Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Pessimism assures that nothing of any importance will change.

Incompetence, fear, or corruption? why not all three?

It is not hopeless, and we are not helpless.

The republican speaker is a slippery little devil.

Thanks to your bullshit, we are now under siege.

This year has been the longest three days of putin’s life.

“woke” is the new caravan.

Seems like a complicated subject, have you tried yelling at it?

They love authoritarianism, but only when they get to be the authoritarians.

Trump’s cabinet: like a magic 8 ball that only gives wrong answers.

No one could have predicted…

It’s easy to sit in safety and prescribe what other people should be doing.

Sometimes the world just tells you your cat is here.

My years-long effort to drive family and friends away has really paid off this year.

Imperialist aggressors must be defeated, or the whole world loses.

Books are my comfort food!

This fight is for everything.

Roe is not about choice. It is about freedom.

If senate republicans had any shame, they’d die of it.

Jesus watching the most hateful people claiming to be his followers

Republicans are the party of chaos and catastrophe.

the 10% who apparently lack object permanence

Beware of advice from anyone for whom Democrats are “they” and not “we.”

Lick the third rail, it tastes like chocolate!

You are here: Home / Open Threads / Sunday Morning Open Thread

Sunday Morning Open Thread

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There are many windows for Ric and Zooey to look out, and now it’s warm enough for them to be open. They particularly like this one.

The Orange One is tweeting again, so that and the aftermath of the London attack will take up too much of my Twitter feed.

In news you can use, this article contains a good list of how to call BS on big data. Samples:

Upon encountering a piece of information, in any form, ask, “Who is telling me this? How does he or she know it? What is he or she trying to sell me?”

Remember that if a data-based claim seems too good to be true, it probably is.

Watch out for unfair comparisons.

Much more good advice at the link.

I’m going to try to limit my internet intake today. Just fed up with so much of it. Will practice piano, work on another post, maybe scan some family photos. You?

 

Reader Interactions

204Comments

  1. 1.

    WereBear

    Working on a book. Moving into a new apartment, while keeping the old one. Enjoying Tristan the cat’s reaction to this new development.

  2. 2.

    manyakitty

    Thinking I should follow your example and avoid the Internet today. I can attend to some laundry and other chores, finish a bit of work, knit, and of course, pet my cats. This is a good list.

  3. 3.

    Emma

    Lunch at my sister’s for her wonderful Korean food. Continue the ruthless cleaning of my closet. Reading classic mystery stories.

  4. 4.

    Quinerly

    Meeting my regular Sunday group at a South St. Louis City biker dive bar(The Off Track Saloon)….”Sunday Morning Coming Down Breakfast Gathering.” As a group, we have been doing this every Sunday for about 2 years…have up to 35 people. 5 buck full breakfast and $2.00 Bloody Marys. They let us bring in our own condiment/fixings bar to dress up our Bloodys.? Friends playing music 2-5 at another place (Howards in Soulard) I’m glad to be back with my tribe. Have a great day everyone. St. Louis area Balloon Juicers always welcome! We are a diverse and friendly bunch.

  5. 5.

    gene108

    I think I am finally getting over a viral upper respiratory infection I had all last week.

    My agenda is rest.

    And read Balloon Juice

  6. 6.

    gbbalto

    In downtown Seattle with extra day ahead of conference. Going to Pike Place Market. Any and all suggestions for downtown eats, drinks, other places to go are welcome. hope everyone is having a good weekend!

  7. 7.

    Nicole

    Taking the husband and son to see “Wonder Woman.”

    Also had a really neat experience last night. I’m in an OOB production of 1975’s “Kennedy’s Children” and last night one of the real life inspirations for one of the characters came to see the play. It was really cool.

  9. 9.

    Tenar Arha

    I’m going to see Wonder Woman again. Before that, I meet with the landscaper about fixing up my father’s house’s garden a bit.

  10. 10.

    debbie

    @Quinerly:

    A billion years ago, we used to do the same thing: Midnight breakfast at Mondo’s in Boston’s Haymarket. Long gone, but a monstrously sized breakfast for a buck. Just a bunch of us clowns and a roomful of farmers.

  11. 11.

    Peale

    Went to see Wonder Woman last night. It really is nice to have a non-broody surlyboy D.C. Hero. Otherwise its the Philippine independence Day parade today. BBQ and chicharrones all around.

  12. 12.

    Van Buren

    I love the cat photo. I think I will try to spend some time today just sitting and looking at nature.

  13. 13.

    JPL

    In between showers, I put down some insect and fungus control. Since I have a dog, it made sense to do early. I also plan on cleaning the inside of my car. I’m not sure when the last time, I did that chore.
    As most are aware, this was our president’s first response to the terror attack

    We need to be smart, vigilant and tough. We need the courts to give us back our rights. We need the Travel Ban as an extra level of safety!

    He’s moved on to guns or something.
    The Guardian has statements from other officials and I found this interesting

    Iran’s foreign ministry spokesman, Bahram Ghasemi, expressed sympathy for the families of the victims and said the rising number of extremist attacks was “an alarming signal for the global community”. He condemned all forms of terrorism “regardless of purpose and motive”.

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/jun/04/world-leaders-voice-solidarity-with-uk-in-wake-of-london-bridge-attacks

    Ivanka must be so proud.

  14. 14.

    raven

    @Quinerly: Is that a pocket park across the street? Long ago and far away in Urbana tavern life was the center of the world.

  15. 15.

    debbie

    @JPL:

    I hope someone questions him on that first tweet if it turns out the perpetrators were British citizens.

  17. 17.

    Eric

    @debbie: even then, can probably be traced back to the immigrant invasions of the anglos, saxons, and jutes. Sad. Plus, you can argue the British terrorism is the fault of the failure to maintain their wall. Very sad.

    There is no reasoning with the non-rational

  18. 18.

    ThresherK

    Enjoying the weather. We are opening the windows today; the weather is that pleasant (by which I mean “not yet 90% humidity”).

  19. 19.

