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You are here: Home / Economics / C.R.E.A.M. / Late Night Crankypants Grifters Open Thread: STFU, Sen. Sanders

Late Night Crankypants Grifters Open Thread: STFU, Sen. Sanders

by Anne Laurie|  April 6, 20182:10 am| 86 Comments

This post is in: C.R.E.A.M., I Can No Longer Rationally Discuss The Sanders Campaign, Open Threads, Post-racial America, Assholes, OLD MAN YELLS AT CLOUDS

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Here's Bernie Sanders photo bombing a group of civil rights activists. pic.twitter.com/KM1Tb8UPmp

— Ragnarok Lobster (@eclecticbrotha) April 5, 2018

Sanders, as predicted, has gone full-metal Ron Paul: Now his Travelling WWC Economic Anxiety Tour is solely a tool for separating his cultists from their money. Unfortunately, the Media Village Idiots hate Democrats almost as much as they love Republicans, so they’re a lot more interested in megaphoning St. Bernie’s attacks on our party than they ever were in helping Dr. Ron (or his idiot son Rand) abuse “his” party-of-convenience.

If there was one day this year when the red-rose-in-their-twitter-profiles “Socialist Progressive” manbabies and the women who love them could’ve profited from not insisting that every political statement or action should revolve around them, you’d think the commemoration of MLK Jr’s assassination (by an economically-anxious WWC guy) would’ve been that day.

"He was obviously an extraordinary candidate, brilliant guy. But beyond that reality," Sen. Sanders says, Democrats have lost a record no. of legislative seats.

— Ruby Cramer (@rubycramer) April 5, 2018

Barack Obama is a two term president. Bernie Sanders is a career politician that needed Russia's help to compete in the primaries and still lost by over 4 million votes.

— Ragnarok Lobster (@eclecticbrotha) April 5, 2018

Bernie Sanders dismissing Barack Obama as nothing more than a "charismatic leader" on the 50th anniversary of King's assassination is perhaps the most Bernie Sanders thing Bernie Sanders has ever said.

— Annissa (@IDreamOnDemand) April 5, 2018

And if Senator Sanders couldn’t find a single commemoration in his home state (there are certainly civil rights supporters in Vermont, many of them presumably Sanders voters), surely he could’ve found an appropriate event in the Washington DC area. But the national media attention was in Selma — so to Selma, Bernie rushed!…

Dems have been doing well recently. Just won a SC seat in WI. Does Sanders not listen to the news? https://t.co/hjHrb6XVIn

— Noah Berlatsky (@nberlat) April 5, 2018

Obama and Holder out here fighting gerrymandering which results in distortions between popular vote and representation, while Sanders and the Red Rose brigade use legislative seats lost to bludgeon the establishment.

— D Frederick Sparks (@dfsparks) April 5, 2018


For the record, Barack Obama is quite a bit more than just a charismatic leader. And the past decade saw genuine progress, particularly on healthcare and LGBT rights. The fierce backlash against the Obama era doesn't negate it. And MLK died to make that progress possible.

— Joy Reid (@JoyAnnReid) April 5, 2018

The Day After: When challengd, always double down!

It's unfortunate that some have so degraded our discourse that my recognition of the historical significance of the Obama presidency is attacked. https://t.co/rRc2KVl8Cl

— Bernie Sanders (@BernieSanders) April 5, 2018

He continues to show amazing political instincts. https://t.co/NhBV85XQ4y

— Dana Houle (@DanaHoule) April 5, 2018

Y’all can defend Bernie all you want. On #MLK50 his lack of self awareness and arrogance in dismissing #44, is wild.

Bernie 2020 died 4/4/18. https://t.co/W6gKZ9dUO4

— Bakari Sellers (@Bakari_Sellers) April 5, 2018

Bernie's team says Bakari Sellers (who represents the mainstream Black opinion on Sanders' comments last night) is "sowing racial division." They sound like Brietbart! pic.twitter.com/ZjBTd5Fs4K

— Marcus H. Johnson (@marcushjohnson) April 6, 2018

The thing about Bernie Sanders' problems with black audiences is that they've been apparent for about three years now and he's shown little ability — or desire — to improve https://t.co/BRMmiEToHG

— Astead (@AsteadWesley) April 6, 2018

Judging from this quote after the town hall in Jackson, MS, the answer to the headline question is still no. https://t.co/99Rp9k94Od pic.twitter.com/yVHw7jnf91

— Ragnarok Lobster (@eclecticbrotha) April 6, 2018

He’s not selling to Black audiences; he’s selling to a self-selecting group of white too-pure-for-politics poseurs. And they LIKE it!

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Reader Interactions

86Comments

  1. 1.

    efgoldman

    April 6, 2018 at 2:22 am

    Just go the fuck away, Wilmer.
    I’m going to bed

  2. 2.

