Huh. https://t.co/9fnXx4OZHv pic.twitter.com/SxB14xr8S7
— Daniel W. Drezner (@dandrezner) August 10, 2017
Just as the Cold War turned us all into Kremlinologists, dissecting every news release to seek out hidden agendas and changes in bureaucratic positioning, the 2016 election disaster has turned us into Trumpologists. In that murky light, this is a most dissectable article from Bloomberg Businessweek:
When news broke on Aug. 3 that Special Counsel Robert Mueller had begun using a grand jury in Washington to gather evidence related to his Russia probe, it appeared to catch the White House off guard. Although many news outlets were reporting the story, Ty Cobb, just four days on the job as the president’s lawyer, issued a statement saying he didn’t know about it, even as Jay Sekulow, another member of Trump’s legal staff, went on Fox News to say once again that the president himself wasn’t under investigation.
As Mueller adds experienced prosecutors and broadens his investigation, Trump’s legal team still appears disorganized and understaffed. An army of well-paid lawyers would help the president get in front of the investigation: preparing responses to allegations before hearing about them from prosecutors or reporters, anticipating where Mueller is going, and developing a counternarrative to stymie him. Junior staffers could spend all night researching case law or obstruction of justice and conspiracy statutes; they could be available at a moment’s notice to draft pleadings challenging Mueller’s requests to interview witnesses or gather documents.
Instead, Trump’s defense has been almost entirely reactive—responding to the latest bombshell report with uninformed statements by surrogates. The strategy adopted by those close to Trump, if not his legal team, has been to try to discredit Mueller’s investigation by pointing out potential conflicts of interest or political biases that may exist among his investigators. “I don’t get any sense that they’re trying to get ahead of anything,” says Don Goldberg, who worked in the White House Counsel’s Office during the Clinton administration. “You wonder about whether the top people at the White House really understand what they’re stepping into.”…
…[T]he legal team largely consists of three people: John Dowd, who replaced Kasowitz as Trump’s chief personal attorney; Sekulow, a Christian-rights lawyer who serves as the public face of the defense team; and, as of July 31, Cobb, who will oversee the White House response to the probe. Both Dowd and Cobb spent the bulk of their careers at top-notch D.C. firms. Dowd, 76, was a longtime partner at Akin Gump Strauss Hauer & Feld, while Cobb, 66, spent 28 years at Hogan Lovells. Neither brings the resources of those big firms with them in their defense of the president. Dowd left Akin Gump two years ago to strike out on his own, while Cobb had to resign from Hogan Lovells to take the White House job. Dowd represented Senator John McCain in the 1989 Keating Five investigation of lawmakers improperly intervening to save a failing bank during the savings and loan crisis. More recently he defended hedge fund manager Raj Rajaratnam, who was convicted of insider-trading charges. “I know John Dowd, and he’s a very fine lawyer, but it’s a job that usually requires backup,” says Amy Sabrin, a retired Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom partner who worked for Bill Clinton on the Paula Jones sexual harassment case. Dowd, Cobb, and the White House declined to comment for this article…
If Mueller’s prosecutors eventually get into the president’s business dealings and start following the money, Trump would also need experts, such as forensic accountants, says Sabrin, the retired Skadden attorney. He’d have to be willing to open his files to people outside his inner circle. For a president known for keeping his financial records under wraps, some lawyers in Washington say that’s unlikely….
The whole article is well worth reading, but IMO the main message seems to be Dear WH occupants: You guys have NO IDEA what a world of hurt you’ve blundered into.
Thoughts?
Baud
Fixed
Quinerly
Read and linked to this this AM. Gave me some hope. But…. sometimes I feel like I’m on a roller coaster and Baud’s running mate threw up on me.
lollipopguild
Trump knows nothing and understands nothing therefore his people are pretty much the same. “I have all the best people”.
Baud
@Quinerly: At least he didn’t set up a private email server.
In other news
lamh36
dmsilev
@Baud: Nah, any big firm giving serious consideration to taking on Trump as a client would demand a big up-front payment. They care about their reputation as well, and Trump doesn’t exactly come across as a client who listens to and heeds lawyer advice.
MomSense
@Quinerly:
Worst. Roller coaster. Ever.
smintheus
Also, because it’s Trump, it’ll be a lot harder to add good lawyers later in the process than sooner because it becomes clearer by the day that the client remains out of control. Plus some lawyers are likely to get fed up and quit, making it even clearer that others should stay away from Trump Inc.
TenguPhule
@MomSense:
So much falling, not enough rising. And who turned out all the lights?
lamh36
@Baud: too true…Trump barely seems to pay folks he actually owes…
dmsilev
What could possibly go wrong?
TenguPhule
@Quinerly:
This is why Baud should have picked the piano playing chicken.
Thoughtful David
Hat tip to whoever it was that linked to this in a previous thread (rikyrah?):
About media complicity in Trump.
The day after the election I canceled my WaPo subscription. Ain’t never going back. Those treason-abettors will never get another cent from me.
smintheus
@lamh36: Should be good for American competitiveness. Those have to be Obama-era standards he’s gunning for, right?
Yarrow
@dmsilev: Didn’t the good law firms say they wouldn’t take him as a client because they knew he wouldn’t pay?
TenguPhule
@Baud:
I wouldn’t rule that out at this point.
Everything else he’s blamed her for turned out to be him.
MomSense
@TenguPhule:
And the ride never ends. Stop this crazy ride, I want to get off!
smintheus
@TenguPhule: They’re using an RNC server; set it up almost immediately after taking office.
Mnemosyne
@lamh36:
Geez, even the commenters at the Hill think it’s a bad idea.
But it’s not going to do automakers a whole lot of good unless they want to stop selling cars in California. We have our own emissions standards and you can’t sell a car here unless it meets them.
Yarrow
Re: Mueller’s team, saw this:
Mueller ain’t playing.
Gravenstone
@Baud: Demonstrably both. But the bottom line likely always wins out over reputation.
TenguPhule
@Mnemosyne:
Only until The SC says you must conform to the lowest common denominator.
I’m only half kidding.
Yarrow
@Mnemosyne: I thought there was some issue that state emissions standards couldn’t be higher than federal ones. Lawsuits pending. Or something. Maybe I’m remembering wrong.
debbie
@dmsilev:
Trump has proven himself to be the kind of guy who never pays for anything up front.
trollhattan
“Tell you what, I won’t pay you up front but here are Tiffany, an ’87 Caddy limo, gold of course, membership at two of my golf resorts and a hat. Are we good here?”
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
My thoughts?
Three sticks “trumps” two scoops
And just to give you all nightmares:
Trump: Are these my two scoops of ice cream, Melania?
Ivanka: Those are my boobs, dad! And I’m your daughter, Ivanka!
Trump: You can call me “daddy” if you like.
different-church-lady
He could always rely on a public defender.
mike in dc
Donnie, Paulie and Jared have all had lawyers quit on them. The term of art “against legal advice”(ALA) comes to mind. Trump won’t realize how fucked he is until Mueller’s referral is made to the DOJ(and Congress, most likely). By then, it’s too late for even great lawyers to clean up after his shitstorm.
