A sidelight on yesterday’s Tomahawk raid on a Syrian airbase.
1: Fifty-nine Tomahawks fired.
2: Targetting: “The targets included air defenses, aircraft, hangars and fuel.” For good reason (IMHO) the strike avoided stored chemical weapons. Personnel at the base were warned of the impending attack and as of now, no casualties have been reported.
3: Results: some shit got blown up. All of it can be repaired or replaced with out, it seems, significant difficulty.
All of which is to say that this was what most kindly can be called a warning shot, and rather less so, performance art.
Which gets me to my point. The price tag for fifty nine Tomahawk missiles runs a little bit shy of $90 million.
For scale: that’s roughly 60% of the $148 million the to-be defunded National Endowment of the Arts received in 2016.
I believe Donald Trump’s grant was titled, “Very Expensive Holes In Concrete.”
Image: Adrian Hill, A British Mine Exploding, sometime during World War I.
Corner Stone
“But it just feeels so goood to burn off $75M to $90M in one big load, maaaannn”
Thoroughly Pizzled
Why does the media love war so much? When did they lose that part of themselves that cared about real people and real lives? Was it ever there?
Corner Stone
Having proven himself repeatedly historically incompetent on any policy related to internal domestic governance, Trump has turned to the last refuge of the low polling scoundrel.
Corner Stone
The Soviets are…um, excuse me, the Russians are claiming that something like less than two dozen actually hit anything and the main airfield/runway is intact.
Kind of like claiming manly man Trump had a bad case of ED during his first hot military style action.
Corner Stone
Anyone setting up a drainage collection system for the sweet, sweet tears of all the isolationists/nationalists who voted for non-interventionist candidate Trump?
Raven Onthill
Violence for purposes of political propaganda is otherwise known as terrorism.
schrodingers_cat
Has the Comrade from Vt spoken?
Baud
@Corner Stone: It’s shocking that he changed his views on Syria.
Jeffro
Guy’s an incompetent douche – it’s no wonder he screwed this up.
I’m just praying that a big bite of well-done steak (with ketchup!) lodged sideways saves the Republic, and soon.
Corner Stone
@schrodingers_cat: That catamount dude we have some strange nickname for?
Taylor
@Corner Stone: The cheaper the hood, the gaudier the patter.
The Moar You Know
Hooray! Not three months into the orange idiot’s presidency and already we’re blowing shit up. God, feels like I’m twenty and back in the eighties.
Don’t ever let them tell you that you can never go home again. This is going to be an old-fashioned Republican presidency, y’all.
zach
Where’s the proof that there were chemical weapons stored at this airfield. Syria claims it destroyed all its chemical weapons stocks; Russia backs that story; America specifically claims that this airfield houses chemical weapons stores. If we’re sure of that, we have proof. Let’s see it.
Specifically, McMaster today: “There were measures put in place to avoid hitting what we believe is a storage of sarin … [so] that it would not be ignited and cause a hazard to civilians or anyone else.”
“We believe” is a pretty weak statement; let’s see the evidence.
Corner Stone
@zach: Just so I know, what do you think killed those 100 people?
Frankensteinbeck
@Corner Stone:
Tears? From my observations, they’re bitching about what a hawk Hillary would have been. I have to hand it to the folks who said sexism runs deeper than racism. They were right.
D58826
Others have called it ‘sending a message’. Funny we have been sending these messages for years and yet the recipients do not seem to be paying attention. They just keep on misbehaving and when they die the next generation continues right along. Case in point Assad father and now son or the dear leaders in N. Korea.
lgerard
If only Susan Rice had (something something) trumpp would not have been forced to act presidential
Woodrow/Asim
@Corner Stone:
Enter Gizmodo: With Attack on Syria, Trump Alienates the Alt-Right
Hate blinds.
schrodingers_cat
@Frankensteinbeck: Women got the right to vote after black men did!
hovercraft
Speaking of GOP wet dreams. Yesterday in Texas:
Texas House Votes to Nix Vouchers, Maybe Dooming Senate Bill
The Texas House has voted to oppose taxpayer dollars going to private and religious schools, expressly forbidding state funding for vouchers.
| April 6, 2017, at 1:32 p.m.
