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Putin dreamed of ending NATO, and now it’s Finnish-ed.

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You are here: Home / Little triggers

Little triggers

by | 246 Comments

This post is in: 

They keep pulling me back in:

A bill that once seemed primed to sail through the Senate suddenly has a problem.

Surrounding Corker on the Senate floor were leadership figures like Sens. Mitch McConnell, John Cornyn, John Barasso, and John Thune. But Corker spent much of the time arguing with Pennsylvania Rep. Pat Toomey, an ardent supply-sider who’s been frustrated with Corker’s efforts to install a “trigger” to recoup revenue if the tax bill doesn’t vastly grow the economy. Other members, like Idaho Sen. Jim Risch, Utah Sen. Orrin Hatch, and Ohio Sen. Rob Portman came in and out of the huddle. Corker at one point walked over to the Democratic side to speak with Maine Sen. Angus King, on whose motion they were voting. McConnell separately walked over to Johnson, whose has his own set of concerns with the bill.

[….]

“It doesn’t look like the trigger’s going to work, according to the parliamentarian,” Cornyn told a flood of reporters when he exited the chamber. “So we have an alternative—frankly, a tax increase that we don’t want to do—to try to address Sen. Corker’s concerns.”

I know these Republican Senators think if they vote for this, they’ll get cushy jobs as lobbyist when voters throw their sorry asses out of office. They should remember something else: when that sweet lobbying gig is over, they will rot in hell for eternity.

Reader Interactions

246Comments

  2. 2.

    Baud

    I recall the heady days of the ACA debate when the folks at GOS were livid that the Dems might negotiate with Olympia Snowe on a trigger for the public option. This brings back memories. Not good memories, but memories.

  3. 3.

    Jack the Second

    It’s hilarious to me that the Republican’s big “give massive tax cuts to the rich” bill is as much work for them to formulate and negotiate and pass as the PPACA was for the Democrats.

  4. 4.

    Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (formerly Mumphrey, et Al.)

    To be nitpicky, I think they’re going to roast in hell, not rot. But point taken, otherwise.

  5. 5.

    Llelldorin

    You seem to forget that these are members of the First Church of Christ, Kleptocrat: If you’re rich, it means that you’re a member of the elect, because otherwise God wouldn’t have slipped you all those C-notes under the table.

  9. 9.

    jl

    I think the kefluffle in Doug!’s post has already been settled and they are already passing big chunks of the disaster out of the Senate.

  10. 10.

    japa21

    KInteresting that they feel the need to keep Corker’s vote. It means there must be 2 other Senators they can’t count on.

  11. 11.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    frankly, a tax increase that we don’t want to do—to try to address Sen. Corker’s concerns.”

    and this is the tax increase that will most likely be trigged by an economic downturn? brilliant work, fellas

  12. 12.

    Percysowner

    I’m Unitarian, so I don’t believe anyone goes to Hell. I’ll go with they feel the pain they inflicted on every single person that it touched, then they come back poor, and non-white, and female in a country that follows the culture they have pushed forward.

  13. 13.

    John Revolta

    It’s not my favorite Costello song, but I love how he rhymes “censored sequences” with “consequences”.

  14. 14.

    SiubhanDuinne

    But Corker spent much of the time arguing with Pennsylvania Rep. Pat Toomey

    Toomey’s a senator. WTF, Slate?

  22. 22.

    sixthdoctor

    NEW: McConnell says no more votes until 11 am tomorrow.The tax bill won't finish tonight.— Sahil Kapur (@sahilkapur) December 1, 2017

    STATE OF PLAY—Major provisions in Senate tax bill continue to be renegotiated and rewritten. A lot remains up in the air. Biggest sticking points are the ~$1 trillion red ink and pass-through breaks. GOP leaders want to pass it tomorrow.— Sahil Kapur (@sahilkapur) December 1, 2017

  23. 23.

    Mike J

    Weird. This disappeared when I tried to post it a second ago. Trying again.

    Frank Thorp ‏Verified account @frankthorp

    Asked if he thinks they can finish the tax bill tonight, Sen @PatRoberts throws some shade at Corker: “He’ll probably call another meeting along with other people who won’t be here very long to determine the fate of the rest of us.”

  25. 25.

    LurkerNoLonger

    i don’t know if this should go in the good news thread or here:

    Andy Slavitt
    ✔
    @ASlavitt
    BREAKING: Senate GOP can’t get tax bill done tonight. They will try again tomorrow. And so will we.

  27. 27.

    Corner Stone

    Why does Tweety keep insisting that D’s could have somehow stopped this bill if they wanted to?

  28. 28.

    Llelldorin

    @sixthdoctor: This kind of legislative fizbin is exactly why John McCain’s intermittent Deep Concern™ about regular order was such an important point. It’s a pity that he’s reverted to his usual stance that Deep Concern needn’t actually impact his vote in any way.

  31. 31.

    Tenar Arha

    @Jack the Second: But that’s the point, it isn’t. h/t Cole It’s tire rims and anthrax with motor oil poured on top to try and make that stick together. It’s the kludgiest of kludges, which won’t actually compile! It’s a lazy essay with no footnotes, and wide margins to hit the required page count, which ignores all the requirements. It’s a rush job, that isn’t even worth the price. It’s possible it’s the fricking end of capitalism as we’ve known it if it passes.

    ETA Basically, IMHO, if the GOP hadn’t lost it’s mind long ago, it wouldn’t even be this close!

  32. 32.

    BlueDWarrior

    @Corner Stone: because he can’t imagine that the Republican party are now acting like the PRC politburo. The Democrats are elected officials in America, they have to be able to do something, right?