Yarrow
@trollhattan: Trump probably thinks they should pay him for the “honor” and “privilege” of representing him.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@Yarrow:
Jeffrey Yohai should watch his back. Putin doesn’t like snitches. And he no longer has any compunctions against murdering American citizens on American soil
Millard Filmore
I was thinking along those same lines during the election, and that did not work out to my satisfaction. Maybe his circle of friends, out to Ryan/McConnell and beyond have a plan to use the upcoming war with NK to make Trump president for the duration of the crisis (more accurately, for life).
trollhattan
@Yarrow:
CA and cooperating states are grandfathered in via primacy, as CA’s emissions regs preceded the feds. Has been upheld in court during…oh…every Republican administration.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@Millard Filmore:
If “by life” you mean until Kelly, McMaster, and the Secret Service murder the loudmouth twerp in the bunker after starting a nuclear war, then yes Trump could be “president-for-life” using the NK crisis.
Kay
It’s just amazing what assholes they are. “We want to reduce our payroll”
No wonder there are so many leaks. Everyone who works there hates them, and rightly so. They’re horrible people. They’re incompetent but that’s not the half of it- they’re strutting, egotistical incompetents who never shut up.
Assholes. Rude, ignorant, loud, know-nothings.
Chitown Kev
You would think it an honor, in a way, and definitely a challenge of the highest order to represent a POTUS…but not true for 45…also noted that in this particular case, Twitler does not seem to be taking Bannon’s advice (For Trump to hire Dershowitz wouldn’t be the worst move in the world…but Dershowitz wants to get paid and he probably fears that he would get stiffed…and there is no prestege in defending Trump).
I know that an investigation of this magnitude will take some time but I can’t help but wish, at times, that this would go a little faster…especially after Twit’s NK comments…but I do want the job to be as thourgh as possible…we only get one crack at this.
Millard Filmore
@Yarrow: You may be misremembering something, but California needs to seek special permission from the feds at regular intervals to use its own air standards.
epa.gov/state-and-local-transportation/vehicle-emissions-california-waivers-and-authorizations
Yarrow
@trollhattan: Thanks. I knew I’d seen something about it, but obviously had it backwards.
Mnemosyne
@Yarrow:
Here’s a comprehensive article from the LA Times that Michael Hiltzik wrote in March of this year.
Short version: many Republican administrations have tried to conquer California’s regulations, none have succeeded.
Quinerly
@MomSense:
Actually no. Trump and I could be on the roller coaster, for some bizarre reason. WORST. Roller. Coaster. Ever.
SatanicPanic
@Chitown Kev: Dershowitz has been defending him in public for free, he might as well be his lawyer too
Kay
Donald Trump is such a great manager he would rather shit all over the people who work for him than get on the wrong side of Putin.
That’s how great at managing he is. Everyone who works for him will absolutely loathe him, if they don’t already, and they do judging by how something unflattering that makes him look like a bumbling fool leaks every 20 minutes.
Schlemazel
@dmsilev:
Something something about a man who is his own lawyer
Yup, sounds like the tangerine tantrum.
Davebo
@Baud:
Retainers are required for good reason. Once they dry up you’re on your own!
Splitting Image
It occurs to me that Trump is staffing up his legal team the same way he staffed up the Cabinet: he filled the top jobs and didn’t bother with the grunts up and down the chain who are supposed to report to the top guys.
As a result, every department has a guy who can go on TV and say that everything is peachy, but none of them can count on the manpower or the expertise to deal with a real crisis. It could be problematic for Trump down the line if his legal team has the same problems as his cabinet.
Anyone care to place some quatloos on whether the lawyers mentioned in the article are still working for Trump when the fur really starts to fly?
Villago Delenda Est
The way I heard it, some lawyer at a high profile firm summed up the rejection of Donald for two reasons: He doesn’t listen, and he doesn’t pay.
MikeBoyScout
Trump Inc is way in over its head with no idea of the depths and currents.
We need to work and hope he doesn’t drag us to death with him.
Hate our best interests depends at all on Republicans.
Villago Delenda Est
@SatanicPanic: Dershowitz has reduced himself to the status of an ambulance chaser. Fuck him.
dm
@lamh36: it’s getting close to rolling back buggy-whip regulations. We’re probably past peak internal combustion engine.
rikyrah
Dear Mr. Mueller,
Please hurry up. We don’t want to witness another Hiroshima or Nagasaki.
Thanks,
America.
Yarrow
More related to Manafort:
The email snippet:
“Mr. Manafort is in the process of retaining his former counsel, Miller & Chevalier, to represent him in the office of special counsel investigation. As of today WilmerHale no longer represents Mr. Manafort.”
Follow up tweet:
Looks like Manafort’s lawyers fired him. Did he lie to them?
mai naem mobile
I am surprised any good lawyer would want their name attached to Dolt 45. They can’t need the money if they’re that good. If I was that good and Dolt asked with what he’s basically accused of I would say no.
Yarrow
@Kay:
Donald Trump knows if he gets on the wrong side of Putin things will turn very, very bad for him very quickly. He’ll do anything to show his loyalty to Putin in an attempt to keep that from happening. It’s completely obvious that he’s owned by Putin. Just look at what he does.
different-church-lady
I’m so old I can remember when Hillary Clinton shouldn’t run to save the country all the drama and trouble of endless investigations.
rikyrah
Caroline O. @RVAwonk
Insurers cite the Trump administration’s hostile policy messages as a substantial reason for higher premiums next yr
Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (Formerly Mumphrey, et al.)
These fucking people…
Sometimes it just hits me out of the blue, this is really happening, and there’s going to be a record of all this. We’re going to be looking back on this, years from now, teaching children in a history class or paging through an almanac, and there it’ll be, in black and white, printed on actual paper, along with the Battle of Gettysburg or the Four Freedoms. How are we going to explain to anybody, 50 years from now, that Donald Trump really, truly was the president of the United States, just like Lincoln or Woodrow Wilson or Dwight Eisenhower? This is so surreal.
Mnemosyne
@different-church-lady:
I was going to laugh at this, but I would have started crying instead. ?
rikyrah
John Whitehouse @existentialfish
How the Jeffrey Lord experience started: CNN took requests from Trump himself on who they should hire nytimes.com/2017/04/04/magazine/cnn-had-a-problem-donald-trump-solved-it.html?_r=0 …
Yarrow
@Millard Filmore: Thanks. Maybe that’s what I remember hearing or reading.
dm
@Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (Formerly Mumphrey, et al.): Donald Trump really was the president of the United States, just like Warren Harding and William McKinley.
lollipopguild
@Kay: Tell us what you really think, do not hold back.
No Drought No More
I was taught of the gnarly power of the feds at a young age, and took the lesson to heart as a kid. My father worked for years at a Public Health Service hospital, and would tell of a murder that occurred on the hospital’s grounds, which was located on federal property. The cops never did solve it, but each and every year the FBI would return to the hospital for a day or two, just to reinvestigate the case. They did for many, many years. His message was loud and clear: never fuck with the federal government. By the time I was in high school and Warren Burger advised Americans to avoid the U.S. legal system at all costs if they possibly could, I was already a true believer.
