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Balloon Juice

Come for the politics, stay for the snark.

Giving in to doom is how we fail to fight for ourselves & one another.

Everybody saw this coming.

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Let me file that under fuck it.

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Make the republican party small enough to drown in a bathtub.

We still have time to mess this up!

Red lights blinking on democracy’s dashboard

How any woman could possibly vote for this smug smarmy piece of misogynistic crap is beyond understanding.

Fundamental belief of white supremacy: white people are presumed innocent, minorities are presumed guilty.

This country desperately needs a functioning fourth estate.

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This has so much WTF written all over it that it is hard to comprehend.

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🎶 Those boots were made for mockin’ 🎵

There are no moderate republicans – only extremists and cowards.

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Every one of the “Roberts Six” lied to get on the court.

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He wakes up lying, and he lies all day.

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You are here: Home / Economics / C.R.E.A.M. / Thursday Evening Open Thread: The Gang That Couldn’t Grift Straight

Thursday Evening Open Thread: The Gang That Couldn’t Grift Straight

by Anne Laurie|  July 13, 20176:28 pm| 260 Comments

This post is in: C.R.E.A.M., Dolt 45, Goddamned Traitors, Open Threads, Republican Stupidity, Russiagate, Assholes

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Asked three times whether Pence met with Russians, spokesman declines to answer pic.twitter.com/yBLImfxiFO

— Axios (@axios) July 13, 2017

Now Pence folks won't rule out Pence met w Russians, after all those denials from Pence himself ? (via @playbookplus https://t.co/9ApbNGnbdJ

— Jonathan Martin (@jmartNYT) July 13, 2017

And that, folks, is how we end up with President Ryan. https://t.co/zQACkKUBks

— Damon Linker (@DamonLinker) July 13, 2017

Forty-odd years of being carefully nursed by right-wing billionairs has really ruined the GOP grifters’ criminal stamina. Sure, Tricky Dick’s CREEPsters and St. Ronnie’s Iran-contra thugs were dumb and impulsive, but they didn’t break down like wet toilet paper at the first sign of exposure!

Apart from always wearing rubber gloves while dealing with Repubs, what’s on the agenda for the evening?
.

Note also Ryan’s weird dance yesterday where he wouldn’t say no, he would not meet w a Russian promising help against Hillary.

— Dana Houle (@DanaHoule) July 13, 2017

Ryan dodged the question as well, so buckle up for President Hatch.

— Kevin M. Kruse (@KevinMKruse) July 13, 2017

Worth noting that McConnell knew about Russian efforts to interfere in US elections but kept quiet so he could take healthcare from kids.

— sean. (@SeanMcElwee) July 12, 2017

So it turns out at least six campaign members had multiple meetings with Russian officials. Close enough, right? https://t.co/YjkVlzK2JC

— Kevin M. Kruse (@KevinMKruse) July 12, 2017

.@KellyannePolls: "What's the conclusion? Collusion? No, we don't have that yet." #Hannity pic.twitter.com/hWLQ9WPpc3

— Fox News (@FoxNews) July 13, 2017

… "no, we don't have that YET." YET??!? https://t.co/bjtsW0DdDj

— fake nick ramsey (@nick_ramsey) July 13, 2017

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Previous Post: « The Future’s So Bright, We’ll Have to Wear Chem Suits
Next Post: Chicago Tribune: “GOP operative who sought Clinton’s emails from Russian hackers, committed suicide, records show” »

Reader Interactions

260Comments

  1. 1.

    Tom Levenson

    July 13, 2017 at 6:32 pm

    Drag it out til Jan. 1 2019 and go w. President Pelosi.

  2. 2.

    West of the Cascades

    July 13, 2017 at 6:32 pm

    What sort of a world are we living in where “President Hatch” actually sounds good, compared to the other three alternatives? Of course, circa July 2019, “President Pelosi” sounds even better …

  3. 3.

    GregB

    July 13, 2017 at 6:33 pm

    It’s dildos and wetsuits from the top to the bottom.

    Poor Mother.

  4. 4.

    Roger Moore

    July 13, 2017 at 6:34 pm

    “no, we don’t have that YET.” YET??!?

    Kinsley gaffe.

  5. 5.

    Jeffro

    July 13, 2017 at 6:35 pm

    People don’t forget – there is likely to be some lag time and so if Trump goes and pence is sworn in he will have a little bit of time to name his own VP.

    THAT person is much more likely to be president a year from now than Paul Ryan.

    Regardless of how it plays out, each and everyone of these folks who are guilty need to be indicted, tried, and convicted. No need to game it out too far – just push for absolutely complete investigations into every aspect of this mess.

    And no more “looking forward not back”, either

  6. 6.

    debbie

    July 13, 2017 at 6:35 pm

    Bet the GOP’s now regretting not going with superdelegates.

  7. 7.

    Roger Moore

    July 13, 2017 at 6:38 pm

    @Jeffro:

    People don’t forget – there is likely to be some lag time and so if Trump goes and pence is sworn in he will have a little bit of time to name his own VP.

    THAT person is much more likely to be president a year from now than Paul Ryan.

    You sure about that? Remember, the replacement VP has to be confirmed by both Houses of Congress. If it looks as if Pence is in trouble, do you think Ryan is going to schedule a confirmation vote?

  8. 8.

    Manyakitty

    July 13, 2017 at 6:38 pm

    @Tom Levenson: From your lips to God’s ears

  9. 9.

    Uncle Omar

    July 13, 2017 at 6:39 pm

    You know, I believe that I would come out of retirement for the opportunity to cross-examine any of these dopes under oath in front of a jury.

  10. 10.

    MisterForkbeard

    July 13, 2017 at 6:40 pm

    @debbie: Superdelegates are such a crock. Absent evidence like this coming out during the primary, they would never reverse the public decision. And even then it’d be a tough lift.

    We kept saying as much to the Bernie supporters in 2016 after Bernie was mostly eliminated, and it was right then. It’s right now.

  11. 11.

    ? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?

    July 13, 2017 at 6:41 pm

    One thing’s for sure: the next few years are going to be turbulent and I can’t see Trump making it to 2020, in any capacity.

  12. 12.

    Keith P.

    July 13, 2017 at 6:44 pm

    The Kellyanne Spicer segment should be an embarrassment.

  13. 13.

    rikyrah

    July 13, 2017 at 6:46 pm

    We were talking about this at work. I brought up Pence.

    You all do realize that all these ‘leaks’ to the press is information that The Spooks have had.

    No wonder they went crazy after the election. They had given this info to the FBI- who didn’t do their phucking job.

  14. 14.

    Mingobat f/k/a Karen in GA

    July 13, 2017 at 6:48 pm

    On the agenda for tonight is more Broadway: 1984. Two blocks from the hotel, and it looks like it might be something I’ll love, so why not.

    Yeah, I’m purposely paying money on my vacation to be left freaked out and depressed.

  15. 15.

    dm

    July 13, 2017 at 6:51 pm

    @Tom Levenson: From your keyboard to God’s browser.

  16. 16.

    Chyron HR

    July 13, 2017 at 6:52 pm

    @Mingobat f/k/a Karen in GA:

    The only musical version of 1984 I need is the Rick Wakeman one with Chaka Khan!

    Journey to the Center of the Earth also, too.

  17. 17.

    Brachiator

    July 13, 2017 at 6:53 pm

    In related news concerning the GOP v America, the Republican Congress declines to take away Kushner’s security clearance. Again, the Republicans are going all the way to back Trump. He probably has assured the leadership that there is nothing behind all this, and the Republicans are stupid enough to believe him.

    Collateral damage so far? The “liberal fake news media,” of course, and the intelligence agencies, which in nutjob land need to be purged of all the “deep state” traitors.

    This crap is unbelievable. Just unbelievable. Trump is not only a traitor, but he is pulling the entire country into his bizarro conspiracy world.

  18. 18.

    StringOnAStick

    July 13, 2017 at 6:54 pm

    @rikyrah: I can imagine how some IC people are at the Hair on Fire stage and have been for months now. I know these are puzzle masters, but I suspect they are working fast to figure out the connections and what they can safely leak, and that’s from people who are predisposed to not wanting to be in the spot light for any reason. At this point I figure it is a race between the anti-Russia IC and the pro-Russian, pro-tRump (the NYC office that Guilianni colluded with). There isn’t much we can do except keep holding the elected R’s feet to the fire and make them as nervous as possible, then tie them to tRump with unbreakable rope once that lying bastard is revealed to the the Russian stooge we all know he is.

  19. 19.

    bemused

    July 13, 2017 at 6:54 pm

    Busy so only hearing bits from msnbc in background but man, I hope there is confirmed evidence Trump was fully informed on Jr’s meeting. Better yet would be that Trump made an appearance too. A girl can dream…

  20. 20.

    TaMara (HFG)

    July 13, 2017 at 6:54 pm

    @Tom Levenson: I have been saying this for months now. Just paralyze the current crew with investigations and subpoenas, then it’s up to us to vote these traitors out of office…THEN impeach, with alacrity.

  21. 21.

    JPL

    July 13, 2017 at 6:54 pm

    @Mingobat f/k/a Karen in GA: Well I’m green with envy. Enjoy.