    Starfish

    Attempting to score political points on the backs of the dead in countries that are supposed to be our allies is ghoulish; and if we had a functional press, they would say so.

  20. 20.

    debbie

    @satby:

    NPR just interviewed the Carmel, Indiana mayor about climate change. Nice to hear non-Pence types actually live there!

  21. 21.

    Quinerly

    @raven: @debbie:
    I’ve been blessed since my last year of law school in’84 to live in a neighborhood that urban living, music, communal gatherings are at the center of my life…no marriages, no children. Diverse group of a lot of old traveling hippies that have settled down who now get up early on Sunday and want a hearty, cheap meal.? This community I felt always balanced my professional life and as I have gotten older, I have found that I would rather hang with them than professional acquaintances and old law school friends. For the most part I’m the youngster in the group at age 56. Over 30 plus years, we have all traveled and camped together at music festivals and on float trips. The “professionals” in my life have long given up on me…think I’m nuts. I do detect envy, though, when they talk about their kids in college and the expense after asking about my yearly pilgrimage to the SW. I’m lucky how I have organized my life and thank DOG every morning. Love all of you guys. Thankful for this little on line community and have thoroughly enjoyed meeting some of you in person. Good people hangout here!?

  24. 24.

    Starfish

    @debbie: What I am wondering is if Britain knows better than to share the details of a recent attack with him now if they want to control the message of what is going on.

  25. 25.

    ThresherK

    @debbie: I will look that up. My hunch is that NPR had no idea that Pence is so loathed there (because it’s RealMerka),

  26. 26.

    Hill Dweller

    @JPL: Trump also took part of the London Mayor’s statement completely out of context to attack him on Twitter this morning.

  28. 28.

    debbie

    @ThresherK:

    I know that I didn’t know. My only exposure to Indianians prior to Pence (and other than Quayle) was to screen customer service complaints at White Castle many years ago. The calls from Indiana were uniformly vile and racist. I thought I’d heard it all, having lived in NYC, but this kind of bile was something else. I had to hit pause a number of times!

  30. 30.

    bemused

    Finally have summery weather here, 86 last couple of days. I noticed one kitty was sun bathing on a window sill and quickly moved plants safely away. She has knocked down plants before trying to loll in spot with maximum sun and heat.

  34. 34.

    wmd

    Big data brings to mind the aphorism: “If you torture the data enough eventually it will confess”

  35. 35.

    JPL

    @Starfish: Trump is considering a trip to London later this week, in order to show solidarity. What I want to know is what Theresa May things about that idea?

  36. 36.

    Tissue Thin Pseudonym

    I’m working on introducing a new cat to the household. I got Finnick at the Humane Society on Friday. I intended to get a feisty little girl to replace Monster, but then I met him. He was found as a stray, and they had to amputate his left hind leg due to multiple torn ligaments and other damage in the knee. He’s obviously still trying to master navigation as a three-legged cat, and I think there’s still some pain from the surgery.

    Harry has been more upset by this development than I had expected, given how easy going he is about everything else. We’re making some progress, though. Finnick just spent about 20 minutes outside of his own room, though he hid under my bed for much of it. Harry is hissing and patrolling around him. It’s progress. I’ll be gone all afternoon, and they’ll remain separated by the French doors to the front room.

  37. 37.

    bemused

    @schrodingers_cat:

    lol With built in fur coats, it amazes me how much they love the heat. Our two are long hairs and will make a beeline to get as close as possible to gas fireplace when we turn it on. They also cuddle, draped over each other when napping.

  39. 39.

    WereBear

    @debbie: My only exposure to Indianians prior to Pence (and other than Quayle) was to screen customer service complaints at White Castle many years ago.

    My mother got us out of Indiana when I was six. Classic quote: “They won’t let you live!”

  40. 40.

    WereBear

    @Tissue Thin Pseudonym: Sounds like a good plan. We are moving to another apartment in the same building, and only Tristan is bold enough to move between the two.

    I don’t think the other three even know we are doing this :)

  41. 41.

    ThresherK

    @debbie: I actually went to Indianapolis in the 80s to do a few fun things. Well, fun to me. This was before anyone knew who Dan Quayle was. I went to the symphony, the theater, a Pacers game, and a cabaret, and the folks I met were not unlike the kind of people who go to symphony and cabaret things here in my New England city-burb.

    But of course that was not a representative sample: A Beethoven and Mahler program (and the conductor’s talk afterwards–geeking out time!), Moliere’s The Misanthrope, and “two couples & a piano” act which was well versed in Rodgers and Hart and The Bangles, in a few neat skits.

  42. 42.

    schrodingers_cat

    @Patricia Kayden: Oh please the cat has more majesty and dignitude in his little paw than the corpulent personage you mention.

    Bosscat says, why you need flowers, when you has me to look at. I is prettier than they are and I purr.

  43. 43.

    Kelly

    Gathering up one of our 5 year old grandsons for a stay with us here on our dead end road where two rivers meet. Agenda walking in the woods, wading in the rivers, throwing rocks, explore caves, bake a cake with grandma, watch Shaun the Sheep.

  44. 44.

    satby

    So I have to work today, of course. My latest crazy office manager story is: she decided, and talked the doctor into, ordering the same scrubs for everyone in the office (which isn’t an unreasonable idea by itself). They’re cute enough, IF you’re thin, which I and three of my coworkers aren’t. In an office of 7 women, four of them basically morbidly obese (but not the manager, of course) they ordered tight, form fitting nurse’s scrubs that run smallish and lovingly hug every flabby roll around the middle in excruciatingly revealing detail. And each outfit cost about $65 per after the volume discount. You can get basic scrubs at Walmart for $5.99 per piece. They could have given all of us $20 to purchase two sets of the same colors for what they spent on just two outfits.
    If you ever read about a doctor’s office worker going postal, it will be me, because I just can’t with such dumbshit.

  50. 50.

    Starfish

    @JPL: Can he shut his pie hole in solidarity? I mean, can he participate in a moment of silence?

