If we discussed this yesterday, I missed it, but Facebook’s turnabout on the Russia election meddling scandal seems significant. From the NYT:
Facebook to Turn Over Russian-Linked Ads to Congress
By SCOTT SHANE and MIKE ISAAC SEPT. 21, 2017WASHINGTON — Under growing pressure from Congress and the public to reveal more about the spread of covert Russian propaganda on Facebook, the company said on Thursday that it was turning over more than 3,000 Russia-linked ads to congressional committees investigating the Kremlin’s influence operation during the 2016 presidential campaign…
Facebook’s admission on Sept. 6 that Russian agents covertly bought ads on the site during last year’s campaign has brought intense scrutiny on the social network and on Twitter, entangling both companies in the investigation by Robert S. Mueller III, the special counsel. Both companies have turned over detailed data to Mr. Mueller.
The disclosure of the ads also raised the possibility of future regulation of political advertising on social media platforms. This week, congressional Democrats asked the Federal Election Commission to advise on ways to prevent illicit foreign influence on American elections via social media, including possible new laws or regulations.
The news triggered Twitler, whose severe, untreated personality disorder makes any suggestion that he wasn’t elected by popular acclaim an intolerable insult:
The Russia hoax continues, now it's ads on Facebook. What about the totally biased and dishonest Media coverage in favor of Crooked Hillary?
— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) September 22, 2017
Facebook’s Zuckerberg was also triggered, but in a more rational “greed-head deflecting threats to the bottom line” kinda way:
“We are in a new world,” he said. “It is a new challenge for internet communities to deal with nation-states attempting to subvert elections. But if that’s what we must do, we are committed to rising to the occasion.”
Despite Russia’s stealth attack, Mr. Zuckerberg argued that Facebook remained a force for good in democracy, promoting billions of online discussions, linking voters to candidates and helping two million Americans register to vote. He said that positive role was “100 or 1,000 times bigger” than the illicit activity.
I would counter that the elevation of an erratic demagogue like Trump, with the social media-fueled assistance of a murderous foreign autocrat, suggests that social media might not be a net positive for democracy. But safeguarding democracy isn’t Facebook’s purpose, and neither is giving my auntie a place to publish photos of awful decoupage projects.
Facebook and Twitter don’t charge us for using their platform because WE are the product they offer to their advertisers. This time, a significant number of those advertisers were hawking hate instead of hand sanitizer.
As the Times article points out, Facebook generates tens of billions in advertising revenue every year, and anyone with a credit card and a Facebook account can buy an ad. Self-serving platitudes aside, Zuckerberg and shareholders of other tech companies that are mainlining billions in self-service advertising revenue have no real incentive to change.
It’s going to take government regulation (unlikely in the current political environment) or mass action by consumers to solve this problem. And solve it we must; 2018 is right around the corner.
Starfish
The threat to governments from social media are not new. We were cheering them on when those threads were in the form of the Arab Spring, and I am not sure how I feel about all this and the large role in everything that these social media companies have.
Is there a way to bring social media in line without allowing a crack down on marginalized activists?
TenguPhule
Speaking of products, Late Night with Colbert last night probably educated millions of people of just how bad the Equifax scandal has gotten with not one, but two break ins of their database by the same people.
TenguPhule
Have you seen the government we’re currently stuck with? And worse, they’re trying to strip consumers from being able to do anything either.
trollhattan
I like how he randomly capitalizes Media, as though it makes the media more scarier.
The breadth of apparent Russian infiltration and influence is beyond what I can wrap my brain around. I think back to our very own pet Russian, BIP with renewed interest as it seems they’ve been testing the social media waters for a long while, seeing what and where they can gain influence, salting away the knowledge for future use. Beyond Vlad being able to point to democracy’s “obvious flaws” to keep the folks back home happy with their current kleptocracy, there has to be a longer game afoot. I wonder what it is?
Kay
Why does Russiagate news make Donald Trump so mad? :)
Major Major Major Major
You get ads for hand sanitizer? I get ads for underwear (when I see them at all, thanks Adguard!). I’ve been assuming that’s targeted at young gay men.
MattF
People are discovering that Google, Facebook, Twitter maybe… aren’t so totally and unreservedly great, after all. And… heresy, I know… maybe even Amazon.
trollhattan
O/T Well she did it. That ^#%$ DeVoss rescinded Obama’s college sexual assault guidelines. Because men’s rights.
Having a hard time explaining to my daughter how a rich woman is keeping busy trying to make girls’ lives less safe and also destroy public schools. A very hard time.
a thousand flouncing lurkers (was fidelio)
I wonder how much of this about-face has to do with Zuckerberg’s own political ambitions.
MattF
@Kay: There’s a widespread plot to take him down. No point in denying it.
Major Major Major Major
@trollhattan: Trump is the MRA president. Which is all the more true the more you know about those fuckers. Straight white men who spend too much time on reddit and blame minorities for their problems.
WaterGirl
Does anyone really believe that no on one at Facebook knew what was going on? I’ll start: No.
rikyrah
Funny how a subpoena from someone NOT playing with you, changes the tune….
Uh huh
Uh huh
Betty Cracker
@trollhattan: I’ll admit I used to roll my eyes when people called BiP a Russian troll back in the day. It just seemed like such a bad investment! Why pay an idiot to babble nonsense on Balloon Juice, FFS? I’m not rolling my eyes at the suggestion anymore. Even if Putin sunk a billion into subverting US democracy, it has paid off handsomely.
rikyrah
GOP ‘moderates’ give up on concessions they once deemed important
09/22/17 12:44 PM
By Steve Benen
Over the summer, during the various stages of the health care repeal fight, several Senate Republicans at least went through the motions. Unwilling to look like knee-jerk partisans, GOP senators like Ohio’s Rob Portman and West Virginia’s Shelley Moore Capito – sometimes labeled as “moderates” by news outlets – said they weren’t prepared to endorse the Republican plan because it was a Republican plan.
