I’m sure Cheryl will be along with greater details once we have them, but in the meantime:
BREAKING: North Korea launches unidentified missile eastward, Yonhap news agency reports, citing South Korean military officials
— NBC News (@NBCNews) November 28, 2017
This is a little unusual for this time of year. The typical pattern is that the DPRK essentially stops weapons testing from the late fall through the winter.
Pyongyang’s last recorded weapons test occurred 73 days ago, on Sept. 15. That launch, in which a missile was fired over Japan, capped a bout of activity that had heralded a number of technological developments in North Korea’s weapons program, including the test of its most powerful nuclear bomb yet.
North Korea hasn’t fired a missile for 60 days, but that may have more to do with its own winter training cycle than with Pyongyang easing off on provocations.
Since Kim Jong Un took power in late 2011, only five of the isolated nation’s 85 rocket launches have taken place in the October-December quarter, according to The James Martin Center for Nonproliferation Studies’ North Korea Missile Test Database.
The Korean People’s Army regularly enters its training cycle every winter “and getting ready for it involves a calm before the storm,” said Van Jackson, a strategy fellow at the Center for Strategic Studies at Victoria University of Wellington.
“Fall is the harvest season, and a lot of military labor is dedicated to agricultural output when not in war mode; inefficient, but it’s the nature of the North Korean system,” said Jackson, a former U.S. Department of Defense adviser. “It’s a routine, recurring pattern, which means we should expect a surge in provocations in the early months next year.”
North Korea’s last launch was on Sept. 15, when the isolated state fired its second missile over Japan in as many months. That missile that flew far enough to put the U.S. territory of Guam in range.
As more information becomes available, what we know about today’s launch is likely to change. So stay frosty!
d58826
Well I guess rocket man figured it was a good time to jerk Dotard’s chain a bit.
Corner Stone
They still don’t have quite enough human feces gathered to spread out over the farms. So the military has a little time to kill.
Cheryl Rofer
It’s unusual because it’s 3 am in North Korea. The best information will be on Twitter. People to follow:
@mhanham
@annafifeld
@nktpnd
@narangvipin
And a few others, but those four will get you started.
Shea Cotton (@shea_cotton) has timelined North Korea’s missile tests. They tend to slow down during the winter, but they are not completely absent.
Oh, and for those of you in the Santa Fe area, I’ll be speaking on North Korea next Monday.
Corner Stone
And I don’t know what Cole did to piss off FireFox but it just chews and chews on Balloon-Juice.com. It’s the only site I visit on FF that is getting the full on business like this.
Cheryl Rofer
I’m gonna get me some lunch. I’m coming down with a cold, but fortunately I have turkey soup.
waspuppet
Wait – you mean insulting and baiting people might cause them to act more aggressively against you than otherwise?
Are you saying that international diplomacy is different from getting a variance from the Queens zoning board?
Maybe if I were a Master Dealmaker I would understand what’s happened here.
Cheryl Rofer
Also, will take a while for the numbers on range and altitude to come in, along with splashdown site.
Villago Delenda Est
Also, too the NK Army has to rest up for the annual Team Spirit saber rattling exercise.
Adam L Silverman
@Corner Stone: Remember, Alain has been out of pocket because his mother died. The funeral is tomorrow. Once he gets through that he’ll begin to reengage with the site maintenance that has backed up. So sorry for the inconvenience, but given the circumstances…
Brachiator
@Corner Stone:
Are you running the new FireFox (Quantum)?
Villago Delenda Est
@Corner Stone: I’m running on the new FireFox and it’s fine for me.
Corner Stone
@Brachiator: Yes, FF Quantum 57.0. Says it is up to date.
schrodingers_cat
@Corner Stone: Ever since I updated my Firefox, Balloon Juice has been taking forever to load.
Corner Stone
With such bad balance in his walking gait, I am surprised Trump can play golf at all without falling over a few times.
Corner Stone
@schrodingers_cat: I saw Flying Toaster say she was looking into some interaction when she had more time.