AUSTIN, Texas (AP) — The Texas House has voted to oppose taxpayer dollars going to private and religious schools — expressly forbidding state funding for vouchers.
Thursday’s 103-44 vote came during the House’s larger budget debate and could kill a sweeping “school choice” bill approved by the state Senate last week.
Republicans control both chambers but while many senators see vouchers as a civil rights issue that helps poor children leave failing public schools, the House has repeatedly defeated any proposal that could hurt funding for traditional classrooms.
House Democrats opposing vouchers typically team with Republicans from rural communities, where schools are top employers as well as social centers offering football and other popular activities.
Anticipating opposition, the Senate voucher bill exempted communities with fewer than 285,000 residents. But overwhelming House opposition didn’t wavier.
I guess even with Abbott and DeVos on board, convincing rural representatives that bleeding money from one of the largest employers in their districts wasn’t a great idea. SAD !
schrodingers_cat
@Corner Stone: Yeah one who shouts a lot and has an awesome case of bed hair.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Barry McCaffrey, who must be running on about two hours’ sleep, said in pretty much one stream of words that the next step is to take out Assad’s air force. He did not say, as he was saying last night, that this would lead to certain American casualties and increased conflict with Russia. He then said the US has no direct national interest in Syria. I also heard the Russian are already helping Syria beef up their anti-aircraft defenses.
McCain is in hour twelve or thirteen of his war-agra hard on
Cermet
How is this not considered an act of war thus require pre-authorization before such a huge military attack doesn’t violate the constitutional separation of powers relative to only congress can authorize “war”? This was a massive military strike against a country we were not previously at war with! This is a declaration of war (sneak attack and all that.) Could some legal eagles explain, please?
JMG
Well, this is one of the problems with chemical weapons. You can’t get rid of them by bombing them, because then you’ve released them yourself.
schrodingers_cat
In Soviet America we bomb refugee children to save them but ban them from entry!
OzarkHillbilly
I weep for our country, unlike Republicans and their voters who fall for the same bullshit lines no matter how many times they are proven false, Apes can distinguish between true and false beliefs in others, study suggests
schrodingers_cat
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: T is a bigger disaster than Bush II. So ME War 2.0 is going to be a bigger disaster than Iraq.
?eric
The number one intended “message” that we can take from the attack is that we are not buddy-buddy with Russia. See, we can take actions hostile to Russian interests…….(note: no Russians or Syrians were harmed in the filming of this “hostile” action because we warned these foreign interests before we notified Congress.) Le Sigh.
?eric
@Cermet: we did get russian pre-authorization; hence, no problem. Oh, you meant the US Congress? My bad.
Это курам на смех
It cost a few dollars, but the ratings are boffo. The next production, in which the US tangles with Russian air defenses, is going to wow the critics. Box office gold.
Corner Stone
@Woodrow/Asim: “The Alt-Right wants good relations with Bashar Al-Assad.”
/Richard Spencer
What in the ever loving fuckity?
zach
@Corner Stone: I have no idea but I’m sure I’ve read many news articles today that state as fact that the Syrian military conducted a sarin gas attack without presenting facts to back up a pretty critical claim. Most articles hinge on Turkey’s analysis concluding sarin exposure.
American intelligence capabilities have come a long way since the Cuban missile crisis; I expect at least as high a standard of evidence in making a public case for war.
Corner Stone
@Это курам на смех: Is that the movie where Maverick and Goose take that polaroid of the Soviet fighter plane?
Because they were…inverted.
gvg
@zach: There have been autopsies performed in Turkey in front of international observers. Doctors without Borders was mentioned in news reports I saw. So it happened.
The Alt right is saying false flag I have read.
Russia is saying faulty intelligence and the US blew up a storage depot. usually the alt right says the same thing as Russia but apparently not this time.
Another report is that the depot story is unlikely because this chemical (Sarin? not sure which one has been definitively identified) is not stored already mixed because of the danger, so it gets mixed just before using etc. I don’t know enough to evaluate this.
?eric
@zach: well, i think colin powell may have retarded the standard a bit………
Corner Stone
@?eric:
The number one message I am seeming to take from the attack is that it doesn’t matter how fast you mow, but how well you mow fast.
GregB
Now watch this drive.
Greenergood
Hie could’ve waited until Sunday; instead $90 million for a nothingburger ‘attack’ to distract us from the US-China ‘summit’ at the Summer Dacha.
