Here’s a shocker via CBS News:
White House officials have been looking into whether $500 million in loans that went to Trump administration senior adviser Jared Kushner’s family real estate company may have spurred ethics or criminal law violations, according to the head of the federal government’s ethics agency.
David J. Apol, acting director of the Office of Government Ethics, said in a letter sent late last week to Rep. Raja Krishnamoorthi that the White House Counsel’s office told him that officials were probing the loans to Kushner Cos. and whether “additional procedures are necessary to avoid violations in the future…”
In a statement from Kushner attorney Abbe Lowell to CBS News early Tuesday, Lowell says he confirms White House counsel has concluded there were “no issues involving Jared.”
Pay no attention to the feathers littering the floor of the coop, ladies and gents — the fox has assured us that all is well in the hen house.
But while the Trumps might be devouring Uncle Sam’s choice poultry, the Trumps themselves are seen as fat, slow-moving pullets by a far more ruthless predator. Via TPM:
By all evidence President Trump had to be pushed to sign off on this expulsion of Russian diplomats/spies. Reports also say that Trump refused to commit to the expulsion until he saw that other European allies committing first. Both domestically and internationally, Trump seems to have been faced by a fait accompli. All that said, he did sign off on a major expulsion. Yet note that Russia appears to be placing the blame on the United States and President Trump…
President Trump has been extremely accommodating toward Russia and lavish in his praise and defense of Vladimir Putin. It has not been reciprocated. Russia has continued with a series of aggressive buzzing of US navy ships, particularly in the seas north of Europe. Putin gave that wild speech about new nuclear missiles that could obliterate Florida and could overwhelm any missile defense (we’ve known both are true for like half a century). Trump’s toadying has been met with provocations and what can only be called trolling, though perhaps that’s not yet part of international relations jargon.
Trump’s too dumb and vain to realize he’s being serially humiliated by Putin, but the rest of the world sees it. Hard to see how this ends well.
Open thread.
TenguPhule
Well, yes.
Corner Stone
This is like Snoop’s dealer clearing Snoop Dogg of all possession charges.
“Murder Was the Case That They Gave Me”
Brachiator
Whoa, whoa, whoa! Slow down there. All the Deplorables assure me that Trump is the best durn prizledent that ‘murrica has ever had. He’s a tough deal maker and a political counterpuncher. Toady? Unpossible.
Maybe Putin’s lickspittle.
LAO
Hmm, this is some fucked up shit. Cleared by the White House Counsel. I can’t even.
eric
@TenguPhule: it is not hard at all to see how it ends well. I can imagine a world where world opinion against Russia hardens, while US hegemony in the world decreases. Trump leaves office humiliated and his clan on the way to the poor house or jail. We get a democratic party with a greater spine and/or a more energetic youth tied to the democrats for years to come.
The real issue is ending the GOP’s structural rigging of voting and the impediments to voting rights.
Baud
Maybe if Putin offers Jill Stein’s seat at the table to Stormy Daniels…?
TenguPhule
@eric:
I can assure you that a world with China ascendant and the US on the decline is not an optimal one.
schrodingers_cat
According to Stormy D doesn’t he get off on being humiliated if he is attracted to that person?
bemused
@Baud:
Dumb or scared out of his mind? Anyone who cozies up with Putin should be aware of the financial and physical risks if Putin decides you’re not a great asset to him.
? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?
@eric:
Agreed
SiubhanDuinne
@LAO:
These people are fucking shameless. Every last fucking one of them.
dmsilev
While doing some background reading for a project at work, I came across this lovely work from a few years ago:
‘epidemic model for contagious disease’ seems like a fair description of Twitter etc.
(fun thing is that this paper is actually relevant to the project I’m working on, which has to do with exotic types of magnets cooled to near absolute zero.)
LAO
@SiubhanDuinne: They’re not even pretending at this point. I believe that Jared Kushner, will be the end of this all, wind up in federal jail. But damn, I can’t get over the sheer gall of this people.
? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?
@TenguPhule:
This was inevitable with or without Trump as president.
Gin & Tonic
In related news, I conducted an inquiry into how all the chocolate ice cream in the freezer got consumed last week when my wife was away, and have determined that there were no issues involving me.
clay
@LAO: Technically, we don’t know if Kushner was cleared by the WH Councel. All we know is that Kushner’s lawyer says he was cleared by the WH Councel.
