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You are here: Home / Elections / Election 2017 / Wednesday Morning Open Thread: Things Get Better, Eventually

Wednesday Morning Open Thread: Things Get Better, Eventually

by Anne Laurie|  December 13, 20176:09 am| 156 Comments

This post is in: Election 2017, LGBTQ Rights Are Human Rights, On The Road, Proud to Be A Democrat, All we want is life beyond the thunderdome, Daydream Believers

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Germany's Brandenburg Gate in 1939 vs. 2017.

Happy Hanukkah! pic.twitter.com/hxMuL2zU0b

— (((Yair Rosenberg))) (@Yair_Rosenberg) December 12, 2017


.

What’s on the agenda, as we start an unexpectedly bright day?
***********

From the Washington Post:

Doug Jones’s odds-defying victory in Alabama — handing Democrats a vanishingly rare Senate win in the Deep South — scrambles President Trump’s legislative agenda for the coming year, threatens to heighten Republican infighting and sounds an alarm for the GOP’s prospects in November’s midterm elections.

Any dent in the two-seat advantage Republicans hold in the Senate would carry major governing consequences, but the loss of what had been considered one of the party’s safest seats carries a special sting for the GOP.

One consequence is Democrats’ much more plausible path to the Senate majority next year. The 2018 map was widely seen to favor Republicans, with 10 Democrats seeking reelection in states President Trump won last year and only two Republican seats clearly at risk…

Some Republicans view the Alabama seat once held by Attorney General Jeff Sessions as the first casualty in an internecine GOP battle that has pitted establishment Republicans personified by McConnell against populist insurgents led by former White House strategist Stephen K. Bannon.

“It should be a hurricane siren for every Republican,” said Josh Holmes, a former top aide to McConnell. “This is what the death of a party looks like, and without an immediate course correction and rejection of the Steve Bannon view of the world, you can lose races in states like Alabama.”…

Barring a new effort at bipartisan dealmaking that has been largely absent so far under the Trump administration, the GOP appears on track to head into the November midterms with only one major accomplishment to tout: a tax-cut bill that has polled poorly and delivers most of its direct benefit to corporations and the wealthy…

Father, who says he's a local peanut farmer in Wicksburg, outside Roy Moore rally talks about losing his gay daughter at age of 23 to suicide. "I was anti-gay myself. I said bad things to my daughter, which I regret." pic.twitter.com/J0oOU0EJI2

— Vaughn Hillyard (@VaughnHillyard) December 11, 2017

Just talked with Nathan Mathis, the father in this video. He says tonight: “Hopefully people in politics will stop using gay folk to bash them. The voters need to make them stop…People in Alabama are good people–very good people." https://t.co/LpxoVu2mnY

— Vaughn Hillyard (@VaughnHillyard) December 13, 2017

Mr Mathis, nothing will ever take away all your pain. But I hope tonight makes it hurt a little less.

— Dana Houle (@DanaHoule) December 13, 2017

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Reader Interactions

156Comments

  1. 1.

    TS

    December 13, 2017 at 6:12 am

    Morning Ho & 3 white guys/2 white women – discussing why Moore lost
    No mention of who voted for Jones

    Edit: Ah – it was the young voters in the college towns

  2. 2.

    satby

    December 13, 2017 at 6:16 am

    @TS: the line from Shakespeare has to be updated to: the first thing we do, let’s kill all the media pundits.

  3. 3.

    Chet

    December 13, 2017 at 6:18 am

    I’m excited about this win. And I don’t buy the argument that a Moore win would be better because it would give Dems a chance to run against him nationally in 2018. They still have Trump to run against, and his endorsement of Moore. And Jones will be a good, Democratic senator.

    For my own part, classes are winding down and we’re getting ready for finals. Lots of panicked students and last-minute regrading.

  4. 4.

    Chet

    December 13, 2017 at 6:21 am

    @TS: Argh. So they’re not talking about the racial breakdown? That was a stark graphic being passed around last night.

  5. 5.

    Cermet

    December 13, 2017 at 6:23 am

    First, what a tragic occurrence for that father; so very glad he can share his pain and warn others, words matter.

    So, when does Jones have to defend the seat? Certainly, his odds for re-winning it are very remote. Still, a nice pick up for now. Does demonstrate that the crazy factor does hurt the thugs.

  6. 6.

    Derelict

    December 13, 2017 at 6:24 am

    @Chet: THIS. Every Deocrat has to hang Roy Moore and Donald Trump around the neck of every Republican. Donald Trump, the most corrupt president in history and a proud serial sexual assaulter and sexual predator, is the GOP’s president and standard bearer–and he loudly endorsed a child molester and embezzler for United States Senate. THIS is what the GOP is, and every vote for a Republican is a vote endorsing child molestation, sexual assault, and stealing from the public.

  7. 7.

    rikyrah

    December 13, 2017 at 6:26 am

    Good Morning,Everyone ???

  8. 8.

    rikyrah

    December 13, 2017 at 6:27 am

    @Cermet:
    2020 is when the election is again.

  9. 9.

    mike in dc

    December 13, 2017 at 6:28 am

    @Cermet: 2020. He’ll be rewarded with a Cabinet pick if he loses.

  10. 10.

    ThresherK

    December 13, 2017 at 6:28 am

    @satby: I thought that the WS line was a stab at the people whose idea that killing all the lawyers was actually constructive.

  11. 11.

    Cermet

    December 13, 2017 at 6:29 am

    @rikyrah: Yes, it is – finally! One sexual predator down, and one big orange fart cloud to go
    @rikyrah: Also, thanks for the info

  12. 12.

    OzarkHillbilly

    December 13, 2017 at 6:32 am

    Damn. Just Damn. Is nothing sacred anymore? Ala-fucking-bama used to be one of the 2 places one could be absolutely certain of for sure fire shoot yourself in the face stupidity. Next thing you know they’ll elect a DEM governor of Mississippi.