?eric
@Corner Stone: It is not what you mow, but who you mow.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Um….
Chris
@Woodrow/Asim:
??????????? What does the alt-right care if we bomb some brown people?
Major Major Major Major
@Chris: they’d prefer we bomb the brown people here, first, is all.
schrodingers_cat
@Chris: Syrians can be quite light skinned, Thinking Housewife used to love Assad. I have no idea why. They are fond of cruel people.
Cermet
I still don’t get how this isn’t a major crime – even if he notified congress, the full house must pass a resolution authorizing potential military action first to be legal under the crazy war powers act. This attack sets a president that cross’s a line that I am not aware has been don before. This is, by any standard, a major attack upon the official military of a sovereign country we are not at war with. This is not an attack on a terrorist organization in a sovereign country but the country’s actual, official military. How is this not a total violation of our laws!?
gene108
@Chris:
Fascists have to stick together
?eric
@Chris: these brown people are ruled by a guy who is the ally of their White Nationalist ally: Putin. So, if Putin has a purpose for Assad, then all hail Putin and his purpose.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Alex Pareene, drawing a link from the joint session non-SOTU to our fabulous new war:
I’d quibble with the idea that actual upper-class New Yorkrers (though what the hell does that even mean anymore?) DVR morning joseph, but other than that…
?eric
@Cermet: It is not illegal when the WHITE president does it.
Baud
@Cermet: Judging by the number of people I saw on the TV saying how legal this was, this was not legal.
hovercraft
I can’t understand the report, but it seems that the Russians may not be all that impressed with our prowess?
Via FARK
Russian news reports from Syrian airbase after US missile strike and…damn, really? That’s *all* the damage 60 cruise missiles did? Either we need to up the payload or this entire thing was a damn distraction
It’s from FARK, so who knows how accurate, but if it is… SAD!
Corner Stone
Speaking of Palace Intrigue – I can’t keep track of who is what anymore in the MSNBC lineup. Why was Hallie Jackson in FL yesterday but now it is Chris Jansing? Their titles keep changing all the time.
It’s like a game of Hot Seat around here.
zach
@gvg: @gvg:
Yes, it seems likely to me that sarin exposure happened; Turkey’s not a neutral party here, but I can look past that. I can’t ignore the lack of evidence that the Syrian military continues to possess/manufacture sarin, that it was deployed in this attack, and that it was stored at the bombed airfield.
But honestly I still think unilateral bombardment is dumb even if we’re 100% sure of all that. Other forces in Syria are known to possess and use chemical weapons and this creates a huge incentive to use them — the US can’t respond in the same way against unconventional forces and any accidental exposure can be turned into a claim of Syrian military use with a demand for an increased unilateral response. In general, I think chemical weapon needs to be proven and attributed with a very high standard of proof, and then the response needs to be more severe and multilateral.
D58826
@gvg: I guess there might be a question as to whither the sarin was used by Assad or one of the rebel groups fighting Assad. These groups hate each other as much as they hate Assad so it’s not beyond the realm of the possible that it was a rebel group. However there are witnesses (creditable?) that report a bomb was dropped from a plane and when it exploded people began getting sick. The rebels don’t have an air force. So if I had to bet I would go with Assad. I do understand the skepticism, however. I remember those innocent US destroyers just taking a pleasure cruse in the Gulf of Tonkin.
Either way the tomahawk attack it was an act of war by the US and will simply make the situation worse once some of the terrorist groups outside of Syria hit western (US) targets. All other reasons aside, I would not be staying at a Trump hotel or playing on a Trump golf course anytime soon.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
I don’t know who Thinking Housewife is, but from what I’ve heard/read in the last couple days, the various Xian sects in Syria tend to side with the government. The Crusader mentality is alive and well in some wide swathes of America.
gvg
ok this tells that the Turkish government based the conclusion of Sarin on autopsies of three victims under supervision of WHO.
I don’t want to trigger moderation by doing too many links but look up a guardian article on why the airstrike hitting a depot story promoted by Russia is not likely to be true. “Syria chemical weapons attack: what we know about deadly air raid ” is the title.
Experts are also saying a mix of chemicals were probably used, not just Sarin. Bleach smell indicates chlorine also.