  55. 55.

    Cheryl Rofer

    I was just looking at the bird feeder and opening the windows for the cats and thinking wow, there really are a lot of birds out there. Turns out I wasn’t the only one thinking that. A Cooper’s hawk landed in a dead branch a hundred feet or so down the yard. Would have made a great picture – just in the early morning light, shadows around. But the hawk didn’t stay there long. And the little birds knew – it’s very quiet out there now.

    It took me a while to accept that the Cooper’s hawks consider the feeding stations theirs too.

  57. 57.

    Kelly

    @satby: Grandma and grandpa Kelly’s house in the woods is very popular in the summer. We’ll have all the grandkids here for camp out in the yard in August.

  59. 59.

    satby

    @WereBear:

    your manager is an idiot.

    Last Monday, she got a bee in her bonnet and decided to just throw away all the “duplicate” contact lens trial boxes we had. Scores of them, an entire wastebasket filled, emptied, and half filled again just tossed. Perfectly good contacts, in the trash.
    the very next day the doctor couldn’t dispense what she planned, because the contacts left in the drawer had all expired 6 months earlier. It was admittedly a less used brand, but much of what she tossed the day before were the same things, she threw them out without checking the expiration on the stock in the drawers. She threw out the replacements.

  60. 60.

    bemused

    @satby:

    I hope the scrubs selection has a wide size range too choose from because who the hell wants to work all day in too snug clothing! I’m small but I’d want freedom of movement and breathability. Clothing too form fitting makes me too hot and feel restricted.

  61. 61.

    D58826

    But Faux news has the important trhings covered:Wonder Woman,” which opened Friday to mostly strong reviews. But over at Fox News, some exception was taken to the superhero’s lack of patriotism.

    On Friday’s edition of “Your World With Neil Cavuto,” pundits Dion Baia, Mike Gunzelman and Cavuto debated their concerns on the so-called “un-American” turn the live-action film took. Cavuto began the segment by citing that “some are calling it less American,” without citing exactly who took umbrage with Wonder Woman’s lack of perceived patriotism.

    Cavuto added that Wonder Woman’s costume wasn’t red, white and blue, and pointed out that “in order to appeal for foreign audiences, [it has] very little reference to America at all.”

    http://www.rawstory.com/2017/06/watch-fox-news-pundits-upset-wonder-woman-isnt-wearing-patriotic-underwear/

  63. 63.

    Patricia Kayden

    @Tenar Arha:

    I’m going to see Wonder Woman again.

    It’s really all that? Okay. I wasn’t going to see it but I keep seeing rave reviews. I guess it can’t be worse than other boring comic-based movies so why not?

  65. 65.

    satby

    @bemused: they’re pure polyester too, not a cotton-poly blend like most scrubs. I hate them, and deliberately didn’t give them my sizes for that reason. I did everything I could discourage this purchase, because I am going to be insisting on changing my schedule and if it’s too much hassle I’m just giving notice; and one other person is planning to quit if she heard this week she got the job she interviewed for. So right there is $130 down the tubes unless they can find short fat replacements

  66. 66.

    Patricia Kayden

    @D58826: LOL. So Fox News expected Wonder Woman to stand up at attention and start the movie by singing the American National Anthem and saluting the American flag? Really? Are any of those types of movies pro-American? I assume movie directors and producers want to maximize their profits by appealing to movie goers overseas, which makes a whole lot of business sense. Any excessive pro-American jingoism could turn foreigners off completely. Believe it or not, people who live elsewhere are proud of their countries too.

  67. 67.

    Ohio Mom

    I did the internet on a very reduced schedule for the better part of last week. It was good for my blood pressure (metaphorically speaking, I actually have very good blood pressure).

    But I wonder if my being able to step away so easily isn’t a sign that all the Trump/Congress news has become “normal” to me, that it doesn’t feel as urgent to keep up.

    Or maybe I am also just completely fed up. I can’t imagine three and a half more years, the thought is exhausting.

  68. 68.

    Calouste

    @JPL: The UK has a general election on Thursday, so I think the shitgibbon will be told to go fuck himself. Politely of course.

  70. 70.

    satby

    @debbie: The weekday ones are mediocre, I have to be at the Saturday one to make it really worthwhile. So that will be my next argument with the boss, and honestly, I start to think it would be more fair for me to quit.
    There’s someone who wants to pick up my hours though, so it may not be a problem.

  72. 72.

    japa21

    BTW, has Trump said anything about restricting travel from Ireland in the wake of the IRA bomb plot that was foiled on Friday? I think it was Friday.

  73. 73.

    GregB

    Someone needs to do a simple diagram connecting the myriad terrorist organizations and their spiritual roots. I surmise 90% of these groups are tied directly to Saudi Arabia. The country not on the ban list and the country that still chops off heads as a form of government execution and the recipient of soon to be billions in US weaponry. Soon to be owners of vital US infrastructure. Yes, those assholes.

  75. 75.

    MomSense

    @satby:

    I shouldn’t laugh but “pure polyester” is so funny. Wonder how many Esters it takes for each garment?

    I remember from the batman pajamas days that those polyester suckers magnified all the smells. Yowza. An office full of people in smell magnifying scrubs sounds horrible.

  76. 76.

    Tenar Arha

    @Patricia Kayden: I’m a fan of comic book based movies. I am of the belief we’re living through a kind of golden age of these movies. Where technology & storytelling allow us to see what has previously only been drawn or imagined, while various directors and writers have figured out how to tell these stories without letting the effects completely overcome the story. Patty Jenks has now joined certain Marvel & DC directors with Wonder Woman by fusing a WWI movie (with a bit of suffrage) and a comic book story. Basically she’s done similar thing like Logan did for dysfunctional families and the long slow decline of aging & Captain America: The Winter Soldier did for a suspenseful spy thriller.

    (Add to that that there’s FINALLY a women led production & superhero & I’ve had difficulty climbing down from cloud 9, I’m so happy for her success).

