Every word of this @ShaneGoldmacher piece is a) true b) a service c) belies the notion of some grand plan by Trump https://t.co/5lAgEzGAB3
— Maggie Haberman (@maggieNYT) May 15, 2017
Good thing for our national self-esteem that we know he lost the popular vote, because Trump’s a perfect representative of his in-every-sense “base”:
White House chief of staff Reince Priebus issued a stern warning at a recent senior staff meeting: Quit trying to secretly slip stuff to President Donald Trump.
Just days earlier, K.T. McFarland, the deputy national security adviser, had given Trump a printout of two Time magazine covers. One, supposedly from the 1970s, warned of a coming ice age; the other, from 2008, about surviving global warming, according to four White House officials familiar with the matter.
Trump quickly got lathered up about the media’s hypocrisy. But there was a problem. The 1970s cover was fake, part of an internet hoax that’s circulated for years. Staff chased down the truth and intervened before Trump tweeted or talked publicly about it.
The episode illustrates the impossible mission of managing a White House led by an impetuous president who has resisted structure and strictures his entire adult life.
While the information stream to past commanders in chief has been tightly monitored, Trump prefers an open Oval Office with a free flow of ideas and inputs from both official and unofficial channels. And he often does not differentiate between the two. Aides sometimes slip him stories to press their advantage on policy; other times they do so to gain an edge in the seemingly endless Game of Thrones inside the West Wing.
The consequences can be tremendous, according to a half-dozen White House officials and others with direct interactions with the president. A news story tucked into Trump’s hands at the right moment can torpedo an appointment or redirect the president’s entire agenda. Current and former Trump officials say Trump can react volcanically to negative press clips, especially those with damaging leaks, becoming engrossed in finding out where they originated…
Sounds like Reince may be looking for the escape hatch. (And I suspect Michael Steele is lifting a glass of Baileys in his memory, cereal garnish optional.)
Speaking of people who aren’t qualified for the jobs they occupy, remember all those Very Serious Pundits who assured us that Trump’s “inexperience” didn’t matter, because he was gonna surround himself with quality advisors?…
Imagine being a national security aide intentionally hoaxing your own boss. https://t.co/m47fU56wBW
— Tom Nichols (@RadioFreeTom) May 15, 2017
@RadioFreeTom Reading the article, it seems it wasn't intentional. Apparently, she also thought the faked 70s Time cover found on the internet was real.
— Hanno Zulla (@hzulla) May 15, 2017
If MacFarland didn't know, then she failed in her basic obligation to get accurate info to the boss. Not sure what's worse. https://t.co/iNmxbgdwvn
— Tom Nichols (@RadioFreeTom) May 15, 2017
lamh36
Profiles in courage…NOT
Butthurt Jordan Trombone (fka XTPD)
Which mad king is Blithering Butthole? Kaiser Wilhelm (too intelligent?) Carlos II de España (legit disabled?) Gaius Julius Caesar Germanicus (possibly intentionally trolling the Senate)? Or is it completely unfair to any of the above to be compared to Donald?
lamh36
Nora
@lamh36: Mr. Maverick. “He’s got an R after his name, so it must be all right.”
lamh36
Barbara Starr pointing out that if this was intel coming from an ally, that we do NOT own the rights to that information. It’s about the confidence that other countries have that they can share resources with the US…
If true and he shared with Russia, Cheeto does NOT know what the Russians already know…and can this info be used by Russia to go after the source of the intel…smh
TenguPhule
Is it still doom and gloom when we’re right?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@lamh36: somewhere the first two John Sidney McCains blush with pride.
Baud
Whew. Saw the title and thought this post was about me.
rikyrah
@lamh36:
Da hail ????
TenguPhule
@Baud:
Rest assured Baud, we never thought of you as angry. Mildly upset at the absolute worst.
rikyrah
@lamh36:
The curve for White Men is REAL.
This is unphucking believable ???
? Martin
How was McFarland or Trump supposed to know it was fake when it aligned perfectly with the facts being reported over at Fox? This conspiracy must go even deeper than anyone imagined!
hovercraft
@lamh36:
I think Adam has stated in the past that this was a concern for some of our allies who share intelligence with us. Something like this, the realization of their biggest fears will cause them to withhold information with us unless they absolutely have to. At least during the transition Obama could hold back some stuff, but now he has access to everything. This bozo is going to get us all killed.
? Martin
@rikyrah: Speaking as a white man – of course it’s real.
Baud
@TenguPhule: I’m pretty angry. Grrrr.
donnah
What really frosts my cookies is that all of this stupid bumbling is being shrugged off by everyone. Well, everyone on the Right and in the news. Doop dee doo, just Trump being Trump! Hell, he can declassify anything, nevermind going through the proper channels. And hey, someone slipped him fake info because they don’t know what they’re doing, either! ha ha! what a laugh riot!
Jeez, I hope we survive this circus.
lamh36
More profiles in courage from ur Senator Betty…smh
West of the Rockies (been a while)
@Butthurt Jordan Trombone (fka XTPD):
Well, Donald Duck is no despot, but he is fat in the bottom, easily pranked and given to bouts of rage.
Elizabelle
@hovercraft: Not us all killed, but I wonder how the families/parents of active duty military and government employees (CIA, State) will look at this. He is making their jobs harder and very likely putting them in harm’s way because allied intelligence may be less forthcoming.
When will parents and families of those in the military turn against the Great Real Estate Developer (who should not be anywhere near classified intelligence)?
MisterForkbeard
@TenguPhule: The old saw about “Is it really paranoia if they really are out to get you?”
I’m still pretty sure this is just Trump being a huge insecure idiot. But I don’t get how Rs can pretend this is acceptable or normal. And the media always treats these thing as flashes in the pan rather than ongoing incompetence that must be addressed and then lets it go a day or so later.
@hovercraft: He’s probably not going to get us all killed. He will, however, screw up all our relations with our allies and vastly decrease our own security and intelligence capabilities in addition to all the other social and fiscal harm he’ll cause.
Elizabelle
@donnah: It’s been, what, two hours?
lamh36
The likely story the admin will run with…
@b_fung
Expect this convo, over on r/The_Donald, to play out repeatedly in the coming days. McMaster with the GOP fig leaf.
Brachiator
@Butthurt Jordan Trombone (fka XTPD):
Mentioned it before, but Trump is very much like Pappy O’Daniel, a radio entertainer who got elected governor of Texas. Twice.
Pappy never bothered learning his job, but got bored and decided to run for the Senate. He won there, too, beating out an upstart named Lyndon Johnson.
MisterForkbeard
@lamh36: I salute your bravery and iron stomach for reading /r/The_Donald, but I don’t have the intestinal fortitude to deal with that level of racism, sexism, and idiocy. Can you summarize? Is it basically “Trump didn’t do this, but if he did he totally had the right to do it and it was a historic act of leadership to share this info with the Russians”?
ETA: “And also, McMaster says Trump didn’t do this, even if his list of things not discussed doesn’t actually conform to what the problem is.”
Jim, Foolish Literalist
The American people don’t care
I wonder what the count of traffic driven to WaPo from buzzfeed is, might be a good indicator of non-political junkie interest
chopper
@West of the Rockies (been a while):
OTOH, he speaks better english than trump does.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
lamh36
@MisterForkbeard: its a twitter link to a pic of an exchange
MisterForkbeard
@lamh36: Thanks. Now I can safely open it. Still slightly nauseated. :)
lamh36
If the meeting was on the up and up…why did admin feel need to scrub the record after the meeting…
Redshift
Everyone at Fox believes the phony Time cover is real, and the White House runs on the assumption that everything on Fox is true. I would definitely believe that McFarland thought it was real. It confirmed what she believes, why would she question it? Frankly, I’m more surprised anyone on staff contradicted it.
Brachiator
Of course, the person who boasted about this most vociferously was Trump himself. He talked about how he was bigly great and always knew how to select the best people.