  13. 13.

    OzarkHillbilly

    December 13, 2017 at 6:37 am

    @ThresherK: Well, it’s a start anyway. ;-)

  14. 14.

    Betty Cracker

    December 13, 2017 at 6:37 am

    Every single reporter who has ransacked flyover country to interview Trump voters this year should take their asses down to Alabama and interview black voters who turned out in droves to put Jones over the top.

  15. 15.

    raven

    December 13, 2017 at 6:38 am

    @TS: That’s fucking bullshit, go back under your rock.

  16. 16.

    Betty Cracker

    December 13, 2017 at 6:39 am

    Twitler’s already making self-serving excuses on Twitter this morning, which can only mean this loss stings badly.

  17. 17.

    Immanentize

    December 13, 2017 at 6:40 am

    And a good morning it is! We still can hang Roy Moore around the neck of every Republican who didn’t specifically call for him to step down. It is the whole of the GOP that is the party of molesters. That is how this works. Did they stop talking about Hillary after she lost? Damn, Trump posted about her yesterday!

  18. 18.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    December 13, 2017 at 6:49 am

    @Betty Cracker: Twitler should keep in mind that excuses only satisfy the giver.

  19. 19.

    bystander

    December 13, 2017 at 6:54 am

    One MSNBC reporter was discussing the great turnout among African-Americans. Heidi P. waxes about the purity and beauty of Millenials, but I don’t know what empirical data she has except there are more of them by virtue of time.

  20. 20.

    Schlemazel

    December 13, 2017 at 6:54 am

    @Cermet:
    2020, the same year Franken’s seat will be up for grabs

  21. 21.

    gene108

    December 13, 2017 at 6:54 am

    @Betty Cracker:

    Pish-posh, when have the views of non-conservative whites been a reason to do anything in this country?

    I mean, if blacks, liberals, etc wanted to be taken seriously by the media, they would become white conservative Christians.

  22. 22.

    NotMax

    December 13, 2017 at 6:54 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA

    A little something for you dropped into in the Early Morning thread.

  23. 23.

    Schlemazel

    December 13, 2017 at 6:55 am

    @ThresherK:
    The conspiritors are planning for how they can solidify their coup. Killing the lawyers is not a good thing but the quote is taken out of context

  24. 24.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    December 13, 2017 at 6:57 am

    @NotMax: I saw it and just replied. Actually the Zoo is less than a mile from here, though there’s a freeway(I-5) and the mighty LA River between there and here.

  25. 25.

    TS

    December 13, 2017 at 6:57 am

    @raven:

    That’s fucking bullshit, go back under your rock.

    No idea how to answer this one – other folks understood who said what – why not READ before you abuse the messenger

  26. 26.

    bystander

    December 13, 2017 at 6:58 am

    @Immanentize:

    And a good morning it is! We still can hang Roy Moore around the neck of every Republican who didn’t specifically call for him to step down.

    And the ones who changed their minds like the odious Mitch McConnell.

    “Deck the halls/With Roy Moore’s undies/Falalalala Lalalala”

  27. 27.

    TS

    December 13, 2017 at 7:00 am

    @Chet:

    Argh. So they’re not talking about the racial breakdown? That was a stark graphic being passed around last night.

    They may have after I tuned out – but I didn’t hear it – I left when they were comparing the Alabama loss to Scott Brown’s senate win

  28. 28.

    OzarkHillbilly

    December 13, 2017 at 7:00 am

    @Immanentize: Well, KIllary IS the greatest monster to ever trod the earth since Godzilla.

  29. 29.

    debbie

    December 13, 2017 at 7:01 am

    As a few people have posted on FB, what a lovely present for First Night! Good Yontov to us all!

  30. 30.

    p.a.

    December 13, 2017 at 7:03 am

    Good morning. If the Rethugs manage to pass some version of the tax giveaway, might establishment Rethugs (spellchecker capitalizes that for me!) try to oust tRump (25th Amend or whatev) as an obvious electoral anchor? Would love to see the well dressed fascists vs the MAGA-hat beat up pickup fascists in open warfare.

  31. 31.

    NotMax

    December 13, 2017 at 7:03 am

    Pillow talk chez Moore.

    “I told you to contact Christine O’Donnell and have her cast a spell, but no-o-o-&#8230.”

  32. 32.

    Kay

    December 13, 2017 at 7:04 am

    @gene108:

    I hope they interview religious AA voters in Alabama and we can really delve into why their version of Christianity seems to have higher standards than the white people version. They somehow manage to square “being religious” with “not voting for child molesters”.

    And he is a child molester. This victim narrative could easily be in a charging document. There are people serving long prison sentences for stuff like this:

    Alone with Corfman, Moore chatted with her and asked for her phone number, she says. Days later, she says, he picked her up around the corner from her house in Gadsden, drove her about 30 minutes to his home in the woods, told her how pretty she was and kissed her. On a second visit, she says, he took off her shirt and pants and removed his clothes. He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear.
    “I wanted it over with — I wanted out,” she remembers thinking. “Please just get this over with. Whatever this is, just get it over.” Corfman says she asked Moore to take her home, and he did.

    14 years old.

  33. 33.

    debbie

    December 13, 2017 at 7:04 am

    @Betty Cracker:

    He knows no loyalty. It must be getting very crowded underneath that bus.

  34. 34.

    d58826

    December 13, 2017 at 7:05 am

    Victory is sweet but it was a near run thing. It is still depressing the number of Americans, esp. white Americans, willing to vote for an accused pedophile and to continue to support a serial groper.

  35. 35.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    December 13, 2017 at 7:05 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: This is untrue, KILLary is much worse than Godzilla.