I suspect she’s telling the truth, but I won’t actually believe it until I hear it from the source, given the nature of whom we’re dealing with.
TenguPhule
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?:
No. No it wasn’t.
Major Major Major Major
@dmsilev: graphs are such fun data structures.
Major Major Major Major
@TenguPhule: please propose a series of events and decisions by president Hillary that prevent an ascendant China and keep American hegemony at or above 2015 levels.
Corner Stone
@Gin & Tonic: To be clear Counselor, you merely facilitated the consumption of the chocolate ice cream?
? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?
@TenguPhule:
Adam himself has said it before I believe. It was just a question of when and how hard.
? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?
@Major Major Major Major:
Launch a preemptive first strike on the PRC.
Oh you mean something that would actually work and isn’t completely insane.
Ruckus
@LAO:
sheer gall
That sheer gall is all they have, it’s the only way they get anywhere, anything. All they have to do is find someone who thinks that sheer gall means something. Look at drumpf’s supporters. They rave about him because of his sheer gall in politics, which is to let your freak flag fly. drumpf is no different in his politics than the vast majority of republicans, but he said it out loud and that didn’t fly before him. He got away with it because he wasn’t a politician, republican politicians assumed that they couldn’t do that and get away with it. And maybe they couldn’t. But drumpf could, because he wasn’t one of them, he was one of their supporters. Of course he also thinks he’s a gift to the world. The world knows that he’s a month old fish that’s been sitting out in the sun in a box.
dmsilev
@Major Major Major Major: In this case, the interesting bit wasn’t so much the static structure of the graph, but how it evolves with time. Not continuously, but rather in large jumps:
The criticality and the statistics of the avalanches are what drive the connection to the work I’m doing. Magnets behave in much the same way, as do earthquakes and a host of other phenomena.
SiubhanDuinne
@LAO:
Nope. In fact they seem to take enormous delight and pride in their wanton destruction of laws, traditions, norms, and institutions.
I hope you’re right about Jared, but I also devoutly hope it’s not limited to just him.
schrodingers_cat
@dmsilev: So is it a second order transition?
Mnemosyne
@dmsilev:
I saw an article a few years ago that showed that traffic moves more like a spring than had been previously realized — it slows down when there’s an issue, but then “springs” back when road conditions allow. It apparently was kind of a big deal for road engineers to find this out.
Major Major Major Major
@dmsilev: yes, they’re fun because you can do so much with them!
@Mnemosyne: having a mathematical model for predicting traffic is huge for traffic engineers.
The Moar You Know
I don’t worry about just the Russians (I worry about them too just to be clear). It’s obvious that the fat orange bastard is ripe for the picking and there’s a line of people just waiting for the right moment to gouge some choice coin out of him. That baiting threat made by Daniel’s lawyer earlier in the week…think she’s the only one? It’s gonna cost a lot to shut her up and I’ll bet there’s literally a hundred more waiting in the wings. And that’s just the trouble his dick has caused. There’s 238 and 15 ounces more of him* and I’ll bet every last gram of his worthless carcass is in deep shit.
To use a nature analogy, he’s a beached whale and every predator within a hundred miles can smell the stink and is running to get their share.
*military doctors never lie so I am told
LAO
O/T:
SiubhanDuinne
@Ruckus:
I admire this sentence unreservedly, and will seize the first opportunity to plagiarize it.
Adam L Silverman
@TenguPhule: @? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?: The PRC’s rise isn’t exactly inevitable, but it is probable. That said a number of things could have been done to constrain them in regards to becoming the regional rule maker in Asia-Pacific – TPP for one, which was the real purpose of that agreement – as well as limit their ability to become a full realized global rule maker. Some of that was binding them to the global order through multilateral agreements with them. Some of that was constraining them with multilateral agreements that initially exclude them (TPP) and would require them to modify and moderate their behavior to eventually join them. Some of that was recognizing that they may be a rising peer competitor, but that doesn’t mean they have to be an enemy and finding common issues that they can be worked with on.
None of that is going to happen for the foreseeable future. And even if there is US will and interest to begin doing so again after say a change in who is president, it is unlikely it will now work.
Mike in NC
Per WaPo, Fat Bastard recently suggested the funding for his precious fucking WALL come out of the Pentagon budget. Not gonna happen.
Immanentize
@LAO: I agree. I don’t see any other path given all the information.