But despite his declining popularity, his supporters don’t care. His anger is their anger. His enemies are their enemies. His ignorance is their ignorance. And most critically, the GOP Congress continues to support Trump against any challenge.
lamh36
@Salon
Despite Donald Trump’s deep unpopularity, MSNBC is moving to the right
lamh36
Patricia Kayden
@lamh36: Ostrich head firmly lodged in sand. What a profile in courage Little Marco has turned out to be. I’m sure this will augur well for him when he runs in 2020. /s
Brachiator
A bit of international news:
And yet Putin and Trump are still best buddies, and some conservatives want the two to co-operate in the fight against ISIL.
mai naem mobile
I feel like the IC is screaming for help and the GOP establishment is sitting on their hands twiddling their thumbs saying ‘Not till we get our tax cuts!’
Fuck these people. If Obama had done any, any of this shit, he would have been impeached within 3 days.
? ?? Goku ? ?
@lamh36: Totally asinine and gutless. Just because he can legally do so doesn’t mean that he should have or should face no consequences. Oh, but wait we need tax cuts. Those will sure help after the nuclear holocaust
hitchhiker
The phrase “lathered up” as a description of DT is nauseating.
It’s bad enough we have to see his bloated face all over everything. It’s gross to see his disgusting silhouette anywhere near the white house or the oval office or air force one.
But now they’re going to plant a “lathered up” version in my brain? Gahhhhhhhh.
Patricia Kayden
@lamh36: Sad. You would think that MSNBC would try to profit off all of the anti-Trump sentiment which has been flourishing since his election. It’s times like this that I wish Soros was the leftwing wizard that Rightwingers make him out to be so that he could create a news channel to compete with MSNBC, CNN and Fox News. Sigh.
debbie
@Brachiator:
The report I heard said approximately 50 bodies were being cremated each day.
lamh36
I eagerly await Adam’s post, cause I know he has something to say bout all this
lamh36
Yep…whatever Cheeto says…Ryan et al will run with it.
https://twitter.com/tparti/status/864249702451212289
Corner Stone
@Patricia Kayden: Andy Lack deserves a serious serving of the two-minute motherfucker treatment.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Patricia Kayden: apparently Andrew Lack thinks the news should be read by people like Matt Lauer and Brian “Chopper Bri” Williams. It puts that whole “national security town hall” in a new light for me.
lamh36
Sloane Ranger
Going back to the Time magazine cover, even if the 1970’s one was real, where’s the hypocrisy? There’s 30 years between covers. The staff at Time could have changed several times over in that period. Not to mention that scientific thinking could have changed.(I am not a scientist so I don’t know if that’s the case but then neither is anyone at the Trump White House!
This seems to be more evidence that he doesn’t understand that changing your mind in the light of new evidence is actually a good thing!
lamh36
@kylegriffin1
Now Reuters, NYT, and Buzzfeed have all confirmed The Washington Post’s report.
Baud
@lamh36:
Someone should follow up with all of these Trump defenders by asking whether they then think it’s ok for the news media to report the information publicly, since it’s no longer classified.
Corner Stone
Dina Powell used to have some level of regard in professional circles. Dignity Wraith strikes again.
lamh36
https://twitter.com/RonBrownstein/status/864251498406039552
Corner Stone
@Baud:
Yes, I am also curious to find out which anti-Assad cel embedded in Syria gets to be completely wiped out over the next few days.
Baud
@Corner Stone: All of them, Katie.
mai naem mobile
@Patricia Kayden: I think it has to do with some merger or other regulatory stuff Comcast wants from Lumpy.
JMG
I don’t think it’ll be long before we find out the intelligence service that was comprised by the blabbermouth was Israel’s. That’s a really bad group to make annoyed.
Baud
Kevin Drum
MisterForkbeard
@lamh36: You know, Treason charges require two witnesses, right? Think the Russian Ambassador and his photographer would be up to it?
scav
@lamh36: All those failing fake media sources trying to confuse All True Americans about the desparately needed innovative CEO brilliance, the deep commitment to the bedrock conservative genius nd ethos that once Made America Great demonstrated by the Hero Donald in a critical moment where he is wrestling with the corrupt and fatally broken American government by going all off-road Rambo in order to Make Them (and their tax rebates) Safe.
MisterForkbeard
@Baud: Do you have a link to that article? That sounds like something I’d like to read in more depth.
Baud
I think we should talk talking about how Reaganesque Trump is. Just to make the Republicans deny it.
Baud
@MisterForkbeard:
http://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2017/05/entire-world-adapting-having-idiot-white-house
lamh36
geg6
CBS News leads with the story as breaking news. And brings up his tweets about Hillary’s emails being reason to not give her intelligence briefings. Michael Morrell is calling this extremely bad.
Corner Stone
At this point I respectfully disagree with Cole’s assertion on twitter. Nothing that comes out of Mcmaster’s mouth can be believed until thoroughly verified. And since he is the NSA that means never for most topics.
Dignity Wraith is always going to take his toll.
Corner Stone
McMaster just gave it up. He’s done.
Mnemosyne
@Brachiator:
We have literally seen this before. There are people alive today who saw these things happen before with their own eyes.
Baud
@Corner Stone: What did he say? TV is not on.
lamh36
So cause McMasters was a “good guy” we are supposed to believe him? Nothing to see here folks…
AdamK
@Butthurt Jordan Trombone (fka XTPD): Caligula was dealt with.
Corner Stone
@Baud: He said out loud what his statement previously said. Mcmaster gave up any shred of credibility he may have had. he talked about ongoing military operations and sources & methods. The McMaster Fig Leaf ™ .
McMaster can not be believed on anything he says during this administration.
lamh36
McMasters said NOTHING to contradict the WashPo story…instead talked around the points in the WashPo story…
but hey…he’s was a good General so…we should all believe him..
At what point does one admit that just cause someone is good on the job, doesn’t mean they can’t change once they are out?
Felonius Monk
McMaster’s demeanor was the tell. He’s a lying sack of shit.
Baud
@Corner Stone: Thanks. So if I interpret that correctly, he’s not denying that Trump revealed classified info, but he’s noting that there exists classified info that Trump did not reveal. Correct?
Corner Stone
No, Cole. That is not what he said. He came out and lied by omission using a non-denial denial. He said he was in the room and the report as reported did not happen. He cited Rex Tillerson as support. His credibility does not exist any longer.
lamh36
These folks are willing to put their career reputation on the line for Donald Fuq’n Trump…smh
rikyrah
@mai naem mobile:
3 days?
That long?
Corner Stone
God dammit. This is too serious a story to have Tweety on in prime time to interview people about it. STFU and let your god damn guests finish their fucking sentence.
lamh36
hovercraft
@Elizabelle: @MisterForkbeard:
I may be exaggerating slightly, but he’s endangering all of us, of our allies don’t share we are more vulnerable. Someone giving you a heads up is more useful than someone shoving you out of the way at the last minute. We need to work with our allies before the threats become imminent.
lamh36
Tweety pulling Pat Bukkkanan from under whatever rock he was under to comment…
Get the fuq out of here Tweety
hovercraft
@lamh36:
But even McMaster lied by denying shit that wasn’t asserted in the article that he was supposedly rebutting.
Baud
@lamh36: LOL. Of all the people in the world they could have called….
Corner Stone
@lamh36: McMaster did say it. He said the story as reported was false and did not happen. He then cited two senior officials, one of which was SecState who “remembered the meeting the same way”.
McMaster is a piece of garbage now, just a hollow shell. Every thing Trump touches turns to shit.
Corner Stone
Over the weekend on MtP SecState said he has to work daily to earn Trump’s trust and confidence. Now McMaster and to a lesser degree Powell both sacrificed their reputations and dignity in the same day. Rosenstein is now also a fucking punch line after decades of service. Paul Ryan is a national joke SNL put in an ice cream jockey’s uniform.
There is no one who will survive intact during this administration.
TenguPhule
@lamh36:
mai naem mobile
@rikyrah: lofisticuffs not that they wouldnt want to do it in 8 hra.
Thoughtful David
@lamh36:
This is the interesting story. How did this story get out? If this had been a competent administration, whoever knew what happened would, out of loyalty to the boss, just sit on the story. Maybe tell him he screwed up, and not to do it again, but the story would never be heard.
