This is a sad story. I’m glad at least that this guy has come to his senses about Trump and I hope others do before more damage is inflicted on Americans, whether they voted for him or not:
Beginning in January 2016, Kraig Moss traveled to 45 rallies, belting out songs in support of Donald Trump and telling the story of his late son, Rob, who died three years ago from a heroin overdose. In this way, the musician earned the title of “the Trump Troubadour,” a true believer said to symbolize “the voice of unheard America.”[….]
But this bill backed by the president “disgusted” him. He no longer sings songs about Trump, and he now wonders if any of his sacrifices were worth it.[….]
“The one platform that I was just so genuinely involved in with my heart was the one thing that he just turned right around,” Moss said. “He’s turning his back on all of us.”
He couldn’t have bothered to actually read about Trump’s plans before he did all that singing?
Sorry, I don’t celebrate stupidity and its high time the media stopped too.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
I find it hard to sympathize with someone who voted because of a hate-fueled delusion, an that’s the one he’ll admit to a stranger
You Built That.
but but but heez a rill merkin, not a kostul aleet!
And you are quite right.
Trump Troubadour? The only Troubadour was Woody Guthrie, who wrote about the Old Man back before the current monster was hatched.
I know I should feel bad for these folks…but I just don’t.
@germy: Uh, Ernest Tubb would have something to say about that.
Not to be a pedantic asshole, but isn’t it “traps”?
It should be “traps,” not “tracks.”
From the annals of “I didn’t think the Face-Eater Party would come for my face” and “Republicans are insensitive about anything that doesn’t impact them directly”…
Also, has this person seriously never met a Republican before?
Fuck that guy. I’ll continue to fight for public policies that will help him and his ilk. But as for Moss personally? I would gladly direct him to the nearest conflagration and bid him leap into it and rid the world of his stupidity once and for all. Anyone worth their daily intake of oxygen could see Trump was a liar and a con man.
The one “talent” that Benedict Donald shares with Barack Obama is that people see in him what they want to see in him. It’s genuinely mystifying.
No. This guy was a part of 45 Trump rallies. He heard all the bigotry. The build the wall, the beat his ass and I’ll pay for your legal fees. The misogyny. The “lock-her-up.” And he was fine with ALL that shit.
You’re right. I fixed it. Thanks!
@schrodingers_cat: also. too. doug. enough with the racists’ stupidity and their sob stories.
@Penus, @XTPD: I think it’s tracks, as in tracks on a magnetic tape.
@Doug!: well, never mind, then.
Please allow me to introduce myself,
I’m a man of great, great, tremendous wealth
I mean, I’m really, really rich
And many people are saying I’ve got great taste
The best taste, really
I’ve been around for so long, you wouldn’t believe it
I’ve made the best deals – so many deals
I was playing golf at Mar-a-Lago – such a fabulous, fabulous place
When Congress had its moment of just tremendous doubt
And so much pain…so, so much pain – just the most pain
Made damn sure that Ryan
Washed his hands – he’s got puny hands by the way, I mean, you should see how small this guy’s hands are!
And sealed its fate.
I have been scanning the Twitter feeds of America’s top political reporters (not the TV pundit kind) for the last 30 minutes, and they could be summarized as follows: ??? I guess it boils down to the facts that Ryan’s career is finished if AHCA fails, which would be the reason it passes but not that many members of his caucus like him anyway, so it could also be the reason the bill fails.
His son dying of a heroin overdose is sad. Him being a dumbass, refusing to do his homework on Trump before the election and instead just believing Trump’s rally lies, is not sad. It’s just stupid and I have zero sympathy for that. Glad he’s woken up, but until and unless he realized the Democrats are the party that will work to help people like his son–and he votes for Democrats–he hasn’t changed.
wasis still fine with ALL that shit.
I’m tired of reading about these dumb f*cks — call me when they start voting for their actual interests.
C-Span is kind of interesting right now, if you know what I mean. I’m mildly sedated and I’m interested.
@raven: I meant Trump Troubador.
I don’t think Mr. Trubbs worried himself over the Old Man’s rental policies.
His sacrifices travelling around the country basking in the attention from fellow Trumpers helped contribute to many people in his son’s situation dying in the future, so no, not worth it. I’m sure he will repent by travelling around the country to Trump protests basking in the attention from fellow anti-Trumpers.
He also quit his job and sold most of his possessions. He was a groupie.
He fell for the con.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@amk: that shit is what brought him to a trump rally in the first place
@amk: I stand corrected.
@Shalimar: In other words, narcissistic personality disorder?
@LAO: Amen sister.
Stories I am tired of reading
* T voter sob stories
* Bannon evil mastermind stories
*Ivanka as a “liberal” paragon stories
Flanders' Former Neighbor
Umm, you did.
I’m laughing loudly at this post. This idiot attended and sang at 45 rallies where he saw Trump encourage rally attendees to physically assault protesters and we’re supposed to feel sorry for him now?
Naw. Let him suffer along with the rest of us.
I think the reason I am able to tolerate these tales of idiocy are because they are supposed to point out to 45 and on the fence republicans that they cannot count on support for stripping away healthcare and mental health services from their constituents. It also helps to point out that 45 ran on expanding health care and providing bionic universal health care – better, stronger, faster, cheaper, etc. That those of us with brains knew he was bullshitting is a story that should be told but let’s wait until after we defeat this republican death plan.
For now I hope the media keep running with these stories.
Their interests are fucking over people of color. And talk radio told them obamacare was all about helping Those Folks.
Different family of Trump supporters whose eyes were opened, but here goes the sad saga from Eddie’s Steak Shed, near South Bend, Indiana. Put this on the thread below, too. Adam linked to another story on this last night.
On how a Trump supporter’s husband is suddenly being deported. From the heartland. Whoops. The wife of the deportee is a naturalized American citizen. Immigrated from Greece 30 years ago.
Ricardo Beristain, a Mexican national, visited an aunt in Los Angeles in 1998, liked the country, and overstayed his visa. In 1999 or 2000, he married the Trump voting Greek immigrant, Helen.
In 2000, he and Helen accidentally crossed the border into Canada (she was pregnant at the time), and came to attention of authorities. Which was during Bill Clinton’s presidency. And then Mr. Beristain was known to authorities and checked in, every year during the presidencies of GW Bush and Barack Obama. He was given a work permit, a driver’s license, and a Social Security number. The Beristains had three American born children.
From the South Bend Tribune, in Indiana: Eddie’s Steak Shed owner held for deportation
Wife and kids wait, hope for reprieve from ICE agent
ICE only decided to move on him once Trump had given them the go-ahead to deport widescale. There are apparently about 1 million with orders to deport, still remaining in the US. Three previous presidents had shown more discretion, pretty much going after those with criminal convictions.
Ah yes. Deport the illegals. But not that upstanding illegal I know. Uh huh.
All said, story depicts how difficult it is for a Mexican citizen to enter the US legally. It was likely much easier for Trump-loving Helen the Greek, back in 1987 or earlier.
Also gotta wonder how that’s going to go for the Greek immigrant family. Is Ricardo going to be able to pay off the note for buying the restaurant now? Did he pay cash? I’m curious on that front …
Leopards, here be your faces.
I love stories like this because I get a good belly laugh first thing in the morning. Fuck this guy. I hope the salt from all the tears he’ll cry erode his fucking face.
This election has changed me. Normally I can sympathize with just about anyone. But Trump supporters? I hope they have nothing but the pain and misery they wished on everyone else. And yes, I realize that makes me a hypocrite. I can live with it.
On the (potential) plus side: maybe the story of his too-fucking-late epiphany, along with other similar stories, being given “air” play in the MSM, will help those not-completely-fucking-stupid Shitgibbon voters to have epiphanies of their own, which could lead to a wave election next year.