    CaseyL

    April 6, 2018 at 2:31 am

    He got a taste of the big time and can’t let go. What a useless appendage.

  3. 3.

    Citizen Alan

    April 6, 2018 at 2:31 am

    I’m profoundly embarrassed that as recently as three years ago, I had admiration for Bernie Sanders and hoped that he would run for president, not to win, but to pull the party to the left. I’m embarrassed that I was completely taken in by him and failed to realize that he was a self-righteous sack of shit who is as big an enemy of the democratic party as anyone in the GOP.

  4. 4.

    Tilda Swintons Bald Cap

    April 6, 2018 at 2:31 am

    He’s gonna fuck up 2020, just watch.

  5. 5.

    Mary G

    April 6, 2018 at 2:34 am

    You aren’t even in the party. Go away.

  6. 6.

    Mnemosyne

    April 6, 2018 at 2:35 am

    All of the love for the recent broadcast of “Jesus Christ Superstar” made me think of one of my favorite Elvis Costello lyrics, which may be apropos here. In the song, the narrator has died and gone to heaven, where he encounters God Himself:

    So there He was on a water-bed
    Drinking a cola of a mystery brand
    Reading an airport novelette
    Listening to Andrew Lloyd Webber’s “Requiem”
    He said, before it had really begun, “I prefer the one about my son
    “I’ve been wading through all this unbelievable junk and
    Wondering if I should have given the world to the monkeys”

    (Since people are sometimes confused, we humans are “the monkeys” in this context, though in concert he and the band often break into a few bars of “I’m A Believer” after that line.)

  7. 7.

    Jay

    April 6, 2018 at 2:40 am

    When Politicians first get elected, a “best before” date should be tattooed on their foreheads.

  8. 8.

    Schlemazel

    April 6, 2018 at 2:45 am

    So I never saw anything. Did Cole ever get his Amazon delivery? Did the sofa get to its rightful home?

    can’t sleep clown will eat me.

  9. 9.

    Yutsano

    April 6, 2018 at 2:48 am

    @Mnemosyne: I’m hoping the usage of the Lloyd Webber “Requiem” isn’t supposed to be disparaging, because it’s an incredible piece of music.

  10. 10.

    Ninedragonspot

    April 6, 2018 at 2:56 am

    So Bernie’s plan for the 2020 primaries once again involves losing all the Southern states and most of the urban centers? Ok, then. Please proceed, Senator.

  11. 11.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    April 6, 2018 at 3:03 am

    @Tilda Swintons Bald Cap: No he won’t, he’s yesterday’s news.

  12. 12.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    April 6, 2018 at 3:05 am

    @Schlemazel:

    can’t sleep clown will eat me.

    So you share Omnes and my concerns.

  13. 13.

    NotMax

    April 6, 2018 at 3:07 am

    (With apologies to Émile Coué.)

    Wilmer: Every day, in every way, more and more irrelevant.

  14. 14.

    David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch

    April 6, 2018 at 3:11 am

    Bernie’s team says Bakari Sellers (who represents the mainstream Black opinion on Sanders’ comments last night) is “sowing racial division.” They sound like Brietbart!

    Blacks are the real racists.

  15. 15.

    David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch

    April 6, 2018 at 3:16 am

    535 members in Congress.

    Why is Wilmer the only ONE to vote against BOTH the Magnitsky Act and the recent sanctions on Russia’s election interference?

    Russian lawyer Magnitsky ‘tortured, beaten to death’ – report

    The law at first blocked 18 Russian government officials and businessmen from entering the United States, froze any assets held by U.S. banks and banned their future use of U.S. banking systems.

    The Magnitsky Act, rather, is about money. It freezes certain Russian officials’ access to the stashes they were keeping in Western banks and real estate and bans their entry to the United States.

    Why would he vote against a law that punishes 18 elites, torturers, murderers, oligarchs, and their bankers?

  16. 16.

    hervevillechaizelounge

    April 6, 2018 at 3:17 am

    Hot take: I know losing weight was probably beneficial to his health but I prefer chubby Al Sharpton.

    In the 90s he was plump and sassy; now he looks somehow…..diminished:(

  17. 17.

    opiejeanne

    April 6, 2018 at 3:21 am

    My initial reaction to Bernie’s comments about President Obama was, “How DARE you, HOW FUCKING DARE YOU!!!”

    My response has not softened since yesterday.

  18. 18.

    NotMax

    April 6, 2018 at 3:22 am

    Were the public marketplace as well equipped as is BJ, all Wilmer would ever be mentioned with or quoted about is pie.

  19. 19.

    opiejeanne

    April 6, 2018 at 3:24 am

    @hervevillechaizelounge: I think part of it is also his age which is now showing a bit more. For a while after Al Roker lost all that weight he looked similar, but he’s a younger man (I think) and now he looks pretty good.