  22. 22.

    ? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?

    July 13, 2017 at 6:56 pm

    @Brachiator:

    Again, the Republicans are going all the way to back Trump. He probably has assured the leadership that there is nothing behind all this, and the Republicans are stupid enough to believe him.

    Or the leadership is involved somehow

    Collateral damage so far? The “liberal fake news media,” of course, and the intelligence agencies, which in nutjob land need to be purged of all the “deep state” traitors.

    I think the country needs to be purged of RWNJs

  23. 23.

    JPL

    July 13, 2017 at 6:56 pm

    @TaMara (HFG): It would be nice if we held the majority. just sayin

  24. 24.

    MisterForkbeard

    July 13, 2017 at 6:56 pm

    @rikyrah: According to CNN, Mueller’s team was not aware of the meeting with Veselnitskaya, but they’re looking into it now. It looks like the whole thing might have been sparked by the SF86 refiling, in which Kushner had to amend his filing to include all the Russian contacts he conveniently “forgot” about.

  25. 25.

    Mike in DC

    July 13, 2017 at 6:58 pm

    1. Wait until 2019. Dems take House.
    2. Impeach both Trump and Pence simultaneously.
    3. Immediately after removal, Pelosi steps down. House Dems elect Hillary Clinton as Speaker (you dont have to be a member of the Congress to be speaker. )
    4. Clinton gives her inaugural address, later referred to as the “suck it, wingnuts” speech.

  26. 26.

    Brachiator

    July 13, 2017 at 6:59 pm

    Apart from trying to avoid getting sucked into the morass of Trump stupidity, I am counting down the days until the premiere of this season of Game of Thrones.

    Torture porn, gratuitous sex and violence? Bring it on.

    And this weekend, the charming comedy film, “The Big Sick” opens in wide release, and I plan to see it again. Avoid spoilers, go see it. Very heart warming.

  27. 27.

    MisterForkbeard

    July 13, 2017 at 6:59 pm

    @Brachiator: This shouldn’t even be a call by Congress. The Admin/IC people in charge of clearance are supposed to revoke it in cases like this. Adam’s detailed this in the past.

    Realistically speaking, at that point Trump would overrule the revocation, and then you’d be in a world of shit. Because it’d be really obvious to basically everyone but Trump loyalists what was going on, but “Trump Loyalists” includes most of the GOP. So you’d have an obvious major issue and no way to resolve it.

    But then, “Obvious major problem and no way to resolve it” has basically been the MO of the entire Trump Administration.

  28. 28.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    July 13, 2017 at 6:59 pm

    @? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:

    I can’t see Trump making it to 2020, in any capacity.

    Even BOP #1852345?

  29. 29.

    Uncle Cosmo

    July 13, 2017 at 7:00 pm

    @Jeffro:

    People don’t forget – there is likely to be some lag time and so if Trump goes and pence is sworn in he will have a little bit of time to name his own VP.

    That’s why it’s so crucial for Bobby Three-Sticks to nail Mikey Dense to the Treason Wall first. (I would not be surprised if that’s why he’s moving deliberately – you don’t want to shitcan a traitor only to hand the job over to another traitor.)

    Unfortunately whatever supreme Being there might be can’t possibly love us enough for there to be more mundane indictable offenses enough in Dense’s closet to compel his resignation a la Agnew.

  30. 30.

    ? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?

    July 13, 2017 at 7:00 pm

    @Mike in DC: What about the Senate? We don’t control it anymore

  31. 31.

    stinger

    July 13, 2017 at 7:03 pm

    @Tom Levenson: That would get my vote. Or, the Dems gain the majority, they select Hillary as their ML, she becomes President, and Nancy becomes ML. THAT would be thoroughly satisfying.

    I may have read it somewhere in BJ comments once.

    ETA: Might have been Mike in DC!

  32. 32.

    Mike in DC

    July 13, 2017 at 7:04 pm

    @? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:
    Well, whether or not the Senate goes along with removal depends upon 3 things:
    1. Has their agenda stalled out under Trump?
    2. Has public opinion turned on them?
    3. How serious are the allegations and how strong is the evidence?

  33. 33.

    West of the Rockies (been a while)

    July 13, 2017 at 7:05 pm

    How has 36 year old Kushner outfoxed everybody so far? He’s NOT that bright. And why isn’t Ivanka mentioned as colluding? She has a position there, she’s in on this shit and is bedding (gross) Kushner. She’s dirty, too.

  34. 34.

    Major Major Major Major

    July 13, 2017 at 7:05 pm

    An unpleasant person in my department was let go from work today, likely on account of said unpleasantness, so I’m doing pretty alright all things considered.

  35. 35.

    ? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?

    July 13, 2017 at 7:05 pm

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: Maybe. He’s not a healthy man. If he watches a lot of TV, I can easily see him having a blood clot or an aneurysm. Unfortunately he has access to the best medical care in the world as president.

  36. 36.

    efgoldman

    July 13, 2017 at 7:06 pm

    @Jeffro:

    he will have a little bit of time to name his own VP.
    THAT person is much more likely to be president a year from now than Paul Ryan.

    True, but that person also needs to be confirmed by both houses. If it comes to that, I can see the RWNJs being all fractious.
    Ford was a known quantity, not a nutcase, and everyone’s favorite second banana.

  37. 37.

    Brendancalling

    July 13, 2017 at 7:06 pm

    @Jeffro: now you’re just setting yourself up for disappointment and anger.

  38. 38.

    Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes

    July 13, 2017 at 7:06 pm

    Possibly the finest projection by a spokesman on a lawyer headed for a major career crash, ever.

    Kasowitz gets whiskey bent and hellbound, because that’s the only excuse for this…

    Since the story was published, his spokesman issued a statement disputing several parts of the story: “Marc Kasowitz has not struggled with alcoholism,” Sitrick wrote. “He has not come into the office intoxicated, attorneys have not had to go across the street to the restaurant during the workday to consult Kasowitz on work matters.”

    The spokesman clearly has experience with old time drunk lawyers that embrace their alcoholism and make it work for them. Kasowitz clearly doesn’t struggle with it – he goes with it. And no, they don’t have to drag him out of the bar to get work done – he’s desk drinking…

  39. 39.

    Baud

    July 13, 2017 at 7:08 pm

    Maybe the Obamacare repeal effort is a effort to distract from the Russia stuff.

  40. 40.

    jl

    July 13, 2017 at 7:08 pm

    I guess since total incompetent fools is the topic of the post, this isn’t off topic. I can’t help reposting it until FPer highlights it.

    The funding for the Cruz improved Senate tax cut pretending to be a health care bill is a total fraud. Cruz amendment uses the same pot of money over and over again to pay for the various supposed and purported improvements and sops to the moderate GOPer Senators.

    Good excuse to contact Senators again, with aghast and concerned questions about what the hell is going on up there.

    Uh Oh: O’Care Repeal Bill Counts The Same Pot Of Money Multiple Times
    http://talkingpointsmemo.com/dc/senate-republicans-double-dip-obamacare-repeal

    Edit: Might want to comment that if YOU couldn’t do addition, you’d probably lose your job.

  41. 41.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    July 13, 2017 at 7:08 pm

    @MisterForkbeard:

    This shouldn’t even be a call by Congress.

    True, it shouldn’t.

    The Admin/IC people in charge of clearance are supposed to revoke it in cases like this. Adam’s detailed this in the past.

    But Adam has also pointed out that the President* can grant a clearance over their objections.

  42. 42.

    MisterForkbeard

    July 13, 2017 at 7:08 pm

    @Major Major Major Major: I always feel petty at moments like that, until I remember that I won’t have to deal with said person again.

    When our company was acquired last year, it was generally a letdown but I was positively ecstatic that they removed my own personal nemesis and reassigned him to some shithole somewhere. Considering that I’d came this close to trying get him fired a few months earlier (at some risk to my own career) it was a very welcome development.

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: Yep, pointed out that Trump can overrule the revocation in my 2nd paragraph. It’d be a huge problem for most presidents, but the Republicans have already demonstrated that they just don’t give a shit.

  43. 43.

    Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism

    July 13, 2017 at 7:08 pm

    Apart from always wearing rubber gloves while dealing with Repubs, what’s on the agenda for the evening?

    Trying to keep my blood pressure down. I survived my third sleep study in six weeks last night, and I’m having a lot of trouble convincing myself that there’s not a grift involved somewhere.

    This should have been a straightforward prescription renewal.

  44. 44.

    Tilda Swintons Bald Cap

    July 13, 2017 at 7:08 pm

    Jr. admitted to being a traitor. He is still free and not under arrest. Kushner has now modified is SF-86 multiple times, which would land any one of us in court. They are getting away with this everyday. Trump will still be POTUS 4 years from now. There are no magic fixes to this, only the ballot box.

  45. 45.

    Shana

    July 13, 2017 at 7:09 pm

    @Mingobat f/k/a Karen in GA: Well, I’m seeing “Assassin” on Saturday, so you’re not alone, I guess.

  46. 46.

    stinger

    July 13, 2017 at 7:09 pm

    @Major Major Major Major: Congrats! Hope things get quickly better at work for you.