  34. 34.

    sixthdoctor

    @Llelldorin: I don’t understand him or Collins. Murkowski got bought off, fine, but by McCain’s sainted “principles” this should have been a thumbs down. Yes, I know, he is who he is, and I can’t expect logic in a bad dream, but still…

  35. 35.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Corner Stone: is anyone pushing back or are they all giving him that “Uncle Spittles is so amusing if you’re not in spray range!” smile his guests tend to get?

  36. 36.

    mike in dc

    There’s still a slim chance this thing falls apart either in the Senate or during reconciliation–a lot of reps don’t like the state and local deduction elimination because it effectively raises taxes on their constituents. There’s a ton of other poison pills in this that are only still there because of the desperation to deliver for their donors.

  39. 39.

    Corner Stone

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: That’s three shows in a row that (I’ve seen) not one person said “52 to 48”.
    Matthews (tonight) said “Did anyone really think Chuck and Nancy had done a good job of stopping this bill? C’mon!!”

    edited

  40. 40.

    TenguPhule

    @mike in dc:

    a lot of reps don’t like the state and local deduction elimination because it effectively raises taxes on their constituents.

    Unfortunately this was one of the things both bills had in common and it still passed in the House.

    The weak spot for now seems to be the having to raise taxes in the bill to get out of the deficits at the back end.

    We might be able to leverage this against them.

  43. 43.

    eemom

    @jl:

    I think the kefluffle in Doug!’s post has already been settled and they are already passing big chunks of the disaster out of the Senate.

    Link please??

  44. 44.

    TS

    @Corner Stone: Anything goes wrong in the US – it is ALWAYS the democrat’s fault – the GOP can do no wrong – it was the dems who elected trump because they had such a bad candidate, it was the dems who lost the senate because no-one liked health care, it is the dems who must resign because of sexual harrassment – it is ALWAYS the democrats who get it wrong – but that terrible liberal media.

  46. 46.

    piratedan

    I’m guessing these guys are under the impression that if the Dems do get back into power that they’re just going to go back and do what they used to do… I’m thinking that after the debacle that was McConnell, Boehner and Ryan that the Dems, if they do sweep back into control may very well, stop all of the collegial legislating and stick it right back to the GOP base. After all, watching the GOP make a mockery of the process, I could see the Dems using the said same process and introducing estate taxes, taxes on churches, taxing these supposed 503 public interest groups, and completely taking back congressional control from the President on MULTIPLE items. Nancy Smash will not fuck around and I’m guessing Shumer has seen enough of McConnel to know that his word is essentially worthless. Yes, its the long game, but if these bastards manage to bring this into play, watch for voter suppression en masse to be next on the agenda. Lets face it, the GOP is not going to go down without trying to gerrymander their asses into the driver seats eternally and enough people are pissed off now that they ARE voting (for crying out loud, we’re even flipping local seats in Oklahoma) and who would have thought that Alabama would even be in play, regardless of the choices.

  47. 47.

    jl

    @eemom: I posted on absolutely infallible authority: BJ commeters in previous thread. Ex cathedra quality assertion. But maybe I go look.

  50. 50.

    eemom

    @jl:

    Cool. Cuz as I understand it, the kerfluffle means that the so-called deficit hawks either vote against the thing or out themselves as just another set of plutocrat whores.

  52. 52.

    ruemara

    If we get back both houses, prosecute these fuckers should be the first order of business. I’d like to see if Donny’s heart can take it. Like all good torture, start small and work your way up.

  53. 53.

    TenguPhule

    @eemom: jl was saying they’d passed the bill, I believe. I was just correcting him.

    We have a chance. Slim, but real.

  55. 55.

    David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch

    If they’re still wrangling to get Corker’s vote it must be a good sign.

    I mean, if their whip count was at 50 or 51 they could just blow him off, cuz even at 50 they could still pass it with a tiebreak vote. They certainly want to avoid tax increase triggers at all costs.

    That they’re not blowing him and considering tax increases must mean they’re below 50.

  57. 57.

    jl

    @TenguPhule: Thanks.
    @eemom: Apparently there is a real problem. Below is link to an AP story. Corker and, I think, some others want a trigger to scale back high income tax cuts if promised growth spurt doesn’t spurt and deficit blows up, but parliamentarian says that can’t go into reconciliation. So now Corker and maybe some others want to just make the bill smaller. I think pressure on Congress is useful, because changes like that can jam things up, and if it passes make it less horrible.

    And a smaller bill would even further piss off the big donors. I heard news reports that they are pissed off, for example, that estate tax probably won’t be eliminated immediately. One of the bills doesn’t eliminate it at all. I want the big donors to be as pissed off and disappointed with their incompetent dishonest corrupt GOP flunkies as possible.

    GOP tax bill gains support; Senate leaders work on holdouts
    https://finance.yahoo.com/news/maine-sen-collins-still-problems-153301575.html

  59. 59.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch: true, but… “couldn’t even get Bob Corker to vote for it” is a really bad headline for a bill that’s already really unpopular.

    I saw a tweet today that Flake and Corker have been spending a lot of time together. If Pence has to vote for this, they really hand the Dems some talking points

  60. 60.

    David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch

    Think about all the times these assholes have taken a bill to the floor without the votes.

    Remember when ACA repeal failed in the House. All week long they said they had it in the bag the vote was a mere formality. And then they lost.

    Remember when how embarrassing it was when they couldn’t pass a simple farm subsidy bill that goes to red states.

  61. 61.

    Llelldorin

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:
    Particularly because his coverage always sounds exactly like an American sportscaster trying to cover a foreign sport that he doesn’t understand _at_all_ by BSing his way through.

    “What, the Republicans seem to be about to score? Where is the Democrats’ defense???”
    “The Republicans look confident out there on the field… wait a minute, there’s a huddle over by the official…”

  62. 62.

    jl

    Collins, Murkowski and McCain deserve some contacts just to shame them with their outrageous corruption and bad faith.