Yet this story got out. The WaPo story even mentioned “officials” plural.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
at least on twitter, this seems to be the congealing consensus about McMaster and the WH response
Corner Stone
@lamh36: I don’t think Uncle Pat has aged in 30 years. He must drink goat’s blood during the full moon. Or stem cell baby’s blood. Either one.
TenguPhule
@Brachiator:
Fake news, The US State Dept has been shut down since February.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Corner Stone: Bay gave him her life force to continue the Family Project– I forget what that is in the original Middle German
Mnemosyne
@lamh36:
Let’s not fool ourselves. Sure, they want tax cuts, but even more than that, they want to take us back to pre-Civil Rights. Poll taxes. Legal discrimination. The whole nine yards. And they can only get it if Trump is in charge, because they all sold out to the Russians to get what they wanted.
Steeplejack
Jesus. Tweety just trundled out Patrick fucking Buchanan. Did not see that coming. I hope he doesn’t hang around for Rachel Maddow’so show.
lamh36
TenguPhule
@MisterForkbeard: Needs two American witnesses. Which Trump has thoughtfully provided. Even if they have to be tortured into admitting it.
Corner Stone
@Steeplejack: And Pat is just as fucking brain addled and hateful as I remember him from last seeing him 10 years ago.
lamh36
Wow…CNN State Dept sources had no idea about the details of the story.
Officials on the statement…they didn’t know that the SoS had already put out a statement and it came from the White House…smh
“surprising” “odd”
hovercraft
@Corner Stone:
He’s a fan of Cheney’s apart from the whole foreign intervention thing ;) and they did cut their teeth together way back in Tricky Dick’s administration, maybe drinking kids blood is a secret they managed to keep.
lamh36
@Corner Stone: Evil eats away at ur soul like with KellyAnne Conway and Bannon unless ya do like Uncle Pat and dine on babies innocent tears and dreams
SiubhanDuinne
@Butthurt Jordan Trombone (fka XTPD):
Perhaps he has porphyria. If one of the domestic staff leaks (heh) that he pees purple, there’s a “Madness of King Donald” play in the offing.
lamh36
batgirl
@mai naem mobile: Bingo! This is about Comcast sucking up to Trump to gain favor for regulatory, legislative purposes.
sigaba
@lamh36: I LOLd.
America, are you not entertained?
hovercraft
@lamh36:
Twitter knows that this was leaked from inside that room, someone close to him did this, knowing what they’ve been through the last week and knowing that he desperately wants and needs to focus on the trip that’s coming up on Friday. We already knew that the G7 was going to have some awkward moments, this will make those ;readers even more cautious in their dealing with him.
dmsilev
@lamh36: Are Downfall remix videos still passé, or can we now bring them back as retro?
Patricia Kayden
Remember when Paul Ryan said that Secretary Clinton shouldn’t have access to classified information because she was “reckless”? It’s so odd how he hasn’t said peep about Trump’s recklessness with the Russians.
Kathleen
@Corner Stone: Maybe Cheney shares his stash of warm blood from cute puppies.
JMG
I said it in the previous thread, but I’d bet good money McMaster was the leaker, or told the story to the leakers and sent them forth with his blessing. His statement was a model of a man planning ahead for an occasion where his first words will be “I solemnly swear.”
geg6
@SiubhanDuinne:
Oh, I don’t think they need the porphyria excuse for this one. There are aspiring playwrights already working furiously on the book for that one as we speak, only four months in.
That said, anyone else feeling like it’s been four years already and not four months? Fucker is aging me more quickly than I already was.
Baud
@sigaba: America! America’s Most Watched Reality Show.
Repatriated
@lamh36: They should record anyway, figure out what tv program is playing, and then digitally subtract the tv program audio, leaving only the shouted conversation.
lamh36
? Martin
@Corner Stone: Trump is serving up some powerful Kool-Aid.
Baud
@lamh36: I wonder if someone will get stabbed.
Immanentize
@hovercraft: why not Lavarov? He is just the guy to do it.
sigaba
@Repatriated: You cant do that unless you have an LTI model of the room and know the positions of all the sound sources within half a wavelength (IAA sound engineer)
I recommend blind deconvolution.
lamh36
Prediction: Cheeto and GOP will use this upcoming overseas trip to ride out this storm…with help of US media and the bullshit “no critcizing the Pres when across the pond” excuse.
Baud
@lamh36: You’re assuming he won’t spill more state secrets on his foreign trip.
Mnemosyne
@lamh36:
WTF?
Kathleen
@lamh36: I thought that was Paul Ryan’s gig?
? Martin
@Baud: God doesn’t love us that much.
lamh36
@Baud: Springer style chair fight…
Turgidson
@Baud:
They never really had a proper reckoning for their complicity in the eight-year atrocity that was their previous Dear Leader’s administration. They lost a couple elections, but not as badly as they deserved, and they made their comeback despite/because of the fact that they became considerably more unhinged.
I don’t see any reason to think this time will be all that different. Maybe the backlash will be worse, but I don’t a chastened GOP that “learned” anything will be the outcome. When Trump goes down or loses reelection or otherwise exits, the GOP’s leaders and influence-peddlers will collectively shrug, say “that was weird, glad it’s over” and get on with the business of accusing the Democratic president of treason for wanting to help poor people. And the BothSiderist media will let them.
JMG
Look, the first thing that’s gonna happen on Trump’s trip is that the Pope is gonna diss him in public. Trump won’t get the dig in person, but Fox will tell him. So we’ll get a rage tweet at the Pope. Yeah, that’ll take the heat off.
lamh36
If Pat Buchannan on MSNBC while Lawrence O’Donnell is on the chopping block…doesn’t confirm the way MSNBC is trying to lean…smh
weaselone
@hovercraft:
It could have been leaked by virtually anyone. The story indicates that the Intel in question was actually from a partner and that we notified them that Trump had leaked this information to minimize the fallout and damage. The partner could have then leaked this info to get back at Trump. Or the Russians could have leaked the information just to screw with us.
Corner Stone
This is the only time when Tweety is actually any good – when some scumbag like Ned Ryun is on trying to hardcore spin RW talking points that Tweety doesn’t like. He shreds those people when they try that.
JWR
@hovercraft:
Provided it wasn’t the Russians, maybe all that needs be done is wait for the next “You’re Fired” moment?
TenguPhule
@Patricia Kayden:
IOIYAR.
I repeat that Babylon 5 quote about Paul Ryan.
I do want to live long enough to wave.
lamh36
Per CNN, Russian statement… “Ambassador has no comment”
Russians right now ….
https://twitter.com/psddluva4evah/status/864267298932236289
Baud
@Turgidson: Agree. Even if we are lucky enough to have a repeat of the 2006 and 2008 elections, I can’t trust that we won’t be locked in the same cycle we were in last time. Despite what the GOP and Trump are doing, I still see a lot of hesitation among people who simply don’t want to accept that the Dems are by and large correct and the only sane choice.
Mnemosyne
@Turgidson:
There’s not a lot that can be done as long as Fox News is pumping propaganda into people’s heads 24/7 under the guise of “free speech.”
bluehill
Interesting but depressing take on USA by former CIA analysts.
Elie
@Thoughtful David:
This. Who leaked this story?
Timurid
@lamh36:
He’s struggling to type his post, as it’s hard to see the keyboard through the bottom of a shot glass…
Cheryl Rofer
I am making a chocolate chip cookie recipe with dates and nuts in place of the chocolate chips, and the cookies are AWESOME!
I have been planning to do this all day and see no reason not to do as I planned.
SiubhanDuinne
@Corner Stone:
Somehow along the way, I had missed that Rexxon was in the room. (That’s kind of new and different for this administration, yes? Having the Secretary of State actually present at a high-level meeting with foreign diplomats?)
BBA
Nothing short of a stroke will get him out of office, and maybe not even that.
All is lost.
Hail Kek.
TenguPhule
@Cheryl Rofer:
Blasphemy! No Chocolate?! Healthy Food?!
Shame! Shame Shame!
