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You are here: Home / Open Threads / Shallow Roots (Open Thread)

Shallow Roots (Open Thread)

by Betty Cracker|  June 21, 201711:00 am| 303 Comments

This post is in: Open Threads, Politics, Republican Stupidity, Assholes, General Stupidity

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Check out this cypress tree on the bank of the Suwannee River. It’s an old tree. That particular stretch of the river has had two “hundred-year” floods in the past eight years:

But the tree endures — so far — because of its unique root structure. It has adapted to living in a flood-prone area, something non-tree Floridians are also going to have to do.

Late-ish to the party, but here are a couple of luke-warm takes on last night’s special election losses:

1) After President Obama was elected in 2008, Democrats won seven consecutive special House races, retaining six seats and flipping one GOP seat to a Democrat. In 2010, the Democrats lost the House in a wave election. Just saying.

2) Via Stephanie (@echo_fish) on Twitter, Anna Maltese posted a message from a friend who is a political organizer. It’s required reading for anyone who is feeling Eeyorish today, IMO:

Trump, his odious sons, his liars for hire, et al, utterly devoid of humility or grace, are taking the classless victory laps you’d expect this morning. Good! Let them think narrowly retaining four seats in solid red districts means they don’t have to worry about 2018.

But we know the truth: There are no saviors, there is only working hard to change things. We’ve made significant progress. Now is not the time to get discouraged.

I know it’s hard. Progress is being rolled back. Outrageous shit is being done in our names. Truly ghoulish, horrible people are reveling in their assumed ascendancy. People who imagine themselves Trump’s opposites are just as brazenly spinning these results for their own purposes.

But the one sure way they win is if we cede the field. I refuse.

Now, feel free to discuss any topic — open thread!

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Reader Interactions

303Comments

  1. 1.

    Gin & Tonic

    June 21, 2017 at 11:04 am

    But the one sure way they win is if we cede the field. I refuse.

    Brava!

  2. 2.

    Baud

    June 21, 2017 at 11:05 am

    Eeyore was a sunny optimist compared to Internet liberals.

  3. 3.

    Thoroughly Pizzled

    June 21, 2017 at 11:07 am

    God, I remember the elections in 2009. We thought the GOP was committing suicide! If only.

    I’m feeling fairly good about next year. We just need to make it through the intervening nightmare time.

  4. 4.

    Teddys Person

    June 21, 2017 at 11:08 am

    The Georgia 6th (median household income: ‎$72,832) elected Karen “I do not support a livable wage” Handel, proving once again the Republican motto: Fuck You, I Got Mine.

  5. 5.

    Amaranthine RBG

    June 21, 2017 at 11:09 am

    After Clinton lost to the most unqualified person ever to ascend to the presidency, I had hoped that there would be some serious soul-searching by democrats.

    That doesn’t seem to be happening.

    I gave a fair amount of money to Clinton’s campaign and I have lost count of the number of phone calls I’ve received from people who are laying the groundwork for Kamala Harris, Gavin Newsome and some other turds who have zero chance in 2020.

  6. 6.

    Baud

    June 21, 2017 at 11:10 am

    As president, my first executive order will be to formally declare the glass half-full.

  7. 7.

    germy

    June 21, 2017 at 11:11 am

    Randy Bryce wants to challenge Republican House Speaker Paul Ryan for the First District of Wisconsin, where Ryan beat his most recent Democratic challenger by 35 points.

    Bryce is a pretty amazing challenger for Ryan: he’s an ironworker and “a cancer survivor, Army veteran, political coordinator for his union, and member of the Wisconsin Veterans Chamber of Commerce’s board of directors.”

    He raised $100,000 the day he announced.

    Bryce is a Sanders supporter who’s squaring off against David Yankovich — another Sanders supporter — for the Democratic nomination in Wisconsin’s First.

  8. 8.

    rikyrah

    June 21, 2017 at 11:11 am

    Ain’t no shade like upper crust British shade

    ……………………………………

    Donald Trump’s state visit to UK cancelled, Queen’s Speech reveals
    Monarch makes no mention of planned visit in address to Parliament

    Joe Watts

    Donald Trump’s state visit to the UK appears to have been axed after officials failed to mention it in the Queen’s Speech on Wednesday.

    Theresa May invited the US President after they were pictured holding hands together on the White House lawn earlier this year, but the visit was threatening to spark large-scale demonstrations.

    Both Downing Street and the White House have brushed aside claims the trip is in doubt, but the invitation to Mr Trump has faced a wall of criticism amid the President’s outlandish behaviour.

    The monarch’s address to Parliament usually mentions all planned state visits, but that delivered by Queen Elizabeth on Wednesday only contained a reference to welcoming King Felipe and Queen Letizia of Spain in July.

  9. 9.

    satby

    June 21, 2017 at 11:12 am

    So good I put that image on FB.
    I was in grade school during the Civil Rights era, the Viet Nam war, and just about to graduate from high school the year Roe v Wade was decided. Politics and progress are lifetime games, there are no short seasons.

  10. 10.

    Amaranthine RBG

    June 21, 2017 at 11:14 am

    After Clinton lost to the most unqualified person ever to ascend to the presidency, I had hoped there would be some serious soul searching by democrats

    Hasn’t happened. People are just doubling down on failure.

  11. 11.

    rikyrah

    June 21, 2017 at 11:15 am

    Trump’s infrastructure initiative is already failing
    06/21/17 09:20 AM
    By Steve Benen

    Much of the country might have missed it, but the White House kicked off “Infrastructure Week” in early June, which was intended to be a public-relations campaign in which Donald Trump touted his support for a popular idea: improving the nation’s infrastructure.

    It was, however, a flop. The White House’s plan, by officials’ own admission, is still months away from completion, which meant “Infrastructure Week” amounted to one fake signing ceremony, in which Trump put his signature on a glorified press release, asking Congress to privatize the nation’s air-traffic control system.

    And two weeks later, the idea appears to be effectively dead. The Hill reported:

    A Senate panel has declined to include President Trump’s controversial proposal to separate air traffic control from the federal government in a must-pass aviation bill, according to the committee’s chairman.

    Sen. John Thune (R-S.D.), who leads the Commerce, Science and Transportation Committee, said the Senate’s long-term reauthorization of the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) will not include the spinoff plan, citing the lack of support for the idea on his panel.

  12. 12.

    Baud

    June 21, 2017 at 11:16 am

    @germy: Why mention who they supported in the last primary?

  13. 13.

    germy

    June 21, 2017 at 11:18 am

    @Baud: Good question. I guess they like pinning tags on everyone: “Berniecrat. Hillary Supporter”

  14. 14.

    FlipYrWhig

    June 21, 2017 at 11:19 am

    @germy:

    Bryce is a Sanders supporter who’s squaring off against David Yankovich — another Sanders supporter — for the Democratic nomination in Wisconsin’s First.

    I can’t wait to find out how their future loss demonstrates how the neoliberal Democratic establishment blew it again!

  15. 15.

    Teddys Person

    June 21, 2017 at 11:19 am

    @rikyrah: Shorter Trump Administration: Trumpov Inc. can’t make easy money off infrastructure so we’ll concentrate on sending Ivanka and Jared on a “diplomatic mission” to set up an easier grift with China.

  16. 16.

    eclare

    June 21, 2017 at 11:20 am

    Thanks Betty, it will be a long slog, but I’m in.

  17. 17.

    Keith G

    June 21, 2017 at 11:21 am

    So much of electoral behavior is tribal, yet also a lot of it is about how voters feel in their gut about their situation in life and policies that might help/hinder that situation.

    Some Democratic leaders are beginning to show signs of skill at focusing on a better type of messaging. Keeping the faith, and keeping messaging discipline during these times of horrible policy will end up helping the Democrats pick up voters who they didn’t have with them in 2016.

  18. 18.

    Baud

    June 21, 2017 at 11:22 am

    @FlipYrWhig: Meh. It’ll be tough to win but I’ll root for the nominee.

    Plenty of decent Sanders supporters out there. Keith Ellison and Tom Periello come to mind.

  19. 19.

    Mike in DC

    June 21, 2017 at 11:22 am

    Our base is fairly activated, but so far the Republican base is too. We can hope they become more disaffected as time goes on, but running good candidates and registering voters is the best strategy overall.

  20. 20.

    Teddys Person

    June 21, 2017 at 11:22 am

    @Baud: Isn’t “Democrats in Disarray” the media’s popular narrative choice?

  21. 21.

    Frankensteinbeck

    June 21, 2017 at 11:23 am

    As was pointed out last night, we had these special elections at all because these districts were picked by the GOP as utterly safe. If they had to replace the Representative, they knew they could do it with no risk. That does add perspective.

    @Amaranthine RBG:
    Soul searching to what? The only serious alternative offered has been to abandon a message of inclusivity for one based on a simple, ‘destroy the rich’ economic leftism message. That has been tried, and worked even less, so what should we find?

  22. 22.

    SiubhanDuinne

    June 21, 2017 at 11:24 am

    @rikyrah:

    Best thing about the Queen’s Speech was that her outfit, especially the hat, was a visual echo of the EU flag — cornflower blue with lots of yellow-centered flowers, similar to the circle of yellow stars on a blue field in the flag. Many people saw it as a deliberate message that she, personally, remains opposed to Brexit (though she can never say so). LOL, and also to no mention of any Trump visit.

  23. 23.

    Baud

    June 21, 2017 at 11:24 am

    @Teddys Person: Sure, but that doesn’t seem to apply here when the candidates aren’t a proxy for the primary.

  24. 24.

    Butthurt Jordan Trombone (fka XTPD)

    June 21, 2017 at 11:24 am

    SHIT LIGHTNING

  25. 25.

    germy

    June 21, 2017 at 11:26 am

    I read the supreme court will “hear case that could reshape the US political map”
    AP

    The Supreme Court will take up a momentous fight over parties manipulating electoral districts to gain partisan advantage in a case that could affect the balance of power between Democrats and Republicans across the United States.

    At issue is whether Republican lawmakers in Wisconsin drew legislative districts that favored their party and were so out of whack with the state’s political breakdown that they violated the constitutional rights of Democratic voters.

    It will be the high court’s first case in more than a decade on what’s known as partisan gerrymandering. A lower court struck down the districts as unconstitutional last year.

    The justices won’t hear the arguments until the fall, but the case has already taken on a distinctly ideological, if not partisan, tone. Just 90 minutes after justices announced Monday that they would hear the case, the five more conservative justices voted to halt a lower court’s order to redraw the state’s legislative districts by November, in time for next year’s elections.

  26. 26.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    June 21, 2017 at 11:26 am

    @germy: Bryce is a pretty amazing challenger for Ryan: he’s an ironworker and “a cancer survivor, Army veteran, political coordinator for his union, and member of the Wisconsin Veterans Chamber of Commerce’s board of directors.”

    Helluva resume. Ryan is pretty well entrenched, but if Ossoff or Quist had been vets, we might have seen very different outcomes.

    ETA: Damn, Betty, you make FL look good

  27. 27.

    Teddys Person

    June 21, 2017 at 11:27 am

    @Baud: I don’t think the press is interested in making that distinction.

  28. 28.

    Baud

    June 21, 2017 at 11:28 am

    @Teddys Person: Fair.

  29. 29.

    Judge Crater

    June 21, 2017 at 11:28 am

    Realistically, Trump is either an aberration or a sign of severe disfunction in our democracy. It’s the Paul Ryans and Mitch McConnells and Tom Prices (the odious HHS Secretary) who worry me. They are intent on rolling back history to the 18th century. They have no plan for the future except to turn the government and society over to the one percent and a small demographic of “entrepreneurs”, capitalists and “libertarians” who believe in social darwinism and the innate power of the “free market” to solve all problems. It’s total bull shit but it seems to appeal to a minority large enough to give them the balance of power.

  30. 30.

    sigaba

    June 21, 2017 at 11:28 am

    @Butthurt Jordan Trombone (fka XTPD): “The parties have both failed us, which is why Democrats must unilaterally stand down.”

  31. 31.

    Baud

    June 21, 2017 at 11:30 am

    @Butthurt Jordan Trombone (fka XTPD): Putting aside the fake litmus test for Dems, why does he think an independent would win in these districts? There have been plenty of districts where Dems haven’t put up a nominee. No independents have stepped up.

  32. 32.

    Felonius Monk

    June 21, 2017 at 11:31 am

    @Amaranthine RBG: Fuck you.

  33. 33.

    catclub

    June 21, 2017 at 11:32 am

    After President Obama was elected in 2008, Democrats won seven consecutive special House races, retaining six seats and flipping one GOP seat to a Democrat. In 2010, the Democrats lost the House in a wave election. Just saying.

    You read my mind. Congress members picked for Cabinet posts are likely to be from solid seats for the Presidents party.

    My only other comment: Why did the other race, which was closer, get so little coverage? And did the extra coverage help or hurt Ossoff?

  34. 34.

    Teddys Person

    June 21, 2017 at 11:34 am

    @Baud: President Baud cannot come soon enough for me. I hope you have a strategy for capturing the “I know he/she is a liar, cheat, and thief, but I’m voting for him/her anyway because reasons” vote. Those are the people that have been harshing my mellow for the past 6 months.

  35. 35.

    FlipYrWhig

    June 21, 2017 at 11:34 am

    @Baud: I am very tired of the excuse-making among the Sanders set. If relative moderates aren’t winning, fine, point made. But out-and-proud progressives aren’t winning either. Keep trying, then, and hit on a winning formula, and then await the inevitable copycats. Losing NBA GMs don’t say, hmm, the Golden State Warriors started winning a lot of games with perimeter shooting, if we just have _our_ guys fire wildly from the perimeter we’ll have a boatload of championships in no time! You kinda need the talent before the strategy is going to work.

  36. 36.

    Immanentize

    June 21, 2017 at 11:34 am

    So, in 2018 we will not only have a good increase in the base generic Dem. vs Rep. stats, we will also have the advantage of arguing for divided government and checks and balances. The cause of each might be the same (Trump) but a candidate does not need to be a progressive revolutionary to pull those two arguments together for a win in a close district.

  37. 37.

    Baud

    June 21, 2017 at 11:35 am

    @catclub: The other district was more solidly red, I believe. The coverage (and money) for Ossoff probably riled up the GOP base. But it’s hard to find the right balance where we get our voters interested while the other side stays apathetic.

  38. 38.

    catclub

    June 21, 2017 at 11:35 am

    @Teddys Person: Tough call between that and Both Sides Do It.

  39. 39.

    mai naem mobile

    June 21, 2017 at 11:35 am

    I had a dispiriting conversation with a millenial yesturdy evening. He’s a young Hispanic American who does handy man kind of stuff for us once in a while. I started with how disappointed I was in the GA loss. And he mentioned Hilz(he’s no political junkie.) Then we talked about Dolt. He calls him the Suicide President – I love love love this term. Anyhow, he moved onto OBama making it look like the Russians hacked the election and Obamas dad was a Russian. Clinton Foundation…Hilz’speeches, Rothshilds..At that point i said ‘Next thing you’re going to tell me the Jooz really control the world’ and he said ‘Well,yes, they keep their race pure….’ Oy Vey!!!! WTF where do these peopLe get this shit? I had stuff to do so I’ll revisit this conversation with him at another time. At least he didn’t vote in ’16. BTW, he’s not some stupid moron. I am beginning to think we need to have our own disinformation stuff.