Would y’all like fries with that unicorn steak, by the way?
@schrodingers_cat: I can’t get enough of the bannon evil mastermind stories. It’s the same part of me that is fascinated by James Bond films. The villain is always so entertaining.
@SFAW: If he and his buddies stay home on election day, I’d be fine with that.
@germy: Probably not to the degree of a personality disorder. But anyone who sings in public likes the attention and acclaim.
I feel more sorry for that guy who’s getting deported thanks to his wife voting for Trump. And speaking of, Kraig was all about those deportations… until he wasn’t.
Shoulda used the ol’ bean Kraig. The noggin. The space in your skull that, like your house, was “completely gutted” when you started supporting Trump.
I’m sorry the guy is having a sad (I know more than a few people who’ve lost or nearly lost loved ones to heroin) but if he spent as much time THINKING as he did writing Gonna Build a Wall maybe he wouldn’t feel so sad, betrayed, and ashamed.
Also too, I am tired of reading their sob stories. These aren’t children who got into the chemicals under the sink, and got injured. These are full-grown adults who are fully capable of making rational decisions. The fact that they voted for this guy is fully on them, and I’m tired of being pressured to feel bad for them.
Should they have figured out that a 70 year old guy who has spent the better part of his life courting wealthy people’s approval and who had never cared about anyone except himself would never lift a finger for them? Of course. But I resist the nearly overwhelming urge to express schadenfreude because I want people like this to be willing to publicly express their regret and disgust without people like me jumping on them. The guy lost his son, and that’s a lot of punishment for one man to bear. At least he is advocating for something that would help addicts — mandated coverage and getting antidote into the hands of local EMT and police forces. A lot of people are just complaining about drug dealers and doctors and yada yada yada.
@schrodingers_cat: The Ivanka stories are the worst! What a fu*cken phony she and her husband are, makes me want to vomit.
@germy: perhaps I should have said “economic interests.”
Read his words. He’s still stupid. Just disillusioned enough that he questions if it was worth it, but still stupid. Sorry for his loss but the lies and racism he fell for was the real draw. He became minstrel to an evil clown, even selling his possessions like this was Jesus 2.0. Doug, stop trolling us with one more White Working Class Sucker for Trump story. They really aren’t having a come to their senses moment. Under that sorrow is the same wicked bigotry that gave Trump his EC win.
Post an article when they’re wearing sackcloth and ashes with black lives matter across their face.
@schrodingers_cat: Yeah, I feel like that too (celebrating stupidity, who coulda knowed?), but maybe narratives like this are what will get some slow wits to wake up.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
I wonder who his MoC is in upstate NY, and if he’s called said MoC to speak up for other addicts and their parents
Another small towner shocked to learn that big city huckster is a big city huckster.
@debit: You were thinking about a dog from Rochester, if memory serves. What’s up with that?
And thinking of marvelous Walter makes me smile. Goofy guy.
@Elizabelle: I found this particular story to be hilarious! I mean she voted for Trump expressly because of his immigration policy — yet, some how forgot she was married to an illegal alien. NO SYMPATHY!
@MomSense: Good point.
This guy sounds like good folks.
I should find him and apologize for my education.
@Elizabelle: I feel sorry for the kids in this family saga, but the wife is a stone cold idiot. Unlike the troubadour she still feels no mercy for others. She wanted to hurt other people and apparently cannot get it into her thick skull that these other people are just like her and her husband. They are no more criminal than he is.
Fuck this. Really. I have lost patience with people who vote against their own self interest again, and again, and again. If they live on a bubble it would be one thing, but don’t make everyone else suffer because you are an uninformed dolt.
Similar story about the wife who voted for Trump and now her hubby is being deported in Granger, IN, which is next to South Bend. The family owns a very popular steakhouse here, and I guess all the locals have been going by to complain that the man being deported isn’t who they meant when they voted for Trump. They wanted those other Mexicans thrown out, the ones they didn’t know.
Yeah, I’m sick of hearing and reading this bullshit too. They’re getting what they voted for. Time they realized that they’re not in the club.
Possible title for his first album release?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
wouldn’t surprise me if this guy doesn’t know who his MoC is, but he knows he hates that San Francisco Liberal Nancy Pelosi and that know-it-all lady from Massachusetts or wherever
There’s a diary on DKos this morning that quotes an article from the New Yorker (I think). The article says Democrats should quit trying to feel everyone’s pain and hold onto their anger. Amen to that!
Here’s the perfect instrument to accompany Moss’ future gigs.
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
“Pretendin’ to be an injun jus’ to get special treatment, that’s what the radio guy tol’ me.”
Mingobat f/k/a Karen in GA
I don’t wish the loss of a kid on anyone. But you know what would be even worse? If the son died four months before his own daughter was born, they needed the Social Security survivors benefit to help feed the kid, and now there’s a party in charge that would bankrupt the entire system. Never mind how I know this [cough dead nephew cough his daughter is a gem cough too good a kid to be from my family cough a better person than Paul Ryan will ever be].
Also, Medicaid pays for my father-in-law’s badly-needed nursing home care, and the party in charge would put him out on the street. We don’t have the resources to properly care for him at home, or we’d already be doing that.
So my energy is taken up with worrying about my own family — I can’t be worrying about some Trump voter too.
Hey, they’re the ones who wanted a meaner, more selfish country. It’s not my problem if they can’t handle living in it.
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
You misspelled Taxachusetts you coastal elite.
THE RACHEL MADDOW SHOW 3/23/17
Massive, nationwide protest changed course of GOP anti-ACA plan
Rachel Maddow looks at how massive, nationwide protest and resistance attached human stories to the consequences of repealing Obamacare and made the Republican legislative plan much more difficult.
Mingobat f/k/a Karen in GA
@EdTheRed: That’s just beautiful.
Call me when they start giving a shit about problems like this before it affects them or someone they know personally.
Republicans find a way to make a bad health care plan even worse
03/24/17 08:00 AM—UPDATED 03/24/17 08:08 AM
By Steve Benen
The original Republican health care plan, unveiled by House Speaker Paul Ryan (R-Wis.) a few weeks ago, landed with a thud. Independent estimates found the GOP proposal would strip 23 million Americans of their health coverage, and when Ryan told his members they could either take it or leave it, many House Republicans went with the latter.
So, Ryan tried again, this week unveiling an overhauled version of his plan, which failed to address any of the problems with the first version, and which the Congressional Budget Office found would take coverage from 24 million Americans. The Speaker again told members they had to accept this his bill, and GOP lawmakers again said they wouldn’t.
And now, with their backs against the wall, Republican leaders are making even more changes, managing to make a bad bill even worse in the hopes of avoiding a humiliating failure.
I can appreciate the fact that “Essential Health Benefits” may sound like some wonky phrase that makes readers’ eyes glaze over, but this is a critical element of the debate. Under the Affordable Care Act, private insurers are required to cover a series of health care treatments in every plan. The benefits include things like prescription drugs, maternity care, and various pediatric services, such as vision care for children.
To woo right-wing House members, Republicans have agreed to scrap the Essential Health Benefits from federal law. As Business Insider’s Josh Barro explained yesterday, “If the EHB rules were repealed, insurers could literally sell plans that do not pay for you to go to the doctor, or that don’t pay for prescription drugs, or that don’t cover pregnancy-related care. EHB repeal would also allow insurers to sell plans that do not cover substance-abuse treatment, a key issue for members of Congress from states hit by the opioid epidemic.”
@Shalimar: well, yeah. As a formerly full-time musician, I can attest to that. There’s nothing like being on stage or performing, better than any drug in the world. (that’s not to say our buddy Mr. Moss isn’t an idiot of the highest order. He is.)