  36. 36.

    Matt McIrvin

    December 13, 2017 at 7:07 am

    @TS: Scott Brown’s Senate win was the Bizarro World version of this. Low turnout, super-white turnout, and the biggest jerk won in a super blue state.

  37. 37.

    NorthLeft12

    December 13, 2017 at 7:10 am

    Mr. Jones, or should I say Senator Jones, has an opportunity to show Alabama what a good Senator looks like. Over the next two years he may dispel some of the negative stereotype that liberals and Dems have in Alabama enough that re-election is a possibility. And yes, I know that the stereotype is primarily constructed of GOP propaganda.
    At least he should be able to energize the Dem base enough that the election should be competitive. This is a chance, nothing more, nothing less.

  38. 38.

    JR

    December 13, 2017 at 7:14 am

    Fezzik, you did something right.

  39. 39.

    rikyrah

    December 13, 2017 at 7:15 am

    Mr Mathis made me cry ??

  40. 40.

    rikyrah

    December 13, 2017 at 7:17 am

    Turnout matters. Turnout made the margin outside of a recount, which they were prepared to steal.

  41. 41.

    Kay

    December 13, 2017 at 7:18 am

    There was a white (self identified) conservative Alabama journalist on cable last night who said that Jones’ not waffling on abortion rights lost the race for him. She said this with so much smug certainty that I turned it off. I wonder if she’ll ever be asked about that. So much of political journalism is limited to what white people think. Once you see it you can’t unsee it- you think “well, that;s true for white voters”. Mentally add “white” to “religious voters” in the same way you can add “white” to “working class voters” in political commentary and it’s more accurate.

  42. 42.

    Jeffro

    December 13, 2017 at 7:18 am

    @Chet:

    So they’re not talking about the racial breakdown? That was a stark graphic being passed around last night.

    I keep mulling over the fact that 52% of college-educated white women voted for the pedophile who wants to take away their right to vote. (62% of college-educated white men too)

    Then I realize, even higher %s of non-college-educated whites voted for the pedophile…and THEN I realize, no level of education (or lack thereof) excuses voting for a pedophile who got himself kicked off of the Alabama Supreme Court TWICE for not following the law.

    Fucking get with the program, my fellow white people. Fucking. Get. With It.

  43. 43.

    MattF

    December 13, 2017 at 7:20 am

    @NotMax: Every time someone refers to Mrs. Moore, I think of the video of her wearing the crucifix earings. So weird.

  44. 44.

    OzarkHillbilly

    December 13, 2017 at 7:21 am

    @?BillinGlendaleCA: Naaawwwww. Godzilla destroyed Tokyo (or was that the US Army Air Corps?) Killary just destroyed the Republican party.

  45. 45.

    satby

    December 13, 2017 at 7:22 am

    It’s happy news to wake up to, I was abstaining from all news last night, including here because I didn’t have the energy to deal if Moore win.

    Other happy news, my foster cat found starving in a filthy, disgusting home abandoned by hoarders is being adopted by a lovely family! Though his place in our rescue has already been filled by a 3 kitten litter thrown out of a moving car, one of them sustained terrible hip and leg fractures. I will never understand how some people can be so vile.

  46. 46.

    debbie

    December 13, 2017 at 7:23 am

    And Assange has waded in with these winners:

    I’m just curious as to how many illegal aliens and deceased persons managed to cast votes for #DougJones?— Julian Assange ? (@Real_Assange_) December 13, 2017

    I wonder if #KateSteinles killer somehow managed to cast a vote for #DougJones? It wouldn’t surprise me in the least. #DNCFraud pic.twitter.com/dJdtOWhsGN— Julian Assange ? (@Real_Assange_) December 13, 2017

    The second tweet includes a badly executed Photoshopped picture of Obama pinning an award on the murderer. You’d think Russia had better artists.

  47. 47.

    OzarkHillbilly

    December 13, 2017 at 7:27 am

    @satby:

    I will never understand how some people can be so vile.

    notsobrightbart and gatewaytohellpundit can be educational.

  48. 48.

    comrade scotts agenda of rage

    December 13, 2017 at 7:27 am

    Yunno who gets some hope out of this race? McCaskill here in Misery. She’s the last Dem to run for a statewide, federal office against someone who was considered an outlier in the modern GOP (I didn’t consider him an outlier, he just opened his mouth and said “inside words”, but I digress). If Moore had won, that would tell her next year the Misery GOP could nominate another Akin and she’d be toast.

    Of course this might also show the Goopers here that they’d better nominate somebody who doesn’t use “inside words” in the hopes of ousting her.

  49. 49.

    Kay

    December 13, 2017 at 7:29 am

    “Educated” is a bad marker on character and ethics. My God, look at the list of high profile sexual harassers. Do they lack formal education? Degrees? High standardized test scores? Of course not. They’re “educated” out the wazoo. They’re educated sleasebags. What they lack they can’t remedy with a credential. I don’t think we should conflate “educated” with “decent human being” as much as we do- there isn’t a shred of evidence that it’s in any way true.

    Worse, level of education is often correlated with income so by making this connection between “decent person” and “educated person” we end up correlating “higher income” with “good” and that’s how we ended up in this mess to begin with. Break that up.

  50. 50.

    bemused

    December 13, 2017 at 7:32 am

    @NorthLeft12:

    Sen Cory Gardner said Moore was unfit to serve but Jones should vote with Senate GOP.

    We should be encouraged by Jones win and the previous amazing wins by Dems in local Virginia races. I am and hoping the trend back to decency and sanity will be even stronger by 2018 elections. A long hard slog to get our democracy back but I have to believe it will happen.