    ETA: Annnd, I’m totally wrong. They are both 63. Some people just don’t age as well as others

  20. 20.

    Mnemosyne

    April 6, 2018 at 3:27 am

    @Yutsano:

    I think He doesn’t really give it a chance since He makes His disparaging comment before it had really begun. And in the next verse, He wanders off and leaves us to ourselves, so I think He’s just tired of humans altogether.

    Costello is a huge fan of all forms of music, so if “Requiem” is really good, it’s probably more of a teasing joke than a slam. I’m not much of a Lloyd Webber fan myself, so I don’t know.

  21. 21.

    NotMax

    April 6, 2018 at 3:29 am

    @opiejeanne

    “It’s not the years, it’s the mileage.”
      – Indiana Jones

    :)

  22. 22.

    Mike in DC

    April 6, 2018 at 3:39 am

    He’s an appearance or three away from decrying “identity politics”, which should be the end of his prospects.

  23. 23.

    cokane

    April 6, 2018 at 3:41 am

    Anne: TEH MEDIA ARE COVERING SANDERS TOO MUCH!!

    Also Anne: HERE’S A POST ENTIRELY ABOUT SANDERS

    goodlord youre a juvenile

  24. 24.

    sukabi

    April 6, 2018 at 3:42 am

    So how many people were trampled so Bernie could get his mugshot?

    That’s a guy that loves the spotlight….even if it isn’t his.

  25. 25.

    cosima

    April 6, 2018 at 3:52 am

    @Citizen Alan: I sent links about this issue to daughter, who, living in VT, still has a bit too much affection for BS, and is surrounded by others who have even more. One of the things that I told her is that he seems determined to damage the Dem party. I was never a fan. I am glad you’ve seen the light.

    What drives this old crank’s drive to damage the Dem party? It’s not his party. Why isn’t he talking about the GOP, current WH occupant(s), the real damage being done by them *today,* and his plans to counteract those things? Does RMIII have a file on him too?

  26. 26.

    Kathleen

    April 6, 2018 at 3:59 am

    @David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch: Because someone is paying him to?

  27. 27.

    mai naem mobile

    April 6, 2018 at 4:00 am

    I don’t even remember what it was about but wasn’t the FBI or FEC or somebody looking into some irregularity of Sanders’ election finances. I thought he has hired some big shot lawyers. I don’t know if I am confusing Jane’s college scandal stuff with Bernie’s election money problem. Anyhow, i don’t want Bernie’s seat to go GOP but I wish this scandal would end his POTUS goals and shut him up.

  28. 28.

    gene108

    April 6, 2018 at 4:08 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA:

    No he won’t, he’s yesterday’s news.

    He has a cult like following of enough people to fuck shit up.

    At some point it became “cool” to not identify with being a Democrat or Republican, and there are a larger than I suspected group of folks to the Left of everything in our society, who feel Bernard is the only one who represents them.

    If he runs in 2020, he will unleash the same kind of division as he did in 2016. Too many people reflexively will not back either major Party, and having a prominent person bash the Democrats reinforces the narrative in their minds that the system and anyone in it are corrupt.

    But because Bernard is an Independent, he is above it all.

    Also, too Bernard spends more time bashing Democrats than Republicans. It seems his mission (maybe marching orders from Putin?) is to ratfuck the Democrats, like he did in 2016.

  29. 29.

    Patricia Kayden

    April 6, 2018 at 4:13 am

    @Tilda Swintons Bald Cap: Not with sensible voters. I don’t think Sanders is as popular as he thinks he is. And his anti-Obama comments won’t help him among the important Black base of the Democratic Party.

  30. 30.

    Patricia Kayden

    April 6, 2018 at 4:16 am

    @David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch: That’s always the accusation. Sanders sounds like he’s playing for the other team.

  31. 31.

    Kathleen

    April 6, 2018 at 4:22 am

    Bitter old white man who writes rape fan fic says what?

  32. 32.

    rikyrah

    April 6, 2018 at 4:36 am

    @Patricia Kayden:
    Uh huh ??

  33. 33.

    rikyrah

    April 6, 2018 at 4:38 am

    You can’t Whitesplain the shyt that Bernie did to Black folks. You simply can’t.

  34. 34.

    rikyrah

    April 6, 2018 at 4:41 am

    @gene108:
    Here’s the thing.
    A serious Democrat is going to do what Hillary failed to do in 2016-treat him the way that Hillary treated Barack Obama in 2008. No kid gloves for Bernie.?

  35. 35.

    TS

    April 6, 2018 at 4:57 am

    @Patricia Kayden:

    And his anti-Obama comments won’t help him among the important Black base of the Democratic Party.

    president Obama also has many white supporters – they are lost to Wilmer as well.

