s as though the credit card/debt industry has become in effect like the company store, keeping workers trapped in place, never able to clear their debt or negotiate for better.

  54. 54.

    amk

    bbc with scaremongering muslims are coming !!! fp piece with auto playing vid and all.

    well, christians have had two millennia to do their own killings, now it’s only fair for other religious nutz to do the same.

  55. 55.

    rikyrah

    @Kay:
    Should the stimulus have been bigger?
    Yes. But, I remember that time. I remember that we didn’t quite understand that the GOP had decided on Economic treason against this country. Plus, we still had Democratic turds like Max Baucus to contend with on our side .
    I am thankful for Obamacare. I am thankful that it provided a sense of peace for over 20 million Americans.

  58. 58.

    Kay

    @Baud:

    People say “single payer” but you’d have to put limits on single payer or back it with up with catastrophic insurance and OMG if payroll taxes went up and single payer was worse than what people have thru their employer that would be a political disaster too. It’s a loser. Kasich actually got hurt by Obamacare. He has to support the Medicaid expansion because he knows full well how many white rural people benefit but it killed him in the primary because his base were furious that poor people got “free” healthcare and they were paying 90 dollars a pay period or whatever.

    Trump must be mad as hell he got stuck with it. He should have stuck to going to factories and pretending they were hiring people because he made them. He said yesterday that he didn’t want to do it- he wanted to cut taxes- but his tax cuts will be a political loser too.

  59. 59.

    Lapassionara

    @debbie: not to mention that government does not exist to make make a profit for its shareholders. At any event, we all know that the drive for efficiency in business usually means doing the same jobs with fewer people, which leads to crappy customer service. The federal hiring freeze means doing fewer jobs, with fewer people, so fewer day care workers on military bases, and the like. So, result is not just crappy customer service, but fewer places for babies in those day care centers, or shorter hours the center is open. And a non functioning State Department, etc.

  60. 60.

    Baud

    @Kay:

    if payroll taxes went up and single payer was worse than what people have thru their employer

    That would almost certainly happen, at least for many people, no?

  61. 61.

    NotMax

    As accomplished a Speaker as he was candidate for veep?

    Nature abhors a vacuum, so there’s got to be something between his ears. What is an open question.

  62. 62.

    Baud

    Back to the topic, Reuters says they are negotiating with the Freedom Caucus to make the bill even harsher in order to find the votes.

  64. 64.

    Kay

    @rikyrah:

    I don’t know enough about the stimulus to say it should have been bigger. I’m fine with Paul Krugman but I feel like liberals idolize him and ignore when he’s wrong. Didn’t he say we would have “zombie banks” ? What happened to that? I’m impatient generally with counterfactuals. I’m suspicious of them because they’re always treated as if they have been proved right and I just don’t buy that trying one thing proves another thing “right”. I’d have to see the other thing in action to say that conclusively. Single payer works for old people because there’s a huge group of people paying in for decades and not using Medicare. That wouldn’t be true if we put a huge group of young people on it. It’s expensive. Someone has to pay for it OR you’d have to limit it in some way or put insurance behind it.

  65. 65.

    Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism

    @Baud: You probably wouldn’t have if you’re not in the SF fan or writers communities. He’s one of former WorldNetDaily columnist Theodore Beale’s boogymen.

  66. 66.

    Elizabelle

    Given that the GOP opposed him at every turn on “jobs creation” (other than military) and infrastructure spending, I thought it was brilliant that Obama went for healthcare first.

    (1) The nature of work has changed. Lots of people in the “gig” economy, and hard for young people to get a start.

    (2) Healthcare IS a jobs program. Very hands on. I don’t know why that did not get more play.

    (3) Focus on preventative care. It’s insane to have large swathes of the population with inadequate or no healthcare, and then “hello 65 and Medicare.”

    (4) Frees up worker mobility — you could leave a substandard job, and still have healthcare.

    Very Christian thing for a Kenyan Muslim and demon Democrats to do. I think “blame” will turn to “credit” before too long, particularly as the GOP scares more and more Americans. They’re insane, cruel and stupid. Short-sighted and unpatriotic too.

  67. 67.

    NotMax

    @Baud

    “How about ‘More for bombs, less for moms?'”

    “Um, we’ll table that one for now. Anyone else got a slogan?”

  68. 68.

    Mike J

    @Baud:

    I don’t think I’ve heard of him.