  51. 51.

    hueyplong

    December 13, 2017 at 7:33 am

    Though posted several times last night, this should be said at least once in each and every thread today:

    The KKKeebler Elf’s seat will now be occupied by a guy who famously, successfully prosecuted Klansmen.

    Suck it, Sessions. Arc of History, you small fecal pile.

    Thanks to the Black Belt. Thanks to the larger cities. Thanks to the college towns. Thanks for your perseverance, to all who have cast votes in lost statewide Alabama elections so many times. Resistance might not be futile after all.

  52. 52.

    bemused

    December 13, 2017 at 7:35 am

    @Betty Cracker:

    This!

  53. 53.

    rikyrah

    December 13, 2017 at 7:35 am

    @satby:
    You are good people, satby ?

  54. 54.

    Immanentize

    December 13, 2017 at 7:36 am

    @?BillinGlendaleCA:

    This is untrue, KILLary is much worse than Godzilla.

    Ah, the Ultimate Showown of Ultimate Destiny!

  55. 55.

    Kay

    December 13, 2017 at 7:37 am

    Bannon does this. Bannon thinks he’s a better person because he went to Harvard. He thinks Scarborough is a worse person because he went to the University of Alabama. Trump does it too. He brags about where he went to school, as if that’s some measure of overall worth.

    They’re all terrible people. They’d still be terrible people with either a high school diploma or a graduate degree. Credentials measure certain specific things and NONE of those things necessarily equal “good person”.

  56. 56.

    satby

    December 13, 2017 at 7:37 am

    @rikyrah: it is a good morning! ?

    @Kay: we should dispute the whole notion of “good people making bad choices” entirely. You are not a good person if you reflexively vote for the party whose policies and goals are intended to hurt people other than you.

  57. 57.

    JMG

    December 13, 2017 at 7:38 am

    Remember, it was as much low turnout for Moore as high turnout for Jones that swung the election. Don’t take the exit polls as gospel on how white Alabamians feel because they don’t measure stay-at-homes. Were those people just unable to hack Moore, demoralized by Trump or what? It’s a question the press ought to answer but seldom does, the “why didn’t you vote?” story.

  58. 58.

    satby

    December 13, 2017 at 7:39 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: oh, I see them IRL all the time. I just don’t understand that level of damage.

  59. 59.

    Amir Khalid

    December 13, 2017 at 7:40 am

    @satby:

    You are not a good person if you reflexively vote for the party whose policies and goals are intended to hurt people if he than you

    It appears autocorrect has played some kind of trick on you.

  60. 60.

    schlemazel

    December 13, 2017 at 7:41 am

    MPR just made a HUGE announcement!!! Gov. Dayton is going to appoint his Lt. Gov, Tina Smith, to fill Franken’s seat. They seemed breathlessly surprised which is odd given this is exactly what he said he would a week or two ago.
    The rumor is now she has changed her mind & will run again next fall. That bodes better than her original seat warmer only policy for the Dems to keep the seat. To me the issue is she is a blank slate even though I am involved in state politics. We don’t need a second empty suit from MN in the Senate even though that would be better than any Republican

  61. 61.

    satby

    December 13, 2017 at 7:42 am

    @rikyrah: oh, so many other people are much nicer ?, but thanks!

  62. 62.

    bemused

    December 13, 2017 at 7:43 am

    @Cermet:

    It makes me sick thinking of all the suffering endured by Mr Mathis and other broken families that might not have happened if they weren’t in thrall to phony religious cults.

  63. 63.

    debbie

    December 13, 2017 at 7:44 am

    Because of the weather, I’ll be working from home and will be listening to hear if Glenn Beck cries tears of RWNJ misery.

  64. 64.

    OzarkHillbilly

    December 13, 2017 at 7:46 am

    The chairman of the National Republican Senatorial Committee urged Alabama’s newly elected Democratic senator, Doug Jones, to “do the right thing” and vote with Republicans.

    “Tonight’s results are clear — the people of Alabama deemed Roy Moore unfit to serve in the U.S. Senate,” Gardner said in a statement. “I hope Senator-elect Doug Jones will do the right thing and truly represent Alabama by choosing to vote with the Senate Republican Majority.”

    Hubris, thy is a Republican: They are certain sure they know what god wants, that they are his true servants in a war against godless hedonism even as they do everything the bible excoriates, and when they are rewarded for their behavior with an electoral loss, they are certain that what the voters are telling them, they don’t really mean.

    I am not going to disabuse them of these notions.

  65. 65.

    Peale

    December 13, 2017 at 7:46 am

    @Kay: yep. We do this thing where we put our heads in the sand when it comes to the existence of racism amongst educated people. It doesn’t really exist, you see. It couldn’t possibly exist. It’s supposed to be a marker of being uneducated. So someone like the Mercer or Koch, who fund all of these racist groups, are supposed to only be doing so because they want to rile up the white masses to elect people who’ll give them a tax cut. They are only instrumentally racist. Because we for some reason can’t imagine that educated, wealthy people can’t be stone-cold racists.

  66. 66.

    satby

    December 13, 2017 at 7:46 am

    @JMG: I agree! In a very high profile election, with stark choices and high stakes, turnout was considered amazing at roughly 39%. That’s not amazing, that’s appalling in a democracy that needs to get back to functionality. This time it helped us, but: Why are so many citizens disinclined to vote?

  67. 67.

    satby

    December 13, 2017 at 7:47 am

    @Amir Khalid: fixed it. Yes, my Kindle hates me.

  68. 68.

    Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes

    December 13, 2017 at 7:47 am

    @Kay:

    I no longer use the phrase “voting against their interests” for people of Appalachia, the Rust Belt and the South. They’re voting their interests – trading off better living standards in order to be shitty to “others”.

  69. 69.