No other path except the one where the Trump enterprise succeeds in corrupting everything, cancels elections, and Jared becomes the Queen’s Consort in five years after the death of the King-for-Life.
The Moar You Know
@TenguPhule: Rarely disagree with you, but yeah, that state of affairs is inevitable and would have been no matter who took the wheel of the Great Ship America. It’s been 21 years since I last set foot in China, but the only thing that’s changed is that they’re doing it even better than they were then.
ETA: the good news is that they’ll destroy Russia economically. America…they’ll keep us going for a long time. You don’t kill the dairy cows.
dmsilev
@schrodingers_cat: Effectively yes. The PRL article (sub. access req.) doesn’t explicitly use that term, but their model shows all the hallmarks of a second-order transition.
catclub
speaking of Foxes finding no problems:
LAO
@Immanentize: You owe me a keyboard!
Adam L Silverman
@LAO: What we don’t know is how firm is that support when it moves from polling on the issue to actually supporting the politicians that would do those things. Up until Parkland the conclusion has always been that the polling numbers look great for this stuff, but it is really soft/weak support. That when actual measures are put in place the support is nowhere near that high. This is what the NRA, GOA, NAGR, etc are counting on. What we don’t know yet is if Parkland has really moved that. Though I expect we’ll find out.
dmsilev
@Mnemosyne: I know there’s a lot of interest in mathematically modeling road traffic under various conditions, both at the “simulate a bunch of cars on a computer” level and the “do some math and try to figure out the underlying “rules” of behavior” level. Don’t know much more about the field than that, sadly.
jonas
@Mike in NC: Why not? They’re rich again, per said Fat Bastard.
? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?
@Immanentize:
I hope you’re being sarcastic.
Real talk: They won’t corrupt everything. Trump won’t cancel elections because he knows doing so will sign his death warrant.
catclub
@The Moar You Know:
I think that gravy train has departed. If everybody knows AND it makes no difference to his supporters, there is just no point. He is a cheapskate, so on this score he is happy he will never pay for silence again. get out of jail free card.
dmsilev
@Mike in NC: Congress would have to approve the military spending that money on The Wall. Which is to say, yeah no.
LAO
@Adam L Silverman: I agree. Only time will tell.
Immanentize
@LAO: @clay: I agree with Clay here. I know you have a lot of respect for Abbe, LAO, but he has said some very on-the-edge-of-untrue things regarding his client. On this one, why would McGahn be giving the final verdict of the ethics investigation? I believe McGahn might have said, “there are no issues involving Jared” about his specific Qatar discussions, but also mentioned that there are plenty of issues about his father and other family members and the family business…. Something like that. It was too imprecise to be a statement that Jared was cleared of ethical violations….
? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?
@Adam L Silverman:
What are the consequences to the US and liberal democracy in general if China becomes world head honcho?
Ruckus
@SiubhanDuinne:
Feel absolutely free to do so. I was trying to think of something that everyone would recognize as one of the worst smells ever. Month old fish in the sun? Check. I added the box because that’s where he’s put himself.
The Moar You Know
@Mike in NC: I work in the industry. I suggest he continue to pursue that course of action. You will see the entire military-industrial complex suddenly rediscover their fealty to the rule of law. You can do anything and they’ll excuse it, save for fuck with one red cent of their budgets.
Capri
My local congressman semi-regularly mails out opinion polls to his constituents which Mr. Capri and I fill out and send back religiously. Often they send back the results. In my red county in a red state, 95% want more background checks before weapons purchases and 75% do not want concealed carry licenses to be free to the applicant.
Citizen Alan
@Major Major Major Major:
Well it’s a long shot, but renegotiate the TPP in a way that somehow answers the most serious concerns of its US detractors (i.e. the Bernie humpers) while still achieving the goal of excluding China from Pacific Rim trade. Also, invest heavily in renewable energy infrastructure so that we can take the lead in renewable technology instead of surrendering the 21st century to the Chinese. She might not have been able to pull it off, indeed probably would not have been able to, but she would not have abjectly surrendered in a way that ensures a precipitous decline in this country’s International importance.
Major Major Major Major
@Citizen Alan: And of course she’d have to do all that with a Republican House and probably senate.
HeleninEire
OT. Cuzza time zones and also too I’m very busy at work. Just read the “On the road and in your backyard thread.
Yeah Ireland. Come visit. It really is as pretty as the pictures. Much more so.
