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Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

A thin legal pretext to veneer over their personal religious and political desires

Only Democrats have agency, apparently.

They traffic in fear. it is their only currency. if we are fearful, they are winning.

Consistently wrong since 2002

Conservatism: there are some people the law protects but does not bind and others who the law binds but does not protect.

I’d hate to be the candidate who lost to this guy.

Imperialist aggressors must be defeated, or the whole world loses.

Too often we confuse noise with substance. too often we confuse setbacks with defeat.

JFC, are there no editors left at that goddamn rag?

Teach a man to fish, and he’ll sit in a boat all day drinking beer.

Second rate reporter says what?

I’d try pessimism, but it probably wouldn’t work.

Let us savor the impending downfall of lawless scoundrels who richly deserve the trouble barreling their way.

A sufficient plurality of insane, greedy people can tank any democratic system ever devised, apparently.

Schmidt just says fuck it, opens a tea shop.

You cannot shame the shameless.

Why is it so hard for them to condemn hate?

Speaking of republicans, is there a way for a political party to declare intellectual bankruptcy?

Since when do we limit our critiques to things we could do better ourselves?

I see no possible difficulties whatsoever with this fool-proof plan.

Do not shrug your shoulders and accept the normalization of untruths.

if you can’t see it, then you are useless in the fight to stop it.

Whoever he was, that guy was nuts.

Proof that we need a blogger ethics panel.

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You are here: Home / Politics / An Unexamined Scandal / Open Thread: Watching the (Moral) Defectives

Open Thread: Watching the (Moral) Defectives

by Anne Laurie|  March 31, 20175:59 am| 144 Comments

This post is in: An Unexamined Scandal, Dolt 45, Foreign Affairs, Open Threads, Republican Stupidity, Republican Venality, Trump Crime Cartel, Assholes

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Like if Don Knotts played Jack Ruby pic.twitter.com/LYIAeF8uqP

— Father Guido SarDShK (@ZeddRebel) March 31, 2017

Stunning exchange at Senate Intel:

Q: GOP Sen – ‘Why do #Russia active measures work?

A: @selectedwisdom – “Because #Trump embraces them." pic.twitter.com/XWSAzTnjkM

— Charles Lister (@Charles_Lister) March 30, 2017

FLASHBACK — Mike Flynn: “Lock her up! … If I did a tenth of what she did, I would be in jail”

Now he wants immunity https://t.co/mJKvZJvyBz pic.twitter.com/zl44VSL7ez

— Bradd Jaffy (@BraddJaffy) March 30, 2017

Michael Flynn's public offer (https://t.co/jdiBvNCr40) "suggests that he has nothing good to give the prosecutors." https://t.co/CFy1bSdtMX

— David Gura (@davidgura) March 31, 2017

… Although Flynn’s lawyer, Robert Kelner of Covington & Burling, refused to comment for the article, he tweeted out a statement teasing that “General Flynn certainly has a story tell, and he very much wants to tell it, should the circumstances permit.”

As an experienced lawyer, Kelner will know that the Justice Department would never grant immunity for testimony on these terms. Prosecutors would first require that Flynn submit to what’s called a proffer session in which Flynn would agree to tell everything he knows in exchange for the prosecutors agreeing not to use his statement against him. Only after the prosecutors heard what Flynn could offer in terms of evidence against others, and had an opportunity to assess his credibility, would they be willing to discuss any grants of immunity or a cooperation deal. At a minimum, the prosecutors would require Flynn’s lawyer to make a proffer outlining the information that Flynn could provide…

I suspect that Flynn’s lawyer is really targeting Congress. He is hoping that one of the Congressional committees will take the bait and grant him immunity in exchange for his testimony. If that happened, it would be extremely difficult to prosecute Flynn after he testified. Remember Oliver North?…

it's him circling wagons, not becoming a supergrass. If there's a case to be made prosecute and offer leniency at sentencing for testimony.

— Father Guido SarDShK (@ZeddRebel) March 30, 2017

There's a very short list of people Flynn would need to be able to incriminate for anyone to take him up on this deal https://t.co/kQG0wY0OgT

— John Tabin (@johntabin) March 30, 2017

Flynn, Page, Manafort…Amazing that of 4 suspects under investigation this guy has been the quietest this week. pic.twitter.com/qJglJ1mnGk

— Father Guido SarDShK (@ZeddRebel) March 31, 2017

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Reader Interactions

144Comments

  1. 1.

    David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch

    March 31, 2017 at 6:11 am

    JΞSŦΞR ✪ ΔCŦUAL³³º¹‏ @th3j35t3r 8h8 hours ago

    #FLASH A previously reliable source says they have 2 further sources stating Trump is “considering his options, including resignation”.

    1,045 replies 4,449 retweets 7,615 likes

  2. 2.

    Phylllis

    March 31, 2017 at 6:12 am

    The love of money is the root of all evil. From One Timothy (New Trump Revised Edition).

  3. 3.

    The Pale Scot

    March 31, 2017 at 6:14 am

    For Whovians,

    Rowan Atkinson is Doctor Who

    IT”S FRIDAY, YEEAAA

  4. 4.

    OzarkHillbilly

    March 31, 2017 at 6:16 am

    @David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch: A source has 2 sources. No wonder our news is so fucked up.

  5. 5.

    David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch

    March 31, 2017 at 6:17 am

    Scott Dworkin‏ @funder

    Long story short: 10 mafia members were arrested by FBI today that have ties to Trump, Russian mob & Felix Sater #trumprussia #russiagate

    http://www.cnn.com/2017/03/28/us/new-york-mafia-allegations/

    FBI Visits Office of Saipan Casino Run by Trump Protege
    by Matthew Campbell
    March 30, 2017, 3:20 PM PDT March 30, 2017, 11:11 PM PDT

    Saipan local television, KSPN2, reported Thursday that there was an FBI raid at the Best Sunshine office. It’s not known whether Imperial Pacific was the target of any investigation or what law enforcement officials may have been seeking.

    Its board members include James Woolsey, who ran the U.S. Central Intelligence Agency in the early 1990s and was among national-security advisers to Trump’s presidential campaign. Former FBI director Louis Freeh and Ed Rendell, a former Pennsylvania governor and Democratic National Committee chairman, sit on an advisory committee, as does Haley Barbour, the ex-Mississippi governor and Republican National Committee chairman who’s now a prominent lobbyist.

