Why Trump has struggled to assemble a legal team https://t.co/yEqpMnhSuF via @BostonGlobe
— Zeke Miller (@ZekeJMiller) April 21, 2018
… Except for the other losers! Donald Trump and Rudy Giuliani represent everything Boston most loathes about NYC. So it’s not surprising the Boston Globe was happy to share:
… [T]he lure of representing the most powerful man in the world isn’t appealing to this generation’s cadre of top white-collar criminal defense attorneys: Twelve partners from a total of seven firms have said no to President Trump’s entreaties to help him navigate the special counsel’s probe into Russian meddling in the 2016 election.
Being turned down time and again led Trump to pick former New York mayor Rudy Giuliani this week, turning to a former presidential candidate and one-time US attorney who was known for his at times imprecise but often effective advocacy of Trump on the campaign trail in 2016. Trump also brought on board a relatively obscure husband-and-wife team of former federal prosecutors with a white-collar criminal defense practice in South Florida.
It’s hard to call it a dream team.
“Rudy Giuliani has always been available,” said Roger Cossack, a former California prosecutor and legal analyst on TV. “Hiring Rudy Giuliani only underlines Trump’s dilemma in finding a lawyer who will work for him.”…
“What we’re seeing with President Trump is really unprecedented,” said Timothy Naftali, a historian and former director of the Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum. During the depths of Watergate, Nixon had a squadron of high-power lawyers to walk him through the process. “Nixon’s problem was that he wasn’t honest with his lawyers. And he didn’t really allow them to defend him,” he said…
Lawyers who’ve watched firms turn him down say it’s a combination of factors. There’s Trump’s reputation as a very difficult client who will undercut, change his mind, and publicly humiliate. Managing partners at top firms also fear Trump is so polarizing that their practice would lose clients and talent if they’re associated with him.
“Everyone who becomes associated with Trump becomes diminished,” explained one leading white-collar crime expert, who didn’t want to be named for fear of offending the president. “You come out with less of a reputation.”…
Another institutional worry at large firms is that Trump tends to ignore advice, even if it’s the best that money can buy. Some point to the president’s long history of civil litigation as a New York real estate developer and a casino owner, which gives Trump the confidence that he can be his own lawyer…
Firms also are worried that representing Trump could hurt recruitment of the best students coming out of law schools, particularly women, Bennett said…
(Also, he’s a notorious deadbeat.)
Much more, including a list of refuseniks, at the link.
Yeah, no. The fucker’s a traitor. If it were doubtful, sure sure, he deserves the best lawyers. There’s no fucking doubt. You don’t get representation when your goal is to rip down the entire system.
Nice weekend so far. My cousin’s daughter had her Bat Mitzvah today. After the dinner, they finally broke out the greatest hits of the 1980’s towards the end, which finally got the adults/parents on the dance floor.
I have a real problem understanding why he can;t assemble the best team that Putin could buy… or is it that maybe there are simply not enough shysters willing to get on the Russian Mob money train that wouldn’t make matters even worse? Surely there is some firm somewhere that needs to be co-opted that is currently clean?
He does deserve the best counsel that he can get. Which is exactly why so many are turning him down.
Look at the people that are willing to work for him. Are any of them worth spit? The answer of course is no, they aren’t. Why would any lawyer in their right minds want to work for this assclown? Their reputations will be destroyed for years, possibly for ever. Would you want that when your reputation and skill makes you a rather comfortable living? He signed his pal, and a couple of unknowns. That’s as good a counsel as he deserves, probably much better than he deserves. And that ain’t saying much.
? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?
Any takers on what country this is?
Check out Michael Avenatti’s CV… he’s beaten the NFL in court. He worked extensively with members of The Eagles. He is a professional race car driver. I think he is the real-life “Most Interesting Man In The World”.
Between him and Mueller… Trump is fucked.
@Chet Murthy: If I were feeling less cynical tonight, I’d stand up for the rule of law and the Sixth Amendment and all that.
I’m feeling very cynical tonight.