  40. 40.

    catclub

    June 21, 2017 at 11:38 am

    @Teddys Person:

    I hope you have a strategy for capturing the “I know he/she is a liar, cheat, and thief, but I’m voting for him/her anyway because reasons” vote.

    That worked for a Lousiana Governor/Senate election against the klansman. IN the distant past now (1990’s).

  41. 41.

    Amaranthine RBG

    June 21, 2017 at 11:38 am

    And since this is an open thread, go take a look at the 8-1 opinion out Monday : https://www.google.com/amp/www.scotusblog.com/2017/06/opinion-analysis-justices-reject-california-courts-jurisdiction-claims-state-litigants-state-defendants/amp/

    This effectively destroys people’s ability to efficiently join class actions to recover for their injuries.

    Sotomayor stood alone in dissent. The other so called liberal justices joined to ass fuck plaintiffs. Her dissent is worth a read.

  42. 42.

    nominus

    June 21, 2017 at 11:38 am

    Twitter is a bit unbearable today, somehow my feed is full of I-told-you-so-ing from the brogressives who wondered why Generic DNC Corporate Candidate couldn’t beat someone who literally said “fuck the poor” in the reddest district in the country. Their reasoning? Quist outperformed Clinton without help from the DNC, but DNC backing was obviously the kiss of death in GA-06. God save me from my own party.

    I’ve been blocked a few times telling them that they should run a super-left socialist for the Alabama special election this year, surely if Ossof wasn’t progressive enough, they can show us it should be done.

  43. 43.

    Baud

    June 21, 2017 at 11:38 am

    @FlipYrWhig: I agree completely. They think they gain credibility when Dems lose so they don’t have to show us how win themselves. Their strategy seems to be based on a process of elimination — if all else fails, we’ll have no choice but to try it their way. The real world doesn’t really work that way.

  44. 44.

    Frankensteinbeck

    June 21, 2017 at 11:39 am

    @mai naem mobile:
    A good reminder that racism is not exclusive to whites. White racism is doing so much damage, it’s easy to forget you’ll find some in other ethnicities.

  45. 45.

    Baud

    June 21, 2017 at 11:41 am

    @Teddys Person:

    “I know he/she is a liar, cheat, and thief, but I’m voting for him/her anyway because reasons”

    Those were my reasons. I thought we were going to play dirty now.

  46. 46.

    Immanentize

    June 21, 2017 at 11:42 am

    @catclub:

    Why did the other race, which was closer, get so little coverage? And did the extra coverage help or hurt Ossoff?

    My understanding is that the nature of the South Carolina district (less educated) and the vast blowout there by Trump didn’t look at all like a good opportunity. Whether the national attention was good or bad for Ossoff, who knows. It weaponized the money on both sides. That said, I did read that the two month delay between primary and runoff really gave the Republicans a big opportunity to define Ossoff and start some hanky panky (like maybe the letter with powder to Handel).

  47. 47.

    D58826

    June 21, 2017 at 11:43 am

    From Huffington Der Fuhrer can’t even get any love from the Queen –

    Donald Trump’s planned state visit to the UK appears to have been shelved after the Queen failed to mention it in her speech re-opening Parliament.
    Her Majesty usually lists all formal visits for the coming year, but pointedly did not include the US President’s trip.
    The absence of Trump’s tour is the clearest signal yet that no date has been agreed on his controversial visit, and follows claims that he was worried about mass street protests causing embarrassment to himself and the Royal Family.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.co.u…..k&

  48. 48.

    zhena gogolia

    June 21, 2017 at 11:43 am

    @Baud:

    I resemble that remark!

    Seriously, thank you, Betty.

  49. 49.

    Iowa Old Lady

    June 21, 2017 at 11:43 am

    @Amaranthine RBG: I say again, she got more votes.

  50. 50.

    FlipYrWhig

    June 21, 2017 at 11:43 am

    @catclub: I have to think that a large factor in Ossoff’s loss was the way he became the Next Big Thing — which ended up rallying local Republicans to stick it to the kinds of people who got excited about him and wanted him to win, especially after the incidents of violence and threats from leftish sorts over the past few weeks.

  51. 51.

    gvg

    June 21, 2017 at 11:43 am

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: I think that may be a past truism that isn’t so much any more. There just aren’t as many vets in the population to vote for another vet. The numbers aren’t there any more. My evidence is not conclusive but i have noticed republicans passing stuff that distinctly hurts vets and not paying a price for it. I think they did in the past.
    there is a loud part of the population that pictures themselves as patriots and pro vets pro armed forces but hasn’t actually served themselves. the salt of the earth or gun rights nuts…..they are so disconnected from the real vet interests that what they support isn’t always actually good for vets and our politics have begun to take it into account. there are still a lot of voters who think they are supposed to say they support vets but are pretty ignorant and um have personal reasons for overlooking harm to vets like cuts to the VA.
    We are also sort of guilty of the habit because we always point out when the GOP does something that will hurt vets, like we expect them to lose votes, only it hasn’t been happening. Democratic vets still tend to lose in red areas. Look at Kerry and Max Cleland. We need to not pin hopes on the vet angle. Of course I still think we should look after them just like all the other disadvantaged groups or anyone we make promises too, that’s why I am a democrat. those are my values.

  52. 52.

    Baud

    June 21, 2017 at 11:43 am

    @nominus: Expected and irrelevant.

  53. 53.

    Repatriated

    June 21, 2017 at 11:44 am

    @Baud:

    Those were my reasons. I thought we were going to play dirty now.

    Baud 2020! Because Reasons!

  54. 54.

    trollhattan

    June 21, 2017 at 11:44 am

    A common statistical conversation in floodprone areas is what one-in-two-hundred means. Not that it occurs once in two-hundred years but each year has a 0.5% chance of occurring, a flood does not ensure you’re good for 199 years.

    “No duh” but here’s the rub: USACE draws flood maps and if an area proves more floodprone than previously, it can be reclassified. It gets interesting when you go from 100-year to 99-year, because your mortgage holder will require flood insurance and the premium difference between 100 and 99-year is breathtaking. I know this because we went the reverse direction, from 99 to 100 year, based on levee improvements. We’re keeping the insurance even though it’s no longer required. As best as I can figure our house is 16feet msl and for much of 2017, the nearest river (a mile away) varied between 15 and 30 feet. Flood stage is 33.5 feet.

    Sea-level rise+more intense storms will render significant swathes of real estate uninhabitable sooner than people think.

  55. 55.

    Baud

    June 21, 2017 at 11:45 am

    @gvg: Kander in Missouri.

  56. 56.

    zhena gogolia

    June 21, 2017 at 11:45 am

    @Felonius Monk:

    Oh, thank you, I was trying to formulate the perfect response but you beat me to it.

  57. 57.

    Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho

    June 21, 2017 at 11:45 am

    That is a stunning photo of a very cool tree.

  58. 58.

    Frankensteinbeck

    June 21, 2017 at 11:47 am

    @FlipYrWhig:
    It might simply be that a giant Democratic wave still has limits. A +20 shift across the board would be a truly outrageous political shift, but would not carry these super-red districts.

  59. 59.

    Butthurt Jordan Trombone (fka XTPD)

    June 21, 2017 at 11:48 am

    @mai naem mobile:

    he’s not a stupid moron

    Assumes facts not presented as evidence

  60. 60.

    D58826

    June 21, 2017 at 11:49 am

    also from huffington

    Dying in a fiery ball of rock and ash doesn’t exactly sound like the best way to go, but experts have warned that modern civilisation may indeed face the same fate as the dinosaurs.
    A leading astrophysicist has warned of the danger that unexpected asteroids pose to our planet, and classified the threat not as a matter of if, but when.

    Sooner the better????? Or failing that how about: The Yellowstone supervolcano hasn’t erupted for 72,000 years, but in the past week it was hit by hundred of earthquakes

    http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/technology/an-asteroid-strike-on-earth-is-just-a-matter-of-time-say-experts/ar-BBCZxTA?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=iehp

  61. 61.

    Baud

    June 21, 2017 at 11:49 am

    @Butthurt Jordan Trombone (fka XTPD): Yeah, I think Ben Carson proved you can be both highly skilled and crazy.

  62. 62.

    FlipYrWhig

    June 21, 2017 at 11:51 am

    @nominus: I didn’t see the final tallies, but didn’t Parnell in SC outperform every other Democrat in these special elections? Is anyone now contending that the obvious best path forward is the embrace of Parnellism?

  63. 63.

    Frankensteinbeck

    June 21, 2017 at 11:51 am

    @Butthurt Jordan Trombone (fka XTPD):
    I think we should accept that bigotry and a willingness to believe bigotry-backed arguments is independent of other cognitive measures.

  64. 64.

    Brachiator

    June 21, 2017 at 11:52 am

    Actor Daniel Day Lewis has announced his retirement from acting.

    At the age of just 60, the legendary triple Oscar winner – recipient of more best actor Oscars than anyone in Academy Award history – says that his next film, Paul Thomas Anderson’s fashion drama Phantom Thread, will be his last.

    A select list of his films is a miniature history of the United States, redolent in themes of how we came together and sometimes fell apart as a nation, and variations on savage and civil society.

    The Last of the Mohicans
    Gangs of New York
    Lincoln
    The Age of Innocence
    There Will Be Blood

    And he is a featured actor in three films of emotional depth and beauty: My Beautiful Laundrette, The Unbearable Lightness of Being, In the Name of the Father.

    It might be fun to make a double feature viewing night of My Beautiful Laundrette and Moonlight, in that both films deal with the mysteries to yearning for and finding love against impossible odds.

    A review in the Guardian notes of the last film:

    He was absolutely superb in Jim Sheridan’s In the Name of the Father (1991), playing the wrongly convicted Gerry Conlon – and incidentally achieving a wonderful, touching chemistry with the actor who played his father Giuseppe, the much-loved and still much-missed Pete Postlethwaite.

    If he is indeed done with actin, what a wonderful body of work to have blessed us with.

  65. 65.

    Major Major Major Major

    June 21, 2017 at 11:52 am

    I got into my ride from the train station to the office and the first thing I heard from NPR when I opened the door was “stabbed in the neck”, so, happy Wednesday, I guess.

  66. 66.

    Baud

    June 21, 2017 at 11:52 am

    @FlipYrWhig: And he’s a banker!

  67. 67.

    Major Major Major Major

    June 21, 2017 at 11:53 am

    @Baud: all democrats are always proxies for the 2016 primary, until at least 2021.

  68. 68.

    D58826

    June 21, 2017 at 11:55 am

    and for those interested in the physics of why some planes can’t fly in hot weather – it isn’t the heat per say but the air density hot air is less dense than cool air thus the plane needs more power to take off. – http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/technology/science-says-why-some-airplanes-dont-fly-in-high-heat/ar-BBCXHP5?li=BBnbcA1&ocid=iehp

  69. 69.

    FlipYrWhig

    June 21, 2017 at 11:56 am

    @Baud: Bearded people with ties to investment banking are obviously what swing voters in red states are clamoring for! Where have you gone, Jon Corzine? A nation turns its lonely eyes to you!

  70. 70.

    Betty Cracker

    June 21, 2017 at 11:56 am

    @Amaranthine RBG: What you say is demonstrably false; there’s been a ton of soul searching. It is still ongoing, and there have been policy changes at the party level in response. What has been remained distressingly consistent is the whinging of folks who refuse to take “yes” or “okay, work with us to make that happen” for an answer.

  71. 71.

    Baud

    June 21, 2017 at 11:56 am

    @D58826: I assumed it was the tires. Interesting.

  72. 72.

    Baud

    June 21, 2017 at 11:57 am

    @Betty Cracker:

    there’s been a ton of soul searching.

    I’m still looking for mine.

  73. 73.

    Major Major Major Major

    June 21, 2017 at 11:57 am

    @Frankensteinbeck: gerrymandering creates a bunch of ~+6 districts, not a bunch of +23 districts. It’s designed to be safe most of the time but it’s very vulnerable to waves. Think of a substandard levee.

  74. 74.

    Aimai

    June 21, 2017 at 11:58 am

    @Keith G: do you not get that your tribalism argument runs dead against the better messaging argument? They don’t want the same things we want OR they wont accept it from our hands. Its neither our messages nor our messengers. They reject US and our team.

  75. 75.

    pat

    June 21, 2017 at 11:59 am

    open thread…

    I just bought a bag with a front flap that closes with a strong magnet. Will this magnet be bad for the camera I want to carry around in it?
    Thanks for any response….

  76. 76.

    Butthurt Jordan Trombone (fka XTPD)

    June 21, 2017 at 12:02 pm

    @Baud: That is: ultracrepidarian.

  77. 77.

    Major Major Major Major

    June 21, 2017 at 12:03 pm

    Bouie looks at new electoral analyses and finds that Obama-to-Trump voters are white racists who want white socialism, I am shocked to find gambling going on in this establishment. http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2017/06/voter_study_group_and_why_obama_voters_defected_to_trump.html

  78. 78.

    FlipYrWhig

    June 21, 2017 at 12:03 pm

    @Baud: Oh my fucking God, a friend on FB just posted about how Parnell was so close and _if only Democrats had put forward a progressive agenda_ he might have won. It’s South fucking Carolina. Has a progressive agenda ever had any traction in South Carolina? Why isn’t the lesson to run like Parnell did, which was _the opposite of_ this bullshit? Why, _why_, WHY is the ~40-year-old political left these days so fucking drenched in confirmation bias and general idiotism?

  79. 79.

    Wapiti

    June 21, 2017 at 12:03 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    Many people saw it as a deliberate message that she, personally, remains opposed to Brexit (though she can never say so). LOL, and also to no mention of any Trump visit.

    In my imaginings the queen is thinking, “The United Kingdom was pulled together over centuries with a lot of blood and treasure spent, and you Brexit wankers are going to destroy my kingdom.”

  80. 80.

    hovercraft

    June 21, 2017 at 12:04 pm

    We’ve made significant progress. Now is not the time to get discouraged.

    But the one sure way they win is if we cede the field. I refuse.

    THIS.
    I’m disappointed as hell today, I suspected when he came up short in round one that he’d lose, but I was still hopeful. But FFS people it’s just been seven months, we’ve barely started.

    As I a black woman with young kids, just leaving the house is dangerous for them, and when I think about my 10 year old boy out and about in the next few years, the temptation to just freak out with fear is sometimes overwhelming. But I can’t live like that, I can’t raise him to live in fear, I simply have to work hard to prepare him for the world he will have to live in until all of us can change the fact that simply because of what he is and will be, a big black kid/man, he will be seen by many people as someone to be feared, a threat, someone who can be put down with impunity. My sweet little boy who is scared of flies, scares people, not to mention my mouthy 14 year old daughter who doesn’t always know when to keep her mouth shut, could be perceived as threats at any time.
    This is my reality, this is why giving up is not an option.
    Change is hard, it takes lots of work, it involves lots of setbacks, but in order to create a safe place for our kids and those we love, we have to keep working. Nothing worth having comes easy, evicting the pestilence that has taken over our government requires all of us to keep working as hard as we can for as long as it takes, because for many of us it’s life and death. Not just the people of color being killed with impunity, but also the undocumented families being ripped apart, the millions who are going to lose insurance, the elderly who will no longer have access to long term care, the millions across the country who are going to lose their battle with opiod addiction as treatment centers and programs are eliminated, our schools being stripped down to the bone, Wall Street unleashed to wreak havoc in our lives again, those who will have their lives destroyed by a misguided war on drugs, and each and every one of us whose lives will be negatively affected by the rulings of the corporate Supreme Court that would like to strip us all of our workplace rights and protections. Fighting is hard, this and other places are a place for us to all come and voice our frustrations and vent, but once we are done with that, we need to all go out and continue the fight each in our own little way. We can never give up, too much is at stake, and the only way we are going to win this fight if we all work together.