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-03-30/fbi-agents-visit-office-of-saipan-casino-run-by-trump-protege

    It seems they’re going to get them on money laundering.

  6. 6.

    David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch

    March 31, 2017 at 6:22 am

    Why has Trump’s cybersecurity adviser’s website mysteriously disappeared?
    DNS records for the Giuliani Security website have been deleted, and the IP address isn’t working either.

    Mary-Ann Russon
    By Mary-Ann Russon
    January 16, 2017 12:38 GMT

    http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/why-has-trumps-cybersecurity-advisers-website-mysteriously-disappeared-1601291

    Dumfounded‏ @j2dumfounded

    Just a reminder that cyber security “expert” Giuliani has investments in Russian oil company Transneft.
    What could go wrong?

    1:34 PM – 31 Jan 2017
    10 replies 127 retweets 85 likes

    To quote All the President’s Men: “If you guys can get John Mitchell Giuliani that would be beautiful”.

  7. 7.

    Ceci n est pas mon nym

    March 31, 2017 at 6:24 am

    @David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch: Let’s say Trump resigns, now or later, and Pence, not yet under indictment, takes over. Do we get a repeat of the Ford-pardoning-Nixon thing? Can they head off our hearing the evidence and Trump facing consequences? Or are there parts of this process which are inevitably going to drag his butt into criminal court, regardless of whatever games his cronies play?

  8. 8.

    David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch

    March 31, 2017 at 6:24 am

    .

  9. 9.

    JPL

    March 31, 2017 at 6:29 am

    I’m skeptical of the idea that the walls are closing in on Trump. I would think that he’d want to keep Ivanka from having a formal role, in order to protect her.

  10. 10.

    David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch

    March 31, 2017 at 6:29 am

    Meanwhile, on the Alt-Left:

    Armando‏ @armandodkos

    Imagine what The Intercept would be publishing if Hillary Clinton’s former National Security Advisor had sought immunity.

    5:55 PM – 30 Mar 2017

    11 replies 59 retweets 179 likes

    Benghazi Jim Halpert‏ @Wilson__Valdez

    Instead….crickets. Really tells you a lot about who they are.

    2 replies 14 retweets 49 likes

  11. 11.

    David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch

    March 31, 2017 at 6:31 am

    @JPL: As his daughter/common law wife, Ivanka Lolita couldn’t be compelled to testify.

  12. 12.

    David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch

    March 31, 2017 at 6:34 am

    Charlie Savage @charlie_savage

    Exclusive: Trump declares Somalia a war zone, lifts Obama’s civilian protection rules for airstrikes, commando raids

    6:25 AM – 30 Mar 2017

    244 replies 2,759 retweets 1,117 likes

    but, but….. revolutionary Susan Sarandon assured us Trump was a pacifist.

  13. 13.

    David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch

    March 31, 2017 at 6:38 am

    Scott Dworkin‏ @funder

    Long story short: 10 mafia members were arrested by FBI today that have ties to Trump, Russian mob & Felix Sater #trumprussia #russiagate

    http://www.cnn.com/2017/03/28/us/new-york-mafia-allegations/

    FBI Visits Office of Saipan Ca$in0 Run by Trump Protege
    by Matthew Campbell
    March 30, 2017, 3:20 PM PDT March 30, 2017, 11:11 PM PDT

    Saipan local television, KSPN2, reported Thursday that there was an FBI raid at the Best Sunshine office. It’s not known whether Imperial Pacific was the target of any investigation or what law enforcement officials may have been seeking.

    Its board members include James Woolsey, who ran the U.S. Central Intelligence Agency in the early 1990s and was among national-security advisers to Trump’s presidential campaign. Former FBI director Louis Freeh and Ed Rendell, a former Pennsylvania governor and Democratic National Committee chairman, sit on an advisory committee, as does Haley Barbour, the ex-Mississippi governor and Republican National Committee chairman who’s now a prominent lobbyist.

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-03-30/fbi-agents-visit-office-of-saipan

    I saw Barbour on msnbc yesterday, he looked panicked and spent his time screaming about the liberal media.

    It seems they’re going to get them on money laundering.

  14. 14.

    NotMax

    March 31, 2017 at 6:38 am

    “It profits a man nothing to give his soul for the whole world, but for Wales Putin?”

  15. 15.

    bystander

    March 31, 2017 at 6:40 am

    Clinton Watts is coming up on Morning Joe. Just chug some Pepto and let’s watch.

  16. 16.

    bystander

    March 31, 2017 at 6:41 am

    NB: Joe contends that the “illegal” unmasking of Flynn is “5% of the story.”

  17. 17.

    NotMax

    March 31, 2017 at 6:41 am

    @
    David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch

    Never forget that Barbour was prominent among those who traveled to Hong Kong harbor to be handed briefcases stuffed with cash intended for the G.O.P.

  18. 18.

    bystander

    March 31, 2017 at 6:45 am

    It was Obama’s fault: He didn’t realize quickly enough that the repub candidate would actually collude with Putin.

  19. 19.

    rikyrah

    March 31, 2017 at 6:48 am

    Good Morning, Everyone???

  20. 20.

    bystander

    March 31, 2017 at 6:48 am

    @JPL:

    I would think that he’d want to keep Ivanka from having a formal role, in order to protect her.

    Trump is using Lolita to protect him, not the other way around. Remember we’re talking about a narcissist.

  21. 21.

    JPL

    March 31, 2017 at 6:51 am

    @bystander: Your jesting, I hope.

  22. 22.

    David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch

    March 31, 2017 at 6:51 am

    @rikyrah: Good morning!

  23. 23.

    David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch

    March 31, 2017 at 6:54 am

    The New Yorker has a comprising photo of Trump, Bannon, and Conway (photo)

  24. 24.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    March 31, 2017 at 7:03 am

    @David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch: Amazing photo.

  25. 25.

    debbie

    March 31, 2017 at 7:05 am

    @David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch:

    I call bullshit.

  26. 26.

    debbie

    March 31, 2017 at 7:06 am

    @JPL:

    That would assume he is a loving father who puts his daughter before himself. Silly JPL!

  27. 27.

    OzarkHillbilly

    March 31, 2017 at 7:10 am

    @JPL: It’s always Obama’s fault. Have you learned nothing?

    ps: how’s your commute?

  28. 28.

    bystander

    March 31, 2017 at 7:11 am

    @JPL: Sorry, I’m not jesting but it’s not what I think. Joe Scar asked Clint Watts what the Obama administration did wrong. Watts said they didn’t realize quickly enough what was going on with the Russian hacking and why.