What incentive is there for a top lawyer to say yes to Trump? There’s not much prestige in it, unlike when previous Presidents have had legal issues. Trump’s a …difficult person to work with, especially when you’re going to have to tell him things that he doesn’t want to hear. And he’s famous for not paying his bills.
Anybody who had a choice in the matter who wasn’t a Grade A wingnut taking one for the team would running screaming in the opposite direction.
Yeah, I have to say that he really is a fascinating guy. Seems pretty smart, has great presence, shows a sense of humor and, from what I’ve seen and read about him, is a good lawyer. If I was in trouble or had a legal issue, I’d sure hope my lawyer was like him. Stormy hit the jackpot in hiring him. And so did he. He’s your next superstar lawyer.
@r€nato: “He worked extensively with members of The Eagles.” Nothing to be proud of.
I suspect this is more important than they are willing to admit.
But this from Corallo is bullshit about democrats “’throwing temper tantrums’ and blocking efforts to represent Trump.”
The partners who may be democrats and may be blocking taking Trump are rightly looking out for the wellbeing of the firm. As an earlier quote so accurately puts it,
Rick Wilson would say it’s the ETTD problem: Everything Trump Touches Dies. What top-flight law firm wants to risk that?
Sprinkled onto the orange shit sherbet sundae of Trump are his reputation for being a bad payer. And, as was pointed out repeatedly, he doesn’t take the advice of the lawyers, even as they bill him (or more likely the RNC or whoever is ponying up now) $1000/hr (or more?). Who wants that? He’d be an absolutely awful client.
And as long as black and brown people get 15 seconds of a public defender’s time to file plea bargains, I’ll take a very hard pass on this sanctimony: “We have a longstanding tradition in American law that everybody deserves the best counsel they can get.” Hah.
@geg6: He’s your next superstar lawyer.
The sooner he can eclipse Dershowitz, the better.
I don’t think he has any real money, and that’s why he’s doing the penny ante stuff like charging the Secret Service for golf carts, etc. Any good lawyer probably knows what he has and doesn’t have too.
I heard Giuliani is working pro bono on this case. I assume he knows Trump will stiff him and so wants to get that out of the way up front.
@justawriter: You get what you pay for…
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@piratedan: Sure Ghoulian, but that’s not going to help Trump. It’s very simple. good lawyers want to win and Trump will certainly undermine and case them make.
None that can afford the fact that Trump won’t pay. And he’ll ignore their advice, and badmouth them on Twitter.
Any decent law firm has certainly gone in with the “this is what needs to be in escrow before we come back”. Nobody has come back after the initial interview.
I assume Avenatti knows what he is doing, though his media theatrics make me uncomfortable. On the other hand, he did offer a settlement early on that would have basically ended the whole thing. So, I think he’s enjoying it a little too much too soon, but the Trumpsters gave him the go ahead when they turned down a cheap exit.
But, so far it’s all good because I saw a clip of Avenatti trying, fairly succesdfully, to not laugh in a Trumpster lawyer’s face during a joint news show appearance, and that was fun. Guy has more self discipline than I do.
I read that Guliani hasn’t done any litigation in 29 years. I guess that means he’s rested and ready.
You clearly have no idea what Avenatti is doing here. That “settlement” offer was fool’s gold. He was praying they were stupid enough to take it. And laughed his ass off all the way to the microphone when they did not.
? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?
Why does everybody hate the Eagles and Don Henley? I think some of their stuff is good
Hard to believe he’s tanned though, sleeping in that coffin for 29yr.
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?: Don Henley Must Die!
Fly, Eagles Fly!
He’ll be 74 next month. All the stamina that pro bono can buy.
I wonder how many of those were curtesy interviews?
I don’t think he has any real money either but the penny ante stuff? That’s just him being his cheap ass self. He may think big but he doesn’t think well. Everything is shinny and cheap, the gold was spray paint.
Major Major Major Major
In Haneda airport, boarding in an hour for a 9-hour redeye(?) to SFO, after which I will attempt to work from home.
Another thing I will miss is Coca-Cola Plus, which as far as I can tell is Coke Zero with five grams of dietary fiber.