  81. 81.

    Frankensteinbeck

    June 21, 2017 at 12:05 pm

    @Major Major Major Major:
    Yes! But these were not those +6 districts that this kind of Democratic enthusiasm could flip. If we can keep this going until the next election, there will be Hell to pay. Can we? I don’t know. The impression I get is that this has little to do with anything the Democratic Party does. Rather, voters are viscerally angry at Trump and the GOP to an extent and breadth we haven’t seen before.

  82. 82.

    SatanicPanic

    June 21, 2017 at 12:05 pm

    @FlipYrWhig:

    confirmation bias and general idiotism

    I think the one answers the other

  83. 83.

    Teddys Person

    June 21, 2017 at 12:06 pm

    @FlipYrWhig: “South Carolina is too small for a republic and too large for an insane asylum.” ~ James L. Petigru

  84. 84.

    SatanicPanic

    June 21, 2017 at 12:07 pm

    I dunno, I’m pretty whatever about this. It wouldn’t have flipped the House and Republicans are gonna be a**holes regardless. I didn’t buy it that Ossoff winning would have changed their vote on the AHCA

  85. 85.

    Baud

    June 21, 2017 at 12:07 pm

    @FlipYrWhig: I expect it’s the same reason the right wing blames us for everything. Avoidance of personal responsibility.

  86. 86.

    feebog

    June 21, 2017 at 12:07 pm

    All of these special elections were in safe districts within red states (Montana-at-large excepted). The fact that the winning margins shrunk dramatically in each race is significant. As is the fact these were special elections which common wisdom says favors Republicans because they are more reliable voters. There are several score less reliable Republican seats up next year. IMHO getting quality candidates to run is going to be a key factor. The other key factor is going to be Trump, assuming he is still around 18 months from now. I think the shrinkage in the vote gap in these races is almost entirely due to him at this point. How much more toxic will he be this time next year?

  87. 87.

    Elie

    June 21, 2017 at 12:08 pm

    @rikyrah:

    Ain’t no shade like upper crust British shade

    LOL — So true!

  88. 88.

    O. Felix Culpa

    June 21, 2017 at 12:09 pm

    @Baud:

    As president, my first executive order will be to formally declare the glass half-full.

    As loyal minion, I will drink it.

  89. 89.

    Chyron HR

    June 21, 2017 at 12:11 pm

    @Amaranthine RBG:

    Free Clue: Ossoff was ahead in the polls until one of you demented fuckers decided to perforate a congressman in the name of True Progressive Bernitude.

  90. 90.

    msdc

    June 21, 2017 at 12:11 pm

    @catclub:

    My only other comment: Why did the other race, which was closer, get so little coverage?

    There’s a good chance it was closer because it got so little coverage. Nationalizing a race can mobilize the opposition, too. Sometimes a stealth upset is easier than a highly-touted one.

  91. 91.

    Chris

    June 21, 2017 at 12:12 pm

    @Baud:

    Yeah, in terms of politics, I have no beef with the majority of people in Sanders’ corner of the party. It’s just he himself that’s toxic. If he would finally learn to shut the fuck up, sit the fuck down, and let other people like Ellison take it from here, I suspect the “rift” would be fine.

  92. 92.

    Mnemosyne

    June 21, 2017 at 12:12 pm

    @Amaranthine RBG:

    I hoped that white male Democrats would wake up and pay attention to the fact that Democratic voters of color are being systematically squeezed out of their voting rights, so I guess we were both disappointed.

    Jim Crow is being re-implemented in front of your eyes, and all you can do is bleat about how it’s all the Democrats’ fault because it doesn’t affect your privileged white male ass.

  93. 93.

    Le Comte de Monte Cristo fka Edmund Dantes

    June 21, 2017 at 12:13 pm

    @Baud:

    If there aren’t FEMA camps and guillotines in your first order, you’re dead to me.

  94. 94.

    But her emals!!!

    June 21, 2017 at 12:13 pm

    @Major Major Major Major:

    In a state with 10 congressional district and equal numbers of Democratic and Republican voters, gerrymandering can also be used to create 3 districts that are +40 for Democrats and 7 districts that are +17 for Republicans.

  95. 95.

    Butthurt Jordan Trombone (fka XTPD)

    June 21, 2017 at 12:14 pm

    @feebog: Don’t you get it, this proves that SUCH PWNÈD ALL WE and the appropriate result is for all of us to curl into a feral position and cry in a fire.

  96. 96.

    nominus

    June 21, 2017 at 12:14 pm

    @FlipYrWhig: Their arguments cleverly avoid inconvenient things like numbers and facts. They can’t point to any specific point about a losing candidate, just that anyone who is not Berned doesn’t have an exciting message to excite voters, so the proletariat revolt gets put on hold until someone turns farther left.

  97. 97.

    O. Felix Culpa

    June 21, 2017 at 12:16 pm

    @Frankensteinbeck:

    it’s easy to forget you’ll find some in other ethnicities.

    In my experience, you can find racism in all ethnicities. Otherizing others is a human thing.

  98. 98.

    Elie

    June 21, 2017 at 12:17 pm

    @hovercraft:

    We can never give up, too much is at stake, and the only way we are going to win this fight if we all work together

    .

    Yes, this will be the most important work of my life for the foreseeable future. I am now the Secretary for my 42nd Legislative District here in WA — helping to get nominees elected for local and state races. It starts here and there is lots to do — not particularly sexy but very necessary. We have had a surge of membership so that is very good. We have to make the issues real for people in rural areas like the 42nd represents…. It is how to get the message out not just through our candidates but from the Democratic Party…

    I have to remember how proud I was of this country in 2009 when we elected Obama… of still believing in the dream of “freedom and justice for all” — even when we fell short. Of the blood of martyrs for the civil rights movement and how it spurred the desire for justice for all in our country — and the world. I have to keep reminding myself of that United States….

  99. 99.

    jeffreyw

    June 21, 2017 at 12:17 pm

    Turtles all the way down!

  100. 100.

    SatanicPanic

    June 21, 2017 at 12:18 pm

    @Chyron HR: This strikes me as a questionable thesis.

  101. 101.

    Matt McIrvin

    June 21, 2017 at 12:19 pm

    @D58826: The thing about giant-meteor stories is that there’s way more of an ongoing effort to observe and characterize these things than most people realize. You could have said 25 years ago that we weren’t even looking. But the potentially hazardous asteroids that could really end civilization are essentially all well-known at this point, and there are no predicted impacts at least for the next hundred years or so. There’s always the possibility of us being pasted by a giant long-period comet or something, but it’s much more remote.

    The potential city-busters are less well characterized, and in fact they hit the Earth all the time, usually in uninhabited areas because that’s most of the Earth. Chelyabinsk was an unusual case of one coming down close enough to a city to cause damage. But these impacts are not going to end humanity unless someone mistakes one for a nuke attack, and that itself is way less likely than it used to be.

    To my mind the big civilizational dangers are the ones everyone knows about: global warming, nuclear war, resource depletion.

  102. 102.

    Peale

    June 21, 2017 at 12:21 pm

    @D58826: I’m kind of in favor of the large solar storm knocking out all electronic devices. By the time we rebuild all of that, half the population will have been killed off by starvation, disease, and rioting.

  103. 103.

    The Moar You Know

    June 21, 2017 at 12:21 pm

    the proletariat revolt gets put on hold until someone turns farther left.

    @nominus: Turn left three times and you’ve turned right.

    Guess that’s what happened to Stein, et al.

  104. 104.

    O. Felix Culpa

    June 21, 2017 at 12:21 pm

    @hovercraft: Righteous rant. Thank you.

  105. 105.

    Captain C

    June 21, 2017 at 12:21 pm

    @Amaranthine RBG: Yeah, I’m sure if we just pushed doctrinaire Marxism, the good people of GA-06 and SC-05 would have voted 90% for it.

  106. 106.

    Betty Cracker

    June 21, 2017 at 12:21 pm

    @hovercraft: Every bit of this.

    @Elie: Kudos to you for taking a leadership role in your local party.

    @jeffreyw: Thought the photo would show stacked turtles, but instead it’s a very well camouflaged specimen!

  107. 107.

    Brachiator

    June 21, 2017 at 12:23 pm

    @mai naem mobile:

    Anyhow, he moved onto OBama making it look like the Russians hacked the election and Obamas dad was a Russian.

    Apparently, a Black Russian.

    I don’t know what else could be said about this guy’s baroque conspiracy theory.

  108. 108.

    Mike in Arlington

    June 21, 2017 at 12:23 pm

    Betty,

    Thanks for this. I was starting to get a bit down.

    Also, my impression is that the South Carolina race is more heartening than Georgia. The dem was outspent and didn’t get nearly the support from the national party, and he still made huge gains. I suspect that part of what happened in GA-6 is that the attention changed the dynamics of the race.

  109. 109.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    June 21, 2017 at 12:24 pm

    Listening to this week’s Pod Save American (recorded pre-GA election). Chuck Schumer calls out Joe Lieberman, his voice dripping with contempt, for killing off the public option in 2010.

    (Of course, if he read blogs instead of wasting his time in the legislature for X years, he’d know what really happened…)

  110. 110.

    Laura

    June 21, 2017 at 12:24 pm

    @Brachiator: I would SO let that man make me a custom pair of handmade shoes any damn day!
    Daniel Day Lewis has a solid body of work without one regrettable stinker among them. His fellow actors all brought their A game as well.
    For me while I loved My Beautiful Launderette, My Left Foot and The Name of the Father struck a chord.
    I was in West Yorkshire in October of 1989 on a solo journey at a turning point -my older brother’s survival from a vicious testicular cancer and my decision to go to college and leave the glamour of working at a chain grocery store.
    The earthquake in San Francisco happened the day I landed and was the ongoing headline for days until news broke of the Guildford Four’s innocence and the cover up.

    Despite the Rupert Merdochification of the British tabloids, the newscoverage in the national and regional papers was first rate journalism.
    Daniel Day Lewis has certainly put in a full shift and deserves the most satisfying retirement.

  111. 111.

    rikyrah

    June 21, 2017 at 12:25 pm

    THE RACHEL MADDOW SHOW 6/20/17
    RICO lawsuit exposes Trump Russia ties on another front
    Rachel Maddow looks at the checkered past of a Donald Trump business associate who may become a legal liability to Trump, and reports on the new access by the Senate Trump Russia investigation to FinCEN documents that will help them follow Trump’s money

  112. 112.

    Jeffro

    June 21, 2017 at 12:25 pm

    I’m thinking of switching parties and primarying Trumpov…the initial press conference should be a hoot:

    “…and so, I’m here today to switch parties and primary the current leader of the Republican Party, one Donald J. Trumpov. I do this for multiple reasons. First, because every American with two brain cells ought to be primarying this president* – he’s a clear and present danger to our country’s security and prosperity. Second, because at this point Republicans only listen to other Republicans, so if I want to be heard, I have to join the GOP. Third, my understanding is that becoming a Republican will give me access to gobs and gobs of that sweet, sweet, Mercer money as well as whatever other ‘dark money’ is made available to me via the Koch network and other shadow financing groups – possibly to include laundered donations from overseas interests. And finally, I’m running just to show other Republican candidates and GOP voters what a candidate with principles looks like, as it has been decades since they’ve seen on on the Republican side.

    I promise to never comb-over, spray-tan, or tweet; I’ll actually fill important vacant positions so that the government can do its job; and I hate golf with a passion. By the way, my wife actually still digs me and my kids are normal, so there’s that. I know how NATO actually works and don’t own any hotels, nor am I trademarking anything in China, so I can’t accept any emoluments. I’m fully aware that Frederick Douglass has been dead for some time now, and that the Panama Canal is not a new thing. I have been known to read a book or two, and at my cabinet meetings, the only thing going around the table will be some crackers and buffalo chicken dip I whipped up – NOT fawning praise from sycophants.

    So that’s really it: I’m hereby switching parties and running for the Republican nomination in 2020. Thank you, and if you’ll please get out your checkbooks, let’s GO WIN THIS THING, REPUBLICANS!”

  113. 113.

    FlipYrWhig

    June 21, 2017 at 12:25 pm

    @nominus: But then when someone is blessed by the holy hand of Bernie Sanders himself and still loses, it’s _still_ because the Establishment fucked up somehow. At a certain point this isn’t analysis, it’s theology.

  114. 114.

    Mnemosyne

    June 21, 2017 at 12:25 pm

    @Butthurt Jordan Trombone (fka XTPD):

    I have found my Twitter soulmate:

    PruneTheRoses ? @taysdadtx

    GA06 has activated BROSIS, right on schedule.

  115. 115.

    rikyrah

    June 21, 2017 at 12:26 pm

    THE RACHEL MADDOW SHOW 6/20/17
    Career criminal, mob ties, Trump associate
    Tim O’Brien, executive editor and columnist at Bloomberg View, talks with Rachel Maddow about how Donald Trump’s past business dealings could integrate with the Trump Russia investigation.

  116. 116.

    Captain C

    June 21, 2017 at 12:26 pm

    @Frankensteinbeck:

    to abandon a message of inclusivity

    Which kind of sounds like “go back to the back of the bus and let your betters take care of you, eventually” to those who are accused of practicing “identity politics” by sheer dint of their existence.

  117. 117.

    Elie

    June 21, 2017 at 12:26 pm

    @Chyron HR:

    This is totally not fair and totally inflammatory. The man who shot the Congressman was mentally ill. Coincidentally he had, at one point, been a Bernie supporter but to even hint that this was some planned or directed purpose from Bernie is just horrible and a page right out of the alt-right talking points. You should be ashamed and also STFU!

  118. 118.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    June 21, 2017 at 12:26 pm

    @Brachiator: Apparently, a Black Russian.

    Barack Alexandreovich Opushkin (with apologies to Russian speakers)

  119. 119.

    rikyrah

    June 21, 2017 at 12:26 pm

    Don’t get demoralized by Ossoff’s loss, Dems. Operate as if the House is in play — because it is:https://t.co/furUTiKJNb
    — Greg Sargent (@ThePlumLineGS) June 21, 2017

  120. 120.

    Jeffro

    June 21, 2017 at 12:26 pm

    @rikyrah: In my wildest dreams, they RICO his ass so hard, he has to ask his cellmate to loan him a quarter to call Ivanka once a month.

  121. 121.

    Kryptik

    June 21, 2017 at 12:27 pm

    As much as I hate to give any credit to someone like Chris Cillizza, both on principle and because the rest of his analysis is the same brand of ‘scold Dems for GOP’s sins’ bullshit….I have to begrudgingly give him this:

    “There are no moral victories in politics. No matter what the losing side says — and they always say this — the only thing that really matters when it comes to special elections is the ‘W’ and the ‘L.’”