    ETA So YMMV, but it’s a good story inside an action based comic book film.

  77. 77.

    schrodingers_cat

    @GregB: They are much worse about women’s rights too. I have known female Iranian graduate students, professors, doctors etc but never any SA women who had those opportunities.
    Most men from SA I knew were undergrads, with their fancy shmancy cars, they had $$ to burn.

  79. 79.

    Patricia Kayden

    @japa21: Is the IRA full of non-White folks? If the answer is “no”, you have the answer to your query.

  82. 82.

    Patricia Kayden

    @GregB:

    I surmise 90% of these groups are tied directly to Saudi Arabia.

    Saudi Arabia’s respect for human rights are nonexistent. There are too many examples of this. But we’re buddy buddy with Saudi Arabia because of the oil, I guess. Who cares that the vast majority of the 9/11 terrorists were from that country.

  83. 83.

    Montanareddog

    @JPL:

    Trump is considering a trip to London later this week, in order to show solidarity. What I want to know is what Theresa May things about that idea?

    yeah, with a bit of luck, Corbyn will be PM by then

  84. 84.

    WereBear

    @bemused: OMG pure polyester is pure hell.

    True. Yes, it doesn’t wrinkle or show stains, and heaven knows it is indestructible, but so is chain mail, and makes as much sense.

  85. 85.

    Amir Khalid

    I can remember when Malaysia was a more tolerant society than this nonsense, up until the late 1970s. On balance, I believe the rise of religiosity in Malaysia’s Muslim majority to be a negative thing.

  87. 87.

    MoxieM

    Continue packing for move to the Happy Valley (Hamp) . Wince at late nite over posting. Beyond wincing at words coming over the airwaves. This place is a balm (long time lurker, more recently, poster.)

  88. 88.

    Laura

    @gbbalto: The Old Stove or any Elysian Fields for good fresh beer.
    Vons, for great food at real good prices.
    The aquarium is very nice!
    The commuter ferry to west Seattle is a short ride both ways!
    No better dive bar than 5Points in tillicum square!
    Weed on every corner in Belltown.
    Seattle International Film Festival at Cinerama.
    Get on it!

  89. 89.

    Patricia Kayden

    @JPL: I hope Trump doesn’t go to London right now. That would just add gas to the already tense situation with which the British are dealing between the terrorist attacks in Manchester and London. They don’t need a bombastic idiot rolling around making bigoted comments against Muslims and yapping about useless travel bans.

  90. 90.

    GregB

    @schrodingers_cat:

    While no fan of Iranian theocracy, there is much more to admire of the Iranian’s governance and culture than the Saudi’s.

    The largest Jewish population in the greater Middle East, outside of Israel, resides in Iran. As you say, women are allowed far greater involvement in politics and education.

    From Wikipedia: “Jews in the Islamic Republic of Iran are formally to be treated equally and free to practice their religion. There is even a seat in the Iranian parliament reserved for the representative of the Iranian Jews. However, de facto, discrimination is common.”

  91. 91.

    Kelly

    I despise Saudi Arabia. I’ve often wondered what the world would be like if we had buddied up to Mossadegh in 1953 instead of backing the coup. A leftist democracy allied with us in the Persian Gulf might have grown. Could have ended up like Turkey I suppose. Couldn’t have been any worse than the current mess.

  92. 92.

    hitchhiker

    @gbbalto:

    welcome to Our Fair City!

    around 2 pm today I’ll be taking my amazing dog on our usual walk from downtown (near convention center) up to Volunteer Park — it’s about 5 mi roundtrip and takes you thru some Seattle classic neighborhoods … care to come along?

  94. 94.

    gene108

    @schrodingers_cat:

    I was flying to India, in 1996, and I sat next to a lady from Saudi Arabia. She was going to college in India.

    From talking to her, colleges in Saudi Arabia are not as good as Indian colleges and Saudi Arabian colleges did not offer women much in the way of study.

  95. 95.

    Anya

    @JPL: She’ll probably tell him to stay away. Londoners despise Trump. I would argue that he’s the most hated man right now. His London attack tweets didn’t win him any fans.

  96. 96.

    No Drought No More

    I’ll be needing to grin and bear it today. My neighbor is fed up with everything (again), and when she gets like that she practices the piano off-and-on all day long. Badly.

  97. 97.

    Elizabelle

    Cleaning the apartment in Barcelona. Have a wonderful friend, a Californian who now lives in Tuscany, coming to visit for maybe 10 days. She and I are planning how we can stay outside the US of Cray Cray as much as possible.

    She says it’s raining in Milan too. Maybe it will clear by the time she lands, if not, we need the rain.

  99. 99.

    Amir Khalid

    @Patricia Kayden:
    Now there’s a country up to its gills in religiosity. Wahabism seems to believe that all true Muslims should live in the 7th century, like the Prophet did. It has made Saudi Arabia a socially retrograde nation, tolerating or even indulging the bigotry, sexism, and extremism of its most reactionary people. Contrary to the belief of many Muslims today, I don’t consider it the most properly Islamic society there is, and it’s certainly not one non-Saudi Muslims should seek to emulate in their own countries.

  100. 100.

    Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho

    @Patricia Kayden:

    Who cares that the vast majority of the 9/11 terrorists were from that country.

    Who cares that OBL himself was from that country, apparently. They got stuff we want (and biz for the Great Orange Menace) so it all comes out in the wash.

    @Amir Khalid: Hi to you! For me that the rise in religiosity of the Xians here is a negative thing. Especially those who don’t have much truck with those sissy New Testament themes. Not that they’d have a sense of where the sissy stuff is in the Bible.

  101. 101.

    Oldgold

    J.K. Rowling @jk_rowling

    It’s called ‘leadership’, Donald. The terrorists were dead 8 minutes after police got the call. If we need an alarmist blowhard, we’ll call.
    Donald J. Trump @realDonaldTrump
    At least 7 dead and 48 wounded in terror attack and Mayor of London says there is “no reason to be alarmed!”

  103. 103.