@justawriter: Re Ghouliani working for free – wasn’t that Manafort’s in as well?
Gotta wonder if Rudy is not being paid cash, what he wants on the down low.
Damn it. Fired up KSP and my space station around Kerbin is missing, while the one around the Mun is fine. Think it’s because my fix to crash on launch is to uninstall Stockalike Station Parts Expansion Redux, start KSP without loading a game, exit, reinstall it and play as normal. Think I screwed up once and loaded a game while Station Parts wasn’t installed.
It would be nice if ships/landers/stations would retain their names/icons after docking.
@Major Major Major Major:
Probably helpful in a population that’s older.
Major Major Major Major
@Mike J: aw no, that sucks!
This generation’s cadre of top white-collar-criminal defense attorneys, on the other hand…
I know I’m not the first to say it, but lawyers like getting paid and Donny’s not a safe bet there.
@Major Major Major Major: They’ve got that out here – it’s just hard to find.
I’m going to Vegas for a company convention this week. It’s going to be a lot less interesting than Japan, that’s for sure. :P
Major Major Major Major
@?BillinGlendaleCA: yep, and also the Japanese diet is not a fiber-rich one anyway.
@MisterForkbeard: they’ve got many Japanese products in the states, but not at every corner store. Or did they recently release a non Japanese version?
Avenatti practices in Los Angeles, pays to be media savvy there.
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?:
They should Get Over It.
@Major Major Major Major: I’m pretty sure I’ve seen that in a San Mateo area non-japanese store, but I can’t remember which one.
If I remember I’ll shoot you a mail or something.
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?:
I don’t hate The Eagles.
Major Major Major Major
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?: @Doug R: I blame The Big Lebowski.
@MisterForkbeard: I dunno, do I really want to go to San Mateo? ??
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?:
Because they sound like they need to take a little blue pill to maintain an erection.
No offense intended.
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?: They killed Joe Walsh and turned his corpse into something that has zero relation to his James Gang days. Or even his early solo days.
I like the Eagles. They just won a Super Bowl and a lot of people I know were pretty fucking happy.
Speaking of happy.
Building a piece of art from a scrap yard in Eureka that ends up in the Smithsonian aint bad.
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?: because they stole ‘Hotel California’ from Jethro Tull?
@Major Major Major Major
So, soda with added sawdust.
@HumboldtBlue: And a tip of the top hat to Hobart who kicked things into gear.
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?:
Not everybody does.
I think Desperado is a work of genius, and play it as often as I play anything.
But de gustibus.
Arguments about matters of taste are utterly pointless.
As for Bouffant, and similarly for Loomis at LGM, my advice is to remember the Dutchess’s line from Alice
He only does it to annoy, because he knows it teases
and to thus ignore the trolling provocation.
Villago Delenda Est
Donald doesn’t listen
Donald doesn’t pay
Donald wrecks your reputation.
He’s King Midas in Reverse.
@Villago Delenda Est:
aka, Shit Midas.
@M. Bouffant: Members of The Eagles mostly sue other members of The Eagles. I didn’t check to see which assholes he has worked with, but I would guess Henley and Frey.
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?: I think some of their stuff is great. That said, Henley and Frey had a decades long history of being narcissistic, selfish dicks.
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?: I agree. I think pretty much all of their stuff is good. Including Hotel California, as overplayed as it is now.
Doolin-Dalton and Bitter Creek too.
@Major Major Major Major: Last redeye I took (and maybe the last ever) from LAX to BWI had a 2 hour layover at Dulles. I could have driven home in that two hours. Got a little shuteye at the gate, even though they design the seating to make it impossible.
Donald: You’ll do it?
Rudy: No. But I won’t talk unless the deposits stop.
Donald: It’s pro bono. Or I turn you in.
Rudy: Try it. I’m leaving the country.
Donald: One payment, from Turkey. And you tell someone Mueller wants to negotiate.
Rudy: I’ll wear that dress again.
Donald: Say you respect me.
Rudy: Don’t worry so much.
Donald: I can’t sleep.