  36. 36.

    sukabi

    April 6, 2018 at 5:03 am

    @rikyrah: I honestly don’t think he’ll make it to the 2020 race, he’s coming up on his expiration date. Don’t think the media will waste much air time on him past the mid-terms. There will be too much else to report on…especially when they’ve already got a shouty old white guy that’s going to be constantly creating havoc and possibly perp walked…

  37. 37.

    Chyron HR

    April 6, 2018 at 5:03 am

    @cokane:

    You have to speak up, it’s hard to hear you when you’re wearing a giant bird costume in remembrance of the time a bird landed near Bernie and thus marked him as Messiah.

  38. 38.

    hervevillechaizelounge

    April 6, 2018 at 5:11 am

    @gene108

    At some point it became “cool” to not identify with being a Democrat or Republican,

    I blame the both-sides bullshit the media is constantly peddling. If both sides do it and the republicans are (inarguably) evil the democrats must evil as well, despite all evidence to the contrary.

    Am I allowed to swear on here? If so, allow me to say that Bernie is going to fuck us in 2020; the act will be lubricated with rubles and Russian bots and egged on by the voracious media much like the bar patrons celebrated Jodie Foster’s rape in The Accused.

    I’m praying his wife goes to the clink for defrauding that Vermont college; I don’t know if an imprisoned missus would cause him to drop out of the presidential race but it might tamp down the media ardor—folks will be a little more interested in his taxes this time around.

  39. 39.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    April 6, 2018 at 5:18 am

    @gene108: The cult is shrinking, I’ve seen it on this very blog.

  40. 40.

    BillinGlendaleCA

    April 6, 2018 at 5:30 am

    @hervevillechaizelounge:

    Am I allowed to swear on here? If so, allow me to say that Bernie is going to fuck us in 2020

    We’ve seen St. Barnard’s playbook, I’m sure that every Democratic candidate has leaned from Sec. Clinton’s mistake. They will hit him hard and hit him often. It also helps that it will more than one.

  41. 41.

    Woodrowfan

    April 6, 2018 at 7:29 am

    @Citizen Alan: you’re not the only one. I strongly leaned towards Sanders when the campaign began, but he wore less and less well. Now I can’t stand the SOB…. (and happily voted for MS. Clinton in the VA primary)

  42. 42.

    Weaselone

    April 6, 2018 at 7:39 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA:
    Yeah. There were plenty of Democrats interested in Bernie because he was economically to the left of Clinton and didn’t have her baggage. I recall, he even had decent support among millennial minorities. He’s steadily been accumulating his own baggage and alieating a good chunk of the people who voted for him last time.

    On top of that, we’re probably going to see a wide open field next time around. Provided Bernie runs in the primary, there’s going to be at least a few lower profile candidates looking to drink Bernie’s economic populist milk shake, plus 1 or more contenders who will be out to freeze and nail his jello to the wall.

  43. 43.

    Aimai

    April 6, 2018 at 8:02 am

    @sukabi: wrong. All their time will be wasted in him!

  44. 44.

    msdc

    April 6, 2018 at 8:24 am

    @Ninedragonspot: Yes, but will he then refuse to concede and encourage his followers (both real and bot) to sabotage the Democratic nominee?

    We can’t let this guy hang around next time. Some candidate needs to nuke him from orbit – it’s the only way to be sure.

  45. 45.

    FlipYrWhig

    April 6, 2018 at 8:25 am

    For Donald Trump it’s always 1985. For Bernie Sanders it’s always either 1966 or 1996. At this point he reminds me of one of these persistent-verging-on-lifelong cranks like the Time Cube guy, devoted to proclaiming his own superior intelligence, spraying a cockamamie Theory of Everything in all directions, and dismissing all skeptics as the jealous Establishment trying to silence him.

  46. 46.

    kindness

    April 6, 2018 at 8:42 am

    Bernie, show us your taxes before you think you can run again.

  47. 47.

    No Drought No More

    April 6, 2018 at 8:54 am

    At least Bernie opposed the Bush-Cheney plot to war. Unlike Hillary, who took counsel of her own perverted ambition and dismissed her support of the Big Lie War a simple “mistake” as recently as 2016 (and pshaw, everyone makes mistakes). Hundreds of thousands of dead, god knows how many billions of U.S. tax dollars flushed down the toilet AND into the pockets of the kleptomaniacs that ginned it up, but Bernie is annoying, and after all, isn’t that what counts?

  48. 48.

    Josie

    April 6, 2018 at 9:03 am

    Bernie was and is destructive to the Democratic party, and bringing up Hillary’s past mistakes in no way negates that.

