Anyone watching? I can’t — I’m busy, plus I can’t stand the sight of Comey’s puffy-eyed mug, even if he is confirming that the FBI is investigating the Trump campaign’s Russia ties. Comey is a piece of shit. I hope he’s the piece of shit who brings down Trump. But he’ll always be a piece of shit, regardless of present and future actions, for his unforgivable grandstanding in the 2016 election.
I’m also not going to watch the Gorsuch hearings because I have no desire to witness Grand Theft, Supreme Court Seat on live TV. Gorsuch fails the only standard that matters; he is not Merrick Garland.
germy
Thoroughly Pizzled
I am very sorry that I share this world with a putz like Trey Gowdy.
germy
rikyrah
How to Con Black Law Students: A Case Study
Elie Mystal
MARCH 20, 2017
This month, Bethune-Cookman, a historically black university in Daytona Beach, Fla., announced an “affiliation” deal with Arizona Summit Law School, a for-profit institution in Phoenix. A joint scholarship program will send Bethune-Cookman students and students from other historically black colleges to the law school. Other programs, including intensive LSAT prep classes, have been announced as part of the deal.
Bethune-Cookman doesn’t have a law school, so it makes sense that it would want to partner with an accredited institution. But there’s a problem: Arizona Summit, formerly known as the Phoenix School of Law, may be accredited, but only 25 percent of its graduates passed the Arizona bar exam on their first try last year.
That’s an embarrassing result for any school. To compare, the law school at Arizona State posted a 77 percent pass rate for first-time test takers of the same bar. Statewide, 64 percent of first-time test takers passed. In other words, Arizona Summit’s results weren’t even in the ballpark of respectability.
Arizona Summit can’t blame the aptitude of its students for its low bar passage rate. The median LSAT score at Arizona Summit is 143, which is on the low end, but about the same as the median score at Florida A&M University College of Law. Still, over half of Florida A&M law school graduates passed the Florida bar last summer. And Florida A&M charges about $14,000 in yearly in-state tuition, a fraction of the cost of Arizona Summit, which charges about $45,000 in tuition and fees per year. That doesn’t include the cost for Bethune-Cookman students to move from Florida to Phoenix.
……………………….
But encouraging African-American students to attend Arizona Summit will not help them achieve their goals. It will hobble them. Going to a law school that doesn’t prepare most of its students to pass the bar is not an “opportunity,” unless “opportunity” means being saddled with debt that you’ll spend the rest of your life trying to pay back.
For-profit schools like Arizona Summit prey on students with high aspirations but little knowledge about how the postgraduate system really works. Many black students aren’t just the first people in their families to go to graduate school — they are the only people they know in the game. Information passed down from family, friends or mentors is hard to get when you don’t have people in your life who have been there. Too many aspiring black students are trying to piece together education plans based on career fairs and Google searches.
germy
@Thoroughly Pizzled: And I’m sorry I share this world with Trey Gowdy’s barber.
germy
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/fbi-director-to-testify-on-russian-interference-in-the-presidential-election/2017/03/20/cdea86ca-0ce2-11e7-9d5a-a83e627dc120_story.html?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-main_fbidirector-750a%3Ahomepage%2Fstory&utm_term=.8365afab5820
Big Ole Hound
How any of these assholes conducting confirmation hearings can pretend this is anything but a charade is beyond me. Keep a straight face for the cameras boys but we all know the outcome and the posturing that will follow. Why bother?
Spanky
Mayhew has a IC hearing thread upstairs, and I suspect it’s only a matter of time before Doug! and Cole bigfoot each other doing the same.
Gonna be a fun day on the blog.
amk
beebs live blog
Tried watching it, couldn’t hack it for more than 5 minutes.
Spanky
@Big Ole Hound: Yeah, the outcome is going to be to put the attention on whodunnit? that exposed the name of the US Person in the Trump transition team who, uh, dunnit. It’s not the crime, it’s the
cover upwhistleblowing.David Anderson
@Spanky: de-bigfooted
germy
@Spanky: The more the merrier. There are local blogs in my hometown that get updated every six months. They address fascinating issues about my neighborhood but they’re too listless to post. Also lots of abandoned blogs.
I’m glad to see balloon-juice humming along.
David Anderson
@Spanky: Given a bit of parsing (1 person under investigation still working in the White House) and previous knowledge that 4 people were under suspcicion, the WHODONIT could plausibly be Page, Flynn, Stone plus probably Bannon still in the White House….
catclub
Any Democratic senator who asks the one relevant question: “Is your name Merrick Garland?” would be too shrill.
amk
Why the fuck not, comey? It’s a simple question.
Spanky
@David Anderson: Yeah, I tried to edit my comment, but time expired.
I still think the part about Doug! and Cole will hold, though.
geg6
@germy:
As I said in the disappeared post, we have liftoff, folks!
Spanky
@amk: Because the answer is “Melania”.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
I’m also worried about tornado of spin picking up the goalposts and moving them into the parking lot
randy khan
So Comey confirms the things we already know. I guess there’s nothing wrong with that.
Iowa Old Lady
I’m listening to the House hearings. The Rs are all about the criminality of leaking.
tobie
I listened to Schiff, who did a very good job laying out the case while seeming even-keeled, and listened some to Nunes and Rooney ask NSA Director Rodgers about nothing but the danger to the intelligence community of illegal leaks until I started screaming at my computer screen. The two bombshells thus far are that the FBI is conducting an investigation into collusion between Trump and the Russians and that the NSA stands by its January assessment that the Russians intervened to help elect Trump. The only thing the Republicans want to do is quash the evidence. That’s all they’ve got because the rot exposed is so friggin deep.
JPL
@amk: It’s not Hillary.
Another Scott
Not watching, heard a couple of minutes of it and had to turn it off during Nunes’ opening statement.
It’s probably all kabuki, but hey if it makes Donnie blow a gasket (as he seems to have done on Twitter this AM), then it’s not a bad thing. The thing to watch is for signs that it starts hurting him with Republicans, but even that won’t be a dramatic indicator (Nixon was still > 50% when he finally got on the helicopter.) He’s at 80% with them at the moment. The drip, drip, drip doesn’t help him.
Cheers,
Scott.
Snarki, child of Loki
Congratulations, Republicans!
You just elected a traitor to America.
Feeling proud? I bet you are!
rikyrah
@germy:
Kevin M. KruseVerified account @KevinMKruse 23m23 minutes ago
Remember…
Nunes has RUSSIAN BUSINESS PARTNERS WITH TIES TO PUTIN.
JPL
@Snarki, child of Loki: Obviously, they are fine with that, since they are more concerned about leaks.
Thoroughly Pizzled
They really think that focusing on leaks is going to work? I feel like ignoring this to death would be a better plan.
JWR
Screw NBC for cutting away, for baby pictures! and a commercial, right in the middle of Adam Schiff questioning Comey. These hearings may strike some as Watergate 2, but I fear, (know), that Our Media just ain’t up to the task.
geg6
@David Anderson:
I haven’t seen or heard a word of the testimony other than what I saw at TPM, but why couldn’t that one person in the WH be Dolt 45 himself?
Jeffro
Floored that the Rs on the committee are coordinating to try and make this about the leaks, rather than about the fact that THEIR GUY and HIS TEAM were working with a HOSTILE FOREIGN POWER’S INTELLIGENCE SERVICE to elect THEIR CHOICE FOR PRESIDENT.
(sorry, rikyrah’s CAPS rubbed off on me…actually, it’s not rikyrah’s fault, I’M PISSED ALL OVER AGAIN!!1! TRAITOR REPUBLICANS!!)
tobie
I gather that Nunes represents California’s 22nd district (Bakersfield/San Luis Obispo county). Any chance this fucker can be challenged in 2018? I’m assuming this agribusiness county is pretty conservative but BJers in southern CA might have a better sense.
geg6
@JWR:
I have been seeing some improvement, IMHO. But certainly not at NBC. I would, however, like to recommend Scott Pelley at CBS and Jake Tapper at CNN for “most improved” trophies for their lack of fucks to give for GOP nonsense recently.
Adam L Silverman
@germy: The game is afoot! We have an active spy and mole hunt! of course I’ve been saying that for several months, but…
germy
@catclub:
They should ask “Should Garland have been granted a hearing?”
And if he answers “Yes”
ask him “Then why are you here?”
lollipopguild
@geg6: So I am not the only person who saw a post that disappeared.
Thoroughly Pizzled
Trey Gowdy is going after Loretta Lynch and Sally Yates. He is scum.
RareSanity
Trey Gowdy is such a weasel…
His line of questioning is very clearly trying to imply that a member of the Obama National Security Council leaked the Michael Flynn phone transcript story to the press.
What a schmuck.
germy
@rikyrah:
I learn that sort of stuff by visiting places like this. It’s never mentioned (as far as I know) on the nightly TV news.
Xantar
“Director Comey, you say that you’ve been investigating Russian interference in our Democratic process since July and you’re only just now confirming it. You also felt it necessary to tell Congress that you were investigating Hillary Clinton’s e-mails just a few weeks before the election even though you turned up nothing.
Explain.”
(I can dream, can’t I?)
Adam L Silverman
@David Anderson: The world of counterintelligence runs deep. Whatever little Comey is saying in open session is just that: very little. The bare minimum. It is what he will say in classified session that matters. And from the looks on Senators Feinstein and Grassley’s faces last week after receiving an update, it is far, far deeper and far, far graver than what little is being mentioned in open hearing in the House today.