  65. 65.

    jl

    @Llelldorin: Matthews probably thinks that if Schumer and Pelosi had laughed off Trump’s tweet predicting there would be no deal even before the spending authorization meeting started earlier this week, and just brought a six pack of beer like Ol’ Tip did with the Gipper and slapped Trump on the back and joked it out, it would have all gone away. Or something like that.

  67. 67.

    smintheus

    I’ve said this before about Pat Toomey. I ran cross-country against him. He and his team were notorious cheats who had zero concern for the safety of others. For years they made a practice of trying to injure the lead runners on teams they faced, at the starting line, by stepping down on their heels from behind at the gun and ripping their achilles tendons. That was how they saw their way to winning, by destroying anybody who wasn’t on their team. Toomey was a scum already as a kid, as were all the others who upheld that ‘ethos’.

  68. 68.

    ? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:
    Speaking of Pence, I looked up how many tie-breaking votes he’s cast. He’s cast 3 so far this year since being sworn in. For comparison, Biden cast zero over 8 years. Cheney cast 8 over 8 years. Al Gore cast 4 over 8 years. GHW cast 8 over 8 years. LBJ cast none over his tenure.

  69. 69.

    BlueDWarrior

    @jl: you can do that when both parties intend to govern. As terrible as Reagan was, he internalized he was running an entity of governance. This current crop of Republicans are only in it to hold office long enough to make bank later, or just to make sure Democrats can’t do anything systemically.

  70. 70.

    jl

    @David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch:

    ” Think about all the times these assholes have taken a bill to the floor without the votes. ”

    You are assuming there is actually a finished bill to vote on when they try to bring it to the floor. I think absence of such is one reason.
    The GOP and their donors are so insane with greed, everyone is already pissed off that they are not getting everything they dreamed of. Even minor concessions that any sane greedhead would gladly accept become big problems. I read that the donors have absolutely forbidden that any of their loopholes be closed. Absolutely no tax reform for the super rich or giant corporations. i think their final “What part of NO don’t you GOP pissants understand?” was delivered two or three weeks ago, and that is when shit in the bill started going insane at warp speed.

    I hope we see another example for the saying ‘Pigs get fed and hogs get slaughtered’ soon.

  71. 71.

    mike in dc

    @jl:
    Tweety needs to go. Praying for a minor sex harass scandal involving him so he’s gone before 2020. Is there really a pressing need for a “nostalgic old white guy pretending it’s still the 80s politically”?

  72. 72.

    Spider-Dan

    @TenguPhule:

    I believe implying prison rape is frowned on here. Not sure wishing future rape and abuse to a reincarnation is any better.

    Is it more acceptable to wish plain old eternal torture instead of eternal torture and rape? I mean, essentially we are splitting hairs at that point.

    Just remember, 2018 isn’t when we can start doing this. We’d need 2/3rd majorities in both houses of Congress to do that.

    The only thing that requires more than a simple majority in the House is proposing a Constitutional Amendment, and in that case, that’s a minor obstacle compared to the 38 state legislatures needed to approve it.

  73. 73.

    scott (the other one)

    @sixthdoctor: I mean, that’s the thing, right? He’s not all the long for this world, and his great-grandchildren are already more than set for life several times over. So…what the hell? Is it possible he really truly believes the bullshit his party spews? Or, hells bells, maybe Russia’s got something on his wife and kids…

  75. 75.

    David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch

    @? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?:

    Biden cast zero over 8 years.

    Obama passed ACA with 60 votes, a pretty remarkable achievement. And still the media freaked out because it didn’t have any of their precious “bipartisan support”. Imagine how they would have reacted if Obama could only pass legislation by tiebreaker. But IOKIYAR.

  76. 76.

    B.B.A.

    @Spider-Dan: Veto overrides too. Unless we can get a simultaneous double removal and install a Democratic speaker, there’s going to be a shitstain in the Oval Office vetoing everything to the left of Attila the Hun until January 2021.

  77. 77.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @mike in dc: if you’ve ever seen him breathily asking Erin Burnett, appearing on his show by remote, to lean closer, closer to the camera, it’s pretty fucking gross. Somebody brought it up in a print interview a year or so later. Tweety got very angry, while his wife looked very uncomfortable. I’ll be surprised if something doesn’t come out about him.

  83. 83.

    ? ?? Goku (aka The Hope of the Universe) ? ?

    @David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch:
    Really. Double standards piss me off. I noticed a pattern when looking at the breaking votes since 1945: they were usually few and far between and when used, Republicans cast the most. Beginning in the Regan era, VPs began to cast more tie-breakers.

  84. 84.

    David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch

    @jl: I’m old enough to remember how they insisted for 9 months that the bill would be revenue neutral. That the cost of tax rate reduction would be offset by eliminating corporate tax loopholes. And the gullible media bought it.

  85. 85.

    rikyrah

    WHAT THE PHUCK?

    I SMELL OFFSHORE BANK ACCOUNTS!

    Ben Collins‏Verified account @oneunderscore__

    The Trump administration wants to hand over spying duties to a private company in Whitefish, MT.

    Whitefish is also home to a power company with two employees that got a $300 million Trump admin contract in Puerto Rico.

    Whitefish has 6,500 residents.

  88. 88.

    Jeffro

    It is just about the dumbest, most bullshit-ty piece of legislation that the Repubs could have put forward. I mean, corporations and the very rich get guaranteed goodies while everyone else gets temporary itty-bitty tax cuts and 13M Americans lose their health insurance. All for no blessed ‘growth’ (PRAISE GROWTH) in the economy, which by the way is already doing quite fine. It’s unbelievable.

    AND, on top of all that, it most certainly will benefit Trumpov – you know, that guy who NEVER RELEASED HIS TAX RETURNS?!? – and his family enormously.