Chyron HR
Hypothetically, if a hypothetical blog commenter worked at a hypothetical accounting firm with a hypothetical traitor as a client it would hypothetically be hard for them to keep their hypothetical mouth shut. Hypothetically.
different-church-lady
@Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (Formerly Mumphrey, et al.): People will be reading the 2089 version of Wikipedia and going, “Da fuk? That actually happened?”
If we’re lucky, they won’t be reading it the way we read the entry on Hitler or Stalin.
If we’re extremely lucky, there will be anyone at all around to read it.
lollipopguild
@Chyron HR: I like your phraseology.
Adria McDowell
OT, but have any of you seen this: usatoday.com/story/news/politics/onpolitics/2017/08/10/52-percent-republicans-would-support-postponi…
I don’t even know what to think. SMDH.
Yarrow
@Chyron HR: If anyone hypothetically might be acquainted with such a hypothetical blog commenter, it would be interesting to find out what the hypothetical commenter hypothetically might know.
Schlemazel
@Chyron HR:
I work in IT security, I have been involved in some large scale work that is not for public consumption. If I were to hypothetically want to discuss those things on a blog I would use tor to connect, create a throw away account, say what needed to be said with enough fluff & generic stuff in the comment that while people might suspect it was me they could not ever prove it. I would then remove tor from my machine and never mention it again. Hypothetically that is
different-church-lady
@Adria McDowell: The other 75% of the country would support new elections right this second.
Major Major Major Major
@Adria McDowell: this is a must read if you’re worried about that theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/08/poll-republicans/536472/
different-church-lady
@Schlemazel: But isn’t the NSA storing every one of your keystrokes?
Yarrow
@Adria McDowell: I’ve seen that report today. It’s appalling. These people are authoritarian fascists.
Schlemazel
@different-church-lady:
not unless you interest them. NSA is very interested in tor users but that is very low level stuff, they are looking for bigger fish
rikyrah
Watched Hardball, and the look on Bill Richardson’s face was priceless. He’s been dealing with North Korea for years, and is horrified by Dolt45.
different-church-lady
@Schlemazel: No no no, I remember quite clearly that the NSA is storing EVERYTHING EVERYONE DOES on the internet. There was even a PowerPoint!
Schlemazel
@different-church-lady:
well, saying nothing is always an option
Bobby Thomson
@dmsilev: an attorney who represents himself has a fool for a client. An ignorant layperson with shit for brains who ignores his attorneys is a recipe for a malpractice suit at best.
kindness
What you bet we all know Trump’s tax returns by next year.
different-church-lady
@Schlemazel: I thought I’d been doing that all along.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@Adria McDowell:
Obligatory delusional rightwing tweets from that piece:
different-church-lady
@kindness: Why? They’re going to survive nuclear winter?
different-church-lady
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: Please don’t do that again.
gkoutnik
Ty Cobb’s only 66? That can’t be right. He had a 40 game hitting streak in 1911.
Roger Moore
@Chyron HR:
If a hypothetical person hypothetically knew something actually important, it might be better for them to discuss it with a hypothetical special counsel rather than blab about it on a hypothetical blog.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: Why do Republicans hate peace and prosperity?
rikyrah
Nina Turner’s Inferior Donuts
Her tone-deaf remarks are an insult to the United States’ legacy of civil disobedience
Jeremy Fassler
Perhaps you’ve heard of Nina Turner, one of the few notable women of color to endorse Bernie Sanders, and one of the only women in politics the alt-left doesn’t have a problem with. Find something in Kamala Harris’s record that they don’t like and they’ll gleefully try to tear her down, but they’ll never say a bad word about Turner, as in this fawning profile by resident Paste Magazine BernieBro Shane Ryan.
Turner is a former Ohio State Senator who was appointed to her position in 2008 and won re-election running unopposed in her district. In 2014, she ran for Ohio’s Secretary of State, the first time her name was on a statewide ballot, and she lost by twenty-five points.
Until mid-2015, she supported Hillary Clinton, but then switched to
Bernie Sanders and became one of his most outspoken supporters. From there, she burned a lot of bridges with the Democratic Party at large: she was not allowed to speak at the Democratic National Convention (most likely for not endorsing Hillary Clinton), then considered running on the Green Party ticket with Jill Stein. Now she’s the head of Our Revolution, the far left SuperPAC that she took over from Jeff “Comic Book Guy from The Simpsons” Weaver (“Worst – SuperPAC head – ever!”), and has actually said she would endorse Republicans and third-party candidates if they support single payer.
Drunk on a thin ration of power, Turner symbolizes the worst aspects of the Bernie Sanders movement, harboring an attitudes towards the “establishment” base of the party that is alarmingly similar to the DudeBros of Chapo Traphouse, who infamously demanded on their podcast that the Party “bend the knee” to them. In an interview with The Nation, when asked how she would seek help from the DNC, DCCC and other fundraising bases
affiliated with the party, she replied, “I don’t think it is our job nor
our obligation to fit in. It’s their job to fit in with us.” This may
appeal to the Bernie-or-Bust crowd, but it is extremely alienating to
the rest of us who understand that the ideological divide within the
Democratic Party is not Democrats vs. Democrats, but Democrats and fringe crazies who thrive on any and all attention, even when it is overwhelmingly negative.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@Major Major Major Major:
From your article:
Anne Laurie
@Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (Formerly Mumphrey, et al.):
Same way historians now explain Franklin Pierce, Millard Fillmore, or Warren Harding: Placeholders ‘elected’ for all the wrong reasons, surrounded by grifters & thieves. Exemplars of the old joke that American voters will do the right thing, in the end — after they’ve gone through all the worst possible alternatives.
Roger Moore
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
Not enough chances for looting and murdering Those People.
MattF
Trump’s strategy is denial and blame-shifting. And that’s his whole strategy. I knew a tax lawyer who made sure to tell prospective clients if he thought they might go to jail for what they were accused of. And it had a, um, salutary effect on his prospective clients. But you can’t do that with Trump.
Tom
@TenguPhule: As a general thing, the Supreme Court majority may decide to go full asshole, but the two thirds of the GDP that voted for Hillary aren’t likely to put up with it and voila! constitutional crisis.
Yarrow
@gkoutnik: Apparently lawyer Ty Cobb is a relative of baseball Ty Cobb.
Bobby Thomson
@Villago Delenda Est: at least ambulance chasers practice law. Dershowitz has become a PR flack like Lanny Davis.
Iowa Old Lady
@Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (Formerly Mumphrey, et al.): 50 years from now? I want someone to explain it to me today!
Major Major Major Major
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: yeah, they were primed, the number would have been lower (by some amount at least) if it was the first question. It’s still a horrifying answer of course.
Uncle Ebeneezer
His attorney is named Ty Cobb??? Like the notoriously racist baseaball player. Coincidence?…
Frankensteinbeck
@Yarrow:
God damn, is it. The only question is how Putin owns him, and Mueller will answer that for us soon enough.
@Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (Formerly Mumphrey, et al.):
Racial backlash to desegregation and the first black president. Every historian will consider it obvious and people will have trouble understanding why anyone thought it wasn’t about race.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@rikyrah:
She’s got a huge chip on her shoulder. When it came to actually running against another person in an election she lost. What credibility does she have?
MomSense
Is it true that Manafort’s son in law flipped?
Hellbastard
Congresswoman Cathy McMorris Rodgers is livestreaming a town hall at her Facebook page right now. Rough crowd.