And stating “one person in the White House” means one person that we have high confidence in the assessment. If there’s one, there’s likely more than one.
cmorenc
@Betty Cracker:
Actually, the only standard that matters is the extent to which Gorsuch has realistic humanity in his mindset rather than hard-right ideological constraints that conveniently view the constitution and law as the instrument of the deserving “betters” for exercising control over the “lessers”, with minimal cost to the betters. He fails that test miserably. By contrast, Anthony Kennedy is far more conservative than ideal for a SCOTUS justice, but he at least does pass the humanity test a fair portion of the time, even though he occasionally fails us. I could reluctantly live with another Anthony Kennedy, but another Scalia / Thomas / Alito clone spinning bullshit sophistry around “original intent” or “literal reading of legal language”, as needed to serve the betters against the lessers, is an insult to justice.
Recall that the only reason Merrick Garland was nominated was because he was supposedly a moderate-conservative many Republican Senators had previously held up as a particular circuit judge they could support as a SCOTUS nominee, not because he was at all ideal.
Adam L Silverman
@amk: Sources and methods are not discussed in unclassified fora.
JPL
@Thoroughly Pizzled: I’m sickened that the repubs are siding with Putin. There is no other way to explain it.
piratedan
@Snarki, child of Loki: yes, but at least he’s a Republican traitor, have to stay focused on the things that REALLY matter, eh?
robert thompson
@tobie: Originally from near there. Answer to your question is: Not an ice cube chance in Bako in August.
germy
@Adam L Silverman:
Where does Gorka fit in to this puzzle? Is he going to stick around or will he be gone?
catclub
If I were a GOP senator I would ask Comey about Hillary’s emails just to see if the Democrats’ heads exploded.
amk
See comey? It’s not that hard to tell the truth.
Adam L Silverman
@rikyrah: Remember I have house plants smarter than Nunes.
SenyorDave
The idea that any Congressional republican would seriously investigate Trump or any other Republican is a joke. The concept of country first left the station about 40 years ago for these useless sacks of crap. The most patriotic thing Nunes, Gowdy and the other GOP members of Congress could do would be to commit some type of ritualistic mass suicide. It would also help the gene pool.
Iowa Old Lady
Trump tweet from 2 hours ago:
lollipopguild
@Adam L Silverman: There are rocks smarter than Nunes.
different-church-lady
@germy: I wonder if he’s also investigating how much the Russians paid him to break protocol back in October.
Adam L Silverman
@germy: As far as I know, other than his ties to Victor Orban and the Jobbik Party in Hungary, which are pro-Putin, his involvement is he’s buddies with Bannon. Gorka can’t even credibly pull off being a counterterrorism subject matter expert. He sure as hell couldn’t pull off being a double agent for the Russians.
Corner Stone
Shitlord in Chief must be pissing his pants so far:
JPL
@Adam L Silverman: This is from Chuck Grassley
FBI Dir Comey needs to be transparent + tell the public what he told me about whether he is or is not investigating @POTUS
Who would have thought that Grassley might be the concerned one.
Corner Stone
Rep Adam Schiff reading into the record facts as questions even though Comey doesn’t want to answer them.
Jeffro
I know he’s already on a roll, but Trumpov’s meltdowns today and tomorrow (heck, probably all week) are going to be something to savor…
…almost as much as seeing him led off in cuffs will be.
I keep seeing him at that proverbial police interrogation room table, face in his hands…”I was first approached by the Russian mob to help launder several million dollars back in 1998…” “I was first told that Paul Manafort was taking directions from Russia back in 2015…”
Jeffro
@Corner Stone: I am just dying here…ENJOY IT, TRUMP! That panicked feeling won’t last too much longer; next up is deciding who to sell out, followed by the grim resolve that comes when it’s time to face the music.
Aleta
My impression of Comey: no way a person as false, politically minded, manipulatable, beholden, and ensnared is going to bring Tr down all the way. I hope he twists over his calculations in perpetual torment.
ETA manipulatable not -ative
cmorenc
and – in other news, note the contrast between the boldface leads at CNN vs Fox on Comey’s testimony this morning:
CNN:
…and in smaller, but still prominent font-size: “Comey: No infor to support Trump wiretapping tweets”
“NSA director: We didn’t ask the UK to spy on Trump.”
Faux:
…and only in sotto voce(very small print) lower down:
Comey: FBI investigating Russia ties to election, Trump camp.
Comey confirms publicly for first time FBI probe of Russia meddling in US race.
‘Fake News’: Trump blasts Russia conspiracy…
robert thompson
@Jeffro: If you dont, you should write screen scripts. You would be very good at it. HBO would buy it. No doubt at all.
HRA
Although I worked for years cataloging Congressional hearings for our university libraries and had started watching Congressional hearings as a young teen, I do not consider myself the ultimate expert in them. What I do value is their portrayal of our government system that is not available to those that have lived or now live under a closed government system.
That being said I only watched it till Rogers and Comey gave the statement about there being no evidence of President Obama being involved in the made up statements of the bane idiot.
amk
Rep Jim Hines is nailing the corrupt coterie around the twitler.
geg6
@Corner Stone:
I’d love to play poker with this asshole. His tells are as obvious as his lack of confidence in his manhood.
geg6
Damn it. Used a forbidden word on last comment and am in moderation.
Sorry Betty! But can you rescue me?
germy
@cmorenc: Definitely. In my hometown, one of our local TV new stations is owned by the sinclairr family. It’s fun to compare their daily spins to the other news outlets.
zhena gogolia
@Jeffro:
I wish I had your optimism.
Corner Stone
Oh God. Nunes bringing HRC and the Foundation into this muddle.
Corner Stone
“Questions were raised about Hillary Clinton and her Russian connections”
trollhattan
@tobie:
Eyeballing the map and ethnicity it’s wholly ag-ruled and with a slight Hispanic plurality. To put it succinctly, the Rs are pulling enough Hispanic votes with Nunes to keep the lid on any Dem counterattack. One can safely presume a large part of the Hispanic population is unregistered for a variety of reasons, diminishing their potential clout.
Interesting that it skirts Fresno.
Betty Cracker
@cmorenc: It’s a stolen seat. Period.
@Aleta: I don’t think he will either. But even if he does, he’d still be a piece of shit.
trollhattan
@JPL:
Yup, seems half admiration half jealousy. And you sure don’t hear Putin extolling “giving power back to the states.”
Jeffro
@Corner Stone:
I’m sure he’s just creating sound bites for Fox News…anything they can run on air to help The Cause…”GOP Congressman asks, ‘what about the Clinton Foundation and Russia?’ Comey: no response” It’s maddening.
catclub
@Jeffro:
Sorry, this just sounds like the anticipation here for Fitzmas – when Cheney was juuuust about to be indicted. any minute now.
I see no change in who is president from this.
trollhattan
@Betty Cracker:
Speaking of pieces of shit, I heard Orrin Hatch mewling this morning that everyone understands one can’t confirm a justice in an election year. Even name-checked Biden.
God, how I hate the guy.
Adam L Silverman
@JPL: Grassley may be the best County Commissioner in the Senate, but that doesn’t mean he’s not a person.
Kay
I know it’s bad but I can no longer take Mr. Comey seriously. He just blew any credibility he had with me and he’s never getting it back.
MomSense
@Kay:
Comey has no credibility.
greennotGreen
@RareSanity: I used to see Trey Gowdy on Forensic Files when he was a prosecutor. I wonder now how many innocent people he put in prison.
amk
It’s been clear for months for those who are sane.
germy
@amk: And Navarro is a republican strategist! We’ve living in an upside down world.
japa21
@catclub: You read my mind. Although to all sane rationale people this is damning, it doesn’t mean anything is going to happen. If anybody goes to jail it will be some low level flunky and the GOP and Trump will consider the whole matter closed.
And I do know how obsessed the GOP is with leaks, like when they were all in an uproar over Plame being outed. Oh, yeah, they weren’t.
amk
what is the over/under that the nsa guy gets shitcanned soon?
mouse tolliver
Ouch. Ms. Sewell putting it on the record that Michael Flynn lied about taking money from Russia in violation of the emoluments clause. Now putting it on blast that Flynn was also an foreign agent. Comey looking like he was forced to swallow a live toad, knowing he put his thumb on the scale to help a Russian puppet regime take the White House.
Ella in New Mexico
@Corner Stone: Baby Shitlord inChief is watching his next safari circling the drain.
They’re ALL shitting their pants right now. Everything the Dems are hitting them with is solid and serious and focused. Comedy so far confirmed their legal premises unless they were regarding specifics of the investigation: Russia was working far too closely with key characters in Trump’s campaign to not have broken laws.
Get ready for the big noisy Trump team distraction event. Only question is will it go down Twitter Lane “Arnold Schwarzennegger looks like a tired old man and he screwed Rosi O’Donnell” – style? Or will someone get the bright idea to do something really outrageous?
Thoroughly Pizzled
“The Russians prefer Republicans over Democrats.”
Thank you for saying so, Chairman Nunes!
amk
fucking nunes tried to misrepresent what these two said just a fucking hour ago about putin trying to swing the election for twitler . got smacked down by both.
JPL
@mouse tolliver: Yup.