  47. 47.

    Baud

    July 13, 2017 at 7:10 pm

    @Tilda Swintons Bald Cap:

    Kushner has now modified is SF-86 multiple times, which would land any one of us in court.

    To be fair, if it were any of us, it would be our only crime.

  48. 48.

    stinger

    July 13, 2017 at 7:10 pm

    @? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: You’ve seen his doctor, right?

  49. 49.

    Baud

    July 13, 2017 at 7:10 pm

    @Major Major Major Major: It’s not you, is it? If not, then that’s great!

  50. 50.

    ? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?

    July 13, 2017 at 7:11 pm

    @Tilda Swintons Bald Cap:

    Trump will still be POTUS 4 years from now.

    Unless Mr. Trump meets with an unfortunate end

  51. 51.

    Major Major Major Major

    July 13, 2017 at 7:12 pm

    @MisterForkbeard: It was negatively affecting our work.

    @Baud: ? ? ? ? ?

  52. 52.

    Shalimar

    July 13, 2017 at 7:12 pm

    @Jeffro: Per 25th Amendment, a new VP has to be approved by both the House and Senate. Ryan isn’t going to let that happen if it is obvious Pence is going down too.

  53. 53.

    Shana

    July 13, 2017 at 7:12 pm

    @Major Major Major Major: Mazel tov!

  54. 54.

    NotMax

    July 13, 2017 at 7:12 pm

    @Mike in DC

    Fantasy is nice, in its way. But fantasy nonetheless.

    #2 (simultaneity) is a non-starter
    #3 requires trial and conviction in the Senate
    In the case of #4 (as proposed), the president pro tem of the Senate immediately becomes President if the Speaker position is vacant during succession.

  55. 55.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    July 13, 2017 at 7:15 pm

    @jl:

    The funding for the Cruz improved Senate tax cut pretending to be a health care bill is a total fraud. Crus amendment uses the same pot of money over and over again to pay for the supposed and purported improvements and sops to the moderate GOPer Senators.

    They always say Cruz is a good debater and lawyer, they never said he was good at math.

  56. 56.

    jl

    July 13, 2017 at 7:15 pm

    And forgot that rikyrah highlighted a piece that said McConnell is trying to order his troops to knowingly vote for a dishonest bill. He’s promising the ‘moderates’ that the GOP really don’t mean the slashes in Medicaid, they will be changed later so it’s all good.

    That deserves another call to GOP Seantors to tell them you don’t pay their salaries to be McConnell’s crummy little lying punks.
    https://balloon-juice.com/2017/07/13/nos-are-piling-up/#comment-6465860

    Edit: need to keep calling. This dopes are on the ropes. Keep them off balance, and scare the political hell out of the ‘moderates’ (politely). Do it for the fun of it.

  57. 57.

    p.a.

    July 13, 2017 at 7:16 pm

    So BibleBot Pence denied thrice?

  58. 58.

    Baud

    July 13, 2017 at 7:16 pm

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: Or he is good at math, but he’s a fraudster.

  59. 59.

    Baud

    July 13, 2017 at 7:16 pm

    @Major Major Major Major: ?

  60. 60.

    Yarrow

    July 13, 2017 at 7:18 pm

    @NotMax: President Hatch.

  61. 61.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    July 13, 2017 at 7:19 pm

    @Baud: One of the first statements my roommate of 3 years in college made as a freshman made was that he never had to take math again*, he’s a lawyer now.

    *I believe he made that statement when he saw my oversized Calculus textbook.

  62. 62.

    Keith P.

    July 13, 2017 at 7:21 pm

    I’ve been wondering something – do Trump staffers not realize how much leverage they have over Trump (quitting would lead to a bad news cycle…multiple resigns would be another “Worst Week Ever”) or are they just that loyal to the cause that they let the boss get crazier and crazier. All this talk over “Why does X or Yvanka not talk to Trump to make him stop?” should be replaced with “Why does X not just tell Sr. that if he doesn’t cut they shit, they’re outta here?”

  63. 63.

    Baud

    July 13, 2017 at 7:21 pm

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: I like math. I’m just not good enough at it.

  64. 64.

    r€nato

    July 13, 2017 at 7:21 pm

    It’s treason all the way down.

  65. 65.

    NotMax

    July 13, 2017 at 7:21 pm

    @Yarrow

    Should it ever come to that (extremely, extremely unlikely) a damn sight better than President Tillerson, the next in line.

  66. 66.

    jl

    July 13, 2017 at 7:22 pm

    @Baud: Dammit Baud, when I think you could be the one running this shit show, I just weep for what could have been.
    ‘We still have time to mess this up’.
    You coulda been a contender….

    It would be so much more fun creating this mess with cheery care free beer bashes and lotto for all in the WH instead of anger, subversion and liars with bad attitude.

  67. 67.

    Yarrow

    July 13, 2017 at 7:22 pm

    @NotMax: It is indeed. If the rest of them go down, Tillerson will go down too. He’s in tight with the Russians.

  68. 68.

    Jeffro

    July 13, 2017 at 7:23 pm

    @Roger Moore:

    You sure about that? Remember, the replacement VP has to be confirmed by both Houses of Congress. If it looks as if Pence is in trouble, do you think Ryan is going to schedule a confirmation vote?

    Um, I think the second part of my comment was, ‘no point in trying to game this out’. =)

  69. 69.

    Baud

    July 13, 2017 at 7:23 pm

    @jl: My patriotism was my Achilles heel. I should have partnered with a foreign adversary.

  70. 70.

    Percysowner

    July 13, 2017 at 7:23 pm

    @bemused: Does Donald saying ‘Maybe It Was Mentioned’ make you feel better?

    @Mike in DC: As much as I would adore that, we would never hear the end of how “Hillary STOLE the Presidency. I’ll settle for President Pelosi.

  71. 71.

    TenguPhule

    July 13, 2017 at 7:24 pm

    Every Republican in the line of succession is a traitor.

    EVERY.

    SINGLE.

    ONE.

  72. 72.

    TenguPhule

    July 13, 2017 at 7:25 pm

    @Baud:

    I should have partnered with a foreign adversary.

    Baud/Canada: Because we already blame him for everything!

  73. 73.

    ? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?

    July 13, 2017 at 7:25 pm

    @TenguPhule: And what do we do with traitors?

  74. 74.

    Jeffro

    July 13, 2017 at 7:25 pm

    @Brendancalling: say what now?

  75. 75.

    jl

    July 13, 2017 at 7:25 pm

    @Baud: If you get another chance, Monaco? Classy. They have top people.

  76. 76.

    coozledad

    July 13, 2017 at 7:26 pm

    @Roger Moore: NO FOUL PLAY!
    http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/politics/ct-peter-smith-death-met-0713-20170713-story.html

  77. 77.

    TenguPhule

    July 13, 2017 at 7:26 pm

    @? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: There are so many options to choose from. And then there’s all the ones that don’t immediately result in a hideous agonizing screaming death for them.

  78. 78.

    Roger Moore

    July 13, 2017 at 7:26 pm

    @Brachiator:

    He probably has assured the leadership that there is nothing behind all this, and the Republicans are stupid enough to believe him.

    He has probably assured the leadership that they’re all in this together and he’ll take them down with him if he falls.

  79. 79.

    WaterGirl

    July 13, 2017 at 7:27 pm

    @Percysowner: Wow, if he admitted to that, I think there’s a really good chance that it will be proven that he was actually at the meeting. Apparently he was in Trump Tower that day.

  80. 80.

    Baud

    July 13, 2017 at 7:27 pm

    @jl: Good choice. Very James Bond.

  81. 81.

    TenguPhule

    July 13, 2017 at 7:28 pm

    @Yarrow: Hatch is involved too. He’s already dismissed the Trump Jr email as “Kids will be kids.”

    He’s filthy with Russian blood money somewhere.

  82. 82.

    Laura

    July 13, 2017 at 7:28 pm

    Going out tonight to see Earth Wind and Fire and Nile Rogers and Chic! Le Freak!
    Because when Nile Rogers comes to your town, you’d be foolish to not see Nile Rogers!

  83. 83.

    Jeffro

    July 13, 2017 at 7:28 pm

    @Shalimar: Pence won’t be out before the 2018 elections, but Trumpov might just be. The pressure on Ryan to not risk President Pelosi in 2019 or 2020 would be immense. And there’s always Koch money to help soften the “coulda, woulda” for Paulie Blue Eyes.

  84. 84.

    Roger Moore

    July 13, 2017 at 7:29 pm

    @? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:

    I think the country needs to be purged of RWNJs

    Where are my FEMA camps?

  85. 85.

    bupalos

    July 13, 2017 at 7:29 pm

    @Tom Levenson: PAPA LIKE!!!

  86. 86.

    TenguPhule

    July 13, 2017 at 7:30 pm

    @Brachiator:

    This crap is unbelievable. Just unbelievable. Trump is not only a traitor, but he is pulling the entire country into his bizarro conspiracy world.

    You know we’re in trouble when I’m the one starting to sound sane and reasonable.