    Duane

    Susan Rice was very,very good on mtp. You want to interrogate her? Good luck. She’s going to hand you your ass.

  104. 104.

    gene108

    @Amir Khalid:

    Wahhabism wouldn’t be as much of an issue, as most Muslims are Asian, but I believe the Saudi’s are funding schools to export their theocracy to other Asian countries and it is having some effect.

    Without the spread of Wahhabism it would just be the Saudi’s being weird and you just have to put up with them to get through Hajj.

  105. 105.

    Immanentize

    @MomSense:
    Reminds me of the Coaster’s song “Shopping for Clothes:”

    That suit is pure herringbone. Well that’s a suit I gotta own!

  106. 106.

    WereBear

    @Amir Khalid: We are kind of like that here, with Christianity. The right wing wants everyone to think the most reactionary of Fundamentalists are the “true” Christians, and that is ridiculous.

  107. 107.

    Patricia Kayden

    By the way, how exactly does Trump’s “”Muslim ban” work? The Manchester bomber was of Libyan descent but was born in the U.K. How would a travel ban stop someone like him from coming to the U.S. since he wasn’t born in a majority-Muslim country? Is Trump going to ban Muslims from Europe as well? Ironically, as pointed out above, he didn’t include Saudi Arabia on the list of targeted countries.

  108. 108.

    Kay

    One can imagine an alternative Trump Presidency. In a way, the far Right GOP Congress was a stroke of incredible bad luck for him. If he had a Dem majority in Congress he could have won graciously, dropped his dumb campaign and all those weirdos and misfits he hired and worked with normal people. They’re Democrats, they’re not Republicans. They would have done it. Chuck Schumer is a good negotiator. He would have got a lot and given Trump plenty too. The liberal base of the Dem Party would be angry and that would satisfy the GOP base who like anything that makes liberals angry. Democrats really do want to modernize trade deals and put money into infrastructure and Obamacare really does need fixed. Imagine how shocked people would have been if he had done something TRULY ballsy- “I changed my mind- I like Obamacare- let’s improve it” Christ, OBAMA would have backed that. “Never Trump” was a complete bust. All but 4% of the GOP faithful voted for Trump. They would also have backed a moderate Trump because as we know now they will back anyone with an R after their name.

    Of course, he would have to turn into a completely different and much better person to do all that- unlikely at 70 years old and with his limited world view- but it COULD have happened.

  109. 109.

    Immanentize

    @Patricia Kayden: I’m on the other side on the Trump visit to the UK – if Trump went to London and May treated him respectfully, I think that would mean fewer votes for the Tories on Thursday. Win!!

    ETA I would love to see pictures of Trump Everytime he uses a golf cart off the links.

  111. 111.

    ThresherK

    I’ve mentioned before, but: I had three roomies in college, some time after the Iranian revolution and before the first Gulf War, who were from Iran.

    I was worried for them, not about them. The folks at my college weren’t the most worldly, and these guys were, only college-age, yet much more sophisticated and well-traveled than the typical suburban kids enrolled.

    The movie Persepolis*, really tells a lot about Iran at the time: The theocracy was hellish, and the educated classes (including the protagonist) hoped that the revolution was going to destroy it and something better would go in its place, but those hopes foundered. It was almost the opposite of Soviet Union becoming Russia again (which was a fake “under new management” sign): New people, new costumes, new words, as much oppression, but steered to a different star in the sky, so to speak.

    (*Also a graphic novel which I will read someday.)

  112. 112.

    Patricia Kayden

    @WereBear: Yesterday, I had someone on a Patheos website claim that Trump reflected the values held by American Christians. I pushed back and explained that Trump doesn’t share my values and I consider myself to be a Christian in good standing. I also pointed out how thoroughly Trump’s life and behavior repudiate Christ-like values. The pushback against me was that at least Trump was pro-life and not a murderer of unborn children. **rolls eyes**

  115. 115.

    gene108

    @Kay:

    Other than the random Tweets, his issues with NATO, and spending weekends ar Mar-a-Lago, he is pretty much doing what any other Republican in his position would do.

    I think this gets overlooked. There was never any real policy difference between Trump and the rest of the Republicans on many issues.

    The only two areas he really differed from the rest of the field were on trade and entitlement reform, but he’s completely flipped on trade and seems indifferent on Social Security and Medicare, and had embraced gutting Medicaid. But that has made no difference with his supporters.

  116. 116.

    ThresherK

    @Patricia Kayden: I really haven’t sifted thru Patheos except for that very absorbing, deserved, and brutal takedown of Atlas Shrugged.

    Is there anything else worthwhile there, or is that site basically random and not “curated”?

  118. 118.

    schrodingers_cat

    The thing that bothers me most about T is but he can’t do things that normal human beings even babies can do.
    Smile, hug and shake hands. Yesterday I was watching an episode of the Great War, there was some footage of the German person with the funny mustache, smiling and shaking hands, I believe it was 1934 or thereabouts. Not scowling or using a handshake as a dominance gesture. Even history’s greatest monster…

  120. 120.

    catclub

    @Patricia Kayden:

    I wasn’t going to see it but I keep seeing rave reviews. I guess it can’t be worse than other boring comic-based movies so why not?

    I went and thought ‘blah’. So your ‘no worse than others’ is pretty accurate to me.

  121. 121.

    Immanentize

    @Duane: re: Susan Rice and Hillary — I think the RWNJs are so wrapped up in and certain of their own mythical stories that they really think these women are incompetent and corrupt. So they act that way and when they sit down ready to prove to the world how right they were, they get fed asshole pie. And then they learn nothing and go right back and do it again. Look at flop sweat Gowdy for the most recent version….

  122. 122.

    debbie

    Donald J. Trump‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump 4h4 hours ago
    More
    Do you notice we are not having a gun debate right now? That’s because they used knives and a truck!

    WTF does this even mean?

  124. 124.

    gene108

    @Patricia Kayden:

    It is amazing to me how much the Fundies have embraced Trump as the leader of their Cause. They love him, big league.