Instead, they had certain conditions. These senators said they wanted increased investments to address the opioid crisis, for example, and additional protections for Medicaid beneficiaries. Without some concessions from GOP leaders, these senators said, their support was in doubt.
Two months later, those same senators have apparently decided they no longer care about these conditions. Roll Call reported this week:
It’s almost as if many Senate Republicans weren’t especially serious about their stated principles. Sen. Dean Heller (R-Nev.) said he opposed Medicaid cuts. Portman and Capito prioritized opioid investments. Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.) said he cared about a legitimate, thorough process – including a proper score from the Congressional Budget Office – and a lengthy policy debate.
A big chunk of the Republican Party, including Donald Trump himself, said protections for Americans with pre-existing conditions must be part of any GOP health care package.
And yet, here we are. Graham-Cassidy cuts Medicaid, ignores the opioid crisis, is advancing through a ridiculously truncated process, and eliminates guarantees for those with pre-existing conditions.
MattF
@WaterGirl: Given that Facebook’s business model is based on ‘big data’ analysis of the information that’s gleaned from Facebook users. I’d guess that lots of Facebook metadata converges on Russia.
TenguPhule
@Betty Cracker:
After all, we get so many of them on here for free.
Gin & Tonic
My daughter was a student at one of the first colleges that Facebook was available at, at the time it started. Since I have an .edu e-mail account, I was technically able to sign up shortly afterward. She forbade it.
Smart girl, although she didn’t realize it. I’ve managed to avoid FB in the intervening nearly 15 years, and couldn’t be happier.
TenguPhule
@rikyrah:
Republican moderates always fall back into line.
Looks like it still holds true.
Gin & Tonic
@Betty Cracker: I always viewed him as an Old Believer, not a troll.
MattF
@Betty Cracker: Injecting poison into the information stream is not an efficient way of doing damage, but it is cheap.
Gin & Tonic
@a thousand flouncing lurkers (was fidelio): All of it.
trollhattan
@Betty Cracker:
Same here. I waved him off as deluded and oddly attracted to the conspiracy theory of the moment, but there was too much about his posts that seemed contrived, while conveniently toeing the line advanced by RT and their cohorts. His continually showing little knowledge of where he claimed to live (Pacifica, Portland) was the other clown shoe. We now know this is their MO and they have dumped vast resources into it. I guess we should feel flattered–“A top-10,000 blog!”
Humboldtblue
Speaking of assholes, here’s a followup video featuring the Oregon man targeted by ICE agents in Washington County. Just another example of what it’s like being brown in Trump’s America.
debbie
@TenguPhule:
Yeah, that was the first I had heard of that. This is one of the zillion reasons we need regulation!
germy
@trollhattan: I’m guessing they didn’t send their top talent here.
InternetDragons
Off-topic for this post, but I just heard McCain is a “no” on Cassidy-Graham, and has issued a statement about this.
Looks to be true, but will try to find more info. Here’s hoping.
https://twitter.com/AP_Politics/status/911287202839187456
Mnemosyne
@trollhattan:
FWIW, BIP was either a real guy who had bought the Russian line hook, line and sinker, or a super-dedicated paid troll, because he tried to directly contact me a few times via my linked website after he was banned.
WaterGirl
@InternetDragons: That’s encouraging. At the same time, I’m aware that his previous vote took a lot of people by surprise – they thought McCain was voting with them. I won’t believe anything from McCain until the actual vote is cast. Still, this is much better news than if it was the other way around.
Humboldtblue
@Major Major Major Major:
Hey, hey, hey, I resemble that remark. You aren’t tearing me away from r/aww, r/babyelephantgifs, r/linguistics (those fuckers know their shit!) or any of the other hundred or so subs I am subscribed to. I mean, where else can you go from r/tuglife to r/medieval history to r/classical music without opening a new tab?
Betty Cracker
@InternetDragons: Excellent news! Just saw the statement on Twitter — appears to be accurate.
TenguPhule
@InternetDragons:
Open threads are open.
Here’s to hoping.
SiubhanDuinne
Am on the road in northern Michigan, but just heard that John McCain is a NO on Graham Cassidy.
Good for him.
Okay, on to the Mackinac Island ferry.
Baud
@Betty Cracker:
Especially since so many of us are willing to do it for free.
randy khan
@InternetDragons:
The local D.C. news radio station is reporting the same thing, but they probably got it from the AP, too, so I wouldn’t call it confirmation.
They’re also reporting Collins as a “lean no.”
Fingers crossed.
schrodingers_cat
@trollhattan: There was another person who claimed to be from NoVa who showed up before one of the ignominious healthcare bills was going to be voted but from betrayed zero knowledge of the place. I used to live in MD suburbs of DC and also worked in NoVa for a while and am quite familiar with the area.
ETA: Also his English was most peculiar, and IIRC he accused me spouting Elders of Zionesque conspiracies.
eemom
@Gin & Tonic:
Thought this might be that rare thread where the word Facebook could be uttered without a cascade of smug ass comments from those whose avoidance of FB is the signature achievement of their lives. Alas, ’twas not to be.
nonynony
@Betty Cracker: Paying money to trolls to go post crap and get in fights on blogs with a smallish target audience of people is a nonsensical strategy. It makes sense if the demographic of people reading the website is ideologically diverse and you can end up with a “hey why don’t you and him fight” manuever out of it (which is why I suspect it’s happening in newspaper comment sections and places like YouTube). But targetted advertising makes a hell of a lot of sense. Get Facebook to push your fake news ads to a hundred thousand people who Facebook has deemed like to read similar fake news bullshit? Hell that’s the kind of thing that a 19th century snake oil huckster could only imagine as heaven! You used to have to WORK to compile a list of marks – Facebook gives em to you for pennies on the head!