D58826
@Cermet: GOP will pass that long delayed AUMF, retroactive to 1/20/17, faster than they can repeal/replace Obamacare.
schrodingers_cat
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: She is a conservative catholic blogger, let’s just say that her world view is very similar to the current occupant of the WH and his acolytes. Hates anyone who is not Christian and white, also hates women who are not “traditional”, i.e. have a career. Also, an anti-Semite and a Holocaust denier. In short, a piece of work. I used to read her just to know what the other side thought. I haven’t done so since November.
The Moar You Know
@zach: Shit, we haven’t gone to war with “proof” since World War II. You kids with your quaint ideas.
Seriously, I’d have liked to see some proof as well. Could be the Syrian government. Could be any one of a number of rebels against that government. Could have been the Russians. We’ll never know now, we just blew up all the evidence.
Isn’t that convenient?
Chris
@schrodingers_cat:
So, Jesus.
Humboldtblue
For all the money wasted on expensive hardware at least he’ll save a few bucks banning children from immigrating —
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Corner Stone: speaking of palace intrigue… I can’t even get schaden freudening at the rumors that the sniveling, adenoidal talking thumb Reince Priebus is said to be on his way out. Don Cheeto wants a wartime consigliere?
I have a really bad feeling about this. I’m not hearing or seeing anyone or anything that sounds like warnings against escalation. It feels like everyone’s afraid of being accused of thinking it’s okay to use sarin gas on babies.
?eric
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: it is okay to use high shrapnel devices but not gas…note to despotic self.
hovercraft
@Frankensteinbeck:
The sexism vs racism is very hard to parse. Sometimes it depends on the circumstances, in any given situation the perpetrators are sometimes willing to swallow one or both to achieve the desired result. I go back to the couple in PA in 2008 who told a canvasser that they were voting for the ni**er, they obviously were willing to overlook his race to vote for him, but then right next door in Kentucky you had overwhelming votes for Hillary over Obama, and then 4 years later many of those same people voted for a convicted felon over a sitting president of their party. Racism and sexism can be situational, conceptually people are against them until they feel threatened by the black person or woman. As a black woman I find it that overcoming the stereotype of an angry black woman is always the first hurdle and then there are all the normal hurdles women of all colors face.
Raven
@The Moar You Know: uh, the North Koreans provided all the proof needed when they crossed the Imjin.
The Moar You Know
Wholly OT: pic from Trump meeting with the Chinese president yesterday.
Melania’s hands are twice the size of Donald’s.
Baud
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: I’m not having that feeling yet. But a lot depends on what the Russians and Syrians do next.
Ajabu
And the NEA’s modest grants have frequently helped me feed my family over many years.
Thanks again, Shitgibbon.
gvg
@zach: this is the experts explaining why it has to be Syria not the rebels among several other important points.
“That claim does not fit with facts on the ground, for several reasons. An airstrike on a weapons depot with high explosives would have destroyed much of the sarin immediately, and distributed any that survived over a much smaller area.
“The pattern of casualties isn’t right for the distribution of materials that you would get if you had a location with toxic materials breached by an airstrike. It’s more consistent with canisters that have distributed [chemical weapons] over a wider population,” Guthrie said.”
And also the rebels may have small amounts, a few kilos, but can’t have enough to have done this” to paraphrase the experts in this article. I also mention that I understand the rebels don’t have any air force.
I agree this action on Trumps part won’t do anything useful. He doesn’t know anything, sigh….
the implications are that Assad may have lied to Obama, however it was good he didn’t do anything while Obama was in Office, but clearly Trump is not held in the same caution. Nobody has any good plan for replacing him though and that is why nobody took him out last time. I don’t mean a useful puppet either. the Syrians apparently aren’t in agreement therefore nobody else can really help them. I really don’t know much though.
Baud
@The Moar You Know:
The basis for the first Iraq War was proved.
zach
@The Moar You Know: We have plenty of evidence to have high confidence that sarin was used in 3 attacks on March 25, March 30, and the most recent attack, according to Tillerson: state.gov/secretary/remarks/2017/04/269543.htm
So let’s take all of the evidence that let’s him come to that conclusion, strip out everything that (1) puts an American life at immediate risk and (2) discloses a source critical to preventing future sarin attacks, and release it. The world shouldn’t trust the judgement of American secretaries of state on this stuff anymore. I don’t.
robert thompson
@schrodingers_cat: I was seeing a physician who was Maronite Christian from Lebanon. Her entire family left Syria for Beirut and she did love her some Assad. As someone had noted they were a protected minority. Assad kept them safe.