@Elizabelle: whoops, crossed you in posting. I get to listen to people whine about this in person. The next news story might be about an older lady going nuts in a mall beating Trump voters with an umbrella. Or a clipboard, depending on what’s in my hands at the time.
On a somewhat different subject:
I received e-mail from Jason Kander on behalf of “Let America Vote,” an organization he either started, or is closely associated with. Fundraiser, of course, but what got me interested was this:
They have some money to spend on targeted ads, and they are asking people: On which of three states should their ads be focused — Virginia, New Hamster, or Georgia? The reasoning for each state was laid out in the mail, and the link sent me to the poll. (Interestingly, the Georgia ad was indirectly aimed at the Ossoff race, but was focused on getting the SecState to keep polls as open as possible, it was not an overt “Vote for Ossoff” thing.) The VA ads would be aimed at preventing an override of McAuliffe’s veto re: another voter ID law, and New Hampshire was aimed at getting voters to call their state reps to try to prevent yet-another voting restriction law from being passed. I thought NH was the best bang for the buck, but that’s me.
Anyway: I thought BJ-ers might find it interesting/helpful. I did, because it was somewhat different from the standard “ZOMG RYAN SHITGIBBON MCCONNELL” etc. mails I get. I figure more people registering their honest opinion (and perhaps donating) would be a good thing
The GOP desperately wants to screw the rubes over on healthcare, but they don’t have a non-obvious way to do it.
Even the dumbest mark in the world will notice not having insurance anymore.
@Elizabelle: Kelpie at the Buffalo MN Humane Society. I went up to check her out and asked what her terminal condition was (cancer) and then the staffer told me she was also blind since birth and had always been an outdoor dog. At that point I started crying and fumbled my credit card out my wallet and sobbed, “I’m taking her.”
She’s a super sweet girl, really cheerful and happy and incredibly smart. She learned “step up” and “step down” for the back steps in an afternoon and housebreaking is also going really well. She loves Ellie and is respectful of the cats, who mostly ignore her. I know her time is limited (we’re guessing six months or so) but I’m really glad I have her. She’s just a little bundle of sunshine.
@MomSense: This is a good point. Plus a whole lot of “buyer’s remorse” stories about voters that wish they hadn’t voted for Trump and how he’s letting them down may be a thorn in his side. He wants people to worship him. They did. Now they don’t. His ego can’t process that very well.
@zhena gogolia: Well, actually, Trump did not put out much in the way of plans. It was more about feelings and making talk radio emotional markers. And of course, as so many prior people who have done business or worked for Trump before, he is a con man and a grifter. But being a “Republican” and an “Evangelical Christian,” is a strong indicator of tribal identity, and people have always voted, particular the white working class, along the lines of tribal identity and the strong social psychology support that people get being the member of the dominant group, even if the elite of that group is indifferent to your and yours material welfare.
One of the most chilling moments in an incredibly chilling movie, Conspiracy, based on transcripts of the Wannsee Conference, was one of the Nazis imitating the German citizens who came to his office, “Oh, they whine and want to save their Jew, who is different. They need to learn they are all bad Jews.”
@debit: You’ve got Kelpie!
All right! We need a post on that. With pics.
Am sick of hearing about Trump and Republicans. Release the Kelpie.
Also, since she’s blind, she will appreciate having Ellie around as her “eyes.” Good adoptive home.
Rather than disappointed drumpf voters, I’m more interested in Mr. Timothy Caughman, the man who was stabbed to death for his skin color. Have you seen his tweet after he voted? He loved his country.
@Mingobat f/k/a Karen in GA:
I think this every day. They should be celebrating that they got what they voted for. Losers deserve their misery. That’s basically the Trump-Ryan philosophy.
@Cacti: And the rubes are seeing through the “access to healthcare” that Fuckin’ Paul Ryan and the others are trying to foist on them.
The rubes have access to brand new SUVs, luxury vacays, and even living large in Trump Tower too. Does not mean they can afford them.
The rubes understand that.
@debit: And I should have added that I adopted her so quickly because Walter’s absence left a huge, sucking hole in our house. Kelpie can’t replace him, but she makes it easier to be without him.
Mike in DC
Mostly “too soon” for me to muster much empathy for regretful Trump voters right now. Check back with me in 2018, when we might need some of them.
Last night we were channel surfing and watched “Access Hollywood” for a few minutes. Now I have access to Gwyneth Paltrow.
Fuck this guy and his economic anxiety. Anyone with two brain cells could tell that Trump was a conman and a dumb man’s vision of what a rich person looks like.
Dr. Ronnie James, D.O.
@EdTheRed: [Orson Welles clapping GIF]
Conservatives want to live in a world of winners and losers, because there’s no point in feeling like a winner if you don’t have a loser to look down on, but it’s always premised on the notion that they themselves will be among the winners. So when they’re not, they start rationalizing. And whining. I’ve never met a conservative in my life who accepted that “losing” might just be an objective judgment by the righteous Invisible Hand on their own self-worth.
@debit: Is Ellie warming up to her? You’d said earlier that Ellie was sort of distant (for want of a better term).
Not if the speaker works the sound booth for the troubadour’s recordings.
There’s lots of info out in the real world about con games and con artists– IMO, there ought to be a standard reading list starting with Melville’s ‘The Confidence Man’.
Anyhow, the relevant fine distinction wrt Trump is between the short con and the long con. The short con is when you lose all the money in your pockets. The long con is when you are sent home to fetch the rest of your valuable possessions. Trump is the master of the long con.
Fwiw, I don’t have much sympathy for people who have been fooled– the knowledge is all out there and has been out there for, literally, centuries.
I question a definition of “access” that includes things you can’t partake in. In all those cases, you can’t partake because you can’t afford. This bill allows access for the working poor to emergency care and vaccinations only, then sticks the rest of us with the bill they can’t pay. Socialized healthcare in the most sloppy way possible. Maybe some people will pay out of pocket for physical exams, but good luck affording treatment if you’re diagnosed with anything.
@debit: First Walter, now Kelpie. Seriously, you help restore my faith in mankind. Wow. Just Wow.
@Yarrow: You think twitler would even consider for a nanosecond reading such sob stories? They won’t even cross the path of daily ‘briefs’, which are only pox news and breitfart baits.
@germy: that’s my death metal album
@Ruviana: Ellie is fine with Kelpie following her around in the back yard, and will hang out with her, but they’re not buddies yet. I think they’ll get there.
@schrodingers_cat: Bannon is probably the actual President so we need to hear about him as much as possible since we will be living under his White Supremacist-influenced policies for awhile. Trump is just the dumb figurehead. Reminds me of the Cheney/Bush dynamic.
@debit: Oh, she’s gorgeous.
I think I might adopt an older pet once I’m back from traveling.
Agreed. Plus “Melania has very high favorables!”
Amen, enough of these bullshit memes,
They were suckers who wanted to be suckered, because the other side was stealing their country.
Bannon is an evil fascist/ racist thug which anyone with a brain could have told you.
Lucretia is the spawn of a narcissistic sociopath and she may have more polish but she didn’t fall far from the tree.
You’re right, at this point these stories are amusing, in the sense of how stupid and delusional these people are. I know they don’t trust the MSM, liberal media, but FFS, didn’t they notice that New Yorker’s who’ve know him for decades hated him and wanted absolutely no part of him. In fact his home rejected him at a higher level than anywhere else, DC may have been higher. The only part of NYC that supported him was Staten Island, which is probably only because he’s probably never stepped foot on it. Like Twitler SI feels put upon and looked down on by the rest of the city. Hey Staten Island, you proved that everything we ever thought about you is true, assholes.