Paying money to have trolls go and try to be “fellow traveler” infiltrating social media circles though – that’s where the real work is happening. Guys from Russia pretending to be right-wing MRAs on Facebook, guys from Russia pretending to be leftists on Twitter. Building up profiles and follower networks and then nudging people to be just a bit more extreme – pushing from both sides and pointing people towards “solutions” that will make things worse. That’s how you really break things apart – and the Russians have been masters of that kind of propaganda technique for at least a century, if not more. And I will admit that it’s possible that a site like this would be perfect for that kind of thing. (And then I recognize that that just ramps up the paranoia, which also serves to push things apart and I get depressed. Which also doesn’t help.)
TenguPhule
@Baud: Baud 2020!: A day late and a trillion dollars short!
raven
@randy khan: CNN has a no
http://go.cnn.com/?stream=cnn%3Fsr
Betty Cracker
@trollhattan: BiP was still babbling away in Booman’s comments last time I looked at comments there, which was admittedly months ago. Booman is worth reading…many of his commenters, not so much, IMO.
Major Major Major Major
To echo the others, just got a CNN alert that McCain is a ‘no’ on deathcare.
sherparick
Re Trump’s twit, he is certainly right about the unfair MSM media. They did put the knife into Hillary.
http://www.lawyersgunsmoneyblog.com/2017/03/did-someone-say-emails
TenguPhule
Also, today’s MAKE THE FUCKING AUTOPLAY ADS STOP request.
raven
Percysowner
McCain voting no has also been reported by Talking Points Memo We should still keep calling just in case he reverses himself, or if Collins or Murkowski suddenly have a change of heart. I’ll fax Rob Portman again.
geg6
Wow. McCain has actually put country first and says no to C-G.
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/
schrodingers_cat
@Major Major Major Major: I knew them in grad school the poor persecuted white males whose lunch was being eaten by everyone else, especially women. They would say that with a straight face in department with less 5% females and only one female faculty member. Cry me a fucking river, dudes.
SatanicPanic
Edit- nevermind, other people beat me to it.
TriassicSands
@InternetDragons:
You can’t be off-topic in an “Open Thread.”
Baud
@geg6: Part of me wishes I could know how he would have voted if he wasn’t dying.
InternetDragons
@TenguPhule:
Looks like he’s for real. I know his previous vote came as a surprise, but I don’t think he’d issue a statement like this and then do the opposite. For all his faults, that just isn’t his style.
I still intend to spend the next few days making calls. Also, for anyone who (like me) is in a blue state with senators already supporting ACA, you can still make calls!
I use a tool (linked below) from Indivisible to make calls to folks in red states and offer them support and encouragement to call their senators. I did it the last time we fought this stupidity, and it was a very positive experience overall:
https://www.trumpcareten.org/calls-to-kill-trumpcare/
Good luck, and best wishes to everyone making calls!
eemom
@Major Major Major Major:
I see those men’s undies ads too and I’m the demographic opposite of a young gay man.
Starfish
@nonynony: In general, YouTube comments are a sewer that influence no one. There are a few exceptions, but they are exceptions. I think Twitter is the most dangerous because it is used so much by journalists and media types so you only have to influence a few people for a much larger effect.
Mnemosyne
@nonynony:
IIRC, it has been determined pretty much without a doubt that “The Protocols of the Elders of Zion” was created by the Russian Czar’s propagandists in the late 1800s. So, yes, they’ve been experts in the field for a very long time.
raven
@TriassicSands: You can’t be off topic if you don’t give a fuck either.
jl
I monitor Josh Marshall’s tweeters to get first peep at history being made.
McCain comes out against Graham-Cassidy.
FLOTUS Melania digs into Michelle’s WH garden (constructively), apparently with diverse bunch of kids.
Not sure which is worse news for the Trumpsters.
Roger Moore
@Major Major Major Major:
I gets underwear ads, too, so if they’re targeting young gay men they’re doing a bad job.
Baud
@TriassicSands:
@raven:
Disagree. Everyone stop talking about health care until a new thread goes up, ok?
Betty Cracker
@eemom: My husband is proudly and ostentatiously NOT on FB. I told him fine, but when your high school buddies try to track you down through me, I’m going to tell ’em you ran off and joined a furry puppeteer troupe.
Major Major Major Major
@eemom: Like, sexy men’s underwear?
I don’t think ‘gay’ is a targetable category so maybe you have gay taste in stuff.
jl
@Baud: Baud 2020! A genuine Balloon-Juice product!
geg6
@TenguPhule:
I don’t understand this. I have never once, in the decade or so I’ve been coming to BJ, come across an autoplay ad. Never.
schrodingers_cat
@Betty Cracker: Both me and husband kitteh are not on FB, mostly to avoid crackpot wingtard relatives Indian style.
Gin & Tonic
@eemom: Please quote where I said it was the signature achievement of my life or STFU.
Mnemosyne
@WaterGirl:
One of the evening commenters (Sister Golden Bear) was saying that she has friends who do burlesque shows whose Facebook ads are routinely rejected, apparently by an algorithm, even though they’re careful to not show any nudity.
So somebody at Facebook decided that having ads with Kill All the Jews in the description is fine, but “burlesque” is not.
germy
@raven: Mavis Staples has a new album coming out in November. Check out the first song title:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/If_All_I_Was_Was_Black
Mike J
schrodingers_cat
@Major Major Major Major: They think I am an old man, I used to get ads for Ruskie brides
geg6
@Baud:
Oh, I think we all know the answer to that. If brain cancer is what it has taken to make this guy live up to his campaign slogan, I’ll take it.
feebog
If McCain is a no, that gives Collins and Murkowski the opportunity to come out as no’s as well. Counting Rand Paul, that’s 4. There may be a couple more that come out as no’s over the weekend.