Baud
@bluehill:
But failing so far, if polls are to be believed.
SiubhanDuinne
@Corner Stone:
“Tweety” and “STFU” will never happen. Just accept that fact and move on.
the Conster, la Citoyenne
@bluehill:
populism means white nationalism. Full stop.
SiubhanDuinne
@Steeplejack:
If Rachel has PattyBuck as a guest, she is dead to me.
schrodingers_cat
@BBA: You should go build your bunker just in case.
Corner Stone
@schrodingers_cat: We, as a nation, are not in a very good place right now. And the trajectory is not sloping up and to the right of the chart.
SiubhanDuinne
@bluehill:
Maybe it’s just me, but I do not care to see the words “tectonic shift” and “foreign policy” in close proximity in the same sentence.
TenguPhule
@Baud:
Except among his true believers. They’ve already decided that anything that attacks their world view is “Fake News”. When the world refuses to play along with them, they’re not going to accept that peacefully.
lamh36
ruemara
@BBA: Please. A Warchief like this would’ve been killed in ritual combat by day3.
TenguPhule
@SiubhanDuinne: Just like “Serving” and “Man” should never be on the cover of a Cookbook.
BBA
@lamh36: I take it back. If Collins is suffering then there’s still some hope for the world.
Aleta
At this point the Republican argument has gone from “Didn’t do it” to “Didn’t mean it,” to “Not impeachable” to “You can’t arrest him for it.”
SiubhanDuinne
@Cheryl Rofer:
It’s because of people like you that I have massive trust issues to this day.
lamh36
Cheeto Prez twitter feed tonight gone be LIT!!!
Cause ya’ll know ain’t nobody there with him to stop him
schrodingers_cat
@Corner Stone: True, but lighting one’s own hair on fire and running around in circles is not going to achieve much is it?
Mnemosyne
@lamh36:
Lay down with dogs, get up with fleas, Susie. Too late to be upset with your president now.
SiubhanDuinne
@TenguPhule:
ZACKLY
Mnemosyne
@ruemara:
I admit, I am DYING to know what the screaming argument between the spokesbots in the other room was all about.
bluehill
@Baud: Unfortunately he’s consolidated it within Congress, the only group that matters right now. I think the polls reflect disapproval but that doesn’t mean the people that voted for him want him out of office. I’m sure many of them don’t like some/most of his actions but they still voted for him. It’s going to take a lot of polls specifically about impeachment before Congress feels enough pressure to even consider acting. Ugh. Time for another drink.
Aleta
@Cheryl Rofer: I wonder, if you add coconut …
Corner Stone
@schrodingers_cat: I don’t know if it will do much more than give you a sore scalp. But just saying people are being poopyheads about the reality of where we are doesn’t do much to move the issue(s) forward either.
ETA, McCain didn’t even bother to first give his usual “Strong Maverick” statement before he pooped himself and asked for his tapioca.
McMaster just shredded decades of honorable service with one out loud press statement. Comey’s gone (I didn’t like him) and McConnell said to America they can lick his nuts.
At some point reality has to be faced directly.
BBA
@Mnemosyne: WHY DID YOU GET TWO SCOOPS OF ICE CREAM? ONLY I GET TWO SCOOPS OF ICE CREAM, THAT’S WHAT BEING PRESIDENT IS ALL ABOUT!
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Well, Sue, you’re one of fifty-two people in the whole damn country, in the whole damned world, who could make that more likely than it is now.
Steeplejack (phone)
@TenguPhule:
Fix’d.
MisterForkbeard
@lamh36: Maybe she should have voted for the OTHER candidate, then. That might have solved this problem.
schrodingers_cat
@Corner Stone: Where we are is bad. But what would you call operating on the assumption that we have already lost battles yet to be fought? Gloating about riots and revolutions, what would you call that?
Being realistic?
BBA
@MisterForkbeard: The other candidate? But Jeb wasn’t on the ballot!
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@MisterForkbeard: wouldn’t surprise me if she had
hovercraft
@lamh36:
Fuck Lucy, if she wanted crisis free days she should have voted for and openly supported her former colleague who she knew to be sane and competent instead of this moran who doesn’t even know enough to keep his fucking mouth shut.
Corner Stone
McMaster shit the bed after Cole tried to defend him and now Cole is tweeting about hockey. [insert the whatever subscript]
Mnemosyne
@bluehill:
I tend to agree with Kay that we need some indictments before we start talking about impeachment. Impeachment is (IMO) supposed to remove someone after you’ve shown that they committed crimes, not a shortcut to get rid of someone.
JPL
@Corner Stone: lol Okay, I’m going to try to defend McMaster. He had no idea what was in the article, and depended on the WH staff to inform him, while wearing depends.
Cheryl Rofer
The folks at Lawfare lay out the issues.
I don’t know how they did this so quickly.
debbie
@ruemara:
Right. He’s no Khal Drogo, that’s for sure.
Aleta
@lamh36:
No peace for you, Senator.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
p.a.
Who will be the first from this admin. joining Snowden in Russian sanctuary? Total eventual number?
Marcopolo
So I just read Trey Gowdy has removed himself from consideration for FBI Director. Although I thought he was a none-to-bright @sshole in the wake of the Hillary Bengazi hearings, I do have to give him some credit for realizing the absolute certainty of his loss of personal dignity (at least what he thinks he has left), which happens to everyone who enters the Trump event horizon (and note McMasters was apparently just now sucked all the way in), was too much for him to want to run the agency.
p.a.
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: and it won’t have been quick…
Corner Stone
@schrodingers_cat: There are no other battles. We’re not getting another bite at this apple. Our institutions have failed. I have no faith in the people embedded in those failed institutions. Trump, ZEGS and AG Sessions are going to keep coming. Do you think NC is going to give up on their voter suppression attempts? CJ Roberts all but told them to keep trying.
Until or unless members of the majority party start acting like US citizens and not Republicans we’re fighting a losing rear guard action. Not a battle.
JPL
@hovercraft: I wonder if she watches SNL? Cecily Strong said “You’re doing too much. I want one day without a CNN alert that scares the hell out of me.”
TenguPhule
@schrodingers_cat:
You jumping to conclusions, again.
Its not gloating, its trying to get people’s awareness up to speed as to just how dangerous things have gotten. This is not normal. At this point there could be a fake news story about major riots in all cities breaking out and it couldn’t simply be shrugged off as unbelievable simply because that’s how bad things are now.
Our federal government is quickly running out of credit at the bank of honesty.
Steeplejack (phone)
@Corner Stone:
Yeah, that was a bright spot.
TenguPhule
@p.a.: And it will be out on video. To serve as an example.
Shana
@Baud: You know, NATO shouldn’t make any adjustments to their processes. They should just go ahead the way they always have and show, right out there on the world stage, how inept and out of his depth Trump is. At some point they’re probably going to have to ignore him anyway, just save some time. “See, we can’t deal with him in any way.”
Shalimar
@JPL: McMaster is quoted in the WP article. The reporter who got the quote would have given him a summary of what was in it.
Corner Stone
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: That person’s entire village is most likely dead.
TenguPhule
@Corner Stone: The term for this I believe is a “Forlorn hope.”
Butthurt Jordan Trombone (fka XTPD)
@SiubhanDuinne: IIRC the porphyria diagnosis is apocryphal, George III’s psychotic episodes being mire solidly attributable to hypermania and dementia. Maybe Butthole’s huffing lead paint & mercury?
Kathleen
@lamh36: Commenter at LGM posted this:
The Washington Post article seems to indicate that the compromised information derives from communications intelligence obtained from some partner country (likely the UK or Israel, I’d guess). In which case,
————————-
Here’s a link to the thread at Lawyers Guns and Money:
http://www.lawyersgunsmoneyblog.com/2017/05/medias-focus-clintons-email-server-looking-better-ever/comment-page-1#comment-2763319
Baud
@TenguPhule:
Who the fuck cares?
Villago Delenda Est
Anyone here who has ever held a clearance knows how devastating this revelation is. Donald is using his access to the most sensitive information possible to feed his ego.
Remove from office now.