    SciFi editor, not afraid to speak on political issues, generally leftish. He saw the innocuous Pelosi quote about working with Republicans blah blah blah and decided this was the worstest treason evar even though she explicitly said we wouldn’t compromise on the things that are important to us. And when it was pointed out to him how stupid he was being, he doubled down rather than admit a mistake. It became a minor thing on twitter.

  69. 69.

    Aleta

    @Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism:

    Patrick Nielsen Hayden

    That stuff yesterday could be used as an example of how our brains only want to accept information that fits into our existing belief. And then shut out incoming evidence that we made a mistake, rather than change our belief.

  71. 71.

    Keith P.

    I’m watching Colbert’s show from last night, and he really did skewer Rachel Maddow. Really captured her epic (EPIC) longwindedness, which was front and center with the tax reveal.

  72. 72.

    Kay

    @Baud:

    I don’t know if it would be “worse”. I have what is considered “good” health insurance and the (thankfully few) times I have used it I have paid quite a bit out of pocket- several thousand dollars. My youngest had elaborate eye treatment and surgery (he was born with a defect in his left eye) and all told it was about 7k out of pocket. Same kid had a complex bone break w/surgery and that was 3k. This is with good insurance.

  76. 76.

    Patricia Kayden

    @Elizabelle:

    Given that the GOP opposed him at every turn on “jobs creation” (other than military) and infrastructure spending, I thought it was brilliant that Obama went for healthcare first.

    Plus a record number of jobs were created under President Obama so he left a legacy of a lower unemployment rate and a 70+ month streak of job growth. Healthcare will be President Obama’s greatest achievement although Republicans will work overtime to destroy the ACA.

  77. 77.

    Baud

    @Kay: People keep saying “single payer” like a talisman, but the devil is in the benefit design and financing scheme.

  79. 79.

    Shalimar

    @Frankensteinbeck: I want this version to be Ryancare, because Ryan will be out within a month and they will have to do this again or their base will rebel. We can call the next round Trumpcare.

    They think they’re scared to meet the public now when Democratic voters are swarming their town halls. Imagine how much worse it will be for Republican Congress members when even their private conference calls with their most loyal supporters are filled with angry people demanding some legislation.

  80. 80.

    Kay

    @Elizabelle:

    I agree but it is a POLITICAL loser. It explains a lot, actually. That’s why no one did it before him.

    The funniest part of the health care fight (to me) was when Rahm Emanuel saw the writing on the wall and panicked- he said they should scale it back dramatically. That was a POLITICAL calculation and he would be the one to make one of those! :)

  81. 81.

    Kay

    @Elizabelle:

    A big part of the reason it’s a political loser is that college-educated people have health insurance. Huge percentage. They immediately grip it tighter when anyone says “reform”. I was calling registered Democrats in the 2010 election and the most frequent “concern” I got was would Obamacare somehow take something away from people who were insured. I don’t think I spoke to a single uninsured person.

  82. 82.

    NotMax

    @Aleta

    Unfortunately for our side, “At long last, have you no shame?” doesn’t easily fit on a baseball (or knit) cap.

  84. 84.

    1,000 Flouncing Lurkers (was fidelioscabinet)

    @Mike J: He has a tendency to get obstinate when he’s wrong in public, realizes he’s been wrong in public, and can’t figure out how to back down gracefully. He’s not the only one on the left, or the right, or anywhere else on the political spectrum who tends to this, but when he does it, it tends to get noisy.

  85. 85.

    Aleta

    @Kay: Ah Rahm; he pushed NAFTA, the crime bill, three strikes, helped lose the House in 1994. Maybe he had a hand in dropping health care back then too.

  86. 86.

    clay

    @David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch:

    Donald J. Trump @realDonaldTrump

    Paul Ryan is a totally overrated clown who speaks without knowing the facts.

    3:59 AM – 16 Mar 2017

    Holy shit, is he for real?!? What on earth does he think he can possibly accomplish by getting into a pissing match with the one person responsible for passing his agenda in the House?

  89. 89.

    OzarkHillbilly

    @Patricia Kayden:

    Republicans will work overtime to destroy the ACA.

    Yes, but the conversation has changed. Now they *have* to do it without throwing 24 million out of their insurance.

    (obviously they can do whatever they want, but they will pay political price for throwing 24 M off, apparently a big price, and that is just the shorthand version of what they want to do)

  90. 90.