Millard Filmore
@catclub:
“NRA admits moving money from accounts with foreign donations to US campaign accounts”
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100210420157
https://www.rawstory.com/2018/03/nra-admits-moving-money-accounts-foreign-donations-us-campaign-accounts/
Brachiator
@The Moar You Know:
He will attract carrion-eaters and scavengers more than predators, to use your nature analogy.
This may be a huge nuisance for the Republican leadership, for Putin, and for the background plutocrats. They will have to continue to prop Trump up, even if it means paying off a long, long line of women with stories to tell. I don’t think they would risk the ire of the dopes who support him by cutting him loose. They’re in too deep.
ruemara
@Citizen Alan: I haven’t truly seen a detailed breakdown of the detractors’ problems with TPP that HRC could’ve even addressed. It was still being negotiated. In a way, I’ve been for us being a bit reduced and focusing some of that energy back into the infrastructure of the US. Unfortunately, the US went quite mad and I wasn’t allowed a nay vote on that.
TenguPhule
@Brachiator:
Predators are carrion eaters and scavengers when the opportunity presents itself.
See also, Great White Sharks.
Frankensteinbeck
@Adam L Silverman:
Thank you for phrasing in a way people may listen to my long-running thesis: Gun control is one of the issues where Republicans may support it in theory, all by itself, but they will vote in fanatical lockstep against anyone who suggests it because Fuck Liberals.
Ruckus
@dmsilev:
People like to look at anything out of the ordinary. A traffic accident, flashing lights, bodies on the ground, etc. They will slow down to get a better look. Always. Any time you have a flow system, a bottle neck will disrupt the flow. Traffic is a flow system, a freeway is, in it’s concept, an open flow system. City streets are designed to be a restricted flow system. Any major bottleneck will slow the flow in either but it’s more expected in a restricted flow system.
How well does your magnet work if the coil has a structural anomaly? What does that do for the field?
schrodingers_cat
Putin to the United States:
Teri Keh Ke Loonga* From The Gangs of Wasseypur.
Explanation of the phrase from peeps whose Hindi is better than mine.
TenguPhule
@Ruckus:
Trump is no katsuobushi.
germy
LAO
@Immanentize: I don’t know Abbe (I know Don, jr’s lawyer). But I agree it’s both you and Clay. I think I’m just looking to get riled up today. I may need a day off from politics.
Citizen Alan
@catclub:
Funny how money is fungible when it goes to organizations that in some way provide abortion services, but not in any other context.
Ruckus
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?:
drumpf may be told that but him knowing that?
He doesn’t operate like a normal human, he doesn’t weigh out the benefits of an action or inaction and rarely of saying or not saying something. He’s positive that any thought in his mind is the right one. This is not a normal human in any stretch of the word.
TenguPhule
@Major Major Major Major:
TPP, treaty of friendship with Vietnam, playing India off against China and a good asskicking of American companies that give away their trade secrets to China just to be allowed into China’s markets.
p.a.
Local Sinclair tv station news ‘team’: Facebook information used by both political parties. This is in blue bluey blue Rhode Island. (Possibly technically correct, but… you know)
rikyrah
@LAO:
The White House Counsel, who hasn’t been approved for a permanent Security Clearance either ???
efgoldman
@LAO:
This is how they’ve operated their whole lives. They cheat and chisel and defraud, but at the city, county or state level, where the occasional fine or short jail time is a cost of doing business.
As someone who looks a lot like me predicted just after the election (yes, really) they have no idea of the brightness of the spotlight in the WH, where all the media (except the paper of record, fuckem) is digging around for something to report and scoop. They weren’t prepared, they’re too fucking stoooopid to tone it down, and in the end it will; bite them in the ass – as it’s already done to the country
Citizen Alan
@Major Major Major Major:
Just the Senate, at least as far as TPP goes, since the house plays no role in treaty ratification. And I think it’s possible that there would be just enough Republicans who see the value and keeping China from becoming the preeminent world power to support her on this. Or not. It was just a thought experiment after all, since the nation has, as I’ve said, chosen to surrender the 21st century to the PRC.
Brachiator
@Millard Filmore:
Wow. The NRA is going to the mattresses on this one. It might be a losing strategy.
From poster LAO:
The gun nuts, Fox News and the NRA keep trying to play this as nothing but opposition to the Second Amendment, but the March for Our Lives activists keep hitting the point that they are advocating for reasonable gun control. The gun nuts want to stake out an extreme position, and it may become harder for conservative politicians to ignore reality (even though they will try hard and be well paid for their delusions).