Baud
@bluehill:
Not really, or they would have passed more legislation by now.
Mnemosyne
@Butthurt Jordan Trombone (fka XTPD):
Yep — the latest hypothesis I’ve seen is that George III was bipolar, and the reported blue pee that’s supposed to be indicative that he had porphyria was due to a documented herbal remedy he was being given.
TenguPhule
@Baud: We do, the fuckers live in swing states.
Baud
@TenguPhule: Is there any evidence that he is still strong in swing states? His true base is still the deep red states.
p.a.
No tweets from President Binks on this yet? Who’s keeping him distracted by playing Candyland?
lamh36
@p.a.: too early…he likes late night, early morning tweets
TenguPhule
@Baud: The stories in the FYNYT and other “Trump voter” stories I’ve seen which have been interviewing in battleground states have been that either they don’t care, or they don’t believe it. There’s enough of them in the swingers to make life miserable for everyone else.
And enough of them are armed as well as stupid to make them a concern for other places too.
SiubhanDuinne
@Butthurt Jordan Trombone (fka XTPD):
@Mnemosyne:
Well, I was being somewhat snarky, because I’m aware of the bipolar speculation and the general rejection of porphyria as an explainer for G3. Just trying to come up with another historical figure for comparison, and King George was the first to come to mind. Also, it’s amusing to think about Trump peeing from his tiny, TINY peester and seeing indigo urine drizzle out.
Baud
@TenguPhule: C’mon. Don’t bring me that weak NYT shit.
lamh36
Peale
@Baud: honestly, I think the evidence that the GOP is holding together was that the House is going to gut food stamps and try to privatize Medicare. They have their own polls of their districts. Until we actually win some elections, they can feel secure that their voters are enough to save their seats.
Mnemosyne
@SiubhanDuinne:
I’m about halfway through Christopher Hibbert’s biography of the Prince Regent — I put it down at the point where my novel begins and will get back to it once I finish writing. Hibbert is sympathetic to Prinny without making excuses for him.
Baud
@Peale: I agree with that. But I don’t think that’s a question of Trump consolidating power. This is what the GOP is.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@TenguPhule: that they don’t care about Trump and Russia doesn’t mean they’ll show up to vote for Jeff Flake or whoever runs against Claire McCaskill, especially if Flake and Whoever find themselves forced to say unkind things about trump, who notices, and tweets…
Also too
TenguPhule
@Baud: Anyone who’s still willing to admit to being a Trump voter at this point is full on cyanide koolaid. They’re not changing their minds.
Peale
@Baud: swing states don’t matter for 3 years when the president is running.
JWR
@Villago Delenda Est:
Probably the best explanation I’ve yet to read of what’s gone on today. Short, sweet and oh so true.
Baud
@TenguPhule: Probably not. But they can’t add to Trump’s power because their support is already baked in.
Baud
@Peale: Right. Need to focus on Congress and states.
TenguPhule
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: And I’d believe that this concerns the GOP if not for the fact that the Senate is locking the Democrats out of the AMCA discussions and planning to try and vote on it as soon as possible.
Which was the other story broken by the Washington Post today.
TenguPhule
@lamh36: And that’s the end of any intelligence inside of Syria.
TenguPhule
@Baud: They can’t add to it, but they can certainly try to change the nature of it. And that should be a concern.
Baud
@TenguPhule: How? Trump’s power is based on hate. That’s all his base cares about. They don’t have the flexibility to change anything.
hovercraft
@p.a.:
It’s Monday, Lucretia and Jared are on hand I’m sure. All she has to do is lean over and flash him some skin and that’ll keep his mind off of these troublesome reporters and citizens who insist on harshing his mellow, can no one rid him of them/us?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Ew. And probably
(Michael Steele says all this trouble starts with the COS– getting his own back against Reince Priebus)
Cheryl Rofer
Washington Post, BuzzFeed, Reuters, and now the New York Times all confirming the story, all seem to have two sources. The same two sources, or more?
Baud
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Watching that too.
TenguPhule
@Baud:
By getting his party to fear him and them to the exclusion of all else. They can wield power disproportionate to their numbers by making examples of those who cross them. Its worked for more then one despot…for a time.
Josie
@SiubhanDuinne:
I understand this completely. My mother used to do something with mashed turnips that looked exactly like mashed potatoes. Marked me for life.
TenguPhule
@Cheryl Rofer: Betting on the same. Redundancy to ensure exposure since so many sat on the stories last time.
Baud
@TenguPhule: There is no evidence that that is happening, however. And Trump’s base is too lazy to make it happen.
dmsilev
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Wishful thinking. Firing Priebus and replacing him with someone, anyone, else won’t change the essential issue of who his boss is.
Mart
@TenguPhule: We have friends who are true believers of dear leader who live in TX. They still post go Trump stories in Facebook. On the phone or when we visit,we simply do not discuss dear leader at all. Go from three soft words to shouting match. I spent some time lately watching Faux News for perspective. And it turns out that the press and dems won’t give him a fair chance to start his agenda. He has all these great ideas to keep us safe from brown people, and would you believe the courts are blocking his agenda too? It is truly a shame that this great business leader is getting such raw treatment from the liberals. Also too, there is no there there to this Russian thing.
So yea, depending on your news feed; the end is near, or the start has not been given a chance.
Baud
@dmsilev: Agree. Trump is unmanageable.
TenguPhule
@Baud: No evidence that its been needed yet. So far GOP Congress members have not actually defied Dear Leader on a crucial issue, no matter how sharply they’ve barked. If or when that changes, then we’ll know for sure, one way or another.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Betsy Woodrufff of whatever Village Daily Pennysaver: The President is showing again that he is willing to surprise people.
Because he did this on purpose!
ETA: @dmsilev: No question– they were, in fairness, talking about the story about how anyone on the WH staff can slip whatever article on trump’s desk. But I suspect Michael Steele has a Reince PRiebus voodoo doll that’s barely held together, and he’s finally seeing some effect
Baud
@TenguPhule: They defied him on the budget.
bluehill
@Mnemosyne: Bill Clinton says hi! I don’t think anyone was indicted, were they? I don’t know what the precedence is for impeachment, but I get your point. My main point was that until polls show that the majority of voters want Trump out of office not just disapproval, I don’t think a repub-led congress is likely to act. So rather than impeachment may be fit for office is a better question to poll on.
hovercraft
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: @Baud:
That’s just like a golfer who tries to blame his clubs for his bad form. Twitler is the problem, he sat back and watched his flacks bullshit the press for two days, before he sat down with Holt, he came as clean as he did because he saw that no one was buying the excuse that Comey was mean to Hillary, and so he decided to fuck it and do it live, show everyone who’s boss, his base lurves that shit. He’s the problem, he’s used to just lying with impunity and not getting called on it.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@bluehill: or “Should Congress investigate….?”
I think that last point it the meat of it, he couldn’t stand letting people think that some Deputy something-or-other had had any influence over He, Trump. Comey and Lavrov, both stories about a weak man obsessed with appearing strong
Major Major Major Major
@bluehill: bill Clinton was of course not successfully impeached nor was there a chance of it happening.
lamh36
@Shalimar:
.
Mnemosyne
@bluehill:
That’s part of my point — Republicans decided to take the impeachment process and make it so politicized that it couldn’t be used again. That’s why I think the only way it could be used against Trump would be in the presence of some actual indictments. Federal ones won’t be forthcoming as long as Sessions is in charge, but Sessions can’t stop New York from indicting Trump on state criminal charges for money laundering.
SiubhanDuinne
I don’t say this often, although I’m tempted to do so almost nightly, but — Can you even imagine being Hillary Rodham Clinton and watching your news feed every single day? She must be shaking her head so hard, so constantly, that it’s about to come unmoored from her neck.
Hobbes83
@lamh36: the mavericky-maverick of the mavericks out-mavericked them all.
schrodingers_cat
Does anyone have a link to the pie filter? Thanks.
From Both Sides of the Pond
For the commentators looking for historical monarchs to compare to – Wilhelm II of Germany. Utterly insecure, requiring constant external validation, and with a bully’s firm belief that you make friends by vowing others into submission while always fearing they aren’t really your friends.