Mike in NC
@Adria McDowell: No secret that these people endorse fascism.
Anne Laurie
@Adria McDowell: That’s a narrow margin out of 650 people, winnowed down from those who answered the phone, agreed to respond, and identified themselves as Republican. And, as the pollsters pointed out, it was presented as a totally theoretical worst-case “national emergency” situation. All the people paying for the poll were willing to extrapolate is that there is a hardcore base of extremists who say they’ll follow Trump off any cliff… which we pretty well knew already.
You spin the political centrifuge hard enough, you’ll sift out a froth of “believers”. Doesn’t mean there’s any more of them than there were in October 2016 or 2014 or 2008, but the Trump (dis)organization has kept the centrifuge rumbling to a degree that normal politicians don’t.
rikyrah
Matthew YglesiasVerified account @mattyglesias
Matthew Yglesias Retweeted southpaw
Why are NSC memos being sent to the president’s son?
Another Scott
Dunno if this has been mentioned, but the flooding in New Orleans sounds like a whole flock of chickens coming home to roost.
Lots of finger pointing, lots of history of corrupt and incompetent management, and lack of investment. And thunderstorms predicted for the next 8+ days.
This is just a small, entirely predictable and entirely preventable, illustration of what the USA is in for if we don’t start electing enough people who take their jobs seriously.
Fingers crossed for the people of New Orleans. :-(
Cheers,
Scott.
different-church-lady
@Uncle Ebeneezer: Notorious, yes, but perhaps not accurate:
marduk
“thoughts” are that the Trump team is clearly going to take a political approach because they’re guilty as sin under the law.
debbie
@rikyrah:
NPR interviewed Max Baccus, past Ambassador to China, this morning and he was also appalled.
tobie
@rikyrah: What is it with Ryans and Bernie fandom? First we had Ryan Copper and now Shane Ryan.
Baud
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: Unlike some of the other lefties, her trajectory makes me a little sad.
Frankensteinbeck
@Hellbastard:
Are they pissed at her for voting for Deathcare? Because I would love to find out that the Hell Republicans have been getting hasn’t calmed down because we won that round.
Baud
Heh. I learned about this just the other day.
i.redd.it/lacn8xieexez.png
Hellbastard
@Frankensteinbeck: The crowd seems pro-ACA. Folks in this district have been requesting a townhall for a while now. She sprung this on her constituents with a just a few days of notice. People who wanted to attend had to RSVP and tickets were randomly (or “randomly”) allocated. She seems pretty shook.
schrodingers_cat
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: Because I have quit watching TV since I moved in late October last year, I have no idea what this Turner person looks or sounds like.
TenguPhule
@Millard Filmore:
Which may be unexpectedly short.
Yarrow
@Frankensteinbeck: Yep. My guess is it’s a whole bunch of stuff from money-laundering to collusion with the Russians to help his campaign to whatever the “pee pee tape” is (or is a placeholder for–rumors are it’s way worse than anyone thinks).
@Bobby Thomson: Dershowitz is just gross. Why is he supporting Trump so obviously and publicly? The rumors are disgusting, having to do with Trump’s ties to Jeffrey Epstein, Dershowitz’s ties to him as well and may involve Bill Clinton. Underage girls. Sex trafficking. Just awful stuff. Politico had an article in May about a case going to trial that was abruptly canceled and settled a few days later:
The whole thing is awful. If Trump is involved in that sort of thing and Putin knows about it that may be a big piece of blackmail.
TenguPhule
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: Subtlety. Work on it.
lumpkin
@Mnemosyne:
I’m pretty sure Oregon, Washington and maybe some east coast states have adopted CA emissions standards also. I think the EPA can rescind states’ authority to do that, however. And they probably will.
Yarrow
@MomSense: I posted the article above that says he did. Two sources confirm.
rikyrah
Kyle GriffinVerified account @kylegriffin1
Manafort’s son-in-law reportedly met with federal investigators.
Frankensteinbeck
@Hellbastard:
AH HA HA HA HA. Good. It’s time the Third Rail of American Politics electrocutes some motherfuckers.
TenguPhule
@Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (Formerly Mumphrey, et al.):
Talk about optimism.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Baud: It seems to be self inflicted.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@TenguPhule:
You and I both know that’s what would likely go down. My point was that the likelihood of the GOP so blatantly discarding democracy is nill
lamh36
MomSense
@Yarrow:
Wow. Life comes at you fast.
TenguPhule
@Tom:
Feature, not a bug with these batshit insane Republicans.
MomSense
@lamh36:
Nonononono. My god this is a nightmare.
Baud
@?BillinGlendaleCA: She’s ultimately responsible. I just feel her choices more easily could have gone in another more productive direction. Not based on anything. Just a feeling.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@lamh36:
Oh god. Please don’t let it be nuclear.
Frankensteinbeck
@lamh36:
Trump will tell any audience what he thinks they want to hear. We know what Graham wants to hear. This changes exactly nothing. Trump is a posturing coward with a well established history of aggressive talk followed by hiding in a corner. While this is going to utterly destroy America’s leadership position in the world, it’s not a recipe for new wars.
Baud
@lamh36:
All that follows is completely meaningless.
Yarrow
@MomSense: Guess we’ll see what happened. I find it interesting that such news leaked out. Seems like the leaks from that side are strategic. Mueller’s group has been very disciplined and tight-lipped. When something leaks it seems like they want someone to know something. Is this a way to increase pressure on Manafort? Maybe he hasn’t been fully cooperating and they want him to know they know more than he thinks they do.
Frankensteinbeck
@Baud:
Bingo.
@MomSense: and @? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:
See above.
TS
Despite no ambassador and continual insults from Trump the Australian PM has pledged to follow him over the abyss. I weep for lost sanity.
Baud
@Frankensteinbeck: I’m still more concerned that Trump will egg Kim on enough that Kim will make the first move.
TenguPhule
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:
I’m not that optimistic. Every fucker around Trump is shit and that includes the Generals who rallied to his banner. The SS is a question mark at this point. Every single institution and safeguard has turned out to be wet cardboard when the chips are down.
Republicans haven’t been punished for their sins, they’ve been rewarded.
West of the Rockies (been a while)
I just heard Gorka speak for the first time. Sounds like Milo Y — smug, ignorant, insufferably pleased with himself.
It’ll be a pleasure to watch him crumble in the Trump shit scirocco.
JDM
@dmsilev:
While I’m sure that’s correct, I doubt they’d generally ask for (expecting to get) millions and millions of dollars up front. It’s incredibly likely the total legal bill for Trump is going to run into many millions of dollars. But it certainly true they’d worry about how they’d look, as well as the impossibility of defending a client who has already shown he has a habit of loudly admitting his guilt (quite aside from the many other things he does that suggest his guilt).
Chitown Kev
@Uncle Ebeneezer: Nope… the infamous Ty Cobb’s great great nephew, I think
?BillinGlendaleCA
@schrodingers_cat: She was on the TV machine shilling for St. Bernard last year, always called him Mr. Bernie Sanders. I’ve pretty much pulled the plug on TV as well, except for the local news and sports.
rikyrah
Cause he is Black
Washington ExaminerVerified account @dcexaminer
Dana Loesch explains why the NRA didn’t defend Philando Castile washex.am/2vSLSjI
Yarrow
Poor, poor Nazi. Treated so unfairly. Sad!