    Elizabelle

    @Kay: RE the lack of empathy among the college-educated with good health insurance: Yeah. That’s true, and it’s sad.

  91. 91.

    Kay

    Trump also said he would “reform” trade. If he thinks health care is hard wait until he has to deal with other countries!

    Go boss around those Canadian ag interests. Good luck! He’s not the boss of them.

    I’m hoping he just finds these things too hard and ends up with like Ivanka’s half ass childcare plan, which the base will hate and liberals will also hate. David Brooks might like it.

  92. 92.

    clay

    @David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch:

    Joe Scarborough‏ @JoeNBC

    This is more of the same Washington idiocy:
    1. Slash spending that cripples investments in our country
    2. Explode America’s crippling debt.

    C’mon Joe, you know it’s not “Washington” idiocy. There’s only one group in Washington that does both of these things. (HINT: It’s your political party.)

    Don’t know if you guys saw this one, but after Joe speculated that Trump leaked his own tax return, he got a tweet from Trump’s lawyer to watch his big mouth. Joe gave a pretty good smackdown:

    Joe Scarborough‏Verified account @JoeNBC

    And by the way “attorney”:

    1. Read the First Amendment
    2. Save your dumb thug routine for someone who gives a damn.

  94. 94.

    Kay

    @Elizabelle:

    I don’t think it’s lack of empathy. They make like 50k a year in Ohio. They don’t have any more to spend on health care. I felt it was a valid fear. Obama did too, really. He spent 3/4’s of his time reassuring middle class people they wouldn’t get hurt. They’re risk-averse and they should be. The only people who are comfortable with risk are the very poor and the very rich. One group has nothing to lose and the other is insulated. The thing I’m maddest at Trump voters for is that they took a risk they can’t bear. It’s dumb.

  98. 98.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    I for one am shocked, shocked, that a pack of dogma spewing grand standers are incapable of even doing the one thing they all agree on.

    Tax reform in doubt, how about getting a budget passed to keep the government open?

  100. 100.

    clay

    Ah. I thought that was too stupid a thing to say, even for Trump. I was thrown because the other tweets he posted *were* real.

  102. 102.

    Full Metal Wingnut

    @Kay:

    “No one wants to pay what it costs. Democrats want to shift the costs and spread them over a larger group.”

    Uh yes…that would be Democrats…paying what it costs. Instant self-refutation much?

  104. 104.

    low-tech cyclist

    @POTUS to pool on ACA: “We will get something through. We’re going to mix it up, we’re going to come up with something. We always do”

    He’s been in office less than eight weeks, and those eight weeks have been a sequence of minor to middlin’ fuckups, train wrecks, and embarrassments. There is no ‘always’ when he’s succeeded in ‘coming up with something’ in this arena.

    So now he’ll have his first major fuckup.

  106. 106.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    @David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch: heheh Trump such a useless twat he can’t even wait tell after the failure to start blaming people.

    I have to say Trump and Ryan are the perfect team in a Republican majority government, if one is a Democrat. Talk about the embodiment every liberal critic of the Right. Donald Trump, just like Ronald Regan, but without the charm, speaking presence and intelligence (and yes I am quite aware that Regan wasn’t all that bright, but Regan was at lest smart enough enough to know what he didn’t know, which is more than can be said for The Twat).

  107. 107.

    low-tech cyclist

    @bystander:

    Love the video of Nashville rally yesterday. There’s nothing like people assembling to admire Twitler to the strains of “You Can’t Always Get What You Want”.

    But if you try sometime,
    you just might find,
    you get really screwed!

  108. 108.

    1,000 Flouncing Lurkers (was fidelioscabinet)

    @ThresherK: I think she must be the Blessed Ann, because I’m sure plenty of people blessed her name over the years when she was alive…

  109. 109.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    @Kay:

    Healthcare reform is a political loser.

    It’s also a matter of necessity for society. It’s a loser because a huge chunk of the population grew up eating lead based paint, thinks with a TV and is now well into their second childhoods. Ironically this also means then need health care the most.

  110. 110.

    msdc

    @Kay:

    People said when Obama started with it that he should have focused on the economy and although I supported Obamacare I have to say it DID make more sense to start with “jobs”, politically.

    Norm Ornstein had a good answer for that a couple of years ago: Obama did start with jobs and the economy, and he moved on to health care because the Clinton example showed the perils of waiting too long to pass a major policy change. Hell, Obamacare almost waited too long as it was, after Kennedy’s death and the Scott Brown debacle.