    A win would have sent a statement and put us one step closer. A win would have been a stepping stone. A loss does none of that in any tangible way, no matter how much we narrowed the margins.

    And like I said last night, I understand, on an intellectual level, that the steps made in narrowing the margins can’t be understated. It’s a step forward for sure, and something to build off of. But with what we face, it’s simply not enough, and a loss is a loss. Most people, whether the media (for the horse race aspect), the layman (simply because they don’t understand the underlying dynamics at play the way us junkies do), or even the lefter-than-thou brigade (because of the supposed ammo it gives them) will only care about the W or the L. And while there’s even more double standards at play (like someone pointed out, the same situation with the parties flipped would have the narrative of ‘GOP ASCENDANT’ rather than ‘DEMS FAIL FOREVER’), it’s not enough to really take away from the truth: We Lost.

    And we keep losing. That’s psychologically damaging regardless, even if you try and explain the reasons behind it, and learn from it, because people just don’t fucking care what you really learn from it. They care that you win or lose, because “Winners” are “good people”. “Losers” are “Bad People”. And in our winner-take-all system, you win or go home. And god help me, we need a win, soon. Because the environment we’re in isn’t going to let us take any more losses, not with the demands to blow up the entire goddamn party because ‘America Hates Democrats forever’.

    @Mnemosyne:

    And…this is another concern: we’re just straight up running out of time to get our foot back in the door before the GOP shuts it on us forever via bullshit like this.

  122. 122.

    hovercraft

    June 21, 2017 at 12:27 pm

    @Judge Crater:

    Trump is either an aberration or a sign of severe disfunction in our democracy. It’s the Paul Ryans and Mitch McConnells and Tom Prices (the odious HHS Secretary) who worry me.

    I think that’s dangerous talk, Grover Norquist said years ago that the “actual” individual elected president was not important, they just needed to have five working digits to sign the legislation that he and other true conservatives passed. Twitler may be more than they bargained for because he’s insane, but given that a minimum of 60 % of the republicans in congress know shit about anything other than government is bad, taxes are theft of hard working Americans money, fetuses good, and democrats are evil, he is the logical conclusion of their veneration of the common every day American can do better than “elites” bullshit. Oh and I’m including the venerable senate in that number, these people know nothing and like their fearless leader, lack the curiosity to learn anything. The leadership is evil and crafty, but they are all equally dangerous because the craziest are the ones who keep calling their bluff and forcing them to be even more extreme.

  123. 123.

    SatanicPanic

    June 21, 2017 at 12:27 pm

    @The Moar You Know: I chuckled to myself, yes Stein shows all the signs of someone who made a wrong turn and is not going the way she thought she was. Like a car with AZ license plates.

  124. 124.

    rikyrah

    June 21, 2017 at 12:29 pm

    G.O.P. Health Plan Is Really a Rollback of Medicaid
    Limiting the amount that the federal government would pay for each person would leave states with difficult choices, and would be a fundamental shift of financial risk.

    By MARGOT SANGER-KATZ
    JUNE 20, 2017

    Tucked inside the Republican bill to replace Obamacare is a plan to impose a radical diet on a 52-year-old program that insures nearly one in five Americans.

    The bill, of course, would modify changes to the health system brought by the Affordable Care Act. But it would also permanently restructure Medicaid, which covers tens of millions of poor or disabled Americans, including millions who are living in nursing homes with conditions like Alzheimer’s or the aftereffects of a stroke.

    “This is the most consequential change in 50 years for low-income people’s health care,” said Joan Alker, the executive director of the Center for Children and Families at Georgetown University. “This is a massive change that has hardly been discussed.”

    Since its founding, Medicaid has operated as a partnership between the federal government and the states. Each pays a share of patients’ medical bills, with no overall limit on spending. The American Health Care Act would try to slim down the federal share of that spending, by limiting how much the federal government would pay for each person enrolled in the program. The Senate version of the legislation, expected this week, is likely to make the payments still leaner in later years.

    The results, according to independent analyses, would be major reductions in federal spending on Medicaid over time. States would be left deciding whether to raise more money to make up the difference, or to cut back on medical coverage for people using the program. The Congressional Budget Office estimates that the changes would lead to a reduction in spending on Medicaid of more than $800 billion over a decade. (That figure also includes additional cuts to the Obamacare Medicaid expansion.)

    …………………

    Medicaid is the country’s largest government health care program, covering more Americans than its better-known sibling, Medicare.

    Its reach is broad: About half of all births in the country are covered by Medicaid, and nearly 40 percent of children are covered through the program. Medicaid covers the long-term care costs of two-thirds of Americans living in nursing homes, many of them middle-class Americans who spent all of their savings on care before becoming eligible.

    It covers children and adults with disabilities who require services that most commercial health insurance doesn’t include. It covers poor women who are pregnant or raising young children. Those populations were all included in the program before Obamacare became law.

    It also provides insurance for poor adult Americans, and recent evidence shows that its expansion under Obamacare has given more poor people access to health care services and reduced their exposure to financial shocks.

  125. 125.

    Captain C

    June 21, 2017 at 12:29 pm

    @mai naem mobile:

    ‘Well,yes, they keep their race pure….’

    My half-Jewish genes are quite surprised at this.

  126. 126.

    FlipYrWhig

    June 21, 2017 at 12:30 pm

    Honestly, if the leftish theory about what the white working class really wants is valid, and if they’re right that the white working class is soured on Democrats as a “brand” because of things like “identity politics,” isn’t the next logical step to start running lefties in Republican primaries and attempting to take over the Republican Party?

  127. 127.

    Major Major Major Major

    June 21, 2017 at 12:30 pm

    @But her emals!!!: mathematically, yes, but they usually opt for something that will withstand court challenges, and also there’s the geographic continuity issue.

  128. 128.

    raven

    June 21, 2017 at 12:30 pm

    FIDO

  129. 129.

    Hoodie

    June 21, 2017 at 12:31 pm

    @FlipYrWhig: There is something to be said about Parnellism, but Ossoff might have pulled it off if he was named Archie rather than Jon.

  130. 130.

    rikyrah

    June 21, 2017 at 12:31 pm

    23.

    Is the number of districts that Hillary won in 2016, but have a GOP Congresscritter.

    ALL of them, but at least 15 more, should be the goal of the DNC in 2018.

    This is not a marginal R district….

    and, Ossoff came that close.

    As well as the guy in South Carolina – THAT was the crazy shock of the night for me.

  131. 131.

    Chris

    June 21, 2017 at 12:32 pm

    @Judge Crater:

    Realistically, Trump is either an aberration or a sign of severe disfunction in our democracy.

    Frankly, the latter. Although I’d widen it from “our democracy” to simply “our politics.”

    Was reading a conversation on Twitter the other day between a couple of foreigners, where one of them said “I don’t think Americans realize how much Obama was already the U.S.’s second chance after Bush” while discussing Trump’s effect on foreign relations. And it’s true. 2003 Iraq War, 2008 Great Recession, 2016 Donald Trump. The rest of the world and especially our traditional allies and economic partners are increasingly coming to see the U.S. as Senile Professor Xavier from the “Logan” movie, causing massive death and destruction with every seizure, brain fart, or mood swing – and looking for the exits. The kind of comments we’ve seen out of the French, German, Canadian and other governments lately aren’t the kind of thing they’d say because of one kooky president. It’s because they’re seeing him as a symptom of, as you say, deeper dysfunction.

    It doesn’t mean it’s irreversible or unsolvable, but the world is taking notice, asking itself the same question as you, and increasingly fearing that the answer is the latter. And the more shit like this we pile on, the harder it’s going to be to dig ourselves out.

  132. 132.

    FlipYrWhig

    June 21, 2017 at 12:33 pm

    @rikyrah: Apparently the D was a guy who worked for Goldman Sachs, to boot.

  133. 133.

    JR in WV

    June 21, 2017 at 12:34 pm

    @Amaranthine RBG:

    After Clinton lost to the most unqualified person ever to ascend to the presidency, I had hoped there would be some serious soul searching by democrats

    Hasn’t happened. People are just doubling down on failure.

    Totally disagree. Democrats lost the election because of racism and sexism, plain old hate. I think the outcome is giving everyone plenty to think about. I don’t think the Democratic party needs to do anything but keep working hard.

    The death of Murdoch would help. I still look forward to the arrest of Jefferson Beauregard Sessions III by Robert Mueller III, which won’t hurt at all. I never thought about it before, but both of those guys being “the Third” is quite a coincidence, isn’t it?

  134. 134.

    Mnemosyne

    June 21, 2017 at 12:34 pm

    @FlipYrWhig:

    especially after the incidents of violence and threats from leftish sorts over the past few weeks.

    I’m still quite suspicious of the convenient appearance of the threatening letters and white powder targeting Handel right after her abysmal performance at the debate. ?

  135. 135.

    SatanicPanic

    June 21, 2017 at 12:35 pm

    @Kryptik: This is just shallow nonsense. I’ve been working with Indivisible and doing stuff here in my county and I’M supposed to get upset about a race thousands of miles away that I have no realistic way of influencing? We don’t even have any races here until next year so while it might suck that Paul Ryan would have one less vote, it’s not going to make or break what I’m doing. I’m sorry, this mopey sh*t is f*cking dumb. Anyone feeling bummed- get off the internet and go do some actual stuff. An Ossoff win wasn’t going to save anyone anyways.

  136. 136.

    satby

    June 21, 2017 at 12:36 pm

    @FlipYrWhig:

    Why, _why_, WHY is the ~40-year-old political left these days so fucking drenched in confirmation bias and general idiotism?

    They are the left version of Teabaggers, so we can’t expect them to be any less the idiots.

  137. 137.

    Mnemosyne

    June 21, 2017 at 12:37 pm

    @Baud:

    Have you checked between the couch cushions? I lose mine there sometimes.

  138. 138.

    SiubhanDuinne

    June 21, 2017 at 12:38 pm

    @SatanicPanic:

    someone who made a wrong turn and is not going the way she thought she was. Like a car with AZ license plates.

    O/T, but whatever happened to a formerly active and regular BJ commenter who went by the nym “ThatLeftTurnInABQ” or something like that? Is s/he still around but under a different handle?

  139. 139.

    O. Felix Culpa

    June 21, 2017 at 12:38 pm

    @Captain C:

    My half-Jewish genes are quite surprised at this.

    Hehe! So are mine.

  140. 140.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    June 21, 2017 at 12:40 pm

    @Teddys Person:

    The Georgia 6th (median household income: ‎$72,832) elected Karen “I do not support a livable wage” Handel, proving once again the Republican motto: Fuck You, I Got Mine.

    Did it? Sounds like the kind of place were the effective minimum wage is way above the Federal so living wage is a non-issue and distract is packed with white as the walls, smug middle management twat types. Yet even then Handel could only squeak by and need massive help from the national GOP to do it.

  141. 141.

    goblue72

    June 21, 2017 at 12:40 pm

    @Teddys Person: It worked for the Kingfish.

  142. 142.

    D58826

    June 21, 2017 at 12:40 pm

    @FlipYrWhig: A progressive agenda in SC would be to give the slaves a cup of gruel once a year rather than the daily 1/2 cup.

    And the always sane Dick Poleman on the democrats prediciment after yesrterday:

    Sorry, Dems. A loss is a loss. Moral victories mean squat. If Democrats are to have any chance of flipping 24 districts and recapturing the House, they need to turn districts like Georgia’s Sixth.

    http://www.newsworks.org/index.php/national-interest/item/104993-democrats-lose-again-trumpkins-laugh-their-ossoff

  143. 143.

    ? ?? Goku (aka Junior G-Man) ? ?

    June 21, 2017 at 12:41 pm

    @mai naem mobile: He’ll learn when he’s about to be thrown from a helicopter from 1500 ft up out at sea how stupid that is. Bit by then it’ll be too late

  144. 144.

    zhena gogolia

    June 21, 2017 at 12:42 pm

    @hovercraft:

    Thank you for bringing some perspective. And making me cry!

  145. 145.

    goblue72

    June 21, 2017 at 12:42 pm

    @germy: Bryce’s twitter handle is, if I recall, @ironmustache.

    His campaign ad is also really good. Shades of Ken Loach’s work for UK Labour.

  146. 146.

    rikyrah

    June 21, 2017 at 12:43 pm

    UH HUH
    UH HUH

    Trump seeks sharp cuts to housing aid, except for program that brings him millions

    By Shawn Boburg June 20 at 6:22 PM
    President Trump’s budget calls for sharply reducing funding for programs that shelter the poor and combat homelessness — with a notable exception: It leaves intact a type of federal housing subsidy that is paid directly to private landlords.

    One of those landlords is Trump himself, who earns millions of dollars each year as a part-owner of Starrett City, the nation’s largest subsidized housing complex. Trump’s 4 percent stake in the Brooklyn complex earned him at least $5 million between January of last year and April 15, according to his recent financial disclosure.

    Trump’s business empire intersects with government in countless ways, from taxation to permitting to the issuing of patents, but the housing subsidy is one of the clearest examples of the conflicts experts have predicted. While there is no indication that Trump himself was involved in the decision, it is nonetheless a stark illustration of how his financial interests can directly rise or fall on the policies of his administration.

    The federal government has paid the partnership that owns Starrett City more than $490 million in rent subsidies since May 2013, according to figures provided by a spokesman for the Department of Housing and Urban Development. Nearly $38 million of that has come since Trump took office in January.

    That subsidy generates steady income for Trump and his siblings, each of whom inherited an interest in the property when their father died. Although it represents a small portion of his overall wealth, it is one of the few examples of money the president derives directly from the federal government he oversees.

  147. 147.

    El Caganer

    June 21, 2017 at 12:43 pm

    @Butthurt Jordan Trombone (fka XTPD): So instead of running Democrats who have money and organization, it would be better to run independents who have neither. Hell of a plan.

  148. 148.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    June 21, 2017 at 12:43 pm

    @goblue72: Hiya Dwight! What costume are we wearing today? Principled left wing truth-teller? Hard-nosed pragmatic coalition builder? Domestic terrorist?

  149. 149.

    rikyrah

    June 21, 2017 at 12:44 pm

    “Evangelical” Jerry Falwell Jr. to head Trump education task force. America, say goodbye to Science. Reprehensible.https://t.co/nlVKG809q3
    — Ricky Davila (@TheRickyDavila) June 20, 2017

  150. 150.

    zhena gogolia

    June 21, 2017 at 12:44 pm

    @Brachiator:

    I thought he retired from acting some years ago, to become a shoemaker. Then he came back. I’m skeptical.

  151. 151.

    D58826

    June 21, 2017 at 12:44 pm

    @Baud: Well just make sure your 2020 campaign plane has very BIG wings

  152. 152.

    Mnemosyne

    June 21, 2017 at 12:45 pm

    @Kryptik:

    What I say to Cillizza is, “It’s only been 7 months since the election and +20 Republican House districts have turned into +4.”

    Yes, we do have to win, but it’s also only seven months after the last election.

  153. 153.

    Captain C

    June 21, 2017 at 12:45 pm

    @Brachiator: Who knew that Kenya was part of the RSFSR?!

  154. 154.

    goblue72

    June 21, 2017 at 12:45 pm

    Ossoff lost by a bigger margin to Handel than Clinton lost to Trump in that district. THAT is the comparable. Not some race that a no-name Dem with zero dollars ran against Price.