The general thing to keep in mind during this phase of resistance is that we may have some overlapping interests and can make common cause with people for specific parts of the resistance. Our interests are not identical and so it is likely we will find ourselves at odds with some of our allies in the healthcare fight when we are dealing with immigration, criminal justice, civil rights, taxation, impeachment, etc. This is going to be confusing, maddening, frustrating, head on desk banging work for awhile.
@debit: Oh, you made me cry, too!
Blessings on your lovely endeavor.
@LAO: You really give me too much credit. I can take care of a special needs dog knowing I’m going to be sad when they pass because I know that my sadness won’t last forever. All the dog knows is whether or not they are happy and loved in the moment. If I can give that, then the coming sorrow is worth it.
Dr. Ronnie James, D.O.
As furious as I am at this guy for voting for the [VOID] currently occupying the White House, I think we need to create an opening in society where it’s OK for regretful Trump voters to come forward and be accepted. And yes, his journey to enlightenment is nowhere near complete, but cmon. If people succumbed to groupthink in voting for Trump, and we can use groupthink to get them to unvote him out of office, given the stakes I am 100% abso-fucking–lutely OK with that.
@debit: Kudos to you for sharing your home and heart with Kelpie.
Kelpie is gorgeous! I love her already. Please give Ellie and the cats some skritches for me.
I’m glad he’s seeing the light. There’s some poll data suggesting that some of the Trump voters are, in fact, coming to their senses – the latest Quinnipiac poll (the 37-26 favorability poll) had his support dropping by 10% among Republicans, so he may be a harbinger.
I see and have seen a lot of posts along the lines of “we don’t want these folks” and similar DIAF views. I get that, and I’m mad at them, too. I won’t pander to the bad views they hold and don’t think the Dems should go back on important values to get those voters. But we need to be ready to forgive them if they come to the light side. Even Darth Vader redeemed himself in the end.
@debit: You are such a good human being.
@debit: Glad to hear.
ICYMI: Smartypants reminds us of why this bill is being rushed:
Every day the GOP is delayed is a victory.
I’m tired of reading these stories too, but the career of one John Edwards ought to remind us that any of us can fall for a con. The thing here is, the Trump con was based on people’s hatreds as well as hopes.
@amk: Heavens, no! He doesn’t read! But at some point enough stories like this and TV coverage of some of it will seep through. His people are disappointed and disillusioned with him. They don’t like him anymore. His rallies are smaller. He’ll notice.
@debit: Nah. Accept credit where credit is due. It took me almost 15 years to replace my last dog with my current dog — so allow me my admiration.
@Kropadope: Re: has this person never met a republican before?
Yeah, every time he looks in the mirror. It’s the way their minds work and frankly I feel no sympathy for people who wanted to hurt others but end up getting hoist by their own petards. I am also getting tired of media stories which portray these arsonists who get burned in their own fires as victims.
@JMG: Most women could see through John Edwards, we have known bastards like him all our lives.
Staten Island also is the only part of the city that contains large numbers of the mythical WWC (OK, there are “white” working class people in other boroughs, but Polish immigrant carpenters in Queens aren’t what we usually mean by that term).
As I keep saying, a lot (for me) depends on what “being fooled” means. If you were fooled in the sense that you honestly and idiotically thought Trump would make things better for everyone, that’s one thing. If you were fooled in the sense that you thought Trump would screw over a lot of people and just didn’t expect to be one of them, that’s something very different. And everything we’ve seen out of the Republican electorate in recent decades implies that most of them were in the second camp, which is why I have so little sympathy for them. They fully expected millions of people to be kicked in the teeth by Trump’s presidency, and it’s exactly what they wanted. They just didn’t think they’d be among them.
I took a walk down memory lane and listened to audio of Paul Ryan addressing Atlas Shrugged org on Ayn Rand bday ann plus some reading articles about his Rand love before he tried to play down being a Rand groupie. Of course he is the same ideologue.
Watching Ryan giddy with excitement at his opportunity to get another shot at his lifelong dream of setting the “takers” free makes my skin crawl. I wonder if he still hands out copies of Atlas Shrugged to his staffers but surreptitiously.
@ruemara: Why would you sell your possessions to sing at rallies for a Billionaire? I’m gobsmacked at his stupidity. Speechless.
Do they have to worry about ICE raids?
@Elizabelle: I’m (obviously) a big advocate for adopting older pets. They have so much love to give.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
They thought Niemoller was an instructions manual, but always seem to forget the last line.
It’s all relative, compared with her husband’s 37- 40% her 52% favorable and 32% unfavorable,(3/8).
Michelle was way more popular a was her husband two months in, Michelle 72% to 17%, and Barrack eclipsed them both too, 69% to 28%.
Do you want to know who knows these numbers and wakes up every morning thinking about them? It’s eating away at him, like Lady Macbeth with her damn spot, why can’t those Obama people just go away and everyone realize how good they have it now?
@debit: that’s sweet. thank you…
@SFAW: 40% of the undocumented/”illegal immigrants” are visa overstays, so they are not necessarily Mexican or even people from South America. There are fair number of Irish and Russian and East European overstays in the big coastal cities.
@debit: She looks like a real sweetheart.
I wish there were more information out that older outdoor dogs CAN learn things they’ve never been asked to in the past. (With a patient caregiver.) And about the way to go about trying to housebreak such a dog.
He’s hoping they’ll get so tired of “winning” that they go away?
@Betty Cracker: I understand the feeling, but unfortunately in a Democracy, we need to find a way to get to 55% of the vote. We need that much to switch the House and put Democratic Governors into power Red States that should be Blue like Wisconsin, Michigan, and Ohio.
Why has a lot of the white working class drifted off to Fox land? Over the last 30, well for a lot of the reasons Tom Franks mentions in “Listen Liberal.” Democrats did nothing to slow or reverse the decline of unions, and Walker used his political power to cut off union funding of Democrats. The did not create other groups and bring them on to the table. and of course, they did not do enough to prevent Republicans the 1,000 from get a monetary death grip on American politics. Why did Russ Feingold lose to a nitwit like Ron Johnson twice? Well, in the last election 30 million dollars of ths dark money came into Wisconsin in the last two weeks of the campaign and help carry the state for Johnson and Trump. And there was no longer a union movement in the State that could oppose those lies.
When people become alienated and isolated, they vulnerable to those who want to recruit them.
If his son was still alive, he’d still be a traitor. What a horrible lesson about how these people think.
Even within the world of fake news/conspiracy theories/wev, you can tell a lot about a person by what they choose to fall for. Like, really, you believe that thousands of Muslims were celebrating 9/11 in New Jersey, that black people buying homes caused the financial crisis, and that the reason your health care sucks is because Obamacare gives millions of your tax money to illegal immigrants? I understand that you’re falling for fairy tales, but why those fairy tales in particular? And not, you know, “NASA faked the moon landings,” “Elvis is still alive,” or “in a lake in Scotland there is a plesiosaurus that’s somehow managed to survive for 150 million years without getting caught?” Answer: because you’re deeply invested in believing the worst of a certain group of people, whom you define by ethnic or sectarian identity, in a way that you aren’t in space technology or dinosaurs.
I know believe me I know, I have the misfortune of living right by the Outerbridge, and they venture across the bridge all the time to do their shopping, they are a special breed of people, not pleasant. I’ve lived all around NYC but not in it since 1992, and they are by far the most unpleasant.
@Ian G.: I always refer to Staten Island as the “Alabama” of New York City.
Probably because she’s the first person in Trump’s orbit openly rejecting him.