Gin & Tonic
@Betty Cracker: If someone I’d gone to high school with *did* try to track me down, through any means of communication, I *would* run off and join a furry puppeteer troupe just to avoid them.
germy
@randy khan:
What does a “lean” no mean?
Mnemosyne
@Major Major Major Major:
I see men’s underwear ads, too. That’s not that weird — gay and straight men buy underwear for themselves, straight women buy underwear for men, both straight women and gay men like to look at male underwear models. The only ones who get left out are lesbians.
The weird ad to me was the tourism ad for Israel that featured a bunch of hunky guys in skimpy Speedos on the beach in Tel Aviv. That was a super gay ad from a source I did not expect.
Amir Khalid
@geg6:
I’ll be able to see Lindsay Graham pouting all the way from Kuala Lumpur.
Ella in New Mexico
Scapegoating social media millionaires might feel good for a while, but the truth is, that’s not going to change what happened to us. Getting rid of Dark Money will.
If in the next 2-4 years, we did nothing else (outside of saving healthcare) but to overturn Citizens United and reinstate strong regulation on campaign finance laws and political spending, plus put in place solid reforms that reinforce voter protections, we would have done enough to save the union…
eric
@germy: less calories than a regular no.
Arm The Homeless
@germy:
It means, “don’t count me as the vote that killed this shitty bill, pleeeeeeeeeeeeze”
NotMax
(rubs eyes in astonishment)
There are ads on the internet?
InternetDragons
@Mike J:
I am probably building up a huge karmic debt over this since I’m a mental health professional who ostensibly shouldn’t get enjoyment out of such things – but I confess to experiencing a certain unholy glee in watching Trump implode after being failed by one of his sources of narcissistic supply.
Even though I know his instability makes him dangerous, I think it’s also a good thing when it gets exposed. Again. Every public freakout is another brick in the wall.
Anyway, yeah. That rally should be a real joy…
jl
This must be a feint. She’ll rip everything out and start cheeseburger and chocolate cake vines in March and set them out in May. They grow fast and first crop will be in time for 2018 elections.
Melania Trump embraces Michelle Obama’s vegetable garden
“I’m a big believer in healthy eating because it reflects on your mind and your body,” said Melania Trump, surrounded by about a dozen children in the garden on Friday afternoon. “I encourage you to continue to eat a lot of vegetables and fruits, so you grow up healthy and take care of yourself.”
After brief remarks, the first lady, dressed in a red plaid shirt, black pants and sneakers, joined the children in harvesting lettuce and kale, peas, radishes, Swiss chard and mustard. They also planted cabbage, cauliflower, turnips, carrots, spinach and kale, the White House said.
http://www.politico.com/story/2017/09/22/melania-trump-michelle-obama-vegetable-garden-243017
In more important news, McCain seems to be a firm ‘no’ on Graham-Cassidy.
After the corrupt McConnell killed to the earlier Collins, and lately Alexander, bipartisan, and actual good-faith efforts at a health bill, how can those two even consider voting for the crummy G-C bill. Imma going to go see where Alexander is in the whip count. They both should be firm ‘no’s on any BS the leadership pumps out.
Roger Moore
@WaterGirl:
I think it’s plausible. A major goal of companies like Facebook, Twitter, and Google is to automate as much of their process as possible. It lets them do stuff at massive scale without having to pay a lot of human employees, which improves their profit margin. It also lets them blame any problems on their algorithms rather than flawed human judgment. So yes, it’s entirely possible, maybe even likely, that nobody at Facebook has been paying the least attention to who was paying for ads for what. As long as their money is green and the ads themselves don’t violate content guidelines, Facebook isn’t going to ask questions.
A Ghost To Most
@Betty Cracker: BiP did give us invaluable insights into how the Russian trolls operate.
rikyrah
@SiubhanDuinne:
Oooh…I’ve always wanted to go there.
Is it as beautiful as it seems?
Yes..I am a Somewhere in Time fan.
dm
Facebook today is like television in the days of Minow’s “vast wasteland”:
https://www.technologyreview.com/s/604082/we-need-more-alternatives-to-facebook/
(linked from: https://www.technologyreview.com/the-download/608933/is-facebook-too-big-to-fight-its-ad-problem/).
though, hopefully, it will take less than fifty years for the problem to get solved.
Amir Khalid
@germy:
I think her “lean no” usually means, “What am I bid for a yes?” Although in this instance the legislation being considered is so obviously bad that it probably does mean she is likely to vote no.
Betty Cracker
@Ella in New Mexico: Agreed, but we can’t do jackshit about any of that until Republicans are thrown out of the majority, and that’s a tough nut to crack if we can’t hold an election that is free of foreign influence.
jl
@Amir Khalid: Like Graham really gives a damn? It’s just business. I’ll look for heart broken Graham stories for a laugh when they come out.
Pretenders Human Interest Story song
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iOnTc4FpJcs
Edit: Tattooed Love Boys
I can never remember the title.
Mnemosyne
@jl:
I freely admit, I am not a gardener, but is it common to plant new vegetables in Washington DC in late September? That seems kind of late in the year.
I’m actually not surprised that Melania wants to keep the garden, because she so clearly aspires to be Michelle Obama. As much as Trump hates Barack, Melania loves Michelle.
catclub
@jl:
Yeah, that is a big deal. Naturally, when he says he cannot vote for it in good conscience, I still worry he will vote for it in bad conscience.
This, and Collins and Murkowski and Rand Paul, looks like enough to kill it.