    I’ll start believing national Dems have a plan when Pelosi surrenders leadership. Though frankly its going to take a leadership challenge, since her stepping aside puts Hoyer “next in line, its HIS TURN” and Hoyer is just the worst kind of corporate 3rd way Dem.

  155. 155.

    SatanicPanic

    June 21, 2017 at 12:46 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne: huh, it’s been a while, right? I don’t know.

  156. 156.

    ? ?? Goku (aka Junior G-Man) ? ?

    June 21, 2017 at 12:46 pm

    @D58826: What Dick doesn’t seem to groak is that because it was so close in both SC and GA, that suggests that these supposedly safe GOP districts can be potentially flipped given the right circumstances. Imagine R+5 or less? Those can be flipped

  157. 157.

    Elie

    June 21, 2017 at 12:47 pm

    @Kryptik:

    Well, you can just quit. Seriously.

    We have hard work ahead. The context of your requirement for Democratic success would have required the Dems to win all the interim elections in overwhelming red districts. That was always going to be a long shot and despite the fact that many tried to warn against exaggerated expectations, many still fall into the trap and let the failure to achieve a highly unlikely outcome, to demoralize them. If it were that easy to achieve victories in overwhelming red districts, just by wishing it so and throwing money and expectations their way, there would be no need to have to rebuild what we have to.

    Look, a lot of Democratic congresspeople lost in 2010 because they did the right thing and supported the ACA. Redistricting in red states did further damage as a heavily funded Republican Party won governorships and many state legislative races. They didn’t need to win huge numbers. Many State legislatures are closely divided. A lost race here and there can swing the direction of policy because, as we have already seen, the Republicans take no prisoners and do not fundamentally believe in collaboration or compromise, so winner takes all in their heads means they make every effort to take over the means of staying in power. Were Democrats slow to pick up on what was happening? Yes. We get it now but the road back will involve a lot of work. But its important for you to realize this: the Democrats are woke. For real. And we are ready to put our shoulders into this and are already doing so. That was real work from doorbelling and calling to get Ossof within 4 down in GA-6. You can disparage the results, but that was butt kicking work to bring that result that close. If you have never done anything but sit on the sidelines and whine about results, maybe you should do a little more work. Or not. If all you are going to do is shrivel in the face of big bad framing by the likes of Cillizza, maybe you should stay home on the couch looking at the teevee.

  158. 158.

    ? ?? Goku (aka Junior G-Man) ? ?

    June 21, 2017 at 12:48 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Hopefully the latter, so we won’t have see his blatherings any longer

  159. 159.

    SatanicPanic

    June 21, 2017 at 12:48 pm

    @goblue72: Shorter GoBlue: How ya like these apples and oranges?

  160. 160.

    goblue72

    June 21, 2017 at 12:48 pm

    @rikyrah: This was fully expected. Practitioners expected HUD cuts to avoid PBRA contracts. Too many for-profit (Republican donors) who are owners of HUD-financed Section 8 properties. Cuts were always going to come first at public housing, Section 8 mobile vouchers and HUD capital programs (HOME, CDBG, etc.)

  161. 161.

    schrodingers_cat

    June 21, 2017 at 12:49 pm

    @zhena gogolia: DDL doth protest too much. I too remember the shoe making episode.

  162. 162.

    ? ?? Goku (aka Junior G-Man) ? ?

    June 21, 2017 at 12:49 pm

    @goblue72: And let you take up the gavel after you summarily execute all the corporate whore dems?

  163. 163.

    Captain C

    June 21, 2017 at 12:49 pm

    @FlipYrWhig: That might take hard work and organizing, rather than just shouting at others.

  164. 164.

    Mnemosyne

    June 21, 2017 at 12:49 pm

    @goblue72:

    The Kingfish was assassinated by a political opponent’s son-in-law.

  165. 165.

    Millard Filmore

    June 21, 2017 at 12:50 pm

    @Baud:

    As president, my first executive order will be to formally declare the glass half-full.

    But the glass is clearly half empty!

  166. 166.

    Peale

    June 21, 2017 at 12:50 pm

    @D58826: LOL. What the Democrats need to do to flip a district like GA-06 is show up at levels GREATER than they do for Presidential elections in mid-terms. Something they most assuredly have not done since 1990. That’s GA-06. For a bunch of other districts, they need to show up at about 2/3rds the level that they do for presidential elections. They do that, and they win a lot of governorships back. And a lot of congressional seats flip. Had these same numbers of Democrats in GA-6 come out in 2014, they still would have lost GA-6, but Nathan Deal’s margin of victory would have been cut by 1/3, and that is just from 1 district. Repeat that in two more places and you have a very different GA.

  167. 167.

    FlipYrWhig

    June 21, 2017 at 12:51 pm

    @goblue72: Does Parnell coming closer than anyone mean that Democrats should be finding and running quirky Goldman Sachs veterans to take back red districts in the era of Trump? If not, why not?

  168. 168.

    Mnemosyne

    June 21, 2017 at 12:52 pm

    @goblue72:

    So, just to be clear, you find it totally plausible that large numbers of Price voters split the ticket to vote for Hillary rather than withholding their presidential vote?

  169. 169.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    June 21, 2017 at 12:53 pm

    @FlipYrWhig: was he quirky?

  170. 170.

    hovercraft

    June 21, 2017 at 12:54 pm

    @Elie:
    Good for you, we need people to run for every local office in every city, town and county of the country. What people don’t realize is that the Koch’s started this effort to take over our country more than a decade ago, when Rove was talking about a permanent republican majority, he was speaking of the project to rig the system at every level, against the demographic shifts, he also wanted immigration reform as a hedge and to cement this majority, but they underestimated the nativist streak in their base. Fortunately Obama’s election, a very proud moment for me too, was a galvanizing event for the nativists, it showed that the long predicted “loss” of “their” country was here, not some date in the future, and so it was up to them to take it back now, before it’s too late. This is one thing that we must remember as we mount this fight, no matter how bad or corrupt, incompetent Twitler and his cohorts are, they are fighting to take the country back from us, so at the end of the day republicans will go home and vote for people they believe will hold the hoards of others trying to steal their country from them.
    Best of luck recruiting candidates, we must make them fight for every single seat at every level, even with their billions, they can’t defend every seat.

  171. 171.

    nominus

    June 21, 2017 at 12:55 pm

    @FlipYrWhig: funny that you mention theology; the picture I have had in my head was Linus waiting for the Great Pumpkin. Aaaaaaaany minute now the Great Progressitariat will rise.

  172. 172.

    ? ?? Goku (aka Junior G-Man) ? ?

    June 21, 2017 at 12:55 pm

    @FlipYrWhig: No, it means a quirky capertbagger socialist from the Northeast coming down to run in SC would have totally beaten the Republican in a safe Republican district. You betcha!

  173. 173.

    FlipYrWhig

    June 21, 2017 at 12:55 pm

    @Mnemosyne: I guess it proves that the people of GA-6 liked Hillary Clinton in particular rather than being willing to vote for just any Democrat. ;)

  174. 174.

    FlipYrWhig

    June 21, 2017 at 12:57 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Roll Call’s article on the election said he embraced his nerdiness. Also, he had a beard.

  175. 175.

    Another Scott

    June 21, 2017 at 12:58 pm

    One for ArchTeryx (sp?): TheHill:

    Senate Minority Leader Charles Schumer (D-N.Y.) is appearing bullish about Democrats’ chances to peel off enough GOP votes to block legislation aimed at repealing and replacing ObamaCare.

    Schumer said Wednesday that if Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) pushes to advance legislation before the July 4 holiday recess, Democrats will move to block it.

    “The only way you can get on [with] a bill is called the motion to proceed. … Our whole focus if McConnell will bring this up right before July Fourth is to get three votes against the motion to proceed, and we think we have a damn good chance,” Schumer told “Pod Save America,” a podcast run by former Obama administration staffers.

    Schumer added that it was the “number one goal” of the Democratic caucus to try blocking the legislation — which is yet be finalized — on an initial procedural hurdle.

    If Democrats aren’t able to win over three Republicans, Schumer said that “everything is on the table.”

    “This is full-scale warfare. … We’re not going to be complacent or going along or business as usual,” he said.

    […]

    Good, good.

    Keep calling.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  176. 176.

    Major Major Major Major

    June 21, 2017 at 12:59 pm

    Who put up the troll signal?

  177. 177.

    Mnemosyne

    June 21, 2017 at 12:59 pm

    @FlipYrWhig:

    Another Scott found the links to download the final vote totals in 2016 in Georgia. If I have time this weekend, I’m going to open them in Excel and see if I spot any patterns.

    My suspicion is that a lot of voters left the presidential line blank but voted for Price, which would artificially inflate Hillary’s numbers, but I’ll have to actually look at the numbers to find out.

  178. 178.

    catclub

    June 21, 2017 at 12:59 pm

    @pat:

    Thanks for any response….

    No.

    Mechanical watch, maybe.

  179. 179.

    Tenar Arha

    June 21, 2017 at 1:00 pm

    @FlipYrWhig: I can’t…Oh boy. ~*headdesk*~

    The older I get the more I think that there’s something about never having to really question or explain your place in the world prevents people from understanding that what may be obvious to you is not obvious to others. So, if you’re not Christian, and not white, and not male, and not heterosexual, and not cis, you’re going to see the world as it is much more clearly, because you can see both where it’s flawed and where it works.

  180. 180.

    Mnemosyne

    June 21, 2017 at 1:00 pm

    @Major Major Major Major:

    Their paymasters sent them here to gloat and try to depress us.

  181. 181.

    rikyrah

    June 21, 2017 at 1:02 pm

    @hovercraft:

    Thank you for your testimony. I hear you.

  182. 182.

    rikyrah

    June 21, 2017 at 1:04 pm

    1. This don’t make no phucking sense.
    2. Nobody can tell me that The Spooks actually trust this clown and view him as their leader.

    ……………………………………..

    THE RACHEL MADDOW SHOW 6/21/17
    Pompeo still briefed Flynn on secrets as CIA knew concerns: NYT
    Jeremy Bash, former CIA chief of staff, talks with Rachel Maddow about a new New York Times report that while the CIA knew about the concerns about Mike Flynn, CIA Director Mike Pompeo continued to deliver briefings on U.S. secrets with Flynn present.

  183. 183.

    Chris

    June 21, 2017 at 1:04 pm

    @mai naem mobile:

    One thing I definitely learned living in Miami for a few years is that ideas very similar to those of Fox News, or even to the right of that, do quite well for themselves in the Latino community (not just Cuban). Not as well as they do among white Anglos, obviously, and not so well that most Latinos don’t still vote Democrat – after all, in the Fox News context they’re the ones in the crosshairs. But still there.

    This isn’t any deep insight, obviously. As others have already said, bigotry is universal. It did remind me of the multiple warnings I’ve heard over the years that “no, Latinos won’t turn the country ‘majority-minority’ – the definition of ‘white’ will simply change and many Latinos will simply end up assimilating into the majority, the same way the Irish and South and East European immigrants did a few generations ago.” At times, I felt like I was getting a preview of that.

  184. 184.

    Elie

    June 21, 2017 at 1:04 pm

    @Peale:

    Show me your work. Where is the evidence that the Democrats did not turn out in GA-6? If there are fewer Democrats living and/or registered in GA 6 than Republicans, which I think is the case, not only would they have to turn out but the Repub vote would have to be less. This was a strong turnout election, so its likely that the very tight result (3.8% difference in final complete count result from 538!) was pretty amazing performance for Ossoff and the Democrats.

  185. 185.

    rikyrah

    June 21, 2017 at 1:05 pm

    THE RACHEL MADDOW SHOW 6/21/17
    Georgia Democrats see path to close gap against Republicans
    State Rep. Stacey Abrams, Georgia minority leader, talks with Rachel Maddow about the encouragement Democrats see in the outcome of the Georgia special election.

  186. 186.

    hovercraft

    June 21, 2017 at 1:05 pm

    @Brachiator: @mai naem mobile:

    Anyhow, he moved onto OBama making it look like the Russians hacked the election and Obamas dad was a Russian.

    Apparently, a Black Russian.

    I don’t know what else could be said about this guy’s baroque conspiracy theory.

    I find it amazing how one person could be fathered by so many people.
    James Baldwin
    Lolo Soetoro
    Some unnamed Pakistani man
    Now a Russian, all be it a black russian
    and of coarse an Anti-Colonial Militant Mau Mau Kenyan man named Barrack Obama
    I’m so confused.

  187. 187.

    schrodingers_cat

    June 21, 2017 at 1:06 pm

    @Mnemosyne: Its not that easy to find the raw numbers, breakdown for the Presidential numbers is usually by county not by the Congressional district.
    ETA: If you put up the links, I can go through the numbers. Thanks.

  188. 188.

    Major Major Major Major

    June 21, 2017 at 1:06 pm

    @Mnemosyne: I’ll take your word for it, they’re pied and I can’t see the thread.

  189. 189.

    hovercraft

    June 21, 2017 at 1:08 pm

    @Jeffro:
    So I would definetely vote for you in the primary, but I’m sorry I’d have to vote for

    BAUD 2020 !

    in the general.

  190. 190.

    rikyrah

    June 21, 2017 at 1:08 pm

    THE RACHEL MADDOW SHOW 6/21/17

    Mueller team paints picture of Trump Russia investigation
    Rachel Maddow reviews the people known so far to have been hired by Special Counsel Robert Mueller to work with him on the Trump Russia investigation, and notes what their various qualifications say about the focus of the investigation.

  191. 191.

    jl

    June 21, 2017 at 1:12 pm

    Since open thread, but we need some encouraging news, interesting link I found via Josh Marshall’s twitter.

    Signs that Europe can rely on far better leadership (Macron and Merkel) who will work together to produce very needed and useful reforms that will help solve problems of the Eurozone. Looks like international cooperation will be put on the table. Badly needed international countercyclical fiscal transfers (an important missing stabilizer in current Eurozone) are now on the table. The authors seem to have conventional neoliberal prejudices that drive them to misunderstand Macron’s ideas. The link to Macron’s policy platform is in French, (and my French is even more rusty than German). But from what I can tell, he wants to introduce Nordic labor model to France. That is, weaken labor market regulations, but provide much stronger social safety net for workers laid off. This is an area where the devil is in the details. But as far as I can tell, Macron wants to go Denmark/Sweden wrt to labor market, not a standard neoliberal program to just attack worker bargaining power and wait for Nirvana to develop.

    So, more evidence that the US and UK may find Europe going its own way, and with luck, growing stronger not weaker without influence of toxic US-UK influence.
    Would be far better and safer if US UK and Europe could work tegether, of course. But still, this seems like good news. Best we can hope for, for now.

    Edit: bottom line, from what I can tell, in context of Great Recession in Eurozone, and EU, Macron’s policies have quite a progressive tinge. Though probably not in context of Bernie and Corbyn worlds.

    Forget About Brexit, Focus on the Euro Area Future
    Jacob Funk Kirkegaard (PIIE) and Adam S. Posen (PIIE)
    https://piie.com/blogs/realtime-economic-issues-watch/forget-about-brexit-focus-euro-area-future

  192. 192.

    schrodingers_cat

    June 21, 2017 at 1:12 pm

    There is an almost one to one correspondence between the leftier than thou and the burn everything down or curl up die, give-up already contingent

  193. 193.

    narya

    June 21, 2017 at 1:14 pm

    @Brachiator: I once did a rent-it double feature of “My Beautiful Launderette” and “A Room with a View.” Amazing.