  87. 87.

    jl

    July 13, 2017 at 7:31 pm

    @Baud: Practice in the mirror for the debates:
    “My name is Baud, James Baud, of His Majesty’s Secret Service, of Monaco. I can promise this country baccarat in every den and hot babes in every bedroom.”
    After Trump, you’ll be able to say anything.

  88. 88.

    chris

    July 13, 2017 at 7:31 pm

    @Baud: Canada’s here for you.

    ETA: Damn, TP got there first.

  89. 89.

    Brachiator

    July 13, 2017 at 7:32 pm

    @Roger Moore:

    He has probably assured the leadership that they’re all in this together and he’ll take them down with him if he falls

    I think the vile GOP leadership would drop Trump like a cold turd and walk away without a year if it serves their purposes.

  90. 90.

    TenguPhule

    July 13, 2017 at 7:32 pm

    @Mike in DC:

    1. Wait until 2019. Dems take House.

    I think I see a couple of flaws in this plan of yours.

  91. 91.

    SiubhanDuinne

    July 13, 2017 at 7:32 pm

    @Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes:

    Kasowitz sure sounds like a piece of work. I was reading earlier today about some spittle-flecked, vulgar, threatening emails he sent to someone last night. Apparently he “apologized” today for his intemperate tone, but, you know, he’d had a long day.

    ETA, if I had clicked on your link before writing my comment, I wouldn’t have written it. Or would have written something different. I assumed, wrongly, that it was to a different article published before the email threats.

  92. 92.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    July 13, 2017 at 7:32 pm

    @jl: I’m becoming a bit concerned at your ability to channel Trump’s speech patterns. You may need to consult a professional if this condition persists.

  93. 93.

    Baud

    July 13, 2017 at 7:33 pm

    @jl: Hmmm. That goes well with WaterGirl’s suggestion of “Excellent Fuck.”

  94. 94.

    Major Major Major Major

    July 13, 2017 at 7:33 pm

    @Mike in DC: @Percysowner: Fine, then we do it with Obama. You’re only term limited from being elected, after all.

  95. 95.

    TenguPhule

    July 13, 2017 at 7:33 pm

    @Brachiator:

    I think the vile GOP leadership would drop Trump like a cold turd and walk away without a year if it serves their purposes.

    Its far too late for that.

    Between what they’ve already signed off on and the Russians holding whatever the hell it is they stole from the RNC servers, the GOP is wedded to Trump to the bitter end. They literally have no other chance for survival.

  96. 96.

    jl

    July 13, 2017 at 7:34 pm

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: Low energy libs from Liberal Angeles are critics. I don’t like the critics.

  97. 97.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    July 13, 2017 at 7:34 pm

    @Roger Moore:

    Where are my FEMA camps?

    Thanks Obama.

  98. 98.

    ? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?

    July 13, 2017 at 7:35 pm

    @TenguPhule: I’d give a left nut just to see Trump and his kids (adults) being hunted by the Predator. Trump would die first because I can’t see him running

  99. 99.

    NotMax

    July 13, 2017 at 7:35 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne

    Next, blame Google Translate.

    “It sounded better in the original Cyrillic.”

  100. 100.

    TenguPhule

    July 13, 2017 at 7:35 pm

    @jl:

    Cruz amendment uses the same pot of money over and over again to pay for the various supposed and purported improvements and sops to the moderate GOPer Senators.

    Not a surprise. They did it in the House Bill too.

  101. 101.

    jl

    July 13, 2017 at 7:36 pm

    @Baud: Go for it. You will be running again in the post Trump era. Go for broke. Every man a king. Pussy Galore can be your veep. And Dr. Goldfinger your Secretary of Treasury. The country will throw itself at your feet.

  102. 102.

    ? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?

    July 13, 2017 at 7:36 pm

    @TenguPhule: 2018?

  103. 103.

    TenguPhule

    July 13, 2017 at 7:36 pm

    @? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: Predators only hunt prey capable of fighting back. And they kill too quickly.

  104. 104.

    bupalos

    July 13, 2017 at 7:36 pm

    @Percysowner: SETTLE for Pelosi? Sorry, at the risk of inciting the WILMER/HITLERY wars, Pelosi is just objectively at least 2x the progressive that Ms. Clinton ever wanted to be. And still not progressive enough. But seriously, would folks here really prefer Hillary to Pelosi?

  105. 105.

    jl

    July 13, 2017 at 7:37 pm

    @TenguPhule: I get to contact DiFi about this and ask why I haven’t heard her yelling about it in the news.

  106. 106.

    Baud

    July 13, 2017 at 7:39 pm

    @bupalos:

    But seriously, would folks here really prefer Hillary to Pelosi?

    Pelosi is more progressive, but Hillary is more presidential across all the areas a president needs to deal with. So in this fantasy, I would choose Hillary.

  107. 107.

    ? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?

    July 13, 2017 at 7:39 pm

    @TenguPhule: The Alien, then

  108. 108.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    July 13, 2017 at 7:40 pm

    @jl:

    why I haven’t heard her yelling about it in the news.

    At Di-Fi’s age, I think she just yells at clouds now.

  109. 109.

    ? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?

    July 13, 2017 at 7:41 pm

    @bupalos: I’d prefer her to either Trump or Wilmer. Wilmer I’d definitely take over Trump, but he’s too much of a flake for me

  110. 110.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    July 13, 2017 at 7:41 pm

    @jl: Sounds like we may need an intervention.

  111. 111.

    Mnemosyne

    July 13, 2017 at 7:41 pm

    @bupalos:

    Hillary would know how to calm all of our international allies down after all of the damage Trump has done. So, yeah, I prefer Hillary’s ability to fix the shit that Trump has broken over something abstract like “who’s more progressive?”

  112. 112.

    Major Major Major Major

    July 13, 2017 at 7:42 pm

    @bupalos: @Baud: Yeah, being president is about much, much, much more than how progressive somebody’s policy preferences are.

  113. 113.

    SiubhanDuinne

    July 13, 2017 at 7:42 pm

    @jl:

    It would be so much more fun creating this mess with cheery care free beer bashes and lotto for all in the WH instead of anger, subversion and liars with bad attitude.

    Plus, Baud would never embarrass us by appraising the French President’s wife as if she were a side of beef.

    Okay, yeah, Poco would for sure. But not Baud.

  114. 114.

    Baud

    July 13, 2017 at 7:44 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    Vous avez une belle ass.

  115. 115.

    bupalos

    July 13, 2017 at 7:44 pm

    @Baud: talk to me about these ways she’s more “presidential.”

    I find this utterly fascinating. This shouldn’t be a question, but I guess it is.

  116. 116.

    jl

    July 13, 2017 at 7:45 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne: See? very classy.

  117. 117.

    Timurid

    July 13, 2017 at 7:45 pm

    This story just keeps on giving…

  118. 118.

    Patricia Kayden

    July 13, 2017 at 7:45 pm

    @West of the Cascades: @Tom Levenson: “President Pelosi” sounds perfect. Let it be so.

  119. 119.

    Baud

    July 13, 2017 at 7:46 pm

    @bupalos: This game isn’t interesting enough for me to prolong it.

  120. 120.

    ? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?

    July 13, 2017 at 7:46 pm

    @bupalos: Define “progressive”. I’m not afraid to use “liberal”

  121. 121.

    bupalos

    July 13, 2017 at 7:47 pm

    @Mnemosyne: gotta admit, I’m shocked at these responses. She could “calm our allies” better? What does this mean. I feel like you guys are showing where on the doll Trump touched you.

  122. 122.

    Patricia Kayden

    July 13, 2017 at 7:47 pm

    @bupalos: Given what we have now, I’d prefer either Secretary Clinton or Pelosi in the White House. Doesn’t matter which one. Any Democratic politician except Manchin would be better than Trump.

  123. 123.

    Omnes Omnibus

    July 13, 2017 at 7:48 pm

    @Tilda Swintons Bald Cap: Mueller has had his job for two months. This is an investigation that could bring down an administration. They are going to make sure every i is dotted and and every t crossed before moving. Don’t expect anything to move fast.

  124. 124.

    Baud

    July 13, 2017 at 7:48 pm

    @Patricia Kayden: Manchin would be better than Trump.

  125. 125.

    Gvg

    July 13, 2017 at 7:48 pm

    @Roger Moore: if it’s obvious enough high crimes that the GOP Congress thinks Trump needs to be removed finally and then Ryan won’t schedule a vote on a new VP, the rest of his caucus will know he is doing it so he can be President. I am assuming Pence is also dirty as his behavior seems to me to strongly suggest. I think at that point Ryan may lose the speakership. Some others think they would make a better President, others will be angered by the underhandedness and he barely controls them anyway and hasn’t been good at keeping them together. To be fair, there are such significant differences that I don’t see how they can keep together.
    Back when trump picked Pence I thought they would fall out pretty fast. Hasn’t worked that way, and to me it looks like Russians everywhere. Really upsetting.
    Trumps speech defending Jr in Paris, shows he doesn’t have any clue of why help from the Russians is different from some American informant telling him something about Hillary. He is older than I am, how can he be so unaware of basic civics and cultural norms? He is so embarrassing yet again.

  126. 126.

    ? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?