    He is their savior, who will deliver a Christian America to them.

  125. 125.

    Baud

    @gene108: Agree, except perhaps another Republican would have been less ham-handed when it came to immigrants. The biggest difference is that most other Republicans would have had a modicum of management ability.

  127. 127.

    Patricia Kayden

    @ThresherK: I read “Friendly Atheist” and “Formerly Fundie” on a regular basis and a few other leftwing blogs on Patheos. They’re pretty cool.

  130. 130.

    Patricia Kayden

    @gene108:

    He is their savior, who will deliver a Christian America to them.

    Or their version of “Christian America” which probably looks a lot like the hell described in “A Handmaid’s Tale” versus a Christ-like utopia where Jesus’ words about taking care of “the least of these” in Matthew 25 are heeded.

  132. 132.

    Immanentize

    @debbie: what it means to Trump, who knows. But what it really means is that firearms are strictly regulated in the UK and hard to get and stockpile. So many more people in England are alive today because of gun restrictions.

  135. 135.

    Matt McIrvin

    @debbie:

    I hope someone questions him on that first tweet if it turns out the perpetrators were British citizens.

    Won’t matter, since he already complained that the parents of the Orlando Pulse shooter shouldn’t have been let into the country to spawn him here. It’s about race/ethnicity, and not letting the wrong kind of people exist in your country.

  136. 136.

    West of the Rockies (been a while)

    @ThresherK:

    There’s a blogger there (Ed Brayton) who runs Dispatches from the Culture Wars, a progressive/atheist site. I have found it edifying.

  137. 137.

    schrodingers_cat

    @Baud: No more job stealing doctors or researchers, its a win win. BJ comment section denizens told me so.

    ETA: They have suspended premium processing for H1-B. Washpost recently had an article of how that is affecting rural areas with a shortage of doctors. The proposed travel ban is adversely affecting that supply too.
    MASA== Make America Sick Again. Take away doctors and health care, winning!

  138. 138.

    Patricia Kayden

    @Baud: And Rightwingers think that that’s a logical response to gun control advocates. Sigh.

  140. 140.

    debbie

    @Immanentize:

    Well, that helps explain it, but then he shouldn’t have used “we.” In his twisted mind, if Brits had had guns, this wouldn’t have happened. Of course, guns in bars works only in America.

  141. 141.

    PsiFighter37

    Gorgeous morning here in San Francisco…making a pit stop to see friends before heading back to the airport and NYC. It is good to be home again, and especially in environs that are friendly to the resistance.

  142. 142.

    debbie

    @Patricia Kayden:

    I’m curious for the evangelicals’ explanation as to why they’re so silent on issues other than womens’ freedoms. Why are they so silent in light of Mulvaney’s statement that the Trump administration has redefined “compassion” to mean “doing nothing to alleviate pain and suffering”?

  145. 145.

    Amir Khalid

    @Patricia Kayden:
    It’s considered the birthplace of Islam because the Prophet was born and lived his life within the borders of the modern Kingdom of Saudi Arabia, 12 centuries before it came into existence. Also because some of the events common to the history of all the Abrahamic faiths are believed to have happened there.

  146. 146.

    WereBear

    @Patricia Kayden: The pushback against me was that at least Trump was pro-life and not a murderer of unborn children. **rolls eyes**

    Yeah, he claims he is now.

    I believe their own extreme views makes them vulnerable to any con man who claims solidarity with them. They have no way of evaluating anything their own leaders say.

  150. 150.

    Mike in NC

    A couple of very interesting articles in the Sunday paper. One discussed the yooouuuge number of vacancies in the Trump regime due to his paranoia and insistence on absolute personal loyalty (like a certain dictator he much admires): only 5 of 53 Pentagon top jobs filled so far, and only 8 of 120 at the State Department. The other article noted the rising tide of new white nationalist hate groups, including “Proud Boys” and the “Fraternal Order of Alt-Knights”. Would be laughable if these armed stooges weren’t out to physically harm people.

  151. 151.

    tybee

    @raven:

    haven’t really been out too much to catch fish.
    mostly been roaming the beaches on the barrier islands just poking around looking for stealth camping sites.
    we did rescue a 300lb logger head sea turtle who got stranded after laying eggs.
    that was pretty cool.

  152. 152.

    gene108

    @schrodingers_cat:

    I believe the suspension of premium processing is temporary. Once USCIS works through the new applications, they will reinstate premium processing.

    Doesn’t make sense for the government to leave extra money on the table.

  154. 154.

    donnah

    @Ohio Mom:
    I’m an Ohio Mom, too, and I agree with you. I just said to my husband this morning that I am wearing myself out with worry. My outrage meter exploded a while back and hasn’t been reset, so I was questioning my own feelings about how Trump is doing. The media desperately tries to normalize his bizarre actions, the Republicans are thrilled with a Democracry Destroyer, and all the rules and regulations we’ve had in place for decades are being shredded.

    I will never quit fighting. But lately it seems to do little good against the weary acceptance of everyone else. Just like when I thought his campaign comments about Mexicans would do him in, or when the video of his bragging about grabbing…was the last straw, it wasn’t. His lack of any skills, his disregard for Presidential protocols, his flat-out daily lies; nothing comes of it. The daily gaffes come quickly but the investigations of his wrongdoing will drag on for years.

    So, yeah, taking a breather is probably good for me, too. But I’ll never stop hating him and what the GOP is doing to our country.

  156. 156.

    Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho

    @tybee: That’s totally cool. I’m sure the turtle agrees. Happy beaching and fishing (she says enviously).

  157. 157.

    raven

    Well, it’s raining so I guess we’ll take a 50 mile round trip to get butter beans!

  158. 158.

    japa21

    The better half was watching MSNBC and they reported that Fox has said that internment may be necessary.

  159. 159.