    Skepticat

    December 13, 2017 at 7:48 am

    @ThresherK: Glad you mentioned that, as I was wondering about my muddy memory. I think I’d learned it was supposed to mean that if you killed the lawyers, it would disrupt society and you’d have a clear field because the lawyers wouldn’t be there to protect people and justice.

  70. 70.

    MattF

    December 13, 2017 at 7:48 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: I guess Gardner assumes that godless Democrats are in it for the grift. ‘Policy’ is for loozers.

  71. 71.

    satby

    December 13, 2017 at 7:48 am

    @debbie: he’s not even pretending any more.

  72. 72.

    SFAW

    December 13, 2017 at 7:48 am

    @satby:

    the line from Shakespeare has to be updated to: the first thing we do, let’s kill all the media pundits.

    I’m considering translating part of that into Latin, making it my nym/nom.

    [Waves at Villago.]

  73. 73.

    satby

    December 13, 2017 at 7:50 am

    @schlemazel: a blank slate vs a strong progressive voice. Oh well, at least we have our virtue to comfort us.

  74. 74.

    Cheryl Rofer

    December 13, 2017 at 7:53 am

    This is a really good thread. The Republican Party is broken, for many reasons. When you’re broken, you make bad decisions. I’ll post the first few tweets, and you can check out the rest. The important point is that Republican operatives made bad decisions all the way down the line. Bad political decisions, even if you exclude morality. Which you can’t really do, because it’s a factor in voters’ reactions.

    It took an extraordinarily unsuccessful series of choices, by Republican leaders, to make the Alabama race competitive even *before* the Moore scandal. Let’s review them in choose-your-adventure form.

    — Alex Burns (@alexburnsNYT) December 12, 2017

    OK, you chose (1). Now you’re Alabama Gov. Robert Bentley and you have to name a senator. Do you:
    (1) Name an uncontroversial placeholder who won’t seek a full term
    (2) Name a highly popular and well known politician
    (3) Pick the state AG who is currently investigating you

    — Alex Burns (@alexburnsNYT) December 12, 2017

    Welp, you chose (2). Now you’re Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell and the race is getting messy. Do you:
    (1) Stay out of it
    (2) Use your super PAC to nuke Roy Moore
    (3) Ignore Roy Moore, trust Luther to beat him 1 on 1, and nuke a third candidate, House hard-liner Mo Brooks

    — Alex Burns (@alexburnsNYT) December 12, 2017

  75. 75.

    JPL

    December 13, 2017 at 7:53 am

    @rikyrah: Hopefully he realizes that he helped get out the vote for Jones.

  76. 76.

    satby

    December 13, 2017 at 7:53 am

    @SFAW: yeah, I think some people just missed the point of the comment (which wasn’t at all about Shakespeare’s meaning of the line).

  77. 77.

    OzarkHillbilly

    December 13, 2017 at 7:55 am

    I know everyone wants to make this all about the pedophile who was running for the US Senate seat being unacceptable to the voters of Alabama but I do wonder. I wonder if maybe, just maybe, it was really about DEM voters being totally and completely pissed off about the direction of a GOP without a halter or muzzle and now not letting anything stop them from voting, and in the wake of these tax votes GOP voters are coming to the realization that the GOP really does hate them and while they still can’t bring themselves to vote for a DEM, they can no longer bring themselves to vote for a GOP either.

    It’s a thought anyway.

  78. 78.

    Ken

    December 13, 2017 at 7:56 am

    @debbie: In the old days, one of the poll workers would have slapped Assange across the face and challenged him to a duel for impugning his honesty.

  79. 79.

    Cheryl Rofer

    December 13, 2017 at 7:56 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: 22,000 write-in votes say there is something to your theory.

  80. 80.

    satby

    December 13, 2017 at 7:57 am

    O.T. But, did anyone who ordered something have trouble using the special Balloon Juice coupon codes? Message me at the shop if you did.

  81. 81.

    NotMax

    December 13, 2017 at 7:57 am

    @satby

    my Kindle hates me

    (whispers furtively) Feed it some chocolate.

    ;)

  82. 82.

    debbie

    December 13, 2017 at 7:58 am

    @Cheryl Rofer:

    The important point is that Republican operatives made bad decisions all the way down the line.

    More likely, they were never the geniuses they believed they were. How could they be expected to make good decisions?

  83. 83.

    satby

    December 13, 2017 at 7:58 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: @Cheryl Rofer: I wouldn’t doubt that either.

  84. 84.

    OzarkHillbilly

    December 13, 2017 at 7:59 am

    @Peale:

    They are only instrumentally racist

    I always say, does it make difference?

  85. 85.

    MattF

    December 13, 2017 at 7:59 am

    @Cheryl Rofer: Also, pretty much every actor in the mix had to change course sometime between the deciding what to do and the election. So, at each decision point and finally, there was only a ‘use a chain saw’ option that didn’t work.

  86. 86.

    debbie

    December 13, 2017 at 8:02 am

    @Cheryl Rofer:

    Even better — I just realized all those tweets were the day before the election!

  87. 87.

    MattF

    December 13, 2017 at 8:03 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: Also, I just wonder what, exactly, people mean when they say they’re not racist. My current hypothesis is that they’re saying they don’t routinely use the N-word.

  88. 88.

    debbie

    December 13, 2017 at 8:03 am

    Ha! From David Wright @ CNN:

    Charles Barkley is 1-0 against Steve Bannon in special elections— David Wright (@DavidWright_CNN) December 13, 2017

  89. 89.

    zhena gogolia

    December 13, 2017 at 8:04 am

    I went to bed resigned to a Moore win and a pedophile in the Senate. How great to wake up to Jones’s victory! Yay!