Yarrow
I have confidence in the intelligence community. They know what he did. They will take him out. Edit to clarify. They will make it so Congress has to impeach him or get him to resign.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
I’m not watching because I think it would be a threat to my blood pressure, but it sounds like this “zero sum” exchange with a critter named Conaway was quite the display of marble-headedness on the part of said Conaway
@germy: one of Jeb Bush’s closest aides, as I understand it. It’s fascinating to me that so many aide/advisor types like her and Rick Wilson are so solid in their anti-Trump convictions, while the elected, once and future, are so timid and cowed.
D58826
@Adam L Silverman: I have a pet rock that is smarter.
mike in dc
GOP Members doing a hacktacular job here. Just outstanding hackery in a supporting role. The political damage from this is immense. Investigation of ties confirmed. Investigation not ending soon. Trump allegations of improper Obama interference knocked down. Nobody gives a shit about leaks, so much as the possibility that the Commander in Chief is a dirty fucking traitor who betrayed the country and is still betraying the country and will betray the country in the future if not stopped.
zhena gogolia
@Ella in New Mexico:
I like the autocorrect of Comey to Comedy. So apt.
amk
peter fucking king trying to implicate comey’s fbi was doing the ‘leaks’ of classified info. Karma, fucking B, comey.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
NPR has Stephen Cohen trying to explain away Russian intervention and play the “we do it too” card, the host just got a bit impatient with him. The Nation (and NYU) should be embarrassed.
Yarrow
@rikyrah:
Yep. Needs more publicity. He’s compromised.
japa21
@mike in dc: Not only that, by trying to focus on the leaks, they are giving legitimacy to the claims about what was leaked. Also remember when many of them said, so what if Russia hacked DNC and gave info to Wikileaks. Wasn’t it important we knew the “facts”?
Spanky
@mike in dc: It’s all the Republicans have, unless they were to get a sudden burst of real patriotism, not the self-promotion kind.
IOW, it’s ALL the Republicans have.
quakerinabasement
The turd that clogs the golden throne?
Ella in New Mexico
@zhena gogolia: lol so Freudian.
But really, I fucking HATE using iPad to comment. A
Autocorrect is the LEAST irritating aspect.
mike in dc
@japa21: Those are basically arguments that only play to the choir(the base). They don’t persuade a single Democrat or Independent voter. They’re damage control, not denial. By the time we get to rationalizations for not supporting impeachment, those will be fucking fascinating in their creativity and intellectual dishonesty.
tobie
@japa21:
So true. Would love some choice quotes from people like Chaffetz, Gowdy, Nunes et al regarding the value of those Wikileaks during the Dem National Convention. Eat your words, goopers.
D58826
@Betty Cracker: At this point I think the D’s have to all in on the vote against the current SCOTUS nominee and every one else that Trump puts up. It may be the second voyage of the Titanic but at least one branch of the government has to be kept out of the hands of the treasonous GOP. And I include Comey in that description because he had enough info in Oct when he sent the letter about re-opening the investigation of the e-mails..
This is orders of magnitude worse than Watergate. Nixon, in the end, was just a garden variety crook. This is selling the country out to the Russians.
Ella in New Mexico
@Yarrow:
This is exactly why this whole Russian connection is gonna blow up American politics, for better or worse. Exchange lead by Adam Schiff and Comey essentially sets up the premise of how and why Russia is interfering in our political system: “Russia and President Putin in particular have a preference for national leaders and politicians who are business people because they can entangle them in business deals that then allows the Russians more leverage in those people’s leadership of their country”.
Nunes having ties to Russian businesses is not going to go well.
amk
Once again, the rethugs are focused on cover up with a lot of chaff about ‘classified info’ and ‘unauthorized leaks’ bs. Guess some habits die hard.
JPL
Hopefully someone points out that Putin and his cronies were not involved to this extent in previous elections. Nunes seems to think since Obama won, they supported him.
pamelabrown53
@Betty Cracker: #72.
Totally agree, Betty: “It’s a stolen seat, period”. I can’t help but wonder if we didn’t do all we could to prevent the steal because too many on the left wouldn’t fight for the principle that it was President Obama’s pick because Merrick Garland was considered “too moderate”. When I hear such nebulous criteria that Garland doesn’t exhibit enough humanity, then it just reinforces my belief. I am harboring a deep seated anger about about how this transpired.
The Moar You Know
@Adam L Silverman: Feinstein’s been my Senator for most of my life. I don’t like her. She’s a hawk, entitled, way too wealthy and far too willing to leap into bed with Republicans.
But I’ve never seen her look like she did last week. She walked out of that room looking like she’d just been shown a film of her own death. “Rattled” doesn’t do it justice. She and Grassley looked terrified.
Yarrow
Somebody’s nervous…
NR
@pamelabrown53:
It wasn’t the left that lost the Senate to the Republicans in 2014, and it wasn’t the left that lost the White House to the Republicans last year. You guys did that.
This Supreme Court debacle is on you. Not us.
amk
rethugs: the real story is the smoke alarm.
JPL
@Yarrow: Someone needs to explain to Trump, that’s how it works.
just sayin
Yarrow
@Ella in New Mexico: Nope. It’s not going to go well at all. And why did Chuck Grassley invite a member of the Russian parliament and chair of their budget committee to the National Prayer Breakfast just a month or so ago? Link to his Instagram.
pamelabrown53
@trollhattan: #76.
Don’t you wish someone would aak the “mewling Orrin Hatch” how we confirm a SCOTUS nominee from a “president” who was limped into office with assists from a hostile foreign power and an approval rating (after a mere 2 months) of 38%? I guarantee, Orrin et.al will do a 180 if Alito leaves the court in Trump’s last year…even if it’s a week before the election.
amk
@Yarrow: so, the moron is admitting flynn made calls to his puppet master?
Ella in New Mexico
@D58826: This hearing today give the Dems a whole lot of firepower to hold strong together to vote no to putting Trump’s hand-picked rescue judge on the Court.
Dems should hamstring and bog down everything Republicans want to do by waving the Russian flag right in their fat fucking faces.
zach
@Yarrow:
Flynn’s calls were monitored = “Obama wiretapped Trump Tower” … that’s where this is going.
JPL
What are the odds that Trump will mention the hearing tonight at his rally.
Ella in New Mexico
@Yarrow: this seemingly narrow investigation could be the start of a “Great Purge” of every shitbag for sale in Congress, too.
XTPD
@pamelabrown53: One of the more prominent memes among the pink anarchist bunny crowd was that it constituted blackmail to pointing out the importance of the SCOTUS vacancy, and as such the necessity of ensuring a Democratic presidential victory (this was the most notorious such article to “argue” the case). I doubt there’s a more perfect metonymy for the moral bankruptcy of “leftist” electoral nihilism.
Ella in New Mexico
@JPL: He’ll refer to the live stream of the hearings as “Fake News”
amk
@zach: In the face of stout & steadfast denial from both, that lie already got burned.
JPL
@Ella in New Mexico: Should have said lying under oath fake news
My stomach is in knots. Are tax cuts so important, that they want a traitor in the WH?
tobie
@JPL: Good grief, the turd is having a rally again? Please please please mainstream media do not cover this unless something newsworthy is said. All you’re doing is contributing to mob rule.
eclare
@JPL: He has a rally tonight, seriously?
zach
@amk: Not saying it’ll work; just that Trump’s now gonna take the path that the few smart people in the GOP have been recommending he take for last 3 weeks… say that by “wire tap trump tower” he means “surveillance of people attached to my campaign” and that by “obama” he means “the US government while Obama was President”.
The Moar You Know
@JPL: 100%, and also 100% that he doubles down again. No reason not to at this point. His flying monkey brigade will still hoot and howl at those Nuremberg rallies of his.
@Corner Stone: First place I saw this flailing failure of an allegation was the cover of the “Globe”, followed by the National Enquirer. THEN Twitter. This has been focus-grouped and tested, obviously. Wonder if it will work?
Probably. My fellow Americans are fucking idiots.
Yarrow
@Ella in New Mexico:
“It’s not right to have hearings or hold a vote on Gorsuch during the last year of a president’s term in office.”
NR
@XTPD: Just curious, what’s the moral value of the “centrists” blaming the left for their own screw-ups?
amk
rogers is dragging putin’s machinations in european elections through the mud
Spanky
@zach:
I don’t think it’s nitpicking to point out that the Russian ambassador was monitored, and Flynn’s calls to the ambassador were what were picked up. The intel community had no reason to monitor Flynn.
Until then.
An important distinction that is useful to remind Republicans of.
pamelabrown53
@XTPD: #121.
I am so stealing ‘ “leftist” electoral nihilism’! I used to self-identify as a leftist. Since the election of Barack Obama, I have become more and more painfully aware of “electoral nihilism in the service of purity…and I want no part of it. We’ve lost too much ground and too many people have suffered as a consequence.
PST
@trollhattan:
Nunes’s district doesn’t completely skirt Fresno, although mostly it does. I just realized that my son lives in his district (but only barely). He hasn’t lived in Fresno long, but he mentioned that his congressman was a jerk of a Republican, I just didn’t realize which jerk and how big a jerk.
Chris
@Ella in New Mexico:
One of the traditional arguments from the right against capitalism is that people who only care about money can’t be counted on to have any loyalty to their country and are for sale to the first nefarious foreign interest that makes them a more profitable offer.
Funny story…
amk
Exactly.
Spanky
Just some perspective, people. It took 26 months from the arrest of the Watergate burglars until Nixon’s resignation. This whole thing will take time.