  29. 29.

    bystander

    March 31, 2017 at 7:14 am

    @David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch: Why did I expect to see this pic of those three.

  30. 30.

    David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch

    March 31, 2017 at 7:15 am

    @debbie: He doesn’t like being President. It’s boring. If he could just do rallies and ride marine one and be on tee vee every day it would be fine. But he has to live in DC 4 days a week and it’s a boring town. Plus, he’s confined to the oval office most of the day, which means he can’t run around, sexually assaulting women.

    He would love to go back to his old life of money laundering, fornicating, golfing all day, talking pussÿ with Howard Stern, and running beauty pageants.

    Mr. 35% would welcome the relief of resignation.

  31. 31.

    debbie

    March 31, 2017 at 7:17 am

    @bystander:

    Watts, as in J.C.? Oh, please, he knows nothing — specially, he has no idea what Obama did and didn’t realize.

  32. 32.

    debbie

    March 31, 2017 at 7:19 am

    @David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch:

    I disagree. He may not be happy in his job, but with resignation comes the end of everything Donald. Not even Trump could be delusional enough to think he could go back to Trump Industries and make the kinds of deals and money he made before his campaign began.

  33. 33.

    lollipopguild

    March 31, 2017 at 7:21 am

    @David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch: People are refusing to kneel before Zod.

  34. 34.

    Fester Addams

    March 31, 2017 at 7:22 am

    Are they dragging the lake yet?

  35. 35.

    JPL

    March 31, 2017 at 7:22 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: If I need to go downtown, I take the train. Both of my sons live with two miles of work, so their impact will be minor. DIL takes 285 so she’ll have additional traffic. Fulton county schools have spring break next week so that should help. It’s going to be a long time before things get back to normal though.

  36. 36.

    Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes

    March 31, 2017 at 7:22 am

    @JPL:

    Remember – as a clinical NPD sociopath, he’s not a particularly loyal person at his core. He cocoons himself with his children not out of loyalty to them or adoration for them, but because they insulate him from criticism and consequences.

    In addition, he’s not very smart, so he hasn’t thought it through.

  37. 37.

    BlueDWarrior

    March 31, 2017 at 7:25 am

    @debbie: yeah, that’s why I think short of an authenticated sex tape, Trump will have to be dragged out of office.

  38. 38.

    JPL

    March 31, 2017 at 7:26 am

    @Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes: Jared is knee deep in the mess, so it wouldn’t benefit him to walk away. Will no one think of poor Ivanka.

  39. 39.

    OzarkHillbilly

    March 31, 2017 at 7:28 am

    @JPL: Good.

  40. 40.

    evodevo

    March 31, 2017 at 7:32 am

    @David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch: Probably not. Because that would mean he’s a LOSER, and THAT will never fly in TrumpWorld. I predict he’ll go down in flames, after throwing virtually everyone in the admin out of the plane.

  41. 41.

    OzarkHillbilly

    March 31, 2017 at 7:33 am

    @BlueDWarrior: He’d have to be getting fucked by a goat for it to make a difference with his base.

  42. 42.

    Waldo

    March 31, 2017 at 7:33 am

    Hoping all the president’s men cut deals that include prison time. They deserve it, of course, but I’m also dying to see Stone, the dapper douche, rockin’ an orange jumpsuit and prison-issue spectacles.

  43. 43.

    David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch

    March 31, 2017 at 7:34 am

    @Fester Addams:

    Are they dragging the lake yet?

    My guess he’s watching football with Jimmy Hoffa.

  44. 44.

    Sanjeevs

    March 31, 2017 at 7:36 am

    @David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch: General Keith Alexander was on MSNBC last night too. His line was that Putin knows he went too far and the US just needed to be nicer to him.
    We’re beginning to see why McCain called this a centipede and why Feinstein and Grassley looked like they did.

  45. 45.

    Iowa Old Lady

    March 31, 2017 at 7:37 am

    Trump’s morning tweet, about half an hour ago. He’s getting boring even on twitter.

    Mike Flynn should ask for immunity in that this is a witch hunt (excuse for big election loss), by media & Dems, of historic proportion!

  46. 46.

    Lurking Canadian

    March 31, 2017 at 7:39 am

    @debbie: Clint Watts and JC Watts appear to be different people. Both are wingnuts, but only one is a former CFL quarterback.

  47. 47.

    David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch

    March 31, 2017 at 7:39 am

    A report in the Washington Post about Rex Tillerson caused a flurry of speculation on Twitter that the secretary of state may be a vampire, a basilisk or perhaps even Medusa.

    The Post reported that some career diplomats working under Tillerson “have been instructed not to speak to him directly ― or even make eye contact.”

    The former CEO of Exxon turnout to be a blood sucker

    hoooooooooocoooooooooooooooooodaaaaaaaaaaaaaanode?!

  48. 48.

    Peter

    March 31, 2017 at 7:42 am

    @Ceci n est pas mon nym:

    A presidential pardon prevents federal charges, but a congressional inquiry could still proceed and I have no doubt that Trump tripped over his own dick somewhere along the line vis a vis state election finance law.

  49. 49.

    Roger Moore

    March 31, 2017 at 7:43 am

    @debbie:

    That would assume he is a loving father who puts his daughter before himself.

    Of course he’ll put his daughter before himself… if that’s the direction the bullets are coming from.

  50. 50.

    Kay

    March 31, 2017 at 7:45 am

    @JPL:

    I’m skeptical of the idea that the walls are closing in on Trump.

    Comey said at the hearing that “collusion” isn’t a legal term – they use “coordination”. It will be really hard to prove because Trumpsters can point to the (alleged) hackers who were putting the anti-Clinton stuff out publicly and say they got it there, like everyone else.

    Trump doesn’t have to tell Russia to do something they want to do and are doing. All he has to do is ride on it. Now, Comey added something else, he also said “knowing or unknowing coordination” which to me implies there could be something illegal with “going along with it” but I don’t know what that would be.

  51. 51.

    Iowa Old Lady

    March 31, 2017 at 7:46 am

    @David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch: That’s funny but it’s also depressing. People would rather speculate he’s a vampire (and not in a metaphorical way) than deal with reality.

  52. 52.

    rikyrah

    March 31, 2017 at 7:47 am

    @JPL:
    Did the tanker explosion cause the highway collapse or vice versa?