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Yarrow:
Dershowitz was one of those folk that were driven insane by 9/11.
lamh36
Watt’s twitter thread on this is a must re-tweet: twitter.com/shannonrwatts/status/895788938559766528
Baud
@lamh36:
@rikyrah‘s theory is more plausible.
Roger Moore
@Uncle Ebeneezer:
In mild defense of the baseball player, he wasn’t any more racist than a great many other players. The thing that set him apart was that he was a bully with a gigantic chip on his shoulder, an intense desire to thrash anyone who knocked it off, and the physical skills to do so. He is now notorious for beating up black people who didn’t give him the deference he felt he deserved, but he was an equal opportunity offender who beat up plenty of whites, too.
And he did mellow out as he aged. After he was about 30, he stopped- or at least greatly slowed- getting into fights. I think a huge part of it was that he was established enough he finally started getting the respect he had always felt he deserved, so he didn’t feel the same urge to prove himself to everyone around him. As an older man well after retiring from baseball, he gave qualified public support for integration in baseball and actually came out more strongly against it in private. When he gave money for a hospital and college scholarships in his home town, he required that they treat blacks and whites equally, and at a time when that was somewhere between progressive and radical for a small town in the South. I don’t think he was a wonderful person, but he’s an example of how people can change for the better over their lives.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@TenguPhule:
Look it’s simple. If a nuclear war happened and much of the country is destroyed, what good is Trump’s authority at that point? Don’t you think they would be pissed at Trump for ruining the world as we know it for nothing?
Frankensteinbeck
@Baud:
A legitimate concern, but people need to be reminded that nothing Trump says ever means anything. Their minds rebel at the idea that someone would lie so freely, with no concern whatsoever for consistency or how obvious they’re being. Trump tells every audience what he thinks they want to hear. Graham wants to hear there will be a war.
@TenguPhule:
McConnell would tell you otherwise at the moment, probably while screaming profanity in his sleep at McCain. Our institutions are holding up much better than they looked at first. The wheels of the law are grinding, and the stuff Trump is getting done is stuff we merely wish wasn’t within his power. What we mostly found out is that our institutions will not stop the voting public from being stupid, and that there is a weight on the electoral scale. We knew that last already. It isn’t insurmountable.
TenguPhule
@lamh36:
Get your NRA brownshirts while they last.
MomSense
@Frankensteinbeck:
If we were only dealing with one madman, I might be less alarmed by this.
Yarrow
@?BillinGlendaleCA: I’m sure that’s true. I don’t think it’s the only answer to my question, though. He’s one of those people that makes my skin crawl. There is something not good there. Not good at all.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@Yarrow:
Perhaps he can get a job at Brainfart.
Another Scott
Maybe this has already been mentioned…
Not The Onion – Reuters:
If we had a functioning House of Representatives, there would be Articles of Impeachment filed before midnight.
Grrr….
Cheers,
Scott.
Baud
@Frankensteinbeck: Agree.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@Frankensteinbeck:
I hope you’re right.
West of the Rockies (been a while)
Anybody else hate the Land Rover commercial that plays multiple times per hour on MSNBC? Dudes scurrying through the desert hop into a car, just evading a sand storm (could a car in sand dunes outrun a sandstorm?). Smuggy middle guy, not at all out of breath, immediately dons head phones to chill out. Flash edit, and they’re on a sail boat at sea.
I get Land Rover is appealing to aging guys with money, but it’s quite annoying. Of course, YMMV.
TenguPhule
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:
I would be beyond caring at that point.
Unless there is an afterlife and I can come back as gender-swapped Sadako and get revenge.
bemused
@lamh36:
Let’s all roll coal like real Americans.
TenguPhule
@Frankensteinbeck:
I’m pretty sure that’s a flag you didn’t want to trigger.
Yarrow
@rikyrah:
(Dana Loesch explains why the NRA didn’t defend Philando Castile)
TRUTH. No other reason.
Chitown Kev
@Villago Delenda Est:
True…but Dershowitz is a better lawyer than the KKKlown KKKrew representing him now…but Twitler does like his freebies.
@Yarrow: That’s right…forgot all about that possible connection.
Frankensteinbeck
@Yarrow:
Yep. They’re not just the gun manufacturers lobby, they’re the race war lobby.
Yarrow
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: The new Trump TV network.
TenguPhule
@Frankensteinbeck:
The Senate and House breaking down to the point they now impede the Republican agenda is not a sign of the strength of the institution.
lamh36
@Baud: Oh certainly, but Watts 5 tweet thread just give more reinforcement of that easy sentiment.
Anne Laurie
@tobie:
Serious answer to jokey question: Ryan was one of the top ten Irish surnames even before it took off as a first name in America, during the 1970s. There’s a lot of Americans with Irish roots, or who passed through Ellis Island with surnames that got transliterated into common Irish surnames. As a first name, it’s easy to pronounce, hard to misspell, and has a ‘good’ meaning (baby naming books tend to say ‘little king’ although it’s probably more like ‘from the king’s clan/holdings’). Any group of random American males born after 1970 are liable to have at least a few Ryans, just as any 1950s gradeschool classroom would predictably have at least a couple of Davids and Michaels.
A Ghost to Most
@Yarrow:
This.
One thing the troubles has done is rip off a lot of masks. They don’t think they have to hide it any longer.
Baud
@lamh36: I posted my comment before you added the link to Watts.
Baud
@A Ghost to Most: And they don’t hide it.
SiubhanDuinne
There must be something seriously wrong with me that I can’t feel sad at reading this.
Not even for the seventh or eighth time.
Frankensteinbeck
@TenguPhule:
It’s sure a better sign than things looked a few days into the Trump administration. I’ll take a shit show of incompetence foisted on us by whiny white racists over an actual fascist takeover any day.
debbie
Is anyone watching SNL? Bill Hader is Mooshy as the self-described “King of Idiot Mountain.”
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@Frankensteinbeck:
It was a total bullshit copout by Loesch. It didn’t matter if he was smoking some pot. He was killed unnecessarily by police and the NRA ignored the case because Castile didn’t fit the ideal of their membership (white).
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@TenguPhule:
And if you’re (pretend you’re Kelly ftm) family died as a result of this moron’s actions wouldn’t you want to waste him?
rikyrah
Paul Manafort has dropped his lawyers on Russia, and has new representation.
lamh36
@Baud: oh…gotcha
Frankensteinbeck
@rikyrah:
Reports are they dropped him.
Anne Laurie
@lamh36: Loesch has already had to walk that back — the Examiner article has a ‘correction’ where she contacted them to say the slur on Mr. Castille was her personal opinion, not that of the NRA.
She’s a lightly-hinged loon who’ll say anything for attention, but the people at the NRA who’re paying her to front for them don’t want to go down that rabbit hole, not when so many of their best ‘souvreign citizen’ customers are dedicated marijuana consumers too!
TenguPhule
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:
Myself and most of my friends and family may die if this goes completely pear shaped.
Doesn’t mean I want to discuss actions ahead of time.