(But probably not as long as 26 months.)
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@pamelabrown53: at Eschaton there were a couple of regulars who, well into Bush’s second term, were still justifying their votes for Nader in 2000 because Tipper Gore wanted to put rating labels on music
Adam L Silverman
@The Moar You Know: The informed responses were that the last time anyone saw here look like this was when she had to announce that Harvey Milk was murdered.
zach
@Spanky:
I mean, I agree, but I think if Trump had tried this on Day 1 to de-escalate the wiretap claim it would have worked. I don’t think it should work after he explicitly promised new evidence and strongly implied he’d spoken literally, but I won’t be surprised if it does work absent new evidence… until Flynn and Stone are subpoena’d to appear in front of this committee anyway.
mouse tolliver
Jackie Speier pointing out that Trump hired a guy who was doing PR for Putin in the U.S. Comey just swallowed another live toad.
amk
bbc, aljazeera are covering this live. the rethugs should know, because the twitler sure won’t, how this whole thing is noxious to the world view of the americans.
Tom Q
@The Moar You Know: Actually, I saw that look on her face one previous time: when she announced that Mayor Moscone and Supervisor Milk had been assassinated. Which only underscores your point.
amk
twitler just now: The NSA and FBI tell Congress that Russia did not influence electoral process.
jeez.
JPL
@Tom Q: Grassley was green also. That was a tell.
catclub
@The Moar You Know:
That sounds NOT like ‘we know Russians helped Trump steal the election’, but the Jane Harman Treatment: “We have dirt on you , Senators.”
FlipYrWhig
@NR:
Yeah, I’m sure the races in Alaska, Arkansas, Louisiana, Montana, and West Virgina would have been swung by more liberal candidates.
Actual liberal incumbent who ran in Colorado: lost by 2%
Actual liberal challenger who ran in Iowa: lost by 8%.
Actual liberal in a race with a retiring incumbent who ran in South Dakota on “the need to fight the corrupting influence of ‘big money.’… and who “called for opening up Medicare for all Americans, sometimes referred to as a public option; expanding Social Security; fighting the Keystone pipeline; and adopting a Constitutional amendment overturning Citizens United”: lost by 20%.
(You MAY have a case with Kay Hagan in North Carolina, who lost by 1.5%.)
Betty Cracker
@eclare: Yep — in Loo-uh-vull. I expect we’ll see more rallies in the coming weeks. His approval rating is down to 37% — a historic low for someone 2 months into his term — the Trumpcare bill is a nightmare for Republicans, Americans just got confirmation that the FBI is actively investigating his campaign, and he’s been exposed as a liar on the wiretapping issue. When that narcissistic shitheel is feeling under siege, he feeds on the energy of his moron base.
different-church-lady
@amk:
Well, that rules out at least half the country…
JPL
@catclub: Grassley this morning
FBI Dir Comey needs to be transparent + tell the public what he told me about whether he is or is not investigating @POTUS
different-church-lady
@tobie: Rallies are good things for us. The more he does this, the more pathetic he looks.
JPL
@Betty Cracker: He’s suppose to sell his health care plan to those who will lose coverage. Wahoo!
different-church-lady
@FlipYrWhig: Yeah, I’m really enjoying this theory that if only democratic candidates had been even more liberal they would have won over voters who punched the card for a guy who is openly racist with a core made up of white nationalists.
Shorter me: “Forget it Jake, it’s Progressivetown.”
amk
wenstrub pathetically trying to spin all the twitler’s minions’ contacts with the russians. what if they were attending conferences? sheesh. rethugs are flailing and failing.
zach
The GOP questioning makes some sense in the possible context of trying to protect everyone swept up in a cover-up… intimidating anyone who’d think of leaking, trying to establish limits for what constitutes illegal behavior, implying that they’d investigate Obama/Clinton for the same stuff in retaliation.
Corner Stone
@Betty Cracker:
Reminds me of the character Gina Torres played on Angel, “Jasmine”. Except of course that Gina Torres is actually powerful in addition to being smoking hot. Not the worst way I can think of checking out.
“Jasmine, also known as the “Devourer,” is a super being who seeks to gain corporeal form, then blend with all of humanity, making each human her spiritual slave. She feeds on humanity to maintain her form and delivers a Utopian existence to all via mind control”
catclub
@JPL: I still see it all as a charade. All of Trump’s minions could be caught colluding with the Russians, and Trump will ditch them and get a new set of minions – while continuing to talk with the old set [Corey Lewandowski style]- but Trump will skate.
I would be happy to be wrong.
amk
TenguPhule
@JPL:
For Republicans, yes. SATSQ.
Mnemosyne
@NR:
Still pretending that massive voter suppression didn’t happen, are we, comrade?
Interesting that you suddenly show up in a thread about Russian interference in the election to try and change the conversation. Better get your payment now — the ruble is dropping like a stone.
Corner Stone
@JPL: Over/under on how long into the speech the crowd starts chanting, “Lock her up!” ?
pamelabrown53
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: #138.
Thank you. Made my point. That folks would justify the damage done to our country because Tipper Gore, a person with next to zero political power held a view they disliked was a perfectly justified reason to inflict pain and suffering on the masses.
different-church-lady
@Corner Stone: In line waiting to get in?
japa21
@Corner Stone: Waiting for a counter-protest at a Trump event with signs saying and the crowd chanting “Lock him up”.
different-church-lady
@amk: ALGORITHMS!
TenguPhule
@Spanky: 26 weeks maybe.
TenguPhule
@Corner Stone: Under 3 minutes.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@different-church-lady: I’ve been getting a recurring banner here linking to a petition to “investigate Clinton corruption!” I don’t think I’ve seen it since the election. Makes me wonder if they feel they have to stoke up the mouth-breathers as “repeal and replace” falls apart.
D58826
@mike in dc: The GOP and it’s base hate Clinton (Bill, Hillary and now Chelsea) and the Obamas so much that they would vote to confirm Putin as the next justice on SCOTUS. Any hope that Trump will be held accountable by this Congress is wasted.
Miss Bianca
@different-church-lady: @FlipYrWhig: I love how white leftists have completely fallen for the Wilmer trope of “ignore the racism of white voters and pretend that there’s a chance in hell that anything short of a Great Depression-size economic meltdown will convince white people to vote for a leftist populist agenda that gives Their Hard-Earned Money to Those People!”
Chris
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
I thought we were onto hating Chelsea now?
EBT
@NR: Says noted deadbeat donnie voter, NR.
gorram
While I get Gorsuch’s nomination being dead on arrival because he’s not Merrick Garland, even for folks who haven’t committed to that principle, he should fail the basic expectations of a nominee. He’s consistently defending misogynistic clients not just of the more systemic type that Republicans are all for, but literal rapists. His rulings are effectively a call for the recriminalization of being LGBT. He is in favor of Guantánamo continuing to operate, and beyond that torture being used by US interrogators.
On the basis of “women are people,” “Being LGBT shouldn’t be viewed as a crime,” and “Bush era detention and torture techniques were criminal” he fails. Full stop. This is about the moral principle that it should be Merrick Garland getting the hearing today, but it’s also about the emergency that he being elevated to the Supreme would pose for women, for LGBT people, for Muslim people, and for people of color.
Corner Stone
“Aaand I’m spent.”
/APowers
tobie
@amk: I don’t know how that bit played in Peoria. Comey kept on saying rightly “It depends” when faced with questions regarding whether a photo op, a trip to Russia, a speech at a conference with Russia would be enough to launch a counter-intel probe. I just don’t trust my instincts any longer.
Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho
@catclub: It looked to me (as well as very reminiscent of how she looked announcing the murders of Milk and Moscone – to the extent that I recall that) as if they’d both learned something terribly disturbing, but disturbing on a more profound level than that they were in a trick bag themselves. It’s hard to articulate, but concern about of personal trouble looks different.
EBT
@NR: Says noted deadbeat donnie voter, NR.@FlipYrWhig: NR voted for deadbeat donnie, don’t engage him beyond telling him what a sub human Nazi he is and how much you want to shit in his mouth.
Chris
@D58826:
This tends to be forgotten about Vichy: many people welcomed Nazi/Vichy rule with open arms because the opportunity to smash democracy, socialism, and the un-French minorities just meant so much to them, after seventy years of ever-festering resentment for the Third Republic, that they didn’t even care if it took a foreign invasion and a puppet state to make it happen.
GxB
@JPL: Let’s see: googly eyes, super glue, a pair of tube socks – now all we need is someone to do cartoon voices entertaining enough to hold his attention. I’d think Franken would be ideal, but he’s distanced himself from his former career so I guess he’s out.
Goku
@NR: Nobody cares “Not in Russia”. Now go derail another thread at another blog
Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho
@TenguPhule: Just to be wild and reckless, I’ll take the over.
Goku
@EBT: I don’t like NR but where did he say he voted for Trump? If he did it was probably a thread I never saw or didn’t read all the way thru. Link?
sukabi
@Iowa Old Lady: the R’s are all about covering their own asses….the likelihood that before this is over that more than a handful of them opt to take time with their families is growing by the day. They are trying to shut down any real investigation.
Seems to me that in the past congressional investigations have done more to interfere in and derail actual DOJ investigations than they’ve done to help.
Miss Bianca
@Chris:
Then, funnily enough, after the end of the war, suddenly everyone was a member of the French Resistance, and had always been a member of the Resistance! Mais bien sur!