  194. 194.

    Peale

    June 21, 2017 at 1:14 pm

    @goblue72: LOL. Those 125K voters who voted for Price’s underfunded no name opponent in 2016. Well, those would be known as the Democratic Base. Since they show up and voted for a Democrat with no name and no money. All of them appeared to have showed up last night. In that district, at least, an off cycle electorate includes the entire base of democratic voters for a change. I wish they would have showed up a month or so back during the primary. But hey. Take it as you will. There are 125K voters in that district who vote for Democratic congressmen when they show up to the polls. You’ll have to figure out where those additional 10,000 are going to come from.

  195. 195.

    schrodingers_cat

    June 21, 2017 at 1:14 pm

    @jl: What about the German deficit hawk tendencies wrt Greece and Portugal?

  196. 196.

    Kay

    June 21, 2017 at 1:15 pm

    I’m just sick of being the “damage mitigator”. I don’t feel like working so GOP voters can have slightly less reprehensible health care.

    They want these policies. They’re demanding them. Give the people what they want. They can look at the bright side! They can sneer at liberals when the state is garnishing their wages to pay the emergency room. I insist they pay, too. Not my job. 25 dollars a week for a term of “eternity” sounds reasonable and that will just cover interest.

    Sneer away you fucking morons. I’ll be okay. I could get used to not contributing to their astronomical health care costs. This “collective good” and “share the burden” thing was just an idea. I could change my mind.

  197. 197.

    D58826

    June 21, 2017 at 1:16 pm

    In the meantime there are somethings that, I’m afraid, will survive the asteroid strike. I saw this on Twitter last night and the link has rolled off but it seems the State Dept. has launched an investigation into Hillary’s e-mails and whither she and her aides should lose their security clearances.

    Now this is the state department that lacks top deputies and ambassadors and faces a 30% budget reduction. This is the same Sate Dept. that is faced with violence in Iraq, Yemen, Somalia. and Afghanistan. There is a good chance that the situation in Syria will escalate into a direct confrontation with Russia. The Kurds may well declare nationhood in the fall which will aggravate Turkey, Iraq, Syria and Iran. The Saudi’s are trying to isolate Qatar, home of as major US airbase. Iran is throwing missiles into Syria among other things. The Saudi government is undergoing a major shift with the change in the line of succession. In the past week Trump has offended the Romanians by denying, in his presence, that he had discussed visa issues with their p[resident and refused to condemn Russian meddling in the region. He offended the Panamanian president with his talk of the great canal that we built. And leaving no ally unoffended he referred to ‘THE Ukraine’ rather than just ‘Ukraine’. He did of course manage to ignore the deaths of 7 American Navy men and did not say anything bad about Putin.

    But Hillary’s e-mails……. Grassley is conducting a parallel investigation. I wonder if he will look into Der Fuhrer’s running his mouth when talking to the Russians.

  198. 198.

    jl

    June 21, 2017 at 1:18 pm

    @schrodingers_cat: The link claims Merkel is trying to persuade ‘orthoKeynsian’ German establishment that Macron’s reforms have to be on the table and take seriously. It’s a start.

    Edit: actaully, a little stronger, says that Merkel says EU and Eurozone need policy reforms that will prevent repeat of Great Recession macro problems that occurred in the member countries. Germany has been just saying ‘no’ to stuff, needs to starting considering things it can say ‘yes’ to.

    Edit2: some fiscal transfer mechanism is the crucial fix. Merkel is willing to discuss. That is real progress.

  199. 199.

    MJS

    June 21, 2017 at 1:18 pm

    @FlipYrWhig: “Next logical step.” That’s the flaw in your argument, right there. Also, why run as a Republican, when you can run as a third party, and have a hand in electing Republicans?

  200. 200.

    tybee

    June 21, 2017 at 1:18 pm

    @Jeffro: where do i send my donation?

  201. 201.

    Gravenstone

    June 21, 2017 at 1:21 pm

    @Baud: Well, reporting their inclination has the benefit of keeping the primary from devolving into yet another Clinton/Sanders proxy battle, since both candidates supported the latter.

  202. 202.

    Major Major Major Major

    June 21, 2017 at 1:21 pm

    @Kay: This kind of thinking is how they win. Not necessarily how they win every election, but how they win the whole thing. Once you throw out the idea of the common good just because you hate some of the recipients you’ve become them.

  203. 203.

    nominus

    June 21, 2017 at 1:23 pm

    @MJS: there is a point to that, they get to elect Republicans while maintaining their moral purity

  204. 204.

    hedgehog mobile

    June 21, 2017 at 1:24 pm

    @hovercraft: Thank you.

  205. 205.

    rikyrah

    June 21, 2017 at 1:24 pm

    @Brachiator:

    I have a soft spot for Age of Innocence- love the movie. Absolutely love it.

    I’ve found that people either love the movie or hate it. I love it.

  206. 206.

    D58826

    June 21, 2017 at 1:24 pm

    @Kay: Yep. as the book that they SO love to selective quote says – you reap what you so and the fruit of a rotten tree will bear rotten fruit. Or something like that since I tend to read other books. For some strange reason Mat. 25 and the ‘that which you do tothe least of my brothers you do to me’ seems to have been left out of their versions of the Bible

  207. 207.

    hovercraft

    June 21, 2017 at 1:26 pm

    @D58826:

    State Dept. has launched an investigation into Hillary’s e-mails and whither she and her aides should lose their security clearances. …………..
    Grassley is conducting a parallel investigation. I wonder if he will look into Der Fuhrer’s running his mouth when talkin to the Russians.

    They need accomplishments to run on next year and in 2020. If they can show that they had the security clearances of a bunch of people who no longer work for the government, they’ll be able to show how productive they’ve been for the American people. Yay!
    As to your question, NO! How many times do I have to tell you people to just move along, there’s nothing to see here. Al this stuff with Mueller and RICO investigations is nothing it’s barely a scratch, it can’t touch Twitler or his enablers.

  208. 208.

    rikyrah

    June 21, 2017 at 1:27 pm

    @Brachiator:

    If he is indeed done with acting, what a wonderful body of work to have blessed us with.

    He IS a real talent.

  209. 209.

    schrodingers_cat

    June 21, 2017 at 1:27 pm

    @rikyrah: Its one of my favorite DDL movies, as is A Room With a View.

  210. 210.

    Aleta

    June 21, 2017 at 1:28 pm

    Liberals shouldn’t be manipulated by the media’s self-interest, their pump up the-horserace followed by hype-the-disaster coverage. They fuck with our emotions for profit. Damage rational thinking and democracy for profit. The same outlets that said Ossoff was an outside chance now say it’s a crushing defeat, including what was spent. But the huge spending was due to stakes so high it was worth the risk despite poor odds. What if every defeat in WWII had been covered like this.

  211. 211.

    Jeffro

    June 21, 2017 at 1:28 pm

    @hovercraft: that’s totally understandable…in the general, I plan on voting for Baud!2020 myself =)

    @tybee: hold up – I’m going to drop a couple pounds this summer, so that I look better in the press releases. Note that I said “better”, not “good”. Also no need to rush, as we all know not to roll out ‘new products’ in August. I’ll keep everyone posted and look for a post-Labor Day rollout.

    Watch your back, Trumpov, I’m coming for you..FROM INSIDE THE HOUSE!!!

  212. 212.

    rikyrah

    June 21, 2017 at 1:28 pm

    @Major Major Major Major:

    Bouie looks at new electoral analyses and finds that Obama-to-Trump voters are white racists who want white socialism

    Yep. absolutely no problem with White Socialism.

  213. 213.

    JR in WV

    June 21, 2017 at 1:29 pm

    @pat:

    No, I don’t think so. The sort of magnet that will hold your bag shut probably isn’t strong enough to mess up your memory. But you can try it out without any harm, take some unimportant pix and then run the magnet all over your hardware and see wha’ happens.

  214. 214.

    rikyrah

    June 21, 2017 at 1:31 pm

    @Kay:

    They want these policies. They’re demanding them. Give the people what they want. They can look at the bright side! They can sneer at liberals when the state is garnishing their wages to pay the emergency room. I insist they pay, too. Not my job. 25 dollars a week for a term of “eternity” sounds reasonable and that will just cover interest.

    Sneer away you fucking morons. I’ll be okay. I could get used to not contributing to their astronomical health care costs. This “collective good” and “share the burden” thing was just an idea. I could change my mind.

    Keep telling the truth, Kay.

  215. 215.

    pat

    June 21, 2017 at 1:31 pm

    @catclub:
    Thanks. I was worried about erasing the disk or something. Shows what I know about these things. ;-)

  216. 216.

    Peale

    June 21, 2017 at 1:32 pm

    @Elie: It was. I’m not saying last night was a bad turn out. It was a stupendous turn out. But yeah, in 2014 it was a dismal turn out. I read somewhere that this district was realigned in 2010, so those results probably deserve an asterisk.

    2006: 55,294 votes for Democrat Congressman
    2008: 106,551 votes for Democrat Congressman
    2010: N/A (no candidate)
    2012: 104,365 votes for Democrat Congressman
    2014: 71,486 votes for Democrat Congressman
    2016: 124,917 votes for Democrat Congressman
    2017: 124,893 votes for Democrat Congressman (so far)

    It doesn’t really help when there’s no Democrat running, but it looks like voter turnout for the Democrats was as good as could be expected for an off cycle election. There was no mid-term drop off. There was a huge drop off for Handel, though. Were this to happen in 2018, Republicans show up at mid term levels, while Democrats show up at Presidential levels, the house indeed would flip. GA 6 wouldn’t. She got fewer votes than Price did in 2014, but we still lost. But in a lot of districts and states, were that to happen again, the GOP would be sitting in a lot fewer governors seats and we probably wouldn’t lose any of those 22 Senate seats we’re defending.

  217. 217.

    jl

    June 21, 2017 at 1:32 pm

    I think all the fighting over Ossoff-ism versus Parnell-ism is silly. What makes people think that Parnell’s approach would work well in GA-6, which has a much different demo and economic mix than SC? Similarly, why would Ossoff’s approach do well where Parnell ran?

    From what I know, the SC race was a much poorer district than GA, and Bernie approach probably would have worked better there. But how many people would be interested in the GA district.

    If the Dems try to recruit good candidates for a lot of races, those candidates will know better what approach works than big shots like Schumer or Bernie, or all-knowing commenters on miserable lefty blogs. And local candidates will tend to reflect local outlooks anyway.

  218. 218.

    Brachiator

    June 21, 2017 at 1:33 pm

    @D58826:

    In the meantime there are somethings that, I’m afraid, will survive the asteroid strike. I saw this on Twitter last night and the link has rolled off but it seems the State Dept. has launched an investigation into Hillary’s e-mails and whither she and her aides should lose their security clearances.

    I saw this, and wondered at first, “who cares, she is no longer Secretary of State anyway.” Then I ran across this online

    We checked in with D.C.-based national security attorney Bradley Moss about why she may still have the security clearance. Moss told LawNewz.com that it is typical for former senior officials to remain sponsored for security clearances in case they have to be called to advise on matter involving classified information.

    I don’t know whether this is absolutely accurate (maybe Adam can weigh in on it), but if it is true, it would mean that if the Trump Administration pulled Clinton’s clearance, it would be another mean-spirited and misguided gesture at erasing the Obama Administration from history. At this point, I would certainly trust Clinton more to handle some sensitive foreign policy matter than, say, Jared Kushner or anyone else in the Trump administration.

  219. 219.

    Nelle

    June 21, 2017 at 1:34 pm

    I wrote this for another site a week ago:
    I’m not a cock-eyed optimist but I call my senators’ offices once a day. I now know where the interns go to university (and what their names are), who was born where in Kansas, which staffer has been ill for a while and when she came back. One day, I call the DC offices, the next day local offices, the next day DC offices. I do not believe it will make one whit of difference in the current situation.

    But I do it because I’m a drip of water and the Grand Canyon was formed that way. I do it because of all those women of color, year after year, teaching their children dignity and grace of worthiness, in spite of the brutal message that they were not worthy. I do it because MLK Jr, said “I may not get there with you” but he still did it anyway.

    My neighbors (Omaha tribe) look sadly bemused and say, in effect, oh, now you are going to live like we’ve lived for the past century and a half. They know it is a long, long road. This did not happen this year or this decade or even since Reagan. This is baked into the country’s DNA and it began with genocide and slavery.

    So I call, daily. Sometimes briefly, sometimes in long conversations. I find ways to make my neighborhood a welcoming place, to break down strangeness. My Trump supporting neighbor mows my lawn (without charge) and I help his daughter with her reading problems. I look for ways to make a difference in the lives of individuals – I’ll be mentoring a girl who is aging out of foster care as she moves to town and begins university. I’m not saying this to toot my horn. I’m saying this to encourage people to do several things at once, rooted in kindness and a desire for justice. And to take a very long view.

  220. 220.

    Betty Cracker

    June 21, 2017 at 1:35 pm

    @goblue72: How unsurprising. Every bro on Twitter is going after Pelosi. Oh well. At least they’ve moved on from Hillary Clinton.

  221. 221.

    D58826

    June 21, 2017 at 1:36 pm

    @hovercraft: Some of the Obama Homeland security folks are laying out what the Obama admin. found last year with regard to the Russian hack in a House Intl. committee hearing today. But it’s all fake news.

    I did see a tweet in the past day or so That Critter Nunes admitted the obvious – he did not really recuse himself.

    But for the GOP recusal has no real meaning. Ranks right up up the used car salesman promising that the car was only driven on Sunday by grandma and never faster the 25mph.

  222. 222.

    Betty Cracker

    June 21, 2017 at 1:37 pm

    @Nelle: Wise words.

  223. 223.

    James Powell

    June 21, 2017 at 1:38 pm

    @FlipYrWhig:

    Apparently the D was a guy who worked for Goldman Sachs

    So, that explains why he lost!!!

  224. 224.

    jl

    June 21, 2017 at 1:39 pm

    @Nelle: Thanks for that comment. Very encouraging.

  225. 225.

    Elie

    June 21, 2017 at 1:41 pm

    @hovercraft:

    You are absolutely right about the big money take over and the impact of that. We WILL have to fight just like you said…. and stop the endless whining…

    This is the continuation of the civil rights movement. We might be somewhat past the dogs and firehoses, but not psychologically and we have to adopt the same mental toughness that everyone in the movement had then. We will have losses and disappointments but we must always hold ourselves to the standards of equal opportunity and justice for all. No more just trying to run things from voting in national elections every x year. We had better get involved and stay involved in grass roots power building again. We must never forget this lesson and never ever give up. As grim as things can be, I always look with admiration on the people in Russia who openly oppose Putin’s regime. Their fearlessness is inspiring. We are no where near that risk for the most part — at least not yet. We have to stand up with pride and use that fearlessness here.

  226. 226.

    Brachiator

    June 21, 2017 at 1:43 pm

    @rikyrah:

    I have a soft spot for Age of Innocence- love the movie. Absolutely love it.