  49. 49.

    artem1s

    April 6, 2018 at 9:23 am

    Unfortunately the grift of Ron Paul will be with us as long as political operatives can make money running for office. Until we have radical changes in FEC legislation we are doomed to have these idiots running around grifting off of the gullible and enraged mob. If Bernie really cared about the WWC he would be advocating for universal funding of election campaigns, mandatory free media ad buys for all candidates, and limits on spending on election campaigns. Al long as their is an endless pot of Koch and Mercer money to draw from, the grifters will come.

    go away Wilmer. And take fucking Dennis Kucinich with you.

  50. 50.

    Ksmiami

    April 6, 2018 at 9:24 am

    @No Drought No More: Bernie is toxic poison and an ego maniac- oh and he has accomplished exactly nothing for progressive causes so you can shut the fuck up now

  51. 51.

    artem1s

    April 6, 2018 at 9:28 am

    @Weaselone:

    He’s steadily been accumulating his own baggage

    Um, no. He has always had baggage. The media just ignored it because EMAILS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!911!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    JEB’s opposition manual on him was 2 feet thick.

  52. 52.

    AnneWith

    April 6, 2018 at 9:28 am

    @hervevillechaizelounge:

    Am I allowed to swear on here?

    Allowed? It’s practically required.

  53. 53.

    Mnemosyne

    April 6, 2018 at 9:59 am

    @No Drought No More:

    Ah, yes, the anti-war “progressives” who helped Bush get a second term and who helped elect Trump because punishing Democrats was more important than actually ending the war.

    Your actions killed hundreds of thousands of people in the Middle East. Your decision that it was more important to punish John Kerry than it was to end the war did that.

    Your decision to punish Hillary Clinton and help Trump get elected means that the Russians and Syrians are murdering civilians even as we speak.

    You did this. You decided that your hurt feelings were more important than people’s lives. Go fuck yourself.

  54. 54.

    EmbraceYourInnerCrone

    April 6, 2018 at 10:05 am

    Bernie may (supposedly) be to the left of Hillary but whenever he is asked just HOW any of his pie-in-the-sky proposals are going to be funded or the details of how they would work, he just pivots. Single payer was attempted in Vermont and failed because they didn’t have a good roadmap and realistic goals set out before hand(nor a good grasp on where the money for everything was going to come from)

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/theapothecary/2014/12/21/6-reasons-why-vermonts-single-payer-health-plan-was-doomed-from-the-start/#763eaa5f4850

    Bernie is great on slogans, and saying the other candidate is “too centrist” but never has any actual plan for how his proposals will get done. Because putting together a detailed plan is boring and unsexy don’t ya know, and it doesn’t fit on bumper sticker. FSM forbid we have people in Government who actually want to do the hard work of actually governing and understand that sometimes you go with the health care bill (Obamacare/ACA) you can get passed not the one you wanted.

  55. 55.

    kindness

    April 6, 2018 at 10:15 am

    @No Drought No More: Buddy if you want to suck Bernie’s dick that badly you should go over to Raw Story and read their take on it. Almost 500 comments and they are still all in on Bernie. Another shake my head moment.

  56. 56.

    Frankensteinbeck

    April 6, 2018 at 10:21 am

    @Mnemosyne:
    Thank you. This is a wise and correct response and I will remember it when I hear that bullshit argument again.

  57. 57.

    RandomMonster

    April 6, 2018 at 10:24 am

    Ralph Nader 2016 said what?

  58. 58.

    Barney

    April 6, 2018 at 10:28 am

    So, Sanders says that some people can’t see past how great Obama was to notice that over 15 years, Democrats have lost power at the state level, and people say he’s attacking Obama – and try to make it a “black v. white” thing. Never mind that the failures at state level are frequently discussed by all kinds of other Democratic supporters, eg here.

    He goes on to denounce the Republicans as the party of billionaires attacking the working class, and people moan that he attack the Democrats more than the Republicans.

    He then says “get out the vote!” is the important thing, and says recent Democratic success looks promising, and people say it’s all just him getting ready for 2020. Never mind that the main political tactic espoused by this blog is “get out the vote”.

    It’s as if half of Balloon Juice just needs Sanders as a unifying hate figure, and will do so whatever he says.

  59. 59.

    J R in WV

    April 6, 2018 at 10:48 am

    @No Drought No More:

    So:

    At least Bernie opposed the Bush-Cheney plot to war. Unlike Hillary, who took counsel of her own perverted ambition and dismissed her support of the Big Lie War a simple “mistake” as recently as 2016 (and pshaw, everyone makes mistakes). Hundreds of thousands of dead, god knows how many billions of U.S. tax dollars flushed down the toilet AND into the pockets of the kleptomaniacs that ginned it up, but Bernie is annoying, and after all, isn’t that what counts?

    Now help me out here. Are you telling me that as of today you would still vote for Sanders over Clinton in a Dem primary, were that historic set of primaries to be held going forward? Because Clinton voted aye on an Authorization of use Military Force? Because Bush used that AUMF to start a war on false grounds?