I’ve been trying different setups because running BJ on native FF is untenable. But that combo also hates various block programs to different degrees, as far as I can tell.
Adam L Silverman
Part 1:
Part 2:
Cheryl Rofer
Another person to follow.
Cheryl Rofer
Trump is supposed to give a statement at 3pm eastern. Was going to be to the entire press corps, but now limited to the press pool. I am praying he focuses on “Chuck and Nancy.”
Cheryl Rofer
Also looking like long range. But numbers aren’t confirmed yet.
geg6
@Corner Stone:
You keep saying this, but I use Firefox on all my devices and don’t have a problem with it at all.
Spanky
@Cheryl Rofer:
Prepare for the worst, ’cause that’s what he does.
Villago Delenda Est
@Cheryl Rofer: Ought to be very stupid.
GregB
Rex Tillerson has dispatched the coffee boy to negotiate. He’s being sent on horseback and doesn’t speak Korean. All good.
Corner Stone
@geg6: I am happy for you but something changed recently for me and it’s quite frustrating. I’m using the same laptop I always use to surf various sites. I can only imagine it’s the update to FF that’s causing the issue. BJ is the only routine stop I have noticed this behavior, so don’t know what else to make of it.
Cheryl Rofer
Corner Stone
@GregB: Is Papadopolous allowed to leave the country?
geg6
@Corner Stone:
Sorry about that, but just letting you know that it’s maybe your device and not BJ or FF. I’m all updated on everything and no problems.
Brachiator
@Cheryl Rofer:
Also hope that he can suppress his urge to throw out gratuitous insults.
Raven
@Adam L Silverman: I was doing a presentation and ran into the granddaughter of the highest ranking Jewish officer killed in Vietnam. http://www.vvmf.org/Wall-of-Faces/30434/IRWIN-S-LERNER
Cheryl Rofer
Millard Filmore
@Corner Stone:
On my main linux computer, Firefox v57 and the new NoScript goes into a busy loop on B-J.com
I had to go with one of the no-script-light versions to clear that up.
TenguPhule
@Corner Stone:
Probably something involving a mop. Or mustard.
TenguPhule
@Cheryl Rofer: Well that’s definitely not comforting.
TenguPhule
@Brachiator:
Maybe ask for a more likely miracle?
Raven
I’m staring at the Gulf of Mexico between Tyndall and Elgin and can report no increased activity. Couple of C130’s and Blackhawk’s is all. Still no fish!
TenguPhule
@Cheryl Rofer:
This is sadly true. All the successful tests so far have required defenders have clear skies, plenty of warning and homing beacons on the targets.
GregB
@Corner Stone:
He’s got a permission slip from Kellyann Goebbels on Infowars letterhead. All good.
Dread
So, I guess I should go and join our generals and admirals on Twitter to see if the President declares war?
trollhattan
@Raven:
Thank you for your service. ;-)
Tilda Swintons Bald Cap
Hey, maybe the NYT will do a profile about how Kim Jong Un likes to eat Korean food or something.
Raven
@trollhattan: it’s nuttin, believe me!
r€nato
you mean Trump’s endless empty threats didn’t stop DPRK from launching another missile? GTFO
Adam L Silverman
@Raven: That’s interesting.
trollhattan
O/T can there be too much stupid concentrated in one small area? We may soon find out.
I’m imagining the “position wanted” ad. “Alpha male seeks wingnut welfare perch.”
trollhattan
@Raven:
Definitely nuttin’ if they not bitin’!
Raven
@Adam L Silverman: It is. I have another friend whose father was killed that OP, if you haven’t read The Christmas Bombing, pick it up. The height of military stupidity.
Cheryl Rofer
No president yet. They’re waiting for the downers to kick in.
Raven
@trollhattan: I keep hopin.Just a couple of hours of sunlight. On the other hand it is gorgeous.