TenguPhule
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?:
You will learn in time as I have to never predict that Trump will not do that stupid thing because it would be stupid.
efgoldman
@Gin & Tonic:
What about the strawberries?
Adam L Silverman
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?: The issues are going to be over what changes in regards to how the global system is organized and what the rules for operating within it are. There is a dire need to spend a significant amount of effort to think through, in conjunction with our partners, our allies, and even our peer competitors, what the global system should look like for the 21st Century. How it should be rebalanced. What needs to be done to refresh and reinvigorate existing international institutions, which need to be allowed to pass into history, and what new ones we need. And who should be doing what so that the US doesn’t always have to by hyperactive.
None of this is actually happening. Our allies and partners are having some of these discussions because of the reality of the past 18 months. The PRC is certainly having this discussion internally. We know that Putin has his own idea. But right now the US has largely taken itself out of the equation.
gene108
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?:
The U.S. does not have to be in decline. We would lose relative power, because other countries became more prosperous, but this does not mean we have to lose our existing power.
Basically, if you can run a mile in 7:00 minutes and I can run a mile in 10:00 minutes, you are much faster than me. I keep exercising and can now run a mile in 8:00 minutes. This does not mean you have to be slower than me, you can still continue to run your 7:00 minute mile.
There’s no reason another country would be able to supplant the USA as the Number 1 country in the world, but because of Republican fuck-ups it looks like a possibility.
TenguPhule
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?:
Well for starters, the Pacific is going to become an interesting place to be on a boat.
Ladyraxterinok
@eric: Voting rights is THE issue and will be for some time to come. If you are kept from voting, what difference does it make if you got inspired and energized by Saturday’s march??
LAO
@efgoldman: You make an excellent point. Bullshit doesn’t survive the level of scrutiny these grifters are currently facing. If only Republicans in Congress agreed.
TenguPhule
@efgoldman:
Except most of them based in the USA aren’t. And it shows.
As Kay has pointed out, we know very little of Trump’s history and business records because the fucking media didn’t think it was important.
Frankensteinbeck
@TenguPhule:
Trump will not cancel elections because everyone would ignore him if he said to. There is a very large system that will shrug and keep doing what it does. He’s had that problem already with court orders that override him. The System is actually holding up pretty well. It’s the American voters who turned out to be screaming fuckheads in a convulsive battle over whether white supremacy will rule over an ash heap.
Ruckus
@gene108:
You mean life isn’t a zero sum game?
Damn.//
Mnemosyne
@efgoldman:
Anyone who claims that Bogart was “just” a movie star and not an actor should be forced to watch that movie.
germy
@p.a.:
Have they given you “the talk” yet about fake news? Every sinclare station is compelled to read a brief statement about fake news.
My sinclare anchors taped a statement, and they run it every morning at 6:58. They follow the script right down to the last word, comma and period.
Adam L Silverman
@The Moar You Know: It goes beyond that. The DOD or the Services can’t just redirect the money because the President thinks it’s a good idea. Other than limited amounts of discretionary funds, everything in the DOD and Service budgets is approved by Congress. Any reprogramming of sufficient funds to pay for his wall will have to be approved in Congress via legislation. It’s not going to happen.
What we’re seeing is panic is beginning to set in. The omnibus CR last week was the last chance for significant funding for Douchehenge. McConnell has gotten Ryan to going along with no budgetary and appropriations regular order for next FY’s appropriations as he wants no tough funding fights going on and no shutdowns because he and Ryan can’t deliver the votes in either chamber. What you’re going to see is another omnibus CR in August/September in line with the 2 year budgetary outline agreement. This will leave the President going into his reelection campaign without any funding for or any significant progress on his oft promised wall. He’s cunning enough to realize what that will mean in regard to his reelection chances.
The Moar You Know
@Brachiator: I don’t see the women as a problem for him as such: everyone knows about that. It’s everything else. The guy is dirty in every way possible. There’s nothing I can think of that he’s not blackmailable on. And yeah, that’s going to be a very expensive bill to pay to keep him propped up. Hardly seems worth it. Is this really the best plan they could come up with?
Major Major Major Major
@Citizen Alan: No, but the House has partial control over your domestic priorities, like investing in renewables.
Adam L Silverman
@Frankensteinbeck: As with everything the devil is in the details.