  90. 90.

    zhena gogolia

    December 13, 2017 at 8:05 am

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    hahahaha

    Tell that to Merrick Garland

  91. 91.

    satby

    December 13, 2017 at 8:06 am

    Holy shit: USA Today editorial

    Edited to include: ” A president who’d all but call a senator a whore is unfit to clean toilets in Obama’s presidential library or to shine George W. Bush’s shoes: Our view”

  92. 92.

    debbie

    December 13, 2017 at 8:06 am

    More from Burns:

    Will Mountain Brook lawyers and Washington lobbyists keep tweeting "Luther would have won" – like Bernie folk – for the rest of time?— Alex Burns (@alexburnsNYT) December 13, 2017

    Of course they will!

  93. 93.

    LurkerNoLonger

    December 13, 2017 at 8:08 am

    @debbie: Fuck that albino troll. His comeuppance will be oh so satisfying.

  94. 94.

    germy

    December 13, 2017 at 8:08 am

    @Jeffro:

    I keep mulling over the fact that 52% of college-educated white women voted for the pedophile who wants to take away their right to vote. (62% of college-educated white men too)

    I watched a bit of the CBS Morning No Charlie Rose Show, and Norah O’Donnell said it was women who were responsible for Jones’ win.

    There’s always a big disconnect between what I read online and what I see on network news.

  95. 95.

    debbie

    December 13, 2017 at 8:08 am

    @satby:

    What a great lede!!!!!

  96. 96.

    debbie

    December 13, 2017 at 8:09 am

    @Jeffro:

    Really? You can’t hold off on your gloom for even a moment?

    ETA: Edited for prepositional misuse.

  97. 97.

    NorthLeft12

    December 13, 2017 at 8:11 am

    The voting breakdowns that I have seen indicate that the racist, homophobic, and bigoted child molester received solid majorities from white voters. Men, women, educated or not. The African Americans of Alabama voted overwhelmingly for Mr. Jones. I saw 98% of black women and 93% of black men voted for Mr. Jones.
    And they did this while persevering through state organized efforts to discourage and prevent them from voting.

    If anyone needs a lesson in courage, faith, and trust in democracy they should be asking the African Americans of Alabama. I won’t hold my breath waiting for the mainstream media to bite.

  98. 98.

    NotMax

    December 13, 2017 at 8:11 am

    FYI, Alabama governor Ivey (R) is up for election* in 2018. Currently 6 additional Rs also announced as running for gov as well. Ought to be a knock down, drag out primary.

    *Not re-election as she became governor this past April when Bentley resigned.

  99. 99.

    OzarkHillbilly

    December 13, 2017 at 8:13 am

    Supportive of my musings above:

    PARTY GUY

    Alabama’s Democratic Party has been on life support since Republicans gained ascendency years ago, holding no statewide offices and a minority in each legislative chamber, but Jones supported an effort to revive the organization in 2013.

    A former party chairman formed the Alabama Democratic Majority to raise money and recruit candidates, and Jones was among those publicly supportive of the effort. The foundation was dormant by 2014, but Trump’s victory has helped breathe new life into local organizations, including the Democratic Party in Republican-heavy Shelby County, where officials say membership has jumped from around a dozen to more than 200 people since the 2016 election.

    Jones’ victory can only help re-energize the party even more.

  100. 100.

    Jeffro

    December 13, 2017 at 8:14 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: I just saw that and I still haven’t stopped laughing. YES, to truly represent Alabama, Jones should…vote as if he were from the other party. Oh my…

  101. 101.

    Waldo

    December 13, 2017 at 8:15 am

    That God and pony show couldn’t have ended better! So long cosplay cowboy. Hello rodeo clown.

  102. 102.

    Jeffro

    December 13, 2017 at 8:15 am

    @debbie: What gloom? I’m psyched for the future – this is very encouraging!

  103. 103.

    Fester Addams

    December 13, 2017 at 8:17 am

    @MattF:

    Also, I just wonder what, exactly, people mean when they say they’re not racist. My current hypothesis is that they’re saying they don’t routinely use the N-word.

    My impression is that they mean “my prejudicial ideals about those people are correct and justified by their inherent inferiority and habitual misbehavior.”

  104. 104.

    Jeffro

    December 13, 2017 at 8:18 am

    @satby:

    [Assange] isn’t even pretending any more

    Intriguing, isn’t it? That some foreign wackaloon who had nothing…oh no, absolutely nothing, no interest, no dog in the fight…to do with last year’s election feels the need to weigh in on an off-year senatorial election?

  105. 105.

    OzarkHillbilly

    December 13, 2017 at 8:19 am

    @Jeffro: Yep, because only THEY know what Alabama voters truly want.

  106. 106.

    Chyron HR

    December 13, 2017 at 8:20 am

    When will J.D. Vance come out with his next bestseller, “Pedophile Elegy”?

  107. 107.

    Jeffro

    December 13, 2017 at 8:23 am

    @satby: Did the editorial come with a pic of an atomic bomb explosion? Because that is just what it is.

  108. 108.

    Jeffro

    December 13, 2017 at 8:25 am

    @germy:

    I watched a bit of the CBS Morning No Charlie Rose Show, and Norah O’Donnell said it was women who were responsible for Jones’ win.

    That’s aggravating. It was NON-white women who made the difference here. Jesus, anything but the obvious, eh mainstream news? Next thing, we’ll be hearing about a special strain of ‘economic anxiety’ specific to Alabama…

  109. 109.

    schlemazel

    December 13, 2017 at 8:25 am

    @MattF:
    They don’t use the n word around people of color, they admit that there are some good ones, they have never whipped or lynched a black person, they know a black person at work & have even spoken to them on occasion.
    There may be others but I think that about covers it

  110. 110.

    Immanentize

    December 13, 2017 at 8:26 am

    @Fester Addams:. I think you are right. Not racist to many means they are just reporting their (imagined) experiences. In other words, they really really want to say, “I just am calling a spade a spade.”. Friggin crackers (sorry, Betty).