    July 13, 2017 at 7:51 pm

    @bupalos: Well, for one, she wouldn’t be a total embarrassment to the rest of the world on a daily basis

  127. 127.

    bupalos

    July 13, 2017 at 7:51 pm

    @Baud: That’s disappointing. It’s not a game, I’m just giving my real reaction, and honestly can’t understand on what dimension Clinton is preferable to Pelosi in the though experiment where we don’t actually live in a country so infested with racial hatred and resentment that Triumph of the Trump is actually going to come to an early end.

    Don’t you have an office to run for anyway?

  128. 128.

    SiubhanDuinne

    July 13, 2017 at 7:52 pm

    @NotMax:

    Next, blame Google Translate.

    Naah, not here. I save that for Facebook posts.

  129. 129.

    ? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?

    July 13, 2017 at 7:53 pm

    @bupalos: She is younger. And is the person who won the most votes last election. Nevermind the EC if this is a fantasy

  130. 130.

    Mnemosyne

    July 13, 2017 at 7:53 pm

    @bupalos:

    I feel like you guys are showing where on the doll Trump touched you.

    He grabbed us by the pu$$y like he does every woman he meets. You realize that joke isn’t funny when you apply it to an admitted rapist, right?

  131. 131.

    Baud

    July 13, 2017 at 7:53 pm

    @bupalos: Dungeons and Dragons is more real than this premise of this discussion.

  132. 132.

    jl

    July 13, 2017 at 7:53 pm

    Quiet rumblings before the backed up cesspool blows?

  133. 133.

    Patricia Kayden

    July 13, 2017 at 7:53 pm

    @Timurid: So when do we get the satisfaction of seeing Donny Jr. perp walked to a federal prison? Along with all the rest of the sleazy White House occupants.

  134. 134.

    SiubhanDuinne

    July 13, 2017 at 7:54 pm

    @TenguPhule:
    @? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:

    @TenguPhule: 2018?

    Election 2018. New Congress January 2019.

  135. 135.

    Major Major Major Major

    July 13, 2017 at 7:54 pm

    @bupalos: well, Hillary is a much better speaker and interviewee.

  136. 136.

    ? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?

    July 13, 2017 at 7:55 pm

    @Mnemosyne:

    What? You one a them SJWs?

  137. 137.

    jl

    July 13, 2017 at 7:56 pm

    Millions of ordinary citizens of the US are more qualified to be president of the US than Trump. And everyone with any sense knows that, even most of the repugnant GOPers on Congress.

    Millions of US citizens would have the wit and focus to figure out what the hell is in the Senate bogus health care bill, just as one, just one, example.

  138. 138.

    Baud

    July 13, 2017 at 7:56 pm

    @jl: Very true.

  139. 139.

    bupalos

    July 13, 2017 at 7:57 pm

    @? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: When confronted with the idea that a pipeline company wants to build a compressor station on top of a currently living nun:

    Pelosi: “aw hell no, what the fuck are you talking about? Compress this!!!”
    Clinton: “I’m sure we can find a more appropriate place for the compressor station.”

    That would be a kind of off-the-cuff-measure for my progressive expectations

  140. 140.

    Mnemosyne

    July 13, 2017 at 7:58 pm

    @bupalos:

    No, we get it — you don’t understand why we would rather have a qualified person with a lot of international experience as president rather than a “progressive” figurehead you can point to as someone who’s not Hillary Clinton.

    The primary is long over. You don’t have to bitterly cling to your Anyone But Hillary stance anymore, which is what got us here in the first place, jackass.

  141. 141.

    Major Major Major Major

    July 13, 2017 at 7:58 pm

    @bupalos: I fail to see a difference in the outcome between those two responses except that one would piss off a powerful company.

  142. 142.

    SiubhanDuinne

    July 13, 2017 at 7:59 pm

    @bupalos:

    Pelosi is just objectively at least 2x the progressive that Ms. Clinton ever wanted to be. And still not progressive enough. But seriously, would folks here really prefer Hillary to Pelosi?

    Yes, actually, I would. Not that I don’t love Nancy SMASH!!, but her skill set is totally suited to being in Congressional leadership. She is the best as either Speaker or Minority Leader.

    But Hillary has a breadth of experience that would make her a much better POTUS than Pelosi. Of course, either one of them could and would run rings around Trump, Pence, Ryan, Hatch, and anyone else in the current order of presidential succession.

  143. 143.

    Major Major Major Major

    July 13, 2017 at 8:01 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne: I’m also amused by the assumption that a policy which is “twice as progressive” (measured somehow, against something) is automatically better, and that anybody with half a brain should think so.

  144. 144.

    SiubhanDuinne

    July 13, 2017 at 8:02 pm

    @Baud:

    Merci bien, mon cher Baud.

  145. 145.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    July 13, 2017 at 8:02 pm

    @Major Major Major Major:

    one would piss off a powerful company

    I think that’s the point.

  146. 146.

    Baud

    July 13, 2017 at 8:05 pm

    I can’t believe we’re inventing a fake primary war.

  147. 147.

    Major Major Major Major

    July 13, 2017 at 8:05 pm

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: we should consuder policies good regardless of who they piss off, not because of it.

  148. 148.

    SiubhanDuinne

    July 13, 2017 at 8:05 pm

    @Patricia Kayden:

    Any Democratic politician except up to and including even Manchin would be better than Trump.

    Sadly, fixed.

  149. 149.

    SiubhanDuinne

    July 13, 2017 at 8:07 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    They are going to make sure every i is dotted and and every t crossed

    And vice versa

  150. 150.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    July 13, 2017 at 8:07 pm

    @Major Major Major Major: I agree, I was just pointing out the commenter’s point.

  151. 151.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    July 13, 2017 at 8:07 pm

    @Baud: Seems like old times.

  152. 152.

    Major Major Major Major

    July 13, 2017 at 8:08 pm

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: I was socratically missing the point.

    @Baud: some people still haven’t hated Hillary Clinton enough yet.

  153. 153.

    efgoldman

    July 13, 2017 at 8:08 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    …up to and including even Manchin would be better than Trump.

    Considering the state he represents, and how quickly his electorate had devolved, Manchin is doing a hell of a job.

  154. 154.

    Mike in DC

    July 13, 2017 at 8:11 pm

    @NotMax:
    They have to be sworn in first.
    I was mostly joking, of course.

  155. 155.

    Baud

    July 13, 2017 at 8:12 pm

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: It sure does, neoliberal. It sure does.

  156. 156.

    SiubhanDuinne

    July 13, 2017 at 8:12 pm

    Every time I see “SJW,” I have to take several minutes to remind myself that the acronym now stands for “Social Justice Warrioir” and not “Single Jewish Woman.”

  157. 157.

    Major Major Major Major

    July 13, 2017 at 8:12 pm

    @efgoldman: @SiubhanDuinne: @Patricia Kayden: my dog would be a better president than trump and I don’t have a dog.

  158. 158.

    jl

    July 13, 2017 at 8:12 pm

    Right now, Paul and Collins say they are firm ‘No’ on Senate tax cut pretending to be a health care bill.
    Heller, Capito, Murkowski, and other bogus spineless moderates, need to be informed non stop that their constituents are tired of their bullshit.

    Medicaid still slashed. Major insurers opposed to bill Cruz amendment funding is fraudulent. We all know McConnell is asking them to dishonestly vote for a dishonest bill, because McConnell told his whole rotten scheme to whole country: vote to slash Medicaid, but we’ll cook something up to cover for you later. Who is McConnell lying to, the reactionaries or the Moderates? Cruz amendment is another cave to the reactionaries and more punking of moderates. Disgusting display.

    Senate Republicans one vote away from Obamacare repeal failure
    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/07/13/senate-republicans-health-care-bill-cruz-lee-240498?platform=hootsuite

    Edit: don’t call them to try to get a commitment out of them. Call to politically scare the political crap out of them, so that these punks are too scared to do anything. Too scared to commit to anything, to murmur even a meek ‘maybe’ to Senate whip.

  159. 159.

    ? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?

    July 13, 2017 at 8:15 pm

    @Baud: bupalos is JAQing off

  160. 160.

    SiubhanDuinne

    July 13, 2017 at 8:16 pm

    @Major Major Major Major:

    Yeah, I didn’t know what that meant, so I ignored it.

  161. 161.

    Mike in NC

    July 13, 2017 at 8:17 pm

    @Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism: A few years ago my wife talked me into seeing a so-called sleep specialist, who scheduled me for an overnight sleep study. It was very unpleasant because I lay away for hours and they lied about my symptoms on the report, so this doctor wanted me to undergo a follow-up study. The first one cost me about $700 out of pocket and I refused to submit to another.

    Later I went to my regular urgent care doctor and he gave me a prescription for sleeping pills with no questions asked. Ironically I never needed them and get by now with an over-the-counter medication. Long story short: don’t get ripped off by quacks.

  162. 162.

    bupalos

    July 13, 2017 at 8:17 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne: Talk to me about this “breadth of experience.”

    Jesus goddam it. What the fuck. Hillary is a good politician in her realm. So is Nancy in hers. But where in the FUCK would someone get the preference for the “Iraq war hellz yeah, super-predator politician over the California safe-seat politician?” I know these are now defined as Wilmer talking points but drop that and think about what we’re saying if we actually PREFER triangulating Clinton to out-and-proud Nancy.