  112. 112.

    BellyCat

    (Crossposting for those who don’t peruse the On The Road thread)

    Six days after limping into O’Reilly’s Autoparts store — with a tire whose sidewall was chewed up after only 10 miles after our second blowout in two days — we bid the superb staff (and neighborhood panhandlers) a tearful goodbye.

    True, it’s not the destination that provides the greatest rewards. But, if the journey is to be fully savored, I recommend mechanical breakdowns in shady parts of town. They are FAR more interesting than any part of sprawl-urbia. I lost count, but dozens of people, both with and without teeth, stopped by (and several more than oncet, as they say ’round here) to check in or offer help, tools, ideas, connections, a place to shower, and good ol’ fashioned head scratching. And they ALL had a story to share.

    This (mis)adventure deserves a more thoughtful reflection than time or smartypants phone permits — need to be in Tucson by Saturday nite — but here are a few visuals:

    Becci was an angel sent by FSM, inviting us to loiter (apparently indefinitely) in their parking lot. Fun, resourceful, and best of all, a smartass.

    MommaCat was a champ, tirelessly behbeh-wrangling, and BellyKitteh was ever-helpful when he tired of his attempts to play in traffic.

    Two tires, six leafspring bushings, a cracked frame, and a generator fire later, we rolled out at 10:00 pm, Thurs nite.

    220 miles down the road so far and our beloved 60 year old Silver Suppository is actually holding together!

  113. 113.

    1,000 Flouncing Lurkers (was fidelioscabinet)

    @Southern Beale: It’s a shame things weren’t better coordinated for the protests; we’re out of practice here. This is the first presidential visit I can think of in a long time where the people involved thought getting entangled in downtown Nashville was a good idea, although if you can’t fill the Municipal Auditorium (9700 seats at its largest capacity), you’re either too big for the clubs but not ready for the stadiums, or you’re on your way out and your manager hates to break the news to you. If you can’t fill it with free tickets, well…

    It’s my understanding that one group or protesters shouted down a Trump supporter by chanting “Bless your heart!”, which may be the most Nashville thing I’ve seen in a while. Of course, that line isn’t always a polite damnation; but the contexts in which I’ve heard it used positively are either things like “Oh, you made Nana a picture! Bless your heart, honey, let’s put it up on the refrigerator here!” or “Oh, you made me chocolate truffles! Bless your heart, you didn’t have to do that!”, which makes the pejorative use burn even more. It’s such an intimate diss.

  114. 114.

    rikyrah

    They have the White House.
    They have both parts of the Legislative Branch.
    They can pass what they want.

    Trumpcare is who they are.
    Taking away insurance from 24 million people.
    Giving a massive tax cut to the rich
    Making the old fend for themselves,

    THIS IS WHO THEY ARE.

    It’s who folks like me have been saying forever that this is who they are.
    But, it’s unvarnished now.
    No confusion.
    and, watching these muthaphuckas try and defend it?

    Sociopaths. The entire lot of them.

  115. 115.

    The Simp in the Suit

    @Cermet: THIS is absolutely true. This is a no-lose situation for the Republicans. They’ll take some heat, but the ACA is being killed. As it slowly dies, they will just keep repeating that it is dying all on its own, that it was flawed from day one, and that even with all their hard work, they couldn’t save it.

    And about 50% of voters will nod their heads in agreement. They’ve been trained well.

  117. 117.

    Kay

    @msdc:

    Thanks. I get it. I know why he had to do it early. I just think any health care “reform” carries huge political risks because they’re over-laying it on an existing system and there are trade-offs.

    There will always, always be a large group of people who say “this harmed me”. People also lie about it and use it as an excuse to hate the politician. I have had people say to me that Obamacare put their “small business” OUT of business because they had to provide health insurance. That’s just a lie. I have two employees and we didn’t “have” to do anything for them. I don’t know why their small business failed but it wasn’t Obamacare. Frankly, I don’t even know if they had a small business. I feel like there are a lot of Joe the Fake Plumbers out there.

  118. 118.

    Kay

    Manchin said people in his state don’t “know where” they got Medicaid but they will know who took it away.

    This to me seems like a huge failure of Manchin. Christ, buddy. Why don’t your constituents know who helped them? What do you do all day? Is he ashamed? Is it a secret?

  119. 119.