    I think the Dems’ biggest problems in 2018 and 2020 are going to be which angles (and attendant sound bites) to run with, there are just too many to count.

  90. 90.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    @WaterGirl:

    Did you mean “blowing him” or “blowing him off” in your last sentence?

    There is truth in ether statement.

  92. 92.

    Jeffro

    And on a final note: just like with Obamacare, climate change regulation, and everything else, this (the tax ‘reform’ bill) didn’t have to be such a holy rolling clusterfuck for the GOP. They could have just gone with “everyone gets a 5% tax cut, period” or “here are the loopholes we’re eliminating, and we’re going to cut the corporate rate 10% for an almost revenue-neutral bill”. Right? BOOM and they’re off with their great victory. They could have just pulled off the pass-through rate cut – every 1%er in America would have instantly become their own pass-through corporation – and there they are, unified, happy, and that much richer.

    But no – they had to a) fuck the middle class, b) fuck the blue states, c) cut corporate rates tremendously, d) eliminate the estate tax (EXCUSE ME, ‘DEATH TAX’), and actually write in that there would be automatic cuts to Medicare. And then try and get that through on a party-line vote because reconciliation. Ye have got to be kidding me.

    Whenever they are ready to get rid of their Koch habit, they’ll see that they could just be leading normal lives of…leading. They’d still be conservatives. They’d still get to rail against their most hated social programs and try to keep spending down and yada yada yada. They just wouldn’t be bugfuck insane conservatives.

  94. 94.

    rikyrah

    TBogg‏ @tbogg

    To recap:
    TYT’s Nomiki is attacking Joy Reid
    Ex-TYTer Jordan Chariton went after Donna Brazile
    TYT’s John Graziano compared Marcus Johnson to a house slave
    and
    TYT’s Michael Tracey went after Maxine Waters – but she beat him into a coma

    I sense a pattern here.
    #YoungTurKKKs
    9:02 PM – 29 Nov 2017 from San Diego, CA

  95. 95.

    rikyrah

    Yashar Ali
    ?‏Verified account @yashar

    Trump isn’t going to Alabama to campaign for Moore — but plans to hold a rally next door. @jdawsey1 is scoopin’ at the Post

  96. 96.

    Raoul

    a “trigger” to recoup revenue if the tax bill doesn’t vastly grow the economy

    The trigger is counter-cyclical garbage that would most likely lead to grotesque budget cuts to stave off a tax increase. But it does acknowledge the central bankruptcy of the policy ‘theory’ behind the cuts.

    So it must be removed. Not sure how this squares with what buttered waffle Susan Collins wants. It’s all a freakin mess and of course should be pulled back, strangled, and drowned in a bathtub. But at least we have a reprieve tonight to make moar calls!

  98. 98.

    Raoul

    @Mike J: Well. A man from Kansas damn well ought to know what this tax bill will do. He will probably keep his job since it’s a blood red state, but what a shit heel.
    But then, the entire GOP are covered in poo.

  99. 99.

    burnspbesq

    The way I understand it, once the parliamentarian ruled the trigger out of order, Corker, Langford, and Flake threatened to vote for the Democratic motion to recommit, and that when the stuff hit the fan. They’re going to try to find $350B of revenue overnight, which bodes ill for folks like us. I wouldn’t be surprised if at some point some Republican says “well, what about a VAT? That’s the most regressive tax there is.”

  105. 105.

    Raoul

    @TenguPhule:

    Just remember, 2018 isn’t when we can start doing this. We’d need 2/3rd majorities in both houses of Congress to do that.

    True. But I would damn well hope that even with control of one chamber, committee chairs would start holding scorching, fire breathing hearings on all sorts of things. McConnell knows how bad the risks are. They are steamrolling unqualified idiot judges thru the process like they won’t have another chance for decades. Let’s make that so!

  106. 106.

    B.B.A.

    @burnspbesq: There’s a proposal to abolish all federal taxes and replace them with a VAT. It’s been supported mainly by the IRS-is-satan wingnuts but I wonder if this goes down whether it’ll be the next step.

  108. 108.

    SRW1

    @Jeffro:

    Btw if and when this goes down in flames, Twitler’s Twitter meltdown is going to be EP. IC.

    Cause this one would be really personal, not like his usual showy personal stuff.

  109. 109.

    Felonius Monk

    @burnspbesq:

    some Republican says “well, what about a VAT? That’s the most regressive tax there is.”

    Well, there goes all those purchases of private jets and big yachts. The paymasters will be fuming.

  111. 111.

    Viva BrisVegas

    @?BillinGlendaleCA:

    I’ve been told the VAT is wonderful, right here on this very blog.

    It is wonderful.

    It’s the easiest of all taxes for the very rich to avoid and the most difficult for the middle class to avoid.

  113. 113.

    David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch

    The way I understand it, once the parliamentarian ruled the trigger out of order, Corker, Langford, and Flake threatened to vote for the Democratic motion to recommit, and that when the stuff hit the fan.

    These are the offices to call. Since they’re on the fence over the deficit.

    Use their own talking points against them. Tell them you don’t want the country to turn into GREECE, tell them you don’t want to pass debt onto your grandchildren, tell them “WE’RE BROKE”

  117. 117.

    B.B.A.

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: The states would collect it alongside sales tax. Now here I’m thinking, “but wasn’t making states responsible for federal revenue what brought the Articles of Confederation down?” And either they haven’t thought that far ahead, or they have.

  118. 118.

    MomSense

    I’m sitting in a bar listening to some good live music. Fired up!
    FTFGOP. If they pass this turd let’s rub their noses in it. They have revealed themselves to be vile, traitorous, sociopaths.