    If you’ve stood on a corner collecting signatures for 10 hours you’ll know Pelosi is more your functional friend than Clinton. Not Clinton’s fault, but come on!

    I guess I’m open to it on some kind of long term strategic grounds of trying not to upset Republicans as much or something.

  163. 163.

    ? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?

    July 13, 2017 at 8:18 pm

    @bupalos:
    I understand your hypothetical is hyperbole but you needed a more realistic scenario to convince me. In your childish exercise, Hillary and Pelosi would be in firm agreement: No to murdering a nun.

    Oh and by the by, the link in your name goes nowhere

  164. 164.

    Major Major Major Major

    July 13, 2017 at 8:18 pm

    @? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: I don’t see what this has to do with whether or not bupalos is just another queer.

    ETA: oh boy, but bupalos is definitely sea lioning pretty hard!

  165. 165.

    SiubhanDuinne

    July 13, 2017 at 8:18 pm

    @efgoldman:

    Considering the state he represents, and how quickly his electorate had devolved, Manchin is doing a hell of a job.

    He’s godawful, but he’s our godawful.

  166. 166.

    jl

    July 13, 2017 at 8:20 pm

    Need a front post run down of the amazing BS on display re Senate tax cut pretending to be a health care bill. And state of play on vote count.

  167. 167.

    ? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?

    July 13, 2017 at 8:21 pm

    @Major Major Major Major: JAQ= Just Asking Questions
    MM^4: edited. Understood the joke

  168. 168.

    Major Major Major Major

    July 13, 2017 at 8:21 pm

    @bupalos: so those of us who’ve stood on corners collecting signatures before and still prefer Clinton have something wrong in the head or what?

    @? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: I was just having fun with your acronym.

  169. 169.

    Uncle Cosmo

    July 13, 2017 at 8:23 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne: GODDAMNIT S.D. I WAS JUST ABOUT TO POST THAT!!!

    Do you people have some sort of rotating duty schedule for detecting my brain waves & then jumping into a thread before I can get there??? Who the hell is in charge of the Interociter????

    (ETA: Grrrrrrr……)

  170. 170.

    Jeffro

    July 13, 2017 at 8:23 pm

    @Baud:

    I can’t believe we’re inventing a fake primary war.

    Um, we’re Democrats, this is what we do…?

    No circular firing squad handy? NO PROBLEM! We’ll make one up.

    I think I’ll check back later…how much later, I’m not sure yet…

  171. 171.

    Jeffro

    July 13, 2017 at 8:25 pm

    @efgoldman:

    Considering the state he represents, and how quickly his electorate had devolved, Manchin is doing a hell of a job.

    True, but then again the pressure’s off: there’s a Caucasian back in the WH again. His constituents are largely content now.

  172. 172.

    Patricia Kayden

    July 13, 2017 at 8:25 pm

    @GregB: LOL!! Mother can visit him in jail and bring him comic books and Chick tracts.

  173. 173.

    Mary G

    July 13, 2017 at 8:26 pm

    @Tom Levenson: President Pelosi is my ideal karma for the Republican party, and because she has no fear, I would expect another wave of progressive legislation and hope that their killing the filibuster comes back to bite them in the ass big time/hang in there, Judge Kennedy.

  174. 174.

    TenguPhule

    July 13, 2017 at 8:26 pm

    @Keith P.:

    do Trump staffers not realize how much leverage they have over Trump (quitting would lead to a bad news cycle…multiple resigns would be another “Worst Week Ever”) or are they just that loyal to the cause that they let the boss get crazier and crazier.

    I would place bets on 1) Threats of Violence and 2) Threats of Financial Ruin. But threats against them definitely is a factor.

  175. 175.

    schrodingers_cat

    July 13, 2017 at 8:28 pm

    @Baud: You is funny! I thought it was the other way around.

  176. 176.

    Major Major Major Major

    July 13, 2017 at 8:28 pm

    @TenguPhule: let’s also not forget that they agreed to work for Trump so we know their brains do not function correctly.

    @schrodingers_cat: this is actually all one giant distraction from Ivanka’s copyright violations.

  177. 177.

    SiubhanDuinne

    July 13, 2017 at 8:29 pm

    @bupalos:

    You’re acting as though I’m slagging on Pelosi. I’m not; I greatly admire her, and if through some (pretty goddamn unlikely) chain of well-timed events she ended up in the Oval Office, sitting behind the Resolute, I would be the first to applaud and support her. Doesn’t change my point that her particular skills and gifts are better suited to being in a Congressional leadership role than to being POTUS.

    You are a silly person to frame what is a very unlikely chain of events as an ideological struggle between NP/HRC factions.

  178. 178.

    TenguPhule

    July 13, 2017 at 8:30 pm

    @Baud:

    I can’t believe we’re inventing a fake primary war.

    I can’t believe Trump hasn’t been arrested yet.

  179. 179.

    Patricia Kayden

    July 13, 2017 at 8:30 pm

    @jl: I can’t see things going well for Republicans if they pass Trump Care. It’s one thing to lie about something that is theoretical. It’s a whole other thing to take away something tangible.

    And they can’t find a way to blame the negative impacts of Trump Care on President Black Muslim Kenyan.

  180. 180.

    bupalos

    July 13, 2017 at 8:31 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne: skill set. Is the legislation you would or would’t sign now referred to as a “skill set?”

    I won’t be baited into running down Clinton, she’s a particular politician with a particular outlook and sensibility and god knows I wouldn’t have had to come face to face with how bad this country sucks if she had squeaked it out with her lame commercials about job training.

    But I’ll drop everything else and just ask again, why, in this mental exercise (that completely abstracts from the almost-certain fact that a president-that-already-would-have-been-impeached-if-he-was-going-to-be is going to continue to shout at us from his overton window for AT LEAST 4 years) is PREFERABLE to Pelosi? She’ll “calm people?” She’s “more qualified?” or “more stable?” Good god. Just step back and look at what that concedes.

  181. 181.

    SiubhanDuinne

    July 13, 2017 at 8:31 pm

    @Uncle Cosmo:

    Gimme a fucking break. I’m generally about three hours behind the commentariat.

  182. 182.

    TenguPhule

    July 13, 2017 at 8:31 pm

    @Major Major Major Major:

    let’s also not forget that they agreed to work for Trump so we know their brains do not function correctly.

    Trump is the kind of person who can only get dogs to follow him by holding raw bloody meat in both hands.

    And even then, he still has to wear a mask to hide his face for them to get anywhere near him.

  183. 183.

    TenguPhule

    July 13, 2017 at 8:32 pm

    @Uncle Cosmo:

    Do you people have some sort of rotating duty schedule for detecting my brain waves & then jumping into a thread before I can get there???

    It depends.

  184. 184.

    TenguPhule

    July 13, 2017 at 8:33 pm

    @Baud:

    To be fair, if it were any of us, it would be our only crime.

    To be fair, none of us would be stupid enough to try it.

  185. 185.

    efgoldman

    July 13, 2017 at 8:33 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    I have to take several minutes to remind myself that the acronym now stands for “Social Justice Warrioir” and not “Single Jewish Woman.”

    I don’t remind myself of anything. It’s just one more useless (pejorative?) name. like “neoliberal.” It has no real meaning, nor should it. All bullshit. I’m really, really tired of bullshit.

  186. 186.

    bupalos

    July 13, 2017 at 8:33 pm

    @TenguPhule: word.

    And if the world worked the way it should, and that this board both denies and tries to assume it still does…. he would have been. Not that I’m throwing in with you and your stupid guns.

  187. 187.

    Patricia Kayden

    July 13, 2017 at 8:33 pm

    @Major Major Major Major: LOL!! I have two and they’d definitely be more empathetic and decent than the Sleazy White House Occupant. And possibly smarter as well. At the very least there would be no rage tweets.

  188. 188.

    Major Major Major Major

    July 13, 2017 at 8:35 pm

    @bupalos:

    Bubba’s mama baked pie, and her mama before her baked pie, and her mama before her mama baked pie, too.

    Well, there you go, Hillary’s husband would at least be bringing some excellent pie recipes to the White House. Does that count?

  189. 189.

    Patricia Kayden

    July 13, 2017 at 8:35 pm

    @Baud: I blame baud for not fixing this. Lack of leadership on his part. Sad.

  190. 190.

    TenguPhule

    July 13, 2017 at 8:35 pm

    @Tilda Swintons Bald Cap:

    Trump will still be POTUS 4 years from now. There are no magic fixes to this, only the ballot box.

    If our CIA doesn’t eventually step up to the plate and fix this, what the hell are we black budgeting them for?

  191. 191.

    SiubhanDuinne

    July 13, 2017 at 8:35 pm

    @bupalos:

    I have absolutely no idea what that venomous froth-mouthed spittle-flecked rant was meant to convey, and as of now I am going to follow only your recipes for lemon meringue pie.

  192. 192.

    Jeffro

    July 13, 2017 at 8:35 pm

    Sort of a side note: if collusion is really just ‘collecting oppo’ perfectly normal, and all these secret meetings with the Russians were really just normal meetings that ‘anyone would take’…why leave them off the disclosure forms, hedge about them, hide them, lie about them? Iz any of our national media asking that?