    MomSense

    @Kay:

    The thing is that healthcare is the economy. When the number one cause for bankruptcies is medical debt. When people had to choose between paying the mortgage and chemo treatments. When GM was saying it had to lay people off and cut salaries because $1,200 of every car that rolled out of the factory was health care cost. When healthcare spending is 1/5 of your economy and it still leaves so many people out, you have to deal with it. I’m sorry but there was no focusing on jobs and the economy without healthcare reform.

  121. 121.

    Jeffro

    I’m sure I’m not the first to note this or call it by this name, but the Trumpov budget is the quintessential Billionaires’ Budget. Cut all the services that most of the public wants/needs, the stuff that makes a huge difference in people’s lives and the life of our country, dramatically ramp up on defense (as only huge existential threats can possibly touch these folks). All while cutting taxes for the very wealthy and cutting Medicare & Medicaid.

    Yup. Billionaires’ Budget it is. Or Peak Wingnut, if you prefer.

  122. 122.

    rikyrah

    @Kay:

    Manchin said people in his state don’t “know where” they got Medicaid but they will know who took it away.

    This to me seems like a huge failure of Manchin. Christ, buddy. Why don’t your constituents know who helped them? What do you do all day? Is he ashamed? Is it a secret?

    Same way folks actually believed that Kynect didn’t equal Obamacare. You are right. It is the fault of the Democratic Politicians trying to be too cute by half.

    You got Medicaid because of Obamacare. Say it, muthaphucka.

  123. 123.

    Aleta

    @BellyCat: Nice tale and good adventure writing. I admire your abilities with the airstream. They look so cool. In my experience it’s true about the strangers who are most likely to give help and kindly keep one company.

  124. 124.

    FlipYrWhig

    @Kay:

    There will always, always be a large group of people who say “this harmed me”.

    People in general seem very susceptible to thinking a large group of people must be functionally equivalent to “almost everyone.” I definitely do it too: I see Trump on TV with people cheering behind him and I think “why is everyone there such an idiot”? But you don’t really need THAT many people cheering behind you to make it look like a lot. (Trump pretty clearly falls into this trap from the other side, believing that everyone loves him because _the people he sees_ do.)

  125. 125.

    hovercraft

    I am shocked by the tone of these tweets, why have the villagers turned so negative on TRyancare?
    Is this not what the media has been telling us the “people” want for 7 years, a more market friendly smaller role for government, lower cost solution than Obamacare? I’m confused. Because I think it’s what this proposal is, a return to the good old days with a sprinkling of tax cuts for the rich on top and some buzz words.
    Obama and the democrats were spendthrifts who blew up the deficit, and destroyed the economy, but somehow all the cuts in the budget proposal not withstanding, the proposed tax cuts will explode it and all the media budget hawks have stopped squawking.
    @Jeffro:

    Yup. Billionaires’ Budget it is. Or Peak Wingnut, if you prefer.

    Like unicorn’s peak wingnut is a fairy tale, it doesn’t exist, there are always new heights or depths to scale depending on your perspective.

  126. 126.

    MattF

    Trump will try to ‘solve’ his healthcare problem with bluster, bullying, and lying… as usual, but it will, as usual, become clearer that bluster, bullying, and lying is all he’s got. My guess is that most of his supporters will continue to hang on… he’s all they’ve got. But support will erode this time, and will continue to erode in the future.

    It’s not terrifically exciting, but all those other Trumpian lies– on tax reform, on infrastructure, on trade… will all be revealed as time goes on. It’s a long-term project.

    ETA: And, oh yeah, Russia.

  127. 127.

    Tenar Arha

    @clay: He instinctively understands that Ryan is a separate power base. By treating Ryan as an enemy he has his necessary target (he always needs a target), while added benefit, he eliminates a check on his power as the President.

    Whether he knows it or not, he’s trying to run the government like a family firm, and acting as a wrecker towards the branches because he really is/does want to be able to act like an authoritarian kleptocrat. (Because Dolt 45 really does see the Presidency as telling others what to do & not that the President serves the country).

  128. 128.

    hovercraft

    @Kay:

    This to me seems like a huge failure of Manchin. Christ, buddy. Why don’t your constituents know who helped them? What do you do all day? Is he ashamed? Is it a secret?