Hobbes83
@SiubhanDuinne: it’s not like she didn’t warn the mouth breathers who voted for him.
Baud
@SiubhanDuinne: She is strong, and she understands how badly women are treated in our society.
geg6
@TenguPhule:
Personally, I think dates, nuts AND chocolate would be delish. I make mine with milk chocolate chips, raisins and pecans. They are to die for.
Baud
@Hobbes83: Absolutely correct.
Jeffro
@Josie:
I hear they’re also doing great things with cauliflower these days!
Major Major Major Major
@schrodingers_cat: always a simple search away, and possibly coming as native functionality on the next version.
schrodingers_cat
@Major Major Major Major: Thanks much. All the talk of blood and gore is giving me indigestion.
SiubhanDuinne
@Josie:
I know. And I like dates and figs well enough. Just don’t pretend foods are something other than they are. Call a turnip a turnip. (I’m not saying Cheryl was trying to pass off dates and figs as chocolate chips, but there needs to be some kind of obvious and immediate signal, like the crossed-fork-tines thing to signal “PEANUT BUTTER! BEWARE!!”)
amk
we are proud #deplorables. we are winning bigly!
schrodingers_cat
@SiubhanDuinne: Agreed! Food fads is one of the main reasons behind the obesity epidemic.
Baud
@amk: Liberals are upset. Winning!
Another Scott
@Corner Stone: I really don’t know why so many believed that McMaster was somehow going to save us all. Slate.
The fact that he agreed to join Trump’s administration should tell us everything we need to know about him.
Similarly with Mattis – Mattis.
Don’t believe the hype about these people. (I would have thought that everyone had the scales lifted from their eyes after the Petraeus fiasco.)
Nobody who is a political appointee inside the Trump Administration is going to save us. Everyone with authority is damaged goods.
We have to save ourselves, and fight them every single day.
(sigh)
My $0.02.
Cheers,
Scott.
Major Major Major Major
@schrodingers_cat: I was having more trouble with the talk of fruit instead of chocolate.
lamh36
So…the WashPo is gonna have a wall of Pulitzers by the time Cheeto leaves office or is forced out…wont’ they.
JMG
@Jeffro:
i love mashed turnips! We have them every Thanksgiving.
Cheryl Rofer
@SiubhanDuinne: Definitely not trying to pass off dates as chocolate chips. It would be obvious to anyone with intelligence higher than Donald Trump’s. I found some dates in my freezer and was sure I had a recipe for date-nut cookies but couldn’t find it. So I improvised. And they are very good indeed.
bluehill
@Mnemosyne: Ooh I get it. Yes I see your point. I guess one difference is that it would be a repub-congress impeaching a repub president. Of course, that also means it’s even less likely to happen, but repubs have repeatedly shown that they respect self-preservation above all else.
Baud
Via Atrios
schrodingers_cat
@Major Major Major Major: That too. I also hate peanut in desserts.
schrodingers_cat
@Another Scott: I never had any faith in the brass, they are set decoration for the huckster in the WH.
SiubhanDuinne
@Jeffro:
Around the time I started dating the man who became my husband, Betty Crocker or General Foods or someone came out with Instant Mashed Potatoes from a box. My future hub and I usd to have Sunday dinner each week with his grandparents, and the grandfather was so fearful that Grandma would use instant flaked potatoes instead of boiling and mashing by hand that he demanded to see the potato peelings from the garbage every week before he would even allow potatoes on his plate! (This was in the early ’60s, and the grandparents were already in their 80s, so don’t even think about suggesting that maybe Grandpa could have helped [and reassured himself] by, you know, PEELING THE POTATOES HIS OWN SELF?)
amk
@Another Scott: Yup. mad dog, kelly, mcmaster. They all have proved to be big duds so far. Whatever reputations they had, twitler’s touch has turned them into shit.
Major Major Major Major
@Baud:
Hoocoodanode that the obvious Russian mole/useful idiot for them would act like a Russian mole/useful idiot.
@schrodingers_cat: on that we’ll have to agree to disagree.
Baud
@Major Major Major Major: If only someone would have called him out as Putin’s puppet.
amk
@Baud:
Moron.
Jeffro
@SiubhanDuinne:
She did say that if she wasn’t elected, it would basically be the Apocalypse. That’s close enough to count as a horseshoe or a hand grenade.
SiubhanDuinne
@JMG:
I love mashed turnips too! I just don’t want anybody telling me they’re mashed potatoes.
Honesty in everything, that’s my motto.
Baud
@amk: Yep. This is Candidate Trump.
Major Major Major Major
@Baud: you’re the puppet!
MisterForkbeard
@Baud: NOW he’s a pathetic mess? The stones on these guys.
Baud
@Major Major Major Major: It’s not easy being green.
amk
and the week has hardly begun.
samesome shit. everyday. reality teevee.SiubhanDuinne
@Jeffro:
And she was right.
Will there ever be a time when I stop feeling “mildly nauseous” about the results of the 2016 election?
Baud
@SiubhanDuinne: Not I.
p.a.
@Baud:
This isn’t The Onion? The person making this statement has some degree of responsibility for our safety? NOW he’s a pathetic mess??!! I expected careerists, kleptocrats, fascists, maybe some decent actors hoping to minimize Pres. Bink’s damage working in his admin., but someone who actually believed in him??!! The mind boggles…
Corner Stone
@Another Scott: I did not. I was specifically pushing back against Cole’s bullshit that McMaster was the kindest, warmest, most decent man any officer serving under him had ever seen.
I have never believed military officials in a civilian administration are the answer. Gen Kelly at DHS is a fucking monster. Mattis seems unhinged. McMaster has now proven he has no credibility and is just another empty flack.
It’s the pundits (both sides) and media that keep trying to tell us what a grown up, mature, professional FP team Trump has put in place. And if he would only do the same on domestic policy spots he would be golden. He could “pivot” and “become president of all the caucuses” once again.
Jeffro
@SiubhanDuinne: “…demanded to see the potato peelings…”
I might have to cite that example the next time Mrs. Jeffro thinks I’m being a little fussy around here… ;)
amk
@Major Major Major Major: the stupidest political moment on fucking live teevee. and yet, here we are.
Steeplejack (phone)
@Major Major Major Major:
The House impeached the shit out of Bill Clinton—successfully—on not one but two counts. (Two other counts failed.) He was acquitted in the subsequent Senate trial.
Wikipedia article here.
schrodingers_cat
@SiubhanDuinne: Actually, my grandfather used to help my grandmother in the kitchen after he retired and she was still working. His mom passed away when he was very young, so he was a good cook too. Did you MIL dump the peels on his head?
Aleta
@Josie: Roommate hates the sight of strawberry rhubarb pie because one time it looked like cherry and he ate some and it wasn’t.
TenguPhule
@Baud: Trump may have decided to simply ignore any budget constraints, betting that Congress won’t try and stop him. Again, if any stories break that Trump’s people are defying congress’s power of the purse, that’s when the test will come.
Major Major Major Major
@Steeplejack (phone): I was referring to the senate portion, yes. Nobody who wants to impeach Trump means “get the articles passed through the House and then have it die in the senate”.
Baud
@TenguPhule: Ok.
amk
Baud
Watching MSNBC tonight. Thinking they could use more conservative voices.
TenguPhule
@geg6:
Dark chocolate or bust, heathen.
Major Major Major Major
@TenguPhule:
It ain’t congress that’ll stop him if the money runs out, it’s the people who won’t work for free. Plus there’s a massive bureaucratic and accounting system probably written in FORTRAN controlling all this stuff, the checks don’t go out addressed to “cash”.
TenguPhule
@Jeffro:
Smithers, release the hounds.
Steeplejack (phone)
@SiubhanDuinne:
Earlier, as I was uncorking a bottle of cheap bubbly—not celebrating, it was just the only thing I had in the house—I suddenly got this 50,000-foot aperçu that in 100+ days of the Trump regime we’ve had more scandals than in eight years of Obama—and that’s even including all the bullshit fake Obama scandals.
