Justice, justice you shall pursue… — Deuteronomy 16:20
BREAKING: Noor Salman is found not guilty of all charges
— Melissa Jeltsen (@quasimado) March 30, 2018
Jeltsen did an excellent piece of long form reporting on Salman that really gets into the details of why she was even charged.
ORLANDO, Fla. — Noor Salman looked up as the prosecutor directed the jury’s attention to a copy of her 2011 marriage certificate. There, on the screen, was her looping signature, right next to Omar Mateen’s. Proof she wed a killer.
The 31-year-old widow shivered and hiked a purple blanket up to her neck, glancing over at her team of defense attorneys for reassurance. They often soothed her in court with physical touch, squeezing her shoulder or patting her arm. Her fear was palpable.
Later, Salman watched herself on the same screen, testing perfumes at Victoria’s Secret. In the security camera footage shown to the jury, she sniffed a paper strip, then passed it to her husband for his thoughts. He must have agreed; they left with a shiny pink bag.
While her husband was committing mass murder, Salman was in her pajamas, asleep in their home in Fort Pierce, Florida. Seven months later, she was charged with aiding and abetting her husband and obstructing justice for allegedly lying to the FBI. Prosecutors claimed that Salman helped her husband scout potential locations for the attack, created a cover story for him and participated in unusual spending.
The seemingly ordinary excursion to a mall store was now center stage in a federal terrorism trial. In the days leading up to the shooting, Mateen spent thousands of dollars on Salman, buying her clothes and jewelry, including a diamond ring. Prosecutors suggested she got the gifts in exchange for agreeing to help him carry out his heinous plan.
There was zero evidence that Salman was radicalized herself, they admitted. Instead, they argued that she was content to trade her husband – the sole provider for her and her 3-year-old son – for baubles and designer wear.
Salman, who did not testify in the trial herself, pleaded not guilty, and maintained through her lawyers that she had no knowledge of Mateen’s plans. When he began showering her with presents in the weeks before the massacre, Salman was optimistic about their future, her lawyers said, and believed it was a sign her husband – a brutish, abusive man who only permitted her a $20 allowance each week – was changing.
For the 49 families of the victims, the trial was an opportunity for closure. And yet, they didn’t get to see the man that took their loved one’s lives. Instead, they got his wife.
Outside the federal courthouse, on a lunch break from the trial, Salman’s cousin was seething. Susan Adieh, didn’t recognize the one-dimensional cliched caricature the prosecution had described, and she didn’t understand why Salman was on trial. The wives of other terrorists and mass killers never faced charges. She wondered if her family’s religion played a role, even though Salman was not religious.
After all, they were Muslim.
Susan Clary, the family spokesperson, said that many other relatives wanted to come to support Salman, but they were afraid. As Muslim Americans, they worried about being associated with the terrorism case; their jobs could be at stake.
After all, they were Muslim… Pretty much sums it all up right there. Somewhere the shade of bin Laden is smiling. He got almost everything he wanted, as delineated in his manifesto, out of the 9-11 attack.
Click over and read the whole thing. And recognize that on this Good Friday, which is also the first night of Passover, justice has prevailed in a courtroom in Florida.
Stay frosty!
Open thread.
Betty Cracker
I don’t doubt that religious bigotry was at play in this case. But Florida does have a history of going after wives and girlfriends of mass killers — especially cop killers — if they can’t get their hands on the actual perpetrators.
Major Major Major Major
I’ll admit I hadn’t been following this but I’m surprised the prosecution’s case was so ridiculous. Isn’t this the sort of thing that can do professional harm to the prosecutor?
LAO
Very, very good news indeed.
Gin & Tonic
@Major Major Major Major: In Florida?
LAO
catclub
@Major Major Major Major:
prosecution did not bother to tell defense ( until too late) that Mateen’s father had been an FBI informant for 10-12 years. I am surprised Judge did not declare mistrial.
PaulWartenberg
she’s being blamed for the violence of her husband.
what does that say about us?
PaulWartenberg
@Major Major Major Major:
no. there are almost no means of resolving – or punishing – prosecutorial misconduct or overreach.