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Chris: I almost joined twitter to mock Megan McCain when she tweeted at Chelsea Clinton that no one wanted to hear from the daughter of a losing presidential candidate. If there were an Oscar for a lack of self-awareness, the Budweiser princess would be its Meryl Streep
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@tobie:
That region is the end of the road for white flight in California, so an asshole representing assholes. Plus two universities in his district so hippees need to be punched.
Kay
FBI investigation of Trump-Russia coordination began more than 3 months before Election Day.
So was going on during all those lock her up rallies and the obsessive coverage of Clinton’s emails.
They have to know this was a skewed playing field, right? No matter how much you hate Hillary Clinton you have to admit Comey treated these two candidates very differently.
Here’s the other thing. With all the “contacts” political media supposedly have, NONE of them knew there was an investigation into Trump campaign involvement with Russia?
sukabi
@Adam L Silverman: From what’s been going on over the last couple of months that we know about, I’m guessing that the # of folks in the WH that have direct involvement is ….All of them Katie. All senior aides, and a good part of the Republican party.
different-church-lady
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Megan strikes me as bright enough for it to be self-effacing sarcasm.
greennotGreen
@tobie: Wouldn’t it be a great bit of art to hack some news network’s (say, Fox) play of Trump’s speech at his rally and replace it with the audio of one of Hitler’s speeches? Not the raised voice, spit spraying parts, but the lead ins that actually sounded rational until they pulled the audience into the irrational. A thing of beauty. Of course, it could easily be done after the fact (by a person who has the chops) a la “Downfall,” but over TV would be funnier.
catclub
@gorram:
It seems to me if enough people in the US thought those acts were criminal, somebody would be tried for some crimes, and maybe convicted and sent to jail. But, no.
catclub
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: “That is so true, Megan. Say Hi to your dad.”
Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho
@sukabi: I suspect that the “good part of the GOP” disclosure is what left the Senators looking so disturbed after their meeting with Comey.
trollhattan
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Seriously? The Zappa Wing of the Democratic party? Tipper’s big moment was more than a decade earlier, and had basically no effect (other than perhaps those warning label thingies). Sad!
Kay
So, why? I know you’re all going to tell me the two theories- “nationalism” or “create chaos” but that’s not “why”- I’m asking what specifically they want from Trump and Republicans.
What is the edge or benefit Russia gains from an alliance with US conservatives? What do they win and who loses?
sukabi
@Jeffro: while that should be a televised event, it’s not going to happen….but I can see him trying to take a secret midnight vacation to a country that doesn’t extradite…
But he’ll probably stroke out mid twit fit one of these days.
NR
@EBT: I voted for Hillary. Stop lying.
trollhattan
@TenguPhule:
“He may be a traitor, but he’s our traitor.”
Chris
@Kay:
“Contacts” = “people that I allow to use me to leak what they want, as long as I’m getting something that can be spun into an attention-grabbing story.”
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@trollhattan: it were a strange place– by the summer of 2009 the Naderites and the PUMAs had joined forces to agree that Obama was a crypto-Republican, Atrios was calling him Mr Hopey Changey and agreeing with his commenters that Sotomayor was an anti-choice sleeper agent, part of Obama’s grander plot
gorram
@tobie: It’s not really considered southern California, since it’s north of SLO (since the 2013 redistricting). It’s basically the Frenso-area foothills, so it’s a fairly even mix between agribusiness and mom-and-pop farms. The problem is, like many other parts of the country, the White family farms have been sold on “it’s all people of colors’ fault, forever” with maybe a little anti-LGBT/women animus thrown in for flavor. Like you mentioned, because of the agribusiness’ use of immigrant workers, there’s a slim Latin@ plurality, but they’re subject to indirect and direct barriers to voting (if they’re not undocumented). It’s Cook PVI is R+10 for a reason!
What I’d say is much more relevant to flipping districts would be next door, CA-21, which is very similarly rural, but is in the flats of the San Joaquin Valley. There’s far fewer of the small independent farmers or small business owners, so there’s not the same wingnut contingent. Because of the dominance of large agriculturally-minded businesses, it’s easily 70+% Latin@. There’s pretty much the same indirect and direct barriers to voting, but there’s so many Latin@ people that they can still vote down any overtly anti-Latin@ political party. So it’s quickly become D+5 even as a Republican incumbent (since before the 2013 redistricting) has just barely been able to hold on to it. If that Democratic Party put resources into the district, both GOTV and registration, it would probably flip.
NR
@Mnemosyne: Still waiting for any evidence that voter suppression (which definitely happened) swung the results of a single election.
Oh, and you really need to get some new material. Your “you’re working for the Russians” schtick is getting old.
catclub
@mike in dc:
I am so old I remember they said Trump’s campaign was doomed because it was just like his primary campaign and would not pull in any moderate voters.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Megan?
gorram
@catclub: I mean… we elected the guy who pledged to stop, investigate, and potentially prosecute to two presidential terms, so… I dunno about that.
Immanentize
@Yarrow:
Isn’t this already Trump’s last year in office?
ETA Has anyone on the Twitter machine tried this tack yet?
“After today’s hearings, it is clearly Trump’s last year in office. No Gorsuch.”
Chris
@Kay:
They gain from having an isolationist in the White House who weakens our credibility as the major player behind NATO – it’s been their biggest irritation in foreign policy since forever, but especially since expansion.
Mnemosyne
@Kay:
Nope. They will never admit it no matter what the evidence is. They are 100 percent convinced that Hillary lost because she was a bad candidate and everyone hated her and the Democrats never should have nominated her. Anyone who points out the masses of evidence for Russian interference and Republican voter suppression is met with a rousing chorus of, LALALALALALA I CAN’T HEAR YOU HILLARY AND DEMOCRATS ARE THE WORST IT’S ALL HER FAULT THE DEMOCRATS LOST.
NR
@FlipYrWhig: When the Democratic party leadership is completely beholden to corporate donors, and the party as a whole chooses what will help corporate profits over what would be best for the nation, then the national political climate for Democrats becomes so bad that even good candidates are going to lose, even if individually they say the right things.
gvg
@Kay: Maybe just to feel powerful again. Russia strikes me as pathetic and hating it ever since the USSR broke up. Finding a vulnerability like that may just have been irrisistable.
Stupid is running our country. Doesn’t have to be more than that.
trollhattan
@gorram:
Made me look and yeah, hard to see how Valadao keeps his seat: Clinton 55.2 – Trump 39.7%
Hang Trump from Valadao’s neck and see how he defends him in a 70% Hispanic district.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@NR: Go to admit, this perfectly explains CEO Ron Johnson defeating the very Berie-ish, from his policies to his preening self-righteousness, Russ Feingold
Mnemosyne
@NR:
The guy who insists that voter suppression doesn’t matter and that Democratic losses since 2010 are solely because of Democrats is now demanding a new narrative for himself?
Too late, comrade. If you didn’t want people to figure out who was paying you, you shouldn’t have popped up in a thread about Russian interference in the election.
aimai
@NR: Must you? Really, must you? Trump’s voters literally voted for the candidate from Goldman Sachs and the oligarchy. There is zero evidence from the voters that the fact that the democrats had corporate donors (whatever the fuck that means) discouraged anyone but loony assholes from voting for Hillary Clinton. In fact: three million more people voted for her than for Trump. Oh, what is the point of arguing with you? If you aren’t a paid russian shill you are even stupider than I think because you are giving this garbage away for free.
trollhattan
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Yesterday’s “On the Media” had on some affordable housing organizer who had me shouting at my radio (what must other drivers think?) as he carried forth on how Clinton, then Obama destroyed welfare then handed healthcare over to the insurance industry and even now refuse to apologize for their egregious misdeeds.
Normally my favorite program on politics and media but giving this guy a lengthy platform had me steaming mad.
Immanentize
@Mnemosyne: There was a diary at the GOS yesterday that was naming and quoting “progressives” saying, basically, that Hillary was worse than Trump and that voting for Trump was probably a better path. Ooo La La the comments! The most amazing ones were those that basically said that constant attacks on Democrats was a valued free speech endeavor while pointing out this type of idiocy among certain purists was inappropriate, divisive, and should be banned from a democratic website like the GOS. Made my head hurt so….
TenguPhule
@Chris:
As I recall, the deaths of the Vichy supporters in Post-war France were neither swift nor clean at the hands of their former victims.
May Trump supporters suffer the same fate.
Immanentize
@gvg: USSR is a nation-state version of the displaced white factory worker/Trump voter. Same chip, same philosophy, same goal (“If I can’t have it, nobody will.”)
sukabi
@Yarrow: ummmm….pretty sure that reported a while ago…is he gonna tweet that comey won’t verify that Drumpf team was also briefed on same?
Bad thing about this is…now besides his weekly multimillion $ trips to füçk off at Mar a algo, we have to pick up the tab for his depends.
gorram
@trollhattan: A big part of it is that a huge chunk of the Democratic Party writes off California as a nice, fat piggy bank of 55 electoral votes every four years, and doesn’t look much at the actual districts. Both the lines got redrawn nearly five years ago and the demographics have been shifting for much longer. There’s unseized opportunities on the table.