TenguPhule
@Major Major Major Major:
Yet. Always gotta add a yet to everything these days.
amk
TenguPhule
@Steeplejack (phone): Hell, he’s putting Reagan and both Bushes to shame.
EBT
@Major Major Major Major: COMTRAN likely as not.
frosty
@Major Major Major Major: COBOL, would be my guess. But at least now the dates have four spaces for the year instead of 2!
lamh36
Jeffro
@p.a.:
I agree with you – whomever that quote is from was clearly smoking the good stuff for the past 18 months.
Why Trumpov ran??? To satisfy his own need for revenge, to satisfy his unending need for attention (especially attention to the stupid shit that comes out of his mouth).
Trumpov caring about the country??? Ya GOT to be kidding me. The racist sexual abuser tax cheat without a single principle other that Trump First???
And Candidate Trumpov wasn’t a pathetic mess? The Khan family? The Miss Universe blow up? “No puppet! No puppet! YOU’RE the puppet!”???
I’ll be glad for these few folks that finally see the light but jeebus almighty, how much evidence do we have to put in front of people?!?
amk
@Steeplejack (phone): #tansuitgate was the bestest, imo. da pivot point when murkkka went into hold my beer, watch me go into deep shit state.
TenguPhule
@SiubhanDuinne:
1 second after the fusion bombs drop.
Omnes Omnibus
@SiubhanDuinne: Mildly?
lamh36
@lamh36: more of Richard Engel with the cleanup…
SiubhanDuinne
@Cheryl Rofer:
::dubiously::
Well. Okay. If you say so. Just please not to go teasing us with your talk of using a “chocolate chip cookie recipe” and then substituting Not-Chocolate Things for the Chocolate.
Just say something like, “Hey! I made some awe-to-the-fucking-some date/fig cookies! Want some?” And everybody would say, “Yeah, those are great!” and problem averted, and nobody would even have to mention chocolate.
Major Major Major Major
@EBT: @frosty: I was just going off what happened in California.
SiubhanDuinne
@Omnes Omnibus:
It was a direct quote.
Corner Stone
@Steeplejack (phone):
Prepare for your place against the wall, Kommissar!
SiubhanDuinne
@TenguPhule:
You’re a reassuring soul.
Jeffro
@amk: saw the Lieu tweet and it’s a great summing up – hey GOP, two high crimes in under a week? Really? Where do you think we’ll be by July???
Also with the Hayes tweet, another softball for any reporter who cares to toss it at Spicey, Spicette, or even the Mango Menace himself: just because the president can tell a hostile foreign power anything he wants…is that your new standard now? What if it gets us cut off from allies’ intelligence? What if it costs American troops their lives? And of course, you’d be okay with holding President Democrat to that standard as well, right?
Chet Murthy
@Cheryl Rofer: A long time ago, I used to make date nut bread from the Internet Cookbook. Stuff was like cocaine, it went so fast.
Corner Stone
I love date bars. Sue me.
Omnes Omnibus
@Corner Stone: Is that the new term for singles’ bars?
Chet Murthy
@SiubhanDuinne: Heh. I’d watch that, if only b/c Unka Pat is …. well, you know, he’s not very tolerant. To see him have to make nicey-nicey with Dr. Maddow …. But otherwise, yeah, not likin’ it.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@lamh36: the laptop plot and the ban that’s been in and out of the news for several weeks now? that’s what panicked the IC about a super secret source that’s “code word” level secret? I don’t think so. Rachel Maddow keeps coming back to the unnamed city, where presumably the source is. I think Engel’s getting played
SiubhanDuinne
@Steeplejack (phone):
Isn’t that just about the same ratio as number of vacation days/amount spent on security? Eight years Obama : 100 days Trump?
Major Major Major Major
@Omnes Omnibus: I thought singles bars had all been replaced by apps.
frosty
@Major Major Major Major: I was just going off my limited knowledge that FORTRAN was for scientific programming and COBOL was for business programs.
Fun OT facts: My dad, the electrical engineer, preferred to use FORTRAN instead of a spreadsheet for any calcs he had to do. My mom was at one time a COBOL programmer and could have made some big bucks for Y2K but she was getting ready to retire and didn’t want to work that hard.
debbie
The local Fox affiliate is teasing this story as a “bombshell.” Not the adjective I was expecting from them.
Steeplejack (phone)
@Baud:
Rabble-rouser.
West of the Rockies (been a while)
Maybe I missed it, but did Adam weigh in yet?
Omnes Omnibus
@Major Major Major Major: Maybe “date bar” is an app. Or maybe CS is OG.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Chet Murthy: Pat was a regular on her show in the earliest days, I think it was she, or her staff, who came up with the whole “uncle Pat” thing to marginalize him even while having him on, the “Crazy Old” preceding Uncle Pat was implied, I thought, and he seemed to get that.
ETA: Ari Malbec filling in for O’Donnell as O’D’s un-renewed contract runs out…
lamh36
Ari Melber in for Lawrence O’Donnell…I like Ari, but…
SiubhanDuinne
Ari Melber subbing for L O’Donnell tonight.
Should anyone read anything into this?
Steeplejack (phone)
@frosty:
Ah, Y2K. I worked on a couple of hair-on-fire projects that year. Good times.
Omnes Omnibus
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Malbec? Wine on your mind?
lamh36
@West of the Rockies (been a while): I don’t think so. i’m thinking the reason this post it hitting 300+…that Adam’s take is on its way…
Or they’ll be back to back auto post…lol
SiubhanDuinne
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
@lamh36:
@SiubhanDuinne:
Hmmmm…..
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Omnes Omnibus: usually
@lamh36: let’s take it Tbogg!
Major Major Major Major
@frosty: I am wrong, it was cobol! https://m.slashdot.org/story/105067
Chet Murthy
deleted b/c redundant
p.a.
@debbie: Possibly: Fux News Breaking Bombshell: WaPo Fake News Story of Trump Security Slip!
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Baud: Yup, Trump’s budget was as DOA as Obama’s.
Corner Stone
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Engel is a smart guy. If he is putting that out uncritically he is pushing propaganda because he wants to.
Omnes Omnibus
@Chet Murthy: When has that ever stopped anyone around here?
Marcopolo
@West of the Rockies (been a while): Nope. Kinda waiting on a new evening thread from him on why with this latest news we shouldn’t run around with our hair on fire. I think that was snark.
Major Major Major Major
@Chet Murthy:
you’re just trying to get the comment count up, admit it.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Major Major Major Major: Bill Clinton was impeached, there were not enough votes in the Senate to convict.
Steeplejack (phone)
@Corner Stone:
In a perfect world I would drink champagne every day. This is just a mousy little Spanish cava. Unassuming but tasty.
West of the Rockies (been a while)
@lamh36:
Thanks, lam…
Major Major Major Major
@?BillinGlendaleCA: I know. I was using it in the sense that literally everybody who isn’t actively being pedantic about it uses it, including pedants most of the time, to mean “successfully remove from office via the impeachment process.”
Corner Stone
@Chet Murthy: When has that ever stopped anyone around here?
Origuy
@frosty: Yeah, COBOL for decimal data, FORTRAN for real numbers. You don’t want to use floating point for working with money; numbers get rounded in the wrong ways. Generally, the FORTRAN specification is more precise about how floating point arithmetic is done than your typical spreadsheet, or most other programming languages, for that matter. I worked on compilers for both languages and was briefly on the COBOL ANSI Standard Committee.
lamh36
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: I’ve been a bit skeptical of Engel for a while…when it comes to some of his reporting that seemed more to fit the “both sides” mold that MSNBC was pushing for a while.
He’s essentially parroting same talking points being pushed by McMasters before the on camera statement. I linked to some tweet showing excerpt of the talking point circulating around RWNJ Trump supporters…
It’s almost exactly what that talking point said about it not being something Russia did not already know about.
Benefit of the doubt, he’s being played.
But my cynical theory…he knows what he’s doing
amk
twitler’s wall.
Steeplejack (phone)
No Pat Buchanan on Rachel’s show. Whew! And Ari Melber in for Lawrence O’Donnell. Score!