PaulWartenberg
@catclub:
something like that would have been a huge red flag to the appellate courts.
Major Major Major Major
@Gin & Tonic: kind of assumed that ridiculously incompetent failure to convict in a high-profile (if spurious) case would harm a prosecutor anywhere.
@PaulWartenberg: I meant politically.
rp
@catclub: I agree that the prosecution screwed up by not telling the defense earlier, but I don’t understand the relevance of that info. Greenwald and his acolytes have pointed to the disclosure about Mateen’s father as some sort of smoking gun, but I don’t get it. (of course, many of those people also point to the photo of mateen’s father standing behind Clinton at a rally as evidence of some vast conspiracy)
Major Major Major Major
@rp: isn’t that the sort of shit that got the Bundy’s a mistrial?
Feathers
Thank goodness! Is Florida coming to its senses?
@catclub: I wondered at that. Perhaps the judge saw that the defense was likely going to win, and if they didn’t, the case would be thrown out on appeal.
sdhays
Definitely good news.
Yarrow
No surprise there.
Glad she was acquitted and hope she and her family can live in less fear now.
RP
She beat the rap, but not the ride. She’s been rotting in jail for a year, mostly solitary.
Cacti
Politically motivated prosecutors seeking a scalp.
Disgusting.
rp
@Major Major Major Major: Absolutely…from a procedural standpoint, failing to disclose evidence like that is a huge no-no and the prosecutors should be fired.
But what I’m saying is that there seems to be a leap in logic re the actual significance of the info. i.e.,
1. Mateen’s father was FBI informant
2. ?
3. Salman not guilty
Chyron HR
What the fuck?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
In fairness, Dylan Roof’s parents were also prosecuted.
Weren’t they?
“closure”– I think they mean revenge. Like, say, invading a country that had nothing to do with a terrorist attack
catclub
@Feathers:
you know that is like referees who wait until they see if the shot missed before they call a foul. If it was worthy of declaring mistrial, it was worthy of declaring mistrial. I hope the Judge had better reasons for not declaring a mistrial.
Amir Khalid
For me this has all the appearance of a frivolous prosecution. A husband taking his wife to the mall to buy clothes and jewellery is not evidence of anything. If that’s all the prosecution had, then there was no case against Noor Salman. I’m surprised that this got to trial in the first place. How did the US attorney decide to bring this prosecution? How did a grand jury manage to see a case to be answered?
Cacti
@Major Major Major Major:
No more than shooting a random black person does professional harm to a cop.
catclub
@rp: wrong logic:
Prosecutors have information that may have serious bearing on the trial.
Prosecutors ‘neglect’ to inform defense of said information. Once it is released everyone agrees ‘could be serious’ Why didn’t you tell us this when we had time to prepare? What were you hiding? What else were you hiding?
also, as to this: ” I’m saying is that there seems to be a leap in logic re the actual significance of the info”
I agree. but there is a much shorter leap in logic to: “So, was Mateen also an FBI informant?” Should we look into that?
LAO
@Feathers: @catclub: I really did not follow this case but offer the following observations. Often, District Courts will not intervene, if they believe an acquittal is likely. Not because they are lazy but because the government CANNOT bring an appeal after a not guilty verdict but can appeal the granting of a Rule 29 motion or a mistrial. Also, a court is empowered to grant a Fed.R.Crim.P 29 motion for acquital after a jury delivers a verdict, so letting it go to a jury often makes sense to the Court.
It is, however, disgusting that the Court permitted her to remain in custody for a year pending trial. The government had to have mislead the court as to the evidence.
LAO
@Amir Khalid: A confession was coerced.
pat
So the poor woman is held and interrogated for hours without access to an attorney. And scribbles her name at the bottom of a “confession” written by one of the interrogators. Huh?
How did it even get this far????
Disgusting. I hope her family and friends will get her away somewhere she can begin to recover.
LAO
Does anyone know whether the father-in-law testified against her?
burnspbesq
Juries seem to get it right pretty often.
There should be accountability moments for all involved in the decision to bring this case.