  111. 111.

    Amir Khalid

    December 13, 2017 at 8:27 am

    @Peale:

    They are only instrumentally racist.

    When an act has predictable racist consequences, like supporting racist politicians does, as far as I’m concerned that proves the actor is racist. Hard to see how being a willing instrument of racists is different from being racist oneself.

  112. 112.

    bemused

    December 13, 2017 at 8:30 am

    @debbie:

    They believe they can get their way, always, by any amoral, illegal, corrupt means they can get away with.

    Two year old dictators.

  113. 113.

    hugely

    December 13, 2017 at 8:31 am

    @Jeffro: Im here Jeffro, just maybe so pale you dont notice :)

  114. 114.

    gvg

    December 13, 2017 at 8:32 am

    @Kay: Education is a marker of certain things that often impact elections. The poor who don’t have any college often vote in ways that are against their economic self interests, by tribe, and this is hard to understand if you are “educated”. So puzzled college onlookers have learned to check that in polling. the self interests AND the tribe are not in conflict for minorities which is why they routinely vote “smart”. since their votes are not WTF puzzling, they don’t get analyzed as much.
    Education (college) exposes people to other peoples point of view and tends to liberalize them. this means they are a bit more tolerant than however they grew up so don’t expect Alabama college educated to be the same as California college educated. Also that is a measure of average. There are still some real bad people who are college educated and some that are better than average.
    Educated also means that they have been taught to be wiser about SOME types of fraud or false stories.

    Since the current um moral dilemma of society for several decades has revolved around racism, and education has been specifically useful at building tolerism its possible we do sometimes conflate education with morality but I don’t think they are the same.

    Also I wonder how we get at misogyny? Its been disturbing to me to see so many women voting against their interests as I perceive them even if they are educated. I guess I need to remember that colleges and schools didn’t used to be anti racist. It happened over time.

  115. 115.

    SRW1

    December 13, 2017 at 8:33 am

    @debbie:

    Warning: Parody account! Says so right under the photo of Assange.

  116. 116.

    ET

    December 13, 2017 at 8:34 am

    Well now USAToday tell us how you really feel:

    With his latest tweet, clearly implying that a United States senator would trade sexual favors for campaign cash, President Trump has shown he is not fit for office. Rock bottom is no impediment for a president who can always find room for a new low.
    ………………………..
    A president who would all but call Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand a whore is not fit to clean the toilets in the Barack Obama Presidential Library or to shine the shoes of George W. Bush.

    Take that!

  117. 117.

    MattF

    December 13, 2017 at 8:36 am

    @ET: Interesting to see USA Today jump into the deep end. And interesting to see what prompted it.

  118. 118.

    Steve in the ATL

    December 13, 2017 at 8:37 am

    @satby: @satby: remember that “first, we kill all the lawyers” was instructions on how to overthrow a government, not a guide to happier living.

    ETA: late to the party. I see that my noble profession has already been defended.

  119. 119.

    debbie

    December 13, 2017 at 8:38 am

    @SRW1:

    Bastards!

  120. 120.

    satby

    December 13, 2017 at 8:39 am

    @Amir Khalid: that’s what I meant above at #56, but you’ve said it better.

  121. 121.

    debbie

    December 13, 2017 at 8:39 am

    @Jeffro:

    I apologize for misreading your post.

  122. 122.

    satby

    December 13, 2017 at 8:40 am

    @Steve in the ATL: gah! I used the quote as a vehicle to talk about the useless misinforming media pundits, not lawyers!

    ? Baud would have got it.

  123. 123.

    Steve in the ATL

    December 13, 2017 at 8:43 am

    @gvg:

    Also I wonder how we get at misogyny? Its been disturbing to me to see so many women voting against their interests

    Most of that that I see is driven by the evangelical church—women are expected to defer to men at all times.

  124. 124.

    Immanentize

    December 13, 2017 at 8:43 am

    I have some significant Alabama experiences (lived in Montgomery, deposed Klan members, drank beer at Hank Wiliams’ grave on his birthday, ate at Jake’s Fish Camp, etc.) And feel some love and kinship with the state. But I am still amazed by the results! Amazed and a little shell- shocked but in a good way.

  125. 125.

    hueyplong

    December 13, 2017 at 8:44 am

    @ET: Pretty sure USA Today isn’t exactly The Daily Worker.

  126. 126.

    OzarkHillbilly

    December 13, 2017 at 8:47 am

    @satby: Don’t worry, disparaging lawyers never goes out of style. Even lawyers do it.

  127. 127.

    Immanentize

    December 13, 2017 at 8:47 am

    @ET: And USA Today is pretty much delivered to every hotel guest in America.

  128. 128.

    Immanentize

    December 13, 2017 at 8:49 am

    @OzarkHillbilly: That’s because we know enough to know when lawyer bashin is warranted. Answer — more than rarely less than always.

  129. 129.

    OzarkHillbilly

    December 13, 2017 at 8:50 am

    @Steve in the ATL: Not just Evangelicals.

    ETA not enuf coffee.

  130. 130.

    satby

    December 13, 2017 at 8:54 am

    @Immanentize: and during the week most of them are traveling for business. This is another sign of the Republican schism. Happy ? dance ?

  131. 131.

    Jeffro

    December 13, 2017 at 8:56 am

    @debbie: Oh no worries here – I completely get the interpretation! I’m actually pretty optimistic (so much so that I sometimes get knocked for that, lol)

  132. 132.

    Immanentize

    December 13, 2017 at 8:59 am

    @satby: I like the Happy Dance!

  133. 133.