Gin & Tonic
@Roger Moore:
But it wasn’t.
waspuppet
I was “permanently” (took weeks of appeals to reverse) banned from advertising on FB for “insufficiently original content.” I posted about 20 words as a lead-in to a link to an interview with me about my book. That’s how hands-on FB can be if they want. But then, I wasn’t doing something harmless like stealing a presidential election; I was hawking a book. So, you know …
Major Major Major Major
@catclub: if there’s four of them, I think you’re more likely to get all four, since no one can be the deciding vote.
Amir Khalid
@A Ghost To Most:
For a while, BiP was obsessed with convincing li’l old me that the Ukrainians shot down MH17. I can’t imagine a less productive use for a Russian online troll’s time.
donnah
I emailed Lisa Murkowski, even though I live in Ohio. I emailed her the last time the Republicans tried to pass disaster healthcare, and sent one to Susan Collins and my own rep Portman. I also sent a positive post to Jimmy Kimmel’s Facebook page. I’m terrified by the desperation in the Republican rush to run this nightmare through. I’ll call and text and post wherever it works.
And here’s hoping McCain stands tough against it, too.
LurkerNoLonger
@A Ghost To Most: Who was BiP? I’ve lurked here for a long time but I don’t remember him/her.
InternetDragons
As much as I love fantasizing about the day I can relax and not wonder about who I need to call/write next about healthcare, this thing is far from over. Good explanation linked below about how the Sept. 30th deadline for repeal isn’t really the end. Repubs can still begin a new reconciliation process in January, which means they can still pass a repeal & replace bill with a simple majority:
https://thinkprogress.org/reconciliationdeadlinefake-6a7904af0d1d/
Trump’s presidency is so fucking exhausting. There’s always some new insanity to fight against, all while remembering that his appointees are quietly dismantling our governmental structures in ways we can’t directly oppose.
I’ve got to believe that all of this will sort out OK in the long run, but I have to admit that the shorter run pretty much sucks.
jl
@Mnemosyne: I’ve only done that stuff in CA and AK, I got no clue what the planting season is in DC and similar savage East Coast climates. Only other places I’ve spent enough time to know is Reno NV and southern Idaho, where it’s just useless anytime and no point even trying.
Edit: also on Marshall’s blog, Trump apologized to crowd that Melania couldn’t be there today, with FLOTUS standing right next to him. Trump is effing senile. FLOTUS needs a refuge, probably. and nice big garden with local school kids is good for that.
Also, checked whip count for G-C and Alexander is a ‘yes’. Some of these people are such shit-eating jackasses, it is just amazing.
the Conster, la Citoyenne
@Betty Cracker:
Why do progressives not understand that giving Dems a mandate is step 1? They put the policy cart before the horse, then blame Democrats for their policies not being enacted. They wanted to overturn Citizens United so much, they made it impossible by Bernie or Busting their way to a SCOTUS that will never be on their side.
Elizabelle
@SiubhanDuinne: What do the leaves look like up there?
Enjoy!!
Lyrebird
@Mnemosyne: Recall that feeding babies via built-in mammaries and talking about cancer recovery after surgery on such mammaries used to get booted as well!
Major Major Major Major
I think we can credit this massive… success, lack of regress… to Bernie’s well-timed single payer rally in SF with RoseAnn DeMoro today.
randy khan
@germy:
Others have covered this more amusingly, but it’s a signal she’s unhappy without a commitment. Either she’s looking for a
bribebenefit for her state or she’s hoping she doesn’t have to cast the vote to kill it but probably will if necessary.catclub
@LurkerNoLonger: Bob-in-Portland.
I never knew if it was Portland, Oregon, or Portland, Maine. Maybe Portland, England?
jl
@germy: It means slightly less chickenshit than Alexander.
germy
@Mnemosyne:
She’s harvesting. One of the washington newspapers says she’s picking peppers and other vegetables with some schoolchildren.
Her comment about the importance of healthy eating was interesting, considering her husband’s dietary habits.
JDM
@trollhattan:
They’re never too young to learn the phrase “selfish greedy asshole”.
Amir Khalid
@LurkerNoLonger:
Bob in Portland was his full nym. Very pro-Russia commenter.
germy
@catclub:
I always thought it was like The Simpsons’ Springfield.
catclub
@Mnemosyne:
Except the lesbians who wear men’s underwear.
Roger Moore
@schrodingers_cat:
I think they’re just bad at targeting.
Elizabelle
@feebog: Yeah. I am wondering if some Senators in purple states might vote no now too.
Good on McCain. Am confident Murkowski and Collins are nos as well.
schrodingers_cat
@catclub: Portland, Oregon. BiP said so himself.
A Ghost to Not
@Gin & Tonic:
Agreed. I want nothing to do with the racists I grew up with; that includes my family.
InternetDragons
@jl: Getting ready to plant fall spinach, sugar snap peas, and arugula here on the Left Coast, and am wondering what the growing season for that stuff is for folks who have to contend with actual winters.
Elizabelle
@germy: True. But I would guess Melania eats a lot of salads and veggies. She’s gotta keep that figure. It’s no doubt in a written agreement somewhere. She might have Barron eating more healthily too.
The Donald — you just gotta root for the coronary, stroke or aneurysm, and bring it on soon.
jl
@Roger Moore: I’m starting to think the ad algorithm thinks I’m gay (not that there is anything wrong with that). I’m getting all these ads for package resort vacations with two buff young dudes in close proximity, gazing at each other.
Could I get some hot chicks out of the ad algorithm please?
I never get good ads. At least the pathetic men’s hair loss and bad credit ads have gone away, for now. For a while I was thinking i need to get a weekly credit report.
Edit: and mortgage refinance ads, I get them all the time too. I never buy crap on the internet, except technical books. Maybe the algorithm is frustrated with me?