    Three questions between you continuing to comment purposefully to this blog and commenting on pie. I need a facts based explanation of your comment… wait a minute. I’ve read it again, and I don’t want any answers from you, you’re gone right now, pie expert!!

  60. 60.

    Cacti

    April 6, 2018 at 10:48 am

    @BillinGlendaleCA:

    We’ve seen St. Barnard’s playbook, I’m sure that every Democratic candidate has leaned from Sec. Clinton’s mistake. They will hit him hard and hit him often. It also helps that it will more than one.

    Yep. No kid gloves for Bernie in 2020.

  61. 61.

    J R in WV

    April 6, 2018 at 10:57 am

    @Barney:

    Seems like whenever Senator Sanders is in the news, we get brand new commenters kissing his ass. Which gives me another chance to test the Cleek/Major^4 pie filter.

  62. 62.

    schrodingers_cat

    April 6, 2018 at 11:00 am

    @J R in WV: He is the other half of the Barnum and Bailey duo.

  63. 63.

    Mnemosyne

    April 6, 2018 at 11:13 am

    @Barney:

    So, Sanders says at an event memorializing the 50th anniversary of Rev. Martin Luther King Jr.’s murder that some people can’t see past how great Obama was …

    Imma stop you there, because you gave yourself away by leaving out the context of why people are pissed at Bernie.

    It was inappropriate for him to use the occasion of the 50th anniversary of MLK’s murder to bash our first Black president and Democrats generally. He made his speech all about himself and his personal hobbyhorses rather than talking about the man and the movement that was being commemorated.

  64. 64.

    randy khan

    April 6, 2018 at 11:23 am

    @Barney:

    So, Sanders says that some people can’t see past how great Obama was to notice that over 15 years, Democrats have lost power at the state level, and people say he’s attacking Obama – and try to make it a “black v. white” thing. Never mind that the failures at state level are frequently discussed by all kinds of other Democratic supporters, eg here.

    There are a bunch of issues here. Bernie used the phrase “charismatic leader,” which has a certain tinge of describing black basketball stars as “athletic” (that is, in both cases, not actually smart about what they do, but just luckily possessed of certain gifts). By itself, that’s not great, particularly from someone who has had issues in connecting with people of color in the past, but it’s also not awful. And it’s worth noting that describing Obama as “charismatic” and nothing else does in fact imply that he wasn’t particularly great, since defining him by his charisma suggests that’s all he had. However, what really is awful is doubling down by complaining that “some have so degraded our discourse” that they don’t get what he meant. It means that he doesn’t understand the criticism and isn’t going to try to do so.

    I certainly don’t disagree with the point that the Dems have had a lot of trouble at the levels below the Presidency over the last 15 years, but the specific framing that Sanders used seems intended to say that people loved Obama but he really wasn’t a good leader. That’s more than a little problematic, particularly as something to say at a commemoration of another black leader’s life.

  65. 65.

    gwangung

    April 6, 2018 at 11:26 am

    @Barney:
    A) He’s not a good administrator; his campaigns did a poor job of keeping track of campaign contributions
    B) He’s not very flexible; pivoting to meet current events was not a strong point of his campaign
    C) His personnel picks aren’t very ethical; see the hack of Clinton’s data…and then there’s his wife….
    D) He’s just not very good in supporting down ticket candidates and helping them get elected.

    His admirable goals do not overcome his considerable weaknesses as a leader and administrators.

    Not sure why this is even an issue and why he’s continually being propped up.

  66. 66.

    Barney

    April 6, 2018 at 11:35 am

    @Mnemosyne: At an event titled “Examining Economic Justice 50 Years Later”, he replied to this question: “We saw a surge in millennials with you. How are you harnessing that energy to engage and sustain millennials in Jackson, Mississippi and how are you doing the same to reimagine the Democratic party?”. But he didn’t bash Obama, he praised him. This is the problem – you just assume he ‘bashed’ Obama because that’s a kneejerk reaction for a section of Democrats.

    @J R in WV: Not sure how long I’ve been commenting here, but I took a guess that I was in 2014, and I’m right:

    https://balloon-juice.com/2014/03/08/putin/

    Does 4 years still make me a brand new commenter?

  67. 67.

    JAFD

    April 6, 2018 at 11:42 am

    Speaking as one of the ‘Get Clean For Gene’ brigade back in ’68:
    We – parties and country – need candidates who will run quixhotic campaigns against overwhelming odds.
    This takes a LOT of ego and conviction, among other qualities.
    Often they will find that very few agree with them, sometimes they will find themselves the spokesperson for many, and set off a tectonic shift in the political landscape.
    BUT – they rarely have the qualities needed to organize their followers, to maneuver within a party structure, to get their faction nominated and elected to the ‘bottom of the ticket’ offices. This combination is rare in humankind, and those who have it – or who can form a team that can combine them – often gets into the history books.