I don’t know why you people aren’t as vicious to victims of Trump University or any other number of cons you have to be pretty stupid and/or ethically compromised to fall for. A bunch of folks here need to make up their mind whether they can afford compassion to people who are just generally stupid or stupidly desperate. Here we’re confronted with a story of a person improving their understanding, the very kind of transformation we depend upon to uproot this disaster, and this group mostly just offers a collective “fuck you.”
The idea of these stories is now to build a permission structure for others to admit they got conned. Our job is to cluck sympathetically no matter what dances of disgust might be going on inside, because the sympathetic clucking will form a wide & welcoming path for others who are seeing that just maybe they were utterly duped and that the consequences are going to be very, very bad. For them, personally. And for people they actually know.
I cannot get over even now the depth of their certainty that us Democrats have always had contempt for them. That’s the platform on which this whole stinking pile of garbage was built, and it was created right in front of us, for decades.
@debit: How’s Kelpie doing with the peeing in the house thing? Have you figured it out yet?
Mike in DC
Paul Manafort, through his lawyer, “volunteers” to sit for an interview with the House Permanent Select committee on intelligence. Presumably to discuss his profound and undying love for the 5th Amendment.
@schrodingers_cat: I have had au pairs for a long time, none from Eastern Europe, but the rate of “overstayed” au pair visas is apparently so high among certain East European countries that the State Department started refusing to approve visas for them. I had an au pair overstay from a South American country. She is now married and she travels internationally so I assume she was able to fix her visa status.
@Mike in DC: No, presumably to become the next Oliver North who can’t be prosecuted because Congress offered him use immunity.
Breaking news on the WaPost:
Adam Schiff doing a news conference in a few. No idea if these two are related.
Popcorn time? Or watch out for squid ink?
Why the Rush To Repeal Obamacare? It’s All About the Tax Cuts
by Nancy LeTourneau
March 24, 2017 8:01 AM
Why all the rush? The explanation has more to do with what is next on the Republican agenda – tax cuts – than it does with health care. I have noted previously that this second item is dependent on successful completion of the first. Chye-Ching Huang did a great job of explaining why.
Huang goes on to quote Speaker Ryan himself making that case in an interview with Maria Bartiromo.
What Ryan didn’t mention is that the plan has been to do both Obamacare repeal and tax cuts in the Senate via the process of budget reconciliation (which bypasses the possibility of a filibuster) in order to avoid needing any Democratic support. But there are a lot of rules involved with reconciliation – like the fact that bills passed via that process cannot add to the deficit over the next 10 years.
Is the picture starting to come together? Republicans want to pass trillions of dollars of tax cuts, but have to offset their costs in order to use the reconciliation process and avoid having to work with Democrats. Because Obamacare repeal gives them an offset by reducing things like Medicaid to the tune of about $800 billion, it allows them to pile up those tax cuts.
In other words, it’s not just that Speaker Ryan has been dreaming about dismantling Medicaid since he went to keggers. He needs to reduce the money we’re spending on health care for the poor and disabled in order to fund his tax cuts for the wealthy. It’s really that simple.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Mike in DC: this happened? I’m wondering if that will have any impact on votes today, how much Russian music is in the background of those people being asked to walk the plank for Trump and Ryan
To the people here talking about how big is the dems big tent is and we need to extend them a hand and all that, remember these are the very people, who, even after all the twitler, gopee & co ratfucking them, will gladly chop off your hand and burn your big tent to the ground.
Tilda Swintons Bald Cap
@sherparick: I’ll just quote Kay:
Stop blaming Democrats for every wrong that’s been perpetrated by Republicans since the age of Reagan. The WWC voted for him and started their own decline. They need to own it.
Victims of Trump University were at least falling for a ploy that promised personal betterment. It didn’t deliver, but these people may not have had the knowledge to judge what was a credible educational facility. They also didn’t inflict the sort of collateral damage that Trump voters did. In fact, I bet most of them voted against Trump.
@hitchhiker: In all honesty, the comments on the Indiana Public Media story on steak shed Roberto’s upcoming deportation are “you stupid suckers” variety. Pretty much what we would say here, but I do wonder what the conservative Hoosiers following Roberto’s story make of that.
It’s too much meanness, going on too long. From libtards. Does not reflect well. Although Helen the Greek was an IDIOT to vote for Trump, given circumstances in her very own family.
Yes, I know. As I said: do they have to worry about ICE raids?
Or, to be more blunt: if the stereotypical (for white people) Jose Martinez and Sean Padraig O’Flaherty were standing next to each other, and the deport-o-cops were on the hunt, at whom would la migra aim first?
My wife lived on Staten Island for a few years because she had a job there. Soon after she moved there, we went to the movies to see “Working Girl” at the big multiplex. The SI natives didn’t laugh at some of the funny parts because apparently they thought it was a documentary.
A lot of Mafiosi used to live there, and Staten Islanders were kind of proud of that. They’d point out the fancy houses on the top of the hill. On the other hand, there’s a Tibetan museum there, so go figure. Also, some really good, cheap Italian food. There was a place we used to go that my wife said reminded her of her junior year abroad in Rome.
@Aleta: Agreed. For Kelpie, since she’s blind, I tethered her to me for the first few days. I would have like to have crated her at night, but she was having none of it, so there were a few pee accidents the first couple of overnights. If she started to pee inside, I just said, “Let’s go outside!” in a really bright voice and then praised her once she was out and resumed. Praise, praise, praise every time she peed or pooped outside. Now she’s maybe having one pee accident a day, but only when unattended. If someone’s home, she comes up to them to let them know she needs out. Like I said, really smart.
@debit: She’s a beauty. So good that she has found a loving family to be with for the remainder of her life.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
Moss isn’t an idiot, he’s just a simple troll. During the election he supported Trump just to piss people off, now Trump’s president he’s against Trump, just to piss people off. Behold the Modern Right; Shock Jock Clowns all screaming insults all the way down.
And it goes back to Trump’s real problem that is his base is just about pissing other people off. That’s not much to build on. Trump thinks he’s the new Andrew Jackson, but Jackson wasn’t killing Indians just to pollute himself to the sound of their agony, he wanted to steal their land to create the Jackson’s dream society. Evil yes, but a bit more than being an asshole
@germy: And let’s not forget that Trump tweeted condolences about the Utah man killed in the London terror attack, but somehow didn’t find the time to tweet about this American killed in a NYC terror attack at roughly the same time.
sheila in nc
@schrodingers_cat: Just to be clear: I’m making no excuses for Edwards’s love life, but on policy, he was absolutely spot on. Great campaign message about the “two Americas” (rich vs non-rich).
Trump’s Plans For Slashing Government Follow “A Sinister Script”
A Q&A with Rep. Gerry Connolly, whose district includes the third largest number of federal workers in the country.
by Anne Kim and Saahil Desai March 24, 2017
President Donald Trump’s recently proposed 2018 budget calls for massive and unprecedented cuts in domestic discretionary spending, including a 31% cut in the budget for the EPA, a 29% cut for the State Department, and double-digit reductions at a host of other federal agencies charged with everything from maintaining the nation’s national parks to securing the safety of America’s food supply. It’s a down payment on what White House chief strategist Stephen Bannon has called the “deconstruction of the administrative state.”
Every citizen in the country would feel the impact of these cuts, if approved by Congress, but the pain would be especially acute for the constituents of Rep. Gerry Connolly (D-VA), whose diverse northern Virginia district is home to the third highest number of federal workers in the country.
Connolly, a five-term member who serves on the House Foreign Affairs Committee, the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee and as Whip for the New Democrat Coalition, has emerged as an outspoken voice in the Democratic opposition to Trump. We spoke with Connolly recently.