    OGLiberal

    @Kelly: The Brits wanted BP to exploit the oil freely and we hated Mossadegh because Commies! So better to send Kermit Roosevelt there to make sure Shah-boy stayed in power to keep the cash flowing. Mossadegh stays in power and the ’79 revolution doesn’t happen and Iran likely ends up the most liberal nation in the region and one of our most powerful allies there, powerful enough to allow us to not have to suck up to Saudi princes. Even with the revolution, Iran is probably the most Western and democratic nation in the region. Low bar, yeah, but I think we still stick with the KSA over Iran because of lingering Cold War attitudes and the hostage stuff and Israel. Iran’s government is not good by our standards but they are the most pragmatic in the region, outside of Israel. They would have never let a bunch of their citizens be the large majority of the 9/11 hijackers like the KSA did. But our current president schmoozes with the princes while treating Angela Merkel like shit.

    The world would be so much different if Iran was our ally. Seems folks in power in a lot of places prefer the status quo. I honestly wonder why.

  160. 160.

    MomSense

    @Ohio Mom: @donnah:

    Fatigue is a real concern. We have to pace ourselves and we have to make sure we have support. This past week all I could manage was a couple phone calls to my Senators.

    Dolt45 has done so many things that should have him impeached or resigning in shame by now. Just the obstruction of justice should have been enough, but the party in power is craven so they will continue to try to run out the clock and get their tax cuts in before the buzzer.

  162. 162.

    the Conster, la Citoyenne

    Just checked LegiStorm to see if Bernie Sanders filed his Senate personal financial disclosure forms, due today. The latest filing is still his extension request letter. Maybe they only post or are extended to a business day, but, I REALLY want to see this guy’s financials.

  163. 163.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @japa21: The better half was watching MSNBC and they reported that Fox has said that internment may be necessary.

    from what I’m seeing on twitter, somebody in the control room or upstairs reminded them a few minutes later that they’re supposed to think that’s a bad thing

  164. 164.

    Corner Stone

    @japa21: That’s not actually what happened. They played a segment of Nigel Farage on Fox mentioning internment may be necessary. The Fox host immediately released a statement strongly disavowing that and saying that was complete balls to even mention. Then Joy and her panel briefly discussed how damaging, despicable and just nuts it is to even use the word out loud.

  165. 165.

    OGLiberal

    @WereBear: Didn’t Trump want Marla to abort Tiffany?

    Whatever, the god botherers love sinners whi have “reedemed” themselves over people who never needed “redemption”. That’s because most of them are “sinners” themselves.

  166. 166.

    zhena gogolia

    Did anybody note the headline on today’s Times, about how Republican denial of climate change is due to big business and “Democratic hubris”?

    AAAAAARRRRRRRRGGGGGGGHHHHHHH!

  167. 167.

    Groucho48

    @Patricia Kayden:

    A few years ago, one of the Superman movies omitted …truth, justice and the American Way…from the movie intro and Fox News was all over it. America-hating Hollywood liberals and political correctness run amuck.

    Then, it turned out it wasn’t Hollywood liberals who took the phrase out, it was Hollywood capitalists who did. Because of the capitalistic reasoning that it would make more money overseas.

  168. 168.

    West of the Rockies (been a while)

    @donnah:

    I keep hoping for more leaks that do real damage to these people on a criminal, financial, and social level. I want the Trumps, Kushners, Bannons, Conways, etc., ruined, embarrassed, made pariahs.

    The leaks, IMO, seem to be slowing a bit, causing less tumult. I don’t know if Adam Silverman would agree, but that’s my take.

    We have to, as you say, keep fighting.

  170. 170.

    Patricia Kayden

    @debbie: Great questions but I think we know why Conservatives are anti-choice and only care about fetuses. It’s about punishing slutty women for having sex. How better to make a slut suffer than forcing her to have a baby she doesn’t want and to be forced to raise that child? That’s why they only care about the fetus but have nothing to say about cuts to welfare programs and other programs which directly impact children and their mothers.

  174. 174.

    West of the Rockies (been a while)

    @MomSense:

    The thing is,the people getting tax cuts large enough to get all happy about are comparatively few.

    Swathes of Trump voters will be slapped, spanked and sent to bed without dinner, but I guess as long as icky gays and brown people and such don’t get anything, they’re fine with it.

  175. 175.

    amygdala

    Ok, I didn’t expect Trump to “keep calm,” but neither did I anticipate such a gross interpretation of “carry on.” Twitter is excoriating him for going golfing (for the second time this weekend) after his ridiculous Tweetrant. I hope Britain cancels his visit. They’ve got actual important stuff to deal with right now.

  177. 177.

    Uncle Ebeneezer

    @gbbalto: The ferry ride to Bremerton is great. On a clear day, killer view of Ranier. Bremerton itself is kinda dull, but the ride there and back is really nice, and easily accessible from downtown.

  178. 178.

    West of the Rockies (been a while)

    @Patricia Kayden:

    I think when it comes to sex, conservative “thinking” is that women don’t really enjoy it (or shouldn’t anyway). Maybe they believe women should just grimace and think of England (isn’t that the expression?).

    It’s weird. Conservatives are freaky, and not in a good way.

  179. 179.

    Uncle Ebeneezer

    Playing a gig today for an estimated 500 people that should be pretty fun. Though it’s outdoors in Burbank so it may be scorching hot :(

    Saw Wonder Woman yesterday and it was really enjoyable. The only downside was that while Gail Gadot was excellent, they missed the opportunity to cast the woman who was born for the role: Serena Williams! :)

  180. 180.

    Patricia Kayden

    @Groucho48: Because capitalists in Hollywood are savvy enough to know that foreigners aren’t cool with over-the-top American jingoism. Smart folks. (Although most Superman movies suck).

  181. 181.

    Jeffro

    Holy fucking shit did Jennifer Rubin take a bat to Trumpov just a couple hours ago… I am forwarding it to every RWNJ friend and relative I know

  182. 182.

    No One You Know

    @Anya: He’s awfully generous with that offer to require hosting during election week, when he’s so fond of his own bed. It’s almost as if he had nothing else to do.

  183. 183.