    Why’d they lie about them when asked the first (ten) time(s)?

  193. 193.

    schrodingers_cat

    July 13, 2017 at 8:36 pm

    @bupalos: Your not you’re.

  194. 194.

    MomSense

    July 13, 2017 at 8:37 pm

    @Tom Levenson:

    Yes!!

  195. 195.

    efgoldman

    July 13, 2017 at 8:37 pm

    @bupalos: WHAT THE EARTHLY FUCKING FUCK DIFFERENCE DOES IT MAKE NOW, YOU SHITHEAD.

    ETA: Pied, to save what little is left of my blood pressure and my sanity.

  196. 196.

    Patricia Kayden

    July 13, 2017 at 8:38 pm

    @bupalos: So if someone in Secretary Clinton’s mold is the Democratic Presidential candidate in 2020, you’ll vote for …?

  197. 197.

    Chyron HR

    July 13, 2017 at 8:38 pm

    @Baud:

    I can’t believe we’re inventing a fake primary war.

    You’re just mad that you’re so far behind in the hypothetical delegate count.

  198. 198.

    TenguPhule

    July 13, 2017 at 8:38 pm

    @? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:

    The Alien, then

    Which one? The Thing, the Blob, Critters or Calvin from Life?

  199. 199.

    bupalos

    July 13, 2017 at 8:39 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne: I’m not doing that. Follow it back. I was just surprised, in this thing that I’ve identified as a very wishful exercise multiple times, that Clinton’s policy choices are preferable to Pelosi.

    If you want to flesh out how it’s not about policy but temperament or something, go ahead, that’s what I’d like to understand. What is so superior about HC’s “skill set” that would make her a preferable president to NP’s more robust support (now fully baked in) for a full liberal agenda.

  200. 200.

    Patricia Kayden

    July 13, 2017 at 8:40 pm

    @Tilda Swintons Bald Cap: And Kobach is working on the ballot box.

  201. 201.

    Major Major Major Major

    July 13, 2017 at 8:40 pm

    @Chyron HR: fucking superdelegates, this is exactly what happened with the public option!

  202. 202.

    TenguPhule

    July 13, 2017 at 8:41 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    Don’t expect anything to move fast.

    Except Trump trying to shut it all down. By any means possible.

  203. 203.

    Major Major Major Major

    July 13, 2017 at 8:43 pm

    @TenguPhule: capital A, the one that’s sometimes adjacent to Predator.

  204. 204.

    SiubhanDuinne

    July 13, 2017 at 8:44 pm

    @efgoldman:

    EAB (Especially Acronymic Bullshit).

  205. 205.

    randy khan

    July 13, 2017 at 8:44 pm

    @West of the Rockies (been a while):

    Ivanka’s job was to keep Daddy from too many awful things. She didn’t have time for chicanery, much though she wanted to be involved.

  206. 206.

    trollhattan

    July 13, 2017 at 8:44 pm

    Public service announcement: Portland rush hour traffic is just like rush hour everywhere else. Just not a hundred degrees.

    /PSA

  207. 207.

    germy

    July 13, 2017 at 8:45 pm

    So Peter Smith killed himself. That’s news to me.

    This dystopian novel we’re being forced to live in belongs in the slush pile.

  208. 208.

    TenguPhule

    July 13, 2017 at 8:45 pm

    @Major Major Major Major: The proper term in that case is Xenomorph.

    /Nerd!

  209. 209.

    Gin & Tonic

    July 13, 2017 at 8:46 pm

    @bupalos: Maybe the fact that Clinton was running and Pelosi wasn’t?

  210. 210.

    Gin & Tonic

    July 13, 2017 at 8:47 pm

    @efgoldman: How’s your minor surgery thing these days?

  211. 211.

    bupalos

    July 13, 2017 at 8:48 pm

    @SiubhanDuinne: Oh noes!!! You plugged your ears because that was just too TOO for this board to suggest there’s no liberal reason to prefer Hillary to Pelosi? Well, I’ll tell you the secret to great pies then. Cold. Keep the dough cold. If you have some kind of circulatory disorder, much the better. The secret to the flaky crust is to keep the fat in the dough from melting and seeping as a liquid further through the dry particulate than need be. Flakiness is accomplished by enlarging the boundaries of dry particulate to fat. Also, eliminate the liquid (milk?) entirely. melt an equivalent amount of butter, allow it to rise to room temperature, and then commence as if it was milk.

  212. 212.

    tybee

    July 13, 2017 at 8:48 pm

    @Baud: ditto but i could live with smash

  213. 213.

    bupalos

    July 13, 2017 at 8:50 pm

    @Patricia Kayden: Clinton. Assuming the R’s haven’t blown themselves to bits somehow.

  214. 214.

    germy

    July 13, 2017 at 8:51 pm

    Here’s a photo of Nancy Pelosi, age 20, with JFK

  215. 215.

    Chyron HR

    July 13, 2017 at 8:51 pm

    Just a few weeks ago we were being told that Pelosi is “toxic” and has to be purged from the Democratic party, and yet now she’s the ONLY possible choice for the next President. Go fucking figure.

  216. 216.

    bupalos

    July 13, 2017 at 8:52 pm

    @schrodingers_cat: You’re not your what?

  217. 217.

    lollipopguild

    July 13, 2017 at 8:52 pm

    @Patricia Kayden: Yes they can blame Obama and they will blame Obama. They have already cut the commercials and written the talking points blaming Obama. NOTHING is ever their fault. Maybe when every elected GOP critter has to have armed body guards to protect them they will wake up but I really doubt it. They have created an alternate universe and are living in it.

  218. 218.

    efgoldman

    July 13, 2017 at 8:53 pm

    @Gin & Tonic:

    How’s your minor surgery thing these days?

    Thanks for asking.
    Healing nicely, but another two weeks or so (i.e. after the kids come and go next weekend) before I can actually start dialysis.
    Kidney failure is no fun, no fun at all.

  219. 219.

    Omnes Omnibus

    July 13, 2017 at 8:53 pm

    @bupalos: The skill set that makes someone a good legislative leader is different than the skill set that makes someone a good president. Can you name a successful president who came from a background as a successful legislative leader? Also, people are more than a list of policy preferences.

  220. 220.

    WaterGirl

    July 13, 2017 at 8:54 pm

    @Baud: How do you say “I love fat-bottomed girls” in French?

  221. 221.

    Turgidson

    July 13, 2017 at 8:54 pm

    @Tom Levenson:

    Best part of that would be that the very prospect of “President Pelosi” actually happening would cause so many right wing knuckledraggers’ heads to spontaneously combust that even with massive voter suppression, the GOP would be a minority party pretty much everywhere for the indefinite future.

  222. 222.

    WaterGirl

    July 13, 2017 at 8:56 pm

    @Baud: My cocker spaniel, long departed, leading through a seance, would be better than Trump.

  223. 223.

    Gin & Tonic

    July 13, 2017 at 8:57 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    Can you name a successful president who came from a background as a successful legislative leader?

    /Checking to see if raven’s around. No? OK.

    For at least domestic measures of “successful”, a case can be made for LBJ.

    Yes, I know. Still…

  224. 224.

    MomSense

    July 13, 2017 at 8:57 pm

    @Major Major Major Major:

    My dog would not be a better president. She’s constantly showing everyone her crotch. She steals things and holds them ransom for cheese. She never sleeps and sometimes she howls for no good reason. If she had thumbs I’m sure she would tweet offensive things about cats, squirrels, and birds.

  225. 225.

    germy

    July 13, 2017 at 8:59 pm

    @MomSense:

    She’s constantly showing everyone her crotch. She steals things and holds them ransom for cheese. She never sleeps and sometimes she howls for no good reason.

    And this would be different from our current situation how?

  226. 226.

    Omnes Omnibus

    July 13, 2017 at 8:59 pm

    @Gin & Tonic: LBJ is the only arguable example I can think of.

  227. 227.

    WaterGirl

    July 13, 2017 at 9:00 pm

    @Baud: @?BillinGlendaleCA: It’s like my pup who makes his own fun if there’s not enough going on.

    If we want to argue, let’s argue about who we want to see perp-walked the most, or perp-walked first.

  228. 228.

    bupalos

    July 13, 2017 at 9:02 pm

    @? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: They actually wouldn’t be in agreement. Pelosi would look to stop the pipeline, Hillary would look to “make it work for everyone, all of the above.” I’ll agree, that’s largely a function of where they are as politicians, but at least AT LEAST Pelosi comes from there and is that.

    It is past the election, and we all do agree that Hillary isn’t running and nancy isn’t running and it doesn’t matter, so this isn’t some Russian plant or whatever- how do people here get right with the “super predator” thing? That was straight out “it’s ok to pretend you think black people are animals to get elected, that will work out fine. It’s a huge fucking thing in my book, and yes, I did vote for her, canvas for her, GOTV for her even if I did it a little half ass because I truly didn’t believe America was the shitty country that it’s since proved to be by electing Herr Shitstain.

  229. 229.