    Steve in the ATL

    December 13, 2017 at 9:07 am

    @MattF:

    Also, I just wonder what, exactly, people mean when they say they’re not racist. My current hypothesis is that they’re saying they don’t routinely use the N-word.

    Their black maid is “almost like part of the family”

  134. 134.

    Steve in the ATL

    December 13, 2017 at 9:13 am

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    Don’t worry, disparaging lawyers never goes out of style. Even lawyers do it.

    I’m pretty awesome but fuck that Omnes guy!

  135. 135.

    gene108

    December 13, 2017 at 9:16 am

    @NorthLeft12:

    The voting breakdowns that I have seen indicate that the racist, homophobic, and bigoted child molester received solid majorities from white voters. Men, women, educated or not.

    Alabama (and Mississippi) have large African-American populations. What thwarts Democrats is something like 90% of whit epeople vote Republican.

    Depress or peel off white voters, so the Republicans get say 75% or less of the white vote and Democrats have a shot in those states.

    Alabama and Mississippi are much more likely to send a Democrat to D.C. than states like Utah, Wyoming or Idaho.

    If younger white voters in AL and MS are more likely to vote for Democrats, those states could start to be competitive.

  136. 136.

    OzarkHillbilly

    December 13, 2017 at 9:16 am

    @Steve in the ATL: All my lawyer friends say exactly the same!

  137. 137.

    Captain C

    December 13, 2017 at 9:26 am

    @debbie: Someone should tweet back wondering why Assange keeps supporting pedos and rapists.

  138. 138.

    Jeff

    December 13, 2017 at 9:26 am

    @Cermet: 2020

  139. 139.

    bluefoot

    December 13, 2017 at 9:27 am

    @Kay: I wish I could take this comment out to dinner and buy it a nice bottle of wine. I’ve known many well-educated people who were harassers or were bigoted. Just like people who are shocked wealthy suburbs can be racist, people who think educated people are less likely to be harassers need to pay attention to what’s going on around them.

  140. 140.

    germy

    December 13, 2017 at 9:34 am

    @Captain C: Out of curiosity I checked greenwald’s twitter account.

    Not a whisper about the Alabama election. He really doesn’t care.

  141. 141.

    Jack the Second

    December 13, 2017 at 9:44 am

    @MattF: … in front of black people.

  142. 142.

    Amir Khalid

    December 13, 2017 at 9:55 am

    @satby:
    I don’t follow The Donald on Twitter. But I expect to hear of some colourful responses.from him.

  143. 143.

    Amir Khalid

    December 13, 2017 at 10:00 am

    @Kay:
    Donald Trump brags about inheriting good genes from his uncle John, the scientist. Is this typical Donaldian illogic, or is there something in the Trump family history that we should know about?

  144. 144.

    Steve in the ATL

    December 13, 2017 at 10:13 am

    @Amir Khalid: on an unrelated note*, real men can tune their guitars by ear

    *no pun intended

  145. 145.

    Amir Khalid

    December 13, 2017 at 10:16 am

    @Steve in the ATL:
    Sadly, my ears cannot grip a tuning peg.

  146. 146.

    jonas

    December 13, 2017 at 10:16 am

    @Betty Cracker: Tomorrow’s NYT headline: “How do white evangelicals feel about their defeat?”

  147. 147.

    schrodingers_cat

    December 13, 2017 at 10:17 am

    @Betty Cracker: They won’t because unless you vote R you are invisible to them.

  148. 148.

    LanceThruster

    December 13, 2017 at 10:23 am

    Re: Alabama win.

  149. 149.

    Tokyokie

    December 13, 2017 at 11:08 am

    @Amir Khalid: I think there is crucial distinction. Some people are racist because they’re ignorant, but they will, of course, support racist policies. On the other hand, some people will support policies that will have racist results because they are not among those who will be negatively affected and because it’s politically expedient to do so. The former are merely stupid, but the latter are corrupt and evil.

  150. 150.

    the_antibob

    December 13, 2017 at 11:10 am

    @rikyrah: Yes. One of the saddest clips I’ve ever seen… I had to watch Roy Moore riding that horse like a Big Wheel tricycle again, just so I could get back to work.

  151. 151.

    Amir Khalid

    December 13, 2017 at 12:18 pm

    @Tokyokie:
    Is there an important distinction between the ignorant racist and the knowing racist with an agenda? If one of the former willingly goes along with the latter, and so many of them do, there’s no difference in consequences; so I don’t see how an ignorant dupe of racists with an agenda is less bad than the people duping him.

  152. 152.

    Jeffro

    December 13, 2017 at 12:21 pm

    @jonas:

    Tomorrow’s NYT headline: “How do white evangelicals feel about their defeat?”

    Just once, could they ask, “How do religious black folks feel about their WIN?”

  153. 153.

    ruemara

    December 13, 2017 at 12:45 pm

    @debbie: What the fuck?! Horrible, racist crap. Fuck anyone who still respects Assange.

    @OzarkHillbilly: Black folks can do both.

    Folks, the Mercers and the Kochs are classist, facists but most of all, hardcore racists with billions. It’s not hard to accept that.
    I feel for Mr. Mathis. It hurts to lose a child, much less to lose one to suicide and know that you aided and abetted by not accepting that she was gay. I’m glad he found his voice and his penance.

  154. 154.

    Annie

    December 13, 2017 at 1:00 pm

    @MattF:

    They haven’t personally lynched anybody.

  155. 155.

    The Lodger

    December 13, 2017 at 1:03 pm

    @OzarkHillbilly: I suspect Senator Doug Jones will vote according to the wishes of the people who elected him. Hell, the Republicans in Congress aren’t even doing that anymore. (Just take a look at the level of constituent support for the tax bill.)

  156. 156.

    monobrand

    December 14, 2017 at 1:45 am

    That’s hopeful.

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