    WereBear

    @OGLiberal: Didn’t Trump want Marla to abort Tiffany?

    Don’t know, but it sure would explain a lot.

    Millionaire playboy who brags about how much he sleeps around and yet has never gotten someone besides his wives pregnant?

    Yeah. Right.

  184. 184.

    Patricia Kayden

    @West of the Rockies (been a while): I guess you’re right because while they seek to punish women, you will notice that erectile dysfunction is not considered to be a pre-existing condition under TrumpCare. So they are okay with men (like Trump) who boast about their sexual prowess (with multiple women, including while married) but somehow feel that it’s okay for businesses to stick their noses into women’s reproductive rights when it comes to contraceptives and abortion.

  185. 185.

    gene108

    @OGLiberal:

    You don’t need to go back to 1953. After 9/11, Iran made a lot of overtures to Bush & Co that they want to be our friends now and help us fight the Taliban and Al-Qaeda.

    Bush Admin told Iran to fuck off and later named them as part of the Axis of Evil.

    Also, too some very preliminary gestures of reconciliation were made at the end of the Clinton Administration, so there was interest from Iran on better relations.

    Bush, Jr blew that to hell.

    The amount of damage he did to the world cannot honestly be examined until all the right-wing media hacks are forced to STFU, because they distort reality.

  186. 186.

    debbie

    @Patricia Kayden:

    It’s about punishing slutty women for having sex.

    Not that I’ve interviewed thousands, but in my small sample, it generally comes from their having been rejected by a woman years earlier. This camp will also reliably become upset when I ask them why the burden shouldn’t be placed on the man who, after all, could have easily prevented the whole situation by keeping his pants zipped.

  191. 191.

    No One You Know

    @debbie: Because evangelical fundamentalists can’t find a Bible verse that equates compassion with sentimental superiority.

  192. 192.

    Another Scott

    @satby: An opportunity to move up as she destroys her future prospects there, perhaps? ;-)

    Good luck. Hang in there (and/or put out feelers for employment elsewhere?)…

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  194. 194.

    Another Scott

    @GregB: The bin Laden family was from Yemen. The Muslim Brotherhood intellectual foundation for al Qaeda, etc., was from Egypt. Lots of money comes from the tiny rich countries on the Persian Gulf. There’s lots of places to point fingers…

    FWIW.

    Cheers,
    Scott.
    (Who agrees that far too little has been done to end this “wink and nod while money and unemployed youngsters get sent off to do their jihad against infidels somewhere else” stuff…)

  196. 196.

    West of the Rockies (been a while)

    @Patricia Kayden:

    Oh, and I should have mentioned… sex between two women is utterly wrong in Conserva-World.

    Woody Allen I now find pretty repugnant, but I do chuckle at his fifty year old joke:

    Sex between two people is a beautiful thing… with three it’s amazing.

  197. 197.

    SFAW

    @WereBear:

    Millionaire playboy who brags about how much he sleeps around and yet has never gotten someone besides his wives pregnant?
    Yeah. Right.

    He said he was on The Pill

  198. 198.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    Mike Allen of Axios, which he and Jim Van deHei started because Politico was not– judging from this– pathetic enough

    President Trump was like a first responder, quickly retweeting a Drudge headline before details were confirmed: “Fears of new terror attack after van ‘mows down 20 people’ on London Bridge.”

    if my house ever burns down, or the years of cured meats and potato chips catch up with me (I’ve reformed, a bit), I hope the firefighters/paramedics stop to check drudge

    Because I always try to be fair here’s some more context. I don’t think it helps:

    Then he went political (with critics pouncing on his use of “ban”): “We need to be smart, vigilant and tough. We need the courts to give us back our rights. We need the Travel Ban as an extra level of safety!”
    Only after that did he go personal: “Whatever the United States can do to help out in London and the U. K., we will be there – WE ARE WITH YOU. GOD BLESS!”

    and because he learned in journalism school, or maybe from a bad movie about journalism, that one should always try to include ‘local color’, Mike used some British

    It targeted average blokes out partying on the weekend

  199. 199.

    O. Felix Culpa

    Drying out after a long soggy walk from Santanilla del Mar to Comillas. The sun finally emerged late this afternoon. I visited the Gaudi Capricho after fortification from a vino tinto. Bus to Bilbao tomorrow and fly home the day after. It’s been a good trip.

  201. 201.

    catclub

    @gene108:

    Doesn’t make sense for the government to leave extra money on the table.

    Except when you are cutting the budget for the IRS.

  202. 202.

    Origuy

    @Elizabelle: Have you been to Granada yet? The Alhambra is spectacular. I was there in 1995; they were in the middle of a severe drought. I stayed in a little hostal. The hostess told me something in Spanish about the times of the water. I misunderstood and thought that the hot water was off in the evening until morning. Turned out it was all the water in the city shut off at night. The big hotels had cisterns. I had arrived in the afternoon and took a nap. Was going to take a shower but there was no water when I woke up.

  203. 203.

    SFAW

    Since there doesn’t seem to be a new OT: it appears that the Fat Fascist (or is it the Obese Othoritarian[sic]?) has now been to the golf course 23 times in the 19 weeks since he’s been in the Oval Office. Does he yell “четыре!” when he attempts to tee off? [Note to zhena gogolia and other commie-speakers: yes, I know. It was a joke]

    Should he now be referred to as President LazyMotherfucker?

  204. 204.

    No One You Know

    I just read The Hill’s article about Dems wanting Hillary to go away.

    Every single citation was Anonymous.

    Damnit, her interviewers called the shots. If they didn’t want to know, don’t ask!

    This is NOT normal. Anger is a very reasonable response to the theft of the presidency from a highly qualified candidate who won the popular vote.

    Plus I can’t get any response on why I’m banned from posting a comment there. Goddamn Disqus, if it was something I said somewhere else, why can’t I know?

    Anger is fuel. So I just sent my state rep mail on why the state house should get moving on a bill to change elections to one vote-one person, with historical citation.

    I’m still mad.

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