    MomSense

    July 13, 2017 at 9:04 pm

    @germy:

    Maybe she could do a stinto on Fox and Friends. She’d be perfect for that.

  230. 230.

    WaterGirl

    July 13, 2017 at 9:04 pm

    @Uncle Cosmo: The same thing happens to me with various commenters, but I try to think of it as a service they are providing. :-)

  231. 231.

    Major Major Major Major

    July 13, 2017 at 9:04 pm

    @TenguPhule: I know, but it should have been obvious by context. You were talking about the Predator and he used a capital A.

    @MomSense: that sounds much better than trump.

  232. 232.

    SiubhanDuinne

    July 13, 2017 at 9:07 pm

    @efgoldman:

    Kidney failure is no fun, no fun at all.

    I am so sad for you. I doubt it will ever be fun, but I do hope it will become, at the very least, routine. And if a transplant is in your future, I want it to be successful in every possible way.

  233. 233.

    Shalimar

    July 13, 2017 at 9:08 pm

    @bupalos: “Skill set” means Pelosi is great at fundraising, organizing and keeping a diverse caucus in line on important votes. She is the most effective Congressional leader of the last 50 years. She is terrible at public relations and debating, which matter much more for a President.

  234. 234.

    TenguPhule

    July 13, 2017 at 9:09 pm

    @MomSense: Still better then Trump.

  235. 235.

    bupalos

    July 13, 2017 at 9:10 pm

    @Omnes Omnibus: You’re talking about a VERY small sample set. Can you name a successful leader that was installed after impeachment instead of winning an election? It’s a very particular wishful exercise we’re doing here.

  236. 236.

    TenguPhule

    July 13, 2017 at 9:11 pm

    @Major Major Major Major:

    I know, but it should have been obvious by context. You were talking about the Predator and he used a capital A.

    I’ve poking fun at him. Also, I am a scifi nerd about proper names and classifications of killer xenos..

  237. 237.

    TenguPhule

    July 13, 2017 at 9:11 pm

    @bupalos:

    . Can you name a successful leader that was installed after impeachment instead of winning an election?

    There is always a first time for everything.

  238. 238.

    TenguPhule

    July 13, 2017 at 9:12 pm

    @WaterGirl:

    If we want to argue, let’s argue about who we want to see perp-walked the most, or perp-walked first.

    Walked, nothing.

    Dragged out by their feet, so their heads hit each and every concrete slab on the ground.

  239. 239.

    bupalos

    July 13, 2017 at 9:13 pm

    @Shalimar: I’ll disagree that she’s worse than HRC at PR. I think this was true 5 years ago but is especially true today. And her legislative skills and relations would serve her very well as potus, I’d argue better than hllary’s skills would serve her.

  240. 240.

    Omnes Omnibus

    July 13, 2017 at 9:14 pm

    @bupalos:

    It’s a very particular wishful exercise we’re doing here.

    Yes, and I would choose the person who I think would do the better job.

  241. 241.

    Dave

    July 13, 2017 at 9:19 pm

    @bupalos: Oh if we are doing that then I want Obama back. Maybe Michelle even if she is too smart to want a damned thing to do with the office.

  242. 242.

    a thousand flouncing lurkers (was fidelio)

    July 13, 2017 at 9:20 pm

    @bupalos: “policy choices” are not equal to “skill sets” Nancy Pelosi is God-empress of managing the House Democratic caucus, its factions and affiliates and of coordinating with the Senate. This is not a skill distributed evenly amongst humanity, or even among House Democrats, which is why all the attempts to replace her have ended up dead in the water. She would be wasted in the White House, and I am not sure we could quickly come up with anyone else who could, in the event of the hoped-for GOP collapse, hit the ground running to take full advantage of the situation even half as well as the Honorable Minority Leader. Again, this isn’t a question of policy choices; it’s a question of having the specific skills, abilities, and experience to Get Shit Done.

    Go study civics, starting with How A Bill Becomes Law, and well as, specifically, how the U.S. House of Representatives works before you post again. I’ll be looking at Key Lime pie recipes, although this is not Meringue Weather right now.

  243. 243.

    Citizen Scientist

    July 13, 2017 at 9:22 pm

    @Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism: wow, three? Did insurance give you trouble?

  244. 244.

    Iowa Old Lady

    July 13, 2017 at 9:22 pm

    My recollection is that there was an effort to remove Agnew before moving to impeach Nixon because Agnew was susceptible to more legal trouble. I may be misremembering that. It was a similar situation in that both men were horrifying.

  245. 245.

    Brachiator

    July 13, 2017 at 9:54 pm

    @a thousand flouncing lurkers (was fidelio): Why is anyone going on about skill sets? If both Trump and Pence were removed from office (an extremely rare possibility) and Pelosi became president, the universe would immediately become a better place.

  246. 246.

    trnc

    July 13, 2017 at 9:55 pm

    @?BillinGlendaleCA:

    They always say Cruz is a good debater and lawyer, they never said he was good at math.

    I’m still waiting for any evidence that he’s a good debater I have yet to hear a convincing argument of anything come out of his pie hole.

  247. 247.

    frosty

    July 13, 2017 at 10:04 pm

    Late to the party but i’ll enjoy my pie as I finish the comments.

  248. 248.

    mainmata

    July 13, 2017 at 10:11 pm

    @Tom Levenson: Huh? That would mean going through the entire Cabinet succession order first. Impossible.

  249. 249.

    Omnes Omnibus

    July 13, 2017 at 10:16 pm

    @trnc: He won competitions.

    @mainmata: V.P., Speaker of the House, Pres. Pro Tem of the Senate, then cabinet. Source.

  250. 250.

    J R in WV

    July 13, 2017 at 10:26 pm

    @bupalos:

    @Baud: talk to me about these ways she’s more “presidential.”

    I find this utterly fascinating. This shouldn’t be a question, but I guess it is.

    Well, for starters, Secretary Clinton has four years as Secretary of State, meeting world leaders, something at which she has about 3 years and 9 months more experience than Congresswoman and Minority Leader Pelosi has.

  251. 251.

    mainmata

    July 13, 2017 at 10:27 pm

    @Mike in DC: I absolutely don’t get this business about Pelosi/Clinton becoming President. Hasn’t any of you looked at the actual order of Presidential succession?

  252. 252.

    Omnes Omnibus

    July 13, 2017 at 10:32 pm

    @mainmata: Have you?

    The discussion was based on a hypothetical posted above.

  253. 253.

    J R in WV

    July 13, 2017 at 10:50 pm

    @Major Major Major Major:

    No dog, a great one!!

  254. 254.

    dww44

    July 13, 2017 at 11:34 pm

    @Patricia Kayden: They can always ask Trump;he’s pretty adept at finding novel ways to blame Obama, Clinton, and Democrats.

  255. 255.

    a thousand flouncing lurkers (was fidelio)

    July 13, 2017 at 11:47 pm

    @Brachiator: Oh, right, that’s true. My bad.

  256. 256.

    No One You Know

    July 14, 2017 at 12:29 am

    @TenguPhule: Yep. If I had to corrupt a nations’ electoral processes, I’d make sure I didn’t care which individual from the corrupt party took over. If I owned them all, I could even get plausible deniability out of it, playing off one against another while counting on party discipline to get me the votes I ‘paid for’ or the cover I need. And that’s true whether I’m named Putin, Koch, or Mercer.

  257. 257.

    Seth Owen

    July 14, 2017 at 12:52 am

    @Jeffro: They have to be confirmed by the Senate, so it may not happen, depending upon who is picked. Is there anyone in the GOP today like Gerald Ford who can get uncontroversial support?

  258. 258.

    NotMax

    July 14, 2017 at 4:43 am

    @Mike in DC

    Not really. In the case of succession, swearing in is traditional (and an expected nicety) but whomever it is IS the president the moment the high office is vacated. The oath (again, in the case of succession) can be sworn to hours or days later as a public affirmation but confers no office unto itself and is not a requirement under the 25th amendment..

  259. 259.

    Uncle Cosmo

    July 14, 2017 at 8:01 am

    @Patricia Kayden: Late to the thread, as always, but note just FTR that you can’t spell Kobach without spelling Koch.

  260. 260.

    Uncle Cosmo

    July 14, 2017 at 8:20 am

    @Iowa Old Lady:

    My recollection is that there was an effort to remove Agnew before moving to impeach Nixon because Agnew was susceptible to more legal trouble.

    US Attorney for MD George Beall had Agnew dead to rights on felony charges of accepting bribes as Baltimore County Executive (1963-66), Governor (1967-9) & Veep. Beall, scion of the state’s most prominent Republican family, noted the storm clouds gathering over Nixon’s head & concluded that getting Agnew out of the line of succession to the Presidency ASAP was more important than an eventual conviction. With that in mind Agnew was allowed to plead nolo contendere (“no contest”) to the charges in exchange for resigning the Vice Presidency. (ETA: In October 1973. Gerry Ford was nominated & confirmed as VP under provisions of the 25th Amendment later that year, & succeeded to the Presidency when Tricky Dick resigned the next August.)

    Somewhere on my bookshelf I have a copy of Beall’s recounting of the process, ominously titled A Heartbeat Away.

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