Yutsano
@germy: This is so 1984. Is there a clip of it on YouTube or somewhere else?
gene108
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?:
People have to want to accept China as the World’s New #1, unless they plan on going on mission of military global domination.
The U.S. wields soft power because people like big budget Hollywood movies, rock-n-roll, jazz, blue jeans, etc., along with some case to be made for being a proponent of good governance, equality, and such, compared to authoritarian states.
The U.S. is extremely stable, going on 240+ years, with only 2 forms of government, with the current form in place for 229 years. In that time the British Empire waxed and waned, the Tsars no longer rule Russia, the Soviet Union came and went, the Spanish and Portuguese were driven from South America, and the list goes on and on of changes around the world that have happened, while we continue under the same Constitution.
It is something to be admired. And is admired.
efgoldman
@p.a.:
As far as I’m concerned, Channel10 no longer exists except for some NBC network programming.
Fuckem
Mnemosyne
@Major Major Major Major:
You know how I feel about math.
The Moar You Know
@p.a.: Couldn’t understand why my office wingnut was so convinced Facebook had fucked with the election. Finally got out of her today – she’s not talking about 2016. That was “clean”.
2008 and 2012.
They’re convinced FB put Obama into office. Jesus.
Adam L Silverman
@efgoldman: That was me. I use them and blueberries in my protein smoothies.
Adam L Silverman
@gene108: I don’t have to outrun the bear. I just have to outrun you!
germy
@Yutsano:
I haven’t seen one. I read about the prepared statement (required of every station nationwide) and how some affiliates were complaining about it.
I wasn’t surprised to see my local affiliate fall into line. They hated Obama and Hillary, and although they’re somewhat uncomfortable with drumpf they always slant the stories to make him seem more wise and sane than he is.
Gin & Tonic
@efgoldman: Well played.
Yutsano
@gene108: The renminbi would have to start pushing out the US dollar as the major reserve currency. As any cursorial review of the international economy will show, that is nowhere near happening. The greenback isn’t giving up its superior position in international finance any time soon. And China won’t release enough renminbi to make that possible.
? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?
@Adam L Silverman:
I’m also highly skeptical of China as a superpower. I’ve done some reading that says the CCP is hopelessly corrupt and the balancing act it has done over the last 25-30 years is starting to give way. GDP growth is beginning to slow and the party has a lot of factional infighting.
schrodingers_cat
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?: We are most likely headed to a multipolar world with spheres of influence like the kind existed prior to WWII.
Mnemosyne
@efgoldman:
And it’s going to come from a non-traditional news source, like Buzzfeed, Teen Vogue, or the Hollywood Reporter.
catclub
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?:
I would have guessed the opposite, Xi Jinping is apparently now president for life – even got a ‘great helmsman’ title. Factional fighting looks over for a while.
TenguPhule
@Frankensteinbeck:
Depends on what parts of the system you’re looking at.
In theory, a Baverian fire drill with a Nation wide National Security Emergency could shutdown elections, maybe not all of them, but enough in the right areas to make things….interesting. Congress has ceded a lot of power for “emergencies” for the sake of a quick response.
Rules, regulations and norms are being shredded daily and many people’s attitudes to them are also changing and not for the better. Trump is corrosive and the biggest example that the system isn’t working the way sane folks thought it was supposed to.
Mnemosyne
@Adam L Silverman:
Is Putin fool enough to think he can take down China the way he took down the UK and US, or will it be more that they’ll have a tacit agreement to leave each other alone?
schrodingers_cat
@Adam L Silverman: I thought you are the bear!
TenguPhule
@gene108:
Was.
Adam L Silverman
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?: A significant chunk, estimate up to about 40%, of their economy is actually on the shadow side. That will eventually lead to a significant reckoning.
Gravenstone
@LAO: Um, Jkrush’s lawyer claims the WHC has exonerated his boy. Not quite the same (yet) as WHC releasing said exculpatory findings.
ruemara
@p.a.: It is technically correct. However, CA used data illegally. The Obama campaign (the one people tend to compare it to), used data collected legally with clear opt-ins. You signed up for it. You didn’t with the CA data purchase & abuse.
schrodingers_cat
@Mnemosyne: Russians are afraid of China, their next door neighbor with lots more people than they do. In that they have company from India.
Adam L Silverman
@Mnemosyne: I have no idea.
? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?