Amir Khalid
@LAO:
Isn’t that misconduct by Ms Salman’s interrogators?
germy
https://www.thecut.com/2018/03/texas-woman-sentenced-to-5-years-for-voting-illegally.html
LAO
@Amir Khalid: Sure but no mechanism to enforce any penalty. And, I’m sure the prosecution team doesn’t believe the confession was coerced. Thankfully, the jury did.
@burnspbesq:
I agree, I find it very surprising but true (although not always).
rp
@catclub: I agree with all of that. As I said, this is serious misconduct on the part of the prosecutors and they should be fired.
I’m trying to understand how the defense would have used that information had it come out before the trial.
germy
catclub
@LAO: Useful information! Thanks.@LAO: I would be amazed if he did. Given the non-disclosure.
rp
@germy: I hate having to agree with Greenwald, but c’est la vie. :-)
germy
“C’est la vie”, say the old folks, it goes to show you never can tell
gvg
@rp: Read this FBI case falls apart is the description. It’s a sort of FBI covering up their own mistakes by prosecuting an innocent witness. They screwed up before the shooting by clearing Mateen after his coworkers warned the FBI of threats he made. His dad being an informent may have influenced them into clearing the son too soon and Dad looks to be doing money laundering. Reminders of the Tsarnaev case before the Boston bombing and even the handling of Whitey Bulgar.
The impression I got from headlines of dad is an FBI informant was that that implied he was a “good guy” but from the story, he really wasn’t.
Feathers
@rp: Greenwald is a stopped calendar — right once a year.
patrick II
@PaulWartenberg:
That we should blame Melania?
rp
@gvg: Thanks. That’s the missing link I was wondering about. If the FBI soft pedaled the investigation of the son because of the father, hoo boy…
Major Major Major Major
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: i think ‘revenge’ is what most people mean when they say ‘closure.’
Fred
@gvg: I would guess that most informants are not particularly “good guys”. To be an informant you need information. To get information on “bad guys” you need to rub elbows with them. Birds of a feather and all that.
That’s just my speculation.
? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?
This shit right here is why I don’t have a high opinion of prosecutors.
catclub
@rp:
and yet they still went ahead with the prosecution of Noor Salman – stupid. Just drop that and nobody will be interested in how they handled Mateen.
rikyrah
@germy:
OUTRAGEOUS!!!
Major Major Major Major
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?: nor should you, as a class.
Roger Moore
@PaulWartenberg:
The ballot box is the best available means. Vote the bastards out.
? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?
@PaulWartenberg:
None that are legal (aside from voting them out) anyway.
? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?
@Major Major Major Major:
I like the idea of a justice system. I don’t like overzealous, self-righteous assholes with tunnel vision.
different-church-lady
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?: It’s part of how we ended up with Scott Brown in Massachusetts. Aside from her weak campaign skills, a whole lot of people were not favorably disposed towards Martha Coakley due to her involvement in a couple of different circus trials.
Brachiator
@Major Major Major Major:
No. There are some people who believe that if you are arrested, or prosecuted, then you must be guilty, especially if you are a member of the despised group of the day.
That said, I am happy to see that justice prevailed in this case, and that bigots and right wing zealots were denied their pound of flesh.
trollhattan
@germy:
RU fucking kidding me? You can get less than that for involuntary manslaughter.
? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?
BTW was there any evidence that Salman knew what her husband was planning?
Amir Khalid
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?:
Apparently what they had was that her husband the terrorist went shopping with her.
rikyrah
Trump’s own words are again used against him in court
03/30/18 12:00 PM
By Steve Benen
In fall, a group of Democratic state attorneys general and immigration lawyers sued the Trump administration, arguing that the president’s decision to scrap the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals program (DACA) was unlawful, in part because it was motivated by Donald Trump’s alleged bigotry toward communities of color.
The Justice Department tried to get the case dismissed. A New York judge yesterday rejected that effort, citing the president’s “racially charged language.” The New York Times reported:
Mnemosyne
@trollhattan:
Do we need to guess the skin tone of the woman who was sent to jail? ?