Fair Economist
@nonynony:
No, blogs have an important role in the liberal idea ecology still. It’s where ideas get thrashed around. Jamming them up is very useful for people who want to suppress left-wing ideas. Trolls have successfully killed a number of onetime discussion areas – Digby springs to mind. Moving the discussion to social media is definitely in the manipulator’s interest. It would have happened anyway, I guess, but the trolls sped it along.
Also, at least a number of blog trolls, including BiP, are long-standing and started when blogs were much more important than they are now.
trollhattan
@jl:
Color me surprised; I’d assumed it had been ripped out and converted to a tiny Trump-branded golf course ($100k membership initiation fee). I will unironically say good for her.
Back to our regularly scheduled whinging.
Mnemosyne
@germy:
It’s very poorly written, then, because the reporter has one group of vegetables being harvested and a separate set being planted:
raven
@germy: Lil Bit!! OH but it’s off topic. . .
satby
@Amir Khalid: and what a great sight that will be if it happens! Fingers crossed!
TenguPhule
@geg6:
i can tell you that they weren’t here 10 years ago.
They are now.
Mnemosyne
@catclub:
Hey, I don’t judge.
NotMax
@Amir Khalid
What Amir said. Labored (emphasis on the “bore”) to inject multiple anti-Ukraine, pro-Russia comments into nearly any thread, be they pet, gardening or other non-politically intended or no.
A Ghost To Most
@LurkerNoLonger:
BillBob in PortlandOriguy
I’m one of those people who have a credit card and a Facebook account. I’ve been taking out ads for my club’s events. For $30, I got one ad placed on 2000 feeds of Californians who like hiking, cartography, and trail running. Of that, about 170 clicked on the ad and 60 responded in some way (like, comment, etc.)
I’m sure Facebook is collecting a huge amount of data about their ads. Just the data I get for an ad is overwhelming. I’m not sure they were looking at action by Russian trolls related to US elections, until now. The thing about big data is that you have to spend a lot of time trying to figure out what it’s telling you.
A Ghost To Most
@catclub: Portland, Russia.
Fair Economist
@Roger Moore:
At least you could use underwear. I get ads for Roy Moore rallies – I guess because I visit Alabama.
Betty Cracker
@germy: She probably encourages the corpulent old bastard to eat as many fried foods as he can stuff in his big mouth. The day he finally drops dead will likely be the happiest day of her life. Not that I have any sympathy for her whatsoever; she’s a scummy grifter too. But I think she truly loathes Trump, so she’s “relateable” on that score.
jl
@Mnemosyne: You can go to several web sites and get planting times for all over the country.
I’m curious now and will do that when I have time. I’ll start with USDA, and some gardening mag whose name will come to mind soon.
And check out local colleges with ag departments, and nurseries.
TenguPhule
@Fair Economist: I blame the threads for getting ads for Russian/Chinese/Thai Dates/Brides, Pro & Anti Planned Parenthood ads, World of Tanks and World of Warships ads, and stupid autoplay ads of stupid old white men who can’t shut up.
A Ghost To Most
@jl: Yea, well their algorithm also thinks I’m a christian (I get PureFlix ads), so they got some work to do.
Faithful Lurker
@Betty Cracker: I joined Facebook so that I could get Bloom County. I ignore everything else on it. Bloom County is also on the comic strip sites but at least a week behind. I do love me some Opus.
Betty Cracker
@geg6: I got a really obnoxious one here today with “Ring My Bell” as the soundtrack. Not a damn thing I can do about it, though — that’s Alain’s purview.
Major Major Major Major
@jl: what music and tv do you like? That might be how they’re trying to target by proxy.
Patricia Kayden
Hope your aunt doesn’t read BJ, Betty. LOL.
@InternetDragons: Yes. Unfortunately, I cannot imagine that Republicans are going to rest until they eventually repeal and replace the ACA with something awful. That’s just who they are.
jl
@TenguPhule: ” stupid autoplay ads of stupid old white men who can’t shut up.” I seem to constantly have that ad on my ‘puter for last several weeks. Sound never works, so I have no clue what it is about.
Mnemosyne
@Origuy:
I think the bigger problem is that Facebook allows neo-Nazis and Klansmen to openly post on Facebook, which makes it easy for advertisers who want racist customers to find them.
I’m sure that Facebook will claim that it’s a “freedom of speech” issue, but they’re not the government. They’re a private company. They could choose to ban neo-Nazis and anti-Semites if they wanted to, but they choose not to
trollhattan
@A Ghost To Most:
Yup, and it’s not out of the question that they’re honing their messaging with various slices of society–Frank Luntz without the focus groups; Facebook every day of the week. They’re certainly sophisticated enough to know what works on a Trump voter doesn’t work everywhere–“What works on these guys? Let’s find out.”
jl
@Major Major Major Major: Every kind of music you can imagine. TV is news, sports, and interesting crud youtube thinks I want to see. Youtube has decided I am very interested in Conan O’Brien anti-Trump skits. Which are very good. Are they a balding gay man with bad credit who is looking for a resort vacation thing?
satby
@Mnemosyne: those are colder weather crops that should be ready for harvest by the time DC really gets cold. Spinach and kale at least, the others probably will be able to overwinter and be harvested in spring.*
Not a DC area gardener..
rikyrah
#GrahamCassidy is a long saught Republican wet dream to gut not only medicaid and health care for millions, but to punish blue states.
— Jeff Gauvin (@JeffersonObama) September 20, 2017
NotMax
@TenguPhule
Wasn’t all that long ago people here were mentioning getting bombarded with toenail fungus ads (presumably anti-fungus). The ads mentioned within this thread seem at least a tiny step up.