Gravenstone
@Cheryl Rofer: My first guess about the timing was spoofing the visual satellites (won’t do anything about IR or radar, of course). But testing launch systems capabilities in general makes more sense.
Cheryl Rofer
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@Cheryl Rofer:
Trump cannot fail he can only be failed
Cheryl Rofer
@Gravenstone: My default assumption is that North Korea’s missile and nuclear test scheduling has more to do with their program requirements than anything else.
Cheryl Rofer
Cheryl Rofer
Meanwhile, the Republican tax bill is out of committee, might be voted on tomorrow.
TenguPhule
@Cheryl Rofer:
When it rains, it pours.
Cheryl Rofer
“Juche bird” is the short name for the test the North Koreans have said they might do of a missile with a nuke on top and detonate the nuke over the Pacific Ocean.
Cheryl Rofer
TenguPhule
@Cheryl Rofer: Thank you for the nightmares. //
Cheryl Rofer
I haven’t found a livestream of the President’s press conference.
Cheryl Rofer
@38NorthNK is tweeting links to their previous articles on North Korean missiles.
Mike in NC
Dotard will be beside himself if on Friday he can announce both passing tax “reform” and launching a preemptive strike against Little Rocket Man. Winning!
timmeh
This is about the recent defection and maybe Tillerson’s speech.
Cheryl Rofer
Here’s his comment on North Korea.
SFAW
@Cheryl Rofer:
Corker and Johnson both voted to send it to the floor.
Wasn’t someone here predicting that Johnson would do just that? Also good to see that Corker still goes for Partei uber Heimat, that miserable, lying fuck. And Suzie-Q is happy with killing the individual mandate, and Murkowski is down with it too.
Well, at least the Internet is still free.
Cheryl Rofer
Here’s Mattis talking about the launch. Pretty much what’s in this thread.
WaterGirl
@Corner Stone: It’s not just Firefox. It’s been like super slow for me in Safari for a few days.
Schlemazel
@Spanky:
I have tried to prepare for the worst but the bastard still finds new, lower levels of muck
TenguPhule
@SFAW:
That’s scheduled to be destroyed next month.
TenguPhule
@Cheryl Rofer: An empty table would inspire more confidence.
Schlemazel
@Cheryl Rofer:
Well, we can always hope for nuclear winter to save us
Tilda Swintons Bald Cap
If Hillary was POTUS it would be wall to wall Republicans on TV wailing about how weak we are and how Hillary is Neville Chamberlain. At least we don’t have to listen to that.
Adam L Silverman
@trollhattan: Notice what they didn’t do: they didn’t make him a senior fellow or fellow or resident scholar or social scientist or senior social scientist. They made him a consultant. I’m not even sure what that means in think tank world.
The Pale Scot
@Raven: Not home at the moment. Last two weeks at Madeira Beach there was a rotting fish smell at the water’s edge. Faint, but noticeable. No news of red tide, but something seemed off. I didn’t do my interpretive Elephant Seal impression, just taking a quick dip
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@Schlemazel:
Maybe the entire admin will go on AF One to SK and get shot down.
? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?
@Tilda Swintons Bald Cap:
Poor Chamberlain. Despite being a conservative, he deserves better than to be a perpetual punching bag of asshole chickenhawk American conservatives.
Adam L Silverman
@Cheryl Rofer: Why was the SecDef at that meeting? This wasn’t a cabinet meeting. Nor was it specifically about defense appropriations. This was about a year end, kick the can down the road continuing resolution for a couple of months to just keep the doors open through the holidays.
TenguPhule
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?: That would still leave far too many unqualified idiots in charge.
TenguPhule
@Adam L Silverman:
Because the Republicans want to raise military spending and needed a sock puppet.
Brachiator
@Cheryl Rofer:
The race is on …
From Reuters
Adam L Silverman
@trollhattan:
Cheryl Rofer
@Adam L Silverman: I think Trump is being told to use people who actually know what they’re talking about to give statements, so that he doesn’t do a “fire and fury” again. He did it at the session with the Navajo Code Talkers yesterday when he called John Kelly to the podium to talk about what they did. Of course, the fact that the Code Talkers were so clearly not White American Males like him and had actually made a statement loosed his bigotry.