Rudy: I want someone fired.
Donald: How come?
Rudy: Ratted me out freshman year.
Donald: What else.
Rudy: Those contracts have to go to my guys.
Donald: But I already–
Rudy: Cancel it. Your guy got caught cheating vets.
Donald: You’ll tell Fox that?
Rudy: I was on right before you got here.
Donald: So we have a deal?
Rudy: Don’t ever try to fuck with me, Don.
Tilda Swintons Bald Cap
So Trump and Guiliani can talk about the FBI NY office under cover of attorney client privilege. The office that just raided Cohen and has some of Rudy’s buddies.
I’ve seen the Eagles live 4 times, the first, when they were young and lively and a little ragged,, good players, good harmony, neat songs. When they signed with Irving Azoff, they shit canned Felder added Walsh, the reason? Azoff wanted them to rock more so they could fill big venues. Over the last 40 years they’ve gotten slick,, smooth, never break a sweat, highly competent musicians. They do it for the money, Joe Walsh included. There’s a video on Youtube of them backing Linda Ronstadt doing “Silver Threads and Golden Needles” from the early 70’s, that band is the Eagles I like.
@Jager: Bernie Leadon and Randy Meisner were the 2 replaced with Walsh and Tim Schmidt in the first big shakeup. The original 5 Eagles had an equal partnership, and Frey/Henley felt by that time that they were the main draw and should get most of the profits. Walsh and Schmidt have always been contract players rather than equal members of the band. Meissner seems happy to have faded into obscurity, while Leadon sued as part of a long-running dispute. Leadon was thr biggest country influence in that pre-Azoff Eagles, and subbing Walsh in for him is why the sound changed before Hotel California. Felder is apparently a musical genius who can play anything.
Then Frey and Henley had a falling-out that lasted more than a decade, and when they returned they only allowed Felder to rejoin as a contract player too, signing away his rights to an equal share, something he too later sued to get back. Given Avenatti’s age, that is the lawsuit I am guessing he was involved in.
@? ?? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ? ?: I despise their limp-dicked whiny music. Also this.
@Shalimar: It’s late, too much Jack tonight and I was trying to do the history off the top of my head, thanks….I did like the original band a lot.
@joel hanes: No, I really & truly despise their product. Even if they were the greatest human beings in the world, those gawd-awful harmonies & mid-tempo slog are music for squares. They’re the personification of everything that sucked about music & the music biz in the ’70s, & my hate is so pure & unadulterated it exists to this day.
Suzanne explains it well: “… sound like they need to take a little blue pill to maintain an erection.”
It seems fair to me: Trump is notorious for not listening to his lawyers, and not paying them. So now, third-raters and grifters are the best counsel he can get, and it serves him right.
Adam might have something to say about this later on: a Palestinian man, Fadi al-Batsh, was killed in a drive-by shooting in KL. Al-batsh, a resident of Malaysia for the past eight years, taught electrical engineering at the private-sector University of KL, and was an imam at a local mosque. He was on his way to the mosque for prayers Saturday morning when two white men on a motorcycle shot at him. Hamas has said he was a key member of the group, although there seems to be no public information on his precise role. Hamas and al-Batsh’s family accuse Mossad of carrying out the murder. Malaysia has diplomatic relations with Palestine, whose Ambassador issued a statement, but not Israel.
Nice dialog. My guess: Giulani is thinking “If they indicted two of Trump’s attorneys in a row, it would look like concerted persecution, so they wont’ do that, and my safest place is as Trump’s attorney.”
Even if Trump could/would pay I don’t see why any top-tier firm would take the case.
He’ll ignore all advice and when things subsequently go badly he’ll be on Twitter and Fox blasting his counsel, never mentioning he did everything they expressly told him not to do.
And if by some miracle things go well he’ll take all the credit; I did it all myself, he’ll lie, and the try to cheat the firm out of payment like they’re a Mom and Pop commercial laundry.
Ghouliani is up to his undead neck in Russia ties so I understand why he signed on; but can you imagine how desperate for attention that husband and wife team must be?