Coordination and investment could wring at least a few seats out of the valley, and has been proven to work elsewhere in the state. The problem is that it’s very urban-focused – they did it with Ami Bera (basically eastern Sacramento’s seat) and are loudly talking about doing to Steve Knight (basically Van Nuys). That’s all well and good, but they’re overlooking how similar tactics could be retooled for rural, majority minority areas. California is the perfect testing ground for that sort of thing, which can then be exported and retooled for other competitive districts around the country – especially majority-minority rural areas.
NR
@Mnemosyne: Yes. It’s always somebody else’s fault when something goes wrong.
Just like 2010 and 2014. Those disasters were somebody else’s fault, too.
Anyway, Obama himself directly contradicts your assertion that someone else was always to blame, so your continued desperate attempts to evade responsibility are just sad at this point.
Mnemosyne
@aimai:
At best, Novo Russian is reading Russian propaganda sites like Russia Today and listening to Russian shills like Ed Schultz and Thom Hartmann, and then running here to tell us what today’s Russian propaganda talking points are.
At some point, American liberals are really going to have to deal with the fact that leftists in the US have been co-opted by Russian propaganda.
TenguPhule
@Kay:
They knew, they just didn’t bother to report on it because it apparently wasn’t “important” or “believable”.
And emails, too.
amk
The troll is ridiculously childish. Why even engage it?
tobie
@greennotGreen: Heh! That would be some clever agit-prop.
Mnemosyne
@NR:
Nice try, comrade. I love how you turn “some responsibility” into, “See, Obama admits it was all his fault!”
Whatever the Russians are paying you, it’s too much.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Mnemosyne: Is Hartmann on the “Russia is a distraction” train? Has he written a book on it yet? I mentioned upthread, Stephen Cohen was on NPR earlier today, embarrassing The Nation and whinging about the New McCarthyism.
Mnemosyne
@amk:
Just to make sure people don’t think it’s a real person. It’s a paid Russian troll. The fact that it showed up in this specific thread tipped its hand.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
From October, 2016
Miss Bianca
@NR: Speaking of schticks that get old…your completely delusional notion that White America is just waiting for the Great White Leftist Hope to rise up saying. “Socialism for all!” and Trump voters are going to fall on his neck and cry, “Yes! Yes! Yes!” and vote for someone who meets your standard of lefty purity is so contrary to all available evidence, so deeply mentally challenged, as to be almost poignant.
With the accent on the “almost”
rikyrah
@MomSense:
Maxine Waters told you..
The FBI Director has no credibility.
NR
@Mnemosyne:
I’m not “demanding” anything. I’m simply stating that your preferred schtick when it comes to me is getting old.
Say, riddle me this: were the Russians paying me back in 2008, when I was supporting Obama in both the primary and the general election on this very blog? Were the Russians backing Obama back then?
Mnemosyne
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
I don’t trust anyone who gets a paycheck from Russia Today. They are a known Russian government propaganda outlet. Believing anyone who broadcasts for them is like expecting North Korea’s state outlets to tell us the truth.
TenguPhule
@NR:
I merely assume at some point in the last year or so, a video of you and some underage Russians on a water bed playing golden showers has surfaced and now you do as they say, or else.
Is this your cry for help?
Chris
@TenguPhule:
Depends on the Vichy supporter. The boss man himself was found guilty, but then pardoned by De Gaulle in the name of some national reconciliation crap. Then you had people like Maurice Papon, who weren’t convicted for their crimes until around the new millennium and in the meantime remained powerful and influential figures in various postwar governments. I’m trying to rack my brain to see if there’s a French expression equivalent to “too big to fail…”
tobie
@gorram: @Enhanced Voting Techniques: Thanks for the info on Nunes’ district. Balletopedia says he won with 67%, I think, so I guess his seat is secure. Doesn’t CA have non-partisan districting? Don’t know if this district stands a chance of being redrawn.
NR
@Mnemosyne:
I never said it was all Obama’s fault. You have a serious problem with reading comprehension.
But he does admit some fault, so your narrative that you and the Democratic party establishment you unthinkingly and unquestioningly support are completely blameless for Democratic losses has been blown out of the water, sorry to say.
Mnemosyne
@NR:
If you’re spouting Russian propaganda for free, that’s even more pathetic, frankly.
TenguPhule
@Mnemosyne:
And now we have to decide if NK is lying or Trump is lying when they talk about the same things.
There isn’t enough booze in the world for this.
Immanentize
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Time to retweet that.
NR
@TenguPhule: Wow. There’s some pretty sick shit that lives in your head. I recommend seeking professional help.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Senator Rob Portman is also evidence that the white working class of the Rust Belt and Coal Country reject corporatism, free trade, and elitist economics.
geg6
@The Moar You Know:
I remember the clips on the news when Moscone and Milk were murdered and she was the one who announced the murders. She looked just like that.
Spanky
@Kay:
Europe
Europe
Mnemosyne
@NR:
And that same evidence blows your contention that the Democrats are solely responsible for the current situation out of the water as well.
Funny how you’re incapable of admitting that, comrade. And how you showed up in a thread specifically about the documented Russian interference in the election to try and muddy the waters.
So, is it blackmail or straight cash payment? Or just you being dumb enough to fall hook, line, and sinker for Russian propaganda that makes you feel smart?
Emma
For myself, I don’t think you’re a Russian shill. You’re a Bourbon: you have learned nothing and forgotten nothing.
Goku
@NR: I know you are but what am I! Sick burn there Kenosabe
NR
@aimai: It’s what the Democrats do for their corporate donors that’s the problem. 70% of the country wanted a public option in the ACA, but the Democrats killed it because their corporate donors didn’t want it. And they suffered the consequences.
You can see it even today. The Democratic party is not going to propose any major reforms. They’re just going to maintain the status quo and hope that Republican incompetence and a million late-night comedy burns will be enough to get them back into power without having to actually go against what their corporate sponsors want.
danielx
Comey:
“Director Comey, you evidently applied a different standard in discussing the investigation of Hillary Clinton’s emails in October and November of 2016. Can you explain this discrepancy?”
NR
@Goku: It’s not “I know you are but what am I” to point out that the stuff someone thinks and talks about is disgusting when he waves it in everyone’s faces.
Goku
@NR: Corporate donors! Drink! Boy, I’m going to be fucking tanked this afternoon if this keeps up
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@NR: you would have to be twice as smart as you are to comprehend the depths of your own stupidity.
Ella in New Mexico
@JPL:
Yes. That and the fact that all of them were tenderly raised in a political nursery under the oversight of Mitch McConnell and his minions in the House for 8 years in which they simply cannot let the Democrats win a single thing. Ever. Even if they sell their fucking country down the river.
These guys in Congress are not going to be of much assistance in preserving the Union, sadly. 2018 is looking to be quite an interesting year. Treason is not big back on mainstreet.
NR
@Mnemosyne: So, are you walking away from your assertion that I’m getting paid by the Russians? I just want to keep track of what the current narrative is.
rikyrah
@JPL:
It’s the chance to undo the New Deal in its entirety and send this country back to the 1800’s
Kay
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
It was huge! Clinton’s alleged corruption was huge in that campaign. Imagine how different if people knew Trumpsters were under investigation?
This is a legitimate beef Hillary Clinton has. She was treated differently and that made it a different race. I think there has to be some explanation for that forthcoming. Just burying it and pretending it didn’t happen isn’t enough.
Goku
@NR: You’re not being paid. You just do it for free because you’re an idiot
bemused
@Betty Cracker:
Oh gawd, I hope the cable news doesn’t air it. I made the mistake of watching his last recent one thinking I could handle seeing a short portion of it until msnbc switched to their anchors. However, msnbc aired quite a bit of it or maybe it just seemed to go on forever and I had stomach pain. Not gonna watch even two seconds. I won’t make that mistake again.
Corner Stone
@TenguPhule:
Sir, that is a slanderous lie and I demand you retract it immediately! I can not stand water beds and would not be caught recorded on one!
Timurid
@Goku:
Today I’m discussing the fall of the Roman Republic in my World History class.
Oddly enough, that’s also what they’re talking about on TV.
I can’t wait to get home and start drinking…
Chris
@Spanky:
And us.
NR
@Mnemosyne: Obama was talking about himself only in that interview. And I have never placed all the blame for Democratic problems on Obama. Frankly, I don’t even think he deserves the majority of the blame.
In any case, are you now going to accept what Obama said and concede that all the Democrats’ problems are not the fault of someone else? Because that would be progress, if nothing else.
Taylor
Can people just ignore the fucking troll? You are having a conversation with someone who is masturbating as they’re typing.
NR
@Goku: Do what for free, exactly?
LAO
Best tweet from Spicer’s press conference:
TriassicSands
Late to the show.
I was just sitting here wondering when Trump is going to deliver all the important, interesting, incriminating or whatever information he has on the Great Obama Wiretapping Scandal?
I may have missed something or does Trump plan on delivering this critical information at the same time the final report comes in from Hawaii on the status of non-citizen Barack Obama’s birth certificate? That report is due isn’t it? I mean he had this great team of investigators combing the islands for proof that Barack Obama was born in Kenya-Indonesia-Somewhere-Anywhere but the USA.
It makes perfect sense that Trump would withhold that information for years and then release it at the same time he gives us the real scoop on how Malia and Sasha, dressed in black Lycra tights and ski masks, broke into Trump Tower and placed bugs everywhere so that Barack and Michelle could sit around and listen to Trump explaining to anyone who would listen that he is the world’s foremost expert in every field of human endeavor.