WM: The federal government has always been a punching bag for countless politicians. What’s different about what President Trump and Bannon are proposing?
Connolly: I think it’s qualitatively different. This administration, led by Bannon and his acolytes, is actively practicing a form of nihilism and chaos theory to disrupt the entire enterprise.
[Trump] has talked about “dismantling the administrative state.” [But] what he calls the “Swamp” or the “administrative state” – we call public health, safety, and protection. He would dismantle the regulatory framework that provides clean air, clean water, safety for kids, consumer goods, a safe drug supply, a safe food supply and the like. And to say nothing of a robust R&D operation that guarantees us innovation and jobs in the future. He’s made no secret of what his agenda is, and I think this budget, his Cabinet decisions and his other actions and words are very much consistent with this disruptive theory of politics.
Exactly. When I open my front door, I can see it right across the water, and yet, apart from driving across it to go to JFK and once taking family to the train station so they could take the train to the ferry and see the Statue of Liberty on their way into the City, I’ve never stepped foot there, and I’ve lived here for 13 years.
@rikyrah: And yet, were I to murder you for the insurance money, I’d get prison.
Freedom! Teatard Caucus member Dave Brat’s three office phone lines are either straight to voicemail or ringing busy.
Good, good, good. Stick to your NO, you patriot you.
@Elizabelle: Can you imagine the conversation this guy and his wife are having?
Roberto: “Thanks a lot. No seriously. Thanks. A. Lot. You fucking IDIOT. You stupid fucking IDIOT. WTF am I going to do?”
Helen, sobbing hysterically: “I DIDN’T KNOW. I SWEAR I DIDN’T THINK…”
Roberto: “That’s right. You didn’t. fucking. think. Now what the fuck are we gonna do? Pardon me, what the fuck am *I* going to do?”
@debit: Must have been tough for Elie after her loss (and iirc Walter came in part for her because she’d lost a good pal). I admire how you act to fill her needs too. And I admire your teaching ability. It’s subtle; and I’m learning from you.
White House finding new ways to throw Manafort under the bus
03/24/17 09:23 AM
By Steve Benen
White House Press Secretary Sean Spicer probably wasn’t trying to be funny this week with his answers about Paul Manafort, but he nevertheless generated laughter. Asked about Donald Trump’s former campaign chairman, caught up in the Russia scandal, Spicer described Manafort as someone “who played a very limited role for a very limited amount of time.”
Manafort, of course, effectively ran the campaign when Trump secured and accepted the Republican Party’s presidential nomination.
Yesterday, Spicer went just a little further, dismissing the former Trump campaign chairman as someone who was on the team “for five months.”
@Barbara: BINGO! And once he is granted use immunity, like North he will proceed to blab about every last incriminating piece of information that he hasn’t been asked about, to make it unusable against him.
@Yarrow: I am pretty sure it was a UTI. I had some antibiotics on hand, so I started her on them that night and the peeing stopped the next morning. She has a vet appointment tomorrow, and we’ll get a urine sample, but I’m 99.9% sure it’s almost resolved.
@rikyrah: Interesting article about Gerry Connolly (my former rep).
Virginia has a governor’s race this year, and NoVA is vote-rich. I think Ted Cruz’s shutting down the government helped Terry McAuliffe win (rather narrowly) in 2013. People were furious about the shutdown.
So maybe we will see a positive Trump effect this fall. Virginia’s got a horribly gerrymandered state legislature, cruel morons at the helm, so Democrats really need to retain the governorship.
Terry McAuliffe has done a great job. Very impressed with him. Way beyond expectations in sticking to his principles. And very accessible. I smile at all the tourists and other people who show me selfies with our guv.
@sheila in nc: Agreed about the message but he did always seem insincere to me.
@germy: Got it.
Having sympathy for people fooled by Trump is natural– but let me ask a few questions:
1) Can you really believe what these people are saying? Bear in mind that a primary motivation for falling for a con is the possibility of getting in on the action. These people are not all sweet innocents, despite what they saying.
2) Suppose they really were innocent and they really were fooled. Do you think they’ve learned a lesson? Changing the way you see the world is a very hard thing to do.
3) Bear in mind that we libtards are just soft-hearted by nature. Wouldn’t it make more sense to be a teensy bit suspicious?
4) Do you really believe anything Glenn Beck says?
@Dr. Ronnie James, D.O.: awesome name!
@bupalos: The people who were suckered by Trump University were hoping to get rich in real estate. They were not supporting a politician who promised to do horrible things to vulnerable people.
Big difference, that.
@rikyrah: I’ve been saying for awhile, Trump will throw EVERYONE under the bus, with the possible exception of Ivanka, before he leaves or is forced out of office. Bannon may think he’s masterminding how they handle Manafort, but he needs to watch his back. The only safe one is Ivanka. Maybe.
@brendancalling: Their kids are getting ragged at school too.
Not sure whether it’s more for having an illegal immigrant for a dad, or a Trump-voting moron married to an illegal immigrant for a mom.
Latest article I saw, the Trump voting mama was putting a positive spin on it. She and Roberto will have an extended vacay on the Maya Riviera, while they wait nine months for Roberto’s green card to come through.
Which makes me think there was some political intervention, if they’ve got that nine-month date in mind. Maybe Pence or whoever did not want to flaunt the rules (bad hombre! Back to Mexico for you!), but a green card has been promised. Roberto applied for one TEN years ago.
@rikyrah: Its a Russian coup. They want to destroy our assets.
@randy khan: And some beautiful beaches, and some of the worse “remuddled” houses, too. But overall, you nailed Staten Island.
For reasons he didn’t share, my brother lived there for a few years back in the Aughts, and yes, even as a temporary resident, he made sure to drive us past the Mafiosi’s old digs.
@Yarrow: Ivanka is safe because Ivanka has conditioned her response to her father to ensure her own safety. She will never deviate from the path that ensures her own safety and she has a lifetime of learning just how narrow or wide the path is depending on what is at stake for her father. No one else has that, that’s why they can’t be safe like Ivanka.
@debit: Glad to hear that! You are such a good pet parent and dong such a great thing helping and caring for an older dog. I hope you get to enjoy each others’ company for a long time yet.
@Ohio Mom: There was an Italian restaurant in the neighborhood where I grew up (‘La Stella’) that was a well-known Mafia hangout. I later met a woman who was the daughter of a local prosecutor, who told me a few scary stories. A very good, very traditional restaurant, btw.
@SFAW: Indeed. Many years ago in this comments section, I gave the Republican WWC version (updated):
First they came for the communists, and I did not speak out – because — Come on, they’re communists;
Then they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out – because socialist/communist, same thing;
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out – because corrupt union bosses in the pocket of the Democrat party are ruining our country;
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out – because, look, Ivanka is Jewish;
Then they came for me, and that’s when I realized that those bastards were Jewish Communist Socialist Trade Unionists after all!
As someone said recently, sure, I empathize with people like this who realize only now that Trump sold them a bill of goods, but I don’t feel sorry for them. Grow up, be a goddamned responsible citizen, educate yourself, understand the policies you vote for. Until then, you can help yourself to a nice cup of STFU.
Here’s a March 9 item from local NBC station near South Bend, WNDU. On Trump-voting Helen the Greek and the deportable Roberto.
@Barbara: I wonder about Jared, though. Will Ivanka save him from her dad?
@Elizabelle: If his green card comes through. Over a decade of ignoring a deportation order might be a bit of a roadblock there.
@Elizabelle: She is stupid. My au pairs have their social security cards and driver’s license. It doesn’t convey a right to stay in the country once their J-1 visa expires.
Remember that scene in Aliens, where Paul Reiser’s character, the weasely corporate guy, shows how awful he can be by locking Ripley and little Newt in with a facehugger?