?eric
@Baud: my bet is nothing. they say and do nothing. Then, what?
Thoroughly Pizzled
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
I’ll never forgive Pareene for this stupid passage from November 7:
Frankensteinbeck
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
I can see a reason it probably won’t escalate – much. Trump warned the Russians. Given their reaction, this might even have served Putin’s interests, delegitimizing the US as an actor in Syria and giving him an excuse to ignore us. Donnie is a coward, and this was just him thumping his chest. He still has no intention of doing anything his owners in Russia and China don’t want.
The Moar You Know
@Raven: that was just a “police action”, right? lol. I kid. Sure wasn’t a “police action” to the million-plus people who died.
OK, since Korea. You are quite correct.
Thoroughly Pizzled
@hovercraft:
I feel like it’s easier to carve out exceptions for racism. Many racist men have “black friends.” How many woman friends do they have? This doesn’t say much about which runs deeper, though. It’s complicated.
Baud
@?eric: Then this is a blip. We’ll continue to focus on ISIS.
schrodingers_cat
@Thoroughly Pizzled: We are fooling ourselves if think that the stupid is only concentrated on the right side of the political divide.
Baud
@Thoroughly Pizzled: Sounds like someone we can’t count on. At least he’s honest about it.
West of the Rockies (been a while)
Syria was warned? Wasn’t Lump always cryin’ about Obama telegraphing his military strategy? IOKIYAR.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Thoroughly Pizzled: oy, as politics and writing, that is some self-indulgent precious hipster word salad. The corrupt and rotten Andrew Cuomo… I wonder if Pareene was one of the True Progressives singing Cuomo’s praises and damning Obama because Cuomo showed the fabled balls on gay marriage. Right after a right wing billionaire with a gay son bought him those balls.
@Frankensteinbeck: I hope you’re right
LongHairedWeirdo
I’m glad that the people at the base were warned, but by whom? By Mr. “You don’t warn people of your impending attack plans”?
I’m not saying he was wrong, I’m just asking because it’d be like he was an incompetent blowhard on the campaign trail.
Which reminds me: isn’t ISIS supposed to be destroyed by now, or something? Or at least we’d have a plan, a GREAT plan, to destroy them utterly?
Humboldtblue
@robert thompson: Assad and his ruling class are Alawites, a small Muslim sect that isn’t even considered Muslim by some. They are a tiny minority as well
?eric
@Baud: There is nothing for us to do if Assad stays silent, and given that the Russians knew ahead of time and are “making fun” of the efficacy, they are de-escalating the import and the need for any retaliation. Looks like Kabuki to me.
Jeffro
@Corner Stone:
Just keep an eye out for Hallie, no need to worry about the rest.
SFAW
@hovercraft:
Well, maybe if you weren’t so angry …
Yes, I’m just being a smart ass.
schrodingers_cat
@?eric: I think the Russian investigation was getting too hot, this is to show how independent the regime is from the one in Moscow.
Humboldtblue
@Thoroughly Pizzled:
I would say it’s far easier for a white man to have a black man as boss but still recoil instantly if it’s going to be a woman in charge (doubly for a black woman). Of course that black/white dynamic changed extraordinarily in the past 50 years and it happened (my front stoop sociology thinks) primarily through the military and sports.
Baud
@?eric: Could be. The Russians may have given Assad the chemical weapons for all we know.
?eric
@schrodingers_cat: i agree 100%. I think it was intended to kill two birds: the Russian bird and the Trump is ineffectual bird.
?eric
@Baud: Or, he was holding them for a friend.
Chris
@Thoroughly Pizzled:
Yes, it is.
Yes, it was.
No, it isn’t.
Well, they certainly lost this one, didn’t they? You brainless invertebrate.