    Let’s figure out how to do some serious voter registration in their districts. Any jackals have frequent flier miles to spare? A couch for crashing? Let’s go to the Republican districts and register enough voters to throw the bums out.

    Not kidding. I’ll travel anywhere.

  119. 119.

    AnotherBruce

    @DougJ: It’s a good song, but Next Year’s Model was a great album. As good as My Aim is True was, NYM was better. It defined the “revenge and guilt” era of his songwriting.

  120. 120.

    glory b

    Aaaand, it turns out that, as per Rachel Maddow, the hundreds of tax analysts Steve Mnuchin said since last February were running scenarios and would have a great, dynamically scored report showing that the tax bill will be wonderful, didn’t do any of that and they have no report.

    The tax guys say they weren’y included in the process.

    Steve “The Dog Ate My Homework” Mnuchin should be his name going forward.

  121. 121.

    burnspbesq

    VATs are regressive, but they raise fuck-tons of revenue very efficiently. Ireland pays for its 12.5 percent corporate income tax rate with a 21 percent VAT.

    I could get comfortable with a VAT if we could find a way to preserve the overall progressivity of the tax system. There are a couple of ways to do that.

  122. 122.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    I was curious about what all the Republicans who applauded John McCain’s Heroic Thumb thought about his following along with this dog’s dinner. I believe this is what the with-it youths call a “subtweet”

    Steve Schmidt‏Verified account @ SteveSchmidtSES
    Every Republican member who has spoken passionately about out of control spending or the importance of a return to the regular order who votes for this appalling Tax bill was simply conning the American people .

    regular order…

  123. 123.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    John Weaver‏ @ JWGOP
    GOP Senators who have “talked” about helping the middle class, dealing with the growing national debt, helping the working poor & middle class with wage stagnation must vote against this heinous tax bill (which is being re-written as we speak under the watchful eye of lobbyists).

    he works for Kasich now

  124. 124.

    burnspbesq

    @glory b:

    Yeah. Treasury’s IG will produce a scathing report, and Mnuchin will say “fuck you, I’m from Goldman, I do what I want.” Great.

  125. 125.

    Villago Delenda Est

    @burnspbesq: The problem, as you state, is that a VAT is regressive. The GOP hates the “death tax” but loves them some regressive taxation…the “life tax”.

    Time to separate some billionaires from their billions. Start with the Koches and the Mercers.

  126. 126.

    chris

    @burnspbesq: In Canada it’s sorta progressive. There are rebates below a certain income level and they come in the form of quarterly cheques. Very nice when living hand to mouth.

  127. 127.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @AnotherBruce:

    As good as My Aim is True was, NYM was better. It defined the “revenge and guilt” era of his songwriting.

    I call that bold talk for a one-eyed fat man.

  129. 129.

    Percysowner

    @TenguPhule: Wishing someone live in poverty and the wrong race in a racist country, being paid 67% of what men are paid is not being able to control your reproductive choices, not being able to marry the person you love because someone else’s religion disapproves, having your vote not count because of voter suppression all those are all equal to prison rape? What a weird equivalence. Especially since if they learn something and change the system they can come back to a better world. Torture for all eternity with no hope of redemption or release is more acceptable to you? Wow, my mind boggles.

  135. 135.

    chopper

    @Jeffro:

    the thing you have to remember is, the house GOP is just off the rails. thanks to gerrymandering almost every house gooper represents a district stuffed with just the most insane people. anything that has even a remote chance of passing in the house has to look like it was written by torquemada.

  136. 136.

    Raoul

    @Spider-Dan: Well, since prison rape is a real thing, and eternal damnation isn’t*, it is a distinction with a difference, yes.

    *(unless your idea of hell is FSM denying you parmigiano reggiano in the afterlife. that could happen. we just don’t know.)

  137. 137.

    eemom

    @scott (the other one):

    He’s not all the long for this world, and his great-grandchildren are already more than set for life several times over. So…what the hell? Is it possible he really truly believes the bullshit his party spews? Or, hells bells, maybe Russia’s got something on his wife and kids…

    It occurred to me a little while ago that maybe his brain tumor has fucked with his ability to think or act rationally. IOW, he isn’t even really competent to make any kind of judgment call and is just doing what he’s told.

    OTOH, surely even the REPUBLICANS wouldn’t take advantage of a sick old man who doesn’t know what he’s…….bwaahaahaaahaaa, I can’t even finish typing that with a straight face. If he had fucking died this morning they’d have fixed up his corpse and wheeled it in for the vote.

    But about my brain tumor theory — any MD’s care to weigh in? I also remember how he was making no sense in the Comey hearing….

  138. 138.

    Mary G

    @rikyrah: I know the CNN people aren’t going to the WH Christmas party in solidarity with April Ryan and others. We will see just which white reporters go and which join the boycott and we will know who we can and cannot trust going forward.

  139. 139.

    MomSense

    @Shana:

    Alright! Pretty sure Virginia is warmer than where I am. I’ve got soooo much earned time to spend purging the traitorous MOFOs from Congress.

  140. 140.

    chris

    You don’t say

    I’m glad @USTreasury's IG responded quickly to my request. Either Treasury used taxpayer funds to conduct analyses it won’t release because they contradict Mnuchin’s claims that this bill grows the economy, or Mnuchin misled the public about the analysis. Either is a big problem. https://t.co/56HWdgvO3S— Elizabeth Warren (@SenWarren) November 30, 2017

  141. 141.

    catclub

    won’t the fact that it is budget negative over ten years (the $1.1TR JCT estimate)also mean it is budget neagtive in the out years, too? Which should mean it is not eligible for reconciliation, at all?

    Has the JCT done this calculation?

  142. 142.

    Bill Arnold

    @ruemara:

    I’d like to see if Donny’s heart can take it.

    He should quit, for his own good. (I mean that sincerely; he needs to allow himself relaxation time to repair.)