  68. 68.

    Barney

    April 6, 2018 at 11:59 am

    @randy khan: He didn’t call him a ‘charismatic leader’, and he didn’t say ‘charismatic’ and nothing else. He said “there was a charismatic individual named Barack Obama who won the presidency in 2008 and 2012. He was obviously an extraordinary candidate, brilliant guy.”

    @gwangung: Your criticisms are all valid. I’m not saying he’s a good future presidential candidate. I’m saying Balloon Juice sucks when it holds Two Minute Hates of Democratic allies, and it makes me fear the 2018 elections are going to be a damp squib, because attitudes like those in this thread will ruin campaign supporters’ chances of working together.

  69. 69.

    gwangung

    April 6, 2018 at 12:00 pm

    This is the problem – you just assume he ‘bashed’ Obama because that’s a kneejerk reaction for a section of Democrats.

    I think you are being obtuse. And you’re still ignoring the context.

    As well, that section of Democrats includes a very large segment of the African American population. That is a political fact.

    That’s not their problem; that’s Sanders’ problem…which he refuses to deal with.

  70. 70.

    kindness

    April 6, 2018 at 12:35 pm

    Some people refuse to learn the sad lessons of the 2016 campaign and insist the issues were all Hillary was a bad candidate. Hillary did make some mistakes. But she was actually a very good candidate who had an excellent platform but could not overcome an MSM that took the Russian troll bait hook line and sinker. Something all too many BernieBros did as well with far too much gusto for my liking. And let’s be clear about this: Bernie knew. Bernie knew Russian trolls were rat-fucking the Democratic party and Bernie kept it up. Bernie is not the paragon of virtue some people still claim he is.

  71. 71.

    Mnemosyne

    April 6, 2018 at 12:47 pm

    @Barney:

    But he didn’t bash Obama, he praised him.

    If you count damning someone with faint praise as “praise,” then sure. But people without their Bernie blinders on don’t actually count that as “praise.”

    And anyone who blames the Democrats for those lost seats more than they blame voter ID laws, Citizens United, and the gutting of the VRA is selling you something, and it ain’t Democratic unity.

    Take a look at the maps at the Brennan Center. Those lost states just happen to line up perfectly with the states that use voter ID laws to suppress Democratic voters. A total co-inkydink, I’m sure.

  72. 72.

    Mnemosyne

    April 6, 2018 at 12:49 pm

    @gwangung:

    Not sure why this is even an issue and why he’s continually being propped up.

    You know why. As rikyrah keeps reminding us, the curve for mediocre white men is real.

  73. 73.

    Mnemosyne

    April 6, 2018 at 12:53 pm

    @Barney:

    Again:

    “He was obviously an extraordinary candidate, brilliant guy.”

    This is Bernie saying that Obama was a good candidate and a bad president. Saying this to a predominantly Black audience at an event commemorating MLK’s murder is not going to endear him to Black voters, who are the actual backbone of the Democratic Party, not a guy who isn’t even a goddamned Democrat.

  74. 74.

    afanasia

    April 6, 2018 at 12:59 pm

    @Mnemosyne: Amen

  75. 75.

    father pusbucket

    April 6, 2018 at 1:31 pm

    “The business model, if you like, of the Democratic Party for the last 15 years or so has been a failure.”

    “And I alone can fix it.”

  76. 76.

    feckless

    April 6, 2018 at 1:41 pm

    If Barack Obama was such a great president, why is tRump and the GOP in control of EVERY branch of the federal government and the vast majority of the state legislatures & governors? Just because his opponents were unreasonable racists does not excuse Obama from having no apparent plan to deal with that backlash, which was predictable and Predicted, and much like actually campaining for Hillary, or actually doing something about the supreme court, Obama was cool, did nothing, and malpracticed us.

    Obama had to be dragged into LGBTQ rights, and it was the court, not the executive that cinched it. Please tell me how are black people better off than they were in 2007?

    Try to deny reality and hide behind false accusations of racism, Obama’s naivete and hubris laid the ground work for tRump’s rise, PERIOD. And it empowered the enemies of MLK’s cause.

    Bernie actually marched with MLK in the 60s, unlike super H who was still a Goldwater supporter. -Bernie’s family died in the Nazi death camps. Does that make the criticisms of him above automatically anti-semitic like a rational evaluation of Obama’s failed presidency makes a person a racist?

    MLK could and did evaluate civil rights progress with a critical eye. The “leaders” above (and Anne Laurie) would rather live in a fantasy world that delegitimizes any criticism as racist.

    The democratic party is an absolute objective disaster, and a few meaningless elections don’t change that.