Spanky
Since this is an open thread* …
Space, the crowded frontier:
* – I was going to say “All BJ threads are open threads”, but Adam actually tagged it as such!
arrieve
@rikyrah: Sadly that’s a reasonable inference that escaped an awful lot of people.
d58826
So reading thru the comments on David Hogg organizing an advertisers boycott of Laura Ingraham. It is truly amazing how awful this evil all powerful 17 year old (who was totally unknown before the Parkland shooting) is being to poor powerless Ingraham. A person who has trouble rubbing her millions of dollar together and getting her message out from her perch at Faux news. Oh the humanity (or is is Hannity) of the situation.
Yes SNARK!!!!!!!!
Adam L Silverman
@Mnemosyne: Nope, not in the least.
Adam L Silverman
@Spanky: I tag all my threads that way. On purpose.
Amir Khalid
In Newbie Guitarist News:
I’ve got Born To Run down pretty well. I’m going to concentrate on blues progressions next. The challenge for me is stretching my left hand so that I can hit both a root note and the sixth, one string up and four frets away. My problem is — well, you guys know about my left pinky. But The Girl and I will manage. And I hope to reward myself with a Les Paul.
Spanky
@Adam L Silverman: Yes, for the same reason my cats do exactly what I tell them to do, because I can see they were going to do it anyway.
Mnemosyne
@d58826:
I love how the high school kids are “bullies” while the highly paid adult professionals are just poor, innocent victims of their cruelty. Because, ya know, Hogg forced Ingraham to mock his college rejections by being so mmmmeeeaaaannnnn to her.
Oh, and the NRA is being bullied, too. Poor, sweet things who never did anyone any harm. Leave Wayne LaPierre aaallloooooonnnnneeee!
J R in WV
@germy:
“Texas Woman Sentenced to 5 Years in Prison for Voting Illegally”
One more reason to hate Texas… this is despicable and people who allow their state government to do such things deserve the government they have got. But I won’t go there to be subjected to such things.
At least Noor Salman got a good jury, finding of not guilty requires that the entire jury believed she was not involved in the commission of the crimes in the indictment/jury form.
At least it would here in WV. Which isn’t a perfect state, but seems to have Texas and FL beat, at least. Kentucky too, apparently, based upon how teachers get treated.
rikyrah
Outrageous
A Dreamer’s impossible dilemma: where to die?
With USCIS unable to grant parole, Ángel Martínez must choose between receiving medical care – or going to Mexico to say goodbye
Lauren Gambino in Washington
Fri 30 Mar 2018 05.00 EDT
Ángel Martínez did not choose to leave his native Mexico at the age of seven for a life in the United States. But now, nearly 20 years later, he faces a wrenching choice: where to die?
Does he stay in the country that is his home, and receive palliative care to relieve the pain of his terminal medical condition?
Or does he travel to Mexico to say goodbye to his parents – and probably forfeit the chance to return?
Martínez’s fate has become entangled in the national debate over immigration reform that was fueled by Donald Trump’s decision to cancel the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (Daca), an executive program that shielded nearly 700,000 young undocumented immigrants known as “Dreamers” from deportation.
………………………..
In 2007, Martínez was diagnosed with acute lymphoblastic leukemia and ultimately required a bone marrow transplant. His recovery was complicated by the development of graft v host disease, a rare condition that occurs when donor cells attack the host’s organs and can cause severe damage to the skin, liver and lungs.
After 10 years and 21 hospital admissions to manage the disease, Martínez has “no chance of recovery” and is unlikely to live through the year, according to a medical note written by his doctor.
But hopes for Martínez to be reunited with his parents are dim.
His mother and father are not allowed to enter the US because of past immigration violations. If Martínez were to leave the country without permission, it is unlikely he will ever set foot in the US again because he had lived in the country unlawfully before receiving Daca protections. He could try to beg for mercy at the border, but there is no guarantee he would be granted entry.
rikyrah
@germy:
this is despicable!!
Timurid
@gvg:
Dad is a total creep… right wing nutjob, D-list talk radio personality, “businessman” (petty criminal)… he’s like a Muslim/South Asian version of this guy.
d58826
@Mnemosyne: Latest from Twitter is she has been dropped by 10 of her biggest advertisers. NOW that will hurt more than what any 17 year old says. I would say we start a gofundme campaign for her but I don’t think they accept donations of .000000000000000000000001 cents.