Anyone know when Trump’s going to reveal all the damning evidence…I mean proof…of the Kenyan’s felonies?
Bill Arnold
@Aleta:
@Betty Cracker:
Hence Aleta’s hope that he twist in torment forever over a decision process of his own pathological design.
That was an elegant hope (curse?).
catclub
@Ella in New Mexico:
funny. Ever heard of the Confederacy? Or all the people in Bumfuckistan (in every state from Alabama to Maine to Idaho) who wave the Traitors flag? Treason is huge.
Goku
@NR: Being a sellout wh*re
Kay
The lower standard for Trump is well and truly in place.
Donald Trump has not actually accomplished anything since he took office other than announcing he’s rolling back a bunch of regulations.
Any other President we’d be talking about a failed Presidency.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@catclub: in one of this weekends seventeen articles about Trump voters, one of them is quoted as saying they don’t care what trump did with Russia because Clinton was corrupt too.
Gravenstone
Getting in a comment before slogging through the thread. Headline on CNN is “Russia wanted to hurt US, Clinton; help Trump”. Doesn’t that clearly mean that they recognized Trump would be harmful to the US? I know, I know – not like he isn’t proving them right each and every day. But, nice confirmation that the man is an intentional menace to all things American.
catclub
@Taylor: Apparently not. Slow learners.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Gravenstone: and the majority of Senate Republicans, maybe even the majority of the House caucus understand this, and are just sitting by and hoping he signs tax cuts and then has a stroke before doing any more damage.
NR
@TriassicSands:
Probably right after he reveals Obama’s real birth certificate, which I’m sure will happen any day now.
Goku
Also it’s pretty rich of NR to complain about blaming anybody else for the Democrats’ failures since 2010. What have the real true progressives done in the meantime? Who’s fault is it for their not gaining control of the government. Theirs? No certainly not, it the Demonrats’ fault!
Mnemosyne
@NR:
Er, no, I am not willing to say that all of the Democrats’ problems are their own fault. Sorry, you’ll have to tell your Russian masters that you failed to get Democrats to blame themselves for Russia’s interference in our election. I hope they don’t dock your pay too badly.
NR
@Goku: A sellout! My god, that’s funny.
I’m the one advocating for the Democratic party to not sell out and work for the people again. Which would also result in them winning again.
geg6
@Mnemosyne:
Yup. They are stupid and worthless. I refuse to have anything to with them any more, even to mock them in blog comments. You only feed their boundless ego by doing so. That said, I consider every holier-than-thou “lefty” I run into online to be a Russian troll. And I’m pretty sure I’m right to do that.
trollhattan
@Goku:
Heh. Pro tip: the light beer is in the red cooler next to the nacho stand. It’s a long day.
Timurid
Trump on Twitter right now…
Tazj
@Kay: This is why I refuse to give any special accolades to certain television journalists because “they’re learning” or they’re asking the tough questions now. They’re well paid and should have been doing this all along.
Chris
@Taylor:
It would be nice, I haven’t this time and I rarely do, but this is where I repeat my periodic observation that it would be also really nice if this blog actually performed troll control. Expecting a thread to be completely deluged in spam without anyone responding to it is simply not how human nature works. Sooner or later someone responds and it snowballs from there.
NR
@Mnemosyne:
That’s not what I asked. You really should look into that reading comprehension problem of yours.
What I asked was, are you now going to accept what Obama said and concede that all the Democrats’ problems are not the fault of someone else? Meaning, they bear at least some blame for them, as Obama has admitted?
Spanky
@Timurid: Some of us cannot enter the twitiverse from work.
Timurid
@Spanky: That’s not a link to a specific tweet… more like the essence of his tweeting this afternoon.
In other news, the Trump rally tonight is going to be totally off the chain…
Kay
@Tazj:
The email focus is unforgivable. I get it- we were supposed to be outraged because it was Clintons taking liberties and shows the Clinton’s are arrogant, but Gold almighty, 16 months? 16 months on a character/judgment issue when her opponent is Donald Trump? The newest rap against Clinton is she didn’t focus on policy but instead focused on Trump’s character, but why is that? It’s because they ONLY approached Clinton analysis on whether she was a good person or not! The whole thing was a character attack! Of course she focused on Trump’s character. That was the frame.
There are things that are unforgivable, that can’t be undone once done, and the insane email obsession is one of them. Comey’s sanctimonious grandstanding is another.
gorram
@tobie: The lines were redrawn in 2013, so they will be, but probably not for a few more years. We did have non-partisan districting, designed to make all districts as equally competitive as possible, while still being compact and geographically coherent. The thing is, the state’s pretty harshly divided between a very liberal/leftist coastline and a largely very conservative interior, so having districts match the statewide average is difficult to do while keeping them compact.
The current boundaries are definitely preferable to earlier ones, that being said. They provide an avenue for easily silenced groups (namely Latin@ populations) to make their voices heard, even in the inland, because priority is given to boundaries that make competitive districts, like the one bordering Nunes. A GOP-controlled gerrymander would have easily redrawn the boundary between the two to put CA-21 more out of reach for a Democratic challenger while keeping CA-22 as safely Republican as possible. Ideally, yes, we would be able to challenge both districts, but the non-partisan districting at least allows us to challenge one if we get our act together.
Goku
@NR: And pixies and fairy dust will make big meanies Donnie, Vlad, and Bannon disappear in a puff of smoke. Get real. Too many people are brainwashed, too many districts are gerrymandered to hell. People vote for Republicans because they hate the Other and want them to suffer and any progressive legislation is seen as godless socialism.
japa21
@NR: In general I ignore your blathering, but this statement is just inane. Probably 90% of the Dems in Congress supported the public option, but that would not be enough to get it done. And just so you know, Clinton’s policies were very much geared to help the common man and woman in this country not to help the corporations. The facts are that A) the media chose to make this a policy free campaign and B) too many people on the left chose to think, despite all the facts to the contrary, that Clinton and the Dems were the same as Trump when it came to being controlled by the big money.
Mnemosyne
@NR:
I have said multiple times on this very website that there were multiple reasons for this election result, including mistakes by the Democratic Party. But every time I say that, you want me to instead say that the primary reason the Democrats lost was because of Democratic screw-ups.
It was not. Democratic screw-ups contributed to November’s result, but were not the primary reason for the loss.
Sorry, comrade, but your attempts to exonerate your Russian friends have failed once again.
Chris
@geg6:
I wouldn’t, if it wasn’t for the neurotic obsession that so many of them have for defending, ignoring, or deflecting all criticism of Russia. From Bob in Portland’s infatuation with the topic of CIA-Nazis in Ukraine here that started years ago to Glenn Greenwald calling everything McCarthyism, the level of apologetics for Russia is far beyond what’s ever been deployed for any other foreign adversary, and frankly, far more than they deserve. If I never hear the phrase “near abroad,” it’ll be too soon.
(No, most of these people aren’t paid Russian trolls. They just happily take their cues from those who are).
catclub
@Chris:
This, Trolls should be the only ones that see their own posts – but see everyone NOT responding to it. This is doable.
Another Scott
@Betty Cracker: Will Botsplainer be there for us? We need live reports!!1
Then again, ignoring him at his rallies (or having one “team reporter”) would make much more sense. Don’t give Donnie the adulation and attention he so desperately wants at these things…
Cheers,
Scott.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
thinking about the Senate, that might be a high estimate. The Obama Bros single out Joe Lieberman for the death of the PO and Medicare buy-in, but as much as I despise him, and he did single-handedly torpedo the Medicare option right out of the gate post-Scott Brown, I think there were at least a dozen PO opponents in the Senate, and simple ignorance, the fetishization of ‘reining in spending’ was probably a greater factor than corporate donors.
Which, btw, is why I still get pissed off when I see people here still trot out the “if Obama hadn’t spent so much time negotiating with Republicans…” canard. He was arguing with Blanche Lincoln and Ben Nelson (and several others) at least as much as the Queens of Maine.
TriassicSands
OMG, in Trumpland this is the kind of headline we face every day:
Ooooh, my head hurts.
NR
@Mnemosyne:
Actually, every time I’ve brought up the idea that the Democrats might bear some blame for the losses they’ve suffered, you always showed up blaming something, anything else. If you’re now willing to admit that the Democratic leadership bears some of the blame, that’s progress, at least.
As for whether it’s the primary reason, that’s largely a matter of semantics. The Democrats need to make changes to address the losses they’ve suffered. And saying over and over again ad nauseum that I’m being paid by the Russians isn’t going to make that happen.
Miss Bianca
@NR: And saying over and over that “The Democrats need to make changes” and then saying “but *I* can’t be bothered to try to change the Democrats because REASONS blah blah all the neoliberal shills just won’t LISTEN to me” isn’t going to make those changes happen either, comrade. I wonder if the reason that you can’t seem to persuade your local Democrats to adopt your viewpoint is that you’re as much a smug, alienating asshole IRL as you are online. Could it be? It would be irresponsible not to speculate!
EBT
@NR: you voted for deadbeat donnie you piece of shit.
FlipYrWhig
@NR:
Unfalsifiable theories are the best kind, amirite?
rikyrah
@Kay:
Well, already, they got the steel contract for the Keystone pipeline.
The release of the sanctions is worth 500 HUNDRED BILLION DOLLARS – the Exxon deal.