  53. 53.

    raven

    March 31, 2017 at 7:49 am

    @rikyrah: There was no tanker involved. There were huge spools of pvc or fiberoptic cable stored under the interstate and they caught on fire.

  54. 54.

    JPL

    March 31, 2017 at 7:52 am

    @rikyrah: It appears to be caused by stupidity, or what Raven said at 51.

  55. 55.

    Jeffro

    March 31, 2017 at 7:52 am

    @BlueDWarrior: or even then…

  56. 56.

    Baud

    March 31, 2017 at 7:55 am

    @rikyrah: Good morning.

  57. 57.

    Roger Moore

    March 31, 2017 at 7:55 am

    @JPL:

    It’s going to be a long time before things get back to normal though.

    It depends on how willing the government is to push schedules, cut red tape, and think outside the box. After the 1994 Northridge earthquake, Caltrans was able to get some of the completely collapsed freeway bridges back in service in less than 3 months. It required a combination of novel construction techniques, round-the-clock schedules, and a serious willingness to rush bureaucratic processes that would otherwise have taken longer than that by themselves.

  58. 58.

    Peter

    March 31, 2017 at 7:55 am

    @Kay: Well, Roger Stone knew what Wikileaks was doing before it did it. That’s one thread to pull on.

  59. 59.

    kindness

    March 31, 2017 at 7:57 am

    From all this we have learned that that the Republican base would be in favor of horse thieves if Trump was charged with stealing horses. That whole Republicans are more moral and have higher character thing? Not so much.

  60. 60.

    raven

    March 31, 2017 at 7:58 am

    @Roger Moore: Yea, and this is the state that just approved campus carry again.

  61. 61.

    Just One More Canuck

    March 31, 2017 at 7:58 am

    @David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch: The inspirations for the Robert Deniro and Joe Pesci characters in “Goodfellas” allegedly(!!) buried one of the victims in a bocce court and would say hi to him whenever they played

  62. 62.

    Chyron HR

    March 31, 2017 at 7:59 am

    Wake up, sheeple. PVC pipe can’t melt I-85.

  63. 63.

    Kay

    March 31, 2017 at 7:59 am

    But I guess “unknowing coordination” could be more closely linked than “going along”- it could be coordination with an individual or group by Trumpsters but they don’t have anything to prove Trumpsters knew the individual or group were working with or for the Russian government to interfere in the election.

  64. 64.

    JMG

    March 31, 2017 at 7:59 am

    I realize this may start something bad here, but I read the thread about this and there seemed to be no answer. Did the other Bostonians here come up with a place to meet Cole tonight? I’m on the Cape now, but might be back in time.
    BTW, that thread was marvelous Massachusetts action. If the redcoats had just held their fire at Lexington, the Minutemen would’ve started arguing among themselves about where to have lunch and wound up going home mad at each other. The Revolution would never have started.

  65. 65.

    JPL

    March 31, 2017 at 8:01 am

    @Roger Moore: You know I live in GA. lol It does appear that the proposed state income tax cut was not passed last night though.

  66. 66.

    Betty Cracker

    March 31, 2017 at 8:01 am

    @Kay: Two points of possible collusion that are very hard to explain away by shrieking “fake news:” 1) The pro-Russia change to the GOP platform (which was the only change the Trump people requested), and 2) Roger Stone’s prediction about Podesta’s emails, which predated the WikiLeaks doc dump.

  67. 67.

    Roger Moore

    March 31, 2017 at 8:01 am

    @Peter:

    Well, Roger Stone knew what Wikileaks was doing before it did it.

    And he admitted to talking to Guccifer 2.0, AKA the GRU. That sounds a lot like coordination to me.

  68. 68.

    Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes

    March 31, 2017 at 8:02 am

    @JPL:

    I think about her a lot, as a cast member in a “women in prison” movie. Brought down so low, so lonely, needing affection and attention, maybe a little discipline…

  69. 69.

    Roger Moore

    March 31, 2017 at 8:05 am

    @raven: @JPL:
    I’ll just say that California is well, and justifiably, known for the amount of red tape that it can throw at projects. Look up the history of the I-710 extension; they’re still arguing about it and trying to figure out if they can push it through 50 years after it was first proposed. But when push came to shove, we were willing and able to figure out how to fix our bridges in a hurry.

  70. 70.

    Tarragon

    March 31, 2017 at 8:06 am

    I’ve been waiting for an open thread to ask…

    Why do 50% of the articles my Trumpy uncle forwards have “Its Happening!” in the headline? For a while I thought it was some sort of tag indicating Hillary is going to be indicted any minute now. But it can be on anything; Hawaiian judge blocks travel ban. It’s Happening!

    What IS happening? Are they waiting for something?

  71. 71.

    raven

    March 31, 2017 at 8:06 am

    Here’s a screencap of the spools under the bridge.

  72. 72.

    raven

    March 31, 2017 at 8:08 am

    @Roger Moore: At least the didn’t rebuild that monstrosity at the Embarcadero. I also assume, since this is the interstate, that the feds will get in on it.

  73. 73.

    Kay

    March 31, 2017 at 8:10 am

    @Peter:

    But there’s two parts to even that. Stone can “work with” Russians, just like he can “work with” anyone else.

    He would have to be working with Russians to do something illegal and lying about Hillary Clinton isn’t illegal, or the entire GOP would be in prison. These people and entities wanted to do this anyway. They had their own reasons for wanting to elect Trump. It’s possible that Trumpsters could have stood back and let them do it without any coordination at all. They’re kind of dumb and they all think they’re geniuses so maybe they didn’t stand back- maybe they jumped in an “coordinated”- but the fact that Russia wanted this for their own reasons might make it hard to prove coordination. Unless there’s money. Money changing hands would help.

  74. 74.

    Baud

    March 31, 2017 at 8:10 am

    Remember, the National Enquire several days ago was given the go-ahead to throw Flynn under the bus.

  75. 75.

    jacy

    March 31, 2017 at 8:10 am

    @Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes:

    Narcissists will readily sacrifice their children when necessary. Every time. My therapist and I were just having a discussion about narcissistic families and narcissistic parenting — they’ll outwardly look like “good” parents so long as they receive positive reinforcement for doing so. But the minute either their child or outside circumstances trigger them, they’ll cut off that limb as fast they can. You have to remember that a child is only an extension of self to a narcissist. They have no intrinsic value to the narcissist, they only act as a reflection of the narcissist.