  144. 144.

    catclub

    @burnspbesq:

    I could get comfortable with a VAT if we could find a way to preserve the overall progressivity of the tax system.

    I think Yglesias makes the argument that the things government generally does are so progressive, worrying about progressive VAT is not helpful
    (enough).

    Naturally, paying for just defense and private prison contracts takes all that back.

  147. 147.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Jeffro: all the ego, none of war record

    wouldn’t surprise me a bit if the former drives him to take on trump in 2020

  148. 148.

    Zinsky

    I have written at least a dozen letters to the editor of my local newspaper, excoriating this abomination of a tax bill. They haven’t published one of them. Could it be that the publisher of our paper – who owns a number of closely held companies – would benefit greatly from the ludicrous preferential treatment accorded to so-called “passthroughs” in the legislation? Folks, the fuckin’ fix is in. We are getting royally screwed by these bastards and we can’t do a goddamn thing about it….

  149. 149.

    Steeplejack

    Just dawned on me, through an unexpected crossing of the streams on the DVR, that Steven Mnuchin is a ringer for Penny’s ex-boyfriend on The Big Bang Theory. And he seems about as smart. (Possible insult to Penny’s ex-boyfriend.)

  152. 152.

    Emma

    @Zinsky: For god’s sake. Yes, they will probably pass that law. And it is our responsibility to shove it down their throats until they choke. Next year’s elections have to be fought for at every level.

  155. 155.

    Bill Arnold

    @rikyrah:
    Here’s the buzzfeed article:
    The Trump Administration Is Mulling A Pitch For A Private “Rendition” And Spy Network
    Worth a skim. It simultaneously doesn’t seem to be being taken seriously in government, and is pretty worrying.

    The pitch to the Trump administration began in the summer, according to the former intelligence official familiar with it. It involved at least three components: collecting intelligence on terrorists using “a network of assets in a denied area” (meaning spies in hostile countries), an online propaganda operation to counter Islamic extremism, and the rendition plan.

    In case it’s not clear:

    Those familiar with the proposals say one of the driving impulses for privatizing some missions is a fear by some supporters of President Donald Trump, outside government, that the CIA bureaucracy has an anti-Trump bias that would thwart efforts to fulfill the president’s objectives.

  160. 160.

    Chyron HR

    @catclub:

    It’s entirely possible the GOP is in a prisoners’ dilemma where more than three Senators don’t want the bill to pass, but none of them want to go on the record against it.

  164. 164.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Chyron HR: So it ends up as a test of character – like the Stat Trek test. Odds are, they will fail. Nevertheless, we will endeavor to persevere.

  165. 165.

    Jeffro

    hey NoVA-area peeps, feel free to cancel your Washingtonian subscription once you get this month’s issue. It seemed like a bargain at $1 an issue but they can fuck right the fuck off for putting Trumpov on the cover in a flattering light.

  167. 167.

    Jeffro

    @Shana: @MomSense: Comstock’s next to my district too and thanks to Swing Left, I get to help send her packing next year. She’s the worst (well, her and Marsha Blackburn, but I don’t live in Tennessee)

  169. 169.

    Yarrow

    I spoke to both Cruz and Corker after they came off the floor; Corker was subdued, wouldn't talk specifics. Cruz was fiery after I chased his elevator down stairs.— Steven Dennis (@StevenTDennis) December 1, 2017

    "Fifty-one senators want to cut taxes," CRUZ said. "ONE is trying to raise taxes. That’s not right."— Steven Dennis (@StevenTDennis) December 1, 2017

    There is a huge, behind the scenes fight in the Senate right now, with hundreds of billions at stake.
    *Ted CRUZ* leading the resistance to CORKER insistence on more taxes & challenged him on the floor.— Steven Dennis (@StevenTDennis) December 1, 2017

    That’s going to go really well. We all know how much the Senators love Ted Cruz. I’m sure they’ll listen to him yell at them and do what he says. LOL.

  170. 170.

    TS

    Maybe I’m wrong – but sure hope I am right – there are a few GOP senators who are happy to see trump achieve nothing legislatively – and they like to make him think he’s going to win before they pull the plug.

    Sad that just a few can stop the rot – but any port in a storm.

  171. 171.

    Baud

    @Yarrow:

    Fifty-one senators want to cut taxes,” CRUZ said. “ONE is trying to raise taxes. That’s not right.”

    That makes no sense. They only need 51.

  173. 173.

    SFAW

    @MomSense:

    I’ve got soooo much earned time to spend purging the traitorous MOFOs from Congress.

    I have a modest request: after you do all that good work in other parts of the country, can you please arrange for Paul LePage and Elliot Cutler to have a duel where they use flamethrowers on each other? I’d like both of them gone before I move up your way.

  175. 175.

    David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch

    @Yarrow:

    “Fifty-one senators want to cut taxes,” CRUZ said. “ONE is trying to raise taxes. That’s not right.”— Steven Dennis (@StevenTDennis) December 1, 2017

    If they had 51 senators they would go ahead and vote. But they don’t.

  176. 176.

    Bill Arnold

    @rikyrah:
    Well that was fun. 10 “Bill Arnold”s filed comments (none of them me), all but one against net neutrality and all of those boilerplate found with a search. The text for the one pro-net-neutrality comment was not found in a google search.
    My favorite boilerplate (snippet):

    It took only two years and a green light from Obama for companies like Google and Facebook and their liberal allies like George Soros to take total control of the dominant information and communications platform in the world today. We simply canÕt afford to let ObamaÕs disastrous rules stand. The FCC must stand up for a truly free and open Internet by immediately rolling back his cynical and self-serving Internet takeover. The future of a free and open Internet is at stake.

    Sort of confusing the plot, Mr Other Bill Arnold, if you exist. I’m tempted to see if these people actually exist at the addresses given.