    When I went to see it, I had to sit in a center seat in a center aisle so that I could take in all the visuals. I loved how Martin Scorsese gave a sense that the social in-fighting of the New York upper class was just as vicious, if far less bloody, than the plots of Mafia families.

  227. 227.

    Barbara

    June 21, 2017 at 1:44 pm

    The reporting on Ossoff is predictably stupid, a veritable Rashomon of “insight” reflecting solely the individual’s preexisting viewpoint. The pundit class whining that the Dems had no substance (I guess if you have health care benefits you don’t see preserving ACA as substance) and the Wilmerites whining that Ossoff should have been more radical. I go back to what was said in the original post: the Dems won all kinds of special elections in 2009 and even 2010 and it didn’t make a bit of difference. The needle moves only a little, and the more atomized the geographic voting region, the smaller that movement is.

    Why do people like Matt Yglesias (one of the “Dems need substance! people) assume that they have sufficient depth and breadth of knowledge about everything political? Whatever it is, I wish I had been born into a class where no matter what I say, however wrong, it never matters. People will continue to listen to me.

  228. 228.

    SatanicPanic

    June 21, 2017 at 1:46 pm

    @Nelle: you, Hovercraft, Elie and some of the other posters here are an inspiration.

  229. 229.

    Belafon

    June 21, 2017 at 1:46 pm

    @Mike in DC:

    Our base is fairly activated, but so far the Republican base is too. We can hope they become more disaffected as time goes on, but running good candidates and registering voters is the best strategy overall.

    The vote for Handel was down 33% for the Republican candidate versus the 2016 election for the position. The vote for Ossoff was up 2% over the 2016 Democrat.

  230. 230.

    hovercraft

    June 21, 2017 at 1:48 pm

    @D58826:

    I did see a tweet in the past day or so That Critter Nunes admitted the obvious – he did not really recuse himself.

    Not only did he not recuse himself, he said that he and only he as the Chairman of the committee holds subpoena power. But Loretta Lynch spent 20 minutes on a plane with Bill so she must completely recuse herself, and is about to become the target of yet another investigation. At some point the staffs need to tell these morons that these people they keep calling to testify in front of them are making them look like the fools they are, because they are not only smarter than them, they know what the fuck they are talking about. Not just the mental wanderings of some FOX News producers idea of a gotcha question.

  231. 231.

    Keith G

    June 21, 2017 at 1:48 pm

    @Aimai: If I were to believe in the entirety of your statement, what would there be for me to do? Tribal affiliations have become more important now than in the recent past, but there are still “gettable” votes out there at the tribal margins. There are a number of voters who start with their class or demographic affiliation tightly held, but are open to persuasion. Some of that type became Obama voters in 2008.

  232. 232.

    Aleta

    June 21, 2017 at 1:50 pm

    @D58826: T’s misadministration will revive certain themes in press briefings or leaks whenever they are afraid of losing parts of their base. Christianity, mean policing and borders, and ‘T keeps his promises’ (to investigate HRC). I see that as a sign, not necessarily of any effort they intend to make, that they are losing support.

    Fwiw (because it’s in the W Examiner)

    The things that frustrate one piece of Trump’s coalition often endear him to or embolden another wing of the coalition. If he hovers around 40 percent over the months, it’s not that he’s holding his whole base steady — it’s because he’s losing a few supporters with each move but gaining a few more. There’s little he could do to please his whole base but also little he could do to anger his whole base.

  233. 233.

    Barbara

    June 21, 2017 at 1:51 pm

    @FlipYrWhig:

    Why, _why_, WHY is the ~40-year-old political left these days so fucking drenched in confirmation bias and general idiotism?

    Two reasons:

    1. We want everyone to want what we want and see what we see.
    2. Reality — that not everybody wants what we want and diversity means that unity requires compromise — is hard. In contrast, embracing the unprovable counterfactual is easy. Although, I must say, even in Virginia (at least 50 years ahead of SC in receptivity to liberal messaging) did not embrace the populist message of Perriello.

  234. 234.

    pat

    June 21, 2017 at 1:51 pm

    @JR in WV:
    Maybe I’ll try that, just to be sure. And everything runs on a computer these days. I have a very vague recollection of being warned not to put refrigerator magnets near the computer.

  235. 235.

    jl

    June 21, 2017 at 1:51 pm

    @Barbara: As I mentioned above, I think it’s a mistake to think you can take what Parnell did in SC and transfer it to GA, or vice versa.

    Two aspects of the media coverage of the GA election piss me off. One is all the reports I heard talk about bellweathers and momentum for GOP in 2018. But even worse, uninformed reporting about the finance. Every damned report babbles about out of state funding for Dems, and how gosh golly, money just didn’t help them, and implicitly blames the Dems for high campaign spending. So, apparently small contributors from CA and WA are somehow bad, but massive Super PAC GOP money from out of state isn’t even mentioned? Or fact that GOP massively outspent Dems in race? Do the reporters just read off GOP talking points that are handed to them, or what? Infuriating.

  236. 236.

    goblue72

    June 21, 2017 at 1:51 pm

    @Betty Cracker: Pelosi and Hoyer. In fact I was more critical of Hoyer, who is just a douche, and I suspect one reason Pelosi hasn’t just stepped aside, since she clearly doesnt want him as minority leader or potential Speaker. (Totally agree with her on that.) But, you know, ignore all that and make an excuse for yourself by pretending every criticism of a women is automatically sexism. That’s gonna take so far. I’d also include Clyburn too. Guess that’s racist as well.

    The Democratic leadership in the House are all AARP eligible. That is just embarrassing. The only member of House leadership on Team D that was not a senior citizen was Xavier Becerra. And he took one look around, said heck with this noise, and decided to become CA State AG – can only assume he’s thinking of getting statewide exposure on chance Feinstein ever decides to get out of the way.

  237. 237.

    Timurid

    June 21, 2017 at 1:55 pm

    @Frankensteinbeck:

    Remember the old NWA lyric about “showing out for the white cop?”
    Minority groups competing for approval and status by shaming each other has always been a thing.
    And lets not even get started on the Complexion Wars…

  238. 238.

    Barbara

    June 21, 2017 at 1:55 pm

    @jl: Thank you for this. When I talked to my “investment professional” early in the year about Trump killing the goose that lays the golden egg, he said that the U.S. is still the least worst place to invest, but that people he talks with increasingly believe that there is so much pent up, unfulfilled demand in Europe that any positive political and economic movement could make the Eurozone take off quickly.

  239. 239.

    But her emals!!!

    June 21, 2017 at 1:56 pm

    @goblue72:

    I’ve yet to see any reasonable justification for removing Pelosi as minority leader in the House.

  240. 240.

    SiubhanDuinne

    June 21, 2017 at 1:56 pm

    @Brachiator:

    if it is true, it would mean that if the Trump Administration pulled Clinton’s clearance, it would be another mean-spirited and misguided gesture at erasing the Obama Administration from history.

    Are they also pulling Kerry’s clearance? If not, well, it’s still mean-spirited and misguided, but it is aimed solely at Clinton, not the Obama Administration per se.

  241. 241.

    goblue72

    June 21, 2017 at 1:57 pm

    @Keith G: You mean promising to be on voters side & promising to give voters stuff and then keeping those promises? Who woulda thunk?

    The biggest benefit towards reduction of the uninsured rate for Obamacare was the Medicaid expansion. Which wasn’t actually all that complicated. Most of oxygen was spend on designing and (and wonks obsessing over) the Rube Goldberg device of the Exchanges.

    The least popular part of Obamacare? The Exchange. The part that is providing the big benefits that is causing the shitstorm of resistance to repealing Obamacare? Medicaid expansion.

    Biggest problem with the Medicaid expansion? Not increasing the income eligibility cutoff even further. Hoocoodanode non-means tested public benefits could be popular?

  242. 242.

    goblue72

    June 21, 2017 at 1:58 pm

    @But her emals!!!: Besides continually losing House seats to Neanderthals?

  243. 243.

    SiubhanDuinne

    June 21, 2017 at 2:00 pm

    @Nelle:

    That is beautiful, both the comment and the attitude/actions it describes. Thank you for the inspiration.

  244. 244.

    But her emals!!!

    June 21, 2017 at 2:00 pm

    @goblue72:

    I rest my case.

  245. 245.

    Betty Cracker

    June 21, 2017 at 2:01 pm

    @goblue72: You didn’t offer any rationale for calling for Pelosi’s ouster. Neither did the bro chorus on Twitter. I agree about Hoyer, but that’s immaterial. If you don’t want folks to assume the worst of you, show your work.

  246. 246.

    Elie

    June 21, 2017 at 2:02 pm

    @goblue72:

    A replacement for Pelosi is gonna have to fight for it and win. It aint gonna be “handed over” to a young anything without a fight. That is how it goes. Its not about banging your gums together talking all that progressive mumbo jumbo — its about showing whacha got. When someone like that shows up and has the goods, Pelosi will be replaced. It wont be the result of a discussion on some lefty blog.

  247. 247.

    Betty Cracker

    June 21, 2017 at 2:03 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne: Thought you might enjoy this:

    When you leave someone off the guest list. pic.twitter.com/2r6ThxnjeH

    — Schooley (@Rschooley) June 21, 2017

  248. 248.

    jl

    June 21, 2017 at 2:04 pm

    @Barbara: The Trump boom analysis I read in the business and finance press is all from reactionary goof balls who can’t separate economic analysis from their personal ideological fantasies and grievances. Worthless stuff. One example that pops to mind is that if they get all their Trump goodies, they will get TrumpCare for the health industry. If the Trump/GOP vision of healthcare is realized, that is going to be a huge macroeconomic downer big enough to cancel a real infrastructure program (which won’t happen, since Trump’s proposal is a scam that will shuffle money and then be long term drag macroeconomically).

  249. 249.

    zhena gogolia

    June 21, 2017 at 2:08 pm

    @Nelle:

    Wow. I wish this were broadcast on all the cable news networks 24/7.

  250. 250.

    zhena gogolia

    June 21, 2017 at 2:09 pm

    @rikyrah:

    I love it too. He is magnificent in it.

  251. 251.

    hovercraft

    June 21, 2017 at 2:09 pm

    @Nelle:
    Thank you for what you are doing, as you say every bit helps.
    “The journey of a thousand miles begins with one step.”

  252. 252.

    jl

    June 21, 2017 at 2:10 pm

    @Betty Cracker: I’m not a big Pelosi fan, but the idea that you can remove a GOP target and a problem is solved is delusional. The GOP will just do marketing research until they find another. I think Pelosi is a convenient target because of misogynistic appeal to reactionaries and GOPers who label themselves independents.

    I think Keith Ellison would be effective, but imagine the symbolic target he would be.
    When the GOP picks a target to obsess on, I think best response is to ridicule it, and point out that it is BS designed to manipulate voters.
    The one specific pitch to moderate GOPers and the ‘white working class’ (whatever that is) that I like is that they have been played as pathetic dupes who have been manipulated and betrayed by their cynical GOP leaders.

    Edit: bottom line is that until someone better comes along, Pelosi is very good at what she does. I’m not going to let my opponent dictate decisions about our leaders. That makes us playthings of GOP marketing research.

  253. 253.

    JR in WV

    June 21, 2017 at 2:13 pm

    @goblue72:

    I’ll start believing national Dems have a plan when Pelosi surrenders leadership.

    You show your complete ignorance of American government with this one sentence. Pelosi isn’t leader of the national level of the Democratic Party, she is a member of congress in the minority party. As such she gets air time on TV, that’s it. That’s all she has. I guess she gets a vote on the National committee, like 500 other politicians. Still not what you said, not even close.

    Fuck you, also, too!! Russian troll !!! Ignorant Russian troll… to boot.

  254. 254.

    Peale

    June 21, 2017 at 2:14 pm

    @Betty Cracker: They really desparately want someone to be “in charge.” there must be some “top down” problem with the party. Since it didn’t turn out to be the DNC, it must be the former speaker of the house. But someone must be in charge of the party who is making all of these horrible decisions. And it must be someone.

  255. 255.

    D58826

    June 21, 2017 at 2:16 pm

    @jl: @jl:

    Keith Ellison

    He is a three-fer
    1. D
    2. not white
    3. but best of all he really is the MOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOSLIM that Obama wasn’t (despite their best efforts to make him one)

  256. 256.

    hovercraft

    June 21, 2017 at 2:18 pm

    @Barbara:

    Wilmerites whining that Ossoff should have been more radical. ………..

    So the anointed BS candidate won Montana, I must have missed that one.

    Why do people like Matt Yglesias (one of the “Dems need substance! people)

    Because these are the same assholes who spent the entire campaign and post campaign bitching that Hillary had no policy prescriptions because they couldn’t be bothered to watch her boring speeches and then bitched that she and her campaign were too wonky and had too many white papers. The media barely paid attention to any of this because it wasn’t exciting enough, her rallies were all about substance so the media ignored them it was better to televise the moron, who knew, maybe he would bite the head of a bat off on live TV, wouldn’t that be awesome!

  257. 257.

    hovercraft

    June 21, 2017 at 2:21 pm

    @Betty Cracker:
    Love it!!!

  258. 258.

    SgrAstar

    June 21, 2017 at 2:21 pm

    @hovercraft: Beautiful statement of the stakes in this fight, hovercraft. Very resonating. Thank you for your passion and clarity.

  259. 259.

    jl

    June 21, 2017 at 2:25 pm

    @D58826: Well, yeah. I think Ellison has great political skills, but he would be a huge GOP target for smears and stereotyping.

    But anyone who has a leadership position will get the same treatment. It’s futile to make our leadership decisions based on fact that the GOP will come up with and try to sell a bunch of smears.

    I think the best approach is to find a way to effectively communicate to voters how the GOP has manipulated and betrayed them. That is one area where I think the Dems need to do a much better job that can be applied across the board. Much better than what a lot of the establishment Dems have attempted, to appeal to GOP moderates, and much better than the Sanders attempt to reduce everything to economic inequality.

  260. 260.

    HeleninEire

    June 21, 2017 at 2:32 pm

    @hovercraft: Beautiful. Thank you. And good luck to you and your children.

  261. 261.

    HeleninEire

    June 21, 2017 at 2:44 pm

    @SatanicPanic: THIS.

  262. 262.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    June 21, 2017 at 2:46 pm

    GA06 is Newt’s old district, and there were people seriously expecting a Democrat to win with voters dumb enough to vote Newt in over and over again.

  263. 263.

    JR in WV

    June 21, 2017 at 2:53 pm

    @pat:

    Yeah, back in the day we would see people trying to hold floppy disks (which did depend upon magnetic poles to store data) onto the side of their desktop with magnets, or with a binder-clip with a magnet, all bad ideas.

    But that isn’t so much the case any more. Not that I recommend using big magnets around your data storage, but your magnet is neither big nor powerful. I haven’t had a problem from airport x-rays, even more powerful ones. For example…

  264. 264.

    NR

    June 21, 2017 at 2:59 pm

    @But her emals!!!: Pelosi became House Democratic leader in 2002. She’s been House Democratic leader for fifteen years. Of those fifteen years, Democrats have controlled the House for only four–from 2007 to 2010, when they won consecutive wave elections based on an economic crisis and the disastrous aftermath of the war in Iraq.

    I would say that statistic pretty much speaks for itself. If the party keeps suffering loss after loss after loss under the same leadership, it’s time to look at replacing that leadership.