Comment repeated in the next thread. Link to Guardian story is there.
When the scandal gets slow, Putin has one of his own people admit something to the press. He doesn’t support Trump, he supports illegitimizing US politics so he has a better negotiating position internationally. And apparently “The US is just as corrupt as us!” is a big talking point in Russia. He’s doing a damn fine job of it.
@Tilda Swintons Bald Cap:
Different FBI office. They’re just both in New York.
Changes to the Hotel California, Made in Response to Mr. Henley’s Recent Complaint
The only unique thing about Deadbeat Donald is that he can afford a lot better than he is ending up with.
@hervevillechaizelounge: I think you nailed some of the important reasons and here are a few more;
Ego – these top lawyers will hate being ignored or treated like errand boys and idiots. Both privately and publicly.
Losing – the case is a loser, Trump is a loser, and they will hate to be involved in a losing scenario. Especially as they will be identified with this case for awhile which could cost them a lot of business and potential employees.
@Chet Murthy: the best they deserve…
@r€nato: Good! The sooner Trump gets booted out of office, the better for the universe.
@Tilda Swintons Bald Cap: Now that’s interesting.
Question for the lawyers: I’m sure Trump can pay lawyers, but he has a well established habit of paying expenses he can’t get out of by misappropriating other people’s money. Even if it only skirts the edge of illegal, or he doesn’t tell them that’s how he got it, is that going to put the lawyer in danger?
@Ruckus: Yeah, he couldn’t even be bothered to put sprinklers in his supposedly fanciest condo building in the world. And a guy died the other day because of it. He doesn’t like to spend money because being a cheapskate makes him feel powerful — people want him to open his wallet, so like a petulant four year-old, he won’t. Same goes with stuff like refusing to staff key government positions.
Formerly disgruntled in Oregon
@MobiusKlein: What does Rudy want? To stay out of prison. His pro bono role on T’s team is probably to take Donny by the hand and convince him to go quietly, on behalf of Mueller.
@Formerly disgruntled in Oregon: Yeah, I agree. Rudy’s only getting on Mango Moron’s team so he can have access to all that the discovery process produces, looking for information on just how far up shit creek he already is. He’s joining to cover his ass, not Dump’s.
He never developed past that. His body says 70+ everything else about him says he IS a petulant 4 yr old, not like one.
I agree. Look at that smirk on his face.
How can anyone live that long and be such toddlers? Must be the decades with their heads up their asses. I’d imagine that would do it.
Just a bit of a thought. We are in agreement about both of these dipshits but what if rudy flipped? He’s been extremely quiet lately, especially for rudy. What if enough people got him to believe that the only way he isn’t going down is to help take down drumpf. Think he might? He is in the game pretty much only for rudy, what if this is his best/only shot for staying out of the gray bar hotel? Think this selfish asshole might just do it?
@justawriter: “I heard Giuliani is working pro bono on this case. I assume he knows Trump will stiff him and so wants to get that out of the way up front.”
Giuliani will make a big deal about this in his fund-raising, which is why he took the job.
If we had a functioning media the Republican party wouldn’t be able to wash away the “Loser Stink” for a generation.
In the actual world two weeks into the next Democratic administration will be the beginning of the Republican Jubilee where everything is forgiven and very serious people will have regained control of the party.
@Ruckus: “I wonder how many of those were curtesy interviews?”
Probably all of them. What sort of deposit would it take for a top-level law firm to take him on, committing themselves to a long-term major case?
@Frankensteinbeck: “When the scandal gets slow, Putin has one of his own people admit something to the press. He doesn’t support Trump, he supports illegitimizing US politics so he has a better negotiating position internationally. And apparently “The US is just as corrupt as us!” is a big talking point in Russia. He’s doing a damn fine job of it.”
From Putin’s viewpoint, the second-best thing is that he got the weaker and compromised US President. The best thing is that he’s got a (metaphorical) bomb planted in the US political system, especially since the kompromat seems to cover much more of the GOP than just Trump.
Any time that Putin wants to, he can open his desk drawer, and push the red button.