  178. 178.

    John Revolta

    @Chyron HR: Yeah- their voters don’t like it, but their REAL constituents- the donors- want it, and bad.

    What to do? What to do? I hope their guts are churning but good.

  180. 180.

    David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch

    Hell, they only need 50 senators and then pence can break the tie.

    They don’t even have 50 right now.

    Target Flake, Corker, Johnson, Langford, Collins with calls.

  181. 181.

    At sunset the tiercel flew above the marsh, pursuing a wisp of snipe. They drummed away down wind, like stone skidding across ice.

    It’s almost as though they know that the tax cuts are not going to increase revenues …

  184. 184.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @SFAW: Poll taxes are unconstitutional. Just saying. Do carry on. New world and all that. Just call me old fashioned.

  187. 187.

    dmsilev

    Another fun thing to keep in mind is that Congress has a bunch of other business that they need to deal with, soon. Like another ‘keep the government open’ continuing resolution that needs to be passed by this time next week. And that’s just the first of several things that need doing before the holiday recess. So, they don’t actually have all that much time to screw around. That may partially explain the headless-chicken dynamics.

  189. 189.

    Yarrow

    This seems important. NYT link.

    WASHINGTON — President Trump over the summer repeatedly urged senior Senate Republicans, including the chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee, to end the panel’s investigation into Russia’s interference in the 2016 election, according to a half dozen lawmakers and aides. Mr. Trump’s requests were a highly unusual intervention from a president into a legislative inquiry involving his family and close aides.

    Senator Richard Burr of North Carolina, the intelligence committee chairman, said in an interview this week that Mr. Trump told him that he was eager to see an investigation that has overshadowed much of the first year of his presidency come to an end.

    “It was something along the lines of, ‘I hope you can conclude this as quickly as possible,’” Mr. Burr said. He said he replied to Mr. Trump that “when we have exhausted everybody we need to talk to, we will finish.”

    In addition, according to lawmakers and aides, Mr. Trump told Senator Mitch McConnell of Kentucky, the Republican leader, and Senator Roy Blunt, Republican of Missouri and a member of the intelligence committee, to end the investigation swiftly.

    Of course none of them thought they should say anything.

    Senator Dianne Feinstein, a California Democrat who is a former chairwoman of the intelligence committee, said in an interview this week that Mr. Trump’s requests were “inappropriate” and represented a breach of the separation of powers.

    It sure was. But Republicans…

    Republicans played down Mr. Trump’s appeals, describing them as the actions of a political newcomer unfamiliar with what is appropriate presidential conduct.

    Appropriate presidential conduct? When has he ever demonstrated that he knows what that is?

  190. 190.

    sixthdoctor

    Man, this is really not a good week for my OCD…

    Sens Corker & Flake are insisting that taxes be cut in the amount of 1/2 of that— $500B. If they stick to that, this bill likely dies. 4/— Andy Slavitt (@ASlavitt) December 1, 2017

  192. 192.

    Yarrow

    Forget taxes. Conservative media (and Trump tweets) will be lit over verdict in Kate Steinle case. Push for immigration crackdown will redouble. Shutdown chances up exponentially.— Charlie Sykes (@SykesCharlie) December 1, 2017

    Agree the wingnut media will be 24/7 about this verdict.

  194. 194.

    Jim, Foolish Literalist

    @Yarrow:

    Josh Marshall‏Verified account @ joshtpm
    I hear the worst stuff about Trump and the Committees isn’t even in the NYT article.

    So this will probably drip out over twitter over the next few days

  195. 195.

    Omnes Omnibus

    @Major Major Major Major: Thatcher’s per head tax was a poll tax. Please excuse me while I get legal and historical. Now that I’ve swung a dead stoat in a circle, what is next? I mean, can I put the stoat carcass in Recycling?

  196. 196.

    Immanentize

    @Yarrow: I actually see this as a really good sign. Together with the Trump CRA CRA! leaks, this feels like an orchestrated building narrative of his need to go. A Republican narrative.

  199. 199.

    Yarrow

    @Immanentize: Agreed. I think it’s a good sign that even Republicans are willing to throw him under the bus. What they may not understand is that he’ll take them all down with him. He’ll destroy all of them before he goes.

  200. 200.

    Another Scott

    Donnie’s Twittering and may have an aneurysm before the morning about this:

    A jury in San Francisco has found Jose Ines Garcia Zarate, a homeless undocumented Mexican immigrant, not guilty of murder in the death of 32-year-old Kate Steinle two years ago in a case that became a flashpoint in the national debate on illegal immigration.

    As a presidential candidate, Donald Trump cited the Steinle killing as a justification for his intended crackdown on immigration.

    The president tweeted his response saying, “A disgraceful verdict in the Kate Steinle case! No wonder the people of our Country are so angry with Illegal Immigration.

    The jury of six women and six men acquitted the 45-year-old Garcia Zarate of murder in the first and second degrees, and the alternate charge of involuntary manslaughter.

    He was convicted on the lesser charge of possession of a firearm by a convicted felon.

    Steinle was killed on July 1, 2015, while walking along a San Francisco pier arm-in-arm with her father.

    The basic question the jury had to decide was whether Garcia Zarate intentionally and willfully fired the single shot that killed Kate Steinle. The prosecution said that Garcia Zarate fired a handgun deliberately in Steinle’s direction, seeking to harm her or others. The defense argued that the shooting was unintentional, that the defendant found the gun wrapped in a cloth under his seat at the pier and that it accidentally discharged. The defense also offered expert witnesses who testified that the bullet ricocheted off of the ground and traveled about 78 feet before striking Steinle.

    […]

    The killing gained national attention, in part, because Republican presidential nominee Trump seized on it as he criticized Mexican immigrants and promised to build a wall at the border.