  76. 76.

    JPL

    March 31, 2017 at 8:13 am

    @Baud: Trump saved the day by nabbing the spy, but today Trump said it’s a witch hunt.

  77. 77.

    OzarkHillbilly

    March 31, 2017 at 8:13 am

    @Roger Moore:

    It required a combination of novel construction techniques, round-the-clock schedules, and a serious willingness to rush bureaucratic processes that would otherwise have taken longer than that by themselves.

    In this new age of Trump, that worries me.

  78. 78.

    D58826

    March 31, 2017 at 8:14 am

    If memory serves, most if not all of the Watergate gang did not get immunity. It was plead guilty/talk and maybe a lighter sentence. The crusty old GOP judge, first assigned to the case, wasn’t called maximum John Sirrica for nothing.

    Of course those were the days where Republicans put country first.

  79. 79.

    David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch

    March 31, 2017 at 8:15 am

    @Just One More Canuck: well, at least they had manners.

  80. 80.

    Ella in New Mexico

    March 31, 2017 at 8:16 am

    @Ceci n est pas mon nym: Fortunately, Pence would have to pardon him for such a wide swath of crimes he’d be bound to miss one.

    Besides, what are the rules for pardons when you yourself are also under investigation? Do co-conspirators get to use the “Get Out of Jail Free” card for each other?

    Manafort gave us Pence, don’t forget. Does anyone really think the “serious guy with the steady hand on the wheel” behind the scenes all those months of the campaign doesn’t know EXACTLY what went down?

  81. 81.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    March 31, 2017 at 8:17 am

    @raven: I think Roger is referring to the I-10 bridge in West LA, I think there was fed disaster relief help, but it was pretty much all state decision making.

  82. 82.

    Kay

    March 31, 2017 at 8:18 am

    @Peter:

    For a normal White House there would be an additional risk- that something is uncovered that contradicts their denials but these people lie publicly and constantly every day, so this would be one more public lie to add to the pile.

    This idea that “their reputations will be sullied” or “they will no longer be credible” apparently isn’t something that concerns them very much, and why should it? It’s worked okay for them so far. Donald Trump was and is rewarded for lying. Something like 70% of the GOP base believe Obama tapped Trump Tower.

  83. 83.

    Roger Moore

    March 31, 2017 at 8:18 am

    @OzarkHillbilly:
    Almost all of this stuff is handled at the state level, so Trump won’t have much to do with it. If the suburban commuters scream badly enough, you will be amazed at what kind of rules the state government will be willing to bend to get things fixed quickly.

  84. 84.

    Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes

    March 31, 2017 at 8:20 am

    @Kay:

    What too many “hee hee, ha ha, isn’t it funny what hackers do” and non technical types can’t seem to grasp is that unauthorized access by guessing passwords or phishing is in fact a crime.

    This extends to black hat hackers, white hat hackers and end consumers of stolen data.

    Asking someone to do it publicly is problematic enough; once you start coordinating its use, you become a co-conspirator or accessory after the fact.

  85. 85.

    raven

    March 31, 2017 at 8:21 am

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: Ah, I get my earthquakes messed up.

  86. 86.

    raven

    March 31, 2017 at 8:21 am

    @Roger Moore: They are the one’s who have screamed to keep public transportation out of the burbs.

  87. 87.

    OzarkHillbilly

    March 31, 2017 at 8:22 am

    @Kay:

    Money changing hands would help.

    And e-mails! I want to see the e-mails!!

    Oh, wait a minute…. Only DEMs have to provide e-mails, My bad.

  88. 88.

    Ella in New Mexico

    March 31, 2017 at 8:23 am

    @David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch: And yet It appears that it was Woolsey who alerted the FBI to Flynn’s plans to kidnap Gulen and render him illegally from the US to Turkey-because Flynn was being paid by Erdrogan’s government to act as a foreign agent. Maybe this “casino business” cleverly had prominent people on their “advisory committee” to deflect suspicion. They may have no knowledge of its activities.

  89. 89.

    Baud

    March 31, 2017 at 8:24 am

    @David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch:

    Instead….crickets. Really tells you a lot about who they are.

    That’s amazing. I don’t read them, but not even Fox News is completely ignoring this.

  90. 90.

    OzarkHillbilly

    March 31, 2017 at 8:24 am

    @jacy:

    Narcissists will readily sacrifice their children when necessary.

    My sons can testify to that fact, and yet they still love their mother.

  91. 91.

    Roger Moore

    March 31, 2017 at 8:24 am

    @raven:

    They are the one’s who have screamed to keep public transportation out of the burbs.

    And the state has been willing to listen to them. What makes you think the state will ignore them now?

  92. 92.

    clay

    March 31, 2017 at 8:24 am

    @Kay:

    Trump doesn’t have to tell Russia to do something they want to do and are doing.

    He doesn’t have to, of course, but he DID. What was the quote, on national TV? “Russia, if you’re listening, I hope you’re able to find the 30,000 emails that are missing….”

    Would they be able to demonstrate intent with his own public words? (Kinda like how the court is using his campaign’s words to strike down the Muslim ban.)

  93. 93.

    David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch

    March 31, 2017 at 8:25 am

    Brian Klaas‏Verified account @brianklaas Mar 29

    Days before dropping to 35% approval rating:

    Obama:…………..Never
    W Bush:…………..1,927
    Clinton:……………Never
    HW Bush:…………1,278
    Reagan:…………..Never
    Carter:…………………840

    Trump:………………….68

    942 replies 47,614 retweets 88,918 likes

  94. 94.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    March 31, 2017 at 8:26 am

    @raven: We tend to remember our earthquakes for some reason. That pic is from the aftermath of the ’71 San Fernando quake, though that interchange(I-5/SR-14) also collapsed during Northridge.

  95. 95.

    Baud

    March 31, 2017 at 8:26 am

    @JPL: At least Trump was honest enough to admit he’s a witch. Not even Christine O’Donnell would do that.

  96. 96.

    raven

    March 31, 2017 at 8:27 am

    @Roger Moore: What makes me think the Georgia State Government is incompetent when it come to transportation?

  97. 97.

    Kay

    March 31, 2017 at 8:28 am

    The Indivisible group met with a rep from Latta’s office. Latta is a go along to get along. He’s further Right than he should be given his district (my part of the district is heavily R but there are areas that are 50/50 or even D) but for some reason he escapes notice for this, perhaps because of his blandness and the fact that no one ever sees him or hears from him. So I was interested that he sent someone to meet with Indivisible who are essentially “the Anti-Trump group”. “Outreach” is not something he does.