Of course we could send a box of very very tiny baby violins.
Adam L Silverman
Well this explains a lot. Only the best people picking and vetting the best people!
d58826
@Feathers: no once every 4 years – Feb 29th
d58826
@Adam L Silverman: yes but I’ll bet they drank the BEST moonshine
realbtl
@Amir Khalid: You can get a nice rhythm thing going by holding say the 2nd and 3rd string with you index and use 2nd finger for the 6th for an E chord. Move over 1 string for A. Good luck, sounds like you are making good progress.
James E. Powell
@Amir Khalid:
I don’t know anything about your left pinky, but there are quite a few stellar players who almost never use theirs.
Aleta
@germy: It’s a dangerous sign for everyone.
d58826
David Hogg – MY what a radical student. How will the country survive :TBT to the good old days with @Emma4Change this photo was taken after over 3 months of hard work to launch a weather balloon to the edge of space as part of the amazing Astronomy program at MSD lead by @KyleJeter Emma was head of tracking and predicted landing with in 10 mi
Roger Moore
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?:
I see there being two big problems with our administration of justice:
1) Real justice requires a sense of proportion and mercy; otherwise we’re just extracting revenge. Unfortunately, there’s a large group that’s always demanding more and worse punishment, which pushes prosecutors- and too often judges- to go for the maximum all the time.
2) We don’t actually have the resources to prosecute every crime, or to punish every offender we catch to the full extent of the law. That means despite the demands to punish everyone, prosecutors have to use their discretion about who to prosecute and for what, which makes the whole system incredibly vulnerable to bias.
The worst part is that there’s a vicious circle. The more we try to punish to the fullest extent of the law, the more people we have to let slide for lack of resources. That makes voters angry, so they demand ever more draconian “justice” in the hopes of getting everyone. We have to accept the need to prioritize and do it systematically, so our resources are focused on the worst offenders rather than the easiest to prosecute.
Amir Khalid
@realbtl:
Forgive my newbiosity, but on which frets do the fingers go for that E chord?
Also, I’m considering an Epi Les Paul Studio (the most expensive guitar within my means), a Japanese LP Standard copy at half the price, and a Chinese LP Standard copy at a quarter the price but with a bolt-on neck. I prefer the cleaner, more elegant looks of the Studio to the Standard. All three seem to be well-regarded, at least on YouTube. Which would you go for?
James E. Powell
@Roger Moore:
That large group not only votes, but has the support for the press/media. Someone asked upthread whether there is anything that can harm a prosecutor’s career. The biggest one is going easy or letting a person go, then that person committing rape or murder. That will be on the local news every night, with crying victims and political rivals’ condemnations. A wrongly charged or convicted person might get one mention on the local news.
James E. Powell
@Amir Khalid:
One of my students has the Epiphone. I think it’s very nice.
What I believe realbtl is talking about is barring the second fret of the 4th & 5th strings (D & A) with your index finger, then hitting the fourth fret of the A string with your third finger. Kind of like this guy is doing. There are many variations of this. Concentrate on your right hand getting the rhythm.
Ruckus
@Adam L Silverman:
It’s just all those people who got all the bad breaks in life being allowed to, OK what’s that word, shine, No that’s not it, redeem themselves, No that’s not it, OK I got it, Fuck over everyone they hadn’t gotten to already.
The Moar You Know
@Amir Khalid: if the LP copy is made by Tokai, buy it. It will be a better guitar than Gibson themselves ever made.
catclub
@d58826:
how about crocodile tears?
James E. Powell
@The Moar You Know:
I’ve heard the Japanese made Tokai LP copies are so good that there are copies of the copies. I’ve never actually see one though.
catclub
@d58826:
assuming 23 zeros was intentional, and a penny weighs a few grams, less than one proton. cheapskate
PaulWartenberg
@Roger Moore:
I don’t think Florida State Attorneys are on the ballots. :/