    To take credit he would have to admit he worked with he who shall not be mentioned. Remember many of these people hated Obama with a passion, he made the calculation that distancing himself from Obama was more important than explaining to his constituents that they were all beneficiaries of Obamacare. Dumb calculation because as we learned in both midterms, the GOP will tag all democrats with the Obama “taint”, regardless of how far they run from him, better to just own it and say we disagree on energy/coal but we’ve worked together to bring you healthcare and specifically for you, coverage for Black Lung.

  129. 129.

    Aleta

    @MomSense: The way Republicans ignore the connection between health care and employment and productivity drives me up a wall.

    Health care makes it possible for people to stay employed (fewer sick days and faster rehab), and have good records for advancement. It helps the unemployed get back in the job market. For a company, it increases worker productivity. Their employees who care for children or people with disabilities or parents at home need less time off. There’s less stress and conflict in a workplace when employees have mental health coverage.

  130. 130.

    germy

    @FlipYrWhig:

    I see Trump on TV with people cheering behind him and I think “why is everyone there such an idiot”? But you don’t really need THAT many people cheering behind you to make it look like a lot.

    I saw a clip this morning. What I find dispiriting is how young so many of the supporters are. They look half-bright, but they’re young and they know how to vote.

    Which is why it bugs me when people comment here “After all the olds die out we’ll see a return to progressivism, because only old people are conservatives” etc.

  131. 131.

    hovercraft

    Did I miss something?
    They were hacked, or since they are based in Illinois Obama’s “Deep State” at work?

    McDonald’s Beefs With Donald Trump On Twitter
    Et tu, McDonald’s?

    McDonald’s corporate Twitter account sent a rather negative message to noted fast food lover President Donald Trump Thursday morning, calling him a “disgusting excuse for a President” and insulting his hands.

    @realDonaldTrump You are actually a disgusting excuse
    of a President and we would love to have @BarackObama back, also you have tiny hands

    The tweet was deleted around 9:30 a.m. ET with no immediate explanation. McDonald’s did not immediately respond to TPM’s request for comment.

    The tweet might come as a shock to President Trump, who is a noted lover of McDonald’s.

    “I’m a very clean person. I like cleanliness. I think you’re better off going there than someplace you have no idea where the food is coming from. It’s a certain standard,” Trump told Anderson Cooper. “The one thing about the big franchises: one bad hamburger, you can destroy McDonald’s. One bad hamburger, you take Wendy’s and all these other places and they’re out of business.”

    For the record, his preferred meal is the Filet of Fish.

  132. 132.

    Barbara

    @Baud: Yep. But I think Trump misjudges in thinking that because someone doesn’t go mano a mano they are weak. Ryan has vinegar for blood. He will happily take a million insults if he gets tax cuts for the wealthy he so evidently worships. Unlike Trump, Ryan is disciplined and not easily distracted. Ryan is the tortoise and Trump is the hare in this race.

  133. 133.

    MattF

    @hovercraft: I guess someone briefly took over McD’s Twitter account. Possibly an inside job, which would be a headache for McD. Not a huge deal. Not a huuuuge deal, either.

  135. 135.

    catclub

    Another reason Trump won’t want to belabor healthcare: polling is brutal.

    35% approve/55% disapprove his handling of hc, per new Fox poll

    Of course, in that Fox news poll there is a large fraction on the right that think he isn’t destroying enough, fast enough.

    Similar to ACA disapproval by those on the left.

  137. 137.

    Kay

    @hovercraft:

    In some ways selling the benefits would be (to me) the best part of the job. They should be shameless about it- I would brag it up all the time if I had done it and I was in a white low income rural state. I don’t know why Democrats don’t talk up SCHIP more. It’s huge! Millions of low income children have access to regular health care ONLY because of Democrats. That’s a great accomplishment.

  138. 138.

    Elie

    @MomSense:
    Preach it sister!

    And yeah, the Repubs and Trump may kill ACA and Medicaid but they will own it and all the very serious economic impacts. This will impact their people, major employers, and will not be evenly distributed so some regions will have profound impacts. When they lob on the tax changes and program cuts we are going to have catastrophes pretty quickly. These ideologues are stupid beyond words

  140. 140.

    Miss Bianca

    @Kay: Someone in one of the overnight threads thought I had posted a link to this article…I hadn’t, but I read it, and liked it so much that I’m going to repost it here:

    The Lessons of Obamacare:

    or, What Republicans Should Have Learned, But Haven’t

  141. 141.

    artem1s

    @Kay: Health care reform was, I believe, his promise to a dying Ted Kennedy. I think Obama was a brave man for sticking to that promise.

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