Omnes Omnibus
@Corner Stone: Well played.
Chet Murthy
@Major Major Major Major: No, THIS is how I try to get the comment count up! HA!
No, seriously, I would click the “delete” button, but it seems like that requires a moderator action, and I feel like that’s too much work to ask for. So I just erase the body of the comment.
schrodingers_cat
@Origuy: Did you also program with punch cards?
Mnemosyne
@Marcopolo:
Adam has on rare occasions told us that we’re pretty fucked by a particular piece of news.
I suspect he’s trying to figure out how to break it to us right now.
Major Major Major Major
@Chet Murthy: delete tosses it in the moderation bin and only you see it in the thread, I think.
lamh36
@Mnemosyne: or like Cole he may be struggling with admiration of what they’ve heard about McMaster and reconciling it with his statements on this…
I’m expecting a post from him, but I’ll admit, I may not be able to stay awake long enough for it
amk
@schrodingers_cat: Raises hand. Will never live down that horror.
amk
@Mnemosyne: he already dunnit.
Steeplejack (phone)
@SiubhanDuinne:
Point taken.
Mnemosyne
@schrodingers_cat:
True story: Elvis Costello (yes, the singer/songwriter) had a day job as a computer operator in the 1970s, feeding punch cards into the computers at a bank. This was when he was trying to get his music career off the ground.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@TenguPhule: That’s what I was thinking, if Trump tries impounding funds; that might make Congress act.
schrodingers_cat
@amk: I didn’t know that you were that old, or were you a child prodigy?
Origuy
@schrodingers_cat: Yes, in college and for a couple of years after, mainly when the handful of CRT terminals were busy. I worked for Control Data from 1978 to 1990. By the time I left, everyone had had a CP/M or MSDOS system at work, plus a few Macs.
Marcopolo
So since this was code word intel, what happens to the feckless typist who turned out the internal memo/write up of the Trump/Lavrov meeting. After all, the WP article states that once folks realized Trump shat the bed that the adults tried to limit the mess by redacting or restricting that info from the already typed minutes or restricting access to it. Or does that person already start out with super duper ultra top secret security clearance? Thoughts?
frosty
@Origuy:
Cool! I learned something tonight. Totally useless but it’s new info, anyway.
Steeplejack (phone)
@Omnes Omnibus:
Yeah, when has that ever stopped anyone around here?
Major Major Major Major
@Mnemosyne: I’m imagining somebody telling him that he’d never make it as a musician, but the good news is we’ll always need somebody to feed punch cards.
amk
@schrodingers_cat: That old.
Omnes Omnibus
@lamh36:
I knew him 25-30 years ago. I have had drinks with him. And I have followed his career with interest over the years. I am going back and forth between disappointment and wondering if he was the leak and is now covering it. I’d still trust him more than anyone else in this administration.
OldDave
@amk: I miss punched cards. Not for program or data storage – but they were *perfect* for note-taking. And the sound of a card-reader sucking in 1000 cards a minute is something I’ll never hear again.
Mnemosyne
@amk:
I heard the best part of that job was when someone would trip and fall while carrying a box full of cards that then had to be re-sorted back into the right order.
Omnes Omnibus
@Mnemosyne: And people wonder about the seething rage in his music from that period.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Mnemosyne: Ah, punch cards…I’ll have nightmares tonight.
Steeplejack (phone)
@Major Major Major Major:
Nice ink cloud you’re squirting there. Your original statement was a little strong, especially with “nor was there a chance of it happening” tacked on the end, so you deserved a slap on the wrist.
amk
@Mnemosyne: I didn’t even have had to trip.
Origuy
@Mnemosyne: I was in a class at UIUC around 1975 that used punched cards to program a DEC PDP-11 that was dedicated to two classes. The computer was so slow that we would leave our decks of cards in a queue to be read by whomever was in the room. You had to hope that whoever was handling your carefully punched program didn’t drop them.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Mnemosyne: Back at UCLA the punch card printers usually ran out of ink on the ribbon, so you couldn’t actually read what was on the punch cards. You’d have to run them though the reader and get a printout to figure out what was on the cards and put them in the correct order. The Computer Science students were instantly recognizable because there were always carrying boxes of punch cards. One day the Santa Ana’s were blowing and I saw a female student drop her box, she just sat on the curb and cried.
OldDave
@Origuy: Didn’t everyone at least use a marker to paint a diagonal stripe on the top of the deck? Useful in getting them mostly in order. Fortran back then set aside columns 73-80 for “comments”, which we used for sequence numbers.
Major Major Major Major
@Steeplejack (phone): not really. That’s the usage. It’s what people mean. It’s what I meant.
Steeplejack (phone)
@schrodingers_cat:
Surely both!
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Origuy: We had a PDP-10 that used interactive terminals, we had to use punch cards for the IBM 4043.
Spanky
@Marcopolo:
Don’t hold your breath (about the hair on fire).
Is this about right for a summary?
* Trump invites Russian minister and ambassador in for Oval Office meeting.
* TASS allowed to come along. US media kicked out.
* Many things discussed, of which we the public have no account.
* Russian media release picture(s), which causes outrage! in WH, because
apparently no one thought that the pictures they took would actually, you know, be used.
* Someone in meeting leaks to WaPo about classified 2nd/3rd party info being passed to rooskies
* Over course of X days, WaPo vets and runs past legal dept, dropping bombshell today.
Now, bear in mind that this classified info is still classified right now, despite the bullshit meme that if the Pres said it, it’s declassified. He certainly has the power to declassify, but he didn’t*. If you think he did, Sen. McCain, answer me this: What is the info that is now declassified? Which state’s intel is the source? What are the details? We don’t know, although presumably the WaPo has some of the details.
* The prez can declassify anything he wants, but there’s a process by which the data is precisely described and bounded. Trump didn’t do that, and if he’s done it since the WaPo info came out, it doesn’t change the fact that he told the Russians highly classified data from a 3rd party source.
Lock. him. up.
Chet Murthy
@Major Major Major Major: Right. I don’t see the point in doing that — just makes work for FPers — when I can just erase the comment (and readers can just skip past it).
Omnes Omnibus
@Major Major Major Major: Yeah, and affect and effect are functionally the same.
amk
@OldDave: now you tell me.
Major Major Major Major
@Omnes Omnibus: functionally, in that the meaning is almost 100% easily discernible from context? Yep. Almost guaranteed to be a distinction that disappears soon.
@Chet Murthy: they don’t read the moderation stuff anyway, except Adam.
Origuy
@OldDave: Most people did, but it took many runs to get the programs right. These were in Pascal and assembler (emulated so that we didn’t halt the system). The keypunches were in a separate room, which was locked at midnight. Our room was open 24/7. People punched extra cards with things like semicolons and got pretty good with an Xacto knife. Once we liberated a keypunch just before midnight and they called the campus cops.
The Fat Kate Middleton
@Butthurt Jordan Trombone (fka XTPD): Maybe this guy? <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_II_of_Spain
Omnes Omnibus
@Major Major Major Major: I see them as different words. And I don’t appreciate your work in destroying things. Double plus ungood.
MCA1
@lamh36: Two possible responses for Susan:
1. Fuck you.
2. We can have crisis free days. Many of them. In a row. You can make it happen. Stop your bitching and moaning and go DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT.
amk
@lamh36: What a weaselly pos. Do your fucking job, susan.
MCA1
@lamh36: It would make my day if someone in that meeting had the balls to just step up and say “Are you fucking kidding me? You didn’t KNOW THAT? We’re supposed to have to tell you THAT? Do you know ANYTHING?”
11th Hour doing the full “Pre-Projection” highlight reel of Drumpf campaign harangues about reckless leakage of classified information. That should be an election ad for next fall if this f’er lasts that long, followed by the simple slogan “Lock Him Up.”
TenguPhule
Trump hasn’t just declared war on the USA and allies IC, he’s putting prices on their heads for the Russians.
Retaliation at this point is a given.
Gong to be interesting to see what form that takes. And by interesting, I mean the Chinese curse kind of way.