And then, after they humanely decided not to kill him, he has his own encounter with a grown Giger Alien?
Trump voter. And I never get tired of that scene.
@Yarrow: He is a billionaire. In what world does he need “saving” unless we are talking about a Putin style hit?
Please. The people who were scammed at Trump U were victims. They were promised something of value for the money they paid. Maybe they were stupid or naive to believe they would get what they were promised, but it was a business transaction and they were cheated.
The people like the guy mentioned in the story weren’t buying goods or services. They were buying hate and licked up every bit of it and asked for more. No one at those rallies can claim they didn’t know exactly what they were about. They were a mob screaming for blood and the only reason they have regrets now is because it’s their blood slaking the crowd’s thirst.
@PPCLI: Yeah. Overstaying a visa is an automatic bar to re-entering the country for a long period of years, is it not? No doubt why his immigration attorney worked out the original deal for him after the 2000 stop in Canada.
Trump makes it sound so simple — go back to your home country and do the paperwork there. Like you can then pop right back into the U.S.
No doubt another assurance he makes in blessed ignorance. He’s never had to learn about it, and someone pulled strings for Melania.
@debit: The information on the web I found about older, outdoor pen, unneutered dogs was all negative, and so when I brought one home I believed I might not be up for the job, or have the energy and skills. In his case, all that information was inaccurate. (From the start he’s been much easier than a young untrained dog, and a faster learner than most puppies, and no destruction, zilch.)
“After all,” said Helen, briefly looking up from watching Hannity, “we’re still white, aren’t we? So what’s to complain? Well, except for all those coloreds taking jobs away from us hard-working real Americans, that is. I got me some real economic anxiety about that, I surely do.”
Amazing thing, no one in the Greek family has Mrs. Helen the Trump voter running the restaurant. They know her abilities.
@Elizabelle: Ten years wait for GC when your spouse is a citizen does not sound right. I think we don’t know all the details of his case.
@WereBear: I like the scene where they debate what to do with him. “I say we grease this little rat fuck son of a bitch right now. No offense.” I never get tired of that line.
I really want to see some I shoulda voted for Hillary t-shirts around the Midwest.
@Kropadope: I’d say if you didn’t know that getting rich by Trumpian real estate methods would necessarily involve taking advantage of others, then those folks at the least get an extra -10 in the intelligence department. Trump markets on greed and getting over on others, they may be hurt, but ME FIRST NO MATTER WHAT! It’s no different to my mind than his political stance.
@Barbara: To Trump, Ivanka does not exist as her own person. She is an ego reflection.
Something I’ve been wondering about: I’ve seen it posited here and there in the media/’Net that a TrumpCare rejection by the House will damage President Trump’s reputation as a “dealmaker extraordinaire”. Leaving aside, for the moment, the actual record that Donald Trump’s “dealmaking” prowess has only been truly effective at making large amounts of money for himself, personally, I’m wondering, exactly, what, IF ANY, input the WH has had in producing this horrible botch of the AHCA? AFAICR, Trump has basically limited his (Administration’s) input to running around the country making hot-air brags about “his” “Great” plans; letting Congress come up with a “plan” and then backpedaling away from it as fast as his tiny hands can push. Oh, and of course, blame-shift and self-exculpate. With nasty Tweets.
@Aleta: I’m a big fan of Victoria Stillwell’s approach. I’m no dog trainer myself, but I agree that catching and encouraging good behavior is far more effective and productive than any sort of dominance or punitive methods.
@Neldob: This. Then we can start to believe them a lil bit.
@MattF: There are good reasons for eating where the Mafia eats; they had old-fashioned moms who knew how to cook this cuisine, which tends to be their favorite, so they are discriminating diners.
My NYC friends and I, however, were careful to not eat when the Mafia eats…
“How about Tony’s?”
Yup. This. No sympathy for this idiot. I’m sorry he lost his son, but I couldn’t care less about his burst bubble.
They’re morons. Their surprise is based off from two pieces of ignorance, probably deliberate.
1. Illegal immigrants are largely felons, drug dealers and other serious criminals and the illegal immigrants they know are the exceptions. They aren’t.
2. That Obama and Bush before him weren’t aggressively deporting the felons, drug dealers and other criminals. They were.
This leads us to the current reality. Because Bush and Obama were already aggressively deporting criminals and there isn’t some huge reservoir of criminal illegals to deport, increasing the number of deportations means Trump and ICE will be deporting the “Exceptions”.
Fixed that for you.
You seem to know a lot about this particular guy, most especially that he’s just like a whole group of people that you know all about, and whether their sons died or not, what they are really after is BLOOD!! And I guess you could be right. But I’m really not sure how you think you know that or what you think you get out of that certainty. From my point of view, you’re only helping Trump with that stuff.
@sherparick: I’m in favor of outreach to anyone, as long as it doesn’t entail compromising the principles of equality that should form the core of the Democratic Party. But no one should put me in charge of that outreach, because like I said, fuck that guy.
@Elizabelle: We have tried to reach out to conservatives and republican voters for about 40+ years and it’s only gotten worse not better while we have been kind. This time their rabid candidate is trying immediately to do things that will kill people we know. We told them it was serious. They did it anyway. Several people on this board have said” the republicans are trying to kill me”. I do not think anyone said that about Bush II and I hated him and still want him tried for using torture. This is way beyond the analogy of tire rims and anthrax. these people are them selves bad people. They may learn better but I actually don’t think they should be comforted and reassured. They can vote smarter, and then the next election and the next and they can apologize to people they have hurt and keep acting nice even while still not being fully embraced, and after years if they show they really get it, I may sort of trust some of them a little. Other people will make their own decisions but this election was serious. I am also trying not to throw any allies under the bus which the narrative be understanding to the anxious white working class narrative seems to always lead to. I think I will stick with the people who voted for my best interests even if they happen to be ethnically different than me rather than the spiteful fools who happen to share a thin layer of skin of similar hue but not a heart with me. It’s time for them to find out their are consequences for being mean and liars. Since I am hoping we can mitigate the worst damage which would fall on the innocent, that means I hope the Ryan Trump evil won’t fully happen and these people won’t experience another great depression. that means social outcasting is likely the only real impact and they deserve it. Otherwise we are enabling parents, which they always accuse us of being.
The anger this time is different. We are being unliberal spiteful. But everyone needs to notice this time the results are clearly much worse than prior elections and it is unbelievable that many people are truly surprised. Remember, they voted for a big liar and have a history of voting for liars that has been getting more serious over time. I have read the stories, and it is starting to occur to me, these people are lying. Not all of them and I can’t prove which ones where, but they are telling the story that they think makes them look more sympathetic. The bloodlust hit down part of this campaign was right out there, not hidden. They liked that. He gained support for doing things that we thought were unacceptable. Other republicans lost support when they acted nicer. I’d be stupid to forget that. Some of our neighbors are dangerous. I wouldn’t be friendly to a drug dealer or gang leader, I can’t trust a Trump voter see?
By the way on that Indiana restaurant family where dad’s being deported, he married a citizen in 2001 but still wasn’t a citizen in 2017 nor legal resident? that seems odd to me. I know immigration law is snarled, but is that believable?
What is the non-flag lapel pin that a lot of MoCs are wearing now? It seems to be the same one, and it seems to be both Republicans and Democrats, although I just noticed it in the last few days.
@bupalos: If you truly believe people like that can be redeemed, and are worth your time, patience and understanding, go forth and be patient and understanding. Spend your time feeling bad for them and trying to rehabilitate them.