  265. 265.

    Mary G

    June 21, 2017 at 3:04 pm

    @hovercraft: I’m on vacation and mostly staying off the net, but I am glad I read this thread. I will keep fighting for your kids.

  266. 266.

    jl

    June 21, 2017 at 3:08 pm

    @NR: I think Pelosi will go towards more progressive and popular positions than other leaders who are equally responsible for poor decisions on electoral strategy. The problems with Democratic leadership is bigger than Pelosi. So, I don’t see how specifically getting rid of her will solve all problems.

  267. 267.

    NR

    June 21, 2017 at 3:19 pm

    @jl: Well Hoyer, who’s right behind her, is certainly worse. I’d like to see him go, too.

    And while you’re right that getting rid of them won’t solve all problems, it’s an important first step.

  268. 268.

    Steve in the ATL

    June 21, 2017 at 3:19 pm

    @NR: what a great point. I have been angry all day that the yuge number of Pelosi loyalists in GA-06 did not come out to vote for her yesterday. If only we had run a candidate other than Pelosi in GA-06. We should totally not run Pelosi in 434 districts in 2018, as that was clearly the problem on most elections from 2002-present.

  269. 269.

    hovercraft

    June 21, 2017 at 3:20 pm

    @HeleninEire: @Mary G:
    Thank you, we need to keep the setbacks in perspective no matter how hard it is.

  270. 270.

    Betty Cracker

    June 21, 2017 at 3:22 pm

    @NR: If Pelosi were in charge of the DNC, DCCC or individual House campaigns aside from her own, that might make sense, but she’s not. She’s pretty good at her actual job — controlling the Democratic caucus in the House.

  271. 271.

    hovercraft

    June 21, 2017 at 3:22 pm

    I just used the pie filter on Novo Russia , and it worked!

  272. 272.

    Captain C

    June 21, 2017 at 3:30 pm

    @Peale: And when their own person “in charge” fucks up, no matter how badly, it’s always someone else’s fault.

  273. 273.

    mai naem mobile

    June 21, 2017 at 3:34 pm

    @Frankensteinbeck: @Chris: I’ve run across anti black racism from Hispanics so I get what you guys are saying but I with this guy he’s bought into Dolt and the RW talking point that the Obama people and the Dems are using the Russian hacking as an excuse for Hilz losing in 2016. Also, this guy,I am going to call him J,is not a Dolt supporter. He’s a construction worker. Maybe his coworkers tell him this garbage. Maybe it’s RW talk radio. I dunno. I’ve known him for a few years and I truly don’t think he’s a racist. I was just so flabbergasted when he said this stuff, I felt like Obama in that first Rmoney debate with the gish galloping. We were also doing some physical work in 110 degrees so I wasn’t exactly in top form mentally. I am amazed at how much Clinton garbage is now considered fact.

  274. 274.

    jl

    June 21, 2017 at 3:36 pm

    @Betty Cracker: Thanks, that is the point I tried to make.

  275. 275.

    Betty Cracker

    June 21, 2017 at 3:42 pm

    Former Daily Caller (now Daily Beast) conservative hack Matt Lewis on Pelosi:

    The last reason Pelosi was such an inviting target is that she’s not just a liberal; she’s a liberal woman of a certain age. Now it’s politically incorrect to admit this, but it seems that in much of the county, whether we’re talking Hillary or Pelosi, they come across as hectoring. What is more, this stereotype plays into policy concerns about the “nanny state,” etc.

    We can label this visceral dislike of them “sexist” if we want, but it seems to be that a lot of men and women alike are repelled by their style. To be sure, it is dangerous for me (as a dude) to note this, but it seems to be an observable phenomenon that liberals would do best not to ignore.

    Dogs, fleas, etc.

  276. 276.

    NR

    June 21, 2017 at 3:48 pm

    @Steve in the ATL: Your attempt at snark aside, Karen Handel did attempt to make Pelosi an issue in the special election. Successfully, it would appear.

  277. 277.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    June 21, 2017 at 3:55 pm

    @NR: they used Bernie Sanders in the same ads, and he’s never moved any legilastion through either chamber. Should we get rid of him?

  278. 278.

    NR

    June 21, 2017 at 3:55 pm

    @Betty Cracker: The leadership does affect electoral results, though. They craft the nature of the opposition to what the majority party is doing.

    More than that, though, it also impacts candidate recruitment. It’s a common complaint that young people don’t vote; how easy do you think it’s going to be to recruit young candidates who might excite voters if you tell them that if they win, they are going to be at the very bottom of the ladder in the House, and all the people at the top are in their mid to late 70s?

  279. 279.

    NR

    June 21, 2017 at 3:56 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Get rid of him how? He isn’t part of the Senate Democratic leadership.

  280. 280.

    Jack the Second

    June 21, 2017 at 4:07 pm

    @NR: You suggest abandoning loyal, effective allies because our enemies hate them.

    You have no honor.

  281. 281.

    jl

    June 21, 2017 at 4:07 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Precisely. The GOP uses the old KGB saying ‘Give me the man, and I’ll give you the case’. Dems can’t choose their leadership based on GOP smear attacks. And I think the 2016 election shows that if the voters are discouraged or upset about something, they don’t care about what CW political pundit and consultant types identify as electoral baggage. If a candidate has a message that resonates, the voters will blow off attacks based on that thinking. Being able to deliver a popular and compelling message is where a lot of that famous political teflon comes from, as Reagan and Bill Clinton, and Obama showed.

    If Pelosi were replaced based on GOP smears, the GOP would immediately start to work doing the same thing on whoever replaced her. Playing the GOP’s game is a loser. Dems need to make decisions based on their own criteria and situation

    I do agree the Dems need to have more younger people visible in leadership, but that is a consideration that is independent of BS smears on Pelosi and ‘SF values’.

  282. 282.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    June 21, 2017 at 4:08 pm

    This is interesting

    Nu Wexler‏Verified account
    @ wexler
    Speaker Ryan and Leader Pelosi have nearly identical national favorable/unfavorable ratings.

    Haven’t heard one pundit call for the GOP to ditch Ryan

    @NR: he’s part of a party leadership, they made up a title for him in the futile hope of getting him to stop pissing in the tent

  283. 283.

    jl

    June 21, 2017 at 4:13 pm

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: A lot of CW political analysis in the media seems to consist of GOP talking points and focus group reports, cut and pasted right out of their emails. I don’t know why that is, but it really angers me. If I met half of the big media news divas, I would probably blurt out the question ‘Are you a dishonest GOP hack, incredibly lazy, or just stupid?”.

    Edit: interesting that while current polling is the same, the history is far different. Ryan has been unpopular for a long time. Probably because he is perceived as what he is, essentially a con artist who doesn’t care about the average voter. Pelosi’s shows evidence of how effective the GOP smear machine is as an election approaches.

  284. 284.

    Brachiator

    June 21, 2017 at 4:37 pm

    @jl:

    A lot of CW political analysis in the media seems to consist of GOP talking points and focus group reports, cut and pasted right out of their emails.

    Interesting point. This is part of why I have deliberately avoided much so-called analysis.

  285. 285.

    mai naem mobile

    June 21, 2017 at 4:44 pm

    The problem isn’t Nancy Pelosi. The problem wasn’t Reid and it isn’t Schumer now. PeLodi had plenty of stuff ready to go but assholes like Joe Lieberprick,Ben Nelson and Max Baucus were the problem. Baucus because the mofo intentionally dragged out the O-Care hearings so he could raise money for his campaign and thus the Dems didn’t have time frim other stuff. Also too, the asshole voters who can’t get off their asses and vote in every election. And this isn’t just a voter suppression issue. The voter turnout in this country is awful and in quite a few races you would only need around a 5 percent bump for the Dems to win.

  286. 286.

    Betty Cracker

    June 21, 2017 at 4:55 pm

    @NR: Do you have specific complaints about the nature of the opposition under Pelosi? Evidence that Pelosi has depressed turnout through some particular action? I think she’s done a pretty decent job. She’s been the object of a sexist / ageist smear campaign, but that’s no reason to push her aside.

    While I agree it would be a good thing to have some new blood in leadership positions, I don’t buy the theory that geezers with gavels discourage young folks from running for House seats. Do you have any evidence of that? Supposedly Sanders is the inspirational figure for the youngs, and he’s an old fart!

  287. 287.

    KS in MA

    June 21, 2017 at 4:58 pm

    @satby: THIS.

  288. 288.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    June 21, 2017 at 5:05 pm

    @mai naem mobile: Baucus also said, and I took him at his word, that he didn’t want to jeopardize his friendship with Chuck Grassley, who even as Baucus said this to reporters was already babbling about “pulling the plug on grandma!” Biden and Kerry have said similar things about their great friends, most notably John McCain. It’s one of those “WTF Dems!” things that so many Democrats can’t see that their friendships are one way streets.

    One funny thing about Lieberman, which I already mentioned today and maybe already to you: Chuck Schumer was on the ObamaBros Pod Save America this week, and called out Lieberman by name for killing off the public option. That’s one friendship that Shucker, at least, is not concerned with. I wonder where Schumer stood in the 06 CT primary.

  289. 289.

    NR

    June 21, 2017 at 5:27 pm

    @Jack the Second: In what way is Pelosi effective? Of the seven House elections we’ve had with her as leader, the Democrats have won two. And those only with a big assist from incompetence on the part of their opponents.

  290. 290.

    NR

    June 21, 2017 at 5:36 pm

    @Betty Cracker: So far from the Dems, I’m hearing a lot of opposition of the “Trump is an asshole” variety, which didn’t work during the campaign, and some criticism of their policies. Now that latter is good, but it only tells me why I shouldn’t like the Republicans. It doesn’t tell me why I should like the Democrats.

    In what concrete ways will Democrats make working-class lives better if people vote for them? I’m not hearing it. And more and more, I’m thinking Pelosi is not the one to craft that message. Maybe she’ll come up with something great and surprise me. But Congressional Democrats, at least so far, are not articulating a clear message of what they would do differently other than maintain the status quo. And that isn’t working for a lot of people.

    And yes, she has been the target of sexist attacks. No doubt about that.

  291. 291.

    Miss Bianca

    June 21, 2017 at 5:40 pm

    @hovercraft: What you said. And “damned be he who cries, ‘hold, enough!'” – particularly white people who are looking for “change now!!11!!” and whine because it’s not coming fast enough. How long have people of color had to accept the fact that lasting change in this country comes incrementally, if at all? And that every great progressive change carries an equally great and deadly backlash? All their damn lives and all their damn history here. Fuck that defeatist shit and fuck that “oh, if only Great White Progressive Hope had run/hadn’t been cheated by VOTES/hadn’t had their hopes dashed by the failure of the great socialist revolution to materialize” bullshit as well.

    Committed to the long haul. We fight till we win, and then…wow, guess what? We fight some more.

  292. 292.

    Jack the Second

    June 21, 2017 at 5:43 pm

    @NR: As Minority Leader, she has kept the Democratic caucus from joining Republicans on numerous disastrous pieces of legislation, in many cases blocking them, such as the plan (under Bush) to kill Social Security. As Speaker, she got the PPACA passed, the most significant healthcare legislation of the last fifty years. Hell, she got two healthcare plans passed; the original House version, which Pelosi got passed, which the Senate failed to pass, included a public option and equality for domestic partnerships (a point now mostly moot with the nationwide recognition of gay marriage). It would have insured ~5 million more people.

  293. 293.

    Miss Bianca

    June 21, 2017 at 5:45 pm

    @Elie: And congratulations and kudos to you again for doing this important work.

  294. 294.

    Betty Cracker

    June 21, 2017 at 5:50 pm

    @NR: “I’m hearing” and “I’m not hearing” are doing a lot of work in your response. I won’t bother to post links that disprove your contention that the Dems aren’t offering alternatives besides “Trump sucks.” It would be a waste of time. You’ve made up your mind.

  295. 295.

    Brachiator

    June 21, 2017 at 6:12 pm

    @NR:

    In what concrete ways will Democrats make working-class lives better if people vote for them? I’m not hearing it. And more and more, I’m thinking Pelosi is not the one to craft that message. Maybe she’ll come up with something great and surprise me. But Congressional Democrats, at least so far, are not articulating a clear message of what they would do differently other than maintain the status quo.

    Goddam this is some empty ass rhetoric. And note that I am not simply blasting you, but you are the one to formulate it here.

    First of all, blasting the status quo is not the same thing as making working class lives better. Hell, in some ways, Trump is upsetting the status quo, even if he is only bringing conservative wet dream nirvana.

    Next, let’s dismiss the Democrats and just ask what are the magical policies that will make working-class lives better, and also improve the lives of all Americans? Because, while it’s cool to pretend that working class people are the only ones in the room, that ain’t reality.

    Hint. Bernie ain’t the answer. Bernie has never articulated anything deeper than “let’s do it like they do in Europe,” which is absolutely meaningless.

  296. 296.

    NR

    June 21, 2017 at 6:49 pm

    @Betty Cracker: Actually I would welcome those links if you have them.

  297. 297.

    NR

    June 21, 2017 at 7:14 pm

    @Brachiator: I don’t know why you guys keep bringing up Bernie Sanders when I’m not even talking about him. You guys are way more obsessed with him than any hypothetical Berniebro.

    But fine, since you brought him up, I can tell you that you’re wrong that he hasn’t articulated anything. To take just one example, free college. “Free college” is bold, sweeping, simple, easy to understand, and provides a tangible benefit to a huge number of Americans. In short, it’s everything a policy proposal should be.

    “But it’s not practical!” you’ll cry. I can tell you that we could make free college happen in America right now. But it would require upsetting the status quo. Something the Democratic party is not willing to do.

    By the way, you know two other programs that drastically upset the status quo in America? Social Security and Medicare. Both of which dramatically improved the lives of millions of Americans and remain wildly popular today. If the Democratic party of today had been in power back in the time these programs were passed, they never would have been passed. We would have gotten a little nibbling around the edges and a lot of condescending rhetoric about how doing more wasn’t practical or realistic.

    And that is the problem with the Democratic party of today, and why they keep losing.

  298. 298.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    June 21, 2017 at 7:18 pm

    @NR: “But it’s not practical!” you’ll cry. I can tell you that we could make free college happen in America right now.

    Who’s “we”, screechy internet trool?

  299. 299.

    Brachiator

    June 21, 2017 at 7:42 pm

    @NR: I said that I wanted to take Sanders off the table, and then you waste time regurgitating his college plan. Also note that I didn’t say whether I disagreed with the basic concept.

    My original question stands.

  300. 300.

    Jack the Second

    June 21, 2017 at 8:11 pm

    @NR: You’re right, we should totally make Bernie Sanders Speaker of the House.

  301. 301.

    JR in WV

    June 21, 2017 at 9:20 pm

    @Betty Cracker:

    That’s why I pied him. Talking to an idjit doesn’t make any difference, he won’t listen.

  302. 302.

    No One You Know

    June 22, 2017 at 12:40 am

    @Repatriated: We’ve got a Bumper Sticker, people.

  303. 303.

    The Truffle

    June 22, 2017 at 1:21 pm

    @Frankensteinbeck: Just avoid op ed columns and comment sections for a few days. A lot of people dusting off old GWB columns and replacing “Bush” with “Trump.”

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