  98. 98.

    raven

    March 31, 2017 at 8:30 am

    Economic impacts

    “It’s a massive productivity issue,” said Brian McGowan, a former CEO of Atlanta’s economic development arm and now a principal in the U.S. Public Policy and Regulation practice at law firm Dentons. “You are going to have hundreds or thousands of companies who can’t get their employees to work on time.”

    The public sector will also take a blow as tens of thousands of government workers will be affected.

    McGowan said the short-term potential losses are substantial. It will disrupt businesses’ supply chains. Families will have to re-think how they travel around the city.

    Companies that don’t encourage telecommuting should, while others should look to expand their programs or dust off plans that have been on a shelf, McGowan said.
    The collapse of the bridge will also shift sales at restaurants as diners choose other places to eat because of convenience.

    And like the infamous Snowjam debacle of 2014, McGowan said, “it once again highlights the vulnerability of the Atlanta transportation system.”

  99. 99.

    Another Scott

    March 31, 2017 at 8:30 am

    Morning everyone. Some welcome rain today in NoVA.

    Dean Baker brings the smackdown on a Globe piece about those evil boomers who are destroying the world, and the robots who are taking all the jobs (Hi Martin!) here:

    The Generation of Nonsense in the Boston Globe

    Published: 30 March 2017

    22 Comments

    The main economic story of the last four decades is the massive upward redistribution of income that has taken place. The top one percent’s share of national income has more than doubled over this period from roughly ten percent in the late 1970s to over twenty percent today. And, this is primarily a before-tax income story, the rich have used their control over the levers of economic power to ensure that an ever larger share of the country’s wealth goes into their pockets. (Yes, this is the topic of my book, Rigged [it’s free].)

    Anyhow, the rich don’t want people paying attention to these policies (hey, they could try to change them), so they endlessly push out nonsense stories to try to divert the public’s attention from how they structured the rules to advance their interests. And, since the rich own the newspapers, they can make sure that we hear these stories.

    This meant that yesterday the NYT gave us the story of how robots are taking all the jobs and driving down wages. Never mind that productivity growth is at its slowest pace in the last seven decades. Facts and data don’t matter in the alternative world where we try to divert folks’ attention from things like the Federal Reserve Board (who are not robots, last I checked) raising interest rates to make sure that we don’t have too many jobs.

    […]

    Tell it, Dean!

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  100. 100.

    Baud

    March 31, 2017 at 8:33 am

    @Another Scott: Good. Robots and boomers are a big talking point among the youngsters on Reddit.

  101. 101.

    OzarkHillbilly

    March 31, 2017 at 8:36 am

    @Roger Moore: I didn’t say Trump, I said this AGE of Trump. There is a reason for all those *bureaucratic roadblocks*, it’s called building safe things safely for a reasonable amount of money. This being the major artery it is things will be sped up, but as a lifelong carpenter can tell you, speed kills. Literally.

    And in this new age of Trump, who cares? Plenty more carpenters where that one came from.

    ** yes there are other types of bureaucratic roadblocks that have nothing to do with the construction but rather are territorial, and yes they can be moved to the side when the situation calls for it, but over the years, I and mine suffered too many injuries because somebody else was in a fucking hurry. And that was when we mattered, to our union if nobody else.

  102. 102.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    March 31, 2017 at 8:37 am

    @Baud: He just talked about robots in the excerpt, I’m sure boomers are still destroying the world.

  103. 103.

    SFAW

    March 31, 2017 at 8:38 am

    @David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch:

    #FLASH A previously reliable source says they have 2 further sources stating Trump is “considering his options, including resignation”.

    They must be using last year’s calendar — April Fool’s Day is tomorrow.

  104. 104.

    jake the antisoshul soshulist

    March 31, 2017 at 8:39 am

    It fits with my experience that Pence’s wife would be his holy warrior. Evangelical women tend to be more devout than their husbands, though there
    are plenty of exceptions. Even the thiry year-olds seem like Nancy Reagan at her most starched. Think Phyllis Schafly as a “mean girl”.

  105. 105.

    Kay

    March 31, 2017 at 8:41 am

    @Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes:

    Right, but “coordinating”. If promoting the hell out of the Wikileaks emails and acting as if they proved horrible things about Hillary Clinton when there was nothing there was a crime the entire cable industry would be in prison.

    Trump didn’t have to put them up to this. He could be the incidental beneficiary of the thing. They could have chosen not “Trump” but the least-worst candidate for them who happened to be Trump. It’s even possible that they chose Trump not because of any specific quid pro quo but because they knew he’d be a disaster and that’s obviously not good news for the United States. That’s the “discredit the US” theory. That they wanted to erode trust, create discord.

  106. 106.

    OzarkHillbilly

    March 31, 2017 at 8:42 am

    @Ella in New Mexico: Only the first conspirator making a deal gets the sweet heart treatment. Everybody else gets a hard time.

  107. 107.

    Baud

    March 31, 2017 at 8:42 am

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: Robots vs boomers would be a cool flick.

  108. 108.

    Another Scott

    March 31, 2017 at 8:43 am

    @Ceci n est pas mon nym: No time to check, but my recollection is that Ford’s pardon was for any crimes Nixon committed in office. Most of Donnie’s alleged crimes were before January 20. I can’t imagine a pardon for everything Donnie has ever done (or will do) being accepted…

    Of course, the President’s pardoning power is very broad.

    But I think Jester’s being funny here. I can’t see any way that Donnie is actually thinking about resignation. He doesn’t look that far ahead. Look at his tweets over the last 2 weeks about the AHCA… If Donnie resigns, it will be quickly and not something that he’s planned out. (And I don’t expect it to happen without a real (not potential) 25th or Impeachment hammer hanging over his head.)

    FWIW.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  109. 109.

    Another Scott

    March 31, 2017 at 8:49 am

    @Fester Addams: They’ve got the woman with the red dogs under illegal legs, so it seemingly just a matter of time…

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  110. 110.