@TenguPhule:
But who would believe Trump? I wouldn’t and neither would tens of millions of others. Canceling elections would be one of the biggest own goals in history. Trump would die at or near the White House, and not from a heart attack or stoke, that I can tell you.
Adam L Silverman
@schrodingers_cat: There has been speculation regarding this. I am not authorized to confirm or deny anything at this time.
Mnemosyne
@Adam L Silverman:
It’s an interesting (and terrifying) question, to be sure.
Major Major Major Major
@Mnemosyne:
Grateful for all the technology it provides you??
Yutsano
@Mnemosyne: The Chinese economy is much better situated to win any economic battle there. But China has fewer military alliances to rely on, and the question becomes what side does the rest of the world take if that becomes an actual shooting war?
And both sides have nukes. WHEE!!!
TenguPhule
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?:
Technically all he has to do is convince the local federal officials and law enforcement that there is a imminent credible threat to invoke emergency powers. Unfortunately the system as designed gives the office more believability then you’d think, despite his best efforts to overcome that.
efgoldman
@Mnemosyne:
Even us major newspaper-reading, network-news watching old farts are learning to click on alternate sources.
Mnemosyne
@schrodingers_cat:
That’s why I’m wondering if taking down the US and UK would make Putin overconfident and think he could take on China, too. This is purely me wondering stuff, though, and not based on any actual facts.
TenguPhule
@Yutsano:
Sit back and root for injuries.
? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?
@catclub:
That might have changes the equation somewhat, but the endemic corruption and slowing economic growth are still major problems facing the PRC
Mnemosyne
@Major Major Major Major:
Sure, let’s go with that.
TenguPhule
@efgoldman:
BalloonJuice’s ads don’t count.
TenguPhule
@Mnemosyne:
Not in the same way, no. China’s censorship works for them in this case.
Putin might try sparking unrest in Hong Kong though.
? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?
@TenguPhule:
Just as no one would believe him, no one would accept such events. At least not quietly. Again, Trump would die in the WH and not from too many Big Macs.
Mnemosyne
@TenguPhule:
Actually, he would have to convince state governments in all 50 states that there is an imminent threat that will affect all 50 states at the same time. Elections are run by the states, not by the federal government.
TenguPhule
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?:
Easily solved by a few border wars. //
John Gabriel
Betty Cracker @ Top:
Or Traitor Donald sees it too, but he’s too cowed by Putin, and Russian kompromat, to respond with his usual belligerence.
Ksmiami
@TenguPhule: but it might not be that bad- China is at least trying to raise the standards of living 4 their citizenry
TenguPhule
@Mnemosyne: State officials tend to defer to the Feds when National Security is invoked. Especially if its a “ticking time bomb” urgent scenario.
It doesn’t last for long if the threat isn’t real, but in theory it could last just long enough in just the right places.
schrodingers_cat
@Mnemosyne: I don’t know, but I think at the moment P is focused on the West.
TenguPhule
@Ksmiami:
At the expense of all of their neighbors.
There’s a reason why Vietnam has made up with us so fast and why every single one of the pacific nations bordering China hates and fears them with a passion.
SiubhanDuinne
@gene108:
What you have described here, of course, is the precise opposite of the binary, black-white, either-or, dualistic worldview of Trump and his enablers — leading inevitably to a “win-lose” outcome.
It explains the “let’s do this because it will piss liberals off” attitude. It explains the “whatever Obama supports, we’ll do the opposite” Republican legislative stalemates and Trumpian executive orders. It explains nearly every action taken by nearly every one of his Cabinet members, and of course it explains a lifetime of rip-off business ventures, thousands of lawsuits, and refusal to pay agreed-upon fees.
I hate these people.
? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?
@gene108:
I would definitely prefer a world where the US doesn’t always have to be the World Policeman and other nations can step up and do more to make this world a better place for everyone.
Major Major Major Major
@Mnemosyne: Yay!
TenguPhule
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?:
Not gonna happen until all of our major allies invest a shit ton more into rebuilding their naval forces.
Booger
@The Moar You Know: And Robert Mueller is the Oregon Road Department guy with the cases of dynamite, correct?
schrodingers_cat
@dmsilev: Thanks I will look it up. It is relevant to my interests.
jl
@TenguPhule: I think a dumbass attempt at a national war scare is more likely, or maybe some idiot air strike. They would hope that would change the popular mood. I’m not sure how dumbass and criminal a thing Mattis would agree to, so I’d start to worry if he suddenly got fired before the election. Mattis might agree to something that could be deemed criminal, but not dumbass.