    Several months after Steinle’s death, Trump claimed that she had been shot five times. In reality, she was shot only once.

    In his acceptance speech at the Republican National Convention, Trump tried to link Democrat Hillary Clinton to the controversy.

    “My opponent wants Sanctuary Cities. But where was sanctuary for Kate Steinle?” he asked.

    Yet in aftermath of his sister’s death, Brad Steinle spoke out against then-candidate Trump for “sensationalizing” her death.

    “Donald Trump talks about Kate Steinle like he knows her. I’ve never heard a word from his campaign manager, I’ve never heard a word from him. It’s disconcerting,” Brad Steinle told CNN’s Anderson Cooper.

    “I don’t want to be affiliated with someone who doesn’t have the common courtesy to reach out and ask about Kate, and our political views and what we want,” he added.

    […]

    I didn’t pay attention to the case or the trial. I won’t second-guess the verdict, but Trump has no business politicizing this with his lies. No doubt he will continue tomorrow.

    :-/

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  203. 203.

    randy khan

    @Another Scott:

    No doubt he will continue to lie about the case and to politicize it. He’s still certain the Central Park 5 committed a crime that DNA evidence proved they didn’t.

    Also – and maybe hardly worth mentioning – but the tweet is a complete non sequitur.

  205. 205.

    Mnemosyne

    @Another Scott:

    I remember hearing about that case in the initial reports as crazed illegal immigrant murders tourist for no reason — and that was in the local papers! I never heard the part in the media about her being killed by a single shot that ricocheted, not a deliberate action.

  206. 206.

    Yarrow

    @Mnemosyne: I didn’t follow the story at all but do remember reading about that. It was pretty much buried by the OUTRAGE and anti-immigrant hysteria, though.

  210. 210.

    Citizen Alan

    @Spider-Dan:

    People keep arguing about this. The reason we need a two-thirds majority in both houses is that it is assumed shitgibbon will veto everything that a democratic Congress proposes. You need 2/3 in both houses to overcome a presidential veto.

  213. 213.

    Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes

    Personally, I’ve quit. I’m now only going to concentrate, in order, on the following:

    1. My dick: Does my action or lack of action cause feelings in my genital region? If so, I deem that a positive.

    2. My stomach. Does the action divide something for my gut?

  222. 222.

    But her emails!!!

    @Mnemosyne:

    I’m not local, but that’s the impression I was under as well. As a result, I was surprised by the verdict and went looking for an explanation only to be surprised that what I found was much different than how I understood the case. Trump and the wingnut squad aren’t going to bother doing what I did to find the truth and nuance and even if someone presents it to them, they aren’t going to believe it.

  225. 225.

    Yarrow

    @Mnemosyne: I remember hearing about it in national news, but only on the first day or so. After that it was lost and the story was all about the illegal immigrant who murdered the white girl.

    @Mnemosyne: That sounds awful. Is that what you did to your knee? Didn’t you injure yourself awhile ago? Did you just find out or is this something new?

  228. 228.

    Mike J

    @chris:

    And it taxes the lower classes whether they like it or not

    I’m sure they’ll write in a provision that if you make less than 1/5th of the fpl you can save your receipts for all of your purchases for the year and have the vat refunded for all purchases of gruel or Trump country club dues.

  231. 231.

    Obvious Russian Troll

    @Mnemosyne: My sympathies. I was on crouches for a few days in April, followed by a month or so with a cane, but my injury appears to be related to arthritis. After discussing with my doctor it’s apparently been a problem (that I have ignored) for at least 15 years (I’m 50).

  232. 232.

    David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch

    Jim Acosta‏ @Acosta

    A lot of empty seats at WH tree lighting ceremony ?

    1,907 replies 5,693 retweets 13,288 likes

    Empty crowd Trump Christmas (Photo #1)

    Overwhelming crowds at Obama mooslim Christmas (photo #2)

  234. 234.

    Mnemosyne

    @Yarrow:

    I injured my knee about 5 or 6 weeks ago but only just got in to see an orthopedist yesterday. That’s what he told me I did, though we still need an MRI to see exactly what things look like in there. Yes, there is reconstructive surgery in my near future. ?

  238. 238.

    Yarrow

    @Mnemosyne: Sorry to hear that. I hope the MRI shows the best possible situation given the suspected injury. Modern surgical techniques for things like that can be very effective with relatively quick recovery periods compared to years past, so I hope it goes well for you.

  240. 240.

    Aleta

    @Mnemosyne:

    I do think that “Unhappy Triad” has a better ring to it.

    It almost provokes a challenge. ‘I dare you not to laugh, Unhappy Triad.’

  241. 241.

    MomSense

    @SFAW:

    They are truly loathsome. Let’s just say I would not be sad if they got stuck in mud flats with the tide rising fast.

  243. 243.

    Spider-Dan

    @Raoul: The original comment was about what was being wished on someone after they die in this life, and most of the wishes I have seen expressed for Republicans in the afterlife are, shall we say, uniformly harsh.

  244. 244.

    PaulWartenberg

    I hate to be cautiously optimistic right now, but it’s Friday morning and they still haven’t voted on this tax cut plan, right?

    And there’s a deadline on this bill to get voted on, right?

    /knocks on every piece of formatted wood in the house

  245. 245.

    WaterGirl

    @Mnemosyne:Good news from paragraph 2:

    The good news is that modern medicine has become better than ever at healing and restoring full functionality for victims of the unhappy triad. Below is more information about the unhappy triad and how orthopedic surgery can assist with this unfortunate circumstance.

  246. 246.

    Spider-Dan

    @PaulWartenberg: Unlike the ACA repeal, which was the 2017 budget reconciliation and had a deadline of September, the tax heist’s deadline is much further out (September 2018?).

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