I’m just a silly, stupid woman who tends to believe that when people attend, promote and sing at rallies where hatred is promoted are hateful themselves. You know, the rallies where they chanted “lock her up” had signs that said “Trump that bitch” and “Kill the cunt” and “Hate wins.” When someone tells me who they are, I believe them.
ETA: And I believe that people like that can’t be changed and won’t waste my time or energy on them.
@schrodingers_cat: I’d assumed it was the overstay and active order to deport. Don’t know beyond that. It is a long time, and they have an immigration attorney. Very strange.
What part of this nutjob literally troubadouring twitler in front of his blood thirsty racist mobs do you not get? When they show who they are in public, it’s stupid not to believe them.
Speak for yourself. Some of us don’t fall for any cons. Good hair or bad.
@bupalos: Also, too, for someone advocating understanding, you sure seem to be judgey and confrontational. Why aren’t you trying to understand me, buttercup?
@gvg: I think you are right. They are lying about their motives for voting for Trump, a lot of them. And they were susceptible to all the Hillary hate and misogyny. It’s been relentless.
I know I don’t have much patience with Trump voters, or those I suspect, when I come across them in real life. I mostly think to myself, I hope they spend until 2025 picking splinters out of their rectums, if they live that long. And that bad does not fall upon those of us who were smart enough to vote for Hillary.
The bad hombres are on this side of the border, too many of them.
Still, the symphony of derision heaped upon Helen the Greek in that blogpost was excessive. That said, a lot of the commenters might be folks who have had to live amidst conservative Hoosiers, practicing their Christianity. They’re big on that.
@JMG: WRT Edwards, I like that you separated out hope and hatred as reasons for being conned.
I was conned by Edwards. Weirdly, I think supporting John Edwards was a delivery system to being an Obama supporter. They hit some of the same themes, although only BHO was the authentic one.
@debit: Everything is always one-way street with special snowflakes.
Yep. Exactly. I feel the exact same way.
And since I am surrounded by these people every day of my life, I know who they are. I only know of one that regrets his vote. One. Out of the over 70% of my county who voted for him. Only one.
J R in WV
You go about teaching an older dog about going outside the same way as you do a puppy, but with a little more respect. And the older dogs learn much faster because they’re grown up and know they need to learn.
@satby: Like Nostrodamdus he was. I share that video with every negotiating team just to enlighten and focus the minds.
Sadly, when the MAGA’s realize they’ve been conned, I don’t expect them to hold it against the con artist, but those who warned them against the con artist. Thanks Obama.
He messed up, then he ‘fessed up. Welcome aboard, friend.
@debit: @debit:I apologize if it seemed too confrontational. I’ve mentioned here before that I have a rather dim witted Trump supporting neighbor who lost her son to heroin, and if this guy is like her, your characterization would be entirely unfair and seems to me to lack understanding of what grief can do to people. But beyond that, I really believe it’s counter productive.
I absolutely am trying to understand this mentality of “no backsies” when these people wising up and getting better is really our only way forward. I thought I pretty clearly stated I didn’t really understand it.
@?eric: ha, i missed that – awesome, indeed!
From the annals of “I didn’t think the Face-Eater Party would come for my face” and “Republicans are insensitive about anything that doesn’t impact them directly”…
This pretty much covers my reaction. I admit that I feel sympathy for this man’s loss. I know parents from Maine and Seattle who have lost children to heroin. It is soul crushing. But, I wonder every time I hear people talking about the need for help for addicts in this “unprecedented crisis” where these voices were when addiction was seen primarily as a non-white, urban issue. I wonder if they talked about lack of character instead lack of funding for naloxone. I can’t shake the feeling that this would have been the case.
I am heartily tired of hearing these stories from people who did not vote based upon facts but rather based on their own uninformed perceptions and bigotry. The leopards are coming for their faces and somehow their faces are more special, more pitiable that the faces of those who recognized the Trump Con and voted against it but will nevertheless be devoured. So, it is hard for me not to feel sorry for this man and his loss. It is harder, however, not to think he brought this shit upon himself.
@bupalos: Okay, I apologize for being flippant and dismissive. I truly do believe that people can have a come to Jesus moment, that they can change and become better people and truly feel contrition for harmful acts they’ve done against others. And I believe that it takes a certain amount of decency and self awareness to admit you were wrong, especially in public.
However, I think that Trump and his ilk attract a certain type of person, and that type of person holds views I find repugnant and offensive. I mentioned bloodthirsty crowds and I wasn’t kidding. Did Trump whip up his crowds with positives or negatives? With exhortations to understand dissenters or to silence them and kick them out? In short, did Trump punch up or punch down? I believe he punched down, and that his supporters enjoyed the prospect of/potential to punch down too, that, whoever they are otherwise (kind to kids and animals, generous in their church) part of them needs to punch down. I am not a saint and don’t pretend to be, but at least I can say that I don’t hurt others who are worse off than me. People who do, I think, have a basic flaw in their being, something that can’t be corrected or changed. I could be (and often am) wrong. But I will not try to help or understand someone who enjoys cruelty.
@debit: Good comment. They’re a different tribe, IMHO. We should stop allowing Fox News and Rush to radicalize them. It is not helping anyone, and not even themselves.
To be fair, the traitor unions of the police and firefighters were backstabbing their fellow unions all the way.
When their turn comes, and it will, nobody is going to shed any tears for them.
@gvg: This times a thousand.
to your question, He was an illegal immigrant. So he couldn’t legalize short of an amnesty being passed.
When it was Taneesha, the answer was harsh prison terms. When it was Tiffany, the poor thing needs a rehab center.
Dr. Ronnie James, D.O.
@?eric: Thx man!
@Betty Cracker: https://www.pinterest.com/pin/166351779960537263/
@Elizabelle: I think this is a story about a passive aggressive woman and maybe her in-laws not liking the dude so much?
I’ve been to Niagara Falls many times, and you just don’t blunder over the falls. Every time I’ve gone they’ve checked papers at the border even if it’s for a minute. My family lives on the East Coast which means when extended family (who aren’t US citizens and come on visas) came to stay we’d make day trips. And even if you can blunder over the border there how the heck does someone who is a legal immigrant along with an illegal immigrant think that going to Niagara Falls is a great idea if one person has paper issues? She claims she doesn’t know when the dude lost legal status but he’s been going to an ICE office every year. She votes for Trump anyways. Her husband buys the restaurant from her sister in January and the next month he gets detained in custody? What a coincidence!
I think she wanted a divorce but didn’t want to actually say she wanted a divorce.
@SFAW: Ok, that woman is a ghoul.
No One You Know
@MomSense: I can stand hear Trump voter remorse stories: they reinforce the stories from the other side, people who are fighting for their very lives in the face of grinning GOP indifference.
That needs to be a meme loud and clear: all the modern Republican party wants is that we eat, breed, vote, and die. Belief in them is light amusement to them.
I will never grow tired of being reminded of just how long it takes to educate a Republican.
And how long that education sticks when it’s time pull the lever again.
Let me add mine directed at you — fuck you. Fuck your dipshit neighbor and fuck you for trying to once again lay the fucking responsibility on the people who actually try to make this country a better place. Stop walking in here to chastise us you fuck, go try and talk the fucking racists and the willfully ignorant fucksticks you care so much about and see how fucking far you get. Some bitch in a CNN column tried to blame the Democrats and now here you are doing the same fucking thing.
You think telling these assholes to eat the shit sandwiches they made is counter productive, so fucking what, go have lunch with them and leave your fake fucking “can’t we all just get along” bullshit to yourself.
Just fuck off.
No One You Know
@bupalos: A number of commenters looked a little more deeply at how hard and how long this man campaigned to get exactly what he got.
After all, you want omelettes, ya gotta break a few eggs. That’s what that saying means. What made him think that his own chickens were safe?