Seems to me that there would have to be some fake emergency that covered a whole state, and how likely is that to fly? When it comes to messing with elections, the states have, so far, been jealously guarding their power to hold elections as they see fit. IIRC, even Mississippi told the Triumpsters to go to hell with their bogus voting fraud investigation.
jl
‘Pullet’ doesn’t seem to be the best term for Trump. Is there some lingo for a fat senile rooster that sits and crows all day and night over nothing?
Trump does seem to start with his demented tweets between 3 and 4 AM, so there is some parallel.
TenguPhule
@jl:
El pollo merienda.
Brachiator
@jl:
I don’t know. I heard that when he was all alone in the hotel room with Stormy, he looked her in the eyes and said, “Go ahead. Pullet.”
jl
@TenguPhule: Capon. It was there in the back of my mind. Don’t know why it took so long to surface.
TenguPhule
@jl:
Imminent threat of nuclear suitcases of NK origin.
/Yes, it was a bad episode of NCIS, but remember who we’re talking about here and where he gets all his ideas from.
TenguPhule
@jl: But nobody has chopped off Trump’s genital yet.
Mnemosyne
@jl:
A fake emergency in, say, San Diego would not be enough to cancel elections in San Francisco unless Governor Brown ordered it. How likely is that?
TenguPhule
@Brachiator:
/groan
Yellow Flag, five pun penalty.
Adam L Silverman
@jl:
He wouldn’t. For either.
Mnemosyne
@TenguPhule:
You may want to look at a map and see how much of California is NOT close to a port. Hint: that would be most of the state.
jl
@Mnemosyne: I definitely can see Trump accusing Jerry of planing NK nukes in San Diego. Trump has said we are totally out of control!
? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?
@TenguPhule:
Was there ever a good episode of NCIS? Seriously, not that Quantum Leap was high culture by any stretch of the imagination, but WTF Bellisario?
jl
@Adam L Silverman: If there was a mutual WH job suicide pact, I guess I am glad Mattis backed out. I do worry how far he would be willing to bend in order to remain the Last Sane Man in the residence.
Adam L Silverman
@jl: He won’t do criminal. And he doesn’t do stupid.
Shana
@clay: Abbe Lowell is a man.
jl
@Adam L Silverman: Then, in the Trump administration, the guy is in a precarious and nearly untenable situation, ain’t he?
A commenter posted a Politico article on why Mattis can still keep his job. Much of it was a description of what a master Mattis is of BSing and overawing Trump. If he is who you say he is, I hope he can keep it up.
TenguPhule
@Mnemosyne:
As I already said, its a bad NCIS plot. But remember where the Dolt gets his inspiration from.
And it wouldn’t be California, it would be someplace where the votes actually mattered. //
Jay
@TenguPhule:
Only certain types of boats.
Adam L Silverman
@jl: Yes he is.
Dmbeaster
So Putin knows what Stormy learned – that Trump will bend over and be beat in order to be pleasing.
Miss Bianca
@Adam L Silverman: “Douchehenge”. Heh heh heh. Thanks for that one.
Kathleen
@ruemara: St. Slanders and his disciples have probably never even read it. To quote the great efgoldman, “fuckem”.
SgrAstar
@dmsilev: that is really cool! Thanks.
J R in WV
@Ruckus:
I think I recall reading about the discovery of the cause of “pogoing” in heavy traffic. Which many of us have encountered on large interstates or freeways with heavy amounts of traffic. You come to a near standstill in heavy traffic, thinking you will eventually come to the accident that caused the interruption in smooth flow of traffic.
But you finally get back up to speed, sometimes after several times slowing to a near stop, and never see any sign of an accident or other flaw in the roadway that could have stopped traffic. Because the cause of the slowdown was just overload of the amount of traffic past the ability of the freeway to convey it.
First time I saw this was in the Interstate north out of Florida, just after the western leg out of Sarasota and Tampa merged with the eastern leg out of Miami. Speed up/slow down over and over all afternoon. No accidents, just too much friction between the traffic and the highway.
I don’t know if this phenomenon is related to pogoing in rocket engine thrust or not. Elon Musk may know…
J R in WV
@Mnemosyne:
And there is no emergency worth closing down elections for. Lincoln oversaw elections in the middle of the civil war, for dog’s sake!!!