    Yarrow

    March 31, 2017 at 8:49 am

    @Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes:

    Remember – as a clinical NPD sociopath, he’s not a particularly loyal person at his core. He cocoons himself with his children not out of loyalty to them or adoration for them, but because they insulate him from criticism and consequences

    I’ve been saying for awhile that he’ll throw everyone under the bus, with the possible exception of Ivanka, before he willingly leaves office. Their relationship is so odd–the daughter-wife dynamic has been evident since she was very young–and if there is one person in the world that he would protect, it would be her. Eric and Don, Jr. will be cannon fodder, though.

    We’re already seeing this “everyone under the bus” phenomenon beginning. First it was Flynn they tried to portray as the sole Russian mole in the White House. Now Nunes is going to be hung out to dry. Some resignations have already started. But psychologically being forced to resign means he has lost. I just don’t see how he can do that. He’ll point the finger at everyone and toss out any dirt he’s got on them in an effort to save himself. This includes Mike Pence.

  111. 111.

    Debbie1

    March 31, 2017 at 8:50 am

    @David ?Canadian Anchor Baby? Koch: “but, but….. revolutionary Susan Sarandon assured us Trump was a pacifist.” Oh, well. I guess that’s why elections (like pencils) have erasers.

  112. 112.

    Baud

    March 31, 2017 at 8:51 am

    @Debbie1: To be fair, so did the garbage NYT.

  113. 113.

    OzarkHillbilly

    March 31, 2017 at 8:52 am

    @jake the antisoshul soshulist:

    Think Phyllis Schafly as a “mean girl”.

    Is there any other way to think of Phyllis Schlafly?

  114. 114.

    ET

    March 31, 2017 at 9:09 am

    On a utter happy note that I hope doesn’t get lost in the thread, this video of cats ringing a bell for food is ridiculously funny.

    Enjoy.

  115. 115.

    satby

    March 31, 2017 at 9:12 am

    Wow, I slept late today. Good morning everyone! So today, like all days, is officially “root for injuries” day? Cool, I’m on board. Everyday.

  116. 116.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    March 31, 2017 at 9:13 am

    @Yarrow: Remember Dense and the cabinet are the folk that trigger the 25th section 4.

  117. 117.

    Betty Cracker

    March 31, 2017 at 9:13 am

    @Yarrow: I’m still not allowing myself to believe this will happen — goes too much against my pessimistic worldview, in which the evil generally prospers! But oh how I would enjoy the spectacle of that petulant, revolting sack of shit humiliated before all humanity!

  118. 118.

    satby

    March 31, 2017 at 9:14 am

    @ET: thanks! That’s great.

  119. 119.

    JPL

    March 31, 2017 at 9:19 am

    UH OH! The bridge that collapsed on 85 was on the north side, and it appears that there is damage on the south side also.

    @Betty Cracker: Trump has not taken responsibility for his actions before, and I’m skeptical that anything will stick to him. The repubs don’ts care that he is profiting off of the presidency, because tax cuts.

  120. 120.

    raven

    March 31, 2017 at 9:20 am

    @JPL: How could there not have been damage to the other side with the intensity of the fire?

  121. 121.

    JPL

    March 31, 2017 at 9:21 am

    @raven: I agree but the local nbc station earlier, thought they might be able to open it in a week. Now they are saying it needs to be replaced.

  122. 122.

    Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes

    March 31, 2017 at 9:21 am

    @Yarrow:

    So on a related topic of clueless narcissists, one of the guys in my office just got suspended in two states because he was too stupid to crack his wallet open and take some minor discipline. He’s in his 70s, fairly stupid, litigious and obstinately shifty. He’s got a collection practice with a core flow that I think can be kept, but the mandatory suspension letters are going to cause some evaporation for whoever steps in, and he’s underutilized his staff levels for the volume capacity he should be marketing.

    I was looking at stepping in as placeholder and possibly taking over permanently, but he wants a ridiculous paralegal salary during suspension and frankly has nothing to add besides being reckless and greedy. Yesterday, he was suggesting throwing a diligent, competent staffer under the bus so his ridiculous demand could make the numbers work (my estimate had me putting money in just in order to meet his idiot demand.

    A few minutes from now, he gets my “last best final” which he is going to reject. Close of business, his lights go out, and when he gets reinstated, he’ll be starting from scratch at 72.

  123. 123.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    March 31, 2017 at 9:22 am

    @raven: There’s damage and there’s tear down and rebuild damage.

  124. 124.

    Keith P.

    March 31, 2017 at 9:24 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: Dead and rotting in the grave. Or shoveling shit in hell.

  125. 125.

    bupalos

    March 31, 2017 at 9:26 am

    @JPL: I’m pretty sure he’d be lying to her too. He’s lying to himself. Narcissists don’t really understand that it’s even possible for them to be guilty of things, that doesn’t make sense. He doesn’t have the ability to protect anyone because he doesn’t really understand what’s going on.

    Donald Trump was just trying to make the country stronger by making it’s avatar and the greatest man it ever produced even greater, and cementing a friendship with Russia that would stamp out all evil in the world. He was the only one who could have done that, and he had to do whatever he did in order to make that happen.

  126. 126.

    Kay

    March 31, 2017 at 9:30 am

    @Yarrow:

    He throws people under the bus but only to the extent where doing that doesn’t reflect on him- on his judgment for hiring them in the first place. He has too big an ego to even effectively throw anyone under the bus.

    The “best people”. These people he surrounds himself with are like a mirror to him. They have to be the best people because he’s the best.

    Donald J. Trump‏Verified account
    @realDonaldTrump
    Mike Flynn should ask for immunity in that this is a witch hunt (excuse for big election loss), by media & Dems, of historic proportion!

  127. 127.

    OzarkHillbilly

    March 31, 2017 at 9:30 am

    @Keith P.: With her children fighting like a pack of hyenas over the rotting corpse of her political operation.

  128. 128.

    JPL

    March 31, 2017 at 9:33 am

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: It appears to be tear it down damage.

  129. 129.

    Sanjeevs

    March 31, 2017 at 9:38 am

    If you watch David Cay Johnston’s talks about Trump on Youtube it looks like Trump will have to be dragged out of office by a SWAT team. And me will nuke the US first if he has to.

  130. 130.

    JPL

    March 31, 2017 at 9:39 am

    @Kay: Can Trump issue a blanket pardon? We know that Flynn retroactively registered as a foreign agent. That’s not normal.