Roger Moore
@Amir Khalid:
I would guess that “lean no” means she’s made noises like she’s going to vote no but hasn’t made a definitive statement.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
Did anyone hear of McCain? Says he cannot support Graham-Cassidy
https://www.washingtonpost.com/powerpost/mccain-says-he-will-vote-no-for-gop-health-care-bill-dealing-major-blow-to-repeal-effort/2017/09/22/077ba8a4-9fc0-11e7-9c8d-cf053ff30921_story.html
Mnemosyne
@satby:
The root vegetables made sense to me as things you can plant late in the year and then harvest in the late fall or spring. It was the leafier stuff that confused me.
Baud
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: Off topic, dude.
HeleninEire
@WaterGirl: Yes. I mean yes to your No. Of course those fuckers knew.
different-church-lady
Q: When will people finally realize Facebook is a useless toy at best and destructive, manipulative menace at worst?
A: Never
This has been another episode of SATSQ.
Major Major Major Major
@jl: they wouldn’t be targeting by “percent of liked musicians that are gay”, they’d be targeting, say, Pet Shop Boys or Drag Race fans.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: I think McCain is just trolling the Republicans now.
trollhattan
@Roger Moore:
A big fat no that joined Weight Watchers? Am odd term of art that tells me little.
schrodingers_cat
@Betty Cracker: I keep getting NRA and Russian bride ads on my cell phone. My laptop has Adblock and NoScript so no ads.
misterpuff
Maverick must be relishing cutting the nuts off of POTUS…..again!
You will respect my moral POW authoritah!
different-church-lady
@Betty Cracker:
He was clearly, patently, a Russian Troll. The only question about it is was he a paid troll or just a willing hobbyist.
Betty Cracker
@InternetDragons: Amen to every word — this presidency is an interminable, soul-sucking siege. I sincerely hope McCain’s demurral kills the latest Trumpcare zombie. A new election year should mean that the GOP won’t try to reanimate that particular corpse, but with this insane bunch, who knows? I hope they pay a fucking price for that too, all this uncertainty. I hope enough people are upset about this nonstop, anxiety-ridden shit-show to come to the polls and flip the House.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@Baud:
When has that ever stopped anyone? :P
I was so surprised and happy when I saw that.
@Enhanced Voting Techniques:
I think he really cares about how history will judge him. Facing imminent death can do that.
Booger
@Mnemosyne: All of the former are appropriate for harvesting in D.C. about now; all of the latter are appropriate for planting in D.C. about now, particularly in the heart of an urban heat island. The backyard of the White House might never see a frost. It’s planting zone 7-a.
Roger Moore
@InternetDragons:
It isn’t the definitive end because there’s never a definitive end to anything Congress does. They can always try again. But it is a significant deadline because if they fail to meet it they have to go back and start again in the House. That’s a major setback, especially because it means any attempt to pass repeal will be happening much closer to election time when less politically active people will be paying more careful attention and it will be much harder for them to avoid their constituents.
Felonius Monk
@Amir Khalid:
I think we’d all be happy to send Lindsay over to Kuala Lumpur so you can see him in person. I think we would even spring for a one-way ticket if you promise to keep him. Maybe you could serenade him with some rockin’ guitar solos. :)
chris
@Faithful Lurker: Um, Breathed’s page is public, open to anyone. I go there every day and I’m another no-Facebook-never old grump.
germy
Aleta
A story about Steven King
from Bangor Daily News
Schlemazel
@trollhattan:
I think the thing BIP taught us was how far Putin was willing to go. If good ol BJ had a single troll imagine how many sites had one and how many they invested in Reddit, fb and other huge communities.
JaneSays
@Inte@InternetDragons: They can only use reconciliation once per fiscal year, and all signs point to them using the 2018 bill to pass their tax cuts package (which won’t be nearly as politically toxic in an election year as Trumpcare)…
O. Felix Culpa
@geg6 I just experienced the autoplay ad for the first time last week. Up till then, I didn’t know what people were complaining about. I immediately installed an adblocker (uBlock Origin – thank you, Another Scott!) and voila! no more nasty noise. It really is bad.
TenguPhule
@Betty Cracker:
And not enough cholera among the besiegers.
O. Felix Culpa
@feebog:
Yep. I think McCain’s statement is intended to give cover to other Senators who don’t want to vote for that travesty. Since he doesn’t need to worry about reelection, he can be first in line and look principled.
rikyrah
McCain cannot ‘in good conscience’ vote for GOP repeal bill
09/22/17 02:20 PM
By Steve Benen
If Sen. John McCain’s (R-Ariz.) goal was to play a consequential role in the fight over health care, he’s succeeded beautifully.
Two months ago, it was the Arizona Republican who cast a dramatic deciding vote that derailed his party repeal push. Two weeks ago, it was McCain who seemed to throw a lifeline to the repeal crusade, telling reporters he was prepared to support the Graham-Cassidy proposal.
And this afternoon, it was the veteran lawmaker who announced his opposition to the Graham-Cassidy plan, effectively sealing its fate.
Juju
@Major Major Major Major: I thought MRAs were men who couldn’t get pretty women especially, but women in general to go out with them and then have sex with them.
Major Major Major Major
@Aleta: he should run for senate.
O. Felix Culpa
@Mnemosyne: You can grow late season vegetables like kale and chard.
TenguPhule
@O. Felix Culpa:
But why would you want to? //
TenguPhule
Well that’s…..odd.
Blue Galangal
Apologies if this has been noted above, but if these are fake accounts, these are not “customer” communications. They are fake communications and aren’t protected by, you know, *any*thing.
O. Felix Culpa
@TenguPhule: Because I’m ornery and I like all leafy greens. Except collards. Hate collards. :-P
TenguPhule
@O. Felix Culpa: But Kale is what even food refuses to eat.
eemom
@Gin & Tonic:
Oh, don’t take it personally. I just don’t get why you people are so PROUD of yourselves.