500 HUNDRED BILLION, KAY?
Everything else Vladimir gets is icing on the cake – the White Whale is 500 BILLION.
jeannedalbret
@Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho: She and Grassley were one in horror, almost supporting each other, rather than contemplating separate predicaments.
Mnemosyne
@NR:
So are you now willing to admit that voter suppression happened, or are you still going to insist that it had no effect?
Another Scott
@Kay: The huge benefit that Putin gains with HRC not being in the White House is a likely lifting of sanctions (due to the invasion of Ukraine, etc.).
The only threat to Putin’s hold on Russia is economic discontent. He’s crushed all normal political opposition and controls the press. The only way he’s removed from power is if the masses start seeing that he’s destroying the economy. That was well on the way to happening (see XE.com for the graph of RUB vs USD) as a result in the collapse in oil prices and the sanctions.
HRC would have worked to make the sanctions stronger. Donnie talked about how he and Vlad got along great and how that was great, right? It’s clear who Putin wanted and why.
There may be other reasons as well (weakening US foreign policy and all the rest), but the main reason was the sanctions.
My $0.02.
Cheers,
Scott.
Betty Cracker
@Chris: Since I started the thread, I’ll explain why I’m not doing troll control. It won’t be a popular opinion: I don’t think NR is a troll. A tedious, sanctimonious jackass? Yes. But while he (I think) argues his points so unpersuasively as to actively undermine his cause, my guess is his opinions are sincerely held.
@Another Scott: That makes sense. It’ll be interesting to see how it plays out now because I don’t think Trump can roll back sanctions without destroying his already failing presidency and taking down his party. So his primary utility to Putin is kaput.
Of course, Trump is still useful as a weak, preening failure who devalues US prestige every day he holds office. I guess that’s Putin’s booby prize.
different-church-lady
@Betty Cracker: I have to reluctantly agree with that first ‘graph.
NR
@EBT: No, I didn’t, as I’ve said many times before.
Again :stop lying.
NR
@Mnemosyne: I’ve said all along that voter suppression happened. There is a ton of evidence of it and no reasonable person could deny it.
What is not established is whether it swung the results in any election.
NR
@FlipYrWhig: I think the election results before and after the Democrats’ transition into a center-right corporate party speak for themselves.
EBT
@NR: The more you engage me with your lies the more obvious they are.
different-church-lady
@NR: FUCKIN’ CONGRESS, HOW DOES IT WORK?
different-church-lady
@NR: Yeah, Americans hate corporations so much that they put the guy who IS a corporation in the White House.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
You mean the party that passed a trillion dollar stimulus, got near universal health care after a hundred years, and legalized same-sex marriage, you stupid little fuck? To say nothing of The Most Progressive Platform Ever! Because we had to let Cornel West approve it.
(an old thread two posts down, I think we can play with it)
TenguPhule
@Corner Stone: Goddamnit CornerStone, You’re NR?! I thought it was Doug!
Mnemosyne
@NR:
Oh, so voter suppression happened, but it didn’t matter, because you’ve convinced yourself that it doesn’t matter. Good one.
NR
@Mnemosyne: I didn’t say it didn’t matter. I said there’s no evidence it swung the results of an election.
Those are two very different things.
Mnemosyne
@NR:
Given that that “transition” happened in 1992 with the election of Bill Clinton, I’m not sure why you’re blathering on about 2010 as some kind of pivotal year for “corporatist” Democrats.
2010 was a pivotal year — it was the year that the Kochs and other unaccountable billionaires were first allowed to funnel hundreds of millions of dollars into state and local races with zero accountability. But since that doesn’t fit with your tidy little narrative about how “corporatist” Democrats are solely to blame for their own losses, you will, once again, ignore the reams of contrary evidence.
NR
@EBT: Well you’re certainly the expert on lies, given that you keep telling them about me.
Nonetheless, the fact remains that I voted for Hillary.
Mnemosyne
@NR:
Uh-huh. You just keep telling yourself that there’s no possible way that 12,000 voters were suppressed in Michigan, or that 28,000 voters were suppressed in Wisconsin. Nope, it was all because the Democrats suck.
NR
@Mnemosyne:
It was also two years after the Democratic party was voted into power promising change, and then proceeded to deliver warmed-over Republican policy with a “D” label on it.
And while the transition began in 1992 (or perhaps slightly earlier than that), it continued unabated throughout the 2000s and culminated in the Democratic party we have today. One that won’t dare do anything to upset its corporate donors, not even to stop Donald Trump.
NR
@Mnemosyne: You do understand that saying “X didn’t happen” and “There’s no evidence that X did happen” are not even remotely the same thing, right?
NR
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Which even Obama’s own advisers admitted was half the size of what was needed. And the Democrats then proceeded to give away a third of what was left in the form of stimulus-useless tax cuts.
Hardly something to brag about. The recovery was sluggish as a result and that cost the Democrats big-time.
I seem to recall the Democrats promising universal health care, not “near-universal” health care. The ACA left tens of millions of Americans without coverage. And before you go blaming that on the Republicans, realize that the Democrats had the power to do better. They chose not to.
Actually the Supreme Court did that. But whatever. I’ll give you that one. One outta three ain’t bad, I guess.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
“half”? Source?
You don’t understand economics any better than you understand politics
Because of the Supreme Court brought to us by people like you and Ralph Nader
You really are one dumb little fucker.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@NR: also, you stupid sniveling little shit, if the American people are so hungry for Bernie-ism, you need to explain why the very Bernie-ish Russ Feingold underperformed the terrible awful neoliberal centrist Hildebeest.
Mnemosyne
@NR:
I have to admit, I find it really fascinating that a troll who normally only shows up to defend the name of St. Sanders the Incorruptible shows up today to try and distract us from clear evidence that the Russians did, in fact, interfere in our election and does have strong ties to the Trump administration.
Why is that, comrade? It’s not a coincidence that you just happened to show up in this thread and just happened to try and change the subject away from Russian interference.
The only question in my mind now is if you’re being paid or giving it away for free.
NR
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
I can’t do a deep search at the moment, but
here’s a source talking about how at least some of Obama’s advisers knew the stimulus was too small.
Edit: It looks like that source is paywalled. But Google the article title and you’ll find a version you can read.
I understand both far better than you. In fact, in that same article I linked, you can find a quote from an administration official that essentially says “If the first stimulus turns out not to be enough, we’ll be able to pass a second stimulus.”
And wow, what an absolutely massive political error that turned out to be, and it’s one that liberals at the time desperately tries to get the White House to understand, to no avail. We knew that we were only going to get one bite at the stimulus apple, and so therefore it was better to go big because the risks of a too-small stimulus were too great.
We liberals were right about both the policy and the politics, and you “sensible centrists” were wrong.
No, because the Democratic Congress passed a bill that left lots of people without coverage. They could have and should have passed Medicare for all, which would have been untouchable by the Supreme Court. They chose not to, because protecting the profits of the big insurance companies was more important to them than improving the health care of the nation and ensuring everyone was covered.
And morons like you are still too stupid to see it.
NR
@Mnemosyne: My first comment in this thread was a response to someone blaming liberals for our current political ills. Funny how you’re not calling that person out as a Russian agent, eh?
I guess it’s only “distraction” when someone is saying something you don’t like.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
You didn’t say that, Dummy, you said Obama advisers said the Stimulus should have been double what it was.
Oh, you are precious in your stupidity. Nancy Pelosi, who knows her caucus like you know the moles on your mom’s back, told the White House that a trillion dollar ask would spook her Blue Dogs, and in the Senate “we” didn’t have sixty votes, and even among the 58 “we” had at the time, people like Claire McCaskill and Ben Nelson were determined to say they had trimmed the fat
No, they couldn’t have, you stubbornly stupid little creature, because Joe Lieberman would never have voted for it. Neither would Blanche Lincoln, Mark Pryor, Mary Landrieu, or Tim Johnson, and none of those people lost their seats for being too conservative, you idiot. And that’s without mentioning Jim Webb or Bill Nelson.
and go find an economist who will say tax cuts are not stimulative, that’s a separate question from whether they’re a good idea
then bring your mommy another Bacardi and Yoo-Hoo, and get to tonight’s foot massage, earn your place on that Hide-a-Bed in the basement
Mnemosyne
@NR:
Uh-huh. And the reason you felt it necessary to direct the conversation away from the fact that the Russians helped elect Trump was … ?
But rest assured that everyone has now seen what you did there. You’ll do anything you can to distract people from Russian interference in our elections.
NR
@Mnemosyne:
The conversation was already directed away from Trump when other commenters started trashing liberals and blaming them for every problem under the sun.
Hell, in the original post, Betty also mentioned the Supreme Court hearing. So this post was never entirely about the Comey hearing in the first place.
Christ, you’re dense.
NR
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
You know what? I’m not up for dealing with your deep-seated psychological issues. They’re honestly really creepy and life is too short to deal with shit like that. So I’m out.
It’s funny to see people still bleating “But we didn’t have the votes!” eight years after the fact, though. Plenty of other people have woken up to the fact that that’s bullshit. Maybe one day you will too.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
So your theory is Blanche Lincoln really wanted to vote for single payer, but the dastardly Obama stopped her? And here I’ve been calling you stupid.
and Roberts, Alito, the Iraq War, the Trump presidency, Gorscuh… All on you, Bernie, Nader and the rest of your kind.
EBT
@NR: You are a libertarian posing as a bernout with a faux leftier than thou attitude.