Shana
@West of the Rockies (been a while): I agree, but the Booking.com ad with the horrible kindergarten teacher is possibly the worst ad ever made.
Another Scott
@rikyrah: Dropped, like this?
;-)
Cheers,
Scott.
Omnes Omnibus
@Anne Laurie:
Lightly?
Yarrow
@rikyrah:
Read my comment upthread. It looks like Manafort may not have fired his lawyers but his lawyers quit.
TenguPhule
@Frankensteinbeck:
I do not like this choice between Syphilis and AIDS.
geg6
@Frankensteinbeck:
Lately, you are my BJ light. You keep that small flame of optimism going for me. I wallow in the same despair so many other commenters do, day after day. But then you show up and give me hope. Thanks for that.
West of the Rockies (been a while)
@Shana:
Oh, gack! Yes, that’s a horrible commercial. Makes teachers look terrible.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Yarrow: Well…he’s a lawyer.
Omnes Omnibus
@?BillinGlendaleCA: I see how this works.
Anne Laurie
@SiubhanDuinne: Yeah, one reason I thought it was interesting: Bloomberg — a not-stupid business institution — through its widely-read-by-bidnizmen Businessweek blog, points out that Donald Trump Is Doing It All Wrong.
Of course, Michael Bloomberg notoriously doesn’t love Donald Trump, and vice versa. But having BloomBizWeek spelling out Trump’s (and his minions’) particular jeopardy here seems like as close as we’re liable to get to a Cronkite-on-Vietnam moment, doesn’t it?
Yarrow
@?BillinGlendaleCA: LOL. There is that. But this is worse.
germy
Samuel L. Jackson was asked about playing golf with drumpf
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@TenguPhule:
Mine could too if this thing escalates enough. Though you are in a more unique location.
Speaking of Hawaii:
Kiss that Hawaiian timeshare goodbye / Islands will sink in 80 million years
m.sfgate.com/news/article/Kiss-that-Hawaiian-timeshare-goodbye-Islands-2468202.php
Anne Laurie
@Omnes Omnibus: Well, the NRA is paying her, presumably quite well; you and I are doing this for free!
Omnes Omnibus
@germy: IOW he is a cheating pig of a person. But we knew that already. Preemptive apology to all pigs everywhere.
Omnes Omnibus
@Anne Laurie: I’d still go with un.
TenguPhule
@Anne Laurie:
How far we’ve fallen.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:
You can always move to the new one that’s being created as we speak.
germy
Frankensteinbeck
@geg6:
Thank you. It’s not like this is a GOOD situation, but thank goodness rumors of the death of the Republic seem to be greatly exaggerated. The basic dynamic of incompetence I anticipated is playing out, and things are going a little better than I thought it would because it turns out McConnell is less competent than I thought.
geg6
@Omnes Omnibus:
Just wanted to say that saw what you did the other night. Wanted to say I appreciate your comment that I’m not a horrible person. Truce.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@Frankensteinbeck:
Me too. Trump wasn’t that much of a surprise. I never expected Huckleberry McConnell to be such a paper tiger.
schrodingers_cat
@Omnes Omnibus: I have utmost respect for lawyers, they have been at the forefront of thwarting T’s vilest impulses, first there was Sally Yates, and now Mueller. And the immigration lawyers in the trenches, since that infamous travel ban fighting one deportation order at a time, sounding alarm about scapegoating of the population most of the media likes to ignore.
geg6
@Frankensteinbeck:
Yeah, I sure feel that I certainly overestimated the Turtle’s abilities. Thank pasta.
Miss Bianca
@TenguPhule: oK, I gotta ask – what’s with the piano-playing chicken? This is the second reference to it that I’ve seen. What am I missing?
schrodingers_cat
@geg6: Its easy to thwart progress and say no, but harder to get things done.
I have cut out TV news and NYT completely. I also try to focus on things I can do and fret less about the minutia beyond my control. Yet I am appalled every single day but I have deliberately decided not to bathe in overwhelming negativity by controlling how much news I consume per day.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@schrodingers_cat:
Lawyers get a bad rap for defending criminals and chasing ambulances. Everybody hates lawyers except their own and when they need one.
Adria McDowell (formerly LurkerExtraordinaire)
@Shana: Not gonna lie, the face of the kindergartener who has the teacher’s cell phone snatched away from her makes my husband and I laugh. The indignity of it all! How dare she! Lol.
As the mom of a soon-to-be kindergartner (less than 2 weeks now!), I know they can be a handful.
TenguPhule
@Miss Bianca:
There was a thread a couple weeks ago where a comment came up about a piano playing chicken for America’s got Talent (IIRC), I started joking about it being Baud’s new running mate and one thing led to another…..
gene108
@MomSense:
If the hacked texts from one of his daughter cell phone is true, there maybe little love lost between father and daughter.
Matt McIrvin
@Mnemosyne: Congress is probably going to try to make California’s emissions standards illegal. These people never actually cared about federalism, states’ rights or localism when it pushed against them.
Kraux Pas
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:
You’re forgetting one of the hottest hot buttons in our polarized culture, precise language.
ETA: There is also the idea that they obfuscate with precise manipulation of language. Seriously, though, if Republicans want to come to our country, they should learn to speak English.
Omnes Omnibus
@geg6: No problem. Truce accepted.
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: To be fair, lots of people hate their own lawyers.
Mnemosyne
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:
IOW, the NRA’s lawyers called Loesch and said, Jesus Christ, you fucking moron, you just set our whole organization up to be sued by the Castile family!
Mnemosyne
@Shana:
Worse than the Toyota ad where the kid brags about how he shamed his parents into buying a better (aka more expensive) car?
I am not a parent, but if that had been my kid, I would have pulled over to the curb and said, If you don’t want to be seen in our car, you can walk the rest of the way to school.
Matt McIrvin
@Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (Formerly Mumphrey, et al.): Our descendants will say “Once cucks, betas and feminazis ruled the world, but then THE MIGHTY IRON PENIS OF TRUMP SMOTE THEM ALL!!! HAIL TRUMP HAIL TRUMP now time for your daily lead supplement and mandatory concussion, children!”
Quinerly
@West of the Rockies (been a while):
I have never understood it. Bugs me. Thought I was old and just didn’t get it.
Miss Bianca
@Yarrow: then both those Ty Cobbs are relatives of mine. Ewww….!
jl
@Mnemosyne: Apart from that, a stupid dodge that reveals the NRA to be hypocritical racists and bigots. IIRC, there was no evidence of drugs at the scene and at the time. Tests showed evidence of traces of dope in a bag or something taken from the care, much later. Much later. That minor dope evidence played zero role in Castille’s treatment at the scene, IIRC.
And since when does what might result in a very minor drug charge result in forfeiture of an important constitutional right? Hey, I;m a sinister gun control collectivist liberal evil doer, and even I believe 2nd amendment is important and should mean something, for everyone qualified to carry arms. Too bad NRA and Loesch seem to disagree with that now.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Matt McIrvin:
This Congress? Really? You should take this act on the road.