@different-church-lady:
Yep, I knew you’d be along with your particular bizarre species of fanaticism on the subject. Lemme guess — you’re foaming at the mouth now, right?
A Ghost To Most
@TenguPhule: Kale is good for wrapping liver in on the way to the garbage can.
A Ghost To Most
@eemom: I’m sure the Mercers and Putin are happy for your
supportpersonal information.? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@germy:
Read the whole thing:
They want to rollback the French Revolution and the Enlightenment. And isn’t funny how a supposed “nationalist” wants his own country to be weakened?
Faithful Lurker
@chris: I was hoping you were right so I could avoid FB. I looked at BB’s home page and the strip there was from several days ago. It was #490 and the new one is #493. So, I guess I’m stuck unless I want to give it up for a week and let the homepage catch up. First world problems.
Ithink
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:
Absolutely terrifying. And I thought I had read & heard all there needed to be on Mr. Heimbach. These people are beyond redemption and are utter monsters!
Julie
@germy: Which is supposedly in Oregon, so…
different-church-lady
@eemom: I don’t usually foam at the mouth when I’m right about something.
Gin & Tonic
@eemom: What’s the point of being morally superior if you can’t lord it over others?
different-church-lady
@eemom: Also, I was among the first to “foam at the mouth” about spam, back when people were saying, “What’s the big deal? You just delete it.” Just a couple of years later it was a major menace (although minor in perspective to the kind of menace we’re dealing with today).
Gelfling 545
@Baud: Well, he always was, as are we all.
different-church-lady
@Gin & Tonic: I’ll admit that resisting Facebook is the signature achievement of my life as soon as someone else admits joining Facebook was the signature achievement of theirs.
Gelfling 545
@InternetDragons: I think he means it but a crap ton of calls thanking him for it couldn’t hurt.
Gelfling 545
@Mnemosyne: The vegetables mentioned thrive in cool weather, so are frequently planted in spring and fall.
Aimai
@the Conster, la Citoyenne: yup.
Gelfling 545
@Amir Khalid: Oh, speak not the name!
eemom
@different-church-lady:
There are a lot of upsides to FB, none to spam.
It is not the signature achievement of my life, but I have found it truly invaluable in restoring connections to all kinds of people from my past whose presence in my life NOW enriches it beyond measure, and who otherwise would have been lost to me forever. New friends made too.
You are not right. You are just weirdly obsessed. Stay off the damn thing if you don’t like it and STFU.
different-church-lady
@eemom: The problem with “staying off the damn thing” is that too many parts of our society now DEMAND that you be ON the damn thing.
Just one example: the manufacturer of professional gear I use frequently had a robust, organized tech support chat board going. They shut it down and moved all on-line tech support to Facebook. It’s now a disorganized mess, unsearchable, and filled with memes and snark instead of actual information.
If you care to disregard their constant privacy retools, their mining your life for sellable data, the trolling, the insipidness, the encouragement for empty “communication”,the way it destroys people’s attention spans, their insatiable desire to see all communication go through their company, and their now obvious role in creating perhaps the greatest threat our government has ever attempted to function under, then yes, I suppose it’s a pretty cool little toy.
J R in WV
@trollhattan:
It’s easy. Explain to her that some people are very afraid that they will have to go to work for a living, or even be unable to make a living at all. So those people are desperate to crush others’ ability to rise up the economic ladder, mistakenly believing that life is a zero sum game, that the rich people won’t do as well if other people also do well.
Also, too, greedy and evil. Maybe that’s all you need, really, those two clear words. She’s greedy and evil. Works for me.
eemom
@different-church-lady:
Yeah, and NONE of that is true of the rest of the internet, amirite?
But since I’m clearly on “whatever you say” turf here, ok. You ARE right. Facebook is the antichrist, and God put you on earth to save us from it. Run along now and set yourself up with a megaphone on a street corner before it’s too late.
J R in WV
@schrodingers_cat:
You have always seemed like an Elder of Somewhere. Not Zion, tho.
Elder of Barsoom, that’s it!!
J R in WV
@Roger Moore:
And I need new underwear, but did I get any red hot deals? Hell nos!!! This AI is really an Artificial Stupid!!!
J R in WV
@Mnemosyne:
Those are all fall crops, they can be mulched when it gets cold, some will produce by late this fall, others will get a head start on next spring. DC can have brief terrible winter storms, in which case someone will need to cover some of those plants, but kale, cabbage, cauliflower are all hardy fall crops. But those storms are more and more unlikely – I dunno why?
ETA: It is a little late, neighbors got their fall gardens in last month mostly, but DC is south of here in terms of growing seasons. And she isn’t a big gardener either, so learning a little.
Maybe someone gave her a tiny nudge. She hasn’t been living there for very long, has she?
J R in WV
@LurkerNoLonger:
BiP was Bob in Portland. He claimed to be a strong union man, former USPS shop steward, etc, etc. All BS, he was a total troll… I know union officers, married to one. Bob in Portland was never in a union. Plus totally pro Russia. How many union guys you know like that? Zero – 000.00
J R in WV
@Fair Economist:
“….I guess because I visit Alabama.”
Oh, no. I am so sorry!!
Amir Khalid
@Felonius Monk:
What have I ever done to you, that you threaten me like this? (sad face)
1000 flouncing lurkers (was fidelio)
@satby: Kale loves cold weather, and no colder than it actually gets in DC (it’s not Vermont, after all!) it should do well, as will the cabbage & cauliflower. The spinach might be for baby spinach. I doubt killing frosts in DC are as late as they now are in Nashville, but she might have 45 days or so to work with, and longer if it’s covered.