    **Way to do Putin’s work for him by insinuating that Sanders knowingly conspired with a foreign power. The orwellian cry for unity as you ampify attacks on 48% of the party is stunning.

  77. 77.

    Psych1

    April 6, 2018 at 2:05 pm

    @Barney: Correct. Half this blog has their head so far up Hillery’s ass they can’t see straight.

    They are the ones hurting the Democratic chances 2018.

  78. 78.

    Chris Johnson

    April 6, 2018 at 2:28 pm

    @Barney:

    Does 4 years still make me a brand new commenter?

    Yup. Try 12 years ;)

    Also, settle down. You’re perfectly correct that a bunch of Balloon Juice posters flip out at the very thought of the Senator from Vermont, but the demographic here is very old and very plugged in to the Democratic establishment. These are the people who’ve kept the Democrats going in these years of decline, they’ve kept the lights on when little more could be done, and they don’t like being lectured by upstarts or carpetbaggers. I’m quite sympathetic to ‘Wilmer’s message but he is just another politician and they’re all corrupt (and all millionaires, it seems, including him: which explains why he can’t show his taxes, bad for the image)

    Somebody younger needs to take up the mantle, but not Bernie. He’s done. He was already old in 2016, and he is neither as charismatic nor as honest as Obama. And Obama took exactly the same shellacking from traditional Dem Hillary stans: look at Balloon Juice from ten years ago and you’ll see a completely different perspective. Obama won and became President, so he’s exempt from the kind of behavior you’re complaining about. If he’d lost the Presidency, you’d see exactly the same vitriol against him on this blog.

  79. 79.

    Kathleen

    April 6, 2018 at 3:08 pm

    @feckless: Putin paying triple time troll?

  80. 80.

    gorram

    April 6, 2018 at 3:13 pm

    @feckless: “If Barack Obama was such a great president, why is tRump and the GOP in control of EVERY branch of the federal government”

    Why didn’t the Magical Negro save us? And also, how dare the Blacks fall for the obvious lie that we’re racists?

  81. 81.

    ruemara

    April 6, 2018 at 5:22 pm

    @Barney: Heh. I’m black. I know a solid “You’re so articulate” when I hear one. And, obligatory fuck you for bending into pretzels when if that was a Republican, you’d be calling out that dog whistle.

    @Psych1: And fuck you,

    @feckless: too.Triple fuck you for that Bernie marched with MLK LIE. Bernie attended the speech in Washington. He had nothing to do with the civil rights heroes of the era. As for the rest of your bullshit, yeah, fuck your stupidity. That you guys dismiss the importance of the ACA & the DOJ is fucking telling, you giant sack of fetid compost.

  82. 82.

    Mnemosyne

    April 6, 2018 at 5:23 pm

    @feckless:

    After the 2010 election, state lawmakers nationwide started introducing hundreds of harsh measures making it harder to vote. The new laws range from strict photo ID requirements to early voting cutbacks to registration restrictions.

    Educate yourself, white boy. You’ve been lied to. The people who told you the Democrats are to blame for everything lied to you.

    Haven’t you ever wondered why Bernie used 20 years of Hillary’s public tax returns to bash her but refused to ever release his own? What does he have to hide?

  83. 83.

    Mnemosyne

    April 6, 2018 at 5:35 pm

    @ruemara:

    Jared Kushner’s grandparents escaped the Holocaust while much of the rest of their family died. I guess his actions are also above reproach, amirite? ?

  84. 84.

    LongHairedWeirdo

    April 6, 2018 at 5:58 pm

    I don’t know Bernie’s history, but I do recall hearing that one of his phone bankers said that, when calling a black Hillary voter, to bring up welfare – Bernie was much better on welfare. Tone deaf, and clueless… and for an old guy, I feel sympathy that he might be trying, and just doesn’t get what he’s doing that’s wrong. I felt the same way for Ross Perot, who tried saying “when economic times are bad ‘you people’ (African Americans) get it worst”. That’s a fairly true statement; civil rights progress is best when there’s plenty of good jobs and good money flow out there. But there was pretty harsh blowback. (Please note: I’m not suggesting that these gentlemen were treated unfairly – my sympathy is more like, I’ve been in situations where everything I said was wrong and I didn’t know why, and that really sucks.)

    For all my sympathy, though – Perot or Sanders could ask advisors “why am I blowing this so badly?” and find there are plenty of people willing to explain and help, and likely make them better _people_ (not just better candidates).

  85. 85.

    David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch

    April 6, 2018 at 9:40 pm

    I see Яussian bots (Wilmer Division) really hit this thread.

  86. 86.

    cleosmom

    April 7, 2018 at 10:32 am

    @Kathleen:

    Putin paying triple time troll?

    Just a garden-variety dick cheese is my impression.

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