Ah, a freerider. “I hate the Democrats, I can’t be arsed to vote for them, but I still fully count on them to protect me from all the things I’m too bored and self-indulgent to protect myself from.” How original.
robert thompson
@Humboldtblue: Assad’s regime is basically a bundle of small in numbers but big in imp[act minorities. The Christian are a small but high\technical class that does carry some political weight with Assad. If it was a Islamist state rather than a somewhat secular one they would have zero political capital. Thus their strong support.
hovercraft
@SFAW:
There’s the rub, I’m a very angry black woman these days!!
Fortunately I’m not alone, many people are angry, I just have to make sure I channel my anger in productive ways, it’s all well and good to bitch on a blog, but I have to give to the right causes, and attend the right meetings to do my part in ensuring that we are never caught flat footed like we were last year. Turns out I had way too much faith in my countrymen and women, they are ignorant, gullible, sexist, racist fools, and it’s my job to shake all the complacent people up and get them to care enough to vote. The one silver lining is that Twitler is doing an excellent job of getting these people to wake the fuck up. Turns out that who’s president does make a difference. Who Knew? Dumbfucks!!!
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Fareed Zakaria, Nick Kristof and I’m guessing 80% of the Sensible Centrists who will be on MSNBC today. I was glad to see Gene Robinson remained more than a bit skeptical last night.
I’m trying to remember the name of the ret’d general, for Commander of NATO, Rhodes Scholar, one-time Clinton ally who was very skeptical of Syrian intervention in ’13, one of the few people pointing out that a ‘no-fly zone’, especially in Syria, is a declaration of hot war, not a free vote by the UN.
ETA: Wesley Clark! He used to be a cable news regular, haven’t seen him in a while
robert thompson
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Wesley Clark perhaps.
Humboldtblue
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
You should try Andrew Bacevich instead. He’s not only Cole’s former CO he’s an excellent source for military issues.
SFAW
@hovercraft:
I can’t argue with a single thing you wrote.
Woodrow/Asim
@Corner Stone: @Chris: it’s a waste to apply logic where naught but hate exists.
Debbie1
You could get whiplash watching this guy’s decision making (and reversal) process. To any armed forces members who voted for him, good luck with that. Imagine being sent to war by Donald goddam TR*mp. A reality show host who refused to fight for his country or to pay taxes to support those who fight.
Debbie1
@Frankensteinbeck: Just so you know, only white women say that. Them who make more $ on average than black men. As a thought experiment, check how many positions are saved at news desks for white women versus people of color. Or, for that matter, how often white women get shot/killed by cops. Those poor dears. Now, back to your regularly scheduled Syrian bombing…
Debbie1
@Baud: Well, in the absence of authorization from Congress or notifying our non-Putin allies, would it have killed TR*mp to have addressed the nation & explained himself to the people who are actually paying for this latest misadventure?
artem1s
Lord Small Gloves decides to ignore the Obama administration self imposed rules of engagement to minimize civilian casualties and kills 200 civilians in his first major offensive. Assad ramps up his chemical attacks (has been since January. wonder why that date is significant) against his own citizens who are on the front line fighting the war against ISIS. The Orange Sock Puppet claims he’s not gonna tell the enemy when he’s gonna strike just to spare the lives of a few filthy refugee brown people like weak Obama did. Then Putin’s Butt Buddy suddenly decides that telling the enemy his plans is a good thing and manages to launch $70M worth of Tomahawks and barely hits anything of value.
even better Betsy DeVos’ brother and Blackwater just hit paydirt and will get fat stacks of unbid government contracts to run up a 3 trillion dollar debt in their new off the books war. WOW. It took Shrub nine months to get to this point and he had to stumble ass backwards into 9/11 to jump start his fake war on WMDs. Mission Accomplished!
Lizzy L
@artem1s: What’s your source for the claim that there were 200 civilian casualties from the bombing? The reports I’ve seen say there were no casualties.
les
@hovercraft:
But are you full of eels?
Sorry, sometimes I have no self control.
StringOnAStick
@Chris: Pareene is worse than a free rider, he’s the guy who uses his position as a writer and journalist to push his “why I don’t have to like HRC or bother to vote” schtick, which others will read and emulate. Pareene sees it as a thought experiment, whereas I see it as him being a lefty BillO.
Starfish
The Onion is the only news organization that got it right.
Tehanu
@zach:
Proof? What is this “proof” of which you speak? President* Dump don’t need no stinkin’ proof!