  131. 131.

    bupalos

    March 31, 2017 at 9:42 am

    Donald Trump in prison is probably not the best ending here. It sounds great, but the way that would shake out in reality would likely be very iffy. Like lots of domestic terrorism and lots of Republicans like ZEGS getting to hop in the escape pod, and possibly even being remembered as The Serious Wonk That Crossed the Aisle to Do His Duty And Save the Country. Dems need to start thinking about switching to offense, and how the groundwork can be laid here for a more progressive agenda. Including how to trade things like Trump’s last 10 years on earth for a better country and better life for generations of Americans.

  132. 132.

    Roger Moore

    March 31, 2017 at 9:50 am

    @?BillinGlendaleCA:

    I’m sure boomers are still destroying the world.

    One boomer in particular…

  133. 133.

    Betty Cracker

    March 31, 2017 at 9:50 am

    @bupalos: Trade his last 10 years with whom? How does the soft landing you envision work?

  134. 134.

    laura

    March 31, 2017 at 9:54 am

    @Roger Moore: well, some bridges . . . The bay bridge replacement took way to long -thanks Arnold! But the LA freeway bridge repla cement was greased lightening, and as mentioned earlier, novel building technique by C.C. Meyers used railroad bed sections undergirding. I was at the Alliance for Jobs lunch on Wednesday and it was a topic of discussion just before Governor Brown’s presser on the major Transportation package that hopefully gets passed next week. If a certain Steve Glazer gets the stick out of his ass about denying BART workers the right to strike. Thanks to a super majority in the legislature, it’s doable, and badly needed and so overdue. The Reps, as usual, want no increase in any tax ever, and would prefer a funding source that knuckles the poors, so it hangs on the timidity of a handful of dems. Our roadways are crap and this winters weather have taken a huge toll on them.
    Think driving down the Oroville dam spillway.

  135. 135.

    Yarrow

    March 31, 2017 at 9:55 am

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: Yes, but as someone pointed out above, Manafort is the one who pushed for Pence. Why would that be? If Donald knows something–or, heck, if Manafort decides to talk–Pence could be compromised.

    @Betty Cracker: He will be. I have confidence. I don’t know if it’ll be impeachment, 25th amendment, or he’ll resign. I think resignation is the last option. I means he lost. I don’t think he can handle it. But maybe he can convince himself it’s his best move, in which case he’ll claim he’s done everything he wanted to do and leave. Still won’t save him from investigation and prosecution, though.

  136. 136.

    geg6

    March 31, 2017 at 9:57 am

    @JPL:

    Pittsburgh just went through this very thing last September, with some minor differences. One of the main arteries into the city from the very populous South Hills is the Liberty Bridge. Some idiot welder from a company contracted to do maintenance caught the bridge on fire (slag fell into an improperly stored plastic vent pipe) and it distorted the steel chord that held most of the load of the bridge, making it too dangerous to open to traffic for 24 days. Fire burned at 1200 degrees F for over a half hour until firefighters could put it out. Contractor had to pay more than $3.5 million in fines for fines and emergency repairs to PENNDOT, another upcoming $500K for the cost of emergency and permanent repairs, over $11K to OSHA for safety violations and another $1K per day to the Pittsburgh Bureau of Fire for not having a permit for hot work. None of this was covered by insurance. And I can’t tell you how horrible it made traffic going into and out of the city. Be prepared for a long closing and lots of traffic headaches.

  137. 137.

    geg6

    March 31, 2017 at 10:01 am

    @bupalos:

    Trade what? I’m not willing to trade anything to keep that shitty orange Cheeto afloat. Fuck him and fuck that shit.

  138. 138.

    Yarrow

    March 31, 2017 at 10:01 am

    @Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes: That sounds awful. And really stupid on his part. It’s amazing what narcissism can do.

    @Kay: I no longer believe that he writes all those tweets. He probably still writes some but a lot are disinformation. I much more believe the National Enquirer angle that Flynn was the lone bad guy Russian mole and look how great Donald was to catch him.

    He’s a narcissist, so he can’t really see people he picked as reflecting on him. They are tools for him–a means to an end. When they are no longer useful, they can go. Perhaps must go. That’s why I think that as the noose tightens, he’ll throw everyone under the bus in an effort to save himself. The only one who may be spared is Ivanka because of their weird relationship.

  139. 139.

    O. Felix Culpa

    March 31, 2017 at 10:03 am

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    My sons can testify to that fact, and yet they still love their mother.

    How old are they? It can take a long time for children, even adult children, to realize just how they’ve been used (and abused) by the narcissist parent. It’s a very deep wound that no one likes to look at. My youngest sister was nearly 50 before she became “woke.”

  140. 140.

    liberalandlovingit!

    March 31, 2017 at 10:37 am

    @Phylllis:

    yea. and “poverty is the greatest violence”.

  141. 141.

    jacy

    March 31, 2017 at 11:16 am

    @O. Felix Culpa:

    My kids are 16 and 11 — they have a pretty good idea that their dad sees them as “things to show off” and to berate when they don’t meet his standards for what his children should be. He’s a devout Catholic and they both identify as agnostic, so that’s a huge thing that’s going on right now. I just stay out of it and try support them and remind them that he does love them, he just has trouble showing it because of the way his parents treated him. He’s not “full-blown” narcissistic all the time, but his mother puts Donald Trump to shame in that department, and he reverts back to that pattern whenever he’s under stress. Which is most of the time. I think sometimes it’s hardest on the kids when he shows flashes of decency and empathy, and then those evaporate like they were never there.

  142. 142.

    Mobile

    March 31, 2017 at 11:34 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: Naw. The Republican base knows that “a good goat will do that.” (Punchline to a very old and nasty lawyer joke)

  143. 143.

    O. Felix Culpa

    March 31, 2017 at 2:43 pm

    @jacy:

    I think sometimes it’s hardest on the kids when he shows flashes of decency and empathy, and then those evaporate like they were never there.

    Yes, that behavior raises hope and is never sustained. So the child’s natural, innate hope for a “normal,” loving parent gets dashed. Over and over again. Eventually the child (often not until well into adulthood) has to let go, if they want any kind of healthy balance in their life.

  144. 144.

    moops

    March 31, 2017 at 4:32 pm

    Congress will trip over themselves to offer Flynn immunity. It doesn’t matter what he has. They want to take this from the FBI, and in return for immunity, Flynn can testify that Everything with Russia was Him. He is going to Ollie North this whole thing and sink all the investigations. In return he will be taken care of by the right-wing welfare system for his whole life.

    He’ll get to do talk shows and write books and go on tours, just like Ollie

    http://olivernorth.com/

    He will be a hero because the media will tell the faithful he is a hero.

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