That’s just a theory. If it’s what they’re doing, they’re batting .500 so far.
trollhattan
@Adam L Silverman:
Embarrassing the Heritage staff is a hallmark of a certain distinction.
mike in dc
Outside of actually striking US territory with a nuke, what’s the worst-case? Juche Bird taking place near Guam? That’s the most provocative action I can think of short of an outright act of war. The question is whether the Pentagon would be successful from restraining Trump from ordering an attack on DPRK.
Schlemazel
@? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:
That is the hope of the universe!
J R in WV
@Cheryl Rofer:
Steve Herman worked for The A P with my wife, so we knew him well in the long ago. He is a good reporter, loved the SE Asia area, freelanced out there, then got on with VOA, so his reports can be trusted. A least as much as the DOD can be trusted, if not moreso.
Villago Delenda Est
@mike in dc: China has stated that if NK strikes first, they will be neutral.
US strikes first, it means war with China.
Cheryl Rofer
@mike in dc: North Korea has stated many times that their nukes are for deterrence, not first use. They said it again in tonight’s statement. I believe them, because they know that a nuclear war would destroy them.
Their announcement is that it is a new missile, the Hwasong 15, an intercontinental ballistic missile that can reach all of the US with their hydrogen warhead. They said that this “completes” their program, a word that experts have been looking for. There was an earlier statement from a general that Juche Bird might be necessary to convince the US. So what Trump tweets will be important. He’s tweeted tonight; I think he’s had a bad day, but he hasn’t tweeted about the North Korean test.
Strange as it may seem, I think that all this points to talks being a good idea. The way to start would be military-to-military deconfliction talks, so that their missile tests don’t accidentally come down on Japan. Military deconfliction would lead to dealing with some of North Korea’s concerns. The US and South Korea regularly have military exercises or, more frequently, overflights of South Korea by US B-1s from Guam. The B-1s can’t carry nuclear weapons, but the North Koreans don’t trust us, and conventional attacks concern them too. They would very much like those flights to stop.
On our side, we’d like some way to deal with incidents like the North Korean soldier defecting last week, and the North Koreans pursuing him across the DMZ. And the occasional North Korean decision to shell a random island.
Once those talks accomplish something, it may be possible to extend the subject to their missile and nuke tests. That’s how it’s done. And no way will North Korea give up its nukes, so declaring that that is necessary before any talks, as various members of the Trump administration have done, is a good way not to have talks. It may be useful to state it as a long-term goal, but the Negotiator-in-Chief doesn’t believe in giving his strategy away.
I think it was hopeful, as I said upthread, that the Orange One had Secretary Mattis speak to the test this afternoon, rather than blustering off by himself. They may be getting across to him that this is serious business.
Matt McIrvin
@Cheryl Rofer: War would be the best thing politically that has happened to Trump since he was elected. Why would he not want it? There’s the certainty of it going badly and the possibility of nuclear apocalypse, but Trump is a wounded animal with little to lose.
If he gets the DPRK to actually nuke an American city, that’s like 9/11 times a thousand. Russiagate would be gone. Trump could declare himself emergency dictator and rule by decree, as long as the blast doesn’t personally get him. He wins in that case.
Cheryl Rofer
@Matt McIrvin: I think that Trump is too much of a coward to declare war. I know that one can make the argument that that is all the more reason for him to make war, but look at the video of his statement yesterday. Look at any video of his statements under stress. He hugs himself, literally. He has nothing to say. “We’ll take care of that.” That’s what you say when you have no idea of what to do. It’s possible he’ll start a war in utter desperation, but he’s not there yet.
Meanwhile, Alex Wellerstein, a historian of nuclear weapons, is tweeting his thoughts in this thread, which is very good.