Frankensteinbeck
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: and @geg6:
I have not discounted McConnell as a source of trouble, but he saved up all his juice and went balls-to-the-wall to fuck over the country, and failed. Failed barely, maybe, but failed at the thing he’d reserved all his power for. He’s facing an uphill struggle doing anything else, with no signs he even cares about anything else. He could certainly still be dangerous, but thank goodness he’s not the juggernaut I expected. Democrats still have enough power to stymie him, and it turns out Republicans do NOT always fall in line.
Quinerly
Strange night, strange thread. Commented early, had drinks, dinner, hung out with friends for some live music. Came back, started from the bottom up. I’m very frightened.?
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@jl:
Silly libturd, gun rights for white people, not ni**ers!
Omnes Omnibus
@West of the Rockies (been a while): @Quinerly: LR sponsors a sailing team. The ad is supposed to be LR picking up the sailors and delivering them to the boat despite “bad” conditions.
TriassicSands
Hilarious, Trump is so toxic that major law firms don’t want his business. What I don’t understand is why they would be worried that he wouldn’t follow advice or refrain from spontaneous outbursts. There’s nothing to worry about — it’s guaranteed — he won’t follow advice and he’ll be yammering away on Twitter at 3 AM.
But what the rest of us have to worry about is what Trump will do if it looks like he’s going down. Will he decide that the best course of action would be to take the whole world with him? That would be my guess. No one with the delusions of grandeur that afflict Trump is ever going to go quietly.
Cheryl Rofer
@Quinerly: I’m still trying to assimilate the “thanks to Putin” thing. Went out for chocolate with friends, still can’t quite wrap my head around a president doing that.
I do think that the risk of nuclear war, despite the words, remains low. North Korea isn’t going to start it, and Trump doesn’t have the balls.
Millard Filmore
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:
If you can afford one. Money does indeed buy justice.
Quinerly
@Omnes Omnibus:
Thank you.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@Kraux Pas: Yeah, lawyers can be pedants.
@Omnes Omnibus:
Yeah, but lawyers (you’re one so you should know) as a group are wrongly maligned. A court system without lawyers would be a nightmare.@Mnemosyne:
Hope she’s getting all the shit she deserves for this.
Edit: now that I caught you, you live in SoCal right? Ever been to Santa Catalina Island?
@Frankensteinbeck:
He could still be a problem but he’s not Hercules.
Millard Filmore
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
California’s variance is at the pleasure of the feds. All the Feds have to do is say “No”, something they have become really good at.
JPL
Trump thanking Putin again
cmgajcluckovich.files.wordpress.com/2017/08/lk081117_color.jpg
Frankensteinbeck
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:
And finding that out was the biggest and most pleasant surprise of these last six months.
SiubhanDuinne
@Cheryl Rofer:
O.M.G. Dying.
I have friends in Santa Fe who keep asking me to come out for a visit. Had not planned to drive out again until April 2020, when my grandniece in Phoenix is getting married, but now I think I’ll have to check out SF early and often.
Quinerly
@Cheryl Rofer:
Been there, done that chocolate. A glorious place. I tend towards the Mexican chocolate. If it is a chocolate with Chimayo chile, the better …thanks for the interlude. Overload here at the House of Poco.
Lyrebird
@Villago Delenda Est: At least most of the ambulance-chaser ads on Yellow Pages that I’ve seen do not telegraph big ol’ messages about SOME Americans being less than others. Sad sad sad sad.
I challenge myself to show basic respect to whoever is doing a needed job that I would not and could not do, like guard prisons, draw blood, direct traffic, etc. Used to approach Dershowitz that way – I could never represent the clients he has represented, but I believe every American deserve good representation.
Now, just UGH and SAD.
Anne Laurie
@Frankensteinbeck:
One more example of the Trump Reverse-Midas Touch. As long as the Democrats were holding the fort & keeping the lights on, being a “master legislator” gumming up the works wasn’t so hard. When Trump showed up, took over the GOP without a serious fight, and the Democrats told him to pound sand… suddenly McConnell was another nasty little man whose only real talent was befuddling the rubes. Even McConnell had bought into that myth, from his expression when Collins / Murkowski / McCain gave him the finger!
West of the Rockies (been a while)
@Cheryl Rofer:
How’s it playing on Fox? Rush and Coulter backing Trump up, saying he’s just a good business man? I haven’t seen a conservative response yet. NRO has nothing on it as of five minutes ago.
Yarrow
@Frankensteinbeck:
I never get tired of watching McCain fuck over McConnell at the late night health care vote. It’s especially fun with this soundtrack.
Quinerly
@SiubhanDuinne:
GO! People think I’m weird but consider off season in SF and NM….restaurants, museums to yourself. Plus, very good rental deals. My February since 2011. Will never change
TriassicSands
@Frankensteinbeck:
It’s good to see Trump going after McConnell now. Eventually, Trump may alienate everyone in D.C. Except Kellyanne Conway.
The wording is important here. I’d say…”it turns out that ALL Republicans do not ALWAYS fall in line.” But it’s a very small number and a very few instances. The Senate health care bill was a very special case. Who could have imagined that the Senate would come up with a bill every bit as bad as the one the House put together? Of course, both bills were accurate reflections of the GOP and its membership, so it shouldn’t have been a surprise. Still, one would expect at least a nod in the direction of the masses, but true to form the Republicans kept the heart of their plan to the end — tax cuts for the wealthy; nothing (good) for everyone else. I count it as nothing to offer young, healthy people the chance to buy worthless health care plans for less money than actual coverage would cost. Paying something for nothing is never a good deal and offering the naive and stupid the chance to spend their money that way is not a favor. At least, I don’t think so.
Anne Laurie
@Cheryl Rofer:
You haven’t spent the last sixty-plus years ending every interpersonal contact with some variant on the phrase “You’re not quitting on me, I’m quitting on you!”
Teachers, wives, relatives, contractors: All Trump really understands is walking out before his latest ‘partner’ can get to the door.
BBA
@TriassicSands:
Not if the bombs fall first, and there’s nobody left to alienate.
Uncle Ebeneezer
@Roger Moore: Interesting. I only knew the legend. Thx
?BillinGlendaleCA
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:
Yes.
efgoldman
@Lyrebird:
Dersh used to be a super strong defender of the constitution, especially the first amendment. He was always an obnoxious publicity hound, and that hasn’t changed.
Since 9/11 he has turned into a torture apologist monster, as subtle as John Yoo.
Students used to love getting into his classes (going back decades). I don’t think he’s been in a classroom since the 80s.
Miss Bianca
@SiubhanDuinne: don’t hate me because I’m beautiful. Hate me because I was just at that chocolate house with my sister, drinking rose almond chili chocolate elixir…and I brought some home!
OK, I’m up for a repeat attempt at a NM meet-up, pretty much any time!
dm
@Cheryl Rofer: The first Korean war was pretty much the result of miscalculations on both sides (North Korea: the Americans won’t come to South Korea’s aid, we’ll invade! US: yes we will, but the Chinese won’t mind us pushing close to their border.
With Trump throwing around terms like “pre-emptive strike”, things get considerably more fraught. With North Korean televsion talking about testing three missiles by launching them toward Guam, fraught again.
Frankensteinbeck
@TriassicSands:
Like McConnell’s power, now that we’ve seen it broken, I think we need to face that it’s a much-inflated superstition. Obstruction is much easier than getting anything done. It’s only been put to the test once in these six months, and the House only pulled it off – barely – when Ryan told them it would be the Senate’s problem. The Senate just barely failed to pull it off. And frankly, when the votes were really tough during the Obama administration, on the budget and debt ceiling, it was the Republicans who caved. I don’t think we can trust that Republicans will fall into line. This is a totally different situation from eight years of protest votes.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
It was a beautiful place. I was on vacation in LA last year in August for a week and was glad I got to spend a day there. Took the Humvee tour and hung around Avalon. Very picturesque bay. It was easily the best day of my trip.
Lyrebird
@efgoldman: Thanks for the refresher. The justification of torture (which is bad for our troops & mission and ineffective in addition to being wrong) was that point for me when he went from “abrasive” to “abominable”. And you clearly know the descent in more detail…
efgoldman
@Lyrebird:
He’s been a fixture on Boston talk radio and TV since at least the 1970s. He never met a camera or microphone he didn’t love. I don’t think anybody takes him seriously any mire.
Omnes Omnibus
@Lyrebird:
Honestly, as a former soldier, the wrong is and should be enough.
TriassicSands
@BBA:
No worries. There is zero risk of Trump doing anything stupid. That’s because the “adult” Kelly is in charge now. You notice how Trump has quit spewing outrageous Tweets since Kelly took over. Yep, Kelly marched in and took charge. No more foolishness from Trump. Who knew it would be so easy to get Trump under control?
Or maybe you haven’t noticed. Maybe Kelly doesn’t have Trump under control. Maybe we’re all screwed. Obviously, Kelly isn’t up to the job. Our last hope is to bring in the Terminator — Ahnuld — now, he would get Trump under control — if having one’s head smashed like a cantaloupe dropped form the top of the Burj Khalifa is being under control. Think of the Nielsen ratings!
Yarrow
@TriassicSands: Kelly’s got to be in trouble because he’s on the cover of Time magazine. Trump doesn’t like co-stars.
Quinerly
@Miss Bianca:
Did someone say, “chile chocolate?”
TriassicSands
@Frankensteinbeck:
That’s true, but the record of Republicans falling in line is much older than eight years. What is different, apart from the need to get something done when the only thing you really care about is tax cuts for the wealthy (and hurting the poor for sport) is Trump. Presidents and their own parties have had scuffles over the years, but never in recent decades anything like what Trump has been doing. His current attacks on McConnell is unprecedented, as was his attacks on Sessions. Trump’s abysmal character is on view for all to see and it doesn’t stand up to scrutiny…at all.
The thing with Trump is he doesn’t care what the Congress passes as long as they pass something. At one time or another he lauded both the House and Senate health care bills. That was easy to do because he had no idea what was in either bill. We’ll have to see what happens with tax reform. If it hurts critical groups the way the health care bills did, then maybe Collins will stick with her “No” vote, but I wouldn’t count on it. Murkowski? I don’t know. McCain? He might vote “No” just as a big Eff You to Trump, but we shouldn’t forget that both he and his wife are multimillionaires. It won’t be fun, but it will be interesting.
Lyrebird
@Omnes Omnibus: Well I like your take on the matter. As a long-haired pacifist with a “schoolmarm with a bleeding heart” vibe, I spend a fair amount of time teaching my students about the practical side as well, lest they dismiss the moral argument because of who I am.
If I get pushback, I sometimes ask them to picture the folks who wrote the Geneva Accords, the Army Field Manual, etc., & ask ’em if such folks were likely other dreamy-eyed hippy-dippies or perhaps not.
TriassicSands
@Yarrow:
Right you are. I wonder if Kelly begged them not to put him on the cover? Or, if by now, he’s sick of the job and hoped it would get Trump to fire him. The time may come when being fired by Trump (or a surrogate since Trump is too much of a wimp to do it himself) may be as respected an honor as receiving the Presidential Medal of Freedom (bestowed by any president other than Trump).
Kevin Drum has a post up about McMaster being isolated and out of favor. Eventually, if he avoids prison, Jared may hold every position in the federal government — Trump will have had everyone else fired.
I don’t know what kind of grades Trump got in elementary school, but I’m pretty sure the following comment appeared more than once: “Does not play well with others.”
Calouste
@dm: China is going to be different now than in 1950. Beijing is not that far from Pyongyang, and I can’t imagine the Chinese leaders being interested in nuclear fallout blowing over. I wouldn’t be surprised if they have a way to get rid of Kim if he threatens to go too far.
efgoldman
@Calouste:
Their real fear, according to news reports, is hundreds of thousands of North Korean refugees being displaced and streaming across their border.
Omnes Omnibus
@Lyrebird: Sometimes, “it is wrong and one should never do it,” is all one should need.
randy khan
@Baud:
I was there. The story is true. I was walking towards my seats and heard the booing, and then heard them announce Price’s name after he threw the pitch. (It was the thank you announcement.) The Public Health Service group that sang the National Anthem got a much better reception.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: It’s almost like a different country, but you’re still in LA county.
randy khan
@Baud:
Well, probably both him not following their advice and not paying their bills, but traditionally law firms tend to think of these sorts of jobs as loss leaders (even if they want to be paid *something* for their work).
?BillinGlendaleCA
@efgoldman: That’s the fear in South Korea as well with an uncontrolled collapse.
efgoldman
@randy khan:
Sure, but they’re going to be doing hundreds of hours of research as well as the actual representation, for a client who’s going to lose anyway because he can’t listen to his lawyers and control his impulses, and has a well-earned reputation for not paying his bills.
Achrachno
@Cheryl Rofer: “North Korea isn’t going to start it, and Trump doesn’t have the balls.”
But I fear he does have enough loose screws.
randy khan
@efgoldman:
Worse, someone who might lose *because* he doesn’t listen to his lawyers. In comparison, not having your bill paid is not nearly as bad.
Frankensteinbeck
@TriassicSands:
Don’t they need 60 votes for tax reform? They do for the budget and debt ceiling, so they ain’t gettin’ shit for their campaign to destroy America there.
Cheryl Rofer
@West of the Rockies (been a while): I don’t watch Fox. Too much else to do. I have been wondering about conservative reaction too. But Fox has typically been pushing “hate Hillary” in contrast to real news.
coin operated
@efgoldman:
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
I mention both of these points when arguing with warmongering wingers. Especially S. Korea…the *last* thing they want is a half-million peasants flooding the job market. If, in the future, they ever reunify it’ll make what East and West Germany went through look like a cake walk.
Cheryl Rofer
@Anne Laurie: Yes. I have a tweetstream on this and related themes brewing.
Cheryl Rofer
@dm: Yes. I think that the North Korean statement is an offer to negotiate in their strange way: we won’t send missiles to Guam if you won’t do your overflights. That’s actually almost reasonable within their calculus. But no way the Trumpies will see it, much less respond in any reasonable way.
RobNYNY
@dmsilev:
A lawyer who represents himself has a fool for a client.
If Donald Trump is giving himself legal advice, he not only has a fool for a client, he has a fool for a lawyer.
TenguPhule
@Cheryl Rofer:
The problem is Trump doesn’t give a shit about consequences. What he’s afraid of varies from moment to moment and he’s perfectly capable of being more afraid of public ridicule then he is of getting other people killed and shooting his mouth off.